# Barefoot transition thread/journal



## Mule (17 November 2019)

I have decided to set up this thread as a way to measure the progress of my horse's transition to barefoot. So for anyone who's interested in this stuff, I will be adding to it regularly.


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## Mule (18 November 2019)

https://forums.horseandhound.co.uk/threads/trouble-with-finding-hoof-boots.782447/

Ok, for the first set of photos, see the link above. I tried to upload them to this thread but couldn't do it. Posts 7,8 and 12 are all photos of his hooves. 

Post 7

photo 1 is his front left hoof.
photo 2 is both left and right hinds
photo 3 is his right front
photos 5 and 6 are hoof shots at different angles.
Post 8

photo 1 is left front
photo 2 is left hind
photo 3 is right hind
photo 4 is right front
Post 12 are x-rays of his fore hooves

First x-ray is of his shod hoof. It has a thin sole
Second x-ray is his unshod sole, which is extremely thin.


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## Mule (18 November 2019)

Right so, its about 3 and a half weeks since his front hoof with the very thin sole had its shoe removed.
It's about 2 and a half weeks since his other front shoe was removed and it's a week and a half since his hind shoes were removed. It was a strange way to take them off but the first front shoe was removed off for the hoof x-ray and the other front shoe became loose so I removed it. The farrier was out of the country so he wasn't able to remove the hinds until later. 

I looked in to getting hoof boots. I got advice on here to contact Urban hoof and The hoof boutique. That's why I initially took the photos. They were both really helpful, but due to the difference in the sizes of his hooves and especially his uneven hoof bulbs, finding a boot that would stay on was very unlikely. I decided to give him a few months off to give his hooves a chance to improve. According to the research I've done, his uneven heels should correct themselves over time once shoes are removed. After a few months I'm going to re-measure his hooves to see if I can find a boot that will work. 

He had been quite uncomfortable walking on concrete since the 4 shoes came off. I noticed that he was walking comfortably a few days ago, so that was very encouraging. He also tried to canter after his friends in the field but soon thought better of it 
I'm fortunate in the surfaces I have, as he walks between his field, a sand and a concrete surface a few times each day. I started putting keratex hoof hardener on him on Saturday. The instructions say to put it on the sole and the hoof wall daily for a week then twice weekly.


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## Mule (18 November 2019)

This is another post just to give anyone who's thinking of trying barefoot a few hints. I didn't do any research beforehand as taking off his shoes happened quite suddenly. The farrier and I had been talking about it for a while and I was going to take the plunge in January because removing his shoes was definitely necessary for his long term soundness. At any rate the timescale was moved forward.

I thought barefoot was just taking off the shoes and the horse would be a bit sensitive so I'd get him hoof boots and that would be it. I had always removed his shoes for about 6 weeks over the winter to try to improve his hooves so I knew what to expect at the start.
This time, when I removed them I asked for some advice on HHO. I learned that nutrition was also very important. His diet consisted of hay/ grass, salt and a token feed of beetpulp. I added some micronised linseed and a forage balancer called PRO BALANCE from Progressive Earth. I also read Nic Barker's book (owner of Rockley) and it was very interesting so I'm looking at him going barefoot as a project (I like projects)

Knowing what I do now, if I were to do it again, I would put him on the supplements a couple of months before taking the shoes off. I would have left him go a month or so unshod before trimming his hooves. I would also have started putting on Keratex or similar in advance of removing his shoes. I do think it's helpful that I don't plan to ride him for a while so I'm not fussing about when he is going to improve. Because I don't have a timescale I'm more relaxed about it.

I can't see any difference in his hooves yet but it hasn't been long so I'm not expecting it. The nail holes on his front hooves have grown out and they are nearly grown out in his hinds. I'm going to take monthly photos as there should be a noticeable difference from month to month. even if I can't see it. I will update everyone with posts on this thread more often that that because judging by the improvement in his walk his hooves are improving all the time. As well as being comfortable walking on sand and concrete he was marching in the field today

Another positive about removing his shoes and uploading his hoof pictures to HHO was that Ester noticed that he was wearing the sides of his right hooves unevenly. I think this may explain his asymmetry when riding and his stiffness when bending to his left while doing carrot stretches. So onwards and upwards


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## Wheels (18 November 2019)

I am going through a similar journey!

I will look forward to reading about your progress


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## Sasanaskyex (18 November 2019)

Watching this thread with interest I took shoes off my ISH 4 months ago so going through it all too. We're currently not using boots, I bought some Cavallo Treks but had to send them back, my friend bought a scoot boot sizing kit and let us borrow it but none of them were right. She's okay on hard smooth surfaces but shortens her stride on stones. She wears one of her feet unevenly too where she's slightly pigeon toed on her left - which I think (saddler thinks) is related to asymmetric shoulders but her feet are growing through a completely different shape so we will see what they are like when a full hoof grows through.


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## Mule (18 November 2019)

I'm looking forward to hear about yours 


Wheels said:



			I am going through a similar journey!

I will look forward to reading about your progress
		
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## Mule (20 November 2019)

So, the beast's hooves look slightly different. There are 3 long but cosmetic grass cracks in the left forefoot (he never gets cracked hooves) See photo at bottom of post.
His hoof walls have also grown quite a bit. Weirdly enough, they didn't look longer two days ago but they do nowðŸ¤·â€â™€ï¸ I don't have photos because I was lacking a hoof holding person. I will be more prepared in future.

When I went to see him today he was chilling out, standing on a patch of gravel. Apparently that's a good surface for hooves. He must be onboard with the barefoot thing

I've been using keratex in order to strengthen his soles. As I was putting it on tonight, I spilt a bit, then felt a burning sensation. I looked down and remembered I had stuck my finger with a needle earlier
Formaldehyde does not belong in the body prior to death. . .
(I just found out there's formaldehyde in keratex).

Anyway I am going to order a magnesium supplement for the beast. He is getting 6g of magnesium oxide in his balancer but I'm going to increase it, specifically for his hooves.
Hoof crack photos below. I've added a close up because they looked more dramatic in person.


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## Red-1 (20 November 2019)

I would be very careful of too much Keratex. I have used it where a hoof is obviously soft, for example the sole easily deforms when you press with a thumb, but don't use it if the hoof is normal.

I found that if you overdo the Keratex it seems to get better, but then splits and cracks. 

When I have not used Keratex and the hooves have simply grown the nail holes out, no splits etc. I do pre prepare with correct diet and a barefoot supplement, and salt, and smooth the edges every time a nail hole reaches the floor, also keeping it quite compact. But, they were also good feet to start with.


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## Mule (20 November 2019)

Red-1 said:



			I would be very careful of too much Keratex. I have used it where a hoof is obviously soft, for example the sole easily deforms when you press with a thumb, but don't use it if the hoof is normal.

I found that if you overdo the Keratex it seems to get better, but then splits and cracks.

When I have not used Keratex and the hooves have simply grown the nail holes out, no splits etc. I do pre prepare with correct diet and a barefoot supplement, and salt, and smooth the edges every time a nail hole reaches the floor, also keeping it quite compact. But, they were also good feet to start with.
		
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Interesting, perhaps we now know where those hoof cracks came from ðŸ¤”
What do you think of just using it on the soles?


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## Red-1 (20 November 2019)

I find that it seeps! So even if just put on the soles it ends up on the walls.


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## Mule (20 November 2019)

I'll lay off it so, thanks for the tip 


Red-1 said:



			I find that it seeps! So even if just put on the soles it ends up on the walls.
		
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## Red-1 (20 November 2019)

It is very drying, which is how it hardens soft feet. Sadly, feet need to be flexible. 

I don't mind it as an emergency measure for a very soft sole. But only use enough to firm it up.


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## Mule (2 December 2019)

It was -2 this morning and the ground was frozen for the first time this winter. The horses were in when I went to give them their breakfast. As I was leaving to go to work I'd noticed the other horses were gone back out to the field but the beast was still in. He was looking after them and neighing pathetically but they paid no attention to him (poor mule).
I realised that because their field had become a bit churned up in the rain it would be now be rock hard, pointy, frozen mud. Obviously not comfortable for a thin soled mule.
Another horse would have left his friends go out and stayed in to rest his hooves but the beast is herdbound...
I later found out that he braved the ground conditions and followed his friends. He got a kiss and a carrot when I came home 😊

On December 5th it will be 4 weeks since his shoes came off. I will upload pictures to see if anyone can spot a difference.


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## splashgirl45 (2 December 2019)

i used keratex on my loan horse but my farrier told me to only put on the soles and not to do it every day.  i cant quite remember but i think it was every other day for the first week and then less and less gradually and only do it for 3 weeks.....then once a week if needed.  hope this helps


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## Mule (2 December 2019)

splashgirl45 said:



			i used keratex on my loan horse but my farrier told me to only put on the soles and not to do it every day.  i cant quite remember but i think it was every other day for the first week and then less and less gradually and only do it for 3 weeks.....then once a week if needed.  hope this helps
		
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I'm going to have a good look at his hooves tomorrow. It was too dark for me to have a decent look at them by the time I got back from work today. I also need an assistant to take photos of his hooves while I hold them up. I'll see how his soles feel tomorrow. It hasn't rained for about a week now, which I'm sure is much better for them than the constant wet.


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## Pinkvboots (2 December 2019)

It's been so wet here one of mine has very soft heels and he was a bit sore so they have been in at night so they dry out a bit.


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## Mule (2 December 2019)

Pinkvboots said:



			It's been so wet here one of mine has very soft heels and he was a bit sore so they have been in at night so they dry out a bit.
		
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Good idea


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## gunnergundog (2 December 2019)

Maybe try Hoof Armor??  I've only just started using it; I did three applications over ten days and have noticed a difference.  Not sure how long it will last though.


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## Mule (2 December 2019)

gunnergundog said:



			Maybe try Hoof Armor??  I've only just started using it; I did three applications over ten days and have noticed a difference.  Not sure how long it will last though.
		
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I think that's a good idea. I'll definitely do it when I bring him back in to work.


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## gunnergundog (2 December 2019)

Maybe consider it now?  It would help him with the frozen ground and prevent any soreness/bruising which may delay his return to work.


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## paddy555 (2 December 2019)

Mule, if your ground is similar to ours this morning don't forget this is the worst thing possible for newly de shod horses. ie frozen rutted ground. It is due to continue with us for the rest of the week, not sure about the rest of the country but 3 or 4 days on that sort of ground can cause problems.


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## Mule (2 December 2019)

paddy555 said:



			Mule, if your ground is similar to ours this morning don't forget this is the worst thing possible for newly de shod horses. ie frozen rutted ground. It is due to continue with us for the rest of the week, not sure about the rest of the country but 3 or 4 days on that sort of ground can cause problems.
		
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Good to know. Perhaps I should keep him on soft ground? He can stay in a sandy area and go in and out of a stable as well. I have bedding in the stable and he likes to spend some time there.


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## Mule (2 December 2019)

gunnergundog said:



			Maybe consider it now?  It would help him with the frozen ground and prevent any soreness/bruising which may delay his return to work.
		
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 From the sounds of it I think I'll keep him off the frozen ground while it lasts.


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## paddy555 (2 December 2019)

A mule in a manger said:



			Good to know. Perhaps I should keep him on soft ground? He can stay in a sandy area and go in and out of a stable as well. I have bedding in the stable and he likes to spend some time there.
		
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if your ground is rutted or likely to be keep him off it whatever it takes. It hopefully won't be for long. A few days being shut off the field or even stabled will be a lot less painful than a bruised foot. I have seen a  lot of people get into trouble with this over the years. It really sets their BF progress back.


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## Mule (2 December 2019)

paddy555 said:



			if your ground is rutted or likely to be keep him off it whatever it takes. It hopefully won't be for long. A few days being shut off the field or even stabled will be a lot less painful than a bruised foot. I have seen a  lot of people get into trouble with this over the years. It really sets their BF progress back.
		
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It's lucky I posted about it so. Christ, the last thing I need is for him to go backwards! Thanks for letting me know


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## Mule (2 December 2019)

He's now ensconced in his stable with lots of hay and extra bedding. I went out to see if they were around and luckily there were in the yard. The gate to the field is closed and they are all staying in until the weather improves.


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## Red-1 (3 December 2019)

A mule in a manger said:



			Good to know. Perhaps I should keep him on soft ground? He can stay in a sandy area and go in and out of a stable as well. I have bedding in the stable and he likes to spend some time there.
		
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That is what mine is doing. In on a thick bed at night and on the arena all day. No rutted ground at all. She is walking out in hand for 40 minutes 3 times a week and doing some lungeing 2 or 3 times a week too. To get to the turnout we have an area of pea gravel. 

Last year, when mum had her fall and was ill, she was turned away and shoes pulled so I could deal with what needed dealing with. She came back into work at Xmas and remained without shoes until March time. With increased hacking and doing BS she was OK, but was feeling the area between the collecting ring and competition ring, so had fronts only. Then I wanted to go XC, so had backs too.

This year, mum is again unwell so yet again the shoes have come off and I am taking pressure off myself to sort out life. This time, with only a few months shod over the summer, her feet have been so much better. Better shape, better strength, no softness, so far no soreness (shoes off end September). Last year her frogs were over growing, this year they are perfect. 

I am starting riding again over the Xmas holidays, if life has eased off, and hopefully she will be seamless back to proper work. 

What I am trying to say is, that if you need to re-shoe over summer, it is still worth trying again once the ground softens next year for winter and you will be riding less. 2nd time round you would be in a much better position to start with, with stronger feet that are already better formed.


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## Floofball (3 December 2019)

Jumping on this thread as had my lads fronts removed yesterday (backs removed 5 weeks ago) Have always wanted to try him BF as he’s never been footy if he loses one and he’s never had a shoeing break. I generally don’t end up doing much with them Dec/Jan anyway so fingers crossed 🤞🏻 
3rd hack after having backs off he felt a little sticky (having felt amazing on the first 2!) so have scaled down the hacks - will buy boots if needed but his feet are changing shape so much I want to wait a bit first. I have boots and pads that will do for his fronts if he needs some help in the short term but again will wait for a while before I measure to buy new ones.
He’s on a barefoot friendly diet already as managed as metabolic (EMS) and grows hoof very quickly. I’m really hoping to prove my sceptical farrier wrong and do this 😃


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## Sasanaskyex (3 December 2019)

Whitehorseslave said:



			I’m really hoping to prove my sceptical farrier wrong and do this 😃
		
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Funny you say this, you hear a lot of stories about farriers who have told their clients that their horse would "never go/cope barefoot".

I mentioned barefoot to my farrier and said I was thinking about it, his response was something along the lines of "Yes do it! I've been wanting to say this for a while." He's been super supportive and even helped me measure for hoof boots.

My vet on the other hand..."oooooh hmmmm well that's not a good idea..."


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## Mule (4 December 2019)

Red-Nose said:



			That is what mine is doing. In on a thick bed at night and on the arena all day. No rutted ground at all. She is walking out in hand for 40 minutes 3 times a week and doing some lungeing 2 or 3 times a week too. To get to the turnout we have an area of pea gravel.

Last year, when mum had her fall and was ill, she was turned away and shoes pulled so I could deal with what needed dealing with. She came back into work at Xmas and remained without shoes until March time. With increased hacking and doing BS she was OK, but was feeling the area between the collecting ring and competition ring, so had fronts only. Then I wanted to go XC, so had backs too.

This year, mum is again unwell so yet again the shoes have come off and I am taking pressure off myself to sort out life. This time, with only a few months shod over the summer, her feet have been so much better. Better shape, better strength, no softness, so far no soreness (shoes off end September). Last year her frogs were over growing, this year they are perfect.

I am starting riding again over the Xmas holidays, if life has eased off, and hopefully she will be seamless back to proper work.

What I am trying to say is, that if you need to re-shoe over summer, it is still worth trying again once the ground softens next year for winter and you will be riding less. 2nd time round you would be in a much better position to start with, with stronger feet that are already better formed.
		
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I'm sorry about your mum. It's encouraging to hear that you can shoe for a period of time without undoing the progress the hooves have made. Thanks for the tip.


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## Mule (4 December 2019)

Sasanaskyex said:



			Funny you say this, you hear a lot of stories about farriers who have told their clients that their horse would "never go/cope barefoot".

I mentioned barefoot to my farrier and said I was thinking about it, his response was something along the lines of "Yes do it! I've been wanting to say this for a while." He's been super supportive and even helped me measure for hoof boots.

My vet on the other hand..."oooooh hmmmm well that's not a good idea..." 

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I find vets tend to be very out of date about hooves. I've had vets suggest certain types of shoes and pads that had my farrier looking very uneasy.


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## Mule (7 December 2019)

I took new pictures today. I walked him over cavaletti and brought him for a stroll on a hard and slightly uneven surface. It's similar to the tyoe if surface where we often hack (albeit, less rutted)

I also did carrot stretches. I hadn't done them in ages and was expecting him to be very stiff. He was unusually flexible Whether that's related to him having his shoes off or not, I don't know. I think the hoof walls have worn a lot more evenly than in the previous photos. They looked very uneven from left to right on each individual hoof. They no longer do I will be sure to do the stretches after his next trim in order to see if there is a change.

The original photos that I took a month ago, just after he came out of shoes are at this link; https://forums.horseandhound.co.uk/threads/trouble-with-finding-hoof-boots.782447/

Anyway, his hooves definitely look different to me. His frogs are shedding. The frogs look a bit plumper too. As expected, his hoof walls are longer. I thought the nail holes were gone but they are still growing out. I think his collateral grooves look deeper but that couldn't have happened in such a short space of time so I'm not sure what I'm seeing there.

He is perfect walking around now. His trot is a bit flat but I'm not surprised by that. I'm happy with how he was walking on the hard, uneven surface where we went for a walk.

The most interesting thing for me is definitely the even wear of the hoof wall. Judging by his increased suppleness when doing carrot stretches, it's quite possible this would transfer to ridden work, which potentially could mean the end of his one- sidedness. What does everyone else think of the photos?

Left fore





I don't have a side view of his left fore.

Right fore







Right hind


*See the apex of the frog is gone.


I have a side view of both hinds but I managed to delete the photo of the underneath of his left hind.


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## Mule (7 December 2019)

These photos show the difference in the wear of the hoof walls. Here's a picture of his right fore today:




His right fore a month ago


His left fore today:


His left fore a month ago:


His right hind today:


His right hind a month ago:


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## Mule (8 December 2019)

Did more carrot stretches today. He's suddenly turned in to a contortionist! It must be the removal of the shoes and the resulting even hoof wear as nothing else has changed. Also walked him in hand on the uneven surface and over cavaletti. He's walking happily.


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## Mule (23 December 2019)

The beast has been barefoot for 6.5 weeks now. Over the last week or so he  is a bit more sensitive than he had been. I'm no longer bringing him out on the driveway because he's very uncomfortable there. His walk looks a bit odd, even on the sand surface. I'm not sure but I think he's landing toe first. It looks different than normal anyway. I don't know why this would have changed? Is it something to worry about??

The good news is that he's become even more flexible when doing his carrot stretches. He no longer lifts a leg or shifts his weight to do the stretch. He can even do ones that he was physically unable to come near to doing before.

The increased flexibility has been the most surprising thing for me. It explains the problems he was having when I'd ask him to use himself correctly. He always loved to jump but his attitude was very different when it came to flatwork.

I had recently come to believe that his one sided stiffness and difficulty with flexion was a physical problem that wouldn't be fixed just by schooling. I had him booked in for x-rays to try to figure out what the problem was but circumstances intervened and I ended up taking off his shoes first. It was lucky too because I couldn't see a vet suggesting that removing his shoes would help. Another thing was that he always required a lot of work when the physio came. The physio always found asymmetries in his body.  The reason seems obvious now that I know his hooves were so unbalanced.

Another interesting thing is that his uneven heels haven't re -set themselves yet so I wonder what effect it will have on his body when they do? Should I expect a dressage loving mule


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## Mule (23 December 2019)

The above post is really long. Basically, he is now our of shoes 6 and a half weeks. He is more sensitive and I think he is landing toe first. I'm unsure why that is and am wondering should I be concerned?

The good news is he has become even more flexible and I've realised that schooling problems we had, including asymmetry and general stiffness were due to his hooves bearing his weight unevenly. No wonder the poor thing disapproved of dressage, it all seems so obvious now.


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## alibali (23 December 2019)

A mule in a manger said:



			The above post is really long. Basically, he is now our of shoes 6 and a half weeks. He is more sensitive and I think he is landing toe first. I'm unsure why that is and am wondering should I be concerned?
.
		
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I'm no expert but have heard anecdotally that some horses do very well for the first 6 weeks or so out of shoes then seem to get more tender at around 6 weeks. The general advice I've seen has been not to panic, use hoof boots where necessary to keep them comfortable and it's a stage they pass through before coming good again. Hopefully someone more experienced than I at transitioning will be along shortly with further reassurance!


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## Mule (24 December 2019)

alibali said:



			I'm no expert but have heard anecdotally that some horses do very well for the first 6 weeks or so out of shoes then seem to get more tender at around 6 weeks. The general advice I've seen has been not to panic, use hoof boots where necessary to keep them comfortable and it's a stage they pass through before coming good again. Hopefully someone more experienced than I at transitioning will be along shortly with further reassurance!
		
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Ah, that's a relief  How long does this stage usually last? Perhaps I should see it as a sign of progress then. Unfortunately he can't wear hoof boots yet because none fit him yet due to his hoof distortions. I'm told this should change once his heels even out.


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## Mule (24 December 2019)

I've uploaded side X rays of his front hooves that show the medio-lateral imbalance. From what I can tell, he is landing first on the inside of both front hooves.  I forgot to upload these ones before. Also, notice that his leg bones are not lined up straight with his hooves. From what I've read it seems that's the cause of the medial first hoof landing.


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## ycbm (24 December 2019)

alibali said:



			I'm no expert but have heard anecdotally that some horses do very well for the first 6 weeks or so out of shoes then seem to get more tender at around 6 weeks. The general advice I've seen has been not to panic, use hoof boots where necessary to keep them comfortable and it's a stage they pass through before coming good again. Hopefully someone more experienced than I at transitioning will be along shortly with further reassurance!
		
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It's very common,  often referred to as 'coming alive'  because it so much resembles numbness wearing off. 

.


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## Red-1 (24 December 2019)

It is normal for them to be a bot sore after a honeymoon period. I found that this stage lasts about 3 months, but if I have fitted hoof boots they are comfortable.


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## Wheels (24 December 2019)

I hope he improves soon

I dont have any practical advice as I'm new to this transitioning too but sending you good vibes


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## Mule (24 December 2019)

Wheels said:



			I hope he improves soon

I dont have any practical advice as I'm new to this transitioning too but sending you good vibes
		
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Thank you


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## HelenBack (24 December 2019)

A mule in a manger said:



			I've uploaded side X rays of his front hooves that show the medio-lateral imbalance. From what I can tell, he is landing first on the inside of both front hooves.  I forgot to upload these ones before. Also, notice that his leg bones are not lined up straight with his hooves. From what I've read it seems that's the cause of the medial first hoof landing.
	View attachment 39672
View attachment 39673

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Are you having the hooves trimmed to help correct the imbalance or letting him sort himself out? I won't go into too much detail as this is your post but mine has had a problem with ML imbalance too and I think the trimmer I've been using has actually made things worse. I don't know now whether to get somebody else involved or just let the horse do his own thing for a while and see what happens. We're at a livery yard though so I don't know if he'll be able to wear the hooves to keep up with the growth.


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## Mule (24 December 2019)

HelenBack said:



			Are you having the hooves trimmed to help correct the imbalance or letting him sort himself out? I won't go into too much detail as this is your post but mine has had a problem with ML imbalance too and I think the trimmer I've been using has actually made things worse. I don't know now whether to get somebody else involved or just let the horse do his own thing for a while and see what happens. We're at a livery yard though so I don't know if he'll be able to wear the hooves to keep up with the growth.
		
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I'm letting him sort himself out. I'm new to this but I'm sure some people in the forum will be able to help. I don't know much about it but my feeling is that if the imbalance is caused by a conformational problem I'd be concerned that changing the hoof shape by trimming mightn't be helpful. If the hoof lands a certain way because it toes out, for example then I think it would be safer to let it sort itself out. One thing I keep coming across in my research is the idea that the horse grows the hoof it needs. In regards to him being able to wear his hooves without trimming, walking him on a hard surface should help.

My horse's hoof walls are already bearing weight more evenly. I think the increased flexibility in his body since his shoes were taken off may be explained by that. Even though his conformation seems to encourage L-M imbalance, taking the shoes off is helping his hooves wear more evenly. I think it might be because his sheared heels are beginning to come right.


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## ycbm (24 December 2019)

IF (and that's a big if for horses who can't wear boots,  are still sore in boots and for some owners without enough daylight at this time of year)

then the horse will indeed put its foot into the optimum shape to suit the joints above it if it is ridden or walked on abrasive surfaces or turned out on an abrasive track system.

Most times,  anyway.

It's a joy it watch it happen.  I wish i'd taken photos now but my TB had a growth ring which hit the floor on one side a centimetre before it hit it on the other.

This horse was putting all his weight down the inside of his right fore, as you can see.




And after a few months,  much more level, not to mention deeper, stronger and less splayed







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## HelenBack (24 December 2019)

Thank you for both of your replies, that makes sense. So at the moment I'm walking him in hand in boots for about 45 minutes to an hour. He's on a standard out by day and in at night arrangement and we don't have access to a track. I haven't done any walking without boots yet apart from going to and from the field. He's super comfortable in boots but I'm not sure he'd go that far without just yet. I can keep this routine going most days even throughout winter.

So would this be enough to allow him to self trim or do I need to be getting the boots off more for that to happen?

I find the whole balance thing very confusing I must admit. Years ago the farrier we were using then said he had a natural imbalance that she wouldn't want to tinker with. The trimmer now is adamant that his hooves must be balanced, although I gather that it is to him and not some uniform ideal. The trim he has now though I think makes him look more imbalanced than he was before!


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## ycbm (24 December 2019)

You need to get the boots off to self trim,  but ten minutes a day on concrete or tarmac if he's happy will do to start with.  

Can you ride out with them on and hop off and take them off and tie them to the saddle or put them in a backpack to ride home?  I do that sometimes.
.


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## Red-1 (24 December 2019)

I also used to ride out with boots then pull them on the way home. So,I rode most of the ride and walked in hand the last bit as I was too awkward to re-mount. 

Other days I would simply do a shorter walk with no boots.


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## HelenBack (24 December 2019)

That sounds doable, I'll have a proper look at how he is without the boots and start to work on it. Of course the advantage of leading when time is tight is you don't have to bother with grooming beforehand!
Sounds like I might need a trimmer still at least for now, in case we're not doing enough unbooted for him to self trim. I think the key will be finding somebody who only trims what's necessary rather than doing something just for the sakes of it...


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## Mule (12 January 2020)

Well, I have good news.  His hooves have improved again. His back hooves are actually becoming a normal shape 😮They don't look as flat as a pancake anymore. They are becoming upright. I think his heels are growing back under him more, if that makes sense.

His heel bulbs have become even more even on both the fore and hind. My photo taking assistant is away for the week but I will take photos when he's back. I need the photos to have a better look at the underneath of the hooves so I can study them properly. He's also walking better than he was.

His front hooves look a bit long now but it's a month since his last trim. He is now out of his front shoes for 10 weeks and his back shoes for 9 weeks. I'm feeling very positive about it all and I'm so glad I took the shoes off


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## Floofball (19 January 2020)

A little update from me ☺️

Backs have been off 13 weeks now - nail holes have grown out and feet look great 👍🏻 
Fronts have been off 7, they didn’t break up badly - the oldest nail holes have grown out and the last ones will be gone by the next trim when i’m Hoping to measure for boots. He’s never been footy although trot looked flat in the school for a while when I checked him on the lunge first couple of weeks. He now looks to be moving great, he feels so much sounder out on the roads (just doing 30-45 mins a couple of times a week) When I took him out yesterday he was very aware of his feet for the first time - avoiding loose stones etc - I’m thinking this is indeed his feet coming alive again 🤞🏻 
Really hope I can keep patient and see this through - I’ll need to up his exercise when grass starts coming through so keeping everything crossed that I’ve got the timings right!


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## Mule (19 January 2020)

Winter Wonderhorse said:



			A little update from me ☺️

Backs have been off 13 weeks now - nail holes have grown out and feet look great 👍🏻
Fronts have been off 7, they didn’t break up badly - the oldest nail holes have grown out and the last ones will be gone by the next trim when i’m Hoping to measure for boots. He’s never been footy although trot looked flat in the school for a while when I checked him on the lunge first couple of weeks. He now looks to be moving great, he feels so much sounder out on the roads (just doing 30-45 mins a couple of times a week) When I took him out yesterday he was very aware of his feet for the first time - avoiding loose stones etc - I’m thinking this is indeed his feet coming alive again 🤞🏻
Really hope I can keep patient and see this through - I’ll need to up his exercise when grass starts coming through so keeping everything crossed that I’ve got the timings right!
		
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Brilliant news and even if he stays footy for a while the boots should sort it.


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## Wheels (19 January 2020)

That's great winter wonder horse.  How are you getting on mule?


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## ycbm (19 January 2020)

Watch the feed folks!  My TB is rock crunching since I discovered that he has a serious intolerance to soya based feed.

.


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## Gloi (19 January 2020)

A long hoof wall isn't what you are wanting. I'b be starting to put a decent roll on those walls and encouraging the outside of the sole to be taking a share of the weight. It's how I like them to be anyway, let the whole foot be used.


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## Pinkvboots (19 January 2020)

gunnergundog said:



			Maybe try Hoof Armor??  I've only just started using it; I did three applications over ten days and have noticed a difference.  Not sure how long it will last though.
		
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I was going to buy this how is it to apply? And how are you finding it? My horse has gone a bit sore again on his flatter foot I am hoping this will help!


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## Mule (19 January 2020)

Wheels said:



			That's great winter wonder horse.  How are you getting on mule?
		
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He's improved a lot. His hooves, particularly the hinds are a lot less flat. His heels are coming back and he's walking better. He really is developing  normal looking hooves 
The difference is unreal.

He's due a trim soon so I might wait to take photos until then because his hooves have got long so they look flatter than they really are. I'll likely have the photos by next weekend. My idea was to take monthly photos although this month's will be over schedule, but not to worry. How is yours getting on? It's exciting isn't it


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## Wheels (19 January 2020)

mule said:



			He's improved a lot. His hooves, particularly the hinds are a lot less flat. His heels are coming back and he's walking better. He really is developing  normal looking hooves 
The difference is unreal.

He's due a trim soon so I might wait to take photos until then because his hooves have got long so they look flatter than they really are. I'll likely have the photos by next weekend. My idea was to take monthly photos although this month's will be over schedule, but not to worry. How is yours getting on? It's exciting isn't it 

Click to expand...

So far things are going well, I will caveat that we still have a long way to go and some days are better than others but we are back having lessons and schooling as well as hacking both with and without boots depending on what we are doing.  Seedy toe and thrush and other crumbly white line issues are now resolved and the seedy toe hole and nail holes are all gone.

Will continue to monitor and see how he gets on with the now increasing workload


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## Mule (19 January 2020)

Wheels said:



			So far things are going well, I will caveat that we still have a long way to go and some days are better than others but we are back having lessons and schooling as well as hacking both with and without boots depending on what we are doing.  Seedy toe and thrush and other crumbly white line issues are now resolved and the seedy toe hole and nail holes are all gone.

Will continue to monitor and see how he gets on with the now increasing workload
		
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How are the boots working out? Are they staying on?


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## Wheels (19 January 2020)

Oh yes, they're fab.  They have meant that I can hack further and start some canter work in the school way earlier than I would have been able to without them. The horse and his feet have thrived due to their use


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## Mule (19 January 2020)

Wheels said:



			Oh yes, they're fab.  They have meant that I can hack further and start some canter work in the school way earlier than I would have been able to without them. The horse and his feet have thrived due to their use
		
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I'm going to re measure mine for hoof boots in about a month. His heel bulbs are almost completely even now, so in a month they will hopefully be fine. The main problem with finding boots to fit was his uneven heel bulbs so I'm more enthusiastic about our chances now.


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## Wheels (19 January 2020)

That's great mule, I'm sure you'll find something to suit


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## Mule (19 January 2020)

Wheels said:



			That's great mule, I'm sure you'll find something to suit
		
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I hope so, I'm a lot more optimistic about it. He's come on so much it's worth it, even if I can't find boots I'll wait until he's able to be ridden without them.


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## Mule (29 January 2020)

Ok we're now on week 12. There have been big changes. His hinds in particular are growing upright. They are no longer pancake flat, we actually have angles! They are growing under him rather than forward and flat. The farrier is seriously impressed!
As usual, the hooves could be cleaner (particularly the left hind)

Right fore underneath



Right fore side



Left fore underneath




Left fore side



Left hind underneath 💩(there seems to be a bit chipped off the side wall) 



Left hind side




Right hind underneath



Right hind side (look at that angle!)


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## ycbm (29 January 2020)

Well done you!  great improvement and they're not finished yet either, even better already growing in. 

.


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## Mule (29 January 2020)

ycbm said:



			Well done you!  great improvement and they're not finished yet either, even better already growing in.

.
		
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It's so exciting  I'm really pleased with the hinds. Do you notice there's a lot of, I'm not sure that it's concavity but more space? around the frog areas.


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## ycbm (29 January 2020)

Everything is improving, but looking at the tops rather than the bottoms theres a much, much stronger foot coming down


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## Mule (29 January 2020)

ycbm said:



			Everything is improving, but looking at the tops rather than the bottoms theres a much, much stronger foot coming down 

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I'll sound a bit clueless now but, what should I look for at the tops?


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## Mule (29 January 2020)

Here's a (very hairy) face to go with the hooves😎


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## Floofball (29 January 2020)

Gosh, he grows a coat doesn’t he! 😂 backs are looking so much better 👍🏻 If you draw a line following the the hoof angle from the coronet on the fronts you can see the angle the hoof will be - I’ll try and have a go but I’m not very techy 🙄


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## Floofball (29 January 2020)

Disclaimer! I’m not an expert in marking up hoof photos 😂 Something like this - red line follows hoof from bottom up and yellow from the top down - it’s just to give you an idea of what others can see re the hoof growing. It’s great your keeping such a good record of things 👍🏻


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## Mule (29 January 2020)

Winter Wonderhorse said:



View attachment 40851


Disclaimer! I’m not an expert in marking up hoof photos 😂 Something like this - red line follows hoof from bottom up and yellow from the top down - it’s just to give you an idea of what others can see re the hoof growing. It’s great your keeping such a good record of things 👍🏻
		
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Oh wow, I like the look of that yellow line! I can't wait till he's marching about showing off his new hooves to everyone


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## Mule (9 February 2020)

I measured the beast for hoof boots yesterday. I sent photos to urban horse and the hoof boutique for advice. I first sent them photos just after his shoes had been removed but because his hoof bulbs were so uneven no boot would be likely to stay on. Now that his heel bulbs are more even I'm hoping that I can find a pair that will fit 🤞


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## tda (9 February 2020)

mule said:



			I measured the beast for hoof boots yesterday. I sent photos to urban horse and the hoof boutique for advice. I first sent them photos just after his shoes had been removed but because his hoof bulbs were so uneven no boot would be likely to stay on. Now that his heel bulbs are more even I'm hoping that I can find a pair that will fit 🤞
		
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I have used Scoot boots, they are pretty flexible and forgiving for fit. 
The hooves are growing really well, I'd be very happy with them x


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## Mule (9 February 2020)

tda said:



			I have used Scoot boots, they are pretty flexible and forgiving for fit.
The hooves are growing really well, I'd be very happy with them x
		
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Thanks


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## Mule (15 February 2020)

Hi everyone, I'm feeling a bit discouraged. Since the beast has been barefoot he is always the last to come in for his feed. He also no longer plays with the other gelding. I have spent time watching him in the field recently and have seen that he is still uncomfortable walking barefoot. This is on clay soil, in winter so it is a very soft surface. When he's not comfortable walking on such a forgiving surface three months after having his shoes off, I'm afraid that he may never be.

His hooves look so much better but his original x-rays show miniscule sole thickness. He is on pro forage balancer, isn't eating grain, lives out 24/7 and spends time on concrete and sand daily so his diet and environment are good. The thing is that he is comfortable in shoes but they aren't conducive to him having healthy hooves. His heel bulbs were uneven in shoes, he was very one-sided when ridden, possibly because of this. He is equally supple on both sides since removing the shoes. I can see this when doing carrot stretches. When shod, his hooves grew forward and flat rather than down.

 As positive as all the changes are, it makes me very uneasy that he isn't even field sound. I really don't know if he ever will be. I am going to measure him for hoof boots again soon but how realistic is riding going to be? I'm wondering will he be be unsound to be ridden even in boots? On the rockley blog they are able to ride the horses even without boots after this length of time. Some of those horses have been brought there as a last option. When they can go sound within that time period I don't understand why mine isn't. What does everyone here think?


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## Red-1 (15 February 2020)

I think that out 24/7 on clay in this wet winter, it is not surprising that his sole is not hard and strong. It has been awful. His feet do look a much better shape and if it were me, I would delay shoeing until the new angles are down a bit further.

Mine have, for the past few years, done several months in winter barefoot, and TBH we have barely had to alter their work pattern. BUT they have been on a dry bed at night, and turned in an arena in the day. I also use hoof preparations so can kind of control how dry/flexible the hoof is.

As he is doing so well in hoof shape, I would consider stabling overnight on a dry bed. Walking on the road is king to hoof health, and as long as it is smooth tarmac, starting with 100m and working up from there, it is generally well tolerated even with horses who have weak feet. Now you can get boots to fit, I would do that. The Cavallos are very accommodating for walk type exercise. I would start the walking on the road in boots, and gradually take them off for the last part of the walk.

In your last photos the frogs look thrushy. Frogs should be smooth, not pitted. I would suspect thrush plays a big part in his comfort. I don't think you will get ontop of it when out 24/7 in this weather. When bringing in overnight, I would start with a Cleantrax soak. Trim the frog of ragged/pitted bits first.

As an emergency measure I will mix old fashioned hoof oil and liquid tar and use daily as this does dry and harden the frogs. The bed must be clean and dry. As soon as the frogs don't change overnight I would cease the use of this, as it is very harsh. When the thrush s active you will find that the pits/grooves grow overnight. When it is not active, it stays the same. I always dry brush the feet morning and night, get into every crevice. That way you know if a crevice is growing and can treat straight away.

If he is uncomfortable in the field, something needs to be done, and that is what I would do.


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## Mule (15 February 2020)

Red-1 said:



			I think that out 24/7 on clay in this wet winter, it is not surprising that his sole is not hard and strong. It has been awful. His feet do look a much better shape and if it were me, I would delay shoeing until the new angles are down a bit further.

Mine have, for the past few years, done several months in winter barefoot, and TBH we have barely had to alter their work pattern. BUT they have been on a dry bed at night, and turned in an arena in the day. I also use hoof preparations so can kind of control how dry/flexible the hoof is.

As he is doing so well in hoof shape, I would consider stabling overnight on a dry bed. Walking on the road is king to hoof health, and as long as it is smooth tarmac, starting with 100m and working up from there, it is generally well tolerated even with horses who have weak feet. Now you can get boots to fit, I would do that. The Cavallos are very accommodating for walk type exercise. I would start the walking on the road in boots, and gradually take them off for the last part of the walk.

In your last photos the frogs look thrushy. Frogs should be smooth, not pitted. I would suspect thrush plays a big part in his comfort. I don't think you will get ontop of it when out 24/7 in this weather. When bringing in overnight, I would start with a Cleantrax soak. Trim the frog of ragged/pitted bits first.

As an emergency measure I will mix old fashioned hoof oil and liquid tar and use daily as this does dry and harden the frogs. The bed must be clean and dry. As soon as the frogs don't change overnight I would cease the use of this, as it is very harsh. When the thrush s active you will find that the pits/grooves grow overnight. When it is not active, it stays the same. I always dry brush the feet morning and night, get into every crevice. That way you know if a crevice is growing and can treat straight away.

If he is uncomfortable in the field, something needs to be done, and that is what I would do.
		
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Thank you, I'll do this x
ps, what do I use to trim the frogs? Should I also try to harden the soles?


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## Wheels (15 February 2020)

Sorry you're having problems - it's difficult to know what to do sometimes.

I'm new to this too so dont have any help for you but sending you good vibes.


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## Mule (15 February 2020)

Wheels said:



			Sorry you're having problems - it's difficult to know what to do sometimes.

I'm new to this too so dont have any help for you but sending you good vibes.
		
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Thank you x


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## Red-1 (15 February 2020)

mule said:



			Thank you, I'll do this x
ps, what do I use to trim the frogs? Should I also try to harden the soles?
		
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Ha, my farrier did give me a knife and a sharpener, but although I do rasp the feet myself, I am far too scared to use the knife! I am not sure if I would cut the horse or myself. 

If it is a minor flap I confess to using various scissors. If it is more major I get a professional in to do it. Usually, if the horse is walked out on the road and the frogs are healthy, it sort of does itself. 

If they are just pits and not deep grooves/no flaps than I would simply Cleantrax, keep dry and use the concoction. Dry brushing is excellent as the bacteria and fungus need damp/no air. But do get boots and start walking as this increases hoof health immensely.

I have used hoof hardener in the past, but it is very strong in effect and the feet can then become brittle, so use sparingly.  Again, it is an emergency measure, not a routine use. 

When the ground dries up, if he is more sore then don't despair if you have to shoe up again. But, come autumn, you may find that when taking the shoes off a second time, you are starting from a strong place. I would, however, shoe every 4 weeks to try to limit the amount they grow forwards again. Also make sure the farrier shoes beyond the line where the hoof touches the floor at the back (shoeing long) as this will slow the growing forwards of the heels. 

Next year I would then try not to let the feet get waterlogged. I use fancy French hoof grease to completely envelop the hoof in the morning which seems to keep some of the wet out. 

You asked about Rockley, they are very knowledgeable, but their turnout areas are also fab. They are not turned out in a waterlogged clay field. I think this is a very limiting factor, especially as you are starting with very weak feet.


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## Mule (15 February 2020)

Red-1 said:



			Ha, my farrier did give me a knife and a sharpener, but although I do rasp the feet myself, I am far too scared to use the knife! I am not sure if I would cut the horse or myself.

If it is a minor flap I confess to using various scissors. If it is more major I get a professional in to do it. Usually, if the horse is walked out on the road and the frogs are healthy, it sort of does itself.

If they are just pits and not deep grooves/no flaps than I would simply Cleantrax, keep dry and use the concoction. Dry brushing is excellent as the bacteria and fungus need damp/no air. But do get boots and start walking as this increases hoof health immensely.

I have used hoof hardener in the past, but it is very strong in effect and the feet can then become brittle, so use sparingly.  Again, it is an emergency measure, not a routine use.

When the ground dries up, if he is more sore then don't despair if you have to shoe up again. But, come autumn, you may find that when taking the shoes off a second time, you are starting from a strong place. I would, however, shoe every 4 weeks to try to limit the amount they grow forwards again. Also make sure the farrier shoes beyond the line where the hoof touches the floor at the back (shoeing long) as this will slow the growing forwards of the heels.

Next year I would then try not to let the feet get waterlogged. I use fancy French hoof grease to completely envelop the hoof in the morning which seems to keep some of the wet out.

You asked about Rockley, they are very knowledgeable, but their turnout areas are also fab. They are not turned out in a waterlogged clay field. I think this is a very limiting factor, especially as you are starting with very weak feet.
		
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That's good advice, I don't feel like I've failed at it now that I have these things to try. The most I can do is to try my best and give it every chance to work. If it doesn't, then at least I'll have tried.


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## Gloi (15 February 2020)

I think your horse may currently be a good candidate for putting hoof armour on the soles. Once you've done the cleantrax soak and got rid of any thrush why not try it. It puts a coating across the sole to add strength and let new sole grow without getting worn away.


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## Leo Walker (15 February 2020)

If you can I would go for a wood pellet bed/ Nothing dries feet out like it!


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## Mule (15 February 2020)

Gloi said:



			I think your horse may currently be a good candidate for putting hoof armour on the soles. Once you've done the cleantrax soak and got rid of any thrush why not try it. It puts a coating across the sole to add strength and let new sole grow without getting worn away.
		
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 I will definitely try it.


Leo Walker said:



			If you can I would go for a wood pellet bed/ Nothing dries feet out like it!
		
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I'll have a look and see if I can find a place that stocks it,


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## ycbm (15 February 2020)

In the early days of barefoot, the recommendation was that the horse should spend time on dry turnout, which is why I started keeping mine in a barn, where they could keep moving but have dry feet.

You havent failed, you just dont have the right environment.  24/7 clay means they are weakened by being waterlogged but also that they are getting no decent stimulation to grow thicker soles.

I agree you need to try a waterproofing product, and get him working in some boots.


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## Errin Paddywack (15 February 2020)

All my horses have lived out 24/7 on heavy clay.  Our land gets very, very wet in winter.  I used to get lots of hoof abcess problems mainly in youngstock, caused I am sure by the feet being too soft with all the moisture and because our land had been ploughed prior to our having it, lots of stones had been brought to the surface.  It gradually got better as the horses got older and developed thicker soles.  Takes time though.  My stallion had repeated abcesses and I was told he had very thin and soft soles.  This was when he was under 5.  Eventually his feet became good enough to be left to self trim and were hard as rock.  Farrier used to look at him and say he doesn't need trimming.  Have faith and give him time.


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## ycbm (15 February 2020)

Can you remind me if he's been tested for Cushings?

.


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## Mule (15 February 2020)

ycbm said:



			Can you remind me if he's been tested for Cushings?
.
		
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He hasn't. He's 13. Do you think it's a possibility?


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## ycbm (15 February 2020)

mule said:



			He hasn't. He's 13. Do you think it's a possibility?
		
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Definitely.

.


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## ycbm (15 February 2020)

And I would insist even if your vet says there is no point. Thin soles are often the only symptom.

A friend if mine was told there was no point, vet did the test very reluctantly, and the result came back sky high.

.


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## Mule (15 February 2020)

ycbm said:



			And I would insist even if your vet says there is no point. Thin soles are often the only symptom.
.
		
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He is also very hairy this year. He's not as hairy as the 26 year old mare who is on prascend but he is pretty hairy.


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## Gloi (15 February 2020)

mule said:



			I will definitely try it.

I'll have a look and see if I can find a place that stocks it,
		
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You need to get it on the internet
https://www.facebook.com/hoofmanshipshop/


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## Mule (15 February 2020)

Gloi said:



			You need to get it on the internet
https://www.facebook.com/hoofmanshipshop/

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Excellent. I've been reading up about it and it sounds very good.


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## Mule (15 February 2020)

Gloi said:



			You need to get it on the internet
https://www.facebook.com/hoofmanshipshop/

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I've just ordered it


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## Gloi (15 February 2020)

mule said:



			I've just ordered it

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did you get the starter kit with th applicator?


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## Mule (15 February 2020)

Gloi said:



			did you get the starter kit with th applicator?
		
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I did.


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## PurBee (15 February 2020)

Looking at your 12 wk hoof pics, the one thing that im seeing that stands out with all 4 feet and can be causing uncomfortable feelings for your horse are the bars. 

Because the pics arent at the angle needed to really assess it clearly - (camera at heel bulb looking along the plane of the hoof), i could be wrong with what im seeing from the ‘sole face’ underneath pics youre showing.

Front right hoof - right bar - heel half long, not too bad tho’. Fuzzy pic when i zoom, im seeing a faint hairline crack in the bar halfway down? If cracked pressure needs to come off the bars completely and trimmed right to sole plane.
Theres a corresponding bulge of the hoof wall at the quarters, which is same in all 4 feet, the same side where the longest bars lay. As i dont have camera at heel shots, to assess lateral balance its hard to confirm they’re uneven.

Front left hoof - right bar, from heel to halfway long, laid over sole, can see sole turned white part from bar pressure....easier to see on black soles. I can see a V crack where the white line of bar ends, cause by long bar. The bars can withstand full pressure only when they are growing upright, but when they start leaning over then the horse will feel it and it can walk footy just with a minor bar issue.

Rear hoofs same, the right bars are long. Moreso right hind than left hind

Sometimes footiness is caused by the slightest anomaly with hooves, and my own have strode off confident when ive taken just a few mm off the bars. Ive had hairline cracks that are hard to spot unless you really look, but taking the pressure off the bar, like you would with a cracked hoof wall, can make all the difference with comfort for the horse.

Your horses soles arent showing signs of p3 pressure on them, so when im looking im trying to find anything on the hooves which would cause him to be sore on clay. The fungus has been mentioned, so certainly treat that, although i wouldnt say that the frogs have been completely eaten up with fungus as can happen...there’s a lot of frog there, decent size, shape.
The bars are the only other thing i can see which can be placing pressure in the wrong places because of their distorted shape.

Its great your trimmer has got rid of the long toe. The underslung heels will right themselves in time.

Trim the bars to sole plane...or slightly shorter if/where they are cracked, then assess how he strides.
Is his stride better on the field or concrete? Or footy on all surfaces?

Would be handy to see pics from the heel, looking along sole plane, with fetlock in view.....allow the hoof to hang loose with grip on fetlock and take pic from above...if you fancy it and have time!

I wouldnt give up just yet. Youve got some major wall distortions to grow out, and the hoof still re-adjusting. It takes a while for the minerals to do their job. Its only been 12 weeks.
Trim the bars, assess comfort of horse, then boot if still footy. 

Cushings test as mentioned is worth doing.


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## Mule (15 February 2020)

PurBee said:



			Looking at your 12 wk hoof pics, the one thing that im seeing that stands out with all 4 feet and can be causing uncomfortable feelings for your horse are the bars.

Because the pics arent at the angle needed to really assess it clearly - (camera at heel bulb looking along the plane of the hoof), i could be wrong with what im seeing from the ‘sole face’ underneath pics youre showing.

Front right hoof - right bar - heel half long, not too bad tho’. Fuzzy pic when i zoom, im seeing a faint hairline crack in the bar halfway down? If cracked pressure needs to come off the bars completely and trimmed right to sole plane.
Theres a corresponding bulge of the hoof wall at the quarters, which is same in all 4 feet, the same side where the longest bars lay. As i dont have camera at heel shots, to assess lateral balance its hard to confirm they’re uneven.

Front left hoof - right bar, from heel to halfway long, laid over sole, can see sole turned white part from bar pressure....easier to see on black soles. I can see a V crack where the white line of bar ends, cause by long bar. The bars can withstand full pressure only when they are growing upright, but when they start leaning over then the horse will feel it and it can walk footy just with a minor bar issue.

Rear hoofs same, the right bars are long. Moreso right hind than left hind

Sometimes footiness is caused by the slightest anomaly with hooves, and my own have strode off confident when ive taken just a few mm off the bars. Ive had hairline cracks that are hard to spot unless you really look, but taking the pressure off the bar, like you would with a cracked hoof wall, can make all the difference with comfort for the horse.

Your horses soles arent showing signs of p3 pressure on them, so when im looking im trying to find anything on the hooves which would cause him to be sore on clay. The fungus has been mentioned, so certainly treat that, although i wouldnt say that the frogs have been completely eaten up with fungus as can happen...there’s a lot of frog there, decent size, shape.
The bars are the only other thing i can see which can be placing pressure in the wrong places because of their distorted shape.

Its great your trimmer has got rid of the long toe. The underslung heels will right themselves in time.

Trim the bars to sole plane...or slightly shorter if/where they are cracked, then assess how he strides.
Is his stride better on the field or concrete? Or footy on all surfaces?

Would be handy to see pics from the heel, looking along sole plane, with fetlock in view.....allow the hoof to hang loose with grip on fetlock and take pic from above...if you fancy it and have time!

I wouldnt give up just yet. Youve got some major wall distortions to grow out, and the hoof still re-adjusting. It takes a while for the minerals to do their job. Its only been 12 weeks.
Trim the bars, assess comfort of horse, then boot if still footy.

Cushings test as mentioned is worth doing.
		
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PurBee said:



			Looking at your 12 wk hoof pics, the one thing that im seeing that stands out with all 4 feet and can be causing uncomfortable feelings for your horse are the bars.

Because the pics arent at the angle needed to really assess it clearly - (camera at heel bulb looking along the plane of the hoof), i could be wrong with what im seeing from the ‘sole face’ underneath pics youre showing.

Front right hoof - right bar - heel half long, not too bad tho’. Fuzzy pic when i zoom, im seeing a faint hairline crack in the bar halfway down? If cracked pressure needs to come off the bars completely and trimmed right to sole plane.
Theres a corresponding bulge of the hoof wall at the quarters, which is same in all 4 feet, the same side where the longest bars lay. As i dont have camera at heel shots, to assess lateral balance its hard to confirm they’re uneven.

Front left hoof - right bar, from heel to halfway long, laid over sole, can see sole turned white part from bar pressure....easier to see on black soles. I can see a V crack where the white line of bar ends, cause by long bar. The bars can withstand full pressure only when they are growing upright, but when they start leaning over then the horse will feel it and it can walk footy just with a minor bar issue.

Rear hoofs same, the right bars are long. Moreso right hind than left hind

Sometimes footiness is caused by the slightest anomaly with hooves, and my own have strode off confident when ive taken just a few mm off the bars. Ive had hairline cracks that are hard to spot unless you really look, but taking the pressure off the bar, like you would with a cracked hoof wall, can make all the difference with comfort for the horse.

Your horses soles arent showing signs of p3 pressure on them, so when im looking im trying to find anything on the hooves which would cause him to be sore on clay. The fungus has been mentioned, so certainly treat that, although i wouldnt say that the frogs have been completely eaten up with fungus as can happen...there’s a lot of frog there, decent size, shape.
The bars are the only other thing i can see which can be placing pressure in the wrong places because of their distorted shape.

Its great your trimmer has got rid of the long toe. The underslung heels will right themselves in time.

Trim the bars to sole plane...or slightly shorter if/where they are cracked, then assess how he strides.
Is his stride better on the field or concrete? Or footy on all surfaces?

Would be handy to see pics from the heel, looking along sole plane, with fetlock in view.....allow the hoof to hang loose with grip on fetlock and take pic from above...if you fancy it and have time!

I wouldnt give up just yet. Youve got some major wall distortions to grow out, and the hoof still re-adjusting. It takes a while for the minerals to do their job. Its only been 12 weeks.
Trim the bars, assess comfort of horse, then boot if still footy.

Cushings test as mentioned is worth doing.
		
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Thank you, that's really helpful. I will take the photos you suggested. He walks better in the field than on concrete but he is footy on both. Do you think hoof imbalance is the reason for the bulge on the hoof walls?


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## Mule (16 February 2020)

The beast is in a stable with nice dry bedding. I had some iodine lying around so I sprayed his frogs with that. His collateral grooves, towards the heels are much deeper than usual, so I think they definitely need treatment. Remind me the next time I get a horse not to buy an (almost) half draught with giant, hooves 🙇‍♀️

I went out to him tonight to skip out his stable. There was one only dropping but he managed to stand on it with all four hooves🙄 I'd forgotten how messy he is in the stable. That's obviously not good for thrush so I'll have to keep an eye on it. I've made a start on it now so that's good. Does anyone know is it best to wait until autumn to get the cushings test or should I get it now?

On another note, the 26 year old mare with cushings and chronic laminitis is barefoot and happily canters in for her feed so surely there's hope for him too.


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## PurBee (16 February 2020)

This is the type of view thats helpful to see balance:

https://barefoothorseblog.blogspot.com/2010/08/
The ‘7 weeks deshod’ angle particularly showing a bit more leg to see how the hoof hangs in alignment with leg bone.

I think the side wall bulge is more to do with the under-run heel effect. The hoof wall cells being bound like a matrix to each other, if you imagine that as a sheet of paper, and the heel grows forward and under, the walls bend to accomodate the shifting growth pathology. That could be what is ‘pulling’ your bars over, as a secondary effect to the heel growth angle. So the bars end up growing over/leaning over instead of ‘up’ and the horse loses support of bars too. The growing over onto sole will cause pressure there on the sole - but its normally thick in the seat of corn area, however the frog crevice side of the bar is being ‘levered’ with every step with over-laid bars, and could be felt more sore in the frog crevice where the bar grows out from. So like with long hoof walls, trimming the excess wall off the bar, relieves the ‘leverage’ effect and soreness.
Hooves with upright growing bars are resilient, and can be left longer that sole plane without causing soreness. Its mainly bent over bars that can cause issues...behaving like a flared hoof wall.

Under-run heels are tricky because they are always low, never growing hugely tall because they just lean growing forward.
My mares fronts were prone, she came to me sporting real long toe, crushed heels...long skinny frogs...and very footy. 

 The apex of the heel should be roughly level with the base of frog, but we have that apex moved forwards with under-run heels.
 Getting the cells to grow upright again requires the heels to be trimmed, and definitely the toe bringing back as has been done on your horse. 
 The imbalances can be caused by the conformation of the horse, and/or uneven trims. The horse will adjust to uneven trims, and behaviour of gait sets in, so then balance is trimmed, horse should slowly re-adjust.
It’s a long process with long-standing issues, so 12 weeks is nothing. I’d give a horse a year to try to rehab, if no luck, plonk shoes back on.
 This wet winter hasnt been the easiest to deal with barefoot with constant wet either!


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## Mule (16 February 2020)

PurBee said:



			This is the type of view thats helpful to see balance:

https://barefoothorseblog.blogspot.com/2010/08/
The ‘7 weeks deshod’ angle particularly showing a bit more leg to see how the hoof hangs in alignment with leg bone.

I think the side wall bulge is more to do with the under-run heel effect. The hoof wall cells being bound like a matrix to each other, if you imagine that as a sheet of paper, and the heel grows forward and under, the walls bend to accomodate the shifting growth pathology. That could be what is ‘pulling’ your bars over, as a secondary effect to the heel growth angle. So the bars end up growing over/leaning over instead of ‘up’ and the horse loses support of bars too. The growing over onto sole will cause pressure there on the sole - but its normally thick in the seat of corn area, however the frog crevice side of the bar is being ‘levered’ with every step with over-laid bars, and could be felt more sore in the frog crevice where the bar grows out from. So like with long hoof walls, trimming the excess wall off the bar, relieves the ‘leverage’ effect and soreness.
Hooves with upright growing bars are resilient, and can be left longer that sole plane without causing soreness. Its mainly bent over bars that can cause issues...behaving like a flared hoof wall.

Under-run heels are tricky because they are always low, never growing hugely tall because they just lean growing forward.
My mares fronts were prone, she came to me sporting real long toe, crushed heels...long skinny frogs...and very footy.

The apex of the heel should be roughly level with the base of frog, but we have that apex moved forwards with under-run heels.
Getting the cells to grow upright again requires the heels to be trimmed, and definitely the toe bringing back as has been done on your horse.
The imbalances can be caused by the conformation of the horse, and/or uneven trims. The horse will adjust to uneven trims, and behaviour of gait sets in, so then balance is trimmed, horse should slowly re-adjust.
It’s a long process with long-standing issues, so 12 weeks is nothing. I’d give a horse a year to try to rehab, if no luck, plonk shoes back on.
This wet winter hasnt been the easiest to deal with barefoot with constant wet either!
		
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Just reading that I'm not surprised it's a long process, particularly when the hooves have a lot of problems. It must have taken some time for the hooves to have become so distorted, so it makes sense that it will take time for them to recover. I'm hopeful that hoof armour, boots and a drier environment will help him.

I re-measured him recently but the stupid measuring tape is scratched and too hard to read in photos. I'm going to re-measure after his next trim and send the pictures to the hoof boutique for help as I can't tell where the heel buttress is.


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## ycbm (16 February 2020)

mule said:



			His collateral grooves, towards the heels are much deeper than usual, so I think they definitely need treatment. Remind me the next time I get a horse not to buy an (almost) half draught with giant, hooves 🙇‍♀️
.
		
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This isn't an area where they normally get thrush, and it's usually a sign that the depth in the heel inside the foot is increasing,  with a tighter connection and more digital cushion raising the pedal bone inside the foot. 

It's something I would be very happy to see.  

.


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## Red-1 (16 February 2020)

I too would be happy to see deeper grooves there. As long as the grooves are smooth and clean, it simply means the hoof has more depth.

One thing I find helps, if I bring a wet, naked hoof into a dry bed I use grease on it to prevent it from drying out too quickly. Then grease it again before it gets wet, to prevent it getting wet too quickly. I know that many people disagree with this, but then they also like the look of my horse's feet.

I use a specialist barefoot grease from France, it is really effective. I believe the big grey from Ireland with the huge crack that featured in several barefoot threads on here also used this grease to good effect, and the foot, that many thought would never come sound, did.

I had a quick search, can't find the barefoot one, but this is the sporting one. They come in summer, winter and mid season...

http://equiworldlimited.co.uk/tacks...ucts_id=1740&zenid=4q6muem91q4qb0pvatuug8kqt2

They also do a regerating balm.

Once the frog has a tough outer against thrush, I would use this, but twice a day after dry brushing so it is scrupulously clean. With the frogs I would first go a Cleantrax soak. You need 2 bottles to do 4 feet, plus a soaking boot. It is a pain, but the feet do look a lot better straight away.

I have never used hoof armour as I would not be able to monitor for thrush if they were covered. I have found that keeping them clean is key, along with not letting them go wet/dry/wet/dry without the above grease on them to prevent the swing being too quick.

I know it all sounds a pain, along with needing to walk in hand with boots, tailoring the diet etc. but looking at the shape of the hooves I would do it for the longevity of the horse.


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## Mule (16 February 2020)

ycbm said:



			This isn't an area where they normally get thrush, and it's usually a sign that the depth in the heel inside the foot is increasing,  with a tighter connection and more digital cushion raising the pedal bone inside the foot.

It's something I would be very happy to see.

.
		
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Ooh excellent, that's cheered me up


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## Mule (16 February 2020)

Red-1 said:



			I too would be happy to see deeper grooves there. As long as the grooves are smooth and clean, it simply means the hoof has more depth.

One thing I find helps, if I bring a wet, naked hoof into a dry bed I use grease on it to prevent it from drying out too quickly. Then grease it again before it gets wet, to prevent it getting wet too quickly. I know that many people disagree with this, but then they also like the look of my horse's feet.

I use a specialist barefoot grease from France, it is really effective. I believe the big grey from Ireland with the huge crack that featured in several barefoot threads on here also used this grease to good effect, and the foot, that many thought would never come sound, did.

I had a quick search, can't find the barefoot one, but this is the sporting one. They come in summer, winter and mid season...

http://equiworldlimited.co.uk/tacks...ucts_id=1740&zenid=4q6muem91q4qb0pvatuug8kqt2

They also do a regerating balm.

Once the frog has a tough outer against thrush, I would use this, but twice a day after dry brushing so it is scrupulously clean. With the frogs I would first go a Cleantrax soak. You need 2 bottles to do 4 feet, plus a soaking boot. It is a pain, but the feet do look a lot better straight away.

I have never used hoof armour as I would not be able to monitor for thrush if they were covered. I have found that keeping them clean is key, along with not letting them go wet/dry/wet/dry without the above grease on them to prevent the swing being too quick.

I know it all sounds a pain, along with needing to walk in hand with boots, tailoring the diet etc. but looking at the shape of the hooves I would do it for the longevity of the horse.
		
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I'll have a look at the grease. Thanks for the link. I agree that making the effort is worth it. I'd like to give him the best chance. The way his hooves were shaped I'd say he would have been a candidate for navicular at some time in the future.


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## HashRouge (16 February 2020)

When was he last trimmed OP? Just be aware that farriers sometimes over trim unshod hooves, as though they were preparing them for shoes. This can make the horse less comfortable, so might be another reason your boys is still not completely sound. Remember, the Rockley horses aren't trimmed at all as they are turned out on a range if surfaces to "self trim".


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## Mule (16 February 2020)

HashRouge said:



			When was he last trimmed OP? Just be aware that farriers sometimes over trim unshod hooves, as though they were preparing them for shoes. This can make the horse less comfortable, so might be another reason your boys is still not completely sound. Remember, the Rockley horses aren't trimmed at all as they are turned out on a range if surfaces to "self trim".
		
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He was last trimmed on January 27th. I do notice that the farrier doesn't take much off him. He just uses a light rasp on the the hoof walls. I was surprised when I started reading about hooves that some farriers/trimmers are much more invasive. I've read about people trying to create concavity by going at the sole. I suppose if you have a horse with good sole depth you can get away with that but it would be disastrous for the likes of the beast.


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## Brownmare (16 February 2020)

I have a horse with draft type feet very similar to yours. The key to getting him comfortable barefoot was trimming his bars right down. That stopped a lot of the flaring and the abscesses he used to get at this time of year every year! 

My farrier said recently that he has advised a few of his clients with thin soled horses to add pea or whey protein to their feeds and he is seeing significant improvements.

Another thing you may want to look at is rockering the heels to encourage more upright growth while leaving some heel height for comfort. http://www.hoofrehab.com/HeelHeight.html


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## PurBee (16 February 2020)

Its ideal if they have a range of surfaces to condition the feet to. I’ve tried creating different surfaces, which mine have more access to in summer, from soft mud, massive crushed rock paths, gravel areas, flat smooth hard concrete....their feet are always better in summer being exposed to all these surfaces constantly. 

There’s a ‘wild herd’ on the bog near me, their feet have hard tracks, forestry soft ground, mud...ive seen their hoofprints where they go...which is everywhere! Up on high banks...even over stacks of slippy log poles. These ponies canter up my hard track when i shoo them off from my yard, not one of them lame! They need worming, decent food in winter, but theyve got great self-trimming feet!

Gravel is a god-send. If you have even a small area you can gravel where they can have a haynet, that would help ensure a few hundred steps on that surface per 24hrs.


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## Mule (17 February 2020)

I have a hopeful update.The farrier is coming tomorrow. I will be at work when he comes so I spoke to him over the phone. He suggested trying hoof casts. He has found them useful for laminitic mares that are in foal and he thinks they will help him too. So fingers crossed 🤞


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## Mule (17 February 2020)

I have a hopeful update.The farrier is coming tomorrow. I will be at work when he comes so I spoke to him over the phone. He suggested trying hoof casts. He has found them useful for laminitic mares that are in foal and he thinks they will help him too. So fingers crossed 🤞


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## Mule (18 February 2020)

The farrier came today while I was at work. He suggested putting a cast on the beast's hooves. Anyway I assumed (my fault entirely) this was just some sort of resin but when I came home his co-owner informed me it was a glue on aluminium shoe with a cast wrapped around it🙇‍♀️ I didn't know whether to laugh or to cry but seeing as the horse is now comfortable I suppose I should laugh.

At least they are only on the front hooves and there's also some sort of putty on the frogs so they are still being stimulated. I'll be able to exercise him now that he's comfortable. The shoes/cast should stay on for 3 weeks. I will have hoof boots by then and if necessary he can wear them during the day and go without them at night when he's in the stable.

I can understand why horse shoes were invented. You have a horse with dodgy feet, bang on a pair of shoes and off you go. It makes sense for people who need horses to earn a living. Anyway I will take photos ofaa his cast/shoes and upload them later🐎👟👟


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## Red-1 (18 February 2020)

_Once upon a time, a farmer had a valuable horse run away._

_“Bad News!” said the people._

_“Good news, bad news, who knows?” replied the farmer._

_Later, the horse returned to the farm with many wild horses accompanying it._

_“Good News!” said the people._

_“Good news, bad news, who knows?” replied the farmer._

_Some time after that, the farmer’s son fell and broke his leg while trying to train one of the wild horses._

_“Bad News!” said the people._

_“Good news, bad news, who knows?” replied the farmer._

_Soon after, the army came through town conscripting all able-bodied young men, and the farmer’s son was passed over._

_“Good News!” said the people._

_“Good news, bad news, who knows?” replied the farmer._

I have seen many versions of this story, but I thought it was apt! I hope today's news turns out to be a good news day.


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## Mule (18 February 2020)

Red-1 said:



_Once upon a time, a farmer had a valuable horse run away._

_“Bad News!” said the people._

_“Good news, bad news, who knows?” replied the farmer._

_Later, the horse returned to the farm with many wild horses accompanying it._

_“Good News!” said the people._

_“Good news, bad news, who knows?” replied the farmer._

_Some time after that, the farmer’s son fell and broke his leg while trying to train one of the wild horses._

_“Bad News!” said the people._

_“Good news, bad news, who knows?” replied the farmer._

_Soon after, the army came through town conscripting all able-bodied young men, and the farmer’s son was passed over._

_“Good News!” said the people._

_“Good news, bad news, who knows?” replied the farmer._

I have seen many versions of this story, but I thought it was apt! I hope today's news turns out to be a good news day.
		
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😂 I hope so too 🤞


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## Mule (18 February 2020)

Blue shoes; at least he's fashionable 😏


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## PurBee (19 February 2020)

mule said:



			Blue shoes; at least he's fashionable 😏
	View attachment 41418

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He’s looking dapper! 😄


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## Mule (19 February 2020)

PurBee said:



			He’s looking dapper! 😄







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😂


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## paddy555 (19 February 2020)

I was not too sure from your pics and my personal experience of identical feet that the fronts were going to make it barefoot, however the casts do show up a definite line of new growth and is coming down at a better angle so I would carry on with BF and when the casts come off get him booted as much as possible to keep him comfy. 
I would also test for cushings. That can answer a lot of questions.


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## HashRouge (19 February 2020)

What do they look like from the underside Mule? I've never seen them used before!


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## Mule (19 February 2020)

paddy555 said:



			I was not too sure from your pics and my personal experience of identical feet that the fronts were going to make it barefoot, however the casts do show up a definite line of new growth and is coming down at a better angle so I would carry on with BF and when the casts come off get him booted as much as possible to keep him comfy.
I would also test for cushings. That can answer a lot of questions.
		
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The new growth is positive. I just made an appointment with the vet for a cushings test so at least I'll get an answer on that front.


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## Mule (19 February 2020)

HashRouge said:



			What do they look like from the underside Mule? I've never seen them used before!
		
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I will take pictures of the underside today. I tried to do it last night but it was too difficult to get a good shot at the same time as holding his hoof up. I'll have an assistant later 😊


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## Mule (19 February 2020)

paddy555 said:



			I was not too sure from your pics and my personal experience of identical feet that the fronts were going to make it barefoot, however the casts do show up a definite line of new growth and is coming down at a better angle so I would carry on with BF and when the casts come off get him booted as much as possible to keep him comfy.
I would also test for cushings. That can answer a lot of questions.
		
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Was the horse with similar feet able to go barefoot on the hinds?


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## paddy555 (19 February 2020)

mule said:



			Was the horse with similar feet able to go barefoot on the hinds?
		
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no, he was never able to go barefoot (he had never been shod) in fact he was unable to wander around the yard comfortably in all honesty unless booted. His hinds were different to yours and were bull nosed so not a good guide for you. I had him at 3 and he died at 25. He was unable able to be ridden, he was a rescue and came with too many problems. I  looked at your first pics when you took the shoes off and thought "Ben is reincarnated"  then I thought it was better to keep quiet until you saw how you got on.


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## Mule (19 February 2020)

paddy555 said:



			no, he was never able to go barefoot (he had never been shod) in fact he was unable to wander around the yard comfortably in all honesty unless booted. His hinds were different to yours and were bull nosed so not a good guide for you. I had him at 3 and he died at 25. He was unable able to be ridden, he was a rescue and came with too many problems. I  looked at your first pics when you took the shoes off and thought "Ben is reincarnated"  then I thought it was better to keep quiet until you saw how you got on. 

Click to expand...

Mabey it is Ben reincarnated. Mine was born in a rescue centre
At any rate we know mine can work in shoes so all is not lost


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## paddy555 (19 February 2020)

mule said:



			Mabey it is Ben reincarnated. Mine was born in a rescue centre
At any rate we know mine can work in shoes so all is not lost

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lucky horse he came to you. I hope it works out for him but if not then shoes are not the worst thing for a comfortable life.


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## Mule (19 February 2020)

paddy555 said:



			lucky horse he came to you. I hope it works out for him but if not then shoes are not the worst thing for a comfortable life.
		
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Absolutely


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## Mule (21 February 2020)

HashRouge said:



			What do they look like from the underside Mule? I've never seen them used before!
		
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Here's a photo of the underside. There's a kind of putty over  the frog. The hoof needed to be picked out so it may be hard to see.
	


I think I see the beginnings of concavity in this picture of his front hoof with the measuring tape. His co- owner has commented on how well he is walking now he has shoes on. He is getting impatient 🤭, however I will be able to convince him to give him a chance with the hoof boots.
I wasn't there when the farrier came so I wasn't able to ask him about the bars.


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## Gloi (21 February 2020)

Hopefully you'll get your boots pretty soon then once the cast are off the hooves can carry on with their journey to health.


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## Mule (21 February 2020)

Gloi said:



			Hopefully you'll get your boots pretty soon then once the cast are off the hooves can carry on with their journey to health.
		
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Absolutely. I've sent new measurements to the hoof boutique and to urban hoof and my hoof armour package has arrived today. I'll put that on when the casts come off.

I haven't sent photos of his hinds for boot ideas because I want to see how he is without them first. They hinds so are much better than the fronts.


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## Gloi (21 February 2020)

mule said:



			Absolutely. I've sent new measurements to the hoof boutique and to urban hoof and my hoof armour package has arrived today. I'll put that on when the casts come off.

I haven't sent photos of his hinds for boot ideas because I want to see how he is without them first. They hinds so are much better than the fronts.
		
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It might seem a long journey but it will be worth it in the end


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## Mule (21 February 2020)

Gloi said:



			It might seem a long journey but it will be worth it in the end 

Click to expand...

I just have to keep his co-owner onboard. If the boots work out he will be.


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## Mule (21 February 2020)

I heard back from Carolyn at Urban Horse today. She suggested cavallos regular in size six for the fronts with 12 mm pads during transitioning and scoot boots later on. I find her really helpful so it's great to have her advice. It seems much easier to find suitable boots now that there isn't the hoof distortions. The sheared heels made it impossible to find boots that weren't likely to fall off.

I have also emailed the hoof boutique so I will also see what their advice is. He won't actually need boots until his casts come off in a couple of weeks. I'll also put on the hoof armour then. I'll see how he fares with unbooted hinds for now.

Whatever about the fronts, I'm confident he will be ok barefoot on the hinds 👣


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## Mule (21 February 2020)

Here's some flashback photos from 11th of November;

This is his right fore:
See the stretched white line and the uneven medio lateral wear on the hoof wall. There's almost a convex look about the sole.




This is a disturbingly misshapen left hind. Look at the heel bulbs 





🌟*Behold his February 18th right fore!*



If the fecker came sound he could feature in a barefoot transformation photoshoot type of thing 👣


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## ycbm (22 February 2020)

Those hinds 👀😳😖 !!!


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## Mule (22 February 2020)

ycbm said:



			Those hinds 👀😳😖 !!!
		
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I know, they were horrendous 😂


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## Mule (23 February 2020)

I am posting a Christmas photo of the mule in his Santa hat. Not purely to spam the thread either; He has skinny legs supporting a bulky body. That's also a lot of weight for weak hooves to support. Perhaps that doesn't help him either🤔


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## Mule (26 February 2020)

Good news!
The mule lost one of his aluminium shoes/ casts  2 days ago. I expected him to be sore again but he wasn't ...

Earlier today, he got out on to the driveway and walked around completely normally! He then proceeded to walk over the pebbly bit😀 
I'm half afraid he'll go back to being sore tomorrow because I can barely believe it! 

His shoes have been off now for 16 weeks and it's just possible that he's coming sound. I was about to give up and re-shoe him 🎉🎊🎉


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## Wheels (26 February 2020)

That is great news   I hope he continues to improve


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## Mule (26 February 2020)

Wheels said:



			That is great news   I hope he continues to improve
		
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I know, I can't believe it 😀
How are you getting on?


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## Mule (27 February 2020)

I will also find out the results of his cushings test on Monday.


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## Wheels (27 February 2020)

mule said:



			I know, I can't believe it 😀
How are you getting on?
		
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Pretty well at the minute thanks. We are back out competing dressage again.  Still a little unsure going over rough stones and ground but very happy with progress at the 4 month stage.  Still a while to go


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## Mule (27 February 2020)

Wheels said:



			Pretty well at the minute thanks. We are back out competing dressage again.  Still a little unsure going over rough stones and ground but very happy with progress at the 4 month stage.  Still a while to go 

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Excellent, well done 😊


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## Sasanaskyex (27 February 2020)

My little mare has just gone over the 7 month barefoot mark now and is noticeably much sounder over uneven ground and stones. Generally she is walking out more confidently too. Yesterday she was all giddy and decided to trot over the car park coming home which is really gravelly and only tripped once. Her feet look great too, I will take some updated 'after' pictures soon.


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## Mule (27 February 2020)

Sasanaskyex said:



			My little mare has just gone over the 7 month barefoot mark now and is noticeably much sounder over uneven ground and stones. Generally she is walking out more confidently too. Yesterday she was all giddy and decided to trot over the car park coming home which is really gravelly and only tripped once. Her feet look great too, I will take some updated 'after' pictures soon.
		
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Good news, I'm looking forward to seeing the pictures.


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## Mule (28 February 2020)

I have just purchased a pair of Cavallo treks, size five with 12mm medium pads 😊
They will be quite tight in width but just a bit too long so they have a better chance of staying on than the size six, which would be longer again. So we should soon be ready to start back riding.

I'm wondering about how to avoid rubbing in the heels. I've read that people put socks on over the hoof. Has anyone here had any experience with using them or something similar to protect the heels from rubs. I'm wondering what type of socks to use and do they bunch up under the boots?
I'm going to use hoof armour on the hinds and then see if he needs those booted too.


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## Gloi (28 February 2020)

Do you know they are going to rub. They usually don't unless the horse has really sensitive skin. Try them first on short rides and don't get mud and grit in to start off with  and the heels should toughen up quickly. I've found socks and gaiters just a nuisance.


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## Mule (28 February 2020)

Gloi said:



			Do you know they are going to rub. They usually don't unless the horse has really sensitive skin. Try them first on short rides and don't get mud and grit in to start off with  and the heels should toughen up quickly. I've found socks and gaiters just a nuisance.
		
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By short rides do you mean 10 minutes or so?


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## Gloi (28 February 2020)

mule said:



			By short rides do you mean 10 minutes or so?
		
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Only you know your horse, keep your eye on him and build it up. You'll soon notice if there is likely to be a problem


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## Floofball (2 March 2020)

Well Feb was a bit of a write off with all the horrible storms BUT decided to be positive today and ordered his boots. The horses have been so miserable that I let diets slide a bit and grass definitely coming through now so we have to get moving more now! Only managed a couple of outings in Feb - he still feels great and is happy on all the surfaces I’ve tried so far. Put my old macs on him to start getting him used to boots but they are too big for him - clumsy Mctrip hazard 😂 have ordered the easy boot trails in hopefully the right size 🤞🏻


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## milliepops (2 March 2020)

mule said:



			I'm wondering about how to avoid rubbing in the heels. I've read that people put socks on over the hoof. Has anyone here had any experience with using them or something similar to protect the heels from rubs. I'm wondering what type of socks to use and do they bunch up under the boots?
.
		
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I had cavallo treks for one horse and did find that they rubbed after a bit so I used gaiters, not the cavallo ones though, the HHO wisdom was that they were rubbish. When they were in the wash I used socks and didn't have a problem with bunching up but the gaiters were better. Sorry I can't remember what they were now but I'm sure others can advise.


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## ycbm (2 March 2020)

Boa gaiters were good because they had a tongue that the horse stood on to stop them riding up. I think these are the same.

https://www.equinepodiatrysupplies....boot-old-macs-multipurpose-hoof-boot-gaiters/

C.


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## Gloi (2 March 2020)

ycbm said:



			Boa gaiters were good because they had a tongue that the horse stood on to stop them riding up. I think these are the same.

https://www.equinepodiatrysupplies....boot-old-macs-multipurpose-hoof-boot-gaiters/

C.
		
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In theory but they didn't work for mine  The Boa boots were a nightmare too, lethally slippy on grass and the wires kept wearing through. Soon got rid of them for some Gloves.


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## Mule (2 March 2020)

Good news. The vet rang today with the results of the dex suppression test. He doesn't have ppid 🎉🎊🎉

I think the reason he's so improved is because, since being taken off the field, his feet have finally had the chance to dry and harden. It's thanks to the advice on this forum. It never occurred to me that the problem was the wet field


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## Mule (3 March 2020)

Bad news update
He lost his last cast today. He's ucomfortable again😢
 I realised that the reason is because the cast that fell off was on the left hoof. His x-rays showed that both soles were very thin but that there was practically no sole on the left hoof 😔

I thought the whole thing was solved. Now I'm suspicious that the right hoof was ok for some time. That would explain why he was sound when he lost the right cast. It's likely it was the left hoof that was sore all along. 

The farrier is coming later so I'll have a chat with him. I'll be taking more photos too. His boots have already been dispatched.
 Maybe he can wear a shoe on his left hoof and go bare on his right 😆


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## Gloi (3 March 2020)

mule said:



			.

The farrier is coming later so I'll have a chat with him. I'll be taking more photos too. His boots have already been dispatched.
Maybe he can wear a shoe on his left hoof and go bare on his right 😆
		
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Have you tried the hoof armour on him yet? He sounds like a good candidate for it.


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## Mule (3 March 2020)

Gloi said:



			Have you tried the hoof armour on him yet? He sounds like a good candidate for it.
		
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I put it on his hinds when the farrier came today. I had to rush off afterwards so I haven't had a look at him since. I'm going to put it on his front hooves as well. I didn't think of it today becaue of the drama with his left fore being tender. 

When I thought both front hooves were fine I was just going to use boots on them for riding and try riding with hoof armour on the hinds.


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## Gloi (3 March 2020)

mule said:



			I put it on his hinds when the farrier came today. I had to rush off afterwards so I haven't had a look at him since. I'm going to put it on his front hooves as well. I didn't think of it today becaue of the drama with his left fore being tender.

When I thought both front hooves were fine I was just going to use boots on them for riding and try riding with hoof armour on the hinds.
		
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With the fronts being sore it should protect the soles in the field too and hopefully let them grow a bit thicker and not be so soft with the wet. Hope things work out.


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## Mule (3 March 2020)

Gloi said:



			With the fronts being sore it should protect the soles in the field too and hopefully let them grow a bit thicker and not be so soft with the wet. Hope things work out.
		
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So do I. My poor delicate horse😔
 Good hooves will be a prerequisite for any horse I get in the future


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## Mule (5 March 2020)

Bah, the hoof boots are too big🙄 (size 5 cavallos) It was prophesied that they'd be tight on him. I'm going to order a fit kit.

I've put hoof armour on both hinds and the left fore (the tender one). The applicator gun is blocked, so I've brought it home to have a poke around it. Despite wearing gloves I still managed to get it on my hands (clumsiness). It gets weirdly hot 🔥
I will have photos of hooves tomorrow 👣
 His co-owner jokingly suggested selling him to the local meat man 😲


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## Mule (5 March 2020)

Dupe


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## Mule (5 March 2020)

Re; selling him to the meat man, if the next boots I get don't fit, I'll be tempted 😒

Although, one benefit of having him stabled at night is that I get to spend a lot more time with him than when he's in the field. I have a little crate in his stable and I sit in with him and listen to an audiobook. It's relaxing. He has even given me the odd nuzzle, which is nice (he's not that type). We're bonding over hooves


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## Mule (5 March 2020)

I've just thought of an idea. Horseshoes are comfortable because the walls 
bare the weight of the horse. There is no pressure on the sole of the hoof. Perhaps boots with the sole area cut out would work similarly. When the boots are on, the weight would be carried solely by the hoof wall, mimicking horseshoes. What do you think? Are there any boots that work like this?


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## Gloi (6 March 2020)

mule said:



			I've just thought of an idea. Horseshoes are comfortable because the walls
bare the weight of the horse. There is no pressure on the sole of the hoof. Perhaps boots with the sole area cut out would work similarly. When the boots are on, the weight would be carried solely by the hoof wall, mimicking horseshoes. What do you think? Are there any boots that work like this?
		
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If the horse is still footy in boots you can put pads in and I suppose you could cut the pads so they only went round the wall of the hoof and had a space in the middle and there are pads which have a thicker part for the frog to encourage the frog pressure which you really want. I think though you just need to give your horse more time, keep the hoof armour going and use your boots for riding once you get the right ones (which you will, just be patient).


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## Mule (6 March 2020)

Gloi said:



			If the horse is still footy in boots you can put pads in and I suppose you could cut the pads so they only went round the wall of the hoof and had a space in the middle and there are pads which have a thicker part for the frog to encourage the frog pressure which you really want. I think though you just need to give your horse more time, keep the hoof armour going and use your boots for riding once you get the right ones (which you will, just be patient).
		
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The problem with getting boots for him is that his front hooves are 10mm wider than long. There aren't many boots that cater for that shape. Apparently it's a common shape in tb's and draughts. He's a TB/ID cross.

His hind hooves are more round so
 I might be in luck there.


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## Gloi (6 March 2020)

mule said:



			The problem with getting boots for him is that his front hooves are 10mm wider than long. There aren't many boots that cater for that shape. Apparently it's a common shape in tb's and draughts. He's a TB/ID cross.

His hind hooves are more round so
I might be in luck there.
		
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So long as you can get the hoof in the boot and you are only doing slow work you'll manage for the time being. The problems with fit start when you go in mud or canter or ride for hours. Once the hooves improve they might round up too. Just plug on. My first one I booted had hooves so contracted nothing really fit , they were so long and narrow, but they did improve and become a slightly better shape in time.


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## Mule (7 March 2020)

Gloi said:



			So long as you can get the hoof in the boot and you are only doing slow work you'll manage for the time being. The problems with fit start when you go in mud or canter or ride for hours. Once the hooves improve they might round up too. Just plug on. My first one I booted had hooves so contracted nothing really fit , they were so long and narrow, but they did improve and become a slightly better shape in time.
		
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The hoof armour has really helped his tender front hoof 😊


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## Gloi (7 March 2020)

mule said:



			The hoof armour has really helped his tender front hoof 😊
		
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That's good news   I think he is a really good candidate for it helping him, protecting the sole so it has chance to thicken up.


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## Mule (7 March 2020)

Gloi said:



			That's good news   I think he is a really good candidate for it helping him, protecting the sole so it has chance to thicken up.
		
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He strolled down the driveway again so it's definitely helping!


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## Mule (7 March 2020)

He broke out in to the field the other day. This is him, upon his return.


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## Mule (12 March 2020)

Here are hoof photos from today 12th March. It's four and a half months in.
The hooves aren't the cleanest (my assistant, who's holding the hooves is getting impatient)
He trotted down to me for his dinner today, which was very encouraging.
I can't believe I haven't ridden him in 4.5 months, he'll be horrified when I get up on him again🙈

Left hind





Right fore


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## Aoife 2020 (12 March 2020)

Looks like you’re having problems with him been barefoot. His feet are looking a lot better but  some horses just can’t be barefoot and needs a pair of  shoes to correct problems . I am very lucky that my mare has brilliant feet .


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## ponyparty (12 March 2020)

It can take 12 months (ish) to grow a whole new hoof capsule; 4.5 months really isn’t that long to transition esp when looking at how his hooves started. It’s amazing the difference in OP’s horse’s feet really. Transitioning isn’t always plain sailing, it’s a process and depends how damaged the hooves were to start with. 

I think he’s doing great, mule, and you’ve inspired me to keep going with my boy!


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## Mule (12 March 2020)

Aoife 2020 said:



			Looks like you’re having problems with him been barefoot. His feet are looking a lot better but  some horses just can’t be barefoot and needs a pair of  shoes to correct problems . I am very lucky that my mare has brilliant feet .
		
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I'm going to try more boots and see how we get on. If I can't get boots to fit he'll have to be reshod because he can't be ridden as he is. I already have 2 field ornaments and I don't want another 🏇


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## Mule (12 March 2020)

ponyparty said:



			It can take 12 months (ish) to grow a whole new hoof capsule; 4.5 months really isn’t that long to transition esp when looking at how his hooves started. It’s amazing the difference in OP’s horse’s feet really. Transitioning isn’t always plain sailing, it’s a process and depends how damaged the hooves were to start with.

I think he’s doing great, mule, and you’ve inspired me to keep going with my boy!
		
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Thank you x


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## Mule (12 March 2020)

Whatever about his hooves, he must be the muddiest horse in existence. I think it's quite impressive


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## Gloi (13 March 2020)

mule said:



			I'm going to try more boots and see how we get on. If I can't get boots to fit he'll have to be reshod because he can't be ridden as he is. I already have 2 field ornaments and I don't want another 🏇
		
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You will get boots to fit, you don't want to undo the work you've done so far. Some dry weather will really help.
Who does your trimming?


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## Mule (13 March 2020)

Gloi said:



			You will get boots to fit, you don't want to undo the work you've done so far. Some dry weather will really help.
		
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I hope so. I agree about not undoing the work. It would be such a shame after spending so long at it. There's been such an improvement. His hooves, especially the back ones look so much better. I think the most recent change is the angle of the sole.


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## ponyparty (13 March 2020)

When I took my boy’s shoes off the first time, it took about 5-6 months for his feet to start looking really good - and his feet were in a much better starting place than your boy’s! So do give it time. My boy was still footy though, even though his feet looked great - it was the grass, I realise now, he’s metabolic and SO grass sensitive it’s unreal. If only I’d moved him somewhere suitable then and persevered... things might be a lot different now. Anyway, that aside, do persevere with the search for hoof boots. They are expensive but once you’ve got the right ones, much cheaper than being shod every 6 weeks (or less in my boy’s case... and extra for remedial farriery 😰). When I had his shoes pulled for the second time, I was absolutely gutted at how crushed his heels were, how deep the central sulcus again, and how long his toes were, even though they hadn’t seemed long in shoes?! To my eye anyway. I could kick myself for being pressured into putting shoes back on him! All that rehab time, wasted and back to square one! 😩


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## Mule (13 March 2020)

ponyparty said:



			When I took my boy’s shoes off the first time, it took about 5-6 months for his feet to start looking really good - and his feet were in a much better starting place than your boy’s! So do give it time. My boy was still footy though, even though his feet looked great - it was the grass, I realise now, he’s metabolic and SO grass sensitive it’s unreal. If only I’d moved him somewhere suitable then and persevered... things might be a lot different now. Anyway, that aside, do persevere with the search for hoof boots. They are expensive but once you’ve got the right ones, much cheaper than being shod every 6 weeks (or less in my boy’s case... and extra for remedial farriery 😰). When I had his shoes pulled for the second time, I was absolutely gutted at how crushed his heels were, how deep the central sulcus again, and how long his toes were, even though they hadn’t seemed long in shoes?! To my eye anyway. I could kick myself for being pressured into putting shoes back on him! All that rehab time, wasted and back to square one! 😩
		
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I hate the idea of his hooves deteriorating. Were you able to keep your boy barefoot after you realised about the grass sensitivity?


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## Mule (16 March 2020)

Got up on the beast this morning. I don't know what came over me but I said I'd try it and see how he was. He strolled around no bother and even decided to go over a line of cavaletti. Considering he hadn't had anyone on him for four and a half months, if he was comfortable he would have marched around the place so I got off.

I trotted him around with a lunge whip to have a look at him. Although he trotted without much prompting, his step is quite low so he's being careful. He is fine walking in hand on a roughish surfaced road now (thanks to hoof armour on his bad hoof) So from the look of things he should be fine to be ridden in hoof boots  All that remains is to find a pair that fit.


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## Gloi (16 March 2020)

mule said:



			Got up on the beast this morning. I don't know what came over me but I said I'd try it and see how he was. He strolled around no bother and even decided to go over a line of cavaletti. Considering he hadn't had anyone on him for four and a half months, if he was comfortable he would have marched around the place so I got off.

I trotted him around with a lunge whip to have a look at him. Although he trotted without much prompting, his step is quite low so he's being careful. He is fine walking in hand on a roughish surfaced road now (thanks to hoof armour on his bad hoof) So from the look of things he should be fine to be ridden in hoof boots  All that remains is to find a pair that fit.
		
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Good start. As his heels gradually move back you will probably find that the flare at the quarters gets less and his feet start to be a more standard shape for the boots  If you get the Hoof Armour on all his hooves he might fancy walking out on the roads with you on him


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## ponyparty (16 March 2020)

mule said:



			I hate the idea of his hooves deteriorating. Were you able to keep your boy barefoot after you realised about the grass sensitivity?
		
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Due to other issues he had and treatment being paid for by insurance claim(s), I felt I had to follow vet advice to put shoes back on. I am kicking myself now; if I knew what I know now I never would have.

Shoeing also masks footiness due to grass sensitivity so in hindsight it was quite dangerous as it potentially masked early warning signs of laminitis.

I pulled his shoes again in November 2019; he went away to track rehab livery in December; after his first trim he walked away lifting his hinds as of he was wearing travel boots, getting accustomed to not having great long toes..! He’s staying there for at least 6 months, or just until his feet come right - however long that takes. If he’s still nowhere near sound enough to ride after 12 months, or he has any arthritic or metabolic flare ups, I will pts as he’s just so complicated to manage.


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## Mule (16 March 2020)

Ok bad news, it's the end of the road😦 I heard back from the hoof boutique and urban hoof today.
No hoof boots are going to fit him properly. The boot companies I contacted directly were of the same opinion. The width to length measurement is too disparate (18mm in one hoof).  I looked in to customs but can't afford them.
He has hoof armour on all four hooves now and he still isn't right ridden. 

He may well come sound to be ridden carefully without boots, eventually but I'm not willing to give him more time off. I also want to gallop and jump and go hacking on rutted trails up mountains.

I've texted the farrier to see if he has anymore ideas but if not, I'm going to re-shoe. All I can think of is to give him a twice yearly break from shoes and also remove them whenever his heels start becoming uneven.


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## Mule (16 March 2020)

One particularly useful thing I've learned is that uneven heels are the cause of his one- sidedness and trouble with vertical flexion (and lateral to a lesser degree). It answers so many questions about our dressage difficulties (my poor little mule wasn't physically able for what I was asking him). So as soon as we get uneven heels, the shoes will come off and no dressage until he's even again.

So anyway, that's my tale of woe. I'll see what the farrier comes up with 🤷
He'll be as disappointed as I am.
Anyway, I suppose you can't win them all. Thanks everyone for all your help and support


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## Red-1 (16 March 2020)

mule said:



			One particularly useful thing I've learned is that uneven heels are the cause of his one- sidedness and trouble with vertical flexion (and lateral to a lesser degree). It answers so many questions about our dressage difficulties (my poor little mule wasn't physically able for what I was asking him). So as soon as we get uneven heels, the shoes will come off and no dressage until he's even again.

So anyway, that's my tale of woe. I'll see what the farrier comes up with 🤷
He'll be as disappointed as I am.
Anyway, I suppose you can't win them all. Thanks everyone for all your help and support 

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Not all doom and gloom. I applaud your decision to keep him comfortable and enjoy him this summer. I also applaud taking them off again when you are able, and, as I said up-thread, you will  be in a better place next time as you will have gained this time.


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## Mule (16 March 2020)

Red-1 said:



			Not all doom and gloom. I applaud your decision to keep him comfortable and enjoy him this summer. I also applaud taking them off again when you are able, and, as I said up-thread, you will  be in a better place next time as you will have gained this time.
		
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Thank you


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## Floofball (18 March 2020)

It’s very difficult isn’t it. Due to the horrible storms I let diets slide a little, to try and keep them happy, my boy hasn’t put too much weight on but I was becoming increasingly concerned that I wasn’t going to be able to balance doing the miles needed to keep weight down and manage his diet/quality of life while the grass is now coming through. After realising I was seriously considering reshoeing, I looked into track livery. It seems like a really good solution to get him through the transitioning phase, condition his feet and hopefully get weight off at the same time. I have actually got a place for him and was all geared up to take him next week. Thought I was doing the best possible thing for him to give him the best chance BUT now, due to sensible precautions re Coronavirus, the yard has decided to not allow non-essential visits. If I take him I may not see him for the duration of his stay (minimum stay is 3 months) Really not sure what to do in these uncertain times 😩 he will have the best care and hopefully benefit tremendously from his stay but I‘m not sure I can wave goodbye to him? It’s either take him and miss him like mad or get the muzzles out, start soaking hay and micromanaging him again. The best thing for him is to go but for me??? Really undecided - help! What would you guys do in these unprecedented times?

I have 2 loo rolls for anyone with good advice 🤓


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## Mule (18 March 2020)

Floofball said:



			It’s very difficult isn’t it. Due to the horrible storms I let diets slide a little, to try and keep them happy, my boy hasn’t put too much weight on but I was becoming increasingly concerned that I wasn’t going to be able to balance doing the miles needed to keep weight down and manage his diet/quality of life while the grass is now coming through. After realising I was seriously considering reshoeing, I looked into track livery. It seems like a really good solution to get him through the transitioning phase, condition his feet and hopefully get weight off at the same time. I have actually got a place for him and was all geared up to take him next week. Thought I was doing the best possible thing for him to give him the best chance BUT now, due to sensible precautions re Coronavirus, the yard has decided to not allow non-essential visits. If I take him I may not see him for the duration of his stay (minimum stay is 3 months) Really not sure what to do in these uncertain times 😩 he will have the best care and hopefully benefit tremendously from his stay but I‘m not sure I can wave goodbye to him? It’s either take him and miss him like mad or get the muzzles out, start soaking hay and micromanaging him again. The best thing for him is to go but for me??? Really undecided - help! What would you guys do in these unprecedented times?

I have 2 loo rolls for anyone with good advice 🤓
		
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I don't honestly know, but I didn't want to read and say nothing. Maybe one consideration would be finances with the coming recession. If you need to be careful then not paying for livery would make sense. Another thing is whether you're ok to do the micromanaging. Have you the time for it. It's such a shame about visiting restrictions, particularly as you don't know how long they will go on for.


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## Mule (22 March 2020)

I rode him properly for the first time today. He hadn't been ridden in 5 months and he just happily strolled around 

He's so nice to ride now. I think it's due to   his hoof bulbs becoming even. They improved after a couple of months of him being barefoot.
He was always very one sided and found it difficult to flex. I didn't know why, until I noticed the change when the shoes were pulled.

I'm looking forward to schooling without spending 90% of the time focussing on suppleness! I can't believe I didn't cop on to it being a physical problem until recently 🙇‍♀️


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## Mule (22 March 2020)

In light of my experience, it would be interesting to talk to physios about barefoot. I'd be curious to see if they have noticed beneficial outcomes.

I can see 3D printing becoming a big thing for hoof boots in the future. It would be ideal for hoof shapes like the beast's.


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## PurBee (22 March 2020)

mule said:



			In light of my experience, it would be interesting to talk to physios about barefoot. I'd be curious to see if they have noticed beneficial outcomes.

I can see 3D printing becoming a big thing for hoof boots in the future. It would be ideal for hoof shapes like the beast's.
		
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That is such an excellent idea! The boots would fit perfectly and the perspex/plastic 3-d printing stuff would offer protection and flexibility while being a ‘throw away’ boot, after the hooves change shape. Wow...that idea is a great innovation and has mileage as a business venture Mule!
Have you seen the videos on youtube of the 3-d printing conventions? They 3-d print food, clothes, human footwear...its incredible technology 😀


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## Mule (23 March 2020)

PurBee said:



			That is such an excellent idea! The boots would fit perfectly and the perspex/plastic 3-d printing stuff would offer protection and flexibility while being a ‘throw away’ boot, after the hooves change shape. Wow...that idea is a great innovation and has mileage as a business venture Mule!
Have you seen the videos on youtube of the 3-d printing conventions? They 3-d print food, clothes, human footwear...its incredible technology 😀
		
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I haven't seen any of the videos, I don't really know much about 3D printing. It sounds pretty exciting though.


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## PurBee (23 March 2020)

hopefully the above video will play for you....its not working atm for me.

it shows the complexity and variety of materials available to 3d print.
A 3-d digital rendering of a horses hoof would be needed in order for the designer to make a perfect fit wrap around boot To 3–d print. Its such a great idea! Amazed the equine world isnt onto it already.


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## lilly1 (11 May 2020)

Just read your post as I'm starting the journey to barefoot. Did you put shoes back on in the end?


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## Mule (11 May 2020)

lilly1 said:



			Just read your post as I'm starting the journey to barefoot. Did you put shoes back on in the end?
		
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Hi, I did put them back on. It was the right decision for him as he's much happier. He's galloping about playing with the other gelding again.

I will always give him a couple of months out of shoes over the winter to try to keep his hooves in good shape.

*Something else occurred to me after I put the shoes back on. He was born in a rescue centre to a mare that died a few weeks afterwards. Both he and his dam are unlikely to have had proper nutrition before he was born. That may have had an effect on things like hoof health.


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## Orangehorse (12 May 2020)

My horse was barefoot and completely sound for a couple of years, but the upkeep and what was happening in my life made me put shoes back on, and my trimmer fully understood and was sympathic.

So he has been shod, until 6 weeks ago when farrier removed the shoes.

I am itching to get the rasp out and just rasp round his toes!  I used to do this when under one trimmer who was very relaxed about it, but his feet are sort of OK but a bit chipped and one foot definitely looks longer than the other and is a slightly different shape.

When he first went barefoot his feet changed enormously, and went from being noticeablely pigeon toed to nearly normal, it was fascinating to see how his hoof "moved"

So do I get the rasp out?


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## Gloi (12 May 2020)

Orangehorse said:



			My horse was barefoot and completely sound for a couple of years, but the upkeep and what was happening in my life made me put shoes back on, and my trimmer fully understood and was sympathic.

So he has been shod, until 6 weeks ago when farrier removed the shoes.

I am itching to get the rasp out and just rasp round his toes!  I used to do this when under one trimmer who was very relaxed about it, but his feet are sort of OK but a bit chipped and one foot definitely looks longer than the other and is a slightly different shape.

When he first went barefoot his feet changed enormously, and went from being noticeablely pigeon toed to nearly normal, it was fascinating to see how his hoof "moved"

So do I get the rasp out?
		
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I would. You don't need to take much off.  I've just sent off for a new rasp to deal with mine. I've not been riding during the lockdown and his hooves have grown like weeds and  are so hard with the dry weather the rasp I normally use is barely touching them. I rode him a couple of times for the first time last week to give them a bit of a council trim but they need a bit of work on them.


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## HeresHoping (12 May 2020)

Fascinating story. It took my EMS girl nearly three years to come completely comfortable bare foot. She's hopping lame now with a mahoosive bruise. 

OH - get the rasp out. 

I have a range of 3D printing technologies at my finger tips. For plastics and composites. I also see custom hoof boots as a possible application. However, I'm not sure how robust our materials are going to be - we're probably better off vac casting in a semi-rigid rubber for the base. Anyone wanting to explore this further, please do get in touch with me.


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## Floofball (13 May 2020)

While people are still posting on this thread I thought I’d give a little update on my lad. I thought we were sailing through the transition then the long dry spell came! Cue feet starting to crack and self trim a bit too quickly. I am getting him used to boots on the front but still not ridden him in them yet. He’s still sound and striding out in walk on most surfaces but only striding out in trot on softer ground. I was starting to feel a bit lost with it all to be honest and the temptation to put shoes back on and crack on with more work was very strong 😱 BUT I keep reminding myself why I’m doing it and I’m determined to give it my best shot sooooo, he’s off to track livery at the end of this month 👍🏻 I’m really hopeful we will both benefit from the service, experience and support provided 🤞🏻


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## Mule (13 May 2020)

Floofball said:



			While people are still posting on this thread I thought I’d give a little update on my lad. I thought we were sailing through the transition then the long dry spell came! Cue feet starting to crack and self trim a bit too quickly. I am getting him used to boots on the front but still not ridden him in them yet. He’s still sound and striding out in walk on most surfaces but only striding out in trot on softer ground. I was starting to feel a bit lost with it all to be honest and the temptation to put shoes back on and crack on with more work was very strong 😱 BUT I keep reminding myself why I’m doing it and I’m determined to give it my best shot sooooo, he’s off to track livery at the end of this month 👍🏻 I’m really hopeful we will both benefit from the service, experience and support provided 🤞🏻
		
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Good luck Where is the track livery?


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## ycbm (13 May 2020)

Do you have anyone supporting you?   Feet often crack because they are too long, barefoot feet look very short compared to shod, and worsening performance in spring is more often talked to grass growth than it is to the ground being harder. 

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## Floofball (13 May 2020)

mule said:



			Good luck Where is the track livery?
		
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I”m taking him to Gawsworth - really looking forward to it 😊


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## Floofball (13 May 2020)

ycbm said:



			Do you have anyone supporting you?   Feet often crack because they are too long, barefoot feet look very short compared to shod, and worsening performance in spring is more often talked to grass growth than it is to the ground being harder.

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No it just me, that’s why I’m really looking forward to getting him down to the track livery 😅 my lad has EMS so never gets to eat much grass. His companion is a previously laminitic section a who is uber sensitive to grass. They are out overnight on a bare paddock with hay then come off during the day and have soaked hay. I did leave them out one day as you just wouldn’t think there was grass for them to eat but pony had mild pulses by teatime 🙄 so maybe he is reacting to the spring grass 🤔 I will be learning a lot as I go - what do people do with their barefoot horses if they are sensitive to grass?


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