# Surrogate Mare



## sammylou93 (28 May 2012)

I have a healthy, sound 9 yr old 15.2hh chunky TB who doesn't have the temperment or willingness for a ridden career and beacuse of her sharp nature and lack of facilities/money I don't want to breed from her. 

I have been in touch with both Beaufort and Twemlows who say she is too small, does anyone know if there are any other studs who would be looking for something like the above? Thanks


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## millimoo (28 May 2012)

Meant in the nicest way, but no sensible breeder would/should breed from a mare with a questionable temperament... Sorry, just my opinion 
What about the blood banks in the UK?


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## ribbons (28 May 2012)

I think sammylou was suggesting her mare fore embryo transfer so it would not be her mares foal. Hence the title surrogate mare.
I think you might struggle to place her sammy


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## ribbons (28 May 2012)

Grrrr bloody phone.
As I was saying sammylou, you will struggle to place her for ET. They do like big roomy mares. Often using shires and other draught horses.


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## s4sugar (28 May 2012)

The more wouldn't be contributing her genes but would not be a good example to a foal.


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## Alec Swan (28 May 2012)

ribbons said:



			.......

 Often using shires and other draught horses.
		
Click to expand...

The thinking regarding recipient mares for ET,  is now changing.  It's generally accepted that for the generally TB influenced Sport Horse Donor mare, the recipient needs to match the donor as closely as possible.  The big Shire and Draught mares allow the received foal too much room,  and there have been many who have been disappointed in the foal produced,  by the recipient,  whilst in uteri.  Big stout mares will produce big stout foals,  regardless of the parentage,  and that may not be what's wanted!

Ther recipient mare cannot influence the foal *genetically*,  but she can and will influence the growth rate of the unborn foal.  

Some scatter brained and stupid mares can to be good mothers,  some not,  and that's why it's considered ideal if the mare has had a previous foal,  so that her abilities as a mother can be assessed.  We had a borrowed mare from an HHOer,  last year,  and to say that when she arrived she was a bit difficult,  was an understatement.  She sort of settled,  and she and I found common ground and got on.  When she foaled,  she was a saint,  and as good a brood mare as could be wished for.  There's no telling,  it seems! 

A 15.2 well proportioned TB mare may well be of interest to those who perform ET on Polo Ponies,  and I suspect that that's what Beaufort do.  "Phone them and ask.  

They will tell you that the mare will influence the size of the foal,  as she carries it,  and demonstrably,  big mares will produce big foals.  They will also tell you that a mare will limit the size of the foal that she's carrying,  and that after birth,  it will reach it's full potential.  Clearly,  that's rubbish,  or at least it would be potentially suicidal to rely on the theory.

At 15.2 I would suggest that your mare may be a little small for the SH breeder to use as a recipient.  Polo Ponies?  a different matter perhaps.

Alec.


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## sammylou93 (28 May 2012)

Thanks for your replies.

Alex - Beaufort want absolute min 16hh, ideally 16.2hh but then that was for the sport horses. Shall give them a call tm re polo pony route, thanks.

She is a gem on the ground and doesn't show nutty tendancies when in the field, it's purely when ridden, hence why I wouldn't actually want to take a foal of her.

Her bloodlines are racing, do TB studs tend to use surrogate mares or are they all proven and retired from the track?


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## ribbons (29 May 2012)

That's interesting enfys, and I'm very pleased that the thinking on the size of the recipient mare is changing. I knew of a very special breeding of an Arab where the recipient mare was a shire. The foal was huge, and he was very disappointing to his owners for that very reason.
Some mares that carry the label of difficult are in actual fact sweethearts with a wonderful natural temperament, especially TB's. 
It is very often the human influence in early life that has caused these sensitive animals to show difficult attitudes when in work, yet allowed to relax and enjoy motherhood are wonderful. As you said though, ET centres would usually want to know mares breeding record. I doubt any would be interested in a maiden.


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## mafalda (2 May 2013)

On the Beaufort site they specifically mention maidens as preferable.


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