# Best thing since Ronnie Wallace?



## Eagle_day (27 August 2010)

To be continued ......


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## rosie fronfelen (27 August 2010)

Eagle_day said:



			To be continued ......
		
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WTF??????


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## JenHunt (28 August 2010)

ditto Rosie


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## Simsar (28 August 2010)

Eagle_day said:



			To be continued ......
		
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Continue on....................


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## Eagle_day (28 August 2010)

Is Judgemental the best thing for Hunting since Ronnie Wallace?

Alas, no.  While much of what he says is sensible and indeed laudable, other comments are stark-raving bonkers and downright insulting.

Let us start with the latter.  In generally abusing the efforts of hunt staff, masters, secretaries and committees, he tars himself with his own brush and becomes guilty of the arrogant and rude behaviour that he accuses hunt officials of.  I wonder if he has ever field-mastered or even collected a cap: both are very difficult jobs and if the individuals performing those tasks sometimes forget to smile, then perhaps they should be forgiven.  It is unfortunate that our crusader does not appreciate the efforts given by so many in their free time and for no remuneration, just for the love of the sport.

Now on to the suggestion from La-la Land.  While I do not know whether the MFHA read this forum - reading other threads here, I imagine they are too busy at the moment to do so - I know for a fact that the antis do.  They must be wetting themselves with laughter at the proposition that hunt staff voluntarily identify themselves and wear name tags.  Prosecutions have failed because of LACS' failure to identify staff allegedly breaking the Hunting Act - some of you may remember antis' video footage from the West Country a couple of seasons or so ago that appeared quite damning but nevertheless failed to secure convictions because of the lack of ID.  The fact that LACS are now prosecuting hunts on the basis of covert surveillance makes the removability of those name badges utterly irrelevant.

Many of you will have served on various committees, clubs and perhaps parish councils and will recall the newcomer full of ideas but insensible to the feelings and long-term service performed by the remainder, and often only too keen on his self-promotion.  After a period of grief, he disappears as quickly as he appeared, leaving the rest to just get on with it.  Such people used to be called 'blowhards'. But never Ronnie Wallace.


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## rosie fronfelen (28 August 2010)

Eagle_day said:



			Is Judgemental the best thing for Hunting since Ronnie Wallace?

Alas, no.  While much of what he says is sensible and indeed laudable, other comments are stark-raving bonkers and downright insulting.

Let us start with the latter.  In generally abusing the efforts of hunt staff, masters, secretaries and committees, he tars himself with his own brush and becomes guilty of the arrogant and rude behaviour that he accuses hunt officials of.  I wonder if he has ever field-mastered or even collected a cap: both are very difficult jobs and if the individuals performing those tasks sometimes forget to smile, then perhaps they should be forgiven.  It is unfortunate that our crusader does not appreciate the efforts given by so many in their free time and for no remuneration, just for the love of the sport.

Now on to the suggestion from La-la Land.  While I do not know whether the MFHA read this forum - reading other threads here, I imagine they are too busy at the moment to do so - I know for a fact that the antis do.  They must be wetting themselves with laughter at the proposition that hunt staff voluntarily identify themselves and wear name tags.  Prosecutions have failed because of LACS' failure to identify staff allegedly breaking the Hunting Act - some of you may remember antis' video footage from the West Country a couple of seasons or so ago that appeared quite damning but nevertheless failed to secure convictions because of the lack of ID.  The fact that LACS are now prosecuting hunts on the basis of covert surveillance makes the removability of those name badges utterly irrelevant.

Many of you will have served on various committees, clubs and perhaps parish councils and will recall the newcomer full of ideas but insensible to the feelings and long-term service performed by the remainder, and often only too keen on his self-promotion.  After a period of grief, he disappears as quickly as he appeared, leaving the rest to just get on with it.  Such people used to be called 'blowhards'. But never Ronnie Wallace.
		
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ED, i do so agree. there is no comparison whatsoever between these two men i knew Ronnie quite well when he was with the Heythrop and helped to bring on new hunters for him. he was a god in hunting circles and was referred to as just that. when he moved to Exmoor, my bosses moved as well so they kept up with him-i remember a long chat with Ronnie when he was not in the best of health but still had the hunting will about him,noone will ever replace him or his hunting skills! JM is a joke, i thought he was a decent type with a font of knowledge, but he has turned out to be an attention seeking man--


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## Simsar (28 August 2010)

Now you know why I take the ****!  Name him please.


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## rosie fronfelen (28 August 2010)

Simsar said:



			Now you know why I take the ****!  Name him please.
		
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do you mean Judgemental?


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## Simsar (28 August 2010)

Yes!  I knew RW.


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## rosie fronfelen (28 August 2010)

Simsar said:



			Yes!  I knew RW.
		
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we obviously moved in the right circles!!!lol--


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## Simsar (28 August 2010)

So who is JM??


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## bahumbug (28 August 2010)

One Ronnie Wallace
There's only one Ronnie Wallace
One Ronnie Waaaaaaallace
There's only one Ronnie Waaaallace


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## rosie fronfelen (28 August 2010)

Simsar said:



			So who is JM??
		
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????? you been on the vino, Simsar?lol--


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## Simsar (28 August 2010)

rosiefronfelen said:



			????? you been on the vino, Simsar?lol--
		
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No I am asking who is Judgementle? The real judgementle.


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## rosie fronfelen (28 August 2010)

dont tell me there are 2!!!


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## rosie fronfelen (28 August 2010)

he is a mystery man,knows alot about hunting somewhere in the West Country-- cant make him out and i think that is his intention, to keep everyone guessing.why he thinks he is anyone special, god knows.


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## Simsar (28 August 2010)

He does quote himself somewhere as Big family in hunting something something I will find it, we have started a fan club!  Oh and he has pink eyes, and is a bloke, I like him.


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## bahumbug (28 August 2010)

Simsar said:



			He does quote himself somewhere as Big family in hunting something something I will find it, we have started a fan club!  Oh and he has pink eyes, and is a bloke, I like him.
		
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me too!


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## Simsar (28 August 2010)

Quote from the man himself.




I come from a well known hunting family, hunt extensively and my own family have come home and said exactly the same.


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## rosie fronfelen (28 August 2010)

Simsar said:



			He does quote himself somewhere as Big family in hunting something something I will find it, we have started a fan club!  Oh and he has pink eyes, and is a bloke, I like him.
		
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i've been following your fan club lol- but pink eyes??? theres something not ringing true and i cant put a finger on it- hes entertaining but-----?


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## Judgemental (28 August 2010)

I have only just spotted this.

Have met The Late Captain Wallace on as I recollect three occasions and followed the Heythrop in a landrover several times, when he was master.

No not remotely - The Late Captain was somebody who would eclipse me in every respect; indeed I have already described myself as "a humble poltroon of the Uria Heap mentality". 

I am just a fresh face with some fresh ideas and opinions based upon considerable knowledge of hunting and my intention is to promote new thinking.

Whilst we can have some levity there is serious work to be done to maintain hunting, let alone repeal the wretched act.

As I have said time and time again, you have a whole new playing field on the horizon come the new season - POLITICALLY.

A squalid administration passed the act and now you have a COALITION of diverse opinions.

Firstly I take some offence. Nothing I have said in this thread in any way impugnes any officer of a hunt, or generally. 

The main trust of Eagle_day's point on that is that I appear to criticise hunt officers for not smiling.

That was not what I was saying, I was suggesting that everybody should try and smile at those on foot and in vehicles in public places. Particularly the non-hunting public. of course it's helpful to smile at those you hunt with BUT DO NOT KNOW. Personnel people will tell you it's a brilliant way of making folk feel comfortable in large businesses.  

My words may have been misunderstood.

Frankly if our very attractive secretary and one of the joints were to smile at one two much when collecting the cap or whatever, one might get the wrong idea. I say what a deliciously naughty thought! Well I never. I shall never be able to look at her again with a straight face; you really are bounders leading me astray. 

So far as the antis are concerned, don't even bother to worry about what they might think - that only gives the SCUM 'Mental' sustenance! 

Now so far as tags are concerned. I am quite prepared to stand wholly corrected on the following. But did not the last and very poor administration suggest somewhere they were proposing that horse owners should be identifiable when on a public road - something to do with having something like a tax vehicle tax disk in a leather pouch hanging from the martingale or breastplate.

Of course I could be wholly mistaken but I thought I read something to that effect, a year or so ago.

As a result I considered this and wondered if the COALITION might go down a similar watered down road under self regulation. 

So some fresh innovative thinking is called for.

Now Mr Eagle_day lets have some original, outward and forward looking thoughts from you as to how best improve the image of hunting. It's not bad but it needs to be better. Othwise you will not be pulled out for early morning hunting and left in the kennel. No flesh and just biscuit possibly a little flaked maize if you are very lucky!


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## Judgemental (28 August 2010)

rosiefronfelen said:



			i've been following your fan club lol- but pink eyes??? theres something not ringing true and i cant put a finger on it- hes entertaining but-----?
		
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Charlie's are pinkish at night? Where did pink eyes come from Rosie - LOL


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## rosie fronfelen (28 August 2010)

Judgemental said:



			Charlie's are pinkish at night? Where did pink eyes come from Rosie - LOL
		
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read through the posts judgie!!


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## Judgemental (28 August 2010)

rosiefronfelen said:



			read through the posts judgie!!
		
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Just off to give my horses their late evening feed will be back in moment to have a read 21:48


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## rosie fronfelen (28 August 2010)

page 2, post 17. how many horses do you have in, and are they in work?


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## Ravenwood (28 August 2010)

I actually agree with Judgemental to some extent.  I think that some packs really are their own worst enemy.  For example there is a huge pack here which attracts a massive following to each meet.  The worst offenders are the car followers - literally hundreds of them.  The masters feel that they have no restriction, or liability for their car followers and that people who live (or move here) should expect to be blocked in the roads.

The trouble is, a lot of us are very pro hunt and support it 100% but equally we have to work, pick up children, get to doctors appointments etc and you can't if the roads are blocked by hundreds of vehicles.  This is what gives hunting a bad name - the arrogance and running roughshod over everyone else.

Conversely and as a good example, I went cubbing this evening with a very small pack - and today (like every other day) when we were on the road (field, hunt staff, hounds etc) someone shouted "CAR" and we all got off the road and let them pass - to me that is courtesy and good manners.

Just because we are hunting today - it doesn't mean that we have to hold up everyone else who isn't (as much as they probably wish they were!).

I think that in this day and age, public relations from the hunts is vital.  It is ridiculous to antagonise one single person and quite frankly, no need.

As to smiling politics within each hunt - LOL I am pretty sure that the field know the secretaries etc and how happy their dispositions are!


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## rosie fronfelen (28 August 2010)

i assume these are the stag hunters?


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## Ravenwood (28 August 2010)

Not mentioning names


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## rosie fronfelen (28 August 2010)

i know, have seen them for myself- hundreds of vehicles--


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## Ravenwood (28 August 2010)

But when you actually live here............well, its enough to turn you anti!!!


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## rosie fronfelen (28 August 2010)

i can quite believe it- we used to go stag watching in the evenings, most enjoyable.


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## Judgemental (28 August 2010)

Ravenwood said:



			But when you actually live here............well, its enough to turn you anti!!!  

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Ravenwood, good evening. Remind me please, was the Captain's last pack the Exmoor or thereabouts, becasue he would have just about told anybody what their 'fortune' was and fairly colourfully if they blocked a road whilst hunting.


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## Ravenwood (28 August 2010)

Yes, Captain Wallace was indeed Master of the Exmoors until his demise.

He was certainly a colourful character!  Although from a personal point of view, not my favourite person as his people skills were perhaps lacking but as an ambassador for hunting ....... we all know he was a legend, never to be forgotten


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## Judgemental (28 August 2010)

Ravenwood said:



			Yes, Captain Wallace was indeed Master of the Exmoors until his demise.

He was certainly a colourful character!  Although from a personal point of view, not my favourite person as his people skills were perhaps lacking but as an ambassador for hunting ....... we all know he was a legend, never to be forgotten 

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Yes, in my youth I witnessed a fair explosion with the Heythrop at Upper or Lower Slaughter, somebody's horse kicked a hound at the meet! They were sent home and told not to come out again on that ....... ...... horse. In front of the whole field - a lady too. You could see her wanting the ground to open up - then he added let that be a lesson to rest of you - anybody dare kick my hounds is not welcome!


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## rosie fronfelen (28 August 2010)

he was a hero in my book- and had hell of a personality,but as you say, hounds were his greatest love and god help anyone who put a hoof wrong!!


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## Ravenwood (28 August 2010)

LOL - I remember a very embarrassing moment when a young hound literally veered and ran straight across under my horses hooves whilst we were all galloping across a field - it yelped but appeared to be fine  But because my hunt is so nice and friendly, they were lovely about it and didn't blame me at all!  Phew!! 

Actually, my horse was onced owned by an elderly gentleman who held a meet at his house, my horse apparently kicked a hound (find this hard to believe but hey ho!) and he beat her - she promptly threw him off and he was airlifted to hospital - oh dear oh dear!!


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## Alec Swan (29 August 2010)

During the '70s,  I worked at Cornbury Park,  and my employer was joint master of the Heythrop.  The memories are flooding back!

We met at Rangers Lodge,  one morning,  and RW drew up in his beaten up old Renault 4.  Tony Collins was the kennel huntsman, not that he got to hunt hounds very often.  RW walked across to his hounds and said "Good morning Hounds" and as one,  they replied!  On that same day,  he asked me to hold his horse,  whilst he hunted hounds on foot,  at a place known as The Camp,  at Finstock.  His hounds showed the same passion for him,  as he did for them.

I once caught a hound in a snare,  one that I'd forgotten to lift.  If the idiot who'd found the hound had removed the wire from its neck,  then no one would have been any the wiser.  They didn't,  they removed it from the post,  and the hound rejoined the rest,  wearing a neckless!  At the end of the day,  RW tracked me down to my Estate cottage,  and came striding down the path.  To my utter amazement,  he was charming.  I'd witnessed him correcting others,  when they needed it,  and perhaps when they didn't,  and I wasn't looking forward to my "interview"!  He talked for over an hour,  sitting at my kitchen table,  of hunting,  and this was at the end of a long day.  

Ronnie Wallace was a remarkable man,  and whilst I'm not qualified to offer comparisons with others,  I would think that he was certainly a determined and committed ambassador.  Whilst the field were reminded of their place,  those who weren't,  were generally treated with courtesy.  That was my experience of him,  and for myself,  I liked him.

Alec.


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## rosie fronfelen (29 August 2010)

Alec, you are spot on with your assumptions, there will never be the likes of him again.


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## rosie fronfelen (29 August 2010)

Judgemental said:



			Ravenwood, good evening. Remind me please, was the Captain's last pack the Exmoor or thereabouts, becasue he would have just about told anybody what their 'fortune' was and fairly colourfully if they blocked a road whilst hunting.
		
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Exmoor foxhounds- not the stag hounds.


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## Simsar (29 August 2010)

Pink eyes meaning stays up late drinking!  should have been red but JM wrote in Pink.  Don't worry private joke.


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## rosie fronfelen (29 August 2010)

so hes a boozer!!!


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## Judgemental (29 August 2010)

rosiefronfelen said:



			so hes a boozer!!!
		
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Throughly boring hardly ever touch a drop. 

Although I will admit I do like my flask out hunting with the following:

Strong whiskey mac - more whiskey than mac - oops I have spell whiskey the American way, that must be a giveaway.  

Sloe Gin but it must be sweet

Apricot Brandy - just love the stuff

What is your tipple? 

It has to be a double pocket one. Glass or Crystal in a leather case are not really satisfactory - why, because I do like to be social with my flask out hunting. Some of my friends are less than careless when taking it and I once I lost one in the handover. They are about a couple of hundred now. But the friend did appear the next day with half a dozen bottles of whiskey. 

Now this is a subject I could really get into!


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## Simsar (29 August 2010)

Hello


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## rosie fronfelen (29 August 2010)

Judgemental said:



			Throughly boring hardly ever touch a drop. 

Although I will admit I do like my flask out hunting with the following:

Strong whiskey mac - more whiskey than mac - oops I have spell whiskey the American way, that must be a giveaway.  

Sloe Gin but it must be sweet

Apricot Brandy - just love the stuff

What is your tipple? 

It has to be a double pocket one. Glass or Crystal in a leather case are not really satisfactory - why, because I do like to be social with my flask out hunting. Some of my friends are less than careless when taking it and I once I lost one in the handover. They are about a couple of hundred now. But the friend did appear the next day with half a dozen bottles of whiskey. 

Now this is a subject I could really get into!
		
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i cant hunt now so i stick to wines at home-at meets this god awful mix of hot milk and whisky was often on offer-ugh-preferred a nice punchy punch, or a port.(used to drink neat whisky like water!) hubby has whisky in his flasks.( Note the plural!)So where do the pink eyes come from?????


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## Judgemental (29 August 2010)

Simsar said:



			Hello
		
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Do we have a little tipple Simsar or are you very good and do not have a flask about your person when hunting.


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## Simsar (29 August 2010)

Judgemental said:



			Do we have a little tipple Simsar or are you very good and do not have a flask about your person when hunting.
		
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WM is a favourite then Port, sorry I have a glass/leather case flask.  How are you today JM.


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## Judgemental (29 August 2010)

rosiefronfelen said:



			i cant hunt now so i stick to wines at home-at meets this god awful mix of hot milk and whisky was often on offer-ugh-preferred a nice punchy punch, or a port.(used to drink neat whisky like water!) hubby has whisky in his flasks.( Note the plural!)So where do the pink eyes come from?????
		
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LOL the pink eyes thing is one of those seemingly Masonic like codes. I am lost Simsar started it so she will have to explain

Hot milk and whiskey. Now is something I have never come across at a meet.

Must be a custom amongst hunting folk in Wales. Perhaps somebody can enlighten us if it is elsewhere.

This a brilliant subject to find out what folk take in thweir flasks?


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## Simsar (29 August 2010)

Rosie it was a figure of speech about the red eyes!  Didn't mean anything. Just a quip.


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## Simsar (29 August 2010)

Judgemental said:



			LOL the pink eyes thing is one of those seemingly Masonic like codes. I am lost Simsar started it so she will ahve to explain

Hot milk and whiskey. Now is something I have never come across at a meet.

Must be a custom amongst hunting folk in Wales. Perhaps somebody can enlighten us if it is elsewhere.

This a brilliant subject to find out what folk take in thweir flasks?
		
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Loving the spellin HICK mistakes UP


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## rosie fronfelen (29 August 2010)

Judgemental said:



			LOL the pink eyes thing is one of those seemingly Masonic like codes. I am lost Simsar started it so she will ahve to explain

Hot milk and whiskey. Now is something I have never come across at a meet.

Must be a custom amongst hunting folk in Wales. Perhaps somebody can enlighten us if it is elsewhere.

This a brilliant subject to find out what folk take in thweir flasks?
		
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no judge- this disgusting drink was a favourite in the shires of leicestershire!!!!!( back in the 80s-)


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## Judgemental (29 August 2010)

Simsar said:



			WM is a favourite then Port, sorry I have a glass/leather case flask.  How are you today JM.
		
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I am in very good order thank you, yourself?

Glass adds a certain quality to one's persona but my chums are such clutces, that I know they will drop it in the mud and then the horse steps on it! 

I have a slight pechant for cherry brandy but on balance I think my favorite is Apricot brandy

Too much Whiskey Mac gives me a headace and under any type of riding/crash  hat with the strap 'anall, it becomes uncomfortable.

Port is ok. It's meant to loosen the vocal cords so your hollar is more audible.


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## rosie fronfelen (29 August 2010)

Simsar said:



			Rosie it was a figure of speech about the red eyes!  Didn't mean anything. Just a quip.
		
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no probs. Simsar, the thought of pink eyes--- well, i dunno!!!


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## Judgemental (29 August 2010)

Simsar said:



			Loving the spellin HICK mistakes UP
		
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Yes, it's getting progressively worse


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## rosie fronfelen (29 August 2010)

Judgemental said:



			I am in very good order thank you, yourself?

Glass adds a certain quality to one's persona but my chums are such clutces, that I know they will drop it in the mud and then the horse steps on it! 

I have a slight pechant for cherry brandy but on balance I think my favorite is Apricot brandy

Too much Whiskey Mac gives me a headace and under any type of riding/crash  hat with the strap 'anall, it becomes uncomfortable.

Port is ok. It's meant to loosen the vocal cords so your hollar is more audible.
		
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haha-- no wonder they are a gobby lot round here!! too much of the dark red stuff--------------!


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## rosie fronfelen (29 August 2010)

have looked at the glass flasks(christmas pressies?)but not at those prices, and the fear of droppage and hence damage- no chance boyo!!!


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## Simsar (29 August 2010)

Judgemental said:



			I am in very good order thank you, yourself? I have hurt my ankle slipping in a divit so feeling sorry for myself, bloody hurts!

Glass adds a certain quality to one's persona but my chums are such clutces, that I know they will drop it in the mud and then the horse steps on it! 

I have a slight pechant for cherry brandy but on balance I think my favorite is Apricot brandy Yuk!Too much Whiskey Mac gives me a headace and under any type of riding/crash  hat with the strap 'anall, it becomes uncomfortable.

Port is ok. It's meant to loosen the vocal cords so your hollar is more audible.  Now the spelling what is going on??.
		
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JM a few more clues as to who you are my dear friend would be greatly recieved.


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## Judgemental (29 August 2010)

rosiefronfelen said:



			no judge- this disgusting drink was a favourite in the shires of leicestershire!!!!!( back in the 80s-)
		
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Well I have learnt something. Yuck, can't think of anything worse at the meet.

Oh yes there are the punches. Some know what they are doing others don't. It's the latter that either sears the back of one's throat or you think you are drinking cough mixture.


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## rosie fronfelen (29 August 2010)

HAHA Simsar- I before E, except after C!!!!! LOL--- just joking!


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## Judgemental (29 August 2010)

Simsar said:



			JM a few more clues as to who you are my dear friend would be greatly recieved.
		
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I am as I say a mere poltroon of no consequence so it doesn't matter.


What's more important is your ankle:

"I have hurt my ankle slipping in a divit so feeling sorry for myself, bloody hurts!" Tail bandage and keep walking about on it and paracetamol.


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## Simsar (29 August 2010)

rosiefronfelen said:



			HAHA Simsar- I before E, except after C!!!!! LOL--- just joking!
		
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Then edited love it!


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## Simsar (29 August 2010)

Judgemental said:



			I am as I say a mere poltroon of no consequence so it doesn't matter. No fair enough, it would be very boring to know who you are.
What's more important is your ankle:

"I have hurt my ankle slipping in a divit so feeling sorry for myself, bloody hurts!" Tail bandage and keep walking about on it and paracetamol. My friend Ginge sent me an email on how many post I'd done yeaterday!  lets hope it gets better soon.  LOL 

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But thanks for advise. x


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## Maesfen (29 August 2010)

Nobody remembers him with the Hawkstone Otterhounds then?  I don't, wasn't around here then but husband does and was lucky enough to be given the mask by RW which is still hanging on our wall along with some pads.  Have many tales to tell of him - but not on here as they're not our tales to tell, that's the trouble when you know so many hunt staff!

Rosie, tut tut, no need to qualify the Exmoor are foxhounds, they are the only pack of any type to have Exmoor in their title.

How about port and ginger wine as a stirrup cup, will that do?  I'll let you know when we have our meet and you can come and try it, we usually have a few empty saddles later..........


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## rosie fronfelen (29 August 2010)

Maesfen said:



			Nobody remembers him with the Hawkstone Otterhounds then?  I don't, wasn't around here then but husband does and was lucky enough to be given the mask by RW which is still hanging on our wall along with some pads.  Have many tales to tell of him - but not on here as they're not our tales to tell, that's the trouble when you know so many hunt staff!

Rosie, tut tut, no need to qualify the Exmoor are foxhounds, they are the only pack of any type to have Exmoor in their title.

How about port and ginger wine as a stirrup cup, will that do?  I'll let you know when we have our meet and you can come and try it, we usually have a few empty saddles later..........
		
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i was answering a question asked by judge.


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## rosie fronfelen (29 August 2010)

i know by the way that the stags are Devon and Somerset!! i am sorry for my bad wording, this isnt gonna be a pick up on Rosie comments i hope---Ronnie wrote excellent books on his life including hilarious quotes.


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## Maesfen (29 August 2010)

No offence meant or caused at all Rosie, sorry if it sounded like it.


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## rosie fronfelen (29 August 2010)

no offence taken- i had no idea about the Hawkstone Otterhounds, way before my time! what years were they?


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## Judgemental (29 August 2010)

rosiefronfelen said:



			i was answering a question asked by judge.
		
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Did I ask a question? 

I know I asked to be reminded if Captain Wallace's last mastership was of the Exmoor, by that I mean foxhounds, well that goes without saying. Bearing in mind there are only two packs of stag hounds the D & S and Quantock. Do the Tiverton still exist or did they get amalgamated?

Port and ginger wine that's interesting, thing is which port, you have to be careful with port?

I think I am right in thinking the Captain popularised Red PVC rain proof hunt coats, to the shock of some? 

I am sure some knowledgeable person will correct the facts.


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## rosie fronfelen (29 August 2010)

no sorry, as i said, bad wording- all i know is that if Ronnie had the staghounds there would not be a traffic problem!!! no idea about the Tiverton, way past my days on Exmoor--


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## Maesfen (29 August 2010)

rosiefronfelen said:



			no offence taken- i had no idea about the Hawkstone Otterhounds, way before my time! what years were they?
		
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They were formed sometime in the 1800 but he was Master for nearly 30 years.  It's all in here, a legend of a man -

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/obituaries/1384219/Captain-Ronnie-Wallace.html


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## rosie fronfelen (29 August 2010)

thanks for that bit of info!


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## pastie2 (29 August 2010)

Judgemental said:



			Did I ask a question? 

I know I asked to be reminded if Captain Wallace's last mastership was of the Exmoor, by that I mean foxhounds, well that goes without saying. Bearing in mind there are only two packs of stag hounds the D & S and Quantock. Do the Tiverton still exist or did they get amalgamated?

Port and ginger wine that's interesting, thing is which port, you have to be careful with port?

I think I am right in thinking the Captain popularised Red PVC rain proof hunt coats, to the shock of some? 

I am sure some knowledgeable person will correct the facts.
		
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A very well known fact Judge, he started the red pvc years ago. As for port, it doesnt really matter when mixed with ginger wine!!!


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## Simsar (29 August 2010)

MFH how are ya?


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## rosie fronfelen (29 August 2010)

Simsar said:



			MFH how are ya?
		
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MFH-judge-- since when???


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## Judgemental (29 August 2010)

rosiefronfelen said:



			MFH-judge-- since when???
		
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I think Simsar is cunningly drawing the coverts but she will have better scenting conditions


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## Maesfen (29 August 2010)

Simsar said:



			MFH how are ya?
		
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Fine thanks, how's yourselves?



rosiefronfelen said:



			MFH-judge-- since when???
		
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Lol, no, I'm not Judge!  Refers to my old username of Maesfenhorse which got shortened to MFH a couple of years ago; the handle's stuck but couldn't be further from the truth! 

BTW, Tiverton are still going last I heard.


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## rosie fronfelen (29 August 2010)

sorry Maesfen(sounds welsh) i didnt realise you were MFH in your past postings! i do get things buggered up sometimes--


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## Simsar (29 August 2010)

Thought that might confuse a few LOL!


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## pastie2 (29 August 2010)

Judgemental said:



			I think Simsar is cunningly drawing the coverts but she will have better scenting conditions
		
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Hey Judge, you talk the talk, can you walk the walk. Tell me have you ever sat on a horse in your life! Ronnie Wallace PAH!!! In your dreams.


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## Maesfen (29 August 2010)

rosiefronfelen said:



			sorry Maesfen(sounds welsh) i didnt realise you were MFH in your past postings! i do get things buggered up sometimes--
		
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Lol, don't worry about it.  It's a covert that borders our land and the family have been responsible for it since Adams was a lad and it's not far from the Welsh border too; it's also my prefix.

I'll get you a wooden spoon S!


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## Simsar (29 August 2010)

What happened to pref a british bred one? Put that back.


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## Judgemental (29 August 2010)

pastie2 said:



			Hey Judge, you talk the talk, can you walk the walk. Tell me have you ever sat on a horse in your life! Ronnie Wallace PAH!!! In your dreams.
		
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Madam, _whilst removing my hat_, you will note that you are extended every courtesy from my direction. Therefore I would invite you to take your 'horse' home and not come out again, if you are going to make absurd comments coupled to the most appalling bad manners. Goodday to you.

Now let us remember where this thread started, the wholly ineffectual Eagle_day. The 'freelance' chartered accountant. The bloodsucking professionals who then leach off such as myslef who actually gnerate the wealth to pay professionals such as Eagle_day.

Not a single post since, with any constructive comment, alternatives or opinions by Eagle_day. Typical no iniative!


Frankly it is the Eagle_days who are still unable to come to terms with the fact that we have a COALITION government along with a few disallusioned Labour MPs now climbing into bed with Cameron and Clegg. It is the Eagle-days who have put hunting in the position it is in now. No imagination, no savior faire, just the same old way of going on with unsmiling folk generating antipathy whereever they are perceived. Bleating about how their officers do sterling work all unpaid - if you join a club sunshine, you do your best to promote a betterment of the hunting and the greater glory of the sport.

Lets be hearing from you Eagle_day or hasn't the fact there is a change of government and all that that entails, reached the 'exciting'  fens of Lincolnshire. 

All you have done is run a heel line from the thread which was attracting considerable comment and constructive suggestions.




I suggest you too, take you horse home but we will have a subscription off you first!


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## JanetGeorge (30 August 2010)

Judgemental said:



			All you have done is run a heel line from the thread which was attracting considerable comment and constructive suggestions.
		
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Well - after a heel line, I'll start a riot by saying that - IMHO - the late,great Ronnie Wallace was NOT a 'good ambassador' for hunting!  (Awaits drawing and quartering!)  He was - by all accounts - a great huntsman, and an excellent Master - and to my own knowledge, a very personable and courteous character!  

BUT - he ruled the MFHA with a rod of iron for many years - and by extension - the BFSS too!  His 'keep our heads down and our powder dry' policy played a LARGE part in the eventual ban!  All through the '60s, '70s and '80s, the LACS - a tiny and insignificant little group - was beavering away, particularly in schools - indoctrinating the teachers, parents and politicians of the next generation!  And WHERE were the MFHA and the BFSS while public opinion was being turned against hunting??  Keeping their heads down and their powder dry, of course, as instructed by Ronnie.

And it was left to a few of our great political supporters - in particular Lord Kimball - to kill off anti-hunting bills!  By the time of the early 1990s,  a few sensible people FINALLY saw the writing on the wall - and it was in the '90s that we saw the emergence of some TRUE ambassadors.  People like James Barclay (the younger!)  And George Bowyer!  And for a short time, Derek Laud.  And of course Robin Hanbury-Tennison.  And amongst the professional huntsmen, Julian Barnfield and Patrick Martin in particular!  And, unlikely as it seems, Frederick Forsyth!

But of course it was too late - the LACS by then HAD changed public opinion.  Not on their own, of course - times were a-changing too!  There was less contact with the countryside for most.  There was certainly less 'respect' for the 'upper classes' - so the Toffs on horsebck theme found fertile ground.  And they weren't very clever - wherever we debated with them - we won hands down.  But for 30 odd years we DIDN'T debate with them - we let them get on with spreading their lies and their hatred.

So I'd say YES to Ronnie as a great huntsman and MFH - but NOT what I'd call 'an Ambassador'!


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## Judgemental (30 August 2010)

JanetGeorge, outstanding absolutely brilliant. 

In days of yore I watched you on television doing the most difficult job.  

For the avoidance of doubt: when I said,_ "All you have done is run a heel line from the thread which was attracting considerable comment and constructive suggestions". _
I was of course referring to the thread I started, *"Too many who hunt are unfriendly and get hunting a poor social reputation".*

*So Eagle_day come on, lets have some alternatives and new initiatives?*

I suppose what these threads do do and of course there was no Internet in the 70's, 80's and 90's. It flushes out the weaknesses and the *antediluvian* thinking still in the minds of too many who hunt!


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## rosie fronfelen (30 August 2010)

i take great objection to your comments Janet George about Ronnie Wallace, if i remember rightly your contribution to the CA was not too greatly appreciated, anyway, back to Ronnie, i knew him pretty well and his latter 2 wives, helped to bring on his hunt horses and your comments on him not being a great ambassador are an insult to him.thank god for his rod of iron, who do we have now with that attitude- noone unless there is financial gains to be had at the end!! Name dropping will not help your cause by the way!!


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## rosie fronfelen (30 August 2010)

Judgemental said:



			Madam, _whilst removing my hat_, you will note that you are extended every courtesy from my direction. Therefore I would invite you to take your 'horse' home and not come out again, if you are going to make absurd comments coupled to the most appalling bad manners. Goodday to you.

Now let us remember where this thread started, the wholly ineffectual Eagle_day. The 'freelance' chartered accountant. The bloodsucking professionals who then leach off such as myslef who actually gnerate the wealth to pay professionals such as Eagle_day.

Not a single post since, with any constructive comment, alternatives or opinions by Eagle_day. Typical no iniative!


Frankly it is the Eagle_days who are still unable to come to terms with the fact that we have a COALITION government along with a few disallusioned Labour MPs now climbing into bed with Cameron and Clegg. It is the Eagle-days who have put hunting in the position it is in now. No imagination, no savior faire, just the same old way of going on with unsmiling folk generating antipathy whereever they are perceived. Bleating about how their officers do sterling work all unpaid - if you join a club sunshine, you do your best to promote a betterment of the hunting and the greater glory of the sport.

Lets be hearing from you Eagle_day or hasn't the fact there is a change of government and all that that entails, reached the 'exciting'  fens of Lincolnshire. 

All you have done is run a heel line from the thread which was attracting considerable comment and constructive suggestions.




I suggest you too, take you horse home but we will have a subscription off you first!
		
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come on now Judge,be fair, you are an enigma to alot of people so what can you expect? your english is hard to follow in these modern times so what are people supposed to think,
Pastie2  sent you a message about me when i was on the ban, you asked her about her lifestyle etc, and then not another peep out of you- so, who are YOU? regarding ED, well, i can understand him-ihavent followed all these posts as to be honest what can the likes of us do regardingthe political side of things. can we not wait and see what the coalition come up with, we are better off now than with Brown and his cronies and any repeal is going to take months.


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## Maesfen (30 August 2010)

rosiefronfelen said:



			i take great objection to your comments Janet George about Ronnie Wallace, if i remember rightly your contribution to the CA was not too greatly appreciated, anyway, back to Ronnie, i knew him pretty well and his latter 2 wives, helped to bring on his hunt horses and your comments on him not being a great ambassador are an insult to him.thank god for his rod of iron, who do we have now with that attitude- noone unless there is financial gains to be had at the end!! Name dropping will not help your cause by the way!!
		
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Rosie, you're talking a load of tosh and anyone with an atom of sense would realise it too.  
Nobody could have worked harder and stronger than Janet at that time and many, even now, regret her being pushed form the CA but they couldn't do with her straight forward talking even though it had been proved how popular she was with the members.  Janet was a huge influence on the Rally and the Marches (of which I too walked a hundred miles) which were huge successes and managed to bring all field sports together, something which the 'old men' had never done as they were so territorial, almost anal about anyone else having a say in what they saw as their property.  Hunting would be in a far worse position if Janet had not been so good at her job back then; we all owe her a huge debt and we do well to remember that.
She's also right, Ronnie was a legendary huntsman, a brilliant doggie man, his hounds would do anything for him and he was (rightly) a force of nature to be reckoned with especially if he thought you had done anything wrong but he also could never accept he was wrong; I have too many anecdotes of him which prove otherwise; and that 'certainty' set the cause back several times over the years - but he was never wrong, his certainty was unshakeable; it's just such a shame that in many ways he handed ammunition to the other side while still being positive he was right and nobody with the guts to say  otherwise.


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## rosie fronfelen (30 August 2010)

thank you, i was just giving my own opinion and as many others on here state that we are still able to have free speech. many from here walked many miles on the marches i might add, and the older generation supported in a vast way. nothing will change my views on Ronnie, i had too many conversations with him to do that, on the other hand i have no wish to fall out or make enemies over this, my physche(sp?) wont cope these days so lets beg toagree to disagree- mind you, i dont appreciate my opinions being called tosh-


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## JanetGeorge (30 August 2010)

rosiefronfelen said:



			thank you, i was just giving my own opinion and as many others on here state that we are still able to have free speech. many from here walked many miles on the marches i might add, and the older generation supported in a vast way. nothing will change my views on Ronnie, i had too many conversations with him to do that, on the other hand i have no wish to fall out or make enemies over this, my physche(sp?) wont cope these days so lets beg toagree to disagree- mind you, i dont appreciate my opinions being called tosh-
		
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Of course you're entitled to your opinion - as I am to mine - whether you agree with it of not.  However, I take exception to being accused of 'name dropping' (if I'd wanted to name-drop, I'd have come up with FAR 'bigger' names than those mentioned as good ambassadors for hunting.)

As for my 'efforts' not being appreciated at the CA, to paraphrase Maesfen, more tosh!  I still have a small CASE full of letters, cards and e-mails I received from a wide range of CA members - both after the Rally and the March, AND after I was sacked by a Johnny-come-lately CE (who went nearly as fast!)  The only reason said CE got away with it was that some Bord members thought they needed a fallguy to facilitate the removal of someone higher up the foodchain - and in this sort of politics, there's no such thing as loyalty or integrity!


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## rosie fronfelen (30 August 2010)

JanetGeorge said:



			Of course you're entitled to your opinion - as I am to mine - whether you agree with it of not.  However, I take exception to being accused of 'name dropping' (if I'd wanted to name-drop, I'd have come up with FAR 'bigger' names than those mentioned as good ambassadors for hunting.)

As for my 'efforts' not being appreciated at the CA, to paraphrase Maesfen, more tosh!  I still have a small CASE full of letters, cards and e-mails I received from a wide range of CA members - both after the Rally and the March, AND after I was sacked by a Johnny-come-lately CE (who went nearly as fast!)  The only reason said CE got away with it was that some Bord members thought they needed a fallguy to facilitate the removal of someone higher up the foodchain - and in this sort of politics, there's no such thing as loyalty or integrity! 

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there are 2 sides to every story Ms George, you are quite above yourself with your comment regarding FAR bigger names to quote- and that is typical of a snob, which is the thing that the hunting fraternity want to see less of. as you say,opinions are entitled to, also you arewrong about loyalty and integrity, 2 things that Ronnie stood for!!


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## Simsar (30 August 2010)

STOP! STOP! STOP! Now if their is a fan club to be started it will be JANET GEORGE and I for one can say Janet is NO SNOB, and the CA are all ************* I don't know anything about all this but name calling and bitching and she said you said is not called for on this forum please.


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## Alec Swan (30 August 2010)

Whilst I can't be certain,  I suspect that the man himself would find much of this rather embarrassing. 

JanetGeorge,  I always enjoy your posts,  but for just this once,  I have to disagree with you.  Ronnie Wallace rode (sort of!) rough shod over most who didn't agree with him.  He bullied and barged his way through his arguments.  He was,  I'm sure,  on occasions wrong.  He was after all human.  

He did,  irritating though he may have been,  represent hunting.  Were there others who could have worn the mantle which he assumed (and that is the right word)?

Regardless of his faults and mistakes,  he was most certainly an ambassador.  He may not have been perfect,  but he was passionate. My memories of the kindness and restraint which he showed to a young man,  me,  will remain in place.

Alec.


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## Judgemental (30 August 2010)

Simsar said:



			STOP! STOP! STOP! Now if their is a fan club to be started it will be JANET GEORGE and I for one can say Janet is NO SNOB, and the CA are all ************* I don't know anything about all this but name calling and bitching and she said you said is not called for on this forum please.
		
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Simsar, yes I agree completely. I was not going to say anything but please can we all be measured in all this.

It could be that threads on this Forum and other things, may possibly be the means by which politicians can see if we are able to handle self-regulation.

The Internet and it's content is the most accessable media means for MP's to make many judgements.


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## JanetGeorge (30 August 2010)

rosiefronfelen said:



			there are 2 sides to every story Ms George, you are quite above yourself with your comment regarding FAR bigger names to quote- and that is typical of a snob, which is the thing that the hunting fraternity want to see less of. as you say,opinions are entitled to, also you arewrong about loyalty and integrity, 2 things that Ronnie stood for!!
		
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Oh get a LIFE!  If you want to pick every post I make apart line by line - then expect some back - and I thought you didn't WANT to fight!  I mentioned some people who - IMO- were GOOD ambassadors for hunting - to a MUCH wider public than Ronnie reached!  You accused me of name-dropping - which I wasn't - and I pointed out that IF I wanted to name-drop, there are 'bigger' names I could have mentioned.  I didn't say that they were my best friends or I knew all their wives or that I brought on their hunt horses!  ANYONE who knows me knows I am NOT a snob - and I resent that accusation far more than anythingelse you have to say.

And if you'd read my post properly, I referred to the CA Board - in 1998 - in my comment "in this sort of politics, there's no such thing as loyalty or integrity!"  I was NOT referring Capt Wallace - he wasn't a Board member of the CA and if he HAD been things would have been very different!   If he WANTED someone 'out' he told them to go - he had the courage of his convictions.  

Oh - and it's MRS.George-and has been for 28 years!


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## rosie fronfelen (30 August 2010)

i know more about Captain Wallace than you realise, but well leave it at that- so im off to get a life and leave it at that, thank you.


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## Eagle_day (31 August 2010)

Right, where were we? Ah .... yes: Judgemental is Rory Knight Bruce and I claim my £5.

Or maybe not.  He is, however, very bitter and twisted about Chartered Accountants; perhaps he has been badly advised in the past - poor judge of character, perhaps.  As an accountant who, on a conservative estimate, has saved and recovered in tax twice what I've billed my clients, I scarcely deserve the epithet 'blood-sucking' and would be more than happy to quote him for future business.

While I am delighted  to shamelessly plug my business, I will do no such thing for what I've done for hunting over the years: those who know, know,  and I will leave the self-promotion to others.

I do regret not adding earlier to this thread but I have been rather busy this bank holiday weekend.  Indeed yesterday I was out with our foxhounds in the morning and a pack of bassets in the afternoon.  Judgemental would do well to get out a bit more and cut back on trawling internet fora: he will find travel really does broaden the mind.  Or is he, as Kipling put it, preoccupied with 'killing Kruger with his mouth'?  It may be that the words of the King are even more appropriate and we should demand "A little less conversation, a little more action please".

Elvis has left the building.


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## JanetGeorge (31 August 2010)

Eagle_day said:



			Right, where were we? Ah .... yes: Judgemental is Rory Knight Bruce and I claim my £5.
		
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  Gee thanks -  mouthful of a VERY nice Australian red now adorns my screen!


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## rosie fronfelen (31 August 2010)

JanetGeorge said:



  Gee thanks -  mouthful of a VERY nice Australian red now adorns my screen!
		
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have to give it a scrub then, Mrs George.


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## Judgemental (31 August 2010)

Eagle_day said:



			Right, where were we? Ah .... yes: Judgemental is Rory Knight Bruce and I claim my £5.

Or maybe not.  He is, however, very bitter and twisted about Chartered Accountants; perhaps he has been badly advised in the past - poor judge of character, perhaps.  As an accountant who, on a conservative estimate, has saved and recovered in tax twice what I've billed my clients, I scarcely deserve the epithet 'blood-sucking' and would be more than happy to quote him for future business.

While I am delighted  to shamelessly plug my business, I will do no such thing for what I've done for hunting over the years: those who know, know,  and I will leave the self-promotion to others.

I do regret not adding earlier to this thread but I have been rather busy this bank holiday weekend.  Indeed yesterday I was out with our foxhounds in the morning and a pack of bassets in the afternoon.  Judgemental would do well to get out a bit more and cut back on trawling internet fora: he will find travel really does broaden the mind.  Or is he, as Kipling put it, preoccupied with 'killing Kruger with his mouth'?  It may be that the words of the King are even more appropriate and we should demand "A little less conversation, a little more action please".

Elvis has left the building.
		
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Nope - wrong. Now the Silverton would be Interesting.

New face, new ideas, new broom in the yard sweep out the old ideas onto the muck heap

Mr Eagle_day, I am sure you are a very competant accountant - I don't need accountants - LOL - So you saved a bob or two in tax for a few folk, how does that help hunting in the contemporary world?

What I would welcome hearing from you, is not what you have done in the past for hunting but what you are going to do in the future, what new and exciting initiatives, you can suggest, in the current climate.

Yes we are all out with packs of hounds - how remarkable - you would not think it would you, people on this forum go out with hounds.

Come along now Eagle_day, some smart cutting edge ideas, please?

I did see you on televison did I not?


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## Simsar (31 August 2010)

Evening all.


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## rosie fronfelen (31 August 2010)

Judgemental said:



			Nope - wrong. Now the Silverton would be Interesting.

New face, new ideas, new broom in the yard sweep out the old ideas onto the muck heap

Mr Eagle_day, I am sure you are a very competant accountant - I don't need accountants - LOL - So you saved a bob or two in tax for a few folk, how does that help hunting in the contemporary world?

What I would welcome hearing from you, is not what you have done in the past for hunting but what you are going to do in the future, what new and exciting initiatives, you can suggest, in the current climate.

Yes we are all out with packs of hounds - how remarkable - you would not think it would you, people on this forum go out with hounds.

Come along now Eagle_day, some smart cutting edge ideas, please?

I did see you on televison did I not?
		
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excuse me butting in, but surely gentlemen its time to call a truce, we all want whats best for hunting but we have different ideas and opinions-we are all neither right or wrong but its daft to keep scoring points over each other. i hold my hands up too as ive had plenty to say as well but at the end of the day we are all on the same side,i hope, as i have no idea who either of you are and dont want to know.


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## Judgemental (31 August 2010)

JanetGeorge said:



  Gee thanks -  mouthful of a VERY nice Australian red now adorns my screen!
		
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Mrs George, I really am so sorry that your VDU should be so adorned as a result of Mr or is it Sir Eagle_day suggestiong that I am Mr Bruce - perish the very notion. 

As I have said on more than one occasion,  I am a mere poltroon of the Uria Heap mentality.

But does it matter whos who, not really. But it does does it not, to the old gurard, those who have failed miserably and presided over hunting up to and during the 2004 Act.

They need to wake up get their act together and think forward.


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## Judgemental (31 August 2010)

rosiefronfelen said:



			excuse me butting in, but surely gentlemen its time to call a truce, we all want whats best for hunting but we have different ideas and opinions-we are all neither right or wrong but its daft to keep scoring points over each other. i hold my hands up too as ive had plenty to say as well but at the end of the day we are all on the same side,i hope, as i have no idea who either of you are and dont want to know.
		
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You might be right Rosie but there has been a comprehensive failure, namely the 2004 Hunting Act.

In companies when there is failure there has to be change and radical change at that!

I might as well add those charged as Hunting Ambassadors are being paid some very serious salaries - they had better be earning their keep and failure is not an option - otherwise it's the Gulag.


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## rosie fronfelen (31 August 2010)

oh, just get it sorted then!


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## Judgemental (31 August 2010)

rosiefronfelen said:



			oh, just get it sorted then!
		
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Rosie, between us all we can go a long way to sorting this, because the power of the Internet did not exist in 2004. The so called movers and shakers of hunting can learn and be told it's not all some gin swilling jolly in the clubs of London, at the expense of such as oursleves.

They will work and work very hard to restore the status quo!


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## Eagle_day (2 September 2010)

Firstly, apologies to Mrs G: while computer monitors are two-a-penny at Currys, a good wine is irreplaceable.

Let us cut to the chase.  Three things those in the Hunting world should do - with examples - to promote our cause:

1. Be nice to people:
    - Encourage the new and nervous.
    - Never hold up traffic longer than you can help it.
    - NEVER reprimand anyone in public

2. In the PR battle - don't give the antis an inch:
    - Respond to their rubbish round-robin letters in the local rag
    - Don't let their arguments go unanswered on the web, on Facebook, Twitter and all internet fora.
    - And take the PR fight to them. Eg. Tony Blair has admitted his biggest regret was banning hunting: SHOUT it from the rooftops.

3. Continue to work with our political friends who now, and only thanks to Vote OK, are in government.

All this is already being done by those who Judgemental insults so grievously.  It will not happen overnight but incrementally.  There is no silver bullet.

So, to use the words of the comic genius Monty Python, Judgemental 'is not the Messiah, he's a very naughty boy'.


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## Simsar (2 September 2010)

Oh the life of Brian, fab film.  JM you are now Brian.


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## EAST KENT (2 September 2010)

The "having to let her go" of Mrs George was the most regretful act achieved by the BFSS /Countryside Alliance .BRING HER BACK!! Give the "CA" some teeth back.


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## Simsar (2 September 2010)

Excellent a campaign!


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## JanetGeorge (2 September 2010)

EAST KENT said:



			The "having to let her go" of Mrs George was the most regretful act achieved by the BFSS /Countryside Alliance .BRING HER BACK!! Give the "CA" some teeth back.
		
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That's very kind of you - but I'm far too old and out of touch!   I also have FAR too many horses to look after! And of course it's a whole different 'scene' now -diplomacy and 'soft' PR are the way forward - and I don't DO soft PR (or diplomacy!!)


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## EAST KENT (3 September 2010)

JanetGeorge said:



			That's very kind of you - but I'm far too old and out of touch!   I also have FAR too many horses to look after! And of course it's a whole different 'scene' now -diplomacy and 'soft' PR are the way forward - and I don't DO soft PR (or diplomacy!!) 

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Well the diplomatic soft approach has got us nowhere fast, never would in my opinion. As I see it ,calling it the "Countryside Alliance" instead of the BFSS was a cop out anyway. Instead of an emblem depicting field sports we now have a bloody poached egg on spinach for God`s sake. All this very polite turning the other cheek ,whilst the LAC spread rubbish at their will,us keeping stum and being gracious pleeeeaaassseee. Anything that REALLY does get us back chasing FOXES is OK by me.


  Come on Charlie ,nab a few more humes,you`re doing a great PR job !


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## Judgemental (3 September 2010)

EAST KENT said:



			Well the diplomatic soft approach has got us nowhere fast, never would in my opinion. As I see it ,calling it the "Countryside Alliance" instead of the BFSS was a cop out anyway. Instead of an emblem depicting field sports we now have a bloody poached egg on spinach for God`s sake. All this very polite turning the other cheek ,whilst the LAC spread rubbish at their will,us keeping stum and being gracious pleeeeaaassseee. Anything that REALLY does get us back chasing FOXES is OK by me.


  Come on Charlie ,nab a few more humes,you`re doing a great PR job !
		
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East Kent, in full cry - here here - for far too long, indeed all my life I have been told, "don't you worry about a thing old boy, we have our ear to the ground and 'special' channels. Sir Rupert Potlington-Symth-Blowingoffinthewind, (he of the chalk stripe suit, regimental tie and carefully coiffured silver locks at 'Trumpingtons') will have a gin and pink with the minister, at the In and out Club don't you know. It will be alright, nothing to worry about old chap" (Tap tap of the nose along with a knowing wink).

Absolute unadulterated bull ....!

*Fail ye not who are charged with sorting out this mess and Hunting Act 2004, because I for one have at this time, very little faith.*

Why, because hitherto you allowed Tony Blair to walk all over you and he has admitted he knew absolute .... all about the job!


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## Eagle_day (8 September 2010)

Fifteen years out of date.


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## stablelad (27 October 2010)

EAST KENT said:



			The "having to let her go" of Mrs George was the most regretful act achieved by the BFSS /Countryside Alliance .BRING HER BACK!! Give the "CA" some teeth back.
		
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Here here! I totally agree with East Kent, BRING BACK MRS. GEORGE!! In my opinion she is a great ambassador to our cause, only if the now hierarchy had her backbone and fight we may not be in the position we are now! It seems since JG departed the Alliance not much has happened! Where has 'diplomacy and soft PR' got us?


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## EAST KENT (27 October 2010)

Judgemental said:



			I am in very good order thank you, yourself?

Glass adds a certain quality to one's persona but my chums are such clutces, that I know they will drop it in the mud and then the horse steps on it! 

I have a slight pechant for cherry brandy but on balance I think my favorite is Apricot brandy

Too much Whiskey Mac gives me a headace and under any type of riding/crash  hat with the strap 'anall, it becomes uncomfortable.

Port is ok. It's meant to loosen the vocal cords so your hollar is more audible.
		
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Now ,now JM..what exactly would you be "holloaing"? Somebody with a duster on the end of a hunting whip?? Naughty..in the corner for at least an hour,and no hip flask either while you repent.


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## EAST KENT (27 October 2010)

rosiefronfelen said:



			there are 2 sides to every story Ms George, you are quite above yourself with your comment regarding FAR bigger names to quote- and that is typical of a snob, which is the thing that the hunting fraternity want to see less of. as you say,opinions are entitled to, also you arewrong about loyalty and integrity, 2 things that Ronnie stood for!!
		
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Behave yourself! Probably the stupidist thing ever done by the pro hunters was allowing Mrs George to exit the fray.All that daft non confrontational "reasonable" discussion,welcoming the bloody governments "assessments of our sport,which they totally ignored,really!! Shot ourselves in the foot!
  Show some bloody respect  please.


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## rosie fronfelen (27 October 2010)

EAST KENT said:



			Behave yourself! Probably the stupidist thing ever done by the pro hunters was allowing Mrs George to exit the fray.All that daft non confrontational "reasonable" discussion,welcoming the bloody governments "assessments of our sport,which they totally ignored,really!! Shot ourselves in the foot!
  Show some bloody respect  please.
		
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look here- this is way out of date,i've moved on and so has this thread. If you are bored find a post that is more recent please!!!


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## Judgemental (26 December 2010)

My handler, or as they are referred to on this forum, one's OH most thoughtfully gave me The Keen Foxhunters Miscellany by Peter Holt and published by Quiller.

A most excellent book full of the most marvellous vignettes and anecdotal stories concerning hunting from it's earliest inception. 

An ideal source/sauce to flavour this forum.  

One of the most fascinating pieces concerning the late Captain Ronnie Wallace.

In his last season as Master of the Eton College beagles in 1936. The pack hunted 104 days and accounted for 75 brace of hares and three foxes. Unfortunately at his last opening meet, the pack found a fox and killed it in somebodys kitchen. A female anti from Bracknell read about the event and saw Ronnie Wallaces picture in the local paper. She wrote to him, you have a very sweet face, can I not save you before its too late?


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## EAST KENT (26 December 2010)

Most men would have buckled under that offer!


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## Alec Swan (26 December 2010)

EAST KENT said:



			Most men would have buckled under that offer!

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Some possibly,  but I suspect that the good captain,  would have initially acquiesced,  enjoyed being saved,  and then wandered off,  to continue in his own way.  Which is exactly what I would have advised!!

Alec.


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## Judgemental (26 December 2010)

Alec Swan said:



			Some possibly,  but I suspect that the good captain,  would have initially acquiesced,  enjoyed being saved,  and then wandered off,  to continue in his own way.  Which is exactly what I would have advised!!

Alec.
		
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Would you count yourself as a bit of a bounder with the ladies then Alec?


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## EAST KENT (26 December 2010)

Clever puppy!!


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## Alec Swan (26 December 2010)

Judgemental said:



			Would you count yourself as a bit of a bounder with the ladies then Alec?
		
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Not if I'm to be judged,  I wouldn't!

The words "Ageing"  and "Lothario",  seem,  strangely at odds with each other!

Alec.


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## EAST KENT (27 December 2010)

Hmm..the older they get the more octopus like they become ,in my opinion.


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## Simsar (15 May 2012)

rosie fronfelen said:



			WTF??????
		
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PML! and tha's how we will remember the truly wonderful ROSIE!. xxxxxxx


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## EAST KENT (16 May 2012)

Full of fire and brimstone..can you dig out any more? It is a very tame place now,is`nt it!


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## Vulpinator (16 May 2012)

Ive just stumbled upon your thread and brought myself up to speed, Whilst not wanting to interupt such a wonderfull too and fro. 

Whilst Ronnie was a tyrant and no mistake he would not have taken lightly to the way hunts are now opperating under this ludicrus law.

He would also have taken great umbridge at the way some not all of the latest traunch of masterships treat and deal with staff and others.

I think that a few words should have be said to Masters by the Man himself from beyond the soil and that is "Treat your staff right they provide the sport and keep the hounds" and Treat them in a curtious and supportive manner and make sure they are looked after its they that will make the sport last till repeal.


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## Alec Swan (16 May 2012)

Simsar said:



			No I am asking who is Judgementle? The real judgementle.
		
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rosie fronfelen said:



			dont tell me there are 2!!!
		
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rosie fronfelen said:



			he is a mystery man,knows alot about hunting somewhere in the West Country-- cant make him out and i think that is his intention, to keep everyone guessing.why he thinks he is anyone special, god knows.
		
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rosie fronfelen said:



			i've been following your fan club lol- but pink eyes??? theres something not ringing true and i cant put a finger on it- hes entertaining but-----?
		
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Judgemental said:



			Charlie's are pinkish at night? Where did pink eyes come from Rosie - LOL
		
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rosie fronfelen said:



			read through the posts judgie!!
		
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Judgemental said:



			Yes, in my youth I witnessed a fair explosion with the Heythrop at Upper or Lower Slaughter, somebody's horse kicked a hound at the meet! They were sent home and told not to come out again on that ....... ...... horse. In front of the whole field - a lady too. You could see her wanting the ground to open up - then he added let that be a lesson to rest of you - anybody dare kick my hounds is not welcome!
		
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rosie fronfelen said:



			he was a hero in my book- and had hell of a personality,but as you say, hounds were his greatest love and god help anyone who put a hoof wrong!!
		
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Yes,  without question,  I shall miss Rosie.

Alec.


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## oakash (19 May 2012)

I'm somewhat surprised that no-one seems to have picked out Judgemental as a fraud. He or she thought - according to posts - that the correct term for a 'hunting scarlet' coat was 'PINK', for goodness sake!. Those of us who have hunted long and regularly, I suggest, and that would include Ronnie Wallace, would know that the 'pink coat' term, rather than 'RED' is something only used by journalists, antis, and the ignorant, and other people who don't know their a---from their elbow.


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## EAST KENT (19 May 2012)

Actually  ,here I will confess,Rosie and I ,through various PMs decided that JM actually was a bit like old Man Steptoe,living in a basement flat somewhere and toasting bread on an Old three pronged toasting fork over his couple of lumps of coal. I kid you not,we had a great laugh over that one..oh ..and he read a lot!


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## Alec Swan (20 May 2012)

EK,  you have a PM.

Alec.


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## dunthing (20 May 2012)

A wonderful "debate" which I thoroughly enjoyed reading again. Rosie will indeed, be sorely missed.


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## Eagle_day (30 December 2012)

Indeed she will. I am very sorry to hear Rosie has died. May she be happily hunting on the Fields of Elysium.


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