# Foals turning grey



## DanielleP (14 August 2008)

Who has any experience of this? 

What colour were they born and how long did it take for them to turn grey? 

I have a black foal who is turning grey and interested to find out how 'white' a grey she is likely to be. Mum was flea bitten grey and dad is black. Best guess?


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## josephine (14 August 2008)

My foal was born of both grey parents.  My mare was dark dappled grey when I got her at aged just 7.  She is  now pure white but slightly fleabitten, aged 15.  Foalie was born liver chestnut with blaze.  Is now 12.5 weeks and dark steel grey on head and neck and body now turning too.  

I am wondering the same!


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## wonkey_donkey (14 August 2008)

My foal is 6 weeks old and was born dark brown with white socks and a big white blaze. However, he had white circles around his eye's and a white beard so obvious from day one that he was going to be a grey. He is 6 weeks old now and his face is turning very grey and there are loads of grey hairs mixed in within his coat which now makes him look a dun sort of colour. I reckon he will grey all over by the time he is about 6 months old.
Hope that helps.


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## DanielleP (14 August 2008)

Have you got any pictures? I am intrigued! Foalie sounds lovely.


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## Springs (14 August 2008)

Hi All,

we have a 4yo stallion who was from a gray mare and a bay stallion. He was born bay and his colour has changed over the past 4 years. He is now a steel gray with an all black main and tail.

If you look at the webb site you can see him and his mother Jasmin and see the changes. http://www.springfieldstud.com

The gray geine is generally the dominent one so if one of the parents is a gray then there is a very high chance that you will have a grey foal.


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## DanielleP (14 August 2008)

Thats great thank you. 

My foal was born black with a white star and one white sock.  Over the last 3-4 weeks she has started gettign white hairs around her eyes muzzle and ears, and yesterday i noticed a few grey hairs mixed in her coat so i think she will go grey just not sure how grey and how long it will take. 6 months is probably a good guide line. 

Have you got any pictures of your foal turning grey ? Thanks


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## Springs (14 August 2008)

Hi, it was 2 years before spring really changed colour, but the little bits of gray around the eyes are a good sigen that yours will change over a period of time.


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## josephine (14 August 2008)

Here is my foalie two weeks ago showing how grey she is going!


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## DanielleP (14 August 2008)

I love Jasmin. My grey mare who had the foal is a King of Diamonds mare horse on my signiture. and who can be seen http://www.greenlees-equine.com/photo1424598.html


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## josephine (14 August 2008)

[ QUOTE ]
I love Jasmin. My grey mare who had the foal is a King of Diamonds mare horse on my signiture. and who can be seen http://www.greenlees-equine.com/photo1424598.html 

[/ QUOTE ]

She is lovely.  My mare is King of Diamonds on her dam's side, so they are related!


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## DanielleP (14 August 2008)

Josephine&gt; Wow! do you think that she will change to the iron grey and stay iron grey or do you think she will go lighter?


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## DanielleP (14 August 2008)

Josephine&gt; LOL! Springs is KOD too so we are all running around with grey KOD offspring on our hands!


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## timmy1977 (14 August 2008)

the grey gene is so strong that alot of coloured stallion owners wont let them cover  grey mares as it brings the statistics on the success rate  of getting a coloured foal down.


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## Faithkat (14 August 2008)

My filly was born chestnut (YAY) but  . . . . 

2 days old (28 April 2007)







6 weeks old






3.5 months  (8 August 2007)






13 months (1st June 2008)






and last week - 15 months (5 August 2008)


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## DanielleP (14 August 2008)

wow! what a change, mum is gorgeous has to be said! Do you think baby will be rose grey?


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## Faithkat (14 August 2008)

I think she will be proper grey like her mum by next year,  Mum was apparently born chestnut too (filly's sire is chestnut) but when bought at 23 months was pretty much as grey as you can see in first photo.  She was only just 6 (by 4 days!) when she had the filly last year.


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## Magicmadge (14 August 2008)

I am wondering about this one to. My 12 month filly is out of a mare born bay and now grey with black, legs, mane and tail at 5. The filly was black with white star and socks when i got her at 8 months. Now she is more like dark chocolate (could be the sun) and is getting white hairs throughout her coat, not loads but they are increasing.  Nothing around the eyes. Would the greying process be quicker than this if she was going to be like her dam?


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## Faithkat (14 August 2008)

Not necessarily.  I bought a "grey" Arab when he was 18 months old and he was actually dark bay roan (don't have pics that I could post) and he went truly grey quite slowly.  His father was white by the time he was 20.  My New Forest yearling is passported as grey (his sire is grey) but he looks dark brown in photos.  There are grey hairs appearing in his coat but he doesn't have the grey above the eyes that the filly had at a few days old.  Have to wait and see!


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## josephine (14 August 2008)

[ QUOTE ]
Josephine&gt; Wow! do you think that she will change to the iron grey and stay iron grey or do you think she will go lighter? 

[/ QUOTE ]

I think she will be iron grey/roan for a year or so and then slowly get greyer and paler.  All a bit of a gamble really!

I dont  mind what she is, she is adorable and I will keep her with me for ever (if fate is not too unkind to me)!


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## Becky123 (14 August 2008)

I have just put my mare in foal to a grey stallion, she is a bay, were are hoping for a grey


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## CrazyMare (14 August 2008)

This is all interesting, my mare is grey, I put her to a bay stallion. Foalie came out chocolate brown and is now a dark dark dark bay/brown showing only a dot of white hair on her head.

Reckons she will go grey!?


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## danni1986 (14 August 2008)

hmmm its a tricky one! my KOD mare (yay) was very dark steel grey when i got her as a 7yr old, now at 16 she is flea-bitten white!!  Her filly (bay sire) was born very dark bay, with jet black mane, tail and points. she then went very light bay, and now is very dark again with grey hairs in it, almost a bit roany!! so who knows!!


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## volatis (14 August 2008)

[ QUOTE ]
the grey gene is so strong that alot of coloured stallion owners wont let them cover  grey mares as it brings the statistics on the success rate  of getting a coloured foal down. 

[/ QUOTE ]

The grey gene is dominant in that if it is passed on, the foal will eventually grey out. However it has no impact what so ever on your chances of getting a coloured foal - totally different genes. 

I bred a heterozygous grey mare (so a 50/50 chance of passing on her grey gene) to a heterozygous coloured stallion (again a 50/50 chance of a coloured foal)
The foal inherited the tobiano gene from its sire, and so was born bay and white. However she also inherited the grey gene from her dam, so her bay bits will eventually grey.

There was still a 50/50 chance of the stallion passing on his tobaino gene, as there is with every single heterozygous tobiano stallion in the country.


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## nikkiportia (15 August 2008)




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## nikkiportia (15 August 2008)

Heeheee, 
	
	
		
		
	


	




 Loved this little foal from about 3 seasons ago, little panda eyes 
	
	
		
		
	


	




 Was a complete little shite though,


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## timmy1977 (15 August 2008)

hi, yeah i appreciate what you are saying, i wasnt talking about heterozygous coloured stallions though just coloured stallions in general, im no expert its just i was talking to a breeder at addington last week and they were telling me that alot of breeders wont use grey mares with the coloured stallion as theres even less chance of a coloured foal than with say a bay mare or chestnut. prehaps they were passing on incorrect information


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## CalliChristmasTree (15 August 2008)

Horsey at the yard was born completly chestnut but will be all "white" by the time he is 5..
Just over a year old now and already looking roany.


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## Shilasdair (15 August 2008)

My foal was born bright chestnut (dam chestnut, sire grey).  She didn't have the grey circles round her eyes, but did have  a few white hairs through her coat.
By 6 months she was chestnut roan, by a yearling she was er...peach coloured....and now (as a 3yo) she is quite a dark dapple grey.
She will go white, but I think it'll be a few years.
S


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## no_no_nanette (15 August 2008)

Josephine and DanielleP, I've got another KOD mare, (grandsire on dam side), and she looks SOOOOO like your girl, Danielle, I can't believe it!  Same facial expression .... (And apparently KOD was capable of being a complete 
b*$*!*d on occasions, which explains a lot about Beth!  
	
	
		
		
	


	




 )  Beth was very dark dapple grey when we bought her at 4; at 12, she's now very slightly flea bitten white.  Her yearling was born dark brown/bay, but is starting to go roan, and is definitely going to be grey at some point, though he's taking his time about it!


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## volatis (15 August 2008)

timo, sadly a lot of stallion owners seem to know bu**er all about colour genetics, so wouldn't be surprised if they were saying that. But the mare carrying the grey gene has no impact whatsoever on whether the stallion passes on his tobiano gene.


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## JanetGeorge (16 August 2008)

[ QUOTE ]
hi, yeah i appreciate what you are saying, i wasnt talking about heterozygous coloured stallions though just coloured stallions in general, im no expert its just i was talking to a breeder at addington last week and they were telling me that alot of breeders wont use grey mares with the coloured stallion as theres even less chance of a coloured foal than with say a bay mare or chestnut. prehaps they were passing on incorrect information 

[/ QUOTE ]

Yep!  A heterozygous coloured stallion has a 50% chance of producing a coloured foal to a non-coloured mare of ANY colour including grey.  If the grey mare is heterozygous for grey, then there's a 50% chance that a coloured foal will grey out.

So they were right in ONE way - because while your chance of a coloured foal from a grey mare is exactly the same as from a bay or a chestnut mare (50%) your chance of having a foal that STAYS coloured from a grey mare is only 25%.


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## timmy1977 (16 August 2008)

they were yor typical "i know what im talking about  people!" you know the kind of people who always have to be that bit louder than everyone else so everyone can hear they're opinions.  so you are probaby right.  thekind of people who wear a porsche baseball cap and drive ford escort!


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## CrazyMare (16 August 2008)

Just a quick one - can you have the mares tested to find out if they are hetero or homozygous for the grey gene? Or can my dark dark bay filly be tested to see if she has the grey gene?

Filly just has a dot of white on her face at 4 months old. Has had that since birth


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## SirenaXVI (16 August 2008)

[ QUOTE ]
Just a quick one - can you have the mares tested to find out if they are hetero or homozygous for the grey gene? Or can my dark dark bay filly be tested to see if she has the grey gene?

Filly just has a dot of white on her face at 4 months old. Has had that since birth







[/ QUOTE ]

What colour were her legs when she was born?  If they were dark, she will def go grey. if they were a sort of buff colour, she will stay bay.

The test for the grey gene is not yet available, they are working on it as we speak.  One thing can be guaranteed, as your filly has only one grey parent, she (if she does turn grey) will be hetero and not homozygous grey and will have a 50% chance of having a non greying foal if she is put to a non grey stallion.  However, looking at your picture I would hazard a guess that she will stay bay(as long as no dark legs at birth) which means that her mum only has one grey gene which makes her heterozygous.

If your filly stays bay, no point in testing for the grey gene, it won't be there.  Grey is dominant and cannot hide so in order to have a grey foal, one or both of the parents must be grey.

Lovely filly


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## CrazyMare (16 August 2008)

This is her legs when she was about 2 months old. Fairly light I think?


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## SirenaXVI (16 August 2008)

I would be willing to bet she will not go grey, which also means that mum only has the one grey gene


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## CrazyMare (16 August 2008)

Thanks Sirena!!! To be honest - the colour doesn't matter to me, however she is such a gorgeous shiney colour that it would be lovely if it stays!


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## DanielleP (18 August 2008)

nikkiportia&gt; wow i have never seen the rings around the eyes quite so prominent and white as that!


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## DanielleP (18 August 2008)

rufus blue moon&gt; Really! have you got any photos? I must admit my mare can be a bit of a handful to ride!


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## no_no_nanette (18 August 2008)

Here she is, the witch!  (She's feeling very sorry for herself at the moment, as one of the other brood mares has just kicked her in the fleshy part of the inside hind, poor old thing, so she's getting lots of cuddles!)










This is Fionn at a few months old .... at 14 months, he's now a kind of bay/roan, and is definitely going to end up grey


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## friskimagic (7 September 2010)

http://www.myphotos.yahoo.com/s/21a0llbdlfnvgnw8nm3v this is pics of my 5 month old foal and pics of his dad...both parents were grey but foal born a palomino with pale legs,he now has a dark muzzle and face and mane is silver but legs still same pale colour, mums dam was a palomino and mum had a dun foal too also dad has thrown both a bay and a chestnut foal in the past what colour will my foal be?


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## amy_b (15 October 2010)

I have a chestnut mare I bought when she was 6 who's sire is grey,she has always had fleck of grey in her coat but nothing more. she is now 11 and the flecks year on year are increasing to the point where this year her blaze is smudged and she has a white patch on her bum. I spoke to a genetics expert and he said it is most likely she is turning grey and they recently tested an andalucian who was 18 and took nearly all of his life to turn grey!! we are having her tested for the grey gene out of interest!


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## amy_b (15 October 2010)

CrazyMare said:



			Just a quick one - can you have the mares tested to find out if they are hetero or homozygous for the grey gene? Or can my dark dark bay filly be tested to see if she has the grey gene?

Filly just has a dot of white on her face at 4 months old. Has had that since birth






Click to expand...

There is a test to find out if your horse is hetero/homo for grey gene

http://www.horsedna.co.uk/


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## kirstyc (15 October 2010)

Hi
ive been learning alot about colouring since my foal was born in september. They have to have atleast 1 grey parent to turn grey and most greys end up all white (grey) as they get older, but it would be interesting to find out how the colour is decided before they turn grey wether it has anything to do with parentage etc...I was once told they are a dark solid colour when they are born because most foals are born during dark hours in the wild and its to stop preditors seeing them again dont no how true it is...My mum has had a foal born this year foals mum is a grey welsh A ( all grey parentage) and dad is a liver chestnut Welsh B ( mostly grey and chestnut parentage) and the filly foal was born dark bay but now turned grey.This has probably not answered your question but i thought id just share my thoughts on this subject


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## xena_wales (15 October 2010)

SirenaXVI said:



			What colour were her legs when she was born?  If they were dark, she will def go grey. if they were a sort of buff colour, she will stay bay.
		
Click to expand...

That's not necessarily the case, though it does seem to hold true a lot of the time.  My foal was born with dark legs, so I had him tested, and he doesn't carry grey:


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## KarynK (15 October 2010)

kirstyc said:



			Hi
ive been learning alot about colouring since my foal was born in september. They have to have atleast 1 grey parent to turn grey and most greys end up all white (grey) as they get older, but it would be interesting to find out how the colour is decided before they turn grey wether it has anything to do with parentage etc...I was once told they are a dark solid colour when they are born because most foals are born during dark hours in the wild and its to stop preditors seeing them again dont no how true it is...My mum has had a foal born this year foals mum is a grey welsh A ( all grey parentage) and dad is a liver chestnut Welsh B ( mostly grey and chestnut parentage) and the filly foal was born dark bay but now turned grey....

Click to expand...

Kirstyc Grey is not a colour but an effect on the cells that make colour it is similar to grey hair with age in humans but a lot quicker.  The genetic mutation that causes Grey is a one off that was prized and spread by humans several thousand years ago, every grey that is around today is descended from that one horse.  So  there would be no grey in true wild horse populations, but greys are known to survive in feral horse populations in the USA that are prey to Mountain Lions, because the foals are a solid colour at birth they survive where foals born coloured are much rarer as they are easy prey.

Every grey will still have genes for normal colours, and every grey is born with a colour apparent, which is how you get a solid coloured horse from two greys, once grey is lost the colour becomes apparent.  So your mum's welsh mare is actually a black base colour possibly bay, the foal therefore is a bay carrying chestnut but because she also has the grey gene she will go grey herself if that makes sense.


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## devilwoman (17 October 2010)

amy_b said:



			There is a test to find out if your horse is hetero/homo for grey gene

http://www.horsedna.co.uk/

Click to expand...


I'm tempted to have my filly tested, I don't mind if she greys but would love her to stay dark, one grey is enoug to keep clean !

Her mum is the grey and her dad is Bay - she is 7 weeks old now and still doesn't have a single white hair on her - she doesn't have any "goggles" in fact she was starting to have some show but they were bay and where her foal coat is thinning out in places its very dark underneath, atlhough I know that is not an indication that she won't grey out.

This is her yesterday at exactly 7 weeks old ;-


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## HBBambee (17 October 2010)

Sorry pics quite big...
This is bramble just minutes old, he had goggles from day one







And this is him now at 4 months...







His sire who is chestnut has so far produced all foals that are the same colour as the dam, apart from one foal with a bay dam who turned out chestnut.
Brambles dam was once iron grey when she was 4yrs she is now 10 yrs and white.

We also bred a foal from this mare 4 yrs ago the sire was chestnut roan, pic at a week old..







And now aged 5 yrs


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## lillith (18 October 2010)

Not sure if this has been mentioned but having spent a long time cellectively looking at foals and working out the likely colours another forum I frequent has come up with a theory. It seems that most foals who go grey are born proportionaly darker. Obvioulsy there are some exceptions but generaly a black foal is born slate coloured and bays have paler legs. Foals that go grey are often born proper black or bay or whatever the base colour is. Just an observation but interesting.


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