# Yearling filly in foal. Help needed.



## TheTrotter. (20 July 2013)

Hello, a friend of mine recently purchased a yearling filly, had her around a month now, and her previous owner let her run with a stallion since weaning, so is definatly in foal. 
I know this is not common practice, but I understand it does happen. 
Can anybody offer me any advice on what extra things we should do with her? Feeding, management etc... 
Me and my friend have no experiance in breeding so would like all the advice we can get in ensuring the filly and the foal inside are as healthy as possible.. 
Thankyou.


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## Maesfen (20 July 2013)

How do you KNOW it's in foal; have you had her tested?  If you haven't then that is a priority to have done by a decent equine repro vet (no dearer than any other just more experienced with all things breeding.  If you give us your locality someone will probably be able to recommend one)

It might not be too late to abort any foetus and from preference that is certainly what I would do to give the filly every chance to grow on easily and properly.

Until you have her tested there is no way for knowing for sure and only then can you make a decision as to what you have to do.  Come back and let us know when she's been tested as there is still time to alter things if it's done early enough.


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## TheTrotter. (20 July 2013)

Our vet has checked her, she is definatly in foal. Possibly around 2months gone, going to get a second opinion, but he seemed pretty sure!


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## bonny (20 July 2013)

What checks did he do ?


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## sallyf (20 July 2013)

If shes only around 2 months in foal it would be pretty easy to abort her at this point in time without any serious consequences.
It may take more than 1 prostaglandin injection to do it though but then they are only around £7 each.
I certainly wouldn't be letting her carry the pregnancy on


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## TheTrotter. (20 July 2013)

Ultrasound, so he is certain she is in foal.


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## Maesfen (20 July 2013)

sallyf said:



			If shes only around 2 months in foal it would be pretty easy to abort her at this point in time without any serious consequences.
It may take more than 1 prostaglandin injection to do it though but then they are only around £7 each.
I certainly wouldn't be letting her carry the pregnancy on
		
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Absolutely agree with Sally.


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## Capriole (20 July 2013)

Another that would rather she wasn't put through a pregnancy here, at her young age.  If she was mine I would be speaking to my vet about aborting the foal.


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## bonny (20 July 2013)

I'm guessing that your friend bought her thinking she was in foal seeing as she checked so soon after buying her and before anything can have shown ? So presumably she wants her to have the foal ? How big and how old is she ?


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## TheTrotter. (20 July 2013)

bonny said:



			I'm guessing that your friend bought her thinking she was in foal seeing as she checked so soon after buying her and before anything can have shown ? So presumably she wants her to have the foal ? How big and how old is she ?
		
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Yes, she knew she was/possibly in foal when she bought her.. 
She doesn't want to have the foal, but after speaking to the vet, simply aborting the foetus is not possible, if it was possible it would have been done.. 
Filly is about 11hh, a heinz 57 really, and is a year and 3months old, so will foal next year.


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## bonny (20 July 2013)

TheTrotter. said:



			Yes, she knew she was/possibly in foal when she bought her.. 
She doesn't want to have the foal, but after speaking to the vet, simply aborting the foetus is not possible, if it was possible it would have been done.. 
Filly is about 11hh, a heinz 57 really, and is a year and 3months old, so will foal next year.
		
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Bit late now but I have to ask why your friend bought her ?


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## TheTrotter. (20 July 2013)

bonny said:



			Bit late now but I have to ask why your friend bought her ?
		
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A pity buy really, she didn't actually think there was much of a chance of her being in foal, being so young.


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## twiggy2 (20 July 2013)

if your friend had the vet out and he scanned her surely he would have given care advice?

if not he/she is the person to ask.

i have no experience of breeding but would have thought that such a lengthy pregnancy would be fine to abort at 2 months. was there a reason why this is not so ?


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## TheTrotter. (20 July 2013)

All I was asked, was to post on here asking for advice on how to manage the mare. 

I do not have any control on whether the owner aborts the pregnancy, all I know is that she has told me it simply is not possible. 

If anybody does have any advice it would be greatly appreciated, as this is a owner who does not have any experiance breeding, let along a yearling..


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## bonny (20 July 2013)

TheTrotter. said:



			All I was asked, was to post on here asking for advice on how to manage the mare. 

I do not have any control on whether the owner aborts the pregnancy, all I know is that she has told me it simply is not possible. 

If anybody does have any advice it would be greatly appreciated, as this is a owner who does not have any experiance breeding, let along a yearling..
		
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Don't really know what you expect people to advise, it all sounds very irresponsible but I guess if she's continuing with the pregnancy then all she can do is treat her as any other pregnant mare and hope for the best.....


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## Maesfen (20 July 2013)

I think that is probably your friend deciding SHE doesn't want to abort rather than it being impossible to abort now as of course it is rarely impossible to purposely abort at any stage except very late in pregnancy which she isn't.


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## AJBliss (20 July 2013)

Perhaps she should discuss with a reproduction specialist.  It is not fair to the filly to simply to decide to continue when aborting the foetus shouldn't be too difficult at this stage, as sallyf says--it should be a matter of a few injections under veterinary guidance.  There are several great repro vets in this country who her vet could contact to check a good protocol for this filly.  If your friend purchased her as a "pity buy", why continue the pregnancy if she doesn't have to go through it?  Best of luck, this is what I would be doing were I her, and I do have experience breeding.  If I could avoid having a pregnant yearling, I most certainly would!


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## Capriole (20 July 2013)

You are getting advise, and advise from people who actually do have experience in breeding and owning youngstock, so I don't get your problem.  People are asking questions to get the full picture. Ask the vet if you have questions and you don't like our answers


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## Mrs. Jingle (20 July 2013)

I am far from an expert on breeding, but I am well aware that it is extremely possible to abort this poor little filly's unwanted offspring at 2 months and further if necessary for the filly's well being. 

If she bought her purely out of pity then I have to question why she is happy to allow this risky pregnancy to continue. It really isn't in the best interests of either the filly or the unborn foal is it? If she has asked you to post on here about care etc., cant you report back that the general opinion is not to go through with the pregnancy and try and persuade her this really isn't a good idea at all?


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## FionaM12 (20 July 2013)

It seems very naive to suggest going on a forum to find out how to manage her whole pregnancy! It's obviously a huge topic and not something anyone can give you instructions on in a few posts.

This is a great place for ongoing support though if your friend wants to join and ask specific questions as things progress. She needs to be aware though that her seemingly irresponsible decision to leave such a baby in foal is likely to be challenged if she does so.


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## TheTrotter. (20 July 2013)

She would like to know whether she should be doing anything diffrent with her, at the moment she is turned out with a gelding, with no extra feed, just grass. So when should we feed her anything extra? and what would you reccomend?


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## cptrayes (20 July 2013)

TheTrotter. said:



			She would like to know whether she should be doing anything diffrent with her, at the moment she is turned out with a gelding, with no extra feed, just grass. So when should we feed her anything extra? and what would you reccomend?
		
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If your friend is having to ask these questions through you and not even direct (and you are a brand new poster yourself) then she is completely irresponsible to allow this pregnancy, if it really exists, to continue. Go back to her and tell her to abort the foal as a welfare issue for the poor little filly.

And maybe advise her to buy a goat next time, not a pony.


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## Roasted Chestnuts (20 July 2013)

Personally I would be aborting the foal. This baby should be getting fed for her own growth, not having it stunted by having a baby 

Tell your friend to google, there are plenty of breeding tips available online. Pity buy or not she should be making the best decision for the horse not the prospect of having a cute wee foal next year which is what it looks like by the postings. Tell your friend to join and field these questions herself unless this is another on of those 'MY FRIEND has just..............' posts when its really the OP  Call me cynical.......


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## TheTrotter. (20 July 2013)

Black Beastie said:



			Tell your friend to join and field these questions herself unless this is another on of those 'MY FRIEND has just..............' posts when its really the OP  Call me cynical.......  

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Not Cynical at all, just didn't want to be thrown abuse at.. 
Simply want advice on what to do, other than aborting. Seems this was the wrong place to be asking for advice, just get looked down upon.


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## FionaM12 (20 July 2013)

TheTrotter. said:



			and what would you reccomend?
		
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You already know what everyone would recommend.


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## FionaM12 (20 July 2013)

TheTrotter. said:



			Not Cynical at all, just didn't want to be thrown abuse at.. 
Simply want advice on what to do, other than aborting. Seems this was the wrong place to be asking for advice, just get looked down upon.
		
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No-one is looking down on you. They are all just honestly telling you what they would do, or recommend anyone else to do. The prime concern here is this poor filly's welfare.


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## Meowy Catkin (20 July 2013)

TheTrotter. said:



			Seems this was the wrong place to be asking for advice, just get looked down upon.
		
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You have been given some very sound advice from experienced breeders - it's just not the advice you wanted to hear.


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## TheTrotter. (20 July 2013)

Forget it. I'll look somewhere else for advice.


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## AJBliss (20 July 2013)

TheTrotter. said:



			Yes, she knew she was/possibly in foal when she bought her.. 
She doesn't want to have the foal, but after speaking to the vet, simply aborting the foetus is not possible
		
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Here, you say she does not want to have the foal, and now you say that she does not want to abort it.  If she does not want to have the foal, and her vet has told her aborting the foetus is not possible, please have her ask her vet to consult with a specialist.  I'm not sure why the recommendations here have suddenly changed how she feels from not wanting a foal to wanting a foal...?


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## Maesfen (20 July 2013)

TheTrotter. said:



			Not Cynical at all, just didn't want to be thrown abuse at.. 
Simply want advice on what to do, other than aborting. Seems this was the wrong place to be asking for advice, just get looked down upon.
		
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TBH there is no other advice rather than aborting.  It is not something to be taken lightly to be breeding from something so young and if there is any possible means to avoid the pregnancy, it should be taken. 
I actually find your vet very naive and unrealistic to have given you that poor advice; it shows they have no experience in this field and is possibly looking at it from the money angle because your friend is surely going to need them a lot before, during and after foaling if there is to be successful outcome without endangering the mare.
I find it very hard to stomach that your friend and their vet should be so irresponsible as to let it continue.


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## Mrs. Jingle (20 July 2013)

'''''''''''Me and my friend have no experiance in breeding so would like all the advice we can get in ensuring the filly and the foal inside are as healthy as possible..'''''''''''

OP I quote the above from your original post, if you and your friend want to ensure that this young filly remains healthy and has a viable future, I repeat, please have your vet abort the unborn foal. You haven't answered the question about WHY this foal can't be aborted, what has your vet said about this then to arrive at the conclusion you have? 

Nobody is looking down on you (well I'm not obviously can't talk for other posters here), but to become defensive when you are given extremely good advice and warned of the negative side of trying to force this filly to continue to full term, will of course make people suspicious of your genuine intent with this filly. Please reconsider and make the filly's well being priority and ask your vet for his/her support in terminating the unwanted and very risky pregnancy and care of the filly for the next chapter in her sorry little life.


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## sallyf (20 July 2013)

Yes absolutely you asked for advice and I have given you the best advice which is to abort the foal.
Absolute twaddle that foal cannot be aborted simply.
In fact I know someone that pg'd a mare that they were unaware was in foal that then aborted at 9 months with no issue.
Mare had been turned out in one of there fields after coming out of training ,it seems there was an escapologist welshie colt next door.
Anyway going back to the mare I foaled a 2 year old for someone a number of years ago that had been bought from the side of the road as a rescue case.
She suddenly developed a bag after being fed for the winter and I suspected she was in foal which vet confirmed.
Filly foaled fine although it was a hard foaling as the foal was large.
It ruined the filly though she never went on to do anything useful and ended up being put down by the time she was 4.
I think being poor and in foal had caused her to have growth problems.
The foal also never went on to be anything useful either and was actually a real nuisance as the mare had never taught it any manners being a baby herself.
It really depends what your friend wants to achieve out of it in the end.


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## TheTrotter. (20 July 2013)

Please can I PM someone on here? I really don't know what to do, but don't want to discuss openly on here..


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## FionaM12 (20 July 2013)

AJBliss said:



			Here, you say she does not want to have the foal, and now you say that she does not want to abort it.  If she does not want to have the foal, and her vet has told her aborting the foetus is not possible, please have her ask her vet to consult with a specialist.  I'm not sure why the recommendations here have suddenly changed how she feels from not wanting a foal to wanting a foal...?
		
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I'm making an educated guess here that the owner (who I'm guessing is also the OP) fancies the idea of a cute new foal so won't agree with aborting.


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## TheTrotter. (20 July 2013)

FionaM12 said:



			I'm making an educated guess here that the owner (who I'm guessing is also the OP) fancies the idea of a cute new foal so won't agree with aborting.
		
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This is not the case.


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## Meowy Catkin (20 July 2013)

It ruined the filly though she never went on to do anything useful and ended up being put down by the time she was 4.
		
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This is well worth quoting. 

Your number one priority is the health of the filly. Please do the right thing by her.


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## FionaM12 (20 July 2013)

TheTrotter. said:



			Please can I PM someone on here? I really don't know what to do, but don't want to discuss openly on here..
		
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Maesfen is a very experienced breeder I believe, and is online I think.


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## Meowy Catkin (20 July 2013)

TheTrotter. said:



			Please can I PM someone on here? I really don't know what to do, but don't want to discuss openly on here..
		
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PM Maesfen as she is very experienced, kind and I'm sure that she wont mind.


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## FionaM12 (20 July 2013)

TheTrotter. said:



			This is not the case.
		
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I'm sorry if I'm wrong, but that's how it looks. No explanation has been given as to why she can't abort.


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## sallyf (20 July 2013)

welcome to pm me if you want advice I own/run a large stud with many years experience


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## Maesfen (20 July 2013)

Yes I am and willing to help if I can; there is also Sallyf, AJBliss and others that have answered both of your threads.


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## Mrs. Jingle (20 July 2013)

You are more than welcome to pm me OP - but I am not an experienced breeder, having only bred a couple of home mares in my lifetime. I could only reiterate what I have already said. So probably not much help to you.


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## TheTrotter. (20 July 2013)

Have PM'd Maesfen. Thankyou everyone, I'm sorry for becoming so defensive. I'm just really upset about the whole situation...


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## AJBliss (20 July 2013)

Best of luck!  None of us bite, we just all have this filly's best interests at heart, and can't help but advocate for her welfare.  I'm sure Maesfen will give you sound practical advice, and I hope you'll be able to help your friend and her horse.


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## FionaM12 (20 July 2013)

TheTrotter. said:



			Have PM'd Maesfen. Thankyou everyone, I'm sorry for becoming so defensive. I'm just really upset about the whole situation...
		
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That's understandable, if you really are posting on behalf of a friend who is making a poor decision about the unfortunate filly.  You are in a difficult situation. I hope she does the right thing.


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## sallyf (20 July 2013)

AJBliss said:



			Best of luck!  None of us bite, we just all have this filly's best interests at heart, and can't help but advocate for her welfare.  I'm sure Maesfen will give you sound practical advice, and I hope you'll be able to help your friend and her horse.
		
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Absolutely all we want to do is help


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## Maesfen (20 July 2013)

Have replied to your PM.

To others, please can you back off a bit, they're between a rock and a hard place and is only trying to do their best.  I can say the situation is not of their making but one they've got lumbered with if that helps.


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## Spring Feather (20 July 2013)

I've replied to your other post in the Lounge.  Abort would be first choice for me, but if you aren't going to abort then the filly needs to be on a high protein diet now in order for her to carry this foal without detriment to herself.  Once she's foaled you will definitely need to speak to an independent nutrionist and find out the levels of feed you'll need to give the filly in order for her to feed the foal and her own growing body, othewise she'll end up looking like a coat rack in no time at all.  Tell your friend to be prepared to have to spend a very decent sum of money each week to feed this filly once she's foaled, it isn't cheap keeping a regular broodmare in tip top condition let alone a 2 year old dam with a suckling foal at foot.


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## Meowy Catkin (20 July 2013)

I really hope that everything goes well OP.


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## mynutmeg (20 July 2013)

Abort if at all possible would my first, second and third choices, if thats simply not a choice then feed, feed and feed is the most important thing as you need to feed for both the filly's growth and the growth of the foal. 
I would recommend the Top Spec nutrition line as I got very good, independant advice from them but also phone 3 or 4 of the feed companies and talk to several of the nutritionists about the best sort of feeding for this poor little filly. 
As per Spring Feather this filly is going to cost a lot to feed both now and once she's foaled - you may need to supplement the foal quite early on as well as I'd be surprised if a 2 year old would be able to produce enough milk to feed a foal properly AND have enough left to grow herself. 

The other thing is that this will more than likely set the filly back so be prepared not to do any backing until she's at least 4 rather than the more normal 3 year old as she will take time to catch up on lost growth.

If possible get her on livery at a stud or similar as it will be of enourmous benefit for the filly to be in with more experienced broodmares.

Good luck with the pair of them and whatever else you do make sure she is watched like a hawk at foaling time, as her small size will put her at more risk of complications.


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