# Sycamore Seedlings



## Dizzleton (9 April 2015)

Hi all,

One of our fields is covered in literally thousands of sycamore seedlings. The horses haven't been grazing it as it was being rested from November time.

What is the best way to get rid of the seedlings? 

I've only really heard about Atypical Myopathy last Autumn, but my and many horses have been grazing the sycamore 'infected' field for around 10 years with no issues. Could my sycamore tree be one of the less toxic ones?

Thanks!


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## milliepops (9 April 2015)

Another whose horse has happily munched around sycamores for years. The thought is terrifying now!  But we have fenced off our seedling-infested area and are hand picking them.  Boring tedious job but the mower wouldn't collect the waste if we just used that.


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## The Fuzzy Furry (9 April 2015)

After getting mine chacked last year whilst doing the annual oak limbs safety checks, I asked the tree surgeons to identify  1 tree & he said mine was field maple (looks v similar to sycamore). Since been backed up by another tree expert, so worth double checking.


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## milliepops (9 April 2015)

this is quite a handy guide to the leaves, though wrong time of year to look for them! http://sylva.org.uk/myforest/documents/myForest_Tree_Identification_Key.pdf


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## Equi (9 April 2015)

The Fuzzy Furry said:



			After getting mine chacked last year whilst doing the annual oak limbs safety checks, I asked the tree surgeons to identify  1 tree & he said mine was field maple (looks v similar to sycamore). Since been backed up by another tree expert, so worth double checking.
		
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What's the difference? Like do they have different seeds or leaves?

I too have had the same trees and seedlings for 15+ years and never a sick horse but now I'm panicking and almost have my horses all dead.


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## Merlin11 (9 April 2015)

I've been pulling them out by hand. Some people mow them but my mower doesn't pick anything up and most of them are on a steep slope. It's hard work but I am getting there.


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## The Fuzzy Furry (9 April 2015)

equi said:



			What's the difference? Like do they have different seeds or leaves?

I too have had the same trees and seedlings for 15+ years and never a sick horse but now I'm panicking and almost have my horses all dead.
		
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To me, there is not a lot of difference, still got the 'winged' seeds. Worth doing a Google search on the images bit to see if this helps.
Otherwise, perhaps if you have a good gardening place near you, you can take leaves and also seeds (and a photo of the tree bark) to get it properly identified.
I took some down to Wisley (5 miles away) last year after tree surgeon chap told me & they also agreed with him (I didn't suggest what they were, just asked for ID on the samples I had).

However, having asked 3 different (large) equine vet practices round here who have all dealt with 'Sycamore' poisoning, none were able to identify the difference in the trees.
So, there you go. I haven't chopped mine down, its been there since we brought the land back in the 70's.

It sits in a row of deciduous trees (mostly horse Chestnuts but also 2 oaks, a Hornbeam and Hazel) on that boundary, tho on the other 3 boundaries I have extensive oaks, most of which are over 150 years old, so Acorns always get me scooting round to clear them, particularly in a 'mast' year like we had in 2013 

EDIT: 2 Large vet practices have confirmed that a true Field Maple is NOT poisonous.


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## Equi (9 April 2015)

Just found this:


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## Irish gal (9 April 2015)

We were warned in Ireland by government vets that all type of maple trees - as well as sycamore - were to be avoided.


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## The Fuzzy Furry (9 April 2015)

Another Acer, known as Acer Campastre - aka Field Maple: https://www.rhs.org.uk/plants/details?plantid=4356


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## Gift Horse (9 April 2015)

Field maples and Sycamores are both acers (maple family) so to my thinking they could both produce these toxic seeds. 
I am spending 30mins to an hour each  evening pulling them up by hand to reduce the risk - I am no expert on trees or toxins though.


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## The Fuzzy Furry (9 April 2015)

Article from Liphook here: http://liphookequinehospital.co.uk/news/2014/11/atypical-myopathy-sycamore-poisoning-in-horses-information-for-owners/ which goes into details with causes, symptoms etc.

And at the end:

"Currently, Sycamore seeds and to a lesser extent leaves, are the only known source of the toxin that causes the disease; however it remains possible that the toxin may be found elsewhere. To our knowledge, every UK case has been linked with the European Sycamore. There is often concern over other members of the Acer family. Although thorough investigations of all tree species have not been performed, it appears as though some other North American and Japanese Acers (or Maples) that are grown as garden trees and shrubs can produce the toxin; *however Acer Campestre or the &#8220;Field Maple&#8221; which is common in hedgerows does not appear to produce the toxin*."


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## Equi (9 April 2015)

Well we're all screwed really. Like I say I've had horses here for 15 years and never had an issue.


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## Gift Horse (9 April 2015)

Thanks Fuzzy Furry that's helpful/ interesting.


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## Gift Horse (9 April 2015)

Thanks Fuzzy Furry that's helpful/ interesting.


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## Gift Horse (9 April 2015)

So helpful, I thanked you twice! Sorry on the train rubbish signal.


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## Tiddlypom (9 April 2015)

I hand sprayed part of my land with Headland Relay last year, primarily to rid it of clover, plantains and buttercups. It seemed to take out our field maple seedlings too. Much more economical and effective than Grazon 90, which I had used before.

http://www.progreen.co.uk/Weed-Kill...or-Paddocks/Headland-Relay-P-5LT/prod_25.html

Worth a try? The keys (whether sycamore or field maple, or other acer), seem to be able to travel a hell of a distance. They fetched up in my arena, which is well away from any field maple trees.


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## Equi (9 April 2015)

How much land did it do? I've got just over an acre but the pesky things are all over my yard too in the cracks of the paths etc. I don't know if there is more this year or if I've only just noticed them now .... I've definitely see them before though.


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## Tiddlypom (9 April 2015)

equi said:



			How much land did it do?
		
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5 litres covers 2.5 acres. Its approved for knapsack use, at :-

_Example Knapsack Dilution for Grassland - use 25ml Relay-p in 1lt of water to cover 50m2_

It's not officially approved for removal of acer seedlings, but it removed mine.


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## debsflo (9 April 2015)

Gift Horse said:



			Field maples and Sycamores are both acers (maple family) so to my thinking they could both produce these toxic seeds. 
I am spending 30mins to an hour each  evening pulling them up by hand to reduce the risk - I am no expert on trees or toxins though.
		
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same here ,hand picking every night a different patch


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## Ali27 (9 April 2015)

Calling atypical myopathy, sycamore poisoning is so misleading. We had a youngster with atypical myopathy last Oct and no sycamores in sight however there was a silver maple in paddock. Apparently any tree in the Acer family is a risk.


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## Equi (9 April 2015)

It must be something to do with the horses too. I know someone who had one horse go down with it the rest of the herd were fine.


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## charlie76 (9 April 2015)

I've now resorted to halving my paddock and grazing the furthest point away from the trees. I've still picked out the odd one or two but not tonnes like there was ( not so many now I've spent three hours picking them! ) in the side nearest to them. Its also easier to scan three acres rather than seven! I will continue to pick them and then mow once they are all through. I'm really annoyed as the paddock that was ' safe' last year with none in seems to have loads this year. 
Bloody things!


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## hairycob (9 April 2015)

I get sycamore seeds in one end of my paddocks even though we are 1/4 mile from the nearest tree.  They are designed to be spread by the wind. Recent tests in Holland found no hypoglycin a in field maple.


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## Ali27 (9 April 2015)

hairycob said:



			I get sycamore seeds in one end of my paddocks even though we are 1/4 mile from the nearest tree.  They are designed to be spread by the wind. Recent tests in Holland found no hypoglycin a in field maple.
		
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We have no sycamores anywhere in the area. The only seeds in the field were from the silver maple tree which had black tar spots on the leaves.


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## charlie76 (9 April 2015)

Now I'm even more confused as I think a lot of our seedlings are ash and not sycamore. Are ash seedlings and seeds poisonous??


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## charliecrisps (10 April 2015)

These seedlings look very similar. You need to identify the tree. This will be easier when the leaves are back on,. I tape off the area and then cut and collect. I tried various sprays last year and nothing seemed to work!


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## Dizzleton (10 April 2015)

Thanks all, I'll have to try and identify the tree when it's got some leaves on again. Luckily the tree borders the drive of a garden centre owner, so he should be able to help!


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## nicelittle (10 April 2015)

We've been paying our children 1p per seedling to pull them up! Borrow some local children if you don't have your own perhaps?!
They've pulled 100s already!


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