# Excessive Smega Production - Causes?



## missmatch (26 February 2014)

My 5 year old gelding has been having problems with this since September last year, Initially he had an infection which was treated with 3 boxes of Norodine. Then the vets thought it may be a fungal infection which was also treated. Then we realised the bedding he was on was making it worse, this was changed. Two weeks ago it needed cleaning again, vet assumed this was because he had diarrhoea. Yesterday, vet needed to come out again to clean it as it was so swollen and sore he was unwilling to pee. Nobody knows whats wrong with him. Since September hes had 12 sheath cleans all under sedation. Hes on danillon now to bring down the swelling and vet back out next week.

Has anyone any ideas as to what would be causing this? It is an excessive amount produced and the smell is horrific. Hes grumpy and uncomfortable and I am worried the insurance will run out before we find an answer. There must be a reason this is happening. Thank you


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## Jay89 (26 February 2014)

Have you tried natural yoghurt up his sheath for a few days. Sounds like he's had a lot of antibiotics and cleaning. Maybe the natural bacteria in his sheath is not what it should be.


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## Goldenstar (26 February 2014)

Is he overwieght ?


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## missmatch (26 February 2014)

Jay89 said:



			Have you tried natural yoghurt up his sheath for a few days. Sounds like he's had a lot of antibiotics and cleaning. Maybe the natural bacteria in his sheath is not what it should be.
		
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He had the Newmarket sheath broth after his first lot of treatments to rebalance everything. Shall ask about natural yogurt, Thank you


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## missmatch (26 February 2014)

Goldenstar said:



			Is he overwieght ?
		
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Apparently not! Hes a round, shortbacked pony but vets are happy with his weight. When this started in September he was the thinnest and fittest he had ever been


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## applecart14 (26 February 2014)

missmatch said:



			My 5 year old gelding has been having problems with this since September last year, Initially he had an infection which was treated with 3 boxes of Norodine. Then the vets thought it may be a fungal infection which was also treated. Then we realised the bedding he was on was making it worse, this was changed. Two weeks ago it needed cleaning again, vet assumed this was because he had diarrhoea. Yesterday, vet needed to come out again to clean it as it was so swollen and sore he was unwilling to pee. Nobody knows whats wrong with him. Since September hes had 12 sheath cleans all under sedation. Hes on danillon now to bring down the swelling and vet back out next week.

Has anyone any ideas as to what would be causing this? It is an excessive amount produced and the smell is horrific. Hes grumpy and uncomfortable and I am worried the insurance will run out before we find an answer. There must be a reason this is happening. Thank you
		
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I had my vet out yesterday to my horse about another problem and whilst discussing the horse told him my horse had been staining his thighs really badly for about three weeks following his 'bean' removal. 'Beans' are large pieces made up of smegma also made up with dead skin cells, smegma, dust, shavings and dirt!  They gather next to the horses ureatha in his penis and can supposedly change the way the horse moves if they are large enough.  Bailey's was a huge bean!  The vet was very impressed saying it was the largest he had ever seen!

I must admit when I have seen him ridden since then he has been moving exceptionally well - hardly suprising really, it must have been extremely uncomfortable for him.


The vet said the bean removal (although he had only used a very, very mild solution of hibiscrub and warm water) had altered his PH balance which had produced the excess sticky tar like substance that had coated his thighs.


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## Fat_Pony (26 February 2014)

How do you sort the sticky tar?


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## missmatch (26 February 2014)

I use baby shampoo and sponges from the £ shop. They have normal sponge on the bottom and a rougher top - Will see can I find one like it to show you.

Kind of like this: http://www.superdrug.com/superdrug-round-massage-sponge/invt/257516&bklist=


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## katpower (27 February 2014)

How's his gut health? I've noticed that a lot of horses with impaired health in other areas also have mucky sheaths. History of frequent colicking, ulcers etc often seem to go hand in hand with unhealthy sheaths. You could try giving him probiotics orally for a course or two, and see if they make a difference.

What are you cleaning his sheath with? I only ever use water, water-based lubricant, and a soft cloth. Anything else can damage beneficial bacteria (not that it sounds like he has many of those).

Something I've considered, but never trialled, is the possible replacement of healthy sheath flora. Occasionally, people/animals with severely impaired gut health are given a shot of poo from a healthy sample, to introduce a new population of good flora. I have wondered if his might be possible with sheath health. Perhaps if a very healthy horse was given a clean with a cloth, and after giving the unhealthy horse's sheath a good clean, the impregnated cloth was introduced to the sheath (crude method) - or if you know a helpful scientist, you could culture the good bacteria in a lab then introduce to the sheath (fancier method)... very speculative!

In any of his sheath cleans, has anything ever been found (apart from loads of gross smegma) that seems anomalous? Any lumps, bumps, foreign matter or objects? Have you cleaned right up inside, to the very back of the sheath where the willy attaches to the abdomen?

P.S. I am a semi-professional willy washer in Australia - I spend way too much time fondling horse wangs...


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## missmatch (27 February 2014)

katpower, funnily enough hes had terrible digestive issues, When I bought him he was diagnosed with colitis after multiple colics and in January he had a mass emergence of red worm which caused diarrhoea. He has been on vet probiotic powder since January and Myoplast as well. The vets clean it with just warm water and ky jelly, as do I, hes never had anything else up there. 

The Newmarket sheath broth is a very expensive bottle of good and bad bacteria which was put in there 4 days in a row by the vets, to rebalance everything.

The only anomaly ever seen were like tears to the sheath wall, higher up the cavity. Its just a huge amount of smegma build up within a week, enough to make him really uncomfortable

How do you list semi professional willy washer on your cv? Must raise a few eyebrows!! I must admit I do most of the geldings on the yard now ...... New career choice???


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## katpower (27 February 2014)

missmatch said:



			How do you list semi professional willy washer on your cv? Must raise a few eyebrows!! I must admit I do most of the geldings on the yard now ...... New career choice??? 

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It's my secret identity  I have a "real job" during the week, and they don't know about my weekend job!

Have you had any natural-therapy types look at him? We have a marvellous equine acupuncturist/Chinese herbal dude over here, who's done wonders with horses with all sorts of problems. He's a big fan of aloe juice for horses with ulcers, which can be hard to diagnose sometimes except by treating - something else to consider...

I wonder what those tears are all about? I wonder if they're a factor?

What feeds is he on? Can you try cutting out all sugars?


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## missmatch (27 February 2014)

You really need a super hero costume for your weekend job :-D

No natural therapists but someone has recommended Immunal so may give that a go. It cant be anymore expensive then what hes on now.

No idea on the tears the vet had never seen them and swabs were clear.

Top spec lite balancer and topchop lite, so very little sugars. I know sugar affects him quite badly and makes him very itchy. He also has sweet itch x


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## Micky (27 February 2014)

Try adding a tbsp of natural yogurt to his feed for a good few weeks to help balance his gut again, cheap and works. If it doesnt it wil not do him any harm in long run...


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## lizbet (28 February 2014)

Are there any pink patches inside the sheath if so i would consider a biospy.It is a simple procedure and worth doing.Also  anything irregular on penis to biopsy.Mine had vitilgo and benign papallomas.These can turn into problems if not looked after .we monitor them.Clean sheath with 5inch strips cotton wool worm water and get into folds of sheath for good cleaning once a month.Never anything else up there cloths sponges etc some come with cleaning product on them.Good luck


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## soloequestrian (28 February 2014)

I know he's only young, but it might be worth testing for Cushings.  My older gelding had no sheath issues for years, but for about the last four he will get swollen and sore relatively quickly, and he also has Cushings.  There may be no connection of course, it might just be age.  I make sure I clean him about once per week and I don't use any water or anything - just remove any smegma by hand.  If he were getting like yours, I would be doing this daily if he'd let me.  I've noticed since doing this that his sheath is always cool to the touch and smaller than it used to be, so it seems with him that even a very small smegma build up has an effect, so perhaps yours just has some sort of vicious circle effect - the sheath is never clean enough for long enough to recover.  I would be very wary of biopsy - mine had some skin samples taken for another condition and it was a horrible procedure.


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## charliejet (28 February 2014)

I know your horse is only young but dont rule out metabolic issues as they can cause this.  Cushings is something to bear in mind, they often test negative in the early years as well, the tests are not reliable enough yet.


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## lizbet (28 February 2014)

Sorry to disagree with someone on hear but if a biopsy is required then it should be done. There can be various nasty cancers in the sheath and penis.Also benign conditions.I did not have a bad experiance with having a biopsy done sorry someone did.Your vet will know if it needs to be done.They dont usually biopsy if not necessary. I can definatley relate to Ems chushings conection and sheath problems.We can only go off our own experiances.


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## soloequestrian (28 February 2014)

lizbet said:



			Sorry to disagree with someone on hear but if a biopsy is required then it should be done. There can be various nasty cancers in the sheath and penis.Also benign conditions.I did not have a bad experiance with having a biopsy done sorry someone did.Your vet will know if it needs to be done.They dont usually biopsy if not necessary. I can definatley relate to Ems chushings conection and sheath problems.We can only go off our own experiances.
		
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Um, I didn't say don't do it - I said 'be wary'.  You made it sound like something that should be done as routine, and my experience of it was that it was extremely unpleasant and then the wounds didn't heal well.  My vet didn't warn me about how horrible the whole thing would be, and I now wish I hadn't had it done and had just treated the condition according to what was suspected, rather than have a very traumatic confirmation.


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## lizbet (28 February 2014)

soloequestrian said:



			Um, I didn't say don't do it - I said 'be wary'.  You made it sound like something that should be done as routine, and my experience of it was that it was extremely unpleasant and then the wounds didn't heal well.  My vet didn't warn me about how horrible the whole thing would be, and I now wish I hadn't had it done and had just treated the condition according to what was suspected, rather than have a very traumatic confirmation.
		
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  pls calm down  and read again x


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## shergar (1 March 2014)

I would feed the supplement ECHINACEA to boost the immune system,we always use it when horses are unwell,if you Google sheath cleaning horses ,that page will come up with lots of pictures,that you can click on,one is a gloved hand holding a bean the size of an egg ,that was removed from way up inside the sheath,may be your horse is over producing to try and remove  a high up bean,that would account for the red marks.


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## jojo5 (3 March 2014)

Just wanted to echo lizbet's word of warning. My lad, who has always produced a fair amount of 'gunk' had two tiny white patches on his penis, which turned out to be squamous cell carcinoma, resulting in resection of much of his penis. I really really don't want to cause any worry or panic - just saying keep an eye out - there may have been no connection between smegma production and this but just saying ..........


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## missmatch (3 March 2014)

Just to update: He is going over to the equine hospital tomorrow. It is very swollen, sore and the swelling is coming down into his belly. Enough is enough. Fingers crossed its nothing serious x


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## lizbet (3 March 2014)

jojo5 said:



			Just wanted to echo lizbet's word of warning. My lad, who has always produced a fair amount of 'gunk' had two tiny white patches on his penis, which turned out to be squamous cell carcinoma, resulting in resection of much of his penis. I really really don't want to cause any worry or panic - just saying keep an eye out - there may have been no connection between smegma production and this but just saying ..........
		
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  this unfotunatley is very common. Some are cancer and often overlooked.my horse did not have it but had the type that can turn into cancer if not monitored.Penis amputation seems to be quiet common.Please dont worry because it can also be anything.Getting a good diagnois is key.Also a chushings and Ems test is a good idea.Good luck with your horse this is worst case scenario and no one is suggesting it applies to you .They also cope extremley well from the many horses i have seen with it.


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## katpower (4 March 2014)

Good luck for you and your boy xxx
Please keep us updated - I find it very valuable to add to my pool of willy knowledge - and that then can be valuable to my clients!


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## twiggy2 (4 March 2014)

have the vets taken a swab to rules out bugs and infections, repeated courses of antibiotics will not be having a good effect on his gut and he may need a specific one rather than repeated random courses


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## missmatch (4 March 2014)

twiggy2 said:



			have the vets taken a swab to rules out bugs and infections, repeated courses of antibiotics will not be having a good effect on his gut and he may need a specific one rather than repeated random courses
		
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His initial swabs in Sept showed an infection which was treated with norodine. That is all the antibiotics he has had. I am hoping that today the vets will do more other than just clean it in the hope that an answer can be found. Shall update later. Thank you.


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## HappyHooves (4 March 2014)

Fingers crossed and Wishing you the best of luck- been there, done that with my lad!


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## twiggy2 (4 March 2014)

good luck X


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## Flummoxed (4 March 2014)

Sorry to hear about your horse's problem and hope the vet's get to the root of the problem and he soon feels better. Must confess that I read your thread because I have a mucky gelding. There are some interesting suggestions on here.


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## lizbet (5 March 2014)

Hi any news yet .out of interest read Dannilon v metacam people have been having reactions. Swelling sheaths and bellies. HOPE ALL IS WELL.


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## missmatch (7 March 2014)

Sorry for the delay in updating and Thank you for the pm reminder. He went to the hospital and I genuinely dont feel like anything was achieved. The vets have said everything is down to larval cyathostomosis, but, this doesnt sit well with me. When this started over 6 months ago, there was no indication of any red worm problems. That began in January. He is to be worked, get some weight off him and see how he goes. Bloods taken have shown anaemia now - he is on a supplement for this. He has never been anaemic before. His sheath is still swollen, the swelling is still into his belly and it feels horrible lumpy. Hes also very grumpy about it now. I wish I could update with a diagnosis or at least a way forward but I am no nearer than I was. He is still getting bouts of horrible diarrhoea too.


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## lizbet (7 March 2014)

So frustrating.Could be lot worse i suppose. Keep pushing if your not happy you know your horse the best.wishing you the best.keep us all informed.It would seem quiet a few are following his progress.x


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## shergar (8 March 2014)

Anaemia is always secondary to some thing else blood loss, worms ,ulcers ,diet ,    ect,  have look on Google.                                                                                     
Fingers crossed you find the cause ,he sounds very special .


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## katpower (10 March 2014)

I suspect he has something really not right going on his gut, and the sheath is secondary to that. 
Could you put him on a course of ulcer treatment, just to see if there's any improvement at all?


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## kellyb (21 May 2020)

I realise this was a very long time ago but curious to know what the outcome was for this boy?


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