# Chaff for Horse with Gastric Ulcers



## SammyDingle (29 May 2013)

Hi, 

This is also posted in Vets 

My boy was diagnosed with ulcers and has been on Gastoguard and Pronutrion for the past 4 weeks. Was re scoped and there has been a massive improvment 

He is currently fed Top spec balancer (Vets instruction) and Safe and Sound. After some research though i have read the chaff i am using isnt the most suitable. I have looked at Dengie Alfa-A Molasses free and Top spec Alfalfa. 
 Can anyone give me any ideas on what i can use?

Just to add its a 16.2hh highly strung TB i am feeding. He holds weigth VERY well. Infact too well 

Thank you x


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## JillA (29 May 2013)

If you are feeding chaff to stop him bolting the rest, how about a small amount of speedybeet instead? Or try and find some real hay chop, without any kind of additives, you could make your own if you have a garden shredder. Alfalfa doesn't agree with some horses but at least it doesn't contain mega sugars. 
I don't know about the so-called molasses free varieties, someone else on here probably does.


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## Silver-Moon (29 May 2013)

Mine can't tolerate anything with alfalfa in it and it also has to be molasses free so I have found a plain straw chaff which seems to be suiting him. 

I did use Northern Crop Growers Graze on Gold blend but they are having production difficulties so I am now using Honeychop unmolassed chopped oat straw.

Hope you find something soon and naglet improves x


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## Ginger Bear (29 May 2013)

I have a tb that holds weight well, he's on hifi molasses free.


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## Pearlsasinger (29 May 2013)

We use the Honeychop plain oat straw, Halley's also make a similar product and we also got some Halley's chopped hay, when we were having trouble getting dried grass.


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## MagicMelon (30 May 2013)

If you google it, there is some suggestion that alfalfa is beneficial for gastric ulcers.  So any pure alfalfa chaff should help I would have thought?  I think Simple Systems does 'pure' alfalfa in the form of nuts which I think you soak so you could try that instead.


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## NeedNewHorse (30 May 2013)

MagicMelon said:



			If you google it, there is some suggestion that alfalfa is beneficial for gastric ulcers.  So any pure alfalfa chaff should help I would have thought?  I think Simple Systems does 'pure' alfalfa in the form of nuts which I think you soak so you could try that instead.
		
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Yes, I have read research somewhere that the calcium in the alfalfa helps to buffer the stomach contents. My mare is going brilliantly on it and I have noticed a huge difference in her and I always, always feed some alfa-a before I ride so she has that in her stomach regardless of being in or out.

I would definitely recommend it and to be honest. I would go for the molasses free version. You don't have to feed lots, just introduce it gradually.


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## SCMSL (30 May 2013)

Yes, alfalfa is the best but make sure you either go with chaff or cubes  - the pellets aren't as good as they don't really stimulate chewing. And chewing produces saliva which neutralizes the acid in the stomach.


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## Spot_the_Risk (30 May 2013)

Dengie Healthy Tummy, specifically for horses with ulcers!


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## Flora (31 May 2013)

I have a TB with ulcers and he is on Top Spec balancer, conditioning cubes and the Top chop and he is doing and looking great on it.


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## Hedwards (31 May 2013)

I used Dengie Healthy Tummy for my ulcer boy (finished his GastroGuard this week - keep your fingers crossed for us!), however when my local feed merchant ran out, I got the Alfa-A Oil... and noticed no difference in him whatsoever... I'm just trialling Dengie Hi-Fi Mollasses free - would mean one feed for both my horses... if it doesnt work for him he'll go back to the alfa-a oil... however, so far so good! He is a TB... but very laid back, lives out 24/7. I'd also highly recommend the alltech Lifeforce feed supplement for any horse prone to ulcers, works really well for my boy, and his coat/feet etc. have all improved since he's had it too!


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## strides-eventing (31 May 2013)

Dengie Healthy Tummy is alfalfa feed made especially for horses with/susceptible to gastric ulcers in mind. I feed it to my boy and it's been fab so well worth a look! I was also told by vets to steer clear of pony nuts/cubes as when wet they expand and create more surface area for bad bacteria for ulcers to form in the stomach (apparently) so have been told to use a coarse mix. That said its worth considering cereals can increase the acidity of the stomach and therefore increase the risk of an ulcer occurring. 

Hope this helps, but dengie healthy tummy has a majorly big vote from me!


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## bandit87 (31 May 2013)

concentrates (hard feed i.e balancer, mix, whatever) is broken down in the small intestine, fibre eg chaff is fermented in the hindgut. when concentrates are fed with fibre, this causes the concentrates to bypass the small intestine and end up being fermented, however, this causes a great influx of acid and also destroys gram negative bacteria, which causes gram positive bacteria to flourish and cause imbalance of the hindgut. as the horse has ulcers, feeding chaff with your concentrates will only cause more with the influx of acid to the hindgut...
unfortunately, i cant spout out a random brand of chaff and say its good because 'thats what i feed mine', i prefer to consult peer reviewed papers which is far more informing


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## bandit87 (31 May 2013)

and dont forget, feed companies prime motive is to sell you any old ***** that the market to all types of horses. dont be fooled about what is says on the tin!


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## Goldenstar (31 May 2013)

Alfalfa is high in calcium which is why vets recommend it for horses who are ulcer prone .
Giving alfalfa mixed with a little oil before work can help with preventing the splash type ulcers .


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## morrismob (31 May 2013)

bandit87 said:



			concentrates (hard feed i.e balancer, mix, whatever) is broken down in the small intestine, fibre eg chaff is fermented in the hindgut. when concentrates are fed with fibre, this causes the concentrates to bypass the small intestine and end up being fermented, however, this causes a great influx of acid and also destroys gram negative bacteria, which causes gram positive bacteria to flourish and cause imbalance of the hindgut. as the horse has ulcers, feeding chaff with your concentrates will only cause more with the influx of acid to the hindgut...
unfortunately, i cant spout out a random brand of chaff and say its good because 'thats what i feed mine', i prefer to consult peer reviewed papers which is far more informing
		
Click to expand...

very interesting. I feed a high fibre diet but add top spec cool balancer to it so should I feed the balancer by itself ? Sorry might be a numpty question but I didn't know the above.


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## bandit87 (1 June 2013)

Goldenstar said:



			Alfalfa is high in calcium which is why vets recommend it for horses who are ulcer prone .
Giving alfalfa mixed with a little oil before work can help with preventing the splash type ulcers .
		
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that makes sense, but notice how there are no concentrates in the feed, which is why it is complementary to the GI tract


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## bandit87 (1 June 2013)

morrismob said:



			very interesting. I feed a high fibre diet but add top spec cool balancer to it so should I feed the balancer by itself ? Sorry might be a numpty question but I didn't know the above.

Click to expand...

yes, for the wellbeing of the GI tract, feeding your balancer seperate to your forage will allow th balancer to be broken down in the small intestine and then any subsequent forage injested will  then bypass the small intestine and be fermented in the hindgut, without escorting your balancer with it. i dont know if your horse is a feed bolter or not, but it requires some serious feed bolting with fairly large feeds to be able to choke on them!!!
feed companies are always happy to take your money wthout fully informing you on whats being sold, its horrifying! but if the can sell you a tenners worth of chop with your 12 quid mix, then its all good for them!!!


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## TwoStroke (1 June 2013)

Sorry bandit, but that sounds rather suspect to me. Can you link any references to support the idea that feeding fibre with starch causes all the starch to get into the hindgut?

Imo that's rubbish - horses eat fibre constantly in the form of grass/hay. The idea that you have to withhold fibre when feeding starch is crazy. Starch will be digested in the small intestine so long as its fed in small amounts (ie no more that 1g per 1kg of body weight). This is true regardless of whether the horse has also scoffed some fibre, be that chaff, grass or hay. Indeed, ALL concentrate feed will contain some measure of fibre, so it's impossible to separate them entirely.


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## whizzer (1 June 2013)

I use dried grass(graze on) or spillers conditioning chaff. Horse is a very poor doer,can't cope with alfalfa as it sends him nuts & is very fussy so point blank refused to even look at the hi-fi unmollassed stuff! I use the dried grass in winter in his feed & some in a seperate bucket as well for him to pick at. He needs something a bit more tempting in the summer so has the spillers stuff then.


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## Tnavas (1 June 2013)

NeedNewHorse said:



			Yes, I have read research somewhere that the calcium in the alfalfa helps to buffer the stomach contents. My mare is going brilliantly on it and I have noticed a huge difference in her and I always, always feed some alfa-a before I ride so she has that in her stomach regardless of being in or out.

I would definitely recommend it and to be honest. I would go for the molasses free version. You don't have to feed lots, just introduce it gradually.
		
Click to expand...

Was just about to write the same thing. It's not actually the Lucerne that helps the ulcers but the level of calcium in it.

You can do the same by adding ground limestone to the feed at a fraction of the price.


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