# Hobday and Tieback advice



## ClaireT (12 March 2008)

My horse had his operation yesterday and I wonder if any of you guys can give me advice on post-op care. He was a stage 4, but thankfully they scoped him again after the op and he's shown 100% improvement. 
	
	
		
		
	


	




The vet advised total box rest, but said that he can get led out for grass. What are other people's experiences? I know the 4 weeks box rest will pass in no time, and I'm trying to think of ways to keep him settled and manageable. We are on a large yard and I'm thinking he might be happier moved to a quieter corner to recuperate.
Any advice you can give would be greatly appreciated


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## pinktiger (12 March 2008)

my chap had this done back in november by geof lane, the hole that drains has to be cleaned twice a day and the scar kept dry,, my boy was on 6 weeks box rest and not aloud out until rescoped,, all feeding done from the ground soaked hay, and keep as quiet as poss 'no yelling'!!!! Coughing might happen but mine never coughed, but if yours does it shouldnt be too much, no green/yellow discarge from the nose,,, still dont really understand it but 'no sugabeet'!!  you will notice nw how many horses have had this done, and also horses that should have it done!!!!!


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## bexandspooky (12 March 2008)

I think generally they are happier in a fairly busy area so that they have alot to watch - that way they dont get quite so bored!

That and plenty of stable toys and small holed haynets!

Dont know anything about the op itself, but hope it goes well!!


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## Quarrybank (12 March 2008)

I'm prob not the best person to speak to as Spider has had complications  
	
	
		
		
	


	




He was done in October by Geoff Lane. The tie back &amp; hobday itself was a complete sucess. Unfortunately Spider has not adapted to eating &amp; swallowing post op &amp; thus ends up with food going down the wrong way i.e into his broncual tubes  
	
	
		
		
	


	




Ditto the 6 weeks box rest, then a gradual return to work. All food on the floor, soaked hay, no sugar beet &amp; no very lush grass.
I would suggest you take his temperature every day &amp; then if there are any complications developing you catch them early.
If you notice any food coming down his nose, if he goes off his food or any excess coughing I would call your vet just to check.
I also ditto the comment that it is more common than you think!  
	
	
		
		
	


	




It is an op that has a high sucess rate &amp; only 10% have complications. unfortunately I was one of the unlucky 10%.
However I would still have gone through the op as his prognosis as an eventer was not good without it.  
	
	
		
		
	


	




Spider is back in work since early jan &amp; is def improving, so I'm still hopeful that he might fulfill his eventing career.


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## ClaireT (12 March 2008)

Pinktiger - thanks for your advice - has your boy recovered well? Did you take him out of his box or did you leave him in for the entire recovery time? 
I'm a bit worried about him being a spooky prat if I take him for grass!! 
	
	
		
		
	


	




 We feed everything off the floor anyway, so that will be fine, but will soak his hay. When did you start riding him again, and how much work did you do at first??

Bexandspooky - thanks for your thoughts 
	
	
		
		
	


	




, but I would never use a haynet, especially not for a horse on boxrest. Horses are designed to eat from the floor so that their lungs are kept clear. He will be kept away from our main yard as having horses go in and out past him every day is only going to frustrate him, poor boy.


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## ClaireT (12 March 2008)

OMG Quarrybank, what you and Spider have been through sounds awful. 
	
	
		
		
	


	




It sounds like you've had a long, long road back to recovery. I am so pleased for you that he can hopefully go on to event.
Do you mind me asking if your insurance covered all the post op complications?


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## Quarrybank (12 March 2008)

Yes it been a fairly horrid few months, but even in the last few weeks he's improved lot's. He's now cantering &amp; I'm going to start jumping him in a few weeks &amp; see how he copes.
I have to walk alot when I start working him &amp; he then coughs a fair bit to clear himself, then repeat in trot &amp; then canter. Once he's had a good clear out in all paces he works fine with just the odd cough, so I'm hopeful with this routine he'll be able to work ok.
Re the Insurance - I'm with Petplan &amp; they've been fantastic. They paid out for the op &amp; all complication. I just had to pay my excess &amp; the livery for stabling while he was in the vets.
Good luck with you boy. If you are unsure about anything please feel free to ask.


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## pinktiger (12 March 2008)

am sorry to hear about QB trouble with the tie back, and i think you have a good example of both extremes,, My chap has had no complications at all, he eats fine, and there is no coughing at all!  I am, i know very lucky, as for the box rest the whole reason is to allow all healing and the implant to stay in place, if you do take him out and he gets away from you he could do some serious damage, for that reason my chap never got a foot over treshold!!  I left him in the whole time and just fed him hay no hard feed.. He has hard feed now and he went straight out in sand paddoks once scoped and clear, he is only 3 and ive just started backing him, he sounds fab, and again in work no coughing or nasal discarge!  My insurance nfu paid no prob they were fab, paid the excess ect n livery


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## Holloa (12 March 2008)

My dad's horse had the same op by Geoff Lane back in october 07, same as one of the other posters ( sorry didn't copy your user name!) his op went very smoothly, but because he was so big 17.3hh, he developed a myopathy, spasm in the muscle (like a dead leg) under the GA. This meant that he had to stay at the hospital for a further 3 weeks whilst being on drips, steriods, given physio etc.. it was quite worrying, at one point they thought his pedal bone on the other leg would rotate due to the strain, as he was resting the whole of his weight on his left leg to compensate! we were distraught, but luckily with acupuncture and steroids,(yes we tried everything) he came good.

Luckily for us, by the time he was ready to come home, the hospital had looked after his wound, so we didn't need to clean it, it had healed up nicely.
As far as box rest, he was on box rested for 2 more weeks once home. Then let out into a small paddock for 1hour a day. Typical bad luck he got an abcess so was back on box rest for 2 more weeks!! :-( Now finally he is out, in a work routine of 2 weeks walk hacks, then short bits of trot, and now little bits of canter work. Lots of hill work. and he's coping really well, we still get bits of nasal discharge from time to time, nothing to worry about, i asked my vet, he coughs a bit, but it soon clears. and he's acting like he's got a second chance on life! really happy to see.
hay is on the ground.
got the same advice about sugarbeet,  asked the hospital why this was, they didn't know! so ignored that, and he's on 1/2 scoop in each feed, hasn't bothered him, i like sugarbeet as a weight gainer, as he lost soooo much muscle when he was in hospital, was like a toast rack! hes better now.

hope this helps.

if there's anything else, don't hesitate to ask.

i'm hoping to hunt him next season.. just need to get his fitness up now, which ain't easy with such a big horse!!! ;-)


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## GTs (12 March 2008)

My horse had zero days box rest after her surgery - oops!


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## ClaireT (12 March 2008)

Thanks for your comments Melsk1, am glad to hear that your horse is now on the mend. I am glad you mentioned feeding sugar beet as that will be one of my questions for the hospital tomorrow. This plays a big part in my horse's diet and he's only just putting on weight after the winter, so I don't want to cut it out unless they advise me to. 
What would you recommend feed-wise? A few posters have said they fed hay only, but my boy would waste away if I cut out his hard feed!


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## Britestar (12 March 2008)

Unfortunately our horse suffered the same problems with myopathy, and tragically didn't make it. Its a year now, and we still miss him everyday


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## Holloa (12 March 2008)

I am feeding him 2 good scoops D&amp;H Alfalfa, 1 good scoop D&amp; H Country cubes (which is low to medium work) i think they used to be pasture nuts but name was changed, plus 1/2 scoop Kwikbeet (soaked), all this is twice a day. on top for his dinner he gets 1 scoop garlic ( as i think this helps with his respiratory system, not just for flies!) a really good glug of soya oil prob more like 1 cup full. carrots, plus mudx and farriers formula.  and he gets 3/4 slices of hay at night and about 2/3 slices in the day. we don't have much grazing at the mo, but he's looking much much better. just need to work on the muscle now!

thanks for the nice comments! here's a pic for interest, don't know if you can tell much difference??

*first one before the op july 07* 







*2nd after the op- well just recently march 08*


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## Holloa (12 March 2008)

I feel very lucky that we still have Maverick... i'm  so sorry that your boy/girl didn't make it. RIP


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## Quarrybank (12 March 2008)

re the feeding, Spider is not easy to keep weight on either. He was on fibre only at first, but this was hay / haylage plus Alfalfa A as a hard feed replacement.
He to lost a lot of condition, but that was due to his complications. Once he came home the second time he looked like an RSPCA case  
	
	
		
		
	


	




 &amp; I changed the Alfalfa A to Alfalfa A oil which is the same energy as a medium mix. He has 2 large scoops of that, plus 1/2 scoop of conditioning mix (he hated having no mix!  
	
	
		
		
	


	




 ) twice a day. plus garlic &amp; formula 4 feet (as his vit &amp;min supplement &amp; to help his feet) in his evening feed. He also has ad-lib hay.
He now looks fab &amp; has put all his condition back on &amp; has started to muscle up with the work. If it wasn't for the cough things would be perfect now 
	
	
		
		
	


	




If you don't have any issues I think you can feed what you want (sugar beet aside)


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## VictoriaEDT (12 March 2008)

ditto quarrybank! I was also one of the unlucky 10%

Romeo had his op (grade 5 LH) at Bristol by nigel woodford and geoff lane and the op was a success but Ro got an infection and we nearly lost him. He wouldnt eat, his temp went sky high and he was shaking all over. Scoped him and there was a tiny yellow pimple above that larynx, showing infection on the other side of the tissue. 2 weeks later (and £5000 not inc the £1500 for the op) he came home. 

No real probs since, he coughs a lot at start of exercise, mucous from nose very occasionally. They said to stable him no where near (min of 50 yards) a hay barn or dry hay for at least 6 months after the op and put him on haylage.


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## toomanyhorses26 (12 March 2008)

Does anyone know the reason for the no sugar beet rule with horses such as this?? My 7 year old had the op as a 2 year old and was fed sugar beet as part of his ration when he was racing but when I had him vetted my vet mention that I shouldn't feed him sugar beet but couldn't really tell me why!!??


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## Holloa (13 March 2008)

I would like to know the answer too!! Would be very interested if someone finds out!


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## ClaireT (13 March 2008)

I went to see Aston today and the vet in charge of him said she couldn't understand why feeding sugar beet would be any different from other hard feed, provided that it was kept moist? She was going to ask the surgeon, just too make sure. Aston had a feed in when I went to visit,and there was sugar beet in it!


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## pinktiger (13 March 2008)

i was told by vet,surg,nurse and was also on discarge notes, i think is to do with the husks and the horse not being in control of it dribbling down the wrong way, the feed should be damp enough so the horse can make a mush in the mouth before it swallows????? is what i was told!!  i thk it depends on whether you think your horse is coping wel and want to take the risk!


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## Duddy07 (26 March 2008)

Ok.. as you all know a heck of a lot about this subject advice please.

I have found a 13 year old ID x who is absolutely wonderful in everyway BUT he has between 1-3 roar.  Not been confirmed by owners vet as never wanted the horse scoped without sedation and decided not to operate.  The horse roars even in trot and has trouble (i think) with stamina.  I have him on a weeks trial and basically he seemed to get tired very quickly and was breathless after 20 mins jumping.  She wants £3k for him all in.   

Is the tieback operation costly?  Is it done under general?  I just know this horse would be one in a million if he didn't roar but am very worried about going down this avenue I have no clue about.


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## kerilli (26 March 2008)

i'd have a chat with your vet about it, tbh.
there can be complications, they're rare, but someone on here is in an awful position at the moment with a horse they had operated on which had complications and now aspirates food. prognosis not good at all.
i think the horse is expensive in light of his problem, tbh. i would expect a reduction in price because of it, unless he is a bona fide saint.


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## Duddy07 (26 March 2008)

Ok so spoken to my vet and she said I can continue to fork out for the 5 stage vetting to see if anything else is wrong with him and then endoscope him resting.  That's £300 gone right away.  If potentially he has bad case then will need to put on a treadmill.  That's £500.  Then he will need to have tieback £1000 and then she said I could have potential problems with after care.  

Walk away I think.  Thanks for your help and I hope the person with the poorly horse is ok 
	
	
		
		
	


	




  Sending lots of spinks!!!!  (Good luck).


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