# Putting a healthy horse down



## smellydogjack (10 February 2016)

A lady at my yard has caused uproar. Her life situation  has changed and she can't really keep her horse. I suspect- after much deliberation, she has decided the only choice she has is pts. Said mare is 10, and a lovely horse, but she wouldn't trust a loan home, and she couldn't bare to sell. Que an uproar that she is cruel etc... from the rest of the yard. Part of me gets it. I get why she can't see through any other choice, I'm not saying I would do it. However part of me understands.

Pointless post but it's played on my mind all week.


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## _GG_ (10 February 2016)

There's a blog link in my signature....have a read, feel free to share with your friend and maybe share with others on the yard as well. What your friend is thinking of doing is seemingly awful, but in reality, a very responsible decision that will guarantee the future of a horse she loves. It doesn't mean she doesn't love the horse....in fact, it means she loves it so much she wants to protect it from an uncertain future. 

The only other thing I will say is that it may be worth mentioning Horses4Homes to her as a way to loan, but she would still need to be in a position to step in if anything fell through.


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## Dusty85 (10 February 2016)

Whilst it seems a bit unnecessary, I get why she had made that decision. Its her horse so she has final say. 

As long as the horse doesn't suffer it's not cruel. Others should butt out and not make a hard decision harder.


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## Michen (10 February 2016)

I think it's rather unfair to put down a healthy, useful and rideable horse if it can very easily be sold on and give someone else pleasure as these types are easily loanable as well. 

If however the horse is unrideable and has issues of some sort then I do believe she is doing a very responsible thing for the horse she loves.


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## jrp204 (10 February 2016)

Her horse, her decision.


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## fatpiggy (10 February 2016)

Can't bear to sell but will PTS instead?  Hmmm.  If her circumstances have changed, she should put the horse up for sale or through the nearest market and let it take its chances. No doubt the money she would get would be helpful.  No-one turns down £££s if they have any sense?


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## luckyoldme (10 February 2016)

we all bang on about old horses being sold, what difference does it make? Whenever you sell a beloved horse you can t gaurantee where it will end up. be it a younger fit horse or and older one.
I would hate it happening beside me, and would feel very sad and upset by it, but its her horse and she does what she has to live with.


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## Hepsibah (10 February 2016)

Wow. I'm going to have to be the person who goes against the flow here. How flaming arrogant can a person get! She is the only person who can look after a horse? Her horse is better off dead if it can't be with her? It is her horse, yes and it is her decision to make but what a rotten decision for the blimmin' horse! The horse only has one life and she's taking it for no good reason. vile.


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## Damnation (10 February 2016)

Her horse her choice.

Those causing uproar should think about the emotional hell this woman is going through.

I can see why they wouldn't be happy but at the same time, she is saving the horse from an uncertain future. She obviously cares more about the horse than money.

We currently have a crisis of too many horses and not enough homes. Think about it.


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## smellydogjack (10 February 2016)

This is why it has played on my mind. I really understand  both sides... I am also ashamed with how people have reacted to her, she is not finding this easy.


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## zaminda (10 February 2016)

The question for me is is the horse rideable? If the horse can be ridden and has no health issues then i'm with the wtf camp. If everyone decided to put there horse down when they didn't want it any more, there would be no horses for people to buy who couldn't produce their own. If however the horse is particularly sharp then I can understand, as horses like this can go the wrong way. Not saying it would, but they are much harder to find a good home for.


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## madlady (10 February 2016)

OP I have to say I personally think that the owner is doing the right thing.

I have 4 horses, a 23yo, a 16yo and 2 7yo (mare and a gelding) who I bred myself.  If my circumstances changed and I could no longer keep them I would have them all PTS if I could not guarantee their future.  I would rather a horse have a shorter happy life than a longer awful one.  Yes I know the chances are they could go on to happy homes and be loved for the rest of their days but can I guarantee that?  If I couldn't say to myself with any degree of certainty that I have secured their future then I would go down that path.

Even more so nowadays when there are far too many horses for the homes available and they are becoming more of a disposable commodity.


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## MotherOfChickens (10 February 2016)

Hepsibah said:



			Wow. I'm going to have to be the person who goes against the flow here. How flaming arrogant can a person get! She is the only person who can look after a horse? Her horse is better off dead if it can't be with her? It is her horse, yes and it is her decision to make but what a rotten decision for the blimmin' horse! The horse only has one life and she's taking it for no good reason. vile.
		
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I agree actually. Different if the horse has issues.


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## Pinkvboots (10 February 2016)

It's her horse she can do as she likes it's no one else's business, I would rather have one of mine pts than have them neglected by someone and the state of the horse welfare situation in this country at the moment there's a good chance that could happen.


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## MuddyMonster (10 February 2016)

I believe there is a fate worse than death & in her shoes, I'd do the same.


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## Wagtail (10 February 2016)

Hepsibah said:



			Wow. I'm going to have to be the person who goes against the flow here. How flaming arrogant can a person get! She is the only person who can look after a horse? Her horse is better off dead if it can't be with her? It is her horse, yes and it is her decision to make but what a rotten decision for the blimmin' horse! The horse only has one life and she's taking it for no good reason. vile.
		
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Completely agree! There are hundreds of good loan homes out there and also even more people who would buy a ten year old horse and give it a good home. Poor mare. What is the horse like and can she be ridden?

eta: If the horse has issues, then depending on what they are, then PTS might be the best option, but if not, then I think this woman is feeling so depressed she is not being fair on the horse.


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## AdorableAlice (10 February 2016)

Perhaps a little respect should be given to the owner.  It is stated she is experiencing a 'life changing' situation.  Who can judge what a life changing situation is ?  There could be any number of issues, health physical or mental, violence, becoming a carer for a loved one etc etc.  

In 2013 I made the decision to put down horses if the life changing situation I found myself in did not have a good outcome.

it should be remembered that when we take on animals we are responsible for their destiny and there are a lot worse situations then death.  A short drive around and plenty of suffering horses can be seen.

I wish the owner in this sad situation closure and peace in whatever she decides to do.


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## TheSylv007 (10 February 2016)

Hepsibah said:



			Wow. I'm going to have to be the person who goes against the flow here. How flaming arrogant can a person get! She is the only person who can look after a horse? Her horse is better off dead if it can't be with her? It is her horse, yes and it is her decision to make but what a rotten decision for the blimmin' horse! The horse only has one life and she's taking it for no good reason. vile.
		
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Got to say I agree with this - why assume that all other potential owners will be awful?  Is she the only person in the world that can be trusted to look after a horse?  Seems she's denying the horse a chance of continuing a happy life (especially if it's fit and well and not even old!).


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## ihatework (10 February 2016)

Ultimately it's the owners decision whatever anyone else thinks. The mistake she made was to discuss her intentions with others on the livery yard.

A horse might be healthy but that doesn't always mean it's suitable to be loaned/sold. From the info supplied we cannot make that judgement.


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## weesophz (10 February 2016)

i think if i was in her position i would probably do the same. Fox is bit older now, covered in bumps and scars and is only insured on one leg.. he is an angel and perfect to me but i know he would be near impossible to sell


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## GemG (10 February 2016)

ihatework said:



			Ultimately it's the owners decision whatever anyone else thinks. The mistake she made was to discuss her intentions with others on the livery yard.

A horse might be healthy but that doesn't always mean it's suitable to be loaned/sold. From the info supplied we cannot make that judgement.
		
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^^^ agree

People are quick to judge and we have to remember horses are not people, they have no idea or concept of being PTS .   But they surely will notice if they find themselves in unfortunate hands/badly managed or misunderstood .

I feel sorry for the owner/her situation, but it really is her business and her responsibility- which she is obviously taking very seriously.


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## LD&S (10 February 2016)

AdorableAlice said:



			Perhaps a little respect should be given to the owner.  It is stated she is experiencing a 'life changing' situation.  Who can judge what a life changing situation is ?  There could be any number of issues, health physical or mental, violence, becoming a carer for a loved one etc etc.  

In 2013 I made the decision to put down horses if the life changing situation I found myself in did not have a good outcome.

it should be remembered that when we take on animals we are responsible for their destiny and there are a lot worse situations then death.  A short drive around and plenty of suffering horses can be seen.

I wish the owner in this sad situation closure and peace in whatever she decides to do.
		
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As usual AA has worded it far better than I could.


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## LeannePip (10 February 2016)

fatpiggy said:



			Can't bear to sell but will PTS instead?  Hmmm.  If her circumstances have changed, she should put the horse up for sale or through the nearest market and let it take its chances. No doubt the money she would get would be helpful.  No-one turns down £££s if they have any sense?
		
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Sorry, i think this is the most ridiculous post!

People do turn down money if its in the best interest of the horse.  Putting a horse through the sales and letting it 'take its chances' is not in the best interest of the horse!

It is upto the owner what she does, yes PTS does seem extreme but its her call if she can't live with giving her horse an uncertain future then it is 100% the right thing to do.  The horse doesn't know, she doesn't have plans for tomorrow or next year or the year after that, they live in the now.  She will know all those years of love and will never have to worry about ending up in the wrong hands, it is ridiculous to think that that is better than a few hundred quid for the owner.


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## 9tails (10 February 2016)

The age and health of this horse is the issue for me.  If the horse is unrideable then fair enough, but if she's rideable I really don't understand it.  There is at least a good 10 years of work left in this mare.


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## rowan666 (10 February 2016)

Damnation said:



			Her horse her choice.

Those causing uproar should think about the emotional hell this woman is going through.

I can see why they wouldn't be happy but at the same time, she is saving the horse from an uncertain future. She obviously cares more about the horse than money.

We currently have a crisis of too many horses and not enough homes. Think about it.
		
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^^ Exactly this!


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## Goldenstar (10 February 2016)

jrp204 said:



			Her horse, her decision.
		
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It is, but there's no reason why a nice sound ten year old won't find a good home so if it were me I would sell carefully to the right person .


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## milliepops (10 February 2016)

AdorableAlice said:



			Perhaps a little respect should be given to the owner.  It is stated she is experiencing a 'life changing' situation.  Who can judge what a life changing situation is ?  There could be any number of issues, health physical or mental, violence, becoming a carer for a loved one etc etc.  

In 2013 I made the decision to put down horses if the life changing situation I found myself in did not have a good outcome.

it should be remembered that when we take on animals we are responsible for their destiny and there are a lot worse situations then death.  A short drive around and plenty of suffering horses can be seen.

I wish the owner in this sad situation closure and peace in whatever she decides to do.
		
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Well said AA.


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## madlady (10 February 2016)

Goldenstar said:



			It is, but there's no reason why a nice sound ten year old won't find a good home so if it were me I would sell carefully to the right person .
		
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And there is the crux - carefully to the right person.  If you couldn't find that right person/home and guarantee your beloved horse a future (regardless of age) what would you do?


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## touchstone (10 February 2016)

I know someone who is currently trying to sell a pony that is sound, no vices, priced sensibly but has had no takers for about a year.   Luckily she isn't in a position where her life is changing drastically so can hang on for longer, but it isn't always easy to find all these wonderful homes, especially when statistically there are more horses than good homes out there for them.

I would struggle to pts a healthy rideable ten year old, but I would never say that I wouldn't do it; until you've lived the other persons life you have no right to judge her decision and I respect her choice to provide what she thinks is best for her horse.  Perhaps she has tried and failed to find the right home.

I'd far sooner pts than sell into an uncertain future.   The horse only lives in the now, pts isn't a cruel choice in itself.


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## Lanky Loll (10 February 2016)

AdorableAlice said:



			Perhaps a little respect should be given to the owner.  It is stated she is experiencing a 'life changing' situation.  Who can judge what a life changing situation is ?  There could be any number of issues, health physical or mental, violence, becoming a carer for a loved one etc etc.  

In 2013 I made the decision to put down horses if the life changing situation I found myself in did not have a good outcome.

it should be remembered that when we take on animals we are responsible for their destiny and there are a lot worse situations then death.  A short drive around and plenty of suffering horses can be seen.

I wish the owner in this sad situation closure and peace in whatever she decides to do.
		
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Well said, but can't help wondering what may happen in the future if/when the owner comes out the other side of this current situation whatever that may be.  If it's a situation similar to yours AA the owner could find themselves in 12 months time wishing they hadn't gone through with it.
It's an awful position to be in, and I can't help thinking that IF (big if) the owner had the option to turn the horse away for 6-12months somewhere similar to GGs set up (I appreciate this may not be an option), they could give themselves time to assess their situation and go from there?  This is assuming the decision is one that they have come to relatively quickly in reaction to fast changing circumstances.  This may not be the case and the owner may be beyond that point already.


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## Wagtail (10 February 2016)

I think that if the owner is doing it during a crisis or because she is severely depressed, then putting the horse down will only end up coming back to haunt her. She may be racked with guilty which would hamper her recovery. IF the horse is rideable and healthy/sound, then I think she is making a bad mistake at a time when she is not able to think rationally. She is thinking in extremes. It will not be good for her in the long run.


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## popsdosh (10 February 2016)

madlady said:



			And there is the crux - carefully to the right person.  If you couldn't find that right person/home and guarantee your beloved horse a future (regardless of age) what would you do?
		
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My view is a lot are to quick to question what she is doing .Which approach requires more guts and total love of your horse? I pray that those who criticise are never in the desperate situation to have to make that decision or maybe are less caring than you make out to turn your back on the horse to whatever may be fall it. I think maybe there would be a good home for the horse however if the owner is worried to much it cannot be guaranteed they must do what is right for them ,you really have to remember how desperate do things have to get to even contemplate this for her. I certainly would never dream of criticising her and would support her until you get that desperate you cannot comprehend how it is.


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## twiggy2 (10 February 2016)

fatpiggy said:



			Can't bear to sell but will PTS instead?  Hmmm.  If her circumstances have changed, she should put the horse up for sale or through the nearest market and let it take its chances. No doubt the money she would get would be helpful.  No-one turns down £££s if they have any sense?
		
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don't judge everyone by your own standards


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## Valar Morghulis (10 February 2016)

MuddyMonster said:



			I believe there is a fate worse than death & in her shoes, I'd do the same.
		
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This, every single time.


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## Annagain (10 February 2016)

It's hard to make a judgement without knowing the full story. Personally, I would sell (or even give away if it was the right person) a healthy, rideable, sweet horse with a chance of a good, useful, happy life. However, none of us know the owner's situation. I just hope she doesn't regret her decision in years to come if she comes through whatever it is she's going through now.  

Having said that, I think I would PTS my boy if I was in a situation where keeping him was impossible. He's 20, with foot problems which mean he can't jump and he's riddled with melanoma. He's fine at the moment and enjoying life as a happy hacker but I don't know how long that will continue.


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## cavalo branco (10 February 2016)

This is an interesting discussion and one decision that I will have to make in the future, let's just say, due to ill health. I've already decided to have my 17 year old PTS, he has had PSD, has arthritis and 5 melanomas. He is happily field sound but would never find another home.
However, my rising 9 has every chance of another owner and I will certainly try to sell him when the time comes, hopefully not for a few years.
I know that this is an individual's decision but surely she could attempt to sell first? She may be pleasantly surprised.


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## AdorableAlice (10 February 2016)

fatpiggy said:



			Can't bear to sell but will PTS instead?  Hmmm.  If her circumstances have changed, she should put the horse up for sale or through the nearest market and let it take its chances. No doubt the money she would get would be helpful.  No-one turns down £££s if they have any sense?
		
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There is a lovely saying that is very accurate and true.

Never assume.  For the simple reason that it can often make an  ASS out of U and ME.

Further more, your assumption that the owner will, "no doubt find the money helpful" could at best be inappropriate  and at worst the biggest insult going.  There are many situations where money cannot and will not be able to buy health or happiness.  It is another assumption that the owner will have "live with her decision".  Given there are no details, and why should there be, it is no doubt a private and personal situation that the owner is in.  

Never assume, it is rude, arrogant and not a nice trait.


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## fatpiggy (10 February 2016)

twiggy2 said:



			don't judge everyone by your own standards
		
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It wasn't meant like that - the dangers of the written word. WHat I meant was, if her problem was financial then the selling the horse would be sensible and practical. There are plenty of perfectly good, capable owners out there looking for the right animal.  I'm hardly the person you should condemn where money is concerned - lots of people thought I was mad to buy my mare because she was sensitive, unpredictable to ride and something of a fruitcake.  She then turned out to have epilepsy.  Not being a person to give up easily I persisted with the vets and got her long term treatment, so she got old enough to develop chronic arthritis and then Cushings, and I paid for all of that too.  At the very best estimate that little lot amounted to £44K.  Yes, you did read that right and all but the first few hundred pounds came straight out of my bank account, not the insurance. I wouldn't have sold my horse if my circumstances had changed, I would have PTS - but as you can see, she came with quite a lot of baggage and I wouldn't have expected anyone to step into my shoes.


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## Goldenstar (10 February 2016)

madlady said:



			And there is the crux - carefully to the right person.  If you couldn't find that right person/home and guarantee your beloved horse a future (regardless of age) what would you do?
		
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What would I do I would PTS.
But I have bought had think of three off the top of my head horses who came to us when there owners had to sell Fatty was young ( 8) and the others where thirteen fatty is still here and the others where with us until lameness led me to PTS both where twenty then.
People do buy older horses and do right by them nothing like this is easy.
I would not hesitate to put down a quirky or physically difficult to manage horse  if I had to part with my horses but a nice healthy horse just coming to her prime I would seek to sell to the right person .


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## Amymay (10 February 2016)

Damnation said:



			Her horse her choice.

Those causing uproar should think about the emotional hell this woman is going through.

I can see why they wouldn't be happy but at the same time, she is saving the horse from an uncertain future. She obviously cares more about the horse than money.

We currently have a crisis of too many horses and not enough homes. Think about it.
		
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I absolutely agree.

The only mistake this lady has made is to tell others of her plans.


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## madlady (10 February 2016)

Goldenstar said:



			What would I do I would PTS.
But I have bought had think of three off the top of my head horses who came to us when there owners had to sell Fatty was young ( 8) and the others where thirteen fatty is still here and the others where with us until lameness led me to PTS both where twenty then.
People do buy older horses and do right by them nothing like this is easy.
I would not hesitate to put down a quirky or physically difficult to manage horse  if I had to part with my horses but a nice healthy horse just coming to her prime I would seek to sell to the right person .
		
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Same here, I would do everything in my power to find the perfect home for mine but if I couldn't then, like you, I'd pts - even if healthy.


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## ljohnsonsj (10 February 2016)

I've said it 100 times before and i'll say it again, there is far worse fates for horses and any animal than death. My best horse is happy and healthy, she's also very quirky and been passed pillar to post before I got her. She is now totally content with herself and happy. If I had to give her up would I sell her on? Absolutely not, PTS would ensure she had the best life and never encountered a nasty human again in her life.


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## respectedpony driver (10 February 2016)

Glad I am not one of your horses.'Put it through the nearest market'.



fatpiggy said:



			Can't bear to sell but will PTS instead?  Hmmm.  If her circumstances have changed, she should put the horse up for sale or through the nearest market and let it take its chances. No doubt the money she would get would be helpful.  No-one turns down £££s if they have any sense?
		
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## oldie48 (10 February 2016)

A lot depends on the horse doesn't it? Straightforward, healthy, well schooled horses in their mid life are like gold dust especially if they are between 15.2 and 16.2. But, quirky horses with health issues are very difficult to rehome well and are probably best pts in a circumstance like this. Every horse I've ever bought for myself has been bought as an 11 year old, My old TB is now 28, Mr B is 13 and will stay with me forever. I sold a horse I bought aged 11 as a dressage schoolmaster (paid a lot of money) as a hack when he was 17 (runs to find cover!) He's been with his new owner for nearly 2 years now and I get regular updates and pictures from her and I know he won't move on again and he is loving his new job but clearly didn't want to do any more dressage despite his natural talent and being 100% sound and healthy. I'd like to think I am the sort of owner anyone would want to sell to, provided the horse, of course, was suitable for me. We are out there, you know, but you may have to sort the wheat from the chaff, so to speak.


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## Equine_Dream (10 February 2016)

Hepsibah said:



			Wow. I'm going to have to be the person who goes against the flow here. How flaming arrogant can a person get! She is the only person who can look after a horse? Her horse is better off dead if it can't be with her? It is her horse, yes and it is her decision to make but what a rotten decision for the blimmin' horse! The horse only has one life and she's taking it for no good reason. vile.
		
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Im afraid I agree with this! Normally Im the first to support someone taking responsibility and having an animal pts where there are issues that mean it is likely to struggle to find a good home e.g. old horse/dangerous horse to ride/severe health issues etc etc.
But when we are talking about a perfectly young healthy horse Im afraid I find it very sad. To say the horse is better off dead than with anyone except its current owner when there is nothing wrong with the horse and no reason why it couldn't be found another lovely home - sorry I just dont get it. Seems very selfish imo. Shes putting her own feelings above the horse


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## Cortez (10 February 2016)

Of my current 5 equines, only one is really saleable. The others (2 aged, 1 an abuse rescue and NOT an amateur ride, 1 a mule - he'll be going to the Donkey Sanctuary if I die/become incapacitated) will be put down as required when either they need it, or I need it. I have this written in my will. We don't know the full story with OP's friends horse, but I would suspect there is some reason why it cannot/should not be sold on.


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## Tapir (10 February 2016)

If this was an older horse or had health issues I'd agree but it is only 10 years old - it may well end up in a better home.  Should no one ever sell a horse in case it ends up in a bad home? Just have it pts instead!  how ridiculous.  If that was to happen, everyone, including me would have to breed their own as there would be none to buy.  How many of those agreeing have sold one of their horses?  Of course you can't guarantee a good home for life, that's impossible but the chances of it ending up being neglected have got to be fairly slim.  Yes, there may be lots of horses suffering but there are many, more that are not.

I think if she's goes through with this she will regret it later.  I'd never forgive myself for having a healthy horse pts because I couldn't be bothered to find it a good home.


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## Luci07 (10 February 2016)

I am with the camp of not putting down a healthy uncomplicated horse. I appreciate it is the business of the owner and she may well have serious issues we know nothing of, but the horse isn't responsible for them. She could find a good sales livery and perhaps put a time on it but if the mare is genuine and healthy, she will find a good home. I am very glad that not everyone takes the view that they are the only ones who could ever offer a good home as what would the market be? I understand her reservations about a loan, but to PTS because she can't bear to sell?

An elderly horse, a horse with known issues or unrideable/ill.. yes PTS but not one that could happily go on to live with another owner and enjoy life.


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## HashRouge (10 February 2016)

I think it really depends on the horse, would be nice to have some more info from the OP. If it is healthy, good natured and a nice ride I'd be a little shocked at someone choosing to PTS rather than sell, as such a horse would have a good chance of finding a nice home. However, if, like so many horses, it has health or behavioural problems, which would make finding (and keeping!) a good home very difficult, then I do think she is making the right decision. It is very hard to judge this without knowing the full story.


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## smja (10 February 2016)

There are more horses for sale at the moment than there are homes for them, it seems. The owner has decided to ensure her horse's quality of remaining life by PTS, a decision that I'm sure was not made without due consideration. Whilst I'm not sure I would choose the same, I cannot help but feel that owner has taken her responsibility to the horse seriously and does not deserve to be castigated for it.


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## paddi22 (10 February 2016)

why not sell? Think its extremely arrogant to think no-one can look after your horse but you. Most people would snap the hand off a seller to get a nice, sane 10 year old. Unless the horse has issues there's no reason why it can go to a new home and work away for another 15 years. Has the horse issues?


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## AdorableAlice (10 February 2016)

Equine_Dream said:



			Im afraid I agree with this! Normally Im the first to support someone taking responsibility and having an animal pts where there are issues that mean it is likely to struggle to find a good home e.g. old horse/dangerous horse to ride/severe health issues etc etc.
But when we are talking about a perfectly young healthy horse Im afraid I find it very sad. To say the horse is better off dead than with anyone except its current owner when there is nothing wrong with the horse and no reason why it couldn't be found another lovely home - sorry I just dont get it. Seems very selfish imo. Shes putting her own feelings above the horse
		
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I so hope the owner in question does not read this thread.  It should never have been started in the first place.  If you don't get it - don't pass an ill informed comment.


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## Damnation (10 February 2016)

AdorableAlice said:



			I so hope the owner in question does not read this thread.  It should never have been started in the first place.  If you don't get it - don't pass an ill informed comment.
		
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^^ This.

What is it with horses that turn grown adults into silly little playground children? Ganging up on eachother, bullying eachother?

The horse isn't suffering, its well looked after, butt out.


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## kassieg (10 February 2016)

The thing I regret the most is not pts my old mare when I let her go for a companion home as she then got passed on despite being unsound. She luckily ended up in a lovely home but it gave me a lot of heartbreak

Sadly I was 16 & still in college so it was my parents financial decision & at that time I wouldn't have considered it but now it would have been my first thought.  She was only 10 but had navicular & djd & was an absolute b**** to deal with for anyone other than me


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## Goldenstar (10 February 2016)

Damnation said:



			^^ This.

What is it with horses that turn grown adults into silly little playground children? Ganging up on eachother, bullying eachother?

The horse isn't suffering, its well looked after, butt out.
		
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Posters are not butting into anything .
While it's possible a few know the RL story here the vast majority don't and I don't see any bullying here there's no one to bully .
I think the poster who called the decision vile was out of order and should consider with compassion what the owner must be going through.
I do hope the owner of the horse finds a way forward but tbh in the situation she in how could this thread make it worse, it's just exploring the issue .


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## Orca (10 February 2016)

Hepsibah said:



			Wow. I'm going to have to be the person who goes against the flow here. How flaming arrogant can a person get! She is the only person who can look after a horse? Her horse is better off dead if it can't be with her? It is her horse, yes and it is her decision to make but what a rotten decision for the blimmin' horse! The horse only has one life and she's taking it for no good reason. vile.
		
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I'm torn between agreeing with this and understanding her thinking. The problem is that while there are indeed great homes out there, they just can't be guaranteed. I know someone who has twice bought back horses who have gone to homes which weren't as described. This is all well and good for someone who is in a position (financially or in terms of space) to do so but what happens otherwise? Those horses would have had awful lives and very uncertain futures and this lady vetted conscientiously - it still happened. 

On the other hand, good all-rounders are the horses who instill confidence, who teach people to ride. This mare sounds like she could be highly valued and much loved by someone for many years to come and without ponies and horses like that, I wouldn't have had my first (much loved) few. If only that future were guaranteed.


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## JanetGeorge (10 February 2016)

I  must be a senimental old fool.  I have a couple of retired mares, in their 20s, in the field and contributing to me going totally broke!  I worry myself sick if I don't see one of them immediately (the old cow hides behind the  rise of a hill) but as long as they are  eating well and looking well, I can't bring myself to put them down.  I wouldn't lend or sell them - when I'm actually bankrupt they'll be PTS - but until then .....


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## laura_nash (10 February 2016)

paddi22 said:



			why not sell? Think its extremely arrogant to think no-one can look after your horse but you. Most people would snap the hand off a seller to get a nice, sane 10 year old. Unless the horse has issues there's no reason why it can go to a new home and work away for another 15 years. Has the horse issues?
		
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I know someone who sold a nice, well bred, sane 8 year old to a carefully vetted home.  Many years later they found it at a sales in a terrible state phyically and mentally.  I don't know what I would do if I was ever in a position where I had to sell, but I can understand why the lady might be making this decision, she may have had a similar experience herself in the past.


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## madlady (10 February 2016)

AdorableAlice said:



			I so hope the owner in question does not read this thread.  It should never have been started in the first place.  If you don't get it - don't pass an ill informed comment.
		
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Damnation said:



			^^ This.

What is it with horses that turn grown adults into silly little playground children? Ganging up on eachother, bullying eachother?

The horse isn't suffering, its well looked after, butt out.
		
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Absolutely agree with both of you.  Horses don't have the same concept of life and death as we do. 

We don't have the full story here but, for all of the people thinking this owner selfish how about this for a scenario:

You have been diagnosed with a terminal illness or have become suddenly immobile (accident or whatever) - you have tried and tried to find the perfect forever home for your healthy 10yo however haven't been able to do that.  Loan is out of the question as you can't guarantee that the horse would have a place if something went wrong with the loan.  What would you do with your horse then?

It could well be that this particular owner has been diagnosed with something terminal or severely life limiting and she is trying to do the best thing for her horse to guarantee it's future and has been unable to do so.

The rescue centres are full, there are more good healthy horses than there are homes for them.  Are you all saying that the perfect home is out there for every horse?  Get real.


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## Damnation (10 February 2016)

Goldenstar said:



			Posters are not butting into anything .
While it's possible a few know the RL story here the vast majority don't and I don't see any bullying here there's no one to bully .
I think the poster who called the decision vile was out of order and should consider with compassion what the owner must be going through.
I do hope the owner of the horse finds a way forward but tbh in the situation she in how could this thread make it worse, it's just exploring the issue .
		
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Goldenstar - Sorry I didn't make it clear (My fault!), I was talking about the people on the yard with which this has caused "uproar". 

It caused uproar at the last "big yard" I was at when I had my 7 year old TB PTS. To the ourside world she was a happy healthy TB. She actually had behavioural issues and a slipped disc in her spine. I was then told it was my fault, my weight that caused the injury, she was a young horse she should be allowed live etc. In the end I wasn't even allowed to PTS on the yard, I had to box her home the morning of the "deed" and have her PTS at home. She would have been on constant painkillers with daily physio which wasn't possible, feesable, and with no winter turnout, cruel. 

Yards can be horrible, judgemental places. The complete tw*ts who judged me (One of which was my mother) didn't see the mental strain it put on me, the anti depressants I was put on after I made the decision to PTS and the DAYS in tears over what had happened. People need to think before they open their mouths to cause an "uproar".


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## wingedhorse99 (10 February 2016)

Lanky Loll said:



			Well said, but can't help wondering what may happen in the future if/when the owner comes out the other side of this current situation whatever that may be.  If it's a situation similar to yours AA the owner could find themselves in 12 months time wishing they hadn't gone through with it.
It's an awful position to be in, and I can't help thinking that IF (big if) the owner had the option to turn the horse away for 6-12months somewhere similar to GGs set up (I appreciate this may not be an option), they could give themselves time to assess their situation and go from there?  This is assuming the decision is one that they have come to relatively quickly in reaction to fast changing circumstances.  This may not be the case and the owner may be beyond that point already.
		
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I know someone who had an early teens TB PTS. Single mum, working full time, and studying for job related qualifications. Time and money a huge struggle. She put him on grass livery, but he didnt thrive, and battled mudfever etc. And I think she decided against another winter. He was sound, and rideable, but a TB nature with quirks, including hacking quirks and she felt he wasnt safe enough for sharers / loan. 

As part of having him PTS she made the decision in his memory not to ever ride or get another horse, and her life has gone in other directions. 

I dont judge her. I am sure she has judged herself more than enough already.


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## Annagain (10 February 2016)

Goldenstar said:



			While it's possible a few know the RL story here the vast majority don't and I don't see any bullying here there's no one to bully .
I think the poster who called the decision vile was out of order and should consider with compassion what the owner must be going through.
I do hope the owner of the horse finds a way forward but tbh in the situation she in how could this thread make it worse, it's just exploring the issue .
		
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I agree, give the owner isn't (openly) on this thread it's more or less a hypothetical situation we're discussing. 

For me the crux of the matter is whether the owner is considering the horse's best interests (potential for future mis-treatment or being passed from pillar to post etc) or if she just can't be bothered to find her a good home. 

Without knowing the exact circumstances it's difficult to tell. "Her life situation has changed" could mean something terrible, or something good, like moving abroad or a new baby - not ideal with a horse but not something that couldn't be dealt with short term while the right home was sought if the mare really is as good and healthy as OP says.


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## Fiona (10 February 2016)

Would a vet agree to put down a sound, youngish horse with no behavioral issues??

Fiona


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## wingedhorse99 (10 February 2016)

smellydogjack said:



			A lady at my yard has caused uproar. Her life situation  has changed and she can't really keep her horse. I suspect- after much deliberation, she has decided the only choice she has is pts. Said mare is 10, and a lovely horse, but she wouldn't trust a loan home, and she couldn't bare to sell. Que an uproar that she is cruel etc... from the rest of the yard. Part of me gets it. I get why she can't see through any other choice, I'm not saying I would do it. However part of me understands.

Pointless post but it's played on my mind all week.
		
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Is the horse nice to hack and school alone and in company, well schooled, travels, 100% sound, no iffs / buts or hang ups. Nice nature, decent conformation. Anybody's ride? 

Or as I strongly suspect, the horse has a few ifs and buts which is driving her concern.


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## MotherOfChickens (10 February 2016)

Fiona said:



			Would a vet agree to put down a sound, youngish horse with no behavioral issues??

Fiona
		
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they might but I don't know many vets who would appreciate it. 

Noone is bullying anyone. It's an almost hypothetical question-would you put down a healthy, useful horse rather than sell/rehome. Some of us would, some wouldnt.


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## Tapir (10 February 2016)

madlady said:



			how about this for a scenario:

You have been diagnosed with a terminal illness or have become suddenly immobile (accident or whatever) - you have tried and tried to find the perfect forever home for your healthy 10yo however haven't been able to do that.  Loan is out of the question as you can't guarantee that the horse would have a place if something went wrong with the loan.  What would you do with your horse then?
		
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I'd find somewhere for it to go on sales livery.  A good place should find a home for a straight forward horse fairly quickly.

Or I'd leave it in my will to World Horse Welfare who have such a scheme.  I know some would object to leaving a horse to a charity but if it could be ridden then the chances are it would find a loan home pretty quickly.


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## muckypony (10 February 2016)

I think the most infuriating thing about this thread is that no-one knows whether the horse is actually sellable or not, so of course it seems like people are jumping to conclusions.

If the thread said owner wants to PTS, horse is quirky a bit arthritic.. The comments would most definitely be in agreement. However if the thread said owner wants to PTS, horse is a nice person, has been a successful RC type, sound and fit.. There would generally be uproar here too.

Nobody knows so really, we can't pass judgement.


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## MDB (10 February 2016)

this is a really interesting thread and one where my opinion has been going back and forth. 

at first i was quite horrified. i will admit it. now we don't know the whole story. but assuming the horse is fit and healthy and rideable and safe. i was quite shocked.

but then i thought about my own two horses. for those of you that know me i am in northern Spain and rescued two mares from pretty awful situations. they are young-ish, healthy, rideable, locely personality horses. if i ever had to up sticks and move back somewhere and couldnt bring them... what would i do? 

i know that there is virtually zero chance of me finding them an owner here who will respect them and treat them the way they deserve. apologies to any Spanish on the forum. but certainly in this part of Spain i can count on one hand the number of horses i have seen that have good homes if you get my gist.

i wouls have to have them PTS. i couldnt bear the thought of my beautiful ladies being maltreated or being unhappy. but that is here where horses are viewed very differently than the UK. there is no RSPCA, or welfare officers to report things to. and nobody cares. but is it really that hard to find a decent loving home in the UK?? i have no idea.


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## DD (10 February 2016)

Dusty85 said:



			Whilst it seems a bit unnecessary, I get why she had made that decision. Its her horse so she has final say. 

As long as the horse doesn't suffer it's not cruel. Others should butt out and not make a hard decision harder.
		
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^^^
this


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## Equine_Dream (10 February 2016)

AdorableAlice said:



			I so hope the owner in question does not read this thread.  It should never have been started in the first place.  If you don't get it - don't pass an ill informed comment.
		
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With all due respect I am entitled to my opinion and will express it as others have done. The OP has asked for opinions I am entitled to share mine as everyone else has.
And yes I do think its selfish and putting her feelings before the horse. Just because SHE can not bare to loan or sell the animal must die!?!!  Sorry but I find that so very sad


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## Equine_Dream (10 February 2016)

Damnation said:



			^^ This.

What is it with horses that turn grown adults into silly little playground children? Ganging up on eachother, bullying eachother?

The horse isn't suffering, its well looked after, butt out.
		
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Excuse me!? No one is ganging up or bullying anyone. OP asked for opinions people are giving them. If you don't like it then dont read the thread!


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## Damnation (10 February 2016)

Equine_Dream said:



			Excuse me!? No one is ganging up or bullying anyone. OP asked for opinions people are giving them. If you don't like it then dont read the thread!
		
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Read my post below that and you will see what I meant so chill your beans


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## Equine_Dream (10 February 2016)

Damnation said:



			Read my post below that and you will see what I meant so chill your beans 

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*puts beans in freezer* just read your other post. Sorry I just have a bug bear with people throwing the word bullying around. I didn't realise you meant the people on the yard


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## Damnation (10 February 2016)

Equine_Dream said:



			*puts beans in freezer* just read your other post. Sorry I just have a bug bear with people throwing the word bullying around. I didn't realise you meant the people on the yard
		
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Its ok, I do admit I didn't make it very clear so apologies, but I did mean the "Uproar" the OP mentioned on her yard.


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## ester (10 February 2016)

We seem to have very limited information to pass any sort of judgement on. 

If we are talking about healthy relatively uncomplicated 10 year old I would find that decision a bit bonkers and am very thankful that neither of our horses previous owners made that decision or we wouldn't have them!


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## VikingSong (10 February 2016)

Hepsibah said:



			Wow. I'm going to have to be the person who goes against the flow here. How flaming arrogant can a person get! She is the only person who can look after a horse? Her horse is better off dead if it can't be with her? It is her horse, yes and it is her decision to make but what a rotten decision for the blimmin' horse! The horse only has one life and she's taking it for no good reason. vile.
		
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This.

I don't think it's acceptable to PTS a perfectly healthy horse, especially when they're still relatively young. I could half understand if the horse was a veteran, but it isn't. I must say, I'm quite surprised by how many there are on this forum who see horses as nothing more than property that can be PTS for convenience.

If she does have that horse PTS, then I hope she's prosecuted.


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## Cortez (10 February 2016)

VikingSong said:



			This.

I don't think it's acceptable to PTS a perfectly healthy horse, especially when they're still relatively young. I could half understand if the horse was a veteran, but it isn't. I must say, I'm quite surprised by how many there are on this forum who see horses as nothing more than property that can be PTS for convenience.

If she does have that horse PTS, then I hope she's prosecuted.
		
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IF it is perfectly healthy, IF it is rideable, IF it has no issues.......it is still perfectly legal for an owner to dispose of a horse by euthanasia.


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## madlady (10 February 2016)

VikingSong said:



			This.

I don't think it's acceptable to PTS a perfectly healthy horse, especially when they're still relatively young. I could half understand if the horse was a veteran, but it isn't. I must say, I'm quite surprised by how many there are on this forum who see horses as nothing more than property that can be PTS for convenience.

If she does have that horse PTS, then I hope she's prosecuted.
		
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So sending through an auction (as another poster suggested) where potentially it could go for meat is better?


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## turkana (10 February 2016)

VikingSong said:



			This.

I don't think it's acceptable to PTS a perfectly healthy horse, especially when they're still relatively young. I could half understand if the horse was a veteran, but it isn't. I must say, I'm quite surprised by how many there are on this forum who see horses as nothing more than property that can be PTS for convenience.

If she does have that horse PTS, then I hope she's prosecuted.[/QUOTE

What would the charge be?
		
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## ester (10 February 2016)

Cortez said:



			IF it is perfectly healthy, IF it is rideable, IF it has no issues.......it is still perfectly legal for an owner to dispose of a horse by euthanasia.
		
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Yes quite, prosecuted for what exactly!?


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## AdorableAlice (10 February 2016)

VikingSong said:



			This.

I don't think it's acceptable to PTS a perfectly healthy horse, especially when they're still relatively young. I could half understand if the horse was a veteran, but it isn't. I must say, I'm quite surprised by how many there are on this forum who see horses as nothing more than property that can be PTS for convenience.

If she does have that horse PTS, then I hope she's prosecuted.
		
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Always wise to read and have the ability to understand, the thread from the opening comment prior to opening ones mouth.


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## fatpiggy (10 February 2016)

amymay said:



			I absolutely agree.

The only mistake this lady has made is to tell others of her plans.
		
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Well I would most definitely agree with that last sentence.


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## catkin (10 February 2016)

VikingSong said:



			This.

I don't think it's acceptable to PTS a perfectly healthy horse, especially when they're still relatively young. I could half understand if the horse was a veteran, but it isn't. I must say, I'm quite surprised by how many there are on this forum who see horses as nothing more than property that can be PTS for convenience.

If she does have that horse PTS, then I hope she's prosecuted.
		
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I was not going to answer this thread but this highly judgemental comment must be challenged. 
Do you REALLY know the horse in question? There are many fabulous looking horses around for all outward appearances healthy, successful etc - but without knowing every detail of how they have become/remained like that ( and the owner, and perhaps their vet arre the only ones who REALLY know) can you be sure that this is the case. I know a few horses like this, including one of my own, but to keep them healthy in both body and mind needs expensive and time-consuming care, management and access to specialised facilities.

These horses are FAR from commodities to their owners and the real fear is that without the special care the horse would soon be on a downward spiral.


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## Pinkvboots (10 February 2016)

Equine_Dream said:



			With all due respect I am entitled to my opinion and will express it as others have done. The OP has asked for opinions I am entitled to share mine as everyone else has.
And yes I do think its selfish and putting her feelings before the horse. Just because SHE can not bare to loan or sell the animal must die!?!!  Sorry but I find that so very sad
		
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it's probably not the fact she can't bare to loan or sell she probably does not trust anyone enough to take care of the animal and quite frankly I don't blame her, some of the welfare cases that have come to light recently with well known well respected horse people failing to give there horses basic care, I have been shocked beyond belief at what has come to light is there any wonder, if you sell your horse to someone there is no guarantee they won't sell on to just anyone, and it's a sad fact of today that so many people do not give a *****,  I would not be able to sleep at night wondering if my horse was being fed and being looked after so I know what's I would choose.


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## fatpiggy (10 February 2016)

Pinkvboots said:



			it's probably not the fact she can't bare to loan or sell she probably does not trust anyone enough to take care of the animal and quite frankly I don't blame her, some of the welfare cases that have come to light recently with well known well respected horse people failing to give there horses basic care, I have been shocked beyond belief at what has come to light is there any wonder, if you sell your horse to someone there is no guarantee they won't sell on to just anyone, and it's a sad fact of today that so many people do not give a *****,  I would not be able to sleep at night wondering if my horse was being fed and being looked after so I know what's I would choose.
		
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But you could say that about just about anything. My cat came from a sanctuary and is now leading a life of bliss. My horse got 17.5 extra years of life because I stood up for her and didn't just give up and replace her, despite the cost, not only financial, to myself.  Not everyone is a horrible uncaring person who gets an animal just because they fancy the idea of it.  The horse could actually end up with a better owner than it has right now after all - we don't know how she cares for the animal, what standard of knowledge she has etc. 
TBH, looking at all the kerfuffle this post has caused, the OP would have done far better to think whatever she likes but not say anything in public.


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## Molly'sMama (10 February 2016)

Goldenstar said:



			It is, but there's no reason why a nice sound ten year old won't find a good home so if it were me I would sell carefully to the right person .
		
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who says the owner has the time, energy, money or health to do such a thing? that requires continuing to look after the horse, pay for it, go to viewings. 
If the owners only option is sell quickly + cheaply or PTS ... i can completely understand.


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## Equine_Dream (10 February 2016)

Pinkvboots said:



			it's probably not the fact she can't bare to loan or sell she probably does not trust anyone enough to take care of the animal and quite frankly I don't blame her, some of the welfare cases that have come to light recently with well known well respected horse people failing to give there horses basic care, I have been shocked beyond belief at what has come to light is there any wonder, if you sell your horse to someone there is no guarantee they won't sell on to just anyone, and it's a sad fact of today that so many people do not give a *****,  I would not be able to sleep at night wondering if my horse was being fed and being looked after so I know what's I would choose.
		
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If everyone thought like that then none of us would have our horses, unless bred by ourselves, and some horses would have some very short lives indeed!
Im sorry but I just dont think its right to play god and cut short the life of a beautiful healthy animal just because of your own selfish feelings. We're not talking about scrapping a car here. Its a life.


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## stormox (10 February 2016)

There are way too many horses around, and not enough good homes for them. If the owner wants the horse PTS, its her horse, her decision.


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## Pinkvboots (10 February 2016)

Equine_Dream said:



			If everyone thought like that then none of us would have our horses, unless bred by ourselves, and some horses would have some very short lives indeed!
Im sorry but I just dont think its right to play god and cut short the life of a beautiful healthy animal just because of your own selfish feelings. We're not talking about scrapping a car here. Its a life.
		
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I know I agree but you can't help people for thinking this way with all the neglected horses you hear of it makes you worry about where or how yours might end up, or the said person might not even be bothered to try and re home and thats the reason we just dont know, I am all for giving any horse a chance if I can, if someone in the yard next door was in this situation I would be the first to offer my empty stable to them to help them out if they needed some help until there situation changed f thats what they wanted, but at the same time if pts was what they wanted I would accept there wishes.


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## tiddley (10 February 2016)

If this lady took her horse to a market there is no knowing where it will end up, could go for meat, could go to a bad owner, if the horse is pts, at least she will be able to sleep at night without wondering if the horse is suffering somewhere.  I would be of the opinion that this lady is taking a very responsible outlook and it will not have been an easy decision for her to make or carry out.


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## YasandCrystal (10 February 2016)

I am rather torn on this topic. I would consider retirement livery perhaps in her shoes. I do understand the sentiment that no one will necessisarily look after the horse as she does. I know of horses who are never seen by a dentist, their worming is scant if ever, feet are left for months, vaccinations not uptodate. Mine live in luxury by comparison with regular dentistry, worm control, physio visits always adlib forage and appropriate supplements. Would I trust a new owner to keep them the same? No I wouldn't because so many don't and it is often those owners that won't part with their equines because they state they fear a poor life for them in a new home!!!
Mine would go to retirement livery if necessary and pts a last resort.


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## luckyoldme (10 February 2016)

Equine_Dream said:



			If everyone thought like that then none of us would have our horses, unless bred by ourselves, and some horses would have some very short lives indeed!
Im sorry but I just dont think its right to play god and cut short the life of a beautiful healthy animal just because of your own selfish feelings. We're not talking about scrapping a car here. Its a life.
		
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I worked with horses when i was younger and came away from it because the actual horse industry is heartbreaking. My horse will be with me till his times up, having said that if i could nt afford him i would also pts. Admitedly mine is in his 20s so it would be really unfair to pass him on evan if i could. Is it really any different? ..the horse really would nt know too much about it and the horse does nt know how old it is.


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## Equine_Dream (10 February 2016)

luckyoldme said:



			I worked with horses when i was younger and came away from it because the actual horse industry is heartbreaking. My horse will be with me till his times up, having said that if i could nt afford him i would also pts. Admitedly mine is in his 20s so it would be really unfair to pass him on evan if i could. Is it really any different? ..the horse really would nt know too much about it and the horse does nt know how old it is.
		
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Its not really about the horse not knowing any different though. A dead horse doesnt know anything. Its about the principle that its wrong to cut short the life of a young healthy useable horse for your own selfish feelings


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## oldie48 (10 February 2016)

I have to admit I'm a bit confused by some of the posts that suggest it is better to pts a horse than risk it being sold into the wrong home and not properly cared for. As I said earlier I've always bought older horses for myself, some that have changed hands several times but I've never viewed anything that wasn't well looked after, I've seen a fair bit of rubbish shoeing and a bit too much fat but nothing that smacked of neglect. We always bought 5 year olds for my daughter, a couple of ponies, that she outgrew and her first eventer which we sold when she went to university rather a long way away. We bought quality animals and ensured they were properly schooled, hacked out alone and in company and had excellent manners. They all went on to fab homes that kept in touch with us and when her lovely 14.2 had to be PTS I was contacted before it happened and told the circumstances. I have no problem at all in an owner making the decision to pts if the horse is for some reason a "very difficult sale" but to suggest it's not possible to find good homes for nice horses seems a bit odd. Most people don't have the experience, knowledge or skill to bring on young horses and frankly, most of the problematic ones we see all around us IMHO are the result of breeding from unsuitable stock or being started by the inexperienced. Where are we supposed to source our horses if no-one sells?


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## Apercrumbie (10 February 2016)

If the horse has severe issues whether soundness or behavioural then I have every sympathy as the owner is making a responsible decision.  If the horse is sound and without any major behavioural issues, then sorry but I think the owner is unbelievably selfish.  Yes there is a welfare crisis, but most responsible horse owners manage to find perfectly adequate homes for their animals.  Her 'feelings' will result in an animal unnecessarily dying.  It doesn't matter if she's struggling to cope, there are ways of managing without shooting a perfectly healthy animal.


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## luckyoldme (10 February 2016)

Equine_Dream said:



			Its not really about the horse not knowing any different though. A dead horse doesnt know anything. Its about the principle that its wrong to cut short the life of a young healthy useable horse for your own selfish feelings
		
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i don t think its selfish, I just think its an incredibly sad decision to make.


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## _HP_ (10 February 2016)

smellydogjack said:



			A lady at my yard has caused uproar. Her life situation  has changed and she can't really keep her horse. I suspect- after much deliberation, she has decided the only choice she has is pts. Said mare is 10, and a lovely horse, but she wouldn't trust a loan home, and she couldn't bare to sell. Que an uproar that she is cruel etc... from the rest of the yard. Part of me gets it. I get why she can't see through any other choice, I'm not saying I would do it. However part of me understands.

Pointless post but it's played on my mind all week.
		
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Her choice...obviously.
One can only assume she has thought it through and this is her only choice. Bit of a shame if its really just a case of her not being able to bear selling it if its sellable but what can you do.
I just a had a healthy pony PTS becuase her companion was being pts but she was elderly and it felt right. I dare say some would think that was wrong but hey no. &#9786;


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## cobgoblin (10 February 2016)

Hepsibah said:



			Wow. I'm going to have to be the person who goes against the flow here. How flaming arrogant can a person get! She is the only person who can look after a horse? Her horse is better off dead if it can't be with her? It is her horse, yes and it is her decision to make but what a rotten decision for the blimmin' horse! The horse only has one life and she's taking it for no good reason. vile.
		
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I agree with this.
If the horse is healthy, rideable and doesn't have any issues that make it dangerous, then pts  is for selfish reasons.


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## Natch (10 February 2016)

fatpiggy said:



			Can't bear to sell but will PTS instead?  Hmmm.  If her circumstances have changed, she should put the horse up for sale or through the nearest market and let it take its chances. No doubt the money she would get would be helpful.  No-one turns down £££s if they have any sense?
		
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It's clearly not about the money, nor should it be. Letting it take it's chances through the nearest market is pretty irresponsible in my opinion. If it went to an unsuitable home where the rider got badly hurt, would the couple of hundred quid in your pocket be worth it? It's about being unable to guarantee the future of that horse. She might go on to have a wonderful extra 15 years, she might have a terrible 15 years. 

Whilst I feel very sad reading about it, it's her horse, her decision, and a bullet in the brain however sad we might be about it is not a welfare issue.


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## smokey (10 February 2016)

I am very lucky. I found myself unable to do my horse justice over this last year, due to life changing circumstances. I am lucky because I have a friend who has taken her on loan for a year. Hopefully I will then be in a position to take up the reins again. The same friend will also inherit my horse should I spin off my coil before the horse. The understanding being that if my friend is for whatever reason unable to keep my girl, she will have her pts. My horse has known me and this friend since she was weaned. There is no one else I would trust to love her as I do. I completely get where this lady is coming from, and I wish her all the best, whatever the outcome.


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## oldie48 (10 February 2016)

_HP_ said:



			I just a had a healthy pony PTS becuase her companion was being pts but she was elderly and it felt right. I dare say some would think that was wrong but hey no. &#9786;
		
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I wouldn't think it wrong and neither would most people who stop to think about it.


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## julie111 (10 February 2016)

This is such an emotive subject and people will always have different views. I own a rising 7 yo cob who cannot do anything other than a short plod around the block, he has danilon as and when needed so he isn't worth anything but to me he is special. If I found myself in a life changing situation I wouldn't hesitate to pts. The horse the op is talking about is still young and sound, therefore I'm going to sit on the fence with this one. What a sad situation to be in.


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## Clodagh (10 February 2016)

I think the owner is awful! How could she put down a perfectly sound horse? I am the first person to recommend PTS with problems, but not in this case. Why can't she loan it out and if it gets returned shoot it then, if she can't look after it.


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## AdorableAlice (10 February 2016)

Clodagh said:



			I think the owner is awful! How could she put down a perfectly sound horse? I am the first person to recommend PTS with problems, but not in this case. Why can't she loan it out and if it gets returned shoot it then, if she can't look after it.
		
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Read the opening post.


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## Clodagh (10 February 2016)

AdorableAlice said:



			Read the opening post.
		
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I have, it doesn't say the horse has any problems?

A lady at my yard has caused uproar. Her life situation has changed and she can't really keep her horse. I suspect- after much deliberation, she has decided the only choice she has is pts. Said mare is 10, and a lovely horse, but she wouldn't trust a loan home, and she couldn't bare to sell. Que an uproar that she is cruel etc... from the rest of the yard. Part of me gets it. I get why she can't see through any other choice, I'm not saying I would do it. However part of me understands.

Read more at http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/foru...ting-a-healthy-horse-down#jldicoYUFCy8vgc9.99


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## Meowy Catkin (10 February 2016)

Without knowing the FULL details of this specific case, none of us can possibly know if the owner is being selfish, altruistic or just plain practical by planning/having the horse PTS.


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## Hepsibah (10 February 2016)

Damnation said:



			^^ This.

What is it with horses that turn grown adults into silly little playground children? Ganging up on eachother, bullying eachother?

The horse isn't suffering, its well looked after, butt out.
		
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I don't consider being put down on the whim of the owner to be well looked after. I would feel the same way if it were a hamster or a golfish rather than a horse and there is no bullying going on here at all, I was under the impression we were grown ups discussing a moral issue which is relevant to us as a group because we are all horse owners/riders. Also, there is no butting in being done as it is a third party opinions thread on a public forum so your insistance that people who don't agree with you on this are silly little playground children has no merit.


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## _GG_ (10 February 2016)

9tails said:



			The age and health of this horse is the issue for me.  If the horse is unrideable then fair enough, but if she's rideable I really don't understand it.  There is at least a good 10 years of work left in this mare.
		
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I've only quoted this one post due to the last sentence, but this post is in response to many I have read.

Yes, there are plenty of potentially good years left in this mare, but the responsible thing is to look at the entire future of a horse when you buy it or are faced with a situation like this horses owner...not just the next few years. 

It's all well and good saying that this is a rideable and young horse that could easily go on to someone else, but what happens if that person decides to sell when the horse gets older? I've recently taken a 17 year old from someone I know and have known for years, it's why he came to me, the owner knows me and knows that this is the last home he'll ever have. Not everyone selling an older horse knows or even sometimes thinks about the future of that horse. Of course there are homes that keep horses until their dying days, but there are also lots of owners that don't.

If this owner has this healthy horse put to sleep, she is saving it from the possibility that in 2, 5, 10, 15 years time, it will end up sold again, maybe into dealers as it gets older, maybe sent through the sales, maybe left in a field and abandoned. This isn't just a possibility, it's a very real reality as it is happening to horses, numerous horse, right now. Up and down the country right now, there are horses in very poor situations...most of them having been sold by one or more owners over the years. 

I'm not saying there's anything wrong with selling a horse, of course there isn't...but I am saying that there is nothing at all wrong in making a decision to protect a horse from an uncertain future. 

For everyone saying the owner could loan the horse...she may not be in a position to sort things if it falls through and she needs to take it back suddenly. 
She doesn't want to sell it? Maybe it's nothing to do with her not thinking anyone else could look after it, but just that she'd have no control over the horses future and would be powerless if it ended up in the wrong home/hands. 

I find it incredibly sad when any horse has to be put to sleep and it seems especially sad when it is a healthy horse, however, me feeling sad doesn't help the horse and we don't live in a rose tinted world where the welfare headlines and rescues are all about other people and other horses. No...we live in a world where the welfare crisis is very very real and quite simply, a heck of a lot of horses end up in awful situations and I'll stand up now and say that none of mine will leave my care. Not because I don't trust anyone else to care for them or because I don't think there are good homes out there, but because there are simply no guarantees that even the best of homes won't fall into troubles and leave my horses at risk. 

Put simply...putting to sleep a healthy horse, as sad as it is, would allow me to sleep at night. Looking at the sheer numbers of horses in the welfare system, if any of them went to other homes, I would always be concerned about where they were.


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## luckyoldme (10 February 2016)

smokey said:



			I am very lucky. I found myself unable to do my horse justice over this last year, due to life changing circumstances. I am lucky because I have a friend who has taken her on loan for a year. Hopefully I will then be in a position to take up the reins again. The same friend will also inherit my horse should I spin off my coil before the horse. The understanding being that if my friend is for whatever reason unable to keep my girl, she will have her pts. My horse has known me and this friend since she was weaned. There is no one else I would trust to love her as I do. I completely get where this lady is coming from, and I wish her all the best, whatever the outcome.
		
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i think that sums it up nicely.


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## AdorableAlice (10 February 2016)

The words - life changing situation, hold the clue as does - after much deliberation.

There is far more to this than meets the eye and I really hope the owner does not read this thread.  The original poster is on a livery yard with the owner and the decision to post the comments on an open forum was ill thought out at best.

The opening poster continues to state - "I suspect" and "que uproar from her fellow liveries".  What a shame brain, gob and judgement failed to register before posting.  Liveries at their very best.

It is time admin pulled this thread and gave the owner the dignity of making her own decisions without ridicule and rampant assumption.


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## _GG_ (10 February 2016)

Clodagh said:



			I think the owner is awful! How could she put down a perfectly sound horse? I am the first person to recommend PTS with problems, but not in this case. Why can't she loan it out and if it gets returned shoot it then, if she can't look after it.
		
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Well, given how expensive it could potentially be to do that, it may be out of the question with her life changing situation. We don't know the facts, but I do now how much it costs to have a horse put to sleep, even if it's shot and that's not with having to arrange to have it returned from a loan home first.


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## Wagtail (10 February 2016)

Very odd that the OP has not been back to this thread.


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## popsdosh (10 February 2016)

Wagtail said:



			Very odd that the OP has not been back to this thread.
		
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maybe they realise the can of worms thats been opened.

Wish the lid could go back on!


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## Hepsibah (10 February 2016)

I enjoy this sort of debate. It makes me think and has been known to enlighten me and change my viewpoint.


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## Irish gal (10 February 2016)

smellydogjack said:



			A lady at my yard has caused uproar. Her life situation  has changed and she can't really keep her horse. I suspect- after much deliberation, she has decided the only choice she has is pts. Said mare is 10, and a lovely horse, but she wouldn't trust a loan home, and she couldn't bare to sell. Que an uproar that she is cruel etc... from the rest of the yard. Part of me gets it. I get why she can't see through any other choice, I'm not saying I would do it. However part of me understands.

Pointless post but it's played on my mind all week.
		
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Haven't read every post on this but personally I think this is the height of narcissism and I love the quote "she couldn't bear to sell". Why not, is she so arrogant that she thinks she's the only person on earth who can look after a horse properly. If she sold her the next owner might look after her a whole lot better for all she knows - bet the poor mare would be willing to take the risk! What she's doing is cruel, cutting the  mare's life in half at least. It's not love for the poor horse, just some sort of selfishness that's motivating her. Sell the poor animal and give her a chance at life, and get over herself.


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## _GG_ (10 February 2016)

Hepsibah said:



			I enjoy this sort of debate. It makes me think and has been known to enlighten me and change my viewpoint. 

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Agreed. I used to be vehemently against it, then read something I had written one day when I found an old diary at my parents house about the first welfare case I was involved with as a child and it was like a light went off. The worlds not perfect and there won't be a perfect future for every horse, just because we want there to be.


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## _GG_ (10 February 2016)

Irish gal said:



			Haven't read every post on this but personally I think this is the height of narcissism and I love the quote "she couldn't bear to sell". Why not, is she so arrogant that she thinks she's the only person on earth who can look after a horse properly. If she sold her the next owner might look after her a whole lot better for all she knows - bet the poor mare would be willing to take the risk! What she's doing is cruel, cutting the  mare's life in half at least. It's not love for the poor horse, just some sort of selfishness that's motivating her. Sell the poor animal and give her a chance at life, and get over herself.
		
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I think there are a lot of assumptions in this and no regard for the fact that "couldn't bear to sell" might not have anything to do with narcissism.


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## MargotC (10 February 2016)

I have been in this position. The decision was certainly not one made "on a whim".

I am not going to sum up my reasoning (or the events) again.

However it ensured the horse would not be passed from pillar to post (which I considered realistically to be the likely outcome if sold), and it ensured that I, for my own sake, would not have to spend the years worrying and wondering what became of him.

I think that unless a person is able and willing to offer a person such as the one mentioned in the OP a fully-fledged alternative in the form of taking the horse on and guaranteeing for its welfare out its life, they should keep their unhelpful opinions to themselves and instead offer some compassion.

You never know whether you yourself will find yourself in a similar situation in the future no matter what your current circumstances are.


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## popsdosh (10 February 2016)

Hepsibah said:



			I enjoy this sort of debate. It makes me think and has been known to enlighten me and change my viewpoint. 

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It would be a different matter if this had actually been started by the owner,god knows if they know what its doing to them.


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## Irish gal (10 February 2016)

_GG_ said:



			I think there are a lot of assumptions in this and no regard for the fact that "couldn't bear to sell" might not have anything to do with narcissism.
		
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I'm responding the OPs original post and giving my opinion. And yes to me it's narcissistic. We are clearly told the owner couldn't bear to sell, therefore she's putting her own feelings of attachment to the horse ahead of the mare's welfare, so her feelings take primary importance ahead of the horse. That to me is narcissistic I'm afraid, and it's also insulting to all the great people out there who might buy the horse. For instance the mare could be bought by somebody with plenty of land and have unlimited turnout that she may not have now, or she could go to a better rider, naturally a better situation for the mare.

Why don't we all take a look at this from the mare's point of view for a minute, not the owners. She's ten and a lovely horse, so on what planet is it a better idea to put her to sleep rather than sell her!? It reminds me of the Egyptian Pharoahs having their slaves buried along with them. So this woman can't keep horses any longer, grand, let somebody who is able to take care of them.


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## moosea (10 February 2016)

Pinkvboots said:



			I know I agree but you can't help people for thinking this way with all the neglected horses you hear of it makes you worry about where or how yours might end up
		
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I think that perhaps we get a little carried away with focusing on all the welfare cases that we hear of. 
Thinking about your horsey acquaintances the majority, if not all, of them provide good, loving and long term homes for their horses. 
The media do not tell us of all the wonderful homes available and therefore do we get caught up in the paranoia of 'no one can look after my horse as well as me'  ??

I do not agree with PTS of healthy, sound, relativity young horses that have few issues.


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## lamlyn2012 (10 February 2016)

Haven't read all the replies so sorry if this has already been said but would she consider loaning to one of the equine colleges?


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## Ditchjumper2 (10 February 2016)

Her horse, her choice. I have three and 2 of them would be pts rather than sold if I found myself in that position. My horses, my responsibility, my choice.


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## Luci07 (10 February 2016)

Ditchjumper2 said:



			Her horse, her choice. I have three and 2 of them would be pts rather than sold if I found myself in that position. My horses, my responsibility, my choice.
		
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Interesting. You said 2 out of 3 suggesting that one could be sold.

I have 2. If anything really bad happened to me, the young fit one would be sold and the old retired one would be PTS.


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## Ditchjumper2 (10 February 2016)

Luci07 said:



			Interesting. You said 2 out of 3 suggesting that one could be sold.

I have 2. If anything really bad happened to me, the young fit one would be sold and the old retired one would be PTS.
		
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The teenage hunters with soundness issues that I manage well would be pts. The young one I would sell.


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## hairycob (10 February 2016)

All we really know about the horse is that it is 10 & the OP thinks it's lovely. That could mean anything from it's a totally sound novice ride to it's knackered but a nice person or it's got huge behavioural issues but looks nice. Let's face it one person's lovely is another person's nutter/ physical wreck/ nappy git. So really we know chuff all for anybody to condemn the owner.


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## BBP (10 February 2016)

I was called cruel the other day by non horsey friends for saying that if anything ever happened to me and my sister wasn't able to look after him I would want my pony to be put to sleep. I appreciate he is a different case to what this horse sounds like. He is only 10 and although he looks a million dollars and is a lovely person, he would be horribly open to abuse. He is too small for most adults, too sharp and unpredictable for most kids and he has a hidden illness. You can't see it to look at him but it shows itself in his electric personality and his poor or erratic performance and occasional planting. His muscle cells do stuff that his brain doesn't understand. I feel that whilst there are a lot of people who could look after him beautifully, not many people would want to take one on with so many issues. He'd be one that I believe would get passed on til he became dangerous and got shot anyway. I know most of you horsey lot would understand that my my non horsey friends really don't and probably think I am vile, as someone else put it. But he is my best mate and I would rather secure his future.


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## millikins (10 February 2016)

Just a thought but a friend of mine has a mare on breeding loan to a surrogacy set up. The horse will be kept until she is 12, then PTS or taken home. Might be worth considering if circumstances for owner might improve.


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## AdorableAlice (10 February 2016)

Irish gal said:



			Haven't read every post on this but personally I think this is the height of narcissism and I love the quote "she couldn't bear to sell". Why not, is she so arrogant that she thinks she's the only person on earth who can look after a horse properly. If she sold her the next owner might look after her a whole lot better for all she knows - bet the poor mare would be willing to take the risk! What she's doing is cruel, cutting the  mare's life in half at least. It's not love for the poor horse, just some sort of selfishness that's motivating her. Sell the poor animal and give her a chance at life, and get over herself.
		
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Yet another one who fails to read and understand the opening post - "get over herself" how utterly unneeded and rude.  I hope, if you are unfortunate enough to find yourself in a life changing situation you can get over yourself.

Why o why are so many users failing to read the actual words on the opening post.?


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## ester (10 February 2016)

At the end of the day it is the owners decision, she is the one that has to feel comfortable and live with that decision and as such others feelings don't really matter.


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## Regandal (10 February 2016)

I'm lucky in a way,  both of mine are worthless. When I go,  they go.


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## minesadouble (10 February 2016)

If it's a lovely 10 year old useful animal with no issues then to be honest I can't understand her logic. However, not knowing the full story I don't feel in a position to make a judgement. 

This aside I do wonder how her Vet will feel (if she is using a Vet). I had my old mare PTS just before Winter and a Vet who is new to our practice and did not know the mare (who was 28 at the time) came to do the deed and asked a lot of questions about we had made the decision to PTS. I did feel she was ready to question the decision until she was in possession of the facts about the mare's age and health issues.


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## cbmcts (10 February 2016)

While it's not what I would do,we don't know the owner or the horse and TBH it would be very rare an occasion that I wouldn't support PTS for ANY reason. It's not an easy option for 99.99% of owners and it's not as if the horse will suffer now or in the future. 

For the previous poster who asked if a vet would do it, many wouldn't (but there are sensible vets out there who would) so Thank God for knackermen and the hunt - they don't ask questions or make judgements in these circumstances. And the one who hoped the owner would be prosecuted - why? What is cruel about PTS?

I will take an educated guess that a lot, if not all of the people who are causing 'uproar' on this ladies yard would run a mile if they were handed the horse and congratulated on their new acquisition. It's interesting that those protesting on this thread are not offering a home - of course if they did so I'd think they were mad   The reality is that horses are not cheap to keep, not easy to sell as there are no guarantees that the next home and the one after that and of course the ones following those will be a good one. Loaning is only an option if you can take them back and what used to be the last ditch option of a rescue centre no longer exists. 

It's so easy to judge, much harder to provide a life long solution isn't it?


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## Illusion100 (10 February 2016)

Indisputable facts about life are uncertainty and finality. 

I, for one, would rather have a humane end amongst those who love me than dying amongst others that don't.


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## chaps89 (10 February 2016)

I was in a situation last year whereby the (young) pony I'd bought had multiple lameness problems and a metabolic problem. She also wasn't enjoying her work and lameness problems meant we couldn't control her weight as well as we needed for the metabolic issues. Outwardly she was a happy, healthy looking mare. But pts was seriously considered. And I had no end of stick from people on the yard for that. All issues are now under control but it means she is not an easy to manage pony so if something were to happen to me she would be pts despite the fact she is a very useful hacker (or was until she got liver disease but that's a whole other problem, lol) 
So this lady has my sympathies.
Ultimately her horse, her decision. And we don't have enough facts her to know the situation well enough to pass informed judgement/comment. 
I have to say if horse is a nice, sound, easy to do 10 year old then I would be surprised at the lack of attempt to sell, as has already been pointed out how many of our horsey acquaintances do we think really neglect their horses? Can't be that many so must be good homes out there. This said I do very much understand the point gg makes about the immediate home the horse is (hypothetically) sold to might be great but who knows what might happen 2/5/10 years down the line? Once the horse is dead it knows no different and there is no potential for future suffering. And if the horse is quirky/has health problems then I could fully understand why an owner might make that choice over re-home.


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## Irish gal (10 February 2016)

AdorableAlice said:



			Yet another one who fails to read and understand the opening post - "get over herself" how utterly unneeded and rude.  I hope, if you are unfortunate enough to find yourself in a life changing situation you can get over yourself.

Why o why are so many users failing to read the actual words on the opening post.?
		
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If you had bothered to read my first post you would see that I quoted the opening post in full. There's no question of it not having been read and digested. This owner in my opinion does need to get over herself, we are told that she can't bear to part with the mare and so she's going to be pts.

So she's putting her own feelings of attachment and anxieties about the horse's future ahead of it's welfare. If we all adopted this woman's position there wouldn't be a horse bought or sold again. Everybody on this forum has bought a horse at some time, that would not happen if all owners decided their animals faced an uncertain future by being sold on so it would be better to pts.

This animal is 10 and we're told she's a lovely mare, therefore she has a job and a life to look forward to with a new person, if the owner could only bring herself to part from her.

I personally class this owner as cruel and I feel upset for the poor mare, who's only fault it seems was to wind up with someone who would rather see her put down than be sold on. 

She's not the first person to have her circumstances change. I have on a number of occasions had to sell my own horses when circumstances dictated and it's not the end of the world. Not everyone who steps into the yard would I sell to and I've even, just not liking the impression on the phone, told people to forget about it. Sellers have a lot of discretion and can take their time to get the right fit and an excellent home for an animal.


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## AdorableAlice (10 February 2016)

Irish gal said:



			If you had bothered to read my first post you would see that I quoted the opening post in full. There's no question of it not having been read and digested. This owner in my opinion does need to get over herself, we are told that she can't bear to part with the mare and so she's going to be pts.

So she's putting her own feelings of attachment and anxieties about the horse's future ahead of it's welfare. If we all adopted this woman's position there wouldn't be a horse bought or sold again. Everybody on this forum has bought a horse at some time, that would not happen if all owners decided their animals faced an uncertain future by being sold on so it would be better to pts.

This animal is 10 and we're told she's a lovely mare, therefore she has a job and a life to look forward to with a new person, if the owner could only bring herself to part from her.

I personally class this owner as cruel and I feel upset for the poor mare, who's only fault it seems was to wind up with someone who would rather see her put down than be sold on. 

She's not the first person to have her circumstances change. I have on a number of occasions had to sell my own horses when circumstances dictated and it's not the end of the world. Not everyone who steps into the yard would I sell to and I've even, just not liking the impression on the phone, told people to forget about it. Sellers have a lot of discretion and can take their time to get the right fit and an excellent home for an animal.
		
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Circumstance change and life changing circumstances can have vastly differing meanings.  My thoughts are detailed in post 17 of the thread and I am one of very few seeing a different side to the situation, perhaps because I have been very near to having to make big decisions through life changing circumstances and I seem to be able to comprehend the situation a little more clearly than most.

The opening post should never have been made and I hope the whole thread is pulled before the owner gets to see it.  I certainly have 'bothered' to read your post and it is evident that you and many others to be fair, are not able to see the bigger picture.  That is me done on this thread.


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## Meowy Catkin (10 February 2016)

The thing is we don't have any information at all from the owner, so it's impossible to judge their motives. The opening post is second hand information and I know from experience how inaccurate that can be.


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## Knockadoon (10 February 2016)

Equine_Dream said:



			Im afraid I agree with this! Normally Im the first to support someone taking responsibility and having an animal pts where there are issues that mean it is likely to struggle to find a good home e.g. old horse/dangerous horse to ride/severe health issues etc etc.
But when we are talking about a perfectly young healthy horse Im afraid I find it very sad. To say the horse is better off dead than with anyone except its current owner when there is nothing wrong with the horse and no reason why it couldn't be found another lovely home - sorry I just dont get it. Seems very selfish imo. Shes putting her own feelings above the horse
		
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But what happens when the horse gets old in its new home. Will they guarantee they won't sell it on as an old animal with little value.


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## Irish gal (10 February 2016)

It's true we don't have enough information and we're all coming at it from our own experience. The first thing into my head was financial trouble but I can see what people mean, it could be a health problem for instance. Basically we need the OP to elaborate or as AA as suggested it could even be better that the whole thing is pulled in case it's some sort of dire situation and debate here only adds to the owners troubles.


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## Micropony (10 February 2016)

If something unthinkable happened to me, my current horse would be sold. I bought him as a just backed 3yo and my firm intention is that he'll be with me for all his days. He is a lovely, straightforward healthy chap and while, as some posters have pointed out, there are no guarantees for any horse, he would have a very good chance of finding an excellent home with someone else and having a lovely life.

My last horse, however, was a different matter. He was a lovely horse. He was extremely handsome and looked fantastic. However he wasn't straightforward in any way. He was tricky to ride and I was significantly overhorsed, as most average riders would have been. Most riders good enough to cope with his quirks confidently would be looking for a horse better trained than him, and able to work at a much more advanced level than he was capable of. And he had numerous health issues that, although he was in full ridden work, his management required considerable thought, care, time, effort and expense compared to a "normal horse" like the one I have now. If, when he was 10, I had found myself unable to keep him for some terrible reason, I would have PTS. It would have broken my heart, but it would have been the right thing to do. Much as I loved him, and special as he was to me, objectively speaking his chances of finding a good permanent home with someone else would have been slim to none.

I am fortunate enough to be on a yard where my fellow liveries would have understood, supported me, and treated me with compassion at what would have been a very traumatic time for me.

We don't know from the OP's post whether this poor woman's horse is more like my current horse or my last one, so I really don't see how any of us can judge her.

I am just very very grateful that I am not in her position, poor woman.


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## ILuvCowparsely (10 February 2016)

One does hear of  awful loan homes and horses returning in poor condition.  So I can see where the owner is coming from, but that said for every bad loan home there are many many lovely homes. One of my livery owners had a loan horse, he is an x french steeple chaser and he fell on his feet with the owners.  The owner since signed him over to the mother and daughter, as she could no longer afford him.  He wants for nothing and will stay with them till his last day on this earth.

So really I can't see why the owner cant look a bit further and vet the homes or go through somewhere like Horses4Homes where lovely homes are waiting out there.  Specially when this mare is only 10 and could have another 15 years of life, so I think IMO the owner is being too hasty.  I don't doubt she has thought about it, but maybe someone at the yard should help her and explain about the nice homes and offer her to help find one.

  She needs support at this time, and if she throws it back at you, then there is nothing more you can do.   I feel sorry for this mare in this circumstance.


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## muckypony (10 February 2016)

Wagtail said:



			Very odd that the OP has not been back to this thread.
		
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I thought this too... Just imagine if the great hho detectives have missed a troll... I hope so.


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## monkeymad (10 February 2016)

My greatest fear for any of my animals is that they suffer.  I have never sold any of my horses. I have put 2 out on loan, both were local (within 20 miles) so I could vet homes, and made appointments a couple of times a year to visit horses in their new homes.  When loan homes ended horses came back and were put on grass livery until a new home was sourced. If you sell you have a 50\50 chance of the horse having a secure future. For me those odds are too high. If I couldn't find a good loan home, couldn't afford to retire horses I would have my horses PTS.


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## tankgirl1 (10 February 2016)

AdorableAlice said:



			Perhaps a little respect should be given to the owner.  It is stated she is experiencing a 'life changing' situation.  Who can judge what a life changing situation is ?  There could be any number of issues, health physical or mental, violence, becoming a carer for a loved one etc etc.  

In 2013 I made the decision to put down horses if the life changing situation I found myself in did not have a good outcome.

it should be remembered that when we take on animals we are responsible for their destiny and there are a lot worse situations then death.  A short drive around and plenty of suffering horses can be seen.

I wish the owner in this sad situation closure and peace in whatever she decides to do.
		
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I wish there was a 'Like' button on HHO


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## Equine_Dream (10 February 2016)

Knockadoon said:



			But what happens when the horse gets old in its new home. Will they guarantee they won't sell it on as an old animal with little value.
		
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Again if everyone thought like that no one would ever sell their horse. It would mean that most of us on this forum wouldn't have our horses. Im sorry but there is no reason a healthy young rideable horse can not be found a good home.


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## Irish gal (10 February 2016)

I have to say I think people should have faith in the good buyers and homes that are out there. It's all fine and well talking about horses not having a great chance of finding a good home but to be honest, for a good horse, I don't think that's true. I help people find horses as an agent and all I see are horse lovers looking for their forever horse. 

And we must remember that it's also a business. A seller asked me this week how her horse was settling in who went to England. I sent her on photos the new owner had sent me, but apart from the lovely photos, he had gone to the best possible home. The seller is a brilliant horse woman and is a breeder and producer for a living, meaning all of her youngsters are sold off - it's how she earns a crust. We both concluded about this lad, that he had landed on his feet and we very much doubt he will ever see a days hardship in his life. What better result than that. 

She bred and beautifully produced a wonderful youngster who has now gone on to make a very committed owner hopefully very happy. That's the result we're all looking for and there's no reason why there isn't a good home out there somewhere for any decent horse.


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## Hepsibah (10 February 2016)

Birish? That you?


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## ILuvCowparsely (10 February 2016)

muckypony said:



			I thought this too... Just imagine if the great hho detectives have missed a troll... I hope so.
		
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Well considering there are 39 post of their posts  I doubt it.

 Maybe they got scared off or upset by some of the members post.  It is normal you place an innocent post then  it gets twisted and makes the Op feel they don't want to return.


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## Irish gal (10 February 2016)

I'm concious of the forum rules and don't want to be landing myself in trouble, I'll PM you.


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## popsdosh (11 February 2016)

HGA-12 said:



			Well considering there are 39 post of their posts  I doubt it.

 Maybe they got scared off or upset by some of the members post.  It is normal you place an innocent post then  it gets twisted and makes the Op feel they don't want to return.
		
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The issue I am a little disturbed by is the OP should have really not put it on here if truth be known especially something so emotive. Its ok if it was their horse however I really do not think it is fair to talk about another owners situation and the decisions they have had to come too. If indeed it is as described I do not envy them and all this thread has done is make a horrible situation worse for that person if they find out about it. Do we really want that on our conscience as that person has not asked for our comments. I hope they could draw some comfort from the fact the majority to my mind sympathise and understand.
If the owner indeed is aware of this thread please get the OP to reply to my PM as I wish to offer you another option where you are still in control but have the weight taken off your shoulders at this time.
If not I send you my best wishes and hope this has indeed has not made a horrible situation intolerable and good luck .
To the judgemental lot I sincerely hope you never end up in such a desperate situation!


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## Ahrena (11 February 2016)

For me it really depends on the horse.

A healthy, relatively sensible 10 year old should be sold I think...

But then when my mum was diagnosed with a terminal illness (was given 6 months, ended up being 3), we made the decision to have 2 of our horses PTS.

One had navicular and to be honest I think we would of done it before that winter anyway as she was struggling when it was cold and wet.

The other was a stunning 12 year old Welsh x. But she had a HUGE array of issues. She was a serious rearer and still quirky to manage on the ground, we'd retired her a year or so previous to this after trying to fix her for 6 years as her behaviour was too unpredictable. 

So when the time came where I would of struggled to pay for and take care of 4 horses myself, we decided to let them go. I really really struggled with the Welsh. When I looked at her in the field that morning, alert, shiny coat...it felt like murder.

But after it was done, it was the right decision. I struggle enough with 2, 3 would of been incredibly hard, and for what really? She didn't know what was coming.

Luckily Im on a very supportive yard and no one questioned our decision. I think in part my mum also found it comforting to think they would 'go with her'.


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## Vodkagirly (11 February 2016)

The opening post says it's a lovely horse but doesn't mention health / soundness or straight forwardness to ride.
I know some lovely horses that are only sound due to extensive management/drugs /shoeing that I would recommend pts rather than pass on.
I know lovely sound horses that have lots of hidden Health issues.
I know lovely horses that are a nightmare to ride. Again I think it may be very difficult to find the right home for them.  Especially if circumstances mean time is against the owner. 
I suspect there is more to this story and wouldn't judge without hearing the whole story.


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## smellydogjack (11 February 2016)

For those asking if I'm a troll I am not. I haven't replied as I've been overwhelmed  by all of this. As my original post said this has really played on my mind. For those saying "the lady " will see this. I can assure you she won't.  For those that say the post should be pulled- I've been trying to work out how to do that since yesterday, so by all means report it and get it pulled. To all those who have in boxed me trying to help, thank you but that is not what this post was about. To all those in boxing me abuse, I can only encourage you to get a life.


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## Gixxernic (11 February 2016)

Hepsibah said:



			Wow. I'm going to have to be the person who goes against the flow here. How flaming arrogant can a person get! She is the only person who can look after a horse? Her horse is better off dead if it can't be with her? It is her horse, yes and it is her decision to make but what a rotten decision for the blimmin' horse! The horse only has one life and she's taking it for no good reason. vile.
		
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I agree with you i think its a very selfish decision and she is denying the horse the entitlement to live a happy and prosperous life. Yes its her horse and her decision but its a very selfish one, she could end up in a lovely home . Cant she consider a rescue centre!?! Poor horse &#128534;&#128534;


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## Clodagh (11 February 2016)

smellydogjack said:



			For those asking if I'm a troll I am not. I haven't replied as I've been overwhelmed  by all of this. As my original post said this has really played on my mind. For those saying "the lady " will see this. I can assure you she won't.  For those that say the post should be pulled- I've been trying to work out how to do that since yesterday, so by all means report it and get it pulled. To all those who have in boxed me trying to help, thank you but that is not what this post was about. To all those in boxing me abuse, I can only encourage you to get a life.
		
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I am appalled and horrified that people pm abuse, please report them to admin. It isn't you who is making the decision anyway! I apologise for all the vicious losers out there.


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## Gixxernic (11 February 2016)

smellydogjack said:



			For those asking if I'm a troll I am not. I haven't replied as I've been overwhelmed  by all of this. As my original post said this has really played on my mind. For those saying "the lady " will see this. I can assure you she won't.  For those that say the post should be pulled- I've been trying to work out how to do that since yesterday, so by all means report it and get it pulled. To all those who have in boxed me trying to help, thank you but that is not what this post was about. To all those in boxing me abuse, I can only encourage you to get a life.
		
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Like the last line, i totally get you! Your only pointing out a situation &#55357;&#56397;&#55356;&#57339;&#55357;&#56397;&#55356;&#57339;&#55357;&#56397;&#55356;&#57339;


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## popsdosh (11 February 2016)

Gixxernic said:



			I agree with you i think its a very selfish decision and she is denying the horse the entitlement to live a happy and prosperous life. Yes its her horse and her decision but its a very selfish one, she could end up in a lovely home . Cant she consider a rescue centre!?! Poor horse &#55357;&#56854;&#55357;&#56854;
		
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Somewhere like hillside maybe . I hope one day there is Karma for those sympathetic comments!


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## Equine_Dream (11 February 2016)

What about something like horses4homes or other rehoming charities? Poor mare. I feel so sorry this horse


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## popsdosh (11 February 2016)

Equine_Dream said:



			What about something like horses4homes or other rehoming charities? Poor mare. I feel so sorry this horse 

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What about the poor owner! Luckily the horse is unaware of whats going on so get real.


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## Equine_Dream (11 February 2016)

popsdosh said:



			What about the poor owner! Luckily the horse is unaware of whats going on so get real.
		
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Please keep your patronising comments to yourself. There is no need to get personal. I will state how I feel thank you. And yes I do feel sorry for this horse. Sue me!


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## Pearlsasinger (11 February 2016)

I bought a horse in her late teens, from a family home.  She had previously been working a RS for 4 yrs, who had very responsibly decided to find her a good home before she got too old to work in the RS or to rehome.  On paper the family I bought her from were perfect for her, experienced mum and 2 daughters, one  a very capable rider, and a novice dad who needed a weight-carrier, which she definitely is.  BUT the family had let her get very overweight, ridden her in ill-fitting tack, ignored her when she tried to tell them that she was uncomfortable, in fact worse still, been rough when she threatened to bite because the bridle was too tight.  The horse was very unhappy and closed down when I met her.  When I talked to them it became obvious that they buy horses and sell them on quite often (not as a business but because they wanted something different).
It is not easy to find a horse an excellent home.
If you are having to put all your energy into dealing with divorce, bereavement, financial disaster, serious illness, or worse still terminal illness of a family member or yourself, there is very little opportunity to spend time, energy and money vetting homes.
i am another who is of the opinion that this lady's mistake is discussing her decision with her fellow liveries, who are obviously not able to put themselves in her place at a difficult time.  I really don't understand why some feel that they have the right to judge the actions of others, unless, of course, they can offer the horse a home for life, which I assume no-one has done.


ETA, OP, I understand that you started this thread to ask for the opinions of fellow horse-owners who do not know the horse or its owner, almost as a hypothetical question and definitely not asking for  abuse of the owner or yourself, which is completely unjustified.


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## milliepops (11 February 2016)

Clodagh said:



			I am appalled and horrified that people pm abuse, please report them to admin. It isn't you who is making the decision anyway! I apologise for all the vicious losers out there.
		
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^^ this. I don't understand why some people have to get so carried away when it's none of our business really anyway.


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## fatpiggy (11 February 2016)

stormox said:



			There are way too many horses around, and not enough good homes for them. If the owner wants the horse PTS, its her horse, her decision.
		
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I think you missed out a vital element in your first sentence there - there are too many {poor quality, poorly bred, poorly trained} horses around...     The dog world is no different with many casual owners determined to have a litter out of their bitch because they don't want to deprive them of the experience (yes honestly, people have told me that to my face) and they fail to mention that the fact they can get £500 a pup is actually the real reason for it.  Easy money.  The sanctuaries are full of pregnant or nursing cats because the owners didn't bother to consider neutering.  It is people that have caused the glut of animals, not the animals themselves, but it is always those poor souls that have to pay for it. And many pay with their lives.


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## popsdosh (11 February 2016)

Equine_Dream said:



			Please keep your patronising comments to yourself. There is no need to get personal. I will state how I feel thank you. And yes I do feel sorry for this horse. Sue me!
		
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Nothing personal unless you want to take it that way! A bit more understanding of what brings an owner to make this decision would probably make you look like you had some compassion. Its not a decision any of us would want to be in the position to have to make. Luckily the horse is unaware so how are they being mistreated which would be the logical reason to feel sorry for her.
There are lots of people offering to help out of compassion for the owner and their situation yet those who only think about the horse are no doubt those sending abussive PMs about it. Which is the right course of action?


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## Wagtail (11 February 2016)

popsdosh said:



			There are lots of people offering to help out of compassion for the owner and their situation yet those who only think about the horse are no doubt those sending abussive PMs about it. Which is the right course of action?
		
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That's a very big and defective assumption to make. How do you know that the abusive PMs are not from people who think the OP should not have started a thread about someone else's very emotive situation? Why would they only be from people caring about the horse? Ridiculous!

A more useful thread would have been giving more details about the horse in question because no doubt some people on here may well have been able to offer a loving home.


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## Goldenstar (11 February 2016)

There's never any excuse for sending abusive pm's I just can't think what people are thinking about .


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## popsdosh (11 February 2016)

Wagtail said:



			That's a very big and defective assumption to make. How do you know that the abusive PMs are not from people who think the OP should not have started a thread about someone else's very emotive situation? Why would they only be from people caring about the horse? Ridiculous!

A more useful thread would have been giving more details about the horse in question because no doubt some people on here may well have been able to offer a loving home.
		
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I think generally starting threads about other peoples horses is generally going to lead to problems. To be honest i do question why? sometimes as you dont know the whole story.


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## Clodagh (11 February 2016)

Goldenstar said:



			There's never any excuse for sending abusive pm's I just can't think what people are thinking about .
		
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Absolutely, if you are too ashamed to post it on the forum don't hide behind a pm.


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## Equine_Dream (11 February 2016)

popsdosh said:



			Nothing personal unless you want to take it that way! A bit more understanding of what brings an owner to make this decision would probably make you look like you had some compassion. Its not a decision any of us would want to be in the position to have to make. Luckily the horse is unaware so how are they being mistreated which would be the logical reason to feel sorry for her.
There are lots of people offering to help out of compassion for the owner and their situation yet those who only think about the horse are no doubt those sending abussive PMs about it. Which is the right course of action?
		
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Im sorry but I find the "get real" remark patronising and personal. I have not sent an abusive pm nor do I condone it. You dont know who is sending the pms so perhaps its worth not makinf accusations just yet. 
You have no right to dictate how people should feel. On the info we have been given my sympathies are with the poor horse. I dont see why you find me stating that I feel sorry for the animal so horrific, but that is my feeling on the situation nevertheless


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## Regandal (11 February 2016)

One would hope that in a situation like this,  that the woman's horsey friends would rally round and help sell/rehome the mare.  Assuming that the mare is as described.


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## Merrymoles (11 February 2016)

The reason this thread has got so heated is the horse's age but, really, that is not relevant. The horse could break a leg in the field today and nobody would say "don't pts". The horse has no idea how old it is or what potential it has. Beef cattle go to slaughter at 24 months and anyone who is not vegetarian condones an early death for most farm animals simply because they eat meat. 

I am lucky enough to have a "plan B" if my life changes drastically as my horse will be gifted to a friend who knows him well, will deal with his "issues" like biting and is capable of riding what can be an over-sensitive, unpredictable, horse. However, before I bought him, he had been passed from pillar to post and, if I could not ensure his long-term future, I would seriously consider pts even though he is only 13. I would hate him to return to being the upset, shut-down, unsettled horse that I bought. I know there are some great owners out there but I also know he went through four in less than a year as no-one really wanted him.


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## jrp204 (11 February 2016)

Regandal said:



			One would hope that in a situation like this,  that the woman's horsey friends would rally round and help sell/rehome the mare.  Assuming that the mare is as described.[/QUOTE

Her horsey friends should respect her decision, if she wanted to sell/rehome she would (you hope) ask for help. She obviously has her reasons and she doesn't have to justify herself to anyone. It is rather a shame she disclosed her plans.
		
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## touchstone (11 February 2016)

I don't feel sorry for the horse, it is well looked after and will meet a kind end. I think people's energies would be better placed in getting irate about the countless horses that actually are suffering right now facing neglect and abuse on a daily  basis.  Those are the animals who need our support the most and what rescue centres are meant for.


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## cobgoblin (11 February 2016)

I always find it amazing on this forum that differing opinions are not allowed to exist.OP must have known this was going to be a contentious topic as she stated that she was torn herself.
We have only the stated information that the owner wouldn't trust a loan home and could not bear to sell. No mention is made that any attempt to rehome the horse, therefore we must assume that this has not happened and the owner wishes to have the mare pts because she cannot bear the thought of anyone else enjoying her. She has a 'life changing situation' which could mean anything from divorce, finance, illness or having to move abroad etc. Whatever the situation is, is it fair that just because a human has a problem everything in their sphere or control must suffer the consequences? It sort of reminds me of the situations where a father finds his life intolerable so he gasses his children in the car with him. Now you can all have a good argument about me saying that. But I believe that not trying to sort the situation out in any way possible is selfish. There are good homes out there, presumably most posters on this forum have bought a horse at some time and consider that they have provided a good home ( or perhaps not, which could explain some of the comments). Plenty of people on this forum sell horses.....do they always consider that they have sold to a home that will abuse? Of course not!
So the only real reason for this horse being pts that we have so far is that the owner cannot bear to sell it. I still find that selfish.


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## fatpiggy (11 February 2016)

popsdosh said:



			I think generally starting threads about other peoples horses is generally going to lead to problems. To be honest i do question why? sometimes as you dont know the whole story.
		
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Agreed.

As to abusive PMs, well you only have to look at Faceache.  Its a national sport to send insults in print.


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## rowan666 (11 February 2016)

I have I missed the part where it's confirmed that the horse in question is a somekind of perfectly ridable alrounder that would be easy to rehome?? 
All I can see from OP is that the horse is 10yrs old and that in her personal opinion, which shouldn't be mistaken for fact, lovely and healthy, there has been no mention that this horse is ridable and it could be extremely quirky and taken the poor owner many years to learn how to deal with, there could well be long term health or conformation issues.

 At the end of the day though if the horse is not suffering it is none of anybody elses business and shame on anybody who tries to bring down anybody just because they hold a difference in opinion.


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## Equine_Dream (11 February 2016)

jrp204 said:





Regandal said:



			One would hope that in a situation like this,  that the woman's horsey friends would rally round and help sell/rehome the mare.  Assuming that the mare is as described.[/QUOTE

Her horsey friends should respect her decision, if she wanted to sell/rehome she would (you hope) ask for help. She obviously has her reasons and she doesn't have to justify herself to anyone. It is rather a shame she disclosed her plans.
		
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Right so just because shes now decided that no one else could possibly offer her mare a home as good as hers, the mare must die!? Sorry but I find that utterly ridiculous and selfish beyond belief! What if someone decided that their horse was suddenly the wrong colour and wanted it pts, or the kids have outgrown it so lets pts, or its crap at jumping  so lets just pts? Would you just say "oh well its their horse".
Do you know I hope the owner does see this thread and I hope it makes her think and realise how utterly selfish shes being. Poor horse.
		
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## Equine_Dream (11 February 2016)

cobgoblin said:



			I always find it amazing on this forum that differing opinions are not allowed to exist.OP must have known this was going to be a contentious topic as she stated that she was torn herself.
We have only the stated information that the owner wouldn't trust a loan home and could not bear to sell. No mention is made that any attempt to rehome the horse, therefore we must assume that this has not happened and the owner wishes to have the mare pts because she cannot bear the thought of anyone else enjoying her. She has a 'life changing situation' which could mean anything from divorce, finance, illness or having to move abroad etc. Whatever the situation is, is it fair that just because a human has a problem everything in their sphere or control must suffer the consequences? It sort of reminds me of the situations where a father finds his life intolerable so he gasses his children in the car with him. Now you can all have a good argument about me saying that. But I believe that not trying to sort the situation out in any way possible is selfish. There are good homes out there, presumably most posters on this forum have bought a horse at some time and consider that they have provided a good home ( or perhaps not, which could explain some of the comments). Plenty of people on this forum sell horses.....do they always consider that they have sold to a home that will abuse? Of course not!
So the only real reason for this horse being pts that we have so far is that the owner cannot bear to sell it. I still find that selfish.
		
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Well said! I couldn't agree more!


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## huskydamage (11 February 2016)

Not enough info here to judge. Doesn't say what exactly is wrong with the horse. I'll assume there is something very wrong with it if the owner thinks no one else can look after it but them so it must be pts. Surely this is not a useful healthy horse?


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## jrp204 (11 February 2016)

Equine_Dream said:





jrp204 said:



			Right so just because shes now decided that no one else could possibly offer her mare a home as good as hers, the mare must die!? Sorry but I find that utterly ridiculous and selfish beyond belief! What if someone decided that their horse was suddenly the wrong colour and wanted it pts, or the kids have outgrown it so lets pts, or its crap at jumping  so lets just pts? Would you just say "oh well its their horse".
Do you know I hope the owner does see this thread and I hope it makes her think and realise how utterly selfish shes being. Poor horse.
		
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Since none of us know the full story how can anyone say she is being selfish. 'Poor horse' how many horses are shoved from one unsuitable home to another, maybe this is what the owner wants to avoid? I wouldn't call that selfish.
This thread is nothing but opinions on guesswork. Ownership of an animal gives the ultimate responsibililty and one that is too often shirked. The owner is taking on this responsibility and since we know nothing of her circumstances I will not stand in judgement.
		
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## fatpiggy (11 February 2016)

moleskinsmum said:



			The reason this thread has got so heated is the horse's age but, really, that is not relevant. The horse could break a leg in the field today and nobody would say "don't pts". The horse has no idea how old it is or what potential it has. Beef cattle go to slaughter at 24 months and anyone who is not vegetarian condones an early death for most farm animals simply because they eat meat. 

I am lucky enough to have a "plan B" if my life changes drastically as my horse will be gifted to a friend who knows him well, will deal with his "issues" like biting and is capable of riding what can be an over-sensitive, unpredictable, horse. However, before I bought him, he had been passed from pillar to post and, if I could not ensure his long-term future, I would seriously consider pts even though he is only 13. I would hate him to return to being the upset, shut-down, unsettled horse that I bought. I know there are some great owners out there but I also know he went through four in less than a year as no-one really wanted him.
		
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I don't think you can actually compare the life of a horse with that of a beef bullock. Meat animals are bred specifically for that - meat. They wouldn't exist at all if no-one ate meat, and there wouldn't be much milk available either since only goats don't need to breed every year in order to keep making milk. Leather would be a rare commodity too, and there are plenty of uses for animal hide glue, fertilizer etc still today.  Horses are mostly pets so their life expectancy, barring disaster, is going to be longer.  And that is why a great many people would say that a 10 year old healthy animal of normal talent and behaviour should be given the chance.  I bought my mare as a rising 12. If her previous owner(s) hadn't sold her, I would never have had the joy, pleasure, heartbreak of owning her.  She had had an abusive background, you could see all the whip marks on her flank in her summer coat and she had learned to detach herself from humans because they either sold her or were mean to her so she didn't risk trying to make a connection any more. Self preservation. She was polite and nothing else.  It was 10 years before she let the final barrier down and was truly loving towards me although I had little glimpses of her real nature from time to time when she played little tricks on me or we played rear and chase in the field and then shook her ears at me with a cheeky grin on her face.  I listened to a fascinating radio programme the other week about a girl of 18 who had been in care since the age of 5 and was now preparing to go solo with the help of her latest foster family.  She had been fostered 3 or 4 times, often going from the frying pan into the fire, to people who were no better than her appalling mother who had got a new boyfriend who didn't like the children so gave her the option - her children or him and she chose him.  But finally she landed up with a family who truly cared for her. She called them mum and dad and they introduced her to people as their daughter.  She was a remarkable level-headed, intelligent, eloquent young woman who had been given the chance by an equally remarkable family.  Should she have been left in a local authority run childrens' home, then turfed out at 18 and left to her own devices, so a prime target for pimps, pushers and less than desirable people in society?  I realise this is NOT the same situation but it is food for thought.


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## Equine_Dream (11 February 2016)

jrp204 said:





Equine_Dream said:



			Since none of us know the full story how can anyone say she is being selfish. 'Poor horse' how many horses are shoved from one unsuitable home to another, maybe this is what the owner wants to avoid? I wouldn't call that selfish.
		
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Right so loan the horse, or sell but be very picky with buyers. Or use a rehoming charity. Esbecially if her circumstances are "life changing" im sure they would help.  Im sorry but as Ive said if everyone couldn't bare to sell in case the horse was passed around then I doubt many people would actually have horses.
		
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## Merrymoles (11 February 2016)

fatpiggy said:



			I don't think you can actually compare the life of a horse with that of a beef bullock. Meat animals are bred specifically for that - meat. They wouldn't exist at all if no-one ate meat, and there wouldn't be much milk available either since only goats don't need to breed every year in order to keep making milk. Leather would be a rare commodity too, and there are plenty of uses for animal hide glue, fertilizer etc still today.  Horses are mostly pets so their life expectancy, barring disaster, is going to be longer.  And that is why a great many people would say that a 10 year old healthy animal of normal talent and behaviour should be given the chance.  I bought my mare as a rising 12. If her previous owner(s) hadn't sold her, I would never have had the joy, pleasure, heartbreak of owning her.  She had had an abusive background, you could see all the whip marks on her flank in her summer coat and she had learned to detach herself from humans because they either sold her or were mean to her so she didn't risk trying to make a connection any more. Self preservation. She was polite and nothing else.  It was 10 years before she let the final barrier down and was truly loving towards me although I had little glimpses of her real nature from time to time when she played little tricks on me or we played rear and chase in the field and then shook her ears at me with a cheeky grin on her face.  I listened to a fascinating radio programme the other week about a girl of 18 who had been in care since the age of 5 and was now preparing to go solo with the help of her latest foster family.  She had been fostered 3 or 4 times, often going from the frying pan into the fire, to people who were no better than her appalling mother who had got a new boyfriend who didn't like the children so gave her the option - her children or him and she chose him.  But finally she landed up with a family who truly cared for her. She called them mum and dad and they introduced her to people as their daughter.  She was a remarkable level-headed, intelligent, eloquent young woman who had been given the chance by an equally remarkable family.  Should she have been left in a local authority run childrens' home, then turfed out at 18 and left to her own devices, so a prime target for pimps, pushers and less than desirable people in society?  I realise this is NOT the same situation but it is food for thought.
		
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My thoughts on beef bullocks are that many of them have better, if shorter, lives than significant numbers of neglected horses. We do build relationships with horses and therefore we do consider them in a different way. I'd be unlikely to be able to eat a beef bullock happily if I had had a relationship with it, got to know its personality and its "quirks" as I don't believe they are any less "sentient" than horses. However, I am referring to the imaginary bullock as "it", whereas if it were a horse, it would be "he". My argument really is that, whenever we end an animal's life, age is a major emotive factor for many but doesn't really make any difference to that animal.


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## popsdosh (11 February 2016)

Equine_Dream said:





jrp204 said:



			Do you know I hope the owner does see this thread and I hope it makes her think and realise how utterly selfish shes being. Poor horse.
		
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Oh dear this says so much more about YOU than the owner! you should be ashamed of saying that!! You have just confirmed I was right the first time

The owner never asked for this discussion and here you are calling them 'utterly selfish' you are beyond belief. 

I wish the OP had never put up this thread and I question their motives in doing so now
		
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## The Fuzzy Furry (11 February 2016)

Some people here need to take a LONG look at themselves! Read the posts back in the cold light of day, please!

Maybe I am just having a bad day - have been with a lovely lady with terminal cancer (not at all long for this world)  earlier this morning, holding her 2 horses whilst they were PTS with her there.

There are lots of horses happy with owners, and more who do not have caring owners or good places to be. 

IMHO there are NO rights or wrongs, but people doing as they see best AT THE TIME.
They are probably not in a good place once decision has been made - none of us are (and anyone who is otherwise, is a liar).

Guys, enjoy the horses you have, listen to others, dont be so quick with opinions eh?


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## Equine_Dream (11 February 2016)

popsdosh said:





Equine_Dream said:



			Oh dear this says so much more about YOU than the owner! you should be ashamed of saying that!! You have just confirmed I was right the first time

The owner never asked for this discussion and here you are calling them 'utterly selfish' you are beyond belief. 

I wish the OP had never put up this thread and I question their motives in doing so now
		
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I stand by everything I've said. I believe it is utterly selfish to kill a perfectly healthy rideable young horse because you cant bare the thought of it going to someone else. Call me what you like I don't really care.
		
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## popsdosh (11 February 2016)

moleskinsmum said:



			My thoughts on beef bullocks are that many of them have better, if shorter, lives than significant numbers of neglected horses. We do build relationships with horses and therefore we do consider them in a different way. I'd be unlikely to be able to eat a beef bullock happily if I had had a relationship with it, got to know its personality and its "quirks" as I don't believe they are any less "sentient" than horses. However, I am referring to the imaginary bullock as "it", whereas if it were a horse, it would be "he". My argument really is that, whenever we end an animal's life, age is a major emotive factor for many but doesn't really make any difference to that animal.
		
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Indeed cattle are in many ways more sentient than horses . I hate to admit it but my suckler herd is carrying the odd older cow as a passenger even though I would not condone that for other herds. LOL

I agree on the age thing it is too easy to look on it with human values. They only die once and luckily for them they have no comprehension of how long they should live for however hopefully up to that stage they have the best life possible.


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## luckyoldme (11 February 2016)

The Fuzzy Furry said:



			Some people here need to take a LONG look at themselves! Read the posts back in the cold light of day, please!

Maybe I am just having a bad day - have been with a lovely lady with terminal cancer (not at all long for this world)  earlier this morning, holding her 2 horses whilst they were PTS with her there.

There are lots of horses happy with owners, and more who do not have caring owners or good places to be. 

IMHO there are NO rights or wrongs, but people doing as they see best AT THE TIME.
They are probably not in a good place once decision has been made - none of us are (and anyone who is otherwise, is a liar).

Guys, enjoy the horses you have, listen to others, dont be so quick with opinions eh? 

Click to expand...

thats so sad.puts the whole thing into perspective.
Like others have said we only have the ops version of this story and she has done a runner, in effect we are judging someone whos life we know nothing about, and might not evan exist.


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## ozpoz (11 February 2016)

I don't believe anyone considers PTS because "they can't bear the thought of it going to someone else" . 
It is obvious that people do this because they can't bear the possibility of them slipping down the chain of ownership into bad hands, or worse. And no wonder - we hear daily of abandoned , neglected horses and witness poor, rough handling at many yards.
So don't be quick to blame - we don't know her, her horse, her circumstances, or the kind of people around her who are happy to take it off her hands.


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## popsdosh (11 February 2016)

The Fuzzy Furry said:



			Some people here need to take a LONG look at themselves! Read the posts back in the cold light of day, please!

Maybe I am just having a bad day - have been with a lovely lady with terminal cancer (not at all long for this world)  earlier this morning, holding her 2 horses whilst they were PTS with her there.

There are lots of horses happy with owners, and more who do not have caring owners or good places to be. 

IMHO there are NO rights or wrongs, but people doing as they see best AT THE TIME.
They are probably not in a good place once decision has been made - none of us are (and anyone who is otherwise, is a liar).

Guys, enjoy the horses you have, listen to others, dont be so quick with opinions eh? 

Click to expand...

All I will say FF is you did a wonderful thing today for that lady! God bless you


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## popsdosh (11 February 2016)

ozpoz said:



			I don't believe anyone considers PTS because "they can't bear the thought of it going to someone else" . 
It is obvious that people do this because they can't bear the possibility of them slipping down the chain of ownership into bad hands, or worse. And no wonder - we hear daily of abandoned , neglected horses and witness poor, rough handling at many yards.
So don't be quick to blame - we don't know her, her horse, her circumstances, or the kind of people around her who are happy to take it off her hands.
		
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Agreed we rarely can be sure for certain.


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## Damnation (11 February 2016)

I think people should agree to disagree and let this lie.

There is no right answer.


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## Equine_Dream (11 February 2016)

ozpoz said:



			I don't believe anyone considers PTS because "they can't bear the thought of it going to someone else" . 
It is obvious that people do this because they can't bear the possibility of them slipping down the chain of ownership into bad hands, or worse. And no wonder - we hear daily of abandoned , neglected horses and witness poor, rough handling at many yards.
So don't be quick to blame - we don't know her, her horse, her circumstances, or the kind of people around her who are happy to take it off her hands.
		
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I understand that but why not use a rehoming charity where the horse is offered for lifetime loan?  There are options.
This thread has actually really upset ans angered me. So I am going to respectfully bow out at this stage.


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## ester (11 February 2016)

There is some right dodgy quoting going on in this thread now. 

I think with no info other than that given in the OP no one has sufficient information to judge.


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## ester (11 February 2016)

Equine_Dream said:



			I understand that but why not use a rehoming charity where the horse is offered for lifetime loan?  There are options.
This thread has actually really upset ans angered me. So I am going to respectfully bow out at this stage.
		
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have you ever tried to find space in a good rehoming charity?


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## smja (11 February 2016)

This thread has been playing on my mind again - our old pony is having another setback in his lameness, and we've done an awful lot of weighing up options.

All I can say is that in these kind of situations, there is no 'right' or 'wrong' answer. The owner's responsibility to their horse comes first, above their personal feelings. Other people's input may be valued if asked for, to provide alternatives that may not be immediately obvious.

However, the decision remains with the owner. We have a duty to our horses that I for one take very seriously indeed.
Once someone has made that decision, it's up to the people around them to support them if they can, and refrain from commenting if they cannot.


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## YorksG (11 February 2016)

The level of judgemental sentimentality of some posters views is beyond belief! Unless they are vegan, then I don't think they have the moral ground to shout about selfishness. 
The only problems I can see is that the OP put this thread on here and the owner shared her plans with other people.


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## Llanali (11 February 2016)

I've stayed out until now, but I feel o compelled to mention a parallel story. 

I bred a litter of puppies in spring 2012; well thought out, well planned puppies, all their homes lined up. They were born, and at four weeks my mother was diagnosed with a terminal aggressive brain tumour. 

Pups A, B and C were sorted. Pup D was supposed to be mine, and pup E for my mum to keep. 

When she died, six weeks after diagnosis, my father dropped all the dogs off at my semi terraced house. I could not afford them all or house them. I had an older but fully fit  bitch, the bitch who had just whelped and two pups. I did what I feel most on here who have commented that the owner here is selfish, would probably do; I homed puppy D, through our breed welfare, to a respected home. 

18 months later, I rescued that puppy back from a totally inappropriate setting, and though he has made great strides, he will never recover from the trauma of that home. 

In hindsight, I wish I had put the older, but not ancient, healthy bitch down to make room for both puppies. But had I done that, half this forum would say I was selfish, vile,narcissistic. Getting rid oof older, for a youngster, thinking no one could care like I do. 

Until you find yourself in the mouth of your personal hell, and I pray you don't, please take a care with your judgement. I adore my animals, they are my pridv and joy, and Imake many sacrifices for them, but human life tops out I'm afraid, and sometimes, decisions made that we can never be truly peaceful with, but that are absolutely necessary at that time.


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## hairycob (11 February 2016)

We don't know what is happening to this owner e.g. if you are not going to be in a position to take a horse back putting it out on loan is not a realistic option. And don't bother to come back with "she can always find cheap grass livery" 1) grass livery, cheap or otherwise is flipping scarce in some areas 2) if she is facing severe health problems (e.g. life in a wheelchair) even that might not be a practical option.
We don't really know what the horse is like. I've known plenty of people describe chronically lame, bad tempered or generally difficult horses as lovely so it may be that finding the right home is going to be nigh on impossible or not in the horses best interest to rehome.
It may be that the horse is really sound & lovely but the owner is facing months of difficult chemo/open heart surgery or similar & can't face the stress of worrying about finding a good home.
So sad that so many posters on here have so little imagination about what may be driving the owner to this. Sure, she may be a right bitch who changes her horses as often as her knickers but it's far more likely that she is struggling in a dark & lonely place.


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## Tiddlypom (11 February 2016)

^^^ Very good post, hairycob.

So many people pontificating from their moral high ground whilst knowing eff all about the real back story.


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## Pigeon (11 February 2016)

All the other liveries kicking up a fuss - are they offering to take on the horse?


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## Regandal (11 February 2016)

fatpiggy said:



			As to abusive PMs, well you only have to look at Faceache.  Its a national sport to send insults in print.
		
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Lol!  How true!


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## MagicMelon (11 February 2016)

Thing is, I think the owner is selfish to assume that only she can look after the horse well (which she clearly can't which is why she is now thinking of PTS).  If it's only 10 and possibly rideable (??) then there's no reason why she can't find a decent home, there's plenty out there you just have to look and weed out all the nasties.  I personally would never put down a healthy horse, why can't she loan it out and keep a close eye on it to make sure all is well?


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## Meowy Catkin (11 February 2016)

We don't know anything from the owner, so it is entirely spurious to assume that she thinks 'that no-one else can look after the horse.'


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## fatpiggy (11 February 2016)

moleskinsmum said:



			My thoughts on beef bullocks are that many of them have better, if shorter, lives than significant numbers of neglected horses. We do build relationships with horses and therefore we do consider them in a different way. I'd be unlikely to be able to eat a beef bullock happily if I had had a relationship with it, got to know its personality and its "quirks" as I don't believe they are any less "sentient" than horses. However, I am referring to the imaginary bullock as "it", whereas if it were a horse, it would be "he". My argument really is that, whenever we end an animal's life, age is a major emotive factor for many but doesn't really make any difference to that animal.
		
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Hmm, not all the beef stock do unfortunately.  I grew up in beef land and we let our field to a local farmer. The boys were out on beautiful grazing, doing what beefy boys do until they went to market at 18 months. The farmer took them himself in his small lorry. The local abbatoir was only 8 miles from the market.  I played out with the boys constantly as there weren't any other kids around, gave them names, sat on their backs and generally enjoyed their company. But I still ate my roast beef on Sundays.  Contrast this to the poor little souls which were kept by a local gypsy in a pen on the farm where my horse retired to. They arrived at just a couple of weeks old, put into a concrete pen with no bedding, just slats (I don't think that is legal actually) with just straw and nuts to eat.  As they grew the space around them shrank until they could barely turn around. They lay in their own filth and crapped on each others backs because they were wedged in so tight.  Out of one batch, two died of bacterial pneumonia due to the terrible air quality, they were all alive with ringworm and one went down and was trampled to death by the others. These were the lucky ones, their suffering was over.  As they got bigger they became more sexually active so were fighting and mounting each other in their matchbox of a pen.  Then one day the lorry came for them and the evil creature that owned them beat them into it with a thick stick.  Those poor animals never had so much as a day of having grass under their feet, to run and kick as all baby animals like to do. Their short lives were absolute misery and the whole set-up was a total disgrace.


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## Luci07 (11 February 2016)

Faracat said:



			We don't know anything from the owner, so it is entirely spurious to assume that she thinks 'that no-one else can look after the horse.'
		
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The original post said the owner couldn't bear to sell the horse on. People are judging but we are basing our responses on what we were told in the first post. No, we don't know the whole story, we weren't given it. All we were told is that she can't keep the horse and chooses to put down a healthy young animal who has no issues. I sincerely hope there isn't an awful back story but people are only responding to what they have been told. Anything else is just guesswork.


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## Meowy Catkin (11 February 2016)

Second hand information just isn't as trustworthy as first hand information.


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## Luci07 (11 February 2016)

Faracat said:



			Second hand information just isn't as trustworthy as first hand information.
		
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True....hope this post is just theoretical for both the owners and horses sake.


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## jrp204 (11 February 2016)

Is it me or is the quoting really odd? 


Equine_Dream said:



			image: http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/images/misc/quote_icon.png
Quote Originally Posted by jrp204
image: http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/images/buttons/viewpost-right.png
View Post


Do you know I hope the owner does see this thread and I hope it makes her think and realise how utterly selfish shes being. Poor horse.
Oh dear this says so much more about YOU than the owner! you should be ashamed of saying that!! You have just confirmed I was right the first time

The owner never asked for this discussion and here you are calling them 'utterly selfish' you are beyond belief. 

I wish the OP had never put up this thread and I question their motives in doing so now
Read more at http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/foru...-healthy-horse-down/page5#V7EDrMo5h2D4PZ88.99

It is saying I wrote this which I very definitely did not!
		
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## Micropony (11 February 2016)

Luci07 said:



			All we were told is that she can't keep the horse and chooses to put down a healthy young animal who has no issues.
		
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The only information we were given about the horse was that it is a mare, it is 10 and the OP described it as "lovely". We were not told it was healthy and we were not told it has no issues.

None of us have sufficient information to make any sort of judgement about what this owner is doing. Not that some seem to regard that as a barrier to doing so.


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## Alec Swan (11 February 2016)

VikingSong said:



			..

If she does have that horse PTS, then I hope she's prosecuted.
		
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It's just as well that the same criteria isn't applied to my sheep,  isn't it? 

Alec.


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## Alec Swan (11 February 2016)

Llanali said:



			..

In hindsight, I wish I had put the older, but not ancient, healthy bitch down to make room for both puppies. But had I done that, half this forum would say I was selfish, vile,narcissistic. Getting rid oof older, for a youngster, thinking no one could care like I do. 

Until you find yourself in the mouth of your personal hell, and I pray you don't, please take a care with your judgement. I adore my animals, they are my pridv and joy, and Imake many sacrifices for them, but human life tops out I'm afraid, and sometimes, decisions made that we can never be truly peaceful with, but that are absolutely necessary at that time.
		
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Some would pass judgement perhaps,  but not all.  It's all so often true that the right decisions are rarely the easiest.  I too live with the decisions that I've made and the only 'right',  was that on balance,  there was no other choice.

Alec.


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## Wagtail (11 February 2016)

fatpiggy said:



			Hmm, not all the beef stock do unfortunately.  I grew up in beef land and we let our field to a local farmer. The boys were out on beautiful grazing, doing what beefy boys do until they went to market at 18 months. The farmer took them himself in his small lorry. The local abbatoir was only 8 miles from the market.  I played out with the boys constantly as there weren't any other kids around, gave them names, sat on their backs and generally enjoyed their company. But I still ate my roast beef on Sundays.  Contrast this to the poor little souls which were kept by a local gypsy in a pen on the farm where my horse retired to. They arrived at just a couple of weeks old, put into a concrete pen with no bedding, just slats (I don't think that is legal actually) with just straw and nuts to eat.  As they grew the space around them shrank until they could barely turn around. They lay in their own filth and crapped on each others backs because they were wedged in so tight.  Out of one batch, two died of bacterial pneumonia due to the terrible air quality, they were all alive with ringworm and one went down and was trampled to death by the others. These were the lucky ones, their suffering was over.  As they got bigger they became more sexually active so were fighting and mounting each other in their matchbox of a pen.  Then one day the lorry came for them and the evil creature that owned them beat them into it with a thick stick.  Those poor animals never had so much as a day of having grass under their feet, to run and kick as all baby animals like to do. Their short lives were absolute misery and the whole set-up was a total disgrace.
		
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Oh that is just terrible. Those poor, poor animals. I don't eat meat as I dislike the whole mass produced conveyor belt mentality of it all, even with the better kept animals. I am of the opinion that meat should be at least ten times as expensive for the consumer, so that farmers can afford to give them the best possible lives and make a good profit out of it. Also, I would want abattoirs to be smaller and more local to avoid long journeys and give each animal more time. Meat should be viewed as a special treat, to have far less often than we do. Only then might animals that are slaughtered to provide it, be treated far better. People would be healthier too. We eat meat so often now and it's packaged so people can just forget where it came from. It's a shame.


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## Fellewell (11 February 2016)

Illusion100 said:



			Indisputable facts about life are uncertainty and finality. 

I, for one, would rather have a humane end amongst those who love me than dying amongst others that don't.
		
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Excellent post.

This owner has given her mare a good life and wants to ensure the horse has a good death.
Not all horses settle well in new homes. I have PTS and I have sold on, but it was the stuff I heard back about the ones I sold on that kept me awake at night.


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## cobgoblin (11 February 2016)

Micropony said:



			The only information we were given about the horse was that it is a mare, it is 10 and the OP described it as "lovely". We were not told it was healthy and we were not told it has no issues.

None of us have sufficient information to make any sort of judgement about what this owner is doing. Not that some seem to regard that as a barrier to doing so.
		
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If the horse was unsound, dangerous, had massive issues, was in constant pain or was elderly there would have been little point in posting in the first place. There would have been even less point to posting and not mentioning these conditions.


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## Wagtail (11 February 2016)

Micropony said:



			The only information we were given about the horse was that it is a mare, it is 10 and the OP described it as "lovely". We were not told it was healthy and we were not told it has no issues.
		
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The thread is entitled 'putting a healthy horse down' so I think we can assume that it is healthy, at least as far as the OP is aware. I actually wish the OP would clarify a few points now that she has posted this thread as perhaps all of this disagreement could have been avoided. For example, if she had said the horse was lame, or unrideable, then I think most people would not have a problem with what the owner is doing. If she said the horse is a useful riding horse, then people saying that we don't know about it, would then know. But from the title of the thread, and the OP, we know that the mare is a healthy 10 year old with a nice temperament.


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## Alec Swan (11 February 2016)

Fellewell said:



			&#8230;&#8230;.. . I have PTS and I have sold on, but it was the stuff I heard back about the ones I sold on that kept me awake at night.
		
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With the nightmares being around those which we've 'loaned'.  Never again.

Alec.


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## Micropony (11 February 2016)

Wagtail said:



			The thread is entitled 'putting a healthy horse down' so I think we can assume that it is healthy, at least as far as the OP is aware. I actually wish the OP would clarify a few points now that she has posted this thread as perhaps all of this disagreement could have been avoided. For example, if she had said the horse was lame, or unrideable, then I think most people would not have a problem with what the owner is doing. If she said the horse is a useful riding horse, then people saying that we don't know about it, would then know. But from the title of the thread, and the OP, we know that the mare is a healthy 10 year old with a nice temperament.
		
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I take your point, and Cobgoblin's, but lots of people who didn't know the detail would have referred to my last horse, who I mentioned in my previous post on this thread, as "healthy" and "lovely". He was, as long as he never went out for too long, or in mud, and you didn't mind supporting most of his 650kg when picking out his front feet, and he was ridden religiously 6 days a week, and you were happy to pay for the vet to I/v sedate for the farrier every 5 weeks. And you could cope with his quirks under saddle. He had shivers in front, navicular and rubbish feet, most of which wouldn't be immediately obvious to someone not closely involved in his care. Doesn't mean it would have been possible to find him a good long term home though, had I not been able to keep him.

You're right, there's a lot of information we don't have.


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## ManBearPig (11 February 2016)

This is an interesting topic and I can certainly understand why it has provoked such strong feeling on both sides of the argument. We don't have anywhere near enough information about the horse or the owner to judge in this situation. When the OP said "can't bear to sell" my first thought was that the horse had maybe had a bad past and the owner wouldn't want to risk leaving her vulnerable to being in that situation again. Or perhaps even if a perfect home could be found, the stress of a move would be too much for the mare to cope with. It is not a decision the owner will have taken lightly and she obviously feels it's in the horse's best interests, whatever her reasoning may be.


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## Gixxernic (11 February 2016)

popsdosh said:



			Somewhere like hillside maybe . I hope one day there is Karma for those sympathetic comments!
		
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Why dont you try NOT being so rude and actually respect other peoples comments!!! This is an open forum! And your not even the original poster! 

Each to their own #ignorance


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## Pearlsasinger (11 February 2016)

Micropony said:



			I take your point, and Cobgoblin's, but lots of people who didn't know the detail would have referred to my last horse, who I mentioned in my previous post on this thread, as "healthy" and "lovely". He was, as long as he never went out for too long, or in mud, and you didn't mind supporting most of his 650kg when picking out his front feet, and he was ridden religiously 6 days a week, and you were happy to pay for the vet to I/v sedate for the farrier every 5 weeks. And you could cope with his quirks under saddle. He had shivers in front, navicular and rubbish feet, most of which wouldn't be immediately obvious to someone not closely involved in his care. Doesn't mean it would have been possible to find him a good long term home though, had I not been able to keep him.

You're right, there's a lot of information we don't have.
		
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There is some information that we do have, that a lot of posters are ignoring.  We know that the owner's "life situation has changed and she cannot keep her horse",   which is the reason she is considering the horse's future.

As it is half-term in some areas, I am taking the view that many of the less charitable, more vociferous posters are very young, with little life experience and cannot imagine dealing with a crisis without the support of parents or other relatives.
It does surprise me that rescue charities have been suggested as a possibility, I thought it was well-documented that they are all, good, bad or indifferent full to bursting with horses which have suffered in their previous homes.  They have no room for those with responsible owners who are willing and able to make difficult decisions about their horses' care.

Any-one who cannot keep their horse cannot take the risk of loaning as the horse may well be returned at very short notice, as we hear frequently on here.


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## ester (11 February 2016)

We know the horse is healthy, we have no idea if it is even broken. 

Ditto life changing events, a friend had kidney failure which then involved regular trips to dialysis and now regular trips to the hospital because her transplant has never been happy. Horses kept at home, husband working as much as possible outside of delivering her to hospital and money tight as she can't work. She made that decision for a couple of hers and considered it for one she bred - when she was well, schooling young horses for others etc as she had not been able to put the time in that she would have wanted to if even considering sending her out into the big wide world.


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## popsdosh (11 February 2016)

Gixxernic said:



			Why dont you try NOT being so rude and actually respect other peoples comments!!! This is an open forum! And your not even the original poster! 

Each to their own #ignorance
		
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Maybe try respecting other people who have not asked for their situation to be pulled to bits on here and nasty comments made about them having had to make a difficult decision already! Your in a position to defend what you said they are not so grow up!


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## Llanali (11 February 2016)

Gixxernic said:



			Why dont you try NOT being so rude and actually respect other peoples comments!!! This is an open forum! And your not even the original poster! 

Each to their own #ignorance
		
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Perhaps you should try to remember which media you are using. Hashtags belong on Twitter.


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## paddi22 (11 February 2016)

if you have horses though then surely it's your responsibility to formulate a plan for them if circumstances DO change in your life suddenly, either mentally or physically. 

If anything happened to me, my close horsey friends know exactly what i want to happen to each horse. Some would be pts due to issues, but some could go on to lovely homes. I don't have any respect for the 'i couldn't bear' brigade. If you take on responsibilty for a horse's life then its your duty to 'bear'. I couldn't bear to see any of mine sold, and would worry if they got passed on - but it's my duty to find them as good a home as possible and trust in the fact that 90% of horse owners are lovely and kind.


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## ester (11 February 2016)

Yes, even if that plan is PTS.


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## Meowy Catkin (11 February 2016)

Well I couldn't bare it if I sold one of mine and they ended up locked in a barn with no food or water. 

Extreme example maybe, but it's exactly what happened to my grey's half brother (who was sound, young, healthy and sane). He wasn't the only horse in that barn either and I know that the people who sold or loaned those horses to that stud find what happened to those horses very hard to live with. 

Once a horse leaves your control, there's nothing that you can do and for a caring ex owner or owner who has loaned, it's going to be hard to bare if it goes wrong. Now I know the chances of it going wrong are far smaller than the chances of it going right, but that's no consolation for those it has gone wrong for.

We don't know if this person has had a bad experience with loaning or selling in the past that maybe colouring their thoughts because we just don't have enough information.


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## MagicMelon (11 February 2016)

Luci07 said:



			The original post said the owner couldn't bear to sell the horse on. People are judging but we are basing our responses on what we were told in the first post. No, we don't know the whole story, we weren't given it. All we were told is that she can't keep the horse and chooses to put down a healthy young animal who has no issues. I sincerely hope there isn't an awful back story but people are only responding to what they have been told. Anything else is just guesswork.
		
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Exactly. We can only go by the information given by the OP!


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## Equi (11 February 2016)

Sorry not read any other posts (i will though, just wanted to put this down before i forget or get influenced!) 

On fb recently a rescue advertised a 20+ year old horse, who was no able to be ridden and had other health problems, as an urgent home needed. Owner who adored it had passed away and the family were going to "murder" it but they had begged for some time to find a home. Of course one was found immediately and there was uproar. 

I just felt very sad for the horse, who looked a bit pathetic anyway, and was now having to go through the stress of a new home all because people thought putting him to sleep was abhorrent.

People need to toughen up.


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## MargotC (11 February 2016)

Truthfully selling a horse, even a good one, is a potential minefield. It is a project with an uncertain deadline. Ideally you should be at your best when selling. If you want the best for your horse you want time to vet prospective buyers and homes. You want to be picky. You have no guarantee how long it will take before the right person comes along (and even then you have no future guarantees, as unexpected things can happen for a buyer down the road as they did for you). If you find a good home you still have to hope for the best.

So if you find yourself in a situation where your life has changed to the point you can no longer keep a horse, do you have the time and resources and health to take on supervising a sale to ensure the horse lands on its feet? Can you still afford to be picky? If you can no longer keep a horse I expect this needs to be resolved swiftly, instead of risking advertising for months with all the costs that comes with it.

Putting a horse down is not a quick fix, as anyone who has had to make the decision will know. And yet it might sometimes be the only realistic option and what is right, for the person in question, at that point in time. Some won't realise this until they face it themselves.


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## Gixxernic (11 February 2016)

Relevant for ignorant narrow minded people! Everyone is entitled to their own opinion but popsdash seems to have a problem with everyone that doesnt agree with them , horsey world is the bitchiest place ever! Full of lots of nasty folks!


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## Llanali (11 February 2016)

Quite. If I cared a little more, I might even take offence. If. 

I concur with Alec that this is a hard life. Case in point, the fridge containing the tonic is downstairs, yet the gin is up here in the sitting room. Buggeration factor 20.


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## The Fuzzy Furry (11 February 2016)

popsdosh said:



			All I will say FF is you did a wonderful thing today for that lady! God bless you
		
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Thank you



luckyoldme said:



			thats so sad.puts the whole thing into perspective.
Like others have said we only have the ops version of this story and she has done a runner, in effect we are judging someone whos life we know nothing about, and might not evan exist.
		
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Exactly 



Gixxernic said:



			<snip lots of c r a p > ...horsey world is the bitchiest place ever! Full of lots of nasty folks!
		
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Take a long look sweetie, you might just find one in a mirror


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## Alec Swan (11 February 2016)

Llanali said:



			.

I concur with Alec that this is a hard life. .. .
		
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I may too,  if the post hadn't disappeared!  Weird! :confused3::rolleyes3:

Alec.


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## windand rain (11 February 2016)

I agree with Margot C we certainly dont know how quickly the OP needed the situation resolved. If I had got to the end of the line with any of mine they would be PTS mostly because it is a nightmare trying to sell and an even bigger one trying to loan a horse. If I didnt have the time, resources and health to wait for what could be years to find a new home I would PTS, no brainer really. The old girl and the young dartmoor couldnt really go anywhere else and the youngster is a hot highland which most people wouldnt want as she needs a rider not a novice. I do have the option of a retirement  home for the old girl but if funds were so short I could no longer pay for them then I would PTS before they had a chance to suffer through my loss of money or ability to care for them


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## Pippity (12 February 2016)

MargotC said:



			Truthfully selling a horse, even a good one, is a potential minefield. It is a project with an uncertain deadline. Ideally you should be at your best when selling. If you want the best for your horse you want time to vet prospective buyers and homes. You want to be picky. You have no guarantee how long it will take before the right person comes along (and even then you have no future guarantees, as unexpected things can happen for a buyer down the road as they did for you). If you find a good home you still have to hope for the best.

So if you find yourself in a situation where your life has changed to the point you can no longer keep a horse, do you have the time and resources and health to take on supervising a sale to ensure the horse lands on its feet? Can you still afford to be picky? If you can no longer keep a horse I expect this needs to be resolved swiftly, instead of risking advertising for months with all the costs that comes with it.

Putting a horse down is not a quick fix, as anyone who has had to make the decision will know. And yet it might sometimes be the only realistic option and what is right, for the person in question, at that point in time. Some won't realise this until they face it themselves.
		
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This is one of those times when I wish HHO had a 'like' button.


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## fatpiggy (12 February 2016)

Nahh, you want to try an all girls school!


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