# Is Carl Hester breaking BD and FEI rules?



## follyfoot6 (8 June 2009)

As seen in H&amp;H this week there is a photo of Carl Hester on Uthopia winning a PSG competition with his horse wearing ear covers (or what ever you call them).  Under BD rule 56 this is not allowed and under FEI rules "ear muffs are under penalty of elimination and strictly forbidden." Or could they be interpreted as a protective fly hood which are "then permitted in extreme cases only".  Just wondering if we grass root dressage riders would get away with them, probably not.  Wondering whether to draw it to BD's attention? Look forward to your comments.


----------



## lucretia (8 June 2009)

well observed and i would be interested as well!


----------



## wizoz (8 June 2009)

I can't imagine that Mr Hester would arrogantly think he could get away with using something that is against the rules, I would be willing to bet he either had permission or the photo was taken after prize giving.


----------



## follyfoot6 (8 June 2009)

It looks like the photo was taken during his test, I am sure Mr Hester thinks he can get away with anything!


----------



## Santa_Claus (8 June 2009)

under fei rules they are allowed providing no cotton wool etc put in ears as well normally on very hot days or even head shakers i think. just depends if class under bd or fei rules


----------



## Law (8 June 2009)

Perhaps he had dispensation????! No idea if possible.


----------



## sarkie (8 June 2009)

Dear follyfoot6 try not to be bitter! I was at the show and carl requested permission from judge at c if ear covers were acceptable as it was a particularly hot day with midges. Permission was granted as it is also allowed in FEI competitions at the discretion of the leading judge..

So you too can use them if you want to keep up with the hesters!!


----------



## follyfoot6 (8 June 2009)

Oh thanks for clearing that up just wondered how you know he got permission?


----------



## sarkie (8 June 2009)

Well if you havent recognised my user name its not worth telling ;-)

Believe me I heard it with my own ears - so dont worry about telling tales to BD.


----------



## follyfoot6 (8 June 2009)

You don't need to be so aggressive only asking a valid question!


----------



## sarkie (8 June 2009)

not aggresive at all ! sneaks bored me at school as they still do today


----------



## follyfoot6 (8 June 2009)

When did you leave school - last week?


----------



## popsdosh (9 June 2009)

Refreshing to get it from the horses mouth!!!, and welcome to the forums.


----------



## _jetset_ (9 June 2009)

I have always wondered this as you see quite a few competitors with them on internationally... My mare gets so swishy in her head if a stray hair touches her ear (she is plaited up tightly most of the time because of this) so I can see how they would help!

I am sure one of the junior riders had them on at Someford Park, but I believe that particular test was run under FEI rules...


----------



## SirenaXVI (9 June 2009)

Was about to say that I am sure he would not just arrogantly flaunt the rules - of course he would have asked for permission, just as any of us could


----------



## scotsmare (9 June 2009)

As he said above, permission was sought and granted


----------



## wizoz (9 June 2009)

So I was right then


----------



## Nailed (9 June 2009)

hehe, I think follyfoot need a bit of Carl Hester Back ground.. then she'd know

Well said..
Lou x


----------



## follyfoot6 (9 June 2009)

Having slept on what happened last night and in view of Sarkie's response, I am a little disappointed that someone who is obviously in a position of authority should reply to my innocent question so robustly.  These forums are for getting things out in the open and just a reasonable explanation would have surficed.


----------



## wizoz (9 June 2009)

[ QUOTE ]
  Wondering whether to draw it to BD's attention?

[/ QUOTE ]

I should think this was the bit the quite rightly pi55ed him off.
Like I said in my original reply, I don't believe he'd be arrogant, or even stupid enough to think he could get away with it! So I can certainly understand why he registered JUST to reply to you and you got the reponse you did!


----------



## mtj (9 June 2009)

Umm, i don't think sarkie was the judge 
	
	
		
		
	


	




.   

as someone mentioned, have a little look at a bio for Mr Hester.  

anyway, hopefully this discussion will be brought to BD attention and horses competing in the lower levels will also have the option of ear covers.

seems a bit sad that we are allowed to crank their mouths shut, but not allowed to provide our "happy athletes" with a little comfort.


----------



## kerilli (9 June 2009)

well, follyfoot, if you'd just asked an "innocent question" perhaps the answer wouldn't have been so sharp; i hardly think that saying "I'm sure Mr Hester thinks he can get away with anything!" was very reasonable, in fact is was pretty catty.


----------



## PaddyMonty (9 June 2009)

[ QUOTE ]
I am a little disappointed that someone who is obviously in a position of authority should reply to my innocent question so robustly.  These forums are for getting things out in the open and just a reasonable explanation would have surficed. 

[/ QUOTE ]
As would just asking your question rather than adding about bringing it to the attention of BD  
	
	
		
		
	


	




  I feel it was this that annoyed rather than the genuine question.


----------



## BBH (9 June 2009)

Yes I thought that, I very much doubt they are in a position of authority they are probably just a Carl groupie or wannabe. Clearly gay though.

I think your downfall was suggesting that you let BD know ie why would you the photo was there for all to see and they wouldn't have missed that at the comp anyway.


----------



## wizoz (9 June 2009)

[ QUOTE ]
Yes I thought that, I very much doubt they are in a position of authority they are probably just a Carl groupie or wannabe. Clearly gay though. 

[/ QUOTE ]


----------



## mik (9 June 2009)

Don't be too sensitive, you did bring it up and look up the rules and all. I can't see any competitor of Carl Hester's standing, being naive enough to break the rules or expect that it wouldn't be noticed by us lot. 
Many years ago I used to have lessons with Pammy at my riding school and Mr Hester as you call him was just starting out. So I am biased as I was, as you say one of that lot. 
I think he is great, talented and intuitive as a rider, and trainer, I also hope he is coming to the sunshine tour next year, as when he last came we learnt more watching him school in than watching any Spanish trainer/ rider.


----------



## SpottedCat (9 June 2009)

[ QUOTE ]
Yes I thought that, I very much doubt they are in a position of authority they are probably just a Carl groupie or wannabe. Clearly gay though. 

[/ QUOTE ]

That is just too funny!!


----------



## kerilli (9 June 2009)

[ QUOTE ]
Clearly gay though. 

[/ QUOTE ]

WHAT?!
seriously, wtf does that have to do with anything? just how sensitive is your gaydar anyway?! What a bizarre thing to include.


----------



## KatB (9 June 2009)

[ QUOTE ]
 Yes I thought that, I very much doubt they are in a position of authority they are probably just a Carl groupie or wannabe. Clearly gay though 

[/ QUOTE ] 

LMAO!! I think it was info straight from the horses mouth LHS...


----------



## trotonsir (9 June 2009)

[ QUOTE ]
It looks like the photo was taken during his test, I am sure Mr Hester thinks he can get away with anything! 

[/ QUOTE ]

Reckon this rattled him a bit too.  It was an innocent question which a lot of us were interested in hearing the answer to but reckon you got as good as you gave (if that makes sense!)


----------



## nic85 (9 June 2009)

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Yes I thought that, I very much doubt they are in a position of authority they are probably just a Carl groupie or wannabe. Clearly gay though. 

[/ QUOTE ]



























[/ QUOTE ]

My thoughts exactly Wizoz!!! what sort of comment is that!!!!???


----------



## katelarge (9 June 2009)

It's certainly tempting to think the top riders are prone to f***ing up sometimes like the rest of us, but Carl is riding at a level where a giant stuffup like that could have major ramifications on his business. 

I think the reason he IS the dog's doo-da's is that he, quite simply, doesn't make the mistakes the rest of us do!

Sarkie, eh?...


----------



## eoe (9 June 2009)

You don't have to be Carl Hester to get special pemission to ride using something that is listed as against BD/FEI rules, i had to compete a couple of years ago on one of my horses who had inadvertently trodden on a rotten nail, wasn't lame and was entered for a dressage competition, vet wrote me a letter to say horse was sound to compete but must be competed with an Easiboot on to stop anything getting into the hole whilst it healed.  Judges and venue were more than happy for this to happen and he came 4th.  It just proves that judges are human and its the old saying if you don't ask you don't get.


----------



## archoak (9 June 2009)

Have some of you really not realised who 'Sarkie' is or are you being deliberately provocative  
	
	
		
		
	


	




   I'm not mentioning anything about dressage ever again knowing who could be reading my post  
	
	
		
		
	


	




  Unless of course son gets a 20


----------



## kerilli (9 June 2009)

applechaff, yes, i do realise who 'sarkie' is, but i still don't think there was any need for a reference about sexuality... very bizarre imho.
as they say, don't say anything on here you wouldn't say to the person's face, you never know who might be reading...


----------



## Sarah1 (9 June 2009)

QR - I agree with others, I dare say the comment about Mr Hester thinking he can get away with anything might have rattled him somewhat, not really a very productive comment was it?!
Fair play to 'sarkie' for defending and welcome!


----------



## jules89 (9 June 2009)

Ah well I'm watching him on HCTV now


----------



## ahesk1 (9 June 2009)

I think this has all been blown out of proportion. I don't think follyfoot6 meant to be catty/bitchy but yes, it could have been interpreted in that way. ie, [ QUOTE ]
I'm sure Mr Hester can get away with anything!

[/ QUOTE ]

Some of the responses were equally (if not more) catty including sarkie's - no matter who he actually is it was uncalled for to post such arrogant replies as

[ QUOTE ]
Well if you havent recognised my user name its not worth telling ;-)

[/ QUOTE ]

The rest of the responses were not much more constructive either, they just turned this thread into a petty argument which is unnecessary because it was a justified question. 

It is healthy to question aspects of the horse world because in my opinion it has a tendency to be biased and I am not the only one with this view. I think you should all slow down and think before jumping to the defensive because follyfoot6 was not having a go at Carl, she was merely pointing out something that she was unsure on.


----------



## Nailed (9 June 2009)

I think follyfoot was having a good bitch about Mr Hester to be fair..

And I think he was well within his right to reply with sarcasm.. 

I also think you could have choosen a better post as your first post.. Not coming here and nocking people who you dont know.. you have come across as one of Follyfoots minions.. Not good im afraid,

Lou x


----------



## ahesk1 (9 June 2009)

Well that is your opinion, as it is mine whether to back up follyfoot6 or not. Just because somebody agrees with someone when the rest are disagreeing does not make somebody their 'minion'.

I often read the forum but have never felt compelled to register and actually reply, this has motivated me to because I feel people are, as I stated before, blowing it out of proportion.


----------



## GDB (9 June 2009)

Im sure someone in Carls position wouldnt assume that they could get away with anything, he is constantly watched by too many and I know he would work within the rules. There are occasions when a judge or judges can grant expection to the rules for example.. kt ( glamourdol) competed at Hickstead Premier League without a glove on her left hand because she had broken her wrist 3 days before and was in plaster. I rang BD and cleared it with the judges on the morning of the comp.


----------



## wizoz (9 June 2009)

[ QUOTE ]
As seen in H&amp;H this week there is a photo of Carl Hester on Uthopia winning a PSG competition with his horse wearing ear covers (or what ever you call them).  Under BD rule 56 this is not allowed and under FEI rules "ear muffs are under penalty of elimination and strictly forbidden." Or could they be interpreted as a protective fly hood which are "then permitted in extreme cases only".  Just wondering if we grass root dressage riders would get away with them, probably not.  Wondering whether to draw it to BD's attention? Look forward to your comments. 

[/ QUOTE ]

ahesk1, how can you say this was a "healthy question" when the poster was considering dobbing CH in to BD???

Lets look at the real picture here shall we, CH is one of our most prolific dressage riders in this country, why the hell would he NOT know the rules about wearing ear covers in a dressage test, have you all gone mad and think that he's just a nobody 
	
	
		
		
	


	





Jesus, get real....


----------



## Imonone (9 June 2009)

It is oh so true that the written word can be misconstrued at times but IMHO the original post was catty and uncalled for.

Carl has been a superb ambassador for the sport in this country and I think that even if he had made a mistake for once, he deserved better than this pointedly bitchy post.


----------



## Santa_Claus (9 June 2009)

Hello 'sarkie' 
	
	
		
		
	


	




 welcome to the forum and thankyou for clearing the matter up.


----------



## wizoz (9 June 2009)

[ QUOTE ]

Carl has been a superb ambassador for the sport in this country and I think that even if he had made a mistake for once, he deserved better than this pointedly bitchy post. 

[/ QUOTE ]

Exactly but my point is, I don't think he WOULD make that mistake, he's been in this game for far too long to do so, IMHO.


----------



## muffinino (9 June 2009)

[ QUOTE ]
I think this has all been blown out of proportion. I don't think follyfoot6 meant to be catty/bitchy but yes, it could have been interpreted in that way. ie, [ QUOTE ]
I'm sure Mr Hester can get away with anything!

[/ QUOTE ]

Some of the responses were equally (if not more) catty including sarkie's - no matter who he actually is it was uncalled for to post such arrogant replies as

[ QUOTE ]
Well if you havent recognised my user name its not worth telling ;-)

[/ QUOTE ]

The rest of the responses were not much more constructive either, they just turned this thread into a petty argument which is unnecessary because it was a justified question. 

It is healthy to question aspects of the horse world because in my opinion it has a tendency to be biased and I am not the only one with this view. I think you should all slow down and think before jumping to the defensive because follyfoot6 was not having a go at Carl, she was merely pointing out something that she was unsure on. 

[/ QUOTE ]

Rubbish, the OP was clearly having a go, trying to (for whatever odd reason) either get CH in trouble or troll the forum. If they genuinely wanted to know, the question could have been put in a better, less snide way, not by insinuating that CH had delibrately flaunted the rules and got away with it.

FWIW, I would have thought someone of CH's standing is not so stupid as to think that breaking the rules in such a way would gain him anything. He has too much to lose and, tbh, doesn't really need to stoop that low now, does he?


----------



## archoak (9 June 2009)

[ QUOTE ]
applechaff, yes, i do realise who 'sarkie' is, but i still don't think there was any need for a reference about sexuality... very bizarre imho.
as they say, don't say anything on here you wouldn't say to the person's face, you never know who might be reading... 
	
	
		
		
	


	





[/ QUOTE ]

Kerilli - I wasn't referring to you directly, more the original poster, you were quite right about sexuality having zero to do with anything


----------



## PopStrop (9 June 2009)

I think the fact that this was posted in Latest News shows the OP is just out to cause trouble. Why post on here? If OP had _genuine_ concerns, why not contact BD and ask, instead of suggesting it on here?


----------



## Gamebird (9 June 2009)

Am I the only one who feels mildly embarrassed by this whole thread (by association - I haven't commented on it anywhere) and who thinks it should probably be put to bed now?


----------



## PortwayPaddy (9 June 2009)

I think I'll go with the good old "question asked and answered"

Carl has a website, I'm sure there is a contact email.  So if the question still burns, ask the man!

P.


----------



## MagicMelon (9 June 2009)

[ QUOTE ]
Am I the only one who feels mildly embarrassed by this whole thread (by association - I haven't commented on it anywhere) and who thinks it should probably be put to bed now? 

[/ QUOTE ]

Me too


----------



## lucretia (9 June 2009)

QR
LMAO. I knew this was going to get interesting last night, as i was fairly sure who sarkie was and is within about two guesses..... I thought the OP was catty which is why i was so interested to see the responses as I do know that a great many of the famous read this forum, some of them even comment. 
  being gay has nothing to do with anything, CH may well have forgotten to remove his horses ear covers or the judge might not have noticed or both, as sometimes happens with boots. as it happens he just asked for permission, WTF did it matter in the first place? with the photographic evidence in front of everybody including BD if anyone had wanted to object then or immediately after the test, they would have done so by now, so it was fairly safe to assume CH had the appropriate permission or we would have heard about the row by now!
  And I dont need to go on about CH and what he has done for dressage as his number one groom has already worked for a world and european champion so carl is hardly impressive by comparisson yet, and that would be the day when she sent a horse into any ring not appropriately dressed!


----------



## Tinypony (9 June 2009)

[ QUOTE ]
 Well if you havent recognised my user name its not worth telling ;-)

[/ QUOTE ]
Isn't that a bit like the celeb bleating "Don't you know who I am?".  (No, I don't and I don't care  
	
	
		
		
	


	




).

What a wierd thread, I think the whole thing is an over-reaction to the OP.


----------



## Cyberchick (9 June 2009)

Indeed, CH, you are a dream to watch sometimes but I wouldnt have a scooby doo what 'sarkie' meant. 

I have read all this with interest with my cup of tea and a packet of biscuits and I think it has all gone a little over the top now. A wrongly worded post and a reply from the man himself. CH is fab but not god, calm down, it's a bit of material over a pair of ears that has been explained and should be the end of it.


----------



## Quadro (9 June 2009)

i hardly think some1 in mr h's position would flaunt the rules, the poor man prob knows the bd rule book inside out as im sure there has been many occasions when he has been the subject of jealousy and had to make sure he is in the correct position. anyway a wee bit of material over its ears isnt suddenly going to increase a score from 50%-80% riding and training got the results not ear covers!!!!!
edited as my spelling shocking


----------



## noname (9 June 2009)

For those of you that are interested; I am going to be sending in an application for dispensation for ear covers (when I get round to it).
I rang BD and they said I would need very good veterinary gounds for it. I have to submit a report from the vet with details of the horses condition, my horses treatment history and the vet would need to recommend that ear covers should be worn in competition.
I was also going to submit photos of his ears when the midges get at them so they can see why. 

They are banned because BD are worried that they would be used to muffle sound. I have to agree with them on this one because it would be bloody dangerous. Not to mention ear covers becoming the next ridiculous fashion assessory!!!

My horse has ear fungus/plague, In the summer the midges attack it and make it bleed. Cannot touch his ears at all and you have to lift the bridle over very carefully.


----------



## follyfoot6 (9 June 2009)

I'm back, I certainly seem to have shaken things up a bit!  Thankyou everyone who had an intellectual comment to say about my observations.  There does seem to be some fairly infantile ones which have missed the point completely. I was at Somerford Park on said day, and am a keen dressage rider.


----------



## nokia (9 June 2009)

lol do you really think CH has time to come on this forum ? And i agree that the comments to follyfoot6 where harsh !  The rule book is their for a reason..and yes people that are getting unfair treatment should be reported to BD.

I also think that many of the riders need to tone down on their campness at shows it drives me mad and is not very professional !


----------



## Santa_Claus (9 June 2009)

[ QUOTE ]
lol do you really think CH has time to come on this forum ? 

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, yes i do, as do several other very well known names, you would be really surprised. Honestly in this case CH was prob just pointed in the direction on this thread by a friend and he rightly chose to reply. He has done exactly the same on the BD forum....


----------



## kerilli (9 June 2009)

[ QUOTE ]
lol do you really think CH has time to come on this forum ? And i agree that the comments to follyfoot6 where harsh !  The rule book is their for a reason..and yes people that are getting unfair treatment should be reported to BD.

I also think that many of the riders need to tone down on their campness at shows it drives me mad and is not very professional ! 

[/ QUOTE ]

why wouldn't he have time? he may be a dressage god but i doubt he rides 24 hours a day.
i find that final remark really offensive, and i'm straight as a die. why the hell should anyone have to tone down any part of their behaviour... do you think those with broad accents should pipe down, feminine women shouldn't wear pink, and so on?! and i hardly think he's "unprofessional", btw. unbelievable.
and no, i'm not a CH hanger-on, fwiw.


----------



## wizoz (9 June 2009)

[ QUOTE ]

I also think that many of the riders need to tone down on their campness at shows it drives me mad and is not very professional ! 

[/ QUOTE ]

Homophobe 
	
	
		
		
	


	





Get real, that's life


----------



## OldGit (9 June 2009)

Oh for christs sake maybe the horse gets cold ears. Now if thats the answer to my bucking bronco on Sunday I'd have more interest. Lets move on


----------



## nokia (9 June 2009)

u find everything offensive thats all you ever say !!  i am in the real world, and yes i dont like all this campness sometimes i feel like im in a queen video from 20 years ago at these shows ...dressage is meant to be a professional sport..you dont see all this in football ect.


----------



## dressagediva22 (9 June 2009)

I have just been reading all this and laughing at how out of hand all this has become and aggree that if it was about any other rider it would have been viewed in a completely different manner.
I feel follyfoot6 has raised a very interesting and valid topic which obviousley needs addressing and some peoples responses to this are very childish!!
The original question was not questioning carls riding or anything else, we all know how fab he is.
Maybe some people will feel strongley about this as on the day of comp at somerford park it was very flyey there and maybe carl did have an advantage over other riders who may have also worn fly hoods if they new they could.
Also in the case of noname who is explaining there difficulties in wearing such equipment and how much hassel they have to go through to be allowed to wear the ear covers just to make there horse more comfortable must be slightly infuriating when it appears so easy for others to wear them.
Surely it should be one rule for all to save all this confusion!!


----------



## Shrek-Eventing-SW (9 June 2009)

FFS guys

i am 15 years old and some of u are acting worse than people my age and younger.

Someone asked a question

and it got answered

END OF STORY


----------



## Tinypony (9 June 2009)




----------



## S_N (9 June 2009)

QR - am I the only one who is amazed at the number of similar posting styles being used by 'different' users?  Rat anyone?


----------



## the watcher (10 June 2009)

_ why the hell should anyone have to tone down any part of their behaviour... do you think those with broad accents should pipe down, feminine women shouldn't wear pink, and so on?_ 

On the subject of pink - I think there should be laws against it!


----------



## M_G (10 June 2009)

[ QUOTE ]
Yes I thought that, I very much doubt they are in a position of authority they are probably just a Carl groupie or wannabe. Clearly gay though.


[/ QUOTE ]

That is so uncalled for I do hope you are suitably ashamed of yourself


----------



## Halfstep (10 June 2009)

[ QUOTE ]
As seen in H&amp;H this week there is a photo of Carl Hester on Uthopia winning a PSG competition with his horse wearing ear covers (or what ever you call them).  Under BD rule 56 this is not allowed and under FEI rules "ear muffs are under penalty of elimination and strictly forbidden." Or could they be interpreted as a protective fly hood which are "then permitted in extreme cases only".   

[/ QUOTE ]

I can answer this as just been through it with a friend who rides at FEI levels.  For BD national competitions ear covers are not currently allowed without special dispensation.  For FEI-rules (internationals) they are allowed at the organisers discretion, provided you apply for permission from the director of your sport (Will Connell in GB's case I think).  

If you look at pictures from the European championships at Turin in 07, all horses had them on due to the awful flies. Fair enough. 

Don't see why the OP is having a dig at Carl.  Not fair.


----------



## BBH (10 June 2009)

Actually no I'm not. At the time of the post there was a discussion as to who it was and all I was doing was throwing in some observation to narrow down who it could be. I think its clearly very obvious the poster was gay tbh and you are questioning why I said that as if its a problem ( is it a problem being gay ?, if you are gay why would or should you feel offended by the suggestion that you could be )  I have worked in Islington long enough to recognise such bitchfest responses straight off.

FWIW if any response was required all CH had to do was say this is who I am, thank you for observations, the situation was this, end of. Its not hard is it.If that had happened this thread would have been over in 4 or 5 posts.


----------



## M_G (10 June 2009)

Not a bitch fest response I just thought it was very rude indeed.. TBH I dont believe for one minute it was CH


----------



## BeckyD (10 June 2009)

[ QUOTE ]
u find everything offensive thats all you ever say !!  i am in the real world, and yes i dont like all this campness sometimes i feel like im in a queen video from 20 years ago at these shows ...dressage is meant to be a professional sport..you dont see all this in football ect. 

[/ QUOTE ]

I fail to see why anyone should have to be "not camp" to suit your delicate tastes.  What the heck does it matter?  

If you think football is so much more professional, go play football.  I, conversely, happen to think that football player sex antics in hotel rooms/rape allegations against players/drugs/drink problems/petulant pitch behaviour (need I go on) are not professional.   
	
	
		
		
	


	





I'm afraid you've come across as a very intolerant person.  But at least you were honest, I suppose.


----------



## Thistle (10 June 2009)

[ QUOTE ]
Actually no I'm not. At the time of the post there was a discussion as to who it was and all I was doing was throwing in some observation to narrow down who it could be. I think its clearly very obvious the poster was gay tbh and you are questioning why I said that as if its a problem ( is it a problem being gay ?, if you are gay why would or should you feel offended by the suggestion that you could be )  I have worked in Islington long enough to recognise such bitchfest responses straight off.






My response

I have stayed out of this post so so but feel I have to reply to this.

WHAT ON EARTH DOES ANYONES SEXUALITY HAVE TO DO WITH THEIR ABILITY TO COMPETE?

Dressage is a test of horse and rider not some bizzare competition where sexual performance and style is marked.


----------



## Michelle73 (10 June 2009)

[ QUOTE ]
u find everything offensive thats all you ever say !!  i am in the real world, and yes i dont like all this campness sometimes i feel like im in a queen video from 20 years ago at these shows ...dressage is meant to be a professional sport..you dont see all this in football ect. 

[/ QUOTE ]
No just a healthy bout of violence, spitting, swearing and racism at football!!!! 
	
	
		
		
	


	





Who cares who does what as long as it doesn't hurt anyone or anything!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## BBH (10 June 2009)

My response

I have stayed out of this post so so but feel I have to reply to this.

WHAT ON EARTH DOES ANYONES SEXUALITY HAVE TO DO WITH THEIR ABILITY TO COMPETE?

Dressage is a test of horse and rider not some bizzare competition where sexual performance and style is marked. [ QUOTE ]


[/ QUOTE ]  [ QUOTE ]


[/ QUOTE ] 

What a strange post, talk about getting the wrong end of the stick    
	
	
		
		
	


	




It doesn't but we were trying to figure out who it was.


----------



## nokia (10 June 2009)

i never said anything about sexuallity or abillity to compete..all i said was they need to tone down !! I do sometimes wonder why no major money is in dressage or showjumping these days, most sponsors are "horsey related " these days ie sell equestrian products.

And it does matter to me, the sport needs to be more professional to attract the money to it..the last few weeks newspaper stories about dressage riders was shamefull.

I am running horses paying their BD reg, diesel, training, ect and i want to win more than 15.00 per class.

So before you all start slagging me off about my opinions..have a look at the biger picture.


----------



## BBH (10 June 2009)

There's no point addressing that to me it wasn't my comments. I was quoting back someone who had posted to me. 
	
	
		
		
	


	






I do actually agree with you that in order to attract big sponsorship you need to portray a more credible image. I used to work in a Bank offering huge sponsorship but they wouldn't touch any equestrian sport as they were trying to attract a family market.


----------



## TarrSteps (10 June 2009)

I really don't think the primary problem with attracting sponsors to equestrian events is the presumed sexuality of the participants. 
	
	
		
		
	


	




  And as far as banks are concerned, some of the major sponsors of equestrian events in North American have been banks - they don't seem to have taken your advice. 
	
	
		
		
	


	




  In fact I think part of the attraction IS the family market - all those middle class people with horses and kids with ponies get the warm fuzzies every time they see one of their heroes - horse or human - linked with the brand.

It does also beg the question why the more enlightened businesses, the ones that recognise a market with disposable income when they see one and are actively trying to get a piece of it on tv etc., aren't beating a path to equestrian events' door.  Perhaps someone should mention the connection since getting money for sponsorship seems to be the driving force behind this thread now.

What a very strange turn this has taken.  The things people let loose on the internet . . . 
	
	
		
		
	


	





To the initial question of why someone might get dispensation . . . my guess is because they asked.  In my experience that DOES separate "the big guns" from "everyone else" - the big guns ask, perhaps because the have the confidence, perhaps because that's the sort of people they are.  Other people seem to assume they will be turned down so don't ask, but often feel hard done by later.  It would be interesting to hear from someone here who HAS been turned down on the ear cover subject, specifically someone else at the same show.  That might be an actual story.  And yes, every now and then, people do get something because they are famous and well known.  But that doesn't seem to be the case here.  And again, it's usually because they ask.


----------



## kerilli (10 June 2009)

Well, it doesn't really answer your question TS, but I can remember a fairly well-known eventer getting the big E in the dressage at a 3-day event a few years ago because she put a nose-net on her horse but did not have the necessary written dispensation for it. she'd apparently seen other people using them, therefore concluded that they were legal (which they are, IF you have written dispensation to use them for that specifically named horse), and used one, and was E'd. Those using them with prior written permission were of course allowed to continue. No special dispensation given there to a well-known rider...
I don't think there is "one rule for them, one rule for us" at all, it's usually sour grapes imho!


----------



## Golden_Match_II (10 June 2009)

[ QUOTE ]
I also think that many of the riders need to tone down on their campness at shows it drives me mad and is not very professional ! 

[/ QUOTE ]

I think this a kinda sick comment, to be frank! Your sexuality/personality should never have anything to do with your profession, in the sense that you can be whoever you want to be - not who you have to be. I think it's really sad if little tiny things like peoples sexualities when they're riding annoys you!!!!


----------



## popsdosh (10 June 2009)

We have a mare who has a letter to let her use a nosenet at BE &amp; BD it would probably be more sensible to allow their use for all competitors and then nobody is deemed to be gaining advantage.
Incidentally they are not allowed at FEI under any circumstances.


----------



## StinkiPinki (10 June 2009)

Hilarious! every one really should get a life!! LOL


----------



## Sags_Deer (10 June 2009)

Ive not read all of this and dont really get involved in these messy replies.  But for goodness sake Carl Hester is our best rider and competes at the highest level possible, first of all it doesnt matter what side he bats for and secondly if he is allowed to use ear protectors on his horse then good luck to the guy.  I totally admire him and anyone else at the top they work very hard to get there and obviously have a lot of talent.


----------



## diggerbez (10 June 2009)

[ QUOTE ]
i never said anything about sexuallity or abillity to compete..all i said was they need to tone down !! I do sometimes wonder why no major money is in dressage or showjumping these days, most sponsors are "horsey related " these days ie sell equestrian products.

And it does matter to me, the sport needs to be more professional to attract the money to it..the last few weeks newspaper stories about dressage riders was shamefull.

I am running horses paying their BD reg, diesel, training, ect and i want to win more than 15.00 per class.

So before you all start slagging me off about my opinions..have a look at the biger picture. 

[/ QUOTE ]

i'm sorry...i know this post needs putting to bed now but i really don't think that equestrian sports have problems with sponsorship because Dressage riders are sometimes gay or camp or because some dressage riders got drunk with katire price 
	
	
		
		
	


	








 if it came down to such minute details then other big name sports stars wouldn't have sponsors but they seem to?

Ronaldo (accused of rape and always in the papers for drunken antics)
Steven Gerrard (accused of beating someone up in a nightclub)
Michael Phelps- smoking cannbis on the front page of newspapers
Eric cAntona- kung fu kicking a fan
just a couple of examples off the top of my head. 
	
	
		
		
	


	




so to reiterate...i don't think campness is the problem. its probably more to do with the perception that its an elitist sport done by the aristocracy and royalty.
nokia...you may be homophobic but please realise that such intolerance is hugely frowned upon in today's society so i suggest you keep such opinions to yourself from now on.


----------



## PapaFrita (11 June 2009)

[ QUOTE ]
...dressage is meant to be a professional sport..you dont see all this in football ect. 

[/ QUOTE ]
You don't see dressage fans beating seven types of sh!t out of each other in the stands, either. 
I can't be arsed to answer your comment about dressage being a professional sport. I find it too utterly ridiculous to make the effort.


----------



## BBH (11 June 2009)

i'm sorry...i know this post needs putting to bed now but i really don't think that equestrian sports have problems with sponsorship because Dressage riders are sometimes gay or camp or because some dressage riders got drunk with katire price   if it came down to such minute details then other big name sports stars wouldn't have sponsors but they seem to?
 [ QUOTE ]


[/ QUOTE ]  [ QUOTE ]


[/ QUOTE ] 

My post doesn't mention anything about sponsorship being based on the sexuality of a competitor and yes some banks have supported Zara Phillips for example. In fact the feedback I got was nothing about sexuality it was more the number of falls / deaths in eventing and the antics of some of the showjumpers.  I think its only recently that dressage has been in the spotlight, in the main through Sophie Christensen who i think has been a fabulous benefit ( anyone remember her in the papers with Paul McCartney ) and on the flip side the circus that is Jordan who I  agree raises the profile in a deadly dull sport but not necessarily for the right reasons.


----------



## nokia (11 June 2009)

diggerbez get real...we are living in 2009 not 1963

you may be homophobic but please realise that such intolerance is hugely frowned upon in today's society so i suggest you keep such opinions to yourself from now on

How dare you label me as a homo phobe ! Its people like you that our sport doesnt need .

Who said anything about Katie Price ...again jumping to conclusions !!

See as i said you can not see the bigger picture..ie trying to attract famillys to our events...tv companies ect.


----------



## SirenaXVI (11 June 2009)

[ QUOTE ]
i never said anything about sexuallity or abillity to compete..all i said was they need to tone down !! I do sometimes wonder why no major money is in dressage or showjumping these days, most sponsors are "horsey related " these days ie sell equestrian products.

And it does matter to me, the sport needs to be more professional to attract the money to it..the last few weeks newspaper stories about dressage riders was shamefull.

I am running horses paying their BD reg, diesel, training, ect and i want to win more than 15.00 per class.

So before you all start slagging me off about my opinions..have a look at the biger picture. 

[/ QUOTE ]

As a BD member I completely disagree with your comments.

Yes, the prize money at the lower levels is abysmal, this is primarily because dressage on the whole is not a spectator sport so does not pull in the big money in the way that showjumping for instance does.  This is in no way the fault of gay people as you insinuate.

I presume the unprofessional image you refer to is our old friend KP, who to the best of my knowledge is most definately not gay.  Just because she spent some time chatting to Spencer Wilton does not make Spencer and therefore (in your eyes) gay people responsible for the paps response to the furore that later emerged.

To be perfectly honest I think that on the whole BD does come across as totally professional, you, on the other hand come across as a bitter homophobe.


----------



## Quadro (11 June 2009)

if u dont like gays then horses isnt the sport for you!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## diggerbez (11 June 2009)

[ QUOTE ]
i'm sorry...i know this post needs putting to bed now but i really don't think that equestrian sports have problems with sponsorship because Dressage riders are sometimes gay or camp or because some dressage riders got drunk with katire price   if it came down to such minute details then other big name sports stars wouldn't have sponsors but they seem to?
 [ QUOTE ]


[/ QUOTE ]  [ QUOTE ]


[/ QUOTE ] 

My post doesn't mention anything about sponsorship being based on the sexuality of a competitor and yes some banks have supported Zara Phillips for example. In fact the feedback I got was nothing about sexuality it was more the number of falls / deaths in eventing and the antics of some of the showjumpers.  I think its only recently that dressage has been in the spotlight, in the main through Sophie Christensen who i think has been a fabulous benefit ( anyone remember her in the papers with Paul McCartney ) and on the flip side the circus that is Jordan who I  agree raises the profile in a deadly dull sport but not necessarily for the right reasons. 

[/ QUOTE ]

if you look LHS my comments weren't aimed at you in any way, shape, or form


----------



## diggerbez (11 June 2009)

[ QUOTE ]
diggerbez get real...we are living in 2009 not 1963

you may be homophobic but please realise that such intolerance is hugely frowned upon in today's society so i suggest you keep such opinions to yourself from now on

How dare you label me as a homo phobe ! Its people like you that our sport doesnt need .

Who said anything about Katie Price ...again jumping to conclusions !!

See as i said you can not see the bigger picture..ie trying to attract famillys to our events...tv companies ect. 

[/ QUOTE ]


people like me?!?!  
	
	
		
		
	


	




 what the hell!? it wasn't me saying that camp people were bringing a bad image to the sport and that they should tone down!! i'm all for freedom of speech but not when it negatively targets specific groups in society- be they gay, straight, black, white, purple ad infinitum! i have to do a lot of equal ops training because of my job and its amazing that people sit there saying things that they don't even realise are prejudiced/ stereotyped or whatever! and who said ignorance was bliss??! 
	
	
		
		
	


	





just out of interest which dressage riders were you referring to in the tabloids then if not KP and SW?


----------



## MandyMoo (11 June 2009)

[ QUOTE ]
Am I the only one who feels mildly embarrassed by this whole thread (by association - I haven't commented on it anywhere) and who thinks it should probably be put to bed now? 

[/ QUOTE ]

me too  
	
	
		
		
	


	





this whole thread is ridiculous...a petty arguement that has escalated far beyond what is classed as ''too far''. Give it a rest guys. a question was asked (even if it may seem to some rude) it was answered (to some it may seem to have been rude) - end of thread. 

there was no need to continue argueing for 5 pages.


----------



## polyphonic (11 June 2009)

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

I also think that many of the riders need to tone down on their campness at shows it drives me mad and is not very professional ! 

[/ QUOTE ]

Homophobe 
	
	
		
		
	


	





Get real, that's life 
	
	
		
		
	


	





[/ QUOTE ]

Oh how I adore blatant ignorant comments like this!!
Peter must remember when next at a show, not to speak like Orvill the duck, mince round the course and to not stand like a tea pot!
All in all aside- Ive read through the posts, but the one that stands out as the most cattish goes to post numero uno!


----------



## Penguinboots (12 June 2009)

QR...
I thought the people on this forum were generally an intelligent bunch. I stand corrected judging by this thread....


----------



## jojofruits (12 June 2009)

LOL and you lot wonder why a lot of people are put off from asking for advice on this forum.. a lot of you ( not all.. don't lynch me!) should be totally ashamed of yourselves.. I rarely post here unless its super important ( missing or stolen horses for example) just for this reason.. kindergarden stuff.. shocking! I'm amazed that Horse and Hound are advertising this in their latest emailout TBH!


----------



## cruiseline (14 June 2009)

This thread is a real disgrace, I am shocked by some of the post on here, probably the worst one I have read so far, and that took some beating.

In answer to the OP the answer is NO, otherwise he would have been eliminated, plain and simple.


----------



## charlie55 (14 June 2009)

[ QUOTE ]
This thread is a real disgrace, I am shocked by some of the post on here, probably the worst one I have read so far, and that took some beating.


[/ QUOTE ] Completley agree with you, couldnt believe my eyes reading this...


----------



## SecretSquirrell379 (14 June 2009)

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
This thread is a real disgrace, I am shocked by some of the post on here, probably the worst one I have read so far, and that took some beating.


[/ QUOTE ] Completley agree with you, couldnt believe my eyes reading this... 

[/ QUOTE ]

Ditto but I have noticed that a lot of the very aggressive comments or out of order ones have come from newbies, or people with low post counts....just after some attention and they got it


----------



## JessicaSearle12 (18 June 2009)

Well said cruiseline


----------



## flowerlady (19 June 2009)

Oh dear and all over ear covers


----------

