# What wormers should I use for January??



## eagleowl (28 December 2012)

I am worming my livery yard in January but i'm not sure which wormers to use? I used Equest Pramox last time and I know I need to worm for bots this time! But which wormer should I use?


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## Borderreiver (28 December 2012)

When did you use E Pramox? You have treated encysted redworm, tapeworm and bots with that so you don't need another routine wormer. Just test through the year and only worm those who need it (if any). Routine worming is no longer approved of.


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## lachlanandmarcus (28 December 2012)

Routine worming for things that can be blood tested for (tapeworm) or worm counted for (eg adult redworm) shouldnt be routinely wormed for to avoid resistance building up.

However.....there is currently NO alternative to wormer for the dangerous encysted stage of small redworm and unless wormed for in the autumn/spring this can emerge en masse with potentially fatal results or serious colic.

Everybody should even if worm counting still be either blood testing for tapeworm or worming for it (ideally the former) and worming for encysted small redworm. 

Pramox would cover both tapeworm and encysted redworm, so if this was recent it is correct that they might not need to do anything more until later/spring. If not then they should be re doing it, or (if they have used it for a while or something with the same ingredients) should switch to something that has a different ingredient but also covers encysted worms and tapeworm (NB there arent any other combined wormers for these two so that would mean separate wormers) .


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## ILuvCowparsely (28 December 2012)

eagleowl said:



			I am worming my livery yard in January but i'm not sure which wormers to use? I used Equest Pramox last time and I know I need to worm for bots this time! But which wormer should I use?
		
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I always use hadrian equine

 good advice
 good bargain wormers 
cheaper bulk buy
http://www.hadrianequine.co.uk/


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## Mrs. Jingle (28 December 2012)

I find it slightly odd that someone who owns/runs a livery yard would need to ask on a horse forum about advise regarding worming? Has this not been an issue for your yard before now, have you any qualifications in horse care?

Before anybody jumps down my throat, I do have issues with people who run livery yards without enough studying or experience in horse care. How often on here and other forums do we see new owners being urged to consult their 'livery owner/manager' for advise when they are struggling?

If the person running the livery yard doesn't even know what they are doing then I can only see a potential disaster for the horses kept there frankly.


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## Izzwizz (28 December 2012)

MrsJingle said:



			I find it slightly odd that someone who owns/runs a livery yard would need to ask on a horse forum about advise regarding worming? Has this not been an issue for your yard before now, have you any qualifications in horse care?

Before anybody jumps down my throat, I do have issues with people who run livery yards without enough studying or experience in horse care. How often on here and other forums do we see new owners being urged to consult their 'livery owner/manager' for advise when they are struggling?

If the person running the livery yard doesn't even know what they are doing then I can only see a potential disaster for the horses kept there frankly.
		
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Totally agree with this!!


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## horsestar (28 December 2012)

In all fairness to op they were only asking as it can be confusing and I don't find it odd at all! Even with qualification in all my bhs stages I still have to refer! Lighten the mood its christmas!!!


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## lachlanandmarcus (28 December 2012)

horsestar said:



			In all fairness to op they were only asking as it can be confusing and I don't find it odd at all! Even with qualification in all my bhs stages I still have to refer! Lighten the mood its christmas!!!
		
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I agree with this (altho if they are telling the yard what they 'will' use, it is important to get genned up pretty thoroughly).

In the circumstances, better to ask on here than not at all.And to be honest, it is a useful check anyway, I have had some completely wrong info from supposedly qualified 'SQPs' both at vets and at wormer retailers :-D decided I had to become my own expert!!

These are the best specific info links I have found - need to be used in combination to work out what ingredient works for what worm, and what products they are found in.

whats in the wormers (chemical active ingredients)
http://wormers-direct.co.uk/ingredients.html

different wormers
http://wormers-direct.co.uk/brands.html

worming calendar
http://wormers-direct.co.uk/calendar.html


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## CazD (29 December 2012)

lachlanandmarcus said:



			These are the best specific info links I have found - need to be used in combination to work out what ingredient works for what worm, and what products they are found in.

whats in the wormers (chemical active ingredients)
http://wormers-direct.co.uk/ingredients.html

different wormers
http://wormers-direct.co.uk/brands.html

worming calendar
http://wormers-direct.co.uk/calendar.html

Click to expand...

thanks for that link - that's really helpful.  I've taken on a pony that is difficult to worm and have had to change from syringe type wormers to liquid or tablet ones and finding the right wormer is such a minefield.


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## putasocinit (29 December 2012)

Geewizz leave the OP alone, she is only asking which she has every right to do, and it doesnt mean she doesnt know basic horse care, with all the additional wormers on the market now and resistance i think most people are questioning if they a making the right decision.

However OP i will say that your liveries should be allowed to have worm counts done and if theirs are clear why should they worm, until spring when they would need to worm for tapeworm anyway, this will help break the cycle of resistance to wormers.


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## Emma27 (30 December 2012)

I think OP is right to ask for advice, however, this is not the place to be seeking worming advice.

OP please speak to a SQP or Vet local to you regarding this. They will ask you loads of questions regarding your yard, ie: how many horses, age of horses, pasture management, worming history etc... Then, and only then, they will prescribe the most suitable wormer for you. Wormers are prescribed by Vets, Pharmacists or SQP's, not chosen by owners.

 I still find it funny when owners come into my shop and say "I want 2 x Pramox" for instance. No, it doesn't work like that! You then get it in the neck for daring to ask the aforementioned questions!


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## Misog2000 (30 December 2012)

Emma 27 - if these owners then explained that they were on a whole yard worming program written by their vet, would you sell them the wormers even though you didn't think they were exactly right for the time of year?

I only ask as we had to argue with our local tack shop today to get the wormer on our plan (Eqvalan) as she really didn't want to sell it to us. I do understand that SQP's have done a training course etc and so are able to advise, but should they be trying to overrule the vet? We have also had problems getting a double dose of Strongid P for new horses on the yard (this is the yard rule for new ones as we had a pony die of Tapeworm a few years ago, again approved by the vet) as we get told it is the wrong time of year. Surely it is only the wrong time of year if you only plan to do it once, if you will worm for tapeworm again spring and autumn then surely it doesn't matter.

We are a high risk yard with horses on and off, huge fields so no poo picking, visiting horses etc so worm counting not an option for us.

Not having a go at anyone, just wondering if this was normal, or if she was just being over zealous.

Sorry for the hijack OP


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## TwoStroke (30 December 2012)

I buy wormers from an agricultural outlet rather than tack shops as I get tired of arguing about what chemicals are being put into my own horses - if I want to worm with equitape and equest separately instead of with pramox then I will! You can buy wormers online easily enough, so it gets my goat when tack shop staff get all officious about it.

That said, they may be helpful in the OP's case, as she actually wants advice .


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## Emma27 (30 December 2012)

Misog2000 said:



			Emma 27 - if these owners then explained that they were on a whole yard worming program written by their vet, would you sell them the wormers even though you didn't think they were exactly right for the time of year?
		
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If they came in with a written prescription from the vet then yes I would in theory be able to sell the prescribed wormer. If I thought the prescription was blatently wrong ie: horse would be underdosed etc... then I would question it, we are allowed to overrule vets in this sense. It is me selling the wormer and therefore my licence at risk so I am duty bound to check everything.
 If someone came into the shop and told me verbally about the vet written plan, then I would have to prescribe the wormer myself and ask all the relevant questions and possibly end up prescribing a different wormer than the vet had said to use. It's more than my job is worth not to follow procedure.


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## Emma27 (30 December 2012)

TwoTurtleDoves said:



			I buy wormers from an agricultural outlet rather than tack shops as I get tired of arguing about what chemicals are being put into my own horses - if I want to worm with equitape and equest separately instead of with pramox then I will! You can buy wormers online easily enough, so it gets my goat when tack shop staff get all officious about it.

That said, they may be helpful in the OP's case, as she actually wants advice .
		
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If the SQP advised Pramox and you told her you wanted to worm with Equest & Equitape instead, then I don't see the problem. They do the same thing when combined. This is what was used before Pramox was introduced after all.

I'm sorry if I seem too officious about it too, I'm really not like that. I am just passionate about correct worming practice. You would be surprised at the amount of people who think they know what they are doing when it comes to worming their horses when in fact, to coin a phrase used up here, they know hee haw!


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## TwoStroke (31 December 2012)

Sorry, wasn't aimed at you, emma27. I'm sure you're not officious 

I just still get mad just thinking about my experiences of trying to buy wormers from that bleeding tack shop, lol! Also none of the SQP people have any experience in worming barefoot horses and resolutely refuse to accept that some horses can't tolerate certain wormers. And they *must* be right because they've been on a course, don't you know, and the pharmaceutical companies told them so. Never mind the fact that I actually know my horses, and have wormed them before .

Oops, there I go again !


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