# I am such an idiot need desperate help



## katymay (31 December 2013)

as the title states really! bought a lovely NF pony before Christmas, lightly backed, a little bargy with personal space but felt this was something I could work on, he came complete with dually headcoller and was a bit of a dream come true when we first got him, happy to be stabled overnight even though he had previously lived out, had his teeth done, he was nervous but well behaved, took him for a walk around the roads and he was like a puppy on a lead, stopping and sniffing everything, move on a few weeks and he has changed into a monster, OH went to catch him and he literally turned around and double barrelled him, managed to eventually catch him and put it down to the move to fresh grass, but ever since then he has got progressively worse, constantly tossing his head in the field at me, im sure he knows he is the boss, wont lead nicely at all, even around the small paddock, when he decided he wants to go he just sets his neck and tanks off with me holding on for dear life, I cannot trust him enough to take him out for a walk for some extra grass he just isn't safe, I am panicking because he needs to be trimmed and I am not sure how I can get him up to the house safely! he isn't alone, I have a little Dartmoor that the boys ride who is as good as gold. I really feel like giving up and selling the whole lot, I was stupid to think I could bring this youngster on but wondering how I am going to sell a monster  I am a total failure, I have emailed a professional to hopefully come and help me but what can I do in the meantime? I am fast becoming petrified of him and he knows it


----------



## twiggy2 (31 December 2013)

is he gelded?


----------



## katymay (31 December 2013)

yes he is gelded, he is four in March so still very immature but knows his size!


----------



## HaffiesRock (31 December 2013)

How old is he and when was he gelded?

I have a 4 year old NF mare, lightly backed and she has some personal space issues too. She bullies my boy something chronic and is very aggressive to my boy when food is around (but not me) I always though NF's were sweet little ponies!


----------



## twiggy2 (31 December 2013)

get the professional in to help, stop all hard feed and move to a field with less grass if you can and feed hay instead. do you know when he was gelded?  
don't get too worried just get help to get back on track, moving yards can really upset some horses but they do calm down again as long as they are kept in line


----------



## luckyoldme (31 December 2013)

the phrase 'he knows he is boss speaks volumes' and if you are an idiot then so am I.
I felt exactly the same about my now big softie.
I was terrified evan getting him in from the field, then someone who is more confident went out to get him one day. He tried it on with her, she turned around roared at him and his attitude totally changed.
I honestly think you need to find someone with confidence and experience to show you the way with this lad!
Alternatively maybe if you post which area you are in someone on here might come to your aid!


----------



## HaffiesRock (31 December 2013)

Completely agree it is down to confidence. I have no problems with my little mare at all but my sharer really does. She cant get my boy out of the field without help as the mare crowds her, I just give her a look and she moves aside. Confidence is everything with horses, specially young ones.


----------



## HaffiesRock (31 December 2013)

When my pony arrived (6ish weeks ago?) She had been in at night, heavily rugged and being fed molichaff Cherry and nuts. I whipped the rug off, chucked her out 24/7 with my boy and swapped her feed for hay. She has calmed down no end now and lost some of her extra weight. Maybe the change of yard and routine might be something to do with it? Could he go out 24/7?


----------



## katymay (31 December 2013)

Thanks all, he is in a tiny paddock at the moment with not a lot of grass, he must be getting something as he hardly touches his hay overnight, the only reason I am stabling him is to try and preserve the grass a little as grazing is scarce! not sure what age he was gelded? will check out his passport, he only gets fed a small feed of high fibre nuts (soaked) with a large handful of oat straw mixed in twice a day, I took him off the speedibeet in case that was blowing his mind! I am near Sparkford (Yeovil) if anyone wants to come and look at him  he is a bully to the Dartmoor but doesn't like to be apart from him (Dartmoor is in his own little fenced off area as he is v v fat) a lovely lady on here helped me before with a very spooky childs pony I had that she managed to make come good and we sold on don't want to have to hang my head in shame and tell her I have done it again


----------



## be positive (31 December 2013)

katymay said:



			Thanks all, he is in a tiny paddock at the moment with not a lot of grass, he must be getting something as he hardly touches his hay overnight, the only reason I am stabling him is to try and preserve the grass a little as grazing is scarce! not sure what age he was gelded? will check out his passport, he only gets fed a small feed of high fibre nuts (soaked) with a large handful of oat straw mixed in twice a day, I took him off the speedibeet in case that was blowing his mind! I am near Sparkford (Yeovil) if anyone wants to come and look at him  he is a bully to the Dartmoor but doesn't like to be apart from him (Dartmoor is in his own little fenced off area as he is v v fat) a lovely lady on here helped me before with a very spooky childs pony I had that she managed to make come good and we sold on don't want to have to hang my head in shame and tell her I have done it again 

Click to expand...

Sorry you are having trouble, again!!!! if you want you are welcome to contact me and I will try and come over in the next few days and have a look at the latest monster, no shame in admitting you are struggling, young ponies do go through stages where they may push the boundaries, it is how you deal with them before they become too established that will make the difference, getting help sooner rather than later.


----------



## luckyoldme (31 December 2013)

im a bit too far away from you in Scotland (just), I agree with what others say I think its a traumatic thing for a horse to move and some take it really bad. He is needing you to show him there is nothing to worry about , but when you are nervous he thinks he should be too. Im planning on taking on another horse in the next couple of years and I will be hoping to have a winter with it before evan attempting to ride,,,,,,, my thing would be to turn it out and bring it in every day for a feed and fuss while I bonded with it,,, in all honesty im a terrible rider ane rely on the horse liking me!


----------



## katymay (31 December 2013)

Thank you all, Ann, I will definitely be in touch soon, you are such a star, I am going to give it another attempt tomorrow lunchtime to just walk him calmly around the paddock, will be armed with gloves, lunge line, lunge whip, hat and body protector, he needs to learn that I am boss (she says running and hiding)


----------



## Antw23uk (31 December 2013)

This wont sound nice but to be honest its you that's the issue (sorry told you it wouldn't sound nice) and I think from what I can make out you keep them at home? I think you sound too inexperienced to be keeping ponies at home with no guidance. Sorry if that sounds too frank but to me you sound like you need to be on a livery yard with experienced people around you to gain knowledge and support from them. In this instance (again it seems) that you need to get someone experienced in to help you 
Best of luck.


----------



## be positive (31 December 2013)

Antw23uk said:



			This wont sound nice but to be honest its you that's the issue (sorry told you it wouldn't sound nice) and I think from what I can make out you keep them at home? I think you sound too inexperienced to be keeping ponies at home with no guidance. Sorry if that sounds too frank but to me you sound like you need to be on a livery yard with experienced people around you to gain knowledge and support from them. In this instance (again it seems) that you need to get someone experienced in to help you 
Best of luck.
		
Click to expand...

To be fair to the OP she does keep the ponies at home without the support a livery yard may, although not always, offer but the first pony that she required help with was a little monster that had been miss sold as a quiet childrens pony which he certainly was not, he was barely broken had been ridden only by a large adult and had no manners on the ground, he was restarted and sold to a more suitable home with a more experienced child to bring him on. He was extremely challenging and most people would have struggled with him trying to teach even the basic lunging and long reining which had been missed out in his early education.
This new pony just sounds as if it needs to be occupied and learn a few boundaries, the owner needs some tools in the box in order to keep on top of the behaviour before it gets out of hand, everyone requires help at times and recognising when to ask for help is a good start to improving your experience and knowledge.


----------



## katymay (1 January 2014)

be positive said:



			To be fair to the OP she does keep the ponies at home without the support a livery yard may, although not always, offer but the first pony that she required help with was a little monster that had been miss sold as a quiet childrens pony which he certainly was not, he was barely broken had been ridden only by a large adult and had no manners on the ground, he was restarted and sold to a more suitable home with a more experienced child to bring him on. He was extremely challenging and most people would have struggled with him trying to teach even the basic lunging and long reining which had been missed out in his early education.
This new pony just sounds as if it needs to be occupied and learn a few boundaries, the owner needs some tools in the box in order to keep on top of the behaviour before it gets out of hand, everyone requires help at times and recognising when to ask for help is a good start to improving your experience and knowledge.
		
Click to expand...

Thank you Be positive, Harry was a little monster and is doing really well in his new home, I am the first to hold my hands up and say I lack experience, I guess I have only ever had well behaved ponies growing up and coupled with being a child I was never nervous, go on a few years now I have a family and am more aware of what could happen it has made me a little nervous, well my plans to work on him today have gone out of the window, blowing a hooley out there and raining hard, although I might say sod it and do it anyway, after he has had a few hours to fill his tummy!


----------



## Antw23uk (1 January 2014)

katymay said:



			Thank you Be positive, Harry was a little monster and is doing really well in his new home, I am the first to hold my hands up and say I lack experience, I guess I have only ever had well behaved ponies growing up and coupled with being a child I was never nervous, go on a few years now I have a family and am more aware of what could happen it has made me a little nervous, well my plans to work on him today have gone out of the window, blowing a hooley out there and raining hard, although I might say sod it and do it anyway, after he has had a few hours to fill his tummy!
		
Click to expand...

I think leave it today. The saying in the horsey world ..Choose your fights carefully so basically don't set yourself up to fail. All our lot are being dippies today with this wind and rain so If I was in yor situation I wouldn't be trying anything when the odds are stacked against you with the weather today. Good luck


----------



## Nettle123 (1 January 2014)

Antw23uk said:



			I think leave it today. The saying in the horsey world ..Choose your fights carefully so basically don't set yourself up to fail. All our lot are being dippies today with this wind and rain so If I was in yor situation I wouldn't be trying anything when the odds are stacked against you with the weather today. Good luck 

Click to expand...

This is so true !


----------



## katymay (1 January 2014)

Nettle123 said:



			This is so true !
		
Click to expand...

I have just spent the last few hours pottering around the paddock, mucking out stables and giving him a good scratch if he came over, I left his stable door open and he has happily gone inside and is now munching on a haynet In the dry, the door will remain open and he can come and go as he pleases. Think I need to spend some time just getting to know him a little so I can trust him rather than winding each other up with battles, I don't want to leave things too long though otherwise he is surely going to know he is top dog, I am reading  through Rick Gore on the internet and learning about horse behaviour, hopefully it will give me tips to tackle things, even chatted to his old owner last night to ask what methods she used, don't want this to be another failure.
I really appreciate all the advice given, its nice to not feel so alone in all this, thank you


----------



## NicandLiv (3 January 2014)

I've seen quite a lot of people recently giving up so easily with their ponies, so glad you're sticking at it.  My mare was horrid to her previous owner, rearing, kicking, biting etc.  I've had her three months and she is a dream.  She is my first pony so I'm not even that experienced (I can't even canter just yet!), she just needed a change of scene and a change of owner, her previous owner was in the mindset that if Dee turned to bite, she didn't like it, so owner would stop doing anything.  If she kicked out on a hack, she'd get off and walk home. Never made her stand still, didn't push her out of her space etc.    

I have found with mine if I "work" (I can't even call it that because it isn't lol) her every day for up to 5 minutes.  I'd do, catch, take into another field if possible, stand, back, walk on, stand, back, move (turn on forehand).  And then I'd get on and do my stuff, she hated being tied up so I used to tie her there and leave her, yanking her headcollar when she moved, released pressure when she stood nicely, I'd then talk to her and give her a stroke.

If I do this with her every day she is brilliant, if I miss a day she'll start to regress.  Only small steps, for example she kept fidgeting being tied up, or she'd be slightly bargy.  With this I always make sure that my elbow can hit her chest if I push it out, if she gets bargy I elbow her in the chest, look at her in the eye and say "back" in a very firm but non shouty voice.  IF she barges again I will make her go back four or five paces, if she does it again, I back her up even more (but we've never gotten to this stage).  

If I am in the field poo picking, and my mare comes over (which she never used to do, she's only just started, and I see it as a positive sign) and follows me, I will talk to her and sometimes pat her, but the moment she comes right into my space I tell her to go back and wave my arms.  I was doubting doing this as I thought it might make her scared of me, btu it doesn't, it's teaching her she can come over but she can't come into my space uninvited, it's rude and could be dangerous potentially. 



What's your boy like with children?  My mare I assume had no bad experiences with children and she's fantastic with them.

I would be inclined to do some in hand work with him, it's worked wonders to help the bond between me and my girl.  I did walk, halt, turn on the forehand and I am just teaching her leg yielding.  If she is having trouble with one particular thing I go back to basics so we can always finish on a positive note.  IT made me feel confident and proud of her when she achieved these things, and it brought us closer together as at the same time you're being the leader by moving them and getting them listening to you.


----------



## Skye27 (7 January 2014)

you're not an idiot.. for you to be accepting you're struggling and in need of help, speaks volumes!! 
i really struggled with my youngster when i first got her and was ready to give up.. but, i didn't.. i set myself realistic goals etc and kept track on everything.. which although, it is time consuming, when you look back at even the little things you've done, it boosts your own confidence. stick at it.. if you feel like you're having more issues with your confidence and your horse rather than having fun or making no progress.. then it's time to call it a day. But logging everything, will really help you keep open minded on all the pro's and con's.
really wish you the best of luck!


----------



## YasandCrystal (7 January 2014)

Even experienced horse(wo)men can have trouble with bolshy youngsters. I have 2 youngsters - a rising 4 yr old and a rising 5 yr old and they are big and strong and I have had my share of problems with them. When you are used to older mannerly horses it's easy to forget how challenging youngsters can be and how often (like with small children) you have to repeat yourself multiple times tio achieve what seems a tiny goal.  My filly will rear and plunge and double barrel which is not fun when you are trying to lead her out to her paddock. I just make sure I have a hat and gloves on and carry a whip and always use a rope halter or a dually one for maximum control. The problem is as soon as the horse has a wobbly unless you take control again to give them the confidence in you as a safe leader and good place to be - they lose faith in you and the problem is then self perpetuating.  It's easy to say 'take control' but in reality it's good to get a professional to show you exactly how to tackle bullying behaviour by your youngster and how to remain detached yet fully in control and safe.  
And of course you are not an idiot and you are not alone either.Good luck OP.


----------



## dogatemysalad (7 January 2014)

If its any comfort to you, a stallion was sent to my former yard for a course in 'how to be a nice horse and not try to kill everyone'. 
Who was his owner ? A very well known international eventer with years of experience. 

You're in good company and definitely not an idiot. Stupid people blame the horse and everyone but themselves  We all need support sometimes.


----------



## Angus' yard (7 January 2014)

YasandCrystal said:



			Even experienced horse(wo)men can have trouble with bolshy youngsters. I have 2 youngsters - a rising 4 yr old and a rising 5 yr old and they are big and strong and I have had my share of problems with them. When you are used to older mannerly horses it's easy to forget how challenging youngsters can be and how often (like with small children) you have to repeat yourself multiple times tio achieve what seems a tiny goal.  My filly will rear and plunge and double barrel which is not fun when you are trying to lead her out to her paddock. I just make sure I have a hat and gloves on and carry a whip and always use a rope halter or a dually one for maximum control. The problem is as soon as the horse has a wobbly unless you take control again to give them the confidence in you as a safe leader and good place to be - they lose faith in you and the problem is then self perpetuating.  It's easy to say 'take control' but in reality it's good to get a professional to show you exactly how to tackle bullying behaviour by your youngster and how to remain detached yet fully in control and safe.  
And of course you are not an idiot and you are not alone either.Good luck OP.
		
Click to expand...


This is a really nice reply and I absolutely agree.


----------



## katymay (8 January 2014)

Angus' yard said:



			This is a really nice reply and I absolutely agree.
		
Click to expand...

Thank you, there are some lovely replies and have certainly helped spur me on to be a better horsewoman and not a failure!  I have spent the last few days doing baby steps just building my confidence with him, taking the pressure off of myself has made me so much happier, think I was in too much of a rush to do things with him and have to remember he is just a baby so is probably more than happy to have turn out, chase my little pony around a bit, and come into the stable for his tea and a rest!  Have some fab support locally and have chatted about him going to a professional yard to be restarted, I totally trust her and I can be as involved as I like so might gain some experience and knowledge in the process, once the weather has improved and the nights lighter there will be no stopping us (I hope!)


----------

