# Arthritis - not comfortable on bute - any suggestions?



## Crazydancer (23 December 2017)

My 25 yr old has an old stifle injury we think is causing him some arthritic pain. Vet has been, as has physio, and he is on a sachet of bute a day. Vet said for an older horse already only in light work she didn't think a full lameness work-up was warranted. Plus his hind legs have an exclusion on the insurance due to the old stifle injury, so any costs would have to be covered, which I would do if it was felt to be needed. She said that to keep him on a low dose of bute was perfectly acceptable management at his age, which I agreed with. 

However he doesn't seem happy. It's tricky to know if he's lame as the only sign we had was his saddle slipping slightly to one side, and he's now not being ridden, it's not easy to see if he is unlevel. But I've had him for 24 yrs and all I feel is that he's not happy, not himself. He seems a bit grumpy, and unwilling, and that's not like him. 

He's looking well in himself and his coat, he had been on glucosimine but that's finished and I won't bother with any more as I don't think it made any difference. 

Are there any other medications or supplements than anyone can recommend? I know the evidence for Turmeric is anecdotal, but thinking of trying that as it's cheap, easy and can't do any harm..... Anything else to consider? 

Thanks!


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## tda (23 December 2017)

Turmeric worked well on our old dales gelding, however although he looked well, it was not long before we made the call.  Sorry probably not what you want to hear xx


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## SEL (23 December 2017)

You can feed more danilon than just 1 sachet. My arthritic horse got spooked by fireworks last weekend and the resulting gallop left him very sore this week. He's been on 2 sachets a day and is only just beginning to cheer up.

Boswellia is also something I've found pretty good.


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## Pearlsasinger (23 December 2017)

Have you tried magnetic boots/wraps?  They can work well for some horses but not for others.    I'd be tempted to increase the bute until he is comfortable and then decrease as far as possible.  I am all for quality of life over quantity.


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## splashgirl45 (23 December 2017)

if he is not comfortable you need to up the bute for a coupleof days to see if that helps.  if not i would call it a day as he is old and sounds like his quality of life is not good.  quality of life is the most important thing IMO....


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## Crazydancer (23 December 2017)

Thanks guys, he seems to have good days and bad, with the bad when the weather is damp which stacks up with arthritis. Don't get me wrong, he's not miserable, if I thought his quality of life was poor I would make the decision, I always promised him I owed him that much. He's not even noticeably lame, or even unlevel, anyone who didn't know him wouldn't notice, but I do. 
I will give the turmeric a try, and check out boswellia, I have had that suggested before. Magnetic wraps I don't think are an option, he lives out and I wouldn't want to leave them on in the field. 
In the short term we will increase his bute, thanks.  

tda - how much turmeric were you feeding and how long before you saw a result? I've checked on the FB group page and it seems there is no specific amount, they said try and see if it works and if not increase the amount. All seems a bit vague..... were you feeding straight turmeric or using golden paste? Thanks.


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## AdorableAlice (23 December 2017)

Maybe speak to your vet about upping the dose of bute.  My old horses have had 2 a day and more in advanced old age to keep them happy and mobile.


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## Crazydancer (23 December 2017)

Thanks AA I will. He's not a strapping big chap, only a little 14.2 PBA, but he had been on 2 a day when we started off. I'll pop him back on that and speak to the vet again after the holidays.


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## Boulty (24 December 2017)

I'd agree with discussing about increasing his dose when he's going through an unhappy patch and then trying to reduce it when he's happier.  Even if he ends up on a higher dose than is maybe ideal for long term use if he's retired and you're only using it to make sure he's as comfortable as he can be then I wouldn't worry about potential side effects for the minute as long as he isn't showing signs of any.  Re Tumeric & Boswelia they seem to work for some and not for others.  I've got mine who can sometimes be a bit unlevel behind but isn't lame and isn't unwilling on boswelia and it does seem to have helped him move a bit freer


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## ester (24 December 2017)

I use boswellia but it doesnt touch things like Bute does so I wouldnt have much hope for it is he is already struggling on Bute.

Given that it is potentially one specific joint rather than all over is it possible to stick some steroid in it?


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## tda (24 December 2017)

Crazydancer, I started off with the lot, turmeric, oil, pepper, soon sacked that faff and he just had tablespoon of turmeric and a glug  of oil.  With him I saw it helped within the week.  Others I've tried it with Not as noticeable

14.2hh dales.


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## meleeka (24 December 2017)

Is he well rugged? My old girl is much better if she has a thicker rug than Id think was necessary. Shes a bit odd as shes also much better if she comes in with legs bandaged at night.


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## Crazydancer (24 December 2017)

Thanks again everyone. 
Ester you were kind enough to reply on a previous thread when he dropped weight, I am very happy to report he's looking fabulous now weight-wise, and a real gleam to his coat where the rug sits and polishes it!! His teeth have been done and he did need a bit of work, so that has also helped. You were one who suggested Boswellia. From what Boulty said it may be worth a try if some do respond well to it and I will have a chat with the vet about a steroid injection.  
Meleeka yes he's rugged, except if it is mild, we try and give him a break whenever possible as he doesn't like wearing one. He's not clipped and grows a good coat, and has been fine in 100g, with a 200g when it's been especially cold or nasty. He actually does get too warm if he is over-rugged, and he lives out and much prefers that. When I started keeping him out 24/7 several years back he seemed so much more chilled, it suits him. 
Tda - thanks for that, really helpful. He is a bit sniffy if there is something in his feed he's not sure about so I am starting tomorrow with a  teaspoon and will work up from there!! I have bought a cheap pepper grinder, but I do recall reading something (and this did seem to be a properly written medical report) that a horses digestion did not require the piperene that the human system did, but on the basis that it's advised, I'll try it. He has micronised linseed already so don't need to worry about the oil side. 
Thank you all again, it's really helpful having sounding boards out there, this boy means the world to me, I hate to think he's not 100% happy.


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## sjp1 (26 December 2017)

Turmeric!!  In the Golden Paste version on facebook.  Has helped mine LOADS in a very short time.  Mine is also on Boswellia but it was the Turmeric Golden Paste receipe that has helped more - still on Boswellia as well.


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## limestonelil (26 December 2017)

My lovely Sultan responded very well to Devils Claw which greatly helped with his mobility. Welsh x Arab. (My own arthritis has been considerably worse in the past two weeks, I feel sure that the damp grey weather doesn't help.)


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## ILuvCowparsely (26 December 2017)

Crazydancer said:



			My 25 yr old has an old stifle injury we think is causing him some arthritic pain. Vet has been, as has physio, and he is on a sachet of bute a day. Vet said for an older horse already only in light work she didn't think a full lameness work-up was warranted. Plus his hind legs have an exclusion on the insurance due to the old stifle injury, so any costs would have to be covered, which I would do if it was felt to be needed. She said that to keep him on a low dose of bute was perfectly acceptable management at his age, which I agreed with. 

However he doesn't seem happy. It's tricky to know if he's lame as the only sign we had was his saddle slipping slightly to one side, and he's now not being ridden, it's not easy to see if he is unlevel. But I've had him for 24 yrs and all I feel is that he's not happy, not himself. He seems a bit grumpy, and unwilling, and that's not like him. 

He's looking well in himself and his coat, he had been on glucosimine but that's finished and I won't bother with any more as I don't think it made any difference. 

Are there any other medications or supplements than anyone can recommend? I know the evidence for Turmeric is anecdotal, but thinking of trying that as it's cheap, easy and can't do any harm..... Anything else to consider? 

Thanks!
		
Click to expand...

I always swear by Equimins Flexi Joint   as we had 6 horses/pony improve 89% on it and one dog and they offer a money back guarantee - should it not work.   My mare was told to be on bute the rest of her life but ended coming off bute totally when on Flexi Joint. 



Tumeric I bought once but could not be bothered to mix oil and pepper corns to it.

Though that said a  livery checked with Equine America and this is ready prepared so may try this in the future  as ready to use and no need to ad oil    https://equi-box.co.uk/equine-america-turmeric-3kg.html


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## Britestar (27 December 2017)

You could try adding green lipped muscle to the feed. I get it straight from gold label products.
Not an immediate difference but after week or so it kicks in.


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## Scarlett (28 December 2017)

I would absolutely 100% recommend Animalife Vetroflex. We have an arthritic 19yo. At 15 we were lessening his workload and at 16 he was doing very little though semi retirement didnt suit him. Bute didnt really help him, he was still unlevel, but we swapped him to Animalife Vetroflex Intense in May this year and he is back jumping and is able to buck again. He's off out competing this weekend with his 15yo sharer, just 70/80cm, and is doing incredibly well. We did 3/4 months on Vetrofen Intense and now he is maintained on Vetrofen Healthy which is only £30 a month.


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