# To change horse or not? V long, sorry



## Psych (14 February 2018)

Long time lurker looking for advice.

Ive had an ISH for about three years. Shes a proper pet, very willing and responsive and a super jumper. However, her previous owner had only hunted her so she was very green in some ways.

Im novice in a lot of ways - shes my first horse, and Im very much in the happy hacker camp with no ambitions to do much more than Im currently able to do - 70-80cm jumping, intro dressage, pre novice hunter trials and fun rides.

As Im working full time and am inexperienced in schooling and stable management I keep her in full livery with lessons on site, riding 1-2 times a week in winter and 2-3 times in summer. I also have a share agreement for riding of her with someone far more competent & who schools her, competes her at a low level and takes more advanced lessons and would ride her 6 of 7 days. 

Heres the problem - I feel shes a bit much for me sometimes. The more work thats put into her, the fitter she gets and the more forward she becomes. 

For example, I can take her out cross country and we can have great fun, we walk, trot, small canter, pop a few small jumps. If were in a large group she gets strong above a trot or putting a string of jumps together. Or, at a local show she can get a bit fizzy - not bold exactly, just happy in herself and full of life. 

So, its not unmanageable, her other rider has the skills to sort it out as soon as it kicks off and with me, I tense and start getting into a pulling match, she picks up on the nerves and so on...

What Im wrestling with is: to get to the level of enjoying her to the full I should upskill & Im not sure Ive the time or inclination. Im thinking Id be better with a more cobby type and leave this one go to her loan rider full time (havent raised this with her yet!).

Im mad about her, shes so honest and brave and tries her best at whatever shes asked to do, lovely to handle on the ground and shes fun to ride. Plus, all animals can act out and most of the time I can sort out her messing.  On the other hand, her sharer loves her as well and she (the mare) gets on so well with her and I cant see myself ever getting to the point of being as confident on her cross country or off site as I am with a school horse.

I suppose Im looking for what other people would think & to see if there are things I havent considered? 

Sorry for the essay, trying to organize my thoughts as I type!


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## splashgirl45 (14 February 2018)

she sounds lovely...sometimes its better to stick with what you have got as you are happy with her alot of the time.....a more cobby type can still be very forward going and strong so you could end up with more of a problem....is she more chilled in the summer?  if so why not do most of your riding in the summer and let the loaner take more of the riding in the winter..... or have lessons on her to try and improve yourself and feel more confident....dont feel you have to match up to her loan rider, if you are happy hacking only then just do exactly that.  good luck


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## be positive (14 February 2018)

A couple of things come to mind, firstly that the sharer seems to be getting rather more out of the deal than you do, no wonder she loves her and the opportunities she is having, her management is out of your control are you sure she is not getting fed/ managed to suit her sharer rather than you, it may be better if she was less fit, she can still be fit enough but an over fit, over fed horse will be tricky for a person who only rides 2 or 3 times a week and is in fact riding far less than the sharer does. 

I would suggest that at the end of the winter you ask her to be let down a little, get less feed, assuming she is on hard food, the sharer to remember the horse is yours and needs to be less fit, they can still do plenty with her just wind things down to nearer your level and see if that helps, otherwise you may end up with another horse that you may not enjoy as much when a few tweaks to change things in your favour could make all the difference.
As a YO I have seen similar happen and am always conscious of the level of riding the owner has so try to keep the horses in a way that fits in, I know who pays the bills and they are the ones to keep happy, so to my mind I think you need to see if something can be done as the mare sounds lovely and probably just a bit too enthusiastic at times, just to add don't be concerned about her not reaching her potential or being wasted with you, she is loved, well cared for and will not care if she doesn't go xc or jump big jumps .


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## YorksG (14 February 2018)

be positive said:



			A couple of things come to mind, firstly that the sharer seems to be getting rather more out of the deal than you do, no wonder she loves her and the opportunities she is having, her management is out of your control are you sure she is not getting fed/ managed to suit her sharer rather than you, it may be better if she was less fit, she can still be fit enough but an over fit, over fed horse will be tricky for a person who only rides 2 or 3 times a week and is in fact riding far less than the sharer does. 

I would suggest that at the end of the winter you ask her to be let down a little, get less feed, assuming she is on hard food, the sharer to remember the horse is yours and needs to be less fit, they can still do plenty with her just wind things down to nearer your level and see if that helps, otherwise you may end up with another horse that you may not enjoy as much when a few tweaks to change things in your favour could make all the difference.
As a YO I have seen similar happen and am always conscious of the level of riding the owner has so try to keep the horses in a way that fits in, I know who pays the bills and they are the ones to keep happy, so to my mind I think you need to see if something can be done as the mare sounds lovely and probably just a bit too enthusiastic at times, just to add don't be concerned about her not reaching her potential or being wasted with you, she is loved, well cared for and will not care if she doesn't go xc or jump big jumps .
		
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Perfect reply!


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## ester (14 February 2018)

I agree, she genuinely sounds lovely so let down a bit might help. I certainly wouldn't presume you won't have the same issue, or different issues with a cob.

Do you think with help you'd be able to work on not tensing up? It does get you into all sorts of trouble on all sorts of horses .


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## Ambers Echo (15 February 2018)

I can relate to this - I have a fantastic ISH who is pretty challenging to ride. And the stronger and fitter she gets, the harder it is to ride her power. I'm not (yet!) really up.to her level. But I agree with the above posters - if I was not interested in competing I'd reduce her workload and feed, let her lose some fitness and just have fun. She would be fine with that. So I don't think having a loaner keeping her super fit and tuned up is helping you tbh.


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## LaurenBay (15 February 2018)

Agree with the others, I would ask the sharer not to ride as much so the Horse loses a bit of fitness. See if that helps


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## Ambers Echo (15 February 2018)

ETA when my daughter was having a confidence wobble I rode her pony several times a week. But I was acutely mindful of needing to ride him in a way that suited her not me. I could have taken him up a  few levels, jumped him round bigger tracks, getting him nicely forward and confident. But actually I rode him as she would ride him: calmly, with lots of small jumps from trot, lots of boring (to him) flatwork so that he was not too hot for her when she got on. Not that many horses adjust to the rider - they need to be ridden  how you want them to go.


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## Psych (15 February 2018)

splashgirl45 said:



			....is she more chilled in the summer?
		
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Very much so, she doesnt like the shorter turnouts & feels she has to have the most fun she can in her ridden time!  Once March is half way through, shell start chilling a lot more


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## Psych (15 February 2018)

be positive said:



			A couple of things come to mind, firstly that the sharer seems to be getting rather more out of the deal than you do, no wonder she loves her and the opportunities she is having, her management is out of your control are you sure she is not getting fed/ managed to suit her sharer rather than you, it may be better if she was less fit, she can still be fit enough but an over fit, over fed horse will be tricky for a person who only rides 2 or 3 times a week and is in fact riding far less than the sharer does. 

I would suggest that at the end of the winter you ask her to be let down a little, get less feed, assuming she is on hard food, the sharer to remember the horse is yours and needs to be less fit, they can still do plenty with her just wind things down to nearer your level and see if that helps, otherwise you may end up with another horse that you may not enjoy as much when a few tweaks to change things in your favour could make all the difference.
As a YO I have seen similar happen and am always conscious of the level of riding the owner has so try to keep the horses in a way that fits in, I know who pays the bills and they are the ones to keep happy, so to my mind I think you need to see if something can be done as the mare sounds lovely and probably just a bit too enthusiastic at times, just to add don't be concerned about her not reaching her potential or being wasted with you, she is loved, well cared for and will not care if she doesn't go xc or jump big jumps .
		
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A lot of this rings very true! While the sharer is lovely, she is very young (early 20s) and I think she might forget sometimes that I might prefer to just potter and it should be up to me how the mare is used. 

What really kicked this off is the sharer texted me to say the yard owner had passed on a message I shouldnt ride in an upcoming local show ( sj unaffiliated , Id be going into the 40-60cm, I have no shame being surrounded by kids and out performed by them) as it might be a bit much & I just thought, if Im not able for that, then Im going backwards! 

On reflection, its very unlike the YO not to cal me direct so I think there might be some filtering of what was said... which annoys me in a different way. 

I feel the sharer is almost restricting access, asking me not to ride unless shes there, etc. I know Im not great but I know my limits and I can tell if the mare is  getting fizzy and when to call a stop. I find shes fine with just hanging out together, I can take her xc and I can take her away and walk while everyone else flys off - where she gets hot is when she thinks were going for it - so if shes in the group thats galloping, she wants to be in front! So at least I know most of the trouble spots..

I think the best way to deal is to call the YO direct and ask her about it, then have a three way get together to wind her back.


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## Psych (15 February 2018)

ester said:



			same issue, or different issues with a cob.
		
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Too true, despite the ads I dont believe any animal is actually bombproof &#128521;


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## Always-Riding (15 February 2018)

You've had some great advice already, so I won't add too much to that.

What I will say is, that you should also consider if your horse is suitable to being a gentle hack/light schooling, even with reduced fitness, or whether she actually thrives on the type of work your sharer does with her.

If the latter, and it was me in your shoes, I would seriously consider loaning her (or even selling) and finding something that fits what you want. 

However, saying that, she is your horse and if the share isn't actually benefitting you, it probably should be changed (however that may be).


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## Psych (15 February 2018)

ester said:



			Do you think with help you'd be able to work on not tensing up? It does get you into all sorts of trouble on all sorts of horses .
		
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I know! Im a control freak, I dont mind the thought of falling off (luckily!) but hate the thought of not being 100% in charge and that doesnt work with horses - yes you have to be the boss but you have to work together.. 

Im trying to spend more time chilling before riding and specifically working on breathing slowly and visualizing good outcomes & it seems to be working, we had a wobbler a few weeks ago and we got over it fairly quickly


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## be positive (15 February 2018)

Psych said:



			A lot of this rings very true! While the sharer is lovely, she is very young (early 20s) and I think she might forget sometimes that I might prefer to just potter and it should be up to me how the mare is used. 

What really kicked this off is the sharer texted me to say the yard owner had passed on a message I shouldnt ride in an upcoming local show ( sj unaffiliated , Id be going into the 40-60cm, I have no shame being surrounded by kids and out performed by them) as it might be a bit much & I just thought, if Im not able for that, then Im going backwards! 

On reflection, its very unlike the YO not to cal me direct so I think there might be some filtering of what was said... which annoys me in a different way. 

I feel the sharer is almost restricting access, asking me not to ride unless shes there, etc. I know Im not great but I know my limits and I can tell if the mare is  getting fizzy and when to call a stop. I find shes fine with just hanging out together, I can take her xc and I can take her away and walk while everyone else flys off - where she gets hot is when she thinks were going for it - so if shes in the group thats galloping, she wants to be in front! So at least I know most of the trouble spots..

I think the best way to deal is to call the YO direct and ask her about it, then have a three way get together to wind her back.
		
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I think a conversation needs to be had with them both, the sharer needs to be reminded who owns the horse and the YO reminded who pays the bills, it sounds as if you are very aware of your capabilities and not in need of a "nanny" however well meaning they are, they sound as if they do have your best interests at heart but forget that you are an adult who doesn't need to be controlled in how you use the horse and as I said before the horse really won't care if she is jumping 40cm against children it will not even register in her mind.


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## LaurenBay (15 February 2018)

I would not consider loaning if you enjoy riding your mare. No Horse sits in a field and wishes they were jumping 1m tracks, so don't feel like you should give the mare up just because the loaner does more with her. Your mare will be equally happy jumping the smaller tracks and hacking 

I would not be happy if a sharer text me and told me not to ride unless they were there. Very cheeky and your sharer needs to remember the Horse is not hers and she follows your rules.


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## Psych (15 February 2018)

Always-Riding said:



			What I will say is, that you should also consider if your horse is suitable to being a gentle hack/light schooling, even with reduced fitness, or whether she actually thrives on the type of work your sharer does with her.
.
		
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I honestly dont know. I know she loves the buzz of competition but thats more to do with liking the atmosphere than the level, as happy in an showing class as a jumping, as happy with my baby jumps as in a ODE

She definitely loves going fast xc, I think shed be happiest going back hunting - but I dont think shes unhappy in any of her work  either. (As far as I can tell!) She doesnt enjoy her flat schooling as much, but then once she gets whats going on and gets into it shes fine.


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## ester (15 February 2018)

Psych said:



			I feel the sharer is almost restricting access, asking me not to ride unless she&#8217;s there, etc. I know I&#8217;m not great but I know my limits and I can tell if the mare is  getting fizzy and when to call a stop. I find she&#8217;s fine with just hanging out together, I can take her xc and I can take her away and walk while everyone else flys off - where she gets hot is when she thinks we&#8217;re going for it - so if she&#8217;s in the group that&#8217;s galloping, she wants to be in front! So at least I know most of the trouble spots..
		
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If this is the case she gets told to wind her neck in or the share ends. She sounds a lovely horse so if you really need a sharer I am sure you could find a less problematic alternative. 

Re. the tensing, a lot of us do it, I was thinking whether some NLP or something might help?


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## Ambers Echo (15 February 2018)

Can I just ask why you are loaning her at all? If you are wanting someone to help you develop her then fine - if she's green that is a good idea. But what are you developing her for? If you want a happy hacker/ RC horse then her education should be geared around that and not around producing her for competition. It does not matter how good she is at jumping if you don't want to jump her over the bigger tracks.

Your YO may have suggester a more experienced loaner to help you but it is not helpful if they are taking the horse in a direction you don't want to go.

I am sure most horses would be more than happy with a pleasure ride/ RC life! Horses don't have a concept of being 'wasted'.


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## Always-Riding (15 February 2018)

Psych said:



			I honestly don&#8217;t know. I know she loves the buzz of competition but that&#8217;s more to do with liking the atmosphere than the level, as happy in an showing class as a jumping, as happy with my baby jumps as in a ODE

She definitely loves going fast xc, I think she&#8217;d be happiest going back hunting - but I don&#8217;t think she&#8217;s unhappy in any of her work  either. (As far as I can tell!) She doesn&#8217;t enjoy her flat schooling as much, but then once she gets what&#8217;s going on and gets into it she&#8217;s fine.
		
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I think, as others have suggested, you need to sit down with your YO and sharer. I would use it to get their opinion on the situation - it's very well us giving you advice but we don't know your horse or your riding ability. Let them know exactly how you feel and see what you can all come up with. 

How did you get on with the mare before you got a sharer?


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## KittenInTheTree (15 February 2018)

Your sharer tells you not to ride your horse unless she is present? My gut reaction is to say bin her - the sharer, not the mare, the mare sounds epic - and crack on with enjoying horse ownership at your own pace!


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## Psych (15 February 2018)

Thanks everyone so much. Ive gotten great advice and feel so much better. Going to have proper talk with YO tomorrow and see if the feeling is right that the sharing has gone a bit sideways.  Following on from that Im going to have the tough convo with the sharer about making big changes or (more likely) finishing the share. 
I think the boundaries have just gotten muddled and while in my opinion shes the most super horse ever, realistically she will always be a pet as opposed to a breeding or serious competition prospect so as said upthread, the only point developing her would be to learn together.  
She seems to love our little hacks and small competitions so fingers crossed


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## Psych (15 February 2018)

Always-Riding said:



			How did you get on with the mare before you got a sharer?
		
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Grand! She was always less chill in winter but I thought we were ok! For the first 12 months we were flying, I kept waiting for that honeymoon period to finish and for her to get really cheeky but it really didnt for me. She got a bit full of herself on the yard (wanting to be first in a group, pushing other horses with her bum) but I got that out of her.

Then, of course, I over reached and took her hunting towards the end of the season and it fried her brain. What bugs me is I knew she was hyper as soon as she got to the meet, knew exactly what was happening and dying to be off.  Carried me all the way away from our  nanny to the front - past the master (!)
And instead of realsiing she was at the front and out of friends, set off to ploughing her own path. Three fields later we parted company and I woke up to find her looking down at me as if to say whats wrong? That was fab! 

So while the broken leg was healing, the share started & its been fab until now when I feel its like if have to go through the sharer to ride her? And if Im not aiming to raise my game I shouldnt bother. (Not that I dont want to improve, but Id prefer to do what I do well before I go up a level and Im not in a hurry to do that - work is competive enough, horses are my chill time!)


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## LaurenBay (15 February 2018)

Psych said:



			Grand! She was always less chill in winter but I thought we were ok! For the first 12 months we were flying, I kept waiting for that honeymoon period to finish and for her to get really cheeky but it really didn&#8217;t for me. She got a bit full of herself on the yard (wanting to be first in a group, pushing other horses with her bum) but I got that out of her.

Then, of course, I over reached and took her hunting towards the end of the season and it fried her brain. What bugs me is I knew she was hyper as soon as she got to the meet, knew exactly what was happening and dying to be off.  Carried me all the way away from our &#8220; nanny&#8221; to the front - past the master (!)
And instead of realsiing she was at the front and out of friends, set off to ploughing her own path. Three fields later we parted company and I woke up to find her looking down at me as if to say &#8220;what&#8217;s wrong? That was fab!&#8221; 

So while the broken leg was healing, the share started & it&#8217;s been fab until now when I feel it&#8217;s like if have to go through the sharer to ride her? And if I&#8217;m not aiming to raise my game I shouldn&#8217;t bother. (Not that I don&#8217;t want to improve, but I&#8217;d prefer to do what I do well before I go up a level and I&#8217;m not in a hurry to do that - work is competive enough, horses are my chill time!)
		
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You should not be made to feel like you have got to go through the sharer. It is your Horse and your sharer needs to take a step back. I would keep the sharer but would ask her to do less days so he has a couple of days off during week, I would also say you do not want him to be competed anymore. It might mean she walks away but there are plenty of other sharers out there who would be happy not competing.


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## alainax (15 February 2018)

It&#8217;s supposed to be fun. Ditch the sharer not the horse.


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## Ambers Echo (15 February 2018)

Psych said:



			Grand! She was always less chill in winter but I thought we were ok! For the first 12 months we were flying, I kept waiting for that honeymoon period to finish and for her to get really cheeky but it really didn&#8217;t for me. She got a bit full of herself on the yard (wanting to be first in a group, pushing other horses with her bum) but I got that out of her.

Then, of course, I over reached and took her hunting towards the end of the season and it fried her brain. What bugs me is I knew she was hyper as soon as she got to the meet, knew exactly what was happening and dying to be off.  Carried me all the way away from our &#8220; nanny&#8221; to the front - past the master (!)
And instead of realsiing she was at the front and out of friends, set off to ploughing her own path. Three fields later we parted company and I woke up to find her looking down at me as if to say &#8220;what&#8217;s wrong? That was fab!&#8221; 

So while the broken leg was healing, the share started & it&#8217;s been fab until now when I feel it&#8217;s like if have to go through the sharer to ride her? And if I&#8217;m not aiming to raise my game I shouldn&#8217;t bother. (Not that I don&#8217;t want to improve, but I&#8217;d prefer to do what I do well before I go up a level and I&#8217;m not in a hurry to do that - work is competive enough, horses are my chill time!)
		
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Ouch! Ok well it's a simple enough conversation then = thanks for keeping my horse fit while my leg was healing but I want her back  now!

For what it's worth I would never EVER take Amber hunting! But we are doing ok in taking the scenic route to achieving basic competence and control ..... She is definitely 'wasted' on me but I really don't care. And I'm sure she doesn't either.


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## Pearlsasinger (15 February 2018)

alainax said:



			Its supposed to be fun. Ditch the sharer not the horse.
		
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This, unless you actually need a sharer for either the money or the jobs, now is the time to say "Thank you and Goodbye".  Did the YO find the sharer for you?


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## Mrs B (15 February 2018)

"She seems to love our little hacks and small competitions so fingers crossed."

So, she loves what the pair of you do together, and you love it too. That seems like horsey Nirvana to me! Partnerships like that don't come along very often in life, so hold it close and treasure it.

Stick to your plans and your guns and enjoy your lovely mare - on your own, if needs be.


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## oldie48 (15 February 2018)

Goodness me, you were so brave to take her hunting, I'm a relatively experienced rider now but I have never had anything I could have hunted safely. My present horse is just lovely but I spent the first couple of years pootling round on him, doing basically F all. He didn't mind in the slightest, I suspect he thought he'd entered heaven.  We've had an interesting period, where I am asking more and he's asking Why! If I had had a really competent competitive rider on him from the beginning, we would never have matched up as tbh he would have been just too much horse for me. Four years on, we are a team. Ditch the sharer and do things at your own pace but make sure you have a really good trainer supporting you, you will be amazed at what you can achieve together! Good luck, your horse sounds just lovely!


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## Psych (19 February 2018)

Thanks everyone - talked to yard owner and sharer over the weekend and agreed to put a pin in the sharing and dial back the mares fitness to my level. I think sharer was a bit disappointed but has plenty of other offers from people to develop their horses. Had a lovely hack and she even allowed lots of cuddles (she has weirdly gotten very fond of one of my dogs and is loving hanging out with us at the moment). Roll on the summer!


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## The Fuzzy Furry (19 February 2018)

Psych said:



			Thanks everyone - talked to yard owner and sharer over the weekend and agreed to put a pin in the sharing and dial back the mares fitness to my level. I think sharer was a bit disappointed but has plenty of other offers from people to develop their horses. Had a lovely hack and she even allowed lots of cuddles (she has weirdly gotten very fond of one of my dogs and is loving hanging out with us at the moment). Roll on the summer!
		
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Excellent update


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## splashgirl45 (19 February 2018)

great news, roll on the summer when you can both chill out and have fun,  well done for being brave and standing up for yourself...


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## JDH01 (27 February 2018)

Excellent news that you have had a talk, just remember she is yours and you are paying the bills!


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