# Why do hunts need terrier men?



## TwinkleT (31 December 2017)

As the title really, i'm just curious as to why a hunt would have terriers with them post ban? I can't say I fully understand how hunts work and therefore also what's legal post ban so i'm interested to know why they would be there now because I think I would have assumed they could no longer be used on a normal days hunting?


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## Clodagh (31 December 2017)

If hounds mark a fox to ground, which they could and can do just while trotting past the hole, they needn't have chased it there, the landowner can still request it is dug and shot. It can no longer be bolted torun, obviously.


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## GirlFriday (31 December 2017)

"within the law"...


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## Alec Swan (31 December 2017)

When Hunting was as we knew it,  pre-ban,  then it served two purposes;  whilst it was generally considered as sport,  regardless of the eventual outcome,  it had a secondary use in that for those Landowners who preferred that Toby should not be given best,  so the terrier men were on hand to deal with those foxes which went to ground,  or knew of a safe place that the stopper didn't know of!

Some consider our foxes to be a pest,  some as a venerable quarry,  and some would see them as both!  Me?  That would depend upon which hat I was wearing;  as a gamekeeper and when my wild birds were nesting,  I never spared one,  as my employer was a Joint-Master of the Heythrop,  so hounds never failed to find with me,  and now when I'm shooting and because the hand of just about everyone it seems is turned against him,  when Toby passes me on a shoot day,  so I raise my hat to him,  to the occasional annoyance of my host and the wonderment of others!

It may be true that as the fox is considered by many to be vermin,  so and as with all other vermin their resilience is such that they continue to prosper,  regardless of the attentions of man!  &#8230;. sorry,  I've wandered off the subject a bit,  though terrier men are really a relic of the past,  they're generally on hand just in case their needed &#8212;&#8212; that's my understanding.

Alec.


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## Tiddlypom (31 December 2017)

I'm genuinely confuddled as to why modern hunting seems to depend so much on these quad bike riding 'terrier men'. The blimmin things are everywhere when my local pack fetches up. Do those metal boxes really have terriers inside? It must be a very uncomfortable ride for the canines shut inside them if so.

*TP reminiscing back to the time when it was just the hounds, the master, the huntsman, the whipper in and the field. Plus occasionally a fox or two.*


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## Clodagh (31 December 2017)

Tiddlypom said:



			I'm genuinely confuddled as to why modern hunting seems to depend so much on these quad bike riding 'terrier men'. The blimmin things are everywhere when my local pack fetches up. Do those metal boxes really have terriers inside? It must be a very uncomfortable ride for the canines shut inside them if so.

*TP reminiscing back to the time when it was just the hounds, the master, the huntsman, the whipper in and the field. Plus occasionally a fox or two.*
		
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I'm not sure why they need quite so many. Nasty smelly noisy things. Take off your rose tinted glasses though, the terrierman was always there, they just used to be more discreet.


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## Sandstone1 (31 December 2017)

Why do they need a large bird of prey too??


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## AdorableAlice (31 December 2017)

In the 1980's my then husband was terrier man to a Midlands pack and rode with a terrier and folding spade on the horse.  He was not the best of horsemen but the horse looked after him and just stood there when the terrier was used.

The Masters commissioned a beautiful bronze of the horse stood alongside the spade pushed into the ground and the terrier tied to it.  Sadly the bronze went when the husband left so I no longer have it.


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## Alec Swan (31 December 2017)

Sandstone1 said:



			Why do they need a large bird of prey too??
		
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Ah well,  that's a legal derogation and if you think that it's complete and utter lunacy,  I'd be with you.

Alec.


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## Sandstone1 (31 December 2017)

I 've been told its to help them hunt within the law.


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## Tiddlypom (31 December 2017)

Clodagh said:



			Take off your rose tinted glasses though, the terrierman was always there, they just used to be more discreet. 

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Rost tinted specs, moi ? Maybe the old boy who followed us by road in his ancient landie was secretly our terrierman? He certainly wasn't as intrusive as these bleddy quad bikes + occupants which seem to dominate everything.

I love AA's account of the terrier being carried on horseback, I've never come across that before!


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## popsdosh (1 January 2018)

Sandstone1 said:



			I 've been told its to help them hunt within the law.
		
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Yes they are allowed to flush foxes to a bird of prey and indeed our local hunt has a golden eagle that has been responsible for the demise of several foxes.


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## Shay (1 January 2018)

We have an African Eagle - same reason, but he tends on only come out on display occasions anyway.  He's a bit heavy!

No there are not terriers inside the metal boxes - although there may be one sitting beside one of those on the quad.  They may be a secured weapon - foxes can legally be shot.  Mostly terrier men are there to help.  Open gates, check the correct gates are closed.  Check and if necessary mend fencing - or alert the landowner. Direct nay errant members of the field heading back the wrong way.  Replenish the bait fluid used for the trail - the runner can only carry so much.  If necessary pick up an injured hound.  Video proceedings for proof that hunting is within the law. Video anyone trespassing or causing damage.   Anything that needs doing really.  They  are more mobile than normal foot followers.


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## Clodagh (1 January 2018)

Tiddlypom said:



			Rost tinted specs, moi ? Maybe the old boy who followed us by road in his ancient landie was secretly our terrierman? He certainly wasn't as intrusive as these bleddy quad bikes + occupants which seem to dominate everything.

I love AA's account of the terrier being carried on horseback, I've never come across that before!
		
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Our huntsman had been known to do it, in his youth.
They carrier terriers in the metal boxes with our hunt, they do have grills facing the driver, they are not enclosed.


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## AengusOg (4 January 2018)

In all my years alive I've  never heard the fox being referred to as 'Toby'.


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## Alec Swan (4 January 2018)

AengusOg said:



			In all my years alive I've  never heard the fox being referred to as 'Toby'.
		
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Two quotes from the StalkingDirectory .. I'll admit that I too wondered,  but I'm not alone,  it seems; .


_Why do we call Mr Fox 'Charlie'?
I go along with Sikamalc on this one. 

As regards 'Toby' I heard this term by the lads in the New Forest area when I used to help a keeper that moved to an estate south of Ringwood.

Is 'Toby' used elsewhere?

Re: Why do we call Mr Fox 'Charlie'?
Quote Originally Posted by techman



Is 'Toby' used elswhere?
ln cambridgeshire we call them Charlie, Toby, Reynard ,John nox .we also call badgers skate boards ._

Alec.


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## Littlefloof (27 March 2018)

In northern Norway he's called Mikkel (Michael) Fox.


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## slowrider (6 April 2018)

Probably the terrier prefers the field over TV at home.


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## ycbm (6 April 2018)

popsdosh said:



			Yes they are allowed to flush foxes to a bird of prey and indeed our local hunt has a golden eagle that has been responsible for the demise of several foxes.
		
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Would that be the Hunt where the Huntsman was found guilty yesterday of illegal hunting by flushing to a Golden Eagle?


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## Judgemental (6 April 2018)

Are we talking about hunting in England and Wales or Northern Ireland or The Republic of ireland


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## Chuckieee (7 April 2018)

Our local hunt who hunt within the law use terrier men to capture or divert loose horses to safety, unite riders with loose horses, mend broken gates, jumps, fences, assist emergency services with access issues or to get to difficult sites, manage traffic - foot followers or otherwise , sometimes manage stray members of the field who have become lost.


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## fburton (9 April 2018)

Clodagh said:



			Nasty smelly noisy things.
		
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Just like people then!


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## Judgemental (9 April 2018)

TwinkleT said:



			As the title really, i'm just curious as to why a hunt would have terriers with them post ban? I can't say I fully understand how hunts work and therefore also what's legal post ban so i'm interested to know why they would be there now because I think I would have assumed they could no longer be used on a normal days hunting?
		
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Rubbish you are fully conversant with hunting and it's protocols. Your question and statement are a complete paradox, which easily point to your fulsome knowledge.

Clearly you are trying to ingratiate yourself into matters, that can be perceived to stir up anti-hunting sentiment.

You might as well say, why do folk ride horses trail or drag hunting. Because they are part of the panoply of hunting as are terriers.

In the now immortalised words of our venerated Minister of Defence, "go away and shut up".

We know all about your sort!


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## Judgemental (9 April 2018)

We are seeing far too many 5th Columnist double agents and spy's, coming onto this part of the Horse and Hound Forum, trying to spread poison, in order to denigrate good, decent hunting folk in the minds of the public at large.

Or to generate a discussion which might purport to suggest an illegal act was, or could be committed under The Hunting Act 2004.   

These people need to be rooted out, unmasked, exposed and laid bare as to their nefarious and duplicitous motives.


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## Tiddlypom (9 April 2018)

Don't they just, JM


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## The Fuzzy Furry (9 April 2018)

JM, you having a nice day :biggrin3: (for a change!  )


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## Mule (10 April 2018)

Judgemental said:



			We are seeing far too many 5th Columnist double agents and spy's, coming onto this part of the Horse and Hound Forum, trying to spread poison, in order to denigrate good, decent hunting folk in the minds of the public at large.

Or to generate a discussion which might purport to suggest an illegal act was, or could be committed under The Hunting Act 2004.   

These people need to be rooted out, unmasked, exposed and laid bare as to their nefarious and duplicitous motives.
		
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Don't hold back


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## Aleka81 (13 April 2018)

Shay said:



			We have an African Eagle - same reason, but he tends on only come out on display occasions anyway.  He's a bit heavy!

No there are not terriers inside the metal boxes - although there may be one sitting beside one of those on the quad.  They may be a secured weapon - foxes can legally be shot.  Mostly terrier men are there to help.  Open gates, check the correct gates are closed.  Check and if necessary mend fencing - or alert the landowner. Direct nay errant members of the field heading back the wrong way.  Replenish the bait fluid used for the trail - the runner can only carry so much.  If necessary pick up an injured hound.  Video proceedings for proof that hunting is within the law. Video anyone trespassing or causing damage.   Anything that needs doing really.  They  are more mobile than normal foot followers.
		
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Um! Yes there are terriers inside metal terrier boxes! 

Staggered that you would think there aren't. My pet terrier loves going in her box. Safest way to carry her on the quad. Although my box is wooden not metal.


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## Judgemental (16 April 2018)

Aleka81 said:



			Um! Yes there are terriers inside metal terrier boxes! 

Staggered that you would think there aren't. My pet terrier loves going in her box. Safest way to carry her on the quad. Although my box is wooden not metal.
		
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The late and much lamented Willie Poole, always carried a terrier or two on his quad and sometimes in a box. 

Ah dear Willie. Brings a tear to the eye when I recall listening to his sage advice and convivial banter.

Of course terriers are like King Charles Spaniels, who warned the king of approaching danger, or embarrassments when he was with his mistresses.

Perish the thought that terriers are kept for a similar latter purpose, on the other I'm not so sure come to think of it.

Oh yes, a good terrier will have a variety of little noises and barks to warn one, if one could be mishandled by a sab or embarrassed.


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