# Building a ménage on a budget?



## RoseGrey (7 July 2011)

I need to build a ménage, not only on a budget but in such a way that the land will not be damaged. 

My land has 'historical importance' and therefore I doubt the planning dept would allow me to dig out very much, if at all.

Currently I have a 20m x 50m grass arena with post and rail fencing, which is great when the ground is good.
However, it gets either too slippy or rock hard with a bit of poaching in-between.
The land is mainly sandstone and it has excellent natural drainage already.

It would only have very light use (once a day) so I was thinking along the lines of sand or wood chippings. 
Ideally something that will not damage the land chemically, something that will harmlessly rot down after a few years and then gets topped up is acceptable. 
Need a good plan before I approach the planning department ! 

Anyone done anything similar or have any suggestions?


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## *hic* (7 July 2011)

We are on good drainage and we put woodchip above ground with a membrane to separate the wood from the soil. It gives a lovely springy surface but can be slippy. To best avoid this you need enough depth, enough moisture and a heavy roller as you put it down.

Ours has been down over two winters now and has proved invaluable both as a surface to ride on and somewhere to turn the horses out during the day.

I am NOT saying it is a perfect solution, but it was cheap to do and has answered a need very well. I thought it was interesting that after two of mine had spent a few weeks at livery with an indoor school of sand and fibre where although they were given the opportunity to run loose and play together they didn't really bother, when they set foot on our very springy surface they were both off bouncing around like loonies!


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## intouch (7 July 2011)

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/ménage

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/manège


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## meesha (7 July 2011)

I built a 20x40m arena for £7k that included the groundwork - digging out for drainage and backfilling with stone - 2 membranes, post and electric tape (this works brilliantly - very thick tape so almost looks like rails) and topping of woodfibre - this is actually recycled pallets chipped very small - it is not at all slippery even in horrific wet weather and drains beautifully - can jump, school on it etc and i turn the horses out on it through most of winter - they are always clean - it even cleans their feet and if they wee on it it just drains through.  dont be confused between bark/woodchip and woodfibre - the first 2 can be very slippery.  Woodfibre which I have will eventually break down (mine has been down over 2 years and is great although could do with a topup) but you can then just top it up without having to take the old away.  smells lovely as well.


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## Box_Of_Frogs (8 July 2011)

Ha ha. As Intouch says, building a menage needn't cost you anything at all! Just get into a relationship and then find someone else and pull them into the relationship too. Mills and Boone have got some superb textbooks on this topic. If you decide to build a MANEGE however, meesha and jemima seem to be quite knowledgeable.


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## intouch (8 July 2011)

from Rose Grey 
"Get over yourself. 
I have no time for your silly posts, you make yourself look petty. "
No need to hide your feelings in a PM, lovey.


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## Magnetic Sparrow (8 July 2011)

Thanks, intouch, I learned something - I didn't know definitions 1 and 2 of manege.

Good luck with building your school, RoseGrey.


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## YasandCrystal (8 July 2011)

I would say that woodchip is the most environmentally friendly surface you could go for. Sand is notoriously hard and expensive to ever dispose of should the need arise.

I would advise against using a membrane with woodchip though it makes it very dangerously slippy and I know of 2 people who had to remove their membrane.


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## fburton (8 July 2011)

Boîte_de_Grenouilles;9814763 said:
			
		


			Ha ha. As Intouch says, building a menage needn't cost you anything at all! Just get into a relationship and then find someone else and pull them into the relationship too.
		
Click to expand...

Yes, but can you do that without damaging the land? That's the tricky bit.


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## YasandCrystal (8 July 2011)

Ha ha it's MANEGE by the way not menage! Menage a trois has a whole different meaning indeed OP!


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## amandap (8 July 2011)

intouch said:



http://www.thefreedictionary.com/ménage

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/manège

Click to expand...



If your land is of historical importance (is it listed or protected in other ways?) I think you should contact the appropriate agency and liase with them tbh. I know of a manege built within ten feet of an ancient monument with permission so it is worth investigting the rules in whatever status the land has.

Also doing anything may have a negative impact especially if flora is involved.


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## RoseGrey (9 July 2011)

Its nothing to do with Flora, its more to do with the history of what happened on the land many many years ago. 
There is nothing exciting there, but it has history dating back to Saxon times and has been the object of study over the 20 years or so. 
I need a riding surface that planners will have no objection to... presuming I need permission.
I will contact Planning Dept on Monday to make provisional enquiries.
I doubt rubber/silica materials will be allowed but woodchippings/woodfibre may be...?? 
Fingers crossed !


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## myhorsefred (10 July 2011)

I have used Flexi Ride on mine and am really pleased with it.  My planners liked it as it is not so harsh on the environment, so they told me.  Apparently rubber, after 10 yrs or so, will release some chemical into the land and they told me flexi ride didn't do this. so flexi ride was acceptable to them and I thought' I'd give it a try. 

it is fabulous stuff, doesn't need much management either.  a good rain shower and it comes to the top of the sand and doesn't mix.  very supportive under foot and my horses love working on it.  

i think it is made from the car manufacture industry and it is little bits of carpet and little bits of foam.  I really rate it.

Obviously I don't know what your planners will say, but it might be worth googling to find out more about it.  

i think the company was called 'equestrian direct' if i remember.
x


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## nikCscott (10 July 2011)

Realise it's not the wood chip/fibre base you'd like but it's an interesting watch.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T3UASoV_bGI&NR=1


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## Happy Hunter (10 July 2011)

Brilliant Video!


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## RoseGrey (10 July 2011)

The video is great !

I had a quick look on the Flexi ride web site, I will email them.
Any ideas on costings?
I think I am looking at scraping the top layer of grass off, sinking railway sleepers or similar around the edges and then adding the surface.
I measured the size and its 20m x 55m...  I suppose the sellers of the surface will advise of the depth.
Just the decision on what surface to use is the most difficult !


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## Batgirl (10 July 2011)

I think they have this flexiride stuff at northallerton, it was AMAZING, not sure how well it would cope int eh wet though as it was an indoor arena


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## myhorsefred (10 July 2011)

Mine is a 20x40.  it was 2200 for a 2inch topping of flexiride.  Which was a couple of hundred pounds cheaper than rubber, by the way.

I've been so pleased with mine.  Even in heavy winter and frosts etc, my school is still rideable because the topping is so thermal the sand doesn't freeze underneath.  Also, I find it doesn't blow around either.  I'm very pleased with it. 

And I found the choice of topping SO difficult.  so many to choose from.


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## myhorsefred (10 July 2011)

Batgirl - just saw your post, mine is really good in the wet.  we have a lot of rain here sometimes in wales! and i find the drainage is really good with flexiride.  i also have drains underneath, but it doesn't hold the water.

the company say that it aids drainage.

also, i've just remembered OP, that you can make a whole surface out of 6ins of the stuff.  I have 2ins of it on top of 4ins sand.  I don't know how a full surface of flext ride would ride, i imagine a bit bouncy until it is 'ridden in'.


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## RoseGrey (10 July 2011)

I am sick of the ground being too slippery or too hard, sooo excited about getting a school I can actually ride in at any time of year! 

*myhorsefred*: 15cm approx depth ?? straight onto sandstone soil ? Any shifting ? 
It sounds perfect and I have emailed them already !

As far as costings.. I am budgeting for around £3.5k ? 
Realistic or Fantasy ??
This info is fab.. !!


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## RoseGrey (13 July 2011)

Just got price of £8.5K for 20m x 60m of Flexi-ride !
Way too expensive!


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## lazybee (14 July 2011)

All I did was to install post and rail to the corner of one of my paddocks Then fixed a 15cm 'kick plate' to the posts to retain the sand. Then I ordered the sand direct from the quarry and had it tipped inside, then a bit of pushing and shoving with my neighbours JCB. The sand is deep enough to kill the grass beneath. A couple of times a year I have to treat it with Glyphosate from a watering can. I also chain harrow it with the (big) horse once or twice a year. The sand is porous and there's a drainage ditch on two sides. I've had it for 8yrs with no issues at all. They all love rolling in it too


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## RoseGrey (14 July 2011)

lazybee said:



			All I did was to install post and rail to the corner of one of my paddocks Then fixed a 15cm 'kick plate' to the posts to retain the sand. Then I ordered the sand direct from the quarry and had it tipped inside, then a bit of pushing and shoving with my neighbours JCB. The sand is deep enough to kill the grass beneath. A couple of times a year I have to treat it with Glyphosate from a watering can. I also chain harrow it with the (big) horse once or twice a year. The sand is porous and there's a drainage ditch on two sides. I've had it for 8yrs with no issues at all. They all love rolling in it too

Click to expand...

How much sand did you get and do you find it too deep and heavy in dry weather?
Can you remember the cost approx??


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## Darkly_Dreaming_Dex (15 July 2011)

RoseGrey said:



			Its nothing to do with Flora, its more to do with the history of what happened on the land many many years ago. 
There is nothing exciting there, but it has history dating back to Saxon times and has been the object of study over the 20 years or so. 
I need a riding surface that planners will have no objection to... presuming I need permission.
I will contact Planning Dept on Monday to make provisional enquiries.
I doubt rubber/silica materials will be allowed but woodchippings/woodfibre may be...?? 
Fingers crossed !
		
Click to expand...

we have 2 roman villas under our land  one "underground" the other is being excavated by archaelogists  we were allowed to build the school in a part of the field that geophys and ground penetrating radar said was clear. It was a condition of planning that the county archaelogist dept were allowed to observe the excavation - at £500 a day   anyway Aztec Arenas worked flat out and got the digging done in a day and a half  they are used to dealing with historical sites which helped no end. If you are anywhere near Oxon/Wilts/Berks/Bucks/Hants areas then i can massively recommend them


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## MissChaos (16 July 2011)

myhorsefred said:



			i think the company was called 'equestrian direct' if i remember.
		
Click to expand...

Thumbs up for their surfaces.


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