# Have I over reacted? Interfering livery owners



## Sandie47 (6 February 2018)

hi everyone, 
I am sorry for the essay there is so much to this but I just need some advice. 

I am in the UK and I have a 11hh Shetland pony for my 6year old daughter. 

So last night I looked on my weather app and decided to bring my pony in as it was meant to rain for 18hours the wind was a little strong and it was 2degrees and I do pay for a stable, so why not. The mare  is on a very strict diet as she is a good doer and up until Christmas although we were still in winter she was piling on the weight. 

So I had already organised With professional advice about her diet, which wasnt causing her problems I just didnt want it to escalate and as we are heading into spring I wanted her nice and fit for my daughter to possibly show and hack throughout summer &#128522;

So her diet is specific and Im shes doing amazingly well and is at an ideal weight and she looks amazing considering its winter.

So anyway! 

I kept her in the stable that day because 
1. It was raining all day 
2. The fields are an absolute state 
3. The wind was cold as it has still been 1degrees  
4. I thought Id turn her out around 4pm/5pm before the sun goes down. As shes been very silly with the wind and darkness.
5. We recently thought she was lame which she was boxed for 4/5days with Bute for the first 2days (just in case) but nothing really come of it to be honest so as she had been recently back out for exercise I thought it would be a great way to just keep her in those extra few hours. 

So my plans were to turn her out in day light, turn her out with her feed that had been soaked,weighed and put up ready in her net. which would of kept her going in her shelter till later in the night (thinking about her settling down nicely in a field on her own, shes on her own as the livery owners horse isnt nice to her)

So anyway to my absolute belief when I got up at the yard 
1. The yard was an absolute state hay everywhere covered in mud 
2.the hay was coming from My girls stable. 
3. My stable had hay chucked on the floor with great big chunks stuck together.
4. I was concerned wondering has she pulled it all out and not eaten? You know.

But as in the past the livery owners had interfered and I contacted the other livery girl to see if she had give her anything and she of course said no I wouldnt do that without you knowing or asking me.

So Straight away I got so frustrated  because I knew the livery owners had obviously fed her?! Without my consent! Or even me knowing!

So I sent a text to the Livery owner and she replied this - yes, my partner gave her some

So I was furious at this point. I am quite a hot blooded person and I already organised what my pony was doing feed and more importantly her diet! I have no idea what hay her gave her, no idea how much, no idea what time not a clue. 

I did text back and say could I ask why? And the reply I had (which made me even more upset) was He was concerned as she had been in with no food or water. 
Funny enough her water was filled by me that morning.. also she had text me at 2:30 asking if I was ok and that she hadnt seen me today? (Which is so strange I never see the owner &#129335;&#127996;*&#9792;&#65039 so my reply was yes, just very busy Im up soon. No reply to say would you like me to pop my head in to see if shes ok nothing. 

So when that text came through about she was concerned that she hadnt been fed or had water I sent this - She had a hay net this morning and I had filled her water up &#128522; so please dont worry about what Pony is upto. Could I ask is he does that with the other livery horses in the day to, when there left in? Just thought Id ask, just in case I need to let The owner know. Can I kindly ask you please not feed her or interfere with Pony as I have plans and routine. That Ive been really on top of &#128578;and I would always let you know if I needed help with giving her some hay. I wouldnt feed or water anyones horses unless I was asked and informed the owner what I had. Thanks again &#128522; xx

So to me I honestly didnt know what else to say I thought this text wasnt horrible but a to the point text. 

I just think why would you interfere. This pony is on a strict diet. This is a diy livery. The state the yard and stable was in was disgusting. Pony is a very nervous mare that has her moments and does not like men so maybe he could of been injured or her. 

Sorry for the essay I just wanted to fill you in the bigger picture. She has tried ringing me and wants to speak to me? I feel like Ive said all I needed to say. Do you think Ive done the right thing? &#128532;

^
So this was two days ago. The day after the owner and her husband come out to me and told me I had 4weeks to leave and she will not tolerate anger or anyone speaking to her like that? And didnt going on the text I had sent her. I realise looking back I wish I would of spoken to her face to face but because I was so upset that she had been messed with I just felt my reply to her was in fact ok.
They werent bothered or didnt take any responsibility for there actions which is concerning as she is a vet! 

She took the whole situation really bad completely court me of guard. She was so unprofessional. Almost as though they were embarrassed so they just attacked me with this nonsense. I must of said sorry about 50times 

What do you all think? 

If your still here thank you &#128591;&#127996; Lol


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## Sandstone1 (7 February 2018)

Difficult one really.   I understand that your pony is on a diet but if she only had one small net to last her all day she would probably have eaten it by mid morning and standing in with no food isn't great for ponies.
Livery owner probably thought they were doing you a favour.   Might have been a idea to leave a note or something to say what you were doing.
I wouldn't have been happy to get your text to be honest.   It was quite angry.
I know it's difficult with little fatties but there are ways of keeping them occupied.  You can double net hay.  There are hay balls that can make hay last longer.  Treat balls with a few high fibre cubes.
Difficult situation but as it's their yard there is really nothing you can do now except maybe send them a letter apologising and explaining why you were so upset.


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## Red-1 (7 February 2018)

If I were the livery yard owner then I would not have been happy with the text either, especially as they tried to call to speak with you and you did not pick up.

I can only think they thought they were doing you a favour. I don't think the presence of :smile3::wink4::biggrin4: would take the sting out of the text.

I suspect the part that upset them most was where you were questioning the treatment of the other liveries so you could go tell them, it just looks like a trouble maker.

I can totally understand why the pony needs food restricted, but there is no reason for any horse to be without water. I would have thanked them for putting water in. I would use an extra bucket, or in fact my horses have a large trug that holds 3 1/2 buckets, and is emptied and refilled twice. I appreciate a Shetland may not need this much, but a bigger container or extra bucket is obviously needed, especially as it is cold and he/she will need more in summer. 

For the future, if they are happy to put hay in I would leave hay in 2 double netted nets, so the pony will have food for longer, in 2 doses. 

If you have an issue with someone face to face is obviously better, failing that a phone call, which livery owner did try to do.

If it were me I would buy  huge bouquet of flowers, not in the expectation of having to stay, just in appreciation that they did what they thought was right, and feel that it was thrown back in their faces.

As far as yards are concerned, you are now unlikely to be happy here so I would leave. Many yards would not have been upset at the text. Many yards would not put hay/water into a horse who has none. So, many yards will be suitable.

I do understand why you are so upset. No they did not do the right thing for you or for how you want the pony kept. Communication was not the best and now communication has broken down. At least the pony is fine and you have a month to find somewhere else. If all goes well in that month the livery owners may feel differently.


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## Auslander (7 February 2018)

I appreciate how difficult it is to manage something that is a really good doer, but I can't imagine that the yard owner would have watered and hayed a DIY unless it had no hay and water. Even on a strict diet, a stabled horse needs a constant supply of forage - thats how their guts work - so it might be worth looking into trickle nets, so that your pony can't eat all her forage in a short period, leaving her with nothing for the rest of the day.
I think that a better approach would have been to thank them for caring, and to say "I'll have to think of a way to slow her down, so that she doesn't need to have any extra hay when she stays in".


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## honetpot (7 February 2018)

I can understand why anyone would be cross about giving a pony a bucket of water! I would be grateful. 
  The hay bit. Ponies eat hay quickly, so you either have to split it, pad it out with straw, or feed as chaff. It would have been far better for you to discuss it in an open friendly way than to get upset and angry with them and find a resolution together.
  I would imagine the YO has far more experience than you and perhaps if you as their advice they could suggest something. To be honest |I would ask you to leave, I wouldn't want a paying guest ranting at me.


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## WandaMare (7 February 2018)

This is a complete overreaction on both sides and and the result of only one incident of miscommunication. All it would have taken was for everyone to think more kindly of the other in the first place, ,and decide how to best deal with it next time. If I was YO and I received that text it would be nothing, even if I did think the livery was a bit cross.  I would just make a note to have a quick chat, clear the air and make sure I knew what the owner was trying to achieve. Being thrown off the yard is just silly, maybe they don't want liveries anymore and this was a good excuse.

OP the owners on the yard will be around in the daytime and see your pony standing there unhappy, and therefore they probably thought they were doing the right thing. I would perhaps tell someone next time if you are going to change a routine, and then hopefully this sort of situation won't re-occur. Maybe think of people trying to help and not be so ready to accuse them of interfering, most horse people do want they same thing, for all horses to be well & happy.


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## whiteflower (7 February 2018)

I think you are over reacting. You say she's a vet so I doubt she would do anything that could harm your ponies health. Yes she should have told you that she was going to give your pony hay and water as it had none but by the sounds of it the way the pony was left made her believe the pony hadn't been tended to and had been left in. At the end of the day it's her yard and sounds like she is proactive in ensuring the horses on her yard are being cared for. Your text sounds arsey and would have annoyed me a lot. You should have seen her face to face to discuss  or rung her. 
I'm sorry that you have been asked to leave, it sounds like a communication break down but maybe a message to let her know you were changing the pony's routeen due to inclement weather and the pony was being dealt with would have stopped the issue arising. If I'm honest it sounds like your more upset by the loss of control of your ponies regime than the concern over any 'damage' some hay and water might cause.


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## Cecile (7 February 2018)

Text messages can cause so much trouble, always better to phone or speak to the person face to face

Badly handled all around, as its DIY it would of been so much easier for the YO to phone you and say pony is short of water and hay, don't worry I will sort it until you can get here, do you want the hay soaked or dampened

I personally would be quite thankful if someone gave mine a top up of water and as it all comes out the same tap no harm can come of it.  Unknown hay source I wouldn't be so chuffed about so easier to phone first

Miscommunication can be the downfall in yards..... I would be concerned if there was a pony in my stables short of water or no hay

Everyone should of stopped and taken a breath, YO really should of phoned you or left you a note on the stable door, you should of gone to see the YO or spoken to her on the phone not sent a text but like everything in life hindsight is a wonderful thing.......

I'm convinced text messages or faceache will start WW3 at some point


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## ester (7 February 2018)

So from my reading your reply to the text at 2.30 did not tell them that you had been up earlier that morning (granted they didn't specifically ask that) but it reads to me that they thought you had not been up and not hayed and watered the pony. 

This is definitely the time when speaking in person is much better than texting if you are unhappy about something. 

I hope you find another suitable yard.


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## Sandie47 (7 February 2018)

Sandstone1 said:



			Difficult one really.   I understand that your pony is on a diet but if she only had one small net to last her all day she would probably have eaten it by mid morning and standing in with no food isn't great for ponies.
Livery owner probably thought they were doing you a favour.   Might have been a idea to leave a note or something to say what you were doing.
I wouldn't have been happy to get your text to be honest.   It was quite angry.
I know it's difficult with little fatties but there are ways of keeping them occupied.  You can double net hay.  There are hay balls that can make hay last longer.  Treat balls with a few high fibre cubes.
Difficult situation but as it's their yard there is really nothing you can do now except maybe send them a letter apologising and explaining why you were so upset.
		
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Thank you for your reply.  and if it&#8217;s ok I&#8217;d like to reply.

Going to try and reply very simple (so please don&#8217;t take it the wrong way just have a lot of comments to get through and want to do them all and answer every bodies) &#55357;&#56842;

Her hay net is a full sized hay net. 

And it wasn&#8217;t for all day it was for 5hours.

She is on straw for forage (I think!) it&#8217;s wheat or oat but I can ask the Livery owner.

To me the favour would of been to text/ring and ask if she could put some hay in. Or used the already prepared hay net the was ready for her afternoon hay. Also text or rung me to say that her husband had given some hay.

I don&#8217;t think I could leave a note with what I&#8217;m doing on a diy livery with every step I&#8217;m doing. If that makes sense. It&#8217;s already totally lost confidence in what I&#8217;m doing and the trust in the livery owner as I haven&#8217;t the foggiest idea what her routine is if liver owners take it amount themselves to feed horses and not tell the owners. And couldn&#8217;t that of been both ways? Couldn&#8217;t they of written a note for me instead of me coming up and finding it on the floor with no idea what had happened.

My text I wrote over and over there was no other way for me to write it. I tried being really nice but at the same time what other words could I of said politely I made sure I wasn&#8217;t angry within the text and made sure to put smiley faces and kisses at the end (sorry I know that&#8217;s a pathetic excuse) but what could I have said when she replied her message which was confronting me about my welfare to my horse. However I did straight away apologie for my text that had offended her and it was not at all my intention. Please try and see what the question is about can people just feed your horse without you knowing or you asking. 

Her hay net is doubled. 

She has a lick in her stable.

She also has a treat ball that I put a small handful of pony nuts every morning.

It is there yard yes and I would of thought there policy would be to not intervene unless speaking to any owner. I don&#8217;t know if I stated anywhere either that other things have been unexplained to. Also as courtesy I just thought they would of asked. They know how this pony is mine and my daughters world we are at the livery 4times a day without fail. 

I would of totally understood if the livery owners were noticing things and were concerned about her welfare but this pony is in a 10* home. Just for me my respect I wouldn&#8217;t intervene after 3hours. 

I did explain why I was upset face to face when they spoke to me.

Maybe it&#8217;s just me and my courtesy. Not to get involved with someone else&#8217;s pony.

Thank you anyway &#55357;&#56842; please don&#8217;t take this in anyway other than me just replying back to you &#55357;&#56842; and giving you explanations. I am a very polite and honest girl who hates confrontation and I don&#8217;t mean any harm with what I write or do in life.


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## The Fuzzy Furry (7 February 2018)

OP, as a YO I would have been:
1. a bit miffed to find a pony in with empty water
2. No hay
3. Not having seen livery, then I'd 'presume' that the livery hadn't been up.
4. Not impressed at snotty reply to text.

That said, I've asked my liveries in the past to let me know when plans change - after all, I don't want to find a horse/pony out on own nor left in yard on own as either would indicate to me that owner not been up.
As a YO I would intervene even with a DIY if I thought its needs were not met, I'd deal with the immediate scenario in front of me and then call owner. I've done this only the once in 30 odd years & that time it was needed as she'd had a crash on way to yard, a serious one & was glad of me stepping in.

YO's are not able to always 2nd guess owners and its courteous to let them know if your usual movements change - just as a politeness, like you would do if lodging somewhere yourself.

That said, seems like its keep your head down & look for somewhere that is happy for you to change routines without letting anyone know. Perhaps find your own yard?


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## Rowreach (7 February 2018)

The Fuzzy Furry said:



			ot able to always 2nd guess owners and its courteous to let them know if your usual movements change - just as a politeness, like you would do if lodging somewhere yourself.
		
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Mine is on DIY and if my routine is going to be different (there's a couple of times this winter where I've decided to leave mine in during the day, or known I would be a bit late bringing him in) I make sure to let the YM know.

As it happens, he and I have indeed "interfered" when we realised that we hadn't seen the other DIY livery for a couple of days, or any evidence of her checking her horse which was in a pretty bare paddock, and so we gave it hay and water.  Just as well, as she'd gone away for a few days and not told anyone, and wasn't responding answering her phone ...

I think there has been a bit of an overreaction here OP, it was only one day after all.  If you want to stay on the yard I would go and have a face to face chat with the YO and try and smooth things over.  Maybe things will have calmed down by now.


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## ester (7 February 2018)

That is a good point actually, even on DIY we have always had a routine so if that was changing significantly I would always let the YO know (though quite active as having two herself) just out of courtesy.


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## Sandie47 (7 February 2018)

Red-1 said:



			If I were the livery yard owner then I would not have been happy with the text either, especially as they tried to call to speak with you and you did not pick up.

I can only think they thought they were doing you a favour. I don't think the presence of :smile3::wink4::biggrin4: would take the sting out of the text.

I suspect the part that upset them most was where you were questioning the treatment of the other liveries so you could go tell them, it just looks like a trouble maker.

I can totally understand why the pony needs food restricted, but there is no reason for any horse to be without water. I would have thanked them for putting water in. I would use an extra bucket, or in fact my horses have a large trug that holds 3 1/2 buckets, and is emptied and refilled twice. I appreciate a Shetland may not need this much, but a bigger container or extra bucket is obviously needed, especially as it is cold and he/she will need more in summer. 

For the future, if they are happy to put hay in I would leave hay in 2 double netted nets, so the pony will have food for longer, in 2 doses. 

If you have an issue with someone face to face is obviously better, failing that a phone call, which livery owner did try to do.

If it were me I would buy  huge bouquet of flowers, not in the expectation of having to stay, just in appreciation that they did what they thought was right, and feel that it was thrown back in their faces.

As far as yards are concerned, you are now unlikely to be happy here so I would leave. Many yards would not have been upset at the text. Many yards would not put hay/water into a horse who has none. So, many yards will be suitable.

I do understand why you are so upset. No they did not do the right thing for you or for how you want the pony kept. Communication was not the best and now communication has broken down. At least the pony is fine and you have a month to find somewhere else. If all goes well in that month the livery owners may feel differently.
		
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Thank you for your reply  and if it&#8217;s ok I&#8217;d like to reply.

Going to try and be very simple. (So please don&#8217;t take it the wrong way I have a lot of comments to get through) and want to do them all and answer everybody

I can now see that people arnt liking the text I replied. In my absolute honesty it WAS NOT my intention to cause any trouble to be horrible or cause any upset I was simply just giving my answer back. I had re wrote it several times to try and simply make sure she wouldn&#8217;t miss read it and take it way out of context. 

A favour would of been a text/call or left a note to say what had been done. The emojis were put in the text as (probably out of habit) but also as we all get along so well. And again this wasn&#8217;t meant to be a &#8220;sting&#8221; message it was me asking them not to worry about her as she&#8217;s our pony and to not intervene unless you speak to me.

I can now see that my wording and the way I put things arnt very as good as others. (As me writing back to everyone I feel like every reply I give is put the wrong way lol) I&#8217;m re reading absolutely frightened to offended someone now just by simply replying.

I am 100% no trouble maker. Again this wasn&#8217;t my intention it was just a simple question to a &#8216;friend&#8217; as her horses are kept in daily in winter. (Anyway) and do we have a right to know sort of thing. So yes I apologised anyway to the other livery lady face to face and to the owners for me writing that if it caused offence.

I don&#8217;t know where these posts have got that she was left with no water? My pony WAS fed and WAS watered and WAS mucked out 5hours before he had flung the hay in. Her morning hay is always the less amount as just my routine with her. But she had  TWO buckets of CLEAN water that was not frozen done in her morning routine. Which was not touched when I got there (so he hadn&#8217;t filled them up or touched them) all he had done was flung hay in (don&#8217;t know what hay) But she did have hay left in her hay net which confussed me even more. So please she has access to clean water all day (but redone 4times a day) 

Her hay net it doubled. 

I tried calling before the text was said about had she put hay in (because I wanted to know if pony had eaten or just emptied some of her hay on the floor) which is odd as pony is a very clean girl. Then when she asked me to call her i tried 4times with texting in between each other saying ring me. (We both live in forests the only way contact it made as its easier is through text) always has been. And I do like it as I have things &#8220;on paper&#8221; if that makes sense.

Face to face did happen the morning after. 

I will be buying flowers and a little gift for her new born as a thank you regardless for having us there for 7months. 

I would love to stay but it&#8217;s livery owners choice. 

And this is where it all differs for me was it the right thing to do? A secret feed? Which I have no idea how long has been going on for and was not done correctly (flung on the floor. Not separated. Not soaked. Not weighed. No idea what hay it was. The mess that was made and not cleaned up (on the yard) and no communication to let me know) 

I am actually in the process of owning my own land so will be nice to trust myself and not have to worry about if pony is in danger of laminitis. Colic or any other health problems caused by unknown things. But I am glad I have raised awareness to people to make sure communication is key! 

1000000000% communication had broke down. Not my end. I have since been letting everybody know what I am doing and when she&#8217;s fed watered and exercised.... probably way over board but I just don&#8217;t have any choice. Just don&#8217;t know what else I could do at a diy yard. 

Thank you very much for your reply I hope this has simplified what you were thinking as an outsider.  
Please again this is through &#8220;text&#8221; so I don&#8217;t mean any hurt I am a polite honest girl who&#8217;s just &#8220;standing up for herself&#8221; and explaining your concerns. 
Thanks


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## webble (7 February 2018)

I can see your point but a simple thank you and explaining you had fed herwould have sufficied if this was the first time it had happened. If it kept happening then a polite non accusational face to face confrontation would be the next thing.


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## ester (7 February 2018)

The trouble is that if you are saying she definitely had water (though you weren't there, buckets can get knocked etc), and they are saying she didn't then you are essentially also accusing them of lying which is also not a way to keep people on side.


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## The Fuzzy Furry (7 February 2018)

Sandie47 said:



			1000000000% communication had broke down. Not my end.
		
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Agreed it broke down.

Now try to look at it from the YO angle - it WAS from your end as you didn't mention any changing over of time stabled.

Anyway, all now going round in circles to the 'I did' and 'she did' so best to accept that there was indeed a problem, right the issue (as already mentioned) with flowers.
And move on.


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## conniegirl (7 February 2018)

Sorry but If I were a YO, I'd be very miffed and likely to ask you to leave as you sound more trouble then you are worth.


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## Sandstone1 (7 February 2018)

Sandie47 said:



			Thank you for your reply.  and if it&#8217;s ok I&#8217;d like to reply.

Going to try and reply very simple (so please don&#8217;t take it the wrong way just have a lot of comments to get through and want to do them all and answer every bodies) &#65533;&#65533;

Her hay net is a full sized hay net. 

And it wasn&#8217;t for all day it was for 5hours.

She is on straw for forage (I think!) it&#8217;s wheat or oat but I can ask the Livery owner.

To me the favour would of been to text/ring and ask if she could put some hay in. Or used the already prepared hay net the was ready for her afternoon hay. Also text or rung me to say that her husband had given some hay.

I don&#8217;t think I could leave a note with what I&#8217;m doing on a diy livery with every step I&#8217;m doing. If that makes sense. It&#8217;s already totally lost confidence in what I&#8217;m doing and the trust in the livery owner as I haven&#8217;t the foggiest idea what her routine is if liver owners take it amount themselves to feed horses and not tell the owners. And couldn&#8217;t that of been both ways? Couldn&#8217;t they of written a note for me instead of me coming up and finding it on the floor with no idea what had happened.

My text I wrote over and over there was no other way for me to write it. I tried being really nice but at the same time what other words could I of said politely I made sure I wasn&#8217;t angry within the text and made sure to put smiley faces and kisses at the end (sorry I know that&#8217;s a pathetic excuse) but what could I have said when she replied her message which was confronting me about my welfare to my horse. However I did straight away apologie for my text that had offended her and it was not at all my intention. Please try and see what the question is about can people just feed your horse without you knowing or you asking. 

Her hay net is doubled. 

She has a lick in her stable.

She also has a treat ball that I put a small handful of pony nuts every morning.

It is there yard yes and I would of thought there policy would be to not intervene unless speaking to any owner. I don&#8217;t know if I stated anywhere either that other things have been unexplained to. Also as courtesy I just thought they would of asked. They know how this pony is mine and my daughters world we are at the livery 4times a day without fail. 

I would of totally understood if the livery owners were noticing things and were concerned about her welfare but this pony is in a 10* home. Just for me my respect I wouldn&#8217;t intervene after 3hours. 

I did explain why I was upset face to face when they spoke to me.

Maybe it&#8217;s just me and my courtesy. Not to get involved with someone else&#8217;s pony.

Thank you anyway &#65533;&#65533; please don&#8217;t take this in anyway other than me just replying back to you &#65533;&#65533; and giving you explanations. I am a very polite and honest girl who hates confrontation and I don&#8217;t mean any harm with what I write or do in life.
		
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Sorry but it is a welfare issue to leave a animal without water.  Your first post says the yard owner was concerned that she had no hay or water.  I fear if I saw any animal with no water i would have done the same.
Your post is also a little difficult to understand.
I'm guessing that they thought you hadn't been up at all so that's why they intervened.


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## 9tails (7 February 2018)

How could a shetland pony have gotten through a full sized double netted haynet and a full water bucket in five hours?  I smell a rat and wonder if the owner's husband made such a mess to antagonise you and have an excuse to ask you to leave.  

In future, don't send texts.  If someone doesn't like you, whatever you write and no matter how many smileys you add they'll take offence.


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## WandaMare (7 February 2018)

conniegirl said:



			Sorry but If I were a YO, I'd be very miffed and likely to ask you to leave as you sound more trouble then you are worth.
		
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Having read your further replies on here OP, I'm afraid I would have to agree with this. Your reaction to the YM (whether they were right or wrong to give your pony hay or water) is quite hostile. I could have understood you being a bit miffed for someone putting in extra hay or slightly annoyed, but you say you were 'furious' which is pretty strong tbh. The trouble with DIY livery is that its just not worth enough financially to put up with this sort of aggravation. Its different if you're a manager at work and your paid to deal with 'people issues' but when its at your home, and someone is just paying a basic rate for facilities, it doesn't come anywhere near covering this sort of thing. I'm pretty sure this is why the yard owner has asked you to go somewhere else.


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## Theocat (7 February 2018)

I also think you overreacted, and you don't seem to think about things from the other point of view - it will help you in future if you do that.

Completely off the topic of how to communicate, but if you have a Shetland pony that needs to lose weight, I wouldn't personally be bringing it inside just because it's slightly cold and wet. If you'd ever been to Shetland in January you'd discover what they have evolved to cope with - It's no wonder they're so often too fat!!!


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## meleeka (7 February 2018)

I think If its true that they have fed hay without any cause to, Id be off anyway. Im afraid everyone is reading between the lines here and assuming that your pony didnt have food and water for a considerable time. Im amazed that going only on what has been stated, people wouldnt mind somebody just taking it upon themselves to throw some hay in. Id be cross if it were me and it was a DIY yard.  

It does sound like there are issues apart from the hay with you and the YO, so probably best to move on.


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## PapaverFollis (7 February 2018)

I think if my horse was dieting and I have genuinely left them with water and a suitable portion of hay and was coming back within an appropriate time frame I would be a bit annoyed at someone throwing hay in without specifically asking me first.... I would not however act on my annoyance by sending a ranting text (and it is ranting even with the smiley faces).  YO should have texted along the lines of "Fluffy is stood in without hay and water, going to top up water... when was she fed?  Does she need more hay? Is everything ok?"  ... "not seen you today" doesn't really cover it?  But then OP probably should have texted back and been clear that she had been up already and was coming back at X time.  YO may have assumed from OP's text that she hadn't been up at all yet and Fluffy hadn't had anything at all.

OP massively over-reacts to her horse getting hay (why bring whether other horses get hay given or not into it at all?).  I would just have had a easy word with YO when I next saw them "thanks for putting hay in for Fluffy, I understand why you did so and it is good that you care about and keep and eye out for the horses, but she had had her ration and I'd appreciate a text next time becuase I am trying to strictly control her diet - I'm so glad you were there to top up her water though - I'll definitely make sure I leave her with more next time!"

YO in turn over-reacts to the grumpy text by chucking OP off yard... but can see why, as some people have said, who wants the hassle in your own back yard for not much income?  But the chuck off yard reaction makes me wonder if OP has been a pain/rude/agressive before - and perhaps not even realised and YO has not "had a word" when she should have and is bubbling with frustration and has therefore over-reacted to this.

It really does all boil down to poor communication from everyone!

OP - if I were you I'd go start fresh at another yard, worry less about the Shetland being out in cold weather (she can cope and it'll get the weight off better than anything!) and work on keeping channels of communication open with your new YO (and working hard to always see things from their perspective too).  It may be that you find a yard where YO doesn't care about the horses at all and doesn't interfere at all - that brings it's own issues but may suit you.


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## JFTDWS (7 February 2018)

Since the OP's posts are so difficult to read and poorly expressed (evidenced, for example, by the confusion as to whether the pony had water or not), it's inevitable that the communication broke down here.  

Realistically, you need to get a grip on what's important.  If your pony is at a good weight currently, a brief exposure to some extra hay is unlikely to cause huge problems.  I would have more sympathy for your cause if the pony suffers from a condition which could be exacerbated by the hay (allergies / RAO / laminitic tendencies etc).  One instance of extra hay rations won't harm the vast majority of ponies - even if it isn't your hay, and is still in sections (shocking :rolleyes3: )

If the YO made such a mess it was immediately obvious what had happened, I'm unsure why you think that it may have happened in the past and you hadn't noticed.  Surely it would have been just as obvious?

I don't routinely tell my YO what I'm planning with my horses, unless it would affect them or the other livery - but it's usually obvious I've been there, the ponies always have forage or water, and if she gave them extra, I wouldn't be concerned (even if it were unnecessary).  And there aren't many out there who are more obsessive about their horses' weights than me.

Another livery interfering would be entirely different - I would find that very frustrating, as it's none of their business how I keep my horses (and my current fellow livery is in no position to judge my management).  However, a YO has a responsibility to ensure the welfare of any animals on their land - it is entirely their business how their liveries manage their horses.


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## Ambers Echo (7 February 2018)

Theocat said:



			I also think you overreacted, and you don't seem to think about things from the other point of view - it will help you in future if you do that.
		
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I agree with this.

If you feel that their interference put your pony at risk or made judgements about your care of the pony then I can understand that you felt furious and upset. But at the same time, your YO saw a pony stood in with no food and water, texted you about when you were coming up and was just told you were busy so would be up later. Given the information she had, it was reasonable for her to think your pony had been left in without hay and water so from her point of view giving him some was the right thing to do. Your pony was not harmed, no-one did anything wrong. There was no need for drama!

Years ago I had two shetlands who lived  out. I worked long hours so I was always up early and late and rarely saw anyone else. I'd fill  up buckets in the morning and by evening they would be nearly empty and I would fill up again. One day I arrived and the buckets were still full. That puzzled me because I wondered why they weren't drinking. Next morning some had gone but in the evening they were still full again. I checked for dehydration and asked the YO if she had been topping up but she hadn't. 

So I left a note saying 'Dear Water Bucket Fairy - please don't refill our buckets because our human who comes up quite late thinks we are not drinking anything and it is freaking her out! But thank-you for looking out for us!!"

They were never topped up again. I was not offended that someone obviously thought I was neglecting them - they weren't to know and they did what they thought was right.


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## alainax (7 February 2018)

Yes you over-reacted, its done now, learn a lesson and move on. 

The word "interfere" and this sentence was what got my back up 




			Could I ask is he does that with the other livery horses in the day to, when there left in? Just thought I&#8217;d ask, just in case I need to let The owner know.
		
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 I have no idea what you were trying to achieve or imply with this, but its maybe what done it. 

A simple " oh right, her rations seemed spot on this morning, I might need to look at trickle net! I'll catch up with you next time I see you" Then when you see them have a chat about diet etc.

You mention you re-wrote the text many times to make sure you didn't miss anything out and it sounded ok. My theory on these sorts of things is less is more. The less you write down, the less can be taken the wrong way or used against you. I get the not wanting confrontation part, but things are usually much easier just to discuss.


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## _GG_ (7 February 2018)

A livery yard owner or manager is responsible legally for the welfare of any horse on the property they manage/own. That means that they have a duty of care to all animals and if they see no water or hay, they are within their rights to supply it if they feel concerned for the animal. 

Yes, they could have checked, but you really should have informed then of the change in routine.

I understand your annoyance, but it's worth remembering that any attempt to care for the welfare of your horse is a good thing So if you don't want It, explain nicely why. Never be annoyed at anyone for giving a damn about your pony. 

I do find your attitude to be quite inflexible and overly reactive. Either say what you feel and stand by It, or change the way you communicate. Being so inflexible and rude/confrontational while saying you are polite and don't like confrontation doesn't work well. 

This is all being blown so far out of proportion. They didn't know if you'd been up as you didn't inform them of a change in routine. You have a right to keep your pony as you wish, but they were right to step in where they thought the pony needed food and water. All you had to do was say, "sorry, I should have let you know she'd be in all day and had her morning ration so you knew you didn't need to do anything but thank you for looking out for her".

Speak face to face or call in future. Maybe after you've calmed down and realised your own mistakes.


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## SEL (7 February 2018)

OP - I have one who is on a very, very strict low sugar diet. One day she accidentally got given her neighbours net of haylage instead of the pre soaked net I had left for her. By the time I got to the yard she had pretty much eaten all of it (in record time, but who can blame her?!).

To say I was upset was an understatement, especially because the lady who had fed it to her was one of the joint owners of the yard. BUT she mis-read my note and didn't really have the experience to understand the difference between haylage and soaked hay (no comment on that - I'm not on that yard any more). I took a deep breath and decided that I needed to leave even clearer notes in the future or ask one of the more experienced liveries to help out instead of the owner. No point in sounding off at people, when they didn't mean to make the mistake. I think if I'd sent your text I'd have been booted off the yard too.


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## Pearlsasinger (7 February 2018)

It all sounds like a lack of communication to me.  Every-one should have rung rather than texting.  The best hing OP can do now is find a new livery yard, make sure the livery is paid up to date and give YO a gift of a bottle of wine/lowers/chocs/something appropriate as pony goes to its new home, thanking them for all that they have done.
In your new yard OP don't communicate by text but do let YO know if there is to be a change in your routine.
As for the Shetland, I would leave it out if I were trying to manage its weight.


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## ester (7 February 2018)

SEL said:



			OP - I have one who is on a very, very strict low sugar diet. One day she accidentally got given her neighbours net of haylage instead of the pre soaked net I had left for her. By the time I got to the yard she had pretty much eaten all of it (in record time, but who can blame her?!).
		
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on more than one occasion a livery got the breakfasts confused (adjoining corner stables) and F got the feed intended for a fit, eventing poor doer TB. He thoroughly enjoyed that (it was pure feeds so at least lots of chaff!) and the TB would be weaving for the rest of his breakfast! I was cross and worried about colic etc but it happens. I'm sure it just taught F what he was missing out. 

JFTD I'm glad it wasn't just me confused about the issue of hay still in sections!


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## LaurenBay (7 February 2018)

I would say both sides have over reacted.

Getting some extra hay once in a blue moon will not harm the pony if it is already at a good weight. Plus the mess can be cleared away easily enough. I don't know why you text the YO asking about other liveries, that is really none of your concern. I can understand why you asked about your Pony, but I would have left the others out of it. Regarding water, again it isn't the end of the world if pony had some more water. However I understand your concern that you are watching ponies weight. I would have just thanked the YO for putting in the hay and water and said that you had changed your routine for that day so that is why pony was in, in future if you change the routine you will give them a heads up.

YO kicking you off for it is a bit of an over reaction too. It is a simple mis communication.


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## Sandie47 (7 February 2018)

it doesn&#8217;t matter what I say. Or word things or try and say she had hay and water I feel like it&#8217;s getting very personal and is all my fault. Wouldn&#8217;t of happened if I was just asked. Anyway I was going to reply to everyone but just can&#8217;t get my words out. However I did think it was wrong feeding horses without letting someone know wether it&#8217;s anybody. But please Thank you everybody so much for replying. Took everything in and cried lol. Anyway I do now think it was more to this than than meets the eye as I know for a fact she had to say something to &#8220;cover&#8221; why he had interfered. 
Again anyway thanks


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## Rowreach (7 February 2018)

Sandie47 said:



 it doesn&#8217;t matter what I say. Or word things or try and say she had hay and water I feel like it&#8217;s getting very personal and is all my fault. Wouldn&#8217;t of happened if I was just asked. Anyway I was going to reply to everyone but just can&#8217;t get my words out. However I did think it was wrong feeding horses without letting someone know wether it&#8217;s anybody. But please Thank you everybody so much for replying. Took everything in and cried lol. Anyway I do now think it was more to this than than meets the eye as I know for a fact she had to say something to &#8220;cover&#8221; why he had interfered. 
Again anyway thanks
		
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But you were asked, she texted you!

You asked us if you were overreacting and you got responses.

I now think you're overreacting to those.


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## GermanyJo (7 February 2018)

Cecile said:



			Text messages can cause so much trouble, always better to phone or speak to the person face to face

B


I'm convinced text messages or faceache will start WW3 at some point 

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&#128070;&#128070;&#128070;
Couldn't agree more


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## Sandie47 (7 February 2018)

Rowreach said:



			But you were asked, she texted you!

You asked us if you were overreacting and you got responses.

I now think you're overreacting to those.
		
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Ok thank you for your reply


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## Snowy Celandine (7 February 2018)

OP, I'm afraid you sound a little overwrought and this appears to be a regular state for you so I'm afraid that I wouldn't want you on my yard (if I had one) either. I think you need to learn to communicate, either face to face or over the telephone and also ask yourself if a Shetland really needs to be pampered quite so much i.e. bringing in if it rains and having its food pûréed or the equine equivalent!! They are a native breed and if it needs to lose weight as well it would be better staying outside.


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## DabDab (7 February 2018)

Hmm, I think I know the yard you're referring to. If I'm right then the owners are lovely and possibly two of the most laid back people I know


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## DabDab (7 February 2018)

DabDab said:



			Hmm, I think I know the yard you're referring to. If I'm right then the owners are lovely and possibly two of the most laid back people I know
		
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OK, so I am right. Op, I am not in any way impartial so you can of course ignore everything I'm about to say, but... You are a very novice, first time owner, so you are unlikely to appreciate just how rare it is to be able to have the freedom that they offer on a yard, plus access to year round 24/7 turnout in a variety of different types of paddocks, with amazing off road hacking on your doorstep. When I kept my horse at their home he would regularly tip his water over and I was very glad of them checking it every night before bed just in case. I can say hand on heart that these are genuinely good, uncomplicated people that would not wish your pony any harm at all.


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## tristar (7 February 2018)

you did the all the right things, you sound a lovely caring owner for your pony.

i hope you have your own place soon and some peace to enjoy it.

i  would be upset if people thought i had not fed my pony when i had, and was returning soon.

in a world where horses are frequently abused one way and another just be proud you are doing the best for your pony.


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## Darlabean (8 February 2018)

Whats done is done. Take it as a lesson. Calm your manner, dont stress as much over some hay, water and a messy stable in the future. Chill out, its meant to be enjoyable.  Put your Shetland out to help manage its weight in winter.  Youve cooked your chips at this place so need to look for another quickly. Move on, put it behind you, learn from it. We all make mistakes, its how we learn and grow and its normal .... you havent committed a crime or an atrocity, youve just been human.  We have all over reacted at one time or another, miscommunicated and then regretted it.  Sometimes a situation goes too far and all we can do is cut our losses and get the heck out of there as quickly as possible.  If you will have your own place soon, focus on that. I wouldnt bother giving YO a present on departure, theyve decided youre more stress than the income you give them is worth. They just want you to leave quietly without any grand finale, presents wont mean anything apart from a rather embarrassing display of remorse creating more nuisance for them   .... wait until you have your own place, believe me, its flipping brilliant and you do things your way with no interference from anyone. I could never go back to livery ....


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## tristar (8 February 2018)

op i can tell you i have met more than  a few yard owners who truly have not the patience to deal with their liveries.

and for what its worth i would have bought my pony in if it was raining, i don`t care what breed it is standing out in winter rain is  not good for any livestock, i believe under animal welfare legislation ALL  horses and ponies should have access to shelter from bad weather.


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## hopscotch bandit (8 February 2018)

I had a livery send me a nasty text saying "I wish people would leave my ******ing horse alone" after I had text her to say her horse had jumped out of the paddock was running around like a loon and I'd managed to catch him with a tub of nuts that I had shaken and I had put him back in his field unharmed and he had settled!! She then started bombarding me with unpleasant messages like "did you bother to check he wasn't injured?" and "why didn't you ring me and I would have sorted it?".  Glory be!  So I told her she was an ungrateful w**ch and I wouldn't bother in future left it at that.

Quite by coincidence some half an hour or so later  my partner and I had gone for a walk after I'd caught her horse.  The public footpath rose up a hill.We were stood at the top of the hill which looked down on our yard and paddocks and my partner spotted her in my horses paddock, unfortunately we could only see part of her paddock but he saw her stride towards my horse, she flew back out of view and then he saw her storm out.  We never knew what she had done to my horse but it was still very disconcerting and we couldn't work out why she would have been in her paddock. She'd had a few drinks I think as she was a bit of a wino and used to spend all her time at the pub.

So now I tend not to interfere in other liveries business unless its something like a horse stuck in a net or cast in a stable.

She did later apologise.


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## LaurenBay (8 February 2018)

hopscotch bandit said:



			I had a livery send me a nasty text saying "I wish people would leave my ******ing horse alone" after I had text her to say her horse had jumped out of the paddock was running around like a loon and I'd managed to catch him with a tub of nuts that I had shaken and I had put him back in his field unharmed and he had settled!! She then started bombarding me with unpleasant messages like "did you bother to check he wasn't injured?" and "why didn't you ring me and I would have sorted it?".  Glory be!  So I told her she was an ungrateful w**ch and I wouldn't bother in future left it at that.

Quite by coincidence some half an hour or so later  my partner and I had gone for a walk after I'd caught her horse.  The public footpath rose up a hill.We were stood at the top of the hill which looked down on our yard and paddocks and my partner spotted her in my horses paddock, unfortunately we could only see part of her paddock but he saw her stride towards my horse, she flew back out of view and then he saw her storm out.  We never knew what she had done to my horse but it was still very disconcerting and we couldn't work out why she would have been in her paddock. She'd had a few drinks I think as she was a bit of a wino and used to spend all her time at the pub.

So now I tend not to interfere in other liveries business unless its something like a horse stuck in a net or cast in a stable.

She did later apologise.
		
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See this person I would have given notice to in a heartbeat!!


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## hopscotch bandit (8 February 2018)

LaurenBay said:



			See this person I would have given notice to in a heartbeat!!
		
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Yes me too!  Would love to know what she did to my horse.


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## sunshine100* (10 February 2018)

When you get your own land put the buckets in tyres or something secure or buy a water trough so it does not fall over-also a shelter is a must-and ask your local neighbours to keep an eye out when you are not there-you will be grateful if anything happens.


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## Chianti (11 February 2018)

I would have been cross as well. I had the opposite situation once when I was on part livery and if I put hay in the stable during the day when she was in the owner used to take it out- she wasn't a fatty! I'm sure you'll be happier on a new yard. Once you've had a situation like this it's better to move on as you can never really trust the yard owner/manager again.


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## honetpot (11 February 2018)

tristar said:



			op i can tell you i have met more than  a few yard owners who truly have not the patience to deal with their liveries.

and for what its worth i would have bought my pony in if it was raining, i don`t care what breed it is standing out in winter rain is  not good for any livestock, i believe under animal welfare legislation ALL  horses and ponies should have access to shelter from bad weather.
		
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 Our native ponies are adapted to be out in bad weather. Their coats are especially adapted so they have an undercoat and a top coat of guard hairs that deflect the water away from the skin. In the Fell, Highland and Shetlands, their manes and tails are adapted to divert water away from the skin.
  There are far more welfare issues with animals being kept over rugged, and in boxes with little ventilation, which cause breathing problems and stereotypical behaviours. A stable can be actually colder than being outside if it is drafty and the animal has no ability to move to keep warm, or eat a constant supply of roughage to supply heating by its digestion/fermentation in the gut.
https://www.bluecross.org.uk/fat-horse-slim
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dsH3OKPRgvg   I think a rainy windy day on the mainland  would be a breeze to these ponies.


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## tristar (11 February 2018)

i am fully aware of native hardiness thank you, nowhere have i said the pony could not live outside.

i have owned any trained almost every native british breed and some foreign breeds and never had them suffer from being in a stable for a few hours.

i would still offer any animal shelter in winter rain.

op opted to bring in pony, it is her pony, her stable. 

i have  many  times seen horses out in winter rain, soaked to the bone, and shaking like a leaf, perhaps there is research into the benefits of that.


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