# New restrictions and hunting.....



## L&M (16 October 2020)

Just curious to see what packs are doing within the new 'tier' system in England, especially the ones in the highest risk category?

We hunt in Wales, where we have a proposed 'circuit break', but not holding out much hope for advice from the MFHA considering the Hunting Office website has not been updated since the 14th Sept.....


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## SOS (17 October 2020)

I imagine it will completely depend on whether organised outdoor activity is allowed in the tiers or not. I haven’t seen any guidance on this but it must be somewhere.

Will be an awful shame if the whole season is cancelled with hounds and horses finally getting fit and everyone working so hard to make it happy. Repeated breaks will also make it hard to keep the former fit... who knows!


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## Tiddlypom (17 October 2020)

It’s going to be especially interesting keeping within the guidelines for those packs who straddle areas with different Covid restrictions. 

The neighbouring pack to mine kennels their hounds in Wales, but a substantial part of their country and many of their meets are in a (currently) tier 2 part of England.

As of yesterday, no one from tiers 2 or 3 in England is allowed into Wales unless for defined criteria, which does not include adults playing sport. What happens when hounds cross from England to Wales or vice versa?

Also, crossing locked down county borders within Wales is banned except for limited purposes.


Better keep strictly to those trails, eh.


Hmmm.


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## L&M (17 October 2020)

Yes will be very interesting, especially in Wales - our neighbouring pack kennel in Shropshire (medium risk), but do also hunt in Powys (Wales, who are about to have a 2-3 week lockdown/travel restrictions), so imagine they will stick to Shropshire meets. But both MFH live in Powys to add to the complications.

I just hope packs adhere to any restrictions, whether in the 'very high risk' tiers, or if under 'lock down - we cannot afford anymore bad publicity atm......and the anti's would have a field day.


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## ester (17 October 2020)

Tiddlypom said:



			It’s going to be especially interesting keeping within the guidelines for those packs who straddle areas with different Covid restrictions.

The neighbouring pack to mine kennels their hounds in Wales, but a substantial part of their country and many of their meets are in a (currently) tier 2 part of England.

As of yesterday, no one from tiers 2 or 3 in England is allowed into Wales unless for defined criteria, which does not include adults playing sport. What happens when hounds cross from England to Wales or vice versa?

Also, crossing locked down county borders within Wales is banned except for limited purposes.


Better keep strictly to those trails, eh.


Hmmm.
		
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hounds can cross, you're just not allowed to go with them so wait for them to come back


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## spacefaer (17 October 2020)

L&M said:



			We hunt in Wales, where we have a proposed 'circuit break', but not holding out much hope for advice from the MFHA considering the Hunting Office website has not been updated since the 14th Sept.....
		
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The MFHA/Hunting Office have sent out guidance to officials  (ie masters,  Secretaries etc) on every change of Govt policy, before and since 14th September. This info has been disseminated amongst the supporters as necessary but I do agree,  they could also have updated their website!


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## Rowreach (17 October 2020)

Our local pack straddles an international border  and they have beggar all control over their hounds at the best of times.


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## Amymay (17 October 2020)

I’m expecting the ‘circuit breaker’ to be pretty extensive lockdown, so can’t imagine there will be any sort of hunting going on whilst that’s in place.


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## Shay (17 October 2020)

Except right now that isn't in place....

We can only respond to the rules as they are.  The Hunting Office has actually been really quick in responding to support packs - but less so in updating their  website.    TBH - I can forgive them that!


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## L&M (17 October 2020)

Shay said:



			Except right now that isn't in place....

We can only respond to the rules as they are.  The Hunting Office has actually been really quick in responding to support packs - but less so in updating their  website.    TBH - I can forgive them that!
		
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But may well be in wales from next week.....


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## palo1 (18 October 2020)

ester said:



			hounds can cross, you're just not allowed to go with them so wait for them to come back 

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Mmm well yes but trail layers can't cross (unless you can have some on the English side and some on the Welsh...). It is certainly going to be interesting. I just hope that we can keep going and maintain the support of those around us. So far so good but as well as knowing, understanding and following the guidelines tact and diplomacy will be needed.


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## Tiddlypom (18 October 2020)

Wrt the Welsh/English border straddling pack that I referred to above, I hadn‘t realised that the kennels are situated in a Welsh county which is already (since Oct 1) subject to a fairly strict local lockdown. English members of the field should definitely not cross from their tier 2 area into Wales, but it’s also marginal at best as to whether the Welsh residing subscribers should leave their ‘locked down’ county to travel into England.

Local Welsh lockdown rules applicable to the above mentioned border straddling pack.
_
You can leave the area if you have a “reasonable excuse” to do so – this includes going to work where you cannot work from home, or using public services that are not available locally. It also includes leaving your local area to visit family or close friends on compassionate grounds if necessary.

But the basic message is that we want people to stay in the area as much as possible. *You do not have a reasonable excuse to leave the area to do something if you could be reasonably expected to be able to do it within the area. This also works the other way around. Those living outside the area should not enter it if at all possible.*_

According to the antis, they were out cubbing yesterday in the border area, saying that they could cross the border as they were ‘working’, though I do not know how accurate that report was.


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## L&M (19 October 2020)

Welsh gov 'fire break' states no outside gatherings or organised activities, thats' hunting scuppered for the next 3 weeks then.

Oh well, for the greater good and all that and at least they have made it clear.....keep safe all.


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## L&M (20 October 2020)

Just had a random text for the Hunting Office, with an update on hunting in Wales during the 'fire break' (or 'not hunting' as expected).

But how weird - I am not on any hunt commitee and just a subscriber.......do you think they read my post lol?!

The powers of this forum......!


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## Julie Ole Girl (26 October 2020)

In Wales, all I know is I can't go and buy a new bit for hunting, but I can get plenty of wine instead.......


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## L&M (26 October 2020)

There is always a silver lining......!


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## Parrotperson (30 October 2020)

our local hunt is having "opening meet" tomorrow but with more than 30 people and two covid Marshalls who are supposed to keep it all safe. Not sure its within the rules though. Can't see anything online from the Hunting Office about it.


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## Tiddlypom (30 October 2020)

From the hunting office‘s most recent update:- 

https://thehuntingoffice.org.uk/covid


It starts off promisingly, then there a load of waffle about the risks being low even with larger numbers of participants. So is the rule of 30 max in any area going to be adhered to or not? If not, how is hunting going to justify that?

Good luck with keeping more than 1 field of 30 completely separate from another over a whole day.

_*Numbers in attendance is stipulated by the current Government guidance on numbers meeting outside,* however we remain confident that due to the very nature of hunting activities (their occurrence outdoors in rural open spaces and the continuous movement of followers across an open piece of country) the risks are significantly low even with larger numbers of participants.

In line with the Government advice for Providers of grassroots leisure activities, and the Government advice on Staying alert and safe, the Hunting Office has issued guidance to hunts regarding organising activities for larger groups of people. _*Hunting activities for larger groups will be organised in accordance with the Covid-19 Secure Guidance which will include the completion of a risk assessment, and all reasonable steps will be taken to mitigate the risk of transmission.*


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## Goldenstar (30 October 2020)

We have to book in to hunt before five the day before .
It’s subscribers only .
Our field won’t be over thirty and we keep in groups I have been closer than two metres from someone when Fatty was being naughty but only for a few seconds it’s easier than I thought it would be .I hunt with an anti viral snood round my neck atm so if I had to get off and help someone it’s there and I have a small sanitiser with me 
cant do much more than that .
I think it’s likely we will get stopped at some point as a English lockdown sadly looks likely .
The country is facing economic disaster I might as well try to have fun while it’s possible .


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## ester (30 October 2020)

There's more than 30 hound exercising here in recent weeks. (pre booked only)


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## emilylou (30 October 2020)

We are only allowed if we book in advance, if you turn up without booking you are turned away and they are keeping it to 30 max.


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## Fred66 (30 October 2020)

Parrotperson said:



			our local hunt is having "opening meet" tomorrow but with more than 30 people and two covid Marshalls who are supposed to keep it all safe. Not sure its within the rules though. Can't see anything online from the Hunting Office about it.
		
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Just checked the government website. So in England outdoor activity that is organised under a ruling body is allowed subject to it following their guidance. There is no restriction on numbers. Depending what Tier you’re in would then determine how the field can interact. ie you could ride closely with members of your own household but should maintain a larger distance from others


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## Tiddlypom (30 October 2020)

Fred66 said:



			So in England outdoor activity that is organised under a ruling body is allowed subject to it following their guidance. There is no restriction on numbers
		
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Please can you give a link to that.

ETA I can see this, which applies to tier 1 areas in England.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publi...-on-the-phased-return-of-sport-and-recreation



*Large gatherings*
_See team sport guidance._

_People should continue to socially distance from those they do not live with wherever possible. Social interactions should be limited to a group of no more than 6._

_Businesses and venues following COVID-19 Secure guidelines can host larger groups. This is also the case for events in public outdoor spaces that are organised by businesses, charitable or political organisations, and public bodies, provided they take reasonable steps to mitigate the risk of transmission, in line with COVID-19 Secure guidance and including completion of a risk assessment. Any other gathering in an outdoor space must not be any larger than 30 people._

Is a pack a business? It’s not a charitable or political organisation, or a public body.


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## ester (30 October 2020)

I get confused because the phased return of sport keeps talking about August so we are a bit past that, and the tier one guidance here just says 6 under outdoor sports and exercise. But I know the kids are still playing football matches. . . 
https://www.instituteforgovernment.org.uk/explainers/coronavirus-lockdown-rules-four-nations-uk


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## Tiddlypom (30 October 2020)

My recent text alert from the local pack re when they were in the vicinity stated:-

‘Government rules re Covid guidelines apply’

Just wondering which government rules/Covid guidelines they are following...

ETA It would be helpful if the Hunting Office gave more detailed guidance on numbers.


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## L&M (30 October 2020)

Or live in Wales and watch your hunter get fatter and hairier by the day.......if Wales get another firebreak in Jan, (assuming we are not all in National lockdown), will find it very hard to keep motivated for the rest of the season.

What a muckle.


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## Fred66 (30 October 2020)

Tiddlypom said:



			Please can you give a link to that.

ETA I can see this, which applies to tier 1 areas in England.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publi...-on-the-phased-return-of-sport-and-recreation

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Here you go:

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/local-covid-alert-level-very-high#sport-and-physical-activity


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## Goldenstar (31 October 2020)

Looks like we all will be in the same boat soon.
I will keep mine in work they are not stabled over night yet and I will try to leave them out an extra month .
Then I suppose I will have to do some decorating .


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## Tiddlypom (31 October 2020)

As above, it now looks like whether hunting is exempt or not from the current rule of 30 will be a moot point soon.

Lockdown here we come.


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## Steerpike (31 October 2020)

Our local pack think they are exempt, they had a meet next door and there was lots of people turning up, one of the masters last week said they have had more people joining them recently than in previous years and basically said if they are in groups of 6 and socially distance they can have as many as they like out.


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## Goldenstar (31 October 2020)

Fred66 said:



			Just checked the government website. So in England outdoor activity that is organised under a ruling body is allowed subject to it following their guidance. There is no restriction on numbers. Depending what Tier you’re in would then determine how the field can interact. ie you could ride closely with members of your own household but should maintain a larger distance from others
		
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This is how I understand it .
Lots of packs can restrict to 30 quite easily that’s not without financial hurt though .


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## Tiddlypom (1 November 2020)

You have posted in multiple hunting threads .

Hunting will not be permitted from Thurs Nov 5th onwards under the new stricter lockdown rules. Whether it will be able to resume at the end of that period is, as yet, unknown.

ETA Though what I posted above applies just to England. Currently no hunting in Wales during the circuit breaker lockdown.


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## HorsesRule2009 (2 November 2020)

This is such a horrible year!
I have just started as a Stud Groom with a pack in England, and niw trying to keep the hunt horses fit enough so if restrictions are lifted early December they are fit and ready to go, but this is obviously now with out them hunting twice a week 🤦🏼‍♀️☹️. 

Ps I do realised that there are far worse things happening due to covid etc. 
But as my job I need to have them ready for when/if the restrictions allow us to hopefully hunt again this season


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