# Anyone keep non-free range cats?



## BBP (18 March 2015)

I've just moved house to a gorgeous little terraced cottage with a lovely garden. Its lacking in small furry friends (my cat has stayed at my sisters where I was living before) and a house without a cat doesn't feel right. However it fronts on to a straight 40mph rat run road and I know the previous owners lost 2 cats in 2 years on the road. I don't use the front door but even going out of the back one they could dash straight down the driveway and onto the road.

I have always had 'free range' cats growing up but at this house I'm not sure they would last long. So im thinking of building a 'catio' (enclosing the patio by the back door with a mesh and wood structure, shelves and plants for them to lounge on, get some fresh air and sunshine). Then as we get time/money in the summer I thought I could construct an enclosed aerial walkway up and over the parking and sheds and into another bigger pen in the garden.

I don't want to compromise the welfare of a cat if this arrangement won't provide them with sufficient freedom, what do you think?

I'm also concerned that rescues won't rehome if the cats don't have freedom to roam where they want, but I don't want to give money to an unscrupulous breeder looking for kittens on the Internet so I'm not sure how to find my new friends. Would I be better going for kittens who don't know any better? Would grown up cats who have had full freedom find this set up frustrating do you think? I would like two so that they have company when I'm out.


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## shadeofshyness (18 March 2015)

I've seen rescues advertising cats that have to be indoor-only for medical reasons so you might be able to offer the perfect home for one of those little chaps.


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## ILuvCowparsely (18 March 2015)

KatPT said:



			I'm also concerned that rescues won't rehome if the cats don't have freedom to roam where they want.
		
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You can give an indoor cat a home, as they are not allowed to roam free, for this certain rescues will re-home to an indoor home only.
cross post with above


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## webble (18 March 2015)

Oh yes the rescue I volunteer for are always looking for homes for indoors cats


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## sarahandwilby (18 March 2015)

Indoor/house cats are getting far more popular now, especially with the fancy breeds, and most of them don't get access to a 'catio' (love that word, never heard of it before!). I'm sure you'd be fine rehoming a rescue


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## HashRouge (18 March 2015)

I think a catio is a great idea, and there are lots of cats who can't go outside for medical reasons if you want to adopt one rather than buy one. My next door neighbour used to work for the CPL and she fostered kittens and helped to rehome them, and when I was about 16 she had a family of 3 white kittens to rehome, 2 of whom were deaf. They needed an indoor only home as obviously being deaf would make them less safe in traffic etc and I know they went to a woman locally who wanted indoor cats. We took the one kitten that could hear as we already have a free range cat, so couldn't have indoor cats too. And I used to live in Spain and was involved with an animal sanctuary that took in a lot of cats with the feline leukemia virus and they aren't allowed outside either as they can pass it to other cats or pick up lots of other infections very easily. But they can live long lives and they are harder to rehome so it's very worthwhile to give one a home. I had one for a bit, called George, he was lovely .


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## BBP (18 March 2015)

Ah, I hadn't thought of FIV or deaf cats, I just keep seeing the rescues saying must have access to garden and no main roads. Finding a pair might be tricky but I'm sure there are a couple of fuzzies out there who would love a home like mine!


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## Gleeful Imp (18 March 2015)

My 3 rescues are currently house cats, and are very happy healthy cats. When I move, I will be cat-fencing them in so they have their own garden catio!!!!


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## HashRouge (18 March 2015)

KatPT said:



			Ah, I hadn't thought of FIV or deaf cats, I just keep seeing the rescues saying must have access to garden and no main roads. Finding a pair might be tricky but I'm sure there are a couple of fuzzies out there who would love a home like mine!
		
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I think so, especially if you're building a catio! That might suit healthy but less adventurous cats. One of our two would probably love a catio, she only goes as far as our garden anyway!

NB FIV and FeLV are different things, but both would suit your circumstances I'd think. I had a friend with an FIV cat that lived to a ripe old age, although they did let it outside. I think the jury is out on whether they should be allowed out or not, I've heard conflicting reports. FeLV is more serious and the cats would probably have a shorter lifespan, and they definitely shouldn't be allowed outside unless it's in a secure run.


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## ClobellsandBaubles (18 March 2015)

I find the idea of a purely house cat a little uncomfortable but only as the only experience I have of it is students in tiny apartments with one or two cats who get very little entertainment and are clearly bored/stressed and behaving like mad cats and peeing everywhere etc. 

But that, I feel, is entirely different as you clearly have a good plan with regards to stimulation, relaxation etc. I think a catio, house and/or walkway sounds great and any rescue would be biting your hand off for such a safe environment.

My cat pretty much confines himself to the patio (and underneath it) in winter as he is very sensitive to the cold before Missycat turend up he rarely went outside as he was frightened of the neighbours kittens but now he has a body gurad so he is safe  (He's a bit special).


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## ILuvCowparsely (18 March 2015)

KatPT said:



			Ah, I hadn't thought of FIV or deaf cats, I just keep seeing the rescues saying must have access to garden and no main roads. Finding a pair might be tricky but I'm sure there are a couple of fuzzies out there who would love a home like mine!
		
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I am a foster for the CP, fiv cats are in high demand in london, one of mine had been in my pens 3 months, so I drove to A12 and met someone from the North London branch and handed him over with all his paper work, within 2 weeks I phoned and asked how he was and the girl said oh he has been re-homed a week ago.

CP never put them down and they can lead a normal stretch of life even making to their teens


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## webble (18 March 2015)

All three cats have access to outside and we have a cat flap that tells you where they are and how long they have been in/out. One of them hasn't been out since the flap was installed three weeks ago!


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## joelb (18 March 2015)

Mine are confined to barracks as I live on an A road and letting them out would be wicked. I have pedigrees for that reason and what they've never had they don't miss.  I would never keep one confined that had previously had freedom.  If you're not fussed about getting a kitten there are always retired breeding cats available from ethical breeders. Being indoor or penned would be normal for them and a good breeder would let you have one for the cost of spaying.


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## BBP (18 March 2015)

Thanks for all the advice and input. (My other half is using a week of his annual leave building the catio next week, bless him for tolerating my ideas!)
(Joelb the dogs in your picture are stunning!)


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## chestnut cob (19 March 2015)

We have one who is mainly indoor.  Before my BF moved into my house she lived in his flat (his cat) which I didn't like at all, but she didn't know any different.  He used to bring her here for the weekend and she'd go out in the garden.  TBH that actually made her worse in the flat when they went home.  Now they both live here, she is an indoor cat in the main but goes outside during the day when we are at home.  The garden is cat proof as I had problems with neighbours cats coming in and making a mess, so she can't get out.  TBH she isn't particularly fussed about getting out of the garden.  She can come and go as she pleases when we are in - she'll usually spend a couple of hours out in the morning, come in at lunch, go back out in the afternoon for a bit then is always in by about 3pm, fast asleep on the bed.  If we've both been out all day and she doesn't get to go out she can go a bit crazy so we play with her a lot in the evening to use up her excess energy.

I don't think they miss what they've never had.  I don't have a problem with a cat living inside if the space is big enough and they have enough stimulation.


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## Embo (19 March 2015)

We have 2 rescues, indoor only. We live in a one bedroom, 2nd floor flat and they are happy cats! 

We're moving to a 3 bed house in about 2 months, they will have loads more room. House has a garden, so we're deciding whether we're going to start letting them out.

I'm reluctant as they are both fully black, and the reason they were rehomed to us as indoor-only is because they've never been out in their lives. We're getting pressure from some (mainly the in-laws) that we'd be cruel not to let them out, but they don't know any different and I don't want my kitties getting squashed!

I like the catio idea (and the walkways) , I will put it forward to the OH. 

Good luck with the build and getting some kitties!


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## Spreebok (19 March 2015)

Embo said:



			I'm reluctant as they are both fully black, and the reason they were rehomed to us as indoor-only is because they've never been out in their lives. We're getting pressure from some (mainly the in-laws) that we'd be cruel not to let them out, but they don't know any different and I don't want my kitties getting squashed!
QUOTE]

They're your pets, don't let people pressure you into letting them out if you're not comfortable. They've never experienced it and consequently don't miss it. not to mention they won't have the street smarts!
		
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## joelb (19 March 2015)

KatPT said:



			(Joelb the dogs in your picture are stunning!)
		
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Thank you  most of them have their angel wings now but I have treasured memories.

Would love to see pics of your catio and occupants when project kitty is complete.


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## hackneylass2 (20 March 2015)

Letting cats roam is a pet hate of mine.  I am firmly of the opinion that if cats have enough stimulation, ideally provided by another cat, plus an owner who will interact with them, cats are fine living indoors.  We don't let our dogs roam do we?, however much fun they might have being out to explore on their own,  so why are cats any different?
I used to breed and show Birmans as a hobby, one queen who had 1 litter every 18 months so I was responsible. I gave up after three years because two people who had bought a kitten rang me to ask if I had another as they had lost their cat to the road.  I advertised my kittens to indoor only homes as most responsible breeders do, obviously this was ignored and it upset me greatly that the kittens I had seen born and I had cared for for 14 weeks had been needlessly lost.  It wasn't that the cats were 'valuable' in monetary terms, because they were pedigree, it was that they had value as living creatures. I will say that I also fostered for the CPL and had rescued moggies of my own, so I certainly did not view cats as a commodity!
Three cat-specialist vets with an great interest in feline behaviour also told me that cats are brilliant at adapting, and will be happy, given company of their own kind and owners who take time to interact with them, being indoor only, even if they are an ex street moggy.

I  have always kept my cats, pedigrees and rescued moggies, indoors. They are all 'worth' exactly the same to me.  At my last house I bought a small garden shed and built  an aviary type run to it with logs and shelves for the cats to go in when I was at work when the weather was not terrible!  I'm in a rented house now so that's a no-go, so my cats go in the garden to explore in a 'walking jacket' which they all soon got used to.

I'm sure you will find a way to have happy indoor and restricted outdoor catties, its not all that long ago that 'putting the cat out for the night' was considered the norm, its old outdated views that still persist that cats have to have the freedom to roam, and its sad that some owners will consider the fact that their free roaming cat may some day be killed or worse, badly injured and undiscovered, but still let their cats out. Maybe because when accidents like this happen, the owner is not likely to be there to witness the pain and suffering.  If you love your cats, keep them safe, IMO its your duty as a responisble owner.   Don't be swayed by anyone saying that keeping cats indoors is cruel, letting any creature with little or no road sense out is cruel.  

Your Catio idea is the way forward, I'm sure that your cats will have the life of Riley!


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## lastchancer (20 March 2015)

hackneylass2 said:



			Letting cats roam is a pet hate of mine.  I am firmly of the opinion that if cats have enough stimulation, ideally provided by another cat, plus an owner who will interact with them, cats are fine living indoors.  We don't let our dogs roam do we?, however much fun they might have being out to explore on their own,  so why are cats any different?
I used to breed and show Birmans as a hobby, one queen who had 1 litter every 18 months so I was responsible. I gave up after three years because two people who had bought a kitten rang me to ask if I had another as they had lost their cat to the road.  I advertised my kittens to indoor only homes as most responsible breeders do, obviously this was ignored and it upset me greatly that the kittens I had seen born and I had cared for for 14 weeks had been needlessly lost.  It wasn't that the cats were 'valuable' in monetary terms, because they were pedigree, it was that they had value as living creatures. I will say that I also fostered for the CPL and had rescued moggies of my own, so I certainly did not view cats as a commodity!
Three cat-specialist vets with an great interest in feline behaviour also told me that cats are brilliant at adapting, and will be happy, given company of their own kind and owners who take time to interact with them, being indoor only, even if they are an ex street moggy.

I  have always kept my cats, pedigrees and rescued moggies, indoors. They are all 'worth' exactly the same to me.  At my last house I bought a small garden shed and built  an aviary type run to it with logs and shelves for the cats to go in when I was at work when the weather was not terrible!  I'm in a rented house now so that's a no-go, so my cats go in the garden to explore in a 'walking jacket' which they all soon got used to.

I'm sure you will find a way to have happy indoor and restricted outdoor catties, its not all that long ago that 'putting the cat out for the night' was considered the norm, its old outdated views that still persist that cats have to have the freedom to roam, and its sad that some owners will consider the fact that their free roaming cat may some day be killed or worse, badly injured and undiscovered, but still let their cats out. Maybe because when accidents like this happen, the owner is not likely to be there to witness the pain and suffering.  If you love your cats, keep them safe, IMO its your duty as a responisble owner.   Don't be swayed by anyone saying that keeping cats indoors is cruel, letting any creature with little or no road sense out is cruel.  

Your Catio idea is the way forward, I'm sure that your cats will have the life of Riley!
		
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What a judgmental post. What about farm cats or those living in the countryside? I really don't like the idea of cats being shut in except for medical issues, dogs are very different and are (should be) walked and exercised. Keeping a cat in a small town house is the equivalent of a dog on a chain 24/7 imo, although letting a cat roam near a busy road is irresponsible and asking for heartbreak.  The op's catio does sound like a good compromise though, and an elderly or ill rescue cat would no doubt benefit greatly.


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## BBP (20 March 2015)

Thank you. Hopefully this will be the best of both worlds then, especially if I can get the walkway to the back garden done. I'm hoping it will reduce the threat to the local bird population too!


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## chestnut cob (20 March 2015)

KatPT said:



			Thank you. Hopefully this will be the best of both worlds then, especially if I can get the walkway to the back garden done. I'm hoping it will reduce the threat to the local bird population too!
		
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TBF your cat could turn out to be as rubbish at catching stuff as ours is!  The birds in our garden openly mock the cat as she is utterly rubbish at both climbing and catching birds.


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## Serianas (20 March 2015)

We had a purely indoor FIV boy who was pts about a month ago  my advice would be get the indoor cat food because of the weight issue but he was happy as larry inside  he had been born a feral, rescued, beaten, homeless again, rescued, then he came to us when he had his forever home.  he never pined to go out or even got brave enough to venture outside, which is odd because he was friendly and confident inside


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## EmmaC78 (20 March 2015)

I have two cats and both have the option of going out whenever they want.  One goes out all the time and the other is perfectly happy as a house cat.  It has been a good few months since I remember him wanting to go outside and even then he just walked from the back door to the front door and came back inside.


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## Meowy Catkin (21 March 2015)

lastchancer said:



			What a judgmental post. What about farm cats or those living in the countryside?
		
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I agree. I really take offence at HL2's insinuations that all cat owners who let their cats outside don't value their cats as living creatures and aren't responsible owners. 

Sorry OP for going off on a tangent. Your idea seems like a fab one to me given the fast road outside your cottage.


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## madmav (21 March 2015)

Two cats, sisters, at stables, brought in to catch mice. One loves the outdoor life and does her job perfectly. The other stuck her paws up at it all and moved straight into the house. She never ventures further than the porch. They are definitely individuals.


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## flirtygerty (21 March 2015)

Love your idea of a catio, cats by nature roam their territory of up to 5 miles a night ( I think the distance is right) I bred cats for years, having large outdoor runs with plenty of different height play things, not a natural situation, but the next best thing, my logic being, if an animal is confined 24/7 make it's quarters as big and as interesting as possible, my daughter took on an older rescue cat, stays with me when she's away, he's gone from sitting in the doorway, to stalking birds and coming for a walk with you, never underestimate a cats natural instinct


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## HashRouge (21 March 2015)

Faracat said:



			I agree. I really take offence at HL2's insinuations that all cat owners who let their cats outside don't value their cats as living creatures and aren't responsible owners. 

Sorry OP for going off on a tangent. Your idea seems like a fab one to me given the fast road outside your cottage.
		
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I know, I thought it was a ridiculous post and I was going to write a long, ranty reply but decided not to derail the OP's thread! Mind you, I'd like to see HL2 provide our male cat with enough stimulation to keep him happy as a house cat! This is a cat who, before he was even old enough to go outside, had set the burglar alarm off trying to climb out of a (closed!) window and, when under house arrest after years of going outside, clawed his way out through the locked cat flap, not once but THREE times, even managing to move the obstacles we'd placed in front of it after his first escape. Many cats are happy to live inside, some aren't


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## lastchancer (21 March 2015)

We've always had free ranging cats, the last old girl lived 20 years but mostly just walked from her bed, to the food bowl, to the litter tray and back... only venturing out on our garden and only on the odd (warm) day  Never caught a mouse but did once net a particularly gormless spider. The others went out roaming sometimes for a day or two at a time and all lived to good ages. The road near us is busier now though so we'll most likely face the op's dilemma if we think about getting another.
Good luck with your cat venture OP, I'm sure you'll give him/her/them a fab life


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## BBP (23 March 2015)

Project catio starts this week, I'll keep you all posted!


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## ribbons (24 March 2015)

hackneylass2 said:



			Letting cats roam is a pet hate of mine.  I am firmly of the opinion that if cats have enough stimulation, ideally provided by another cat, plus an owner who will interact with them, cats are fine living indoors.  We don't let our dogs roam do we?, however much fun they might have being out to explore on their own,  so why are cats any different?
I used to breed and show Birmans as a hobby, one queen who had 1 litter every 18 months so I was responsible. I gave up after three years because two people who had bought a kitten rang me to ask if I had another as they had lost their cat to the road.  I advertised my kittens to indoor only homes as most responsible breeders do, obviously this was ignored and it upset me greatly that the kittens I had seen born and I had cared for for 14 weeks had been needlessly lost.  It wasn't that the cats were 'valuable' in monetary terms, because they were pedigree, it was that they had value as living creatures. I will say that I also fostered for the CPL and had rescued moggies of my own, so I certainly did not view cats as a commodity!
Three cat-specialist vets with an great interest in feline behaviour also told me that cats are brilliant at adapting, and will be happy, given company of their own kind and owners who take time to interact with them, being indoor only, even if they are an ex street moggy.

I  have always kept my cats, pedigrees and rescued moggies, indoors. They are all 'worth' exactly the same to me.  At my last house I bought a small garden shed and built  an aviary type run to it with logs and shelves for the cats to go in when I was at work when the weather was not terrible!  I'm in a rented house now so that's a no-go, so my cats go in the garden to explore in a 'walking jacket' which they all soon got used to.

I'm sure you will find a way to have happy indoor and restricted outdoor catties, its not all that long ago that 'putting the cat out for the night' was considered the norm, its old outdated views that still persist that cats have to have the freedom to roam, and its sad that some owners will consider the fact that their free roaming cat may some day be killed or worse, badly injured and undiscovered, but still let their cats out. Maybe because when accidents like this happen, the owner is not likely to be there to witness the pain and suffering.  If you love your cats, keep them safe, IMO its your duty as a responisble owner.   Don't be swayed by anyone saying that keeping cats indoors is cruel, letting any creature with little or no road sense out is cruel.  

Your Catio idea is the way forward, I'm sure that your cats will have the life of Riley!
		
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Oh dear, my pet hate is cat owners like this.
Anyone who thinks cats are no different to dogs is a worry.
One of the saddest things to see is a cat on a lead.
I can only imagine the mental torture to a cat being deprived of the ability to come and go as they please, they are their own master.
Its not a case of able to go outside and get fresh air, its having adventures and hunting.

OP, the set up you plan is certainly better than totally indoors, and I'm sure the cats will be physically healthy and accept the situation, but just maybe, it might be worth waiting to fulfill your need (to have a cat or two) until your in a better position to fulfill theirs. 

I know I'm probably in the minority, but I just think that giving ourselves the pleasure of having a cat without risk by subjecting such an animal to a long life of being captive is actually really wrong. 
I realise many don't see that though, and, as in most things, each to their own.

Just to add, hackneylass says providing plenty of stimulation, ideally by another cat, makes it ok.
Surely anyone who really understands a cats preferred lifestyle, realises cats are actually quite solitary a lot of the time. They may cuddle up together on your sofa for a while, but mostly they're off on their own.
To be permanently enclosed together, unable to get away from each other must be awful.


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## Montyforever (26 March 2015)

Having a cat, who literally could walk out of this house and never return should the mood take her, who has never gone further than the garden gate in 15 years. I think the idea of a catio is ideal! 
We have two yard cats, one we lost and he turned up months later living wild two miles down the road. He was bought back, stayed a week and we haven't seen him since - he had acres, a warm bed, plenty to hunt and food. Yet he gets bored and wanders!
His brother on the otherhand is a total lap cat and has stayed put!


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