# Saddle for a large shouldered horse?



## Javabb94 (19 February 2011)

Sort of to do with my other thread, but any ideas for a Saddle for large shoulders?

He isnt a cob he is tb x appaloosa although has low withers but a narrow back


Musnt be a VSD or straight cut as I mainly jump and im 5ft 10" and dont fit on VSD's or straight cut saddles

He has large shoulders and I think thats why my Pessoa is causing him problems, as the tree goes onto his shoulders as its so forward cut,

I noticed John Whitaker ones have a cut back tree to overcome this problem but I wont be able to get enough  money back from the Pessoa to get one

Im currently looking at Jeffries saddles if that helps


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## GreyConnemara (19 February 2011)

Kirsty+Java said:



			Sort of to do with my other thread, but any ideas for a Saddle for large shoulders?

Musnt be a VSD or straight cut as I mainly jump and im 5ft 10" and dont fit on VSD's or straight cut saddles
		
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Hi

Unfortunately you may not have a choice on the cut, as the solution to the big shoulders problem is to go for something straighter cut, as this allows room for the shoulders instead of sitting on top of them.

A jumping saddle on a big-shouldered horse is like someone standing behind you and pinching your shoulder blades inwards, restricting movement.

I had this problem with my Connie, I am about 5ft 7" and very leggy - wanted a jumping saddle but simply couldn't because of his massive shoulders. Even certain GP's were too forward cut for him.

I ended up getting two saddles, a working hunter saddle which is very straight cut, to use for hacking and general riding, and also a Kent and Masters Cob GP. The K&M is quite straight cut for a GP, but has a lovely knee roll, square cantle and open seat, so I find it rides very similarly to a jumping saddle, and that is now, in effect, what it is. These features also help accomodate my long legs!! 

He moves so much more freely since changing to these saddles, and I can actually see his whole shoulder when I am sitting on him, whereas previously I was practically sitting on his shoulder.

IME you should look for a straighter cut GP with a square cantle and decent knee roll and you will be amazed how similar it feels to a jumping saddle, whilst still allowing your horse room for his shoulders.


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## Javabb94 (19 February 2011)

thanks for the info,

Im 5ft 10" and have very long thighs and even on my current saddle i just fit!!

I have lessons at a riding school too as well as lessons on Java at home (mum doesnt like loading him in the dark to take haha) and all the horses there are in Jeffries and I fit on those fine and so im thinking a Jeffries.

I used to have a GFS Pro VSD and my knees stuck 3" off the end and there was just no way of that saddle being ok for me lol 

so got the pessoa fitted but it obviously doesnt fit right!!! 

Getting a Jeffries fitter to come out so hopefully will be one that fits! I prefer flats seats with square cantle also


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## OneInAMillion (19 February 2011)

GreyConnemara said:



			Hi

Unfortunately you may not have a choice on the cut, as the solution to the big shoulders problem is to go for something straighter cut, as this allows room for the shoulders instead of sitting on top of them.

A jumping saddle on a big-shouldered horse is like someone standing behind you and pinching your shoulder blades inwards, restricting movement.

I had this problem with my Connie, I am about 5ft 7" and very leggy - wanted a jumping saddle but simply couldn't because of his massive shoulders. Even certain GP's were too forward cut for him.

I ended up getting two saddles, a working hunter saddle which is very straight cut, to use for hacking and general riding, and also a Kent and Masters Cob GP. The K&M is quite straight cut for a GP, but has a lovely knee roll, square cantle and open seat, so I find it rides very similarly to a jumping saddle, and that is now, in effect, what it is. These features also help accomodate my long legs!! 

He moves so much more freely since changing to these saddles, and I can actually see his whole shoulder when I am sitting on him, whereas previously I was practically sitting on his shoulder.

IME you should look for a straighter cut GP with a square cantle and decent knee roll and you will be amazed how similar it feels to a jumping saddle, whilst still allowing your horse room for his shoulders.
		
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I have a connie too and had the exact problem, wanted a jumping saddle but everything sits on his shoulders, all straight cut saddles fit him but only slightly forward GPs are what we can use on him


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## Javabb94 (19 February 2011)

im really stuck now,


when my legs are off the knee roll it affects my whole riding position,

i dont feel secure as I have nothing to grip my knees to, i tilt forward and my riding is awful,

if only other makes had John Whitaker's idea - - 

a forward cut saddle with a cut back tree to free the shoulders!!!!!!!!!!!


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## GreyConnemara (19 February 2011)

Kirsty+Java said:



			im really stuck now,


when my legs are off the knee roll it affects my whole riding position,

i dont feel secure as I have nothing to grip my knees to, i tilt forward and my riding is awful,

if only other makes had John Whitaker's idea - - 

a forward cut saddle with a cut back tree to free the shoulders!!!!!!!!!!!
		
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IMO a cut back head alone will not be sufficient to free up a horse's shoulders, as the forward cut flap will still be restrictive.

Moreover, your horse may not suit a cut back head, as if i recall correctly you said he does not have much wither - so to be honest it probably wouldn't make any difference.

If you could possibly get a slightly longer seat (consult a master saddler as to whether it is possible) this may give you more room.

Otherwise you may just have to learn to ride with slightly longer stirrups, and thigh blocks on the saddle may help you stop tipping forwards as they will help keep your lower leg stable (I'm sure your instructor could help with this too).


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## Javabb94 (19 February 2011)

thing is i need slightly shorter stirrups as Java moves forward best when i have my legs slightly higher on his sides, plus he is 15.2hh im 5ft 10 im already on his limits!!


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## spotty_pony (19 February 2011)

I am a similar height to you (I'm 5ft9) and my boy has very wide shoulders. He has a Falcon Hawk Event Saddle and although it is straight cut, it fits me really well - and I do have very long legs! I ride him in it for everything, even hunting. It is a made to measure saddle though and my saddler put the knee rolls slightly more forward to support my legs. I would highly recommend this saddle - it is very smart and very comfortable! 

Here it is: 
http://www.longmelfordsaddlery.co.uk/shop/images/uploads/Jeffries Falcon Hawk Event 1.jpg


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## Javabb94 (20 February 2011)

Thanks 

Saddler coming only does Jeffries so will ask him if a falcon hawk event would fit and we could try one I have heard good things about them


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## Natalie_H (20 February 2011)

Mum's TB is the same. All saddles seemed to interfere with his shoulder, but Mum wanted a GP as she needs a decent knee roll. Saddler tried loads on him, and the first one that actually gave him clearance was the Albion. The GFS wasn't bad either, but she found the Albion more comfortable.


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## Boysy (20 February 2011)

You could try and get hold of a Martin Wilkinson jump/gp saddle, they are based on the Ideal trees, i have one and the panels are memory foam and mega soft so although they do appear to go over my mares shoulders, when she actually moves the panels move with her and fold back behind her shoulders so to speak. It is forward cut jumping stylee and doesn't hinder her at all as it is so soft.


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## ISHmad (20 February 2011)

Humphries & Swain saddles are excellent for horses with large shoulders.  The other thing you could try is one of the Heather Moffett Fhoenix or Vogue saddles, they seem to work as well.


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## Javabb94 (20 February 2011)

Thanks for all the suggestions will look into them
And hopefully find something that fits both me and java


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## millitiger (20 February 2011)

I'm not sure the big shoulders is the reason your pessoa isn't fitting.

Pilfer has huge shoulders and a very short back and his jumping saddle is a Pessoa 

And it is not true that you have to have a straight cut saddle to make a big shouldered horse comfortable- what saddles do you think top eventers and sjers wear if they have big shoulders? they are still in very forward cut jumping saddles.

you may need to look at the length of the saddle and where you place it on his back to stop it hampering his shoulder. 
Pilfer always had his saddle a little further back than you'd think so his shoulder was free.

Here is a pic so you can see how big his shoulders are






And here is a pic to show that his Pessoa saddle doesn't hinder him in the slightest!






And to make things even more interesting, Pilfer is 15.3hh on tiptoes and I am 5'10 with very long legs so I am sure you will find a jumping saddle to suit.


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## painted ponies (20 February 2011)

Sorry to say but the Jeffries guy you have coming out is proably going to sell you a Jeffries saddle!  Get a different saddler out that carries a range of different saddles who then isnt loyal to a particular brand.  Would you call Baileys horse feeds to ask about spillers products? Probably not, Baileys are going to sell you one of their products!

Is this guy a Master saddler???


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## Javabb94 (20 February 2011)

No the saddler is someone we know and is just checking the fit of the Pessoa we explained the problem and he is going tj check it


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## Naggy (20 February 2011)

I would personally opt for a HM Vogue GPT as above - http://www.enlightenedequitation.com/saddles_intro.htm. They really are good for allowing shoulder movement and would be forward cut enough to accommodate your legs! I am the same - have a 15.2 Sect D/TB with big shoulders and I am 5ft9 with long legs, so I understand your predicament!


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## Javabb94 (20 February 2011)

Thanks for the suggestions although i need a traditional saddle ie not treeless, i will put a pic of his shoulders on as im not sure whether they are just big or huge!


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## Holly Hocks (20 February 2011)

Hi Kirsty

Have you thought about a made to measure saddle?  I have had two done - wasn't as expensive as some of the new ones off the rack and they both fitted my horses perfectly.  Both mine have huge shoulders, so I have dressage saddles, however when I asked about a possible jumping/GP one he said that they are now able to do them for big shouldered horses and it isn't a problem.  If you're interested, I'll pass you the details of the person I used.


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## alesea (20 February 2011)

I'm a real broken record about this company, but they're always worth chatting to:

http://www.balanceinternational.com/saddles.html

They also fit their saddles marginally further back than most people, so they don't tend to interfere with the shoulders.

New ones are expensive, but there are always second hand ones advertised on the site and on eBay etc.


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## Skippys Mum (20 February 2011)

I was in the same boat as you - 5'10" and long in the thigh (unfortunately compounded by being large in the arse).  Horse has no withers and the biggest shoulders 3 seperate saddlers have ever seen - so much so he ended up having to go treeless for a couple of years till he stopped changing shape as we just couldnt get a saddle to fit him.  I ended up with an Ideal Highland and Cob saddle which is VSD cut and I was convinced wouldnt work for us - but it does.  I can shorten my stirrups no bother without going over the front.

If possible, try something with a square cantle as it gives you more room to manoever in the saddle but you wouldl be surprised at just how much room the Ideal H&C actually has


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## Javabb94 (20 February 2011)

ok thanks will take a look !


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## only_me (20 February 2011)

Pft, sorry was reading the comment about Big shoulder horses needing straight saddles and was thinking utter rubbish!

A big shoulder horse just needs a well fitting saddle, perhaps a breastplate as well to make sure saddle is totally secure.
My BIG shoulder horse is happy in a collegiate jumping saddle, which is a cheap copy of some big brand! I LOVE my saddle, fits quite a lot of horse's too! I always get lots of comments from people asking what type as it looks nice. 
I use a breastplate when jumping as because of huge shoulder plus a short back & powerful back end and the saddle needs to stay put!
http://www.adamshorsesupply.com/browse.cfm/4,6598.html - this is mine.

Its the one in my sig (which is now got a prolite under it, due to horse growing)


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## ladyt25 (20 February 2011)

i think it's a case of trying various saddles. I got a kent & masters GP saddle with square cantle for my horse, he seems to move better in it than his previous saddle which i felt was restricting him in front and also pressing down too much behind (it was quite old).

It's isn't brilliantly cut for jumping although you can move the knee blocks whihc helps.

I would suggest looking at these and also Albions - if you can find a 2nd hand one (they are like gold dust mind). They seems to fit very very well so I would certainly try one. Either those or try Bates of Balance saddles


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## Lynz25 (20 February 2011)

I've had the same issue with my TB with large shoulders and I have very long thighs so getting a saddle I find comfy is normally difficult.  We got a saddler out who carried a variey of different manufacturers makes, models and sizes.  After varies ones were tried we have got yet another Balance saddle - the felix.  The horses I've had always end up moving better with Balance saddles although we have always tried a variety of ones on them.  They are expensive new but they hold their price well and you can get them off ebay cheaper.


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## Javabb94 (20 February 2011)

thanks for the suggestions!

only_me - thats a great suggestion about the breastplate, would you say a normal elastic one with martingale or a 5 point? i wouldnt mind which haha would love to "need" a lovely jeffries 5 point !!


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## Javabb94 (20 February 2011)

ladyt25 said:



			i think it's a case of trying various saddles. I got a kent & masters GP saddle with square cantle for my horse, he seems to move better in it than his previous saddle which i felt was restricting him in front and also pressing down too much behind (it was quite old).

It's isn't brilliantly cut for jumping although you can move the knee blocks whihc helps.

I would suggest looking at these and also Albions - if you can find a 2nd hand one (they are like gold dust mind). They seems to fit very very well so I would certainly try one. Either those or try Bates of Balance saddles
		
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saddler gave me an albion k2 jump and a pessoa legacy xp3 to try and i rode in both and the pessoa was just so much comfier than the albion and had a flatter seat which my instructor said would be better for me, but I kind have now wished i had gone with the albion  although i trusted my saddle fitter to fit the saddle properly so it never crossed my mind that one wouldnt fit etc


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## Luci07 (20 February 2011)

oh interesting - I was going to say try at K2 Jump - which is what I ended up with for my boy. He has very big shoulders and we struggled to find a good jump saddle that didn't impede him. We ended up with the K2 and it completely frees him up.  For my personal preference I wanted something that was more of a close contact saddle but this is what fitted mine the best. He is a ISH btw! Oddly enough, on him this saddle looks like a GP but on a "normal" horse looks very forward cut!


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## Javabb94 (20 February 2011)

Luci07 said:



			oh interesting - I was going to say try at K2 Jump - which is what I ended up with for my boy. He has very big shoulders and we struggled to find a good jump saddle that didn't impede him. We ended up with the K2 and it completely frees him up.  For my personal preference I wanted something that was more of a close contact saddle but this is what fitted mine the best. He is a ISH btw! Oddly enough, on him this saddle looks like a GP but on a "normal" horse looks very forward cut!
		
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arghhhhhhhh i was given a k2 jump aswell and chose the pessoa!!!!!!!!!

i might see if the saddler will swap back to the k2


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