# Hound killed on a railway



## angrybird1 (2 January 2020)

Just heard that a hound has been killed on a railway.  Trains delayed on a main railway to London.  What on earth are the hunt doing hunting near a railway line?


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## Shay (2 January 2020)

They usually aren't.  No one would deliberately lay a trail close to a rail line.  Sabs like to try to confuse and distract hounds with fake horn calls, spraying the hounds with chemicals etc.  Sometimes they deliberately lead them onto roads and rail lines - sometimes the confused and distressed hounds can't find their way back.  The huntsman and whips do thier best to manage the situation - but sadly tragedies do happen.  I can't see anything reported yet to suggest which hunt this might have been, but if you google it you can see that this has happened before sadly.  We have two lines crossing our hunt country.  We stay well clear. But the sabs don't.


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## ycbm (2 January 2020)

The correct question might be, depending on the hunt, why the trail laid was so weak, and the huntsman not in control of his  hounds, that  hounds followed fox scent onto a railway line.

Weak scent and 'accidents' of hounds picking up fox scent are the ruse being used by some hunts to hunt fox and evade prosecution for it.

It was this event, presumably?  Sabs say they were nowhere nearby, hunt say they were hunting legally. Nobody knows who to believe. Time to ban hunting completely where the Huntsman doesn't know where the trail is laid, perhaps?

https://www.banburyguardian.co.uk/n...y-line-between-leamington-and-banbury-1353104

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## Leo Walker (2 January 2020)

My uncle was master of hounds and he was killed on a railway line back in the very early 80s/late 70s, so its always happened. Although I guess in those days they were hunting fox legally so could end up anywhere.


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## Sandstone1 (2 January 2020)

Yes, that's the incident.   Only one incident in a catalogue from this hunt.
Hounds in gardens graveyards etc


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## Equine_Dream (2 January 2020)

Shay said:



			They usually aren't.  No one would deliberately lay a trail close to a rail line.  Sabs like to try to confuse and distract hounds with fake horn calls, spraying the hounds with chemicals etc.  Sometimes they deliberately lead them onto roads and rail lines - sometimes the confused and distressed hounds can't find their way back.  The huntsman and whips do thier best to manage the situation - but sadly tragedies do happen.  I can't see anything reported yet to suggest which hunt this might have been, but if you google it you can see that this has happened before sadly.  We have two lines crossing our hunt country.  We stay well clear. But the sabs don't.
		
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This. One of our local packs lost a hound on a busy dual carriageway. Sabs called the hounds away from the masters. The poor thing became separated and ended up on the road. It was awful 😥


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## SOS (2 January 2020)

I don’t know the incident and I was not there. However I always question if sabs are out mimicking horn calls and the huntsman is also calling... who is actually hunting the hounds?!

The hunt may well of been hunting illegally however I would expect more than one hound to of escaped onto the railway should this of been the case, after all they hunt as a pack and are rarely alone. Even on a trail hunt this hound may of become separated and made its way onto the railway line. Who really knows bar anyone that was there? We are just speculating.

I’m sure all parties were upset at the death of the hound and it’s a real shame the incident happened.


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## ycbm (2 January 2020)

It wasn't a lone hound on the railway,  it was just one that was killed.  

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## Velcrobum (2 January 2020)

According to local sources there was no hound killed the story came from West Midlands Hunt Saboteurs who may or may not be the origin of a number of stories sent to the press.

I personally am very suspicious of hunt saboteurs having been attacked by some many years ago when I was out hacking.


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## ycbm (2 January 2020)

Well if no hound was killed, it looks like a train was held up and hunt and railway officials were on the track, so pure chance that it wasn't. 








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## Sandstone1 (2 January 2020)

Clearly there were animals on the line.   British transport police have said a hound was killed.


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## palo1 (3 January 2020)

How convenient that the sabs were right there, filming.  No huntsman wants hounds anywhere near rail lines or motorways and there is no need for trails laid over them.  Unfortunately hounds will 'roll' on a scent where they haven't quite got the right line sometimes and they will try hard for quite a while on that poor scent.  Scent is difficult too which is part of the art and the thrill of working hounds.  Very sadly, sabs often don't understand or care about the consequences of their actions where they foil a laid trail or disrupt hounds in any way - hounds will then try, and try again to find a scent and they don't know which one is the one their huntsman wants them to follow.  This sort of incident is suspiciously 'handy' publicity for these sabs who have form in disrupting legal trail hunting and causing exactly these sorts of problems.  What a very sad thing to happen.


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## ycbm (3 January 2020)

It was a passenger on the train who was filming.

Are you suggesting that they have a crystal ball to put a passenger on the train that happened to get stopped?


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## Tiddlypom (3 January 2020)

A passenger filmed the Hunt from within the now stationary train, and passed the footage to the sab group. Here’s a couple of stills.







Quite how how the hunt got so close to the through line will be subject to all sorts of misinformation from both the pro and the anti sides. It’s not clear whether a hound was killed or not, the sabs say that one was killed, but a Hunt spokesperson says that all hounds returned safely to kennels. British Transport Police confirmed that they were called to the incident.


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## ycbm (3 January 2020)

palo1 said:



			Unfortunately hounds will 'roll' on a scent where they haven't quite got the right line sometimes
		
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Which would not be a problem if you laid scent as strong as drag hunts do and the huntsman knew where it was as drag huntsman do.




			and they will try hard for quite a while on that poor scent.
		
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The problem is that the scent of fox is more attractive than the trail, not that the scent they are following is poor. The problem is the laid trail scent is poor and they aren't following that at all.





			Scent is difficult too which is part of the art and the thrill of working hounds.
		
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That art and thrill is resulting in the continuing death of foxes by hounds followed by a pack of horse riders.

Hunts flout the spirit of the law continually, and then put their hands up all innocent and say 'it wasnt illegal'  and are then surprised that the sabs have returned in force.

Until you stop that, you will be sabbed.


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## Sandstone1 (3 January 2020)

That was filmed by a passenger on the train.   It's completely ridiculous to suggest that the sabs caused or orchestrated this.
When will people see that hunts are breaking the law and hunting illegally.
Hounds trespass in people's gardens, chase livestock, block roads and even allow hounds to poo on graves.   How would you feel if they pooed on a relatives grave??
No doubt the sabs are not perfect but they don't cause all this surely?
If the Hunt can't control its hounds they shouldn't be out.
If I went round with a pack of out of control dogs I'd be prosecuted.
They can't just keep blaming everyone else.


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## Sandstone1 (3 January 2020)

palo1 said:



			How convenient that the sabs were right there, filming.  No huntsman wants hounds anywhere near rail lines or motorways and there is no need for trails laid over them.  Unfortunately hounds will 'roll' on a scent where they haven't quite got the right line sometimes and they will try hard for quite a while on that poor scent.  Scent is difficult too which is part of the art and the thrill of working hounds.  Very sadly, sabs often don't understand or care about the consequences of their actions where they foil a laid trail or disrupt hounds in any way - hounds will then try, and try again to find a scent and they don't know which one is the one their huntsman wants them to follow.  This sort of incident is suspiciously 'handy' publicity for these sabs who have form in disrupting legal trail hunting and causing exactly these sorts of problems.  What a very sad thing to happen.
		
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They meet a couple of fields away from the railway line.   What did they think would happen.  Also that was filmed by a passenger on the train.
Dont think the sabs could have arranged that.


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## Sandstone1 (3 January 2020)

Velcrobum said:



			According to local sources there was no hound killed the story came from West Midlands Hunt Saboteurs who may or may not be the origin of a number of stories sent to the press.

I personally am very suspicious of hunt saboteurs having been attacked by some many years ago when I was out hacking.
		
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I don't think any one would suggest that sab s are perfect but can't see how they can be to blame for  arrogance, lack of control and chaos caused by the hunt.    Anyone that thinks they are hunting within the law is deluded.   Like it or not hunting foxes with hounds is illegal and it's time that law was inforced properly.


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## Shay (3 January 2020)

I mentioned this to someone out today and they remidned me that the same sab group posted the same vidoes last year...


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## ycbm (3 January 2020)

Can you point us to them?  This seems to be both a regular occurrence,  that hunt losing control of their hounds,  and a genuine incident of hounds on the line in the last couple of days, for which they have apologised but denied a hound was killed.

https://www.leamingtoncourier.co.uk...ailway-between-leamington-and-banbury-1353477


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## Sandstone1 (3 January 2020)

Its in all.the local papers so don't think it a old story.


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## Tiddlypom (4 January 2020)

I’ve no idea if the videos shown by the sab groups were recycled from a previous incident of Hunt trespass or not, but British Transport Police confirmed that they are looking into the latest case of trespass on a railway line which happened on New Year’s Day 2020, and a hunt spokesman also commented on the incident.

From the above link to the Leamington Courier, report dated 2 Jan 2020.

_Amy Lees of British Transport Police (BTP) said: "Shortly before 1pm on Wednesday January 1 British Transport Police were called to the line between Leamington Spa and Banbury station following a report of a group of trespassers and a dog struck by a train.
"BTP officers attended the scene and are currently investigating the circumstances surrounding the incident."
A spokesman for the hunt said: "Following an incident on January 1, 2020 in which British Transport Police were called, we can confirm that all hounds have returned safely to kennels.
"Any reports that a hound was killed is untrue. The Warwickshire Hunt will cooperate with any further investigation and apologises for any inconvenience caused during this incident.”_

Warwickshire Hunt do seem to be one of the naughty packs.


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