# Altior



## blodwyn1 (27 December 2018)

Altior won impressively but the opposition wasn't strong. Imagine the race of masterminded, sprinter sacre, Moscow flyer etc I wonder how he would get on?


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## splashgirl45 (27 December 2018)

that would be a good race, he was pretty impressive though, he skipped over the ground and made the others look like they were in deeper ground......


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## Clodagh (27 December 2018)

He was amazing. I think he would hold his own, but tbh racing would be pretty odd if no horse ever aged and I think to knock a horse as stunning to watch as Altior is a bit sad. I just enjoyed it. I adored SS and I  am not sure how Altior would do against him if both were at their peak but newer model cars tend to be an improvement on older ones. 
He is awesome, long may he carry on.


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## Elf On A Shelf (27 December 2018)

Altior is just awesome! You can't compare them to past era's - too many things have changed, breeding, training, feeding etc. Who knows - those horses of old might have been better with more modern methods etc. 

More to the point - Who else Saw Nico's ride and Interview from the Christmas Hurdle where he beat Buveur D'air! He tried so hard not to win, wasn't best pleased during his interview after! The owners of Verdana Blue are over the moon however! Their quote after is funny - I know the trainer and jockey aren't very happy as they think they've lost their jobs - but we're very happy!


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## bonny (27 December 2018)

EKW said:



			Altior is just awesome! You can't compare them to past era's - too many things have changed, breeding, training, feeding etc. Who knows - those horses of old might have been better with more modern methods etc.

More to the point - Who else Saw Nico's ride and Interview from the Christmas Hurdle where he beat Buveur D'air! He tried so hard not to win, wasn't best pleased during his interview after! The owners of Verdana Blue are over the moon however! Their quote after is funny - I know the trainer and jockey aren't very happy as they think they've lost their jobs - but we're very happy!
		
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I think he tried to win the race and then afterwards the reality dawned on him. It would have been easy for him to lose and Iâ€™m sure with hindsight he wished he had......all very bizarre


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## Elf On A Shelf (27 December 2018)

bonny said:



			I think he tried to win the race and then afterwards the reality dawned on him. It would have been easy for him to lose and Iâ€™m sure with hindsight he wished he had......all very bizarre
		
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I think if he had ridden the horse as hard as Gerraghty rode Buveur D'air the mare would have won by 2 lengths


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## blodwyn1 (27 December 2018)

Oh I wasnt knocking Altior at all! He was magnificent and Special Tiara was a very good horse in his day. I was just speculating what would happen if all the greats were able to run at the same time. My all time great would still be Arkle followed by Desert Orchid and although I moan about ageing I am grateful I got to see them in their prime!


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## bonny (27 December 2018)

Visually sprinter sacre in his prime was the most impressive of any horse Iâ€™ve seen but you canâ€™t knock altiorâ€™s record, he just keeps winning !


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## katherinef (28 December 2018)

I like Altior. A lot. Impossible to  compare to past generations but how would he fare upsides with Viking Flagship, Moscow Flyer? Anyway lets just enjoy him.  As for Desert Orchid v Kauto now there's a conundrum.  I just wonder Desert Orchid could take lengths off his opponents by those fabulous outside the wings leaps conceivable he could  have pushed Kauto into a mistake?  Watching replays of Dessie over 2 miles he was no slouch! It would have been a hell of a race!


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## bonny (28 December 2018)

katherinef said:



			I like Altior. A lot. Impossible to  compare to past generations but how would he fare upsides with Viking Flagship, Moscow Flyer? Anyway lets just enjoy him.  As for Desert Orchid v Kauto now there's a conundrum.  I just wonder Desert Orchid could take lengths off his opponents by those fabulous outside the wings leaps conceivable he could  have pushed Kauto into a mistake?  Watching replays of Dessie over 2 miles he was no slouch! It would have been a hell of a race!
		
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Of course you can compare horses, they all have a handicap mark and the races are timed which gives a lot of clues. There is a reason that most people think we will never see one as good as Arkle and nothing since has had anything like his mark !


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## katherinef (28 December 2018)

Hmmm not sure its so straightforward just to look at the stats..............Desert Orchid for example nowhere near his top mark going left handed........... hence proximity Yahoo in Gold Cup. Too many variables for stats alone. Also the modern Chaser is a different stamp to the old-fashioned Chaser - and  therefore that impacts on timings. This sets out what I'm getting at.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/h...t-he-is-still-one-of-the-all-time-greats.html


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## Clodagh (28 December 2018)

Horses like Arkle and Desert Orchid would be classed as middle weight hunters nowadays. They look huge compared to the modern tb.


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## Orangehorse (28 December 2018)

It was nice to see Altior out and doing what he does best.  People like to see a champion running and winning.
I think it was a case of the trainer spotting that he could enter the race, although he was carrying more weight, and probably guessed that there might not be too much opposition.  Nice for the owner to have another trophy to polish.


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## Mariposa (30 December 2018)

EKW said:



			I think if he had ridden the horse as hard as Gerraghty rode Buveur D'air the mare would have won by 2 lengths
		
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Nico's face was a picture! It was a proper 'oh f*ck' moment!


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## popsdosh (31 December 2018)

Arkle was a freak never to be repeated. I count myself very lucky to just about remember him running . Having said that many trainers today would not have looked at him twice he wasnt exactly handsome. My ex boss used to hunt with Golden miller another freak of a horse . He used to limber up for the Gold cup hunting with the Fitzwilliam the day before.
Modern horses are trained differently and I cant help think that if some of todays horses had more variety they may be different.


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## blodwyn1 (19 January 2019)

Another win today! Jumped to the left but still very impressive. I was sad to see one for Arthur unseat his jockey in the earlier race.


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## Elf On A Shelf (19 January 2019)

It seems to be a day for jumping left as Arthur was doing it occasionally too! Apart from that and his unseat he was jumping well for the most part. Ahh well! He lives to fight another day! 

Altior is an impressive horse. It's a shame no other took up the race. 3 horses, 3rd place went home with Â£16k. It's was worth it for the very well paid for schooling round! I hate it when people run scared of 1 horse! 1 horse can be beaten! I could understand if you were heading out to face Kauto Star, Denman, Neptune Collanges, Long Run and Imperial Commander all in one race but not 1 horse.


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## blodwyn1 (19 January 2019)

I think modern day chasing is spoiled by the emphasis on the Cheltenham's festival. In the past the whitbread, mackeson and the Hennessy gold cups were seen as prestigious races in their own right and not all races were seen as stepping stones to Cheltenham ! This is leading to tiny fields and horses being run only a few times a year.


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## Elf On A Shelf (19 January 2019)

I agree, Cheltenham is not the be all and end all but National Hunt Racing focuses on it. You don't get the same on the flat. Yeah everyone kind of wants to go to Royal Ascot but you have plenty of other races that horses focus on long before and long after then. They are bringing in a 3 day Northern Festival next year - Kelso, Carlisle & Musselburgh to replace the Northern Lights series. It is going to be held the week after Chetlenham. People with horses that would be suitable for these races will run them at Cheltenham or Aintree instead. The Northern Lights series is a mockery anyway. This year only the mares chase (3 runner!) ran true to form. The rest of the races were won by big priced, low weighted horses that had barely scraped a win in their lives.


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## Clodagh (19 January 2019)

TBH it must have been worth having a go today, how far down does place money go? 
Altior doesn't 'stir' me like Sprinter Sacre used to but what do they go on about on the tv, he isn't very impressive/handsome etc. He looks pretty spot on conformation wise for a racehorse, he has a pretty face and has won 17 races, what bit of him needs to be better?
I quite like Cheltenham being like the world championships, I take the week off work and lap it up, but it does seem to be no one can think beyond it. Is prize money being better spread the answer?


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## Chiffy (20 January 2019)

I agree with blodwyn about the endless references to Cheltenham from the moment the National Hunt season starts, itâ€™s really annoying. I remember the other big Gold Cups being much more prestigious than they are now. 
At least Altior appears quite a few times a season. I canâ€™t bear it when horses just appear for Cheltenham.
I am old and forgetful but what was the name of that hurdler that Nicki Henderson wrapped in cotton wool but produced each year to win the Champion Hurdle? The attraction of NH is getting fond of horses that race frequently. 
Altior doesnâ€™t have the physique of Sprinter Sacre to fill the eye, Clodagh, but he has the jump and the speed. Yesterday wasnâ€™t typical because he had no one to race with.


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## blodwyn1 (20 January 2019)

You are thinking of See You Then or as he was nicknamed See You When! He had dodgy tendons but lived to 31!


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## Clodagh (20 January 2019)

Chiffy said:



			Altior doesnâ€™t have the physique of Sprinter Sacre to fill the eye, Clodagh, but he has the jump and the speed. Yesterday wasnâ€™t typical because he had no one to race with.
		
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He doesn't have that arrogant swagger, does he? Truly great horses seem to know when they are.


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## Mariposa (20 January 2019)

Sprinter Sacre just had that amazing swagger, he made it looks so easy. And then the amazing comeback -  it was just so emotional watching it. I get choked up watching it back even now - I clearly remember screaming at the TV for Noel F to move and give Sprinter room as they came up to that last turn. As for Altior, I think he's magical, it's like he has wings. He's such a beautiful horse, looks so intelligent, it's like watching poetry in motion.


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## Clodagh (20 January 2019)

I ghave been trawling around trying to find the C4 'Impossible Dream; clip of his comeback . No luck, off to try again!


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## Mariposa (20 January 2019)

Clodagh said:



			I ghave been trawling around trying to find the C4 'Impossible Dream; clip of his comeback . No luck, off to try again!
		
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I have it saved! http://www.snappytv.com/snaps/the-p...Im77bTHkci2XRjTdKh3Opk1ojgGo0asxHEmtzvuiKkqTA

Hope that link works 

Also this is a nice round up of that Cheltenham  http://www.snappytv.com/snaps/chelt...055O4yLrIKiWdMdIhZUt94go1QV3I1vwZwpxWSY_N8QP8


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## Clodagh (20 January 2019)

Brilliant! You are amazing. ðŸ˜Š


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## Brummyrat (3 February 2019)

Mariposa I will come back to your link when my digibox finally gives up the ghost!  I still have SS second Champion Chase on there and watch it weekly, the roar of the crowd when he moves alongside UDS gives me goosebumps.  I also have the Morning Line from that day too which opened with the Impossible Dream video, I was late for work already but ended up losing all my mascara.  What a wonderful day that was.  Oh and back on topic Altior is awesome but doesn't excite me like Sprinter used to.


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## Mariposa (4 February 2019)

You are lucky - I lost my original recording when we changed our Virgin box!


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## Elf On A Shelf (4 February 2019)

Mariposa said:



			You are lucky - I lost my original recording when we changed our Virgin box!

So this weekend gave some Cheltenham clues! Do you think they will send Apple's Jade to the Champion Hurdle to take on the great Buveur D'Air or should she stick to the Mares Hurdle?
		
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She goes for the Champion Hurdle, Elliott and O'Leary confirmed it. They are taking up the battle. Fair play to them, she will get a 7lb mares allowance which might just help. I love Apples Jade I hope she takes the crown! But then I would also like to see another triple Champion Hurdle winner. But one thing is for sure - the public are getting what  they wanted and good on the owners for taking the chance. She got beat in the Mares hurdle last year.


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## Mariposa (10 February 2019)

EKW said:



			She goes for the Champion Hurdle, Elliott and O'Leary confirmed it. They are taking up the battle. Fair play to them, she will get a 7lb mares allowance which might just help.
		
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It's so exciting! Have to say I'm in the Buveur D'Air camp! I'm going on the Tuesday this year and I'm so excited for the Champion Hurdle...and the Arkle ( come on Lalor!!)


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## Clodagh (13 November 2019)

I just watched the Impossible Dream again, it makes my cry more than the Black Beauty music!


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## Mariposa (14 November 2019)

Clodagh said:



			I just watched the Impossible Dream again, it makes my cry more than the Black Beauty music!
		
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It makes me sob!


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## Clodagh (22 November 2019)

Well, tomorrow. Altior or Cyrname? Or Solomon Grey?

And then at Haydock? Bristol de Mai? Lostintranslation? Someone else altogether?

What a day! I can't watch it until the evening, heaven help anyone who interrupts!


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## Fanatical (22 November 2019)

Clodagh said:



			Well, tomorrow. Altior or Cyrname? Or Solomon Grey?

And then at Haydock? Bristol de Mai? Lostintranslation? Someone else altogether?

What a day! I can't watch it until the evening, heaven help anyone who interrupts!
		
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I am so excited! What an afternoon of action! I think Altior has the edge if he doesn't jump left too much, or have a whoopsie which is going to happen at some point. Would love to see Bristol de Mai do the business at Haydock.


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## Chiffy (22 November 2019)

Well I doubt I shall watch until evening, so I shall have to avoid this thread and social media! I shall be nervous for Altior!


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## Clodagh (22 November 2019)

Chiffy said:



			Well I doubt I shall watch until evening, so I shall have to avoid this thread and social media! I shall be nervous for Altior!
		
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Same, I want him to trounce Cyrname!  I hope to watch from about 4ish x


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## Elf On A Shelf (22 November 2019)

It will be interesting IF Altior stays the trip and his exuberant jumping doesn't take it's toll by the end. 

I would love to see BDM win at Haydock again!


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## Clodagh (22 November 2019)

EKW said:



			It will be interesting IF Altior stays the trip and his exuberant jumping doesn't take it's toll by the end.

I would love to see BDM win at Haydock again!
		
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I envisage the whole thing will be a massive anticlimax, and far from seeing them battle it out on the home straight and one to win by a nose it'll be a proper trouncing either one way or the other.


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## Elf On A Shelf (22 November 2019)

Clodagh said:



			I envisage the whole thing will be a massive anticlimax, and far from seeing them battle it out on the home straight and one to win by a nose it'll be a proper trouncing either one way or the other.
		
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Yeah I think the Haydock race will be more of a race to be honest!


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## Peregrine Falcon (23 November 2019)

Altior didn't look like he was going to win. Nothing to give under pressure.


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## Elf On A Shelf (23 November 2019)

Well that was a beautiful exhibition of jumping from Altior but he couldn't get there! It was obvious when they turned for home Cyrname had too much in the tank for him. 

Apart from the mistake and a few big jumps after Cyrname looked every part worthy of his superior mark. 

I expect they will drop back in trip with Altior now but at least they can say they tried and they werent afraid to try either!


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## Peregrine Falcon (23 November 2019)

Stunning horse but perhaps needed a run?


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## bonny (23 November 2019)

What a race that was and what a horse .....


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## Errin Paddywack (23 November 2019)

Cracking race and two brilliant horses.


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## blodwyn1 (23 November 2019)

Altior today didnt look fit and i think didnt really stay but at least he finished safe and sound.


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## bonny (23 November 2019)

blodwyn1 said:



			Altior today didnt look fit and i think didnt really stay but at least he finished safe and sound.
		
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Nicky Henderson has been saying for weeks how much work he had done and how well he was going.....I think what today has shown is how good cyrname really is, altior probably ran as good a race as he always does.


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## Elf On A Shelf (23 November 2019)

bonny said:



			Nicky Henderson has been saying for weeks how much work he had done and how well he was going.....I think what today has shown is how good cyrname really is, altior probably ran as good a race as he always does.
		
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Exactly. For 2 miler he was just being tapped for toe a little most of the way round. 

If the race had been 2 miles the result MAY have been different but I dont think it would have. I think we now have a better horse to take Altior on with properly.


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## Peregrine Falcon (23 November 2019)

That was a great race with BDM. Lovely story for the winner.


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## Carrottom (23 November 2019)

Is it just me or does Lostintranslation remind anyone else of Kauto star?


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## Dobiegirl (23 November 2019)

It was a fabulous race, both horses were running for the first time this season. I dont know if anyone noticed but Altior changed legs a few times which tells me how much he hated that ground but Ive no doubt the best horse won. Not many horses can win over multiple distances though, Desert Orchid and Kauto Star were two who could , I dont think this takes anything away from Altior who is still the reigning top 2miler.

Lostintranslation performance was fantastic and Is imo the likely winner of the Gold Cup, he reminds me more of Bobsworth than Kauto Star. His owners story is very sad losing a child so young and their colours are the colours of Minions which was his favourite.


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## Mariposa (23 November 2019)

What a race! As an Altior fan I was gutted for him but Cyrname was superb! Looks like Altior hit his usual flat spot but didn't spark up again? 

However, Lostintranslation really blew me away! He really is the real deal. My favourite chaser now that Cue Card has retired - and aptly lives in his old stable apparently. Tizzard really had some class horses this year - Native River, Elegant Escape, Slate House, Reserve Tank,  The Big Breakaway, Thistlecrack, Western Approach....i mean the list goes on and on!! Go Team Tizz!


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## Elf On A Shelf (23 November 2019)

Did anyone see Laurina's race in Ireland? She was another who turned in a superb performance first time out over fences! On the bridle easy does it! I expect she will be made favourite for the Arkle.


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## bonny (23 November 2019)

EKW said:



			Did anyone see Laurina's race in Ireland? She was another who turned in a superb performance first time out over fences! On the bridle easy does it! I expect she will be made favourite for the Arkle.
		
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Willie Mullins is certainly having his usual great season, he is some trainer ...


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## tristar (23 November 2019)

perhaps altior did not like the ground,  what a fabulous big galloping horse cyrname is


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## Chiffy (24 November 2019)

I was sad Altior didnâ€™t win but he didnâ€™t disgrace himself either. Cyrname was superb and so much more sensible than he used to be.
No Carrotom, Lost in Translation does not remind me of Kauto Star, I donâ€™t think he races in the same way at all! He is very, very good though.


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## Clodagh (24 November 2019)

I was sorry for Altior, hopefully he can find his niche again.
LIT is an amzing horse, but I also think Robbie Power is a fabulous jockey absolutely at the top of his game. 
Harry Cobden is fantastic as well, and so young yet so calm.


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## bonny (24 November 2019)

Looks like it might well be round two on Boxing Day ! The king George is going to be some race !


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## Clodagh (24 November 2019)

bonny said:



			Looks like it might well be round two on Boxing Day ! The king George is going to be some race !
		
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I really doubt Altior will run in the KG. But we shall see. I did hear the interviews with both trainers today, NH sounds rotten, poor man.


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## humblepie (24 November 2019)

Lovely to see Altior. Cyrname is really tall. Just fabulous to see two such good horses.


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## Chiffy (5 December 2020)

Reviving this thread as Altior is due to run in the Tingle Creek today. I expect I shall be watching through my fingers! 🐎


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## Elf On A Shelf (5 December 2020)

Chiffy said:



			Reviving this thread as Altior is due to run in the Tingle Creek today. I expect I shall be watching through my fingers! 🐎
		
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Altior was pulled out last night due to the soft ground. 

Still plenty of other good racing today including the Many Clouds and Becher chases at Aintree.


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## Chiffy (5 December 2020)

Oh that’s sad, my morning paper didn’t tell me that although having watched yesterday, I wondered if it would be too soft for him.


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## Clodagh (6 December 2020)

They say most trainers say there are 361 days racing, and only 4 are at Cheltenham.
Nicky Henderson thinks there are 4 days in the year and 361 building up to it.

I think it is a real shame, but I don't own the horse or pay his training fees. At 11 he will do well to win the CC again next year. I'd have thought, but I haven't watched much racing this year so may not be up to date with the 2 mile division. (My favourite race at the Meeting, actually).

Politilogue did so well, and now for a horse that everyone is a bit derogatory about he has won the CC and 2 Tingle Creeks so has covered his costs, you could say. I love John Hales too, he seems such a horse lover.


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## wren123 (6 December 2020)

Didn't politilogue do well, I loved the reaction of his groom.

I'm not  a racing  expert but we always go to the tingle Creek meeting on the Saturday, hopefully will be there next year.


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## Chiffy (6 December 2020)

Clodagh, I was expecting you here! 
Yes a bit of a dim view was taken about NH’s decision. I didn’t realise that Altior can act in the soft. It’s a shame but Altior doesn’t owe anyone anything, he has done plenty. I like all John Haley’s greys over the years and he is so enthusiastic, well done Politilogue. PN’s interview was interesting and we would have enjoyed the two horses meeting.
So much of National Hunt race horse enjoyment is the regulars we get to see. I never got fond of See You Then who only appeared for the Champion Hurdle becoming nicknamed See You When!


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## Crazy_cat_lady (6 December 2020)

Might Bite is beginning to look a sorry sight scrapping round at the back


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## Clodagh (6 December 2020)

Crazy_cat_lady said:



			Might Bite is beginning to look a sorry sight scrapping round at the back
		
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Oh God yes, I love that horse, he doesn't deserve this. He is out of love with the game, let him go and do something else. His owner I don't like - and I don't even know who it is.


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## Crazy_cat_lady (6 December 2020)

Clodagh said:



			Oh God yes, I love that horse, he doesn't deserve this. He is out of love with the game, let him go and do something else. His owner I don't like - and I don't even know who it is.
		
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No he doesn't, im also not sure who the owner is but im also disliking them. I'm surprised how long they took to pull him up yesterday he was toiling from very early on and never looked comfortable. 

Retirement doesn't even mean "rot in a field" I think ror is a fantastic series so there are plenty of new jobs he could do. I could see him in the show ring.


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## Clodagh (6 December 2020)

Crazy_cat_lady said:



			No he doesn't, im also not sure who the owner is but im also disliking them. I'm surprised how long they took to pull him up yesterday he was toiling from very early on and never looked comfortable. 

Retirement doesn't even mean "rot in a field" I think ror is a fantastic series so there are plenty of new jobs he could do. I could see him in the show ring.
		
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I agree. He has such presence.


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## Elf On A Shelf (6 December 2020)

Might Bite really needs to be retired imo. He bled the other day which was why he didn't go a yard in the race. 

As to Altior - people are now being too precious of their horses reputations to keep them for Cheltenham. There are so few races the top notch horses can go in you do need to get out before the Festival. You can keep them apart for most of rhe season but they do need to run once or twice before March. 

It is really getting stupid how the Festival is becoming the be all and end all of the racing season.


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## bonny (6 December 2020)

Crazy_cat_lady said:



			No he doesn't, im also not sure who the owner is but im also disliking them. I'm surprised how long they took to pull him up yesterday he was toiling from very early on and never looked comfortable. 

Retirement doesn't even mean "rot in a field" I think ror is a fantastic series so there are plenty of new jobs he could do. I could see him in the show ring.
		
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He is one of the most stunning horses in training. I guess he is still showing ability at home, must be frustrating to have a horse with so much ability but he does appear to not want to be a racehorse any more.


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## Orangehorse (7 December 2020)

I can't remember, did Might Bite have a hard race?  I know he has been disappointing but the word is that he still goes really well at home.

I have heard it from more than one person that they have had a horse that got really exhausted - bottomed I think the expression - and they were never the same again.  Heart? Physically and mentally.

One girl said she took her hunter staghunting - they were fit having been hunting all winter - but the unrelenting open moorland meant being on the go all day and the horse was never the same again.


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## Elf On A Shelf (7 December 2020)

Orangehorse said:



			I can't remember, did Might Bite have a hard race?  I know he has been disappointing but the word is that he still goes really well at home.

I have heard it from more than one person that they have had a horse that got really exhausted - bottomed I think the expression - and they were never the same again.  Heart? Physically and mentally.

One girl said she took her hunter staghunting - they were fit having been hunting all winter - but the unrelenting open moorland meant being on the go all day and the horse was never the same again.
		
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Might Bite bled early on so didn't go far or get pushed hard.

It is possible to absolutely destroy horses with hard races. It's probably why so few horses go on to do anything after being placed in the National. It's a hard race, or it used to be. I think once you have reached the very bottom of a horse it is hard for their body to come back and that's only if the mind will let them. Some it takes 2 years to get back to something of what they were, some never come back.


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## Elf On A Shelf (27 December 2020)

Altior 2nd today. He didn't look the force of all, looks tapped for toe every step of the way now. 

Nube Negra absolutely hacked up! He looks like a proper horse for the future, Hopefully they give him a nice season this year and he will hit the heights next year.


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## Ditchjumper2 (27 December 2020)

Glad to see him safely home and he was lucky to finish second. If he was mine I  would call it a day. It looked hard work all the way round.


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## humblepie (27 December 2020)

Lovely to see him and that jump where Seau Royal fell - how far did he stand off - eek


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## blodwyn1 (27 December 2020)

It was his first run of the season but he didn't seem to have any sparkle today


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## Crazy_cat_lady (27 December 2020)

Ditchjumper2 said:



			Glad to see him safely home and he was lucky to finish second. If he was mine I  would call it a day. It looked hard work all the way round.
		
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I haven't seen the race yet, will watch later but I agree,  he's nearly 11, had his issues and doesn't owe them anything,  let him go do something else, I think he would do well showing

Haven't seen any announcements about Might Bite so looks like they're persisting with him despite him clearly having enough


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## fankino04 (27 December 2020)

Haven't seen any announcements about Might Bite so looks like they're persisting with him despite him clearly having enough[/QUOTE]
I always wonder in situations like this who's the driving force in keeping the horse in training between owner and trainer, obviously the owner will always have the final say but if you aren't an owner who is especially knowledgeable (and that's probably alot of them) I wonder how much the trainer influences them to keep going and which trainers are the most genuine when doing this.


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## Clodagh (27 December 2020)

fankino04 said:



			Haven't seen any announcements about Might Bite so looks like they're persisting with him despite him clearly having enough
		
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I always wonder in situations like this who's the driving force in keeping the horse in training between owner and trainer, obviously the owner will always have the final say but if you aren't an owner who is especially knowledgeable (and that's probably alot of them) I wonder how much the trainer influences them to keep going and which trainers are the most genuine when doing this.[/QUOTE]

I can’t see NH pushing to keep Might Bite clogging up a stable.
Altior struggled today, I got the impression in the interview that the Game Spirit will be crunch time.


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## Clodagh (27 December 2020)

Shiskin wasn’t that amazing either, and Epatante beaten NH will hope things improve.


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## scotlass (27 December 2020)

Altior was beaten by a very good horse in the making today.   That said, Nico de Boinville looked to be sending out help signals at times, and having watched Chacun Pour Soi running at Leopardstown an hour or so previously, on today's performances, the only view Altior may see of him at Cheltenham is his backside.

Shishkin won easily enough, but made a couple of novicey mistakes on the way round given that this is only his 9th race and a rising 7 year old.

Whilst disappointed with Epatante, who wasn't cheering on the nearly white Silver Streak on King George day that is synonymous with the legend that is Desert Orchid ?


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## Clodagh (28 December 2020)

scotlass said:



			Altior was beaten by a very good horse in the making today.   That said, Nico de Boinville looked to be sending out help signals at times, and having watched Chacun Pour Soi running at Leopardstown an hour or so previously, on today's performances, the only view Altior may see of him at Cheltenham is his backside.

Shishkin won easily enough, but made a couple of novicey mistakes on the way round given that this is only his 9th race and a rising 7 year old.

Whilst disappointed with Epatante, who wasn't cheering on the nearly white Silver Streak on King George day that is synonymous with the legend that is Desert Orchid ?
		
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You have to love SS. He looks like a Connemara pony and runs like a buck. He has such a happy face.


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## MyBoyChe (28 December 2020)

I believe NH has said that Altior has had a dirty scope post race so is suspecting both he and possibly some of his others are not 100%


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## photo_jo (28 December 2020)

Elf On A Shelf said:



			Altior 2nd today. He didn't look the force of all, looks tapped for toe every step of the way now.

Nube Negra absolutely hacked up! He looks like a proper horse for the future, Hopefully they give him a nice season this year and he will hit the heights next year.
		
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And Spanish bred which is an added extra!


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## Elf On A Shelf (6 January 2021)

It has been confirmed today that Might Bite has been retired! Happy days ahead for him!


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## AdorableAlice (6 January 2021)

He would make a lovely show horse.


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## Crazy_cat_lady (6 January 2021)

Glad he's finally been retired! Wonder what he will get up to

I agree with Adorable Alice,  he would suit the show ring, I think the same about Altior as well


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## Jeni the dragon (6 January 2021)

I'm so glad Might Bite has been retired. He's such a stunner, I hope we still get to see him out and about.


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## Gingerwitch (7 January 2021)

Elf On A Shelf said:



			Altior is just awesome! You can't compare them to past era's - too many things have changed, breeding, training, feeding etc. Who knows - those horses of old might have been better with more modern methods etc. 

More to the point - Who else Saw Nico's ride and Interview from the Christmas Hurdle where he beat Buveur D'air! He tried so hard not to win, wasn't best pleased during his interview after! The owners of Verdana Blue are over the moon however! Their quote after is funny - I know the trainer and jockey aren't very happy as they think they've lost their jobs - but we're very happy!
		
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Is that allowed ???? Is  it not classed as fixing if the bookies take a drumming


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## Gingerwitch (7 January 2021)

MyBoyChe said:



			I believe NH has said that Altior has had a dirty scope post race so is suspecting both he and possibly some of his others are not 100%
		
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What is a dirty scope please ?


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## Gingerwitch (7 January 2021)

Elf On A Shelf said:



			Might Bite bled early on so didn't go far or get pushed hard.

It is possible to absolutely destroy horses with hard races. It's probably why so few horses go on to do anything after being placed in the National. It's a hard race, or it used to be. I think once you have reached the very bottom of a horse it is hard for their body to come back and that's only if the mind will let them. Some it takes 2 years to get back to something of what they were, some never come back.
		
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Can you explain has a bleed early on, I assume it means lungs but how would the jockey know that in a race and would they not automatically pull up for there own safety in a race situation ?


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## Elf On A Shelf (7 January 2021)

Gingerwitch said:



			What is a dirty scope please ?
		
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Yes race fixing - deliberately not trying to win is against all rules of racing.

A dirty scope - when a horse has an endoscope and trachwash down their throats and either blood, mucus or general crap is found down there upon testing the sample or is plain to see by the eye.

Yes bleeding is usually from a burst blood vessel somewhere along the line from the lungs to the nose. You don't always know the exact source. Some horses aren't affected performance wise by them - Tiger Roll won the National with a nose bleed, others it's very obvious as the horse suddenly drops the gallop, has no power and feels very dull. We often use the phrase  - stopped like he had been shot - when a horse bleeds. It's tricky with quirky horses as obviously the jockey can't see the nose from where they are and can often think the horse is just being a reluctant monkey. Not all bleeds show on the outside either. So a horse may perform poorly, bleeding is suspected but not visually seen until they are scoped.


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## Gingerwitch (7 January 2021)

Elf On A Shelf said:



			Yes race fixing - deliberately not trying to win is against all rules of racing.

A dirty scope - when a horse has an endoscope and trachwash down their throats and either blood, mucus or general crap is found down there upon testing the sample or is plain to see by the eye.

Yes bleeding is usually from a burst blood vessel somewhere along the line from the lungs to the nose. You don't always know the exact source. Some horses aren't affected performance wise by them - Tiger Roll won the National with a nose bleed, others it's very obvious as the horse suddenly drops the gallop, has no power and feels very dull. We often use the phrase  - stopped like he had been shot - when a horse bleeds. It's tricky with quirky horses as obviously the jockey can't see the nose from where they are and can often think the horse is just being a reluctant monkey. Not all bleeds show on the outside either. So a horse may perform poorly, bleeding is suspected but not visually seen until they are scoped.
		
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Thank you for the explanations. Its minus 5 here and I am waiting for the car to defrost so its been usefully spent lol x


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## scotlass (15 March 2021)

Altior has been withdrawn from the Champion Chase at Cheltenham.   A dirty scope, apparently.


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## Clodagh (15 March 2021)

scotlass said:



			Altior has been withdrawn from the Champion Chase at Cheltenham.   A dirty scope, apparently.
		
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Cheltenham is going to be a last horse standing at this rate!


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## blodwyn1 (24 April 2021)

Altior ran well today but what do we all think about him staying in training?


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## Crazy_cat_lady (24 April 2021)

blodwyn1 said:



			Altior ran well today but what do we all think about him staying in training?
		
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Let him bow out safe and well. I read it though as they want him to stay racing unfortunately

It would be horrible for something to happen to him 

I'd love to see him showing he's beautiful

Retirement doesn't mean chucked in a field there's so many other jobs they can do, I love seeing the racehorses where are they how Facebook page and them all doing various jobs, enjoying their Retirement


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## Clodagh (25 April 2021)

I think he looked really enthusiastic. I am normally keen on retirement but tbh he is so lightly raced I think he could go on and do another season. He runs, what, once or twice a year?


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## Elf On A Shelf (25 April 2021)

He has been 2nd twice now looking like he is tapped for toe in the speed department. He hasn't trailed home stone cold last or pulled up. Why retire him just because he didnt win?

Personally I would give him a spin over 2m4f to see how he gets on with the slightly slower pace and increase on stamina.


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## Parrotperson (25 April 2021)

Agreed Elf. I think he needs a bit further now he's older. 

And congratulations on an excellent season for your stable. What a star Mighty Thunder is!!


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