# Six horses die in 22 Days - Dubai



## Rollin (27 January 2017)

Yet again news of the continued enduring abuse in UAE.  I am so upset.

This is why we stopped our Shagya Arabs competing in endurance (even though they are brilliant at it) and now focus on SJ - which they do very well too!!


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## junglefairy (27 January 2017)

It's unbelievable that this is allowed to continue. It's just scandal after scandal in endurance. The FEI should really be taking a much firmer position.

Those poor horses.


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## Meowy Catkin (27 January 2017)

The whole situation makes me utterly sick.


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## silv (27 January 2017)

Absolutely vile, those poor horses over there.  What I find equally sickening is that there are a few Endurance people over here who are quite happy to sell horses to go to this "hell hole" I guess money comes much higher on their priorities than animal welfare.  I cannot see anything changing soon.


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## Alec Swan (27 January 2017)

I wonder how many horse have died NH racing,  in the last 22 days.

I'm not justifying the Endurance Rides,  just offering a perspective.

Alec.


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## Zoejl (27 January 2017)

Before the fairly recent trends in Arabia, endurance was a  safe sport with very few fatalities. Huge numbers of starters, and unskilled rides, coupled with the training, and veterinary intervention needed to get a horse to run the speeds now achieved over there all contribute to the sudden upsurge in horse deaths


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## be positive (27 January 2017)

Alec Swan said:



			I wonder how many horse have died NH racing,  in the last 22 days.

I'm not justifying the Endurance Rides,  just offering a perspective.

Alec.
		
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Not sure it is comparable but to answer the question 8 on the track since 1/1/17, there will be more injured in training but there must be far more horses involved than there are in endurance in Dubai, 6 in 22 days, presuming that is only the ones known about that died during the races and not including those injured in training, is a disgrace when the whole point of the "sport" should be proving the horse is fully fit and well conditioned, ridden sympathetically to complete, not run into the ground by incompetent riders who have little experience and probably care even less.


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## ycbm (27 January 2017)

Alec Swan said:



			I wonder how many horse have died NH racing,  in the last 22 days.

I'm not justifying the Endurance Rides,  just offering a perspective.

Alec.
		
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I take the point Alex, and I hate the NH deaths. But those deaths are an accident, whereas these are legs breaking on the flat due to weakness caused either by the drug regime they are on (which is known to cause fracture of the cannon immediately below the knee)  or because they have micro fractures already gained in training which have been masked by painkillers, and fail under the pressure of competition.

I would campaign to stop these deaths long before I would campaign to stop NH racing.


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## Zoejl (27 January 2017)

I think a lot are accidents caused by hundreds of horses in the race, ridden by inexperienced riders. All recent deaths have been on the first loop


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## ycbm (27 January 2017)

Zoejl said:



			I think a lot are accidents caused by hundreds of horses in the race, ridden by inexperienced riders. All recent deaths have been on the first loop
		
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How do you get six fatal accidents  in 22 days in  flat races? Horses aren't stupid, they don't trample each other unless it's unavoidable.


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## tiga71 (27 January 2017)

These deaths make me so angry, both at the people who are doing it and the EGB who are condoning it by sending GB riders to compete there. 

I am a member of EGB and I ride only up to 40 km with my hairy cob, but I thought long and hard about rejoining this year as I am so disgusted with EGB's lack of backbone to stand up to these Group 7 people. When you post any dissenting comments on the EGB Facebook page they are quickly deleted and no mention is ever made of the deaths. 

It makes me ashamed to call myself an endurance rider.

I decided to rejoin for one more year to see if anything the grassroots members do makes any difference to the EGB position. I doubt it will have though. I am going to be writing to the EGB board and welfare officer to ask them what their position is regarding these latest deaths and what they intend doing about it. Unfortunately with the EGB, the money that Group 7 sponsors send over to EGB is much more important than taking a stand on the appalling welfare of these poor horses.


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## Zoejl (27 January 2017)

by having 300 young horses galloping at the same time with many inexperienced riders


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## Meowy Catkin (27 January 2017)

Zoejl said:



			by having 300 young horses galloping at the same time with many inexperienced riders
		
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You are being very naive.


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## Zoejl (27 January 2017)

I think not Faracat, I did not say it is the only reason,I know very well the problems.


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## silv (27 January 2017)

be positive said:



			Not sure it is comparable but to answer the question 8 on the track since 1/1/17, there will be more injured in training but there must be far more horses involved than there are in endurance in Dubai, 6 in 22 days, presuming that is only the ones known about that died during the races and not including those injured in training, is a disgrace when the whole point of the "sport" should be proving the horse is fully fit and well conditioned, ridden sympathetically to complete, not run into the ground by incompetent riders who have little experience and probably care even less.
		
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This, plus I would imagine that the majority of people and trainers involved in racing in the UK actually like horses and see them as living creatures and want the best for them.  In the middle east it seems that they are treated as machines by many, you only look at how they treat their women.  I doubt the greater majority have any affinity with the horses in their care.  I am happy to be proven wrong by the way.


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## Meowy Catkin (27 January 2017)

Zoejl said:



			I think not Faracat, I did not say it is the only reason,I know very well the problems.
		
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Then you know that the issues run far deeper than just inexperienced riders and '300 young horses galloping'.


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## ycbm (27 January 2017)

Zoejl said:



			by having 300 young horses galloping at the same time with many inexperienced riders
		
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Even if that were true, then what the hell are they doing galloping three hundred young horse with inexperienced riders on board in such close proximity that they can break each other's legs?


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## Zoejl (28 January 2017)

YCBM I can assure you it is true, and that is a huge part of the problem. In the 40 k qualifier  2 horses had catastrophic injuries, these horses were very unlikely to be overtrained, or be carrying  many injuries as they are young horses just starting, the number of starters in that race was 295. They were started over a 3 hour period. For many of these horses it will have been their first ever outing. At the same time there was a 80k qualifier, the horses in that would be slightly more experienced but still young, in this race there were 370 entered , so 665 young inexperienced horses on course at the same time. This will be compounded by the fact that they will have had the lest important riders, as they are "just qualifiers". 2 horses lost their lives in the Ladies race. Ladies races have always been notorious for lack of control and accidents. The riders are normally very inexperienced and lightweight , and the very fit horses just bolt. That is why the Ladies races are run at such high speeds. So many aspects of Endurance over there need sorting out


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## Zoejl (28 January 2017)

Faracat If you see my first post on this thread you will see I do


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## Alec Swan (28 January 2017)

Zoejl said:



			YCBM .. . So many aspects of Endurance over there need sorting out
		
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Should the day ever arrive when_ 'they'_ view horses as we do,  then there may well be improvement,  but whilst the purse-strings of Int ER is in the hands of one family,  then the situation will remain. _ 'Generally'_ the Arab doesn't give a fig for animal welfare and persuading them that they're wrong would be living a day dream.  

The best that can be hoped for is that the West takes the view that what they do in their own homelands is their concern but that those who oversee the sport of endurance riding here in the UK have spine enough to disregard the financial inducements and have the sport,  here,  administered to in an ethical and humane manner.

Alec.


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## Zoejl (28 January 2017)

Alec Swan said:



			Should the day ever arrive when_ 'they'_ view horses as we do,  then there may well be improvement,  but whilst the purse-strings of Int ER is in the hands of one family,  then the situation will remain. _ 'Generally'_ the Arab doesn't give a fig for animal welfare and persuading them that they're wrong would be living a day dream.  

The best that can be hoped for is that the West takes the view that what they do in their own homelands is their concern but that those who oversee the sport of endurance riding here in the UK have spine enough to disregard the financial inducements and have the sport,  here,  administered to in an ethical and humane manner.

Alec.
		
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Your final sentence Alec is the one we hope for


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## ycbm (29 January 2017)

Zoejl said:



			these horses were very unlikely to be overtrained, or be carrying  many injuries as they are young horses just starting,
		
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I do not accept this argument. Micro fractures of the shin bones are common in two year old tb horses.




			the number of starters in that race was 295. They were started over a 3 hour period.
		
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I do not see how this means that the horses were damaging each other. Less than two horses a minute started on a course of many kilometres. 




			2 horses lost their lives in the Ladies race. Ladies races have always been notorious for lack of control and accidents. The riders are normally very inexperienced and lightweight , and the very fit horses just bolt. That is why the Ladies races are run at such high speeds. So many aspects of Endurance over there need sorting out
		
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Speed kills, exactly. But that's largely unrelated to the number or age of the horses on the course at the time.



I don't see anything in your argument that changes what I have read that it is training methods, drug regimes and exhaustion killing these horses. Whatever, it's utterly shameful.


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