# Setting up a new livery yard from scratch. Anyone done this/any input?



## charlie76 (27 July 2009)

has anyone on here set a livery yard from scratch. If so please could you give me any advice. 
I have been running a yard as a manager for a long time but that is a whole different world to starting from scratch.
The facility I have in mind has a huge arena, lunge arena, brand new stables, rubber matting, off road hacking (over 200 acres) individual turn out, club house, showers, loos, wash box, storage, horse walker ect. Indoor school planned and gallops.
It has great financial backing. On site accom.
It will be run as mainly a full livery yard.
How would you promote the yard? I have my ideas but any more would be great. 
How much would you pay (in the South UK) for full livery for the above?
What would make you go and stay at a yard like the above?
I know that you have to consider the following:
income
profit
outgoings- wages, maintence, feed, hay, bedding, electricity, rates, muck heap removal( there is a estate manager that looks after the land),improvals.
staff wages
insurance
Health and Safety
staff contracts
advertising
BHS approval 
Security
Fire extingushers ect
Staff training
Anything I have missed.

What would be the best way to get paid for livery- cash, cheque, DD??

There would be approx 20 boxes.

As much advice as pos please!


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## DollyDolls (27 July 2009)

The first thing I would say if how much are you leasing the stables/land etc for?
Then work the rest out from there.
I would say full livery is about £20 - £25 per day in SE, multiply that by 20boxes (max income) and see what you have left over &amp; whether it is economically viable.


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## Dubsie (27 July 2009)

Can't help with the costs, but with regard to getting the ££ in I would say direct debit is a must as the ££ will roll in without any input from you unless a payment bounces.


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## Bossanova (27 July 2009)

We charge £150 per week full livery, plus £15/week if they go on the walker every day.
Part livery (everything bar riding) is £105/week

Direct debit is the best way, that way you know it's definitely coming in. Ours pay at the beginning of the month and then settle up any extras by cash/cheque at end of the month.
We offer schooling, exercise, lunging, hacking and walker as extras for the part liveries. As well as clipping, plaiting etc and onsite BHSII.

We dont actually make any money from the liveries, we always come out with a loss!


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## Peacelily (27 July 2009)

Planning planning planning is what I'd recommend. go out to the shops, buy yourself a project book, and some files/folders and use them. 

How would you promote the yard? I have my ideas but any more would be great. 
  depends what clients you were after, back of horse and hound, dressage magazine, any internet sites which appeal to your clients, any BE forums, and other publications which appeal to your market, adverts in tack shops in the area, noticeboards in the area, local areas newpaper if you want to appeal to everyone. Also think about making up a flyer and handing them out at local shows. Promotion can also be having an article in the newspaper that doesn't advertise your yard directly but tells of a success story, or news of an event or update...get some quotes of different advertising costs and then try and weigh up how much of the market you'll reach using it. ie. we all know H&amp;H is expensive but it reaches the masses and so therefore is worth everypenny. 

How much would you pay (in the South UK) for full livery for the above? 
 Do some research, look up all the livery places you can find in your area, mark them out on a map with their costs and USP (unique selling point) that differentiates them from the rest, for you it could be a whole range of things from your 200 acres hacking, to the club house facilities, brand new stables etc... if you want to delve further you can (for a cost, so probably chose the most interesting models) access their company accounts and look behind their scenes through their finances. (yes, you're allowed to do this by law)

outgoings- wages, maintence, feed, hay, bedding, electricity, rates, muck heap removal( there is a estate manager that looks after the land),improvals, staff wages, insurance,Health and Safety, advertising, BHS approval , Security, Fire extingushers, staff contracts, Staff training
   all of what you've mentioned are outgoings, you should evaluate these carefully and this should allow you to figure out how much you're going to charge. Get quotes of where you're going to get feed/hay/bedding from, will they do you a discount if you buy in bulk?can you work out a loyalty scheme with them, contact your electricity/gas supplier - do they have buisness rates? can they help you evaluate how much electricity you'll use? e.g. in the summer you shouldn't need to use lights, but lights in a tackroom, lights in the winter - you can work out about how many hours of electricity you'll use and work this into your plan. Staff wages - what leve of staff are you going to employ - ring the BHS for advice on rates, are you going to offer them anything else? e.g. livery - don't forget to cost this in (means you can therefore only have 19 boxes earning money, BHS approvals, you can find out how much per year this will cost you, the same for security if there's a one off initial cost - how are you going to distribute this?.....
i'd go through absolutly everything you can think off and then work out what costs will be covered by the liveries, or how much you expect something to be paid back by (e.g. if you spend £1000 on security camers/system, are you going to want this cost paid back in 1 yr, 2 yrs? )
I'd work out also how many boxes you need to have full to break even (cover your costs but make no profit) and how many boxes you need to start makeing a profit, and then with the profit - where is this going to go - how will you record it? etc..

also think about record keeping, book keeping, proceedures, planning for growth, goals, objectives, task manaement, client management, day to day management....
(and write it all down in your book...!!!)

....forry if its just a quick rant of a few things...i feel quite strongly about "horse businesses" not making any money and not actually using business sense when it comes to management of the whole operation....I want to see the horse business profitable!!!


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## Vix1978 (27 July 2009)

You must do your market research into your catchment area and beyond to answer most of these questions. Also, if you haven't done already, pull together a business plan. Included in this, you'll want projected cash flows for at least the first year. By compiling these, it will force you to answer the necessary questions.
I would also get a good accountant - if you have 20 boxes at full livery, you will be over the VAT threshold, and that is a nightmare in the equine industry! There is also PAYE, end of year returns etc etc that will need to be filed.
Finally, remember we are in the middle of a credit crunch - is there the market to fill 20 boxes at full livery. Be prepared to comprimise if necc with part livery or even assisted DIY. The numbers have to stack up, but at the end of the day, empty boxes lose you money.
Good luck - it's hard work but worth it!


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## Equus Leather (27 July 2009)

_Claire_ on here has set up a yard from scratch I think, she might pop on later, or you could PM her.


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## Enfys (27 July 2009)

As has Bosworth I believe.


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## charlie76 (27 July 2009)

Really helpful. Thankyou so much.


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## ihatework (27 July 2009)

From the sounds of it you will be going for the upper end of the market.
You obviously need to make sure that there is sufficient demand for this type of full livery. Given I know the area I think you need to make sure you can fill your boxes, and if you can't would you be able to cover costs by having part liveries instead?

I suppose 2 similar/rival yards would be Fair Oak Grange
https://ncsusraermws3.na.jnj.com/eRoom/ClinOp/ClinOpsPh1Room3/0_4f663

and Cane End Stud
http://caneendstud.weebly.com/

Are these full? Might be worth finding out.

Also is it total of 20 boxes or 20 livery boxes? If total remember to take into account any of your own horses and possible grooms horses.

Keep your supplies as cheap as possible - if you can make your own hay/haylage.
Keep very friendly with local farmers for muck removal - worth speaking to them in advance and see if there are any types of bedding they prefer to take.
Haggle with feed/bedding suppliers for bulk discounts

Something you haven't mentioned is lorry parking - I assume this is available as it is essential in this type of yard

As for advertising it might be worth your while sponsoring classes for local riding clubs, pony clubs etc. Maybe arrange clinics that external parties can attend just to get the yard known.


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## hollykb (27 July 2009)

Can't really offer any advice but sounds like you're embarking on exactly what I'd love to do eventually! If you need any staff let me know, I'm in the south east! 
	
	
		
		
	


	




 and good luck!!


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