# Have I ran out of options for my dog?



## littlen (18 May 2017)

I'm not sure if there's any advice that can be given as I've had it all but it helps to have a range of opinions sometimes.

I have a much loved dog, GSD with perhaps some maliniois or other type in her. She had a bad start in life but I have worked very hard with her.
I've had her since a (too) young puppy. She's been to training classes since 8 weeks old. She's done kennel club classes, agility, socialisation classes, fun dog shows all under the guidance of a qualified trainer...I honestly tried my best to make her into a well rounded individual. I followed all of the socialisation rules to the letter.

She started showing signs of nervous aggression from a young age (12 weeks maybe) outside of the home and with strangers. She would hide and cower behind me when anyone passed. She has never had an interest in interacting with anyone outside of family.

A typical example of her walks are barking from the moment the door opens until we walk back, lunging/snarling/growling/barking at every human/dog/cyclist she sees until we get back. She's a large dog at somewhere around 30kg so it's not fun at all. 

I tried to nip it in the bud and consulted a positive veterinary behaviourist from 6 months old. We did BAT therapy which did work to a point but she stalled and hasn't improved much since those initial few months. I've got to the point where I can ask for sit and allow the stranger to pass at a distance but she can not get closer without a meltdown. I have been refered to one of the top behaviourist in the UK who thinks she will always be terrified of life. I've joined dog walk groups and Facebook groups but nothing helps. 

She has never bitten or tried to bite but 'air' snaps. She will chase however given the chance. 

She has effected my other dog who has become more grumpy and withdrawn when walking. She lunges at him when he plays as she is frustrated she isn't allowed off lead to play with him. I can't excersise her enough as I can't let her off lead or she intimidates people. 

I can't walk anywhere except the same route at silly times. I can't go to the beach or woods or for a picnic. I can't go on holiday or leave her with anyone as she wouldn't cope. 

On the other hand, she is the sweetest most loyal dog at home. She spends most of her day asleep and is incredibly gentle. She plays with her toys and runs around the garden like a mad thing. She's not all bad, when she's in her comfort zone she's so happy.

I've got to the point where I'm considering euthanasia as I can't see any other way forward. I don't want another behaviourist as they all say the same. I don't want to try more medication as it never works. I've given up with training her, I've trained this dog more than any dog I know and once she's triggered it goes out of the window. I just want to walk like a normal person without the stares, whispers and people tutting and crossing the road. People judge me as if I have let her do this for fun or as some sort of status but that isn't the case.

I don't feel she's a danger to anyone so that's not a concern of mine. She's muzzled and walked in a dogmatic and harness- pretty much 0 chance of escaping or anything like that. My house is like Fort Knox. It's more a quality of life issue that is keeping me up at night. 

But how do I go ahead with this and live with myself?  I've gone round in circles for months and months but cant bring myself to do what probably needs to be done?
She's only 2. The whole thing seems so final. Is there something I've missed that I can do?

I don't think I can physically do it. My husband is against euthanisaia as she hasn't done anything (he means she hasn't hurt anyone!) which makes it harder but he's away Monday to Friday so isn't the one struggling.


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## Pearlsasinger (18 May 2017)

Do you have to walk the 2 dogs together? It sounds as if you would all get more enjoyment from the dogs being walked separately?

Is there anywhere local where you could pay a fee to exercise her of the lead by herself, or is your garden big enough to exercise her in?

Except for when you walk her, does she seem happy with life? What is she like with visitors to your home?

I agree with you that quality of life must be paramount and if she doesn't have than pts is best.


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## CorvusCorax (18 May 2017)

Her problems are more than likely genetic and it sounds like you have tried your best.

As I've said previously, if she's happy at home and miserable and unhappy elsewhere, then don't subject her to it. Why would you do that to yourself and her?

Pretty much ALL dogs are lovely at home. It's when they are exposed to stress that you see the 'real' dog. And for some dogs 'stress' can be as little as simple exposure to the outside world.

If she were mine and I thought she was very unhappy mentally I would say PTS. If I had the capability to keep her home and keep her happy then I would do so.

However it sounds like you are both incredibly stressed and that isn't sustainable long term. 

No one can validate your decision for you, but best of luck with whatever you decide.


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## CorvusCorax (18 May 2017)

Pearlsasinger said:



			Do you have to walk the 2 dogs together? It sounds as if you would all get more enjoyment from the dogs being walked separately?

Is there anywhere local where you could pay a fee to exercise her of the lead by herself, or is your garden big enough to exercise her in?

Except for when you walk her, does she seem happy with life? What is she like with visitors to your home?

I agree with you that quality of life must be paramount and if she doesn't have than pts is best.
		
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I had a dog who simply didn't want to go anywhere. She would try to run home if you let her off the lead halfway up a mountain. She would run back to her kennel (to then run in circles) from a field next to the house. In the house, she would never settle and did circuits of the living room. The only time I ever saw her lying down  or relaxed was in a crate.
She wasn't interested in applying herself to any sort of training as she had no focus at all.
The world was just too big for her.


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## ester (18 May 2017)

I was going to say if she is fine at home can you just not walk her as she finds it so stressful?


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## littlen (18 May 2017)

Thanks both of you.

I have a young child (who she adores) but find it hard to get them out seperately due to a lack of time. My routine is walk, drop off at childcare, horses, work and repeat.
As I said my husband isn't here so squeezing in two walks per dog isn't always possible.
I do try and take them out individually a few times a week mainly to give my other dog a break! 
If I do take my other dog she is happy to wait in her crate as long as she's been out first.

I can't decide what her quality of life is like I think that's the problem. At home she is happy, but I can't keep a german shepherd type as a house dog can I? Isn't that cruel?
My garden isn't huge sadly but she enjoys running laps of it and digging holes everywhere 

I feel stressed every time she leaves the house. Annoyingly though she wants to come out and I feel awful leaving her behind. She sees the lead and starts the whining and running to the door as if she's desperate to go, tail wagging and full of excitement. It's as soon as she sees something scary that she switches. If she could walk and not see anyone I have no doubt she wouldn't be a problem. She is obedient, comes back, loves splashing about and picking up sticks and chasing flies around. The dogs love playing and chasing eachother and seem so happy playing until something scares her. I don't know if I can take that away from her realistically? 

I can't find anywhere secure and dog free in my area. I did find some dog walking fields but most of them are full of dogs surrounding them which would be no good at all.


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## CorvusCorax (18 May 2017)

Keeping her at home is no crueller than repeatedly exposing her to things she finds terrifying. Not all dogs fit into our human ideal of walks on the beach, playing nicely with others. It's the square peg/round hole issue again.

You could maybe set up some agility equipment for her or do tracking or something.


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## littlen (18 May 2017)

Thankyou.

I probably do put human emotions on her a bit. For example when she can't come on family days out etc I feel bad about leaving her alone but then again she wouldn't cope.

I could probably get her to her 'safe' space a couple of times a week rather than on the walk she finds difficult daily. It would mean days without a walk though. Maybe she would just get used to it once the two walks a day routine was forgotten about.


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## CorvusCorax (18 May 2017)

You are definitely thinking like a human and not a dog - we all do it!

My dog is on a bit of a go slow at the moment for various reasons (see hugely elevated forum post count lol) and I'm staggered at how well he has adapted. You'd be surprised.


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## ester (18 May 2017)

I don't think it's cruel, it's not necessarily ideal and not what we are 'used to' here but if it saves her all that distress I don't see why not, at least for a bit and see how she gets on with home exercise/stuff for a mind and the odd trip to a safe space. If that doesn't work reconsider the PTS but if she can be happy enough mooching about at home I don't realy see the problem.


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## MotherOfChickens (18 May 2017)

I dont think the option of keeping her in her safe space is cruel either fwiw seeing as you have a bit of space. I also wouldnt blame you for the PTS option but a very tough decision with a healthy dog.

there is a website that advertises dog-safe fields you can hire if you've not seen that? a couple of local doggy daycare places near me rent their fields outwith of daycare hours so there might be something similar? There's also something called Wag It Games which are a mix of scentwork/obedience/obstacles/watergames etc etc that you can set up really cheaply in your back garden or living room to give her some stimulation.


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## littlen (18 May 2017)

I had not seen the hire website but I will check it out.

She has been fine with dogs she knows are 'friends' but I would never trust her with a strange person or dog. The hire place I saw was a field surrounded by kennels full of barking dogs. She wouldn't have liked that at all. I will look for it now!

I'll also look at the games thank you!


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## Nici (18 May 2017)

Hmm, your dog seems to be really happy to go for walks, if only she didn't have to see humans/dogs. 
I don't know if that exists, but perhaps there are something like blinkers or an opaque fly mask for dogs? Although GSDs have a great sense of smell and hearing of course, but perhaps it's seeing the other dogs/humans that stresses her out? 
It may not at all work, but perhaps it's worth trying if you are running out of options.


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## dollyanna (18 May 2017)

I would just see how she gets on without any walks for a while. There is loads you can do at home - look into scentwork for a start which could easily transfer to outside walks in the future to help keep her calm then as well. Talking Dogs Scentwork is great if there is a course near you, all of the instructors will happily accommodate a stressy dog and she can attend courses without ever seeing another dog if needs be. 
It is easy to set stuff up at home, and just spend 20-30mins a day doing stuff with her instead of going out. Things like providing all meals in toys will help, and scattering dry food over the garden to sniff out when you are short of time too.
My boy used to need 2 weeks more or less house arrest after going away at the weekend, it raised his adrenalin so high it took a long time to come back down and let him cope again. Over the years we have done less and less but he is happier and happier.
Any dog can be a house dog if you make appropriate changes. It would be good if you have a very short walk you could do each day, just 10mins or so, so that she can get out a little but there are loads of dogs who live happily with no outside life even without the effort put in to make it better for them.
You've got nothing to lose except your dog, just try it and see how she copes - if she likes it, then problem sorted. If not, you still have PTS to fall back on.


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## Leo Walker (18 May 2017)

20 mins scent work tires mine out as much as a good 40min walk. Its really easy to do at home as well, not time consuming, doesnt really cost anything and so easy to teach!


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## MotherOfChickens (18 May 2017)

here's the website

http://www.dogwalkingfields.co.uk


http://www.wagitgames.com  (US site but there are some instructors in the UK)

https://www.uktrackingdog.co.uk

http://scentworkuk.com

scent work and tracking arent necessarily things you need to get training in, although its helpful to pick up tips on progressing properly.


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## Flyermc (18 May 2017)

I dont have a dog and never done it, but what about swimming lessons (for dogs) or a treadmill at home if you have space (ive seen that on the telly!)


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## meesha (18 May 2017)

Friend has a dog who is V anxious she has tried everything with behaviourists, she currently has been prescribed Prozac for the dog, apparently to try to make dog more receptive to training, it's not expensive as drugs are human, i think it costs her £16 a month but it is a small border terrier.

Another option would be to try and rehome with someone who has their own yard or farm.  I have my own yard and secure gate so dog wouldn't need to see any human or other dog in my situation.  Unfortunately I cannot take on another one but this was to demonstrate the right home may be there if you think that is an option.


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## meesha (18 May 2017)

Other option is to walk v late at night in dark as less likely to be people/dogs out... but understand this may not be practical!


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## littlen (18 May 2017)

Thankyou to everyone.

I will look into all of the suggestions. Perhaps less is more with her?

There's a walk I can do where she sees minimal people and she can cope with this one. Maybe one or two meltdowns rather than 12!

I probably wouldn't rehome her. I know her inside out and honestly think to take her out of her safety bubble and away from me would be catastrophic for her. 

A treadmill may be an idea!


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## paddy555 (18 May 2017)

My BC is a bit like this, Not the aggressive part but she simply doesn't want to go anywhere and never has done. That is fine we don't do stuff that normal dogs would like to do. She hates going for a walk. She could go off lead  around our roads and play but hates it. She doesn't like playing with toys and never has done. She is happiest sitting under the kitchen table or in the garden, loves her treats/chews. She likes to be let out in the morning for an hour to wander around our wood on her own. She loves coming out in the landrover  but she wouldn't like to get out anywhere strange. She loves best of all running around the tractor and then lying in the leat getting soaking wet. (she doesn't get that very often as she is a PITA near the wheels)  That is the total of her life for the last 12 years. She seems perfectly happy with that. I'm sure a BC should be doing lots of things like training classes, walks out on a lead etc or even coming out riding but she is happy with her very limited life as a house and garden dog. She sees no reason to have any outside life away from her home. If  dog is satisfied with this sort of limited lifestyle I don't see it is a problem for them.  

 Can  you just let your girl be a happy housedog OP? If she cannot cope with that then perhaps you may need to end it but there is nothing to say a dog has to do stuff  and go out.


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## littlen (18 May 2017)

It just feels a bit wrong as it's pretty much unheard of. People are quick to call owners who don't walk dogs especially ones with plenty of energy!

I think I'm going to start a new routine of just doing the minimum walk wise and see if she's happy with that.

Some days I don't walk them and they aren't that bothered, but she does get silly when the other dog is going out as she hates being left behind. This could be the challenge more than anything.


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## CorvusCorax (18 May 2017)

You really need to rewire your thinking on this.
Who cares what others think. It's your dog and she has some pretty big issues. Look out for her and her needs.
No offence but you seem to be valuing your idea of a perfect doggy life over her extreme stress and upset at the things that trigger her.

If you give her something amazing and yummy or make it her to routine that she eats when the other one goes out, she'll soon see it as a positive. My dog used to love it when my hairdryer turned off just before I went to work as he knew it was breakfast time. Not 'oh no, she's leaving'.


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## Goldenstar (18 May 2017)

Yes ester has it ,what not ideal is not by definition cruel .
I would try it and see how you go .


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## littlen (18 May 2017)

CC you are right.

A lot of the problems I've had are with people's perceptions of her/me. I hate the stares, tuts and way people say things like "she clearly hasn't trained that dog" or whatever. I hate the fact she lets the breed down, she scares people and conforms to everything I didn't want her to be. 

I didn't imagine a dog like this. I imagined wandering along the beach drinking coffee and hacking out with the dogs beside me as we always had done with my other dog. I feel like she has taken this from me in a way although I understand it's not her fault. I love her to pieces but she has sucked any enjoyment I had from owning a dog away and turned it into stress and worry.

Saying that, I do want what's best for her and I will do whatever I can to make her life easier. If she wants to be a house dog then I will try and get my head around that


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## CorvusCorax (18 May 2017)

I do understand, been in a slightly similar situation myself. See how it goes for a while and if you need to make the call then I can't see how anyone would judge you.


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## KittenInTheTree (18 May 2017)

We had a lovely young dog who behaved like that. He loved his walks and "his" people but he just couldn't cope with the rest of the world - nor it with him as, like your dog, he was big and he presented as fierce. The issues began very early on and nothing worked. We tried walking him at odd hours to avoid meeting anyone, but then he took to fearing random birds and trees. On one occasion, he kicked off at a large boulder. I am not joking - it was a horrible state of mind to witness. Like a switch flicked and something else took over behind his eyes. Ultimately, we had to ask our vet to let him go aged eighteen months. I'm sad to say that if I had my time again, I would have taken the decision far sooner


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## Teaselmeg (18 May 2017)

You sound so similar to my situation. My lad is smaller than yours, looks so cute, everyone admires him, until he kicks off !  We have been through many different behavioural medication combinations and have come to the conclusion that he is brain damaged in some way, as no amount of desensitisation training has helped him significantly.  I like you I have had enough of trying with the training and I just give him as good a life as I can.  I do worry about his quality of life, but at the same time, he gets 3 walks a day on our stud, I just have to seriously manage him around people and other dogs,  I have run out of friends who will look after him and one day we will call it a day.

I would really investigate finding a secure field for your lad to run in a couple of times a week.  For my own sanity, it is great to walk my lad somewhere where he is secure and can have a run, it helps make up for all the times he is left in the car, whilst my other dog does other things.  Also look into scentwork both outside and in your house, brain games to mentally wear him out.


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## dollyanna (18 May 2017)

littlen said:



			Thankyou to everyone.

I will look into all of the suggestions. Perhaps less is more with her?

There's a walk I can do where she sees minimal people and she can cope with this one. Maybe one or two meltdowns rather than 12!
		
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Less is definitely more for my boy - it took me several years to realise it, but these days he is so happy. It isn't easy to end up with a dog who isn't what you thought you wanted, but they give so much back that it is still worth it. But life for us became so much easier and happier when I stopped trying to make him into a dog he was never going to be - all the training meant he CAN cope with a lot, but it takes it out of both us so why do it? These days he only "meets" dogs he knows and likes, people he knows and likes or I know will listen to his requirements, walks where he is comfortable, and we have days where we just stay close to home after stressful events, just to chill together. 
Look up http://talkingdogsscentwork.co.uk/Talking_Dogs_Scentwork/Welcome.html for another option, they really are a lovely group of people and so incredibly accommodating to antisocial dogs. The only place I've ever been where people actively stop and go out of our way more than they really need to in order to make sure my dog has as good a day as theirs.


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## BBH (19 May 2017)

I haven't read other responses but I have a dog who has never enjoyed going for walks.

He is a rescue from a breeder and never came out his cage so the big wide world was uber scary.

He was really stressed and sounded like a steam train outside the home with stress which was embarrassing as people thought I'd walked him into the ground.

The truth of the matter is that he is just a complete homebody. I don't take him out now , he mooches around the garden and paddocks and we are both far less stressed.

My thoughts are if she is happy in the home just let her be don't force the issue.
If she was a person with agoraphobia you wouldn't drag them out would you


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## Spiritedly (19 May 2017)

My GSD is very similar. She was fine until she was about a year old and then started getting aggressive and nervous when out but was/is a completely different dog at home. I was lucky enough to have a private yard so she could run around there with our other dog and not worry about meeting other dogs or people. A year or so ago she was diagnosed as having EPI which can cause personality changes and aggression and since starting treatment for it she has improved although she still can't be let off lead in public and I tell people not to approach her as it's not worth the risk.


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## Moobli (19 May 2017)

So sorry to hear you are so stressed and unhappy in your current situation.

You have had some excellent advice already.  It is hard to consider a less active life for an energetic, lively young dog but the reality is that some dogs just cannot cope with the outside world.  

Personally I would invest in a treadmill (you might be able to get a cheap secondhand one on one of the freeads groups), look into the scentwork games already mentioned.  Talking Dogs Scentwork is ideal as you can buy a book, DVD, and even a starter kit with box, catnip scent and mouse so can get started immediately.  You can train scentwork in the house and garden, so no need to leave home.  Also fields to rent for dog walking/training do seem to becoming increasingly popular and widespread so certainly worth looking into just so she can have a real blast and run off energy once or twice a week.  If it is possible to walk her early morning/late evening - even just around the lanes or street where you live will give her some added stimulation of different sounds and scents.  As was mentioned scattering her food around the garden, placing it in dog puzzles/toys (like a kong or a Nina Ottosson games) and making her work for her dinner - ie rewarding for scentwork and obedience lessons will all help with mental stimulation and will help satisfy and tire her.

A raw bone or frozen stuffed kong are ideas to leave with her when you are out exercising your other dog, and she will learn to associate your leaving with an extra tasty treat - so will become something to look forward to.

Does she enjoy car trips?  If so, take her for a drive around to give her a change of scenery.

There are many different things you can do to help her have a good life without the stress of meeting other people and dogs.  All you can do is see how she goes.  You know her best and so will be able to gauge whether she is coping or not.  At the end of the day, there are much worse things than being pts and if that is what it comes to, then you can feel you have tried all other options first.  

Good luck.


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## pippixox (19 May 2017)

I completely feel for you when you feel judged. my last dog was a GSDx who I got as a 2 year old. he loved all people but other dogs, except a few of my friends, really really really stressed him. I spent the first year trying classes, de-sensitising ect. but the day I decided to just avoid other dogs, except my friends 3 he liked, life was so much better for both of us. He did love walks but in quiet places- we avoided parks! luckily he loved people so much, so would go to family events.

he would pull like a tank when he saw other dogs, but then want to run past. if they got too close he would get aggressive, but it was fear. people did not understand this. especially due to his breed, they would judge.

luckily he was great running around my horse fields where there were no other dogs.

I also had 2 friends who knew him well and were strong so could manage him on walks if we went away (although we rarely did!)

My MIL has 2 Chihuahuas who hate walks- she also had a basset before who you could not drag out of the house!
I know you tend to think it is ok for smaller dogs, not bigger dogs, but it does sound like they are happy in their comfort zone. 

we are all different. I am an anxious person who hates crowded places!


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## Wella (21 May 2017)

Where abouts are you? My trainer works with police dogs and the public. He's unbelievable the turn around I've seen with the dogs in our group is fantastic. Some come muzzled and it's the last resort. The problem is usually coming from the owner (not saying this in your case cos I'm not the expert) He got hold of my dog walked him amongst the other dogs on and off the lead just a different dog. Now he's a pleasure. He has taught me a lot the best thing I did was get a choke chain the difference is amazing. And no I don't strangle him or yank his head off. Please try someone who works with these big dogs. Also learning to track and search is unbelievable my dog and me love it. Especially the group searches. Best of luck with your dog you seem to be a lovely owner.


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## SusieT (21 May 2017)

Personally its up to you - if you are willing to go the next 5-10 years walking this way as my experience if unpredictable shepards remain unpredictable and tend to respond to a strong motivated owner only - or not.
If not I think your only option is pts as she's obviously not rehomable. I don't envy you the decision though. The other option is not to take her out at all but you would need enough space at home for that or her to be content at home and accept she will age quicker due to weight gain etc. most likely


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## Cinnamontoast (21 May 2017)

You sound how I felt years ago with Zak. He would scream at other dogs, snapped at people coming into the house and is still awful with other dogs. We had severe trainers, all rubbish til we found a gun dog specialist who got us to do retrieving and focussed him. He now ignores other dogs unless they get very close/touch him. We don't do exciting walks unless he's on lead, it's too stressful for him. He broods in a different room when people come then caves and comes for cuddles. He appears to be typically fear aggressive (attacked as a puppy, worries about everything) 

Today, I had to lock us up in the tennis courts to avoid a sudden influx of dogs. 

When he was young, I never thought we'd get this far. I never thought I could have a 'normal' walk, I never thought he'd stop screaming at other dogs. We taught him a very strong recall and leave it command and to focus on us, not the surroundings. 

I do think you can find a safe place for her to go to be exercised and teach her to focus on you so she's not worrying about her surroundings. Zak has calmed down a lot over the years, but would probably try to kill an invasive dog. I hope you find something to help, I know how hard it is, I find walks very stressful!


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## littlen (22 May 2017)

Thankyou everyone.

She wouldn't cope with a dominant man type trainer handling her. She would probably be quiet but due to fear rather than fixing the issue 

I am very black and white with her and do not baby her but if I get angry or stressed she panics more.

Cinnamon I hope my dog can learn to cope. If not I will be PTS sadly as it's too much stress for us as a family.
She can't really focus on anything other than the scary thing- even food isn't enough of a reward and she's food obsessed!! 

She isn't really interested in toys at all, she likes digging holes and that's about it!


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## pippixox (23 May 2017)

this must be so hard for you and your family, but there are far worse fates, in my opinion, then being PTS. they don't know it's coming. A good quality of life is vital, or what is the point?

I hope some of the ideas people have posted do help though, as clearly in her home she is a lovely dog


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## Pinkvboots (23 May 2017)

As others have said I wouldn't worry about getting her out every day if she finds it stressful I would find other ways to exercise her at home or hire an area where she can have a good run.

my friend has a dog that is not good in public she was attacked twice as a puppy so is very dog aggressive and she can often take a dislike to people, my friend does have 3 other dogs that are fine where ever you take them so they go out but the other one doesn't and she is quite happy, she does have a fairly big area at home where they can all play, her grand daughter does some brilliant training and sets out agility obstacles at home for her to do and she really enjoys it, she is the biggest doberman I have ever seen but when I go round her house she sits on her hind legs waiting for a fuss she really is a happy soppy dog at home with dogs and people she knows.


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## eatmyshorts (31 May 2017)

I can really sympathize with you & appreciate where you are coming from, because she sounds very like our GSDxGSPxDoberman who was (quite literally) thrown (over a 6ft fence) into the pound as a 4week old pup. He remained there until he was a year & a half old & missed all early socialization. Had never been in a house, car, or on a leash when we got him. We've had him 2years & he is still awful with anyone other than us. Walking him is a nightmare - he will attack dogs or people unprovoked, lunge at other dogs, so he is onleash & muzzled ALWAYS when out, as well as wearing a warning harness & Give Me Space bandana. Nobody can even so much as touch him, apart from myself & my husband (even people he has known since we rescued him - he has huge trust issues). Towards us, & his pack, you couldn't find a more sweet & loving dog. When we walk my other dogs, we get comments about how well behaved they all are - when we walk him (on  his own) i'm quite sure people think we are incompetent idiots. It sounds like you have done everything you reasonably can to allow your dog to be a normal dog, but she just can't cope with what a normal dog can. I do think she can still have a good quality of life, with adjustments to allow her to cope. Suggestions such as walking her at night, walking her alone, hiring enclosed dog runs (all things we do), & a treadmill are all good (although i will say we have a treadmill & despite the fact all my other dogs will all now happily trot away on their own on it, this particular dog will not even allow me to get so far as switching it on). Clicker training is an another idea to keep entertained. We also do canicross with our boy, a sport in which he can be exercised & socialized, but remains under strict control (& still wears an open basket muzzle). We are currently also looking into IPO training as it's been suggested it may help focus & control his aggression. I think in rare situations such as yours, & ours, you have to accept how they are, & do the best you can. If you can find another suitable home, although you'd have to be very sure it was the right one (our boy came as a foster, but it became apparent pretty quickly we could never pass him on), it may be an option if you cannot cope any longer. All the best with her xx


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## SpringArising (31 May 2017)

That sounds like a nightmare. I empathise with you and others who have difficult dogs to walk. My dog is wonderful but my God he's a pain in the backside out sometimes if he sees another dog he's taken a liking to - and by liking, I mean wants for dinner. It's physically tiring and embarrassing. 

Would she do the same thing if you took her running?


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## CorvusCorax (31 May 2017)

With all due respect I would not be doing IPO with dogs like these. The very first thing you encounter is a temperament test and a request to touch the dog.

At the very basic levels they have to remain neutral in a group of people, and with the handler out of sight, while another dog/jogger/bike passes them.

In obedience they must work while another dog is on the field. 

The 'protection' phase is a test of resilience under pressure, calmness and stability in the face of threat, not a way to control or focus aggression. 

JMO


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## eatmyshorts (31 May 2017)

Thanks CC ... that's info we didn't know & a good insight ... like i said, it's just something that we were going to look into as it had been suggested to us that may help. I did wonder how on earth it'd work if we don't have an "off" switch. xx


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## CorvusCorax (31 May 2017)

Don't get me wrong, it started off with a reactive dog for me, he did the initial traffic safe companion dog test mentioned above and a tracking degree but he was assessed as unsuitable for bitework which was totally fair enough.
He couldn't deal with the mental stress when the tracks got a bit longer and harder, so they do have to be able to cope with pressure through all three phases as well as all the social stuff to get them there in the first place. It was designed as a selection tool for breeding animals rather than a sport.


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## MeltingSnowflake (7 June 2017)

I agree with some others here who have raised the idea of keeping her as a house dog - there are lots of different ways to tire them out in the house and garden.  

Teaching tricks and obedience, and giving her mind-testing games and raw/frozen/stuffed bones can tire her out mentally, and throwing a ball around the garden/having races/setting up some small agility props would give her great exercise - I remember seeing one 'It's Me or The Dog' episode where they put little showjumps in the garden to tire out an energetic Boxer 

Sorry about your situation - it's a really tough one, but it sounds like you have given her a lovely life and are trying everything you can


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## Moobli (7 June 2017)

How are you getting on with her now Littlen?


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## JLG (8 June 2017)

apologies I haven't read through the 5 pages of replies but as the owner of a reactive rescue lurcher (who is fabulous at home) I feel your pain. You mentioned that you had tried BAT with her but have you tried CARE? Are you on the Reactive Dogs fb group? Its a big and knowledgeable group with authorised trainers that will help.
Whilst my boy is still by no means safe around other dogs and strangers, he doesn't now have a meltdown at the sight of any dog 1/4 of a mile away and is now able to pass most dogs (on the other side of the road) with no reaction.
You know this already, but your stress is adding to her anxiety. Some days I am the same. I have to force myself to be calm and talk in that silly sing-song voice pretending I don't care that he is thrashing about trying to get at a dog on the other side of the road, or that people think I am mad and I have a horrible dog that should be pts. But it does get better. Is there someone who can help out?


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