# Pulls like a ****** train!!



## arlosmum (3 April 2011)

Hi, can anyone help? I've got a 5 year old Springer Spaniel dog. He came from Springer Rescue (thereby hangs a tale) when he was 18 months old, and entire. We neutered him straightaway. We love him to bits, he's not going anywhere, but, and it's a big but, he's a nightmare to walk. 
(I've got 2 Springers actually, but the bitch is 12 years old & an absolute angel)
Back to Wightly ( I know, let's not go there). When he's walked on a lead, he pulls like a train, and then, when he sees something( like a leaf, or a bit of mud) he lunges at it. Both my arms and shoulders are knackered, and its starting to affect me riding!!
I've tried him in one of those harnesses that go around their middle, and the lead is attached in the middle of his back, rubbish, didn't work. He just 'set' himself against it, and pulled.
I then tried a Halti, rubbish, he scratched it off the end of his nose in seconds.
A pet shop owner then recommended the Gentle Leader, after I went, in desperation, to buy a metal choke collar (puts tin hat on!).
He, again, just 'sets' himself against it (the Gentle Leader)
 and pulls. OK, not with the same strength as with a 'normal ' collar & lead, but still a pain in the backside (and shoulders & arms!!)
He's walked a minimum of an hour a day, as I work 3 days a week. On the other 4 days it's nearer 2 hours a day, my girly only comes out once a day with us now, but it makes no difference whether she's with us, or not.
Can anyone suggest a collar, or lead, or combination, that would give me more control?
Thanks


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## Alec Swan (3 April 2011)

A slack lead,  and the outside of your left foot.  

Alec.


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## MurphysMinder (3 April 2011)

Not surprised the harness didn't work, they are after all used to help huskies to pull!
Did you actually get the choke chain or did the pet shop talk you out of it, I have no problem with using a large link choke chain, used correctly, i.e. high on the dogs neck not round its shoulders, it has made many an errant dog of mine listen (can I borrow your tin hat).  Coupled with Alec's advice, you may well see an improvement.
Otherwise, I have found a Gencon headcollar pretty good, similar design to halti etc but the control is from behind the ear rather than turning the muzzle.  Evie didn't like hers at first, the beginning of every walk involved her scraping her nose along the floor for several yards, but I just kept walking and eventually she decided she may as well walk normally and preserve the skin on her nose.
If you have the time, once you have got him listening to you a bit, when you are walking every time he pulls change direction, right, left or even a sharp about turn, he will hopefully realise that he actually needs to concentrate on you if he want to know where the heck you are going.  You will of course have to put up with any passers by thinking you have totally lost your marbles.


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## arlosmum (3 April 2011)

Alec - good advice, thanks. Although the git has legged me up twice when I've done this.!!
Murphy's Minder - I didn't buy the choke collar (wish I had) I may buy one, but will certainly look at the Gencon collar. Sometimes I feel like driving the car slowly with the dog running alongside on the end on a long line!!
Fortunately it's very remote where we live ( on a sheep farm so don't let him off the lead at home) so no passers by to look at us funny!!


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## Dobiegirl (3 April 2011)

My  male Dobe is on restricted lead exercise at the moment and I have him in a Canny Collar it dosnt stop him pulling but its giving my back a rest as I wouldnt be able to hold him in a half choke.

If you google Canny Collar the site has a video of how to use it and Im sure you will be impressed. They are not cheap but you can get them on ebay cheaper.

Hopefully my vet will tell me tomorrow he can now go off lead.


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## MyBoyChe (3 April 2011)

I have a similar issue with my 1yr old springer girl.  Following advice on here from several folk (thanks to them if theyre reading this) I am currently trying a half check on Chloe.  Whilst not perfect yet, she is so much better with this and a longish lead. We are working on walking with a slack lead, when she pulls I am able to bring her back to me with minimal fuss and no achey shoulders.


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## EAST KENT (3 April 2011)

Nothing wrong with a correctly used check chain,I also use the Cesar sideways foot nudge,it does make them clock in and listen.You can also get various training aids from JohnHumphries products for working dogs,one I call a grot collar sits up behind the ears and is thin cord,excellent fopr stubborn cases.


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## soloabe (3 April 2011)

I wouldn't use a choke chain unless you dog actually fully understands the heel command. You can't punish a dog for what it doesn't know.

I much prefer this method.
http://ahimsadogtraining.com/blog/2008/10/12/silky-leash/


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## Vizslak (3 April 2011)

I wanted to pull my own hair out just watching a 5 min video of that training method!! 5 or 6 half hour sessions of that???? My word, you have far far more patience than me to train your dogs like that!


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## MurphysMinder (3 April 2011)

LOL have to agree with you there.  I'd also have a very fat dog the amount of treats that seemed to be given, but fair enough if it works for some.


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## SecretSquirrell379 (3 April 2011)

Our trainer recommends these http://www.k9bridle.com/ she says they are brilliant and you do not need to use them for long. A couple of the dogs in our class has used them and they do make a difference.

We are lucky with Pickle that she does listen to a half halt, occasionally a very quick and strong half halt  but it does work. Very difficult I know but if they pull and you pull back its just an awful viscous circle  Good luck, I hope some of these suggestions help xx


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## Cinnamontoast (3 April 2011)

I'm likng the look of the bridle thing-was just wondering if i could get another attachment point for the harnesses we have and that appears to be it-overkill but i hate the helpless feeling on walks and stressing the dogs.

Two of my three springers are on lead walks currently. The canny collars are helping loads, although Zak's continued belief that he is in fact a cat is often borne out by his crap behaviour on the lead.

On the road wals, the Easy Walk harness is stunning: the lead attaches to a ring on the front of the chest so the dog is turned back towards you, thereby giving you total control. (Honest, this thing is a ruddy miracle but not in the woods where they are used to running). It's also nice cos you're not yanking, choking the dog etc. We got the medium and you measure the dog's girth for the size. Amazon has good deals.

How refreshing to see that people don't think Cesar Milan is a devil! We use the sideways nudge, works well sometimes as they've no idea where the nudge has come from. I also use the Cesar shh noise-it works on Brig and he correctly interprets it almost 100% of the time. There again, I can stamp my foot and he swerves back to heel/stop/halt. I hope the pups get that good eventually (I can dream)


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## soloabe (3 April 2011)

Vizslak said:



			I wanted to pull my own hair out just watching a 5 min video of that training method!! 5 or 6 half hour sessions of that???? My word, you have far far more patience than me to train your dogs like that! 

Click to expand...

We generally go 3-4 5 minute sessions a day and that works well.

I'm not into causing discomfort to my dog because i'm lazy or lack patience so turn to aversives.


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## Vizslak (3 April 2011)

I would write an informed and reasoned reply to that....but I'm too lazy


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## jasmine (3 April 2011)

Apologies for hijacking, but ive tried the K9 bridle, halti and canny collar, Isabel can slip them all.  (The k9 bridle in less than 3 seconds) . Ive tried the nudge with my foot as well..... no response or an evil glare


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## CAYLA (3 April 2011)

The clicker traning thing is fine if you have ALOT of time and maybe one dog to manage.
I think I told the owners I deal with, i.e wanting to hand a dog over to rescue (cos they where fed up and wanted shot) training to "watch that vid" the would most certainly phone back the next day and say "I watched, now can u take the dog in" same goes for the owners who want help, they want things made better yesterday when at the end of their teather, or again we are looking at rehoming the dog.
Or maybe the example of the girl today who I worked with who was avoiding walking the dog because he was unmaneagable, his energy was like level ten already, if I has sadi use that method the dog would be going barmy (adult dog) too not a pup like in the vid.
I used the halti (I would usually use a check chain). she said she could not as he was clawing at it (it took me one walk round a field) 10-15mins to stop it and have the dog walking perfect. I then let her walk him, she donated £75 to the rescue when I got home an checked pay pal
I also stopped it jumping up at folk coming in the house so the donation was that aswell bargain. (but then  really should charge) yes MM im soft there too
Must say I could never do the clicker thing, I would never have the time with the amount I deal with, but if you have the one dog and lots of time and dont mind being pulled in between till it's trained) then go for it.

OP, I would say if you dont want the clicker method which is an option then stick with the halti, or if you want to use the check chain, nothing wrong with that (if you use it correctly) it should take no more than 1 walk to sort the pulling.
Some people like a more disciplined method.

I would imagine it's thats wifes job to do that and many others simply would not have the time, and as MM suggests that would def have to be ya dogs meal otherwise it would be a porker.
Might have been nice to see the end product and her filmed to the end and then we seen the dog for a walk.


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## CAYLA (3 April 2011)

jasmine said:



			Apologies for hijacking, but ive tried the K9 bridle, halti and canny collar, Isabel can slip them all.  (The k9 bridle in less than 3 seconds) . Ive tried the nudge with my foot as well..... no response or an evil glare 

Click to expand...

How does she slip them, rubbing them off? (as in halti) ?


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## CAYLA (3 April 2011)

Vizslak said:



			I would write an informed and reasoned reply to that....but I'm too lazy 

Click to expand...


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## jasmine (3 April 2011)

CAYLA said:



			How does she slip them, rubbing them off? (as in halti) ?
		
Click to expand...

She hooks her paw under it, the canny collar lasted about 10 minutes before she got it off, she walks on 3 legs till its off


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## henryhorn (3 April 2011)

I use a horse leadrope the flat tape sort and fasten the catch as usual to the collar, then use the loop over my GR nose threaded back through the collar, it means you have to hold the middle of the lead (I also have a great lead with a sliding loop I find easier) but it works. 
Using the halti or similar is just determination, when he gets it off you put it back!
The bad news is in the days when I did competion obedience, all the top Champ dogs always entered the show towing their owners full pelt...!


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## Dobiegirl (3 April 2011)

Jasmine with the Canny Collar if you push the little yellow keeper thingmy bob up  to the back of the snout there is no way they can get it off.

Sorry about the techno info


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## CAYLA (3 April 2011)

jasmine said:



			She hooks her paw under it, the canny collar lasted about 10 minutes before she got it off, she walks on 3 legs till its off 

Click to expand...

This is the problem the lady had today, I use a short lead at first, like the length of a handle (them leads you get that are literally a handle an a clip), they then have to walk so close with head postiond up they cannot claw at the halti.


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## CAYLA (3 April 2011)

henryhorn said:



			I use a horse leadrope the flat tape sort and fasten the catch as usual to the collar, then use the loop over my GR nose threaded back through the collar, it means you have to hold the middle of the lead (I also have a great lead with a sliding loop I find easier) but it works. 
Using the halti or similar is just determination, when he gets it off you put it back!
The bad news is in the days when I did competion obedience, all the top Champ dogs always entered the show towing their owners full pelt...!
		
Click to expand...

Thats te best way to be honest, we also use the slip leads and make them into haltis, but I hold the head up high and wont let them drop the claw/scratch.
Ditto HH, if they do come off (get em back on)  march forward


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## Ravenwood (3 April 2011)

Crikey that would drive me mad - a dog pulling on the lead 

Have you tried the flippy stick trick?   

Cut a nice long flippy stick from the hedge.   Put your dog on his lead (I use a slip lead) and walk him along a solid fence (think tennis court) with him on your inside.  As you are walking along and asking him to "heel" swish the stick side to side so that he cannot walk in front of you.   Obviously you don't actually hit the dog with the stick, just swish it in front of him!

He will eventually learn that it is perfectly safe and acceptable to walk alongside you rather than in front of you.  It gives him a comfort zone.

You may also want to practise a bit of focus.  Put the lead on in the garden and ask him to heel, walk a few steps then turn left, then stop, then turn right, then stop - etc etc - that way he has no idea which way you will go next and has to concentrate on you rather than the smells in front of him 

Good luck - I don't envy you, I couldn't bear a dog that pulls!


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## jasmine (3 April 2011)

Thanks for the advice, will give it a go


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## Cinnamontoast (4 April 2011)

Mine aren't keen on the canny collar but when they paw/try to get it off, they get a quick tug to stop them and if they drop to the ground to try to nudge it off, they get a little yank to make them walk on. I found the trick is to hold the lead up a height so they can't bring their paw up to rub it off and it's too tight anyway if you hold the lead up a bit. It doesn't take them long to realise that it aint coming off. 

With Jakey, demon for being just that touch too far ahead, we would dangle the lead in front of his nose and he learned that this was the signal for keeping slightly back.


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## Goya (4 April 2011)

I've found the canny collar works brilliantly for Monty. You do have to make sure it is correctly fitted though. I like it because it seems to me that he is pulling against himself, rather than me.


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