# Restarting 20 year old problems, please advise :(



## Kirstyx1 (13 August 2019)

Hello everyone, I wondered if anyone could shed any insight to my problem. Thank you for any replies x
My horse hasn't been ridden for 15 years and I tried restarting her about 3 weeks ago. The first 10 minute or so ride in the field she was perfectly behaved. It was like she had been ridden yesterday. The second time, fine. The third, she started to nap by the gate. Tiny rears, side stepping and refusing to move and I admittedly jumped off. Since then she has gotten progressively worse, and each time, I have gotten off. I thought it could be the saddle but tried bare back today and she hunched her back, ears back, maybe threatening to buck? She hurried forward and side stepping, half rears. My confidence is at zero as I haven't ridden for 15 years. I hired a trainer who did parelli with her for a hour but she actually seemed more worked up by the end and he was very unprofessional making inappropriate remarks towards my sister and I! I would hire another but don't have the money and can't box her to a lesson as I don't have a box now. Could she be on pain? Considering she is the same with or without the saddle? She looks actually scared, yet i have never raised a hand to her and she was half asleep the first couple of rides? Teeth and feet have been done. Sweet horse to handle on the ground. Thank you so much in advance for any help x


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## Amymay (13 August 2019)

After 15 years of not being ridden, and being the grand old age of 20, quite frankly Iâ€™d let her enjoy her retirement.


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## Kirstyx1 (13 August 2019)

Thanks for your reply, but apparently horses can be ridden well into their 20s if cared for well. I only intend to hack her nothing heavy


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## Leo Walker (13 August 2019)

They can but not always. If you really want to ride this horse you need a proper MOT doing. Back, teeth, saddle, vet check and then get a good instructor involved. Start with ground work and very, very, very, very slowly build up to riding. At 20 with 15yrs off your looking at it taking 3 to 4 months before shes hacking steadily in walk with short bursts of trot, for up to an hour total max.


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## Amymay (13 August 2019)

But she hasnâ€™t been ridden for 15 years.  And will have no historic fitness to even start preparing her for ridden work.  Sheâ€™s even told you â€˜noâ€™, and I donâ€™t blame her.


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## Kirstyx1 (13 August 2019)

Thank you, very true Leo Walker


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## Kirstyx1 (13 August 2019)

amymay said:



			But she hasnâ€™t been ridden for 15 years.  And will have no historic fitness to even start preparing her for ridden work.  Sheâ€™s even told you â€˜noâ€™, and I donâ€™t blame her.
		
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Always a negative troll in the midst


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## Amymay (13 August 2019)

Kirstyx1 said:



			Always a negative troll in the midst
		
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No need for rudeness.  I can just see the situation from the perspective of distance, but more importantly _experience_. Neither of which you have ðŸ˜‰


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## Rowreach (13 August 2019)

Kirstyx1 said:



			Always a negative troll in the midst
		
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Or possibly someone giving you a sensible answer, that you donâ€™t like.


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## Cortez (13 August 2019)

Kirstyx1 said:



			Always a negative troll in the midst
		
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No. Not a "negative troll", just someone giving you a sensible answer....that you don't seem to like very much. Which kind of makes YOU the troll.....

The horse hasn't been ridden for 15 years, has NO residual fitness or muscle tone/memory, and is telling you to eff off. I suggest you listen.


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## EllenJay (13 August 2019)

Kirstyx1 said:



			Always a negative troll in the midst
		
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I don't think you can call Amymay a "troll". Very rude IMHO.

However, you can't take a horse who has done bugger all for 15 years and expect them to behave perfectly.  Firstly, you need to get a vet check to make sure teeth, back and legs are up to work.
Then you need to treat them as an unbacked 3 year old.

I must say, I am very interested in why after 15 years you want to start riding this pony again.


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## Kirstyx1 (13 August 2019)

I think most people can see your replies are hardly constructive  considering I used to xc and sj with her I think I have experience somewhat, however we all loose our way and our nerve from time to time even you the professional I expect  I suspect you are telling everyone on here not to restart a older horse with alot of life left? If she is healthy which I am trying to make sure of before continuing then I don't see your issue?


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## Amymay (13 August 2019)

Whatever.


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## Rowreach (13 August 2019)

Kirstyx1 said:



			I think most people can see your replies are hardly constructive  considering I used to xc and sj with her I think I have experience somewhat, however we all loose our way and our nerve from time to time even you the professional I expect  I suspect you are telling everyone on here not to restart a older horse with alot of life left? If she is healthy which I am trying to make sure of before continuing then I don't see your issue?
		
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Which of us are you responding to?


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## Kirstyx1 (13 August 2019)

EllenJay said:



			I don't think you can call Amymay a "troll". Very rude IMHO.

However, you can't take a horse who has done bugger all for 15 years and expect them to behave perfectly.  Firstly, you need to get a vet check to make sure teeth, back and legs are up to work.
Then you need to treat them as an unbacked 3 year old.

I must say, I am very interested in why after 15 years you want to start riding this pony again.
		
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Of course i dont expect her to behave perfectly, I am trying to figure out what could be the problem, i.e. pain/probably not wanting to work as she has been out of work a long while etc. Asked for a little advice not scathing comments


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## Kirstyx1 (13 August 2019)

Rowreach said:



			Which of us are you responding to?
		
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Amymay


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## Kirstyx1 (13 August 2019)

Cortez said:



			No. Not a "negative troll", just someone giving you a sensible answer....that you don't seem to like very much. Which kind of makes YOU the troll.....

The horse hasn't been ridden for 15 years, has NO residual fitness or muscle tone/memory, and is telling you to eff off. I suggest you listen.
		
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Haha, and you feel this is constructive? Whatever makes you feel better good for you. If you think older horses are useless I think you and your friend need a little more experience and knowledge not me...anyone would think I was trying to take her straight back into show jumping not starting off very gradually as I have been, that's the sad thing about the horse world, so many snotty people among the decent.


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## Kirstyx1 (13 August 2019)

Rowreach said:



			Or possibly someone giving you a sensible answer, that you donâ€™t like.
		
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There's constructive criticism and then there is negative, and quite silly..


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## Tiddlypom (13 August 2019)

Donâ€™t waste your time with this thread, folks.


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## Auslander (13 August 2019)

Don't worry folks. I've got this


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## Kirstyx1 (13 August 2019)

Auslander said:



			Don't worry folks. I've got this





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How mature


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## Amymay (13 August 2019)

Yaaaayyyy ðŸ˜€ðŸ˜€ðŸ˜€ðŸ˜€


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## Auslander (13 August 2019)

Kirstyx1 said:



			How mature
		
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Ok. Mature answer.
Don't join an internet forum, and start mouthing off at people within days. You've been super rude to several posters who are actually extremely experienced, and who gave you good advice. 

And regarding your horse. Many horses work well into their 20's very happily. The ones who have been in regular work all their lives, whose bodies are conditioned to be ridden. Your horse has not, so it would be unkind to try and turn her into a ridden horse after 15 years of retirement.


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## Theocat (13 August 2019)

Okay, Kirsty:

Exactly how much work did you do on the first, second and third rides?

What was it that made you decide to jump off? Have you at any point "ridden her through" a bit of napping?

What does you vet say about bringing her back into work, and her behaviour now?


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## Kirstyx1 (13 August 2019)

Kirstyx1 said:



			How mature
		
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Auslander said:



			Ok. Mature answer.
Don't join an internet forum, and start mouthing off at people within days. You've been super rude to several posters who are actually extremely experienced, and who gave you good advice.

And regarding your horse. Many horses work well into their 20's very happily. The ones who have been in regular work all their lives, whose bodies are conditioned to be ridden. Your horse has not, so it would be unkind to try and turn her into a ridden horse after 15 years of retirement.
		
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Ok well, my lesson has been learned.. don't ask for help from anyone other than a vet. Example- " your horse is telling you to eff off" is that helpful or constructive? I don't think it is at all unkind if started very slowly, and if she is sound all round but I guess this is why I shouldn't ask for opinions from anyone other than professionals. What is unkind is how I have received a onslaught from members grouped together as a pack of bullies do. I wouldn't dream of riding her if I am told by the VET not to. She has been handled, loved and cared for 15 years but as I battled cancer I stopped riding. It was my passion and she was the best horse Iv ever ridden so apologies for wanting that back again.


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## DabDab (13 August 2019)

Leo Walker said:



			They can but not always. If you really want to ride this horse you need a proper MOT doing. Back, teeth, saddle, vet check and then get a good instructor involved. Start with ground work and very, very, very, very slowly build up to riding. At 20 with 15yrs off your looking at it taking 3 to 4 months before shes hacking steadily in walk with short bursts of trot, for up to an hour total max.
		
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Basically this. There is both the physical aspect of her having no muscles developed to carry a rider anymore, plus being older will make her more prone to aches when the muscles are suddenly asked to do something again, and also there is the psychological aspect of her just not understanding why she should have to go do something when she's feeling a bit achy and used to being a lady of leisure. She probably went along with it the first few times because hey, why wouldn't she, and then as she's started to feel it a little bit she's said nah. And saying no thank you has been quite effective because she's gone back to her field and she may even think that this is what she was supposed to do.

If you really want to try working her again you need to get her a full mot and then condition her body and brain gradually again to build her up, making sure you are always setting yourselves up to succeed. And be mindful of the fact that it will take an old horse much longer to build up muscle fitness than a youngster.


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## Auslander (13 August 2019)

Kirstyx1 said:



			Ok well, my lesson has been learned.. don't ask for help from anyone other than a vet. Example- " your horse is telling you to eff off" is that helpful or constructive? I don't think it is at all unkind if started very slowly, and if she is sound all round but I guess this is why I shouldn't ask for opinions from anyone other than professionals. What is unkind is how I have received a onslaught from members grouped together as a pack of bullies do. I wouldn't dream of riding her if I am told by the VET not to. She has been handled, loved and cared for 15 years but as I battled cancer I stopped riding. It was my passion and she was the best horse Iv ever ridden so apologies for wanting that back again.
		
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Oh do get a grip. you silly woman. 

I do agree with one point - your vet should be your first port of call. If you insist on trying to bring a horse back into work after 15 years, and she is objecting, you need to make absolutely damn sure that she isn't in pain.


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## Kirstyx1 (13 August 2019)

Theocat said:



			Okay, Kirsty:

Exactly how much work did you do on the first, second and third rides?

What was it that made you decide to jump off? Have you at any point "ridden her through" a bit of napping?

What does you vet say about bringing her back into work, and her behaviour now?
		
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Hello Theocat, about 10 minutes each time, a little walk about the field, no actual work. Just getting her used to me being on her back, to see how she was with it etc. I have lunged her for roughly 2 weeks prior with no tack and then with tack. It was silly to jump off each time she napped toward the gate, I have lost my nerve I guess. Of course I don't blame her at all for not wanting to after so long, I just thought she might gradually learn to enjoy it again, she loves going in hand on walks out. She had no vices before so I don't know why I worry about the what ifs. My vet is booked in for next week, probably should have waited for him to check her first. Thanks for replying


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## EllenJay (13 August 2019)

Kirstyx1 said:



			What is unkind is how I have received a onslaught from members grouped together as a pack of Bullies
		
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To be fair - you were the first person who started an argument by calling a well respected and knowledgeable member of the forum a "troll" - and no-one has ganged up on you until this point.
Everyone has said that you need a vet check, and to bring her back slowly. What more advice do you want?


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## Kirstyx1 (13 August 2019)

DabDab said:



			Basically this. There is both the physical aspect of her having no muscles developed to carry a rider anymore, plus being older will make her more prone to aches when the muscles are suddenly asked to do something again, and also there is the psychological aspect of her just not understanding why she should have to go do something when she's feeling a bit achy and used to being a lady of leisure. She probably went along with it the first few times because hey, why wouldn't she, and then as she's started to feel it a little bit she's said nah. And saying no thank you has been quite effective because she's gone back to her field and she may even think that this is what she was supposed to do.

If you really want to try working her again you need to get her a full mot and then condition her body and brain gradually again to build her up, making sure you are always setting yourselves up to succeed. And be mindful of the fact that it will take an old horse much longer to build up muscle fitness than a youngster.
		
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Dabdab, and Leo walker, thank you that is definately helpful. Makes perfect sense. I will have her thoroughly checked and be as slow as she needs


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## Kirstyx1 (13 August 2019)

EllenJay said:



			To be fair - you were the first person who started an argument by calling a well respected and knowledgeable member of the forum a "troll" - and no-one has ganged up on you until this point.
Everyone has said that you need a vet check, and to bring her back slowly. What more advice do you want?
		
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Have to you read amymays first and second reply? Not one peice of advice, simply abrupt and negative.


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## Pearlsasinger (13 August 2019)

Kirstyx1 said:



			Ok well, my lesson has been learned.. don't ask for help from anyone other than a vet. Example- " your horse is telling you to eff off" is that helpful or constructive? I don't think it is at all unkind if started very slowly, and if she is sound all round but I guess this is why I shouldn't ask for opinions from anyone other than professionals. What is unkind is how I have received a onslaught from members grouped together as a pack of bullies do. I wouldn't dream of riding her if I am told by the VET not to. She has been handled, loved and cared for 15 years but as I battled cancer I stopped riding. It was my passion and she was the best horse Iv ever ridden so apologies for wanting that back again.
		
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I understand that you won't know this but you have actually been given advice by some extremely experienced professionals, *on this thread*.


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## Amymay (13 August 2019)

I thought saying â€˜Let her enjoy her retirementâ€™ was pretty constructive ðŸ¤”ðŸ˜ðŸ¤¨ðŸ˜‰

Maybe itâ€™s just me ðŸ¤·â€â™‚ï¸


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## Kirstyx1 (13 August 2019)

Pearlsasinger said:



			I understand that you won't know this but you have actually been given advice by some extremely experienced professionals, *on this thread*.
		
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It's the way it was worded. There are ways of doing things and I don't see where amymays "advice" came in?


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## EllenJay (13 August 2019)

Kirstyx1 said:



			Have to you read amymays first and second reply? Not one peice of advice, simply abrupt and negative.
		
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Yes  I did. And from the information you gave the answer was perfectly reasonable.


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## Kirstyx1 (13 August 2019)

EllenJay said:



			Yes  I did. And from the information you gave the answer was perfectly reasonable.
		
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I think you will find dabdab and Leo walkers advice would constitute advice..helpful and NOT a mindless power trip..bye now


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## Pearlsasinger (13 August 2019)

Kirstyx1 said:



			It's the way it was worded. There are ways of doing things and I don't see where amymays "advice" came in?
		
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Amymay wasn't one of the pro's that I meant, I was thinking especially of Auslander and Cortez, who both gave similar advice.


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## EllenJay (13 August 2019)

Kirstyx1 said:



			I think you will find dabdab and Leo walkers advice would constitute advice..helpful and NOT a mindless power trip..bye now
		
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I am guessing that you no longer want me to comment on your post. To bring my replies down to your level, all I am going to say is that the troll spray isn't working.
Happy now?


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## southerncomfort (14 August 2019)

Can I ask what happened when she was 5 years old to make you stop riding her?


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## Kirstyx1 (14 August 2019)

southerncomfort said:



			Can I ask what happened when she was 5 years old to make you stop riding her?
		
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She was about 7, dates are approximate, I fell ill, which gradually took over everything and over the years just lost my nerve really.


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## hopscotch bandit (14 August 2019)

Kirstyx1 said:



			Dabdab, and Leo walker, thank you that is definately helpful. Makes perfect sense. I will have her thoroughly checked and be as slow as she needs
		
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I am really confused reading this thread.  Why do you keep responding to Leo Walker when Leo Walker hasn't responded to you on this thread??? Is LW AM or am I missing something?


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## Kirstyx1 (14 August 2019)

hopscotch bandit said:



			I am really confused reading this thread.  Why do you keep responding to Leo Walker when Leo Walker hasn't responded to you on this thread??? Is LW AM or am I missing something?
		
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They did, half the posts are missing. God knows


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## Leo Walker (14 August 2019)

your missing something...


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## The Trooper (14 August 2019)

hopscotch bandit said:



			I am really confused reading this thread.  Why do you keep responding to Leo Walker when Leo Walker hasn't responded to you on this thread??? Is LW AM or am I missing something?
		
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Leo Walker said:



			They can but not always. If you really want to ride this horse you need a proper MOT doing. Back, teeth, saddle, vet check and then get a good instructor involved. Start with ground work and very, very, very, very slowly build up to riding. At 20 with 15yrs off your looking at it taking 3 to 4 months before shes hacking steadily in walk with short bursts of trot, for up to an hour total max.
		
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## ester (14 August 2019)

hopscotch bandit said:



			I am really confused reading this thread.  Why do you keep responding to Leo Walker when Leo Walker hasn't responded to you on this thread??? Is LW AM or am I missing something?
		
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I'd suspect you have LW on ignore?!


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## Auslander (14 August 2019)

ester said:



			I'd suspect you have LW on ignore?!
		
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Isn't it the case that if you have someone on UI, you can still see that they've posted, just not what they've said. Or have things changed since the last forum renovation?


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## ester (14 August 2019)

It used to be that, now I think you don't see them at all since the move so it doesn't give you the option to uncover you used to have like the old one. Would you like to be a test subject?

I tested on you anyway, and nope it does show me, I'm sure it didn't with someone else. hmmm


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## Pinkvboots (14 August 2019)

I would have a vet check her over and 15 years is a long time especially as she was 5 when you stopped riding her, she essentially has only been ridden for 2 years maximum in her whole life, I find it quite a big ask to expect the horse to be happy with it in these circumstances, personally I think I would leave her to be a retired horse and maybe think about getting another horse to ride.


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## Auslander (14 August 2019)

ester said:



			It used to be that, now I think you don't see them at all since the move so it doesn't give you the option to uncover you used to have like the old one. Would you like to be a test subject?

I tested on you anyway, and nope it does show me, I'm sure it didn't with someone else. hmmm
		
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I just ignored you, and you disappeared completely! Far better set up than previously!


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## JanetGeorge (14 August 2019)

Have come into this rather late - but never mind - I hope I've missed the arguments.  Kirsty, TBH I would think you'd do better with a good equine physio and a good EDT (and a saddle fitter if you're out of practice.)  And then work on the basis of LESS than 5 minutes of walking for the first week (but only hop off if she's walking nicely.)  Then slowly build up to 10 minutes a day, then 15.  It should take 6-8 weeks to work up to walking only for 45 minutes before you ask her to trot.  It's been a few years since I backed an oldie (and she was a 10 year old who'd had 6 foals - so the weight was in a totally different place.)  And she was easy to back - but we literally got on her and off her twice a day for the first few days, then walk 20 yards, then 40 yards.  It took 6 moths to get her fit enough to do the necessary for a 5 stage vetting.  I DID get my 17yo WB back into work after 2 years off - and 5 minutes of walk proved my hips couldn't cope, lol.  So I know how your old girl was feeling.  Get the checks done - and then go SO slow you think you're comatose.


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## Leo Walker (14 August 2019)

Auslander said:



			I just ignored you, and you disappeared completely! Far better set up than previously!
		
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ooh if thats how it works now theres a few people going on UI including Applecart/HB as it happens ðŸ˜‚ðŸ˜‚


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## LaurenBay (14 August 2019)

Pinkvboots said:



			I would have a vet check her over and 15 years is a long time especially as she was 5 when you stopped riding her, she essentially has only been ridden for 2 years maximum in her whole life, I find it quite a big ask to expect the horse to be happy with it in these circumstances, personally I think I would leave her to be a retired horse and maybe think about getting another horse to ride.
		
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This ^^^^

The Horse is probably quite confused and would essentially need re backing all over again. 15 years is a hell of a long time for a Horse. Someone sitting on its back will be a thing of the past by now. 

If you are really serious about getting this Horse back in work then please do a full MOT, This would include, vet, saddle, teeth and pysio. And if she gets the go ahead Then I'd get someone to help you on the ground, start from the basics and take it slow. Lunging and long reining are your friend. I doubt her napiness is naughtiness and I'd put money on being in pain or confusion and lack of confidence from having such a long break.

If she still says no, then I'd retire her and let her live a long and happy live in the field. You must appreciate that what you are asking is a big ask of a Horse.


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## hopscotch bandit (14 August 2019)

ester said:



			I'd suspect you have LW on ignore?!
		
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Yes i do! I've never put anyone on ui  before to so i didn't know what happens. I thought the world was going mad! Lol


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## Upthecreek (14 August 2019)

I donâ€™t mean to be rude but I have to say that I am quite shocked that anyone would consider bringing a 20 year old horse back into work after 15 years of not being ridden. It is sad that your health has prevented you from riding her for 15 years, but you canâ€™t make up for lost time now and you are foolish to try. I think you are very lucky she didnâ€™t try to get you off the second you got on. Her best ridden years are long behind her and Iâ€™d imagine she is very confused. Iâ€™m sorry this is not what you wanted to hear, but itâ€™s best not to ask the question if you canâ€™t deal with people giving an honest answer.


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## Bellaboo18 (14 August 2019)

When did she start her ridden career? She can't have done much before turning 5? As others have said she needs rebacking and (sorry but) by a professional. It's a bit like riding a bike but 15 years is a long long time so you'll have lost muscle and confidence. 
Personally I'd leave her in retirement.


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## tabithakat64 (15 August 2019)

As others have said, she needs, back, teeth, saddle all checked by professionals then restarting by a professional too if their is nothing physically is amiss.

In the meantime I'd recommend you ride yourself to build up your muscle and confidence.  

Expecting to simply be able to hop back on to a horse that's had a 15 year break with no issues at all is unrealistic in my opinion.


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## SEL (15 August 2019)

I'm bringing one back into work after just 8 months off and that's not easy - she's as green as most people's 5yo given how much sick leave she's had over the past 3 years and very much felt like it this morning.

I'm not convinced bringing a horse that was last ridden 15 years ago into work is a good idea.


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