# new pony start of lami



## Sarah04 (20 April 2014)

My new pony who was chunky when i got him 8 weeks ago has started with early signs of laminitis . He is currently on medication for 5 days, he has a very small area of grazing , ive been soaking his hay but he's not eating much and has started eating his straw bedding. He's stabled on a night . Ive started giving him a small holed hay net with dry hay in but once that is gone he's eating his straw. I don't really want to buy rubber matting but if I have to i will or would I be best turning him out on not alot of grass although no field shelter. Ive also got a grazing muzzle not tried yet as grass quite short in section of paddock.Any advice appreciated .  He's a 14.1 Newforest cross


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## DuckToller (20 April 2014)

Can I ask what medication he is on, and has a vet been out?

I wouldn't worry about him eating straw personally, although some people are strongly against it.  My friend is a vet and she feeds her pony more straw than hay as it has fewer calories but fills his tummy up.  

To reduce the calories further, soak his hay for 12 hours, put the muzzle on for part of the day, and weigh-tape him so you can see if he is losing weight.

If he isn't, then you really need to do something more drastic - if you don't get on top of it now, the laminitis will get worse and then he would have to be in, on a deep shavings bed.


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## AmieeT (20 April 2014)

Try strip grazing him, and make sure you're soaking his hay for at least 12 hrs to get rid of all the sugars and double net the haynet to stop him from gorging it all in one. 

Is he on his own in his paddock? Could you get a couple of other horses to graze it down? Is there any chance of you turning him out at night and in during the day? Or turning him out into somewhere like a school or ménage with soaked hay to eat?

Also avoid putting him out when there's a frost (it's starting to get chilly again here on the AMs, don't know about where you are!) because that's when it's very sugary.

You haven't said if he gets any hard feed? If he doesn't need it- cut it out. If that's how you're getting him to have the medication, make sure it's a low-cal low-sugar feed.

Ax


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## Justturnedfifty (20 April 2014)

Get him off grass pronto! Regardless of whether he has a lot of grass or very little, the sugars in the grass will make the laminitis worse. His hay should be soaked for as long as possible, ideally over night and fed in a small holed hay net is ideal. No hard feed where possible unless you have him on bute and literally a token amount to put bute in. Don't starve him, keep his hay net topped up little and often. Ideally he should be on shavings to help support his feet. If you have caught it at such an early stage you need to understand that turning him out on grass too soon will bring on a more severe laminitis attack. You need to be cruel to be kind because laminitis can be horrendous to not only manage but to see your pony in such pain. When he is recovering and has been sound and comfortable for several weeks turn out at night only, as the sugars in the grass is less, but he needs to be on a bare area even if you feed soaked hay and literally only move the fence inches not feet. He needs to be re-introduced to grass very, very slowly. You need to look at the advice from the laminitis trust web site. Good luck!


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## Sarah04 (20 April 2014)

Yes had the vet out yesterday as he had been pottery on feet for a few days and farrier said he was fine! I'm not sure on medication it's outside but its got a long name and he's on 1 sachet twice daily in his feed for 5 days.Once his medication finishes wednesday he will get no more hard feed . He is on spillers lite balancer which was recommended by spillers for lami prone ponies. I just wanted him to get all the vits and minerals from a feed but no calories! We are getting another pony in 2 weeks only a shetland , hes never had lami but obviously will keep an eye on him too.


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## amandap (21 April 2014)

When soaking hay use fresh water each time and rinse. Draining before lifting hay out makes life easier.

http://ecirhorse.org/index.php/ddt-overview/ddt-diet 
http://www.thelaminitissite.org/

You can add a balancer such as Pro Hoof (ebay) to something like (small amount) un mollassed beet for vits and mins. Using a complete feed means you have to feed at recommended (often large!) amounts.

No treats and ensure no one is sneaking him treats or un soaked hay. Give plenty of soaked hay, don't starve him. Switch to a shavings bed as straw can be high in sugars and a deep bed will support his hooves/sole.


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## Kaylum (21 April 2014)

What work is it getting?


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## Sarah04 (21 April 2014)

He hasnt had any work for 1 week now but since having him we do an hour of walk trot and canter work 3 times a week. He wasnt fit when i got him so just building him up slowly!


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## Justturnedfifty (21 April 2014)

Sarah04 said:



			He hasnt had any work for 1 week now but since having him we do an hour of walk trot and canter work 3 times a week. He wasnt fit when i got him so just building him up slowly!
		
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Hi Sarah, I think you have replied to another thread with regard to only recently taking up riding and first time owning a horse, and now your experiencing potentially a full laminitis attack with your Newforest x. I am concerned for you - managing a pony with the start of laminitis can be very difficult. Please ensure you read up on laminitis - the links you have been given are sound advice. For a novice inexperienced horse owner google as much information on laminitis you can, and continue to manage your ponies condition every hour if need be. Out of interest, what else has your vet recommended you ought to be doing with your pony?


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## Carlosmum (22 April 2014)

I have a 14.3 NF x who is a recovering laminitic. I say recovering because he has had several severe attacks but has now been lami free for 2 years.
I manage him during an attack as follows:
Off Grass into a shavings/pellet bed, well soaked hay ( little & often) feedwise he has dengie mollasses free hi-fi. and speedibeet I usually also add NAF Laminaze as extra support.  If he is lame & add a sachet of bute to his evening feed.
Check his digital pulses regularly ( 2x day) when he has had 2 days with no pulses I turn out with a muzzle for an hour or 2 putting out extra soaked hay if necessary.
After a mild attack I can usually start riding again after 4-5 days but I have previously had him on box rest for 10 weeks.
IMO Laminitis is a permanent condition. Once a horse has had it it will always be prone. So management is for life. My chap is not overwieght ( though he was when he first got it) but I watch his diet and access to grass very carefully and this time of year or when the grass is growing strongly, I check his pulses everyday.
Good luck, with careful management you may never face it again.


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## Sarah04 (22 April 2014)

The vet and i decided food only while on medication, soaked hay (which if I keep topped up he's not eating his straw now) and im putting him in a small section of the paddock for a few hours a day which the vet saw and said was fine. When walking to the paddock he's very excitable when walking on the grass and when I take head collar off he has a good roll and buck / bronc so guessing i caught it early .  The only thing he isnt letting me do still is pick his front right foot. Id love to put a pic on here but no idea how! Have done alot of research about laminitis!


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## STRIKER (22 April 2014)

So assuming the lami is in the lf as he doesnt want to take the weight on that leg.


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## Pinkvboots (22 April 2014)

If the pony has laminitis it should not be on any grass at all until the symptoms have gone, even if its only showing mild signs as with the sugar from the grass can soon turn the mild symptoms into a full blown attack of laminitis.


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## thewonderhorse (22 April 2014)

Get him off the grass altogether.

 Soak his hay 12-24 hours and change water also. No hard feed or carrots/apples/mints etc.

Feed him from a small holed haynet and double net it if possible.

Have you got anywhere where you can turn him out with no grass at all?

I would also have him on a deep bed of shavings right up to the door.


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## amandap (22 April 2014)

Sarah04 said:



			The vet and i decided food only while on medication, soaked hay (which if I keep topped up he's not eating his straw now) and im putting him in a small section of the paddock for a few hours a day which the vet saw and said was fine. When walking to the paddock he's very excitable when walking on the grass and when I take head collar off he has a good roll and buck / bronc so guessing i caught it early .  The only thing he isnt letting me do still is pick his front right foot. Id love to put a pic on here but no idea how! Have done alot of research about laminitis!
		
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Don't be deceived that bucking etc. is a sign all is ok. It's amazing how excitement can over ride pain unless severe. Personally I would hold off any grass turnout until he is comfortable off pain relief for a couple of days at least. I wish you had a grass free area you could turn him out in and continue to feed soaked hay.
Often, reluctance to pick up a front hoof means the other is sore, so avoiding putting extra weight on it. Use old carpet pieces/thick matting or a conforming surface for him to stand on when you lift feet and give lots of breaks.
Is he shod? What has the vet said re hoof care?

ps. Watching him move when calm and quiet is a much better indicator of comfort than when in a heightened state ime.

Great you are doing lots of research.


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## Sarah04 (22 April 2014)

Ok ill keep him off grass and then when he's better do I gradually put him back in the paddock an hour a day? Obviously grass will of grown while he's not out. No I don't have any bare areas.  Thanks for all the advice! He has two front shoes no one has mentioned his feet? Before I called vet I had two farriers down who said he was fine just needed to lose weight I knew he wasnt right!


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## Justturnedfifty (22 April 2014)

Sarah04 said:



			Ok ill keep him off grass and then when he's better do I gradually put him back in the paddock an hour a day? Obviously grass will of grown while he's not out. No I don't have any bare areas.  Thanks for all the advice! He has two front shoes no one has mentioned his feet? Before I called vet I had two farriers down who said he was fine just needed to lose weight I knew he wasnt right!
		
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Hi Sarah, you are currently in between the devil and the deep blue sea so to speak. I too had a pottery pony last year, I too thought I had caught him early, kept him off grass for a week, on soaked hay etc. I then turned him out on his restricted grazing patch, all ok for 24 hours, I then moved several fence posts so he had 'proper grass'. Worst mistake I ever made, 12 hours later full blown laminitis! Vet, bute, special plastic/laminitic shoes costing £100, £350 on x-rays to see if his pedal bone had rotated, £50 + on setting up hemp bedding etc. 6 weeks confined to a stable + a further 4 weeks hand grazing and walking out in hand, eventually leading to long reining in straight lines and jockey back on board. Beginning of March this year I set my starvation paddock up, and he is still in it. I move 2 fence posts a day by about 10 inches and that is his treat. Cruel to be kind. No don't turn out an hour at a time unless you are going to put a grazing muzzle on, and as you do not have bare areas, your chap is going to have to get used to a grazing muzzle because this is the only way you will be able to confidently turn him out, and to lose weight. Start to learn how to feel for pulses in his front feet, that's also very important because they are his red light indicator that he is in pain etc.


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## Sarah04 (23 April 2014)

Oh gosh! The vet showed me where to feel for the pulses . Last night he let me pick out his left foot which he hasnt been. How do you keep your starvation paddock short? I'm struggling as now hes inside the grass is obviously growing I could do with something munching it down till he can come back out . Thanks reply


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## Sarah04 (23 April 2014)

Oh also will he eventually be able to have dry hay again?


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## Tiddlypom (23 April 2014)

Sarah04 said:



			How do you keep your starvation paddock short? I'm struggling as now hes inside the grass is obviously growing I could do with something munching it down till he can come back out . Thanks reply
		
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I mow my starvation paddocks with a garden lawnmower if they have grown back a bit. I have posted on other threads, that when I did this recently on an apparently 'bare' 40m x 20m starvation paddock, I collected a 150L twin wheelbarrow load of compressed grass clippings! 

You can hire petrol mowers with a grass collection box if you can't borrow anything suitable.

Good luck.


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## amandap (23 April 2014)

Sarah04 said:



			Oh also will he eventually be able to have dry hay again?
		
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I'm afraid there's no way to predict as every horse is different. The problem with hay is unless it has been tested there is no way to know how much sugars and carbs it contains. You cannot tell by look, smell or age and its hard to predict how your horse will respond in the long term.

Over time you will get better at seeing more subtle changes that point to a problem developing, the sooner you act the better. I have a pony that cannot have any grass or unsoaked hay. Here's some pointers. http://www.safergrass.org/pdf/laminitissigns.pdf

There are times when grass is more dangerous such as sunny days and cold nights hence Spring and Autumn being problem times but even in winter a run of sunny cold weather can be risky. More to learn about I'm afraid.

Remember if using a muzzle the grass has to be long enough so he can get some through the hole or he will be starved effectively.


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## Sarah04 (23 April 2014)

Thank you . Yes we have a ride on mower that collects grass that we tried to use on one paddock but it was a bit bumpy so didnt get it all might mow the flatter paddock . Could I put him out at night ?


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## amandap (23 April 2014)

Putting him out late at night is an option to try in future but I would wait until he is recovered and introduce slowly monitoring his response. A small area with soaked hay is another step forward to try later. 
It's hard I know but when yards don't have grass free areas for these horses in acute laminitis, sadly the stable becomes the only safe option until things are well under control.


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## Sarah04 (23 April 2014)

Sorry to ask such silly questions but wilI i know he's better when he has no pulse, no heat and walks ok on hard ground? He finishes his medication tonight.Thanks


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## Sarah04 (23 April 2014)

Oh we also live on our own farm so i could make one of the paddocks as bare as possible!


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## Kaylum (24 April 2014)

Yes don't fertilise the grass, poo pick as much as possible and if you re sow only use meadow plant seed mix. The type of grass is very important as most paddocks originally were for cattle and horses cannot deal with the richness of it x


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## Sarah04 (27 April 2014)

Little update on Bailey. He finished his medication on wednesday he's been on box rest (looked very depressed) and he's been having soaked hay ...... he is now letting me pick up and pick out all 4 feet normally, he can turn a tight circle with no problems so today I thought I would take him for a walk...Well talk about excitement he was trotting along the track/road and I couldn't keep up so this afternoon I put him in his original paddock (not the one with the lush grass which I suspect started the lami or from what ive read grain can start it so not sure if he's eaten some duck corn!) He was super excited . I'm just leaving him out an hour and then bringing him in. His new friend comes tuesday so I can't wait as im sure he's going to love having a horsey friend! Would like to try and put him back on dry hay in a trickle hay net as to be honest lugging the soaked hay about is flaring up my disk in my back.....not sure if this is too soon ?


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## Tiddlypom (27 April 2014)

Sarah04 said:



			Would like to try and put him back on dry hay in a trickle hay net as to be honest lugging the soaked hay about is flaring up my disk in my back.....not sure if this is too soon ?
		
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Its best to carry on with the soaked hay.

How do you soak yours? I too have a knackered back (4 slipped discs) and I stuff dry into a water butt and fill it via a hosepipe. Soak it for however long, then turn the tap at the bottom of the butt and the water drains out. Then I tip the water butt upside down to drain out the dregs, and the soaked-but-now-drained-hay is ready to feed. At no point am I lugging heavy waterlogged hay around .


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## Sarah04 (27 April 2014)

I fill 4-6 black buckets with hay then fill each bucket from outside tap(takes ages as on spring water) then I empty water out of each one then tip 2 or 3 buckets of soaked hay into a hay net carry heavy haynet to fence tie it up off the ground rinse it through with water and leave to drain for 10 mins then carry to stable whilst trying to tie heavy haynet up pony is pulling at it to get hay out! I have a haybar but he doesn't eat soaked hay well from that so that's why having to use haynet. Think I've done my back in a bit as well from trying to lift his left foot which he never did let me lift till a few days ago. Good old pilates should have me right soon lol . That's a really good idea with water butt wonder if I can pick one up from any we here! Do you feed soaked hay all the time? Do you let him/her eat it ftom water butt? Thanks


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## Tiddlypom (27 April 2014)

Gosh,it sounds like hard work the way you do it!

I don't feed direct from the water butt, as it isn't robust enough. I can get about a third to a half of a small bale of hay in it at a time, all well packed down. Pre getting the water butts, I used to soak hay in black plastic dustbins, and tip them over and invert them to drain afterwards. Got to be easier than a multitude of black buckets!


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