# 60 cattle horses about to get washed away!



## Kokopelli (26 December 2012)

Around 60 horses and cattle have been left on land that is flooded and at a very high risk of being flooded again by the river severn. 

Welfare organisations have been contacted and obviously cannot take on so many horses at once in such a short amount of time so they have asked anyone with spare land that can take a few could you please contact RSPCA or WHW.

We are due even more rain over the next few days and the water levels aren't far off 2007 in which case theses poor animals will not survive. 

Link to photos of the horses currently:https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=4878853371214&set=a.4878851691172.2192292.1293924117&type=1&theater

Even if you can only take on one or two that would be a huge help the landowner says he wants them gone. 

Local radio stations have also been contacted to put a plea out for people to temporarily take on the horses and cattle.

Please don't turn this into an argument but if you can help brilliant.


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## rockysmum (26 December 2012)

Is this the ones on the other thread that the rescue services have been feeding since November.

Why have they been left there so long?

http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=583256


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## Kokopelli (26 December 2012)

Have no idea sorry, I don't think so though.

Basically the farm flooded a few weeks ago and RSPCA was called and went out with food and water but didn't move them as it was drier and not so bad but this time round there is no food, no water and no dry ground. A lot of them are hopping lame (probably foot abcess) and some have wounds which are oozing puss. 

Owner doesn't care about them (before anyone asks no not travellers) welfare organisations are trying to find land to put some of them on and trying to get the horses signed over to them so they can treat/ pts the ones that need it.


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## pixie (26 December 2012)

who do they belong to? Is there not a local slaughterhouse that'll take a job lot?


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## Shadow the Reindeer (26 December 2012)

If the rescue services have been feeding them, why haven't the injured horses been treated or removed? The longer they're left in that state, the longer the recovery rate, if they ever do


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## rockysmum (26 December 2012)

What part of the country is this?


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## Kokopelli (26 December 2012)

They've been fed by local people not rescue services but this was a few weeks ago last time it flooded.

They belong to a private owner, won't post his name on here but can pm if anyone wants it the land owner and horse owners are two diff people but land owner is also trying to help get the horses removed.

That's what I thought pixie, better than drowning imo.

It's in Gloucester the field is the flood plains underneath the A40 causeway, it floods badly in the slightest of rain and it won't be long until the poor horses will not be stood on any solid ground.


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## Kokopelli (26 December 2012)

Rubysmum it is the same horses.


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## Flibble (26 December 2012)

Yes it is the same horses I put link on latest news before I had to go get mine in.


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## M_G (26 December 2012)

Perhaps RSPCA should save their money for cases like this instead of fighting political "class" wars


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## canteron (26 December 2012)

If I lived nearer, I would definitely help.

Regardless of who owns these horses, who has been looking after or why they were bred, they are live animals who should be not be left to drown - while people bicker.

Well done Kopelli for doing your bit and sorry that some other HHO are a little bit less helpful.


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## Highlands (26 December 2012)

Dreadful, not too far away but so sorry we have no keep and lost 7 acres to flooding.... RSPCA will probably wait till horses swimming!


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## Shadow the Reindeer (26 December 2012)

I can only suggest posting links on rescue sites on FB or Twitter (at last something those sites are useful for) - surely there must be someone out there who can provide temp accommodation for them


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## rockysmum (26 December 2012)

Shadeyoak said:



			I can only suggest posting links on rescue sites on FB or Twitter (at last something those sites are useful for) - surely there must be someone out there who can provide temp accommodation for them 

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I have put it on a few of them

Where are all the people from the Welsh Fly Grazing thread, plenty of offers of homes on that one. (In addition to the troll of course)


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## Natch (26 December 2012)

M_G said:



			Perhaps RSPCA should save their money for cases like this instead of fighting political "class" wars
		
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I think they do both.

I don't know this case personally but at a guess ALL the welfare organisations that are involved will be doing their best. Despite new laws it is still desperately hard to seize animals if the owner isn't obliging 

It looks like a very sad typical example of what WHW, Redwings, BHS, RSPCA, Horseworld & Blue Cross were forewarning of in this report.


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## dotty1 (26 December 2012)

I am 20 miles fro Gloucester and it is hammering down now so its going to get worse.  My field and stables are flooded out so unable to help.  No one is going to want 60 horses on their land, finding empty barns would be easier but from what I have read on the local fb page the owner can't even supply hay.  
Why does he have these horses?? are they intended fot the meat trade eventually??
Really sorry I can't help, it is awful


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## Shadow the Reindeer (26 December 2012)

I really hope they find somewhere soon, but at the moment, I can only see one outcome, and it's not a good one


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## horsesatemymoney (26 December 2012)

How awful...stupid question were these in bad way before the rain or are they at risk because of the rain? I wish I could help but I'm miles away


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## rockysmum (26 December 2012)

From the REIN facebook page


RSPCA: 0300 1234 999. World Horse Welfare : 01953 498682. Rspca are appealing for anyone that could house any of these Horses.


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## dotty1 (26 December 2012)

It looks like they have got offers of land for them but the RSPCA won't move them atm.


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## Shadow the Reindeer (26 December 2012)

dotty1 said:



			It looks like they have got offers of land for them but the RSPCA won't move them atm.
		
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The RSPCA needs a rocket up their behind then


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## WoopsiiD (26 December 2012)

Can transport be arranged??
We have no transport but I'm talking to the sanctuary owner, would the owner sign directly to us as we have a 'no RSPCA' policy.
(Sounds awful and not willing to discuss on public forum so please don't ask or think badly of us)


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## dotty1 (26 December 2012)

The lady frantically trying to save these horses can be contacted through the Gloucestershire Horse Riders Facebook page, there is a bang up to date thread on there with all the info


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## Hairy Old Cob (26 December 2012)

rockysmum said:



			From the REIN facebook page


RSPCA: 0300 1234 999. World Horse Welfare : 01953 498682. Rspca are appealing for anyone that could house any of these Horses.
		
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RSPCA Multiple Choice NO ANSWER  WHW NOW CLOSED till Wednesday.


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## Hairy Old Cob (26 December 2012)

They belong to a private owner, won't post his name on here but can pm if anyone wants it the land owner and horse owners are two diff people but land owner is also trying to help get the horses removed.

NAME AND SHAME


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## Natch (26 December 2012)

Hairy Old Cob said:



			NAME AND SHAME
		
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The only thing that would achieve is to get this thread pulled and to quite possibly c*** up the charity's work.


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## Natch (26 December 2012)

Shadeyoak said:



			The RSPCA needs a rocket up their behind then 

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Do we know WHY the RSPCA won't move them yet? Perhaps they physically CAN'T: can't get at the land due to flooding, can't get permission just yet, perhaps they need to wait for one (or more) of the specialist equine charities to arrive with suitable vehicles. Perhaps the land offered isn't suitable, perhaps they need to inspect it first to be sure they aren't putting them at risk in a different way. It's boxing day, perhaps those who are needed aren't contactable. Perhaps they can't legally do it yet.

I'm not saying the RSPCA are perfect, not by any stretch of the imagination, but please, a little less of the unhelpful assumptions


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## rockysmum (26 December 2012)

The latest news is that they have offers of land but the RSPCA wont move them.  Dont suppose many people are answering their phones today either


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## Shadow the Reindeer (26 December 2012)

M&S ChristNatch said:



			Do we know WHY the RSPCA won't move them yet? Perhaps they physically CAN'T: can't get at the land due to flooding, can't get permission just yet, perhaps they need to wait for one (or more) of the specialist equine charities to arrive with suitable vehicles. Perhaps the land offered isn't suitable, perhaps they need to inspect it first to be sure they aren't putting them at risk in a different way. It's boxing day, perhaps those who are needed aren't contactable. Perhaps they can't legally do it yet.

I'm not saying the RSPCA are perfect, not by any stretch of the imagination, but please, a little less of the unhelpful assumptions 

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This has been going on for over a month now, they've had four weeks to organise something


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## lucindakay (26 December 2012)

iwas going to say we have a spare couple of fields, space for two horses but we're on the other side of the country and one horse is recovering at the moment so wouldn't be fair on him, i really wish i could help, good luck to these poor horses, though its good to hear that people are helping


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## WoopsiiD (26 December 2012)

Off grid a bit but:
http://www.rspca.org.uk/inyourarea/detail/-/iya/Birmingham Newbrook Farm Animal Centre/

72 acres???
Before the rspca robbed people I mean asked people to donate this was infact a HMP Farm and I have visited and seen the land first hand.
More than adequate for the horses.
....and dogs and cats....they bragged in a paper that they had 160? pods and only took 20 cats.....then wouldn't take anymore.....140 empty pods by my reckoning..


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## DuckToller (26 December 2012)

I would be willing to help with transport although I am not local, but the trouble is who to get hold of?  The Gloucestershire Horse Riders facebook page is a closed group, so that's no use.


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## merlin12 (26 December 2012)

Hi this is an awful situation.I live in the area and could take one horse as I have facilities.
I beleive the WHW may have been monitoring this . Why can't u get anyone at Christmas. If original poster could contact me .I may have mobile number for field officer.


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## amandaco2 (26 December 2012)

I wish I was closer, poor things...I am pretty soggy but I could have taken one horse......


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## dotty1 (26 December 2012)

The thread has been pulled on Gloucestershire Horse Riders page and a disclaimer put on.  There is a meeting tomorrow of members at the site who are determined to do something. There have been enough offers of land but the difficulty is actually moving the horses legally and I don't think they are reachable by land at the moment, last time hay had to be craned into them fom the causeway.


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## Bigbenji (26 December 2012)

Where is the owner? If the offer of help for land is there why can't they be moved or is access an issue?


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## dotty1 (26 December 2012)

Owner not interested it seems.........landowner is trying I believe and has been asking owner to move horses for weeks.


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## Bigbenji (26 December 2012)

Lovely owner then! 

Makes me feel sick.


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## shadowboy (26 December 2012)

The worcester horse groups have the thread but the issue was about the legality of moving the animals


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## Bigbenji (26 December 2012)

If its the legality of moving them then surely it's the fault of the owner.
I feel for the poor animals but it annoys me that selfish idiots end up having everyone running round clearing up after them because they can't be arsed! 
Sounds like these poor animals should of been moved ages ago.
I really hope something can be done for them and the owners arse spanked!


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## cheeryplatypus (26 December 2012)

Very sad.


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## justforfun (26 December 2012)

So sad that the RSPCA wont pull their finger out to help these horses, but are happy to spend £10.000's on money just to prove a point and 'try' to look good over the fox hunting debate, to think of the ways that money could have been used to help sick and needy animals.
Sick animals dont have days off over christmas, but sounds like the RSPCA dont worry abot that.
Hope those horses are found a better place to live.


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## RoseGrey (26 December 2012)

Totally agree  ^^^^


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## Maesfen (27 December 2012)

If you get the nationals involved the RSPCA will move a lot quicker; that was proved with Hope.  They only like to be seen coming to the rescue otherwise they'll do nought without a bomb up their bum (like a national paper campaign against them)


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## smellsofhorse (27 December 2012)

Any news?


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## mcnaughty (27 December 2012)

pixie said:



			who do they belong to? Is there not a local slaughterhouse that'll take a job lot?
		
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Shoot them, kill them!  Very obviously a quick and easy solution to the immediate problem but not sure this is the ethical one.


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## luckypeggy (27 December 2012)

There are a group of people from the Gloucestershire horse riders group going to look at them today, to look for injuries and food and then calling police/vets and RSPCA from there I think. I believe they have tried media etc but are still trying again. So sad, and its been raining all night again


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## mon (27 December 2012)

Just emailed sky news about it after them going on about hunts, perhaps if a few more contacted them perhaps with more details might help.


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## maisie06 (27 December 2012)

Typical RSPCA, nothing but a political organization who think nothing of wasting thousands upon thousands on a fox, yet always seem to let real cruelty/animals in distress pass them by. Look at Carrot and Spud - it was HHO and BHS welfare that sorted them out in the end - just you wait until a collector comes around my area again, they will hear it...


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## mtj (27 December 2012)

Really sad to see that many posters are using the plight of these horses to have a whine about hunting and the RSPCA.

Harsh truth is that the RSPCA has to work with in the law.  Hence, if these horses and cattle have their legal requirements met (regardless if by owner or others), the welfare agencies are stuffed.  No doubt these bodies are trying to get the livestock signed over.  

Totally agree that media coverage is the best way to get this situation resolved.


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## Spotsrock (27 December 2012)

If transport and legality can be sorted we'd take a relatively healthy one but i'd struggle to take on big vets bills as it would be coming to livery so costing me quite a bit, the keep, weight gain and minor knocks I could deal with. Have to be a biggish one though as pony paddock is full and not allowed tinies in the big field. I can't get the links. How do I offer? I have no transport to go that far though at present. If anyone lincs way gets one and can bring another please let me know, I could arrange collection locally.


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## dotty1 (27 December 2012)

It has been raining all night and is pouring down now.  There is nothing on the facebook site but I know they are going out today.  One of the ladies is very fiesty and I am sure will do all she can.  They have land to move them to and offers of lorries, its just the legalities and physically getting them out.
Stupid question...what are 'cattle horses' and why would someone have 60 of them???, I can only think they are intended for meat


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## flyingfeet (27 December 2012)

Shame the owner isn't selling them, argie horses would make polo ponies and good allrounders


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## Dizzy socks (27 December 2012)

So, just to clarify, are they also looking for people to take cows? And are the horses/cattle used to handling, and safe?

please PM me.


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## AprilBlossom (27 December 2012)

Just to clarify dotty1 - I live almost next door to these horses (thankfully not quite underwater myself yet!) and it has not rained since 3am - I know because I've been awake with an annoying baby since then. 

Please don't hype the situation up any more than has been already. The water levels are about 1 metre lower than they were at peak last time; yes, it's bad, but its been much worse recently. It's annoying that so many people are taking hearsay from 'local' people who actually live nowhere near said field as gospel truth. I do believe there are a few people getting carried away with the romantics of saving these horses.


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## flyingfeet (27 December 2012)

Yes and people are thinking they would be given the horses free, in reality you could have them for 12 months or more, pay all the bills and then have to give them back

If required I would purchase a couple to give them a home, but would need a receipt from the owner.


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## Luci07 (27 December 2012)

Interesting legalities on this....if the animals had been been abandoned, then after 14 days the animals would become the property of the landowner. However, I assume that as the landowner knows who the owner is and is in contact this does not apply?  Which seems tough on the landowner.. I hope this is rectified sucessfully today. We are on sand, on top of a hill and we are suffering from new lakes in the summer fields..


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## JanetGeorge (27 December 2012)

dotty1 said:



			Stupid question...what are 'cattle horses' and why would someone have 60 of them???, I can only think they are intended for meat
		
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Argentinian 'cattle horses' are polo ponies who haven't been trained yet IMHO!  Why would ANYONE in their right mind import Argentinian cow ponies HERE - unless it was to train/sell them for polo??  (The cost of import would FAR outweigh their meat value!!)  Or breed - apparently there are foals out with the group.


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## s4sugar (27 December 2012)

JanetGeorge said:



			Argentinian 'cattle horses' are polo ponies who haven't been trained yet IMHO!  Why would ANYONE in their right mind import Argentinian cow ponies HERE - unless it was to train/sell them for polo??  (The cost of import would FAR outweigh their meat value!!)  Or breed - apparently there are foals out with the group.
		
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Are these anything to do with the Camp Criollo or similar horses off the meat boats to Italy?


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## Pipkin (27 December 2012)

Apparently they've been moved over the last few days,a few at a time. More fly grazing for wales then 

http://www.thisisgloucestershire.co...ded-farmland/story-17693099-detail/story.html


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## Tiffany (27 December 2012)

pixie said:



			who do they belong to? Is there not a local slaughterhouse that'll take a job lot?
		
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Deleted post


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## 747jax (27 December 2012)

video footage I took today in Gloucester from over causeway.... http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=CSVHX_UU6FI


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## Bobbly (27 December 2012)

What does it take for the authorities to step in? Dead bodies floating? Unless the barn is stacked with hay there appears to be nothing to eat except the trees? Someone somewhere needs a good kick up the backside to get this sorted!!


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## sv-masterchef (27 December 2012)

As one of the people who was there today I would like to clarify the situation . There are around 40 privately owned Argentinian horses who were to be used for trekking. The horses are dotted around trapped on islands of mud by the water, some have hay, some don't. We was some that were in a poor condition but not starved, but there are plenty we couldn't get to because of the flooding. It is an awful sight to see horses wading around in dirty flood water up to their chests chewing on wood and dead trees because they have no food. It is impossible to see all of them. The RSPCA could not be more useless, we had to make such a fuss to get the fires brigade there to get a boat down there to assess the situation. It is ongoing because the horses have to be moved which is what the owner wants, but he has to " swim " them through the water to an area where he can park the lorry, he can then take a few at a time. This is a big job, most of them aren't even halter broken. A group of us are there just trying to help, while the RSPCA are being confrontational to us , yet treating the owner like he is a hero !


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## guido16 (27 December 2012)

Sorry for being stupid, but it isn't the Niagra falls!! Why is no one going across and feeding these horses?


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## sv-masterchef (27 December 2012)

The surrounding area is so flooded you can't get to it. There is also the river Severn on one side.


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## AprilBlossom (27 December 2012)

It's been like that for a few days. The horses do not look to be 'hopping lame' or in poor condition, simply a bit short of room currently. They are being kept on flood plains, this is what happens to flood plains...

The 'dirty flood water' is water that has escaped from a river. Not at all unnatural for a horse to drink.

I wish people would stop being so dramatic. Some idiot went and broke their leg whilst on a 'rescue mission' today, no doubt requiring emergency services on top of the multiple fire engines called out by these sosay do gooders.

By all accounts the land owner has been moving horses off the land for the last couple of days (coincidentally when it started to get bad...on Sunday there was no significant flooding, to put things into perspective) so I really don't understand the big hoo-ha, especially from those who live across the country and are just being taken in by an overly dramatic story told by some glory hunters with nothing better to do.


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## AprilBlossom (27 December 2012)

Guido16 - because it's far more exciting and a better story to 'rescue' them in dramatic fashion than lob a few bales of hay out there...  

(Oh, I live down the road from this field, it's flooded yes, but not a patch on the last time a few weeks ago)


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## sv-masterchef (27 December 2012)

Well said December blossom, feel very proud of yourself? Spoken like the rest of the keyboard warriors who are happy to sit at home doing nothing while horses are suffering. Unless you were there you have no right to comment. How dare you ? And as for someone breaking his leg, that is simply not true. Go back to doing what you types do best, nothing


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## AprilBlossom (27 December 2012)

I did have a nice slow drive over the causeway (handily stuck in traffic) and got a good look. I may have driven past the people filming actually, so yes, I was there. I didn't want to go assist the GHR people as I believe a few of those attending were rather unsavoury characters and as I don't believe it's an emergency worthy of bothering this country's already stretched emergency services I'd probably have been lynched!

The whole thing has been blown hugely out of proportion, IMO hence the negativity surrounding it from people like me. Why not spare a thought for the people who's lives have been turned upside down - and at Christmas too - with flooding in the similar area. 

I can't house a horse, nor do I want to wade through water and mud and risk my own safety (and the time of the emergency services should I then need rescue) but if there is anyone who has lost the downstairs of their house this week who needs anything at all, they just need ask.


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## Highlands (27 December 2012)

I am sorry but we have land on flood plains and its called enviromental agency alerts. There is no excuse for this.... And yes I am in the area roughly speaking..... I know this area quite well. Around Maisemore has always flooded, the point to point course had to abandoned by a local hunt. If you keep in a an area by the river then with this amount of rain.... These horses were brought for commercial gain, if you make this kind of commitment then you need to have the acres....

I am not an over emotional person but cruelty and these horses having nothing us not acceptable...., 60 horses need forage... The owner should make provision for this that's what barns are for. Having rescued a mare and nursing her back to health I realise she want through hell and back.

This owner needs these horses freed from suffering whether this is rescuing or another solution and he needs to be made accountable.


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## sv-masterchef (27 December 2012)

No, you weren't there! We were there with the few horses that had made it to a dry land and the owner. Driving slowly past does not qualify you to make negative comments, you have no idea of what went on today or the dialogue we have had with the owner, fire brigade and RSPCA.  No one is glory hunting, please go away with your useless and inaccurate comments, if you want the truth come and help us. And as for your un savoury character comment, you couldn't be more wrong, the people there today ranged from university students   , to nurses and teachers.


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## The_snoopster (27 December 2012)

I am confused (which is not hard these days) but in one post te owners wants rid and has no fodder for them, then in another the owner is removing them but slowing due to how many there are there. Then another posts say they are trekking horses then on another sone are not even handled, so which bits are true and which bits are fiction.
Keeping 60 horses on flood plains with no fodder is asking for trouble full stop if thats the case he/she should sell up and give up, if he does have fodder where the hell is it. Oh I give up with some people


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## Highlands (27 December 2012)

Heard all the above...the owner is now mint to be taking them to Wales, long way to travel twice a say to check them and hay them..... Another field in Wales full of horses .....whose owner sees them once in a blue moon... Grrr


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## Moomin1 (27 December 2012)

sv-masterchef said:



			No, you weren't there! We were there with the few horses that had made it to a dry land and the owner. Driving slowly past does not qualify you to make negative comments, you have no idea of what went on today or the dialogue we have had with the owner, fire brigade and RSPCA.  No one is glory hunting, please go away with your useless and inaccurate comments, if you want the truth come and help us. And as for your un savoury character comment, you couldn't be more wrong, the people there today ranged from university students   , to nurses and teachers.
		
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## Silvermaneuk (27 December 2012)

I would just like to point out that the FB Group Causeway Horses, is in no way associated with GHR. This was at the request of the GHR owner who wanted nothing to do with it. 

All the volunteers who were there, did not do so because of any encouragement or support from GHR. Even though their meant to be a charity for the welfare of horses, they distanced themselves from it. That was their choice.

I would also like to say that despite the negative comments from certain quarters of the equine community, we have had dozens and dozens of messages, supporting what the group did today, which far outweigh any of the negative comments. For that were grateful. Were also grateful for the dozens of offers of land if we needed it. Thank you.

There seem to be a lot of gobby keyboard warriors out there in cyber land happily shooting their mouths off, but not happy to actually DO anything, and then attacking those that did.

What we did today was raise awareness, to try and get the horses additional help, which we did achieve. This was all about the welfare of the animals. I am so proud of everyone who was involved today, there was an immense kindness and love for the animals in the group, and it was wonderful to see, especially in the negative world we live in. Again well done to them all. 

A special thanks to John Green the fire and rescue guy, who we met and begged for help, who then mobilised the fire team who were giving practical help, to the owner to move his horses, who had just been left to struggle by himself. He rocked!

If you want to criticise us, and be negative towards the help we gave today, that shows more about the type of person you are, than who we are.


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## Moomin1 (27 December 2012)

Forgive me for sounding ignorant but what did go on today?


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## noobs31 (28 December 2012)

Silvermaneuk said:



			I would just like to point out that the FB Group Causeway Horses, is in no way associated with GHR. This was at the request of the GHR owner who wanted nothing to do with it.
		
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Is this a private group?  Does not come up in search.


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## Littlelegs (28 December 2012)

So apart from liasing & raising awareness, what actually was done for the horses immediate needs? Like taking forage out to them?


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## AprilBlossom (28 December 2012)

I have no intentions of coming to 'help' sv-masterchef. I don't believe I can be of help - I don't have land, I don't have excess forage and certainly would not force my own horse to go without for the sake of a stranger's (from the video, adequately conditioned) horses, and I do not believe it worthy of excessive 999 calls and harassment of welfare and emergency services.

So I'm not a 'keyboard warrior', because I'm not saying I want to come help and not helping. I'm just not going to help you as I believe you're all being ridiculous.

As little legs said - did anyone TAKE hay to them, or did you all just prance about with the firemen? 

And re the unsavoury characters, it doesn't matter their profession - they can still be rude, vile creatures - behaviour demonstrated last night causing a number of people to be removed from GHR due to abusive comments and PMs. Having been on the receiving end of a few comments myself in the past - apparently I don't love my horse enough as I wouldn't throw myself in front of a bus (or similar) to ensure he was fed (sorry, no, I value my own life slightly higher than my pets, sad but true and I'm sure most of you would agree if pushed) - and it seems honest opinions aren't welcomed by the vigilante rescue group.


Please note, I am sure there were also some very pleasant individuals who I salute for making such a big effort to get something done (even if I don't agree 100%) but the horrid little toads who are just going because its a free activity for the day and they could get on the news need to go back to school or go get a job and enter the real world before slating others!


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## sv-masterchef (28 December 2012)

Once again you have no perception how difficult it is to 'TAKE' hay to them. It required the fire services to use a couple of boats in order to get food to the stranded horses. 
Only the fire services were able to get food to them!! 

Unless you have been there to witness it for yourself you have no right to criticise those that helped.


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## Littlelegs (28 December 2012)

So the horses were provided with forage, got to them by the fire brigade if I read it right? And everyone else helped by liasing, raising awareness, appearing on camera, being seen to be there etc? I'm not sure that a large group of rubber necks watching the fire brigade take hay out by boat is my idea of 'helping'.


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## AprilBlossom (28 December 2012)

*snort* they also jammed up the emergency lines for a while to make sure fire services would attend


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## sv-masterchef (28 December 2012)

The only reason the fire brigade even got involved was because of our group who were there to raise awareness of the horse's plight. Without us being there and contacting the fire brigade and the police, nothing would have been done. The group of at least 20-30 horses stranded in those barns would still be there now without food. And the single horse stuck on a small island of pure mud would have continued to be ignored by the thousands of people driving past and not brave enough to actually stand up and do something about it.


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## sv-masterchef (28 December 2012)

DecemberBlossom said:



			*snort* they also jammed up the emergency lines for a while to make sure fire services would attend 

Click to expand...

Another load of made up nonsense. 

I have to sign out now as I'm on my way back out to help the owner swim the stranded horses back across so he can load them up and take them to a safe place


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## Littlelegs (28 December 2012)

I'm not saying a couple of people weren't needed alongside the fire brigade. But you talk of large groups of volunteers all there in support, even though very few were needed. Fair enough to openly admit that there was nothing on tv & the majority went for a nosey. But don't expect them to be heralded as heros for saving the poor horses.


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## merlin12 (28 December 2012)

Horses can't ask for help ,we have to help them. I hope if I need help some day ,some one will be willing to help me.

Why would some one import lots of unbroken horses for a trekking centre.Surely we have enough of our own?


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## Patterdale (28 December 2012)

Why can only firemen drive boats? Am I missing something?

Sounds like a shocking misuse of the emergency services to me. I hope no ones house was burning down whilst all this was going on.


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## AprilBlossom (28 December 2012)

And don't expect sympathy when one of the 'unbroken' 'wild stallions' or a 'pregnant mare' (of which apparently there are loads...) boots you in the head and you yourself have to e rescued. 

Come on, did no one ever watch 999 as a kid? It's basic rescue etiquette - DO NOT go in after another person/animal etc as usually you'll just make the situation worse.


I just hope you're wearing your hi viz


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## Silvermaneuk (28 December 2012)

Nobody wants your sympathies. Yes people were wearing hi viz.

Its quite clear from the posts on here, that this is just an argument being brought over from another site.

In support of those who were there today and yesterday.

At least these guys got off their asses, and got out from behind their computer screens, to go and try and do something. Rather than just sit there typing about the poor horses. So sick of people shouting off about something needing to be done, and then just sitting there and doing nothing. All mouth and no trousers.

They offered to physically help, they offered to get in the water, to lead horses, they offered to get their hands dirty, they offered to go and get vans and trucks full of food to throw down to them. They stood there, shouting, pleading with the authorities, until one of them listened, even though it was freezing cold and they fought to get more help for the horses. 

The RSPCA who could have provided more transport for the owner, to help get them out quicker, didnt do so. All they did was pay lip service. The fire service have been amazing.

Now if you bunch of negative ninnies, want to carry on making stupid remarks and criticising those people, then that says far more about you, than it does about us.

This has always been about the welfare of the horses, supporting the horses, and supporting each other. The positive support the group received far outweighs any of your criticism, even from your own site. 

Seems to me that there are some people here with personal vendetta's and this is not a school yard, you should take your issues elsewhere. 

I wont be commenting again, because I am not going to waste my energy on people who really dont matter in the grand scheme of things.


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## Littlelegs (28 December 2012)

I've only heard of the other site on this thread, & I'm nowhere near glos. However I stand by my comments. Standing around en masse shouting is not my idea of useful help. Yesterday taking hay out, & physically leading horses to dry land was what was needed in the way of help. Not rubbernecking. Likewise future help needs to be directed towards what will happen long term to these horses. Not a mob stood round for a day.


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## peek-a-boo (28 December 2012)

The_angel_littlelegs said:



			I've only heard of the other site on this thread, & I'm nowhere near glos. However I stand by my comments. Standing around en masse shouting is not my idea of useful help. Yesterday taking hay out, & physically leading horses to dry land was what was needed in the way of help. Not rubbernecking. Likewise future help needs to be directed towards what will happen long term to these horses. Not a mob stood round for a day.
		
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Why do you bother to come on here if you are so against helping these animals that you have to slate the people who are doing something! You have no Idea of whats gone on and by you ignorant comments you have not even bothered to find out the full facts before mouthing off at others!! May be you would do better reining your neck in and supporting people who obviously care about animals and there plight.  Makes my sick some of the comments on here and ashamed that people like you are aloud to own animals!! Go back into the holes you crawled from and let the people trying to help go back to helping! rant over.


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## Shadow the Reindeer (28 December 2012)

The_angel_littlelegs said:



			I've only heard of the other site on this thread, & I'm nowhere near glos. However I stand by my comments. Standing around en masse shouting is not my idea of useful help. Yesterday taking hay out, & physically leading horses to dry land was what was needed in the way of help. Not rubbernecking. Likewise future help needs to be directed towards what will happen long term to these horses. Not a mob stood round for a day.
		
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Why do you think petitions work so well? " Because if enough voices are heard, something has to be done" In simple words, they can ignore the tiny pleaful voice and say they can't hear anything, but they can't ignore a foghorn can they?
Saying nothing and doing nothing is not going to help these horses, but if enough people keep complaining to the RSPCA they at some point will have to do something, because otherwise, it makes them look VERY bad in the public eye.


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## Pearlsasinger (28 December 2012)

How strange that posters who have only just joined the forum are wondering why long-standing posters come on here and suggesting that an argument has been brought over from another forum.  I wonder who did that then?


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## Landcruiser (28 December 2012)

Oh boy. I read this thread in increasing disbelief! Seems to me that a sorry situation is hopefully being salvaged by a group of people who care and are going to a lot of trouble to help these stranded criollos. I'm really not sure what the negative comments are all about, and they seem to be detracting from the point. 

I have 2 criollo horses myself, and have a fair idea who the owner of these horses probably is. I'd guess the horses are a mixture of imports and homebreds, mostly under 10 years old, and potentially fantastic, intelligent riding horses. They are also very valuable, usually selling in the UK for over £4000 each, so "job lot to the slaughterhouse" isn't a desirable outcome for anyone, least of all the horses. 

I'm not close to the area and I don't have my own land to offer, so I can't help physically, but I send you all my support and best wishes.


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## peek-a-boo (28 December 2012)

There is not many left to move now about 8 I am going out there to help warm and dry these animals! I have been told some have open wounds that need treating and some have lost eyes  poor things not eating anything but mud in days. Pity so many people are uncaring and think that its not worth the effort and people have wasted there time!!! well nope as the horses are being moved and only started after protestes there made the owners act.


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## Shadow the Reindeer (28 December 2012)

peek-a-boo said:



			There is not many left to move now about 8 I am going out there to help warm and dry these animals! I have been told some have open wounds that need treating and some have lost eyes  poor things not eating anything but mud in days. Pity so many people are uncaring and think that its not worth the effort and people have wasted there time!!! well nope as the horses are being moved and only started after protestes there made the owners act.
		
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So they're in the process of being removed now? That's some good news I suppose.. shame about the injuries, but at least they're getting treated now..


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## Littlelegs (28 December 2012)

I didn't suggest anywhere people shouldn't help. I asked what had been done for the horses current needs, & the gist of it seemed to be liasing & raising awareness, not simply taking forage &/or removing horses. And afaik the horses are just being moved far away so owner won't be able to provide daily care. So I think those wishing to spend a day helping animals in plight could have spent it more constructively. My comments do not stem from a lack of care, quite the opposite. It's all very well to stand around making a song & dance, but unless you are physically feeding or removing horses, or making arrangements to secure sustainable responsible futures for the animals, then claiming you are saving the horses yourself is somewhat of an exaggeration. But by all means, throw personal insults about if it makes you feel good.


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## AprilBlossom (28 December 2012)

Good grief. 

I will stop commenting now, but I don't for a minute believe they hype you're trying to create about the state of the horses. Not get enough coverage yesterday when they were just in need of some hay?! You do not have my support, you don't need it, nor do the horses need you waffling around with fluffy towels trying to humanise them.


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## Patterdale (28 December 2012)

I heard the horses began to spontaneously combust as they were moved hence need for the fire brigade.....



(  )


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## Landcruiser (28 December 2012)

Good news that most of them are out of immediate danger. Well done to everyone that helped them. "Making a song and dance" has obviously done the trick, in that it's forced the owner into action, with the help of a lot of caring people. Good luck with the rest of the operation.


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## {97702} (28 December 2012)

The owner was already moving the horses before all this kicked off and everyone got so excited about it.  It was tedious enough on GHR, I cannot believe it has spilled over onto here as well


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## Landcruiser (28 December 2012)

There are a few confusing and contradictory parts to this story, and if the owner was already moving them, I withdraw my comment in my last post. I don't withdraw my support for the people who have been concerned about the welfare of the horses, as judging from the video, the conditions they were in were pretty lousy and potentially life threatening. Whatever the reason the horses were there, at least they are being moved to safety now.


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## ISHmad (28 December 2012)

Landcruiser said:



			There are a few confusing and contradictory parts to this story, and if the owner was already moving them, I withdraw my comment in my last post. I don't withdraw my support for the people who have been concerned about the welfare of the horses, as judging from the video, the conditions they were in were pretty lousy and potentially life threatening. Whatever the reason the horses were there, at least they are being moved to safety now.
		
Click to expand...

^^^Like^^^

Whatever the circumstances it is not the horses fault and I'm relieved that they are being moved to what is hopefully a place of safety.


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## nikCscott (28 December 2012)

Came on here to get away from the soap opera that FB GHR had become!

I drove passed an hour ago and all seemed to be gone thank goodness


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## Oliver12 (28 December 2012)

Snowflakedale said:



			I heard the horses began to spontaneously combust as they were moved hence need for the fire brigade.....



(  )
		
Click to expand...

Not very funny.


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## Highlands (28 December 2012)

Positive news... I just hope lessons have been learnt and theses horses don't end up somewhere unsuitable. For people who are all meant to love horses and animals there are some people with odd ideas.... And some who are genuine enough to do good..... If the RSPCA have the goul to ever ring me again then they will be told where to go....


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## Moomin1 (28 December 2012)

Dear me there are some seriously hysterical and fluffy wuffy people posting on this thread.  

I bet the authorities have a whole load of earache and migraines to deal with after listening to them.


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## Moomin1 (28 December 2012)

Oliver12 said:



			Not very funny.
		
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I thought it was funny myself!


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## Moomin1 (28 December 2012)

Highlands said:



			Positive news... I just hope lessons have been learnt and theses horses don't end up somewhere unsuitable. For people who are all meant to love horses and animals there are some people with odd ideas.... And some who are genuine enough to do good..... If the RSPCA have the goul to ever ring me again then they will be told where to go....
		
Click to expand...

I can imagine some of the authorities involved felt like telling certain Joe Public where to go too...


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## mutley75 (28 December 2012)

some have obviously been sold as the quote requests to move them to various parts of the country have started to come in!


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## Hairy Old Cob (28 December 2012)

Lets hope that all the poor horses have Now Been Removed to suitable land unlike where they have been stuck for the last 4-5 weeks, and that the problem has not just moved else where, with the River Severns Reputation I find it incomprehensible that any one would try to keep horses or anything on this land especially in the wettest year on record.


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## peek-a-boo (28 December 2012)

Right To clear this up now. The people who own the horses will not part with any of them, they know that the situation is bad and looks bad and willing to accept that its far from ideal. They have chosen to move the animals and wont take any help even when its driven to the place and parked in front of them. They are going to doggedly keep moving these animals to a unknown location. there is not any chance that they will part with any of them not even if you pay cash for them they wont they have there backs against the wall and wont budge. All that can happen is keep making sure the animal that remain there at the moment are cared for. I know 6 animals are already dead and some have injury's that should be seen by a vet. when I arrived the rspca was on site but even though animals clearly needing a vet stood in front of he he left! all the animal are on safe ground now and none are at risk of drowning, they have food but no clean drinking water. I do not in any WAY CONDONE WHAT THEY HAVE DONE TO THESE ANIMALS but unless the RSPCA or another org steps in these horses will continue to where ever they are going and we can only hope they will be looked after the other end. To be honest I wouldn't give my horse to a random stranger either.  I do not rub any of my animals with fluffy towels and can only comment on what i saw to day. I do feel for the people they are stuck in a rut and nothing they do is going to be right by all but they shouldn't have put these animal in this situation as well. I really do not understand why some of you feel the need to be negative about this people are only trying to make sure these animals a looked after and cared for. some do look like they haven't had a meal in quite a few days. if it was just as easy as throwing hay at them I am sure that would have been done but its not. They only started moving the animals when people started protesting that the horses were in grave danger and have nothing left to eat. The owners have had to swim the horses for a mile down the river to get them to saftey and have been doing that now for 2 days. I have been as honest as I can be and tried to put aside my feeling to tell you what is join on right now!


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## Landcruiser (28 December 2012)

Thank you Peek a boo for clarifying and updating. Did you see the dead horses??? If so, how did they die? And what injuries?


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## AprilBlossom (28 December 2012)

Here's betting she didn't...


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## Moomin1 (28 December 2012)

If those horses really needed to be seen by a vet, they would be.  Simple as.  The relevant authorities would ensure that that was done, either by themselves, or by the owner.

People need to stop listening to hearsay rubbish.


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## Tern (28 December 2012)

Please may i just say 6 horses were killed today - 5 foals, the owner admitted to saying the foals had Salmonella from drinking dirty water - most probably the cause of there death - the horse would have been from drinking dirty water and eating the mud. If you guys have such a problem with it then simply don't comment.


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## peek-a-boo (28 December 2012)

Moomince Pie said:



			If those horses really needed to be seen by a vet, they would be.  Simple as.  The relevant authorities would ensure that that was done, either by themselves, or by the owner.

People need to stop listening to hearsay rubbish.
		
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Thank you for your expert opinion on the situation. I am sure you are right the authorities are gods and on the case, we bow to your superior knowledge!


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## {97702} (28 December 2012)

Killed?  You mean humanely PTS, or died, or were already dead?

And just to let you know, nobody on this forum has the right to say who should and should not comment on a thread other than the moderator(s)....


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## Moomin1 (28 December 2012)

CobbyHoofs said:



			Please may i just say 6 horses were killed today - 5 foals, the owner admitted to saying the foals had Salmonella from drinking dirty water - most probably the cause of there death - the horse would have been from drinking dirty water and eating the mud. If you guys have such a problem with it then simply don't comment.
		
Click to expand...

How did the owner 'know' they had Salmonella.  How were they 'killed'?


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## Moomin1 (28 December 2012)

peek-a-boo said:



			Thank you for your expert opinion on the situation. I am sure you are right the authorities are gods and on the case, we bow to your superior knowledge!
		
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I suppose you are a God then, and you have 'superior knowledge'?  

I bow down to you.


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## Tern (28 December 2012)

Moomince Pie said:



			How did the owner 'know' they had Salmonella.  How were they 'killed'?
		
Click to expand...

The owner knew they had Salmonella as he told our group who went to go help with the horses - they brought bales of hay with them. I have no idea how he knew but im just telling you what been going around..


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## peek-a-boo (28 December 2012)

Moomince Pie said:



			I suppose you are a God then, and you have 'superior knowledge'?  

I bow down to you.
		
Click to expand...

Thank you


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## {97702} (28 December 2012)

CobbyHoofs said:



			The owner knew they had Salmonella as he told our group who went to go help with the horses - they brought bales of hay with them. I have no idea how he knew but im just telling you what been going around..
		
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Ah, so repeating here-say rather than actual known facts   Which is why all this went so out of control on GHR....sigh....


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## Tern (28 December 2012)

peek-a-boo said:



			Thank you 

Click to expand...

haha LOL!


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## Moomin1 (28 December 2012)

CobbyHoofs said:



			The owner knew they had Salmonella as he told our group who went to go help with the horses - they brought bales of hay with them. I have no idea how he knew but im just telling you what been going around..
		
Click to expand...

PAHAHAHAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!

Oh bless, you are quite naive aren't you?

How were they 'killed'?


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## Tern (28 December 2012)

Picklenash said:



			Ah, so repeating here-say rather than actual known facts   Which is why all this went so out of control on GHR....sigh....
		
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Whoever said anything about ghr?


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## ILuvCowparsely (28 December 2012)

Kokopelli said:



			Around 60 horses and cattle have been left on land that is flooded and at a very high risk of being flooded again by the river severn. 

Welfare organisations have been contacted and obviously cannot take on so many horses at once in such a short amount of time so they have asked anyone with spare land that can take a few could you please contact RSPCA or WHW.

We are due even more rain over the next few days and the water levels aren't far off 2007 in which case theses poor animals will not survive. 

Link to photos of the horses currently:https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=4878853371214&set=a.4878851691172.2192292.1293924117&type=1&theater

Even if you can only take on one or two that would be a huge help the landowner says he wants them gone. 

Local radio stations have also been contacted to put a plea out for people to temporarily take on the horses and cattle.

Please don't turn this into an argument but if you can help brilliant. 

Click to expand...



 This reminds me of this  amazing rescue 



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e8iSYMkFO2A






.


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## {97702} (28 December 2012)

CobbyHoofs said:



			Whoever said anything about ghr?
		
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Oh dear....you are a new user who suddenly joined HHO, oddly around the time when this all went **** up on GHR due to mass hysteria and loads of people got banned from that FB group.....it doesnt take much to work it out


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## Landcruiser (28 December 2012)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0l_wxVlltxY

This is a clip from today, showing the owners swimming some of the horses to safety.


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## marmalade76 (28 December 2012)

I do think it's rather rude of these new posters to come on here and tell long standing members what they can and cannot post on - how very dare they!? This isn't GHR where you can get a post removed simply because it's author doesn't agree with you and/or admin!


I'm afraid I'm taking most reports of hopping lame horses, dead horses, salmonella and missing eyes with a pinch of salt - provide proof and I might believe. There has been too much speculation, exageration and conflicting eyewitness reports going on over this I don't really believe a word anyone says.

For once (can't believe I'm going to say this) you are talking absolute sense, Moomin, and I totally agree with you  Who wold have believed that?!?


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## peek-a-boo (28 December 2012)

Aww so proud of you all picking on a youngster pats on the back all round  any yawn with all these childish games so bye god bless you all and happy new year (waves)


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## {97702} (28 December 2012)

Et voila, the classic "I'm not getting my own way so I am going to claim bullying and then flounce off" response 

I would say please go back to GHR peek-a-boo, but I suspect you arent welcome there either


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## Moomin1 (28 December 2012)

peek-a-boo said:



			Aww so proud of you all picking on a youngster pats on the back all round  any yawn with all these childish games so bye god bless you all and happy new year (waves)
		
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Byyeee!  

Ooh, before you go, could you be so kind as to let us know how the horses were 'killed'?  

Ta very muchly!


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## lhotse (28 December 2012)

Not going to get involved in the thread apart to say that the Netherlands clip has just sent shivers down my spine and brought me to tears! What an amazing sight. Not to mention the music is one of my favourites too.


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## Moomin1 (28 December 2012)

marmalade76 said:



			I do think it's rather rude of these new posters to come on here and tell long standing members what they can and cannot post on - how very dare they!? This isn't GHR where you can get a post removed simply because it's author doesn't agree with you and/or admin!


I'm afraid I'm taking most reports of hopping lame horses, dead horses, salmonella and missing eyes with a pinch of salt - provide proof and I might believe. There has been too much speculation, exageration and conflicting eyewitness reports going on over this I don't really believe a word anyone says.

For once (can't believe I'm going to say this) you are talking absolute sense, Moomin, and I totally agree with you  Who wold have believed that?!? 

Click to expand...



Have you had too much eggnog?!


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## marmalade76 (28 December 2012)

peek-a-boo said:



			Aww so proud of you all picking on a youngster pats on the back all round  any yawn with all these childish games so bye god bless you all and happy new year (waves)
		
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Well, if you can't take the heat.....


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## marmalade76 (28 December 2012)

Moomince Pie said:





Have you had too much eggnog?!  

Click to expand...

I haven't had a drop all christmas!


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## {97702} (28 December 2012)

Landcruiser said:



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0l_wxVlltxY

This is a clip from today, showing the owners swimming some of the horses to safety.
		
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Just watched this - yes, there are horses swimming to safety, no, it does not substantiate any of the claims being made


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## marmalade76 (28 December 2012)

Picklenash said:



			Just watched this - yes, there are horses swimming to safety, no, it does not substantiate any of the claims being made 

Click to expand...

Agree, and they're probably being taken away to make sure no-one else helps themselves to them!


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## Moomin1 (28 December 2012)

Picklenash said:



			Just watched this - yes, there are horses swimming to safety, no, it does not substantiate any of the claims being made 

Click to expand...

Not sure if that was the poster's intention to prove - I think they may have just been posting footage generally.


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## {97702} (28 December 2012)

Moomince Pie said:



			Not sure if that was the poster's intention to prove - I think they may have just been posting footage generally.
		
Click to expand...

Sorry I should have been clearer - I appreciate the person who posted this footage was not involved in the "rescue" effort, so was not making any point by posting it.  I believe the video was taken by "rescuers" who were trying to show how appalling the conditions were for the horses...all I see is horses swimming?


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## Baggybreeches (28 December 2012)

The 6 horses in the video footage certainly don't have the look of malnourished horses, they all have adequately full flanks and topline. Horses can swim, and a few bales of hay are not going to make a jot of difference to 60 beasts (other than cause a fight!). I suggest you go and turn your efforts to something more worthwhile like the 'worldwide preservation of idiots'............


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## Moomin1 (28 December 2012)

Picklenash said:



			Sorry I should have been clearer - I appreciate the person who posted this footage was not involved in the "rescue" effort, so was not making any point by posting it.  I believe the video was taken by "rescuers" who were trying to show how appalling the conditions were for the horses...all I see is horses swimming?
		
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If that is the case and they are trying to prove something by that footage then that is laughable.

Plenty of people do the same on their horses in the sea!


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## {97702} (28 December 2012)

Moomince Pie said:



			If that is the case and they are trying to prove something by that footage then that is laughable.

Plenty of people do the same on their horses in the sea!  

Click to expand...

I actually saw a very similar picture on FB today (since I live 5 miles from the stricken horses) - yes, it was someone swimming their horse in the flood water having a great time


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## Moomin1 (28 December 2012)

Baggybreeches said:



			The 6 horses in the video footage certainly don't have the look of malnourished horses, they all have adequately full flanks and topline. Horses can swim, and a few bales of hay are not going to make a jot of difference to 60 beasts (other than cause a fight!). I suggest you go and turn your efforts to something more worthwhile like the 'worldwide preservation of idiots'............
		
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Exactly.


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## peek-a-boo (28 December 2012)

DONT FEED THE TROLL's  blick


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## AprilBlossom (28 December 2012)

Someone want to come on a rescue mission to my place? I've plenty of poo that needs picking to prevent the water becoming dirty


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## {97702} (28 December 2012)

peek-a-boo said:



			DONT FEED THE TROLL's  blick
		
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(a) I thought you had flounced off?  Please feel free to go as you stated you were doing...

(b) The plural of troll is trolls, not troll's 

Thanks


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## {97702} (28 December 2012)

DecemberBlossom said:









Someone want to come on a rescue mission to my place? I've plenty of poo that needs picking to prevent the water becoming dirty 

Click to expand...

LOL thats the photo I meant 

You nasty cruel woman you


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## Moomin1 (28 December 2012)

DecemberBlossom said:









Someone want to come on a rescue mission to my place? I've plenty of poo that needs picking to prevent the water becoming dirty 

Click to expand...

Fun fun fun!  

Wish I had the guts to do that these days on my girl - she's too clumsy compared to my old boy who I used to swim with! 

Enjoy!


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## Natch (28 December 2012)

What a sorry situation all around, but quite why and who caused it to be so sorry is as yet unclear to me.

I thought the horses were unhandled, so why were there two being ridden and four(?) being led in the river? I don't understand why the river was deemed to be the best route to take the horses, surely across land, even if flooded would have been preferable  

If the owner would not accept any help, how did those volunteers go up to these unhandled horses to dry them off?

Whoever it was that was there, if the horses were badly injured and hadn't eaten for days, I hope someone had the sense(?!) to follow one of the horsebox's journeys to find out where it took the horses to, because otherwise it looks and sounds like a bad case of NIMBY.

I am alao curious as to the reasons why 'authorities' (who, exactly?) were reluctant to act, and I can hazard a guess as to why rspca weren't too chuffed with the group of 'volunteers'. 

If the reports on here are true, I am just as worried about the horses' futures as I was their last few days, possibly more so. A horse who hasn't eaten for days being moved on a long journey, after a mile swim, to potentially lush pasture is a lethal colic or laminitis case waiting to happen. A pregnant mare put through that could well increase the chances of loss of both mare and foal's lives.


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## AprilBlossom (28 December 2012)

NB, that's not me in the photo - it's a teen who borrowed G for a dip with his yard mates and their owners - if we keep this level of flood up and I can find some 'brave the cold' pants I'll prob take him over myself this weekend! 

Hydrotherapy is good for horses - it's even better when it's free!! After all, he is a veteran...


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## marmalade76 (28 December 2012)

Baggybreeches said:



			The 6 horses in the video footage certainly don't have the look of malnourished horses, they all have adequately full flanks and topline. Horses can swim, and a few bales of hay are not going to make a jot of difference to 60 beasts (other than cause a fight!). I suggest you go and turn your efforts to something more worthwhile like the 'worldwide preservation of idiots'............
		
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See, it started off with a post with the headline '60 horse stranded without food, shelter or water' (or something along those lines) with an album showing a few horses standing round an open barn surrounded by water - kinda contradicts the headline. None of the horses looked poor, yes, they were standing in mud but I suspect a lot of horses are ATM (mine are if they choose to stand in certain parts of their current eight acres of grazing). I also doubt that there were anywhere near 60 horses there. Some posted that they'd seen hay there, which contradicted the no food claim. Then, when there was not enough outrage at this, reports of hopping lame (my own horse was hopping lame last week, are a big group of local horse lovers going to turn up and harrass me and offer him a home??) and injured horses followed along with outrage at the lack of action from the RSPCA. Now, I'm no fan of the RSPCA, particularly after their recent antics, but these horses could not be classed as suffering, so I can see why they didn't get involved (not even sure if they are involved now). I have a suspision that stories of lost eyes and dead horses are simply an attempt to justify all of this.

The owner is moving them now, and an attempt was made on FB to criticise even this. I think  he thought he'd better move them quick before they ended up in various livery yards all over the county! But how easy could it be to find grazing for a number of horse this time of year in such a wet winter? Not that easy, I'm willing to bet.

As for the risks of water levels rising, it has not rained here much the past few days, a few showers and light rain, that's all. Water levels haven't really gone down, but they haven't gone up either. Most of the rain forecast was actually down stream of here, so would have not affected where these horse were.

Oh, and I doubt they were swam throught the river itself, this is the Severn, they  would have been carried away.


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## Landcruiser (28 December 2012)

They aren't unhandled. They are (as I said before) a mixture of imported cattle horses (working South American horses) and a few home breds. Some of them might be tricky to catch and suspicious, but none will be unhandled, and most will be good riding horses.

I posted the video of the horses swimming to safety because I found a link to it and was fascinated to see just how precarious the situation was, and what a tricky rescue it was. I though others would want to see it too, I wasn't making any point, just trying to bring in more info to a still confusing story.

I'm afraid I don't understand the nastiness of some of the people on this thread..


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## Natch (28 December 2012)

Landcruiser with so much conflicting information going around, some are bound to be suspicious, especially those who like me are nowhere near and so only have amateur (as opposed to professional from, e.g. BHS) reports to go on, some of which contradict one another. It only takes one person to be offended that their version isn't believed to light the blue touch paper and whoosh, a thread can get nasty.


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## Spring Feather (28 December 2012)

I watched the video you posted with interest Landcruiser.  Thank you for posting.


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## Moomin1 (28 December 2012)

M&S ChristNatch said:



			Landcruiser with so much conflicting information going around, some are bound to be suspicious, especially those who like me are nowhere near and so only have amateur (as opposed to professional from, e.g. BHS) reports to go on, some of which contradict one another. It only takes one person to be offended that their version isn't believed to light the blue touch paper and whoosh, a thread can get nasty.
		
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Exactly.

There are people who know exactly what went on from a professional form.  

I wouldn't believe any hype.


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## Baggybreeches (29 December 2012)

Landcruiser said:



			They aren't unhandled. They are (as I said before) a mixture of imported cattle horses (working South American horses) and a few home breds.
		
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At the risk of sounding thick, who would bother importing low value horses from South America, when you can pick up horses for £50 in any auction any day of the week in the UK


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## AprilBlossom (29 December 2012)

I must be fair and say that last night and today the rain and wind is horrendous, and I wouldn't be surprised if the barns those horses in are now quite damp! 

However, the owner clearly looked to have the matter in hand, removing horses calmly and quite impressively (I know I couldn't lead two and ride one in dry conditions, let alone waist high water!). Someone stood on a bridge blithering about the 'poor horses' whilst taking a video is not helping, it's watching.

If I had decided to help (if say, weather was like today) I'd have gone 'oh, hi horse/land owner/whoever you are, would you like some help with removing those horses? What would you like me to do?' And got on with it. Not blared about on the Internet to all and sundry, creating an embarrassing hype for the poor guy, and threatening to 'rescue' the horses (I believe it's more commonly referred to as theft).

The worst part about the offers of 'rescue' is that I saw an individual who only days before was posting about having no money to do anything with her horses as in desperate need f a sharer to finance them etc, offering to take one or two on!!! Vultures...


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## Hairy Old Cob (29 December 2012)

Having worked on the River Severn I have been trying to bite my Tongue "Swimming Horses 1 mile Down the River"
The River Severn is probably the most Evil River in England the tidal reaches have a12 meter tidal range which is why it holds back so much flood water.

To enter the river would almost certainly end in tragedy for horse and rider.
At present you are not allowed to navigate the Severn with a Boat and that includes commercial operators such as the Co I work for.

The pictures of the horses swimming well they were on their feet and by the colour of the water they were in a flooded back water with no flow in clean water.The River Severn is running Chocolate Brown. You never turn your back on a River especialy the Severn.

In an Interview the female owner of the Horses stated they had only been their 4 weeks and didnt realise the place flooded "Yeah Right" FLOOD PLANE No one could be that niaeve why the Causeway over the land? The Farm is Called Severnside which is stretching the point for my knowledge the place has been little more than a semi derelect Low lieing dump for the last 16 years. If though that is the fact that they were that niaeve, the owner should also be culpable for not making the new tennants aware of the flooding implications and the associated dangers to live stock, which has resulted in this Debacle where the Horses are Suffering.

People who have read my posts in the Past will be in no doubt about my feelings for the RSPCA a pseudo political organisation that should have its Royal Patronage withdrawn. And I have my doubts about the Horses origins.


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## Landcruiser (29 December 2012)

The horses are indeed from South America, Old Hairy Cob. Until recently, a large consignment of criollos would be shipped to Italy every spring, then either used for meat over there or distributed as riding horses in Europe by a few criollo dealers. They were bulk shipped and transported, keeping transport costs low. This trade from SA has now stopped, as I understand it.

These horses are low value in Argentina, as they have a huge number of good quality horses over there, and controlled breeding programmes to ensure the criollo type remains true. I assume it's the ones that don't quite make the mark that made up the bulk of the transports. However, in Europe they are high value as riding horses as they are so versatile and clever. As I said at the beginning, I have two of them myself, both from Uraguy on a transport 6 years ago. I paid a kings ransom for them, but they really are fabulous, fun, easy keeping, characterful horses. Both mine were at one time part of this particular herd, which was indeed located in a different place until recently.


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## indie999 (29 December 2012)

Havent read the lot but flood warnings and rain have been in place for hell of a long time and the owner if they know cannot  have mis understood as they basically dont care if they all drown. Life is cheap.
They should have been moved and probably reading the local knowledge of the Severn shouldnt be there in the first place. Perhaps in future a ban on keeping them in this area then the emergency services and anyone else that criticises animal welfare charities(I mean who the hell is expected to go and tackle a flooded river and risk drowning themselves)wont need to be called out. The owner should be banned for life from keeping or working with horses/any animal. As they dont care (& fined). The owner is a costly liability.
Prayer for a dry spell.


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## Kokopelli (29 December 2012)

Blooming heck.

I now apologise for posting this thread, had no idea it would turn into this. Just so people know I'm not involved with all the krap going on at GHR just someone caught in the middle. But seriously hearing some of the suggestions on ghr made some good reading.


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## peek-a-boo (29 December 2012)

Waves smugly at the disbelieving Muppets!


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## ISHmad (29 December 2012)

Have just seen a photo of a dead foal and read that that were others partially buried under the mud. No way of verifying if from this group of horses or not as I don't live there, but from the comments it would appear so.

Hope whoever owns them and allowed that to happen is prosecuted and given a lifetime ban from keeping horses. Well any animal actually.


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## peek-a-boo (29 December 2012)

ISHmad said:



			Have just seen a photo of a dead foal and read that that were others partially buried under the mud. No way of verifying if from this group of horses or not as I don't live there, but from the comments it would appear so.

Hope whoever owns them and allowed that to happen is prosecuted and given a lifetime ban from keeping horses. Well any animal actually.
		
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There are lots of photos  its sickening to see and how this has been covered up! 
Oh well maybe the gobs of know will shut up when it comes on the news and they have there proof!


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## indie999 (29 December 2012)

ISHmad said:



			Have just seen a photo of a dead foal and read that that were others partially buried under the mud. No way of verifying if from this group of horses or not as I don't live there, but from the comments it would appear so.

Hope whoever owns them and allowed that to happen is prosecuted and given a lifetime ban from keeping horses. Well any animal actually.
		
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Yep as has been said this is the Severn and flood plain and no doubt this is not the first time this has happened. Forget the sob story no money, finances etc too little too late. Sickening. Prosecute thats the only way and lifetime ban on all animals but some lawyer will no doubt help with legal aid and the sob story to help them off. Sickening and it will continue. Publicity as to suffering is the only way to get the public to get behind and end this kind of misery grazing.


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## Toast (29 December 2012)

Hey peek-a-boo, dont PETA have a forum? you'd be far more welcome there im sure


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## indie999 (29 December 2012)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-gloucestershire-20507477

There is mention on BBC about the horses and I remember about the dead horse and trap earlier in year etc But definitely is mentioned ?

http://www.thisisgloucestershire.co...roads-closed/story-17699563-detail/story.html

And here............troll? Dont think so?If you click on the second link the pics and location of the horses are mentione. Stupid owners. Its not like the rain happened in one night. Risky and stupid, not brave. Irresponsible to let it get to this.


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## indie999 (29 December 2012)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-gloucestershire-20539048

Are all these horses the same bunch that are in the news at the moment. What a waste of resources if the owners are not taken to task over this? More rain is forecast for next 10 days.


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## ribbons (29 December 2012)

Gobs of know !!!!!!!

What a thoroughly unpleasant turn of phrase peek-a-boo.

Not likely to convince anyone here you are a decent person, whether you are or not.


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## Hairy Old Cob (29 December 2012)

Indie 999 your last 3 links all apply to the Flood at the end of November do you have any Knowledge of what is happening at the present Time?


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## Shadow the Reindeer (29 December 2012)

Have seen the actual photo's... awful horrific scenes, i'd almost go to say this actually compares to Spindle farm (dead foal carcasses hidden under tree branches and taupulin (sp?)  )


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## annaellie (29 December 2012)

They have been appealing for rugs, hay, straw etc. a vet has been out this evening and everyone is working really hard to secure the best outcome for these horses. 
There is a few injuries and a few not made it. I got the information from the Facebook group am quite local to the area so as far as I know that's the way things stand at the moment


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## chanellie (29 December 2012)

Volunteers have been at the site all day with the remaining horses, dead foals have been found in the barn, the police have escorted a vet to site to check the remaining horses and compile a report. Severn Water have provided drinking water. 

Many people are pulling together to offer help etc in the way of rugs and hay also offering places of safety for remaining horses. They are meeting again tomorrow to help etc.

Of course the owner might go back in the night and remove them.


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## Shadow the Reindeer (29 December 2012)

I take it back - it does appear to be in the same league as Spindle farm


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## Landcruiser (29 December 2012)

Where are the photos? Because if you are sure about this, I'm appalled by it. Yesterday was bad enough


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## Shadow the Reindeer (29 December 2012)

Landcruiser said:



			Where are the photos? Because if you are sure about this, I'm appalled by it. Yesterday was bad enough 

Click to expand...

On facebook, there is a group.... the pictures are there


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## Spring Feather (29 December 2012)

If what you say Shadeyoak is factual then these people should be up on charges and banned from ever keeping animals at the very least!  How did the RSPCA inspectors miss seeing the dead foals when they were there??


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## EstherYoung (29 December 2012)

Landcruiser, I was sent photos of dead foals by someone I really trust, who is not a fluffy bunny, and who has no reason to over egg the pudding.

I believe they were first stranded by the November floods and have remained there since. The last remaining ones were moved out of the flooded area today.


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## annaellie (29 December 2012)

The pics are heartbreaking


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## Shadow the Reindeer (29 December 2012)

annaellie said:



			The pics are heartbreaking 

Click to expand...

I'm in tears... who on earth would allow any precious animal to suffer in that way? Disgusted doesn't begin to skin the surface. I gave my boy an extra big hug tonight when I left him tucking in to his hay


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## Toast (29 December 2012)

can anyone provide a link to the facebook page?


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## Landcruiser (29 December 2012)

It's a closed group, I can't get access to the photos.


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## bennibones (29 December 2012)

https://www.facebook.com/#!/photo.php?fbid=4900925322999&set=o.481395601913342&type=3&theater 

hope it works


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## Hairy Old Cob (29 December 2012)

Toast said:



			can anyone provide a link to the facebook page?
		
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Can You????


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## Shadow the Reindeer (29 December 2012)

Landcruiser said:



			It's a closed group, I can't get access to the photos.
		
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You can ask to join?


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## bennibones (29 December 2012)

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?...01877413&set=o.481395601913342&type=3&theater


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## Spring Feather (29 December 2012)

Can't see them bennibones but thanks for trying.  Can you c&p them and then post them on another photo account?


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## Landcruiser (29 December 2012)

Christ


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## indie999 (29 December 2012)

Hairy Old Cob said:



			Indie 999 your last 3 links all apply to the Flood at the end of November do you have any Knowledge of what is happening at the present Time?
		
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Second quote is 28th December if you click the 2nd big photo it moves and shows the ponies?


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## indie999 (29 December 2012)

http://www.thisisgloucestershire.co...oads-closed/story-17699563-detail/story.html#

Hope this opens the horse pic up?

http://www.thisisgloucestershire.co...ded-farmland/story-17693099-detail/story.html

Sorry this is day before says they are being moved (27th Dec) but if you click on the first link I posted(28th December) there is a picture if you move the arrow along of the horses?? Anyhow its on the internet on news reports if you do a bit of searching too.


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## bennibones (29 December 2012)

i have picked a couple will do a few more
 Warning*** some people may find them distressing**

http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/album.php?albumid=5449


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## Landcruiser (29 December 2012)

Unforgivable.


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## Spring Feather (29 December 2012)

Thanks bennibones.  The owner needs to be charged for this.


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## Landcruiser (29 December 2012)

How did the RSPCA miss this???


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## indie999 (29 December 2012)

The more you start digging the more I keep finding over past few months along the Severn. I am not overly familiar with that part of the world but clearly a problem dumping ground. Many of those around the UK. One of the links I added the owner was moving 5 at time to Wales.


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## Natch (29 December 2012)

Is RSPCA still the only welfare organisation involved in this?


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## Landcruiser (29 December 2012)

Those criollos are in very poor condition (not counting the dead ones). Is there anyone who's been on site today who can update on whether there is anyone to monitor the survivors when they are transported to Wales? Surely they can't just be disappeared?


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## bennibones (29 December 2012)

http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/album.php?albumid=5449&pictureid=20563

this photo just about sums up what the owner thinks of his horses, this horse apparently helped his mates across the water and now just left!
Have added a fe others to album


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## luckypeggy (29 December 2012)

Apparently there are volunteers who have found the place in wales where they have moved to and locals there are going to keep an eye and update. The pics are heartbreaking, think it shows that people weren't over reacting when trying to get them out.


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## bennibones (29 December 2012)

Landcruiser said:



			Those criollos are in very poor condition (not counting the dead ones). Is there anyone who's been on site today who can update on whether there is anyone to monitor the survivors when they are transported to Wales? Surely they can't just be disappeared?
		
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i hope for the sake of the horses that organisations will keep checking these people  otherwise they are just going to be in the same state in wales surely!!the rspca wont there crap clearly but maybe one other others or you would hope the owner comes to his sences and gets rid of a few!! maybe someone can post undate from the FB group?


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## Hairy Old Cob (29 December 2012)

Some one must know where the horses are being moved to and where are the owners living at the moment? Who along with woefully inept rspca need to be brought to feel the full force of the LAW about this terrible mess that has been unfolding over the last 5 weeks


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## rockysmum (29 December 2012)

EMW are appealing for anyone local with waterproof rugs they can spare to get in touch.

Poor poor ponies


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## Landcruiser (29 December 2012)

I repeat - unforgivable. Needless, thoughtless, I don't have words for it. These criollo horses have already suffered such a lot at the hands of humans. The poor ******s probably think it's par for the course. I don't believe how they were left there for so long after the fire service baled them out back in November. 

My two criollos were part of that same herd once, It makes me feel sick.


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## Shadow the Reindeer (29 December 2012)

Landcruiser said:



			I repeat - unforgivable. Needless, thoughtless, I don't have words for it. These criollo horses have already suffered such a lot at the hands of humans. The poor ******s probably think it's par for the course. I don't believe how they were left there for so long after the fire service baled them out back in November. 

My two criollos were part of that same herd once, It makes me feel sick.
		
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Give your two a big hug xx


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## JJones (29 December 2012)

Someone has just moved 60ish criollo horses here to Mid Wales, i am trying to read all the thread, can someone pm the names of the people. If it is them, i know eactly where they are.


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## bennibones (29 December 2012)

JJones said:



			Someone has just moved 60ish criollo horses here to Mid Wales, i am trying to read all the thread, can someone pm the names of the people. If it is them, i know eactly where they are.
		
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The best thing to do is go on the FB group and ask one of the admin to pm you as no names will be given out incase they prosocute (sp) but if it is the same people i think they will be glad if you could keep an eye on the horses!
https://www.facebook.com/#!/groups/481395601913342/


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## weebarney (29 December 2012)

Why are some people so vicious towards people who are trying to help or raise awareness? Are they the type that walk on by when people are getting attacked in the street? Shame on you, hope you are never in the position where you need help!
 By the way to people saying fire brigade should be at fires or whatever please remember they are called the Fire AND RESCUE service. Obviously if a human is in a life or death situation they will pull out and go rescue the people before an animal. Or would people rather they were sat in the fire station eating biscuits than helping needy animals?


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## Kokopelli (29 December 2012)

The photos are graphic, don't be surprised if they get removed. 

I think the RSPCA missed it because they weren't really interested and not working to full ability. 

Tbh though I may get my head bitten off for this but I wouldn't have said that the chestnut is super skinny a bit lean yes but definitely not a welfare case yet. A few months down the line who knows.

Also not 100% sure how true this is but I've heard the owner is refusing help (i.e hay donations) this of course can be rumours.


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## Hairy Old Cob (29 December 2012)

Kokopelli said:



			The photos are graphic, don't be surprised if they get removed. 


If these photos are removed I will be discusted people need to be made aware of what has gone on for the last 5 weeks at Severnside Farm.
		
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## Spring Feather (29 December 2012)

Kokopelli said:



			Tbh though I may get my head bitten off for this but I wouldn't have said that the chestnut is super skinny a bit lean yes but definitely not a welfare case yet. A few months down the line who knows.
		
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Not from me you won't.  The majority of the horses I saw on the videos were very well covered, bit over porky for my tastes to be honest.  Then there were a couple of leaner ones who were probably more tucked-up because they were wet and cold.


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## peek-a-boo (29 December 2012)

Its not so much a case of how skinny they are its the fact that one in so lame it cant walk others are hurt they swam a mile with no after care and some are coming on to 20 years old. left standing in wind and rain while soaking wet. its a real shame and I have been lobbying to help these animals since boxing day. I run a small rescue centre but live over 2 hours from the causeway site. its nice to see people offering so much help now, but I am still appalled at some of the members of this site they way they have belittled peoples efforts to help these horses and spent time insulting people. I was on site yesterday and saw what was going on the owners refused help repeatedly so we knew they were hiding something and they did admit to me that foals had died so today some brave souls went looking to see if it was true. A vet has now seen the remaining 17 horses and treated them.
We have to wait till tomorrow to see if the vet will rule to have the horses removed from the owners but until then the owner might come back and take them.
We can only hope that the horses will be safe till the vet decides there fate.
I will update as best I can and hope that the genuine people here are interested  but any more abuse and I shall not waste my time.


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## Landcruiser (29 December 2012)

Keep going, Peek a boo. The pictures speak for themselves. Are we looking at the same pictures, the person who says the horses aren't skinny? What about the dead ones? Are they skinny enough?


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## peek-a-boo (29 December 2012)

Thank you for your support  x


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## Kokopelli (29 December 2012)

Don't think it was lack of food that killed them though. Not saying it's not appalling, it is and no horses should be left in the field the way it was and I take my hat off to people being helpful. But the chestnut in particular is not skinny, he isn't well covered and lacking muscle but not skinny.


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## Burmilla (29 December 2012)

those poor horses. Will the RSPCA now get involved, given the dead animals found? The condition of the others looked reasonable in most cases, but the environment in which they were kept was hideous. Seems like you have achieved a great deal, p a boo, and the other hardy souls helping. Especially the photographers - vital evidence of the owner's dreadful disregard for the safety and welfare of his horses.


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## Bourbons (29 December 2012)

The pictures of the dead horses are so sad, but I agree that the horses in the other pictures aren't horrendously under weight.

I think the most important thing with this whole situation is that the horses are now safe, or on course to being so, and it is a shame that people have been bickering about it all.

I would just like to say that I am aware that this is my first post on this forum, but I am not linked to the rescue in anyway, and I am certainly not a troll. 

(I am in fact a lurker who has been lurking the forums for a few weeks due to being stuck on crummy night shifts, and am all the way down in Kent  )


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## Moomin1 (29 December 2012)

Landcruiser said:



			Keep going, Peek a boo. The pictures speak for themselves. Are we looking at the same pictures, the person who says the horses aren't skinny? What about the dead ones? Are they skinny enough?
		
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You do realise that dead animals decompose and lose body matter don't you?!!  Therefore appearing to be thin?


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## Spring Feather (29 December 2012)

Landcruiser said:



			Keep going, Peek a boo. The pictures speak for themselves. Are we looking at the same pictures, the person who says the horses aren't skinny? What about the dead ones? Are they skinny enough?
		
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Hmm I'm familiar with dead horses.  Anyone who is knows they're nothing like living horses.


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## d_morrow (29 December 2012)

Not having been involved previously, I brought a spare rug to the site this evening following an urgent appeal via Equine Market Watch. My rug was immediately put on a spotty horse very much like the one in bennibones pic so I can vouch for the plight of these horses -  even in the dark and from a distance you could see their ribs. Not only have they had to swim to safe ground, it was blowing a hooley last night and today so they are soaking wet and standing on the edge of what is basically a huge lake with no shelter. Thanks to the efforts of volunteers drawing attention to the case the remaining horses do now have rugs, hay and clean water.   For anyone not familiar with the location, virtually all of the undeveloped land around this area is basically under water (all too visible on this clear moonlit night). Of course it would be, given the weather conditions, as it is a flood plain. No genuinely caring or professional owner would keep animals here in winter.   The A40 high above at this point is a causeway which is a pretty big clue. 
Well done to the folks from Causeway Horses for sticking with this for the sake of the abused and downtrodden and for making things happen. I am shocked at the nasty comments by some on here.


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## rockysmum (29 December 2012)

Oh for gods sake, is there anyone on here would have left their horses in that place for a month.

Is there anyone that thinks the conditions are acceptable.

If so then I am ashamed to be a member of the same forum.

Just how bad did it have to get.


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## maggie mae an storm (29 December 2012)

As always a topic on horse and hound turns into an argument. Chill were all here for the same reason are we not?

If your here thinking your god, or your on drugs claiming this is an illusion Obama has something to say


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## gingerarab (29 December 2012)

Moomincepie your comments have been really out of order all the way through this thread.  Faced with pictures that give you evidence you still cant stop !

This whole issue was about the danger and the conditions the horses were being kept in not how much weight they had on them.


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## Moomin1 (29 December 2012)

gingerarab said:



			Moomincepie your comments have been really out of order all the way through this thread.  Faced with pictures that give you evidence you still cant stop !

This whole issue was about the danger and the conditions the horses were being kept in not how much weight they had on them.
		
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Explain to me which comments have been out of order.  Or merely just pointing out fact or asking for fact?

I have made one comment about weight on this thread.  Stating that dead animals decompose and lose body matter after death.  I did not comment on the weight of the live horses in question.


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## Landcruiser (29 December 2012)

Moomince Pie said:



			You do realise that dead animals decompose and lose body matter don't you?!!  Therefore appearing to be thin?

Click to expand...

Oh for goodness sake. I know the horses didn't die because they are thin! I was being sarcastic (spells it out).

 I know these owners, I know the horses, and I know THEY know how to look after them, in normal circumstances. Things have clearly gone very wrong though, and the people who have spotted the problem and worked to help the horses are to be commended, not criticised! I hate these forum spats - where do you get off, being so negative and critical and downright petty?


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## AprilBlossom (29 December 2012)

Peekaboo, if you would stop hyping everything up - the horses did NOT swim a mile, nor did they swim down the river, they paddled and swam a few hundred metres in giant puddles - I might be more inclined to listen to you.

The photographs are awful, however it must be noted that it is not due to the flooding that this sorry state has occurred. That ground has only been back underwater for a week, the rest of the time since November it's been rather damp, but not flooded. In a way it's a good job there has been flooding and people have gotten nosy about it.

I still stand by my comments about the majority of the people who started making a fuss in the first place - vultures hoping to cash in on a freebie 'rescue' horse or argumentative young madams with nothing better to do. Peekaboo, I don't know f either applies to you, but from some of your comments on this thread, you've not come across brilliantly. Admittedly, I've not been my usual polite self, but I'm not trying to convince people to get on my side and help a cause


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## Moomin1 (29 December 2012)

Landcruiser said:



			Oh for goodness sake. I know the horses didn't die because they are thin! I was being sarcastic (spells it out).

 I know these owners, I know the horses, and I know THEY know how to look after them, in normal circumstances. Things have clearly gone very wrong though, and the people who have spotted the problem and worked to help the horses are to be commended, not criticised! I hate these forum spats - where do you get off, being so negative and critical and downright petty?
		
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How, in any way, was my comment about decomposing animals and body matter, negative, critical or petty?  Enlighten me?  It happens to be truth, I come across plenty of dead and rotting animals, and have stood in on plenty of post mortems, listening to plenty of veterinary pathologists and reading their reports.

If you are so sensitive as to get uppity about a comment like that then you need to go and lay in a darkened room with a cold flannel and calm down!


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## peek-a-boo (29 December 2012)

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ls-rescues--thousands-completely-healthy.html


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## Landcruiser (29 December 2012)

I was speaking more generally.


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## {97702} (29 December 2012)

Ditto DecemberBlossom's post - the abuse and vitriol aimed at local horse owners who didnt jump on the bandwagon of those "argumentative young madams" (nice phrase!) is totally unacceptable, and this is what has caused so much upset locally with this situation.  

Doubtless there will be those who post and say that nothing would have been done unless those individuals had raised awareness; that is quite possibly the case, however it would have been far more helpful and beneficial for people to be mature enough to work together in the rescue of the horses instead of trying to score points against others on Facebook or internet forums.


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## {97702} (29 December 2012)

peek-a-boo said:



http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ls-rescues--thousands-completely-healthy.html

Click to expand...

There are far worse things that can happen to any animal than it is humanely destroyed, as this incident has proved.

Mind you, if you quote the DailyFail as a source......


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## maggie mae an storm (29 December 2012)

Picklenash said:



			There are far worse things that can happen to any animal than it is humanely destroyed, as this incident has proved.

Mind you, if you quote the DailyFail as a source......

Click to expand...

You can believe it though. I've been keeping an out for 11 horses up for adoption on there website since February. An so far i have found 3. An by all means they said they would send us pictures of them. We never got them. So you could criticize or believe it is up to you.


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## rockysmum (29 December 2012)

I dont see the point of this thread anymore.  The horses are safe (well I hope so)

We have trolls joining to post on it.  And some long standing members are trying to defend these owners .  

Concerned people were just after a free horse FFS 

Not a good day for HHO


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## Shadow the Reindeer (29 December 2012)

The horse's that were supposedly a tad 'fat'.. they have their winter coats, and if they're half as thick as my horse's coat, then looks can be deceiving, I personally think a lot of them are borderline, certainly leaning to towards far too thin. That appaloosa certainly was underweight


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## {97702} (29 December 2012)

rockysmum said:



			I dont see the point of this thread anymore.  The horses are safe (well I hope so)

We have trolls joining to post on it.  And some long standing members are trying to defend these owners .  

Concerned people were just after a free horse FFS 

Not a good day for HHO
		
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Just as a matter of interest Rockysmum, are you a member of the Gloucestershire Horse Riders group on FB?  If not, then you will not know the full story of what has been happening.


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## maggie mae an storm (29 December 2012)

rockysmum said:



			I dont see the point of this thread anymore.  The horses are safe (well I hope so)

We have trolls joining to post on it.  And some long standing members are trying to defend these owners .  

Concerned people were just after a free horse FFS 

Not a good day for HHO
		
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Hope you ain't branding me a troll? I just like voicing my opinion an i have a profile on here already though in the confusion of the past year i have lost my piece of paper with my password.


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## {97702} (29 December 2012)

maggie mae an storm said:



			You can believe it though. I've been keeping an out for 11 horses up for adoption on there website since February. An so far i have found 3. An by all means they said they would send us pictures of them. We never got them. So you could criticize or believe it is up to you.
		
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Sorry, I'm really not trying to be rude, but what are you asking me here?  If you are asking me whether I support the RSPCAs actions, no I definitely do not.  They have been clearly shown to have not taken action here in a serious case.


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## peek-a-boo (29 December 2012)

To be honest I don't give a damm how you take my comments as anyone reading through will speak for its self! where the horses has to swim the current was taking them it was not a short swim in a puddle its very cold water I know I was in it a few days before helping a shetland pony! its cold are draining to a strong horse let alone old and ill animals. I am glad you still feel the need to belittle what people are trying to do just shows what sort of person you are. 
I have no wish for anything only to see these horses safe and spent the day trying to find centres to take them in as mine is full! Now I am off to bed as I was up till midnight trying to help last night.


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## rockysmum (29 December 2012)

Picklenash said:



			Just as a matter of interest Rockysmum, are you a member of the Gloucestershire Horse Riders group on FB?  If not, then you will not know the full story of what has been happening.
		
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Yes



maggie mae an storm said:



			Hope you ain't branding me a troll? I just like voicing my opinion an i have a profile on here already though in the confusion of the past year i have lost my piece of paper with my password.
		
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And Yes


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## AprilBlossom (29 December 2012)

Argumentative madam then  I've congratulated the efforts in uncovering evidence of animal cruelty and the plight of these horses (flooding or no flooding). I will never agree with the way it was handled initially, nor the conduct of certain individuals ranging from those pleading poverty one day then the next offering to 'rehome' one of these horses, to those who would be better off joining rent-a-mob. 


Rockysmum, what's really got my goat is the behaviour on a local fb group causing members to be banned then suddenly new members popping up on here with the same posting style and opinions.


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## {97702} (29 December 2012)

Even though your profile says you live in Leeds?  How unusual.  So you will be aware of how all this issue blew up a few days ago, and about how people have been acting throughout, I am surprised you find that acceptable.


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## maggie mae an storm (29 December 2012)

rockysmum said:



			Yes



And Yes
		
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Your kidding me right? If i was a troll i would have been ripping you to pieces by now. Seens as though i am not then obviously not a troll.


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## Moomin1 (29 December 2012)

DecemberBlossom said:



			Argumentative madam then  I've congratulated the efforts in uncovering evidence of animal cruelty and the plight of these horses (flooding or no flooding). I will never agree with the way it was handled initially, nor the conduct of certain individuals ranging from those pleading poverty one day then the next offering to 'rehome' one of these horses, to those who would be better off joining rent-a-mob. 


Rockysmum, what's really got my goat is the behaviour on a local fb group causing members to be banned then suddenly new members popping up on here with the same posting style and opinions.
		
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How have they been acting, I can't seem to find anything?


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## rockysmum (29 December 2012)

DecemberBlossom said:



			Rockysmum, what's really got my goat is the behaviour on a local fb group causing members to be banned then suddenly new members popping up on here with the same posting style and opinions.
		
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Yes I could see how it was being handled.  Of course I dont agree with that, but this thread is making HHO as bad.  Those poor horses, there is no defending them being allowed to live like that.



Picklenash said:



			Even though your profile says you live in Leeds?  How unusual.  So you will be aware of how all this issue blew up a few days ago, and about how people have been acting throughout, I am surprised you find that acceptable.
		
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I joined because it was suggested on here that they were organising some sort of help, not to join rent a mob.



maggie mae an storm said:



			Your kidding me right? If i was a troll i would have been ripping you to pieces by now. Seens as though i am not then obviously not a troll.
		
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Feel free


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## Hairy Old Cob (29 December 2012)

Lets Hope that all the poor live horses have now left this god for saken Shi** hole where they should never have been in the first place see my earlier post it is now time to put away the hand bags and stop bitching and make sure this doesnt happen again.


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## AprilBlossom (29 December 2012)

RM - yes, I agree, and I have eaten my words regarding my initial opinions about it not being that bad - No one should be able to let animals get into that state (the dead/dying, I must say there are some that looked reasonable, not GOOD, but reasonable from what I've viewed first hand) and if getting awareness of that has been achieved then there has been success. 

I'm just loathed to say this as the self important lot who've been helping in the hope of personal gain of some sort will not realise that I am not congratulating them and their efforts, merely fortunate coincidence allowing a proportion of the stricken horses a lifeline at least.


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## Highlands (29 December 2012)

rockysmum said:



			EMW are appealing for anyone local with waterproof rugs they can spare to get in touch.

Poor poor ponies
		
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Brill, I will have a look what I have.... I am going there way on Monday!


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## weebarney (29 December 2012)

Well thank god SOMEONE did SOMETHING!


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## peek-a-boo (29 December 2012)

Thank you, But I would like to say that tarring everyone with the same brush is never a good idea I am old and wiser now and have no need to gain anything. I have my kids my life and content with  that, Yes I know some of the younger people get carried away and they have been told! we don't want actions of some to mar the whole thing some people who have stood watch over this do deserve credit for what they have done and continue to do. These horses wouldn't have eaten today if its was left to the owners they only got clean water today. Some of us who have not been jumping up and down in the spot light have only the welfare of the horses in mind. We are hoping for a happy ending and yes some of the animals were very well fed.


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## TeamChaser (30 December 2012)

Clearly some personal vendetta's going on between here and the GHR site which is a shame because the only thing that should matter is the welfare of these horses


There have been some downright nasty posts on here and I can't believe anyone could try and justify the conditions those horses have been kept in. Whether they look skinny at the moment or not is pretty irrelevant IMHO. Since this area last flooded in November I can't believe conditions can have improved much in the intervening time as it's largely remained somewhere between damp, and monsoon like! If people hadn't intervened - how much longer would they have remained there? How skinny would they have to become before you feel action should be taken? Are the owners only reacting now because their hand has been forced anyway? Really surprised at some of the sentiment on here. Sure it's wet and muddy everywhere at the moment but would you really leave your horses in such conditions? And as for jokes about decomposing bodies of young horses .... really??

I don't know any of the people involved in trying to help, despite being relatively local, no comment to make on personalities involved (which to me is pretty bloody irrelevant anyway!) just glad that something has been done and I hope the authorities will take action against owners. If I can offer any practical help, I'm more than happy to do so


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## Highlands (30 December 2012)

Team chaser, totally agree!

I do know some of the people and the ones I know are knowledge horse lovers who would help because of the horses not because they want a freebie ( including all its added extras.... It's been warm and wet so sure lice is an issue)


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## Moomin1 (30 December 2012)

TeamChaser said:



			Clearly some personal vendetta's going on between here and the GHR site which is a shame because the only thing that should matter is the welfare of these horses


There have been some downright nasty posts on here and I can't believe anyone could try and justify the conditions those horses have been kept in. Whether they look skinny at the moment or not is pretty irrelevant IMHO. Since this area last flooded in November I can't believe conditions can have improved much in the intervening time as it's largely remained somewhere between damp, and monsoon like! If people hadn't intervened - how much longer would they have remained there? How skinny would they have to become before you feel action should be taken? Are the owners only reacting now because their hand has been forced anyway? Really surprised at some of the sentiment on here. Sure it's wet and muddy everywhere at the moment but would you really leave your horses in such conditions? And as for jokes about decomposing bodies of young horses .... really??

I don't know any of the people involved in trying to help, despite being relatively local, no comment to make on personalities involved (which to me is pretty bloody irrelevant anyway!) just glad that something has been done and I hope the authorities will take action against owners. If I can offer any practical help, I'm more than happy to do so
		
Click to expand...

Yet another hysterical answer - JOKES ABOUT DECOMPOSING BODIES?!!  Do you think I was joking?  That is fact.  I wouldn't joke about that sort of thing


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## Dobiegirl (30 December 2012)

Ive kept up to date with this on fb and been horrified at all the in fighting, now ET from EMW is involved things seem to be moving and she has actually been there and reported back. As Rubysmum said they are appealing for rugs so anyone able to help 5ft 9"" and upwards are needed.


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## TeamChaser (30 December 2012)

Moomince Pie said:



			You do realise that dead animals decompose and lose body matter don't you?!!  Therefore appearing to be thin?

Click to expand...

Of course it's a fact that dead animals decompose and lose body matter but I'm pretty sure that the poster that commented was not indicating that a carcass would look any other way? I found your sarcastic comment (complete with winking smilie) unnecessary in this context - just as I now find your resulting to cheap insults unnecessary. Does that make me a hysterical, fluffly bunny hugger Moomince Pie?? Or is it in fact a requirement to share your viewpoint in order to be accepted as relevant on this forum?


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## joeanne (30 December 2012)

Having seen the pictures......the dead foals are certainly not a figment of anyone's imagination.
However, the mob mentality will never work in a situation like this. Its taken the support of people like Elaine at EMW (who has slaved like a dog today to get anywhere with this!) and others like her, who understand they way these things have to be worked, and ensure it is done so.
If my understanding is correct, tonight they are on hardstanding and have forage.
Tomorrow is another day and I am sure Elaine and the rest of the organisations involved will continue the slog to get the remaining animals somewhere safe.


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## joeanne (30 December 2012)

Moomince Pie said:



			Yet another hysterical answer - JOKES ABOUT DECOMPOSING BODIES?!!  Do you think I was joking?  That is fact.  I wouldn't joke about that sort of thing
		
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I have seen the pictures...not one but TWO dead foals, buried in a pit with tarps and a tree to "mark the spot".
The ultimate issue is not that they died, but WHY and HOW they died, and whether or not veterinary care was provided when it was needed.
There is no joke to be had over that....or debate over whether a dead body loses condition......


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## Moomin1 (30 December 2012)

joeanne said:



			I have seen the pictures...not one but TWO dead foals, buried in a pit with tarps and a tree to "mark the spot".
The ultimate issue is not that they died, but WHY and HOW they died, and whether or not veterinary care was provided when it was needed.
There is no joke to be had over that....or debate over whether a dead body loses condition......
		
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Quite, but who joked about it?!!!!!!!

Also, you really think that from a decomposed animal anybody can tell whether they died from this or that or whether they suffered or not or were treated or not?  No, they very rarely can.  The only answers that can be gained with respect to that are by someone investigating with the owner.

Does it for instance cross your mind (just an example now) that maybe, those horses were pts humanely, then dumped in the ditch, with a tarpaulin and tree to mark the spot?!! Yes, an issue for environmental health in that case.  

That being said, you may of course be right.


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## noobs31 (30 December 2012)

Moomince Pie said:



			Quite, but who joked about it?!!!!!!!
		
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You did.  Give it up, Moomince Pie.  Have you not noticed that your fellow overly-vocal and downright nasty naysayers earlier on the thread went eerily silent after the photos were posted?  Just you left now.  Noone's backing you up any more.

TeamChaser puts it well, I won't say it again.  None of us knew for sure in the first place just how bad this situation was, but there was no need for the ganging up and rudeness in the earlier pages.

Some "long-standing" (as they like to call themselves, as though it endows their opinions greater clout) HHO members have really shown themselves up here.  Only one that I've seen has been big enough to see the photos and say "I take it back".

Glad to see the authorities are now acting.  Yes animals are lost every day, but the attempt to conceal four dead foals makes my blood run cold and I for one want this case and owner properly looked at so the FACTS can be established.


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## Milkmaid (30 December 2012)

I applaud all those that are helping but fear these poor beasts are just having the agony of life prolonged :-(
The scum that own these animals will never changed


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## Milkmaid (30 December 2012)

I applaud all those that are helping but fear these poor beasts are just having the agony of life prolonged :-(
The scum that own these animals will never change, shown by their attitude. 
And as for the RSPCA......Someone needs to pull the plug on them, they are utterly useless!


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## EstherYoung (30 December 2012)

ps The fire brigade do charge for non-human rescues. They do have the power to waive the charge in exceptional circumstances but normally, they charge. When my horse got stuck in a ditch they did waive the charge but before their gaffer signed it off they did warn me that their standard rate was around £200 per horse. They're not a charity....


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## rockysmum (30 December 2012)

OK folks I am calling a truce

Lets forget what happened in the past and help those horses that are still there.

Come on HHO its still Christmas (well sort of)

If EMW are on the spot and helping out then lets see if we can help them out.

Does anyone have a link to a page where we can donate to them.

Do they need anything other than rugs.


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## rockysmum (30 December 2012)

Right, found it



http://www.facebook.com/#!/EMWUKElaine



We should be able to do something.  This thread has 26,000 views


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## ester (30 December 2012)

joeanne said:



			I have seen the pictures...not one but TWO dead foals, buried in a pit with tarps and a tree to "mark the spot".
The ultimate issue is not that they died, but WHY and HOW they died, and whether or not veterinary care was provided when it was needed.
There is no joke to be had over that....or debate over whether a dead body loses condition......
		
Click to expand...

and why they weren't disposed of properly as I believe that is likely to be an offence in itself. It is interesting to hear that there are other pics as the one posted on here looked more bovine than equine to me, although I am not sure that makes any difference other than as a point of accuracy iyswim.


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## TeamChaser (30 December 2012)

Only 6 horses left this morning and one would assume they are the last to be moved.  It seems owner may have got wind of authorities on way today(finally!) including CEO of RSPCA 


Those that have organised the efforts to help these horses have also I believe found out where they have been moved to and contacted Welsh welfare agencies to notify them of the situation. Gives me some comfort that they've not gone from one awful situiation to another


There seems to be quite a lot of press activity as well - the BBC down there today - so I wouldn't imagine this will just be left to quietly go unnoticed.


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## luckypeggy (30 December 2012)

It's a shame the press and RSPCA didnt manage to get there yesterday to see all of it, fingers crossed they are still interested in it all. Apparently the land they have been moved to isn't great but at least isn't a flood plain!


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## JanetGeorge (30 December 2012)

rockysmum said:



			If EMW are on the spot and helping out then lets see if we can help them out.

Does anyone have a link to a page where we can donate to them.

Do they need anything other than rugs.
		
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At last news from Elaine, they had enough rugs thanks to some super people - but money is ALWAYS needed.  There's a link in my signature to the official 'just giving' page.


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## Milkmaid (30 December 2012)

Another case of too little, too late from the RSPCA.....
This has been going on since November.....
Sickening but at least now these scumbags will be watched, hopefully more closely! 
If the RSPCA do get their act together I am sure there is enough evidence for a case to ban him keeping anmals but if he is like all the rest any future beasts will just be `owned` by other family members.


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## DJ (30 December 2012)

Milkmaid said:



			Another case of too little, too late from the RSPCA.....
This has been going on since November.....
Sickening but at least now these scumbags will be watched, hopefully more closely! 
If the RSPCA do get their act together I am sure there is enough evidence for a case to ban him keeping anmals but if he is like all the rest any future beasts will just be `owned` by other family members.
		
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Couldn`t agree more ........ may i just point out this article from the 29th of November:


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-gloucestershire-20539048


and i quote: *"An RSPCA spokesperson said a flotation platform was also needed to take the vet to the horses and there was concern for a few foals in the herd."*


This says it all in my opinion ..... especially as at least 2 of these foals are now dead ....


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## Landcruiser (30 December 2012)

Milkmaid said:



			I applaud all those that are helping but fear these poor beasts are just having the agony of life prolonged :-(
The scum that own these animals will never changed
		
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Milkmaid, I am in no way defending the owners (and if you read my previous posts here, you'll know that I find the current situation unforgivable, and I fully support the rescue action). I just want to say that I do know the owners - I bought my first horse from them, and my second had also been bought from them before I had him. Those horses aren't traveller horses, auction buys, whatever. They are mostly biddable, clever, tough criollo riding and working horses. With a little bit of feeding and health care, most of them can go on to be just what they were meant to be...don't give up on them!

Until recently, the horses have been in decent condition, and as far as I know, looked after at least adequately. The owners are very experienced with criollos, and seem to genuinely care about the breed. Things have clearly gone very wrong recently and it's a shame they didn't ask for help before it came to this.


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## Highlands (30 December 2012)

I have two rugs to take, if anyone wants to pm me I can pick up enroute from Worcester area.


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## foraday (30 December 2012)

2013 campaigning by Equine Market Watch Sanctuaries (UK) donate today 

Text EMWS13 add £1 and send to 70070.. We thank you for your kind support.

Message from Elaine Tasker Charity CEO for Equine Market Watch


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## Honey08 (30 December 2012)

TeamChaser said:



			There have been some downright nasty posts on here and I can't believe anyone could try and justify the conditions those horses have been kept in. Whether they look skinny at the moment or not is pretty irrelevant IMHO. Since this area last flooded in November I can't believe conditions can have improved much in the intervening time as it's largely remained somewhere between damp, and monsoon like! If people hadn't intervened - how much longer would they have remained there? How skinny would they have to become before you feel action should be taken? Are the owners only reacting now because their hand has been forced anyway? Really surprised at some of the sentiment on here. Sure it's wet and muddy everywhere at the moment but would you really leave your horses in such conditions? And as for jokes about decomposing bodies of young horses .... really??

I don't know any of the people involved in trying to help, despite being relatively local, no comment to make on personalities involved (which to me is pretty bloody irrelevant anyway!) just glad that something has been done and I hope the authorities will take action against owners. If I can offer any practical help, I'm more than happy to do so
		
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Agree with this.  There have been some shocking posts on this thread.  If you don't want to get involved, don't, but don't criticise those  that do.  If my horses were stuck like that, and I had let them become stuck (feet of water don't appear in a nano second, it creeps up) then I would deserve the criticism and appreciate the help.

Glad to hear some sensible, experienced people got involved, and didn't listen to the "they're fine" brigade.

And what the heck does being a regular poster have to do with the ability to talk sense!!??


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## Kokopelli (30 December 2012)

I heard the dead foals were pts by rspca and owner told to sort disposal of bodies which obviously he didn't. Not sure of true as there's a lot of rumours going around.


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## ILuvCowparsely (30 December 2012)

FWIW  I think if you help with this situation good on you.  You should not be critizied for helping poor animals out of this horrid situation. My views on the RSPCA   is not worth  the time.


 If I lived nearer to these poor horses I would be down there in a shot doing what ever I could to help.
  How can so called horse people critizise people for giving up their time their resources to help  a creature in need.  If you don't want to help then go about your life and leave those who are willing or wanting to help.

 in a big thread like this you always get the wants the point why bother  posts from those  sad individuals.

 The video and pictures are heart breaking


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## Amymay (30 December 2012)

Good to hear via Facebook that the most immediate needs of the horses have been taken care of.

For latest updates please check EMW.


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## jhoward (30 December 2012)

amymay said:



			Good to hear via Facebook that the most immediate needs of the horses have been taken care of.

For latest updates please check EMW.
		
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even emw dont know if all the horses have been taken


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## *Spider* (30 December 2012)

Read this thread from top to bottom. Can not believe my eyes. Some people are certainly eating a lot of humble pie.
A huge well done to the people helping these poor horses.
If anyone needs my help, please PM me, I'll be over in a heart beat.


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## Hairy Old Cob (30 December 2012)

Kokopelli said:



			I heard the dead foals were pts by rspca and owner told to sort disposal of bodies which obviously he didn't. Not sure of true as there's a lot of rumours going around.
		
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Their is also a She involved who is featured in a rspca clip being interviewed and not trying to defend the owners in any way if they couldnt get live horses out how are they going to get carcasses out.


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## DragonSlayer (30 December 2012)

Can't believe some of the comments on here.

The fact that people got up off their arses to try to make things better for these horses is to be commended.

The fact that dead animals have been found (PTS or otherwise) and NOT been disposed of correctly is outrageous.

The fact that it has had to take a lot of foot stamping and shouting to raise awareness is also outrageous, give people a break who actually CARE enough to do something about it. If it had been my neck of the woods, I would have done the same thing.


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## PandorasJar (30 December 2012)

I know nothing on this case and certainly not defending it. But honey08.. we have a local village which is built on flood plains. Had lots of new builds as not flooded in a very long time (over my lifetime). When it did flood a few years back there were sheds completely submerged in a number of days, the first day alone saw feet of water. It was very fast and very few people managed to move anything out, let alone a large number of animals. Ironically it's not been touched in all the rain this year.

Well done to all those helping. Regardless of who or what has happened it's the horses right now that should be priority.


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## Honey08 (30 December 2012)

PandorasJar said:



			I know nothing on this case and certainly not defending it. But honey08.. we have a local village which is built on flood plains. Had lots of new builds as not flooded in a very long time (over my lifetime). When it did flood a few years back there were sheds completely submerged in a number of days, the first day alone saw feet of water. It was very fast and very few people managed to move anything out, let alone a large number of animals. Ironically it's not been touched in all the rain this year.

Well done to all those helping. Regardless of who or what has happened it's the horses right now that should be priority.
		
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Fair enough, sometimes it does happen quickly then, but generally speaking you would surely have time to do something? If you live on floodplain, surely you would have a just in case plan, I think I would.  I'm lucky enough to live in an area that is always boggy and wet but never floods, touch wood!


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## Rose Folly (30 December 2012)

This whole thread has been one of the most sickening and sad I've seen - not only on the state of the horses (and we flood here so I know what I'm talking about); but also because of the appalling negative attitude, bitchiness and insensitivity displayed by some of the posters. You will know who you are, and in my book you are a disgrace to the riding community. 

Well LandCruiser, Peek-a-boo, TeamChaser and others. Thank God there are still some true horsemen about.

At the end of the day I couldn't care a **** about trolls, Facebook, GRH versus whoever. There were 60 horses in a rotten place, and if it hadn't been for people speaking up and kicking up a fuss, things would have just gone from bad to worse.


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## Rose Folly (30 December 2012)

That should have read "Well done LandCruiser...."! Sorry!


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## PandorasJar (30 December 2012)

As I said it's never happened in my lifetime nor anyone else I spoke to, and not this year. There are no rivers on the doorstep of the flooded houses and people got relaxed about it. There were many including friends of mine who werent even aware of it.
It's one thing I'm so cautious about is finding plains and making sure that I'm covered for flooding but for many it's not something to think about.
There's a lovely place near us called water meadpws. A London couple bough it and the back garden ends in a river that frequently floods they had no knowledge of this and hadn't crossed their minds it would be a problem.
I live opposite a place called flood meadows... Which I've never seen the river even near bursting let alone flooding level.
To move 60horses is a big thing... I've not read the story (am on phone) but could see the problem becoming over whelming and the situation getting out of control quickly.
I've emergency land for my lot but have nowhere near that amount and would still not happen overnight. I also wouldn't be putting them deep littered in barns as suggested on the fb page as the barns are surrounded by water. They'd be enclosed with flooding all around, not the safest place to be.


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## JJones (30 December 2012)

These people have moved back to near where they used to live a few years ago, they were well liked and the horses were well cared for. It sounds like things got out of control and very fast. I heard over a month ago that they were trying to rent where they are now, so i dont think they were ignoring the situation, trying to find somewhere that would be able to take all the horses. A huge undertaking. The foals were pts 2 weeks ago (been confirmed) and the bodies werent disposed of but when half your place is underwater i can imagine more serious things were on their mind. Thankfully, they are now on dry ground & safe from futher flood plains.


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## honetpot (30 December 2012)

I have lived on the edge of a flood plain for the past 23 years and fields that have never flooded in that time have flooded this year. I have just purchased 14 acres which I bought in January, its been in the same family for years and looking at the lie of the ground perhaps 30-40 years a go they put in drainage ditchs which because they have never been needed have filled up and the surrrounding ground raised so I have spent the last two days trying to make channels to get the water away.
 I am lucky in that I have concrete yards to put my animals but if I have bought/rented land without these I would be in deep ****, as it is its taking 3 times as long to feed because of the mud.
 There is a saying 'there for the grace of god go I', and I can not for the life of me understand why anyone would criticise someone for showing concern wether they thought it jusified or not, there are plenty of people who are happy to think,'its not my problem'. As always internet forums are such an education in human nature


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## Mariposa (30 December 2012)

Well now its front page of the Mail online too....hopefully the ponies will get the help they clearly need...

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2254785/UK-floods-Three-ponies-left-marooned-water.html


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## PandorasJar (30 December 2012)

What on earth does that have to do with anything.


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## peek-a-boo (30 December 2012)

Nicky Turner-Sterling
Hi everyone, Thanks for being patient, I have been down with the horses since 8am and have only just got home after winding down our 'operation'. Several things we wanted to be achieved have been achieved which has been great. 

Firstly we wanted the plight of the horses to be highlighted to ensure that they were taken off the small island they were on, at the barns. As obviously this was a potentially really bad situation for them. The fire service were wonderful in this, in that once they could see how bad the situation was, they mobilised their team, to have the horses moved, and supported the owners to ensure this was done safely (ie no one drowned). The failure at this point was that none of the horses, once swum across received any veterinary care, and were left in freezing cold and very wet conditions, soaked through, with no water. It was apparent at this point, that whilst many of the criollo horses were not suffering weight condition wise (criollos are excellent dooers and hold their meat) there were many who were struggling to walk, hobbling, hopping lame, eye infections, open wounds etc. The non criollo breeds (for example one of the appaloosa's) WERE under weight. Hence why there was a mixture of conditions there, some obviously being worse than others. When it became apparent that they were not being provided basic care by the owners IE: vet care, fresh water, hay. This then became our next priority. 

Thanks to the donation from Animal Aid a vet was provided last night at their cost. Due to the generosity of some amazing people turning up to help us, we were able to supply the horses with hay (provided for by the horse community) rugs to help keep them dry and warm (again donated by the horse community) and fresh water was provided by a very kind man from Severn Trent who put a tap in for us. Plus lots of love and kindness was poured into these animals by everyone involved, who were hands on at the site. Ensuring that whilst the horses were on site they were given the best care that we could possibly provide them. There are things going on in the background I cant discuss for legal reasons, but this is definitely not the end of this. 

The RSPCA's failure in this case has been a HUGE lack of communication. I have a very lengthy discussion with the 2 officers who attended the site today, and got my point across. Whilst some of you guys are being very anti the RSPCA, they are not blind the fact that this situation, especially from the owners point of view, could have been handled much better (in that he could have done more to ensure their safety). They also I feel, have taken the owners word for many things (which were essentially untrue), which I feel they should not have done, but this is to be addressed at a later date. We did set them straight on quite a few things, as the owner had been lying to them about certain things, like saying he had provided basic care etc and he hadn't, and they were under the impression it was him that had provided the vet care, when it wasn't. 

We were hoping to prove a welfare case for the remaining animals yesterday, as some, especially the non criollo breeds were in very poor condition (underweight, hopping lame etc) but unfortunately this became impossible when in the night, he took the worst cases away!  Making it hard for us to prove the welfare case we had set up yesterday, with the help of the vet, police etc, who were due to attend today. 

We had 2 vets attend to the horses this morning who donated their time, who were able to give them small treatments to ease suffering which was awesome. The welfare agencies who are involved will be attending and following up their standard of care etc. So this is not the end of it from their point of view, they will be ensuring the horses have continued good care. 

The sad truth is that many of these horses are destined for the specialised meat trade. 

Regarding the dead foals, it was confirmed to me today that these foals had been pts due to contracting salmonella. How they contracted it...well this can be from other horses, contaminated feed, contaminated stabling areas, from the ground or water, stress, many things. Obviously their conditions were less than ideal and being foals they would have been more susceptible. PPL on site were warned to disinfect themselves and boots etc. The bodys should not have been dumped, and again the owner lied to the RSPCA saying someone had come to collect them, and we had stopped them, and having been there yesterday all day, we know this not to be true. Personally I had also tried to get the environment agency involved to dispose of them correctly, as they are on a water causeway, and so that was just rubbish plain and simple.

Everything we set out to achieve initially, we achieved, whilst due to the removal of the worst cases, we were unable to prove a welfare case. I am extremely proud of the whole horse community who came together to try and provide a good and LOVING and KIND standard of care to these beautiful, sad animals. All of you who came down to be hands on, should be immensely proud of yourselves, seriously. Also there have been many many welfare agencies involved like horse watch, and WHW and bridgend and VANAH who have been amazing in providing background assistance, phone calls, emails, etc etc and some attending the site today. They will continue the work that we are unable to do. As previously said due to legal reasons I cant tell you whats going on, but this is not the end of the plight of these horses. 

Thank you to everyone who provided your time, money, food, hay, rugs, and even hot drinks and food for the volunteers. I just don't think Thanks is adequate. I am totally over whelmed by the kindness I have seen over the last few days. Its like I said today, with all the hate and vileness in this world, it makes a refreshing change and a wonderful sight to see a community pull together like this. You are all AMAZING. THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU.

Please note I am ill I have bronchitis and a chest infection, which was making me quite poorly at the site today, on top of a chronic illness (I have M.E). I am exhausted and have struggled all day. I will try to answer questions as much as possible, but I need to rest. So please be patient.

Just an admin note: I will not be allowing this group to be used to slander and attack, abuse anyone.Trolling will not be tolerated. This is not what CH is about, its about welfare of horses, and will be continued for this. If your not here for that, you will be removed. I hate to be harsh, but have seen a few trolling posts and abuse and this is not what I want for the group. Debate yes, be passionate and caring yes. Abusive, vile, mean, attacking. NO. Personal details of ANYONE are not to be shared on this site, and will be removed. I am asking for your cooperation, as some of the things posted on this group, did not help our case at all, as it was being monitored by the authorities. Failure to comply will result in your removal. Thanks.


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## peek-a-boo (30 December 2012)

That was what was put up on the site causeway horses by Nicky tonight.


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## Penks (30 December 2012)

Rose Folly said:



			This whole thread has been one of the most sickening and sad I've seen - not only on the state of the horses (and we flood here so I know what I'm talking about); but also because of the appalling negative attitude, bitchiness and insensitivity displayed by some of the posters. You will know who you are, and in my book you are a disgrace to the riding community. 

Well LandCruiser, Peek-a-boo, TeamChaser and others. Thank God there are still some true horsemen about.

At the end of the day I couldn't care a **** about trolls, Facebook, GRH versus whoever. There were 60 horses in a rotten place, and if it hadn't been for people speaking up and kicking up a fuss, things would have just gone from bad to worse.
		
Click to expand...

Hear hear. 






peek-a-boo said:



			Nicky Turner-Sterling
Hi everyone, Thanks for being patient, I have been down with the horses since 8am and have only just got home after winding down our 'operation'. Several things we wanted to be achieved have been achieved which has been great. 

Firstly we wanted the plight of the horses to be highlighted to ensure that they were taken off the small island they were on, at the barns. As obviously this was a potentially really bad situation for them. The fire service were wonderful in this, in that once they could see how bad the situation was, they mobilised their team, to have the horses moved, and supported the owners to ensure this was done safely (ie no one drowned). The failure at this point was that none of the horses, once swum across received any veterinary care, and were left in freezing cold and very wet conditions, soaked through, with no water. It was apparent at this point, that whilst many of the criollo horses were not suffering weight condition wise (criollos are excellent dooers and hold their meat) there were many who were struggling to walk, hobbling, hopping lame, eye infections, open wounds etc. The non criollo breeds (for example one of the appaloosa's) WERE under weight. Hence why there was a mixture of conditions there, some obviously being worse than others. When it became apparent that they were not being provided basic care by the owners IE: vet care, fresh water, hay. This then became our next priority. 

Thanks to the donation from Animal Aid a vet was provided last night at their cost. Due to the generosity of some amazing people turning up to help us, we were able to supply the horses with hay (provided for by the horse community) rugs to help keep them dry and warm (again donated by the horse community) and fresh water was provided by a very kind man from Severn Trent who put a tap in for us. Plus lots of love and kindness was poured into these animals by everyone involved, who were hands on at the site. Ensuring that whilst the horses were on site they were given the best care that we could possibly provide them. There are things going on in the background I cant discuss for legal reasons, but this is definitely not the end of this. 

The RSPCA's failure in this case has been a HUGE lack of communication. I have a very lengthy discussion with the 2 officers who attended the site today, and got my point across. Whilst some of you guys are being very anti the RSPCA, they are not blind the fact that this situation, especially from the owners point of view, could have been handled much better (in that he could have done more to ensure their safety). They also I feel, have taken the owners word for many things (which were essentially untrue), which I feel they should not have done, but this is to be addressed at a later date. We did set them straight on quite a few things, as the owner had been lying to them about certain things, like saying he had provided basic care etc and he hadn't, and they were under the impression it was him that had provided the vet care, when it wasn't. 

We were hoping to prove a welfare case for the remaining animals yesterday, as some, especially the non criollo breeds were in very poor condition (underweight, hopping lame etc) but unfortunately this became impossible when in the night, he took the worst cases away!  Making it hard for us to prove the welfare case we had set up yesterday, with the help of the vet, police etc, who were due to attend today. 

We had 2 vets attend to the horses this morning who donated their time, who were able to give them small treatments to ease suffering which was awesome. The welfare agencies who are involved will be attending and following up their standard of care etc. So this is not the end of it from their point of view, they will be ensuring the horses have continued good care. 

The sad truth is that many of these horses are destined for the specialised meat trade. 

Regarding the dead foals, it was confirmed to me today that these foals had been pts due to contracting salmonella. How they contracted it...well this can be from other horses, contaminated feed, contaminated stabling areas, from the ground or water, stress, many things. Obviously their conditions were less than ideal and being foals they would have been more susceptible. PPL on site were warned to disinfect themselves and boots etc. The bodys should not have been dumped, and again the owner lied to the RSPCA saying someone had come to collect them, and we had stopped them, and having been there yesterday all day, we know this not to be true. Personally I had also tried to get the environment agency involved to dispose of them correctly, as they are on a water causeway, and so that was just rubbish plain and simple.

Everything we set out to achieve initially, we achieved, whilst due to the removal of the worst cases, we were unable to prove a welfare case. I am extremely proud of the whole horse community who came together to try and provide a good and LOVING and KIND standard of care to these beautiful, sad animals. All of you who came down to be hands on, should be immensely proud of yourselves, seriously. Also there have been many many welfare agencies involved like horse watch, and WHW and bridgend and VANAH who have been amazing in providing background assistance, phone calls, emails, etc etc and some attending the site today. They will continue the work that we are unable to do. As previously said due to legal reasons I cant tell you whats going on, but this is not the end of the plight of these horses. 

Thank you to everyone who provided your time, money, food, hay, rugs, and even hot drinks and food for the volunteers. I just don't think Thanks is adequate. I am totally over whelmed by the kindness I have seen over the last few days. Its like I said today, with all the hate and vileness in this world, it makes a refreshing change and a wonderful sight to see a community pull together like this. You are all AMAZING. THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU.

Please note I am ill I have bronchitis and a chest infection, which was making me quite poorly at the site today, on top of a chronic illness (I have M.E). I am exhausted and have struggled all day. I will try to answer questions as much as possible, but I need to rest. So please be patient.

.
		
Click to expand...

Thank you for the update.


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## canteron (31 December 2012)

Beyond impressed, sad for the poor animals who didn't make it, but I have nothing but admiration for everyone who has helped.


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## GoJo (1 January 2013)

so happy it's all been sorted and horses all moved to safer and drier ground.


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## smellsofhorse (2 January 2013)

Im glad something was done and contunies to be looked into.


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## indie999 (2 January 2013)

blucanoo1990 said:



			Im glad something was done and contunies to be looked into.
		
Click to expand...

Hooray for the welfare agencies locals etc. I have lived on a flood plain and there are plenty of warnings in place by the environment agency, amber and red alert and evacuate houses (sandbags the lot). This was in Hertfordshire too(not many people would think this would happen here..but the Thames barrier in place it has happened just less frequently nowadays but still happened...unfortunately houses have been built on old flood plains more so, since Thames barrier but they will always flood out of London if barrier is breached..I digress sorry). I am at a loss to think this happened overnight, the rain we have had has been long and sustained for many weeks now. Thats what is sad about the whole thing. There have been other incidents along the Severn and its sad it came to this for all concerned. We have all this legislation and welfare in place but still it happens and wont be the last time. Owner excuses are just pathetic when there must have been chances to stop this mess.


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## Merlin11 (2 January 2013)

I haven't read the whole thread but just wanted to say well done to those of you who have helped these poor horses.


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