# Help with my youngster



## moomoos (22 March 2016)

Hey horsey people. I'm in need of some advice, with youngsters what is normal behavior after being backed? I know this is like asking how long is a piece of string. But I've got alsorts going through my head. 
She's fab in traffic, Will hack alone and in company but if she sees horses behind the bushes or horses running in their fields she bolts or starts walking backwards. 
Also riding in the school we have battles going on if I ask any more than walk. 
She knows walk, trot and canter. 
Any help would be greatly appreciated. 

Many thanks


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## BethH (22 March 2016)

Have you taught her to long rein, it's a really good way of being able to teach voice commands on the ground that you can use then use ridden whilst teaching a leg aid, they are also able to go forward more easily without a rider too whilst you get them a little bit stronger and ensure they respond quickly to the request.  I also find it useful for teaching them to steady themselves by slowing down - riddenwise if they lose focus on their rider and you need them not to panic it a voice command like steady is invaluable.

I think the other horses situation is fairly usual for a green, inexperienced horse, it's her getting a bit panicky about who she should listen too (i.e., you or the other horses) and what she should do. Does she behave in the same way if she is ridden out with a more established companion?  Wonder if she needs a more experienced horse with her now and again to boost her confidence.


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## moomoos (22 March 2016)

Hi BethH, yes i have long reined her and she's perfect. If I'm on the ground she's a happy,  confident mare who'll listen to whatever I want her to do but the moment I'm on or carting it goes down hill from there, now I have my thoughts on this, could it really be lack of confidence from my part?  After bolting home I'm terrified. Every time I see a horse or something move fast from a bush I do tense up. I try my hardest not to. 
If we're in company she's generally ok aslong as they don't panic.


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## BethH (24 March 2016)

My horse was a very difficult youngster and has never felt confident hacking out alone so I completely understand where you are coming from.  It's one of those things I make myself do rather than enjoy doing and I have to ride every stride to pre-empt the potential black horse scenario if something catches his eye.

I do think as a youngster I didn't ride him confidently enough and that didn't help, but we did also find out he had a back problem causing him niggling pain and I think that made him tense and he learned to feel safe by running away, may be worth a check over, but when they are young they do get themselves in a pickle especially if they feel it from you and if they are changing shape and the saddle isn't 100% comfy that also doesn't help.  

Do you know a good but sympathetic rider / instructor that can hack her out for you a couple of times.  It really helped me to watch someone else on my horse whilst I was on the ground walking with them.  I think when they are tense it can feel much worse sitting on them than they appear from the ground.  My horse went from doing motorbike 3 point turns with 2 legs in the air, to kissing the cows that were terrifying him on one such hack, however given some of the stunts he pulled, I've never completely trusted him and I sure he knows it!!!

Get someone with a decent sticky bum to help you tackle it.  You definitely need to nip it in the bud before it becomes an established habit.  Good luck, not an enjoyable experience by any means!


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## moomoos (25 March 2016)

Her back and teeth were checked.  

So nice to hear that I'm not the only one. Everything you have said is exactly how I feel.  I dread riding her 

How old is your youngster now and what is he like now.


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## BethH (26 March 2016)

Ah well that's a whole other story - but he is now 16, his problems were caused by Kissing Spines - so rather different to yours, but he felt like I was sitting on a razor blade most of the time, I never knew quite what was going to happen next.  He was operated on, really settled down afterwards and actually on the whole is extremely well behaved now 99.9% of the time.  

He is sharp but then he's a conne x & they're generally to smart for their own good! But he is now excellent hacking in company, he will hack alone although it is never going to be his favourite thing nor mine!  He has been out to shows alone and coped well and is now so beautifully schooled I just have to breathe or think it and he generally does it bless him.  My biggest regret is not de-sensitising him well enough as a youngster, the KS made made doing so really hard, but I would do loads of handy pony type sessions with your horse and try and get out to a few clinics as seeing the world a bit more really helps.

Have to say I have owned him for 12years and still haven't met a horse I like as a person or to ride nearly as much as him, he's wonderful and I think all the difficulties have given us a great bond and has meant I've had to do a really good job on the ground and that has been invaluable in every respect. I am certain that as you make  progress you will find the same.  He has also made me 10x the rider I would have been had I not had to learn to deal with his issues, so all in all a bit of a rollercoaster but a fantastic learning curve on reflection!

But the point about them being very over sensitive as youngsters is true I think for most horses, they have to learn to deal with the world and these days it's a pretty scary place.  Would your horse cope with being walked out in hand?  Mind would trust me more on the ground than ridden so if yours is the same that could be a way of helping her to cope with her worries if you are noticing regular scary points on a hack?  Also, I think when they start to do more work it can make them a bit anxious so the tension might be making her feel a bit sore in herself maybe worth a bodyworker going over her.

You are seriously not alone, very definitely not the only one at all - young horses are challenging and yours sounds as if she's coping better than mine did, she is at just the age where they like to push the boundaries a bit.  Mine started off well and about a year into his ridden work became really quite offensive!  He is the most gentle soul in the world now but I took many very deep breaths!!!!


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## RebeccaClark (26 March 2016)

Okay well i have a youngster as well, firstly she will be good in traffic because she hasn't learnt or been conditioned to be scared of it.

She will either bolt or start walking backwards because she's either in fear of these horses, surprised or she's being naughty, naturally horses are pack animals, she will want to go to the horses or join them if they're running, however if she bolts away from them this can be a sign of being scared of them as she doesn't know them or just bad plain manners. 

The battles in the school is a baby green thing, be assertive and make her do it, don't let her hassle you around, you're the boss and she needs to learn. When she gets to trust you she wont bolt and she will understand why you make her do certain things. 

You're doing great


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## be positive (26 March 2016)

RebeccaClark said:



			Okay well i have a youngster as well, firstly she will be good in traffic because she hasn't learnt or been conditioned to be scared of it.

She will either bolt or start walking backwards because she's either in fear of these horses, surprised or she's being naughty, naturally horses are pack animals, she will want to go to the horses or join them if they're running, however if she bolts away from them this can be a sign of being scared of them as she doesn't know them or just bad plain manners. 

The battles in the school is a baby green thing, be assertive and make her do it, don't let her hassle you around, you're the boss and she needs to learn. When she gets to trust you she wont bolt and she will understand why you make her do certain things. 

You're doing great

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I guess you have not dealt with many youngsters, your post is rather simplistic and assumes that the OP's horse is being naughty if she is not scared, to say assert your authority is fine if the horse actually understands what is being asked, if you force a confused horse to comply then you are setting it up to fail or become even more confused and this is how many horses are ruined early on in life. 
You need to build trust and confidence not make them do things with no understanding of why or how, most horses don't bolt as a first option they give warnings that they are unsure and an experienced trainer will read these signals before the horse panics, the OP needs some help to get through this stage as she is not confident enough herself to assert her authority without risking it getting worse.

There is a saying some trainers use that I like to use, "if the horse doesn't understand the question find another way of asking", to me it is about finding how to communicate with them and if something is not working you need to go about it in a different way and that rarely involves battling with them.


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## moomoos (26 March 2016)

Sorry have been bit quiet I've got a lady with youngster experience coming tomorrow morning to come watch me and we'll go from there. Thank you all for taking your time to reply to me. Really appreciate it and will take all advice on board, whether it's something I want to hear or not. She is an amazing horse, actually quite loving for a mare. I personally think it's me I will get through it even it means lots of lessons. I've recently found out she's a year younger than I brought her as. I think this is playing a big part as I'm always subconsciously always thinking about it which means I'm not 100% relaxed, I've only had these problems since I found out. I can walk her for miles when I'm on the ground long reining her.


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## twiggy2 (26 March 2016)

Op if horse feels scared get off and give support from the ground, if she has confidence in you when you are on the ground use it to your advantage, get off until she feels more confidence and the get back on.
my mare was very confident with me on the floor and I soent the first yer without a school and just hacking, if something worried her I gotoff we said hello walked back and forth past scary thing till she was settled then got on and went past under saddle efore carrying on with our ride.
in the school-how do you know the horse knows walk trot and canter?
sounds liek you need some help on the ground to give somedirection and advice in the school


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## be positive (26 March 2016)

I hope tomorrow goes well and the person can get you both on the right track, it is difficult to admit you may be part of the issue but in reality the person doing the training is usually more than half of the equation and will cause a young horse to question things if you are not 100% sure of what you are doing, you cannot learn it all from books or just by having a go, getting help is the way forward and I am sure it will give you the confidence to continue the journey.


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## tallyho! (26 March 2016)

moomoos said:



			Hey horsey people. I'm in need of some advice, with youngsters what is normal behavior after being backed? I know this is like asking how long is a piece of string. But I've got alsorts going through my head. 
She's fab in traffic, Will hack alone and in company but if she sees horses behind the bushes or horses running in their fields she bolts or starts walking backwards. 
Also riding in the school we have battles going on if I ask any more than walk. 
She knows walk, trot and canter. 
Any help would be greatly appreciated. 

Many thanks
		
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You have a brave filly! Traffic mastered! Much better than my mare. Everyone is different like you say. She's looking to you for some reassurance and you need to be her kind and sympathetic teacher.

I would start on the ground in the school, no lunging, just leading and asking to yield the quarters and the fore. When the other horses run and she looks to see what is going on or prepares to jump around, let her look but then ask her to focus on you with loads of praise. Every little good thing she does just pat rub praise smiling and good girls. Whatever you normally use. Don't do loads, ten minutes is enough to start with. A youngsters attention span is about as long as a three year old toddler so they lose interest and look for other stuff so just literally baby steps. Build it up each time. 

At 4 last year she did all her schooling in hand at walk, trot and canter up to a max of 30mins even if her friends are kicking their heels in the field opposite. I only did walk and trot ridden in   school (canter on hacks) as I'm very careful with development. She is 5 this year and I will start to canter in the school. It's hard for young horses so I have waited as we only have a grass school.

Be patient, be kind and understanding. I have only worked my mare in the summer. Winters are turned away. I will continue this until she is 6/7. After all, she is going to be my lifetime horse and I'm no rush. Better to earn trust I think. I can be tough but it's in balance.


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## AdorableAlice (26 March 2016)

RebeccaClark said:



			Okay well i have a youngster as well, firstly she will be good in traffic because she hasn't learnt or been conditioned to be scared of it.

)
		
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If only.


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## gothdolly (26 March 2016)

I really hope it  went well with your trainer. I have a difficult youngster currently, he is really putting me through the wringer. And he is the third one I have broken in, te other two were much more straightforward.  Good luck and let us know how it goes.


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## moomoos (26 March 2016)

Thank you will try that. She responds to walk trot and canter on the lunge she goes in to them straight away and will come back down with a woah. Same when we ride down the track they're all there of the leg and voice.  I'm all for getting help as she is a brilliant youngster just need help bringing out her confidence.


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## moomoos (26 March 2016)

Thank you. She's a good girl. Not phased by anything that could actually hurt her lol she's seen cars, tractors, bicycles, quad/motorbikes, ambulances, lorries and even barking dogs. Just moving horses and birds behind trees that bothers her lol.  

I agree they're still so young aren't they bless them just wanted an insight on youngster behavior. 

She really does look at me for reassurance and guidance once she see something scary and nearly jumped in my arms like a dog lol


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## tallyho! (26 March 2016)

moomoos said:



			Thank you. She's a good girl. Not phased by anything that could actually hurt her lol she's seen cars, tractors, bicycles, quad/motorbikes, ambulances, lorries and even barking dogs. Just moving horses and birds behind trees that bothers her lol.  

I agree they're still so young aren't they bless them just wanted an insight on youngster behavior. 

She really does look at me for reassurance and guidance once she see something scary and nearly jumped in my arms like a dog lol
		
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Sounds like she will mature into a lovely mare 

Being jumpy of that stuff just shows the brain is working as it should.


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## peaceandquiet1 (26 March 2016)

Just going to take time and patience


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## BethH (27 March 2016)

Good luck with the instructor, I hope they turn out to be the perfect person to help you.  Your horse is lucky - she has a good owner who is determined to try to do the right thing by her.  You will have a lovely horse at the end of this.  The reason I know this will be the case is because her owner is asking for and listening to advice and is determined to do her best to get it right for the right reasons.  Please let us know how you get on.


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## moomoos (3 April 2016)

Aw thank you BethH I do try my best. 
Thank you everyone else. I'm now on the look out for an instructor to come help me and my mare progress. Does anyone know anyone my horse is based in Hailsham, East Sussex


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## tallyho! (4 April 2016)

I googled classical/BHS/in-hand instructors in east sussex and someone called Kat Layfield came up and she has had good classical training, in hand as well which I think will help you. I know it's certainly helped me.


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## moomoos (5 April 2016)

Thank you Tallyho I will look her up. The lady who came to me last week was just to tell me her thoughts from an outside view as to whether I've not taught her right or whether we need lessons/help. Anyway I've got a dressage instructor coming out Friday for a hour lesson. She's got lots of youngster experience and teaches flatwork to.


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## tallyho! (6 April 2016)

Flatwork is different to in-hand work. I seems you are on your journey, I wish you luck.


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## moomoos (7 April 2016)

Thank you Tallyho.

 I can get her to do all I ask inhand she doesn't hesitate, she hacks well and listens to all my walk trot and canter cues going through the fields so it really is just schooling we're struggling with. 

Over the last week or so I've done the most silly hacks in distance on her own but we have made progress hacking on our own. Literally started with just a few minutes on the road and back. We're now doing a good 10-20 minutes now. Amazing how such small steps make the most difference


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