# 'Dodgy Dealer' sites.....



## stormox (31 January 2016)

What do people think of the  'dodgy horse dealer' sites that are on FB? I have counted at least 5, definately more sites than necessary, making it confusing for people. Surely one would be enough? They also seem to call someone a 'dodgy dealer' based on just a single deal where someone bought an  unsuitable horse  for whatever reason, occasionally the buyer seeming to have a personal grudge against the seller.
Are these sites justified? Is it fair to label someone a 'dodgy dealer' on the basis of one transaction? 
I'm not sure it is, after all it is peoples livelihoods at stake here.


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## gunnergundog (31 January 2016)

You're only as good as your last sale - no matter what business you are in, so yes, one dodgy sale and your halo IS tarnished.  Can't comment on the various sites you mention though as (fortunately) don't do facebook..


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## Michen (31 January 2016)

Well there's a thread about my mare that I posted on there which has over 200 comments with other people's experiences who have now come forward and a few more who have privately messaged me. If it stops one more person going through what I went through because of those people I'll be happy.


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## stormox (31 January 2016)

Can you call it 'dodgy' if people over horse themselves though ( by buying something greener or more high-powered than they were  able for?) This seems to be happening quite often, as well as  what I'd call 'dodgy' - selling a horse with a serious health problem as 'sound', a rearer as 'novice ride' etc?


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## gunnergundog (31 January 2016)

stormox said:



			Can you call it 'dodgy' if people over horse themselves though ( by buying something greener or more high-powered than they were  able for?) This seems to be happening quite often, as well as  what I'd call 'dodgy' - selling a horse with a serious health problem as 'sound', a rearer as 'novice ride' etc?
		
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A reputable dealer wouldn't sell someone a horse that they considered too much for them.  Have been to Vere Phillips several times and whilst he has sold me some horses, he has also declined (very politely!) to show me/sell me others.


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## Kaylum (31 January 2016)

Some stories are buyer stupidity like got dealer vet to vet the horse, never rode it, never saw it, only saw pictures or was sent a video, no receipt given, no passport. Others are dodgy dealer, doping, food/water withheld, no deposit given back when failed vetting, no money back when horse dangerous, wrong passport, stolen horse.   They are good for people to look at when buying or selling horses, as there are lessons to learn from both sides.  You can see the mistakes made and wonder why....


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## PorkChop (31 January 2016)

I personally think they are really useful - you do get people recommending dealers as well.

Also it allows dealers, if they so wish, to put their side of the story across.


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## Irish gal (31 January 2016)

stormox said:



			Can you call it 'dodgy' if people over horse themselves though ( by buying something greener or more high-powered than they were  able for?) This seems to be happening quite often, as well as  what I'd call 'dodgy' - selling a horse with a serious health problem as 'sound', a rearer as 'novice ride' etc?
		
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I agree Stormox, I was shocked the other day to go on one and see a ferocious complaint from someone who bought a horse that then went on to develop a health problem. The breeder was being completely lambasted and slagged off for something she was not responsible for. A health issue can emerge at any time. Luckily many people sprang to the defence of the breeder who was also being misrepresented as 'a dealer'.

While I think it's great to have a place for naming and warning against genuinely dodgey dealers, unfortunately it also provides a platform for people who feel agrieved and want to unfairly lash out and vent. Which can be really damaging to a reputation. As someone who acts as an agent, I was really alarmed. It's not right that people's good name can be destroyed by a person waging a vendetta, when they are totally in the wrong as was the case in question. The person was saying the complaint the horse developed was hereditary therefore the breeder should have known and not sold, but cancer/heart complaint is hereditary too, yet we never know where it will break out!


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## WeeLassie (31 January 2016)

I think they ought to stick to concrete facts, (names, dates, etc) and stop all the mud-slinging, name-calling stuff that goes on a lot of the posts. Some replies to a post about someone go on and on, just saying the same tit-for-tat rudeness over and over.


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## Kaylum (31 January 2016)

There is a fb page called Horse dealer Haters "named and shamed".

This is to warn dealers who to avoid selling to.


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## PeterNatt (31 January 2016)

Any ethical dealer worth their 'pinch of salt' should take back a horse that they had sold to maintain their good reputation and also so that purchasers have the confidence of knowing that if they bought a horse from them that they could return it within a period of 12 months.  If dealers can not afford to do this then they should not be in the business of dealing horses.


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## webble (31 January 2016)

Kaylum said:



			There is a fb page called Horse dealer Haters "named and shamed".

This is to warn dealers who to avoid selling to.
		
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That page is hilarious


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## stormox (31 January 2016)

I think 12 months is too long by far! It only takes a week or two for a bad rider to wreck a good horse!!


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## Auslander (31 January 2016)

Kaylum said:



			There is a fb page called Horse dealer Haters "named and shamed".

This is to warn dealers who to avoid selling to.
		
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Set up by the infamous K*** T****n!


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## hairycob (31 January 2016)

Yes, that page is hilarious. There was one thread started by a dealer the other day & my first thought was - "have you been drinking"


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## Carefreegirl (31 January 2016)

On the other hand though I've see posts where people have asked about dealers and have got many replies saying dealer is ok. Reassuring for the buyer but maybe not the best place to ask especially if a Google search innocently brings up that dealers name and dodgy dealers FB page attached. 


Off to look at the Horse dealer haters page :biggrin3:


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## Regandal (31 January 2016)

PeterNatt said:



			Any ethical dealer worth their 'pinch of salt' should take back a horse that they had sold to maintain their good reputation and also so that purchasers have the confidence of knowing that if they bought a horse from them that they could return it within a period of 12 months.  If dealers can not afford to do this then they should not be in the business of dealing horses.
		
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12 months!  I think one month is generous.


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## Kaylum (31 January 2016)

Auslander said:



			Set up by the infamous K*** T****n!
		
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Her OH set it up yes indeed.


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## Leo Walker (31 January 2016)

shes also admin of the BSJA group now


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## webble (31 January 2016)

Carefreegirl said:



			On the other hand though I've see posts where people have asked about dealers and have got many replies saying dealer is ok. Reassuring for the buyer but maybe not the best place to ask especially if a Google search innocently brings up that dealers name and dodgy dealers FB page attached. 


Off to look at the Horse dealer haters page :biggrin3:
		
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I don't think it would they are closed groups


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## AShetlandBitMeOnce (31 January 2016)

Kaylum said:



			There is a fb page called Horse dealer Haters "named and shamed".

This is to warn dealers who to avoid selling to.
		
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This facebook page confuses me..  There is a post where someone has shared a horses ad, in shock at it's content. (The dealer had said horse been out for 18 months due to doing a check, she was brought back into work this week and they took her XC that day.) 
The lady was understandably shocked that anyone would do this, yet the page you have mentioned shared it as if to say 'look at these people making any excuses to have a go at us' 

I think it may have been something to do with the infamous K**** T******* being the Admin, and the person who had written the original ad.     I think it's therefore KT trying to clear her name, rather than a useful page.


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## Kaylum (1 February 2016)

AShetlandBitMeOnce said:



			This facebook page confuses me..  There is a post where someone has shared a horses ad, in shock at it's content. (The dealer had said horse been out for 18 months due to doing a check, she was brought back into work this week and they took her XC that day.) 
The lady was understandably shocked that anyone would do this, yet the page you have mentioned shared it as if to say 'look at these people making any excuses to have a go at us' 

I think it may have been something to do with the infamous K**** T******* being the Admin, and the person who had written the original ad.     I think it's therefore KT trying to clear her name, rather than a useful page.
		
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Yes I agree you see she runs an auction fb site where people buy unseen (yes we all know what's coming next) so these people bid and buy unseen from her and others and wonder why they aren't what they wanted. This site has thousands of members btw


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## vam (1 February 2016)

FrankieCob said:



			shes also admin of the BSJA group now
		
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That explains a lot. She runs one or two of the Dodgy Dealer pages so I'm not sure how impartial they are really. I mean she isn't going to have herself put on those sites.....


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## Luci07 (1 February 2016)

The dodgy dealer sites work because consistently, the same names appear. I would accept sour grapes on a few occasions but when you start to have an avalanche of complaints, then you avoid. I have never used ( or know) her, but Clip Clop Traders ALWAYS gets good feedback and she has been going for years. I did ring her when looking and she listened to what I wanted.. and told me she didn't have it. There is another one I won't name, just say "Kent" and had a narrow squeak there myself. Local friend did some digging and lets just say the horse I was going to buy would not have been suitable. I bought from Shane Walsh last time. I googled, found nothing negative, and bought a lovely horse off him. I have recommended him to friends and he has produced the goods.


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## AShetlandBitMeOnce (1 February 2016)

Kaylum said:



			Yes I agree you see she runs an auction fb site where people buy unseen (yes we all know what's coming next) so these people bid and buy unseen from her and others and wonder why they aren't what they wanted. This site has thousands of members btw
		
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Ahh, I was aware of the web page, and I know it is very popular, but I did not knew she created this site.. 

The whole notion of FB auction site for horses screams foolish and chancer of a seller at me! The mind boggles.


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## Jems 1975 (27 November 2019)

stormox said:



			What do people think of the  'dodgy horse dealer' sites that are on FB? I have counted at least 5, definately more sites than necessary, making it confusing for people. Surely one would be enough? They also seem to call someone a 'dodgy dealer' based on just a single deal where someone bought an  unsuitable horse  for whatever reason, occasionally the buyer seeming to have a personal grudge against the seller.
Are these sites justified? Is it fair to label someone a 'dodgy dealer' on the basis of one transaction?
I'm not sure it is, after all it is peoples livelihoods at stake here.
		
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I need the need from anywhere right now and would like to advise people to stay away from the dealer I brought from. Saw me coming and knew it was my daughters first horse and still swaped it for a different horse that had similar markings its cost me a fortune. But finally I have enough evidence that I have a good court case with the support of farm and agriculture, trading standards and consumer rights and I'm happy to name and same so Harry Stoyles and Andy Stoyles from Doncaster I look forward to our court date and hope you get shut down because I am not the first and won't be the last if you are allowed to continue in this business this effects people's lives .


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## Leandy (27 November 2019)

They are an interesting read but like everything on facebook you need to be aware that often the sites and the stories on them may not be what they seem.  You do see themes emerging though and recurrent names to steer clear of.   I agree though that many of the stories are equally buyer stupidity.  Buying unseen often, or just buying from someone who should already have set off the "dodgy dealer" radar in any half awake person without fully trying and vetting the horse in the first place.  Too many people seem to expect something for nothing.  If a horse costs peanuts it likely has an issue which may or may not be obvious on initial viewing.


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## Girlracer (27 November 2019)

I think there is a place for a 'review' system. However my experience has been that not all groups are managed fairly - many dealers are unable to share the other side to a story and often anyone who tries to defend them sharing a positive experience is removed from the group. I hasten to add that this statement is not relevant to all the groups, just a select few.


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## Newtothegeegees (31 December 2019)

Interestingly I notice the Farm is for sale. I wonder if this is why they want to flog all the horses? I’ve researched reviews on this place and it has great feedback. It’s also a riding school so lots of ratings about owners etc.


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## Newtothegeegees (31 December 2019)

Wrong thread


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## luckyoldme (31 December 2019)

I went to a dodgy dealer..so dodgy that the bbc did a programme on him.
I was typical first time buyer..the type that dodgy dealers love.
In short i was stupid ..the dealer was sharp and i paid a lot of money for an 18 year old very unhappy horse. Out of the three parties the horse turned out to be the one with the most common sense.
I was luckily in a position to be happy with what the horse turned out to be...and i would pay the same amount again for the time we had.
A lot of the problem with dodgy dealer sites are that a horse can be one thing in one persons hands and entirely different in anothers. And a lot of horses react very badly to nervous new owners..(i was a typical example of that)
Sometimes its the new owners who are the problem and it can take a long time for them to realise that.


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## ester (31 December 2019)

zombie thread.


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