# which of these two would you feed?



## paddi22 (23 February 2016)

Horses to feed are
-ISH really poor doer, moderate work load
- preganant mare due in a few months
- two year old good doer cob
- ancient oldie pony
- exracer, light work, ok doer
- fat mini

Main issue is due to budget issues i've to try and get them all fed as cheaply as possible and still get them all they need. Hoof quality is a big issue and also getting conditions on some. 

Trying to simplify and cut down on different feeds and supplements. Mainly to save money but also sick of feed room being stacked with various bags, and ending up doubling up on supplements etc.  I'm rubbish at analsying feed properly so would appreciate any insight people might have. Have narrowed it down to two options (i think!) but the main things i want to get are

&#8226; feed has to be wet
&#8226; hoof supplement
&#8226; oils for weight gain
&#8226; as few bags and hassle as possible
&#8226; low cereal as possible

Options i was thinking are:

Equerry Conditioning Mash plus hoof supplement
-but is is the mash a complete feed with all vits etc?

Fibre Beet (has biotin) and baileys stud balancer
- are the oils and biotin enough in it? 
- is the fibre beet better value per bag?

Options ruled out are copra (tried it and horse didn't like it). Micronised linseed, cant get it anywhere handy and any pure feed and simple systems stuff (too hard to get). 

If anyone had opinions on the above or even any other options i'd be really interested to hear!


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## deicinmerlyn (23 February 2016)

Beet, Alfalfa nuts.  Grass Nuts - all can be a mash, then vary quantaties and add a balancer.multi vit supplement and salt and or oil


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## wench (24 February 2016)

Similar to my post a week or so ago! Currently got one horse on topspec balancer and cubes as needed some good feed as a pick me up. 

Other one is on cheapo pony nuts or fibre nuts, dependant on what is cheaper in the shop.

I have decided to move over to Pegasus conditioning cubes. Whilst it may not be the best conditioning cubes in the world, they are a lot cheaper per sack, and will suit both of my horses. This will be fed alongsides a quantity of vit and min supplement.

This will hopefully save me some money, and have decided to cut out all the supplements that don't seem to do anything, and unfortunately the ones that do!


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## Sugar_and_Spice (26 February 2016)

If it was me I'd buy:

Unmolassed sugar beet
Alfa-A oil (don't know why you especially want the oil for weight gain but generic alfalfa chaff is cheaper than branded stuff, although it's likely to be molassed so not so good for feet)
Oats (ok for feet, you don't say any other reason for not wanting cereal)

For vitamins/minerals I like Benevit, it's oil based too.

ISH and pregnant mare would get the lot, the ex-racer too perhaps but in smaller quantities.  Or leave out the Alfa-A if he's a fatty.
The oldie could have the sugar beet and chaff and leave out the oats if he can't chew them.  I'm assuming he can eat chaff.  If not I'd buy grass nuts like someone else suggested and substitute everybody's Alfa-A with those.
Cob could have the sugar beet and a few oats but leave out the chaff.
The mini can have literally a few flakes of sugar beet and a pinch of oats just so he doesn't feel left out.

Regarding Pure Feeds, they're not the cheapest perhaps but they're good I've found.  I used the Easy one and soaked it into a mash in a few inches of water for a couple of hours.  If you want to feed this, I believe they deliver if you buy 10 bags or something so you could have delivered to your home perhaps?


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## AdorableAlice (26 February 2016)

Veteran Vitality to the sport horse and golden oldie.

The rest I would not feed bucket grub but would keep top quality haylage in front of all of them bar the mini, who would have hay, until the grass comes through.  The broodie won't want building up prior to foaling, fat mares having overdone foals can get into trouble.


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## paddi22 (26 February 2016)

cheers for all the advice, it's great to get peoples opinions! That benevit stuff looks amazing, but budgetwise i don't think i could afford it  For feeding 6 off it , plus postage i think its out of my budget. Would love pure feeds but they don't deliver anywhere near me. Tried it in the past but didn't work out on a practical level as based in southern ireland. 

Building stables and fairly broke, so really, really short of cash flow for the next few months. Horses are out 24/7 in poor grazing. Field can't be accessed to drop large bales in, and two of the horses can't have hay - so i've to fork out 6 euro per small bale of haylage.   I've managed to offload the mini on loan and ISH on livery. So only four to feed now!

Veteran vitality looks good - will ring round and see if suppliers near me do it and what price it is. 

If the benevit style supplement is out of budget -  am i best sticking to beetpulp and a balancer?  They will survive without the oils, so maybe a hoof supp will do it? 

 Sugar_and_Spice - hadn't thought of oats. what would you find the best benefit in adding them?  

Issue is also they are fed in the field so there's a bit of musical buckets going on at times!. So ideally would like to get them all on a similar feed and just slip extra handfuls to any who need something in particular.


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## Sugar_and_Spice (27 February 2016)

If you like the sound of Benevit keep an eye on Feedmark's website, they often run special offers BOGOF etc (which basically makes things half price). There's not normally postage charges when you buy direct from them, maybe its your location, if you're a bit out of the way? Also, as its so fab, you can get away with feeding a half dose a lot of the time (meaning it lasts twice as long), increasing to the full dose if there's something wrong eg mud fever or a virus etc. And buy the biggest tub you can because per kilo it works out cheaper.

Oats is just more calories, its the highest fibre/lowest starch grain feed there is, it doesn't come coated in molasses like a mix does, oats are very light so a 20kg bag is huge and lasts forever unlike a 20kg bag of mix, chaff and sugar beet might not be enough to tempt any fussy ones once the grass starts coming through but with some oats added they'll lick the bowl clean, there's a calcium/phosphorus ratio (can't remember what right now sorry) sugar beet and alfalfa are high in calcium and oats high in phosphorus so together they help create a balanced ration. Erm, I think that's about it! I love oats.


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## Sugar_and_Spice (27 February 2016)

Also, now the fat mini is gone I'd feed molassed sugar beet. This purely because the molasses add calories so you can feed less of it and its cheaper to buy than the unmolassed stuff.


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## paddi22 (27 February 2016)

thanks for your advice, that makes sense about the oats. how much would you add per bucket?


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## Sugar_and_Spice (27 February 2016)

If you're using big round scoops, I'd add 1/4 to 1/2 scoop oats per bucket usually. 

Assuming you're going to feed the max volume of about 2 of those scoops per bucket, for a basic feed I'd go with 1/2 oats, 1/2 wet sugar beet and 1 chaff. 

Maybe just a fist full of oats for the good doer cob and 1/4 scoop sugar beet, 1/2 chaff, you don't want to make him fat.

The poor doer - if he doesn't pick up enough, change the oats to 1 scoop and the chaff to 1/2 scoop.


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## paddi22 (28 February 2016)

brilliant, thanks a mil, thats very helpful.

I was looking online and bluegrass do an oat balancer that contains biotin and oils. So gonna go with the unmollased beetpulp, oats, chaff and that oat balancer 
thanks for all the help.


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## Sugar_and_Spice (28 February 2016)

I just googled that oat balancer because I'd not heard of it.  I'm not sure if I found the right thing though.  I could only find an Oat Balancer Mix, which looks like a racehorse feed not a vitamin/mineral balancer.  Probably I'm looking in the wrong place, I'm not a technology person.  Do you have a link to the one you were looking at?  I'm just curious, I like to know what's out there, especially if it's budget-friendly and it works :smile3:


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## paddi22 (28 February 2016)

http://bluegrasshorsefeed.com/oat-balance-mix.html

yep it is a mix, it says it contains beetpulp, so ive contacted them to ask exactly what way it works as not 100% it will suit.

What attracted me was the content being
-Proteins, vitamins & minerals which balance the carbohydrate content of Oats.
-Biotin &#8211; A B-vitamin which promotes healthy hoof growth and a shiny coat.
-Oil & super fibres such as beet pulp to complement an oat rich diet.
-Stamm 30 &#8211; the industry&#8217;s premium protein, vitamin and mineral concentrate

it sounds like a stud balancer, plus biotin and oil. which would knock out me having to buy extra supplements or outshine etc.  just waiting to hear back from bluegrass. 

Baileys do an oat balancer mix but it looks a bit too hardcore for what i need, more aimed at racing.


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## Leo Walker (28 February 2016)

Thats designed for racehorses. Can you not feed something like Pro mineral from Progressive Earth. Works out about £10 a month for a 500kg horse. That and salt and you wont need special hoof supplements etc. Outshine is just linseed really and way, way more expensive! Can you not source any? I used to buy 15kg bags for about £20 inc delivery


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## paddi22 (28 February 2016)

yep it says racehorses and breeding - the breeding part attracted me cause the pregnant mare would suit it. 

but out of curiosity what would make it aimed at racehorses, if its just vitamins and minerals? 

micronised linseed seems impossible to get in southern ireland! would love to be able to get it but never seems available anywhere.

I've always meant to try the progressive earth supplements as they look fantastic, but costs seems too high at the moment. As i've poor grazing it looks like i'd need pro balance +, which is about 25 euro plus probably 5 euro postage to ireland. Feeding rates look like i'd get through 1.8 kg in 11 days for the five (mini plus foal included as one) , so seems very expensive. or am i calculating it wrong?? bag of balancer would seem to be cheaper and less hassle?


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## Leo Walker (28 February 2016)

I suspect that the racehorse stuff is designed to be very nutrient rich and high calorie. I could be wrong though!

You have poor grazing, but your feeding haylage, which is why I suggest the pro mineral. Its the cheapest, but probably has a better spec than benevit etc


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## paddi22 (28 February 2016)

yeah am hoping to cut off the haylage once the grass starts coming through, grass is quite scrubby so wouldn't particularly be lush grazing at the best of time though!

yeah im curious why the oat-balancer is marketed for racehorses too, I'l let you know what blue grass says when they reply.


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## Sugar_and_Spice (29 February 2016)

Thanks for the link. It was the one I found too. I don't think that's a balancer as in something concentrated which you feed a mug full of daily, I think that's a mix to complement oats. I suspect you'd need to feed several kilos per horse per day to get the right amount of vits/mins. I definitely wouldn't give it to the cob. Be interesting to hear what the company say about it. Maybe they think only competition people feed oats.


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## BethH (29 February 2016)

I've just put my gelding on Progressive Earth's pro mineral too, along with brewers yeast after years on Benevit which I think didn't had any one ingredient in enough quantity to be useful enough now he's a bit older.  Have to say my horse is looking good on it.  I think our grass in unbalanced and he looks brighter since he's been on it. I favoured the pro mineral over the pro balancer as although they don't look much different in price you have to feed a higher quantity of the balancer which makes it quite a bit more expensive even though it's a good all rounder supplement.

My horses base feed is Agrobs, wonderful feed with no rubbish in it, great quality for a very good price, our whole yard is now using it.  The museli is just lovely & I bulk it out with the Aspero which is dried grass (like a chaff) in winter and wet it down but you can also buy their grass nuts which are great quality & well priced and soak well.  He gets 1/2 a cup of charnwood linseed - fabulous for coat/skin/feet/joints and a large bag lasts for ages, plus the yeast & minerals.  I also feed dried herbs, here and there as rosehips, marigold and celery seed powder help joint maintenance along with the brewers yeast and are mild natural anti inflammatory's so you could just pop some in as & when needed.  My horse is looking bright eyed and shiny coated and - hurrah after all my depressed posts over the last year or so I am pleased to report I have just had my 4th day in a row of sound horse so the vet diagnostics have been cancelled (again - sigh) - probably the kiss of death posted that on here, bet now it's public he'll break again, but I wonder if some of it is down to getting the right balance of minerals along with B vits from the yeast!


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## Leo Walker (29 February 2016)

BethH If you contact Equivita she will probably be able to do you one mix with the equivalent of promineral and the herbs etc all in one. She used to custom blend me something similar


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## BethH (29 February 2016)

Thanks Frankie but I did look at the equivita as I know a lot of people like it but I found it quite highly priced given the quantities you have to feed, the pro mineral/brewers yeast worked out far cheaper.  Someone told me their horse didn't like the taste and when I asked for a sample to try to make sure he'd eat it, she wanted the details of who had said it to me so I just didn't carry on with the conversation.  I think the big tubs are much more cost effective but I decided to walk away as I didn't want to get in to an argument or be left with a large uneaten tub of it.


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## paddi22 (8 July 2016)

Just a quick update on this thread. I switched to the bluegrass oat balancer a few months ago after the advice on this thread and am absolutely delighted with how its working out. I just feed oats, beetpulp and the balancer now. It's working out really cheap and it gives me great flexability across the very mixed herd i have. They are all looking shiny, happy and in great condition on it. Delighted that the bluegrass one has the biotins and oils as its saved me on extra supplements.  

My feed bill has gone from
&#8226; Hoof supp
&#8226; oil supplement
&#8226; Conditioning mix for oldie/poor doers
&#8226; lo cal balancer for fatties
&#8226; baileys competition mix for eventer
&#8226; beet pulp
&#8226; pony mix for the normal horses

to just
&#8226; oat balancer cubes &#8364;13
&#8226; oats &#8364;6
&#8226; beetpulp &#8364;9

I was really stuck for cash so its saved me an absolute fortune. Thanks so much to the posters who suggested simplifying everything and feeding oats straight originally, i's been a lifesaver!


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