# Talk me through your shod > barefoot transition



## L&B (8 June 2013)

As the title says, talk me through what happened and why you decided to take your horse barefoot - from the day the shoes came off to now... The ups, the downs, the lameness, the soundness, what type of horse etc etc. 
I'm going through it currently and every day is like a rollercoaster and I'm living in the hope that I'm doing the right thing, so needing some stories to read. 
I've not typed this for an argument nor a debate, just as the title says


----------



## FfionWinnie (8 June 2013)

Mine were not shod, but nor had they been in hard work barefoot.  I can't say its been that difficult. All three have been footy at times, due to grass/constant rain. All are self trimming. Number 1 I've had for a year next month. Never been shod 8yr old welsh cob. She had been in light work when I got her and her feet are the toughest now. She is on moderately restricted grazing and only hay in winter. Number 2 I've had for 8 months. 5yr old American Paint Horse, only been shod once in her life when she was backed, and was out of work and needing a trim when i bought her (I didn't get her trimmed and she sorted them herself with work). She gets hard feed in winter and unrestricted grazing now.  She is in hard work and doing up to 24km endurance rides at 10km+/hour, hacking every day on all surfaces. She has boots but doesn't wear them much. May start using them more when ground is hard, will see how she goes. Number 3 we've had for 6 months and is a Shetland who wasn't ridden. He is on very restricted grazing and only hay in winter.  He had a period of footiness which worried me but is going very well now hacking about 4 times a week and also ridden on my hardcore yard quite a lot (enclosed area for daughter!).


----------



## PlodCob (8 June 2013)

Bought first ever horse, complete novices. Settled her in new home for couple of weeks, farrier came, took driving shoes off to take a look, said feet are good and solid, trimmed every 6-8 weeks and shoe-less ever since. Over two years ago, no problems.


----------



## L&B (8 June 2013)

Sounds like bliss... Anyone with troublesome tbs or more 'notorious' types?


----------



## Meowy Catkin (8 June 2013)

L&B said:



			Sounds like bliss... Anyone with troublesome tbs or more 'notorious' types?
		
Click to expand...

Anglo-arab mare.

Quick version -

I moved house and therefore had to change farrier. New farrier quickly changed the shape of her hooves (from good balance to long toes and under-run heels). He blamed the change on everything except for himself.   Three Vets were happy with her hooves, but luckily I pressed for a fourth Vet's opinion and with Vet 4 and a new, new farrier she was trimmed and shod in a more balanced way. After that she was taken BF as the farrier said that her hooves would recover quicker. Had a dreadful time with abscesses due to the stretched white line caused by the sacked farrier, but that stopped as the new tighter hoof grew in.

Two years of no trouble bf/unshod (mainly hacking) and then she went footy recently.  It was straight after a trim, so possibly slightly too much was taken off this time. She's getting back to her old self again now.


----------



## ozpoz (8 June 2013)

Oz came to me unshod, a Belgian warmblood in light work after recovering from a tendon injury. I was told that he had developed stress lami while on box rest and he needed boots for hacking.
 It took me a long time to get my head around his diet, or the fact tiny changes that would make no difference to a shod horse could have an effect on an unshod horse. Due to my own illness it was difficult to manage excercise  for a few months and when I got back into work, I decided to have him shod, mostly because I struggled to get his boots on, due to my own issues.
 It was great for a couple of months, and then his feet were horrible, and his heels began to contract. I started again with the whole diet/ foot health learning curve and bought new hoof boots which were easy to put on and now he has great thick walls, reasonable frogs and really improved hoof quality without cracks or ridges. We can hack out barefoot and he is happy.

I've learned a lot : ) 
I did have a welsh pony nearly 40 years ago who never had shoes in his life, although all my others did.He showed, hacked and pony clubbed, into his 20's, with a special dispensation to attend camp without shoes! I never considered his diet in a barefoot way - I just assumed he had freakily strong feet and put it down to his roan colouring!


----------



## Holly Hocks (8 June 2013)

I now have a barefoot TB mare.  She was diagnosed in October 2011 with navicular in both front feet, bilateral spavin, arthritis in one hind fetlock and hind limb PSLD after investigations into all round lameness issues at Glasgow Vet school. She was shod at the time.

The recommendation was for remedial shoes, but I was concerned that the remedial shoes may work for a while, but not on a permanent basis, so I decided to have the shoes removed and got the help of a barefoot trimmer.  She had six months off work until April 2012 until the suspensory ligament had had time to heal and spent a few hours in the field and the rest of the time in the stable - the turnout kept her sane. 
When I brought her into work in April 2012 I long reined her in front hoof boots - I never needed anything on the hind hooves.  I did six weeks of this and covered miles and miles. All the work was on the roads, I didn't use the school at all.   I wasn't just rehabbing the hooves, I had all the other issues to deal with. 
After six weeks, I then did a a few weeks of long reining without the hoof boots on.  I then got back on board and rode for a few weeks in the hoof boots, before finally taking them off and going bare all round.  She was absolutely fine.  The only issue came when she got an abscess late last year and it took about four months to come out as the vet couldn't find it and didn't even believe it was an abscess.  

I had a lot of advice on diet from Oberon and Cptrayes helped me a lot when she had the abscess.
But I can honestly say, that if the horse hadn't had any issues at all with lameness, I would never in a million years taken the shoes off - I had no reason to.   But having the issues has transformed the way I think about keeping horses.  I used to feed high starch and highly molassed feeds and believed everything I read on the feed manufacturer's websites.  I took my vet's word as gospel - now I question things that I have doubts about.   The vets weren't really very supportive about me taking the shoes off, although one of my vets had seen a horse come back from Rockley, so knew where I was coming from with my views.  I'm sure they would love me to put shoes back on now, but accept my decision.  And I'm not saying that I would never put shoes back on, but for now the barefoot is working.  Good luck if you decide to go down the barefoot route.


----------



## china (8 June 2013)

Tb with navicular and bone Spavins. Lame after many remedial shoeing attempts. Took shoes off and had a UKNHCP trimmer. Horse is most sound he has been in three years. He has very odd shaped feet but function over form. If that's how his feet need to be to perform then so be it. In my opinion, shoes were a contributory factor to his navicular. He still has a long way to go as there is a lot of repairing taking place but he's getting there.

My second is a 6 yr old Irish who has only ever worn front shoes for a very brief time. He has lovely looking feet but suffers from soft soles and I'm currently batting with sensitivity to grass and certain ingredients in feed which is continuing to digital pulses in all four legs. He has been a real challenge for me but I refuse to shoe him. If he is a low grade lamanitic then I would rather he was unshod as I would see the signs far far quicker than I would if he was shod. He competes at county level on a very regular basis and managed with no trouble at all. He's not quite at stone crunching stage just yet.


----------



## china (8 June 2013)

Holly Hocks said:



			I had a lot of advice on diet from Oberon and Cptrayes helped me a lot when she had the abscess.
But I can honestly say, that if the horse hadn't had any issues at all with lameness, I would never in a million years taken the shoes off - I had no reason to.   But having the issues has transformed the way I think about keeping horses.  I used to feed high starch and highly molassed feeds and believed everything I read on the feed manufacturer's websites.  I took my vet's word as gospel - now I question things that I have doubts about.   The vets weren't really very supportive about me taking the shoes off, although one of my vets had seen a horse come back from Rockley, so knew where I was coming from with my views.  I'm sure they would love me to put shoes back on now, but accept my decision.  And I'm not saying that I would never put shoes back on, but for now the barefoot is working.  Good luck if you decide to go down the barefoot route.  

Click to expand...

My vet was also completely unsupportive. On their last visit to investigate the digital pulses all he said was put front shoes on him. I have since changed vets and they have taken bloods to test for insulin resistance and have not questioned my choice.


----------



## paulineh (8 June 2013)

As already said in other posts I have an Arab mare that has Navicular,High Ring Bone etc.

She was diagnosed back in 2012 via MRI. Treated twice for the Navicular and once for the Ring bone. Eggbar shoes and for one set of shoes wedges.

Even on 1 Danilon a day she did not look comfortable.

I bit the bolt and last Tuesday had her shoes off. I had in passing spoke to my vet about it and he did not say yah or nay about wheather is was a good idea. When I spoke to my farrier he was a bit iffy about it but did say that she had good feet and as I was not expecting to do too much with her that it was a good idea.

On Wednesday (One day after her shoes were taken off) she looked more comfortable. Her eyes had soffened. 

I know it will be a long process but I have to give her a chance.

She is still on Danilon but this will be reduced over the next 2-3 weeks.

I have changed her diet a bit. I am lucky that she always holds her weight so does not need extras.

Good Luck.


----------



## ester (8 June 2013)

19 yo welsh D

late summer 2011 we lost our medium trot but still sound, jumping, etc but in hindsight not quite 'right'. Lame left fore november, never blocked to back of foot and coffin joint and xrays showed 'flat' pedal bones but no arthritis. Having been on here a while had always said if had foot issues would take them off but at the time vet was fairly positive that changing the shoeing (heels were under run and toes a bit long) and later using steroid injections that we could likely get him right. So shod in bar shoes and then later injected but although feet looked much better after 2/3 shoeings the soundness wasn't- not if he was worked anyway. 

Farrier was keen to try a few more options, like pads vet said its up to you but feet look good so... 
with both of their agreement got a UKNCHP trimmer on board (same as china's) and never looked back. He was sound when shoes came off as he had a steroid injection shortly before. Spent most of last summer walking, with boots on when he was not quite comfy enough. Set up a track grazing system to keep the weight down and supplemented to grazing deficiencies. soles became more concave and soft tissue in the back of foot beefed up, also no longer bull-nosed so suspect pedal bones now in correct place.  Started doing circles end of the summer and went to 1st Dressage in the November, since been out to more dressage, showing, jumping, lots of lessons and lots of hacking wherever we fancy.

Very very pleased to have my boy back as he is otherwise in fine fettle and not looking like a 20 yo

Eta over time I've worried less


----------



## Slightlyconfused (8 June 2013)

Lami horse had massive abcess that burst out of three holes and had to be dug out, farrier didn't want to put shoe on hoof as it would make it weak. Vet recommended cavellos. 
He was sore first off but that was because he had no sole on his RF but with pads and wraps I was riding him.

farrier has said that as his hooves are looking so good he doesn't want to nail hole his them. He has to have boots and pads on turn out and ridden but that's because of his IR and bad rotation in his hooves.
This was last aug.

Old mare, she took off her front shoe then put it back on with the clip the thought her sole and pulled off hoof wall. Told farrier to take them off and we will see how she goes......other than a sole bruise when she stepped on a sharp stone she has been sound. Going to get her some booties though as when she walks on stoney tracks her feet chip. 

The WB I took off with old mare, she is retired so shoes aren't needed, she was sore for a few months but she had stupidly flat hooves so they need to grow into what they are meant to be.

Both if the girls came off in oct last year.......

All my horses are on a low sugar low startch diet anyway and I just added Pro Balance plus to their feed.


----------



## Leg_end (8 June 2013)

My story is on my blog below


----------



## Salcey (8 June 2013)

10yo TB gelding
My boy had a history of low grade lameness when I got him. Farrier told me his soles were to thin to take shoes off.  I changed his diet and 3 months later took off the shoes against advice from farrier and trimmer.  My reason was he was doing more soft tissue damage taking the shoes off himself.
We are on week 17, the first 13 weeks went really well and we progressed from booting for turnout and work to only booting for ridden work and able to be led out for 50 mins in hand walking on tarmac without boots.
The last 4 weeks have been a bit of a nightmare as I've found out he's incredibly grass sensitive and am currently battling an abscess which will not go away.  Having said that I am still so pleased I decided to do this as both these factors were being hidden by shoes and may well account for his long term lameness problems.
Its definitely not a road for the faint hearted.


----------



## L&B (8 June 2013)

I am finding reading these very interesting @Leg_end, your tale with Buddy is fantastic and extremely inspirational... 
I do hope my boy comes right, it's so difficult to explain the heartbreak you feel when your horses aren't right. My boy's not been right now for 8months and has only been made worse by 'remedial farriery'


----------



## ATrueClassAct (8 June 2013)

Little lady is 24 with both fronts having rotated pedal bones. Even considered having her put to sleep because she didn't seem to get sounder at one point but suddenly turned a corner thanks to fantastic remedial farrier from my live saving farrier. I know not everyone agrees with remedial work but she had been shod for 20 years all round and didn't have the frog or the foot to support herself without the heartbar. Now she has grown a healthier frog and foot thank to the correct trimming the farrier advised trying her without shoes on and well it's still early days but she's walking fine on concrete, doing much better on stone and fine on soft ground. She has a pair of cavallo with pads for really tricky terrain but she's retired anyway. 
Diet is fast fibre, pro hoof, little bit of linseed and ad lib soaked hay.


----------



## Hen (8 June 2013)

Very new to this - 6 weeks in - I have a reining mare recently diagnosed with front leg arthritic changes to the knee joint, I took the decision to remove the front shoes but she retains her slide plates behind as I plan to work her on a reining surface shortly and frustratingly it seems to be the one equestrian sport for which a non-shoe option (at least for hind feet) does not exist...

Anyway,shoes came off, immediately started road walking, first in hand and within 2 days under saddle. The most difficult thing she found for the first few outings was the breakover rather than overt footiness. We kept up gentle road walking for 5 weeks, most days and turnout was very restricted (to one hour a day due to previous metabolic issues).

After 11 or so days she did start to get a little footy particularly on stony parts of the yard and she was wearing her hooves faster than I was comfortable with so she got hoof booted with pads which are fabulous and she loves them. No other problems really, she has grown out her nail holes already and I have kept her in the boots mainly with the pads as it keeps little bits of gravel getting embedded. She's been back in full work for the last 2 weeks and is happy at all paces on most ground. Farrier trimmed her on Monday and said he didn't see any need to shoe her, and that her feet would further improve; he noted that she'd completely changed how she weights her feet compared to when she was shod and that we should work with that preference.

I've found everyone I've asked questions of incredibly helpful.


----------



## china (8 June 2013)

L&B said:



			I am finding reading these very interesting @Leg_end, your tale with Buddy is fantastic and extremely inspirational... 
I do hope my boy comes right, it's so difficult to explain the heartbreak you feel when your horses aren't right. My boy's not been right now for 8months and has only been made worse by 'remedial farriery' 

Click to expand...

One thing I all say is that don't expect people to understand your decisions and thoughts. No one else on my yard is barefoot and one has commented that they think it would be cruel to take their horses shoes off, I find it cruel to have them on because Iv seen first hand what they can do, but hey ho ;-) 
People have to find out these things for themselves and it won't be untill they have exhausted all other options and they Begin the research, then they will open the box that is their mind! You can go on and on and on about the benefits are justifying it untill your blue in the face but others simples have to reach that path on their own.


----------



## L&B (8 June 2013)

china said:



			One thing I all say is that don't expect people to understand your decisions and thoughts. No one else on my yard is barefoot and one has commented that they think it would be cruel to take their horses shoes off, I find it cruel to have them on because Iv seen first hand what they can do, but hey ho ;-) 
People have to find out these things for themselves and it won't be untill they have exhausted all other options and they Begin the research, then they will open the box that is their mind! You can go on and on and on about the benefits are justifying it untill your blue in the face but others simples have to reach that path on their own.
		
Click to expand...

Oh China, I'm above and beyond trying to convince people I'm not completely mental 'YOU'VE TAKEN A TB WITH FEET AS BAD AS THAT'S SHOES OFF!?' 
I've been called all names under the sun. Cruel and hippy amongst them.
But my logic is, yes, he's sound in shoes whether they're remedial shoes or glued on aluminiums, or nailed-ons, but he can't keep even remedial shoes on his feet! Throwing them every couple of weeks... Damaging his hoof wall every time - so what else can I do??
Big changes for us afoot (no pun), we're moving yards to suit us better also - he currently has 1hour turnout per day.
The trouble here is I'm working with a horse who has had lammi in the past year also (not with me) and who is EXTREMELY sugar sensitive.

SIGH...


----------



## Leg_end (8 June 2013)

I'm glad you enjoyed our story L£B  It's been a hell of a roller coaster ride and I've had to deal with people saying horrible things, bitching about me and even calling my vet to raise their concerns - all of which are completely unfounded. It's sad that people cannot just be happy for you that your horse came back from the brink 

Chin up, there are understanding people out there


----------



## Hen (8 June 2013)

Chin up it sounds as though you have absolutely nothing to lose (given the fact you are regularly losing hoof even with remedial shoes) - if it's any help my mare also is highly sugar sensitive and has had low grade lami in the past, and the transition is (touch wood) being amazingly uneventful... Finally I worked my way (in circuitous fashion) to an appropriate diet from the end of last year and so far all is looking really good. I also think a lot of people on my yard are actually rather jealous of our Easyboot Gloves which look like little ballet pumps for horses


----------



## china (8 June 2013)

L&B said:



			Oh China, I'm above and beyond trying to convince people I'm not completely mental 'YOU'VE TAKEN A TB WITH FEET AS BAD AS THAT'S SHOES OFF!?' 
I've been called all names under the sun. Cruel and hippy amongst them.
But my logic is, yes, he's sound in shoes whether they're remedial shoes or glued on aluminiums, or nailed-ons, but he can't keep even remedial shoes on his feet! Throwing them every couple of weeks... Damaging his hoof wall every time - so what else can I do??
Big changes for us afoot (no pun), we're moving yards to suit us better also - he currently has 1hour turnout per day.
The trouble here is I'm working with a horse who has had lammi in the past year also (not with me) and who is EXTREMELY sugar sensitive.

SIGH... 

Click to expand...

Oh that's all to familiar, except mine wasn't long term sound in shoes, had them off every other day and his feet ended up like this.


----------



## ester (8 June 2013)

China I'd love to see Prince's current feet/video if you D.P. does them for you. 

I think I've been lucky having them at home so not yard comments  mostly people have only seen him out hacking etc so have just been interested in how he is/his boots if wearing them rather than making any judgement. 

I did say to farrier the other day when he was shoeing mum's that if he were younger I would think about doing 6 months on 6 months off... and he said why he's doing everything you want to anyway


----------



## china (8 June 2013)

Prince doesn't have a current video, they are due next weekend though! Iv had people comment on des and his boots asking how much they are and how long they last! ;-) people seem more shocked at the shape of princes front feet. They are most odd! But he's getting sounder and I'm riding him again and everything's straight above so if that's how they need to be


----------



## ester (8 June 2013)

well we don't really use our boots much anymore so I reckon they might outlive Frank at this rate . He's been trimmed today but I left mum in charge as I am still in wilts this weekend. 

We do tend to conclude that Frank moves straighter than most of us in the vids!


----------



## snopuma (9 June 2013)

My Boy had his shoes off at my request, he was diagnosed with navicular 2 years before and I paid through the nose for remedial shoeing, not a millimetre of change through compared x-rays with 2 years inbetween so I took the shoe off and put boots on, he was sore and pottered and came in from the field tired, but only for the 1st week, by week 6 he could manage in the field without boots, by 3 months I could ride him in boots, by 6 months I could school him on a surface with boots and hack him in them, and that's how we carry on, when the ground is as hard as nails I ride him less, just not to put pressure on him, his feet have changed, he has strong healthy feet, the quality of them is amazing, they were like bread before now I have to soak them a little before I trim because he blunts the rasp so easily!  and yes I did say I trim them, I did have a barefoot trimmer when I started this but she kept whacking him with the rasp as he can be a bit of a twit about keeping his foot on the hoofjack, I didn't think he really deserved that so I now do them, I trim him every 3 weeks as its then an easier job for me and his toe is never allowed to get too long, which is how all this navicular started anyway.


And then there is my mare a little TB who I took barefoot this time last year, she only hd fronts on but started throwing them, she had flat and splayed feet, and she dished badly, with out shoes with the same method as my boy to get there, but she was in boots for longer in the field (and I must mention she didn't start out with a  lameness to cure at all) as I changed them when the ground was hard, which to be fair is the better time to take them off, they wear to suit the horse and the harder ground improves the feet over time, she gets trimmed every 3 weeks too and has not been out of work to make the change to barefoot, she has not had any abcesses and is fed the same as him, no molasses chaff, fast fibre and Prohoof, she has concavity and her heels are where they should be (not crushing the frog!) Oh and she no longer dishes! her body has changed too, she has a more relaxed appearance and where once if you ran your hand over her backside she would flinch and needed to see the physio, she no longer flinches!  my trainer was a bit anti barefoot, but has now actually asked to see me trim as can't believe the change in her, makes me smile!


----------



## pines of rome (9 June 2013)

I have a TB with navicular too! Remedial shoeing only helped for six months, so I went barefoot, not an easy option for my boy and there are days when I want to slap shoes back on!
But I have stuck with it for nearly a year and a half now and although we are not rock crunching go anywhere bare he has made progress and is a much happier horse, who no longer stands in his field pointing!!!


----------



## laura_nash (10 June 2013)

I have a HW coloured cob, a very good doer.  When I got him he was HUGE and his feet were a bit of a mess (he'd been stuck out on good diary grazing for two years with no exercise and infrequent trimming).  I had him shod for the first 2 years (didn't even think about it).  Looking back I think I would still have had him shod to begin with as his feet were very poor and he really needed to exercise to get the weight off.

He always tripped a lot though, including falling over when loose in the field several times.  Around the same time I took him for a clinic at a Natural Horsemanship yard where all the horses were barefoot, changed to a new instructress who was pro-barefoot and he tripped in gallop and gave me a nasty whiplash.  I thought about it, read up on it etc for about 4 more months before finally taking his shoes off.  I stuck with my farrier for trimming, he's great and had managed some big improvements in shoes that made the transition better than it could be.  I was lucky because he wasn't sore around the field or yard even at the start.  Like many cobs he had a great caudal hoof, his problem was always lack of concavity and a stretched white line.

It wasn't easy, especially when he went footy last spring and I couldn't get boots to fit him. He was really sore just walking in from the field for about a week and that was difficult.  I was close to having him re-shod when I finally managed to source some boots for his odd-shaped feet.  Also when I was pregnant and couldn't give him the exercise he needed (or bend down to do foot maintenance tasks) they did deteriorate a bit, so it has taken longer than it might to get him right.  I have heard all the comments, negative, positive and simply bemused.

I'm really pleased I did it though, primarily because of the diet and lifestyle changes it forced me to implement.  Having a more difficult barefoot horse really changes your outlook on feeding, grazing etc.  Because of the massive weight loss in his first year I had got complacent about his weight, getting the last bit off has made a huge difference. Three years on I now have a much healthier, better balanced, slimmer, more forward-going horse.


----------



## ecrozier (10 June 2013)

Wow - I have been really lucky I think. Took Roo's shoes off - hinds last autumn and fronts at Christmas time. He went footy once for about 2 days, not sure if was due to a yard move/new grass, or a long-ish hack with no hoof boots, but put him on brewers yeast and swapped to overnight turnout (on fairly decent grazing) and touch wood has been fine since! 
Also been lucky that no one including farrier has been critical at all! He's self trimmed from the start, bit thrushy on occasion but not causing major problem. Sound on all surfaces except loose stones on concrete so long roadwork hacks we do in boots.


----------



## bouncing_ball (10 June 2013)

Mine's a work in progress. Shoes off June 2012 and turned away. Back in rehab work December. Currently moving well and sound but v wonky feet. Still lots of change and improvement going on. Feet ugly but sound in school and happy for longer hacks. 

http://remi-rehab-journey.blogspot.co.uk/


----------



## maccachic (11 June 2013)

L&B said:



			Sounds like bliss... Anyone with troublesome tbs or more 'notorious' types?
		
Click to expand...

I had a Tb with bad feet there are pics here:  http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/album.php?albumid=5314
Started with one trimmer no change, swapped trimmers and you can see the changes in the pics above, had body work as well huge changes in hold he holds himself. 

Took a little while for him to balance nicely on hard ground was a bit mincy like he was going to slip over, once concavity started to improve traction is now brillant, was out hunting the other weekend in heavy going steep hills didn't slip once.


----------

