# why have a horse if you have it on full livery?



## LuandLu24 (4 September 2014)

Before you all scream at me,  let me just say that I saw this on a Facebook group and there was some very interesting answers, I'm not attacking anyone, this is only a little discussion and opinion sharing. If you have a horse why have full livery? If you have a job or some other kind of commitment that takes up your time in the day or you do nights then I completely understand but people who just can't be bothered mucking out etc really annoy me, if you want a horse and have time then go up and care for your horse! A girl on my old yard had 3 horses and had full livery even though she only worked from 9 until 3 and only came up on weekends to ride them. I go to my horse everyday to do my yard jobs and love it. I'd love to see everyone's opinions on this. Please keep the thread mature and respectful even if you disagree with someone's opinion.


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## Jango (4 September 2014)

I have my horse on DIY and I'm the same as you I enjoy looking after him as well as riding but some people only enjoy riding and if they can afford it and the horse is well cared for why not!


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## PolarSkye (4 September 2014)

When I was working full time, for a global, multi-national company, commuting to London and travelling (internationally) for a minimum of two weeks out of four a month, I had my boy on full livery.

I would never do it again . . . I enjoy spending time with him and looking after him.  However . . . there are people who have the means to pay for their horse's care and only want to ride.  It's not what I would do, but I'm afraid I can't (and won't) judge . . . horses for courses and all that (pun intended).  

P


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## [59668] (4 September 2014)

I have my 2 on full livery because I commute an hour to my job in London.  They are cared for superbly, and have everything they could want.  As it is I get up at 5am so I can ride before work, the horses are a 30 min drive from home, and then a 30 min drive to the station, and I see them on average I would say 5 days a week.  Sometimes I just can't do every day.  They want for nothing though, and are my whole world.


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## MerrySherryRider (4 September 2014)

Can't see a problem with full livery, if the horses are well cared for it can be better than being a haphazard DIY er. It also keeps someone in a job. I'm on diy because I have the time but wouldn't mind being on full livery if I had reason to be.


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## misskk88 (4 September 2014)

When I was on full livery it was due to the fact I was at a yard out of the way of my workplace, and I also did a lot of travelling with my job which meant I was limited on time especially in mornings- somtimes I couldn't even make it up for a few days and so I really did need help often. Full was the only way to ensure it was done every day without any worries! Even though I still work away ocassionally, I am hoping to swap to assisted/DIY shortly, and the yard is on the way to and from work. For me it was a time factor, and moving to DIY is so I can have more money in my pocket!

I would say that as long as horses are cared for either by owner, or professionals in their absence, it is up to individuals what they prefer and what they wish to do with their time and money.The only time I get angry is when horses wellbeing or care suffers due to an owners complete arrogance and laziness.


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## NellRosk (4 September 2014)

Having worked on a full livery yard I noticed there were 2 types of people. Those that loved their horses but just didn't have the time to do everything so put them on full, and those that just couldn't be arsed and liked having a horse as a kind of 'status symbol'.


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## Greylegs (4 September 2014)

I'm retired, occupy my time doing domestic things, gardening and have other hobbies/friends etc. I'm fit and well and technically there's no reason why I couldn't do my own horse, but nevertheless, I choose to keep him on full livery at an excellent yard with great facilities. So I guess I'm one of the people you're talking about.

Why? Well, because he's cared for brilliantly by good people and has a great life. He's in a regular care routine. If I want to go away for a weekend (which I do from time to time) I simply tell the yard and I have no worries about who's looking after the horse while I'm not there. I don't have to make a special arrangement with other liveries or pay extra charges to YOs etc. The owners live on site and are there 24/7 in case of emergencies. Whilst I'm happy to do stable chores and often do, they're done automatically anyway if I'm not there. The yard is 20 minutes away (depending on traffic) so not next door, so wouldn't want to have to go twice a day ... an hour and 20 mins in total travelling time. I generally go every day regardless.

In short, it's convenient, good for my horse and works for me. I have no worries about my horse and his care and I can spend my "horse" time enjoying my horse not mucking out, poo picking, lugging buckets, filling hay nets etc etc.

Ok, it's expensive and I'm on a very tight budget, but, for me, it's worth it.


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## Sparkles (4 September 2014)

Because current situation till early next year means I can't get to my yard on days off, so for them days he needs to be cared for. For the rest, its slightly different as my livery is also where I work.


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## quirky (4 September 2014)

I'm the only diyer on a yard of full liveries.
We have somebody with erratic hours and international travel - she does do weekends herself if she's not away.
Another who has a full-time job and a young child. She has time to muck out, or ride. She chose the riding over mucking out.
We have another who rocks up 3 times a week, once on a weekend.
And lastly, one who rocks up once in a blue moon and will bath and polish horse before going away again.


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## Janovich (4 September 2014)

PolarSkye said:



			When I was working full time, for a global, multi-national company, commuting to London and travelling (internationally) for a minimum of two weeks out of four a month, I had my boy on full livery.

I would never do it again . . . I enjoy spending time with him and looking after him.  However . . . there are people who have the means to pay for their horse's care and only want to ride.  It's not what I would do, but I'm afraid I can't (and won't) judge . . . horses for courses and all that (pun intended).  

P
		
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Agree with above entirely...


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## rara007 (4 September 2014)

Why have a house if you have a cleaner?


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## shadeofshyness (4 September 2014)

If I bought my own horse, I simply wouldn't have time to do the jobs myself every day due to my job and travel required for it. I'd much rather be safe in the knowledge the horse had good care and a good routine - then when I did have time to be there, I would be able to devote all my time to quality time with them i.e. grooming, bonding and riding rather than rushing about mucking out frantically while the horse is tied up outside the stable not interacting with me anyway.


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## Janovich (4 September 2014)

NellRosk said:



			Having worked on a full livery yard I noticed there were 2 types of people. Those that loved their horses but just didn't have the time to do everything so put them on full, and those that just couldn't be arsed and liked having a horse as a kind of 'status symbol'.
		
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Agree with the above too!


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## quirky (4 September 2014)

rara007 said:



			Why have a house if you have a cleaner?
		
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If you didn't have a house, you wouldn't need a cleaner.
I don't get what you're trying to say!


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## Hackie (4 September 2014)

Surely being a good owner is about seeing that your horse's needs are met - the horse doesn't care who mucks it out, changes its rugs or feeds it.  DIY doesn't make anyone a better owner in any sense of the word.  And I think that all the threads on here about DIYers who don't pull their weight is evidence that your livery arrangements are completely irrelevant to your abilities and enjoyment as an owner.

I've had horses all my life, mostly at home so have done 20 years of yard jobs for multiple horses, to me they are a necessity, not something to enjoy.  I also think that having had competition horses, I'm more inclined to look at a horse pragmatically as opposed to a pet.  I've always loved them, and bonded with them, used it as my downtime and enjoyed it but to me it always had a slightly different purpose than to having a horse to ride for fun and 'spend time with'.

OP, I wonder why you think 'if you want a horse and have time then go up and care for your horse'?  I'm pretty picky about having horses on working livery which I've done from time to time, and I would guarantee that the standard of care that my horse recieved in places like that was better than they'd get in your home or mine - plus the added benefits were that I learned a lot about stable management.  So whats your issue?


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## Greylegs (4 September 2014)

NellRosk said:



			Having worked on a full livery yard I noticed there were 2 types of people. Those that loved their horses but just didn't have the time to do everything so put them on full, and those that just couldn't be arsed and liked having a horse as a kind of 'status symbol'.
		
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Erm ... No! Where does that leave me then? I do have the time, but chose to let others do the work. My horse is very much my pride and joy not my "status symbol" 
And I can be "arsed" to look after him myself if I choose to do so. So I don't fit with your categorisation at all.


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## ihatework (4 September 2014)

People all lead different lives with different pressures & priorities.

If you own a horse then you have a duty of care to make sure it is looked after. Whether that is by DIY or full livery I couldn't give a flying fig. 

The horsey world would be much nicer without the significant proportion of judgemental or (reverse)-snobby people around!


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## millitiger (4 September 2014)

Does it matter as long as someone is looking after the horse's needs correctly?


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## PaulnasherryRocky (4 September 2014)

I'm moving from DIY to part livery- not because I can't be bothered to muck out but because the yard i'm moving to only offers part livery, but it is great for me in most other ways so I can put up with not mucking out 5 days a week haha


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## rara007 (4 September 2014)

quirky said:



			If you didn't have a house, you wouldn't need a cleaner.
I don't get what you're trying to say!
		
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If you didn't have a horse you wouldn't need full livery!

Some people enjoy cleaning, others just like a clean house to live in and pay someone to do the dirty work. Some people enjoy mucking out and lugging buckets of water first thing in the morning, others just enjoy a well looked after horse and pay someone to do the dirty work.


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## Jazzy B (4 September 2014)

I think owners who stump up the money for full livery or part livery are much better owners then those who are on DIY and make a bad job of it.  In the last four years on being on two different DIY yards, I have met people whose stable management has defied belief their horses are badly kept, their stables are disgusting and they either just don't know or they don't care!


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## WindyStacks (4 September 2014)

Right now it works for me. I have two small children, a new business and have just moved country - oh and health problems meaning almost constant exhaustion. I'd rather keep my energy for the fun stuff. I feel too frazzled to do DIY right now even though I want to. As an example I went up to say hello yesterday and was so tired I wasn't even sure which one he was in the field and it was only 3pm. 

Trying to get my life sorted out and hope to do DIY starting spring, don't want to jump into it with winter looming. 

Have had 3 major screw-ups in 3 months with full livery at old yard - so I can see why some would rather take self responsibility.


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## tiga71 (4 September 2014)

My horse is on part livery - everything except grooming, exercising, tack cleaning.

When I first got him 5 years ago I was an inexperienced novice. Had volunteered at Horse rescue centre for 18 months doing plenty of mucking out etc but was not knowledgeable about stable management, feeding etc. I read up a lot but I felt that between my inexperience and running my own business (flying to Europe every other week) I felt part livery at a recommended yard was the best thing I could do for my horse. I knew I needed help both in terms of knowledge and time to do basic jobs. I would have managed on DIY as I am not an idiot but being on part livery has been perfect for us.

I still run a business and travel, although try to travel less, but he is still on part livery. i go up everyday unless I am away but it is much easier for me to know that he is looked after without having to organise for people to help when I need to go away or am very busy with work. 

I don't need to poo pick a field or muck out his stable to have a bond with him or to get a massive amount from having a horse. We do an amazing amount together and he is the fittest horse on the yard. I wouldn't be able to do as much with him if I had to do everything, particularly in the winter.


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## NellRosk (4 September 2014)

Greylegs said:



			Erm ... No! Where does that leave me then? I do have the time, but chose to let others do the work. My horse is very much my pride and joy not my "status symbol" 
And I can be "arsed" to look after him myself if I choose to do so. So I don't fit with your categorisation at all.
		
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That was at the yard I worked at, I can't speak for your yard as I have never been. I agree, you don't fit with my categorisation.. and never said that everyone else did!


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## Spring Feather (4 September 2014)

I have around 50 horses living on my farm and except for a small handful, every one of them is on full care livery.  I couldn't care less what owners choose to do, none of my business, I look after the horses and make sure their needs at taken care of, and that's all that's important imo.


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## crazymaisey (4 September 2014)

I pay someone to poo pick as I'd rather save my energy to ride. I'm not in the best of health. I have horses to ride I'm afraid, I love riding. I have dogs as pets!! 

Each to their own though


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## JulesRules (4 September 2014)

I looked at one full livery option before I recently moved my horse and although my first though was "ooh wouldn't it be nice", my second was "What on earth would I do with myself? I'll need a new hobby"

Ended up sticking with DIY all be it DIY plus including t/o and b/i.


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## martlin (4 September 2014)

I like riding my horses, quite enjoy grooming them, too. Not fond of shovelling poo, despise filling haynets and would rather have a lie in, that's why if i don't have to, I don't do the mucking out. Nowt to do with lack of time, international travel or very hard work I'm afraid. I suppose I'm lazy.


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## chestnut cob (4 September 2014)

If someone can afford full livery and that's what they want, I don't see what business it is of someone else's.  I've been full livery in the past, it's great.  Am currently on assisted DIY but doesn't mean to say I wouldn't go back to full.  I detest mucking out and poo picking, if I can afford it why shouldn't I pay someone else?  doesn't make me any less worthy a horse owner.


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## blood_magik (4 September 2014)

mine are all on full livery because I know they'll be looked after and worked if I can't make it up for whatever reason. It's easier to keep them in a routine as well.
The horses dont care who mucks them out or feeds them. No mucking means more time for riding.


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## Pippity (4 September 2014)

My share's on livery one of my days; DIY the other. I'll often pay for a few of the chores to be done on my DIY day because:

a) If I'm not able to borrow a car, I can't get up there early enough to feed/t-o.
b) I have CFS, so there are days when mucking out would wipe me out too much to be able to ride.
c) I only have two days a week with her. I want to spend my time riding and interacting with her, not just shovelling **** while she loafs about in the field.


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## crazymaisey (4 September 2014)

Life's about choice... 

I'm out the house 13 hrs a day working, soon to have a baby.

It's about prioritising for me and how best to use my energy, time and money to get maximum enjoyment out of life.


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## Caramac71 (4 September 2014)

We are on full livery, mainly because the yard is perfect for us and doesn't offer anything else!

But having been DIY and full livery at different yards, I much prefer being on a full livery yard, where there is routine and everything kept neat and tidy. I think it's preferable to most horses to have a set routine, to all be fed and turned out / brought in at the same time.  That was my main dislike with previous DIY yard, having to race around in winter to bring in before dark, as well as field sharing with someone who didn't pull their weight.

We still visit the horse daily, whether intending to ride or not, but as we are quite novicey I like the reassurance of having a knowledgeable YO also checking on her, and being onhand to help with any concerns. Just because someone else has met her basic needs doesn't mean there isn't anything else we can still do for our horse.


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## Goldenstar (4 September 2014)

I have no job and four horses at home .
I have help seven days a week I am in control of every aspect of my horses management but chose not to spend my entire time tied to the stables I have other responsibilities and physically it's hard work for me so why do it if you don't need to.
My grooms are very experienced, my horses have nice lives and are well cared for so I don't understand why the fact I don't get up at six to shovel muck myself should annoy anyone.


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## apachediamond (4 September 2014)

I have my boy on full livery for the following reasons, 2 young children (under the age of 7) and a OH who works all manner of shifts and often away.  I know my horse has a routine and is cared for if the kids are sick, OH is away, working nights etc etc or i'm working late/away.  For me i wanted him to have as much continuity as possible and while i did DIY for the first year i had him there was no set routine for him as i worked round everything else first and he fitted in.

I still go up most nights to ride/groom/spend time with him but now i don't have the added pressure if the day doesn't go to plan of having to try and fit in mucking out etc.


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## FestiveFuzz (4 September 2014)

Who cares?! As long as the horse is well cared for does it matter whether it's on DIY or full livery? Live and let live I say


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## Merrymoles (4 September 2014)

I'm DIY, partly because that is what available locally, partly because that's what suits my budget and partly because I enjoy it most of the time.

However, a tiny part of me thinks that it would be nice if I had more time to do the parts of horse care which actually involve the horse. Most of the time, he gets a quick scrape off and then ridden as I fit it in around mucking out/poo picking, water, haynets, feed, home, full-time work, dogs etc. I noticed last night that his tail was filthy at the top (although remarkably clean further down) but I either had time to ride or time to wash it - guess which won.

I don't think my horse actually cares that he has a mucky tail. He greeted me with a nicker this morning when I turned up to do field service at 7am before work and came and raided my pockets before following me around the field like a big dog. Those are the times I treasure about being on DIY and more than make up for the fact that my horse is a scruffy beast who looks like nobody cares about him. He knows I do!

ETA to add that I don't have any strong feelings about people wanting to put theirs on full livery. I have a friend who keeps her horse next door to her house in the summer (on field livery) but come the autumn he's off to a full livery yard close to where she hunts. She has a full-time, high pressure job, and would have no way of keeping him fit enough to hunt if he were at home. As it is, he is cared for and exercised and she gets to play.


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## Ceriann (4 September 2014)

I had mine on full livery for almost 12 months when they (and i) were between homes and i simply dont have time every day (a job which often requires 14 to 16 hours a day) to travel to a yard and then care for them.  They were brilliantly cared for and wanted for nothing (more pampered than they are now at home with me).  They are now at home with me - literally in the back garden!  I prioritise them every morning (fed, checked over, fly sprayed, rugs chnaged or wahetver and poo picking and if im not not home in time my OH checks them in the evening (I also usually check them last thing at night)).  I love it but if i wasnt lucky enough to be able to afford to have a house with land they would be in full livery.  I think new owners benefit massively form full livery so they can learn how to care for horses - better that than clueless on their own.


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## browneyedbrunnette (4 September 2014)

Mine is on full livery because I suffer from Depression and there are days when I can't get out of bed much less care for a horse.
One my good days when I go to see himself, I help around the yard as much as I can.


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## fatpony (4 September 2014)

Two reasons. My job involves long hours, weekends and on call. I can't physically be there to feed or turnout at set times. Things can change at short notice and I don't want to rely on favours. I'd rather pay for the peace of mind. 
Secondly, I don't have a lot of free time so when I do get to the horse I want to ride him, groom him, wash him, cuddle him. I don't want to muck him out or poo pick instead of spending time with him.


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## Tobiano (4 September 2014)

Right now I have mine on full livery because I work full time.  When I was a kid, I loved nothing more (apart from riding) than to spend hours mucking out, doing haynets and buckets, grooming and even cleaning tack.  Now I just do not have the time to do that AND ride.  And I think I have probably got out of the habit of loving it.. so that when I retire I may well not want to do all those jobs.  I'll probably have a lot more spare time, but a lot less spare energy - being rather at the opposite end of life from when I was a kid!  And I want my best time and energy to be for riding my horse.


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## Sologirl (4 September 2014)

My horse is on full livery because my other half went off to work in Aberdeen, so I am on my own with an 18 month old child and I'm a vet student to boot. I couldn't always guarantee I'd be able to come up every day and I couldn't stand it if I felt my boy wasn't getting somebody's attention daily. I would give anything to be able to get out to see him first thing in the morning or in the evening, I'd go onto DIY, not just because it's cheaper but because I love all aspects of horse care, mucking out etc, and I'd be able to ride more than 3-4 times a week. As it is, I often go a couple of days without seeing him and it's horrible - but I know he's got plenty of eyes on him and is being cared for really well. I love my yard


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## thatsmygirl (4 September 2014)

I choose DIY cause I love mucking out and all the general care involved and just looking after my horses in general and feel I couldn't get the same bond if I was on full livery and wouldn't get the same satisfaction from seeing my stables being spotless. But if people want full livery and willing to spend their money on it then so be it but its not for me.


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## Henry02 (4 September 2014)

I want to ride my horse... Not be a slave to it.

I also think that in a good lot of cases, by the time you've added fuel on getting to a yard twice a day, it almost works out as much as full livery!


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## Kikke (4 September 2014)

I could keep my horses on DiY if I wanted because I do have the time as I only work part time, BUT I DON'T WANT TO.
My horses are there for pleasure and I do not want to make it in to a job where I 'have to go' every day at a certain time. So there are catered for by someone else
I go to them 6 day a week and work them myself and when I am up I am not bothered about turning out or clearing up myself but that is also because I do not have to. They are really well looked after and have their routine that works very well and I am a happy owner which is what they benefit from as well!


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## Dumbo (4 September 2014)

I had my horse on part livery when I had a full time job with ever changing hours so my horse really needed routine and I rode when I could.
Now absolutely loving DIY!

I work on a livery yard, mainly full and part liveries and I see most of the owners daily. There's one girl though that doesn't ride her horse, 3 days a week she just skips him out and brings him in every morning then leaves. Literally spends 5 minutes with him then goes. My mind does wonder why she pays £120 a week just to lead her horse for a total of 15 mins a week...!


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## Burmilla (4 September 2014)

My horses, including current one, have always been on full livery.  I work in a difficult and often dangerous line of work, which has very variable time implications. 
 I know that horse is getting the best of care, exercise, T/O, and have no worries about her being left, because I'm in the middle of domestic drama, and have to make decisions, and actions that will prevent me ensuring her health needs are met.


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## atlantis (4 September 2014)

I always had my horse on DIY or assisted apart from when I moved to a new area and couldn't find a DIY yard I liked. I don't like part / full livery as I like to do things at my convenience. I've just finished sharing a horse who was on 5 day full livery and to a certain extent you have to fit in with the yard. I don't like that. 

However my friend who owns the horse I used to ride gets on really well with 5 day full livery. She has 2 to fit in and works long hours during the week. She goes every day and finished the horses off and does them at weekends. It works for her. 

I worked in a livery yard as a teenager and looked after horses who were status symbols for their owners. £20,000 competition horses who they hacked once a fortnight. I didn't mind though as I got to ride and compete said horses!!! They wanted for nothing and were loved by the owners and the staff. 

Each to their own. I too would rather see horses well looked after on full livery than poorly cared for on DIY. And it does happen soooo much!!!


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## Wagtail (4 September 2014)

I'm a YO and only do full or part livery. My owners adore their horses. Usually the reason they are on full livery is due either to work commitments, family commitments or distance from yard. I think having a horse on full livery, even if you have the time to do them yourself can give you more quality time with your horse.


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## Luci07 (4 September 2014)

Be mature says the OP and then goes onto say it annoys her that there are people who could muck out and "can't be bothered". It is absolutely nothing to do with you or anyone else as to my choices of how I keep my horses and, quite frankly I could not give a monkeys if you take a poor view if I don't muck out my horses and pay someone else to do so! I detest people who attempt to take the moral high ground about DIY versus part and full livery. Horses, however you keep them, even a native on grass, are an expensive luxury that few people can easily afford. Each individual makes the best choice based on their circumstances and budget and no one has the right to start judging. The ONLY exception is when you see a complete novice who looks at DIY and thinks its a cheap way to keep a horse and has no idea as to what they are doing!


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## Arizahn (4 September 2014)

I prefer to be on DIY. I like the little jobs that most people hate, and am obsessive re beds, lol. That being said, I've used Full in the past due to health reasons or when the car packed it in and I couldn't manage a three hour bus journey either way twice daily. I actually felt that I was missing out on much of the fun of owning. But not everyone enjoys mucking out; and it's an expensive hobby, so really you do need to be enjoying it.

At the end of the day, as long as the horse is properly looked after, then it really doesn't matter!


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## FfionWinnie (4 September 2014)

Your initial post isn't exactly respectful op. If folk can't be bothered mucking out and just want to ride and can afford to do so, that's their choice and life is too short to let it annoy you.


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## coen (4 September 2014)

Having been on DIY and full I can't see why you wouldn't have full livery if you could afford it. The horse doesn't care who cleans up its stable and you have way more time to groom ride ect. Majority of people that were at the yard all day spent it chatting rather than doing much with the horses anyway.
Guess you do get the odd time you feel like mooching about but then just do the chores yourself that day it's perfect, horse fits into life instead of everything revolving around it.


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## Batgirl (4 September 2014)

I am on 5/2 full livery. Why? Because I am not a morning person and I would resent having to get up early to do him.  I work 9-5.  I muck out at weekends and go down everyday to ride or just potter about with him.  It is such an odd question to me.


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## FellOutOfFavour (4 September 2014)

ihatework said:



			People all lead different lives with different pressures & priorities.

If you own a horse then you have a duty of care to make sure it is looked after. Whether that is by DIY or full livery I couldn't give a flying fig. 

The horsey world would be much nicer without the significant proportion of judgemental or (reverse)-snobby people around!
		
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Agree with this 100%. Some horse people are way too judgemental about the decisions of others.

When I had my first horse I kept her on DIY, not even at a proper yard just rented stable and field. It was all I could afford at the time and I was younger and fitter.

20 years down the line my health is not great and I have a chronic back problem which means I can't muck out a stable, I work long hours and not very near home, so the only way I can have a horse is full livery. My horse doesn't care who mucks him out, to be honest I don't really think he cares who feeds him. I am there almost every day and usually do evening feeds/hay myself as I like to do this. I've been through a couple of different yards before finding one I am happy with and who I trust with his care.


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## Cinnamontoast (4 September 2014)

When I was out of action, I was ruddy glad to have two people pretty much cover my chores totally. I could get used to it! I've been a lazy cow and barely seen him this week and my sharer has been up and ridden which is so lovely. She loves him and it's really helped during my first week back at work. 

Saying that, I understand why people have full livery, but I couldn't so it because I wouldn't ever go up and it would make me very lazy with his care, which I don't want to happen, plus it's really expensive compared to DIY!!


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## DD265 (4 September 2014)

I needed a yard on very short notice and the only option at the time was a full livery yard - I figured that it would do us temporarily. That was in August 2008 and we're still there!

Initially it was very hard to not go up twice a day - and I did for about a week - but then because I was in my final year at university it was a god send, meaning if I had to pull an all nighter I didn't need to worry about going to the yard in the morning. I could have gone onto DIY but much happier where we are now, and then he was diagnosed with wobblers so having YO there 24/7 to keep an eye on things was great peace of mind.

More recently I've changed jobs and now commute 1hr15+ each way. I leave home between 6.30am and 7am (as I go to the gym before work) and arrive back to the stables in the evening at a similar time. I do go up every day unless there's an exceptional reason but at least if all I want to do is pop my head over the door and give him a carrot, then that's fine.

I don't think it costs me any more to have full livery (admittedly at the moment YO is working him for 20mins 4-5 times a week so that's costing me more!) when you consider the cost/availability of haylage for one horse (small bales) and shavings etc which YO can buy in bulk, nevermind diesel for going up twice a day. Also this is the only yard I've been on where there has been no bitchiness - it's bliss!


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## Sukistokes2 (4 September 2014)

I like doing my own horses, I enjoy mucking out and making the stables nice, putting them to bed and making them comfortable. I feel satisfied when I leave listening to the sound of munching. I even like poo picking and all the other jobs. Good job as I am on my own on my own yard. I could afford to go too full livery but am happy with how it is now. Doing the jobs does not mean there is no time to ride, however I do not worry about what other people do with their horses, as long as they are cared for.....up to them.


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## McFluff (4 September 2014)

I work long hours. Full livery means I don't worry about my horse if I get stuck at work, and when I see her (usually 5 times a week, 2 hours each time), all my time is with her - grooming, riding, cuddling.  Works for me - and I don't think I'm missing out at all. She knows who I am, and I think is happier being part of the yard routine. 
I don't judge anyone's choices, as long as the horse is cared for properly. We all get different things out our hobby.


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## NZJenny (4 September 2014)

Interesting.  Livery, full or other wise, is virtually non-existant in New Zealand.


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## showpony (4 September 2014)

This totally!!! I've two children and  a ft job.. Horses would suffer if they weren't on full livery. Think op you are being slightly judgemental. 



FfionWinnie said:



			Your initial post isn't exactly respectful op. If folk can't be bothered mucking out and just want to ride and can afford to do so, that's their choice and life is too short to let it annoy you.
		
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## *sprinkles* (6 September 2014)

Everyone has a horse for different reasons and so long as the horse is being cared for and treated well then I really can't see why it's anyone else's business what they do with their own animal. 

I have my horses on full livery. I work shifts which makes it tricky, but not impossible to care for my horses. I could really go up there and see to them myself a few days of the week but I choose not to and to pay someone else to do it because I can. I don't want to waste time with chores when I could be riding. That is only my opinion and I have complete respect for people who want to care for their horses. That's not my business what others do. 

Like I said, everyone had a horse for their own reasons. I don't have a horse so I can muck out. So if I can avoid the chore I will. Simple as that. I want to ride so I choose to devote all my time to that. 

I can't stand this inverted snobbery against people who use a full livery service. Who cares ?!


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## Caol Ila (6 September 2014)

No, the way the OP is phrased isn't judgmental at all.  Surely something like "Why use full livery services instead of DIY," gets the same answers, but doesn't make you sound like an ass.  

Mine is on full because when I moved to this country, I was doing a PhD and commuting from Glasgow or Edinburgh to the yard and doing that twice a day would have cost as much as full livery and caused a bunch if stress I didn't need. In addition to that, I discovered -- during a stint on a DIY yard -- that my horse fencewalks for about 2178937 hours per day if she is at a yard where all the DIY horses are on totally random and frequently changing schedules due to their owners' work and homes lives. Even if I kept her to the same routine, the fact that everything else at the yard was on different schedules drove her crazy.  

I also like being able to go away at the weekends and not worry about her. Terrible, I know!  I would also rather ride than clean a stall, but I've met plenty of horse owners who never ever ride, but seem to love mucking out stables.  Beats the hell out of me, but each to their own.


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## Theocat (6 September 2014)

I have a busy job. I like to keep fit and go to the gym, or cycling, or walking. Occasionally I even want to have -shocker- a social life. I also want to ride, and I want to spend time with my horse. Part livery lets me balance everything in my life, and I reckon it only costs about £10 a week more than DIY once you add up everything. The horse has a better routine than I could give, and outstanding care.

Even if I only have 45 minutes at the yard on busy days, I have time to ride even if only for twenty or thirty minutes. 45 minutes would barely get all my yard jobs done on DIY.

If DIY was my only option, I probably wouldn't have a horse. I love horses and riding, but I love other things in my life too and DIY wouldn't let me balance my life as I would want to. That does not make me a bad person...


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## NinjaPony (6 September 2014)

Because I'm in full time education and the only horsey one in my family, thus I study in London, and my family and I live in London. So, I cannot go and care for them every day twice a day myself. They want for nothing, they are very well looked after and get lots of fuss and attention from me because I like to do everything I can when I'm with them. Instead of spending my limited free time mucking out, I spend it grooming, riding, working inhand, cuddling and sorting out and organising their various needs. I'm very lucky to be able to afford full livery, and without it I couldn't have horses. When I get a job I hope to have them on DIY ( and expect I won't have a choice) but that would involve me moving out and closer, which is the eventual aim. I don't like to judge, personally, as long as the horse is happy and well cared for.


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## NativePonyLover (6 September 2014)

I'm on DIY (but do use assistance of YM services) but I'm lucky that I have horsey by default parents, that enjoy being out In the fresh air doing jobs & pottering about the yard - in essence, I have flexible part livery thanks to Mum & Dad. 

Mum took early retirement, so often turns out & mucks out for me in the mornings, so I can have a lie in in the week when I have to be at work. In the evening, I can just ride/exercise or put to bed. 

Dad works shifts & was in nights the week before last, so he did mornings for me then. However, horse has been on box rest the last week & I don't think it's fair on either parents or horse they struggle with him, so I've been doing both ends if the day (and subsequently, had no social life this week!). 

Sometimes, I do mornings & evenings. Sometimes I just do evenings, sometimes I just do mornings. 

I am really grateful to my parents, as I couldn't afford full livery as I'm saving for a house, but it does allow me to have more of a life as well as a horse. 

Do I think I'm a worse owner because of it? No. Do I care if anyone thinks I'm lazy or spoilt? No. Do I realise I'm lucky? Oh, yes.


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## Mongoose11 (6 September 2014)

God, not again.


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## kez81 (6 September 2014)

I am on diy livery now but three years ago I was on a yard that only offered full livery as the yard owner got fed up with diy' ERS that didn't do things properly so insisted everyone had to have full. I must admit as much as I love doing things myself I sometimes miss the full livery. Mostly because it gave me so much flexibility. If I wanted yo poo pick or muck out I could, if not I could just spend more time pampering my horse and enjoying a ride. I didn't have to worry about being up at first light to turn out in winter and back again to bring in before dark. Now I have to do everything myself or it doesn't get done. This meant me having to drive up with kids in tow during holidays despite me being very unwell. I actually threw up in the wheelbarrow a few times as I was poo picking! If I could afford full livery and stomach being around other liveries ( i dont like people!) I would definitely do it again!


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## saddlesore (7 September 2014)

I wouldn't worry- there's another thread currently questioning those who DIY but don't muck out in the morning when the horse is in the field all day! I think some people are just jealous that horses aren't everyone's whole life tbh. So long as the horses are well looked after and the owner enjoys the time they spend with them then why on earth does it matter.


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## Chocy (7 September 2014)

I have a horse on full livery. why?? Basically because I can and want to!! 
I waited til I was in a good enough well paid job before buying my 1st horse and could afford full livery.

Being DIY for me would mean horse having erratic routine diff t/o times etc as i work different areas eveey day so prefer him having settled routine.
Also i don't want to go after work stick him in a field and muck out essentially spending no time with him. I go up all chores are done so I can ride, groom, give him his fav scratch etc all things that would not be done if I was DIY.
so for me being full livery gives me a much better relationship and bond with my horse. I know this as every time I get out my car I'm greeted with OTT neighs  .Only when I've opened car door sitting in car means hes staring out his window at me but silent open door & screeching starts- he is very 'chatty'!!!


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## Tnavas (7 September 2014)

NZJenny said:



			Interesting.  Livery, full or other wise, is virtually non-existant in New Zealand.
		
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We still have so much land available so close to town no one bothers though there are a few places that offer livery service. 

I can see it eventually happening around Aukland and Wellington in the next decade or so. Even Cambridge has become a commuter town now, the growth around here is amazing and grazing land being built on. We've just list another 5 acre block to a new house, I was only grazing my horses there just over a year ago. The new expressway has also stolen masses of farmland.


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## Tnavas (7 September 2014)

NZJenny said:



			Interesting.  Livery, full or other wise, is virtually non-existant in New Zealand.
		
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We still have so much land available so close to town no one bothers though there are a few places that offer livery service. 

I can see it eventually happening around Aukland and Wellington in the next decade or so. Even Cambridge has become a commuter town now, the growth around here is amazing and grazing land being built on. We've just list another 5 acre block to a new house, I was only grazing my horses there just over a year ago. The new expressway has also stolen masses of farmland.


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## Tnavas (7 September 2014)

NZJenny said:



			Interesting.  Livery, full or other wise, is virtually non-existant in New Zealand.
		
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We still have so much land available so close to town no one bothers though there are a few places that offer livery service. 

I can see it eventually happening around Aukland and Wellington in the next decade or so. Even Cambridge has become a commuter town now, the growth around here is amazing and grazing land being built on. We've just list another 5 acre block to a new house, I was only grazing my horses there just over a year ago. The new expressway has also stolen masses of farmland.


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## Clever pony (7 September 2014)

My pony is on full livery and I adore her. The only reason she isn't on diy / half livery is because stables are a good 25 mins away mum and dad aren't horsey at all and school very hard for me


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## Daytona (7 September 2014)

I would not own a horse if I could not keep it on full livery

I have a job, a husband and other hobbies.  Caring for a stabled horse full time is a time consuming job, one I don't have the time to do, as I'd rather spend my free time doing other stuff. I don't visit my horse daily only days I'm riding, and I fully trust the yard I'm at to take care of my horses needs for me.  

My horse is not a pet, I have it to ride and compete only.  Which is what i do and I quite happily pay someone to do the looking after side of things. 

As I said if I could not afford to keep a horse this way I'd rather not own one.


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## zigzag (7 September 2014)

If I could afford full livery the pony would be on it! I worked with horses from the age of 16 to 34 I have mucked out enough stables in my time, besides I don't bond with pony when I muck out, she is turned out in the field then I muck out!


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## Goldenstar (7 September 2014)

I think it perfectly ok to say , I want a horse I want it cared for well but I don't want to do it myself because it's tying and hard work and I like to do other things .
Horses don't care who cares for them as long as they get good care.
I think it's perfectly ok to own a horse and just get on it when you are doing the thing you enjoy with it like say hunting my other half sometimes only sees fatty on a Saturday .
When I was working I cared for horses who's owners sometimes did not see them for months I don't believe it mattered to the horses at all .
It's the owners job to provide the care a horse needs, there's loads of ways to do that doing it your self is only one of them .


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## xspiralx (7 September 2014)

I do find the notion that mucking out somehow signifies that you care more for your horse or have a better bond.

My horse is in part livery for a couple of reasons. I work long hours and although I could just about manage DIY livery, I would be exhausted and would spend more time doing chores than actually riding or spending time with my horse.

I also like the freedom of not being tied to the yard every day. I go down on average 6 days out of 7, but if I am tired, or want to visit my parents or go out for drinks in the evening then I can do it - it means I get a life.

I don't mind doing jobs, but generally I prefer not to - I spend around 2 hours at the yard each evening and the majority of that is riding, grooming and spending time with my horse - not poo picking or filling Haynets, which quite frankly, hardly increases the bond with my horse!


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## Madam Min (7 September 2014)

Both of ours are on full livery simply because we both work full time and although DIY probably would be feasible we'd be pushed. We ride every evening and Saturday and Sunday, at least twice a month we go out competing, the horses want for nothing.

Both of us have ridden and been around horses since childhood and I was a totally pony made but pony less child with a weekly lesson and helping out at the yard on Saturdays. Its not like we are unwilling or dont have the knowledge to care for the horses which I think is sometimes the view of those with horses on full livery.

Hopefully one day, we'll be in the position to buy a place with land but until then as long as we both work the hours we do, they'll be on full livery.


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## PolarSkye (7 September 2014)

Aaaahhhh the Sisterhood of the Horsey World!

Honestly, I don't understand all this judging and questioning . . . there are many reasons why someone would want to put their horse on full livery . . . and many reasons why someone wouldn't.  I have done everything from full to part to assisted to DIY . . . all suited me at the time I made the decision to do so.  What worked for me at one point in time, doesn't necessarily work for me now . . . my life, my knowledge, my experience, my circumstances have all changed since I first loaned or bought a horse . . . and the same is probably true for everyone else here.

So . . . when we had the mares, they were on DIY . . . despite having worked at a RS for years, it was the first time we had sole charge of horses - even if it wasn't ALL the time (we shared them four days a week).  The mares were sooooo easy . . .  and taking care of them on a part time basis was a great way to get out feet wet.  It was a tiny, very friendly yard . . . the mares (both cobs) were easy to do and care for . . . we learned a lot.  When we bought Kal, I was working full time for a multi-national tech company so I put him on full livery . . . for two reasons . . . 1)  I wanted to ease into ownership (I found it very daunting at first); and b) I was going to be away a lot.  After four months, I was made redundant so decided to move Kal to a small DIY yard for the summer where the horses lived out . . . perfect for easing into caring for him myself 24/7 . . . unfortunately he hated the place and I got another job working in London so moved him to a yard with assisted livery . . . I could do him as often as possible, but there was back up for when I was travelling overseas, etc.  I was promoted, making serious money, but travelling overseas much more and the woman who was schooling him for me was setting up her own yard so it made sense (money and time-wise) to move him there and have him on schooling/full livery.  I didn't like only seeing him at weekends . . . and wouldn't do it again . . . but that's not because he didn't the right care, it's because I missed him (and hated travelling and commuting into London every day).  I was made redundant, so I moved him to a DIY yard . . . 

. . . every choice I made suited US (me, him and my family) at the time . . . personally, I would never have him on full livery again . . . but that's a lifestyle choice.  I will be going back to work soon - and I will NOT be taking another high flying job . . . I am nearly 50, I've been there/done that, I can't take the grind, we don't need a big house any more now that my girls are leaving home, and looking after my horse keeps me fit and active . . . but these are MY choices.

WHY is acceptable to judge someone based on whether they shovel poo themselves or pay someone else to do so?

I just don't get it.

P


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## Pigeon (7 September 2014)

It wouldn't be for me, I like the general care almost as much as the riding, but I can certainly understand how people would want/need the option.

I would pay for someone to do the poo picking in a heartbeat


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## Rhodders (7 September 2014)

each to their own I say, but I like my horses out 24/7 so I rent fields (I do have a stable, in fact I used to have 6 stables that never got used). The whole thing for me is the peace of it all, I like to go to do my horses every day, even if I can't ride that day the hour I spend doing the poo picking and other chores is great for the soul.  I always leave in a better frame of mind than I arrived in


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## Follysmum (7 September 2014)

I could never put mine on full livery, I like to do everything myself. Part of me owning my horses is having the day to day bond I have with them. I understand why people do and its nice to hear that people are happy with their arrangements and have great trust with their yard owners.  Its something I would never consider.


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## hroes (7 September 2014)

I have my two on full livery because I'm in college and working a part time job, I still go up everyday and help out on the weekends mucking out all the full livery horses anyway haha


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## el_Snowflakes (7 September 2014)

Each to their own. If the horse is being looked after then  I don't see a problem. I'm sure there are plenty of reasons for taking advantage of FL....work/family commitments/other hobbies/ allergies/ health problems....I wouldn't expect anyone to have to justify it.


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## TheoryX1 (7 September 2014)

Polarskye you do say it so well, oddly enough in a similar position to myself, but I walked out of a horrible, stressful business (well, business was great, business partner was horrible and stressful), I had a job, was made redundant and this time am going to find myself something nice to do again, without stress and business partner (awful, vile, short man ......)/

If someone wants their horse on full livery then fine, its not hurting me, its not hurting the horse, so why all this vitriol being poured on here?  Is there a tiny element of jealousy from those who maybe secretly want to do it, but cant afford it?  Harsh comment I know, but true.  If the horse is being looked after and it suits the owner, then quite frankly, whose business is it?


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## Luci07 (7 September 2014)

There is definitely a holier than thou element coming through with this post. Have absolutely no intention of justifying my choices for my horses to a complete stranger or feeling I have to explain why I make them.

Isn't it about time someone brought up draw reins again??!


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## Auslander (7 September 2014)

i'd never presume to judge someone based upon how much **** they shovel. 

I've never had a horse on anything other than DIY/my own yards - but I wouldn't have the slightest issue with having mine on full livery and just enjoying them.


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## Copperpot (7 September 2014)

Mine have been on full livery before and if you get a good yard it's lovely. Then one needed to live out, so I moved and now have 3 living out. I do love taking care of them myself but it's hard with shift work etc. This week I seem to have spent all my time poo picking and filling up water tanks. So I've decided to pay someone to poo pick for me especially now the nights are drawing in. 

On my days off I love spending all day up there toodling about doing little jobs. I often wonder what I did with my time when I didn't have to do any of that stuff. I think my house was a lot tidier though &#9786;&#65039;


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## Henry02 (7 September 2014)

I'd also like to know how I would be supposed to look after a horse on DIY when on tour in Afghanistan with the army...


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## Copperpot (7 September 2014)

Henry02 said:



			I'd also like to know how I would be supposed to look after a horse on DIY when on tour in Afghanistan with the army...
		
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Apparently all you need to do is get up earlier &#128541;


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## Moomin1 (7 September 2014)

I wouldn't ever have my mare on full or part livery, because I find caring for them daily one of the most important and fulfilling aspect of owning a horse.  

Personally, I would rather see someone keep their horse on full livery than some of the idiots who are on diy and don't bother providing the right standard of care though.


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## saddlesore (7 September 2014)

Copperpot said:



			Apparently all you need to do is get up earlier &#128541;
		
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Post of the day!


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## quirky (7 September 2014)

I'm really surprised how shovelling poop creates such a bond with a horse for a number of people on this thread.
Mine justs munches away on her hay paying me no heed. It certainly isn't a bonding moment.
Have I been shovelling poop wrong for all these years!?


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## Evie91 (7 September 2014)

Personally I think part livery is the best way to keep a horse - yard owners with tonnes of experience and established routine for the horse. 
Owner then gets to spend quality time, riding, grooming and faffing with the horse.

My horse was on part livery for five years - our 'bond' was no different than when I was on DIY. Horse now lives at home - her time table now has to fit in with mine. I wouldn't change her being at home, I love it but if I was to have another ridden horse, I wouldn't hesitate to put it on part livery.


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## Moomin1 (7 September 2014)

quirky said:



			I'm really surprised how shovelling poop creates such a bond with a horse for a number of people on this thread.
Mine justs munches away on her hay paying me no heed. It certainly isn't a bonding moment.
Have I been shovelling poop wrong for all these years!?
		
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It's about spending time around and near your horse, rather than the actual activity.  I would absolutely hate turning up once a week, barely having any say over the care of my horse, and having her see me as someone who just rides her once per week and me treating her like a riding school horse.  But I do see how some people may not be in a position to do otherwise, so I wouldn't berate them for that.  Like I say, rather see that than some people who have their horses on diy but don't bother providing the right level of care.


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## TGM (7 September 2014)

Moomin1 said:



			It's about spending time around and near your horse, rather than the actual activity.  I would absolutely hate turning up once a week, barely having any say over the care of my horse, and having her see me as someone who just rides her once per week and me treating her like a riding school horse.
		
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Why do you assume that people on full livery turn up just once a week to see their horse?  I've been on full livery in the past when commuting into London to work, but I usually saw my horse at least four or five times a week, and when I was at the yard I'd groom and feed etc.  But it did mean that when I couldn't get there all the horse's needs were catered for.  I now have my horse at home and do all the work myself, so am not adverse to caring for my horse myself.


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## Moomin1 (7 September 2014)

TGM said:



			Why do you assume that people on full livery turn up just once a week to see their horse?  I've been on full livery in the past when commuting into London to work, but I usually saw my horse at least four or five times a week, and when I was at the yard I'd groom and feed etc.  But it did mean that when I couldn't get there all the horse's needs were catered for.  I now have my horse at home and do all the work myself, so am not adverse to caring for my horse myself.
		
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Why so defensive?  I don't 'assume' at all - I was using it as an example to the point I was making about developing a bond.  Many people have their horses on full livery because they cannot get to see their horse until weekend or whatever.....

If you read my previous post, I have said quite clearly, twice now, that I take no issue with people having their horses on full livery, and would actually prefer to see people do that, than have them on diy and not provide the right care.  It is just MY preference that I have mine on diy, and would not consider anything other.


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## mandwhy (7 September 2014)

Good god, I might have said the same thing once but these days the things I could do with my time if I was in full livery, I'd ride every day for a start, I'd have more than one horse, I'd have a youngster and spend loads of time working on it. I'd do things like plaiting and putting on bandages and oiling hooves and grooming and massaging just for fun, sigh! Having lessons, having a go at classical in hand work. Seriously, I wouldn't miss the manual labour, and I'm sure I could muck out my own stable occasionally if I sorely missed such things. My horses live out and I just spend all my time on heavy, muddy, soggy, smelly work, oh and injuring myself. Oh and winter is coming to remind me that summer is not half as hard and I should have made the time to ride every day when there was actual daylight. YAY.


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## teabiscuit (7 September 2014)

I've never had a horse on livery. It sounds divine, just to be able to use precious time on grooming, riding and scratches etc. 
No pushing wheel barrows, lugging water buckets, filling haynets .....all time spent with the horse.. ...ooo sounds like bliss.. .


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## Mongoose11 (7 September 2014)

Moomin1 said:



			I wouldn't ever have my mare on full or part livery, because I find caring for them daily one of the most important and fulfilling aspect of owning a horse.  

Personally, I would rather see someone keep their horse on full livery than some of the idiots who are on diy and don't bother providing the right standard of care though.
		
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Moomin1 said:



			It's about spending time around and near your horse, rather than the actual activity.  I would absolutely hate turning up once a week, barely having any say over the care of my horse, and having her see me as someone who just rides her once per week and me treating her like a riding school horse.  But I do see how some people may not be in a position to do otherwise, so I wouldn't berate them for that.  Like I say, rather see that than some people who have their horses on diy but don't bother providing the right level of care.
		
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When I have been in full livery I have still visited my mare daily, to groom, exercise, do any jobs that would be routinely done while I was there. Why all the presumptions? It was lovely the other day when somebody remarked how my horse watched my every move while I was at the yard but not necessarily at her side. Ahhh but I bet that'd be the bond we built up while I was on DIY?


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## Moomin1 (7 September 2014)

Mongoose11 said:



			When I have been in full livery I have still visited my mare daily, to groom, exercise, do any jobs that would be routinely done while I was there. Why all the presumptions? It was lovely the other day when somebody remarked how my horse watched my every move while I was at the yard but not necessarily at her side. Ahhh but I bet that'd be the bond we built up while I was on DIY?
		
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Are you completely misunderstanding my posts??  I have said FOR MYSELF, it is a major part of bonding, and that I can understand why other people do have theirs on full livery.


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## Spring Feather (7 September 2014)

Mongoose11 said:



			It was lovely the other day when somebody remarked how my horse watched my every move while I was at the yard but not necessarily at her side. Ahhh but I bet that'd be the bond we built up while I was on DIY?
		
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That's also what I see with the horses on my farm.  As said, almost every horse here is on full care livery and I'm the one who does all of the daily stuff with them.  However, every horse *knows* its owner; they know their vehicles and they whinny to them when they arrive.  Some of my liveries don't come for months on end, but their horses still know it's their special person.  None have ever lived on DIY livery btw so, you're right, it's nothing to do with that.


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## Mongoose11 (7 September 2014)

Moomin1 said:



			Are you completely misunderstanding my posts??  I have said FOR MYSELF, it is a major part of bonding, and that I can understand why other people do have theirs on full livery.
		
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You seemed to present full livery as being an option that led to a once a week visit etc, you didn't present any other interpretation and so I believed you were saying that this is what happens on full livery. Apparently, because you are shouting, you didn't mean that at all. 

I don't believe I did misinterpret your post, no. 

Do calm down.


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## teabiscuit (7 September 2014)

SF that's really fascinating. Aren't they deeper than we think.


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## SO1 (7 September 2014)

My pony is normally on DIY grass livery but went on to full livery when he needed to be on box rest and then have rehabilitation after a broken splint bone.

There was no way with a full time job I could give him the high level of care he needed when on box rest and when being rehabbed. I could not go to the yard three times a day to skip him out or give him the attention he needed for the 8 hours whilst I was at work nor could I bring him in at set times whilst I was at work whilst he was gradually having his turn out increased from 10 minutes up to half a day.

I would not have a problem at all with someone else poo picking, or doing the field management or mucking out, if means I can spend more time doing things with my horse and less time doing manual labour!

I don't see how mucking out, making up haynets and feeds creates a better bond with your horse as your horse will probably be in the field whilst you are doing these activities. Does cleaning your own house whilst your kids are out rather paying a cleaner give people a better bond with their kids?

Many people on full livery may spend as much time with their horse as people on DIY or even more as they do not need to spend time doing jobs so the time they save not doing mucking out, poo picking etc they can spend with their horse. It is not just the amount of time you spend with your horse that build up the bond but how you treat the horse when you are with it.

When my pony was on full rehab livery and I could only see him at weekends he still whickered when he saw me just the same as when I was seeing him every day when I was on DIY.

I am on DIY grass livery and I like that as I get to see my pony every day and can decide on his feeds etc but don't have to mucking out also don't need to poo pick, pulling up a bit of ragwort is hard as the labour normally gets. If I had a stabled horse and could afford it I would definitely have my horse on a good full livery yard as then all the spare time I had I could actually spend it doing things with my horse rather than doing stable duties especially if working full time. It would also mean that if I got sick or had a family emergency or my horse needed a lot of vet treatment or a combination of all three, that I would not have to worry about how I was going to divide my time.

I do think DIY can be great and I love seeing my pony every day but I do wonder how people manage to combine it was family and working life and how they can be fully committed to all three and not be completely exhausted, being exhausted all the time is actually not good for your health. I am lucky in that my workplace is normally quite flexible with regard to short notice leave for emergencies but all jobs can easily accommodate this.

I expect there are plenty of people on full livery who choose this not because they don't want to come every day but because they don't want to muck out and do the heavy lifting of water buckets, barrows etc and would rather spend more of their spare time with the horses rather than shoveling poo.


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## mandwhy (7 September 2014)

Seriously I don't do a lot of bonding with my horses when I'm picking up their endless poo, or fixing the fence every god damn day, or dragging water buckets, or lifting hay, I barely see them during these critical tasks! Just in case anyone on full livery thinks they are missing out, after all that I'm too knackered to ride and go home!


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## DragonSlayer (7 September 2014)

If I had just one, it would be on full livery! I work hard full time and would find this a god send! I'm counting down the days with dread until we start feeding and giving out hay, OH has spent all day putting up a new feed shed right next to the hay that's next to the winter paddocks, in order to try to make this winter easier on ourselves!


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## Spring Feather (7 September 2014)

teabiscuit said:



			SF that's really fascinating. Aren't they deeper than we think.
		
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Yes.  I don't think in general horses are particularly clever but where ESP is concerned, they have it in abundance.


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## Tnavas (7 September 2014)

I moved my horse from one yard as it was compulsory to muck out your paddock daily before you rode or brought your horse in. I found that wasn't so bad in summer when there was plenty of light and the ground dry, but come winter the ground was pugged and it took longer to get the wheelbarrow in and out of her paddock and as the days got shorter there was no time left to ride.

YO refused to allow me to muck out just at weekends so I upped and left for a yard where they HARROW - whoopee - every minute I'm at the paddock I can actually spend close up with my horse.

My back, knees, shoulder and elbows are also far happier with this arrangement. There were times when I was in so much pain after mucking out and battling the mud with the wheelbarrow that I'd feed and leave.

I did my training on a yard with a lot of full liveries, many owners came up every day, they often had busy working lives and their horse was their way of unwinding. They'd arrive at 6:30 - 7pm and in summer ride outside or in winter in the indoor. WE had great yard staff and the horses were all extremely well cared for. The grooms also had their favourites, which was generally all of the ones you cared for and these horses certainly weren't short of love and Polo's.


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## Embo (8 September 2014)

Having done almost two years** on DIY, with 5am get-ups, full time job and a used-to-be-needy OH (he is so much better now, but when I started off he was very jealous of all the time I spent at the yard), I would gladly put my horse of full livery. Dealing with all that is exhausting.

Truth is, I can't afford it, so have to stick to DIY. I wish I could pay someone else to do the dirty work, then I would have more time to enjoy my horse rather than just shoveling his poo and stuffing him full of hay!

Having said that, I do enjoy the daily care (mucking out included) but it is very time consuming. So I do have to sacrifice riding time to spend time with the OH. In a perfect world, there would be more hours in a day so I could spend lots of time with both!

Don't see how people can judge those on full livery and make sweeping statements that they are lazy or only have a horse as a status symbol - surely it must stem from jealousy, like most snipey comments!

**ETA, fully aware that some of you have done a lifetime of this - but I've only been an owner for this length of time!


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## Grumpy Herbert (8 September 2014)

My two are on full livery because I work ridiculously crazy hours now.  When I worked more reasonable hours, I did them myself and also provided a groom service for others - I loved it.

Given a choice, I would always prefer to do them myself.  I feel you form a stronger bond with them by doing the rugging up and leading out/in.  Plus you get to know how your horse is normally and can spot if something's not quite right much more quickly.

An added bonus of dealing with 5+ horses and mucking out 5+ stables was I lost 2 and a half stone!!!


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## FellOutOfFavour (9 September 2014)

Embo said:



			Don't see how people can judge those on full livery and make sweeping statements that they are lazy or only have a horse as a status symbol - surely it must stem from jealousy, like most snipey comments!
		
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People who are critical of others they've never met generally seem to either be jealous or insecure.


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## MS123 (10 September 2014)

Theocat said:



			I have a busy job. I like to keep fit and go to the gym, or cycling, or walking. Occasionally I even want to have -shocker- a social life. I also want to ride, and I want to spend time with my horse. Part livery lets me balance everything in my life, and I reckon it only costs about £10 a week more than DIY once you add up everything. The horse has a better routine than I could give, and outstanding care.

Even if I only have 45 minutes at the yard on busy days, I have time to ride even if only for twenty or thirty minutes. 45 minutes would barely get all my yard jobs done on DIY.

If DIY was my only option, I probably wouldn't have a horse. I love horses and riding, but I love other things in my life too and DIY wouldn't let me balance my life as I would want to. That does not make me a bad person...
		
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I completely agree with you! I am the same.


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## BlackVelvet (10 September 2014)

The most important thing to me was that my horse was in a proper routine and looked after. I was on DIY whilst doing my A levels etc as I spend most days at the yard pootling about but when I started work full time, it couldnt be done anymore. I couldnt drive so had to rely on lifts etc. I moved him to part livery to an amazing yard on a bus route so I could get there myself and would always muck out etc if i was there to help the staff out! I loved looking after him but it wasnt always possible and he was stressy if his routine was not stuck too so this way worked best for me. I knew he was looked after and trusted them 100%, they always let me know if he wasnt quite 'right'. Not everyone can do DIY, its each to their own.


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## charliecrisps (10 September 2014)

If I had the money I would love to be on full livery.... More time spending actual time doing things with your horses which I think they appreciate more than who did the mucking out, like grooming & spending quality time with them. It would also save the guilt that some days you can't do anything more than pick up poo and sling a bucket of feed their way!


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## fattylumpkin (10 September 2014)

My honest feeling is that DIY helps build a bond quicker with a new horse.  Mine is on full livery and lives out 24/7.  I was only her rider before I became her owner so I had no responsibilities other than turning up, tacking up and hacking.  All the poo picking, mucking out of the barn and feeding and watering is done by YO.  In the beginning it was a drawback since I'd turn up and the horse knew that my being there meant only one thing - time to work.  And work she did, and even started to look forward to our rides together so she was never much trouble to bring in.  But once the ride was over she expected to be put out at once and turned grumpy if I kept her tied up and tried to groom or spoil her.  She never came when I called or showed any real interest in my presence if treats weren't involved.  It was clear her horsey buddies were miles more important than me.

When I became her owner I finally had the feedom to invent ways to be around her, so that meant turning up to the yard for no other reason than heading out into the field to give her a good grooming and then leave without riding.  I also spent an afternoon each week in various weather sitting in her field reading magazines.  All obvious stuff and not rocket science, but it's what I had to do to replace time spent mucking out and haynet filling and so on, which are jobs I think horses understand and appreciate.  Now the bond with my horse is pretty good and she comes when I call, follows me around if I'm in the field and likes being fussed over.  But it's taken since april last year when I first met her to build that bond, which is rather slow.

That being said, I'd have shifted her to a new yard with DIY the second she was bought and paid for if I hadn't firmly believed that the horse is much much happier where she is, in a place which has a structured daily routine, is familiar and of fantastic high standard.  Moving to a DIY yard would be for my benefit, not hers.


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## coffeeandabagel (10 September 2014)

I slogged through last winter with two on DIY and poo picking. I lost loads of weight, got fitter and enjoyed their company. I didnt get to see my hubby much and always felt time pressured. So pros and cons.
I had to move yards, and now only have one horse and she is on 5 day livery because thats all they do and beleive me I looked for another DIY yard but couldnt find one. I thought I would hate it since I am bit of a control freak over horse husbandry, but yes I have time for hubby, DIY, cooking dinner occasionally. I do everything at the weekends and enjoy the exercise butI have put on 8lbs in 6 months and am not so fit! Thats partly due to only riding one a day
What would I chose if I had to move  - I dont know?


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## Dizzle (10 September 2014)

Because OH said I could 

We're expecting our first child next month and I'm happier knowing I don't have to worry about my horse, I know that she is looked after, fed, watered and her health monitored, I don't have the time or the energy to muck every day at the moment and we're still trying to finish off renovations on the new house in the next few weeks.

 Once baby arrives and I'm riding again I don't want to be spending my free time mucking out, I want to be back in the saddle.

I have a day off work today and I love the fact that I can spend the morning doing house work (errr, and a quick check of HHO) and then I know when I go to the yard later I can spend quality time with my girly rather than knackering myself out mucking out.


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## paddy (10 September 2014)

Mine are on part livery, but on my OH's yard.  Sometimes I do them myself, sometimes I don't.  None of them have ever complained that I haven't personally removed their poo, filled their haynets and scrubbed their water buckets.  No matter what type of livery, Mac has always been very clear that I am 'his' person.  I have a demanding job, they have a good life and are well looked after.


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## OWLIE185 (10 September 2014)

My job involved travelling all over the world for long periods of time but when I was back at base I was able to enjoy riding my horse out on a daily basis and go for some nice long hacks.  The livery yard looked after my horse and kept him ticking over (I also had a couple of non-paying sharers that would ride him out or have lessons on him). Having him at full livery worked out really well for all concerned including the horse who I owned for about 17 years.  Eventually I bought my own place with land and continued riding him until he was 25 when he sadly died.  I learnt a lot of horse management from the staff and other liveries at the livery yard which enabled me to look after him myself.  I believe that my horse was well looked after and was exercised each day.  Being in full livery it provided employment for the staff and also the opportunity for two other people to ride a nice well behaved horse.


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## LeannePip (10 September 2014)

Mine is on Full livery 4 days per week - i dont have a job that keeps me out of the  country and i dont work stupid hours, I basically work 7.30 - 5pm 3 days a week and 7.30 till 2.30 two days a week!  i have her on livery because i dont live in an area where decent yards are in abundance and easily accesible, the closest yard to me that is DIY and vaguely what I needed was 7-10miles away if you were trying to avoid traffic! the yard we are moving to on saturday is 3.5miles and they only do part, they have the facilities which mean i can keep my horse in work over winter and hopefully keep her UFP at bay + have time for all the other things in life that i find you can neglect when on DIY! Family time, social life, gym ect ect it really is a no brainer.

I have only done Proper DIY with her for a few months and found that i didnt have time to fully do any of the above, social life was half hearted and rushed, didnt have time to acctually ride the horse most of the time so couldnt compete as much as i'd have liked, was constantly rushing around, coudlnt dedicate anough time to the gym and other goals - Part livery helps me really balance eveything in my life and not be compleetly knackered all the time!  I won't beable to have a horse on Part Livery forever as atm dont have much in the way of out goings, but for now it works perfectly!

i dont like the attitude that people who have their horses on full livery are any less of an owner - TBH most of the pro riders i have worked for practically had their horses on full livery, we mere mortals did the ***** shovelling, haynet filling, bringing in and out and the riders did exactly that - rode all day!


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## Kate212 (13 October 2020)

Wow this was 2014. I’m a bit late but oh well. I’m getting my first horse this December after about 10 years of riding and caring for them. I’m currently about to start a 15 month long full time 8-5 job plus with GCSE studying alongside. I don’t like the idea of full livery because I wanted to look after my horse completely and get up every morning and stay till a ridiculous time of night because I just wouldn’t want to leave him “haha”. Unfortunately though my work is half an hour away and I have to set off about 7am or earlier to avoid traffic. I’ve decided that until my apprenticeship is finished or such a time during my apprenticeship that I feel I’m able to do DIY, I shall for now use a full livery service to make sure my horse is getting the best care possible whilst I am not there. Although it breaks my heart the thought of someone else tending to my baby;(


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## Gloi (13 October 2020)

I'm retired and have been on DIY until recently. I've had some illness in the past couple of years and put him on full livery. I enjoy it because I no longer feel so tied. I can miss a day if the weather is foul or I don't feel well without guilt or arranging cover. When I do go and ride, or just give him a fuss, which I do most days ,I am going because I want to not because I have to .


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## ForeverBroke_ (13 October 2020)

I've been on DIY and 5 day livery and quite frankly the idea of going back on a DIY yard fills me with dread.

The lack of routine and comings and goings would and do stress my horses out. My care is just as good as the livery, and they do everything exactly to the letter that I would do myself. On rainy horrible days they are in, dry and happy whereas on DIY I would be stressing myself to get there in time to bring them in before they lose it. There is someone on the yard 24/7 so the minute they see or spot something 'going wrong' they are on it. My boys wouldn't receive that level of attention on a DIY yard. In my area you pay for what you get. The DIY yards are poor facilities, and run poorly also. The full/part livery yards are professional and a happy and relaxed place for both owners and horses. I still go to my yard every day, and spend time with them all just as I would on a DIY yard. I love looking after them, but do not love the stress and organisational chaos of 'most' DIY yard setups.

I would never go back on a DIY yard again.


Edited to add - just seen this is a prehistoric thread!


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## shamrock2021 (13 October 2020)

I was on DLY in the past it wasn’t cost effective it was cheaper to do full livery. Most yards where I live don’t offer DLY because they don’t want people coming to the  yard very early in the morning .  The problem with DLY livery is that You have to be there everyday and you have less time with your horse at least with full livery you can give your horse your full attention.


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## exracehorse (13 October 2020)

Lexi2009 said:



			I was on DLY in the past it wasn’t cost effective it was cheaper to do full livery. Most yards where I live don’t offer DLY because they don’t want people coming to the  yard very early in the morning .  The problem with DLY livery is that You have to be there everyday and you have less time with your horse at least with full livery you can give your horse your full attention.
		
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I’d have to work even longer hours to pay for full livery so .. would actually have LESS time to ride.  Fully livery is 150/200 per week.


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## stormox (13 October 2020)

Because I want to ride my horse, not spend hours mucking out etc leaving no time to ride. Whats the problem with that? I currently have my horses at home but much prefer the fun and companionship of keeping a horse in a yard.


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## shamrock2021 (13 October 2020)

exracehorse said:



			I’d have to work even longer hours to pay for full livery so .. would actually have LESS time to ride.  Fully livery is 150/200 per week.
		
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It only €90 week where I live .


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## exracehorse (13 October 2020)

Lexi2009 said:



			It only €90 week where I live .
		
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thats bloody cheap.  Example ... local to me .... 
.

Full livery is £700 per month and includes 7 day services, use of all facilities, straw bedding (ad lib) or shavings (2 bales per week), basic feed and hay or haylage ad lib. 

Grooming livery is £820 per month and includes all of the above, plus extra feed eg balancer, daily (apart from Sundays) grooming and tack cleaning.


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## Muddywellies (13 October 2020)

I've recently moved yards from DIY to full. Only reason is beause life has thrown an awful lot at me lately and I need the support.  I've never done full livery and I'm not finding it easy as I desperately miss looking after my horse.  But it was a necessary move and my horse is thriving with a structured routine and regular work.  So believe me, it's not by choice, but I needed help and this has lightened the load a bit.


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## Smogul (14 October 2020)

fattylumpkin said:



			My honest feeling is that DIY helps build a bond quicker with a new horse.  Mine is on full livery and lives out 24/7.  I was only her rider before I became her owner so I had no responsibilities other than turning up, tacking up and hacking.  All the poo picking, mucking out of the barn and feeding and watering is done by YO.  In the beginning it was a drawback since I'd turn up and the horse knew that my being there meant only one thing - time to work.  And work she did, and even started to look forward to our rides together so she was never much trouble to bring in.  But once the ride was over she expected to be put out at once and turned grumpy if I kept her tied up and tried to groom or spoil her.  She never came when I called or showed any real interest in my presence if treats weren't involved.  It was clear her horsey buddies were miles more important than me.

When I became her owner I finally had the feedom to invent ways to be around her, so that meant turning up to the yard for no other reason than heading out into the field to give her a good grooming and then leave without riding.  I also spent an afternoon each week in various weather sitting in her field reading magazines.  All obvious stuff and not rocket science, but it's what I had to do to replace time spent mucking out and haynet filling and so on, which are jobs I think horses understand and appreciate.  Now the bond with my horse is pretty good and she comes when I call, follows me around if I'm in the field and likes being fussed over.  But it's taken since april last year when I first met her to build that bond, which is rather slow.

That being said, I'd have shifted her to a new yard with DIY the second she was bought and paid for if I hadn't firmly believed that the horse is much much happier where she is, in a place which has a structured daily routine, is familiar and of fantastic high standard.  Moving to a DIY yard would be for my benefit, not hers.
		
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ho
I find that a bit depressing. My pony is on full livery and, for him, my arrival means playtime. He loves his job.


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## Gingerwitch (14 October 2020)

I am a crap owner then, I have 4 on full livery. You know what my horses hear my car and whicker to me. All bar the latest one canter to me when I go to their field.  I work a huge amount of hours and all over the UK. I do crazy early and late hours and want to know mine are happy and looked after.  They are an hour from home and I like to ride. It costs a fortune yes - the last one was left to me when my friend died earlier this year. Would I change anything  With the yard and staff where they are - not a chance in hell, except for me to move house but then I am even further off the main motorway network and my main airport.


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## Floofball (14 October 2020)

Having read the whole thread I would just like to apologise  to people who posted 6 years ago for the ‘like’ notifications 😂
Having done nearly 40 years DIY I moved to full livery earlier this year. I’m loving it! I only have so much energy so it’s truly wonderful to be able to just enjoy quality time with my lad. Spending a lot less time at the yard but far more time with my horse - I t’s a win win for me, I feel like my horsey mojo is coming back and I’m in no rush to take him home yet. He seems very happy too 👍🏻


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## jenniehodges2001 (14 October 2020)

Why have a dog and bark yourself......?

Personally I love assisted DIY.  I can be at work for 7am knowing that in a couple of hours time my horse will be dressed, fed and turned out and bought in and fed an hour before I arrive at 4pm.

Then I have the pleasure of mucking out (which I love to do) and all the other things that keeps my horse ticking over.


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## Reacher (14 October 2020)

Zombie 🧟‍♂️  🧟‍♀️  thread.


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## McFluff (14 October 2020)

It's weird reading a thread that you responded to 6 years ago!
And with hindsight I can see I fell into the trap of responding to defend my decision to use full (actually it's really part) livery.

What I should have said is 'because I can'.

We do live in a strange world (even by 2020 standards) when people are negatively judged for making choices that make sure their animal receives appropriate care...  It is not 'lazy' to choose a solution that ensures your horse has high quality consistent care in a good routine that suits them.


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## sbloom (14 October 2020)

I used to spend two hours with my horse, doing all the fun stuff, when he was on part livery (everything except riding, tack cleaning and only brushing off every day).  He was more bonded to me when I spent half an hour with him, near-turned away on DIY grass livery, but was feeding him.


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## poiuytrewq (14 October 2020)

quirky said:



			If you didn't have a house, you wouldn't need a cleaner.
I don't get what you're trying to say!
		
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That you can have a house/horse without the dirty work, cleaning/mucking out.  Just because you pay someone to clean your house (or muck out your horse) doesn’t mean you shouldn’t have it.


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## DressageCob (14 October 2020)

I wonder why someone decided to join this forum, search for a zombie thread from 2014, and then contribute to it as their one and only post 😂

Still, it has made interesting reading. My two are on full livery for a few reasons. (1) it is the only livery my yard offers, and I wouldn't keep my horses anywhere else. (2) I work long hours and my work involves travelling all over the country, sometimes fairly last minute. If I were only DIY I would struggle. (3) The standard of care provided by the professionals working there is far superior than that I can offer (example: the difference in bed when I choose to muck it out myself!). (4) I can choose just to do the fun stuff with my boys, such as grooming, riding, feeding sweeties etc, rather than use what little time I may have to skip out the stable or fill their water. 

But really the main reason is number 1!


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## PapaverFollis (14 October 2020)

This thread being bounced up was weird because we'd just had that thread from a new user worrying that it waa somehow morally wrong to have a horse on full livery and 'only' see it 4 times a week...

Almost feels like someone was baiting the forum for some negative responses about full livery? ... but perhaps all just a coincidence.


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## chaps89 (14 October 2020)

This thread is interesting. 
Lots of people saying the horse doesn't know who is mucking them out etc, which I generally agree with.
But I know. I know what her droppings are like, whether she's hungry when I get up or not and if I need to adjust her forage rations, if her companion is settled or not, if her feet are warm or she has pulses and many more things that I wouldn't be so on top of if she wasn't on DIY.
So basically, I am a control freak and that's why DIY works for me 😂
I do need assistance so I can only go up once a day at times (becoming more pressing with a new job on the horizon which will involve a big commute) but I totally think it's ok not to be able to do it all and need some help.
Some horses on DIY would be infinitely better off on part/full, but most horses on part/full have good lives and are well looked after, same as most horses on DIY are well looked after too.
If the owner can afford it, wants or needs to do it then I don't see why anyone should judge. The world would be boring if we were all the same.


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## ihatework (14 October 2020)

chaps89 said:



			This thread is interesting.
Lots of people saying the horse doesn't know who is mucking them out etc, which I generally agree with.
But I know. I know what her droppings are like, whether she's hungry when I get up or not and if I need to adjust her forage rations, if her companion is settled or not, if her feet are warm or she has pulses and many more things that I wouldn't be so on top of if she wasn't on DIY.
So basically, I am a control freak and that's why DIY works for me 😂
I do need assistance so I can only go up once a day at times (becoming more pressing with a new job on the horizon which will involve a big commute) but I totally think it's ok not to be able to do it all and need some help.
Some horses on DIY would be infinitely better off on part/full, but most horses on part/full have good lives and are well looked after, same as most horses on DIY are well looked after too.
If the owner can afford it, wants or needs to do it then I don't see why anyone should judge. The world would be boring if we were all the same.
		
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I do agree, I’ve got control freak tendencies as well.

It’s the little things like, how many droppings, how much hay they are eating, how much water drinking,  if & when they cough, general demeanour, running a hand over them to judge temperature/sore spots/filling

That is for me what makes or breaks a livery. If I have just one or 2 people looking after the horse, notice the little things and importantly communicate them back (increasing confidence levels that these things get noticed) then full livery is either great or stressful. IME it’s been 50/50.


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## Ranyhyn (14 October 2020)

I couldnt care less what anyone else does personally!


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## jkitten (14 October 2020)

PapaverFollis said:



			This thread being bounced up was weird because we'd just had that thread from a new user worrying that it waa somehow morally wrong to have a horse on full livery and 'only' see it 4 times a week...

Almost feels like someone was baiting the forum for some negative responses about full livery? ... but perhaps all just a coincidence.
		
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You know, I wondered that! I read that other thread first and someone in it asked the OP why they would think that anyone would have a problem with the idea of full livery and when I saw this one I thought 'well, maybe because of threads like this'! Having said that, I did sympathise with that OP when I read their question. As a fellow former riding school child/teen, I definitely felt the vibe at the time of 'if you aren't thrilled at the prospect of going to the yard before school, after school and all day every weekend, you aren't sufficiently dedicated and don't deserve a horse!' and TBH even now as an adult it still kind of niggles at me when I think about the possibility of getting one, since I would definitely need at least part livery and very likely full. The answers in that thread and this one are going a long way to dispelling that anxiety, though, so thank you all!


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## Bernster (14 October 2020)

Wasn’t it the same poster?  I thought they were posting here as it was linked to their concerns about having a horse on livery.  But I haven’t bothered going back to re check!

i have 3 (😱) now on livery.  Never thought twice about it tbh and wouldn't give a monkeys what anyone else thought of it. So long as they are healthy and happy, and it works for me, that’s all that matters.


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## scats (14 October 2020)

It’s not for me, but it works for others and that’s great.  If you work odd hours or go away a lot, I can imagine it’s a perfect arrangement.  As another poster has said, I’m also a bit of a control freak, so I’m not sure how I’d cope, though I’m sure I’d get used to it!
We don’t have any option on our yard for any sort of help so it’s completely DIY.  Does mean I work my life around the horses, but I’ve been doing that for 30 years so I don’t know much different.  The idea of assisted livery sounds nice though!


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## blitznbobs (14 October 2020)

I love my horses , have the perfect set up at home, work one day a week and choose to have them on full livery. Because I want to... there I’ve said it. All their needs are met, my needs are met with social, schooling and psychological support on site. I can go away for the weekend with no stress of who im going to ask a favour of when I can’t find a groom... I just prefer it ... my horses are my hobby and fun but full livery means I have no time commitment at all which works well in my life... I also love having stables at home so that I never have to have that ”what do I do if I get chucked off “ stress that I had before we had land of our own.


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## blitznbobs (14 October 2020)

I love my horses , have the perfect set up at home, work one day a week and choose to have them on full livery. Because I want to... there I’ve said it. All their needs are met, my needs are met with social, schooling and psychological support on site. I can go away for the weekend with no stress of who im going to ask a favour of when I can’t find a groom... I just prefer it ... my horses are my hobby and fun but full livery means I have no time commitment at all which works well in my life... I also love having stables at home so that I never have to have that ”what do I do if I get chucked off “ stress that I had before we had land of our own.


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## Cloball (14 October 2020)

If you've mucked out multiple people's horses over the years on multiple yards does that mean you can be on full livery 'guilt free' ?🤓 I think I've done my share of mucking out.


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## Cortez (14 October 2020)

I've certainly mucked out enough horses. If I ever have another one it will most certainly 100% be looked after by someone who is not me. It's not just the physical work involved (in my 60's and have worn out most of my joints), it's the tie of not being able to travel or have a lie-in. Freedom!


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## Mrs B (14 October 2020)

Cortez said:



			I've certainly mucked out enough horses. If I ever have another one it will most certainly 100% be looked after by someone who is not me. It's not just the physical work involved (in my 60's and have worn out most of my joints), it's the tie of not being able to travel or have a lie-in. Freedom!
		
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What's a lie-in?


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## ihatework (14 October 2020)

Mrs B said:



			What's a lie-in? 

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That thing those sensible people on full livery get the option to take! 😁😆


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## windand rain (14 October 2020)

As long as said horse is cared for it is up to the person paying how much they do or dont. I would still go daily even if they were on full livery but not having to do much but pony pat has a small appeal. Would be nice not to worry about their care while on holiday or juggle grandkids in freezing weather but I enjoy being with them I love poo picking especially in dry weather. I dont like people much which would be the biggest drawback and of course you dont get many liveries full or otherwise which have 24/7 turnout 365 days a year


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## windand rain (14 October 2020)

I guess you could also ask why have horses if you don't ride them


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## Mule (14 October 2020)

Once the horse is well cared for, surely it doesn't matter 🤷‍♀️


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## Cortez (14 October 2020)

windand rain said:



			I guess you could also ask why have horses if you don't ride them
		
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What people choose to do with their horses is of course entirely up to them. I would not have a horse if I didn't ride it.


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## Winters100 (14 October 2020)

LuandLu24 said:



			t people who just can't be bothered mucking out etc really annoy me,. 

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I don't really understand why this would annoy you?    Do you feel that people who muck out their own stables are somehow better owners?  Mine are on part livery and I go every day, but boxes, giving feeds, filling haynets, turning out / bringing in etc is done by the grooms.  This leaves me with time to spend exercising them and giving attention, and I don't think they care who mucks out as long as they have a clean bed.  Sure I could do it, but I don't want to, when I am finished at the stable I would prefer to go to do some work or walk my dogs.

I really think we need to get away from this idea of looking at others and judging them for the way that they live their lives.  If someone can afford to have their box cleaned and their horse trained then good for them, if they just visit occasionally why does it matter as long as they have arranged good care?  We are, after all, not the only people in the world who can care for our horses.  Good for you that you enjoy doing the chores, but I really don't think that you should judge others or be 'annoyed' by them if this is not how they prefer to spend their time.


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## racebuddy (15 October 2020)

personally for me i would not have full livery , i was on part livery and absolutley hated it  , he felt like he wasnt mine at all , no control over anything , he was getting kept in when should have been turned out , hay taken off him  when should have been on ad lib , night rugs left on , hated it , i love diy with options of bring in . turnout ect so can work around shifts , ie bring in when on late shifts , ie this am have farrieer so been down before work and done him and he will get turned out , i love seeing him every day and feel like you get a much better bond with them , xx


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## mariew (15 October 2020)

Does it matter as long as the horse is looked after properly? It is easy to pass judgement on others without reason. As a previous lady said maybe they don't want to spend hours up the yard doing chores and would rather pay for someone else to do it. Horses take a lot of time and one of the reasons I haven't replaced mine just yet is I don't want to spend all my time up the yard as I like doing other things too. And I can't afford full livery, and wouldn't want to do it again anyway.


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## CanteringCarrot (15 October 2020)

I've always had full livery. Usually because DIY wasn't an option unless you want just a field with no shelter, and no where to ride. Plus, I usually worked 7:30-4:30 and wasn't about to drive 15-20 min and do a bunch of morning chores before work.

I think your livery experience can depend on the yard. Most I've been on have been flexible. I still stuff nets, give him a feeding after he's worked, water hay in the evening, bring him in, or have the option to put on a paddock with a friend in the winter.

YO will stuff nets and water hay for me, and has in the past, but I told her I don't mind doing it and it is one less thing for her to do. I'll even pick his box in the evening if he's been in there more (due to weather/not standing in his attached paddock). So there is plenty I can do aside from just showing up to ride, and I do go every day.

However, if I take a holiday, fall ill, or whatever else I know his basic needs are met and the YO can take care of it all. I also have access to 2 outdoor schools, 1 indoor, 1 covered lunging area, a solarium, a covered exercise walker, and so on. So going on DIY just isn't appealing, even if I have the time.


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## MagicMelon (16 October 2020)

Personally, I think Id really struggle to have a horse if I had to keep it at livery (even as DIY!). Im very lucky Ive only ever had my horses at home, I hate the thought of the bitchiness I hear about on yards and Im not sure Id cope with being dictated to about when my horse can be turned out etc. or any other rules the YO sets (which are perfectly acceptable Im sure, but Ive always set my own rules). 

Its up to the person what they do but personally I couldnt have others looking after my own horses. I just hate the thought of them feeding them / handling / grooming them etc. as I feel thats all part and parcel of owning them and its not just all about the riding.


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## ILuvCowparsely (17 October 2020)

LuandLu24 said:



			Before you all scream at me,  let me just say that I saw this on a Facebook group and there was some very interesting answers, I'm not attacking anyone, this is only a little discussion and opinion sharing. If you have a horse why have full livery? If you have a job or some other kind of commitment that takes up your time in the day or you do nights then I completely understand but people who just can't be bothered mucking out etc really annoy me, if you want a horse and have time then go up and care for your horse! A girl on my old yard had 3 horses and had full livery even though she only worked from 9 until 3 and only came up on weekends to ride them. I go to my horse everyday to do my yard jobs and love it. I'd love to see everyone's opinions on this. Please keep the thread mature and respectful even if you disagree with someone's opinion. 

Click to expand...

Full Livery as in Full  is everything done including riding and tack cleaning  grooming,  then I don't see the point unless you go abroad for work a bit.


 Part livery like we do  everything bu tack cleaning and riding and grooming, really suits mums and working people alike, that I can understand


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## LadyGascoyne (17 October 2020)

ILuvCowparsely said:



			Full Livery as in Full  is everything done including riding and tack cleaning  grooming,  then I don't see the point unless you go abroad for work a bit.


 Part livery like we do  everything bu tack cleaning and riding and grooming, really suits mums and working people alike, that I can understand
		
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I think if I ever bought a serious horse again, I might have it on full livery. I love horse sports but I don’t have the time to be as dedicated as I would need to be to do a good horse any justice. I’m happy to have my lovely two light hacking horses at home but there is part of me that misses seeing a horse at the peak of its physical fitness, and really developing. It is it’s own kind of experience, to my mind. 

With work being what it is for me, I’d consider having a horse on competition livery or on full livery with a pro. I’d love to watch sessions, go to competitions and maybe ride occasionally, or have the horse at home for breaks or if needed rest for health reasons.

Maybe in a few years time!


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## EllenJay (17 October 2020)

MagicMelon said:



			Personally, I think Id really struggle to have a horse if I had to keep it at livery (even as DIY!). Im very lucky Ive only ever had my horses at home, I hate the thought of the bitchiness I hear about on yards and Im not sure Id cope with being dictated to about when my horse can be turned out etc. or any other rules the YO sets (which are perfectly acceptable Im sure, but Ive always set my own rules).

Its up to the person what they do but personally I couldnt have others looking after my own horses. I just hate the thought of them feeding them / handling / grooming them etc. as I feel thats all part and parcel of owning them and its not just all about the riding.
		
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It's lucky that we are all different. Personally, I would hate having my horses at home.  I like the social side of being on a yard and would hate the solitude of not having anyone around. I am on full livery (non-ridden), a love the fact that if I am caught at the office late I don't have to worry that my horse has been left out by himself/hasn't got any hay etc.
I have done DIY for the best part of 20 years, and I don't have a lesser bond - in fact its probably stronger as I have time to spend with my horse rather than doing chores.

As they say "horses for courses"


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## Toby_Zaphod (17 October 2020)

Haven't read all the posts. Why do some people think that they are bonding with their horse when the muck out, brush the yard or poo pick the paddock? I can understand grooming as you are actually with your horse but adjusting the electric fence to give them more grass doesn't count as bonding either. We have 3 horses, all are in work, they jump, do dressage & arena eventing in the winter. We bond with them by grooming, riding & schooling but most of the other stuff is a pain in the @rse. We do everything because cannot afford full livery on 3 horses, someone has to do it & it's us due to finances. I assure you if I could afford it I'd have someone to muck out, poo pick, adjust fences if I could afford it.


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## The Irish Draft 2022 (21 September 2021)

I actually have done Both My horse is so much happier on full livery I not going to lie I snuggled with full livery at the start because i am a control freak when it comes to  making beds.  Nobody really does DLY in the area I live in so I had to do full livery. When I want to university it was my only option to be able to keep my horse my parents aren’t horsy so wouldn’t have the interest  or experienced in helping me. I have stayed on full livery for the last few years and I love it. 

I don’t now why people are so judgmental in the horse world everyone life is different. We all love our horses and enjoy them people shouldn’t be jealous. Edit sorry I only realize how old this thread it pop up on google when I was searching for this forum .


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## meleeka (21 September 2021)

I’ve just noticed this is an old thread so not sure if i’ve replied already, but I say if you can afford it and find a good yard, why not?   If I won the lottery the first thing I’d do is employ someone to poo pick as I hate it, oh and empty wheelbarrows after I’ve mucked out.  Come to think of it, someone to pick feet out for me would be nice too 😂

I did know someone who kept a horse a long way away and saw it and rode once a month.  That did strike me as a bit odd, because they can’t have had much of a bond with their horse.  I also know of someone on full livery who doesn’t work. She sees to the horse more than the yard does, so I’d consider that a waste of money, but each to their own.


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## Jim bob (21 September 2021)

I spent around 8-10 years doing DIY and i do Miss it. I said i wouldnt do full livery as i like doing my horse myself. However i work very long hours. My horse has complex needs which I struggled to meet due to my work pattern. So he is on full livery which suits my horses needs. Also when i am at work i dont have to worry. On the times i can go down after work i do and ride. And when i have days off i am down there all day.


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## MuddyMonster (21 September 2021)

I've done full/part livery, assisted DIY & DIY over the years. 

I'm currently back on DIY - my preference would be Assisted DIY as a minimum - but the yard is almost perfect, so DIY it is! 

I miss the lie ins and the need to go down twice a day can feel like a tie at times but I don't miss the  cost of 7 day full livery  

Time wise, I spend the same amount of time (if not more) riding and spending quality time with him as I don't have a 40 minute journey to him I did on the occasions he's been on full/part. I can do all my daily jobs in less time I spent driving to and from him on part livery.


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## teddy_eq (21 September 2021)

I have had my horses on full livery for about six years now and I'd not change anything.

Pre-Covid, I spent 20 hours a week commuting into the City and then another 50 working. Anything other than full livery was simply not an option. Now I WFH, I do technically have the time to have my horses on DIY or, assisted but to be quite frank, unless there's a decent DIY yard nearby, you can soon end up spending a lot of money and doing all the leg work as well.

There's a shortage of decent yards in my area so, I'd rather pay the premium and know my horse is receiving the best care, than spend maybe 30% less and be running around like a headless chicken and have less time to do the fun bits and, without putting too finer point on it, worrying about my horse. Additionally, full livery yards generally have better facilities - not all, but most. Especially if you're lucky enough to be stabled with a professional. I don't think I could manage now without hot water for example, yet to find a DIY yard that has that!

As so many people have said in this thread, people with horses on full livery don't love their horses any less just because they don't muck them out!


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## Gloi (21 September 2021)

rara007 said:



			Why have a house if you have a cleaner?
		
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Or a garden if you have a gardener.


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## DabDab (21 September 2021)

Always find it odd how certain threads seem to get bumped back from the world of zombies again and again


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## Shilasdair (21 September 2021)

You are right, OP.
If I don't have time to do my horses, I'll just have them shot.


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## ILuvCowparsely (21 September 2021)

LuandLu24 said:



			Before you all scream at me,  let me just say that I saw this on a Facebook group and there was some very interesting answers, I'm not attacking anyone, this is only a little discussion and opinion sharing. If you have a horse why have full livery? If you have a job or some other kind of commitment that takes up your time in the day or you do nights then I completely understand but people who just can't be bothered mucking out etc really annoy me, if you want a horse and have time then go up and care for your horse! A girl on my old yard had 3 horses and had full livery even though she only worked from 9 until 3 and only came up on weekends to ride them. I go to my horse everyday to do my yard jobs and love it. I'd love to see everyone's opinions on this. Please keep the thread mature and respectful even if you disagree with someone's opinion. 

Click to expand...

I've always thought this,  prob because I always think of full livery as FULL, not part  so everything is done leaving the owner nothing to do.   We had some on full in a yard I worked at . mucking out, feeding watering, exercise tack cleaning full groom you name it. Owner maybe  came to ride 2 - 3 times a year.


  To me Part is what it says  all chores done  but riding  and tack cleaning and grooming left to the owner


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## lynz88 (21 September 2021)

I'm on part livery - while all of his needs are met, I still muck out if I get a chance. But I work quite long hours at times, sometimes 50-60 hours/week though I still try to get down to see him 4 times per week....though during the week I'm generally hardpressed for time.

True full livery never appealed to me, even if I could afford it.  As much as I hate cleaning tack, it feels very "wrong" to have someone else do it, groom my horse (though some days when I'm pressed for time that would be fab! 😉😂), ride/exercise him, etc.  In fact that just isn't what happens back home so was a weird concept for me to get my head around when I learned of it.  Full board back home = part livery over here!

NB: just noticed this is a long dead thread that has been revived!


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## Muddywellies (21 September 2021)

I never thought I would go full livery. Couldn't understand why people would have a horse and not bother looking after it.  Cue massive life change and a need for support and here we are, on full livery.  I'm now eating my own words.   I'm still involved with my horse' s care, without the stress of early mornings, poo picking muddy fields etc etc.  My horse definitely knows who mum is, and I now have the time for more riding and consistent training.   Full livery has been a game changer for me and right now I can't imagine going back to DIY.  My horse now has a better routine and has never been happier and healthier, and riding isn't something that is squeezed in if I have time.  Love it !

Apologies- just realised this thread is from 2014.   I'll leave my comment on tho.


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## oldie48 (21 September 2021)

Well it may be a zombie thread but nothing changes does it? Why on earth do people feel the need to be judgemental? As long as horses are looked after well, what does it matter who mucks out, poo picks the paddocks, cleans the tack or for that matter, schools the horse. I've had horses living at home when I did pretty much everything and on full livery on an expensive yard with all the frills, tbh I don't think my horses noticed the difference and I only noticed when I looked at my bank account. Why can't people just get on with what suits them and leave other people alone?


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## criso (21 September 2021)

What gets called full livery round here is more like part in that it doesn't include exercise.

Last Friday i had the trimmer coming and my plan was bring in from the field to a stable that was ready, groom, quick ride, hold for trimmer then finish off putting in feeds and haynet made up. 

However there had been a mix up in the livery list for the person covering so i ended up diy on that day. 

So i got there, mucked out, put wood pellets and Copra to soak, brought in, held for trimmer, put on horse walker instead of riding while i finished bed, made nets and feeds.  Finished and put in feed and haynet. 

I would have had alot more quality time with the livery option.


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## Ambers Echo (21 September 2021)

Toby_Zaphod said:



			Haven't read all the posts. Why do some people think that they are bonding with their horse when the muck out, brush the yard or poo pick the paddock? I can understand grooming as you are actually with your horse but adjusting the electric fence to give them more grass doesn't count as bonding either. We have 3 horses, all are in work, they jump, do dressage & arena eventing in the winter. We bond with them by grooming, riding & schooling but most of the other stuff is a pain in the @rse. We do everything because cannot afford full livery on 3 horses, someone has to do it & it's us due to finances. I assure you if I could afford it I'd have someone to muck out, poo pick, adjust fences if I could afford it.
		
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This!! I enjoy all aspects of care that involve directly interacting with the horses. But it makes no difference at all to my 'bond' who does the yard chores or the mucking out. If anything it just takes time away from the interactive stuff as I'm too busy getting on with jobs just to chill in the field and watch them or hang out in the barn and groom or just chat to them. If I could afford full livery 7 days a week I'd absolutely ask for that.


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## Peglo (21 September 2021)

This has been an interesting thread, if very old 😂 I do DIY and can totally see people will have more time to spend on the fun things with their horses with livery. But I do feel like feeding them, poop scooping (as they come over for a cuddle and scratch) and hanging around is good bonding time. But I definitely find I don’t have the time to ride as much as I’d like.


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## MuddyMonster (21 September 2021)

I think that last line from @Muddywellies sums it up, for me. I love the bones of my horse & I'd keep my horse if he had to retire tomorrow. But, I love riding my horse too. If DIY livery meant I didnt have the time to do that but part livery did, I'd do it again in a heartbeat.

It just so happens I have a (basic but suits us) DIY yard close to home with great hacking. 

I've been fundamentally the same owner whether I pick up his poo or someone else does throughout the years - I've never loved him less or thought differently about him whether he's been on full/part livery or DIY.


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## criso (21 September 2021)

Peglo said:



			This has been an interesting thread, if very old 😂 I do DIY and can totally see people will have more time to spend on the fun things with their horses with livery. But I do feel like feeding them, poop scooping (as they come over for a cuddle and scratch) and hanging around is good bonding time. But I definitely find I don’t have the time to ride as much as I’d like.
		
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That's why i have livery, much more hanging around time which is part of the fun stuff and the reality is if he poos, i will get it out as i can't leave it there.


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## shortstuff99 (21 September 2021)

I have just moved onto part livery (I still do weekends) after 20 years of DIY and honestly I'm not sure I would go back. My dad used to have to help me a lot due to some physical difficulties and he didn't really want to do it anymore. Plus I was so frustrated with trying to guess when to bring mine in so she wouldn't be on her own (goes ballistic).

Now I have so much more time for riding and socialising! I do sometimes get a bit annoyed as I'm very specific about how I like to look after them, but my horses are really happy.


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## PurBee (21 September 2021)

Full livery is an excellent option for people with schedules that are erratic, and also for folk who hate the back-breaking work of practically looking after a half tonne beasty!

I’ve no judgement whatsoever, if the animal is healthy, stimulated and cared for, what does it matter who provides that? The owner pays to ensure they are cared for. Finding a good full livery is probably more the challenge.

I have horses at home and i’d pay a groom to come in an help a few hours per week if i could afford it. I spend a ridiculous amount of time doing land-management, fencing, drainage, re-seeding, fertilising, topping, strimming, tree-trimming, maintenance of horse areas, making mud-free all weather tracks, sourcing decent feed, maintenance of machinery to do all those jobs, and of course - endless poo-picking!… that i barely have the hours left to actually enjoy the horses! Its ridiculous how much it takes just one person to manage the entire terrain horses require. I’d employ a team to do it all, if money was no object, just so i could spend an hour a week just friggin’ cuddling them! 😂


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## iknowmyvalue (21 September 2021)

I work a job with unpredictable and often long hours, so DIY would be somewhere from impractical to impossible. Currently even on a good day I rarely leave the yard before 7-8pm if I’ve ridden, and that’s without doing any yard jobs at all. I barely have time to cook/do house jobs as it is 😂

So that’s why it’s full livery for me!


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## Winters100 (21 September 2021)

Seems so strange to me that people who are paying for their horses to get good levels of care are asked to justify why they don't clean their own boxes!  What about horses who do not have clean boxes or adequate care?  

I filled my own haynets tonight, along with about 20 others, because the groom was feeling unwell.  Tomorrow I must remember to ask my horses if the hay was tastier, or if they slept better, for knowing that they had been filled by their owner. 

I am clearly a terrible owner as do not intend to ever clean my boxes outside of some problem making it necessary.


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## Gloi (22 September 2021)

Mucking out is much nicer if you are doing it while you are passing the time with your horse rather than because you need to do it no matter what else is going on in your life that day.


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## pistolpete (22 September 2021)

Two points spring to mind. I did it once but only because the yard had many other pluses. Good facilities hacking and appropriate grazing for my horse. I did go every day though. It was very close to home. I felt sorry for the horses who weren’t visited daily by their owners. I can’t say the care they got was great. That’s the biggest issue for me.


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## exracehorse (22 September 2021)

I often wonder how folk can afford full livery. There are two yards near who offer full. In fact only take full livery. And are doing very well. But one is 800 pounds a month. With shoes. Insurance etc on top. That’s a mortgage. You would have to earn a lot of money.


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## ecb89 (22 September 2021)

exracehorse said:



			I often wonder how folk can afford full livery. There are two yards near who offer full. In fact only take full livery. And are doing very well. But one is 800 pounds a month. With shoes. Insurance etc on top. That’s a mortgage. You would have to earn a lot of money.
		
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Or sacrifice a lot


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## lme (22 September 2021)

I keep mine on full because I work full time, have unpredictable hours and they are split across multiple yards in different locations, depending on their needs. The yards they are on all have a good standard of care and knowing my horses are not dependent on me for daily care takes the pressure off.


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## Kat (22 September 2021)

I keep my horse on full livery because I care about her and want her to have a regular routine and proper care no matter how busy I am. 

I don't think it would be fair to have her waiting to be brought in while I'm stuck in rush hour traffic, or turned out before all the other horses because I have an early meeting. 

I don't want to be unable to spend time grooming or riding because I am busy at work and only have time to muck out. 

I have a horse to enjoy riding, grooming and spending time with the horse. Not so that I can spend time mucking out an empty stable and filling haynets. 

I didn't have a horse until I could afford at least part livery because I knew I needed that to provide the standard of care I wanted to, and have time to enjoy horse ownership alongside my job and my family.  

I am perfectly capable of doing all the DIY jobs and have done DIY at times in the past but it isn't sustainable for me. 

I get a bit sick of this holier than thou attitude from some about full livery. Horses don't care who fills their haynet or picks up their poo, they just care that it is done. Paying for livery services is supporting a small business or self employed person, it is good for the industry.


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## Muddywellies (23 September 2021)

Those who have mentioned affording it, yes, it's jolly expensive.   BUT if you to break down what you pay at DIY including fuel for two (for me, sometimes three) visits a day, bedding, hay, feed, external arena hire if your facilities are poor, fuel for collecting hay, paying for holiday cover, plus your time, you'll be amazed at what it all adds up to, and is closer to a full-livery price than you might imagine.


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## shortstuff99 (23 September 2021)

Muddywellies said:



			Those who have mentioned affording it, yes, it's jolly expensive.   BUT if you to break down what you pay at DIY including fuel for two (for me, sometimes three) visits a day, bedding, hay, feed, external arena hire if your facilities are poor, fuel for collecting hay, paying for holiday cover, plus your time, you'll be amazed at what it all adds up to, and is closer to a full-livery price than you might imagine.
		
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I agree, when I added it up I'm paying about £100 more a month then DIY, and that is basically covering for them mucking out. I think that is quite a good deal!


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## j1ffy (23 September 2021)

Gosh, what a judgemental thread! I'm pleased there are a lot of 'live and let live' people with balanced views as well though  

Mine are on part (i.e. everything except grooming and exercise) livery, which also provides the option for exercise as an additional service. Why? Firstly because I work long hours and often have to travel - 'travel' may mean a five-hour round trip to clients so out of the house from 6am to 8pm or more, or the odd overnight. Secondly, because I enjoy occasionally doing all the chores but doing it every day would wear me down on top of work and I'd have no energy to ride. Thirdly, I love riding! Finally, I'm in a very well-paid career and can afford it. Oh and another thing (pulls cigar out of mouth), I have found a yard with great care levels so I completely trust them to take care of my boy. Funnily enough it's a lot cheaper than a smarter yard I was at before but with far more grazing and a lovely relaxed atmosphere.

I don't make it to the yard to see my horse every day, much as I would like to. Other than work I have a partner (who I actually like and want to spend time with, unlike my ex-husband 🤣), a social life and other forms of exercise to fit in. I'm fairly sure that none of my horses care whether they see me every day or not, and they still recognise me and stick their head over the door / come to me in the field when they hear my voice. To me, there's no doubt that they know that I'm 'their' human as they are rarely groomed / ridden by others and, no matter how much a groom or YO likes your horse, they'll never treat them as their own.

One day I hope to have horses at home and run a very different type of business. My wonderful partner is also a builder so I've already told him that he's doing fencing and land maintenance - I'll buy him some nice toys to do it with of course 😝


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## Ambers Echo (23 September 2021)

This morning I planned to spend a bit of time with Lottie in her stable. But after mucking out 3, poo picking the field, doing feeds, hay and water, I didn;t have time. So she saw me for a few minutes though I was there for an hour and a half. I'd have far more quality time with the horses if they were on full.


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## ew0855 (23 September 2021)

I'm currently on full livery as I have a horse who's far too good for me! I don't have the talent or confidence for a highly bred, 17hh, 4 year old. But he makes me happy, he's the most gorgous creature and I adore him. He's also getting a much much better start in life on a professional yard with competant, confident riding than he would with his amateur owner. 

I've got a busy, unpredictable job with long hours that lets me afford to keep Isaac in the luxary he thinks he deserves. I'm happier, healther and more relaxed for having him. His bills support several local businesses. Would I love to have the time and ability to produce him myself ? Of course but the simple fact is I don't. So while Isaac is well cared for and happy we'll continue as we are


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## milliepops (23 September 2021)

there aren't really any full livery yards round me that I'd move to, only one I'm aware of is the yard I moved away FROM... it was WAAAAAAY more expensive than what I pay for DIY incl all costs but that's partly because I get my hay for free plus I have 2 horses on a yard. my time isn't x2 but the costs for full livery would be.

 I used to have assisted DIY which was wonderful and I'd do that again in a heartbeat if I had the option. But having 5 others at home means I'm never able to dodge horse duty anyway so if I'm up to do them i may as well do the other 2 while i'm at it.
I do get a lot of "contact time" while mucking out and poo picking, I always do jobs like that with the horses around and they are sociable so hang out with me, i quite enjoy that (but I'd like a self propelled wheelbarrow very much)


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## DressageCob (23 September 2021)

Having read this thread, my full is other people's part. My full livery includes everything except for exercise/grooming (beyond picking feet out when they come in). I can (and often do) organise exercise on top. 

To be frank, even if I were retired and had time for DIY, and even did everything myself, I would still pay for full livery at my yard. I just don't want to go anywhere else and they only offer full!


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## Birker2020 (23 September 2021)

LuandLu24 said:



			Before you all scream at me,  let me just say that I saw this on a Facebook group and there was some very interesting answers, I'm not attacking anyone, this is only a little discussion and opinion sharing. If you have a horse why have full livery? If you have a job or some other kind of commitment that takes up your time in the day or you do nights then I completely understand but people who just can't be bothered mucking out etc really annoy me, if you want a horse and have time then go up and care for your horse! A girl on my old yard had 3 horses and had full livery even though she only worked from 9 until 3 and only came up on weekends to ride them. I go to my horse everyday to do my yard jobs and love it. I'd love to see everyone's opinions on this. Please keep the thread mature and respectful even if you disagree with someone's opinion. 

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I have always had mine on assisted DIY where the staff will turn out or bring in as and when and put made up feeds/hay tubs over the door.

As my jobs always been a 7.30am start and I have to leave the house for the most part by 6.30am its impossible for me to do the horse reguarly, although I've done it before now when sick, etc.

I really enjoy mucking out and doing nets, water, etc and feel proud of the finished stable.

But I understand the some people work busy jobs, my mate for example is a vet physio so works very unsociable hours.  Not much good her doing a 9-5 when most of her clients aren't available during working hours.  So she has her boy on full livery, so do others I know who have demanding jobs or live far away from the yard.

Even if I could afford it I wouldn't although I happily put my horse on FDC (full day care) one day a week in the winter so I can go and visit Mum, cook her tea and then go to the gym afterwards.


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## D66 (23 September 2021)

This is so judgmental. 
I haven’t read every page so may have missed comments on people who keep their horses at home but have a groom to do daily care. How do they fit into the caring/couldn’t care less spectrum?


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## windand rain (23 September 2021)

The joy in horse ownership for me is caring for them. However if I could afford it, didn't comporomise their care eg top notch care and the livery didn't mind me being around I would love to have the heavy stuff done for me now I am getting old


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## DizzyDoughnut (23 September 2021)

I can see why people want and need full livery but I really enjoy doing everything for mine and feel I wouldn't get to know them so well if they were on full livery and I just turned up to ride. I like just walking to and from the field with them, poo picking while they come and hang out with me etc, however if I could employ someone just to muck out and turn them out on cold wet dark mornings I would. I haven't ridden mine for years due to them being old and retired and now having a 2 year old and a retired pony. I have them mainly because I enjoy being with them and caring for them, riding is just a nice bonus. 
As long as the horse is happy and well cared for it doesn't really matter what kind of livery you use as long as it suits both you and the horse.


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## jay2bee (27 September 2021)

Every DIY yard I've been on, only about 10% of the people actually ride their horses. Mixture of people with too little time and energy once chores are done , or pony patters who don't really enjoy riding anymore/are scared to. At my current full livery yard, everyone has a trailer and is out an about every week, whether it be show jumping/eventing/just nice hacks - just because we don't spend time mucking out and filling nets doesn't mean we don't spend time with our horses!


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## Ouch05 (27 September 2021)

I'm currently DIY the cost is eye watering I could move them to part livery for the same cost. Why don't I? tbh my own stupid fault. I need to just let go a little of the control that way instead of riding riding one, one night and another the next etc I would possible ride both one night and actually have an evening off instead of getting home at 8 every night totally wiped out. But I have only ever done DIY I serious may have to re-think this as everything those on full or part have said is so true. They don't know or care who muck out/fills nets etc but they do know who grooms and rides and that is me!

Taking my tired and broken body off for a wee chat with myself!!!


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## Muddywellies (27 September 2021)

jay2bee said:



			Every DIY yard I've been on, only about 10% of the people actually ride their horses. Mixture of people with too little time and energy once chores are done , or pony patters who don't really enjoy riding anymore/are scared to. At my current full livery yard, everyone has a trailer and is out an about every week, whether it be show jumping/eventing/just nice hacks - just because we don't spend time mucking out and filling nets doesn't mean we don't spend time with our horses!
		
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I also noticed at DIY yards i was at, a high percentage of the liveries didn't ride.  At my yard (I'm full livery) everyone rides and most compete, and we all have extremely good relationships with our horses.   My full livery doesn't include exercise. I bring in, brush, tack up, ride, bath, and generally pamper my horse.   I can do all that because I don't have all the other jobs to do.  Everyone's happy 😊


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## MuddyMonster (27 September 2021)

The thing that always intrigues me, is how do people know who rides & doesn't? 

I ride 6 days a week but rarely anyone is there to witness it. 

I can honestly say, whether I've been on DIY or full livery, I've neither the time or the inclination to keep tabs on who does what or what their relationship is with their horse.


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## MagicMelon (27 September 2021)

I think its up to the individual person. Personally I enjoy looking after my horses and being their sole provider. I dont like people doing my horses, just because Ive never had that, Ive always kept my horses at home so Id feel weird someone else potentially having a say in their care or not doing things quite how I like it. I couldnt trust someone else with mine, more just their treatment, I would hate to risk someone else walloping my horse for example.


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## Bob notacob (27 September 2021)

Currently pushing 66 and a lifetimes of horse related injuries. I still do my horse as a diy but I will gladly go full livery if it gets too much ,rather than give up the horse of a lifetime. We dont do much these days but yesterday he surprised me with a 4th at a good local dressage comp. I am still on a buzz from it ,as if I was 15 not 65 . Way to go Bob notacob. I will do anything to keep involved with my horse.


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## SO1 (28 September 2021)

I am on part livery because of work and distance from the yard.

When  I was on a DIY yard most of the liveries did not work full time or did not work at all being supported financially by their husbands, this was how they managed to find time to ride. I think there was 3 of us that worked full time on a yard with nearly 30 horses.

I am on part livery and yes it is very expensive and I have made significant sacrifices to be able to afford it. However I also have a fairly senior role - Head of 3 departments and a decent salary. I do work long hours at least 2 a week and have also had to work weekends as well so part livery is a necessity for me in the role that I do.

Pony is very well looked after and considered one of the family on the yard as he has been there nearly 7 years now. I try and go up 4-5 times a week to ride. 

I don't understand why the quality of part livery yards often mentioned is so poor, the services should be fairly straightforward to provide. Not noticing injury/illness can I expect be an issue with inexperienced staff but same could happen with inexperienced owner or owner in a rush on DIY. The not providing ad lib hay issue could be solved by yards charging more if people wanted that option. I have a fatty native so he does not have adlib hay, he has soaked hay in small holed haynets. 

The only niggle I have is the no discount if you don't use their feed. I expect this is because it is easier to feed all horses same feeds with minor variations depending on size or type rather than having owners provide their own feeds which takes up lots of space and more complicated for staff. 



jay2bee said:



			Every DIY yard I've been on, only about 10% of the people actually ride their horses. Mixture of people with too little time and energy once chores are done , or pony patters who don't really enjoy riding anymore/are scared to. At my current full livery yard, everyone has a trailer and is out an about every week, whether it be show jumping/eventing/just nice hacks - just because we don't spend time mucking out and filling nets doesn't mean we don't spend time with our horses!
		
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## YorkshireLady (28 September 2021)

Im currently on a fantastic livery yard but also did DIY for years commuting to London after riding then doing eve chores later as well. I got a new job, thought they may not be as flexible so I moved and 7 years plus I am still here. I am not going to go through all the pros and cons here of both as frankly it is choice. However current yard is no where near as much trouble or bitchy as the other. What I love is that my horse has the same routine every day whether i go or not...if I am stuck with work or on holiday he gets the same care and same routine. This is marvellous.

Also as I got older i knew the 5am alarms would need to stop even if i do often ride before work still.

Frankly you can defo keep the poo picking!!


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## criso (28 September 2021)

MuddyMonster said:



			The thing that always intrigues me, is how do people know who rides & doesn't? 

I ride 6 days a week but rarely anyone is there to witness it. 

I can honestly say, whether I've been on DIY or full livery, I've neither the time or the inclination to keep tabs on who does what or what their relationship is with their horse.
		
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Because I'm friendly and chat to people and nod sympathetically when they say they haven't had time to ride this week and arrange to hack at the weekend.  I've been on yards where there is a very definite post work rush hour and most people up at the same time doing chores, grooming, riding.  In the winter it would be dark so everyone working around each other in terms of using the school.

Depends on the yard though, current yard diy and full are separate yards so the people i have most contact with also have services though it varies a bit.


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## Muddywellies (28 September 2021)

MuddyMonster said:



			The thing that always intrigues me, is how do people know who rides & doesn't?

I ride 6 days a week but rarely anyone is there to witness it.

I can honestly say, whether I've been on DIY or full livery, I've neither the time or the inclination to keep tabs on who does what or what their relationship is with their horse.
		
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Because you know everyone on the yard (though I've never been on a large yard with more than about 15 horses) so you usually become friends.  I cant


criso said:



			Because I'm friendly and chat to people and nod sympathetically when they say they haven't had time to ride this week and arrange to hack at the weekend.  I've been on yards where there is a very definite post work rush hour and most people up at the same time doing chores, grooming, riding.  In the winter it would be dark so everyone working around each other in terms of using the school.

Depends on the yard though, current yard diy and full are separate yards so the people i have most contact with also have services though it varies a bit.
		
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Same as me.  I've always been on fairly small yards and you get to know people quite well. Everyone knows who riding, when, where etc etc.   We'd often ride together or if schooling, help each other out.  Also booking system for areas is a bit of a giveaway.


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## Cinnamontoast (29 September 2021)

I know everyone on my yard, we’re all very sociable and on a Whatsapp group. We’ll bring each other’s horses in to save them from being last out, we lend each other stuff, make an effort to speak. I thought it was normal to know what everyone is up to, there are only 8 geldings, about 6 mares with various ponies and I could tell you who rides etc. It’s a friendly yard, we know a lot about each other, which suits me, although I imagine some people literally just want to ride and go.


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## Lyle (29 September 2021)

I've kept horses in the past on 'full care' agistment- horses live in their paddocks, are fed morning and night with rugs removed/added. Owners provided feed, made sure feeds were mixed and placed in buckets ready for feed out, and rugs were kept neatly stored by the paddocks. I worked full time, 7.30am-5.00pm. I rode nearly every day, at 5.30am as the sun came up. By having my horse on full care, he was able to be managed in accordance with a routinevery day of the week (not just work days!). The horses on the whole property were happy, as they all knew the feed up routine. I've been on DIY, where issues happen because someone is feeding their horse, and the other horses can get upset. I love looking after my horses, but at one time in my life, full care worked in the better interests of my horse.


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## Red-1 (29 September 2021)

I keep mine at home and do occasionally think about selling our placed, having a 'normal' house and moving to livery. I have a fab yard I trust, in fact my horses go there if I can't see to them for any reason. 

I always said I wouldn't do it, but I am older now. I just had cold hands at 6am, not nice!


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## ycbm (29 September 2021)

Red-1 said:



			I keep mine at home and do occasionally think about selling our placed, having a 'normal' house and moving to livery. I have a fab yard I trust, in fact my horses go there if I can't see to them for any reason.

I always said I wouldn't do it, but I am older now. I just had cold hands at 6am, not nice!
		
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Every time I get to this point I read another thread on here about problems at livery yards.  I don't have one I trust,  sadly, but then I also don't have cold hands at 6am because I don't go outside till 9 😆
.


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## meleeka (29 September 2021)

Red-1 said:



			I keep mine at home and do occasionally think about selling our placed, having a 'normal' house and moving to livery. I have a fab yard I trust, in fact my horses go there if I can't see to them for any reason.

I always said I wouldn't do it, but I am older now. I just had cold hands at 6am, not nice!
		
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I’d miss the peace and quiet above all else.  You really couldn’t pay me to be on a yard.  A freelance groom might be nice though if I could afford it.


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## MuddyMonster (29 September 2021)

Muddywellies said:



			Because you know everyone on the yard (though I've never been on a large yard with more than about 15 horses) so you usually become friends. I can't 

Same as me.  I've always been on fairly small yards and you get to know people quite well. Everyone knows who riding, when, where etc etc.   We'd often ride together or if schooling, help each other out.  Also booking system for areas is a bit of a giveaway.
		
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Cinnamontoast said:



			I know everyone on my yard, we’re all very sociable and on a Whatsapp group. We’ll bring each other’s horses in to save them from being last out, we lend each other stuff, make an effort to speak. I thought it was normal to know what everyone is up to, there are only 8 geldings, about 6 mares with various ponies and I could tell you who rides etc. It’s a friendly yard, we know a lot about each other, which suits me, although I imagine some people literally just want to ride and go.
		
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Fair enough  

The yards friendly, I like to think I'm friendly and do regularly chat to people when doing jobs if our paths cross. We have a FB page for yard information etc but I can't say whether someone has ridden or not, has routinely come up day to day in conversation. 

I often work flexi-time hours I don't see the same people at the same time day in, day out nor at the same time nor does there seem to be a consistent peak busy period from what I can tell -  it might change over winter, who knows?  It was similar when I was on full livery, but again it wasn't a small yard. It's not unusual for me to leave for a hack with people arriving and come back hours later to a fairly empty yard so might 'miss' a lot  - unless I just happen to speak to someone there who mentions they've done X or Y. 

I'm always aware of being pushed for time though (there's always somewhere else to be or something else to be doing ...) & would rather use my time riding or doing jobs, so I don't tend hang about. Perhaps if I used the tea room or tack room more, I'd know more - who knows


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## milliepops (29 September 2021)

I didn't know what anyone did on my last yard either. it was split with full liveries on one yard and DIYs on the other, only me and one friend worked full time normal hours so I'd rarely see anyone else except on Saturday mornings when all the full liveries had lessons with YO... so I'd arrive, do stables and bog off until things quietened down, haha.


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