# Help - Previous owner won't release passport



## Gerry-Boy (1 December 2016)

Hi guys

I have a huge problem and not sure what to do next. I bought Gerry about 6 weeks ago, the owner couldn't deliver him so asked a friend of hers to deliver him. That friend of hers brought him but "forgot" the passport. I didn't think any of it (silly me!) as I was just so happy to finally have my boy home! I also didn't get a receipt for him. Also didn't think any of that as the owner had said she'd pop over the next week to see how he's settled in and she'd bring his passport then.

Well, that was six weeks ago. I've sent her several emails asking to post the passport, to some she's replied saying she'd post it and to others she hasn't replied at all.

I'm not really sure what do do next. I've thought of taking a solicitor but I'm not sure if they can do anything? All I have is her name, email address and bank details.
I  can prove he's mine by the emails and the bank statements but I haven't got anything official.

I heard it's really easy to get a replacement passport issued - anyone know anything about this?

Any help would be appreciated!

Thank you!


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## Tyssandi (1 December 2016)

Gerry-Boy said:



			Hi guys

I have a huge problem and not sure what to do next. I bought Gerry about 6 weeks ago, the owner couldn't deliver him so asked a friend of hers to deliver him. That friend of hers brought him but "forgot" the passport. I didn't think any of it (silly me!) as I was just so happy to finally have my boy home! I also didn't get a receipt for him. Also didn't think any of that as the owner had said she'd pop over the next week to see how he's settled in and she'd bring his passport then.

Well, that was six weeks ago. I've sent her several emails asking to post the passport, to some she's replied saying she'd post it and to others she hasn't replied at all.

I'm not really sure what do do next. I've thought of taking a solicitor but I'm not sure if they can do anything? All I have is her name, email address and bank details.
I  can prove he's mine by the emails and the bank statements but I haven't got anything official.

I heard it's really easy to get a replacement passport issued - anyone know anything about this?

Any help would be appreciated!

Thank you!
		
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Can you remember who the passport was with??? if so contact them and explain, failing that contact trading standards ( for all the good they are )  Write to the previous owner her and ask her to send it asap.  If she does not send it or reply   book horse in for another passport with your vet.


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## Leo Walker (1 December 2016)

Its either lost or disposed of as they are hiding something, hopefully the former! Get the vet out to scan for a chip, if there is you can get a replacement passport if not then have a chip inserted and a new passport done. I wouldnt even waste your time with trading standards, been there, done that, got nowhere!


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## PorkChop (1 December 2016)

FrankieCob said:



			Its either lost or disposed of as they are hiding something, hopefully the former! Get the vet out to scan for a chip, if there is you can get a replacement passport if not then have a chip inserted and a new passport done. I wouldnt even waste your time with trading standards, been there, done that, got nowhere!
		
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This!  

How far away is the previous owner, could you make an impromtu visit?


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## Vodkagirly (1 December 2016)

Make a copy of the bank transaction, this is your receipt and keep in safe place.
Keep a copy of any correspondence just in case.
Send a text advising that it is illegal to transport and sell a horse without a passport and you will be mentioning to the authorities if not received within 7 days. I doubt the authorities will be interested but worth a go.


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## SusieT (1 December 2016)

She could not have a passport if you didn't see it..!
I would threaten to report her to trading standards personally but you might get yourself in bother - sometimes it is easier to replace passport than chase the original


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## The Fuzzy Furry (1 December 2016)

OP, as mentioned above, print out payment details if you paid via BACS.

Did you actually SEE the passport when trying etc?

If yes, send 1 final letter, enclose an SAE for her to pop passport in.

If not, then get cracking in getting vet out to check for micro chip, and then completing new passport to be reg with the likes of Pet ID etc.
You might have an issue if there is a chip, but a 2nd one can always be inserted if chip isn't recognised.

The irritating thing will be re-starting flu vaccs etc too.


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## Sparemare (1 December 2016)

Did the vet who did your vetting see the passport?


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## popsdosh (2 December 2016)

The Fuzzy Furry said:



			OP, as mentioned above, print out payment details if you paid via BACS.

Did you actually SEE the passport when trying etc?

If yes, send 1 final letter, enclose an SAE for her to pop passport in.

If not, then get cracking in getting vet out to check for micro chip, and then completing new passport to be reg with the likes of Pet ID etc.
You might have an issue if there is a chip, but a 2nd one can always be inserted if chip isn't recognised.

The irritating thing will be re-starting flu vaccs etc too.
		
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Its illegal for a vet to chip a horse that already has one.


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## The Fuzzy Furry (2 December 2016)

popsdosh said:



			Its illegal for a vet to chip a horse that already has one.
		
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Not if the chip cannot be traced. A replacement can be issued


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## Shay (2 December 2016)

Hopefully not - but if you can't get hold of the passport can you be sure she actually had the right to sell him?  If he is a horse missing on loan then he may legally belong to the previous owner.  

Hopefully you saw the passport pre-purchase - or the vet saw the passport on vetting and this is just a lost passport or an old owner who has other things to do.  But the darker side to this might be that if no-one has seen the passport he could be stolen or otherwise not hers to sell. 

I like the suggestion of writing to her (I'd write rather than send a text - but I'm old) stating that it is illegal to sell or transport the horse without the passport and giving her 7 days to respond.  But in your place I would also be starting the process of tracing the ID Chip or freezemark if he has one.  The Chip number - and indeed the passport number and issuing authority-  will be recorded on the vetting report.  But if you didn't have him vetted get the vet out to scan for a chip and hopefully you can trace the PIO that way.

Getting a replacement passport isn't difficult.  My worry would be that the seller did not have legal ownership of the animal in the first place; or that the animal you have is not the animal that was sold.


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## popsdosh (2 December 2016)

The Fuzzy Furry said:



			Not if the chip cannot be traced. A replacement can be issued 

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If the chip cannot be traced to a passport you can use that chip to get a passport.


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## Gerry-Boy (2 December 2016)

Hi All

Thank you so much for your advice!

I had the vet out yesterday because my other horse needed its flu jab and she kindly offered to scan Gerry's microchip to get the replacement passport on the way.

Well, turns out he hasn't got one! (or it has stopped working which according to my vet sometimes happens - but somehow I doubt that!)

That explains why she's gone all quiet... When I saw him she did show me the/a passport, I even checked with her if he was microchipped and I saw that the passport had a microchip number. So whoever's passport she showed me, it wasn't his!

I can't believe this happened to me, how could I be so stupid! And how horrible is this woman, she knowingly sold me a horse I don't know anything about! She sold him to me as a confidence giver - I was lucky nothing worse happened to me when he chucked me off. 
I'm absolutely shocked by what's happened and by the action of that woman!

Anyway, my vet microchipped him yesterday and I sent the forms off for his replacement passport. Hopefully this will arrive soon and he can finally move on to his new home where he'll be much loved and will be schooled by someone who knows how to handle difficult horses.


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## PorkChop (2 December 2016)

Oh, it becomes clearer now!

What a shame, have you tried googling her name, or going on the Dodgy Dealers page on facebook?


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## Gerry-Boy (2 December 2016)

Demented Elf said:



			Oh, it becomes clearer now!

What a shame, have you tried googling her name, or going on the Dodgy Dealers page on facebook?
		
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I did google her name before I bought him but not much came up - definitely nothing worrying! For all I know that's not even her real name...

Thanks for the tip about the Dodgy Dealers, I didn't know about that! Will have a look.


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## Leo Walker (2 December 2016)

Some of them change names so often that you cant keep up! Its not a dealers in Essex is it?


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## Gerry-Boy (2 December 2016)

FrankieCob said:



			Some of them change names so often that you cant keep up! Its not a dealers in Essex is it?
		
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No, it's in Leicestershire


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## be positive (2 December 2016)

If he is a tb bred to race and only 5 then he will be chipped, can you remember the "proper" name he had on the passport you looked at?


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## Gerry-Boy (2 December 2016)

Yes I can - but I doubt the passport she showed me was for my Gerry.

I don't even know if he really was bred to race or if he's actually ever raced. Don't know if anything she told me was true :|


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## D66 (2 December 2016)

There is always the small claims court. You could claim back the cost of the horse and all your expenses inc the passport, less the money you got when you sold him, (if you did get something back).  you might not get your money back but at least she would be on the system.


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## Leo Walker (2 December 2016)

Gerry-Boy said:



			Yes I can - but I doubt the passport she showed me was for my Gerry.

I don't even know if he really was bred to race or if he's actually ever raced. Don't know if anything she told me was true :|
		
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If hes a cob he wasnt bred to race!


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## be positive (2 December 2016)

Gerry-Boy said:



			Yes I can - but I doubt the passport she showed me was for my Gerry.

I don't even know if he really was bred to race or if he's actually ever raced. Don't know if anything she told me was true :|
		
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If he is not a tb and never raced it seems an odd story to give as it devalues them rather than makes them more valuable, it would be more likely they would tell you a tb was a part bred that had been owned by a 70 year old who hacked it round the lanes.

It shows how important it is to do your homework before buying, to not believe anything unless you can verify it, to take an experienced person to the viewing with you and to get them vetted so you are reasonably well covered.


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## Shay (2 December 2016)

Compulsory micro chipping was (in theory) brought in in 2009.  So if he is 5.5 years old he should be chipped if he was born in the UK.  Which opens up the question as to how old he actually is.

Frankie Cob - why do you think he's a cob?  I'm lost.

If he's a TB then  -  as be positive says - its not hugely likely that they would have spun you a line about him being an ex racer as that is an alarm bell to many.  But if he had been bred to race he'd be microchipped.


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## Gerry-Boy (2 December 2016)

FrankieCob said:



			If hes a cob he wasnt bred to race!
		
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Gerry's a TB, my new horse is a cob &#9786;&#65039;


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## Gerry-Boy (2 December 2016)

be positive said:



			If he is not a tb and never raced it seems an odd story to give as it devalues them rather than makes them more valuable, it would be more likely they would tell you a tb was a part bred that had been owned by a 70 year old who hacked it round the lanes.

It shows how important it is to do your homework before buying, to not believe anything unless you can verify it, to take an experienced person to the viewing with you and to get them vetted so you are reasonably well covered.
		
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He's a Tb, no doubt about that. And I know that I was stupid, I should have been less trusting. I googled her before I bought him, asked about the microchip and saw the passport. 

I wanted him so badly that when he got delivered and the guy said he forgot the passport I didn't send him back - I guess I should probably have done that...

I've definitely learnt my lesson though...


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## Caracarrie (2 December 2016)

Gerry-Boy said:



			He's a Tb, no doubt about that. And I know that I was stupid, I should have been less trusting. I googled her before I bought him, asked about the microchip and saw the passport. 

I wanted him so badly that when he got delivered and the guy said he forgot the passport I didn't send him back - I guess I should probably have done that...

I've definitely learnt my lesson though...
		
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Pound to a penny the "friend" that delivered him keeps the seller warm in bed at night!


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## Sparemare (2 December 2016)

Was he not vetted before you bought him OP? The vet who vetted him would have asked to see his passport.


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## Shay (3 December 2016)

Just hope everything works out OK for you OP.  Its hard when you fall in love with one; but the cynic in me says this has the potential for disaster written all over it.  You've clearly been lied to - the only remaining issue is "about what?"  Hopefully nothing major or expensive. Let us know how you go - I suspect we've all made mistakes along the way  - I know I have - and no-one should sit in judgement.


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