# Suspected hindgut ulcers?



## BritishEquestrian (31 October 2015)

Hi

I have a mare who in the spring was diagnosed with grade 4 gastric ulcers - she was then put on Gatroguard for 3 months decreasing the amount each month to wean her off it & was scoped clear after the 1st month & then 3 months later scoped again to see she had no ulcers still. 

She has now started showing the symptoms again (Refusing to go forwards, hates my legs on her, girthy etc) but there has been no change in routine/feed. It definitely is ulcers/stomach area related as saddle/teeth/Physio has all been checked.

The vet has given a weeks dose of gastroguard to see if that improves her at all (In case it is ulcers again) but I am now thinking that it could be hindgut ulcers? Has anyone had any experience with these & found they are more prone after having GG for so long & what was the treatment like? 

Thank you


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## D66 (31 October 2015)

Ulcers are caused by something -pain, lack of fibre in feed, cereals, etc.  It is one thing to get rid of the ulcers but you also need to get rid of the cause/change management or they will return.


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## PorkChop (31 October 2015)

If you are on facebook there is a really good page for Horses with Ulcers.

I don't have first hand experience with ulcers however I do try and feed my horses a gut friendly diet - but I do know that some horses are prone to them and in some cases need to be on a low level of medication for quite some time.


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## Melody Grey (31 October 2015)

BritishEquestrian said:



			Hi

I have a mare who in the spring was diagnosed with grade 4 gastric ulcers - she was then put on Gatroguard for 3 months decreasing the amount each month to wean her off it & was scoped clear after the 1st month & then 3 months later scoped again to see she had no ulcers still. 

She has now started showing the symptoms again (Refusing to go forwards, hates my legs on her, girthy etc) but there has been no change in routine/feed. It definitely is ulcers/stomach area related as saddle/teeth/Physio has all been checked.

The vet has given a weeks dose of gastroguard to see if that improves her at all (In case it is ulcers again) but I am now thinking that it could be hindgut ulcers? Has anyone had any experience with these & found they are more prone after having GG for so long & what was the treatment like? 

Thank you
		
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I am in EXACTLY the same situation with my mare, but possibly about a fortnight ahead of you. We're on Gastrogard again and after the first week, symptoms were worsening. GG can exacerbate hind gut issues due to the lowered acid levels in the stomach allowing less digested food into the hindgut....have been doing my research!!!  So.... We're now on Succeed supplement as well to help the hind gut.

I think there's every possibility that your first course of GG could have altered conditions in the hindgut.  Out of curiosity- did you horse's ulcer symptoms ever completely disappear? Melody's didn't even though she'd scoped clear at the end of the course. She still had a little windsuck and was very swishy with her tail, so I had long suspected something else was going on, but only recently did the symptoms get really bad.


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## BritishEquestrian (31 October 2015)

Melody Grey said:



			I am in EXACTLY the same situation with my mare, but possibly about a fortnight ahead of you. We're on Gastrogard again and after the first week, symptoms were worsening. GG can exacerbate hind gut issues due to the lowered acid levels in the stomach allowing less digested food into the hindgut....have been doing my research!!!  So.... We're now on Succeed supplement as well to help the hind gut.

I think there's every possibility that your first course of GG could have altered conditions in the hindgut.  Out of curiosity- did you horse's ulcer symptoms ever completely disappear? Melody's didn't even though she'd scoped clear at the end of the course. She still had a little windsuck and was very swishy with her tail, so I had long suspected something else was going on, but only recently did the symptoms get really bad.
		
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That is so strange - our situations are basically identical! Her symptoms never disappeared even though the scoping came back clear she was still reluctant to jump but we assumed perhaps that she had lost herconfidence. Definitely going to investigate the hind gut ulcers - have you seen any improvement with the Succeed supplement?


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## okepunya (1 November 2015)

LJR said:



			If you are on facebook there is a really good page for Horses with Ulcers.






 .
		
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 can you show me link it?


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## BethH (1 November 2015)

Have a look at the Protexein products - might help


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## PorkChop (1 November 2015)

okepunya said:



			can you show me link it?
		
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Here you go  www.facebook.com/groups/horseswithulcers/


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## onemoretime (1 November 2015)

Have a chat with Alex Gingell at Hack Up Bespoke Supplements.  He will make up a supplement especially tailored to your horse.


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## Melody Grey (1 November 2015)

BritishEquestrian said:



			That is so strange - our situations are basically identical! Her symptoms never disappeared even though the scoping came back clear she was still reluctant to jump but we assumed perhaps that she had lost herconfidence. Definitely going to investigate the hind gut ulcers - have you seen any improvement with the Succeed supplement?
		
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Yes, the fact symptoms never completely disappeared makes me wonder whether my mare had hind gut ulcers all the way along?! We recently moved on to our winter grazing and although there was a period of adjustment to the new pasture, I'm wondering in hindsight whether it was enough and the new grass (and more of it!) have caused a flare up for her.

Symptoms are still there today, but she's only been on succeed for 4 days and is still on GG, so it's probably too early to tell. I wonder if anyone reading this has used succeed and how long it took for a noticeable improvement to be seen? I suspect that we're not going to get a huge improvement until the GG is either stopped or dosage stepped down.


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## Melody Grey (1 November 2015)

onemoretime said:



			Have a chat with Alex Gingell at Hack Up Bespoke Supplements.  He will make up a supplement especially tailored to your horse.
		
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Has anyone used Hack up for an ulcer preventative supplement. If so, what is the cost roughly? (Appreciated that they're bespoke and prices will vary on that basis!) on the £90/month Succeed, I'm just looking for alternatives as/ when the insurance won't pay for it any longer.


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## NJJolly (2 November 2015)

Melody Grey said:



			I am in EXACTLY the same situation with my mare, but possibly about a fortnight ahead of you. We're on Gastrogard again and after the first week, symptoms were worsening. GG can exacerbate hind gut issues due to the lowered acid levels in the stomach allowing less digested food into the hindgut....have been doing my research!!!  So.... We're now on Succeed supplement as well to help the hind gut.

I think there's every possibility that your first course of GG could have altered conditions in the hindgut.  Out of curiosity- did you horse's ulcer symptoms ever completely disappear? Melody's didn't even though she'd scoped clear at the end of the course. She still had a little windsuck and was very swishy with her tail, so I had long suspected something else was going on, but only recently did the symptoms get really bad.
		
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My mare has recently scoped clear of grade 3-4 squamous and glandular ulcers - still on 1/4 dose gastroguard to wean her off....I also feel hind gut issues may be involved too, so have started her on yea saac which is relatively cheap - I noticed a difference in her poos straight away.  Also, make sure you are feeding low grain, low starch, molasses free etc.  The horses with ulcers facebook group is really good - full of advice x


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## BritishEquestrian (2 November 2015)

Melody Grey said:



			Has anyone used Hack up for an ulcer preventative supplement. If so, what is the cost roughly? (Appreciated that they're bespoke and prices will vary on that basis!) on the £90/month Succeed, I'm just looking for alternatives as/ when the insurance won't pay for it any longer.
		
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Oh my didn't quite realise succeed was quite that much yikes! Is it not possible just to use it more as a cure like GG or is it all permanent?


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## BritishEquestrian (2 November 2015)

NJJolly said:



			My mare has recently scoped clear of grade 3-4 squamous and glandular ulcers - still on 1/4 dose gastroguard to wean her off....I also feel hind gut issues may be involved too, so have started her on yea saac which is relatively cheap - I noticed a difference in her poos straight away.  Also, make sure you are feeding low grain, low starch, molasses free etc.  The horses with ulcers facebook group is really good - full of advice x
		
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Thank you I think I am in that group already.. Just wondering if the Yea saac would make much difference as she more is suffering pain related more than runny poo's/going off food, I will see what the vet says but very hard to justify the £90 a month permanently for the proper succeed supplement once she is back to normal & insurance has run out.


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## Melody Grey (2 November 2015)

BritishEquestrian said:



			Oh my didn't quite realise succeed was quite that much yikes! Is it not possible just to use it more as a cure like GG or is it all permanent?
		
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According to my vets, succeed claims to heal stomach and hind gut ulcers in three months if used alone. Not sure whether the science is there to back that one up?  We're still on GG though due to the severity of the ulcers.  

Succeed is a supplement and not a medicine, so presumably it works over a longer time frame by making the conditions in the gut calm enough for it to heal itself.  

Yes, £90/ month is an awful lot and will be almost unaffordable for me once the insurance is up. I've read a really good old thread on here with reference to someone making their own version consisting mainly of oat flour with added amino acids. I'm seriously considering having a go!!


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## JoClark (4 November 2015)

I am on the FB group, horses with ulcers, I advise anyone to add it, very helpful. Different stories and fixes for everyone, no one fix for all. 

Mine recently went down hill again as the grass went down and I didn't put hay in the field soon enough, I then realised and put a round in and he started getting better but clearly the damage had been done, he's now on abler for a month the maintenance for a bit and hopefully ill have control of it again.

Thunderbrooks feeds are very good, I use thunderbrooks chaff and gut restore which helps the whole gut, stomach and hind. Aviform pro complete balancer or thunderbrooks do base mix which has all you need in.  Micronised linseed from Charnwood milling and organic grass pellets. My horse suffers with high starch and sugar contents, equijewel made him really bad 

We really need a list as to what is actually good for horses, to much junk put in feeds now days


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