# Good 3.5 ton lorries. 2 horses & sleep 2.



## becca1305 (22 April 2011)

Hi guys

Been browsing the ridiculously complicated world of 3.5 ton horse boxes (complicated because of stupid car licence restrictions).

I need a relatively modern (2003 onwards) 3.5 ton lorry which when fully loaded can be driven on my stingy car licence with a budget of around £10k- £20k.

Must happily hold 2 horses and be able to squeeze one (up to) 17.2hh in there. Also must have some form of double mattress/ arrangement to sleep two people laid next to each other... don't mind if its above the cab I shotgun the side away from the drop!

Wondering if any of you lovely people have experiences of such lorries or have been lorry shopping as I really don't want to have to traipse the country just to see if they MIGHT be suitable!

Thanks


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## Booboos (22 April 2011)

My understanding is that the maximum payload of these lorries is around 1.2 to 1.4 tonnes (the latter with no living), so you would really struggle to get two horses in there. Two ponies or one horse would be OK. The 17.2hh may struggle with head height so make sure you look at the dimensions really carefully. I have yet to see one that can fit sleeping space but you never know!

If you can upgrade your license to up to 7.5 tonnes you will have a much better choice, especially for such a decent budget.


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## popsdosh (22 April 2011)

becca1305 said:



			Hi guys



Must happily hold 2 horses and be able to squeeze one (up to) 17.2hh in there. Also must have some form of double mattress/ arrangement to sleep two people laid next to each other... don't mind if its above the cab I shotgun the side away from the drop!

Wondering if any of you lovely people have experiences of such lorries or have been lorry shopping as I really don't want to have to traipse the country just to see if they MIGHT be suitable!

Thanks 

Click to expand...

You cant do it with a 3.5tonne box .If it was light enough I would not want to put one horse in it let alone 2 im afraid.


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## perfect11s (22 April 2011)

becca1305 said:



			Hi guys

Been browsing the ridiculously complicated world of 3.5 ton horse boxes (complicated because of stupid car licence restrictions).

I need a relatively modern (2003 onwards) 3.5 ton lorry which when fully loaded can be driven on my stingy car licence with a budget of around £10k- £20k.

Must happily hold 2 horses and be able to squeeze one (up to) 17.2hh in there. Also must have some form of double mattress/ arrangement to sleep two people laid next to each other... don't mind if its above the cab I shotgun the side away from the drop!

Wondering if any of you lovely people have experiences of such lorries or have been lorry shopping as I really don't want to have to traipse the country just to see if they MIGHT be suitable!

Thanks 

Click to expand...

   Forget the over priced toy lorrys they are for people who only want to carry 1 horse or 2 ponys and dont mind living the size of a broom cupboard , best to invest in  HGV driving lessons and then a world of nice lorrys  is yours, better value and will be up to doing what  you want...


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## EmmaJaneWilliams (22 April 2011)

Try these websites - 

www.bosshorseboxes.co.uk 

http://www.galloperhorseboxes.com/range350.htm

http://www.tristarhorseboxes.co.uk/stock-index.htm

I hope this helps. E x


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## ihatework (22 April 2011)

You would be much better off paying to upgrade your car license and then you will have access to numerous boxes that will meet your criteria.


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## DarkHorseB (22 April 2011)

popsdosh said:



			You cant do it with a 3.5tonne box .If it was light enough I would not want to put one horse in it let alone 2 im afraid.
		
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Agree - not possible legally and safely!!


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## becca1305 (22 April 2011)

Ive found quite a few which say they carry 2 horses and day living... such as the duo weekender, alexanders york. They dont seem to specify weights which is annoying with the duo claiming to have a payload to take two horses but of what size?! The real problem is simply sleeping space... I dont mind having tiny living with no facilities as long as there is room to sleep 2 over the cab or somewhere else on board!

Thanks for the links  I hadnt looked at Boss horseboxes.

Ahh our licences now are just so irritating! I would love to take my HGV test  get a slightly bigger lorry but the way of convincing my parents to let me get rid of the trailer (which I would hate pulling with horses in -on my todd in particular!) was to point out I could drive a little lorry without taking another test :/.


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## Ranyhyn (22 April 2011)

They'll carry them for sure.  Not legally though.  They mean they have space for them!  

The best two horse box Ive ever heard of is the VW lt3.5 the side load ones - however I just don't think you'll get anything with living as well on a 3.5T that'll have payload over to take two!


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## Leg_end (22 April 2011)

As others have said, there is no way you will legally carry two horses (especially if one is 17.2) with a 3.5 tonner. Despite what the manufacturers may tell you they are designed for one horse or two ponies (or v small, lightweight horses) really especially if you want some kind of living as well.


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## ecrozier (22 April 2011)

You might get one that will fit two small horses in but will be borderline. My friend has an LT35  that has decent-ish living, compact but useful. But she can only put one horse in. It came with a partition but would only have fitted 2 x 14.2, and even with no partition wouldn't take 17.hh.
With that kind of budget buying a 7.5 t and taking your test really shouldn't be an issue - I did test and bought my first lorry for £5k.


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## Vickijay (22 April 2011)

As others have said, thats just not possible. Only way to carry two is to upgrade to a 7.5. 

I have a 7.5 which is stalled for 4 but couldnt carry 4. I would only put 2 in it, or 3 ponies/babies. It is 5.2 tons unladen so I can put 2.3 tons of horse, fuel, tack, water, people etc in it and it all adds up pretty quickly!


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## cptrayes (22 April 2011)

If you must have a 3.5, can you bear to sleep in the horse area? Presumably the horses won't be in it overnight ??    You can roll up a 2 inch thick memory foam mattress and carry it in the storage area. If you buy one of the right quality it does fine to stop the floor being too hard, we have one in our luton (bigger lorry). A camping stove will give you hot food and drink. Wet wipes do a great job of replacing a shower   Porta-potti if you really, really need a loo with you, though you'd be really tight for space for it.  Might just be easier to take your test though, do you know you can do "concentrated" courses of a week and take the test at the end of it?


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## Divasmum (22 April 2011)

You won't legally be able to carry two. You need to add the horses weight, tack and other equipment, the weight of the driver and passengers, the diesel and any hay etc. It can't be legally done with a 3.5.


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## lauraandjack (22 April 2011)

Unless you are really prepared to slum it, it's not possible!  And even then you'd be sailing very close to the weight limit!

I have a 3.5t Vauxhall Movano (conversion type) which will, can and does take 2 small horses legally and safely.  However, it is very minimalist inside to save as much weight as possible and I am very careful what I carry on the rare occasion I travel 2 horses in it.  Basically it is a self propelled trailer.  You can get raised roof versions which will take a taller horse.  (To all the 3.5t naysayers, everyone who has ever looked inside is really surprised how much room the horses have, they are like the Tardis!)

It's certainly possible to get 3.5t with some degree of living, but in the words of the guy who built mine "I can put whatever you want in it, full kitchen and everything, but each item you put in takes off your payload."  There is storage space above the cab but no one but the smallest child could sleep there!  Very handy for rugs and stuff but not big enough to sleep.

As others have said, I think you would be better to have some lessons and get the LGV test.  I love my little lorry but I mainly only transport one horse, and only for day trips so I don't need anywhere to cook or sleep.

If you do go for a 3.5t get it weighed and work out what you can legally carry.  Ford Transits and especially VW's are very heavy before you put anything in them, I know of someone who merrily drives round with 2 horses in a 3.5t VW that weighs 3.5t unladen.  She hasn't been caught, yet!


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## almorton (22 April 2011)

some of you people need to do some research before making such assumptions! for you are, im afraid, incorrect.

ive just had a 3.5 purpose built to sleep 2 and carry 2 x 17handers, comfortably and spaciously. before anyone starts about weights or safety, its got almost 1.4 payload, plenty of height and its aluminium build with a reinforced bulkhead front and back and seperate (tiny) living. 
ill be towing a lockable trailer for away shows when i need to carry more gear to ensure im not overweight. 

ive had my horses weighed so i know exactly what they weigh. my biggest for example is a 17h KWPN med weight, shes 620kg. my 2 others are 500 and 510. 

It CAN be done! BUT you need some one used to doing such conversions and have to accept a pretty spray job may not be possible due to the fact that the sides are ali plate not the standard stuff, which lessens weight considerably! 

it is stable, tough, reinforced and virtually no sway / roll.
has fans, temp sensors and all the latest gizmos for horse comfort.
oh, and its defra approved! 
speak to this guy. http://www.thoroughbredhorseboxes.co.uk/

so, anyone wana come for a look??!


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## perfect11s (22 April 2011)

almorton said:



			some of you people need to do some research before making such assumptions! for you are, im afraid, incorrect.

ive just had a 3.5 purpose built to sleep 2 and carry 2 x 17handers, comfortably and spaciously. before anyone starts about weights or safety, its got almost 1.4 payload, plenty of height and its aluminium build with a reinforced bulkhead front and back and seperate (tiny) living. 
ill be towing a lockable trailer for away shows when i need to carry more gear to ensure im not overweight. 

ive had my horses weighed so i know exactly what they weigh. my biggest for example is a 17h KWPN med weight, shes 620kg. my 2 others are 500 and 510. 

It CAN be done! BUT you need some one used to doing such conversions and have to accept a pretty spray job may not be possible due to the fact that the sides are ali plate not the standard stuff, which lessens weight considerably! 

it is stable, tough, reinforced and virtually no sway / roll.
has fans, temp sensors and all the latest gizmos for horse comfort.
oh, and its defra approved! 
speak to this guy. http://www.thoroughbredhorseboxes.co.uk/

so, anyone wana come for a look??! 

Click to expand...

 Id like to see it  sat on a weighbridge with fuel, spare wheel, partitions and all the tack and junk that accumulates inside most lorrys!!! 
Oh and I can get a nice 7.5 tonner for less  12 k  with shower, toilet, fridge microwave, tv and seating/sleeping  for 4 adults .... these 3.5 ton boxes are OK for what they are but dont tell me they are good value or good for much more than one horse to 1 day shows , taking horse for lessons or to somewhere to hack out etc ....


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## almorton (22 April 2011)

i shall post the weightbridge ticket fully loaded with fuel, water, show tack/gear + 2 x competition horses 17 + 16 hands next week when i get back from weston lawns!

im  not saying if i won the lottery i wouldnt trade it in for a 6 horse hgv with full bathroom, BUT it will do a hell of a job for me with the price of diesel and road tax at the mo! ive streamlined but not had to compromise that much. ive even got a small gas hob i can chuck in for a brew when away!

and my figures are correct, its been done as part of an equine transport business, so i know ALL the ins and outs, legalities etc, vosa and defra restrictions! 

all im saying is, dont make assumptions, it CAN be done, BUT you do need to be careful and sensible! and like the 7.5 tonners and hgv's out there, there are good ones and bad ones. thats all.


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## AbFab (22 April 2011)

I have an old VW LT35 which I adore but even with no living at all (can sleep 2 in the luton but nothing else) I couldn't legally carry 2 big horses.  I have just over 1000kgs to play with and my horse weighs 420 so I could carry another little pony but another horse her size would be really pushing it.  If you were mainly looking to carry one 17.2hh though then it would fit in but in this case you'd be sacrificing the living.  

The licencing is ridiculous, I agree!


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## cptrayes (22 April 2011)

almorton said:



			ill be towing a lockable trailer for away shows when i need to carry more gear to ensure im not overweight.
		
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I am reasonably certain that your trailer is included in the 3.5 ton weight if you are towing it from the 3.5 tonner.


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## Mike007 (22 April 2011)

One of the horses has just shrunk by a hand. You have to remember that it will be permanently under full load and when a tyre for example ,blows . The high C of G ,may make it uncontrolable. I do not trust these. Much better to pass ones test and drive somthing with a bit of weight and survivability.


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## miss_c (22 April 2011)

almorton said:



			some of you people need to do some research before making such assumptions! for you are, im afraid, incorrect.

ive just had a 3.5 purpose built to sleep 2 and carry 2 x 17handers, comfortably and spaciously. before anyone starts about weights or safety, its got almost 1.4 payload, plenty of height and its aluminium build with a reinforced bulkhead front and back and seperate (tiny) living. 
ill be towing a lockable trailer for away shows when i need to carry more gear to ensure im not overweight. 

ive had my horses weighed so i know exactly what they weigh. my biggest for example is a 17h KWPN med weight, shes 620kg. my 2 others are 500 and 510. 

It CAN be done! BUT you need some one used to doing such conversions and have to accept a pretty spray job may not be possible due to the fact that the sides are ali plate not the standard stuff, which lessens weight considerably! 

it is stable, tough, reinforced and virtually no sway / roll.
has fans, temp sensors and all the latest gizmos for horse comfort.
oh, and its defra approved! 
speak to this guy. http://www.thoroughbredhorseboxes.co.uk/

so, anyone wana come for a look??! 

Click to expand...

So with your two lightest horses you are over the 1t mark.  Add onto that fuel, parition, tack, water, you, the dog, all your fantastic gizmos, etc, and you will be overweight.  I have a 3.5t and I love it, but I did a LOT of research into them and I know I can only realistically take one horse.  I have 1.2t and that's a high payload.  When I enquired to Boss horseboxes the payload they quoted me was about the same as what I've already got so pointless.


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## almorton (22 April 2011)

cptrayes said:



			I am reasonably certain that your trailer is included in the 3.5 ton weight if you are towing it from the 3.5 tonner.
		
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nope. its additional, so i can tow an extra 3 ton. although im gonna stick with a braked 750, i think thats quite enough lol! 

mad isnt it, i could legally tow another 2 horses in an ifor behind, so transport more legally than a 7.5tonner  not that id fancy that!


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## perfect11s (22 April 2011)

cptrayes said:



			I am reasonably certain that your trailer is included in the 3.5 ton weight if you are towing it from the 3.5 tonner.
		
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 It would if you took your car test after 97 and havent  done the towing test, otherwise it depends on the GTW of the van  most 3.5 tonners are about 5.5 ton so with the  right licence  you could tow about 2 tons....


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## cptrayes (22 April 2011)

almorton said:



			nope. its additional, so i can tow an extra 3 ton. although im gonna stick with a braked 750, i think thats quite enough lol! 

mad isnt it, i could legally tow another 2 horses in an ifor behind, so transport more legally than a 7.5tonner  not that id fancy that!
		
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I stand corrected but I don't think you are quite right. You're OK with your 750kg trailer, but that seems to be the limit?

"Drivers who passed their test on or after this date have category B entitlement only, which restricts the entitlement to motor vehicles with up to eight passenger seats and an MAM of up to 3500kg with trailers up to 750kg MAM (4250kg combined), or larger trailers provided the combination of the trailer and towing vehicle does not exceed 3500kg and the MAM of the trailer does not exceed the unladen weight of the towing vehicle."


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## almorton (22 April 2011)

mike very funny  i see your point but at least i know i can carry 2 x 17hands and my roof isnt sloping ;-) ive had it built on a front wheel drive vehicle to lower the cog. 
ive driven both 7.5 tonners and 3.5's when tyres have blown and can assure you as a small lady driver much prefer the latter! obviously, as long as they are not overweight and built properly.
my dad is an experienced engineer and has checked and double checked all figures before the build. 
the partition weight is included in the unladen weight so doesnt affect the payload. 
im not a hoarder luckily and can cope with minimal gear!

and for who ever said i am over weight, as i said before, you should not be making assumptions about things you know little about! im not, end of.

also, gizomos and technology dont necessarily load your wagon. mine hasnt got a rubber floor, the floor is made of a different composite or something (im not that technical sorry!) which is a lot lighter than rubber, and stronger! 

all im saying is dont discount them if they are done properly.


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## almorton (22 April 2011)

nope, cptrayes, i see where you are coing from but its not cat b, its b + e, allowing a 3.5 to tow more than 750kg, as long as you have the appopriate license. i have!


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## perfect11s (22 April 2011)

Mike007 said:



			One of the horses has just shrunk by a hand. You have to remember that it will be permanently under full load and when a tyre for example ,blows . The high C of G ,may make it uncontrolable. I do not trust these. Much better to pass ones test and drive somthing with a bit of weight and survivability.
		
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 Yes  I wonder If the horses discuss things like we do   oh my human has bought us a oakey is so lovely like a limo its so roomy Hmm mine has bought one of those 3.5 toners  they must think im a sammon not a horse!!! its horrid like one of those smart cars .........


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## almorton (22 April 2011)

perfect11s - i dont really appreciate your sarcasm. you have obviously not looked at the newer build 3.5's so shouldnt really comment or pass judgement.

and by the way, its salmon, not sammon.........!


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## Prince33Sp4rkle (22 April 2011)

i think you would be suprised at hoem much 2 x saddles, 2 x bridles, 2 x rugs, water, 2 x haynets, tank of fuel, 2 x people etc weighs!

having just bought a 3.5ton (will only ever have 1 horse in it i hasten to add), you need a LOT more than 1400 to carry 2 horses legally.

the alexanders with living only have 600kg payload=ridiculous, cant even put one horse in that!!!

BOSS claim to have 1400 payload but they are very very thin GRP and basically an egg box on wheels. no strength to them.


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## perfect11s (22 April 2011)

almorton said:



			perfect11s - i dont really appreciate your sarcasm. you have obviously not looked at the newer build 3.5's so shouldnt really comment or pass judgement.

and by the way, its salmon, not sammon.........!
		
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 thanks I'm sure you're right but isnt  salmom that pompus piggy eyed scot ???!"!!!   yes I have looked at the newer build 3.5 t  someone I know parted with nealy 40k for one!!!! christ  what could you ever do to make a crappy renault van chassis   worth that !! like I said not value for money but I can see the point if you are moving horses for a living and dont want to get involved with operators licences etc and can write the value off against tax otherwise ouch...


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## almorton (22 April 2011)

ok roughly. cant remember exact figures but ive weighed it all.

2 tack saddles bridle boots jacket = 20kg
2 x rugs 10kg
water 20kg
4 x haynets 10kg 
tank of fuel well depends how full tank is. say 80kg plenty to get me about locally. 
2 x people 120 kgs ish?
so 260.
plus horses. 1x 17hand 1x 16hand 1110kg
so 1370?  im under, as i said. 
and i can always run on lower fuel if i need! and im often on my own to be fair.

im not saying ALL 3.5s are under. just it can be done if your careful!


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## almorton (22 April 2011)

40k??! jesus! was it gold plated!


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## Mike007 (22 April 2011)

almorton said:



			ok roughly. cant remember exact figures but ive weighed it all.

2 tack saddles bridle boots jacket = 20kg
2 x rugs 10kg
water 20kg
4 x haynets 10kg 
tank of fuel well depends how full tank is. say 80kg plenty to get me about locally. 
2 x people 120 kgs ish?
so 260.
plus horses. 1x 17hand 1x 16hand 1110kg
so 1370?  im under, as i said. 
and i can always run on lower fuel if i need! and im often on my own to be fair.

im not saying ALL 3.5s are under. just it can be done if your careful!
		
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You said initialy that your van had ALMOST 1.4 tonnes payload. How much more almost  than the 1.370 you have rather optimisticly calculated.Your figures suggest that you are driving around with an anorexic midget and two very thin horses.


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## perfect11s (22 April 2011)

almorton said:



			40k??! jesus! was it gold plated! 

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Not that I could see.. it was  made by some firm called  Theault  it is nicely made and the lady seems very happy with it.. but I would wonder what its going to be worth in a year or two esp now there is a new model movarno/master van out now and you're well into  used top brand 7.5 ton lorry terrtory with 40k  and low depriciation too!!! ..


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## spookypony (22 April 2011)

I think you'd have to do very careful math to get one to carry 2 horse + living. 1 horse + living, fine; 2 horses and no living, also do-able (unless both horses are enormous!). My 3.5t is partitioned for 2, easily enough headroom for 17hh, and has no constructed living to take up more weight. It couldn't really be any plainer! There is plenty of room in either the tack compartment or in the luton to set up an air-bed, but that's roughing it! By my calculations, I could carry 2x medium-sized horses (or slender TBs) or my pony + one bigger horse, but probably not 2 really big horses. I got it for 3 reasons: it's easier and more economical to drive than a 4x4 + trailer, the pony prefers it to trailers, and I can use it to move large musical instruments etc. for concerts.


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## popsdosh (23 April 2011)

almorton said:



			ok roughly. cant remember exact figures but ive weighed it all.

2 tack saddles bridle boots jacket = 20kg
2 x rugs 10kg
water 20kg
4 x haynets 10kg 
tank of fuel well depends how full tank is. say 80kg plenty to get me about locally. 
2 x people 120 kgs ish?
so 260.
plus horses. 1x 17hand 1x 16hand 1110kg
so 1370?  im under, as i said. 
and i can always run on lower fuel if i need! and im often on my own to be fair.

im not saying ALL 3.5s are under. just it can be done if your careful!
		
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You are still relying on the bodybuilder giving you an accurate unladen weight which from experience very few do.It would be a lot more convincing if all this was put into the vehicle and then put on a weighbridge.


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## popsdosh (23 April 2011)

almorton said:



			nope. its additional, so i can tow an extra 3 ton. although im gonna stick with a braked 750, i think thats quite enough lol! 

mad isnt it, i could legally tow another 2 horses in an ifor behind, so transport more legally than a 7.5tonner  not that id fancy that!
		
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The interesting thing here is you are in muddy waters as few people realise that as long as you have done your towing test you can do exactly the same with a 7.5t lorry ,I believe you can go up to 11.25 GTW and more safely.


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## Booboos (23 April 2011)

almorton said:



			ok roughly. cant remember exact figures but ive weighed it all.

2 tack saddles bridle boots jacket = 20kg
2 x rugs 10kg
water 20kg
4 x haynets 10kg 
tank of fuel well depends how full tank is. say 80kg plenty to get me about locally. 
2 x people 120 kgs ish?
so 260.
plus horses. 1x 17hand 1x 16hand 1110kg
so 1370?  im under, as i said. 
and i can always run on lower fuel if i need! and im often on my own to be fair.

im not saying ALL 3.5s are under. just it can be done if your careful!
		
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While all this may well be true for you, I think you might be the exception rather than the rule for a lot of these weights, so it's not unreasonable for people to warn the OP to be very careful!

For example, my 16hh cob weighs 760kilos, my 16.2hh WB weighs 700kilos, my OH weighs 110kilos, my Kieffer saddle weighs 10kilos all by itself. If any of your horses put on 50 kilos in the summer you'd be in trouble!


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## Ranyhyn (23 April 2011)

Well it can be done, but for my own personal (and that of my horse) I wouldn't want to be sailing so close to the wind.

I'd rather spend more money and do my HGV test or only carry one horse  but that's just me!!


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## Ludi-doodi (23 April 2011)

QR 



becca1305 said:



			Ive found quite a few which say they carry 2 horses and day living....
		
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Lots advertise like this giving the impression that it can take 2 X 16.2hh for example. At the end of the day it's your legal responsibility, not theirs, to ensure that you meet the conditions of your license and the chances are that with two horses in a 3.5 you'll be over the weight limit.  The penalties could potentially be quite severe for driving without the appropriate license not to mentioned your insurance would be void too!  

As others have said, spend a small % of your budget on taking the HGV and get something else to do the job.   

Good luck


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## Picaso (23 April 2011)

We have a mercedes 3.5ton box able of taking two 17.2hh's and it has a living of sink, hob, fridge, seat and mattess over the luton, just recently been weighed fully loaded at 3.4ton so it is possible


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## cptrayes (23 April 2011)

almorton said:



			nope, cptrayes, i see where you are coing from but its not cat b, its b + e, allowing a 3.5 to tow more than 750kg, as long as you have the appopriate license. i have! 

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Apologies, the poster does not have the appropriate licence, and therefore is limited to a trailer of 750kg, but you and I are not. It is quite crazy what we are legally entitled to drive with grandfather's rights, isn't it  ?  I do agree with a test for driving the bigger lorry though, it is nothing like driving a car. Still that's easy for me to say when I didn't have to take it!


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## cptrayes (23 April 2011)

Picaso said:



			We have a mercedes 3.5ton box able of taking two 17.2hh's and it has a living of sink, hob, fridge, seat and mattess over the luton, just recently been weighed fully loaded at 3.4ton so it is possible 

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Is your living in the back or the front? (I know your mattress is in the luton, but where are the horses - on the back or in the middle?)

I have seen a couple of 3.5s lately with the horses on the back and that has to be a dangerous weight distribution, making the steering far too light for safety and the whole box unstable if push came to shove. And there is one hell of a shove when a 48 tonner passes you on a motorway.


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## Booboos (23 April 2011)

cptrayes said:



			Is your living in the back or the front? (I know your mattress is in the luton, but where are the horses - on the back or in the middle?)

I have seen a couple of 3.5s lately with the horses on the back and that has to be a dangerous weight distribution, making the steering far too light for safety and the whole box unstable if push came to shove. And there is one hell of a shove when a 48 tonner passes you on a motorway.
		
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And one may still be illegal with this configuration because the weight of the horses exceeds what is allowed for the rear axel.


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## onemoretime (23 April 2011)

Picaso said:



			We have a mercedes 3.5ton box able of taking two 17.2hh's and it has a living of sink, hob, fridge, seat and mattess over the luton, just recently been weighed fully loaded at 3.4ton so it is possible 

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The only chassis that are able to stay under the required weight are Movano and Master.  A Mercedes chassis is much heavier and with 2 horses on board would be way over the limit.


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## perfect11s (23 April 2011)

onemoretime said:



			The only chassis that are able to stay under the required weight are Movano and Master.  A Mercedes chassis is much heavier and with 2 horses on board would be way over the limit.
		
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 Not sure you are right,I doubt the iveco daily and mercedes  sprinter chassis are  heavier than the horrid renault/vauxhall or the equaly cheap and nasty peugeot /citreon   offerings its more they are front wheel drive so the floor is flat and low, so easy to graft some sort of a box on the back is the reason they are made into horseboxes more than weight issues....


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## onemoretime (23 April 2011)

If you read the earlier post from people you will see that you cannot legally take 2 horses in a 3.5 ton box.  We have a Renault Master and it is fantastic, we only carry one horse though and have 3 people up in the cab (all extra weight) as well as the water for the horse, hay tack etc.  Admittedly we bought the chassis brand new and had a Tru Leisure box built onto it.  We have had it 4 years now and it has been brilliant as has the after sales service when horse kicked the back and did some damage, they repaired it FOC. 

When we stay away at shows we take a tent, we cook in the lorry on a camping stove and the lorry is equiped with a sink and cupboard underneath. Camping out providing the weather is good is great fun. There is plenty of storage room both in the tack section and under the bench seat and also in the luton which is large as it is a proper chassis and not a cut and shut van job.

The weight situation is getting very diffuclt and needs careful consideration.  There are often posts on here regarding this situation and most people who know will tell you that you cannot carry 2 horses legally in the small 2 horse boxes.

You would need to get a bigger lorry say a 3 horse 6.5 ton if you want to carry 2 horses.  Its just that you would need to get a bigger lorry plated and also if you licence restricts you then you would need to take a further test.


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## tractor (23 April 2011)

Just a word of warning - the police are well aware that there are a lot of young people driving these lorries - they see us as easy prey as many of us genuinely don't know we are doing anything wrong. 

I was stopped when I had my little lorry, had my cob & a friends TB on board, three people, tack etc - weighed in at 15% overweight. Strictly speaking, that means a fine of up to £5k plus a court apperance. Thankfully the VOSA man understood that I was totally innocent and not deliberately breaking the law. He allowed me to take the horses home and return to be re weighed, as long as it was under I was OK. So...did what he said, returned and was re weighed OK, no fine or court

A very scary afternoon, and after I was given the all clear he told me that they pulled every 3.5ton lorry they saw, they are easy prey and let them reach their targets. 

If you can find a lorry which you believe allows you to take two legally plus living, then great, but please get it properly checked so you don't end up being terrified like me!


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## Mike007 (23 April 2011)

That has to be the strangest definition of "inocent" I have ever heard.


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## tractor (23 April 2011)

Ok, how about ignorant?! There was no intent, I was just too trusting of the lorry I was sold "to take 2x 16.2hh" - the point I was trying to make, beside that of me being a muppett, was that you will be caught if your lorry is overweight and the consequences are potentially not very nice. 

Despite being a muppet, I learnt from my ignorance, didn't travel two again and sold the lorry with full disclosure that it was overweight.


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## Mike007 (23 April 2011)

Well you certainly arent alone on this one. I took a whitaker 7.5 tonner in to be tested and it had a payload of 500kg


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## cptrayes (23 April 2011)

Picaso said:



			We have a mercedes 3.5ton box able of taking two 17.2hh's and it has a living of sink, hob, fridge, seat and mattess over the luton, just recently been weighed fully loaded at 3.4ton so it is possible 

Click to expand...

Obviously in spite of people saying it can't be done, if you took it to a proper weighbridge, it can be done. I am tempted buy  a small box myself, can you tell us how many passengers of what sort of size were in it when it was weighed - people, not horses  because if you put my OH in it as well, you'd go over unless you made him strip first .  Also were you carrying water, and how much? 10 gallons of water weighs the best part of 50kg And did you manage a porta-potti, cos at my age I couldn't go anywhere without one


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## tractor (23 April 2011)

Meep! 

It is scary how low the payload on some lorries is.


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## onemoretime (23 April 2011)

Mike007 said:



			Well you certainly arent alone on this one. I took a whitaker 7.5 tonner in to be tested and it had a payload of 500kg

Click to expand...

That's one horses weight isn't it!!!


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## perfect11s (23 April 2011)

Mike007 said:



			Well you certainly arent alone on this one. I took a whitaker 7.5 tonner in to be tested and it had a payload of 500kg

Click to expand...

 a motor trader friend  had a one on a 2000  eurocargo  yes I took it and some customers to the local webridge to see if it was going to take there two 16.2 eventers...  um we were nearly over with 4 people on board !!!  It ended up re chassised on a 10 toner .....  the previous owner had been carrying 2 regulaly!!!!


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## Vicki1986 (24 April 2011)

3.5ton lorries are for 1 horse or ponies.

i have a chaigley weekender, i have just over 1 tonne payload, i do not have kitchen etc living as i didnt want the weight.

you are unlikely to find a 3.5ton to take two large horses, even with 1.4 payload, by the time you had full living in there, a driver, passengers, tack and gear (do not underestimate this weight) water and supplies, diesel, you'd be hard pushed to make the weight.


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## kezimac (24 April 2011)

almorton said:



			some of you people need to do some research before making such assumptions! for you are, im afraid, incorrect.

ive just had a 3.5 purpose built to sleep 2 and carry 2 x 17handers, comfortably and spaciously. before anyone starts about weights or safety, its got almost 1.4 payload, plenty of height and its aluminium build with a reinforced bulkhead front and back and seperate (tiny) living. 
ill be towing a lockable trailer for away shows when i need to carry more gear to ensure im not overweight. 

ive had my horses weighed so i know exactly what they weigh. my biggest for example is a 17h KWPN med weight, shes 620kg. my 2 others are 500 and 510. 

It CAN be done! BUT you need some one used to doing such conversions and have to accept a pretty spray job may not be possible due to the fact that the sides are ali plate not the standard stuff, which lessens weight considerably! 

it is stable, tough, reinforced and virtually no sway / roll.
has fans, temp sensors and all the latest gizmos for horse comfort.
oh, and its defra approved! 
speak to this guy. http://www.thoroughbredhorseboxes.co.uk/

so, anyone wana come for a look??! 

Click to expand...


and your 1.4t payload includes you, your tack, your fuel, any water....etc..etc... cant see how two 620kg horses (1.24 tonnes) can leave you with enough weight - only 160kg left for diesel, water and driver plus passenger and tack?


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## *hic* (24 April 2011)

perfect11s said:



			a motor trader friend  had a one on a 2000  eurocargo  yes I took it and some customers to the local webridge to see if it was going to take there two 16.2 eventers...  um we were nearly over with 4 people on board !!!  It ended up re chassised on a 10 toner .....  the previous owner had been carrying 2 regulaly!!!!
		
Click to expand...


I went to a weekend clinic recently. Also there was a young pro with her sponsor's 7.5 tonner and three horses - all with eventing kit for the weekend - a driver and a groom. On the way over, out of interest, they went on a weighbridge. The thing weighed in at just shy of 10.5 tonnes.

I'm on the lookout for a nice DAF 45 10 or 12 tonne chassis for mine so I don't have to worry about how kit I've got hoarded on board.


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## lauraandjack (24 April 2011)

Wow!  This topic always seems to bring out people's teeth!

I think a lot of the 3.5t-horseboxes-are-the-spawn-of-the-devil evangelists might be shocked to find out how much a lot of bigger lorries weigh unladen, especially the older ones.  Most horsebox chassis have had a past life as a delivery lorry or similar, basically a cab with a metal box on the back, and don't weigh a lot when unladen.

However, replace that with a horse container with reinforced floor, partitions etc (and especially in the older ones where nothing is lightweight.......you ever tried moving a partition?), living with mattress, cupboards etc, I think you will find that many don't have half as much payload as people expect.

I love my 3.5t, but I think if you are a serious competitor and want living etc, or to carry 2 horses and a lot of kit, you either need a bigger lorry or an Equi-Trek trailer (although they are in a whole new scary category with regard to towing vehicle - they look bloomin' heavy to me!)


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## Booboos (24 April 2011)

It's quite bizarre to suggest that people who are aware of the weight problems of 3.5 tonne lorries only point them out due to some irrational prejudice against them! I am not a lorry builder, have no lorry to sell and no stake in 3.5 tonne lorries or any other kind of lorry. I have a 5.2 tonne lorry and I am very aware of its payload. I happened to look into replacing it, so I am also aware of current alternatives whether they are 3.5, 7.5 or anything in between. It doesn't take much to become informed about these issues!


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## ecrozier (24 April 2011)

I think it's all about the living really on 7.5t and also what the box is made of. My 12 year old merc weighs in with all kit apart from saddles and bridles, water, fuel me and dog at 5240kg. On that basis I can carry 3 as gives me 2.3t for horses plus saddles. Bearing in mind my big boy is approx 550kg (16.2hh MW) I allow 600kg for him and 500 for my Arab (generous estimate as last time he went on weighbridge he was 440kg. Still ok for one more decent sized horse. I do think you need to assume any horse over 16hh is liable to be over 500kg tho.... Our old mare was 16.2hh ISH and weighed in at 690!


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## perfect11s (24 April 2011)

ecrozier said:



			I think it's all about the living really on 7.5t and also what the box is made of. My 12 year old merc weighs in with all kit apart from saddles and bridles, water, fuel me and dog at 5240kg. On that basis I can carry 3 as gives me 2.3t for horses plus saddles. Bearing in mind my big boy is approx 550kg (16.2hh MW) I allow 600kg for him and 500 for my Arab (generous estimate as last time he went on weighbridge he was 440kg. Still ok for one more decent sized horse. I do think you need to assume any horse over 16hh is liable to be over 500kg tho.... Our old mare was 16.2hh ISH and weighed in at 690!
		
Click to expand...

 Yes good point about living quarters  I think what it boils down to is not that many years ago unless the thing looked realy overweight and was swaying down the road largley the police wernt interested , so the builders just used the  cheapest matirials avalible and simple constuction methods, now there is  regular inforcement of weight laws a lorry needs to be engineered so its strong and light.sadly there are still mupets building using domestic kichen units and heavy  ply for the living  I wonder if these rocket sceintists  have ever looked a how a caravan is made!!!!, heck the damm things are as big as a whole lorry with a chassis but only  weigh about a ton , the average living in a 7.5 ton is say 10ft long but seems to add a huge weight...


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## Mike007 (24 April 2011)

The introduction of WIMS has made the chances of getting caught overloaded ,much greater . The sensors built into the road weigh every vehicle ,extremely accurately and  a computer compares the data with records for that vehicle,(having read the numberplate ). Eventualy they will be proved accurate enough to simply fine you automaticly. At present  however, you would be stopped and taken to a weighbridge,in the certain knowlege that you are overloaded.


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## joseyjo88 (24 April 2011)

Mine has about a 1350kg, i took up a 14.2 and 15hhs with half a tank of fuel,  driver, passenger and tack, now i have a 16.1 tb, and will only be travelling him, unless anyone with a tiny pony wants a lift!

My boss old 7.5 tonner only had a 1100kg payload.. 

I believe if you were in an accident and found to have been overweight your insurance would be void.


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