# Dilemma .....



## Dougal9 (18 November 2015)

Hi

I posted on here a while ago about my riding school horse that I was/still am hoping to buy.  However, for the last few weeks I haven't been able to ride him as he had already been worked.  I have been riding another horse instead, who is a real sweetie with and with a bit more spark than the other one, we are getting on really well and I did my first jump on her yesterday which was brilliant !!  However, she is around 19 years old - is this too old for a first horse (having said that I am 54 so we are probably on a level par !!).  She is livelier, and dare I say it has a bit more about her than Dougal on the character front.  Would her age cause a problem getting insurance.....!  I am in a quandry, I didn't expect to like and get on so well with another horse other than Dougal (I have ridden others but none that I got on well with) - what am I going to do ??  My riding instructor said either of them would be good for me, so not much help really.....  Do you think the RS have done this to 'test' my commitment - having said that I've already secured a stable in a 5* yard on 7 day livery, so I am committed to having my own horse.  

I am finding it difficult to take the emotion out of it all - but then I am like that where animals are concerned (don't have the same issue with humans though - hahaha  )

Any thoughts, ideas would be very welcome here


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## Shay (18 November 2015)

You don't say what build the older horse is - but in general terms 19 isn't too old for a horse.  However you will be its last owner.  Only you know if that is an issue for you or not?

Horses - as a really rough generalization - live about 25ish years and, depending on discipline etc, remain rideable for most of that time.  The last 4 - 5 years or so, depending on other health concerns, they will be retired to a field if you can support that financially and they are the right temperament for it.  Otherwise - sadly but responsibly - PTS.  Ponies and hardy native type horses live much longer - 30+ years and stay rideable for more of it.  Bear in mind this is a really broad generalization and young horses become unrideable, old horses stay rideable for longer etc. But you are absolutely right to be thinking about what happens as they age.

You can't in practical terms get insurance for anything over 15.  You can get it, of course, but it is expensive and has so many limitations on it that it isn't really worth the money.  You need third party liability insurance which you get with things like BHS gold membership, or donations to World Horse Welfare.  but you will have to budget for your own vets fees.  Personally I put the sum aside that I would have spent on insurance and effectively self insure.  So far I'm on top - but it is a gamble.

What you don't want - I would have thought - is a young horse (as in under about 7).  You need the experienced and maturity of a schoolmaster type.  Whether you want the mare, or Dougal, or something else depends on what you want to do with them.  If you are thinking along the lines of something to start with that you expect to have fun with for a while but then sell on to get a horse the next level up then a 19yr old isn't the best choice.  By the time you want to sell on it will be 22/23+ and all but impossible to sell.   However if you are thinking more of a companion for the rest of its life and don't mind overmuch what you do with it then a 19yr old is absolutely fine (and before you panic you'll get a good 5 - 6 years if not more as long as it is sound etc.)

I know it sounds really rough and a bit mercenary - but it is also absolutely the responsible thing to think about.  These are expensive creatures and we need to consider what we are really going to do with them if / when they no longer suit.  Most of us can't afford to keep an string of oldies / outgrown ones.  (Speaks the mother of a teen still keeping many of the ponies...)


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## Meowy Catkin (18 November 2015)

You certainly can get veteran insurance, but it will be slightly different to a younger horse policy so do your research to get the best one available.  The right horse is the one that gives you confidence and is suitable for your needs, so as long as he/she is sound and healthy, age isn't everything.

Have you only ever ridden these horses in the school? If you will want to hack out once you own them, the seller/RS should let you hack them before deciding. Do bear in mind that with less work and moving to a new yard, they could be a bit more difficult than they are in the school environment at least to start with. Will you have experienced help and support once you buy the horse? It could be a good idea to book some lessons (for after the purchase date) on your new horse to help you.

So really you want to buy the one that you feel that you could deal with if things went a little bit wrong (which they often can do, eg pheasant spooks the horse), that gives you confidence both on the ground and in the saddle. Plus one that you will look forward to seeing. 

ETA - I certainly do understand why Shay has suggested going for BHS gold and not using a veteran policy. It is something to consider. Petplan's veteran policy is here. https://www.petplanequine.co.uk/insurance/insurance-veteran-plan-details.asp You can insure for accidents up to £1k, but their 3rd party cover is quite low at only £3 million, when £10 million is advised for horse owners.

BHS Gold https://www.bhs.org.uk/membership/types-of-memberships/gold-membership


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## Dougal9 (18 November 2015)

Hi

Thanks both for the comments - all very helpful.  Lily is a x breed, a bit finer than a cob.  I am hoping to have my forever horse - at my age I think that would be the most sensible option.... and I do get very attached anyway.  Dougal is 9 years old, and is I guess more bomb proof than Lily, plus I am hoping that we can grow together and we will probably also end our riding days at around the same time too (hopefully) at which point we will both retire gracefully - he will not be sold.  He never says no, even if I ask him incorrectly he will always try and do something for me   I have hacked Dougal out and he is great, I haven't hacked Lily yet - although I am told she is more excitable on a hack. I am aiming to do a bit of everything, dressage (already done on Dougal) plus SJ and XC.  The yard we will be moving to is an eventing yard.  Dougal is something that I believe I could ride even when we are both very old and grey.  I guess I've just sold myself on Dougal again - not that he was ever out of the picture.  I think I also feel a bit sorry for Lily, as no-one has enquired about her yet, and she is such a sweetie - I really must try and think more practically !!  It is difficult as I can't always ride Dougal which I can understand, I do always go and see him after my lesson though and he comes over straight away to me so I think there is a bond there already.
Thanks again, its really helped me to see things a bit more clearly


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## BethH (18 November 2015)

I'd go for Dougal myself - he is younger and will last longer - mercenary as that sounds.  Also, I know so many horses that break once their work load reduces as they have less fitness & muscle to support any weaknesses they might have, riding school horses are going to be fitter than many privately owned happy hacks & an older horse is usually likely to have more wear & tear so may need to be kept fitter than you expect.  You may find Dougal perks up once he away from a riding school environment.  From personal experience my horse has had a number of issues that have given me huge vet bills and he is very sharp & spooky, it gets boring after a while, I'd thoroughly enjoy something same enough just to hack out on my own for a couple of hours.  Don't underestimate the value of a horse with a sane head!  Good luck & maybe try a few others too just to make sure you are making the right decision.


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## wren123 (18 November 2015)

I would go for Dougal too as Beth says he is younger and will last longer. Also please please do have whatever horse you go for vetted by a recommended vet, not connected to the riding school. He will check their age and also pick up subtle signs of lameness that are easily missed. He will also check hearts and eyes etc.


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## paddi22 (18 November 2015)

dougal 100%. he sounds exactly what you want.


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## be positive (18 November 2015)

Another vote for Dougal, buying Lily because you feel sorry for her is not a good idea, she is older, livelier, may change more once she is out of the RS and will be unlikely to give you much of a future as an allrounder, I also feel sorry for her being moved on at her age when she needs to be winding down a bit and hope the RS will keep her if no one decent comes along for her.

Do get Dougal, or any horse you buy, vetted, also try him a bit more outside a lesson/ school situation you need to ensure as far as you can that he is going to be happy working independently not all RS horses will go alone they can become rather clingy to others, if you are buying him the RS should let you try without having to pay for a lesson, show you are committed by offering a deposit subject to a satisfactory vetting and being able to have at least one relatively unsupervised session where you get him tacked up, ride, untack and put him away, ideally it should be before anyone else has ridden him that day.


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## Dougal9 (18 November 2015)

Thanks again everyone - Yes I am going to have him 5* vetted by an independant vet, although as he is used for the RDA too he does get checked more often than maybe the other horses so I'm hoping there won't be anything too bad if at all, come out of it.  He is proving to be popular too, apparently there have been quite a few enquiries, luckily I got my name on him first - price agreed and all confirmed.
I guess I was just having a bit of a wobble because I haven't ridden him for a while - hormonal probably, the menopause has a lot to answer for !!


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## Dougal9 (18 November 2015)

be positive said:



			Another vote for Dougal, buying Lily because you feel sorry for her is not a good idea, she is older, livelier, may change more once she is out of the RS and will be unlikely to give you much of a future as an allrounder, I also feel sorry for her being moved on at her age when she needs to be winding down a bit and hope the RS will keep her if no one decent comes along for her.

Do get Dougal, or any horse you buy, vetted, also try him a bit more outside a lesson/ school situation you need to ensure as far as you can that he is going to be happy working independently not all RS horses will go alone they can become rather clingy to others, if you are buying him the RS should let you try without having to pay for a lesson, show you are committed by offering a deposit subject to a satisfactory vetting and being able to have at least one relatively unsupervised session where you get him tacked up, ride, untack and put him away, ideally it should be before anyone else has ridden him that day.
		
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I am having stable management lessons too and tacking/untacking every time I ride, but I always ride Dougal alone as I have private lessons.  I think he will love the 1 to 1 attention that he will get


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## Archangel (18 November 2015)

Ooh how exciting and lucky Dougal (he sounds fab).


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## Joanne_Stockport (18 November 2015)

Another vote for Dougal, It's a good thing that you are on full livery to start with as you will have a lot to learn !
Things like feeding, saddle fit, rugging(or not),farriers, teeth, recognising if your horse is not well,ground work, etc..
I bought mine 2 years ago from the riding school where I was taking private riding lessons. 
Mine was pretty young at five and I was pretty green (still is) after only a year of lessons ! It has took me a lot of time and effort as he was napping a lot when we were going out on our own...I think a lot of horses that comes from a riding school are like that as they normally hack in company. My friend too has bought a few horses from a riding school and they all had a problem with hacking alone (rearing, bucking,turning back, planting,etc..).
He might be quite different with only one rider so I would advise to continue having regular lessons to help you through the difficulties !
Good luck and have fun !


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## Dougal9 (19 November 2015)

Hi Joanne

I'm trying very hard to persuade my current riding instructor to continue with our lessons at my new place on a freelance basis (she is the best of the best in my opinion - I've moved on more in the last 6 months under her tuition than I have since I came back to riding 2.5 years ago).  Fortunately the new yard are OK with having outside instructors in and don't charge anything for it.  They do have instructors that they recommend though.  As far as hacking out alone, that will be a no no for a good while - I'm not keen on the idea anyway, I always think its safer to have at least 2 people.  Dougal is fine hacking with just us and another horse, as I usually have a private hack anyway. I'm also having stable management lessons once a week.  I just can't wait to get him to myself, unfortunately I'm going to have to - as although a price etc has already been agreed and he will be mine, the sale of the school won't go through until probably March but on the upside I've got plenty of time to get his new wardrobe together !!!  Is it sad to enjoy horsey shopping rather than shopping for myself .....  !!


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## Apercrumbie (19 November 2015)

Dougal sounds like a brilliant option.  Just be aware though - many riding school horses change a lot once they are no longer in a riding school and their routine has changed.  He may start to really test you so it is important that you have lots of lessons and experienced help around you so it doesn't escalate.  I'm sure you will be absolutely fine - it's just something that many don't tell people who buy angelic riding school ponies who turn out less angelic once in less work.  You sound like you have a good yard to go to and a lovely instructor.  Enjoy your lovely new horse!


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## Dougal9 (19 November 2015)

Hi, to be honest I kind of hope he does change a bit, as he can be lazy so a bit more oomph would be nice - although obviously not too much - haha  !!  The yard are brilliant, I've been really lucky - there are 3 other ladies around my age there who also have recently got their first horse, so there will be lots of support and cobs aplenty !  Some of the yards in this area look down their noses at these wonderful horses ! Their loss I say


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## Joanne_Stockport (19 November 2015)

Dougal9 said:



			Hi Joanne

I'm trying very hard to persuade my current riding instructor to continue with our lessons at my new place on a freelance basis (she is the best of the best in my opinion - I've moved on more in the last 6 months under her tuition than I have since I came back to riding 2.5 years ago).  Fortunately the new yard are OK with having outside instructors in and don't charge anything for it.  They do have instructors that they recommend though.  As far as hacking out alone, that will be a no no for a good while - I'm not keen on the idea anyway, I always think its safer to have at least 2 people.  Dougal is fine hacking with just us and another horse, as I usually have a private hack anyway. I'm also having stable management lessons once a week.  I just can't wait to get him to myself, unfortunately I'm going to have to - as although a price etc has already been agreed and he will be mine, the sale of the school won't go through until probably March but on the upside I've got plenty of time to get his new wardrobe together !!!  Is it sad to enjoy horsey shopping rather than shopping for myself .....  !!
		
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I know the feeling about buying horsey things...he gets more things than me ! I bought too many rugs last winter and he doesn't really need it as my vet recommended not to put anything other than a rain rug. He is a cob and he tends to balloon in the summer so she wants him to be quite trim at the end of the winter. 
You seem quite prepared so that's good. I also did a stable management lesson before buying mine and it did help me. However there are still a lot I need to learn but I find that you do learn as you go. I always asks more experienced owners/riders when I'm not sure, however there is a lot of different opinions in the horsey world so sometimes you have to make your own mind ! 
Once you get to know your horse better make sure you notice the little things that can tell you if something is wrong. For example the original saddle I purchased (and I used a saddle fitter!) did not fit him and just little things I noticed was different (napping more, the way he was going,etc..) ..it is always better to find a problem earlier than later.
Have you had any lunging, ground work lesson so far ? if not that would be good too. 
I must admit I only did ground work recently when I was out of action (after my cheeky boy threw me off when cantering in a field !) and it did make things a lot better afterwards.
Regarding hacking alone, yes in a way it's a lot safer to be with someone else but it always depends how they and their horse are like !
I am in a very small yard and I would have waiting to long (to find a buddy to hack with) so for me it is essential that I can hack on my own.
Depending how your horse is , you will find that you will be able to hack with some people and some not. What I mean is , mine for example I can get him to hack alone but it is still a real struggle to make him go in front so my hacking partner has a horse who likes to be in front and cannot be overtaken when cantering. However my horse can go in front for short period to go through scary bits.
There are some people that you will not want to hack with as their horse (or them) make it to much of a risky business !
Also people go hacking differently, my hacks are quite fast (as I train him for fun rides/endurance) so mostly trot and some canters when possible but I find a lot of people just want to plod (no cantering, little trotting) so for me it's not interesting.
The main advice is that when you decide to hack alone (but it applies to in company too) never turn back home ! Do loops and if your horse misbehave you can get off but do your route on the ground..do no turn back. 

You should have a lot of fun with Dougal


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## Dougal9 (19 November 2015)

Hi

I've had lunge lessons on him and I am planning to learn how to lunge him myself, and we do a lot of pole work (which for some reason we both love), so our flatwork is improving all the time. I've just started to jump (first one on Tuesday this week), it was amazing and definitely something I want to do more of including xc. I too like to hack with trot/canter, the only thing with Dougal is that he will always have to be at the back (which he doesn't seem to mind) as if another horse gets too close to him he will kick out.  He is fine in the paddocks, its just confined spaces like the yard and hacking that he doesn't like it.  He doesn't kick people, just horses !!  At comps they tie a red ribbon round his tail as a warning sign


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## Booboos (19 November 2015)

Just a little note of caution on the fact that he kicks. If you want to school and hack it should be a manageable issue. If you want to compete or do fun rides or showing you may find you have more trouble. Some people do not notice red ribbons, others don't know what they mean and in  some situations horses are just inevitably on top of each other.


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## Dougal9 (19 November 2015)

Hi, apparently he has done quite a few comps and they've just made people aware as to what the red ribbon means and so far there have been no issues.  I don't plan on doing any large one's anyway, I'm not at that level - yet !   He has also been shown, but that's not something that I'm keen on doing.


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## applecart14 (19 November 2015)

Older horses will have more problems.  Add that to a riding school environment where the horse is expected to go round in ever decreasing circles most probably unbalanced and on a less than perfect surface and its a recipe for disaster.  I'd steer clear of both to be honest, sorry that might seem harsh but you have a massive choice of horse out there on the market at the moment, why compromise?

Sorry it might sound harsh but its just my opinion.


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## Dougal9 (19 November 2015)

I hear where you are coming from - but I know and trust Dougal, which means a lot to me.  He is safe, he is bomb proof (as much as any horse can be), and whilst he is a riding school horse he does have more to offer - like me, he isn't just a plodder !.  As someone new to owning their own horse, I don't think I would be happy buying one from the open market I don't trust that people are being honest with some horses.  Anyway, why spend hours and hours tearing around the country trying to find the right horse, when I've already (nearly) got him - give me a horse that I know and trust any day


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## applecart14 (19 November 2015)

Dougal9 said:



			I hear where you are coming from - but I know and trust Dougal, which means a lot to me.  He is safe, he is bomb proof (as much as any horse can be), and whilst he is a riding school horse he does have more to offer - like me, he isn't just a plodder !.  As someone new to owning their own horse, I don't think I would be happy buying one from the open market I don't trust that people are being honest with some horses.  Anyway, why spend hours and hours tearing around the country trying to find the right horse, when I've already (nearly) got him - give me a horse that I know and trust any day 

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Appreciate what you are saying with trust, etc but I think you might be looking through rose tinted spectacles a little with the naiviety that comes from being a first time owner (I do not mean that patronising or nasty, just with the very best intentions in mind).  Even on the best surfaces horses will break, and being used in a riding school continuously on a less than ideal surface does not lend itself to having a sound horse suitable for a first time owner.  If you are not wanting to get a vetting I would at least ask a vet to give him the once over to check he is completely sound before you buy him for the very reasons I have stated previously.

I hope the vet finds him suitable for you as you have obviously decided to buy him from the sounds of it!


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## Dougal9 (19 November 2015)

That's OK - no offence taken, but we all have to start somewhere and I think starting with something that I know and trust is not a bad thing.  He will have the 5* vetting done before any money changes hands, that was always a given.


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## Booboos (19 November 2015)

The transition from riding school horse to privately owned is generally a challenging one. The owner thinks the horse will be grateful for the special cuddles, the new expensive livery, the new tack, etc...the horse is more likely than not freaked out by his security blanket being removed and his work load slashed. By buying a riding school horse you are taking a risk that he will adjust to his new life and do so smoothly. If you were to buy a privately owned first horse that had been out grown you'd have less of an adjustment issue.


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## be positive (19 November 2015)

Booboos said:



			The transition from riding school horse to privately owned is generally a challenging one. The owner thinks the horse will be grateful for the special cuddles, the new expensive livery, the new tack, etc...the horse is more likely than not freaked out by his security blanket being removed and his work load slashed. By buying a riding school horse you are taking a risk that he will adjust to his new life and do so smoothly. If you were to buy a privately owned first horse that had been out grown you'd have less of an adjustment issue.
		
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In this case though the OP has been able to get to know the horse, hopefully the RS will allow her to gradually do more and Dougal to do less schoolwork as they wind down with the lessons, trying to find a decent privately owned horse is like a needle in a haystack add to that a first time buyer and the odds are they will be worse off than taking the risk on one they already know even if it does change a bit she has good backup available she is not taking him home to manage alone.

A 5 stage vetting is planned so that covers applecarts concerns, he is hardly old at 9/10 by the time of purchase, as for the workload most RS horses spend a lot of time in walk with short periods of trot, canter and some jumping also hacking tends to be steady not bombing about the countryside, they are generally fitter than the average privately owned hack and should be more than able to cope with at least another 10 years or so of what in reality will be light work, I think it is far less risky than going out to look for a privately owned horse that may appear sound, fit and healthy but has been barely worked most of it's life so is far greener than expected or hammered round the roads at weekends with nothing during the week, or may well have had some issues that are not declared.

All horses have the potential to break or not cope with a new home, if the RS owners are honest they will want Dougal and the OP to be a good match and will facilitate a transition period if possible, maybe a month as a working livery would be a good idea once they have a sale date confirmed, not all RS horses are going to panic about leaving the school, if they are well educated, have been out to competitions and seen life outside it may be the making of him to have one to one attention within a well run livery yard.


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## Sussexbythesea (19 November 2015)

Booboos said:



			The transition from riding school horse to privately owned is generally a challenging one. The owner thinks the horse will be grateful for the special cuddles, the new expensive livery, the new tack, etc...the horse is more likely than not freaked out by his security blanket being removed and his work load slashed. By buying a riding school horse you are taking a risk that he will adjust to his new life and do so smoothly. If you were to buy a privately owned first horse that had been out grown you'd have less of an adjustment issue.
		
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When the riding school at my old livery yard closed most of the horses were sold to clients and at substantial  prices. I know at least 6 of the new owners well and not one had any significant issues. If anything the horses improved with individual attention. I know of at least 3 that are still with original buyer, two were sold on as outgrown and one belonging to a close friend of mine died of something that sounded like grass sickness a few years later.  
I think it's less of a risk than buying a complete unknown but buying a horse is always a risk regardless.


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## Dougal9 (20 November 2015)

Thanks everyone for all your thoughts/comments - they are all very much appreciated no matter how hard some of them may be to read. Dougal does no more than 2 hours a day (not every day) and that applies to all the horses at the school.  My instructor (who is also the yard manager there and has been for 25 years) has known Dougal since he first arrived aged 4, and she would not have put me forward to the RS owner unless she thought we were a good match.  At 2,500 incl tack, he isn't over priced, in fact I think I have a bargain based on similar horses of the same age/type/ability that are advertised on the open market - I did my research before agreeing the price !!  The yard that I am moving to also has a couple of ex RS school horses, and none of the owners or horses have had any issues, hopefully Dougal and I will be the same.  One of the stipulations of the sale of all the RS horses, is that none of them go on to a working livery.  The owner feels that they have done their time, and believes that they all now deserve to have 1 to 1 care rather than go into another riding school environment.  She is taking the older one's with her, plus a couple of her favourites but not starting up another RS school.  None of the horses that are for sale will be advertised, they will only be sold to Clients, friends of Clients etc. and prospective owners are vetted too.
I do know that buying a horse new tack, extra cuddles etc will not make things right if he is unhappy, and I don't believe horses know how to feel grateful do they - that's just a human emotion that we choose to apply to them. I have worked with animals (mainly dogs) in the behaviourist field, and know that things like TTouch massage can be applied to horses to help calm them should they need it.  So I'm not quite that green !!  I won't be changing any of the style of tack he is used to, but will purchase like for like. However the yard that I am moving to have a process in place where he will be introduced slowly to his new companions, his daily routine will be kept as close as possible to what he has been used to including feed and the transition to new routines etc will be made very slowly. It is a small yard with only about 12 horses, so giving a new horse a bit more attention and help to settle in will not be a problem for them.  I am lucky in that I will also be able to use the farrier/saddler and dentist that he has been used to also.
I don't understand why some people are against buying RS horses (a friend of mine is trying everything to stop me buying him, she has a beautiful dutch warm blood dressage horse who spooks, spins, bucks and rears at the drop of a hat) - they are in the main better trained than some of the one's on the open market and have had a good standard of care. Yes, some of them are dopey but there are a few diamonds amongst them too that shouldn't necessarily be overlooked.   And yes, Dougal is one of them !!


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## VioletFlower (20 November 2015)

I think Dougal sounds great and I'm sure all will be well. There are indeed some great horses at riding schools. I think you are making a very sensible choice (wish I hhjad with my choice of first horse!) Sounds like you have lots of experienced help on hand if you do get any challenges.

I'd be cautious of the 19yo, I'd be concerned you'd not get many years out of her, most horses will be having some wear and tear issues by then. If you had to retire her, you'd have nothing to ride.


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## Joanne_Stockport (20 November 2015)

As I said before, the horsey world is full of diverging opinion so you can "listen" to all the different advice (and think about it) but it's up to you to make your own judgement (and you do not have to justify yourself). 
When I bought mine I was in the same situation (and later on when trying to deal with issues) , having only been riding riding for a year and wanting to buy a RS horse. On top of it, mine was being sold because he did not adjust to being in the RS and had learn all the tricks to escape working ! So he would plant, not wanting to go in the arena , with a rider on he would push them on to the fence,etc..
Even my instructor did not recommend for me to buy it ! However one of the other instructors at the RS (who liked him) started working one to one with him and you could see that he started to behave better. So he was sold pretty cheap because of that and I though the worst case scenario is that I will have to sell him if it doesn't work. So two year later he is still with me , it has been up and down but I have learned so much ! Almost a year ago, I almost decided to sell him as we were having real problems (particularly in the arena where he did not want to move !) but with a new instructor things have improved (still need to work). He is more happy too in general. We are getting pretty good at hacking which is what I and he enjoy the most. The last year has been pretty good as we started going to fun rides (12 miles) and I came back with a few rosettes !

You seem more prepared than what I was at the time and you probably know more about horses than I did 2 years ago. 
I think people who are giving their advices against buying RS horses do it because they know people who have had issues with them.
Either they bought them thinking they will be the same as they were at the riding school or not doing a vetting before and having problems later.

I always listen to advice, particularly if it comes from experienced riders/horse owners but at the end of the day they are not always right (for your particular situation). I know my horse and what works (or not) and with make a decision based on that. 
I say go for it !!


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## Dougal9 (20 November 2015)

Thanks Joanne, really appreciate your comments.  I am going with my gut instinct, its never let me down before, but I'm still trying to take what I can from people's advice too - it can be a difficult blend sometimes ...
I'm not someone who gives up easily, and so if things are difficult when we first move I've got people around me in the yard to help and my instructor will always be on hand, if not to teach then to definitely give advice.


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## applecart14 (20 November 2015)

Dougal9 said:



			I don't understand why some people are against buying RS horses (a friend of mine is trying everything to stop me buying him, she has a beautiful dutch warm blood dressage horse who spooks, spins, bucks and rears at the drop of a hat) - they are in the main better trained than some of the one's on the open market and have had a good standard of care. Yes, some of them are dopey but there are a few diamonds amongst them too that shouldn't necessarily be overlooked.   And yes, Dougal is one of them !!
		
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They are against buying RS horses because of the potential problems they may encounter with them as riding a horse continually in a cirle as the riding school format is, on a poor surface causes all sorts of joint problems. My friend imported one from France, used in a riding school.  She used to ride the mare when she was abroad on holiday and when she found the riding school was selling up bought her. 

She had her imported and had lots of problems with her, and within a year of owning her was having the vet out for athritis of the knee joints.
If you don't listen to anything else from this situation please at least listen to so many of us who are saying get her vetted.

Good luck


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## Joanne_Stockport (20 November 2015)

applecart14 said:



			They are against buying RS horses because of the potential problems they may encounter with them as riding a horse continually in a cirle as the riding school format is, on a poor surface causes all sorts of joint problems. My friend imported one from France, used in a riding school.  She used to ride the mare when she was abroad on holiday and when she found the riding school was selling up bought her. 

She had her imported and had lots of problems with her, and within a year of owning her was having the vet out for athritis of the knee joints.
If you don't listen to anything else from this situation please at least listen to so many of us who are saying get her vetted.

Good luck
		
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She already mentioned that she was getting a 5* vetting done so I think she will know if there are obvious problems from that.


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## Dougal9 (20 November 2015)

Yup 5* vetting was always going to happen.  By the way, he doesn't ride round and round on a continuous circle and the surfaces at the school are not poor either (rubber/sand).  He jumps/hacks/dressage up to elementary level and goes xcountry - a real mixture of disciplines which kind of knocks out the argument of him just going round and round all day .... 
Yes, I may find that he has problems - but then he may pass the vetting with flying colours.  The same applies to horses bought on the open market.  There are arguments for and against buying any horse, I just don't think that a horse should be written off just because they've been in a RS environment.  I have, by the way, looked at others and tried a couple outside of the RS - but I just didn't feel confident not knowing their temperament as I do with Dougal.  Really knowing your first horse before you buy, has got to carry a lot of credence surely !


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## be positive (20 November 2015)

applecart14 said:



			They are against buying RS horses because of the potential problems they may encounter with them as riding a horse continually in a cirle as the riding school format is, on a poor surface causes all sorts of joint problems. My friend imported one from France, used in a riding school.  She used to ride the mare when she was abroad on holiday and when she found the riding school was selling up bought her. 

She had her imported and had lots of problems with her, and within a year of owning her was having the vet out for athritis of the knee joints.
If you don't listen to anything else from this situation please at least listen to so many of us who are saying get her vetted.

Good luck
		
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You are speaking from one bad experience that may have had nothing to do with the RS, your own horse is hardly a good example of a sound non RS horse with all the issues Bailey has had, including arthritis, you know full well that some horses will stay sound, others will break and in my experience it is just as much down to luck as anything else, good conformation will help as will the horse being kept fit enough for the job it is doing, if Dougal has been well looked after, had a variety of work and passes the vet there is no reason to think he will be any more likely to go lame in the near future than any other horse, if he fails the vetting then the OP will probably look elsewhere but I think at the price even with a few minor issues he could be a really good buy and wish her good luck with him.


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## FestiveFuzz (20 November 2015)

It sounds like you're going into this with your eyes open and whilst it's nice to ask opinions on a forum I would take it with a pinch of salt to a certain agree as really your instructor and the YO are best placed (albeit potentially biased) to say whether you and Dougal are the best match as they know both you and Dougal.

Personally I would always avoid RS horses as I would be concerned of the impact of being ridden by so many people of varying abilities and how they would cope with the decreased workload of being in a private home...but to me hacking alone and being able to hop on after a week of no work is vital. That said I am under no illusion that there would be RS horses out there that would be totally able to cope with that, but it's not a risk I would want to take. But then again I have been riding for 23 years and owned many horses during that time, so I put less emphasis on the value of knowing a horse well before I buy.

The only thing that made me a little wary of whether Dougal would be the perfect horse for you was when you said...



Dougal9 said:



			to be honest I kind of hope he does change a bit, as he can be lazy so a bit more oomph would be nice - although obviously not too much - haha  !!
		
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Whilst there's a lot to be said about buying a horse on gut instinct (my current boy is the only one I didn't sit on and just "know" and he's also going to be the only one I've ended up selling). Much like a relationship I wouldn't be too keen to go into it wishing the horse was different temperament wise and would probably hold out for one that ticked all my boxes. Also, reading between the lines if you're not able to buy him until March you may find that your riding has progressed to a point where you're looking for something more by then...so just bear that in mind too.


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## Goldenstar (20 November 2015)

paddi22 said:



			dougal 100%. he sounds exactly what you want.
		
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Me too , you can very lucky with an old horse and 19 is old but you also be unlucky and hit issues quickly .


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## Booboos (21 November 2015)

So this horse is a bombproof competition all rounder but he's being sold for £2,500? In the open market he would be worth 5-10k based on his quality so this is a massive reduction. His owner is either a saint who truly wants a good future for her horses regardless of money or something is not quite right in all of this.

I am not trying to dampen your enthusiasm, I just think that when buying a horse it pays to be really really sceptical and questioning.


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## paddi22 (21 November 2015)

Riding horses often do have a lot of issues transitioning from a riding school to a single home. The main ones are the change from a lot of daily hours of work, to just being ridden by one owner. They can also be very clever and quickly realise they can take advantage of their new owner if they get away with stuff uncorrected (but same with any horse). They can start coming alive and feeling a bit better in themselves and get sharper and more energetic.  They also can have issues with being unresponsive and getting dead to the aids as they have had people bashing their mouths and sides, and bouncing round unbalanced. 

I've never seen a horse go from a RS horse to a personally owned one and not change. usually its for the best though! It's lovely to see them blossom with some personal attention and get a new spark in their eye. 

If they have mainly been ridden in a school they can often be spooky in new enviroments.


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## Aleka81 (21 November 2015)

D



Booboos said:



			So this horse is a bombproof competition all rounder but he's being sold for £2,500? In the open market he would be worth 5-10k based on his quality so this is a massive reduction. His owner is either a saint who truly wants a good future for her horses regardless of money or something is not quite right in all of this.

I am not trying to dampen your enthusiasm, I just think that when buying a horse it pays to be really really sceptical and questioning.
		
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Totally agree!


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## Booboos (22 November 2015)

Just to add...I bought a totally unsuitable first horse from my RC many years ago. Like a total fool I trusted them to look after me and they sold me a complete lunatic (which was not as obvious pre-purchase as you might have imagined).


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## Dougal9 (22 November 2015)

I think i will bow out of this thread - as like some (but not all) riding school horses we seem to be going round in circles.  Apart from some very supportive comments, which I am grateful for, I'm left feeling a bit battered and bruised by the more brutal ones. Not so much the content, but the tone used - maybe unintentional maybe not. No doubt my feeling like this will be used as another reason why I shouldn't buy a riding school horse or even some may say, a horse at all.  Sorry to disappoint those that doubt my sanity - I haven't been put off at all, just put off posting any more comments on this forum !


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## Meowy Catkin (22 November 2015)

Just remember that you are the only one who has seen Dougal in person. Everyone else hasn't, so take their RS horses comments with a pinch of salt as they don't know _this specific RS horse_.


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## SO1 (22 November 2015)

I am sorry to hear this and I have a feeling that I know the RS you are buying from and that the horses there do have a variety of life and it is not a massively busy one so that horses I don't think will have been overworked.

You are taking a risk when you buy any horse and one that you know and your instructor knows is in my opinion less risky. I presume your instructors will go on to get new jobs or may be available freelance to come and support you. They probably won't want their reputation damaged by giving you poor advice or suggesting a horse that would not be suitable.

I think the price seems fair he is not a top competition horse as he will probably be only have been competing at the RS school competitions and he is a coloured cob and there are quite a few of them around. 

The only issue I would say is that if he kicks other horses a lot you may find you need individual turnout when you move to livery as you might not be very popular if he kicks his field-mates and hurts them.

As a Riding School horse is unlikely he has been doing a lot of fast work or jumping huge jumps on hard ground, hunting or eventing and if he is the quieter sort he may have been used more for the beginner lessons and hacks which are sometimes less demanding. He will probably have done no more circles than a dressage horse that goes out competing a lot and is schooled on a regular basis. Riding Schools tend to be careful with their horses as a lame RS horse is no use to them.

You are getting a vetting, you are having your horse on full livery, the horse has been deemed suitable by your instructor, the majority of people would say you are doing all you can to reduce the risk of an unsuitable horse. Yes some RS get more lively when taken out of the RS environment if kept on the same levels of feed and turnout, however you may be able to adjust his management to take into consideration the drop in work levels. I think the most likely scenario is that if he is a steady cob type he won't become much more lively but you might might have issues managing his weight if he is not being ridden so much as cobs tend to be very good doers. If hacking out on your own is something you want to do then you may have to find a way to test that Dougal is ok with this as RS horses rarely hack alone.

As a comparison my pony lived out for 6 years and I moved yards last year and he is now living in at night. A lot of people say that horses that live in at night are more lively to ride than ones that live out. My pony's energy levels have not changed at all since his on a new routine at a new yard.

Good Luck with Dougal and don't let comments put you off- you may find livery yards can be a bit like that at times too, as not everyone has the same opinions on what is best and not everyone is good at putting their point across in a gentle considered way. 



Dougal9 said:



			I think i will bow out of this thread - as like some (but not all) riding school horses we seem to be going round in circles.  Apart from some very supportive comments, which I am grateful for, I'm left feeling a bit battered and bruised by the more brutal ones. Not so much the content, but the tone used - maybe unintentional maybe not. No doubt my feeling like this will be used as another reason why I shouldn't buy a riding school horse or even some may say, a horse at all.  Sorry to disappoint those that doubt my sanity - I haven't been put off at all, just put off posting any more comments on this forum !
		
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## wench (22 November 2015)

I've had plenty of working horses on working livery, and none of them have developed any type of problems from "going around and around in ever decreasing circles on a rubbish surface"

But I would be suprised at a RS owned horse that is actually schooled up to elementary level dressage, without having been competed/trained in a private home first.,


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## Pearlsasinger (22 November 2015)

applecart14 said:



			Older horses will have more problems.  Add that to a riding school environment where the horse is expected to go round in ever decreasing circles most probably unbalanced and on a less than perfect surface and its a recipe for disaster.  I'd steer clear of both to be honest, sorry that might seem harsh but you have a massive choice of horse out there on the market at the moment, why compromise?

Sorry it might sound harsh but its just my opinion.
		
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I have bought several horses that have worked in RS, none of them has been a problem on their own.  They (bar the gelding who had a field accident) have lived long and happy lives as family horses and have thoroughly appreciated the change of pace, as they got older.  So long as the new owner realises that they do not need feeding for hard work, they are fine.

ETA And all 4 have been as near to 'bombproof' as any horse can be.  I can actually remember every 'spooking' incident with each of them because they were so rare.  They were all wonderful at hacking and completely traffic-proof.

I am not surprised that OP has decided to bow out of the thread, although I hope that she is still reading, there has been a lot of unhelpful nonsense based on a few posters single unfortunate experiences.


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## applecart14 (23 November 2015)

be positive said:



			You are speaking from one bad experience that may have had nothing to do with the RS, your own horse is hardly a good example of a sound non RS horse with all the issues Bailey has had, including arthritis, you know full well that some horses will stay sound, others will break and in my experience it is just as much down to luck as anything else, good conformation will help as will the horse being kept fit enough for the job it is doing, if Dougal has been well looked after, had a variety of work and passes the vet there is no reason to think he will be any more likely to go lame in the near future than any other horse, if he fails the vetting then the OP will probably look elsewhere but I think at the price even with a few minor issues he could be a really good buy and wish her good luck with him.
		
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Yes I agree with your comments.  But as I already stated I know someone that bought from a riding school too and had problems because of the stress on the joints. 

I too wish the OP well, I was just pointing out my experience.  You might say "its the luck of the draw" but if the odds MAY already be stacked against this horse (and who knows if they are or not) then IMHO its simply not worth the hassle for a first time owner.  That was all I was saying.

And yes there are plenty of horses of all ages, breeds and disciplines who are the same or much much worse off than my horse, you probably don't hear about them on this forum because of the negative comments given to their owners. I was just trying to save the OP the stress that she COULD find herself in given the horses situation as a riding school horse.

I think when you are a first time owner you want to buy something that might not already be compromised in some way, that was all I was saying.  And look at my horse, he passed two vettings and then went on to develop spavin, the second degree heart block and coffin joint athritis were not picked up on either vetting, because they were not advanced enough or present at the time of the vetting.

I was only trying to prevent future possible heartbreak. Of course I wish the OP well.


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## applecart14 (23 November 2015)

Pearlsasinger said:



			I am not surprised that OP has decided to bow out of the thread, although I hope that she is still reading, there has been a lot of unhelpful nonsense based on a few posters single unfortunate experiences.
		
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Just because my experience differs from yours, its a bit unfair to label it as 'unhelpful nonsense' but then I am not entirely suprised as you always seem to object to everything I write these days.  There are others on this post that did agree with me, so I am not the only one who believes that this horse may already be compromised.  And how many more than a 'few posters single unfortunate experiences' do you need until it becomes a valid point Pearlsasinger??

I spoke to my physio weeks ago now about someone else I know who was buying a potential riding school horse and she said that in her experience the majority and I stress the word 'majority' come with physical problems consistent with leg and joint problems due to the stresses placed on them through poor surfaces and unbalanced riders.  

And before I get accused of saying 'all riding school patrons are unbalanced riders' I am not stating that.  But beginners will not be of the same calibre as more experienced riders.

In the same way I would not contemplate buying a horse that has been ridden in a menage six days a week every week for years, I was expressing the same opinion of Dougal.


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## Dougal9 (23 November 2015)

Ok to make a final summary of my situation, put the record straight and answer the constant trickle of critics........

Dougal is NOT ridden 6 days a week round and round in a circle.
The MOST he does is 2 hours a day, and that is not every day
The SURFACES at the school are of a good quality
His Workload WILL NOT change drastically when we move yards
We will be surrounded by EXPERIENCED people in the new yard to assist if needed
He WILL BE 5* VETTED as I mentioned before


Just because I am coming back to riding after having children DOES NOT mean that I am totally new to horses
He will be my first horse - and be assured I will be better prepared for ownership of him than some of you so called more 'experienced' people
He was in a private home to the age of 4, and then for the last 5 years at the RS where he HAS been trained up to Elementary Dressage Level and competed at that level - now fancy a RS horse doing that !!
He HACKS without issues
He can complete a XC course 
He can complete a SJ course
Yes he kicks if another horse gets to close to his behind but only in CONFINED SPACES and NOT in the PADDOCK 

I joined this forum because I thought I would get some good sound advice - I would like to say a huge thank you to those of you who have answered this thread with such advice.  But for those of you who seem to be just looking down your noses at the horse I am about to buy because he is from a riding school - then get over yourselves ladies !!  A privately bought horse is no less likely to have issues than a RS horse and there is not one of you out there that can prove it - no matter how much you would like to.  And as for using the forum to have a go at each other - well, I'm glad I'm out of it.


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## be positive (23 November 2015)

You have defended Dougal, the RS and yourself extremely well, it is a shame you had to, for some reason you have had some of the most negative opinions of RS horses I have ever heard, mainly based on a single bad experience, I have dealt with many horses from all different backgrounds over the years, inc RS horses as I ran a RS for some time, no horse is perfect and can go wrong despite every care taken.
I really hope you can buy and enjoy owning Dougal and if you feel you can come back please do most of us will be welcoming, you can always block the others.


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## applecart14 (23 November 2015)

Dougal9 said:



			But for those of you who seem to be just looking down your noses at the horse I am about to buy because he is from a riding school - then get over yourselves ladies !!
		
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For goodness sake love, no one was looking down their noses at you!  Far from it.  You asked for advice. I gave you my advice.  My physio has seen it first hand.  So it can be proved.  But whatever. I don't have to get over anything, because I haven't looked down my nose at you. I have already expressed you luck TWICE! 

Your tone, like your quote 'fancy a riding school horse doing that' makes it clear that you believe that I think less of a riding school horse than a privately bought one, nothing could be further from the truth.  You are making assumptions which are incorrect whereas my assumption is borne from a friend who took one on, and her experience and also from discussing a similar case with my physio friend where a mutual friend wanted to buy a RS horse and she said she  has also witnessed first hand that RS horses are likely to have more problems than ' A OTHER' horse..   I would happily of bought a riding school horse years ago before I bought my first horse. However, I now know the pitfalls. Like I would be extremely unlikely to buy another WB again, now I know the pitfalls they can present with, again something borne from experience!

So please don't accuse me of looking down my nose at you, I don't even know you and find it infuriating and annoying that you think I am doing so merely by expressing an opinion that you asked me (and others) to express.


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## wren123 (23 November 2015)

Well said Dougal9, I think you are doing all the right things and Dougal sounds great, and good luck with him. I look forward to hearing your progress


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## Booboos (23 November 2015)

G



Dougal9 said:



			Ok to make a final summary of my situation, put the record straight and answer the constant trickle of critics........

Dougal is NOT ridden 6 days a week round and round in a circle.
The MOST he does is 2 hours a day, and that is not every day
The SURFACES at the school are of a good quality
His Workload WILL NOT change drastically when we move yards
We will be surrounded by EXPERIENCED people in the new yard to assist if needed
He WILL BE 5* VETTED as I mentioned before


Just because I am coming back to riding after having children DOES NOT mean that I am totally new to horses
He will be my first horse - and be assured I will be better prepared for ownership of him than some of you so called more 'experienced' people
He was in a private home to the age of 4, and then for the last 5 years at the RS where he HAS been trained up to Elementary Dressage Level and competed at that level - now fancy a RS horse doing that !!
He HACKS without issues
He can complete a XC course 
He can complete a SJ course
Yes he kicks if another horse gets to close to his behind but only in CONFINED SPACES and NOT in the PADDOCK 

I joined this forum because I thought I would get some good sound advice - I would like to say a huge thank you to those of you who have answered this thread with such advice.  But for those of you who seem to be just looking down your noses at the horse I am about to buy because he is from a riding school - then get over yourselves ladies !!  A privately bought horse is no less likely to have issues than a RS horse and there is not one of you out there that can prove it - no matter how much you would like to.  And as for using the forum to have a go at each other - well, I'm glad I'm out of it.
		
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You've lost the plot now a bit. None of this is about snobbery of RC horses, what utter rubbish. You got plenty of advice and different points of view on buying a specific horse which happens to be an RC horse.

P.S. If you threaten to flounce in a huff you need to flounce in a huff - coming back ruins the flounce.


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## stencilface (23 November 2015)

Hope dougal loves his new home.

Having bought a horse aged 4 who has very low mileage now aged 15, and has been basically off work for 4 years due to lameness, it doesn't matter what work a horse is or isn't in - if they are going to break, they are going to break - you can never tell which horse it will be either!

And FWIW the riding school I went to as a kid still does loads of hacking, and lets pupils take the horses out hunting too, so they are far from dull rides.  And I don't think his price is off either, I just think a lot of horses are very overpriced for what they can do. Horses that can do BE90 for £5000 + is ridiculous imho, its only 90cm for flips sake, most horses should be able to trip over that!


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## Joanne_Stockport (23 November 2015)

it's getting a bit silly this thread really !
I can understand why the OP is getting defensive, she is only new on this forum and and it has obviously open a can of worms !
She did not even ask if there should be a reason why she shouldn't buy a RS horse, she was only asking about a choice between two horses.
They are both from a RS horse.
Fair enough you can warn her put there is not point of going on and on about it.


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## applecart14 (23 November 2015)

Joanne_Stockport said:



			She did not even ask if there should be a reason why she shouldn't buy a RS horse, she was only asking about a choice between two horses.
.
		
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Sorry but I beg to differ.  To quote the OP's last sentence in her original post "Any thoughts, ideas would be very welcome here"

I am only defending myself because I have been told that I am, (and I quote) 'looking down my nose at the horse I am about to buy because he is a RS horse' which is really unfair and not the case at all.  I like all horses, big, small, hairy, clipped, WB's to cobs, Gymkana ponies to Grand Prix show jumpers, Riding School to Spanish Riding School of Vienna, I have no particular 'type' I do not like in general although admittedly we all have our own personal preferences. 

I never said RS horses were dull plods either, far from it, I used to love my lessons in particular I was the only one who loved to ride the RS bucker and rearer for the challenge!

I won't bother to make any further comments as they are only going to be misconstrued and not taken in the kindly way they are intended.


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## paddi22 (23 November 2015)

I can't see why the OP is flouncing off - no-one suggested all rs were crocks.  If I was in her place I'd be grateful to people for pointing out situations where their exRS horses had issues, as it could be useful at some point in the future if there WAS an issue, or it might be handy to flag with a vet during a vetting just to double check.  It happens here all the time with exracers etc, were people flag possible back or si injuries - and if the new owner has a problem with the horse rearing then they have the knowledge of what others have experienced with theirs.

I don't think its out of the blue to assume some ex rs horses might have physical issues. Most yards I've been in over 30 years have had deep surfaces, with horses doing repetitive movements with unbalanced riders.  If the OPs has a good surface with a horse doing 2hrs max that's brilliant, but most don't, and people were speaking from their own rs experiences. 

I read back the thread and can't see anyone being snobby about RS horses??.  Most people have nothing but respect for RS horses, and most are absolute saints.


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## LovesCobs (23 November 2015)

Booboos said:



			The transition from riding school horse to privately owned is generally a challenging one. The owner thinks the horse will be grateful for the special cuddles, the new expensive livery, the new tack, etc...the horse is more likely than not freaked out by his security blanket being removed and his work load slashed. By buying a riding school horse you are taking a risk that he will adjust to his new life and do so smoothly. If you were to buy a privately owned first horse that had been out grown you'd have less of an adjustment issue.
		
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I bought a riding school horse, he'd only been there 9 months and wasn't a beginner ride. However what others have said about the adjustment is very true. The decrease in work load and for my horse the increase in time stabled led to a few challenges in the first year! He's likely to become a different horse. With that in mind I'd go for the steadier horse of the two as the horse you've been riding who's a bit livelier may become a lot to handle in private ownership. I hope it all works well for you 
Just to add I've never regretted it, my lad is great


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## FestiveFuzz (24 November 2015)

Dougal9 said:



			Ok to make a final summary of my situation, put the record straight and answer the constant trickle of critics........

Dougal is NOT ridden 6 days a week round and round in a circle.
The MOST he does is 2 hours a day, and that is not every day
The SURFACES at the school are of a good quality
His Workload WILL NOT change drastically when we move yards
We will be surrounded by EXPERIENCED people in the new yard to assist if needed
He WILL BE 5* VETTED as I mentioned before


Just because I am coming back to riding after having children DOES NOT mean that I am totally new to horses
He will be my first horse - and be assured I will be better prepared for ownership of him than some of you so called more 'experienced' people
He was in a private home to the age of 4, and then for the last 5 years at the RS where he HAS been trained up to Elementary Dressage Level and competed at that level - now fancy a RS horse doing that !!
He HACKS without issues
He can complete a XC course 
He can complete a SJ course
Yes he kicks if another horse gets to close to his behind but only in CONFINED SPACES and NOT in the PADDOCK 

I joined this forum because I thought I would get some good sound advice - I would like to say a huge thank you to those of you who have answered this thread with such advice.  But for those of you who seem to be just looking down your noses at the horse I am about to buy because he is from a riding school - then get over yourselves ladies !!  A privately bought horse is no less likely to have issues than a RS horse and there is not one of you out there that can prove it - no matter how much you would like to.  And as for using the forum to have a go at each other - well, I'm glad I'm out of it.
		
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Unless I've missed something I really don't see how this response is warranted? I don't think anyone has looked down their noses at the horse you're about to buy, just merely suggested things to watch out for or issues you may run into on your request! At the end of the day there's a risk attached to buying ANY horse. A girl I once knew spent years saving for a horse, was finally in the position to buy, found the horse of her dreams and 2 weeks later had to have him shot after a bad slip/fall in the field. You can only minimise risk...the rest quite frankly is down to luck.


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## Orca (24 November 2015)

I can understand op eventually becoming defensive. There's helpful advice and then there's hammering home a point which had already been made several times over. I'm sure most of us know the excitement of buying our first and can imagine how deflating it would be to have a horse or worse, the idea of a type of horse pulled apart.

OP, I think you're making a good choice of first horse. My first, a cob, had worked hard his entire life and continued doing so until his 30's with barely a creak. Another family horse was lightly used and young when she came to us and had to be pts shortly after because of the acute onset of a devastating condition. In fact, most people who have had horses for a long time will have had the unfortunate experience of one breaking - and most of those will not be RS horses! So, it can go wrong or right either way (as I'm sure you know!). 

On a more positive note, buying a horse should be and more usually is a positive, enjoyable experience and overall, a horse you know well is likely to have less surprises in store than one you don't. I'd trust a year spent with a horse over a 5 stage vetting, personally &#55357;&#56842;


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## Auslander (24 November 2015)

I know the riding school in question very well - I used to teach there. It's one of the good ones. The horses are far from overworked, have a life filled with variety, and are well managed and well ridden. The owner is someone I respect enormously, and her staff, certainly when I was freelancing there, were super.
I'd have no hesitation in buyng a horse from there to do the job that Dougal wants hers to do. I've also seen some very nice horses go through that yard who all went on to competitive homes. The owner appears to be trying to find good private homes for the horses, and I think that's very commendable, after they have given her good service over the years.
Best of luck Dougal - I hope you have many happy years with your new boy


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## rachk89 (24 November 2015)

Honestly just ignore others opinions. No not everyone will like him because he was a riding school horse but so what? You like him and that's all that matters. If he makes you smile when you're riding, then ignore everyone else as he is right for you. 

I was told by a few people on here that my current horse wouldn't be suitable for me. Had I listened to them, I would now have a steady cob that would be boring me to death after it helped fix my confidence issues. Instead I ignored them and got the horse that made me happy, the warmblood x Connemara. Luckily for me, his good sire and his Connemara side clearly made him an intelligent horse as he remained calm and unresponsive to my nerves, even if I was literally shaking on him from fear on a bad day. They didn't know him and were wrong about him as they assumed he would be nuts based only upon his age and the Oldenburg in him.

Just like how easily they could be wrong about your horse. Any horse is capable of injuries, my one is stabled next to a horse worth a hell of a lot who just recently got off being stable bound and rehabilitated from a knee injury. There is another horse her by again worth a lot and yet can't be ridden for about a year. Background and price makes little difference in horses, you are either lucky or you aren't. Simple as that.


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## applecart14 (25 November 2015)

rachk89 said:



			No not everyone will like him because he was a riding school horse but so what? .
		
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FFS -Missing the point again....someone please put me out of my misery.  Does no one read the previous replies??  ITS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE FACT HE IS A RIDING SCHOOL HORSE (AND THEREFORE WE CONSIDER HIM RUBBISH) -END OF.  AND BREATHE......


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## PaddyMonty (25 November 2015)

applecart14 said:



			Does no one read the previous replies??
		
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On a long thread no I don't think they do, including you. The OP had already stated she would have a 5 stage vetting carried out long before you first reply. You then went on say OP should get a 5 stage vetting done.


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## Kat (25 November 2015)

OP I am not going to wade in to the argument this thread has become but would like to suggest that you have a read of some of Redmone's old threads about Dolly. They are nice diary style posts about a first time owner buying a riding school pony. They face some challenges get lots of good advice and things work out eventually.


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## applecart14 (25 November 2015)

applecart14 said:



			If you are not wanting to get a vetting I would at least ask a vet to give him the once over to check he is completely sound before you buy him for the very reasons I have stated previously.

I hope the vet finds him suitable for you as you have obviously decided to buy him from the sounds of it! 

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PaddyMonty said:



			On a long thread no I don't think they do, including you. The OP had already stated she would have a 5 stage vetting carried out long before you first reply. You then went on say OP should get a 5 stage vetting done. 

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My very words are above actually suggesting to the OP that if she didn't want to get a vetting done at the very least she should get the vet to check him over.  Then in the next sentence I stated "I hope the vet finds him suitable for you", so I do think I read the post correctly.


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## teacups (25 November 2015)

Applecart, I think then there must be a misunderstanding between your intentions and how it reads. 
This is how what you wrote read to me, for example - you were saying OP was not intending to get a vetting; you strongly advised OP to get a vetting or get a vet to at least look at the horse and, assuming OP got a vetting, hoped that the horse would pass because OP had clearly already decided to buy whatever the outcome.

OP had in fact already said there would be a 5 stage vetting. I'm another who assumed you hadn't read the thread before replying.


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## applecart14 (25 November 2015)

teacups said:



			Applecart, I think then there must be a misunderstanding between your intentions and how it reads. 
This is how what you wrote read to me, for example - you were saying OP was not intending to get a vetting; you strongly advised OP to get a vetting or get a vet to at least look at the horse and, assuming OP got a vetting, hoped that the horse would pass because OP had clearly already decided to buy whatever the outcome.

OP had in fact already said there would be a 5 stage vetting. I'm another who assumed you hadn't read the thread before replying.
		
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I did not state that the OP was not intending to get a vetting at all and I am perplexed that you should think that.  When I said "if you are not wanting to get a vetting" the same as I would state as an example "if you are not wanting salt on your chips you might like to consider vinegar instead".  Bit of a naff example, I know, but all I can think of at this moment in time.

Teacups - you would be great working for the tabloids as they miquote people all the time!  Do you know what, does any of this matter?  The OP asked for opinions.  I gave her mine based on factual evidence and experience and through talking to a very good veterinary physio about a friend who was wanting to buy something similar.  She is experienced in dealing with all sorts of animals from all sorts of disciplines and knows the pitfals based on the work she does treating such animals.   

The OP is not going to listen to this so that's up to her.  She has obviously made up her mind what she wants to do and good luck to her, I sincerely hope it works out for her sake.  The only reason I continued with this thread was because I was labelled as looking down my nose at riding school horses as this was not the case at all.  

Then someone on the forum says "There's helpful advice and then there's hammering home a point which had already been made several times over. I'm sure most of us know the excitement of buying our first and can imagine how deflating it would be to have a horse or worse, the idea of a type of horse pulled apart".  If I was  'hammering home' by repeating what I have already said because the OP then comes out with a sentence like "I don't understand why some people are against buying RS horses".  Maybe it could possibly be for the reasons already given, and i am not the only one to think this!  Its not that we don't like them, its that we know pitfals associated with buying them.  And as for pulling a horse apart, this was not the case, I was merely pointing out a valid experience. Hardly pulling it apart....

I am bowing out of this now, I really am, its getting most silly.


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## teacups (25 November 2015)

I didn't misquote you: I didn't even try to quote you. I told you how what you wrote came across to me.

I was also trying to be nice when I said there must be a misunderstanding bewteen what you intended to say and how it came across when written down. 

My understanding of '...you would be great working for the tabloids as they misquote people all the time!...' (that is a quote) is that your intention is to insult me in return: pretty sure there is no misunderstanding there.


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## rachk89 (27 November 2015)

applecart14 said:



			FFS -Missing the point again....someone please put me out of my misery.  Does no one read the previous replies??  ITS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE FACT HE IS A RIDING SCHOOL HORSE (AND THEREFORE WE CONSIDER HIM RUBBISH) -END OF.  AND BREATHE......
		
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Did i say specifically that you or anyone here won't like him because he is a riding school horse? No so take your own advice and breathe. Calm down.

Unfortunately for the OP she WILL meet people who are snobby about riding school horses. Maybe they are on here maybe they aren't I don't know any of you personally. I am telling her to ignore the opinions of others when it comes to her horse that's all.

And frankly with all the people who jumped up and down going "oh watch out you may get problems with him being an ex riding school horse I know loads of people who had problems" then is it any wonder she took offence? Its the same as when people say cobs are useless you all get huffy about that so understand it from her view.


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## paddi22 (27 November 2015)

rachk89 said:



			And frankly with all the people who jumped up and down going "oh watch out you may get problems with him being an ex riding school horse I know loads of people who had problems" then is it any wonder she took offence? Its the same as when people say cobs are useless you all get huffy about that so understand it from her view.
		
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But even if people DID say that, it still doesn't mean she should take offence at it. I sounded out about an exracer on a forum years ago, and 90% of the comments were about people dramatically saying the issues they or their friends had. I didn't take offence to ANY of it as no one knew either me or the horse, so it wasn't personal, it was people talking about THEIR experiences. And down the line I was grateful people raised the issues they had, as some of them arose later on. Like when the horse was hyper, i remembered someone had said mollassed food affected theirs, so changing diet was a quick and easy way to knock that issue on the head. Having heard peoples story helped me pinpoint any issues as they arose. 

 The OPs horse and riding school sounds great so it doesn't sound like she will have these issues, but i don't see the harm in people telling their experiences.  If everyone had just replied to my ex-racer thread saying 'good luck' 'he sounds amazing' 'gonna be brilliant' i would have gotten a great ego boost, but I wouldn't have learned anything or expanded my knowledge at all.


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## Apercrumbie (27 November 2015)

OP I think you're making a sensible decision buying this horse.  You know him well and he sounds perfect for someone coming back into horses.  Any comments I made about him potentially changing were very well-intentioned.  I didn't say them to put you off, or to be mean about a riding school horse.  As I said I think Dougal sounds great.  I said them because teething issues are almost inevitable and it is best to be prepared.  You have support around you so I have no doubt you will cope well with his settling issues.  I think most people (not all) have been well intentioned on this thread and simply wanted to give you a heads up about potential issues, again just so you are aware, not to be mean or snobby.  A couple of posters have been less helpful but that is all part and parcel of an online forum - you get a complete cross section of opinions.  This is useful as you can consider things you wouldn't have thought of and apply what works for you while ignoring what doesn't.  I hope you continue to post on this forum - I would love to hear about your progress with Dougal when you get him next spring.


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## LovesCobs (27 November 2015)

Apercrumbie said:



			OP I think you're making a sensible decision buying this horse.  You know him well and he sounds perfect for someone coming back into horses.  Any comments I made about him potentially changing were very well-intentioned.  I didn't say them to put you off, or to be mean about a riding school horse.  As I said I think Dougal sounds great.  I said them because teething issues are almost inevitable and it is best to be prepared.  You have support around you so I have no doubt you will cope well with his settling issues.  I think most people (not all) have been well intentioned on this thread and simply wanted to give you a heads up about potential issues, again just so you are aware, not to be mean or snobby.  A couple of posters have been less helpful but that is all part and parcel of an online forum - you get a complete cross section of opinions.  This is useful as you can consider things you wouldn't have thought of and apply what works for you while ignoring what doesn't.  I hope you continue to post on this forum - I would love to hear about your progress with Dougal when you get him next spring.
		
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couldn't have put it better myself. I'd also like to know how you get on. my point was only to then advise Dougal sounded better in terms of buying as he may well have more zip about him when he's yours.


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