# Head nodding when ridden



## Priyashome (22 March 2018)

My horse is nodding her head in trot only with a rider on board. She's totally sound on the lunge. We noticed this a few weeks back, box rested her and brought he back in to work slowly once happy she was sound on the lunge (she began doing it just ridden, then both now again just ridden). She regularly gets everything checked, has two saddles and does it with both (I am due a saddle check so waiting on an appointment). She has a very low pain threshold (she bronched me off when her girth pinched her last year) so Im pretty sure she's not in pain as such. Any ideas? Could it be an evasion?


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## ycbm (22 March 2018)

When caused by the rider it's called 'bridle lame'.  Does she do it when sent on with a loose rein?  With a different rider?  Is your rider trying to hold her in a frame?

If it's not the rider, I would suspect something that is aggravated by weight in the saddle, like kissing spines, and have her back x rayed.

She may have the appearance of a low pain threshold because she is already in pain, and an extra bit pushes her over the edge.


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## be positive (22 March 2018)

Reading the OP again it seems that the horse was lame on the lunge even if only briefly, it could be many things but is rarely an evasion, horses just cannot think that way,  you really need a vet out while she is still lame so you have something to show him.

I  agree with what ycbm says about being in low level pain making you feel she has a low pain threshold.


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## Pearlsasinger (22 March 2018)

ycbm said:



			When caused by the rider it's called 'bridle lame'.  Does she do it when sent on with a loose rein?  With a different rider?  Is your rider trying to hold her in a frame?

If it's not the rider, I would suspect something that is aggravated by weight in the saddle, like kissing spines, and have her back x rayed.




She may have the appearance of a low pain threshold because she is already in pain, and an extra bit pushes her over the edge.
		
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Spot on!  Time for the vet, I think


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## Priyashome (10 April 2018)

Hi all
We had the physio out for a look and she recommended the vet too which we already had an appointment for. The vet saw her yesterday and she was sound at the vets but I think adrenaline has a lot to answer for that. I insisted she is not right and showed the vet a video of the behaviour, they do not think back or back legs.They x rayed her neck, all clear.  They are busy with a conference all week so they have sent us home with bute and want us to carry on working her so they can have her stay next week, relax be ridden and hopefully show the vet the lameness. So frustrating but we are in the path of discovery I hope!!


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## Pinkvboots (10 April 2018)

Priyashome said:



			Hi all
We had the physio out for a look and she recommended the vet too which we already had an appointment for. The vet saw her yesterday and she was sound at the vets but I think adrenaline has a lot to answer for that. I insisted she is not right and showed the vet a video of the behaviour, they do not think back or back legs.They x rayed her neck, all clear.  They are busy with a conference all week so they have sent us home with bute and want us to carry on working her so they can have her stay next week, relax be ridden and hopefully show the vet the lameness. So frustrating but we are in the path of discovery I hope!!
		
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Glad she has been to the vet but not sure I would be happy with the statement that they don't think it's back or legs sorry but most problems are in that area and how the hell can anyone say that by just sight alone, were all the vets at a conference that's bad practice if they were and to be honest I would feel quite fobbed off do you have a different vet practice you can use?


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## ester (10 April 2018)

was she ridden at the vets this time?


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## SEL (10 April 2018)

I too have the problem that adrenaline can equal soundness and mine is also worse under saddle - hocks in our case. 

Incidentally she looks lame on near fore when she's actually bilaterally lame behind. Its to do with how she twists to compensate and it actually puts her neck out too. I can see a bulge in her neck at the moment and all her mane in that area is falling to the wrong side again. 

I'm afraid I had to work her quite hard without bute to make the lameness apparent enough for the vets and even then we're still in dispute over next steps. Very frustrating!


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## Priyashome (10 April 2018)

Pinkvboots said:



			Glad she has been to the vet but not sure I would be happy with the statement that they don't think it's back or legs sorry but most problems are in that area and how the hell can anyone say that by just sight alone, were all the vets at a conference that's bad practice if they were and to be honest I would feel quite fobbed off do you have a different vet practice you can use?
		
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No idea not being a vet myself......They are not 100% saying not back or hind legs but it's not the first place they want to look. I want that particular vet to treat her as I personally feel each time you see someone new you have to go two steps back. I was tempted to leave her there but she needs to be worked for the lameness to show and not sure it would be logistically possible for them to work her when they have a conference or for me to get there!!
They are the go to equine clinic on our area so not many other options.....


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## Priyashome (10 April 2018)

ester said:



			was she ridden at the vets this time?
		
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Yes she was x


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## Priyashome (10 April 2018)

SEL said:



			I too have the problem that adrenaline can equal soundness and mine is also worse under saddle - hocks in our case. 

Incidentally she looks lame on near fore when she's actually bilaterally lame behind. Its to do with how she twists to compensate and it actually puts her neck out too. I can see a bulge in her neck at the moment and all her mane in that area is falling to the wrong side again. 

I'm afraid I had to work her quite hard without bute to make the lameness apparent enough for the vets and even then we're still in dispute over next steps. Very frustrating!
		
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Hopefully when she goes to stay there once she settles they'll see the lameness when they put a rider on. Sounds like you're as frustrated as me!!


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## ester (10 April 2018)

How tricky. Do they have a similar surface to you? Years ago when we had an issue our initial issue was that it only seemed to show up on certain arena surfaces, and not having an arena at home he seemed perfectly sound then. It did get gradually worse enough to be actually lame but didn't start like that. Fingers crossed for next week.


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## Priyashome (10 April 2018)

Thank you x


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## Priyashome (18 April 2018)

So an update. She was lame all last week, even trotted up.the field lame. Dropped her at vet on Monday and they started looking at her Tuesday. Sound Tuesday and Wednesday (today). I suggested ulcers on Tuesday (she has other symptoms) so they scoped her today and she has some quite nasty ulcers that need treatment but the vet is struggling to think that the extent of the ulcers would have caused the lameness.
She's staying until the end of the week and if remains sound they will nerve block front legs as she's shown a slight front lameness on the lunge on hard ground at the vet (not uncommon). Any ideas?


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## ester (18 April 2018)

ulcers are often a result of pain so I would definitely continue with the work up and nerve block one side.


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