# When do you pay the vet?



## Patchworkpony (6 May 2016)

OK - so I've just phoned my vet about paying bills if I have dog insurance. Apparently I have to pay the bill upfront even if it is several thousand pounds and then get the money off the insurance company myself to pay me back. So my questions are is this normal procedure and if so how long do insurance companies take to pay? I've never insured a dog before - we gave up insuring horses when the insurers kept wriggling. What happens if people have a huge bill and haven't actually got the cash as they were relying on the insurance company to pay?


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## MotherOfChickens (6 May 2016)

perfectly normal practise-some will and some will not allow payments to be spread. Some might only do it if they know you well (i.e have been a client for years). My current practise is a mixed practise and will bill -especially if say, the house sitter takes one in for me but I'm not sure about large bills.

I've only dealt with Petplan, KC and Tesco insurance and they've always paid up within the month. If your dog is referred then you will have to pay as you go IME.

People should ideally make sure they have savings or access to credit cards to cover the shortfall. It's not really the vet's business to wait for a payment that may or may not materialise from the insurance company.


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## Dizzydancer (6 May 2016)

My vets accept payment from insurance direct (KC and tesco) and I jst have to pay a £25 fee and proof of insurance policy to them then the excess once insurance paid out. 
I do also have credit card to cover incase anything changed.


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## planete (6 May 2016)

If your vet tells you your dog is going to need an expensive procedure, it is best to have a word with your insurance to make sure they are happy to cover it before going ahead.  If you do not have enough cash to hand to pay up front, tell your vet and hope you can persuade them to take instalments.  Some will.  Or, like DD look around for a vet who accepts direct payment from an insurance, but you then have to use their preferred insurer.


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## blackcob (6 May 2016)

I would say it's fairly normal to request this. The practice I work for will do direct claims with most insurers at present but this is under review because the time and cost involved in administrating this policy is huge - we are likely to be switching to either pay up front only and/or charging an admin fee for dealing with claims. 

To use an example, the Willows protocol is probably fairly typical: http://www.willows.uk.net/en-GB/general-practice-service/pricing-payment-options-general-practice


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## Murphy88 (6 May 2016)

Which insurance company are you with? A lot of practices will only do direct claims with a small selection of reliable insurers, some will only do direct with Petplan. The majority of practices will refuse to do direct claims with insurance companies that are known to be difficult, e.g. animal friends. As Planete says, unless its an emergency I would normally recommend that clients contact the insurance to get pre-approval, and if approval is given then usually a direct claim can be done. Many referral hospitals will expect payment at the time regardless of insurance status, presumably they've been burnt too many times with people racking up huge bills then disappearing!


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## satinbaze (6 May 2016)

I've just seen in today's issue of dog world that both more than and tesco insurance will now only approve a select few referral centres. May be worth checking this if you insure with either of them.


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## Patchworkpony (6 May 2016)

Thanks everyone - very interesting. I can pay up front obviously but was somewhat surprised. However my old vets, where we used to live, who are much bigger and very efficient say that they work with Petplan directly. As I was probably going to go with Petplan anyway this is not a problem. An extra 15 minutes travelling time unfortunately but their staff do seem so much more switched on than the new practise so I was already thinking of going back to them. Their payment policy swung it!


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## Amymay (6 May 2016)

My vets will await payment from the insurance company (if it is a practice approved one).


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## Neversaydie (6 May 2016)

My vet used to take the excess from you as payment and a photocopy of your policy.

Nowadays they are asking for payment up front even for the horse, I told them I would pay them the excess happily but any further treatment payment would have to come from the insurance company. They weren't happy so I told them to refuse treatment which under oath they couldn't do, they had a competed claims form from me and a copy of my policy in the hand of the attending vet as soon as they arrived and I never heard a peep from them about it again.


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## Kaylum (7 May 2016)

Our vets (big practice in york) you pay after the treatment and claim back after. It is your responsibility for the insurance so that is the way they do it.


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## paulineh (7 May 2016)

Both my Small Animal and Equine vets will do direct claims. I use NFU and Pet Plan. Never had a problem.


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## Patchworkpony (7 May 2016)

paulineh said:



			Both my Small Animal and Equine vets will do direct claims. I use NFU and Pet Plan. Never had a problem.
		
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 My vet it appears will do the same but good to know it can work this way. After all what if you had a bill for £10,000!


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## Britestar (7 May 2016)

My vets is you pay and claim it back - after all its your insurance, not theirs. They will however for really big bills do a direct payment if there has been pre authorisation.


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## Welshy (7 May 2016)

I work at a vets. The equine branch seem to be happy to direct claim with any company, though do charge an admin fee. 

The small animal branches will direct claim for certain companies (generally not e&l, animal friends or any companies associated with them) as long as we see a current insurance certificate, the excess is paid upfront and a disclaimer is signed. 

I think people massively underestimate the time it takes to get a claim processed - or even to the stage where it can be sent off. And of course it involves taking a vet out of their busy schedule to fill their bit of the form in. 

The equine insurance companies seem happier with less information and will accept  just invoices for a few months after the original claim has gone in, whereas the small animal companies require a claim form (and relevant history etc) each and every time you send a continuation in. It's not a two minute job. We have a dedicated insurance administrator at the SA branch and currently do not charge an admin fee but I can see that changing in the future as it can't be cost effective.


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## twiggy2 (7 May 2016)

It is illegal for vets to charge an administration fee for insurance claims.
A direct claim is at the.discretion of the vets practice but most will do a direct claim with certain insurance companies.
Idol not know of ant referral centres that allow non payment at time of treatment-but Rosedale allowed me to leave without paying after my daughters horse was pts-maybe it was due to being referred but a vet who was a mutual friend!
Not sure why anyone assumes they should be able to delay payment to a vet though-you don't leave the supermarket with goods and not pay-having animals in your life is a privilege not a right.


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## Clodagh (7 May 2016)

I don't see why any vet would wait a month or six weeks for a hefty bill to be paid. Their overheads are considerable and if there is a dispute with the insurance company the vets cannot just not get paid.
It make sense to me to make the owner pay and claim it back, I normally did in my insurance days only when two horses went to Rossdales for big ops did the insurance pay direct, both were pre approved.


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## Clodagh (7 May 2016)

twiggy2 said:



			It is illegal for vets to charge an administration fee for insurance claims.
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I am sure that your practice does? No offence intended but a friend takes her horses to yours and pays an admin fee for claims. I am sure she said that?


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## Umbongo (7 May 2016)

It is the norm around my area for vets to charge a small admin fee for direct claims. 

I have worked in a couple of small animal practices. We do deal with some insurance payments directly, usually if the bill is in the thousands. Although this is up to the discretion of the vet. Usually vets require a pre-authorisation or will only deal with certain insurance companies. Normally the client pays up front then claims back through their insurance.


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## Welshy (8 May 2016)

I've never heard that it's illegal to charge that fee. I know a lot or practices do.

I forgot to note - when my dog went for referral to Bath, they required a £500 deposit to direct claim. As it was, my bill went over my insurance limit so they ended up keeping that.


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## ester (8 May 2016)

Well as all private medical practices charge a fee for dealing with the insurance companies direct on health insurance I'm not sure why pets would be any different. 
Usually it depends on the insurer, I have done both depending on the situation.


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## druid (8 May 2016)

Direct claim, no charge for the service both at my local vets and the big referral clinic.


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## {97702} (9 May 2016)

Well I'm glad I am not with some of the vets quoted on this thread - I pay my vet as and when I can, my dogs are renowned for racking up huge vets bills which I usually have to pay in installments, my vet practice is great (I have been with them years) and have no problem with this thank goodness


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## twiggy2 (13 May 2016)

Clodagh said:



			I am sure that your practice does? No offence intended but a friend takes her horses to yours and pays an admin fee for claims. I am sure she said that?
		
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Umbongo said:



			It is the norm around my area for vets to charge a small admin fee for direct claims. 

I have worked in a couple of small animal practices. We do deal with some insurance payments directly, usually if the bill is in the thousands. Although this is up to the discretion of the vet. Usually vets require a pre-authorisation or will only deal with certain insurance companies. Normally the client pays up front then claims back through their insurance.
		
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Welshy said:



			I've never heard that it's illegal to charge that fee. I know a lot or practices do.

I forgot to note - when my dog went for referral to Bath, they required a £500 deposit to direct claim. As it was, my bill went over my insurance limit so they ended up keeping that.
		
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ester said:



			Well as all private medical practices charge a fee for dealing with the insurance companies direct on health insurance I'm not sure why pets would be any different. 
Usually it depends on the insurer, I have done both depending on the situation.
		
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I work in small animals whig is septet from equine now Clodagh so equine need challanging if they are charging. 
The vets I work at are part of the biggest UK vet company and last year we stopped charging to process insurance claims after making a charge for them since being taken over a few years before. I can assure all of you if it was legal to charge for the service the company would because we have a full time member of staff who spends pretty much all their time processing insurance claims. 
It was made illegal in 2015 as far as I am aware or that is when we were told we could not charge anymore because of the change,  sounds like lots of people need to speak to their vets about this.


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## twiggy2 (13 May 2016)

What I was trying to say Clodagh was smallies and equine are separate now so equine do their own thing


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## Clodagh (13 May 2016)

twiggy2 said:



			What I was trying to say Clodagh was smallies and equine are separate now so equine do their own thing
		
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Yes I got that. 
Thank you. I would think charging was fair, like you say it must take hours. It may also have changed since 2015 to be fair. Is Rob just equine now? (He may always have been but used to do our hunt teriers when they needed it).


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## Peter7917 (15 May 2016)

My vet doesn't mind either way. I always pay upfront and claim back however they will give me the option. I do have a million animals registered with them though and have been with them years so that may be why..


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