# So your mare's not in foal... What now?



## AndyPandy (5 September 2008)

I know a lot of people have had a bad season (as happens every year 
	
	
		
		
	


	




) and still have an empty mare despite lots of trying to get her pregnant, so I thought I'd post this little guide about what you should be thinking about and doing if you want to try again next year... Hope it helps!

*My mare didn't get in foal this season... what now?*

So youve tried and failed to get your mare in foal this year. Youve had repeated cycles, and for whatever reason shes not in foal. Dont get too downhearted! Read the following points and check if you have covered all these areas  if not, then youve probably got a good chance of getting her in foal next season; but youll have to make some changes!

*1. Get a reproductive soundness examination*

Has your mare been properly assessed for her breeding soundness? If not (or if any of the examinations listed below have not been performed), then we would recommend that you get a full soundness examination done before you start next breeding season. It really is a false economy not to.

Conformation  perineal conformation, to make sure the mares vulva forms a tight seal, and does not allow air inside (pneumovagina), and does not become contaminated with faecal matter; these mares will probably need to be stitched up after breeding (Caslicks procedure).

Vaginal inspection  to check for abnormalities, and to visually and digitally inspect the cervix

Ultrasound  cysts, and any other abnormalities of the uterus should be mapped before breeding, as well as a general examination of the ovaries, and any follicular activity

Cytology &amp; Culture  to check for infection (bacterial or fungal). Many AI centres, vets and studs offer a culture service, but do not perform cytology. One without the other is virtually worthless, as contamination of the culture swab can give a false positive, or infection can be missed by culture alone.

Biopsy  the biopsy consists of taking a small amount of tissue from the uterus (which is entirely painless for the mare), and having it assessed for signs of infection, damage, and/or age related changes. The biopsy will be graded I, IIa, IIb or III  with I being the healthiest, and III showing the mare has less than a 10% chance of carrying a pregnancy to term. There are plenty of treatment options for grades IIb &amp; III.

*2. How old is she?*

If your mare is over 12 years old, did she have any problems with fluid in the uterus after covering? Was she treated correctly? Mares with delayed uterine clearance (DUC) require aggressive treatment with ecbolics (which make the uterus contract, to help expel fluid) like oxytocin or cabetocin. Injections every 6-12 hours are required in many instances (and even more regularly with some mares). Even if your mare has no known history of DUC, then she should probably be given precautionary oxytocin therapy.
Old maiden mares need additional treatment.

*3. Is the stallion you are using fertile?*

Does the stallion have proven fertility using fresh, chilled and/or frozen semen? Look for per cycle pregnancy rates, which will give you an indicator of how fertile the stallion is. Average for fresh should be 70-90% per cycle, for chilled should be 50-65% per cycle, and for frozen 30-60% per cycle. If the pregnancy rates are quoted overall for the season, ask the stud how many cycles it has taken each mare to get pregnant. If the stallion has poor fertility, or the staff sending out chilled or frozen semen are inexperienced, then your chances of success are greatly reduced! Make sure the semen is checked thoroughly prior to insemination.

*4. Is the vet, stud or AI centre doing a good enough job?*

Poor timing, poor preparation, poor insemination, and poor post-breeding management can all be causes of a failed pregnancy. Make sure youve done your research, and are using an experienced vet, stud or AI centre. Get personal recommendations, or go by experience. Dont just go by the fact that they are self-proclaimed specialists, or have a certificate on the wall. Published pregnancy rates are also a useful indicator, but again look for per cycle" pregnancy rates, not overall percentages  99% pregnancy rate is absolutely meaningless!

If youre performing the procedure yourself, make sure you brush up on your techniques. Simple errors can cause drastic reductions in pregnancy rates.

*5. Consider all the potential issues, including stallion-mare incompatibility*

It is possible that there is some underlying problem which has been missed.

Repeated failures could be due to:

- Anestrus (lactational/true/behavioural)
- Chromosomal abnormalities
- Nymphomania
- Delayed uterine clearance
- Endometritis (infectious/non-infectious)
- Urovagina
- Pneumouterus
- Cervical abnormalities
- Ovarian tumours
- Uterine fibrosis
- Endometrial cysts
- Uterine sacculations
- Blocked oviducts
- Hormonal issues
- Reduced immune response
- Stallion-mare incompatibility

Many of these can be checked out for during a breeding soundness examination.

There is currently no known test for stallion-mare incompatibility. Essentially, it is believed that some mares have anti-sperm antibodies which are specific to a particular stallion (or group of stallions), and that they are therefore unable to conceive when inseminated with semen from particular stallions. It is very rare, and people often jump to this conclusion when they have not explored the other options. However, if youve ruled out everything else, and change stallions and the mare suddenly gets pregnant, then you can be fairly sure that stallion-mare incompatibility is the cause of repeated failures.

If youve had a bad season this year, dont feel too downhearted. There are plenty of reasons why the mare might not have become pregnant, and hopefully if you follow this brief guide, you will have a more successful season next year!

(there's a slightly more printer friendly version here)


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## AndyPandy (5 September 2008)

Are you guys finding this helpful/useful?

Any feedback would be very much appreciated


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## CrazyMare (5 September 2008)

Its not applicable to me THIS year, as we didn't try however yes it is, as next year may be our first venture into AI.


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## argyle (5 September 2008)

Thanks AP, thankfully our final mare scanned in foal this week but this has given me some food for thought.  I had one that we didn't manage to get in foal last year, she was only 3 1/2 so i thought perhaps she just wasn't ready.  We backed her and she has done incredibly well under saddle, so much so that we were mde a very good offer for her but had things been different I would have been looking to increase my chances of getting her in foal at a later date.


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## cloppy (5 September 2008)

thanks for that although i now feel so much can go wrong my mare will never get in foal.  No seriously thats a big help many thanks


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## Keltic (5 September 2008)

Thanks AP thats very useful, it gives me a few extra things to discuss with my vet that I had not considered yesterday. 
Can we perhaps get admin to make this one a sticky as I know i will want to refer back to it... (alot!!)


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## Three (5 September 2008)

Thanks AP - really useful. I'm not sure yet if I need your list - we're still trying.....  
	
	
		
		
	


	





However, a question if you don't mind?

Is there any evidence that having a yearling (rather than a foal) at foot prevents pregnancy?

I'm another one voting for a sticky please admin. I refer to this sort of post (like breeding myths) time and time again.


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## Fleur100 (5 September 2008)

Your posts are always informative, useful &amp; timely.

I am fortunate not to have been in this situation my NF &amp; TB mares seem to catch very easily....


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## firm (6 September 2008)

Last year I had  an older mare - 5 attempts not in foal - follicles would only get to 28.  Good repro vet recommended a course of Regumate but I had had enough so chucked her out in the field all winter, ran her through a couple of cycles this year, then took her to the AI centre, inseminated on a 35 follicle &amp; hurrah she is in foal first time 
	
	
		
		
	


	




    So I do totally agree with AP but occasionally who knows what has happened and maybe next year will be better 
	
	
		
		
	


	




   But I would still follow APs advice, thanks AP


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## luckilotti (6 September 2008)

Thanks thats really useful - i agree with the others, this needs to be a sticky for future ref next season


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## htobago (7 September 2008)

I agree - please could this be a sticky? It would be so helpful to have it up there as a reference for everyone, so AP doesn't have to keep answering the same questions all the time!


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## Moggy in Manolos (7 September 2008)

It was really good to read to be honest AP, only just seen it
i tried to breed from my mare this year after about a 9year gap, unfortunately she had delayed uterine clearance and had to be flushed and had oxytocin injections, it was all very traumatic for me and her, though i think she was less affected, i had been lucky and she had 6 easy foals from mating to birth, i think its just her age
i was so gutted at first but have now got over it, due to her age i dont think i would try again next year, i certainly would not let her run out with a stallion, if she were younger i would try again, but she will be 19 next year and given what happened i very much doubt we will try again, i will just buy a youngster to bring on
but reading your post has been really informative and appreciated


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## joy (2 October 2008)

Just posted Fluid in Uterus.
Basically what do I need to do for next year?
Help appreciated.


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## AndyPandy (2 October 2008)

Replied to your post - also feel free to e-mail lab@equinereproduction.co.uk


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## joy (2 October 2008)

Thank you.  Very useful


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## Nesslw (6 November 2008)

If all fails ......RIP ......old girl!!!  Sorry but true


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## CILLA (1 July 2009)

My mare has just been AI'd for the third time, she is termed DUC our vet has struggled with her this time again she is a highly thought of AI vet and my thought are is this always going to be a problem and do we give up , the cost is mounting and i have a life foal guarantee would it be best to use the semen next year on another mare. Will this always be her problem she is 11yr maiden comes into season like clockwork, big follicles etc. Used excellent chilled semen. Thoughts please.


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## sallyf (1 July 2009)

One of the things that heps delayed uterine clearance is for the mare to keep moving.
We have had a couple of extra bad mares this year and as well as all the other treatments we have lunged the mare for short vigarous sessions after each oxytocin or reprocine jab .
Mind we have also teased these mares hard with the teaser stallion as well as all the extra stimulation helps.
Both mares have scanned in foal
Other possible things that help are steroid injection if the mare is a suitable candidate and plasma taken from the mare and infused into the uterus.
Sometimes you need the vet to think outside the box a little.


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## CILLA (1 July 2009)

She was kept outside with others but cannot be lunged due to an injury . How does the steroid injection help ?


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## sallyf (1 July 2009)

steroid injections reduce the imflammation that causes the mare to produce fluid but not all mares are suitable candidates as there is a tiny risk of laminitis in a susceptable mare.
A couple of the mares here have old injuries and are lame but have been fine for just for 5 minutes on a soft surface .
Obviously if she has a new tendon injury or something you cant but it really does work.


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## CILLA (1 July 2009)

I have heard others say lunging works but she had a collateral ligament injury a year ago now and some days sound others not especially with the hard ground at the mo. i will discuss steroid injections though with my vet as she has never had laminitis .
Spoke to the vet yesterday when collected her and said the fluid was worse this time  than the previous two would this suggest the inflammation was already present ? It is hard to decide what to do if she was not such a super mare in all ways (Nimmerdor and Guidam line ) i would not have this dilema .


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## sallyf (1 July 2009)

Another thing to think about have the vets done cervical swabs and smears to see if the fluid is infected or sterile.
We also do a saline flush and then try and culture some of what come back into the bag to see if there is any nasties going on.
Its no good just treating the symptoms you have to try and get to the bottom of what the cause is.
It is really difficult to predict what will work with differant mares but you need all the information really to try and piece together a solution.
We are incredibly lucky as have Rossdales as our vets so they are completely on the ball with everything and anything tricky we just try and work out a plan for that particular mare but you do need as much information as possible.


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## CILLA (1 July 2009)

I agree unless we get to the bottom of what the cause is all the oxytocin and other drugs are futile because we would not be on our third attempt. Thanks so much for all the good advice i may be trekking her down to you for Rossdales to see if they can bottom it !


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## CILLA (3 July 2009)

Another question for u AP. I have been reading and speaking to others who have experienced the same probs and one thing which has been suggested is to use fresh semen as opposed to chilled. I could do this as the stallion is standing about two hours away and then bring her back again. In your experience is this advantageous.


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## merlyn26 (6 August 2009)

very informative - but one suggestion - people should also ask themselves if their mare is overweight - obesity is a big problem - especially in show horses and overweight mares have a reduced chance of getting in foal - so if your mare didnt hold this year, maybe also think about a bit of dieting before next spring - you'd be amazed!


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## dom09 (9 September 2009)

We tried last year to get our mare in foal, tried 4 times at considerable cost. She'd had all the usual vet checks etc so at the end of the year we gave up and sent her to Twemlows stud to be an embryo transfer mare. They found a massive infection in her fallopian tube caused by strangles, so flushed her out with antibiotics and now she is pregnant with her first foal.


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## Alec Swan (20 October 2009)

That was well reasoned and well argued.  The NFFR agreement is another contributing factor to the disappointment.  The huge costs to mare owners, keep, traveling, vets etc.,  in the event of an empty mare,  lays an unfair burden on the mare owner.

I have attempted to use a 25 year old TB stallion over the last 2 years, on 2 seperate and known breeding mares,  and the costs to date have totaled about £5k,  with both mares returning from stud empty.

I checked the stallions published fertility rates with Sports Horse GB, and was told that the figure was 65%.  This is all very well,  but Covering Certificates are not issued to those mares which fail to conceive.  This makes a complete nonsense of the figures,  and actually only relates to any mares ability to hang on to an embryo.

The question of semen motility,  is often discussed.  The vital,  and often forgotten aspect is the question of FORWARD MOTILITY.  Semen which,  under the microscope fails to travel in a forward direction,  or travels in circles,  can actually prevent the viable sperm from reaching its destination,  so often a problem with elderly stallions.

There are many contributing factors which will affect a mares ability to conceive.  That I accept,  BUT there are many,  far too many,  studs which are understaffed,  when we view the fact that they may well have 6 or 8 elderly stallions,  and herds of mares,  running into 3 figures.  

I would strongly recommend that when mare owners are planning to send their mares away to stud,  that if they don't actually visit the premesis,  then they look at the arial photos on Google Earth,  and if horses appear as flocks of sheep,  then give it very serious thought,  or choose a stud which offers the deal of NFNF.


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## shirleyno2 (20 October 2009)

[ QUOTE ]
I have attempted to use a 25 year old TB stallion over the last 2 years, on 2 seperate and known breeding mares,  and the costs to date have totaled about £5k,  with both mares returning from stud empty.

I checked the stallions published fertility rates with Sports Horse GB, and was told that the figure was 65%.  This is all very well,  but Covering Certificates are not issued to those mares which fail to conceive.  This makes a complete nonsense of the figures,  and actually only relates to any mares ability to hang on to an embryo.



  and if horses appear as flocks of sheep,  then give it very serious thought. 

[/ QUOTE ]

Is this stallion in the UK?

How many horses per acre do you think before they are sheep?


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## Alec Swan (21 October 2009)

ssjez,  yes he is,  along with others from a very well known stud.  You may have worked out for yourself,  that I'm no longer as gullible as I was !!


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## Alec Swan (21 October 2009)

ssjez,  having looked at your last question again I've just realised that I din't answer the second part.

I also keep 400 ewes,  and we generally reckon that 2 ewes to the acre is about right.  This does,  however,  depend on so many different factors,  jusy as it would with horses.  

The operative word is "keep".  We are still struggling to find grass for our mares and youngsters.  We haven't had any significant rain since May,  and we are now in a serious drought.  We're feeding our horses,  when under normal conditions,  we probably wouldn't until,  perhaps,  the end of November.

When do horses appear as flocks of sheep?  Don't know really,  probably when there are too many for the given acerage to support.


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## eventrider23 (21 October 2009)

This horses/sheep theory puzzles me....is having 'flocks' of horses a good sign or a bad sign???  For example, in Europe, at say PSI, they have dozens of stallions represented and god knows how many mares.  If having horses in flock numbers is a bad thing, does that mean people should not use the likes of PS or Z or any of the large scale European studs because of this?????

In the case of your personal experience, does the stud name begin with L?


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## Alec Swan (22 October 2009)

Eventrider23,

your first paragraph,  certainly not!  But then I honestly don't know the answer.  We are fortunate,  in that we have 1000 acres of grass at our disposal,  but there is no question,  in my mind,  that when any form of livestock are kept under cramped conditions,  then the daily maintenance of the individual animal,  is going to be just that much more difficult,  and detailed.  With horses we accept the situation,  but not with sheep!

Paragraph 2?  I coudn't possibly comment !


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## fitzaud2 (1 December 2009)

Hi AndyPandy,

This might sound crazy to you as it is not scientifically based, but my father in law has had stallions, has been breeding for 40 years, and has about 30 mares.  Crazy trying to keep track of all of them but he writes everything into a diary.  

Anyway, what he has always said, is that mares are more fertile when the weather is good, and i've seen first hand, on a particular month, if it has been raining all month, most of the mares don't go in foal, but if it's sunny, the mares go in foal first time. 

Do you think it has any logic, or is it just coindcedence.


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## 4faults (13 March 2010)

Hi this is my first post so sorry if it isnt done right, I am a bit of a technophobe! I have a mare that I am putting in foal for the first time this year, a lot of planning has gone into it as she was my competition horse who suffered an injury in July last year, with time spent trying to fix her and then accepting that she was done in her career it was too late to breed from her last year. 
So i have in place the stallion, yard, vet etc but I am just wondering what is too early to put her in because as you can imagine I am chomping at the bit haha. I have had foals before but never AI I have done quite a bit of breeding of Welshies and am eagerly awaiting the birth of a much anticipated Section D foal this year so im just generally wondering about the whole AI process. Very sorry to waffle on but everyone seems very knowledgeable here. Thanks!


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## Brenjack (12 April 2010)

Hi 4faults - I would move this post further down so you create your own post as it might get missed on this bit.


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## ruby1 (24 June 2010)

Mare went for 16 day scan and not in foal,we assumed she would then come back into season 5 or so days later but after 17 days now she is still out,does this happen normally.


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