# Hat or no hat? That is the question.....



## bahumbug (8 July 2010)

I'd be really interested to hear others' view on this. I'm one of those who has taken a striking about turn since Courtney's accident (although I confess the subject's been nagging at me for a long time) and absolutely don't now get on a horse without a good helmet and chinstrap done up.

That's after years of not wearing more than a baseball cap and donning an old (antique almost) hunting cap when  out on the road just really to shut the drivers up. 

Having caught a dose of common sense after a lot of years, I am astounded at Pammy Hutton's no hat comments (this despite her running a BHS yard). Am I just like those evangelical reformed smokers or have others found it all a bit of a wake-up call?


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## muffinino (8 July 2010)

There is no question.

Hat.


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## spike123 (8 July 2010)

I'm a mum. Going hatless doesn't even come into the equation. As far as I am concerned my kids and my husband don't want to end up looking after me due to my stupidity at the end of the day.


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## Kittykins (8 July 2010)

argh, hat! HAT HAT HAT! 

You may be the best ever rider in the world; accidents can still happen. I really, for the life of me, never ever understand how people can ride without wearing one.


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## dibbin (8 July 2010)

Hat, definitely. Was grateful for it this evening when I decked it and cracked my head off the ground!


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## NeverSayNever (8 July 2010)

hat - no questions.also wear a hat to clip, sheath clean, load etc


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## Prince33Sp4rkle (8 July 2010)

for flatwork, never.

for jumping-on current horse yes, previously, no.

for hacking-always.


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## Kellys Heroes (8 July 2010)

Have been very grateful for it in the past - I seem to have a tendency of smacking my head off the ground if I come off when hacking or schooling! I also try and replace my hat if its had a proper good crack on the ground


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## spaniel (8 July 2010)

Hat always.

The only excuse is arrogance, vanity or stupidity...take your pick.


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## Prince33Sp4rkle (8 July 2010)

its called freedom of choice and being bought up in a different *culture*-i look at hats the way you probably look at body protectors, its for higher risk days only.

unless you have never drunk, smoked, been overweight, exceeded the speed limit and always ride in a body protector, and wear a hat for ALL activites round horses, i dont think you can preach-you make your risk assesment and i make mine. thus far my risk assesment has been accurate, iv never had an *oh***** moment and wished id put a hat on.and iv been riding hatless for over ten years, so either iv got hundreds of lives, or what im doing (flatwork, on a perfect surface, on a quiet yard) is not that high risk.


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## Sarah Sum1 (8 July 2010)

Kittykins said:



			argh, hat! HAT HAT HAT! 

You may be the best ever rider in the world; accidents can still happen. I really, for the life of me, never ever understand how people can ride without wearing one.
		
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Yep definitely this ^^^


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## Kittykins (8 July 2010)

Prince33Sp4rkle said:



			its called freedom of choice and being bought up in a different *culture*-i look at hats the way you probably look at body protectors, its for higher risk days only.

unless you have never drunk, smoked, been overweight, exceeded the speed limit and always ride in a body protector, and wear a hat for ALL activites round horses, i dont think you can preach-you make your risk assesment and i make mine. thus far my risk assesment has been accurate, iv never had an *oh***** moment and wished id put a hat on.and iv been riding hatless for over ten years, so either iv got hundreds of lives, or what im doing (flatwork, on a perfect surface, on a quiet yard) is not that high risk.
		
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I drive most days, enjoy driving, and sometimes push the speed a little. I've never had an accident in 10 years of driving, but I still always wear my seatbelt because you just never know.


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## Prince33Sp4rkle (8 July 2010)

you push the speed limit a little, i ride well schooled,well balanced, none spooky horses on a rubber surface......risk is probably less to me, far more people die in RTA each year than falling off horses.


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## bahumbug (8 July 2010)

Prince33Sp4rkle said:



			you push the speed limit a little, i ride well schooled,well balanced, none spooky horses on a rubber surface......risk is probably less to me, far more people die in RTA each year than falling off horses.
		
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Well this is the interesting point, why I posed the question. I thought that although my riding life is a bit more varied, have to say, but now, I won't take the risk. Or, more to the point, wont take it on behalf of my nearest and dearest who'd have to bear the brunt. Freak accidents are what does it. No surface will protect you. And with driving, it's the other guy that causes the accident if you're driving safely, too frequently.

Still can't rule out the idea of taking up side-saddle hunting in full rig and veil at the age of 90 though!


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## Sarah Sum1 (8 July 2010)

I just think that with most sports,there is an element of risk. BUT most other sports will use whatever protective equipment that they need in order to remain the safest as possible. For riders this is a hat. A well schooled horse can freak out if say a low helicopter or balloon were to fly past or whatever, animals are unpredictable and you can never say never.

But each to their own, just hope it doesn't take a serious accident for them to realise.


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## Chestnuttymare (8 July 2010)

I would love not to wear a hat on warm days and not have hat hair, but it's just not worth the risk. I have a family and I owe it to them to minimize the risk. I trust my horse and she is well behaved....mostly. it just takes one bit of bad luck to end up with a fractured skull.


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## Thelwell_Girl (8 July 2010)

spaniel said:



			Hat always.

The only excuse is arrogance, vanity or stupidity...take your pick.
		
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				Kittykins said:
			
		


			argh, hat! HAT HAT HAT! 

You may be the best ever rider in the world; accidents can still happen. I really, for the life of me, never ever understand how people can ride without wearing one
		
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.



bahumbug said:



			...I won't take the risk. Or, more to the point, wont take it on behalf of my nearest and dearest who'd have to bear the brunt. Freak accidents are what does it. No surface will protect you. And with driving, it's the other guy that causes the accident if you're driving safely, too frequently.
		
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^^^These!

Hats are for EVERY ride, EVERY time. For me there is NO question.


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## timefort (8 July 2010)

It used to be lovely to canter across a field, hair blowing in the wind, the feeling of freedom was fantastic and there's no sweaty head at the end of a ride.  

Then I grew up.  

Now I'm a neuroscientist - not only do I see pictures of brains damaged in any manner of different ways by relatively minor bumps on the head but I see the heartbreak and upset it causes family/relations/loved ones.  A sweaty head is a small price to pay for protecting what is your most vital organ.  No brain, no you. 

Sorry, didn't mean to rant - just a bit passionate about this one
x


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## Onyxia (8 July 2010)

spike123 said:



			I'm a mum. Going hatless doesn't even come into the equation. As far as I am concerned my kids and my husband don't want to end up looking after me due to my stupidity at the end of the day.
		
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This.
I am "happy to admit to being less strict about it when younger,but the mere thougth of my OH having to explain to our son why mummy is not there *shudder*

Hats are not that expensive,hat hair is not that bad,if you get headaches the fit is wrong and your life is far too precious to take risks you don't need to.


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## TinselRider (8 July 2010)

Personal choice at the end of the day.

I always wear a hat and feel it selfish not to.


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## Kittykins (8 July 2010)

Prince33Sp4rkle said:



			you push the speed limit a little, i ride well schooled,well balanced, none spooky horses on a rubber surface......risk is probably less to me, far more people die in RTA each year than falling off horses.
		
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my point was actually that wearing a seatbelt minimises the inherent risk in driving, just as wearing a hat minimises the inherent risk in riding. 

More people die in traffic accidents each year than falling off horses because more people drive than ride.


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## numptynoelle (8 July 2010)

I always ride with a hat, but my friend never did...until her boyfriend changed her mind with a brutal little speech..

He said: "It's your choice whether you wear one or not. If you fall off and kill yourself then so be it, but I won't be the one wiping drool off your chin or sh!te off your legs if you fall off and end up a vegetable"

She hasn't gone without one since (even though the boyfriend is long gone).


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## bahumbug (8 July 2010)

timefort said:



			It used to be lovely to canter across a field, hair blowing in the wind, the feeling of freedom was fantastic and there's no sweaty head at the end of a ride.  

Then I grew up.  

Now I'm a neuroscientist - not only do I see pictures of brains damaged in any manner of different ways by relatively minor bumps on the head but I see the heartbreak and upset it causes family/relations/loved ones.  A sweaty head is a small price to pay for protecting what is your most vital organ.  No brain, no you. 

Sorry, didn't mean to rant - just a bit passionate about this one
x
		
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I think you've just captured my admittedly non-scientific view in a trice! I was really impressed that the Us/Canadian riders began to don helmets at dressage shows after Courtney's accident. She's making progress slowly but wow, if only. I agree the freedom of the wind blowing in your hair is a small price to pay. Speaking to freinds a few of us get comments but heh, as you say......


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## sakura (8 July 2010)

personally I always wear my hat when riding


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## spacefaer (8 July 2010)

Part of being a human being is having free will and the freedom to make life decisions.

I school wearing a crash hat, chinstrap done up, on some horses
I school, with a baseball cap on, on some horses.
I hunt in my Patey

I have ridden all types of horses - from showjumpers & polo ponies to bull fighting horses - in many countries all over the world.

My OH has ridden pointers and hunters in a flat cap for most of his life.  
While we both hack on the roads in crash hats, he hunts in either a Patey or a silk hat.

I make my own judgement and it is MY judgement.

I WILL NOT BE PREACHED TO - it is my choice. 

I hear and understand everything that the pro-hat wearers say - that's their choice.



PS you would have to pay me to wear hi-viz too


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## Thelwell_Girl (8 July 2010)

spacefaer said:



			...I WILL NOT BE PREACHED TO...
		
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Don't listen to the preachers then


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## miss_bird (8 July 2010)

I am a complete convert to always hat and body protector each time i get on a horse, and if on the roads hi-viz as well
Yes i miss the wind and my hair and no sweaty itchy scalp but ho hum i also would like to live longer and if a hat and body protector go some way to helping that happen so be it


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## Sanolly (8 July 2010)

If I'm on the mare then yes without a question as she is unpredictable!
I usually wear one 95% of the time on the cobblet but if I am just giving him 20 mins exercise and it's baking hot then I won't. I always wear it for jumping/hacking (I wear Hi-Viz too, but then I used to ride down a very busy main road! :O


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## BritishGroom (8 July 2010)

As much as everyone argues the fact of you wear a hat.. has anyone ever weighed up the facts and virtues of not wearing a hat?
I personally am one who never wears a riding hat unless i have to. I will agree with the majority saying its stupidity, ignorance etc, but i am a natural risk taker. i am one to chance. there's many saying's i could back this up with, including i would rather live regretting i didn't wear one than regretting not trying without. I have fallen off without one many times. Chance, luck, and fate is all you need. i always say if you say you're gonna break your neck, you're gonna. if you say to yourself out loud, i'll be perfectly fine, then you will be perfectly fine.


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## bahumbug (8 July 2010)

spacefaer said:



			I WILL NOT BE PREACHED TO - it is my choice.
		
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Oh please don't shout, no one is preaching at you here, it is a discussion. Thanks.


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## cloudandmatrix (8 July 2010)

BritishGroom said:



			As much as everyone argues the fact of you wear a hat.. has anyone ever weighed up the facts and virtues of not wearing a hat?
I personally am one who never wears a riding hat unless i have to. I will agree with the majority saying its stupidity, ignorance etc, but i am a natural risk taker. i am one to chance. there's many saying's i could back this up with, including i would rather live regretting i didn't wear one than regretting not trying without. I have fallen off without one many times. Chance, luck, and fate is all you need. i always say if you say you're gonna break your neck, you're gonna. if you say to yourself out loud, i'll be perfectly fine, then you will be perfectly fine.
		
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wow. i havnt heard this much **** since cloud decided to **** in the new lorry. but eAch to there own eh


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## Jake10 (9 July 2010)

Hat I don't care if I look silly but I do confess that I don't wear a body protector (I do own one) and haven't for the last 16 years mainly because it feels restricting and uncomfortable (it is properly fitted I just don't like the feel of it)


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## Laur (9 July 2010)

Prince33Sp4rkle said:



			you push the speed limit a little, i ride well schooled,well balanced, none spooky horses on a rubber surface......risk is probably less to me, far more people die in RTA each year than falling off horses.
		
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So why are you wearing a hat in both the pictures in your signature then if you say you never wear them for flat work?  Unless you jump in a dressage saddle or thats not you...


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## 1life (9 July 2010)

[

unless you have never drunk, smoked, been overweight, exceeded the speed limit and always ride in a body protector, and wear a hat for ALL activites round horses, i dont think you can preach-you make your risk assesment and i make mine. thus far my risk assesment has been accurate, iv never had an *oh***** moment and wished id put a hat on.and iv been riding hatless for over ten years, so either iv got hundreds of lives, or what im doing (flatwork, on a perfect surface, on a quiet yard) is not that high risk.[/QUOTE]

But if you did drink or smoke etc most days then you would be putting your health at risk.
So yes, it is personal choice, but it is a risk you are choosing to take each time. As such, with any risk, everyone hopes it will not become the reality. 

Personally, I wear a hat every time and would advise anyone else to. I won't let my 10 year old daughter ride without one, so I have to follow my own advise.


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## the watcher (9 July 2010)

I have ridden hatless, and may well do so again in the future in some circumstances (and I would consider wearing a hat without strap to be effecively hatless)

Most of the time I wear a hat to ride, handling most horses, etc because my yard requires me to do so.


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## ISHmad (9 July 2010)

I wear a hat every time I ride and for when doing groundwork with our youngster.  Love my life, my family, my horses, my friends and want to do all I can to remain on this earth with them for as long as possible.  If I got killed through something as stupid as not wearing a riding hat that would be so hard for my loved ones to take.


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## Prince33Sp4rkle (9 July 2010)

"So why are you wearing a hat in both the pictures in your signature then if you say you never wear them for flat work? Unless you jump in a dressage saddle or thats not you... "

errr, because one is from the warm up at a show, and the other is during a lesson at a yard that requires hats to be worn. at home, and at the other trainers yard i dont wear one.your point is???!!!!


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## BritishGroom (9 July 2010)

cloudandmatrix said:



			wow. i havnt heard this much **** since cloud decided to **** in the new lorry. but eAch to there own eh 

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care to have an effective imput?


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## spacefaer (9 July 2010)

bahumbug said:



			Oh please don't shout, no one is preaching at you here, it is a discussion. Thanks.
		
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It's not a discussion actually.  

It comes across as a lot of self righteous people glorying in how sensible and responsible they are and taking delight in patronising those people who chose, as adults, to do things differently.

The same attitude is evinced when any discussion of hi-viz clothing or back protectors comes up, or indeed when anything other than the "norm" of the majority is shown.

As I said, I choose which horses I ride hatless, I choose the situations in which I do it.  End of.


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## Lanky Loll (9 July 2010)

Hat - my head feels too light without it 
Although my brother doesn't always - despite having been diagnosed as having a thin skull when he was younger (he'd get concussed if you rapped him on the head with your knuckles let alone fell off his pony and wasn't allowed to play rugby at school as he was too much of an injury risk ).  And he always gets grief from me when he leaves it off.
Also - one of the most dramatic bits of video we have of me back in the day, was riding a friends pony (she was off with a broken leg, done tripping over a bit of string ).  He was being a little git in the ring at Harwood Hall (don't know if the venue still exists ??) flybucking and napping.  He flybucked headbutted the H-iron pillar, my head hit the pillar and it pushed me back on  Yes it was a competition and I was wearing a hat anyway so I was alright but if I hadn't been then I dread to think what would have happened.


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## Cavblacks (9 July 2010)

Hat.

Always.

In Tuscany last year my ex and I went for a hack over the mountains, the guy that ran the yard threw me on a 14hh gorgeous American Pony and signaled for us to follow.

I sat there going "Im missing something" but couldnt for the life of me think what until we got off the yard and i scratched my head. head? head - hair? HAT?!?! ARGH

Ex was like "who cares we're on holiday" I was like "exactly, I dont know this horse and oh look main road ahead!!"

Guy wouldnt turn round as he said he didnt have one to give me, but didnt go above trot the whole ride and it lost some of the enjoyment for me as with a hat on I would have been so much more relaxed.


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## Thelwell_Girl (9 July 2010)

BritishGroom said:



			As much as everyone argues the fact of you wear a hat.. has anyone ever weighed up the facts and virtues of not wearing a hat?
I personally am one who never wears a riding hat unless i have to. I will agree with the majority saying its stupidity, ignorance etc, but i am a natural risk taker. i am one to chance. there's many saying's i could back this up with, including i would rather live regretting i didn't wear one than regretting not trying without. I have fallen off without one many times. Chance, luck, and fate is all you need. i always say if you say you're gonna break your neck, you're gonna. if you say to yourself out loud, i'll be perfectly fine, then you will be perfectly fine.
		
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Biggest load of crapola I've ever heard!


Cavblacks - You're made of sterner stuff than me! I still shiver whenever I think about the one time I 'rode' without a hat. I was trying out vaulting, was wearing jeggings and dolly shoes, and got lifted onto a 17hh+ Percheron. Yes there was an experienced girl to hold me on. Heck, the horse didnt move above a very ploddy walk. There was seemingly no way on earth I could fall off... Yet, I wasn't wearing a helmet. NEVER again!



ISHmad said:



			I wear a hat every time I ride and for when doing groundwork with our youngster.  Love my life, my family, my horses, my friends and want to do all I can to remain on this earth with them for as long as possible....
		
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^^This!


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## soot (9 July 2010)

I used to ride without a hat before I moved to the UK. Just wasn't the done thing when I was a kid. Even in my RS we often didn't wears hats to hack out (!) and RI never wore a hat (and also always had a cigarette between her lips -- even over a course of fences, but I digress). On holiday treks in France, Portugal, Russia, Austria, Germany, Italy, Spain, etc, hats were never offered and it never crossed my mind to ask for one.
After moving to the UK I quite happily started hat wearing even though had to be reminded often at the beginning. I get more headaches that I used to and I find the summer a bit sweaty but it's rarely as hot here as back home so I can live with it. Would never ride without now, it's become second nature and you rarely see riders without hats around here even I don't think I've ever seen anyone hacking on the downs without!


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## ironhorse (9 July 2010)

bahumbug said:



			Still can't rule out the idea of taking up side-saddle hunting in full rig and veil at the age of 90 though!
		
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Yeah that's an interesting one. I used to hunt side saddle and started out in a bowler hat, but I wanted to be able to jump, and didn't want to be thinking 'shall I or shan't I ?'
I bought a nice velvet hat with flesh straps and always hunted in that. I actually only fell off once, when the horse stopped at the very last minute at a hedge. Although I landed mostly in the hedge, the hat was trashed. My head was fine (shame about my damaged neck liagaments  )

That said, I school at home in a Champion ventair as I mainly ride when there's no one else around ad you never know..), which is so comfy I (choose it over my Stetson on a hot day now. But the stetson's the order of the day for competing still....if I didn't feel safe on our current horse it might be different, she can be naughty at home but is pretty angelic at shows. If we get a youngster this year, I might be in the Champion for a season or two.


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## Brandy (9 July 2010)

spaniel said:



			Hat always.

The only excuse is arrogance, vanity or stupidity...take your pick.
		
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I agree. Also it is highly irresponsible for anyone particularly someone in the public eye, to advocate not wearing a hat. Even if that is your personal preferance, you should not be making it 'ok' for others to follow your foolish lead. You have a responsability of care to people who might look up to you.

I have on occasions not work a hat, years ago now. In fact I learnt to ride with a hat without a chin strap but again, that was many many years ago.

I was horrified to see a man ride down our lane on a very fired up horse, prancing and spooking all over the place, wearing no hat. Idiot.


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## Brandy (9 July 2010)

The thing that bothers me about other people not wearing a hat is that if (if) they fall off, and crack their skulls open, get trodden on whatever, someone, somewhere will have to 'pick up the pieces'

Its the same as when you get overtaken by a dangerously idiotic driver, I have to say if I went round a corner and found them in a crash, it would pi$$ me off big time. Yes of course I would help but why should I be made responsible for someone else actions?


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## Laur (9 July 2010)

Prince33Sp4rkle said:



			for flatwork, never.

for jumping-on current horse yes, previously, no.

for hacking-always.
		
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Maybe you should have been more specific then!  So you do sometimes wear a hat for flatwork, never was not quite the right word to use!!


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## becca92 (9 July 2010)

There is no question. Always, always, always a hat.

I genuinely cannot believe people are stupid enough to ride often without a hat. How much effort is it, really, to simply lift a hat and place it on your head? Don't tell me you're that lazy. There is absolutely no reason why anybody should be riding without a hat, and absolutely no excuse if something happens. There's a reason why hats are compulsory at events and in riding schools etc. They save your life. I can't tell you how many times I personally or friends and aquaintances have been saved from death by wearing a hat. If you died or suffered brain damage imagine the effects that would have on not only your life, but your friends and family. I wouldn't like to be the person to cause them suffering and grief, which could have been avoided by simply placing a hat on my head when I rode.

Sorry if I come across blunt, but it really angers me.


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## cariad (9 July 2010)

I agree that a hat will not protect you 100% in all cases; it is to an extent a matter of fate how and where you fall-look at Superman. Neither will body protectors, however good. But it will reduce the risk of serious injury. It may be your personal choice not to wear a hat, but it is not your family's choice to either personally catheterise you, manually evacuate your bowels, change your nappies, suck out your tracheostomy, get up to turn you 6 times a night or deal with the bedsores if they don't, clean out your feeding tube, wipe up the dribble etc etc when you have brain damage, or shell out vast quantities of money to get someone else to do it if it's your own fault and there's no-one at fault from whom to claim compensation. That's the reality of the consequences. With good quality care, people with brain damage can live long and (relatively) healthy lives, but I can't think it's any fun for anyone. I think Emma Hindle would find rather more than her eczema irritated if she fell the wrong way without a hat! (last week's H&H).


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## stacey-tipplehill (9 July 2010)

kittykins said:



			argh, hat! Hat hat hat! 

You may be the best ever rider in the world; accidents can still happen. I really, for the life of me, never ever understand how people can ride without wearing one.
		
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^^^ totally agree!!!


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## cloudandmatrix (9 July 2010)

BritishGroom said:



			care to have an effective imput?
		
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oh im sorry- i was simply stating i thought your patiicular post was a bunch of **** , which pretty much summed up how i feel, but i will say my bit. i am not stupid of selfish enough to get on a horse without a hat. 
i dont want my family to have to pick up the pieces of my stupid actions. i dont get why you wouldnt were one tbh. apart fro,m getting a sweaty head- but i would rather have a sweaty head than no head, thanks.


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## Prince33Sp4rkle (9 July 2010)

sorry, didnt think id have to point out that i wear a hat at shows!!!!!!

as for lessons-yes i do wear it if asked, so once a month.

out of choice i never wear a hat for flatowok, is that clear enough for you?! not that it makes any difference at all, as everyone has to wear one at shows and like i said, through choice i would not wear it for lessons either.

splitting hairs much?!


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## MissMincePie&Brandy (9 July 2010)

Hat!
I'd probably be dead or worse if I hadn't have been wearing my hat after the fall I had last week. I landed on my head on rock hard ground off a 17.2 horse who suddenly and unexpectedly erupted, out of the blue into a massive bronking fit, because he'd been bitten by a horsefly.

I had a skull on, but still became concussed, had a sever headache for 3 days and have bruising on my nose. 

If I hadn't had the hat on ..... ???????


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## cloudandmatrix (9 July 2010)

can i also say that it doesnt make you a big clever "natural risk taker" by not wearing a hat. it just makes you an idiot


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## the watcher (9 July 2010)

It should be possible, I think, to discuss or debate issues without resorting to name calling - no matter how strongly you may feel on the subject


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## dressager (9 July 2010)

Wow this hat issue just keeps re-appearing!

I haven't fallen off a horse for nearly 15 years but I still wear a hat. I have had horses trip and fall over with me, mine reared and slipped over once, some of the horses I've ridden are a bit loopy and have got other people off (my 6'+ trainer! My legs are only half the length!)

Riding is a leisure activity whereas driving is essential. I would hope my family would be more sympathetic if I was involved in a RTA...


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## Saucisson (9 July 2010)

Noooooooo!  Not the great hat debacle debate again!  Let it lie down, slowly groan, roll over and die please!  



Brandy said:



			I was horrified to see a man ride down our lane on a very fired up horse, prancing and spooking all over the place, wearing no hat. Idiot.
		
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This guy might be:

1/  A surgeon/anesthetist who may one day be responsible for treating your broken neck when you fell off your horse (whilst wearing your hat).
2/  A soldier who has just returned from dodging bullets in Afghanistan and doesn't quite have the same attitude to personal safety.
3/  Some random bloke who probably doesn't deserve being labeled as &#8220;stupid&#8221; just because he chose not to wear his hard hat.

Come on people, get a grip, some wear em and some don't, there's much more important things in life to be getting stressed about.  (FWIW I used to see a guy regularly riding without his shirt on &#8211; I had no problems with that at all, he was HOT).

Also, because it's Friday and I'm feeling a bit contentious, what is more likely to result in hospitilisation; riding in a school on a trusted horse without a hat or participating in cross-country/racing/polo/hunting/point-to-point/hurdling with all the safety gear?  

Also, how much protection from a brain injury does a hard hat actually offer?  I wear mine to protect against my head splitting open but I was under the impression that brain injuries generally result from the ole grey matter being shaken around/walloped too much?  I stand to be corrected (with information please and not opinion based on one experience in life or indoctrination).

I seem to remember my insurance company didn't give a monkey's whether I wore the right equipment or not, only whether I was competing.  

Let's ban all horse sports &#8211; why should the NHS pay for such tomfoolery (tongue firmly in cheek there) 

PS Hang in there Prince33 Sp4rkle, the only people who normally respond to these posts (as with high-vis) are ardent hard-hat wearers &#8211; it generally isn't very balanced because the people who don't probably can't be bothered having to defend their own personal choices.


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## Crackajack (9 July 2010)

Ok......

Was going to say that i would love to ride without a hat...but then read the 6 pages of this thread! lol

I do "risk" it by not wearing a hat - this is normally in what we call the back field - me and bestie go in there on a regular basis and i feel totally at ease with him in there....walking, cantering, galloping and yes...even jumping 

I do not encourage it to anybody and i do not demontsrate it either - i ride to the field with my hat on (although i dont do chin strap up) and then leave it on the gate whilst i go round field....

I only do it because i trust my beastie - if im schooling i wear a hat as my yard requires me to do so...

Its not something i take lightly but at the end of the day its my decision...hope you all respect that as you dont seem to have done so with others who have been honest enough to tell you they dont wear a hat on occasions


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## Foxglove (9 July 2010)

I personally always choose to wear a hat. 

I have had the misfortune to have had a very innocuous fall out hacking - horse shied and spun and I landed on my head. My hat split and had to be replaced. My landing was on grass and the ground certainly wasn't hard. Had I not had a hat on, it could have been a very different outcome (I only suffered mild concussion).

Now, I do see plenty of people out riding without a hat. A friend of mind rides a former horse of mine without a hat (he really was one of the safest horses you could sit on). It is their choice to ride without a hat, but the excuse that 'my horse is really safe and I don't intend to fall off' is foolhardy at best, stupid at worst. Accidents happen.

People ride without hats to look cool, fashionable or something inbetween. I have more respect for people who admit this fact than try and argue some statistic that they are more likley to get run over by a bus or it irritates them etc. Riding is a risk sport and to a certain extent one should try and minimise a forseeable risk ie if you land on your head you may suffer a head injury.

However, having said all that, if someone wants to ride without a hat, they should have the freedom of choice to do so without being pilloried for it.


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## Sarah Sum1 (9 July 2010)

Crackajack said:



			Ok......

Was going to say that i would love to ride without a hat...but then read the 6 pages of this thread! lol

I do "risk" it by not wearing a hat - this is normally in what we call the back field - me and bestie go in there on a regular basis and i feel totally at ease with him in there....walking, cantering, galloping and yes...even jumping 

I do not encourage it to anybody and i do not demontsrate it either - i ride to the field with my hat on (although i dont do chin strap up) and then leave it on the gate whilst i go round field....

I only do it because i trust my beastie - if im schooling i wear a hat as my yard requires me to do so...

Its not something i take lightly but at the end of the day its my decision...hope you all respect that as you dont seem to have done so with others who have been honest enough to tell you they dont wear a hat on occasions 

Click to expand...

I respect your choice to not wear a hat, but have a couple of questions if you don't mind answering them?
Ok, you say you trust your horse, great, but... what about if (as happened in a previous post) a horse fly bit your horse and he went mental and flung you off, or a low flying military helicopter flew by, or a gang of aliens appeared in front of you  that kind of thing? Coz horses are by nature unpredictable, and you may have the most trustworthy beast going, but if he freaks out for whatever reason and it does happen, he is not going to give you warning and time to jump off. 
Also It worries me if people that don't wear hats have children as you could potentially leave them motherless. Is it not selfish when you have children? I don't know if you have children and am not calling you slefish, just wondered what you thought


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## Sarah Sum1 (9 July 2010)

cloudandmatrix said:



			can i also say that it doesnt make you a big clever "natural risk taker" by not wearing a hat. it just makes you an idiot
		
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Careful how you word things, you may think it's stupid and idiotic not to wear a hat, but I wouldn't go getting personal. You'll get told off by admin and upset people.


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## cloudandmatrix (9 July 2010)

sorry got a little carried away- wasnt being super spesific, just that was what i remembered. sorry! i am still new here lol


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## Thelwell_Girl (9 July 2010)

Just wondering... What the point of wearing a hat if theres no proper chinstrap done up? Seems a bit silly to me... Ah well!


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## Maiko (9 July 2010)

Fabulous, the jolly old hat debate again! We could all save time and just copy and paste the last three million hat debates, as they all say the same thing, which is generally:

(Hat Wearers to Non Hat wearers) You're all thick, ignorant, stupid, selfish morons and a burden to your family when your brains are mashed to a pulp and you turn in to a drooling vegetable....

(Non Hat Wearers to Hat wearers) You're all sanctimonious whingeing ninnies, freedom of choice is ours and our horses are all so safe we will never fall off.....

Personally, I don't give a toss what other people do. I wear a harness hat because I want to, but some friends of mine ride in Beaglers or no hat at all, because THEY want to. Good luck to them, they aren't interfering with me, so it's none of my business what they do. 

And as for the argument that it "sets a bad example to the young", well, their parents should be enforcing rules about wearing a hat or not. No one should be made to feel responsible for other peoples offspring.

Can we have a nice chat about something else now? This ""debate" is pointless.


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## Weezy (9 July 2010)

Another take on it.....wearing a hat nearly killed me   Not jesting at all, my horse and I fell, at speed, flipping over, I hit the deck head first, knocked out, when I came round I couldn't breath because my hat had actually been knocked backwards off my head and the chin strap was around my neck and choking me.

Just thought that would be interesting to chuck in there   People ride with hats that a) don't fit, b) have loose chin straps, c) are rubbish....but people think that is OK as they have something physical on their heads.

Do I wear a hat?  Never used to, only at comps and escorting people out riding - the only reason I had one on the day I fell was because I was taking the YOs 11 year old daughter out hacking and I was setting an example.  I wear a hat now as I have to go up a lane to do anything, even to the school, but I will take it off in the school if I feel like it.


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## Crackajack (9 July 2010)

sarahsum1 said:



			I respect your choice to not wear a hat, but have a couple of questions if you don't mind answering them?
Ok, you say you trust your horse, great, but... what about if (as happened in a previous post) a horse fly bit your horse and he went mental and flung you off, or a low flying military helicopter flew by, or a gang of aliens appeared in front of you  that kind of thing? Coz horses are by nature unpredictable, and you may have the most trustworthy beast going, but if he freaks out for whatever reason and it does happen, he is not going to give you warning and time to jump off. 
Also It worries me if people that don't wear hats have children as you could potentially leave them motherless. Is it not selfish when you have children? I don't know if you have children and am not calling you slefish, just wondered what you thought 

Click to expand...

No hun its fine - glad you're willing to discuss 
Ok...i know my horse well enough to know that he wouldn't run off by a horse fly bite....so scratch that one...its not that i trust him not to do anything its that i trust him to run and only run!
The field we go in is relativley flat with hills only by the exit and entrance (Handy when you want to pull u ) so if he ever did spook or run off i know him well enough to know that he would just simply run - no spinning or bronching etc
I can sit to that - had him for four years now - his longest ever owner!
You have to bear in mind that beastie spent 12-18 months attempting anything within his power to get me off....due to being pinned and wrongly manipulated to do as he was told...ive been jumped out of arenas on him onto concrete ffs lol 
I dont have children.....but i would think differently if i did....not because i would be worried about them having no mum - so to speak - but because i would be worried that i would be setting the wrong example to them as they grow up by running risks when they are not old enough to know for themselves yet 
I can not think of anything that helps me and beastie bond more than galloping through the back field....him with only a bridle on and me in shorts, t shirt and flip flops...
lmfao
I love my pony


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## Crackajack (9 July 2010)

Maiko said:



			Fabulous, the jolly old hat debate again! We could all save time and just copy and paste the last three million hat debates, as they all say the same thing, which is generally:

(Hat Wearers to Non Hat wearers) You're all thick, ignorant, stupid, selfish morons and a burden to your family when your brains are mashed to a pulp and you turn in to a drooling vegetable....

(Non Hat Wearers to Hat wearers) You're all sanctimonious whingeing ninnies, freedom of choice is ours and our horses are all so safe we will never fall off.....

Personally, I don't give a toss what other people do. I wear a harness hat because I want to, but some friends of mine ride in Beaglers or no hat at all, because THEY want to. Good luck to them, they aren't interfering with me, so it's none of my business what they do. 

And as for the argument that it "sets a bad example to the young", well, their parents should be enforcing rules about wearing a hat or not. No one should be made to feel responsible for other peoples offspring.

Can we have a nice chat about something else now? This ""debate" is pointless.
		
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LMFAO


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## Sarah Sum1 (9 July 2010)

Crackajack said:



			No hun its fine - glad you're willing to discuss 
Ok...i know my horse well enough to know that he wouldn't run off by a horse fly bite....so scratch that one...its not that i trust him not to do anything its that i trust him to run and only run!
The field we go in is relativley flat with hills only by the exit and entrance (Handy when you want to pull u ) so if he ever did spook or run off i know him well enough to know that he would just simply run - no spinning or bronching etc
I can sit to that - had him for four years now - his longest ever owner!
You have to bear in mind that beastie spent 12-18 months attempting anything within his power to get me off....due to being pinned and wrongly manipulated to do as he was told...ive been jumped out of arenas on him onto concrete ffs lol 
I dont have children.....but i would think differently if i did....not because i would be worried about them having no mum - so to speak - but because i would be worried that i would be setting the wrong example to them as they grow up by running risks when they are not old enough to know for themselves yet 
I can not think of anything that helps me and beastie bond more than galloping through the back field....him with only a bridle on and me in shorts, t shirt and flip flops...
lmfao
I love my pony 

Click to expand...

Now I am more concerned about you getting horse hairs digging in your naked legs!
I'm a scaredy cat and I worry about galloping with a saddle on let alone bareback! I worry about rabbit holes and the horse going flying. May be why I wear a hat  
ALso do your flip flops not fall off?


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## henryhorn (9 July 2010)

But why should I and every other tax payer be expected to pay for 24/7 nursing care if you fall off on your head and end up cabbaged? 
It's not preaching, it's telling you not to be so utterly selfish.
As for boasting about riding with a crash hat sometimes undone I wonder if a fall may perhaps have already addled your brain, what is the point in doing that?
It's nothing to do with judgement it's using what your head was designed to do, use it's intelligence to realise sometimes we have no control over events and what happens, so it's wiser to be preventative. 
Incase I sound bitter let me tell you why, my much loved brother had the top of his head sliced off by the roof of his car windscreen through not wearing a safety belt. Had he used his brain to get one fitted (they were not in all cars then) we would have enjoyed many more years with him. He lived three hours before they allowed him to die. Would you wish that sort of experience on your relatives? 
I very much doubt it...


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## Annagain (9 July 2010)

Hat, always. 
A few of my more silly falls have included:

On old pony  (14hh bombproof, 100% in traffic but a bit exciteable)
1) Getting on at yard before going into school. He normally walked off forwards so I would jump a bit forwards as well, this time he went backwards. I went straight over his neck. 
2) Bareback, opening gate to leave yard to wander down to field, he tripped over his own feet as I asked him to go sideways, both ended up on floor.
3) Bareback, coming up from field he tripped on a stone, I went flying. 
4) On Badminton ride aged 24 wandering up the big avenue quietly by ourselves tucked into the edge to let others go past us as we were taking it slowly.  A squirrel jumped out of the hedge and landed on his neck. He didn't do much compared to what some would do, just spun round. But it was enough for me to come out the side door and for him to stand there looking at me very confused. 

On my current horse (16.3hh, bombproof, 100% in traffic, ex hunter, very footsure but very strong)
1) Cantering through stubble field at home, he's in 2nd place and not happy so pulling like a train and more interested in getting to front than in where he's going, trips on a rutted bit, I'm on the floor. 
2) In a lesson, instructor goes up to new gallery area about 12ft in the air and starts shouting instuctions at us. My horse doesn't bat an eyelid but horse in front freaks, backs into mine and knocks me off. 

According to some of you some of these situations would be ones when you would never wear hats. My point is no matter what you're doing, where you're doing it or how good your horse is stupid, freak accidents happen. 

How many horses, even brilliant ones wouldn't have a fit at a squirrel jumping onto their necks? I know that was a situation  (as an organised ride) where we would all have a hat on, but it could just as easily have been in a field at home as a Badminton


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## JDChaser (9 July 2010)

IMO horse riding is an extreme sport. We're all so brave to get on a horse, whether it be just a trot around the school, a walk out or galloping around a race course! You'd never see a pro skiier, snowboarder, cyclist, skateboarder...etc doing their sport without the protection of a helmet and other gear - so why wouldn't we use protection too? Everyone agrees that we wear boots with a heel because it's dangerous not to, so why wouldn't you wear a hat as well for the same reason


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## bahumbug (9 July 2010)

JDChaser said:



			IMO horse riding is an extreme sport. We're all so brave to get on a horse, whether it be just a trot around the school, a walk out or galloping around a race course! You'd never see a pro skiier, snowboarder, cyclist, skateboarder...etc doing their sport without the protection of a helmet and other gear - so why wouldn't we use protection too? Everyone agrees that we wear boots with a heel because it's dangerous not to, so why wouldn't you wear a hat as well for the same reason  

Click to expand...

Put like that it's a no-brainer isn't it? Well said!


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## Crackajack (9 July 2010)

sarahsum1 said:



			Now I am more concerned about you getting horse hairs digging in your naked legs!
I'm a scaredy cat and I worry about galloping with a saddle on let alone bareback! I worry about rabbit holes and the horse going flying. May be why I wear a hat  
ALso do your flip flops not fall off? 

Click to expand...

We are lucky our back field is maintained by the YO and you do not have to stay to the edge its just simply an open field to play in...but massive! 
Ive fallen off several times but just landed on my feet with beastie looking at me as if to say - ha ha cant do it without tack can we? lol
He looks after his mum  He knos im the one who has control over food 
Flip flops....no...never thought about it tho...they just stay?! lol 
People are still debating over this hat or no hat thing - why? If you do cool - if you dont sound....each to their own!
Oh and to the person - sorry i cant remember - who said why should people pay taxes/for the NHS - you wont have to with me i pay out of my hard earned cash for private health care!


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## FlorenceBassey (9 July 2010)

I only wear a hat on the road, if i fall off and crack my skull open when ridind in the field or school then so be it, i'm single, have no kids and a distant relationship with family the only one relying on me is me, so i see it as my choice and mine alone.


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## EAST KENT (9 July 2010)

All riders should start bareback riding..gives you balance double quick,you all sound like H@S freaks,maybe you all ride horses that are spooky or whatever.However I do not,and if someone wants to take a quiet ride on a trusty horse without a hat..so what? Pity you..you will never learn the freedom of the wind in your hair..you`ll all be equiped with parachutes next..OH I forgot ..there are those inflating body armour things now ,are`nt there. As a youngster I never wore a hat,except hunting,usually was bareback,and very often the mare had on a halter with reins attached to the D`s.Shock horror..but great FUN.


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## bahumbug (9 July 2010)

Crackajack said:



			Oh and to the person - sorry i cant remember - who said why should people pay taxes/for the NHS - you wont have to with me i pay out of my hard earned cash for private health care! 

Click to expand...

Worth noting though that you dont get taken to the nearest BUPA spa if you're in an accident - it's A&E all the way!


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## Cinnamontoast (9 July 2010)

spaniel said:



			Hat always.

The only excuse is arrogance, vanity or stupidity...take your pick.
		
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Quite. I have a husband and a responsibility to take care of myself therefore the hat is on when I'm on board. No discussion, no reminders needed. 

I cannot abide the people that say 'Oh, it's my life, my risk.' Idiots, frankly. What about the parents/friends etc that would grieve when putting on a hat takes all of 20 seconds?


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## animal (9 July 2010)

I think we should face it that people cannot be @rsed to pick a hat and put it on their head, for lets see, a total of 10 seconds.  I can't understand the logic, and cannot see a genuine reason for not wearing one... apart from vanity.


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## bahumbug (9 July 2010)

animal said:



			I think we should face it that people cannot be @rsed to pick a hat and put it on their head, for lets see, a total of 10 seconds.  I can't understand the logic, and cannot see a genuine reason for not wearing one... apart from vanity. 

Click to expand...

I freely admit I am one of those people who was too bloody prinky to put a hat on. That's why I started this thread, because despite several near misses myself, it was  friends in the US leading by example in wearing hats at dressage shows in the warm up after Courtney King-Dye's accident. After a pony club (hats on) upbringing to eventing and later through dressage I kind of got into this no hats regime and Court's story was a wake up call. I spent a bit of time looking at cute photos of me in the dressage arena (ok cute horse, I'm not that bally vain!) and thought of all the near misses over the years and well....I'm a little older now so I'm glad i got this wake up call rather than a not waking up ever again (or slowly and painfully) for my family. 

To those who have made rude comments about the subject, who are bored of it,  I just feel sorry for you because you clearly didn't read the original post in the first place therefore did not pick up that this is a discussion. The stories here have just strengthened my resolve to leave the baseball cap behind and put a proper hat on when I get on a horse. My husband, who does not ride but is an army officer, said to look at the Kings Troop on hols - hats, even in the sea (riders of course).

Leaving aside the rude people, I thank everyone is contributing to this interesting discussion, keep talking!


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## FlorenceBassey (10 July 2010)

I really dont care what others think or what happens to me


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## Minxie (10 July 2010)

On the rare occasions I do ride I wear a hat - but more because I'm not that good and there's a fairly high risk of me eating dirt 

However.  Of all the fairly spectacular dismounts I've had I've never hit my head.  BUT, i've been damned near concussed on a few occasions by horses while on the ground.  So I guess in terms of personal safety it would probably make more sense for me to wear a hat while mucking out


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## benson21 (10 July 2010)

FlorenceBassey said:



			I really dont care what others think or what happens to me
		
Click to expand...

maybe not, but the ambulance technician, paramedic, nurses, doctors, porters, radiographers, physiotheraposts, occupational therapists, and domestics, have to care for you, all because you cant be bothered to put a hat on.
How selfish is that.


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## WelshMisfit (10 July 2010)

No question about it. Hat every time! It isn't anything I think to question. Why would anyone take the risk by not wearing one? Doesn't matter how well schooled the horse is, they all spook sometimes. It's their natural instinct to flee when they get scared. In fact, I think it's probably more important than ever to wear one if your horse is well behaved, they're more likely to catch you unawares than if you're used to your horse spooking! 
If I was ever in any doubt about the reasons for wearing a riding hat, they were put to bed by an accident a friend of mine had while we were out hacking. Her horse spooked at something, bolted down the main road and stopped mid gallop right in front of a galvanised metal fence (the kind you get on the central reservation of the motorway). She went head first into it, split her hat in two and was in hospital for a fortnight because of it. She still has headaches and dizzy spells because of it and that was three years ago. Sorry, it's just not worth the risk.


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## SJFAN (11 July 2010)

Well I hope that FlorenceB carries written instructions that she does not want medical attention should she suffer a head injury!

I agree about the pleasure and value of riding bareback, but riding bareback does not preclude wearing a hat.

I am puzzled by why this thread appears in Latest News.  Surely it should be in New Lounge?


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## kirstyl (11 July 2010)

Prince33Sp4rkle said:



			sorry, didnt think id have to point out that i wear a hat at shows!!!!!!

as for lessons-yes i do wear it if asked, so once a month.

out of choice i never wear a hat for flatowok, is that clear enough for you?! not that it makes any difference at all, as everyone has to wear one at shows and like i said, through choice i would not wear it for lessons either.

splitting hairs much?!
		
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Better to split hairs than skulls!


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## Ignition (11 July 2010)

Princess Sparkle do you also ride in trainers? Or do you recognise that boots with a small heel are much for practical and safe to wear when riding


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## dreamcometrue (11 July 2010)

It makes sense to wear a hat in case of falling off.

Those who don't wear a hat, its your choice and I don't care. 

I would however, wish that everyone who has posted a frantically defensive post about not wearing a hat would be able to come back and read said post when they are my age so they could see what a to**er they were in 2010.


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## bahumbug (11 July 2010)

dreamcometrue said:



			I would however, wish that everyone who has posted a frantically defensive post about not wearing a hat would be able to come back and read said post when they are my age so they could see what a to**er they were in 2010. 

Click to expand...


Fabulous! LOL


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## combat_claire (11 July 2010)

I don't know if anyone else has been reading Melanie Griffiths articles in the Times every Saturday. She is writing an article from her hospital ward following a refusal during an amateur one day event. She was thrown over the horse and broke a serious vertebrae in her neck meaning she is now paralysed from the chest down and considered a quadraplegic. I appreciate that she was wearing a hat and a body protector, but her writings on her daily struggles to keep control of her bowels, attempt minor movements in the exercise pool and her frustrations at spending months in a collar and brace should lead us all to review our relationship with safety equipment.

I am proud to say that I always wear a jockey skull when riding, I also tend to keep it on when untacking and so forth. I also made a conscious decision to sell a second hand Patey I had acquired and invest in a Charles Owen kite marked velvet hunt cap complete with chin strap. I don't see riding as any different from any of my other risk activities - I wouldn't face the opposition bowling without my batting helmet, I certainly wouldn't go rock climbing without my climbing helmet and I don't hunt on my bicycle without a cycle helmet. The same as I wouldn't have gone into a TA mock battle or across their assault course in my beret. Why should riding be any different?? 

This argument for me at least hasn't presented any new thoughts on why riding hatless is a good thing. I'm not going to preach, it is your choice that in the case of a serious accident you could become a huge burden on the health services and your family and risk giving up the activity you love forever. 

I'm going to stop rambling now as I have to go and buy my new safety helmet for site visits now I am a fully qualified chartered surveyor.


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## Izzwizz (11 July 2010)

Picture this scenario :- horse and rider sit at breakfast table and rider says to horse 
"now be a good boy/girl today and dont chuck me off as we are doing flatwork lesson.  I dont want a poorly head."

Next day, " Today we are off for a hack out so I will wear my hat so you are allowed to have a spook,trip etc"

Horses are animals and dont understand words atall.  Wearing a hat is a no brainer,  and it doesnt matter where you are riding.  If you are going to put a scarf or something likewise on your head, then why not put a hat on instead?  Cannot understand anyone not wearing one, as others have said, we wear seatbelts for a reason - hats are exactly the same!


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## dsykes (11 July 2010)

I wear my hat when leading any pony, and even handling youngsters eg brushing , picking feet up etc . Mine are Exmoor ponies , and I've adopted this habit after being knocked to the ground & knocked out by one when taking her to the field 8 yrs ago . She was a yearling at the time and just being silly and generally jumping around due a hail storm .
The cut to my head wasn't too bad , but the concussion and resultant head injury left me with no sense of taste or smell .Ok , not serious but life changing to some small extent.
I was also dragged about and stood on whilst I was unconscious on the floor , I was off work for 5 weeks . I feel very lucky that my injuries were no worse .
It goes without saying that I always wear a hat when riding .


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## MagicMelon (11 July 2010)

Prince33Sp4rkle said:



			its called freedom of choice and being bought up in a different *culture*-i look at hats the way you probably look at body protectors, its for higher risk days only.
		
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Seriously?  "Higher risk days", what are those?  I haven't fallen off many times over the years but of the times I have done so the vast majority of those times has been during simple flatwork when a horse has spooked etc.  I can't think of many times at all I've fallen off doing "high risk" show jumping or eventing (which I do very regularily)...

Sorry, but your head is your most important part.  I'd absolutely wear one at all times, I think people who don't are nutcases.


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## Shutterbug (11 July 2010)

cinammontoast said:



			I cannot abide the people that say 'Oh, it's my life, my risk.' Idiots, frankly. What about the parents/friends etc that would grieve when putting on a hat takes all of 20 seconds?
		
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I wouldn't go as far as to call them idiots, I just dont think anyone can fully appreciate the reality of a head injury or the effects it can have on your extended family and friends until you have experienced it - and most people have the "it wont happen to me" attitude until it does happen to them.

I was unfortunate enough to be on the receiving end of a serious head injury after being dragged 60' by a bolting horse and being left with a rather large hole in my head.  I wasnt riding at the time, I was loading and I didnt have my hat on. 

That was 3 years, 6 surgeries and a months and months of no riding ago - and I still have more surgery to get this year. Some people might have seen the article in Your Horse magazine this month. It has affected my parents, my children, my partner, my workmates, my confidence, the people who witnessed it (one girl was completely traumatised), its affected every area of my life and all the people around me.  I can no longer ride to the level I could before my accident and I dont think I ever will again. I am also no longer the confident individual I was.

So to those who choose not to wear a hat, that is your choice, but its not the choice of the people around you who have to deal with the aftermath and trust me when I say if it doesnt kill you, it will most certainly take a large chunk of your life and completely destroy it - if you think thats worth the risk then so be it.


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## Tollfarm (11 July 2010)

On our yard we wear the best hats you can get every time we ride. We also where hats when handling the young horses. It is just not worth the risk!! For what? To look cool? Please? I know its personal choice but it does set a bad example to younger riders if people don't wear hats and like many others have said what about the people around you if you have an accident. I just don't understand it!


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## narkymare (11 July 2010)

our queen never wears a hat


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## Thelwell_Girl (11 July 2010)

narkymare said:



			our queen never wears a hat
		
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So?

*cue the cliche*.......

If the Queen jumps off a bridge, or has someone beaten up, or does something else silly and/or wrong, does that make it right?


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## dreamcometrue (11 July 2010)

narkymare said:



			our queen never wears a hat
		
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Beg to differ.  She always has a hat on, except when she rides a horse.


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## Donkeymad (11 July 2010)

BritishGroom said:



			.. has anyone ever weighed up the facts and virtues of not wearing a hat?
		
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No. Please spell them out to me.


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## Hollycat (11 July 2010)

Please be aware that insurance companies are very happy to take premiums, but not so happy to pay out large sums if they can get away with it.  I can fully imagine a company trying not to pay out if the insured was riding without a hat.  Not the sort of stress anyones family wants even if they get the money eventually.  I am also pretty sure that many private health insurance policies would not cover the long term hopsital care of someone that will never regain consciness.

At the end of the day I don't actually care what someone else does.  It not my business. It doesn't worry me when my friends ride without a hat. Its their choice.  I just hope I never have to pick up the pieces if an accident happens when I am am around


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## Flicker (12 July 2010)

It is not just the cost to the rider and their families and friends - what about the NHS and the massive amounts of money that have to be spent patching people up.  My OH is a doctor and he has had to mop up the aftermath of riding accidents, both 'hatted' and 'hatless' so to speak.  Most of the time people wearing hats were able to leave A&E after a couple of hours, with a list of head injury guidelines to follow, a couple of bruises and a good story to tell in the pub later.  Those not wearing hats have usually had to be airlifted to a major head-injury hospital and spend at least a week (sometimes an awful lot longer), at tremendous expense to the tax payer.  And that is before the physio, occupational therapy, psychotherapy and all the other services are involved.
Come on, that's not really fair is it?
Yes, it is your choice - but with that choice comes responsibility.  Especially if you are benefitting from a world-class free health service.


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## Frances144 (14 July 2010)

No hat.... no horse...... no discussion.

Simplz!

I would never consider any other action tbh.

Oh yes, and I have scraped up someone's brains off the road.  They wore a Patey or similar (it was a few years back) and those memories will stay with me forever.


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## teapot (14 July 2010)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode...ife_and_Death/

A timely programme given the discussion and whilst it doesn't feature a patient who's come off a horse - the injuries, after-care and decisions having to be made by others are all valid.

FWIW - I'm all for freedom of choice and thoroughly understand that in hot climates it must be hell to ride in a hat etc. I don't care what people do and I'm not going to ram it down peoples' throats. But why do the 'anti-hat' brigade get so uppity when other people say 'well i always ride in a hat'. It's freedom of choice either way and if you're telling me that you're going to have a go just because someone on an internet forum says otherwise then I think you've got other issues to think about. It's only a forum, not like people are going to hunt you down the street with pitchforks are they? 

I'll openly say that I'll happily wear a hat on the ground is needs be, entirely depends on what's on the end of the rope. And I'll always wear a hat on board. I also hack in yellows.


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## luckyhorseshoe (14 July 2010)

Hmmm...i love this debate as much as the debates on spurs, drawer reins etc.

Now as a rule i do ride in a hat but have i ever ridden without one yes, have i ridden with no saddle/stirrups/bareback/in a headcollar yes.

I think i am perhaps more in the habit of wearing a hat then thinking about the consequences etc....i have worn flip flops around horses (at the moment regulary), never handle horses with a hat or gloves.

However, i have only ridden without a hat on a trustworthy horse - My current ride....i doubt i would ride without stirrups!

Its a matter of choice....i think for the debate to have any worth pro dressge riders will need to be forced to compete in them and since that is not going to happen anytime soon, think we should leave it there!


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## Somethingwicked (14 July 2010)

I would never get on a horse without a hat. I have on two occasions by accident - one at a riding school i was at the mounting block just about to put my foot in the stirrup and my instructor asked what i thought i was doing without a hat (and i was so embarrassed and i hope she didn't think i was planning on actually riding without one), the second time again was an accident, i was so nervous about the jumping i was about to do that i got on and someone asked me what i had forgotten (again i was mortified).

I have known someone who was in intensive care because a horse he was walking beside came down on his head. Luckily he survived and is leading a normal life. If he had been wearing a hat the accident wouldn't have been nearly as bad as it was. Personally i couldn't do that to myself or my family (because its not just yourself that has to deal with the reality of a head injury).

I watched that tv programme last night and found it really heartbreaking.


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## Brandy (15 July 2010)

Saucisson said:



			Noooooooo!  Not the great hat debacle debate again!  Let it lie down, slowly groan, roll over and die please!  



This guy might be:

1/  A surgeon/anesthetist who may one day be responsible for treating your broken neck when you fell off your horse (whilst wearing your hat).
2/  A soldier who has just returned from dodging bullets in Afghanistan and doesn't quite have the same attitude to personal safety.
3/  Some random bloke who probably doesn't deserve being labeled as stupid just because he chose not to wear his hard hat.

This guy is not a surgeon, or an anesthetist, nor a soldier. He lives up the road and regularly rides down a busy road through the village, that large lorries thunder along, he is in the middle of the road on his barely controlled horse. He complained that our dog barked, once and made his horse spook violently, so that his baseball cap fell off and he was hanging over the side of his horse. Had he fallen off, it would have been onto a concrete farm track. Had he hit his head, I would have had to have dealt with it. 

Fair? No.
		
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## DanielleAngel (15 July 2010)

Sometimes, I have forgotten my hat.
On my own land, with my own horse, then yes, I will admit to being a complete [insert whitty insult here] and sometimes if i've forgotten said hat, I will ride without one.

I'm complete not defending riding without a hat at all. Infact, as a general rule to myself, I usually have a check list every morning before I leave the house.

It's just the rare occasion that I really am zombiefied until I get the yard and think "Oh...sh*t!" There's usually always one of the old hats anyway, but sometimes there isn't...
I'd say I probably ride, on average, once a month with no hat due to my lack of rememberence...probably not even a word but you know what I mean.

I would feel comfortable riding with no hat on a horse I knew very well, I have done frequently when I went through a phase a few years ago.

People usually say "You'll learn when you've hurt yourself!" I'd rather kick myself up the butt BEFORE that happens thank you.


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## Marsbar (16 July 2010)

Yes and there are also a lot more drivers.  I wonder what the ratio of deaths to riders is, compared to the ratio of deaths to drivers!

However, the hat thing is personal choice - it's your own brains that you are putting at risk without wearing one, so up to you really.


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## SJFAN (16 July 2010)

Marsbar: you have missed the point that if you incur a head injury which could easily have been prevented by the use of a suitable hat, you use precious health service resources.


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## appylass (16 July 2010)

Hevs said:



			I wouldn't go as far as to call them idiots, I just dont think anyone can fully appreciate the reality of a head injury or the effects it can have on your extended family and friends until you have experienced it - and most people have the "it wont happen to me" attitude until it does happen to them.

I was unfortunate enough to be on the receiving end of a serious head injury after being dragged 60' by a bolting horse and being left with a rather large hole in my head.  I wasnt riding at the time, I was loading and I didnt have my hat on. 

That was 3 years, 6 surgeries and a months and months of no riding ago - and I still have more surgery to get this year. Some people might have seen the article in Your Horse magazine this month. It has affected my parents, my children, my partner, my workmates, my confidence, the people who witnessed it (one girl was completely traumatised), its affected every area of my life and all the people around me.  I can no longer ride to the level I could before my accident and I dont think I ever will again. I am also no longer the confident individual I was.

So to those who choose not to wear a hat, that is your choice, but its not the choice of the people around you who have to deal with the aftermath and trust me when I say if it doesnt kill you, it will most certainly take a large chunk of your life and completely destroy it - if you think thats worth the risk then so be it.
		
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 I'm one who has always, always worn a hat since my mother drummed it into me when I learned to ride, I also spent a large part of my life nursing so have seen the aftermath of head injury. Thank you for that post Hevs,  it might just make someone else think twice before riding hatless. I wish you all the best for the future, I hope things continue to improve for you.


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## Shutterbug (16 July 2010)

appylass said:



			I'm one who has always, always worn a hat since my mother drummed it into me when I learned to ride, I also spent a large part of my life nursing so have seen the aftermath of head injury. Thank you for that post Hevs,  it might just make someone else think twice before riding hatless. I wish you all the best for the future, I hope things continue to improve for you.
		
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Thank you appylass   I consider myself extremely lucky, I had no brain injury, no cracked skull (mother says it was all that milk she fed me as a child lol) - I did have a hole in my scalp that you could clearly see my skull through which was not pretty.  If my post makes even just one person stop and reconsider wearing a hat then its worth me talking about it.


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## Maiko (16 July 2010)

SJFAN said:



			Marsbar: you have missed the point that if you incur a head injury which could easily have been prevented by the use of a suitable hat, you use precious health service resources.
		
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The health service is also used by people who smoke and have lung issues or cancer. And obese people with heart problems. Both of those conditions can be prevented by either not smoking, or not over-eating. Should we prevent those people from using the health services available, or call them stupid or selfish or moronic, which is quite often what the hatless brigade are called during these "discussions".

I wear a hat through choice, but I do get a bit bored with people preaching about the alleged selfishness of those hatless types who may or may not have to call on the services of the NHS after falling off. It's a false argument, particularly when there are so many people using the health service who haven't even contributed to it eg. illegal immigrants! But that's a whole different topic......


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## brighthair (16 July 2010)

I wear a hat because - when I was bought my first pony by my parents, they said if I ever rode without a hat they would sell her. And the same for wearing a seatbelt, if I didn't they would sell my car
I wear a hat because it's never occurred to me not to wear one. Also I work for the ambulance service and I'd look a bit of a tit if I fell off not wearing a hat, the grief from colleagues would be never ending
Also, riding without a hat isn't allowed on the yard


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## alainax (16 July 2010)

I fell off today, wind banged a metal door right in front of the horse, he freaked and we parted company, my head hit the ground twice with a bit of force. I was dizzy for 5 mins but ok. 

If I didnt have my hat on id be in some serious trouble! 


When I was young id ride without, but only in the field, never out and about. But now id always wear one. 

Same with my bike leathers, I used to ride in trousers and a jumper!  I bougth full leathers cause i got some money, that week I came off and have wolverine type rips across them, that would have been my skin!


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## Mrs B (16 July 2010)

I am not here to preach. I _will_ tell you upfront that I always wear a hat. But for those who don't, I am curious to know _why_ you make the conscious decision not to put one on? 

You are all smart, experienced, horse people - you all know that horses can and do trip and fall, even if you are sure they will not spook. Is it a sort of superstition? Is it defying fate? It really can't just be to avoid hat hair, can it?

Is it in defiance of all those who DO wear hats and who you feel are telling you what you should or should not do?

As I said, to those that don't, I am not trying to tell you what to do or not to do, I am just interested to understand the psychology; the actual thought process, that goes on when you take the 'I'm not wearing a hat' route.


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## Paint it Lucky (16 July 2010)

I know it can be tempting sometimes to not wear a hat, but please bear in mind that one of my worst riding accidents occurred whilst riding a very safe horse around an arena at walk.  (eg, a very 'low risk' situation).  He tripped, I don't know what over, the school surface must have been slightly uneven or maybe he just missed his footing who knows.  All I can remember his him falling sideways with me still on him and then I blacked out as he rolled over the top of me, knocking me unconcious and crushing me.

Fortunately I was wearing a hat and there was someone else in the arena who saw the whole freak accident and was able to quickly get help.  I was unconcious for only a few seconds but when I came round I was severely concussed, I couldn't see or co-ordinate at all.  I was taken to hospital and took several hours to return to a normal state.  Despite landing on a soft school surface some of my ribs were also fractured (hardly surprising after being rolled over by 500kg of horse)(prehaps I should have worn a body protector too?!)  I was fine afterwards but am very glad I wore my hat that day (as indeed I do everytime I ride).

So please don't think that just because you are doing something basic like schooling or hacking a known safe horse that nothing bad will happen and there are no risks involved; there is always a risk!  Don't make yourself regret riding without a hat.


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## Ebenezer_Scrooge (16 July 2010)

Hat every time..I was in a freak accident with my saint of a horse yesterday and banged my head, got my arms ripped to shreds by a hawthorn hedge and have brusied my coccyx, my pelvis and left hip .  I was sick and dizzy afterwards but my head is still intact.  Never worth the risk...


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## Dogstar (17 July 2010)

I really can't see why someone wouldn't put a hat on, it only takes a second? If it is for vanity I don't get it either...I am definitely not a snob, but when I see someone riding hatless (in the UK) I cannot help but think 'traveller' or 'chav'!? I am not a hat fascist though. BTW I learnt to ride in the era of the 3686 hats which came off before you hit the ground so I love the new hats which actually do their job. They look smart and workmanlike and most people now hunt in modern hats.


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## SusannaF (17 July 2010)

I've never ridden without a hat and would feel downright peculiar with a "naked head". I've been riding out recently here and several of the people on the hack didn't bother with hats or even proper footwear (including a doctor)...


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## Holly Hocks (17 July 2010)

When I was younger I used to ride without a hat because it was "cool", then about eight years ago at a time when I didn't own a horse, I was in a group at a riding school having a jumping lesson in the field.  They put me on a horse which hadn't seen fillers before, but they didn't tell me.  I went to the jump, the horse stopped and dropped it's shoulder before the fence and I went straight out the side door.  I smacked my head on the grass.  I was concussed slightly but didn't think anything of it.  When I checked my hat afterwards, I found that the skull cap had broken with the impact (bear in mind this was only on grass).  If I hadn't had a hat on, it would have been my skull which would have been broken.  I have NEVER not worn a hat since and I never will ride without one ever again.


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## guido16 (18 July 2010)

For me its a no brainer - always wear a hat. If I dont I might find myself with no brain!

However, maybe I should take a few risks in life. was thinking about going bungee jumping. Now the safe option would be to jump with the cord attached, bit like wearing a hat.

Maybe I will take a wee risk and try jumping without the cord attached. Afterall, as someone said, if I tell myself I will be fine, I will be.

Will let you all know how it goes.............


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## Booboos (18 July 2010)

Hat all the time when riding. If I ever get to 'top hat' level BD, I will still wear a crash hat.

For the last two years I have been wearing a hat when handling on the ground as well after having a couple of near misses with a rearing horse.

I have been thinking of getting myself into the habit of wearing a BP all the time as well, but haven't gotten round to finding one I like.


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## Spudlet (18 July 2010)

I used to work on a neuro ward so - hat, every time. I don't ever want to end up like some of the patients there - tbh, the thought of ending up like that scares me much, much more than the thought of being killed outright.

The thought that sticks in my mind most is the sound of a man who had lost the ability to move, speak or do anything else grinding his teeth so loudly you could hear it from the other end of the ward. That and making moaning sounds were the only things he could do


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## smossy (18 July 2010)

Hat hat hat   even for schooling or just sitting on.daughter fell off cracked two ribs when horse was standing still!!! just got on. a paper bag went under his legs and he lept big time. She was taken unaware and we were talking at time, ( normally he would not react). Just shows you dont have to be moving. If handling some thing silly or young a hat is a must.. Dont fancy being a cabbage state in a chair and a burden to family.. So wear a hat dont be vain,


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## Graureiter (18 July 2010)

I won't be on a horse, or work around a horse not wearing a helmet. Just as I will not fence without a fencing mask. To me they are part of the equipment.

As for other adults, it's their choice.


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## GinaB (18 July 2010)

I wear my hat for riding only, never handling but maybe I should consider if after nearly getting kicked in the head last week while picking out feet! 

I wouldn't get on a horse without one, but it is a person's own decision at the end of the day.

Much the same that I would never get on a motorbike without wearing all the proper safety gear.


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## Prince33Sp4rkle (18 July 2010)

just some comedy input here-would appear i need to wear one at all times,never mind on a horse, as im such a plonker.......bent down to pick up a cat, stumbled,stood up and completely mullered my head on the metal under edge of a stable top door, que blood EVERYWHERE and a whopping headache.am sporting a big dressing currently and praying it stops as really dont want to spend my sun evening in A&E!!!

i am SUCH a muppet!


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## GinaB (18 July 2010)

Ouchies! Poor you, that's the kind of thing I do! (last time I banged my head badly was I juyst lost my balance and fell forward and cracked my head off a sink splitting my eyebrow open!)

Hope you feel better soon!


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## Prince33Sp4rkle (18 July 2010)

oof, poor you!
at least its under my hair so if it scars it wont be visible, appears to have stopped bleeding now so i think ill be ok without stitching!


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## Booboos (18 July 2010)

Ouch that does sound painful!

I have to admit I wear my hat in the horsebox as well because I kept banging my head ducking under the breast bar all the time! Duh!


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## Prince33Sp4rkle (18 July 2010)

well i have stopped dripping blood so i reckon im ok!

booboos-i do the exact same thing all the time, irritating isnt it!


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## SO1 (18 July 2010)

i think as a country we are a nation of hat wearers - i do wonder in other countries where hats are not commonly worn are there more serious head injuries due to horse related accidents?

i always wear a hat now but have ridden overseas on holiday without a hat on and so did my friend who has never sat on a horse before when we went to mexico 10 years ago. however i do think that in some overseas countries the horses are better behaved (anything really tricky ending up as horsemeat) and there is often less traffic or risky things going on.

here in the uk our horses are not always so well behaved and perhaps we ride in more dangerous circumstances, a lot of road riding, people on horses that are not well schooled or people are over horsed or just taking bigger risks.

apart from the time i was silly on holiday i always wear my hat but then i don't consider myself so good a rider that i will not fall off. i have fallen off in the school before in walk on my pony when he spooked when some children leapt out of a barn next to the school and he is not a spooky sort normally.  

i think people should always wear at hat when jumping and riding on the roads at the very least.


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## bahumbug (18 July 2010)

SO1 said:



			i think people should always wear at hat when jumping and riding on the roads at the very least.
		
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Roads/drivers were the literal conversion point for me years ago -  when a groups of us realised drivers simply didn't appreciate pretty horses being ridden by (arguably) pretty riders as a picture, we used to get comments along the lines of 'where's your hat' (expletives deleted), hats on roads become the norm.  It took a while for me to feel the need to wear a hat at ALL times but hey, the hair products are better now so what's the problem ...LOL


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## mybaileysglide (18 July 2010)

depends how well you know the horse your riding and what you are doing with it. if your jumping or hacking or on a horse you dont know or trust, definatly HAT.
but if your on your own horse and you know its safe then i say there is an exception for schooling on a hot day


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## rubysmum (19 July 2010)

it really puzzles me how cross these type of threads always become on a variety of forums
i choose to wear a hat - i would prefer that my family members [ ie people that i might end up with some care responsibility for ] wear hats - other peoples' choices dont actually impact on me - so i feel no need to get aerated bout that
re hi-viz - i wear hi-viz when hacking alone in a sometimes hopeless attempt to make drivers actually notice me & my very large white horse


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## flyingfeet (19 July 2010)

I cringe when I see people not wearing hats, or pateys out hunting! 

My father has suffered a fractured skull with a hat, and wouldn't be here without one. 

I just cannot really understand anyone with any family or close friends wanting to ride without a hat. Buy a nice new one with lots of vents, it doesn't make your head sweat or ruin your quiff. 

I think in the school its easy to think you are immune from outside influence, but reality is if a low flying helicopter appears and your horse spooks and throws you into the side, then its curtains. 

I am aware this is a dangerous sport, but I cannot see the reason for not wanting to take a basic precaution! Weirdly people ride without hats, but with gloves - so they will protect their hands from getting rough, but not their heads!! 

I would ban the use of no hat in warm up, pateys, top hats and bowlers in all competitions, therefore more beautiful safe hats would be designed and the need for people to copy the pros would diminish.


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## Sol (19 July 2010)

Personally, I wear one 99% of the time. I did ride without on holiday - galloping along the beach at that on a horse I'd never met before. 
At home? a) at the livery I'm on, we HAVE to wear hats. b) I'd rather not be stuck in hospital for any length of time tbh.... 

I choose to wear one. For riding & lunging/long reining. If I think a horse is far too nuts to consider getting on it without (if I had to go without) I wouldn't get on it.
I don't ride in a body protector however - why? Because I find them very restrictive and think I actually have a lower chance of staying on the horse WITH one, so I opt to go without for all but XC (speed + solid fences? No thanks.) Whereas a hat isn't going to affect me in any way, except maybe make my head hot. 
Nor would I come onto a yard in flip flops though  Riding boots don't do much to stop me riding well! 

There's nobody really in my little world that I care about so much for that aspect to affect my decision, I ride in a hat for my own sake. I ride, when I do, without one, and it's my own choice. 
Same as with riding bareback, hacking on roads, jumping, getting out of bed in the morning......... life's a risky business!


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## Saratoga (19 July 2010)

Out of interest, all those that *preach* (for want of a better word) to those that don't wear hats, do you do the same to smokers? As last time i checked smoking contributed to more deaths a year than riding without a hat....

Would you walk up to someone smoking in the street and tell them that someone somewhere will have to 'pick up the pieces' when they get lung cancer?


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## Amymay (19 July 2010)

Out of interest, all those that *preach* (for want of a better word) to those that don't wear hats, do you do the same to smokers?
		
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Interesting comparison - and I was just actually thinking the same thing.

There is also no question that smoking _may_ kill you, just as not wearing a hat may.....


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## rowy (19 July 2010)

I always wear a hat, the thought of not never crossed my mind as at the livery yards i have been at for last 5 years said you arent allowed and had to sign a contract to say you wouldn't. scary YO got really angry if she saw someone without one :O

Have my own house with land now and still always wear one cos I have a 3 year old- unpredicatbale. and a spooky highly strung older tb. 

One day i'm hoping to get to advanced medium plus so when i get there i would love to wear a top hat (?) and tails in comp! I would hope by that time my I would know my 3 year old front to back and he would be very well schooled so wouldn't be at risk  

I do understand that if you have a very well schooled horse that you know back to front and just schooling in a menage then its ok. Would def never tho if cross countrying/ sj and hacking on roads! too many bad accidents with hat on has happened and even got mild concussion once where i forgot events of the day :O can't bear to think what would have happended if hadn't been wearing a hat :S

oh what you said above about smoking. even though unrelated to hat topic (i hope i didn't seem like i was preaching??) i do get an urge to tell people on the streets about smoking. learnt about it in a level bio and would never even touch one. lol i hold my breath when some one is smoking nearby!


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## Honey08 (19 July 2010)

Well I haven't got the best brain in the world, but I value it!!


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## Booboos (19 July 2010)

Saratoga said:



			Out of interest, all those that *preach* (for want of a better word) to those that don't wear hats, do you do the same to smokers? As last time i checked smoking contributed to more deaths a year than riding without a hat....

Would you walk up to someone smoking in the street and tell them that someone somewhere will have to 'pick up the pieces' when they get lung cancer?
		
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To be fair I can't really see many people preaching about the hat thing on this thread, just stating whether they choose to wear a hat or not. However, you are right, if we think that others should wear a hat to minimise risk of injury to themselves, then by comparison we should counsel similar caution with other risk taking activities (from smoking to getting pregnant) and we should also take the same precautions with all our activities.

Having said that, there is an easier line to defend: wearing a hat or not is a matter of personal choice, but for many people, e.g. competitors, those who ride in public, those with a public profile, it's also a matter of setting a good example for other, many of whom are children. This gives many people an extra reason to make the choice to wear a hat. In addition, riding in a certain context, e.g. at a livery yard, at a competition, involves having to ride under the rules of that establishment and horse organisations and societies should have rules for wearing hats as part of their duty of care towards those who ride under their rules. If that were followed most people would wear hats most of the time


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## zefragile (19 July 2010)

Saratoga said:



			Out of interest, all those that *preach* (for want of a better word) to those that don't wear hats, do you do the same to smokers? As last time i checked smoking contributed to more deaths a year than riding without a hat....

Would you walk up to someone smoking in the street and tell them that someone somewhere will have to 'pick up the pieces' when they get lung cancer?
		
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It's a bit different though if you're walking up to someone smoking in the street. If it was a thread on a forum I think you'd see plenty of people "preaching" about smoking.


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## combat_claire (19 July 2010)

CotswoldSJ said:



			I cringe when I see people not wearing hats, or pateys out hunting! 

I would ban the use of no hat in warm up, pateys, top hats and bowlers in all competitions, therefore more beautiful safe hats would be designed and the need for people to copy the pros would diminish.
		
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Well said, totally agree. I have seen so many supposedly fitted Pateys go bouncing across the hunting field on impact. I would never ride or hunt without my Charles Owen and I just put up with the stick given about the so called wally strap...


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## Thelwell_Girl (19 July 2010)

rowy said:



			......I do understand that if you have a very well schooled horse that you know back to front and just schooling in a menage then its ok.........
		
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Just out of curiousity, Courtney King-Dye was riding one of her very well schooled horses, whom she knew well, in a menage...


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## Saratoga (19 July 2010)

Booboos said:



			To be fair I can't really see many people preaching about the hat thing on this thread, just stating whether they choose to wear a hat or not. However, you are right, if we think that others should wear a hat to minimise risk of injury to themselves, then by comparison we should counsel similar caution with other risk taking activities (from smoking to getting pregnant) and we should also take the same precautions with all our activities.

Having said that, there is an easier line to defend: wearing a hat or not is a matter of personal choice, but for many people, e.g. competitors, those who ride in public, those with a public profile, it's also a matter of setting a good example for other, many of whom are children. This gives many people an extra reason to make the choice to wear a hat. In addition, riding in a certain context, e.g. at a livery yard, at a competition, involves having to ride under the rules of that establishment and horse organisations and societies should have rules for wearing hats as part of their duty of care towards those who ride under their rules. If that were followed most people would wear hats most of the time 

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But i think that's my point. We can pull people to pieces for all sorts of choices they make in their life. I for one can never understand why anyone would choose to smoke, it's disgusting, it's expensive and inevitably it will probably kill you. But i don't get on my high horse about it when others choose to.

Smoking is a personal choice, and it's accepted by most people, even though it's a bigger known killer than not wearing a hat whilst riding.

So why do people get so upset about riding without a hat, but not smoking?


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## Prince33Sp4rkle (19 July 2010)

ditto the comments re smoking, and as for CKD....i heard she was riding on a concrete walkway between two arenas when the accident happened, not actually in an arena.....


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## rowy (19 July 2010)

thelwell_girl said:



			Just out of curiousity, Courtney King-Dye was riding one of her very well schooled horses, whom she knew well, in a menage...
		
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I know there is still a risk, but it is severly reduced when riding in a menage than out on the roads. I personally wouldn't ride without a hat, other than in comps later on when i get to wear a top hat . But I was just saying I could understand people that did in this case


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## wilsha (19 July 2010)

always wear a hat you must be crazy to ride without! i always ride ith a body protector cos im forced to , no body protector means im not allowed my pony!!!! not fair  the only time i dont wear a hat when im on a horse is if i sit n him in the field


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## Thelwell_Girl (19 July 2010)

Prince33Sp4rkle said:



			ditto the comments re smoking, and as for CKD....i heard she was riding on a concrete walkway between two arenas when the accident happened, not actually in an arena.....
		
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Her website and the news stories say she was schooling, as did the account of her accident.  Even if she was riding along a concrete walkway... Even more reason to don that helmet!



rowy said:



			I know there is still a risk, but it is severly reduced when riding in a menage than out on the roads. I personally wouldn't ride without a hat, other than in comps later on when i get to wear a top hat . But I was just saying I could understand people that did in this case 

Click to expand...

I do see what you mean... If I ever get to the level you are at (in a looooooooong time!) you can bet I'll be accessorising my tails with a lovely velvet helmet!


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## Saratoga (19 July 2010)

wilsha said:



			the only time i dont wear a hat when im on a horse is if i sit n him in the field 

Click to expand...

And that's safer because....???


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## Booboos (19 July 2010)

Saratoga said:



			But i think that's my point. We can pull people to pieces for all sorts of choices they make in their life. I for one can never understand why anyone would choose to smoke, it's disgusting, it's expensive and inevitably it will probably kill you. But i don't get on my high horse about it when others choose to.

Smoking is a personal choice, and it's accepted by most people, even though it's a bigger known killer than not wearing a hat whilst riding.

So why do people get so upset about riding without a hat, but not smoking?
		
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We do restrict smoking in ways that have to do with making an impression on others. For example, advertising for smoking is not allowed on TV, TV shows and films avoid showing people smoke especially in a gramorous, positive light, smoking is heavily taxed to discourage people from doing so, loads of money is spent on educating young people about the dangers of smoking in the hope they will chose not to smoke, etc. So we both think that others have a choice on whether to smoke or not and we say they are wrong to chose to smoke and take steps to discourage them from doing so.

Saying that someone has a choice, is not tantamount to accepting that any choice they make is as good as any other. Some choices are less wise than others and, inevitably, this will be pointed out. In some circumstances, e.g. from one friend to another, we expect other people to point out our unwise choices and they would be remiss if they didn't do so.


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## little_flea (19 July 2010)

Very well thought out post, as always Booboos (I can see why you are in your current profession! ;-) 

I guess the dangers of not wearing a hat in comparison to smoking/drinking/being overweight doesn't really ring true because the process of dying from self-induced health problems is much slower and also something that can be at least partly reversed if behaviour changes, and it is also very much a grey area and a process - you won't unexpectedly drop dead just out of the blue by being overweight - you will most likely be aware of the lead-up to this point and the signs of danger can often be enough to change behaviour - so at which point, some "remorse" has been shown and steps in the right direction have been taken, the person "deserves" treatment... 

Importantly, smoking/over-eating etc are also types of addictions, whereas riding without a hat is not. Just putting on a hat when you go for a ride is a much smaller sacrifice than giving up over-eating/fighting alcoholism - these are deep-rooted psychological issues that are behavioural manifestations of all sorts of issues. The choice to not wear a hat is nothing like that. But very few of us are completely logical in our choices in life - I would never get on a horse without a hat, but I do ride my bike in (not very heavy, but still) traffic without a helmet etc.


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## flyingfeet (19 July 2010)

Booboos said:



			So we both think that others have a choice on whether to smoke or not and we say they are wrong to chose to smoke and take steps to discourage them from doing so.
		
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Yes but if you are smoking pre-made cigarettes you are using a filter to lower particulates, which make them 'safer' (or make you inhale deeper and get more addicted depending on your train of thought!), so kind of akin to wearing a hat!

Not wearing a hat is like smoking roll ups - i.e. you take the full risk. 

I have no issue with people wanting to bash their brains out, but I do have an issue with selfish people not considering their family and taking a basic  precaution. 

Interestingly when seat belts were made compulsory there were people complaining about their civil liberties. Its just change and when all children use hats, and everyone competes in hats this old school thought will eventually wither away.


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## ChwaraeTeg (19 July 2010)

I have just finished reading these 16 or so pages with great interest.
.
Am not sure if this is the place to post a link which will help those who have been affected by head injury and brain damage.
.
It happened to me. Fractured skull, long term coma , on a life support system.
Unable to walk,talk, feed, dress or communicate for quite a while.
.
Was I wearing a hat ? YES.
.
I saw that television programme on BBC2 last week. I just would like to say, there is always hope.
Meantime, once I was well and truly on the mend, my brother sent me this....
It is a book you can download for free and was a great help for me and my family..
.
http://www.tbiguide.com/index.html
.
If the link has to be removed, please send me a pm and I will send it to you.
( I Hope and pray you will never need to use it )
Tegs


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## Flame_ (19 July 2010)

I love the hat arguments. Oh the hypocrisy. The example a few pages back, (was it melanie griffith?) is an argument for why we should all stay on the flat and not go tear-arsing around fields leaping large fixed fences, not an argument for why we should all have hats on. 

The point about how much we want to take care of ourselves and not be a burden on our families would have some credibility if we all stayed at home knitting and doing sudoku. Horsey people face dangerous situations daily left right and centre but we never give it up. Who here has been mobbed in the middle of a field by a gang of narky horses, more than once and still goes in fields without a hat and tazer gun?

The argument about being a burden on the tax payer - Does that stop people boxing, skate-boarding, smoking, crossing the road at a pelican crossing before the green man comes on, riding explosive horses on the road that just floored the jockey (major hypocrisy)? 

Danger surrounds us all the time. People take their chances. Obsessing about the vital need to wear a hat whenever you get on a horse won't stop you getting run over by a bus. 

Why don't people get as wound up about riders who willingly remount horses that chuck them off - neck and back injuries can cause a few problems as well, its not just heads -  than riders who will only ride horses which operate fairly safely and like not to put a hard hat on?


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## Flame_ (19 July 2010)

CotswoldSJ said:



			Yes but if you are smoking pre-made cigarettes you are using a filter to lower particulates, which make them 'safer' (or make you inhale deeper and get more addicted depending on your train of thought!), so kind of akin to wearing a hat!
		
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The idea of inhaling the "safer" cigs deeper also translates to riding or risk taking in general. Fit ABS brakes to a car so its safer. Soon the driver learns his/her limitations have altered and will drive that bit quicker in wet conditions. Sell a rider a hat, it might make them now feel safe enough to jump, hence their risk factor evens out. 

All just examples, probably not explained very well, but say from now on everyone had to ride with no hats and no saddles, wouldn't most of us just slow down and be careful quite a bit? Not try picking that fight with an arsey 5 year old? Go for the gap not over the thick hedge? Maybe even stay in walk on 35 year old cobs? I bet the number of accidents would soon even themselves out to about the same as they are now, as the chances we choose to take relate to the safety equipment we have.


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## MochaDun (20 July 2010)

Hat always.  Because I value my life and I want to reduce the risk of me, through an accident, which could happen even wearing a hat I know, putting my family and friends through possible hell.  

I've seen and experienced enough in my life both within my own family and others families from just the normal stuff happening - eg, sudden death, disease, mental health problems, accidents  etc to know the life changing impact and repercussions such things can have as they ripple on through life for ever more.  And yes you could say that is just life events happening but if I have some control over certain things that come with a risk factor attached and there is a way I can reduce the risk then I will take them.  Life is too short and sometime challenging enough without major problems for "what if's".


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## bahumbug (21 July 2010)

MochaDun said:



			Life is too short and sometime challenging enough without major problems for "what if's".
		
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Quite! Couldn't agree more ( especially here as an ex-smoker and ex-no hatter LOL)


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## MegaBeast (21 July 2010)

Prince33Sp4rkle said:



			ditto the comments re smoking, and as for CKD....i heard she was riding on a concrete walkway between two arenas when the accident happened, not actually in an arena.....
		
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and was she not riding a youngster?

Can't remember if I posted on this earlier as only read the last couple of pages but I still maintain you're in more danger being around horses on the ground than being on top doing flatwork.  Roadwork and jumping is a different story.  

However, some riders are probably more at risk on the flat than others as they're more likely to be unseated by a spook etc.  I can honestly say I've not fallen off on the flat since I was a child (probably been about 15 years or more), and have only come off whilst jumping less than half a dozen times in the last decade.  I don't mean to sound arrogant but I don't believe it's particularly risky for me.  I seem able to stick on pretty much anything, and I've ridder some very sharp and unpredictable horses on a daily basis.  Saying that I do wear a hat always, except for BD where I wear a beagler purely because I like the look of it.


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## ChwaraeTeg (21 July 2010)

MegaBeast said:



			............................  I can honestly say I've not fallen off on the flat since I was a child (probably been about 15 years or more), and have only come off whilst jumping less than half a dozen times in the last decade.  I don't mean to sound arrogant but I don't believe it's particularly risky for me.  I seem able to stick on pretty much anything, and I've ridder some very sharp and unpredictable horses on a daily basis.  Saying that I do wear a hat always, except for BD where I wear a beagler purely because I like the look of it.
		
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 no offense MegaBeast, but you sound just like me 15- 20 years ago. 
I always had "stickability and such tenacity in any situation. People used to bring me problem horses to sort out for them etc etc...
I have started and trained more horses than I can remember ... but there was one day when a freak accident occurred when I was in my 30s ,that changed my life forever.
My horse fell on me.
.
It was just lucky that I was wearing my hat.
This is a post I started :
http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=385501


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## bahumbug (21 July 2010)

ChwaraeTeg said:



 no offense MegaBeast, but you sound just like me 15- 20 years ago. 
I always had "stickability and such tenacity in any situation. People used to bring me problem horses to sort out for them etc etc...
I have started and trained more horses than I can remember ... but there was one day when a freak accident occurred when I was in my 30s ,that changed my life forever.
My horse fell on me.
.
It was just lucky that I was wearing my hat.
This is a post I started :
http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=385501

Click to expand...

Oh gosh, I started this thread as was rather appalled by Pammy Hutton's comments in HH column, so hope you are not offended. I think it is an interesting discussion. I read MegaBeast's post with that 'oops, be careful what you say' feeling.
Chwarae, as one who has similar background to you but fortunately without the life changing accident, I can't guarantee I'll never have a bad accident, no one can, but I'm going to make damn sure I minimise the risks. Thanks for adding to this, as to all who are speaking from authority/experience. Some of the stories on this thread have been very moing, I hope it has made some of the 'unconvertables' rethink..but it is up to the individual (to take the option not to be darn stupid LOL)


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## MegaBeast (21 July 2010)

bahumbug said:



			Oh gosh, I started this thread as was rather appalled by Pammy Hutton's comments in HH column, so hope you are not offended. I think it is an interesting discussion. I read MegaBeast's post with that 'oops, be careful what you say' feeling.
Chwarae, as one who has similar background to you but fortunately without the life changing accident, I can't guarantee I'll never have a bad accident, no one can, but I'm going to make damn sure I minimise the risks. Thanks for adding to this, as to all who are speaking from authority/experience. Some of the stories on this thread have been very moing, I hope it has made some of the 'unconvertables' rethink..but it is up to the individual (to take the option not to be darn stupid LOL)
		
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Thing is, the point I'm making which gets totally ignored is that for quite a lot of riders the risks of being mounted doing flatwork is a lot lower than that of being on the ground picking feet out and doing general jobs around horses.  This seems to get ignored and until someone can prove otherwise then I'll carry on wearing my beagler for BD and proper hat at home!

Yes, freak accidents occur, can happen in any sport.  Eg dinghy sailing (something else I do) there is a very high risk that you might get whacked over the head by the boom (which believe me hurts and can knock you out/split your skull/knock you unconscious into the water) which is why beginners are normally encouraged to wear safety helmets but once you go beyond that level there is no question that you don't wear one.  Nobody would even dream of it, well I know one elderly bloke that does but nobody else.

So, I have assessed the risk, found it acceptable to both me and my family, am aware of the consequences etc but I'll continue to wear my beagler for BD, which is probably on average once a month!


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## Starbucks (22 July 2010)

Sounds like it's all about image to me...

Have ridden on the odd time without a hat for a few reasons. But I think the dressage people do so because they think it looks good.


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## ChwaraeTeg (23 July 2010)

People who are around horses have a choice. 

It matters not a jot if they think they look smart with a hat, or cool without.
The choice is theirs 
(and I do not judge that choice) ......

As long as it is an INFORMED choice,
that they are AWARE of consequences.

and that they will NEVER need to use the link I posted. 

Happy horse keeping everyone


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## Lexie81 (24 July 2010)

spike123 said:



			I'm a mum. Going hatless doesn't even come into the equation. As far as I am concerned my kids and my husband don't want to end up looking after me due to my stupidity at the end of the day.
		
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100% agree with you. I am a mum to a 7 year old, I owe it to her to stay safe, and to ensure she ALWAYS wears a properly fitted hat when riding.


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## MilosDad (25 July 2010)

I love the choice debate on this issue.
You can choose to sky dive without a parachute too.
Remember that your choice has to include your family and friends, so do be sure to ask everyone if they are cool with looking after you for the rest of your blighted life following your avoidable head injury sustained while riding without a hat.


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## Booboos (25 July 2010)

I'd like to re-iterate that I believe people should have a choice whether they were a hat or not, but in that context, what is the cost of wearing a hat? If the cost is minimal, why not wear it anyway?

I suppose a small number of people may suffer from headaches from hats and for a few days a year it may be very hot and uncomfortable to wear a hat, but for most of the time the cost of wearing a hat seems to be a flattened hair style which doesn't seem like much of a cost.


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## amage (25 July 2010)

The people who say that they don't have people relying on them....what about you horse/horses/other animals? If you're in a coma or being rehabilitated costing thousands what will happen to them?!? And fwiw I do know of a case where insurance refused to pay out as injured party was not wearing a hat!


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## SO1 (25 July 2010)

the smoking arguement does not make sense there are a lot more people that smoke than don't wear riding hats so you would expect more people to die of smoking related diseases than non hat wearing accidents. a lot of people taking up smoking at a young age where perhaps they do not understand the risks and then become addicted and are unable to give up even if they want to.

smoking is very bad for your health and had we known what we do now about smoking when it was first introduced it would have be banned as would have alcohol!


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## manes&tails (26 July 2010)

i've always thought about this one.

I'll admit that i have galloped across a grassy field, bareback, with no hat. And yes, that probably was really quite stupid. But each individual with a horse has a unique situation compared to others. I trusted my pony, new the risk and would accept the consequences.

If you want to guarantee no riding accident, the answer's simple. Don't ride. People still have accidents and die whilst wearing hats and body protectors and every other possible saftey contraption. it is rare, but it can still happen.

We used to live in italy where they hardly ever wear hats, jumping 1metre 50 or above and galloping flat out on hacks. now that we are back in the uk and i am older, i always wear a hat, but hardly ever a body protector as i have been winded and jabbed so many times. I feel i can roll better if i fall off without the restriction, however i would wear one if we did some serious x-country. 

i feel that if someone chooses to ride without a hat i would leave them to it. I hate it when safety conscious people interfere with you. Once two women at a yard came up to me and my friend asking us why we werent wearing reflective vests, even when we had not stepped foot on a road and had been riding in a wood in broad daylight!?  

i dont judge people and let them get on with their lives. Obviously if someone was doing something drastic or completely ridiculously stupid, then i may step in and advise them, but thats just common sense


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## manes&tails (26 July 2010)

amage said:



			The people who say that they don't have people relying on them....what about you horse/horses/other animals? If you're in a coma or being rehabilitated costing thousands what will happen to them?!? And fwiw I do know of a case where insurance refused to pay out as injured party was not wearing a hat!
		
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very true!!


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## SuperSketch (26 July 2010)

Hat.

No question about it. I value my life too much to ever get on a horses back without one. I couldn't bear the thought of being a burden on my family with the horrendous consequences should the worst happen if I ever did decide to go hatless.


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## redcascade (28 July 2010)

I know what a controversial subject this is but I fell off my horse yesterday who i know extremely well and am very much in pain today despite wearing my hat.
This is the fall:





My hat afterwards, note the dents on the band, not visible from the outside:





Despite wearing my hat a have a bad headache, a bruise on my forehead(next my fingers on pic)  Have bruised the bridge of my nose, my eye and there's a bruise coming up on my cheek too, I also have a sore neck. My face this afternoon:





I know it's a matter of choice but I can't imagine what would've happened if I wasn't wearing my hat, the horse landed on me and pushed my face into the sand, 17hh of muscle, TBxWB is not fun in this instance! Please learn from my experience which could have been much worse, there is the entire sequence in NL and CR if anyone's interested


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## bahumbug (28 July 2010)

redcascade said:



			Please learn from my experience which could have been much worse
		
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Red Cascade I hope you are over it soon, very dramatic to look at. It was that sort of incident that changed my mind against chancing it sans hat. I hope people looking at this will think again too if they have not made a decision already. 

Best of luck to you!


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## redcascade (28 July 2010)

Thanks bahumbug, replacing the hat tomorrow, and will be getting back on as soon as my neck allows, I will NEVER get on a horse without my hat again, not even breifly as I've experienced it first hand WITH a hat and know how much it hurts


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## Cadburys_addict (28 July 2010)

Hi
Following on from the above fall and I hope you feel better soon, my horse threw me off over his head onto a hard track - i landed on my shoulder and back mainly but I know that I hit my head as my flourescent hat cover had a nice big muddy mark.....although my head didnt take the brunt of my fall, I dread to think what could have happened had I not been wearing it.....I could have been knocked out or worse.....I did replace my hat afterwards as I didnt feel it would give me the right protection should anything else happen.....I sure as hell ached for days after 

It may be people's individual choice when it comes to wearing hats but in my opinion I value my hat just like I value putting my seat belt on when I drive my car because you never ever know what could happen....


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## Flame_ (28 July 2010)

redcascade said:



			I know what a controversial subject this is but I fell off my horse yesterday who i know extremely well and am very much in pain today despite wearing my hat.
This is the fall:





Click to expand...

OK, you had a bad fall and your hat made the injury less serious. 

Why isn't everyone up in arms about you jumping? If you hadn't been jumping, your horse wouldn't have fallen and you wouldn't have needed your hat to protect your head. 

Glad you're OK, btw.


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## redcascade (28 July 2010)

I agree with your comment about jumping Flame_ but... look what happened to Courtney King Dye? She's a top rider and was meerly schooling a horse on a surface when it slipped and fell, putting her in a coma. The question is, if she was wearing a hat could the coma and thousands of dollars and heart ache on behalf of the hopsital and her family been saved?
I know that it's really none of my business what other people choose to do, it's their head at the end of the day, but, if people see what happens with a hat they may wonder what would've happened to me without one. None of my business but I'm still sat here with a headache over a day later 
Thanks, so do I


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## imafluffybunny (28 July 2010)

I used to ride proffesionally in Germany, I never wore at hat, I rode exceptionally well schooled horses up to Grand Prix, I DID however come off once when the horse threw a hiss fit, totally out of the blue and hit my head off the side of the indoor school. 
Personally, I now always ride with a hat, I dont think its an excuse to say my horse is well schooled, they are unpredictable animals. 

Its your choice at the end of the day.


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## burtonse (3 August 2010)

i always wear a hat when out hacking or jumping or when riding an unfamiliar horse. i generally dont when in the arena flatting horses i ride every day. my main reason for this is the likelihood of me falling off in this situation is much much lower and when i have several horses to ride i end up with a sweaty head and a headache on a daily basis esp in the summer.

As others have said, its up to the individual to choose as its their head!


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## intheair (3 August 2010)

Having recently had a fall landing on my head (wearing an HS1) the impact was painful but my head was OK - unfortunately I cant say the same for my lower back (wearing a protector) multiple fractures in sacrum! I am mending and can walk so very lucky!

Would never ride without a HAT!


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## niagaraduval (3 August 2010)

I must admit to not wearing a hat on more than several occasions. Very naughty! 
I think it's more the fact I feel more confortable without a hat and I just tack up and get on, also I seem to have really sensitive ears as soon as they get even slightly cold I get a very bad headache. So in the winter I have always have a fleecy winter hat and my hat won't fit over it so I just go out without one. Also in the summer when it gets really hot I have been known to just nip out without one in the evenings.

I really think people shoul wear them though, I am definately making more of an effort to put mine on. Although I need a new one as it doesn't fit me very well and I just don't like it.

It annoys me to see top showjumpers or whatever not wearing them though on tv etc. What a bad example !


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## bahumbug (3 August 2010)

niagaraduval said:



			I seem to have really sensitive ears as soon as they get even slightly cold I get a very bad headache.
		
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This is priceless! You'll obviously have an even worse headache if you land on your head. Has that ever occurred to you? 

PS The showjumper bit is just so annoying after what you've just said..is it their fault you're daft?


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## niagaraduval (3 August 2010)

bahumbug said:



			This is priceless! You'll obviously have an even worse headache if you land on your head. Has that ever occurred to you? 

PS The showjumper bit is just so annoying after what you've just said..is it their fault you're daft?
		
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I know I should wear a hat and I often do but on some occasions I don't, But I am working on that, I never wore a hat when I was young as I was always riding all the time and I just didn't, my father never wore a hat either.. 
I think the showjumper comment is for kids more than adults..
I make my own choices to wear a hat or not.


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## bahumbug (3 August 2010)

niagaraduval said:



			I never wore a hat when I was young as I was always riding all the time and I just didn't, my father never wore a hat either.. 
QUOTE]

Funny that as I always did wear a hat as a child as was in a yard that also had a riding school and we had to be 'correctly turned out' at all times. Was only later I started to get bit cowboy. Can appreciate the background but I actually have made a firm decision, hot or not, hat.
		
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## mumoftwo (5 August 2010)

Having lived and kept horses in Spain for five years it is the norm' for Spanish people not to wear hats (one old guy asked me if I was scared of my horse becuase I was wearing a hat). Even some of the English ladies keeping horses on the yard had slipped into the 'no hat' camp until we arrived and wore our hats every time we rode. As a result, two of the owners decided to buy and wear hats as well - two days later one of the women was thrown whilst out in the campo and broke a collar bone and hit her head really badly. Had she not been wearing her new hat, who knows?

We owe it to ourselves, our families and our horses to keep ourselves safe - it's not a sign of experience to ride without a hat - it's a sign of ignorance.


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## venus89 (5 August 2010)

hat or no hat i can not understand what i say......
but anyways i choose the hat


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## Onyxia (5 August 2010)

niagaraduval said:



			I know I should wear a hat and I often do but on some occasions I don't, But I am working on that, I never wore a hat when I was young as I was always riding all the time and I just didn't, my father never wore a hat either.. 
I think the showjumper comment is for kids more than adults..
I make my own choices to wear a hat or not.
		
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It really is not.
Kids have parents-there is no way in hell my son would be allowed on without a hat.
Adults are the ones stupid enough to copy whatever name and put themself at risk.
I would sugest you get a new hat if your one is making your head ache and get it fitted.

Obviously,I am a parent,so am a little more safety aware now.
There were times when I younger that I would jump on an old faithfull without a hat in the summer to save mysef hat hair.
Now I simply can't stand the thought of my OH having to tell our son mummy wont be comming home because she did not want a sweaty head.


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## Paddydou (5 August 2010)

Personally I think times are a' changing. Where as once it was considered an extra to wear a hat not we are far more safety concious about the whole thing. 

I wear my hat (I feel weird with out it), but I have also ridden with out it, the last time I actually went back and got it as I couldn't concentrate and it felt weird. 

But (and here is the big but) I have a body protector and never wear it, even on cross country courses. I hate it. It restricts me I can't sit up properly and balance in the saddle with it on, I feel like its pushing me forward all the time my bum is massive and is pushes on my lower spine and makes me sit in a weird way. In 15 years of owning one I have worn it all of once. In fact I don't even know what I have done with it other than I know I haven't got rid of it. I felt very unsafe wearing it because I couldn't get the right balance, feel in my seat.

I believe that in a few more years time we will not be discussing hat or not but other safety issues such as body protector or not. 

I do not agree with those who do not wear hats but it is their life, their decision and as such I respect that. No its not a good role model issue to not wear a hoat but then hey most teenagers are looking up to Katie Price and if we go by that we will have a generation of blinged out horses with riders who are full of silicone and botox. Dressage arenas will be covered in pink and wonderbras...!


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## EventingDaun (5 August 2010)

Unless I know for certain that we're going swimming in the pond or lake, I always wear my hat. When I was younger (growing up on a country ranch, then riding horses at a polo barn) I rarely wore a hat, because back then in the area very few people did, and I guess my dad didn't know that either he or I were supposed to wear hats!

I am so grateful and feel so lucky that the worst equine related injury I sustained in that period was a broken arm rather than brain damage, and possibly death!


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## applecart14 (5 August 2010)

Having suffered from severe concussion which involved a stay in ITU, a CT scan, a suspected brain bleed following a fall from a horse in a sand covered menage WITH a hat on I felt incredibly lucky to have got away with what I did and most probably wouldn't be here now unless I'd worn one.  To me not wearing one is like driving a car without a seatbelt, jumping XC without a body protector or climbing a mountain without a safety rope.

Many years ago a fellow livery died following a fall from a horse (she was wearing a hat but it did not fit her correctly).  When something like that happens on your door step you  tend to learn a lesson quickly.


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## asommerville (5 August 2010)

Having been bucked off on Sunday and landed on my head, i feel very lucky to have been able to get up and chase after my horse....however very stupidly did not have on a body protector and i have been hobbling about for the past few days!  So i woudl say always have a hat on and i'm going bnody protector hunting this weekend.

Also was suprised to get to the yard yesterdya to find that one of the kids who was there when i feel off and said how bad it was had fallen off her horse and had no hat on!!! needless to say she got very very sore ears from me!


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## rupertsmum (9 August 2010)

i've been riding for the last couple of weeks in a baseball cap!  Have always ridden in a hat and don't know why i havene't been recently, probably becasue i've only been riding round the fields at home.
last Thursday i feel off my non -spooky, 'safe' boy and bruised my pelvis quite badly, however, just in the moment where you know you have parted company and know it's going to hurt all I cold think of was 'oh  my goodness i haven't got a hat on!'

OK hat on from now on................. please take note of my story. as i was riding- i was in a day dream and thinking how well he was going, he didn't do anything wrong, just went sideways!
could have been much, much  worse


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## Kaylum (9 August 2010)

hat for whatever equestrian event your doing or horse your riding.  Had an unflappable bombproof horse and had him for many years.  One day riding down the bridlepath and without any warning whatsoever he reared very high and I fell off.  Just goes to show any horse not matter what you think can rear.  We think he was stung.  

Have seen a top event rider fall off her horse and end up in the school wall, had a hat on though.  Flat work in the school can be worse than jumping (never really got why its different to wear a hat for jumping and not for flat work).


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## MilosDad (10 August 2010)

Darwinian selection at work here.
Whether you wear a hat or not; for you it is a choice. For your relatives and friends there is no choice.
For the people who have to sort out your injuries there is no choice.
Before you make your choice experience what it is like to tell someone their loved one is brain injured and may die/be damaged forever
How can I put this politely..well I can't.
If you don't wear a hat you are stupid and that is where Darwinian selection comes in.


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## Saucisson (10 August 2010)

Darwinian selection at work here.
		
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Surely &#8220;Darwinian Selection&#8221;(I prefer the term natural selection) would be the following:-

Individual chooses not to wear hat, has offspring who inherit the inclination to both ride horses and not to wear a hat.  Offspring of original individual all die in riding accidents due to head injuries. Genetic line is discontinued. 

Or, take two individuals, one chooses to wear a hat and one doesn't, both have offspring who inherhit the hat/no hat inclination.  Offspring cycle continues and various accidents occur.  Natural selection only comes into force if one or other families evolve a resistance to death by head injuries.  This may occur in the non-hat wearing group as individuals who survive falls may have thicker skulls/protective plastic type hair/better brain cushioning and develop this feature in their descendants.  

So, if natural selection is the argument, I propose that the non-hat wearing group are the &#8220;winners&#8221; as they are more likely to produce a &#8220;super safe&#8221; race of thick-skulled equestrians who have no need for a hat &#8211; that would no good for the hard hat industry at all and many people will loose their jobs..................so wear a hat for them (and to avoid the protective hair, not keen on that for the species).

Of course non of this applies if the individual doesn't get the chance to breed so I guess it may apply to non-hat wearing children.  Injuries do not apply unless the individual is prevented from breeding.

*tongue residing a little bit in the cheek so don't get worked up*


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## EAST KENT (14 August 2010)

OH Goody..so as a non breeder it is`nt a problem NOT wearing a hat then


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## GingerToo (18 August 2010)

HAT!
Being at a dressage yard surrounded by people who are not riding in hats I was mocked for having a skull cap on with the chin strap fastened, I always stood up for myself and kept it on.
And the other day one of my 'non hat' friends fell off doing flat work and hit his head on the fence and was knocked clean out! All I said to him was, 'You should have worn a hat'. Thankfuly he learnt his lesson, so did the rest of the no-hatters!!!!!


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## ali985 (19 August 2010)

Hat deffo 4 me, have fallen off sooo many times and hit my head i dont think i wld b here now if i wasnt wearing my hat!!


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## 4leggedfurries (20 August 2010)

I've always worn a hat to ride, my parents instilled it in me from when I first started.  They did this as I'm the most accident prone person they know and if anyone was going to have an accident it would be me!  This was brought back to the fore a couple of weeks ago when I took a crashing fall head first onto the tarmac while out hacking, the horse put in the tinest spook at nothing and I just went out the side door.  Even with my hat on I was still nearly knocked out, was dazed and confused and was seeing stars until the next day.  It was nearly 6 hours later before I could string a proper sentance together.  When I got home my dad pulled my hat apart (as there was no way I'd be waring it again) so we could see the damage.  Right there in front of my eyes was an undeniable dent in the foam, had I not been wearing my hat, that would have been my skull and I wouldnt have been seeing stars, I probably wouldnt have been seing anything at all!! Dont mean to sound dramatic, but my accident was 'just one of those things' which could have ended so much worse.  Thankfully all I suffered were minor injuries and re-cracking my ribs for the 3rd time, plus a headache for the weekend.  Ok its cost me £70 to replace my hat, which I could ill afford, but whats £70 when it can save your life??


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## xloopylozzax (20 August 2010)

*havent read all posts*

all i can say is evolution is a wonderful thing, those who are stupid enough to ride without a hat will be removed from the gene pool soon enough without us worrying over them.


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## cobface (20 August 2010)

I have fallen on my head too many times - not worth the risk for me TBH.
Flat work - horses spooked mid canter totally unexpected
Road work - horse reared and flipped, landed on my head on the concrete - cue hat actually split!! i still had to go to hospital as i was dizzy as hell when i stood up, infact i would have been dead if not wearing one
Jumping - too many times

Plus i have two young children to think about


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## jojo5 (20 August 2010)

Sorry, but, how is this even a question???


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## nuttynugget (9 September 2010)

Got bucked off and kicked in the head.. If I wasn't wearing a hat the metal shoe wouldve split my head open.as it was I still had to have a hospital stay if i wasnt wearing a hat couldve been a lot worse!!!

People that dont wear hats are idiots in my opinion. A simple item which could save your life.

Every horse can spook or trip.. Every rider can fall off


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## Beth&Cleo (9 September 2010)

Ok, haven't read all posts so sorry if I'm repeating what someone has said.
 I think riding without a helmet is incredibly irrasponsible. So it's your choice whether you wear one or not but what about the family and friends who have to deal with the after affects should you have an accident?


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## SpockkyBoy (10 September 2010)

Always wear my hat riding- with it done up.

Fallen off schooling and jumping and had some bad concussion in the past too (could of been worse but my helmets have taken the brunt of it). Even fallen off in halt before! Never had it drilled into me to wear a hat, but to me helmets were in invented for a reason.


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## ArcticFox (10 September 2010)

I would always wear a riding hat every time I sit in a saddle, when I am jumping my horse at home I also wear a body protector.  My husband is not horsey and would not understand if I didn't, most of the time I am on my own when schooling too.  

I have had occasional falls one my horses in the past, some have been the most sensible horses I have ever sat on - I fell off on a road as a man on the other side of the hedge started his strimmer just as we were riding past, I was very glad to be riding with a hat and it wasn't the horses fault.

As a BE rider, I am amazed that so many people at intro level (Until this year) would wear patey hats to do dressage - I have watched horses rearing and bucking with their rider wearing a hat that wouldn't help them if they fell off. I am so pleased to hear that some dressage riders are now making it a rule that they must be worn.

I appreciate that there is freedom of choice but as our sport is constantly fighting to remain an olympic sport we cannot allow those people to ban it due to safety because some people can't be a**ed to wear a hat.  

I would like to add though that if I ever get to compete at an international event I hope that a hat company has brought out a BS standard top hat by then as they do look cool (if they haven't then I will still be wearing by navy blue hat with 5 point harness!)


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## KarynK (12 September 2010)

Well wearing hats and body protectors are creeping into that outpost of the tough and IMO loony world of the Pro Bull Rider Circuit.   I love this and have been watching it for a few years (though I can't really see why you would do this rather than eat the steak) BUT the helmet brigade are growing thankfully!  In this particular case I think Stormy owes his life to his helmet!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JMsBDb6N8UY

Though to some the safety Vs cool tradition message is has not penetrated the extra thick skull evolution has given the dumber cowboy!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0948_B6r1kA


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## lannerch (12 September 2010)

After a coma, two weeks in intensive care as the result of a riding accident when hat was not properly secured..... hat always!
( and now always secured )

My well schooled horse deposited me whilst schooling a few months back, a cat (black but not lucky) jumped out into the areana from no where, horse spun quicker than I even realised what was happening, I just missed the fence in my fall.

Horses are animals, they are not bombproof anything can happen with any horse even whilst schooling!

Riding itself is a risk by itself don't be selfish to your family and increase it by being reckless!


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## guido16 (12 September 2010)

I never wear a hat, I am far to good a rider to ever fall off. My horses are perfectly schooled and understand that they can not ever buck, rear, nap etc

I think I look pretty darn cool without a hat on, its a fashion statement and means I can wear baseball hats to match the colour of my jodhs. 

My head is not as heavy as my hips so if god forbid, I ever did fall off, the laws of gravity would make my hips overtake my head and land me in an upright position.

Oh, hang on.....no, thats not right.    In actual fact, I am not a complete TWONK

I do wear a hat.   Always.


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## lannerch (12 September 2010)

guido16 said:



			I never wear a hat, I am far to good a rider to ever fall off. My horses are perfectly schooled and understand that they can not ever buck, rear, nap etc

I think I look pretty darn cool without a hat on, its a fashion statement and means I can wear baseball hats to match the colour of my jodhs. 

My head is not as heavy as my hips so if god forbid, I ever did fall off, the laws of gravity would make my hips overtake my head and land me in an upright position.

Oh, hang on.....no, thats not right.    In actual fact, I am not a complete TWONK

I do wear a hat.   Always.
		
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Does that mean your hips are still heavier than you head ? lol


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## guido16 (12 September 2010)

Because of the weight my hat adds to my head, I have added a few more layers of cellulite to my hips, just to be on the safe side......


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## Shutterbug (12 September 2010)

KarynK said:



			Well wearing hats and body protectors are creeping into that outpost of the tough and IMO loony world of the Pro Bull Rider Circuit.   I love this and have been watching it for a few years (though I can't really see why you would do this rather than eat the steak) BUT the helmet brigade are growing thankfully!  In this particular case I think Stormy owes his life to his helmet!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JMsBDb6N8UY

Though to some the safety Vs cool tradition message is has not penetrated the extra thick skull evolution has given the dumber cowboy!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0948_B6r1kA

Click to expand...

I was watching this the other night and commented to my OH that they were now wearing what appeared to be football helmets like they wear in American Footie (or rugby for wimps as my dad used to call it )


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## Carefreegirl (12 September 2010)

Always for me but theres a  mum with a 10 month old baby at the yard who doesn't, I've told her I think she's mad but it's up to her. Just hope I'm not there when it goes tits up as it nearly has a few times, I don't want to clear up the mess. I believe the law is that under the age of 14 you must wear a hat on the roads.


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## KarynK (12 September 2010)

Hevs said:



			I was watching this the other night and commented to my OH that they were now wearing what appeared to be football helmets like they wear in American Footie (or rugby for wimps as my dad used to call it )
		
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Just makes me go cold when the wrangler hands him back the cowboy hat at the end, your head is never going to stand much of an animal several times your size standing on it!  In fact it's frightening how little your head can stand and anything up to standard you put on it cool or not is going to help your chances of surviving. 

It scares me what I used to ride in as a kid, there were no regulations and no safety standards and my hat was appalling, but no one minded and it was comfortable!  A bit like top level dressage and especially eventing, that top hat looks so good but it is likely not to be with you when you hit the deck from your often tall, highly charged mount!

But here's a question for you all how many of you change your hat after a fall or more to the point dropping it on the concrete ?


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## sjdress (12 September 2010)

Prince33Sp4rkle said:



			you push the speed limit a little, i ride well schooled,well balanced, none spooky horses on a rubber surface......risk is probably less to me, far more people die in RTA each year than falling off horses.
		
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Im sorry but i have to say that after working in a hospital and seeing what happens to people and their families when they have a head injury from falling off a horse because they do not think its cool to wear a hat or think they are invinsible i'd say speeding a bit with a seat belt on is much less risk.  I really dont understand why people dont wear hats, takes 2 seconds to put one on...


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## Saucisson (13 September 2010)

Ok, I am only here really as a bit of a Devils Advocate.

I always wear my hat but I do appreciate that this is the result of indoctrination and pressure from my Mother etc ( but my Father was a tunnelling engineer who handled explosives and worked underground all his life and died of..stomach ulcersat 49).

My OH is a military man who has seen some pretty horrible things in life.  He never wears a hat unless he is in competition.  He is also 16 yrs older than me and has a lot more experience of horses.  I dont argue with him, horses are his hobby and his pleasure.  He could easily have died in different circumstances before in his life.  I do not dictate to him the risks.  For me, it would make ME stupid to do that.

All I can say is this, wear your hat.  Its better that dribbling  food down your dress in 5 years.

However, do not judge other people so harshly who dont have the same generation/nationality/ money/ horses/ disciplines etc   etc


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## Pheme (13 September 2010)

It's not a question for me, never get on without a hat.


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## Vetwrap (15 September 2010)

Hat - always.  Schooling, hacking, loading, working with young and unfamiliar horses on the ground.  Hi-viz as well, having learnt from experience...


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## MagicMelon (17 September 2010)

Always a hat without a doubt.  People who choose not to wear one are ignorant, arrogant and selfish.


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## Foxfolly (18 September 2010)

Never ever ride without a hat!

OH ended up in hospital for 10 days with a fractured skull and bleeding on the brain last year after an incident when bringing some yearlings in from the field. He was never unconscious but still can't remember the first 5 days in hospital even though I could have a conversation with him, as head injuries go his wasn't that bad but it still took him 6 months to fully recover and he has been left with a wierd sense of smell!! Thank god it was the youngsters with no shoes on, if they had been shod he might not be here today!!

Anyway we now always wear hats when bringing the horses in from the field. Our hats are by the door of the stables and it is now just second nature to grab a headcollar and a hat! Its just not worth the risk IMO!!


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## suze0103 (20 September 2010)

I would never consider riding without a hat and anyone that does is either plain stupid or just showing off! you could be the world's best rider and can still fall off. 

I was watching one of my friends ride her horse the other day wearing trainers and not wearing her hat, in her words she never rides in a hat anymore! Her horse hasn't been ridden for a while so was full of energy and leaping around and I honestly felt scared for her whilst watching her!


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## kazhar (20 September 2010)

To be honest it ever occured to me NOT to wear a hat! its akin to not puting a seat belt on or using a child seat for your baby. its all about reducing the risk....you could be the best rider in the world, think your horse is totally bombproof etc, but at the end of the day...horses are not machines. they are animals. they dont have gears and brakes that always do as you say. they have minds of their own sometimes and it only takes one slip up and your dead. having worked in A and E for many years, it just makes me want to walk away from the next head injury that says.." oh but it messes my hair up" or its cool to go hatless! too late after your a vegetable to say oh I wish  had worn a hat. I really dont get what the big deal is...never ever heard anyone say oh look at her, no hat...shes soooooo cool! just makes me think that no hat = no common sense.


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