# Peptizole - anyone tried it??



## Tiger21 (4 February 2015)

Just curious if anyone has used this as an alternative to gastrogard? Exact same drug so assuming it should be just as effective but coming in about £80 a week cheaper to treat.


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## popsdosh (4 February 2015)

Tiger21 said:



			Just curious if anyone has used this as an alternative to gastrogard? Exact same drug so assuming it should be just as effective but coming in about £80 a week cheaper to treat.
		
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Exactly the same it is the only licenced alternative to GG made by norbrook .Just as effective


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## ClumsyPonyPF (4 February 2015)

Like above, is exactly the same just before gastroguard was the only licensed one on the market.
We have swapped onto it and has the same effect


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## Tiger21 (4 February 2015)

Excellent - thanks guys. Seems like a no brainer to swap on to it then!


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## sunleychops (4 February 2015)

Its also a bigger syringe.


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## ecrozier (4 February 2015)

Tiger21 said:



			Just curious if anyone has used this as an alternative to gastrogard? Exact same drug so assuming it should be just as effective but coming in about £80 a week cheaper to treat.
		
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I haven't used it personally so no direct experience but I have heard two vets say they aren't 100% convinced it is fully as effective, somthing to do with the method of buffering the omeprazole through to the stomach? I am fully prepared to stand corrected though, as I say, this is hearsay.  Also though - its much lass than £80 cheaper if you buy via ****** - think roughly £25 different....  Bigger mark up via the vet practices on GGard!


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## mega spoilt ponies (4 February 2015)

I have found that it is not as effective as Gastrogard. The 'carrier' is still under patent with Gastrogard.


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## Tiger21 (4 February 2015)

ecrozier said:



			I haven't used it personally so no direct experience but I have heard two vets say they aren't 100% convinced it is fully as effective, somthing to do with the method of buffering the omeprazole through to the stomach? I am fully prepared to stand corrected though, as I say, this is hearsay.  Also though - its much lass than £80 cheaper if you buy via ****** - think roughly £25 different....  Bigger mark up via the vet practices on GGard!
		
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I can get peptizole for £20 a box of 7 cheaper than GG from the vet. As the peptizole is a bigger syringe I would only need 1 whereas I need 1.25 GG a day so that's where the majority of my saving is coming from (should be £60 a week not £80). I know practises that are selling GG for over £100 more per box so don't think the price I'm getting has a ridiculous mark up. obviously it's all about getting him better in the end so definitely need something that works - decisions!!


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## ecrozier (4 February 2015)

Tiger21 said:



			I can get peptizole for £20 a box of 7 cheaper than GG from the vet. As the peptizole is a bigger syringe I would only need 1 whereas I need 1.25 GG a day so that's where the majority of my saving is coming from (should be £60 a week not £80). I know practises that are selling GG for over £100 more per box so don't think the price I'm getting has a ridiculous mark up. obviously it's all about getting him better in the end so definitely need something that works - decisions!!
		
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****** sell GGard for £154 a box of seven and peptizole was £138, that was a few weeks ago - appreciate the point re larger tube though.  And does depend what your vet charges for prescriptions etc (fortunately mine doesn't!) 
TBH - my vet doesn't like GGuard/Merial on principle as he objects to the astronomical price they've charged all these years, but when faced with my horse and his ulcers he said that he still has more faith in the carrier/buffering system they use.  A friend's vet also said something similar.  However another friend has had her mare on peptizole, its taken 4 months but she is gradually coming right.  All anecdotal I guess!


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## ecrozier (4 February 2015)

Ooops seems I can't say who sells it for that price! But I just googled 'cheap gastroguard'!


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## Tiger21 (4 February 2015)

ecrozier said:



			****** sell GGard for £154 a box of seven and peptizole was £138, that was a few weeks ago - appreciate the point re larger tube though.  And does depend what your vet charges for prescriptions etc (fortunately mine doesn't!
TBH - my vet doesn't like GGuard/Merial on principle as he objects to the astronomical price they've charged all these years, but when faced with my horse and his ulcers he said that he still has more faith in the carrier/buffering system they use.  A friend's vet also said something similar.  However another friend has had her mare on peptizole, its taken 4 months but she is gradually coming right.  All anecdotal I guess!
		
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I'm only £162 for GG from vet so sounds like I'd be as well sticking with them! Haha noticed there was just stars but assumed you weren't deliberately keeping your source secret!! He's been on GG for 28days then 14days into the reduced dose symtoms reappeared so vet suggested to try another 28days - I have 2 full boxes of GG left so would only need to use peptizole for a couple of weeks + withdrawal but not sure if that makes any difference or if it's worth changing


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## ecrozier (4 February 2015)

What grade of Ulcers was he scoped with? Potted history of mine isn't dissimilar - presented with behavioural issues, scoped, ggard short course - all seemed fine for a while (a few months), small flare up, another short course, all ok for a bit, then yet again gradually worse, this time got as bad as the original problem again, so we are on a prolonged course at the moment (28 days, then half dose for 14 days, then 1/4 dose for another 14 days).  However with a bit of research I now suspect hind gut is actually as much if not more of an issue for mine as he's a week into GGuard now and doesn't seem much improved so I am going to start treating that... If I can't sort him, I'm a bit stumped but there are some good recommendations on here for a vet called Donna Blinman so may go that route...
Good luck!


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## Tiger21 (4 February 2015)

ecrozier said:



			What grade of Ulcers was he scoped with? Potted history of mine isn't dissimilar - presented with behavioural issues, scoped, ggard short course - all seemed fine for a while (a few months), small flare up, another short course, all ok for a bit, then yet again gradually worse, this time got as bad as the original problem again, so we are on a prolonged course at the moment (28 days, then half dose for 14 days, then 1/4 dose for another 14 days).  However with a bit of research I now suspect hind gut is actually as much if not more of an issue for mine as he's a week into GGuard now and doesn't seem much improved so I am going to start treating that... If I can't sort him, I'm a bit stumped but there are some good recommendations on here for a vet called Donna Blinman so may go that route...
Good luck!
		
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He has hasn't been scoped the main reason being we are fairly rural and the nearest place is a 150mile round trip and I don't have my own transport at the moment. My vet agreed that his symtoms were textbook for ulcers so as an alternative to scoping we did a trial with GG during which I saw a slight improvement so therefore moved to full treatment. While he was on GG I got my old horse back and he just seemed so much brighter and happier in himself and his work. If this next month on full dose doesn't sort things I will get a scope to see exactly what we are dealing with as realise we can't continue filling him with GG in the hope it might eventually work. I know your probably thinking why consider scoping now and not at the start but I suppose I was thinking or hoping that he wasnt too bad and would be fine after one course


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## Scatterbrain (4 February 2015)

Peptizole successfully cleared the gastric ulcers one of mine was suffering from. My vet advised me to use a daily maintenance product afterwards to prevent them returning.
Peptizole will not however treat hind gut ulcers. I used ranitidine to treat those and always give this horse 10 x 150mg tablets 1.5hrs before I ride him as a preventative and to reduce acid production. This guy is very sensitive and prone to ulcers, so prevention is key.


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## ecrozier (4 February 2015)

Scatterbrain did your vet presecribe the ranitidine?  Did you feed alongside the Peptizole?
Tiger - totally understand your reasoning.  Think some do simply take longer, but also worth looking into hind gut issues, there is an arguement that prolonged use of GGuard can actually worsen hind gut conditions....


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## mega spoilt ponies (4 February 2015)

Mine has been on Peptizole/Gastrogard for 3 months with absolutely no symptomatic relief or improvement in hideous grade 4 pyloric ulcers :-(

we are now trying half dose GG, ranitidine and sucralfate


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## ecrozier (4 February 2015)

Wow, MSP, poor horse   have you rescoped and there is literally no improvement?  Horrendous.


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## Tiger21 (4 February 2015)

Ecrosier - my vet gave me the option of ratinidine for the trial as it is much cheaper but I think for it to be most effective it has to be administered every 8hours and my schedule wouldn't allow me to do that. It's also a lot of crushing tablets if they won't take then whole in a feed - I was going to be 25 300mg tablets a day. Would GG mask symtoms of hind gut problems? Just hopeful that since he improved that we are treating the right thing 

MSF - hope you get to the bottom of it all - for your sake and poor ponies.


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## ecrozier (4 February 2015)

Tiger21 said:



			Would GG mask symptoms of hind gut problems? Just hopeful that since he improved that we are treating the right thing
		
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I'm certainly no vet but from fairly extensive research it seems like the opposite is potentially true - certainly GGuard/Peptizole won't fix any hindgut problem and there is a fairly convincing argument that as proton pump inhibitors they may actually exacerbate it   I'm in exactly same position, as initially mine was better on the GGuard but this time it hasn't worked.  I have decided to try to treat the HGA alongside continuing to use the GGuard for ulcers in case we have two probems running hand in hand, will finish prescribed course of GG but if that doesn't do the trick either try Ranitidine, somehow making the schedule work, or try one of the other possible fixes for HGA without the influence of the GG.  If that doesn't work - who knows?! Currently have a very beautiful field ornament as he's unrideable!


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## mega spoilt ponies (4 February 2015)

Gg will aggravate hind gut

My horse was much worse on re-scoping unfortunately. Vet thinks his issues (violently coldbacked) are purely the result of ulcer pain. Whereas my instinct tells me he is in pain somewhere else and thats why the ulcers are not responding to treatment. 

Im busy working my way through every diagnostic test under the sun!


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## Scatterbrain (4 February 2015)

ecrozier said:



			Scatterbrain did your vet presecribe the ranitidine?  Did you feed alongside the Peptizole?
		
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We did the course of Peptizole first, as didn't realise he had hind gut issues too at that point. Once he scoped clear, he still had some ridden issues, so my vet prescribed ranitidine to target the hind gut. I was advised to feed it every 8 hrs for optimum effect. 
I now only have to throw 10 tablets in a small feed 1.5hrs before being ridden and give him a maintenance stomach product twice daily.
 The tanking off with me on board has ceased, he's eating better and the saddle slipping slightly to the left has completely gone (hind gut ulcers can make them move awkwardly on the RH).
Hope you find a solution for your boy. Ulcers are clearly very painful!


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## Elf On A Shelf (4 February 2015)

We use all forms of ulcer stuff in the yard. GG works the best. When we have a horse diagnosed with ulcers we put them on 2 weeks of full dose of GG. Depending on the grade of ulcers the horse may stay on a half syringe of GG maintenance dose a day or go onto Peptizole or Ulcer Gold half syringe a day.

The horses that were given Peptizole or Ulcer Gold from the start showed very slow signs of improvement compared to GG - hence we always start on GG - but the other 2 seem to work well enough on that as a maintenance dose. Any lower and it didn't do a dot for the horse.

For a horse with seriously painful ulcers we do 3 - 4 days of Antepsin first before GG. MSP - it may be worth asking your vet about this stuff?


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## Nari (4 February 2015)

Antepsin was a God send to me last winter, at one point it was the only thing that could get him off the floor. After the weekend when I used all my vets supply & they'd borrowed from most of the local vets too we resorted to Gaviscon Liquid &, though not quite as effective, it did give him enough relief that very frequent doses kept him comfortable. I keep him on a daily dose of Gaviscon now, but still have a bottle if Antepsin to hand for emergencies. When he was feeling well enough to eat again EquiShure also seemed to help keep him comfortable.


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## ecrozier (4 February 2015)

Equishure is what I am about to try.... Mine is very happy to eat thankfully!


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## Laafet (4 February 2015)

Nari said:



			Antepsin was a God send to me last winter, at one point it was the only thing that could get him off the floor. After the weekend when I used all my vets supply & they'd borrowed from most of the local vets too we resorted to Gaviscon Liquid &, though not quite as effective, it did give him enough relief that very frequent doses kept him comfortable. I keep him on a daily dose of Gaviscon now, but still have a bottle if Antepsin to hand for emergencies. When he was feeling well enough to eat again EquiShure also seemed to help keep him comfortable.
		
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We use Ranitidine and Antepsin on foals with the runs, it is very good for gut problems.


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## Pigeon (20 December 2015)

mega spoilt ponies said:



			. Whereas my instinct tells me he is in pain somewhere else and thats why the ulcers are not responding to treatment.
		
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Is this a thing? My guy's seem to recur at the same time of year even with very careful management so I'm wondering if this is his issue. However I can't find much online about it? He isn't a stressy horse really.


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## Goldenstar (20 December 2015)

mega spoilt ponies said:



			Mine has been on Peptizole/Gastrogard for 3 months with absolutely no symptomatic relief or improvement in hideous grade 4 pyloric ulcers :-(

we are now trying half dose GG, ranitidine and sucralfate
		
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Has he had antibiotics alongside the GG/ P.?


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## Goldenstar (20 December 2015)

Pigeon said:



			Is this a thing? My guy's seem to recur at the same time of year even with very careful management so I'm wondering if this is his issue. However I can't find much online about it? He isn't a stressy horse really.
		
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It's defiantly what can be going on .
The ulcers are caused by the pain of a other undiagnosed condition .
In fact I think ulcers are probably very rarely a stand alone issue except in horses on very forage deprived high grain diets .


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## mega spoilt ponies (21 December 2015)

Having now been researching for the last two years it seems it is actually not very common for the ulcers to be stand alone where they are not splash ulcers. It is usually the case that there is pain somewhere and that the ulcers are secondary (navicular, kissing spine, arthritis seem to be common).

Sadly for my horse we just can't find anything else physically wrong with him - he may be one of the unusual ones where it is just stress, despite not being an outwardly stressy horse. He has now been turned away to grass for 6 months in case there is some invisible injury that needs to heal!


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