# Urgent Advice please - Plasma transfusion for young foal or alternative



## Dolcé (7 March 2011)

The results of the foal's LgG tests came back and is lower than it should be (675mg/dl), vet has offered plasma or treatment with antibiotic paste.  There is obviously a huge difference in cost but that isn't really important, is there a huge difference in results though?  Our initial reaction was to go for the plasma but this involves sedation and 30 minutes ish of transfusion, I think we would have to get mare sedated again too as I am not sure she will stay calm in the box whilst foal is treated.  Upon discussion we realised that the level is more than half way between the two crucial figures, 400 and 800 mg/dl and wondered if the antibiotic paste would suffice.  I just wondered what experiences of both anyone had and also what thoughts are on which to have.  My gut is to go with the plasma but it seems an awful lot to put this baby through when she has already been messed around so much, I am also quite concerned at how stressed the mare is already, she really does hate vets but will do what is best.  I have absolutely no experience of this so would really appreciate any advice those with experience could give.


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## BallyshanHorses (7 March 2011)

I work for a Tb stud and we have given up on using plasma.We have had foals have some very dramatic side effects from it but if you have no alternative I would go ahead with it.
It still has mixed reviews  so see what your vet says.


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## Dolcé (7 March 2011)

I have to ring vet in the morning to tell her what I want to do, what do you do if you don't use plasma, do you just risk it?


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## imafluffybunny (7 March 2011)

I had a foal a few years ago who needed a plasma infusion. Mare and foal were sedated and foal treated, no stress to either. 
I dont know much about the paste but was pleased we went with the plasma.


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## BallyshanHorses (7 March 2011)

I would risk it if I were you.I am not trying to scaremonger but it is not all plain sailing either and I am sure you were told of the side effects.I am just saying that I have seen plenty get plasma and they still end up getting Rhodacoccus etc later in life so I just wonder why it is so bloody pricey when it is so hit and miss.


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## Dolcé (7 March 2011)

Eek, side effects weren't mentioned at all, I think the vet was telling me to go with the antibiotic paste, but without telling me if you know what I mean!  She kept saying how healthy foal was and it wouldn't be cruel not to give plasma but I just don't want to get it wrong for the foals sake.


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## BallyshanHorses (7 March 2011)

On the other hand there are plenty of foals who are born whose bloods are not taken for an IGG test and I am sure they have to cope with everyday life without the owner knowing that its low in antibodies!!!


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## sallyf (8 March 2011)

If the foal looked bright and alert with an Igg of 675 i dobt we wouldnt do a plasma transfusion.
Our vets who are one of the leading vets in Newmarket generally give Plasma if the Igg is below 400 and with the ones between 400 and 800 they judge the foal on how it is in itself.
Obviously if it is weak or maladjusted we would give plasma but if it looks fine we would just go with 5 days of tribrissen injections


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## Touchwood (8 March 2011)

I wouldn't give plasma at that level either.

However, we have given it quite a lot over the years when needed, and I think it is great stuff.  The only side effects I have seen is when the foal is a bit small, and in that case, you should give it in 2 lots rather than 1 go.  We never need to sedate either.


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## JanetGeorge (8 March 2011)

hch4971 said:



			I think the vet was telling me to go with the antibiotic paste, but without telling me if you know what I mean!  She kept saying how healthy foal was and it wouldn't be cruel not to give plasma
		
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A nod is as good as a wink - etc.  I don't take Igg as standard (in fact I can only remember doing it twice in the last 50 odd foals) and never given plasma - so can't comment on possible side effects or efficacy!  I've only once had to give transfusions to a foal and that was a Dummy foal at about 4 days.

BUT - stress is about the worst thing for young foals (and it isn't that good for their Mums either!)  As long as foal had a decent amount of colostrum, mare is producing plenty of milk, and foal is bright and well, then I doubt my vet would recommend antibiotic paste either!!  Just keeping it away from any likely sources of infection and watching closely!  The antibiotic paste isn't the greatest thing for a young digestive tract if it's 'a precaution' rather than actually NEEDED - and you still have the stress to the foal of shoving it down throat!


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## Dolcé (8 March 2011)

Thank you all so much for your input, it is so difficult dealing with these things when you don't know anything about it.  I have googled but it didn't really help know what to do for the best.  Sallyf, I assume the antibiotic paste the vet is talking about is tribrissen so I think we will go with that.  Foal is very bright in herself. Thank you all so much.


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## angrovestud (8 March 2011)

My only experiance of Idg tests I am afraid are negative my old vets who I now would not touch with a bargepole when our first colt was born mum regected him we had to milk mum and bottle the colostrum in to him, the next day when the vet came she did the test and rang me  the next morning to tell me that he had almost no score that he needed blood Plasma and she was going to take it from our stallion his sire and he would need sedation the mare would need it as well and then the plasma would be centrifuged brought back and administered ,I do not remember what the level was,  but anyhow she went on to ask how the foal was well he was dong the wall of death round the box and mum was allowing him on we spent 24 hours teaching her, I advised the vet he was happy and health and I got told I would Kill him! and I was at risk of making him very sick, I still said no glad I did as we know of one foal that was given inported plasma that had a anafalatic shock I for one wouldnt touch it unless the foal was already at deaths door.
Forgot to say the boucing wall of death foal is now a daddy himself my vet wouldnt advise me to use it either


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## sallyf (8 March 2011)

hch4971 said:



			Thank you all so much for your input, it is so difficult dealing with these things when you don't know anything about it.  I have googled but it didn't really help know what to do for the best.  Sallyf, I assume the antibiotic paste the vet is talking about is tribrissen so I think we will go with that.  Foal is very bright in herself. Thank you all so much.
		
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I expect that the paste would be trimadiazine which is a broad spectrum antibiotic that i often used in foals.
Tribrissen would be the same thing but injectable.
Personally prefer to inject in the first few days as think the pastes can be a bit hard on the gut but thats just personal preference and what our vets do.
But we dont pay vet call outs and can also inject ourselves so pastes are often a cheaper alternative for someone such as yourselves.
We have just treated a foal with Tribrissen for 5 days even though it had a Igg of 1200
but the cord broke and left very little stump which we had to take action to stop bleeding.
It was thought to be better safe than sorry as the umbilical cord was vulnerable.
We treat each individual foal on what we see.


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## Touchwood (8 March 2011)

Echo Sally - I would always rather inject in the early days rather than use paste.


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## Dolcé (8 March 2011)

I have just been to pick up the paste so, do I use it or do I wait and see if it is needed.  Foal is in purely because of being early and being very small and I will keep her in until mum shows that she needs to go out.  I then have to balance mum's needs because she is likely to kill the foal bouncing around the box herself once she gets fed up, as soon as she starts barging the door rather than her usual waiting patiently I will know that she needs some time out. I must admit I was a bit confused about treating with antibiotics when there doesn't appear to be an infection and I was concerned about foalie's gut but I really don't want to risk her health.


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## tristar (8 March 2011)

i had a foal with 400 score, he was perfectly healthy, still is at 3 years, would never have known if vet had'nt taken blood, he had no treatment, he did have an umbilical infection but i thought  it was due to another vet breaking the cord at birth before i had the chance to stop him, this could  have also resulted in the foal not recei.ving the full full quota of blood from his dam, i am not sure but that could possibly have reduced his score


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## Smee (8 March 2011)

I had a foal who looked as strong as an ox when born, feeding well & bright as a button. IGG came back pretty much none existent! (mare did run milk before foaling) I was advised to plasma transfuse him, then on re-test he was still under the magic 400, although still looking bright as a button. Vet advised 2nd plasma, after which he tested just about 400. We decided not to go for a 3rd, but gave paste then aswell. However he had Gastroguard to help his tummy. Poor boy had all this (& on a bank holiday w/e!) Both he & mum had to be sedated when transfusing. I can't say that he is any worse for his treatment (still as strong as an ox & bouncing around!), but nor can I say what would've happened had I not had him tested (except I wouldn't have had to fork out a fortune in vets fees & out of hours call out charges!)

Good luck with your little one hch4971 & let us know how you get on.


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