# Horse being bullied in field. What to do?



## Holly Hocks (25 September 2010)

I moved my 20 year old TB gelding to a new DIY yard today.  Geldings go out in one field, and mares in the other and there are two starvation patches for the fatties. 

All the other liveries had been told what time I was arriving and that they could be there if they wanted to.  None of them turned up.   So I contacted my friend who also has her horses there and she told me just to turn him out - there were four other geldings out in quite a big grassy field.  A shetland - (was no problem), an 18 month old coloured - (no problem), a chestnut section D (a bit dominant, but nothing worse than ordinary first time newcomer in field behaviour) and an appaloosa gelding.  The appaloosa has already bullied one horse on to the starvation patch as it chased it relentlessly round the field until the other horse was trying to climb over a wall to get out.   So I turned mine out - didn't seem to be any problems other than the usual roaring and running round and I kept an eye on them for about 2 hours.  When I left, they were all happily grazing, although mine was on the outside of the group.  
When I returned this evening, mine came in to have his tea and was then keen to get out in the field again.  The appaloosa has relentlessly chased him, running up to him with it's mouth wide open and not letting him graze or be with the other horses.  To give mine his due, when it ran at him, he stood his ground and kicked right out with his back legs at it, which the other horse it bullied wouldn't do.  However I am worried sick that when I go tomorrow he will be injured.  I did put front brushing boots on him (couldn't decide whether to risk the heat damaging his legs, or a kick injury).  I can't go to bed and sleep because I am so worried. 
Do you think this other horse is just sorting out the order of the pack and should I leave it a couple of days to see if the situation improves, or should I get him out straightaway?  I can't really move yards again as everywhere is full and this is the closest to home with the best facilities, but there aren't any other fields to put him in and I don't see why I should put an already lean TB in a starvation patch with no other horses......please help me, am worried sick. x


----------



## Honey08 (25 September 2010)

Its just them sorting out the pecking order.  Its normal for a new horse to be kept away from the herd for a week or two by the herd leader.

That said, its usually best to let them sniff over a fence for a few days, and introduce them one by one for a few days.  Its really up to the yard owner to sort this out.  Could your horse go into a starvation paddock for a few days til he settles?

Don't worry - it will sort out.x


----------



## Holly Hocks (25 September 2010)

Hi Honey.
Thanks for that.  
I did think about the starvation patch as it is just on the other side of the fence, so they can meet over the fence, but it is tiny, and the other bullied horse is in there at the moment.  However he is moving yards on Monday due to the situation, so if it continues, it is definitely something I will think about.  The thing is, the bully socialises with the horse it has bullied, over the fence, but when they turn it out it with it, it chases it and tries to attack it, as it is doing with mine, although mine is quite a wily old horse, so I think he knows what to do.  You've made me feel a bit better though.  It seems that I must just have been lucky in the past - all I have ever had is the running round and roaring and then settling down to eat.  I'm not used to all this!  I'll give it a couple of weeks and see where we're up to. x


----------



## Louby (25 September 2010)

Its awful isnt it.
Im a whimp and lasted 2 days at one yard .  My horse is a nightmare, he stands there and takes it, doesnt kick back, just gets kicked  and he was chased by the boss for 2 days, other horses wanted to play with him.  After the 2nd day I couldnt take anymore, I hated the yard too and moved back to where I came from.


----------



## Dolcé (25 September 2010)

They can take a few weeks to settle fully, ours are quite good with newcomers to their herd but Rafferty spent weeks apart because he was absolutely terrified of them all and little mischief was outside the 'herd' for a good month, although the youngsters played with him.  I would leave it a couple of days and you should be able to tell whether it is going to settle or not.  The herd leader will be strange with him for a while every time you put him back in the field, it sort of starts all over again but shouldn't be for as long as the first time he went in, it's is like he just has to remind yours that he is in charge in case he has forgotten.  If, after a couple of days, it is still a problem then look at perhaps the herd leader being removed to a starvation paddock for a few days rather than yours.  This will give yours time to bond with the others and make it easier when the leader goes back in.  If only they could all go in like Storm did when we bought him, he walked in and started eating alongside the others with absolutely no racing around, it was like he had been there forever!


----------



## Kellys Heroes (25 September 2010)

Aw no hun.
I know its awful to watch - our mare was very poorly with laminitis in April - after 3 months we were able to turn her back out - only for an hour a day.

She was always the boss in the field before so we were looking forwards to seeing her going back out eventually!!
However, she got in the field, the other horses chased her round constantly, cornered her and Kelly stood at the gate, calling and pacing until we went to get her in.

It was awful seeing it but we were advised to leave them to it. 2 months on, she's back to being the boss of the field - they just needed to sort out their hierachy and we think because she'd been ill, the other horses saw her as a weakness and obviously you don't need a weakened horse in your herd.

Stick to it - boot up if need be OR if possibly, only turn him out while you are at the yard and bring him in before you go just so he has the opportunity to establish himself back into the herd AND your nerves are slightly less ragged!
Good luck
K x


----------



## Holly Hocks (26 September 2010)

Thanks everyone.  I went up early this morning and he was just pacing up and down one hedge.  He came over to be brought in - not something he would normally do, and was shaking like a leaf. He seems to have dropped tonnes of weight overnight and was really tucked up.  When I was bringing him in, the other horse tried to chase him again with me on the end of the rope.  Fortunately I managed to scare him away, but not happy.  I have put him back into the starvation patch with another wimpy one and the farmer has said that he will do something about the problem as when the bully came over to the fence which overlooks the starvation patch he saw mine get really scared.  I've got a mare coming home from hospital tomorrow so he has said that one possibility is that I can put my two out in the haylage field with his cows.  There aren't many cows out and the field is really rich, so I'm thinking that might be the best option....


----------



## lisab (26 September 2010)

This is horrible, poor you.  I've been here too.  I think the idea of putting the bully horse separate is a good one so yours can bond with the herd.  But sometimes, the only thing to do is separate them.

When I moved to my yard, I was warned about the bullybogs horse.  He's an absolute psycho.  The YOs said it would probably be ok if my horse stood his ground - which he did.  They got on ok(ish) for a few weeks then they had the most horrendous fight - rearing up at each other like stallions and trying to kill each other with their feet.  I had to go in and rescue my horse (who at this point, had the pyscho horse's rug in his teeth and was trying to rip it off him).  They were both dripping with sweat and my horse had the most awful bite wound on his jaw - almost down to the bone.  This was last Oct/Nov and it has scarred him.

After this incident, we split the field in 2 with electric fence.  But that didn't work either, because mine went up to the go and batter the other one, struck out with his front foot, got caught in the fencing, panicked, ran backwards and put his back out.

We have now double, back-fenced the field with a strip of no-horse-land in the middle, so they can't get to each other.  This has completely solved the problem.

I'm not sure if this is viable at your yard (we only have 4 horses at ours - 2 YOs and us 2 liveries).

I totally sympathise with you, it is so worrying.

Wishing you the best of luck.


----------



## Becki1802 (26 September 2010)

Personally I can't watch when it gets like this.  I took my horse on horsey holiday to my parents house and turned him out with just a few of the herd (2 out of 6) and it was awful.  The exmoor pony spent the entire time attacking my lad like you've described and the others were so upset.  He was kicking back at her the entire time and after 2 days it still carried on.  He was lathered up and I was terrified of a serious kick.  Thing with horses is a kick in the wrong place is the end of the matter and I wasn't willing to take that risk as I couldn't live with the worst if it happened.  What I did in the end was used electric tape to give him a small paddock in the corner of the field.  The other horses were then turned out around him so he had the company but they couldn't get to each other.  Only the pony was a problem and continued to go at him through the fence but he made friends with the others and so we then added a youngster to his field and they settled lovely.  How big is the paddock?  Could it be divided into 2 with tape?  If not I'd go for the haylage field with the cows.


----------



## kirstie (26 September 2010)

If I were you I wouldn't put him back out there with that horse. I'd put him in the paddock next door and hope that he can go out with the mare once she arrives.
It's really not worth the injury, you will feel awful if he does get hurt, not to mention a possible vet bill...
It is a horrible situation, so worrying. I hope it can be resolved for you soon.


----------



## Holly Hocks (26 September 2010)

Hi again everyone. 
Well I went back again to ride about 10am and he was in the starve patch with the other  victim and pulling at the blades of grass nose to nose with him.  Such a shame he is leaving tomorrow. However farmer knows that he has to do something about the problem and I think he will.  I have left mine in the stable this afternoon with a huge haylage net so that he can fill himself up and I'll  turn him out again with his buddy tonight in the patch.  He will stay in with the mare tomorrow night and hopefully by Tuesday problem will be sorted.  Somebody stayed after I had left last night and said that bully pants had pinned mine into the corner and just stared at him and every time mine went to move, he attacked him.  I can't believe he has no injuries today as he is one of the most accident prone horses I know.  I have never seen him as distressed as he was first thing this morning.


----------



## Pearlsasinger (26 September 2010)

This really annoys me, (not your fault, I know)  If your horse had been introduced to the field mates over a fence/wall, they would have had the opportunity to get a lot of this initial stuff over without any-one getting hurt.  Than after a week or so, he could have been put in with them with very little skirmishing.  TBH if he was threatening the bully back he will probably be ok and they WILL settle down eventually.  I certainly understand your concern.


----------



## siennamum (26 September 2010)

Some horses are just bullies and should be kept seperate from others. I've known a few horses in livery yards who have been PTS from broken legs etc. and it is almost always one aggressive horse in the field who causes the problem. 

We have a pony who will bully the others if he thinks he can, thankfully he is 13hh and unshod, the others treat him with distain. If he were bigger he would be a problem.

I live in fear of horses kicking each other and will always mix herds very carefully, it really annoys me to hear statements like "just leave them to it and they will sort it out", as the sorting out can be fatal.

I wouldn't put your old boy in with the bully ever again. Sounds like you are doing all the sensible things, but IMO the horse that should be kept seperate to the others isn't yours.


----------



## Holly Hocks (26 September 2010)

The problem is, that over the fence, the bully horse is perfectly sociable.  I have seen him with the other horse that he bullied and he is nice as pie over the fence,but when it is turned out, it just attacks him.  The other people have had their horse in the patch next to the big field for weeks, but other horse still attacked it when they turned it out.....I have been on quite a few yards and had horses for 20 years, so please don't assume that I know nothing, but I have NEVER seen aggression from any horse like has come from this one.


----------



## cbmcts (26 September 2010)

We always used to take the bully and the bullied (IYSWIM) and barn (in a seperate bays in an old cow barn) them next to each other for a week out of sight of the other horses - as herd animals any company was better than none so by the time they were turned back out they were friends.

Obviously, hay nets, water and feed were at the far sides of the bays to avoid any sniping while they were in.

My YO (RIP) at the time was a very old school horsewoman and managed introductions to the herd very well ie new horses were only introduced at field change time so everything was more interested in new grass rather than fighting and it was a gelding only herd so taking away another potential source of friction so bullying was very rare but the I saw the above method work on 2 or 3 different occasions.


----------



## Pearlsasinger (26 September 2010)

cbmcts said:



			We always used to take the bully and the bullied (IYSWIM) and barn (in a seperate bays in an old cow barn) them next to each other for a week out of sight of the other horses - as herd animals any company was better than none so by the time they were turned back out they were friends.

Obviously, hay nets, water and feed were at the far sides of the bays to avoid any sniping while they were in.

  My YO (RIP) at the time was a very old school horsewoman and managed introductions to the herd very well ie new horses were only introduced at field change time so everything was more interested in new grass rather than fighting and it was a gelding only herd so taking away another potential source of friction so bullying was very rare but the I saw the above method work on 2 or 3 different occasions.
		
Click to expand...

QR  I think that's a lot of the problem in general.  Far too many people with very little experience of horses set up livery yards for people with very little experience of horses.
Unfortunately 'old school' horsemen & women are definitely in the minority these days.


----------

