# Horse put down/RSPCA can't be bothered?



## Depp_by_Chocolate (27 January 2016)

In today's news:

http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/news/horse-put-down-after-being-found-dumped-and-starving-524871

Not only is this a crying shame, I mean the poor thing only looks like it is coming 2 this year and already worked to exhaustion by vile idiots, but I do believe this beautiful horse could have been saved.  I have seen worse cases than this, including some that have had to be supported by a sling because they couldn't support their own body weight and still make a full recovery.

I get the feeling sometimes the RSCPA can't be bothered with long term care to bring a horse back to health, far easier to say it's too weak, put it to sleep.  I think the police and local authorities should contact equine charities for welfare cases, as they at least have the horse's best interest at heart.


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## 9tails (27 January 2016)

"Although an experienced horse handler and transporter and vet were at the scene, and assisted with many attempts to get the horse to stand over two hours, it became apparent the horse was far too weak and unable to support his own weight."  What more do you expect them to do?


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## The Fuzzy Furry (27 January 2016)

Dont diss what you cant see tho, the animal was emaciated which could well have been worm riddled (as so many youngsters are). Once bloods been run then prob best to PTS.
This has been done quite a lot round here, far better to save those who can be saved than pump drugs into over-fragile bodies already.
Just my opinion tho. Ties in with the 'why keep them alive' thread really.


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## Tiddlypom (27 January 2016)

The equine charities are already over run. Sad decisions have to be made, as there simply isn't room to rehab them all. Even so, it sounds like he was given every chance over several hours, with a horse transporter there ready to take him in if only he could get to his feet. Must have been very upsetting for all those present.

I'm currently fostering a pony for the RSPCA, which frees up a place in one of their rescue centres. Maybe you could do the same, OP, to help take the pressure off?


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## Goldenstar (27 January 2016)

Tbh the opposite is my experience a fortune is spent on impaired horses many of whom will never stand up to a days work .
I have seen RSPCA's officers go to extreme lengths to save horses who are in terrible condition it must cost a fortune .
Whatever you think of the RSPCA I have never seen them not go the extra mile for a horse in a extreme situation .
You can't save them all neither should you try .


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## twiggy2 (27 January 2016)

I wish they would put more to sleep


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## ycbm (27 January 2016)

Depp_by_Chocolate said:



			In today's news:

http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/news/horse-put-down-after-being-found-dumped-and-starving-524871

Not only is this a crying shame, I mean the poor thing only looks like it is coming 2 this year and already worked to exhaustion by vile idiots, but I do believe this beautiful horse could have been saved.  I have seen worse cases than this, including some that have had to be supported by a sling because they couldn't support their own body weight and still make a full recovery.

I get the feeling sometimes the RSCPA can't be bothered with long term care to bring a horse back to health, far easier to say it's too weak, put it to sleep.  I think the police and local authorities should contact equine charities for welfare cases, as they at least have the horse's best interest at heart.
		
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I think you are being deceived by his long coat and his markings. He looks to me as if he has a spine like a razor blade.  And what would he have grown up into? Yet another nondescript coloured cob when the market is saturated with them. If he had lived, he would only have been depriving another of a home  

Blame the owners, not the RSPCA.


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## Depp_by_Chocolate (27 January 2016)

9tails said:



			"Although an experienced horse handler and transporter and vet were at the scene, and assisted with many attempts to get the horse to stand over two hours, it became apparent the horse was far too weak and unable to support his own weight."  What more do you expect them to do?
		
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Me personally would have given the horse more time than 2 hours, a sad waste of a young life for the sake of a little more time and care.



Tiddlypom said:



			The equine charities are already over run. Sad decisions have to be made, as there simply isn't room to rehab them all. Even so, it sounds like he was given every chance over several hours, with a horse transporter there ready to take him in if only he could get to his feet. Must have been very upsetting for all those present.

I'm currently fostering a pony for the RSPCA, which frees up a place in one of their rescue centres. Maybe you could do the same, OP, to help take the pressure off?
		
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I know they are overrun, all the more reason that horse/animal breeders should be licensed - but that's a whole other thread.

Currently I have neither the time nor money to keep any horse, but glad there are people like you who can foster/loan horses from charities and hopefully I will be in a position myself to do the same thing one day.



Goldenstar said:



			Tbh the opposite is my experience a fortune is spent on impaired horses many of whom will never stand up to a days work .
I have seen RSPCA's officers go to extreme lengths to save horses who are in terrible condition it must cost a fortune .
Whatever you think of the RSPCA I have never seen them not go the extra mile for a horse in a extreme situation .
You can't save them all neither should you try .
		
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I can only imagine the vet bills of animal charities.  I don't think badly of the RSCPA, it was just my opinion they gave up on this horse too soon.

I don't know, maybe the horse decided his time was up.


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## chillipup (27 January 2016)

I think the phrase, 'You're damned if you do and damned if you don't' comes to mind.


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## Depp_by_Chocolate (27 January 2016)

ycbm said:



			I think you are being deceived by his long coat and his markings. He looks to me as if he has a spine like a razor blade.  And what would he have grown up into? Yet another nondescript coloured cob when the market is saturated with them. If he had lived, he would only have been depriving another of a home  

Blame the owners, not the RSPCA.
		
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The breeders are as much to blame half the time.

I don't believe he would have deprived another of a home if he lived.  I noticed his spine too and put it down to being emaciated, we'll never know how he would have turned out.


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## twiggy2 (27 January 2016)

Depp_by_Chocolate said:



			In today's news:

http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/news/horse-put-down-after-being-found-dumped-and-starving-524871

Not only is this a crying shame, I mean the poor thing only looks like it is coming 2 this year and already worked to exhaustion by vile idiots, but I do believe this beautiful horse could have been saved.  I have seen worse cases than this, including some that have had to be supported by a sling because they couldn't support their own body weight and still make a full recovery.

I get the feeling sometimes the RSCPA can't be bothered with long term care to bring a horse back to health, far easier to say it's too weak, put it to sleep.  I think the police and local authorities should contact equine charities for welfare cases, as they at least have the horse's best interest at heart.
		
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how do you come to your conclusion on the horses age?


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## Depp_by_Chocolate (27 January 2016)

twiggy2 said:



			how do you come to your conclusion on the horses age?
		
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Looks like lasts years yearling to me, or could be 2 rising 3, certainly looks very young.  It's not uncommon for certain people to harness up their yearlings/2 year olds.

He reminded me of my old horse when he was a yearling, not that my horse was in that condition, but similar length of forelock, tail and baby face of that age (I'm visualising the horse standing up, not lying down).


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## Murphy88 (27 January 2016)

Without being there its impossible to say, but it seems to be like the right decision was made for the horse. I have been out to horses, including RSPCA cases, that have been unable to stand, and believe me 2 hours feels like forever, and by the end of that time the horse will probably have completely given up. Its not as simple unfortunately to just say 'put it in a sling'; firstly, you have to get the animal onto transport and then transport it down (dangerous if it starts flailing), not to mention hospitals with proper sling facilities aren't exactly common and its very expensive to hospitalise a down/slinged horse. Slings aren't without complications either, I have managed many horses in slings and some simply do not accept the sling and have to be euthanised because of it, others cope with the sling but get awful pressure sores. As others have said, it seems like the best choice was made here both for the horse and in terms of using funds in the best way to help as many horses as possible.


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## EQUIDAE (27 January 2016)

There are worse things that can happen to a horse than a swift death


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## ycbm (27 January 2016)

Depp_by_Chocolate said:



			The breeders are as much to blame half the time.

I don't believe he would have deprived another of a home if he lived.  I noticed his spine too and put it down to being emaciated, we'll never know how he would have turned out.
		
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How would he not have deprived another horse of a home? There aren't enough homes for horses now. Horses are being put down because there is no home for them. If he had taken a place in an animal shelter, another horse somewhere which might have got that place will instead be put down.

It isn't possible that it could be any other way as long as there are too many horses and too few homes for them.

Yes he was emaciated. So emaciated that he could not stand after two hours of being helped. The right decision was made. Shame on the owners.


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## Daughter of the Moor (27 January 2016)

Depp_by_Chocolate said:



			The breeders are as much to blame half the time.

The breeders are to blame ALL the time. I gave up breeding purebred registered ponies 5years ago when I saw how difficult it was becoming to find decent homes. There poor coloured cobs are always at the bottom of the pile, bred with no thought whatsoever for their future. PTS is often,sadly, the kindest option.
		
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## Depp_by_Chocolate (27 January 2016)

ycbm said:



			How would he not have deprived another horse of a home? There aren't enough homes for horses now. Horses are being put down because there is no home for them. If he had taken a place in an animal shelter, another horse somewhere which might have got that place will instead be put down.

It isn't possible that it could be any other way as long as there are too many horses and too few homes for them.

Yes he was emaciated. So emaciated that he could not stand after two hours of being helped. The right decision was made. Shame on the owners.
		
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We'll have to agree to disagree.  I don't think any horse's life is less valuable than another, it's a shame some end up in less desirable hands like this poor creature, but I don't agree with x horse is more deserving of a home over y horse, hence my view of he wouldn't have deprived another horse of a home, he deserved a loving owner too.


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## hairycob (27 January 2016)

Poor horse but sounds like the right decision. The number of horses charities can take in is limited and should be taken by those with more chance of coming good than this poor scrap had. At least he won't suffer any more.


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## EQUIDAE (27 January 2016)

Depp_by_Chocolate said:



			We'll have to agree to disagree.  I don't think any horse's life is less valuable than another, it's a shame some end up in less desirable hands like this poor creature, but I don't agree with x horse is more deserving of a home over y horse, hence my view of he wouldn't have deprived another horse of a home, he deserved a loving owner too.
		
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Regardless of what you think - this is the decision charities have to face. Some horses and ponies are rehomable, some aren't. Sadly the ones that have the most chance of being rehomed are taken, and the rest tend to be PTS  People want bigger horses that are rideable or diddies as companions, everything in between has very little success of being homed


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## Depp_by_Chocolate (28 January 2016)

EQUIDAE said:



			Regardless of what you think - this is the decision charities have to face. Some horses and ponies are rehomable, some aren't. Sadly the ones that have the most chance of being rehomed are taken, and the rest tend to be PTS  People want bigger horses that are rideable or diddies as companions, everything in between has very little success of being homed 

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Not entirely true as there are charities that don't pick and choose welfare cases based on re-homing potential.  Donkey Sanctuary is one, Redwings Horse Sanctuary is another, for many years the latter would never even re-home but started to when they joined forces with another sanctuary.

You only need to look at charities and see they do have 'everything in between' and not just the big rideable types or the diddy companions and if any horse they have whether big, small or in between cannot be re-homed, will spend the rest of their days at the charity. It does happen. Maybe the RSPCA and possibly Blue Cross are not in a position to keep horses indefinitely which is why re-homing is a big thing for them, but that's not to say other equine charities are not as discriminatory, for want of a better word.

That's all I have to say on matter.


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## BethH (28 January 2016)

Oh no - was gutted to see this I used to have the yard over the road.  I have a feeling that it was probably driven hard in training to be a trotter, I saw a similar youngster being hammered along the road in the summer, I sincerely hope it's not the same one.  Feel quite tearful at the sight of this the poor little thing.  By being PTS, it may well have avoided a pretty hard life over the next few years despite the anger I feel at what these poor horses have to go through with no choice.


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## ycbm (28 January 2016)

Depp_by_Chocolate said:



			We'll have to agree to disagree.  I don't think any horse's life is less valuable than another, it's a shame some end up in less desirable hands like this poor creature, but I don't agree with x horse is more deserving of a home over y horse, hence my view of he wouldn't have deprived another horse of a home, he deserved a loving owner too.
		
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I can agree to differ on opinions, but not on facts I'm afraid.

It's got absolutely nothing to do with  any horse's life being more valuable than another's.

If there are a thousand horses looking for homes and people only have space and money to offer homes to nine hundred and fifty of them, fifty have to die. 

That's the current situation in this country. He died. If he hadn't, another would.


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## fatpiggy (28 January 2016)

ycbm said:



			I can agree to differ on opinions, but not on facts I'm afraid.

It's got absolutely nothing to do with  any horse's life being more valuable than another's.

If there are a thousand horses looking for homes and people only have space and money to offer homes to nine hundred and fifty of them, fifty have to die. 

That's the current situation in this country. He died. If he hadn't, another would.[/QUOTE

I agree completely.  I'm absolutely not an apologist for the RSPCA, I've seen with my own eyes on more than one occasion that they are less than efficient, and rather different from what they claim to be, but it would have been the attending vet who advised PTS, the RSPCA wouldn't have just done it themselves.  I remember watching a programme where a 4 year old coloured cob was removed from a scrap yard in a similar state to this poor creature, except it was still on its feet.  It was taken to a sanctuary who worked so hard with it, clearing out its enormous worm burden for a start. Less than 6 weeks later it collapsed and died anyway and it was found that its guts were shot  to hell by the worms and the best it could ever have been was a colicky poor doer and useless for work of any kind.

I have no doubt the police actually know full well where this poor animal came from.  As others have said, this type and their settled cousins like the ones that live near me like to hammer youngsters along the roads (I see a nice coloured holding up the rush-hour traffic regularly, its no more than 3 I'm sure) and the police see them around the same as we do. But of course they aren't going to do anything about it because they are untouchable and they know it.
		
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## applecart14 (28 January 2016)

Depp_by_Chocolate said:



			In today's news:

http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/news/horse-put-down-after-being-found-dumped-and-starving-524871
 I have seen worse cases than this, including some that have had to be supported by a sling because they couldn't support their own body weight and still make a full recovery.

I get the feeling sometimes the RSCPA can't be bothered with long term care to bring a horse back to health, far easier to say it's too weak, put it to sleep.  I think the police and local authorities should contact equine charities for welfare cases, as they at least have the horse's best interest at heart.
		
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Perhaps the vets on the scene new something we didn't know, i.e. maybe the horse had other issues which became apparent after examination at the scene, multiple organ failure, myopathy because it had been recumbent for so long, sarcoids (which although not life threatening would have had a outtcome on its future).  Maybe the horse wasn't suitable for a sling, due to temperment or other problems which weren't disclosed to the press. 

Unfortunately the RSPCA only have room and money for so many horses and so have to sort out the wheat from the chaff.  Sad, but unfortunately true.

 The RSPCA seem to be coming in for a lot of slack these days, and I have to say I really admire them for the work they do.  Maybe I am missing something, but they seem to be a tireless organisation, trying their best with the huge overflow of caseloads that they have to deal with.


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## widget (28 January 2016)

a dose of realism for some. The rescues are over run, people don't go to rescues for horses generally so rehoming figures are low and difficult decisions have to be made. The cost and time of rehabbing this guy would have been huge and many more could be saved with that space and money.  If the vet had said he was saveable then im sure they would have tried.  
RIP  pony


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## Casey76 (28 January 2016)

I feel that too much time, money and energy is spent on keeping horses who will never amount to anything alive in sanctuaries.  Until we can harden our hearts, take a big step back and take a really good look at what is in front of us, the over population of horses in the UK is going to get worse and worse.

If horses and ponies were assessed by a vet upon entry into sanctuary, on their conformation and morphology, way of going, current state of health etc, and make a decision there and then to euthanize or to rehabilitate, then the numbers of horses in sanctuaries would plummet.


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## ester (28 January 2016)

the longer a horse is down for the worse it gets too, after a couple of hours at the very least they needed to be looking at manhandling it to turn it onto it's other side and if you can't get it up to travel it anywhere more comfortable without a winch, sedating an already sick horse which could easily have lots of other complications from emaciation  such as organ failure rather than just being down due to exhaustion.

Once horses are down it generally isn't good for them and I am actually pleased to read he was PTS.


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## twiggy2 (28 January 2016)

horses need to enter the food chain i the UK, even if it is into the per food chain, if they were worth money at slaughter if presented in good condition, blood test run and negative for certain drugs/illnesses then they would not end up dumped in this sort of state/way.
Live export is inhumane in my eyes as is allowing a horse to end its days in the way this one did.
there needs to be a radical change and it could start with the UK being responsible for the slaughter of ALL animals produced in the UK for meat/horses need to be part of this.
On a grander scale the UK have outsourced to much i the way of farming to other countries-we are getting rid of our biggest asset-we could be self sufficient if needed but a more sensible thing would be to produce what we can for the UK market ad exchange or sell our excess.
I shall hop of my soap box now


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## fatpiggy (28 January 2016)

ester said:



			the longer a horse is down for the worse it gets too, after a couple of hours at the very least they needed to be looking at manhandling it to turn it onto it's other side and if you can't get it up to travel it anywhere more comfortable without a winch, sedating an already sick horse which could easily have lots of other complications from emaciation  such as organ failure rather than just being down due to exhaustion.

Once horses are down it generally isn't good for them and I am actually pleased to read he was PTS.
		
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At least this poor boy had a few minutes of care and some hay to eat and wasn't left to die in the mud like so many.  I came across a video of an American couple who found a dog literally on its last legs in the street. They took it into their flat, bathed his sores and syringed water into him, then spent the night taking it in turns to sit up with him, stroking and comforting him, before the vet came and PTS in their arms the next day.  That is true compassion by real animal lovers. He wasn't their problem or responsibility but they did it anyway.


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## ester (28 January 2016)

twiggy2 said:



			horses need to enter the food chain i the UK, even if it is into the per food chain, if they were worth money at slaughter if presented in good condition, blood test run and negative for certain drugs/illnesses then they would not end up dumped in this sort of state/way.
Live export is inhumane in my eyes as is allowing a horse to end its days in the way this one did.
there needs to be a radical change and it could start with the UK being responsible for the slaughter of ALL animals produced in the UK for meat/horses need to be part of this.
On a grander scale the UK have outsourced to much i the way of farming to other countries-we are getting rid of our biggest asset-we could be self sufficient if needed but a more sensible thing would be to produce what we can for the UK market ad exchange or sell our excess.
I shall hop of my soap box now
		
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That would need certain people to pay to have them passported and microchipped to though. I do suspect the requirement to chip has potentially increased the number of dumpees that we are seeing at the moment as they can no longer be sent to the local knacker.


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## twiggy2 (28 January 2016)

ester said:



			That would need certain people to pay to have them passported and microchipped to though. I do suspect the requirement to chip has potentially increased the number of dumpees that we are seeing at the moment as they can no longer be sent to the local knacker.
		
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yes it would but if a horse arrived a the knackers without a chip then legally it is not owned so no-one would get any money, if the horse was worth £80 and chipping it cost £20-30 I do think they would have them done?

If there was a central data base for all chips then passports could be made redundant too?


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## ester (28 January 2016)

Chip cost + passport costs for the most part probably are more than horse worth though.


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## MurphysMinder (29 January 2016)

I will no doubt be shot down here but I actually think the RSPCA and other charities should pts more animals (large and small)  rather than spend a fortune on treating them when there is such a crisis in unwanted animals at the moment.  Lengthy expensive treatment is one thing when an animal is in a loving home,  but putting one through it when there is no knowing what the outcome will be for them is a waste of funds in my view.


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## turkana (29 January 2016)

9tails said:



			"Although an experienced horse handler and transporter and vet were at the scene, and assisted with many attempts to get the horse to stand over two hours, it became apparent the horse was far too weak and unable to support his own weight."  What more do you expect them to do?
		
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I agree with you, the horse was not put down by the RSPCA but by a vet who was on scene,the OP was not there so how does she know the horse was put down too soon.

I was a helper in a case of a down horse, there were several of us & an exerienced vet who bought sailing ropes with her (she said these are the best ropes to use) the decision was made to put him down after about an hour & several attempts, as he had given up. He wasn't even trying anymore. 
It is an upsetting enough thing to deal with without people who weren't even there deciding that they know better than those who were.


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## twiggy2 (29 January 2016)

ester said:



			Chip cost + passport costs for the most part probably are more than horse worth though.
		
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passports need getting rid of in my opinion, they are just a money maker as they are not proof of ownership or linked to where a horse is kept-meaning it would just be cost of chipping


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## popsdosh (29 January 2016)

twiggy2 said:



			passports need getting rid of in my opinion, they are just a money maker as they are not proof of ownership or linked to where a horse is kept-meaning it would just be cost of chipping
		
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So how does the chip work without a passport?. Nearly all the cost in chipping is the cost of the vet, chips cost £1-2 I could do all my own but I am not allowed to can do any other animal apart from a horse,Why?
They cant play the welfare card!


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## Fenris (29 January 2016)

9tails said:



			"Although an experienced horse handler and transporter and vet were at the scene, and assisted with many attempts to get the horse to stand over two hours, it became apparent the horse was far too weak and unable to support his own weight."  What more do you expect them to do?
		
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From the photo the pony is thin but alert and interested in what is going on around it.  Why not put up a temporary shelter, roll it onto some bedding, ensure plenty of feed and see what happens, if necessary a drip?  Spending two hours hauling it about is bound to stress its system and weaken it further.  Other much thinner ponies have been brought back from the brink after all and used as fund raising material so it seems very much to be pot luck for animals in terms of the treatment they get.



The big problem is economics and laws and regulations that encourage people to act irresponsibly.  That and the general condemnation of even the thought of the meat market.


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## EQUIDAE (29 January 2016)

Fenris said:



			From the photo the pony is thin but alert and interested in what is going on around it.  Why not put up a temporary shelter, roll it onto some bedding, ensure plenty of feed and see what happens, if necessary a drip?  Spending two hours hauling it about is bound to stress its system and weaken it further.  Other much thinner ponies have been brought back from the brink after all and used as fund raising material so it seems very much to be pot luck for animals in terms of the treatment they get.



The big problem is economics and laws and regulations that encourage people to act irresponsibly.  That and the general condemnation of even the thought of the meat market.
		
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Why make the poor little sod suffer any further? Better a week to early than a day too late...


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## twiggy2 (29 January 2016)

popsdosh said:



			So how does the chip work without a passport?. Nearly all the cost in chipping is the cost of the vet, chips cost £1-2 I could do all my own but I am not allowed to can do any other animal apart from a horse,Why?
They cant play the welfare card!
		
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that the horse would be registered on a central data base via its chip number ad it would be legal proof of ownership-a horse presented to be Slaughtered would be scanned and the person presenting the horse would have to provide proof of identity-I am just thinking aloud it is just if a horse was worth money for meat I think numbers found in such dire situations would reduce massively


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## twiggy2 (29 January 2016)

Fenris said:



			From the photo the pony is thin but alert and interested in what is going on around it.
		
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How on earth can you see that from the photo?


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## chillipup (29 January 2016)

Fenris said:



			From the photo the pony is thin but alert and interested in what is going on around it.  Why not put up a temporary shelter, roll it onto some bedding, ensure plenty of feed and see what happens, if necessary a drip?  Spending two hours hauling it about is bound to stress its system and weaken it further.  Other much thinner ponies have been brought back from the brink after all and used as fund raising material so it seems very much to be pot luck for animals in terms of the treatment they get.



The big problem is economics and laws and regulations that encourage people to act irresponsibly.  That and the general condemnation of even the thought of the meat market.
		
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And you would know so much more about the situation than the vet who was on site? My previous post read: the phrase, You're damned if you do and damned if you don't - comes to mind. Your post proves this exactly.

Given that all the horse rescue centres are already full with the unwanted dregs from the indiscriminate breeding from equine owners - I doubt you'd find any of them willing to take in an equine that couldn't even stand, in today's situation. And yet, they still used a photo to highlight their plight! and bloody rightly so too.


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## turkana (1 February 2016)

Fenris said:



			From the photo the pony is thin but alert and interested in what is going on around it.  Why not put up a temporary shelter, roll it onto some bedding, ensure plenty of feed and see what happens, if necessary a drip?  Spending two hours hauling it about is bound to stress its system and weaken it further.  Other much thinner ponies have been brought back from the brink after all and used as fund raising material so it seems very much to be pot luck for animals in terms of the treatment they get.
How can you tell the pony was alert & intersested from one photo, even if he was when the photo was taken how do you know he stayed that way for another 2 hours?
The horse I tried to help was rolled over using ropes & was alert for a short time but it didn't last long he quickly gave up, have you ever been part of a group of people trying to help a down horse?
Until you have you can't know how difficult it is, it was about 2 years ago for me & it still upsets me to think about.
You say that other thinner ponies have come back to full health but maybe they still had some fight in them, if they give up there's nothing more you can do & they simply start to die in front of you, it's a horrible thing to witness & all you can do is put them down.
		
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