# Lucinda green Clinic - I Confess to Being a Little Disappointed.............



## charlimouse (2 March 2012)

..............But not in my horse, she was awesome !

First up this morning was a session in the arena, over loads of skinnies, arrowheads etc. Working on control, so starting off in trot, before progressing to canter. Once all the horses amd riders were focused on the job inhand, we did a few combinations on unknown distances to improve the horses footwork. We then progressed onto jumping from walk over some blocks. Jem being a horse of minimal effot just walked through the blocks pushing them out of her way ! We then worked on doing an emergency stop on long reins slightly Mary King style, fro when we have to slip our reins XC. Morning session over, it was a long wait for XC this afternoon.

Off XC, we spent 5 minutes just jumping some straightforwards fences, getting them into a rhythm, and to blow away the cobwebs. I was disappointed to find most of the fences were off limits due to the BE event being run at the venue at the end of March , so we were pretty limited in what we could do, and most of the fences were only about 90cm. Started off walking over a ditch. Jem took Lucinda a little too literally when she said she didn't mind if the horses put a foot in the ditch, by climbing down into it hoof by hoof ! We then added a sheep feeder after, before jumping the full coffin. Jumped a few lines of fences incorporating the coffin, and some angles. Found a couple of bigger fences so I headed off and jumped those, before coming back and jumping a log, turn to a fence in the hedge line, then a turning 3 strides to an arrowhead.













Back to a combination incorporating barrels, to an into space, down a drop turn to a skinny single barrel. Jem caught me out first time by runnung past the barrel . Made her jump it from a very tight turn back, before jumping the whole combination well. Finally we went to play in the water. had a paddle first, before jumping out up a step in walk. We then jumped in over some blue barrels, before finally jumping over the blue barrels that had been put in the edge of the step. I then linked a corner and log in just to make sure Jem was on the ball.

Now if you have got this far you may have noticed, whilst describing the exercises we did, I haven't said much else. This is due to the fact there really isn't anything else to say . I didn't get any feedback, I just did the exercises I was told to do, competently and that was it. I don't think it helped I was the only one in the group wanting to progress beyond BE100, and Lucinda was just kind of like, 'well you can jump that fence if you want'. Nobody else in the group did, but despite this I still got no feedback from LG when I took myself off to jump the more difficult fences. I don't know weather this is a good or bad thing. I didn't earn a single well done, nor were any corrections or comments made. It was like I wasn't there . I just feel for £120 I didn't get much out of it. It would have been more productive to have taken myself off to Somerford Park on my own to jump some more combinations and play round some more interesting fences. 

Ho hum, at least I know my horse was brilliant ! A flat/SJclinic with Ginny turnbull next week and then off to Somerford BE100 to kick off the event season, can't wait !


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## FrodoBeutlin (2 March 2012)

Uhm, what do you mean, no feedback? No comments or corrections made at all? What about the other participants, did they get more feedback? That does sound a little disappointing, £120 is a lot of money for not a lot of training


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## LEC (2 March 2012)

I would be rather peed off if me. Not to say anything, even to talk about your aims and discuss them is pretty poor. £120 is a lot of money as well especially if there is 4 in your group that is £620!!


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## teapot (2 March 2012)

Gah that's disappointing, think this is the first negative feedback I've read or been told about an LG clinic 

Hope next week's one is better


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## charlimouse (2 March 2012)

FrodoBeutlin said:



			Uhm, what do you mean, no feedback? No comments or corrections made at all? What about the other participants, did they get more feedback? That does sound a little disappointing, £120 is a lot of money for not a lot of training 

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No nothing, no comment was made, it was like I wasn't there 



LEC said:



			I would be rather peed off if me. Not to say anything, even to talk about your aims and discuss them is pretty poor. £120 is a lot of money as well especially if there is 4 in your group that is £620!!
		
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We had a brief minute at the beginning just saying what we had done, but nothing else. I did keep trying to remind her I plan to go Novice this season, but we were very limited by the fences available, so we made them as difficult as possible, but just a little feedback would have been nice. There were 5 of us in the group ! 



teapot said:



			Gah that's disappointing, think this is the first negative feedback I've read or been told about an LG clinic 

Hope next week's one is better 

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It should be as it is free !


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## vicky86 (2 March 2012)

I had a lesson with lucinda a few years back, had a good lesson but not tonnes of feed back i have to say. My horse did not get the walk to a ditch concept either, however it was a bit more problematic with him as the ditch was deep (and quite sizey) he put his foot down it, i fell off and he scared himself to death. Subsequently he stopped and the next ditch I attempted which he had never done,in his life, not even the first time he did one, it took me a good long while to get his confidence back and up to the last event I did on him was a bit suspicious of them. 
I understood the concept behind why we were doing it and don't blame lucinda it was just one of those things but I kind of wish I'd never done it. Btw he had evented for about 6 years by then up to novice level and had never misjudged a ditch before so I don't feel he was unsafe or too blarzay about them.
Sorry your lesson wasn't great but your horse looks lovely.


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## Rosiefan (2 March 2012)

How would walking an experienced eventer through a ditch be useful? Genuine question, I'm not trying to be clever.


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## oldvic (2 March 2012)

I suspect that LG is more geared to giving confidence to less experienced horses and riders. As a rider she is more instinctive than a technician so her way is fairly surface. She tends to select shorter striding types that suits her "get behind them and kick" style and always said she found the rangier types harder to ride. These are the ones that require technique as well as instinct.
Frustrating but take it that you weren't giving her too much obvious to say.


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## vicky86 (2 March 2012)

Rosiefan said:



			How would walking an experienced eventer through a ditch be useful? Genuine question, I'm not trying to be clever.
		
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Apparently it was to make him realise where his feet were. He obviously could only work out his foot positioning at trot or above .


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## opinionuk (2 March 2012)

I must confess that i went to one of her clinics last year and was also a little disappointed, I found it was a little ' going through the motions' and wasn't offered much feedback as to what I was doing right or wrong while my horse bounced about on her hind legs, I wouldn't go to one of her clinics again I didn't feel as if I actually learnt anything.


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## fayemouse123 (2 March 2012)

I couldnt agree more, I was really disappointed in my Lucinda Green clinic too.  The most fun and beneficial part like you say was going off and jumping some fences on my own! I do think her clinics are good if you have very young horse, or are struggling a lot with straightness, skinnies and rushing, as the exercises from walk give young horses time to take everything and work things out for themselves and the skinny work in the arena definitely gets them straight and channelled between hand an leg.   However even though I was riding a friends green horse I still found the clinic too slow and whilst she did give me a few useful pointers these were few and far between x


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## LEC (2 March 2012)

oldvic said:



			I suspect that LG is more geared to giving confidence to less experienced horses and riders. As a rider she is more instinctive than a technician so her way is fairly surface. She tends to select shorter striding types that suits her "get behind them and kick" style and always said she found the rangier types harder to ride. These are the ones that require technique as well as instinct.
Frustrating but take it that you weren't giving her too much obvious to say.
		
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That is a really interesting summary OV - who do you think are the modern xc gurus? I would love a session with Blyth Tait but I understand he is not a big fan of teaching. I always loved his books.


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## avthechav (2 March 2012)

Sorry to hear that this was not quite what you needed.  I think that XC clinics are sometimes very expensive for what you get out of them.  I am also very wary after a horrific clinic at Moreton Morrell where I was reduced to tears for about an hour and half by a really nasty and unhelpful BHS instructor.  I think that nowadays instead of risking a confidence blowing session or at best an ok session I would rather save up and pay for a lesson with an instructor who knows me at a local xc course.


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## DarkHorseB (2 March 2012)

LEC said:



			That is a really interesting summary OV - who do you think are the modern xc gurus? I would love a session with Blyth Tait but I understand he is not a big fan of teaching. I always loved his books.
		
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I have had 4 lessons with Blyth Tait (all in an arena) and have to say have found him to be a very inspiring and interested teacher


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## soupdragon71 (2 March 2012)

LEC said:



			That is a really interesting summary OV - who do you think are the modern xc gurus? I would love a session with Blyth Tait but I understand he is not a big fan of teaching. I always loved his books.
		
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Have had a couple of lessons with Blyth, at Mistatiger's place (admittedly in indoor school, but definetely related to xc as well as sj) and he is a brilliant teacher - so encouraging, enthusiastic and makes the lesson a lot of fun! He got on my horse as he was being a prat to start and all I could think was 'a world champion is riding my horse!'. Of course he made him look amazing (as always;p). I don't know how much teaching he does, but if you get a chance do it, as he really is good an wasn't stupidly expensive either.


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## kerilli (2 March 2012)

OP, i've had the same in a LG clinic (have been on quite a few), and the one where she ignored me, I was on my very nice obedient but unflashy little homebred (rock solid Intermediate horse) and we did every exercise totally competently as instructed, but with no 'wow' moments (including when LG wandered in front of the skinny she'd just told me to jump, oops). she doesn't seem to have a lot to say if you are doing a decent job (and the best in the group?) i suspect...  she's very very good, as oldvic says, at instilling confidence and a bit of verve though, I think.
frustrating to be restricted to the small fences, but it sounds as if you and Jem went really well.
tbf it's better than being ripped apart!


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## DarkHorseB (2 March 2012)

That's disappointing CM 
How did you feel it differed to the lesson you had with Millie which you felt really gave you the impetus to get to the next level?


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## TopTotty (2 March 2012)

Well.....please don't get me started.....I went for a two day clinic at Arena Uk, with two horses, two years ago.... stayed the first day for the indoor jumping but was so downhearted by the end of it I just wanted to cry.  She spent all her time on the 'professionals' in my group and I just felt crap and left out.....we left and drove 4 hours home!  I complained and she told me that no one had EVER complained before!!!!  I told her that if I had given a lesson and someone came away feeling like I did I would be gutted........no reponse!!
I had been the previous year with one horse as I won a lesson with her and it was good....but as Charlimouse says....no feedback just a raz over some fences and then jumping xc out of walk.

Charlimouse.....I have just been to Somerford this week.....we decided after that lesson that we would just do it ourselves!!  

On another note whilst I was at Somerford this week we saw another BIG name giving a lesson and it was carnage.....overfacing of horses.....a nightmare from where we were standing....


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## soupdragon71 (2 March 2012)

DarkHorseB said:



			I have had 4 lessons with Blyth Tait (all in an arena) and have to say have found him to be a very inspiring and interested teacher 

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  - snap!!


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## JoJo_ (2 March 2012)

Gosh that doesnt sound worth the money. You probably would have been better to hire an xc course on your own to practice! I have to say when I watched the LG clinic they have put on H&C tv many many times, she seemed to only have anything to say when a combination was really struggling.


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## Fools Motto (2 March 2012)

Not had a LG clinic yet, want to do the Downlands one, but expense of it puts me off, now this news has put me off further.
I have had a Nick Gauntlet clinic at west wilts. I was REALLY disappointed by him arriving 30 mins late, and within 10 mins we moved outside to start jumping. I really wanted advice on the flatwork as that is our weakness. He only told me to smile more and enjoy it!!!
Anyway, the showjumping was great, and the XC - well, I was just used as a 'lead horse' as several others were very ditch shy..... after giving about 50 leads over several ditches, and getting bored I took my chance while being told to link 2 jumps and a ditch together I added some of the other jumps into the mix!! I think, if I looked closely, I may have got a nod of approval!! Nick was fine at the end, but the lack of flatwork for me (promised 2.5 hrs of all three phases combined) did make me feel a little let down. 
Anyway, going back to LG, I guess she is a lady of little words when things are done so perfectly, so you are obviously total stars!!!


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## charlimouse (2 March 2012)

oldvic said:



			I suspect that LG is more geared to giving confidence to less experienced horses and riders. As a rider she is more instinctive than a technician so her way is fairly surface. She tends to select shorter striding types that suits her "get behind them and kick" style and always said she found the rangier types harder to ride. These are the ones that require technique as well as instinct.
Frustrating but take it that you weren't giving her too much obvious to say.
		
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I assume I wasn't doing anything hideously wrong ! Interesting thoughts.



opinionuk said:



			I must confess that i went to one of her clinics last year and was also a little disappointed, I found it was a little ' going through the motions' and wasn't offered much feedback as to what I was doing right or wrong while my horse bounced about on her hind legs, I wouldn't go to one of her clinics again I didn't feel as if I actually learnt anything.
		
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Yes, there was definately a 'going through the motions' feel to it !



kerilli said:



			OP, i've had the same in a LG clinic (have been on quite a few), and the one where she ignored me, I was on my very nice obedient but unflashy little homebred (rock solid Intermediate horse) and we did every exercise totally competently as instructed, but with no 'wow' moments (including when LG wandered in front of the skinny she'd just told me to jump, oops). she doesn't seem to have a lot to say if you are doing a decent job (and the best in the group?) i suspect...  she's very very good, as oldvic says, at instilling confidence and a bit of verve though, I think.
frustrating to be restricted to the small fences, but it sounds as if you and Jem went really well.
tbf it's better than being ripped apart!   

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Agree with this competely. Jem is very obedient, but is a very unremarkable bay TB mare. She is very rhythmic and just puts in the required effot over a fence. Nothing flashy or hugely inspiring, but correct.



DarkHorseB said:



			That's disappointing CM 
How did you feel it differed to the lesson you had with Millie which you felt really gave you the impetus to get to the next level?
		
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The situation with Millie was a bit different. I was far less experianced. I had only done 2 PN's and due to some c*ck up when doing the groups I ended up in a group with Intermediate horses . Little Millie pulled out all the stops, and not only kept up with the other horses, but put a couple to shame . LG was raving about her, because we were expecting nothing, and she surprised us.


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## Third_Time_Lucky (2 March 2012)

OP - After reading your post I'm slightly relieved I wasn't able to get a place for today's clinic.  I applied but it was full and was put on the wait list, received a call Wednesday this week and asked if I wanted to attend tomorrow as she was running an additional day at Thirsk as they had been inundated with applications.  

I wasn't able to take up the place for tomorrow as had other plans so instead (as I had already booked the day off work) went with friends XC schooling and had a really good session (concentrating on jumping skinnies/ditches etc).  Certainly seems I had the better deal, only cost me £15 to go schooling, the money I've saved (£105) not going to Thirsk will get me a few extra lessons with my dressage trainer.


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## georgiegirl (2 March 2012)

Third_Time_Lucky said:



			OP - After reading your post I'm slightly relieved I wasn't able to get a place for today's clinic.  I applied but it was full and was put on the wait list, received a call Wednesday this week and asked if I wanted to attend tomorrow as she was running an additional day at Thirsk as they had been inundated with applications.  

I wasn't able to take up the place for tomorrow as had other plans so instead (as I had already booked the day off work) went with friends XC schooling and had a really good session (concentrating on jumping skinnies/ditches etc).  Certainly seems I had the better deal, only cost me £15 to go schooling, the money I've saved (£105) not going to Thirsk will get me a few extra lessons with my dressage trainer.
		
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where did you go schooling out of interest as were hoping to get out and about soon but quite a lot of courses are normally not open until the end of april round here 

charliemouse - sorry to hear the lesson sounded rather uninspiring! had we been fit enough I probably would have booked autumn in for it but kind of glad I didnt now! Its a shame the one gary parsonage is running at bishop is straight after the BE - would have liked to have found out what his teaching is like.


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## TarrSteps (2 March 2012)

Interesting.  I went to one of her clinics years ago now . . . with a plain bay, big striding horse who always did the minimum (but was very competitive) and had a similar experience.  I had one specific issue she did address when I asked but it was mostly to tell me not to worry about it, which was helpful for me to hear from someone of her stature at the time.  At the end she went down the line, giving everyone compliments and things to work on, got to me and said, "Well, you have a good rapport with your horse."  I took this to mean "You're pretty awful but somehow your odd horse jumps for you."  I have to say, I know she didn't mean it the way I took it but it really upset me and put my overall riding back.  That was in the days when her clinics tended to be quite scary - there certainly was little discussion of analysis or technique but I'm interested to hear it's still an issue with some people.

I do know people who have got a great deal out of her clinics though, so I don't think it should necessarily put people off.  Her approach works very well for some, especially people without a deep xc background.  I find all clinicians (and instructors) have people they work better or worse for and it's a rare person who can really help everyone, including people who ride in a way they don't usually teach or horses they don't like.  (Mark Todd told me straight out he didn't like the horse I was riding - fair enough, I didn't much either but I wasn't paying - and I still got a lot out of the clinic though.)


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## oldvic (3 March 2012)

LEC said:



			That is a really interesting summary OV - who do you think are the modern xc gurus? I would love a session with Blyth Tait but I understand he is not a big fan of teaching. I always loved his books.
		
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A hard question to answer as there aren't really the XC gurus like there were in the days of Lady Hugh Russell, Bertie Hill, Lars Sederholm, etc. I would agree about Blyth. Like all the good kiwis, he instinctive but backed by excellent technical knowledge. David O'Connor would be one but that is no help over here! I haven't seen the likes of Caroline Moore, Emma Fisher, Lizzel and Eric Winter teach so can't comment although they are high in th BE system as,of course, is Yogi. From hearsay all have a lot to offer some but aren't for everyone - but then who is? 
Just remember that success doesn't necessarily mean a high level of technical knowledge and this is a requirement for teaching.


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## TarrSteps (3 March 2012)

In fact it can be argued that people who have developed their successful approach organically, rather than from a system, through study (even after the fact) are perhaps less equipped to analyse and assist other riders because they don't always know how and why they do what they do. I don't think it's a coincidence that David O' Connor's mother was herself a renowned teacher and author on the subject of eventing. He also worked with a wide range of other people and had always been markedly open to other approaches. (Even the dreaded Parelli!  )  

Also pedagogy is a skill in itself, separate from whatever skill is being taught. As with any other ability, not everyone possess it to the same degree. Like riding, it takes practice but, also like riding, simply doing a lot of it does not guarantee excellence.


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## Circe (3 March 2012)

TarrSteps said:



			Also pedagogy is a skill in itself, separate from whatever skill is being taught. As with any other ability, not everyone possess it to the same degree. Like riding, it takes practice but, also like riding, simply doing a lot of it does not guarantee excellence.
		
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Had to google pedagogy , but yes, it might be a simple case of not being a skilled teacher, even though LG is obviously an extremely skilled rider. 
I dont know about LG, but I certainly know extremely intelligent people who find it extremely hard to explain something, mainly because they "get it," and cant understand why others don't.
Kx


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## Rosiefan (3 March 2012)

vicky86 said:



			Apparently it was to make him realise where his feet were. He obviously could only work out his foot positioning at trot or above .
		
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Thank you for trying to explain .

I think Rosie will only ever pay for training herself with the one-to-one trainers she uses most of the time. She hasn't got a great deal from any of the names she's done clinics with as far as I know - even the junior team trainers except for Lizzel and Yogi - but if someone else is paying she'll give it a go . 
Everybody's different though so it's worth a go but annoying if it doesn't help when it's so costly


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## kerilli (3 March 2012)

TarrSteps said:



			In fact it can be argued that people who have developed their successful approach organically, rather than from a system, through study (even after the fact) are perhaps less equipped to analyse and assist other riders because they don't always know how and why they do what they do. I don't think it's a coincidence that David O' Connor's mother was herself a renowned teacher and author on the subject of eventing. He also worked with a wide range of other people and had always been markedly open to other approaches. (Even the dreaded Parelli!  )  

Also pedagogy is a skill in itself, separate from whatever skill is being taught. As with any other ability, not everyone possess it to the same degree. Like riding, it takes practice but, also like riding, simply doing a lot of it does not guarantee excellence.
		
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Absolutely. I've been taught by people who were such naturals that they just couldn't understand why/how I was having a problem, let alone how to sort it. Very frustrating all round... 

DO'C was very hot on the difference between instinct and technique at the Hartpury lect/demo. He said the guinea-pig riders had great instincts but needed to improve their technique. fascinating stuff.

LG is a weird one, because she's really ace for certain people (i saw her turn a stiff, nervous only-ridden-at-a-riding-school rider into a keen, competent-xc-rider in 2 hours once) but ignores others - she gets distracted by a few and then ignores the others. (a couple of people fell off at MK when I did a clinic with her there, she hadn't been paying attention, turned to us and said 'did anyone see what happened?'  ermmm....) sometimes she's just not paying attention (as when she stood in front of the skinny she'd just told me to jump, she was chatting to someone else, forgot she'd told me to come and jump it, i came round the corner and had to suddenly circle away because i assumed she'd move, and she didn't. she apologised though!)
i'd only send a specific type of rider for 1 of her clinics now. fof had a bad fall at MK in a LG clinic, going down PN steps on buckle end (on purpose, that was the exercise) she lost balance and came off the back, ouch. i know of someone who had an absolutely horrific purler of a fall at a LG clinic too, having been told to jump a fence the wrong way.


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## Fourlegsgood (3 March 2012)

I am afraid that all of these comments just reinforce by belief that it is best to stick with a regular trainer that gets to know you and your horse. Going to one off clinics is rarely as much help as the equivalent amount of money spent on regular lessons.


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## TarrSteps (3 March 2012)

I do actually agree in principle BUT I have also been to clinics that have literally been life changing and I suspect there have been riders who felt that way about LG.

I would say a good start would be to stick to people recommended by your usual trainer, friends etc and to audit as many clinics as possible.


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## LEC (3 March 2012)

I think its important to have lots of tools in the box as there are lots of ways to skin a cat and I find clinics really good for adding that extra bit of polish sometimes. I think its very important to know what style you like being taught, try and watch them teach first and to only spend what you would not be very upset to lose if it is slightly disappointing.


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## Goldenstar (3 March 2012)

IMO one off clinics can fall onto a pleasant but expensive day camp and it sounds like what OP had.
But one off clinics are helpful they make question how you are doing things and at there best can really push you to the next place .I have a trainer that I work with regularly but she encourages me to try different trainers it makes you question and sometimes you get a something that makes a huge difference . I took a five raising six year old to one this week in the jumping the trainer picked up that now and again he does not jump off both hind legs at the same time and is not even in front ( TB who was in training and probably started over hurdles)
The trainer said what do you feel I said he feels like he just does not get what goes wrong.
She said lets jump single fences from walk what a difference after about six times he really got it it was worth the whole clinic for that . That's what a one off can do at its best.
OP look on the bright side ,better what happened than you could do a thing right and LG spent her time on you and you came home thinking what on earth was I doing thinking that I was ready to go out and complete !


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## Mistatiger (3 March 2012)

LEC I would say that Blyth is a very enthusiastic teacher who gives loads of encouragement. So do go to a clinic if you get the chance. If you are anywhere near the NE he is here in June.


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## Dotilas (3 March 2012)

LEC said:



			I would be rather peed off if me. Not to say anything, even to talk about your aims and discuss them is pretty poor. £120 is a lot of money as well especially if there is 4 in your group that is £620!!
		
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I'm not a maths expert, and am probably missing something vital... 4 x £120= £480? and even 5 x £120 = £600 ...


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## daisycrazy (3 March 2012)

When it comes to a system rather than an organic/instinctive approach, Chris Bartle has to be your man. Can't recommend him highly enough. And the results speak for themselves.


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## DarkHorseB (3 March 2012)

I think when you are in the lucky position that you and your horse have done very little wrong you have to be ultra aware to pick up the little things you are told. I like group lessons as I find I often learn as much about me and my horse by watching other people. What they are good at and what not so good at. What worked for them and whether it would or wouldn't work for us.
When you are an established partnership you probably aren't going to have the real light bulb moments or get the same level of help for someone where the wheels have badly fallen off.

I recently had a lesson with Ian Stark where happily my horse went really well and coped with some very difficult exercises. So in one sense I maybe didn't get as much feedback as for the ones where it went a bit wrong but I still thoroughly enjoyed it and felt we had been stretched. Any comments I did get were spot on and things I definitely need to work on though!I find with the one off trainers I have always come away with something that's given me food for thought and to work on. Sometimes quite minor sometimes major!! You do tend to get most from someone you see more regularly though - which is where it has been good to go to someone like Blyth for 4 lessons on 3 separate occasions over about 18 months as he has remembered the horse and rider and can see the differences - perhaps more than a regular trainer that sees you month in and month out.

Of course it doesn't help if the venue you go to doesn't quite match up to the level you are at - although good instructors can make a good lesson out of very little! A couple of my best XC lessons have been where the instructor has had to think on their feet to make the best out of what they have available!!


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## whiteclover (3 March 2012)

I have to say I agree with the coment that some people are great riders but cant translate that into teachng. I had a lesson with one famous eventer once and I asked him if he could tell me what he was doing with the flatwork as he was riding my horse at the time & he couldnt explain it to me.


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## Maisie2 (3 March 2012)

tbh reading through various clinic reports and queries on this forum about different instructors it is very obvious that there are wide ranging opinions on their abilities.  My daughter did a clinic with one of our top trainers quite a few years ago on her established Novice horse and rather like CM didn't get an awful lot of comeback, but it was an interesting if somewhat expensive experience.  I was a bit  when the trainer got a bit bored when a horse wouldn't go in the water and her solution was to wave her umbrella behind it.


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## BeckyD (13 March 2012)

I know what you mean - I was at her MK clinic a day or so before your clinic, and she actually said very little to me.  However, she was saying more to some of the others and giving them more help and I think she said little to us as she didn't really need to.  What LG did say to me was actually very helpful - I have a lot of confidence when riding in some ways in that I'm happy to try most things and I don't really get that nervous, but in my own ability I have zero confidence and I always assume that anything that goes wrong is 100% my fault, and that it has indeed gone wrong.  LG helped me realise that sometimes the horse needs to meet you half way!  Sounds obvious I know, but what I think of as things going wrong, she thought of as learning experiences.  My horse can be tricky to ride to a fence, although I have always assumed I'm doing it wrong, but she said that I'm actually doing the right thing and with the right timing, but that Bill is resisting and fighting.  She suggested a change of bit to a Waterford and it's early days but it does seem to have made a difference.

So on the one hand I would agree with Charliemouse - she doesn't give tonnes of feedback which is what I had been expecting (I had gone there expecting to be torn apart) but I think, from listening to what she said to others and watching a lot of her clinics on Youtube etc, that she concentrates her advice on the areas that really need it - and as long as in her opinion you can get safely from one side of the fence to the other, then the world according to LG is good.  

After all the clinic is called XC the Safe Way and is really about training the horse to think for itself and contemplate its own fate.


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## amy_b (13 March 2012)

daisycrazy said:



			When it comes to a system rather than an organic/instinctive approach, Chris Bartle has to be your man. Can't recommend him highly enough. And the results speak for themselves.
		
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I second Chris Bartle, I would save up for one lesson with him over ten lessons with somebody else - totally transformed my riding. abosolute legend. 

I went to a LG clinic a couple of years ago and had a similar experience, very interesting to watch the others and how she worked them through thier problems but got very little feedback for my mare who just popped everything. I imagine the people that get the most out of it are people with problems xc.


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## Lark (13 March 2012)

Very interesting.
Someone I know organised for her to come over our way last year.
I didn't have anything in full work at the time so didn't do it myself, so cannot comment on that part.
Feedback seemed to be good but the overiding issue was the expense.
LG is one hungry lady. It cost a fortune and ever part had to be organised for her including her flights (which I thought was a bit ridiculous).  If you are making that much money get a secretary.
Someone who had done a clinic with her previously (a few years before) thought she had paid money for old rope as nothing had changed.

So value for money seems to be the fundamental issue.

Have heard really good things about Pippa.  Has anyone had a clinic with her?


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## Andalusianlover1 (13 March 2012)

charlimouse said:








 sure Jem was on the ball.

if you have got this far you may have noticed, whilst describing the exercises we did, I haven't said much else. This is due to the fact there really isn't anything else to say . I didn't get any feedback, I just did the exercises I was told to do, competently and that was it. I don't think it helped I was the only one in the group wanting to progress beyond BE100, and Lucinda was just kind of like, 'well you can jump that fence if you want'. Nobody else in the group did, but despite this I still got no feedback from LG when I took myself off to jump the more difficult fences. I don't know weather this is a good or bad thing. I didn't earn a single well done, nor were any corrections or comments made. It was like I wasn't there . I just feel for £120 I didn't get much out of it. It would have been more productive to have taken myself off to Somerford Park on my own to jump some more combinations and play round some more interesting fences

I did one of her clinics 2 years ago at our yard.  I was very excited as she was my heroine growing up. I was disappointed the same way as you.  I got no feedback, Lucinda was more interested in the people with more eventy looking horses wearinf breastplates and all the gear than my chunky Andalusian.

She comes every year to our yard and does exactly the same thing, arrowheads in both directions etc etc no doubt it will all be the same again when she comes this month I think.

I'm glad I did it but I wouldnt pay that amount again for another clinic with her.
		
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## Andalusianlover1 (13 March 2012)

I worked it out once that for a 2 day clinic she must have raked in about 3 grand!  Not a bad earner is it for the same thing year in year out!


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## Lark (13 March 2012)

amy_b said:



			I second Chris Bartle, I would save up for one lesson with him over ten lessons with somebody else - totally transformed my riding. abosolute legend. 

I went to a LG clinic a couple of years ago and had a similar experience, very interesting to watch the others and how she worked them through thier problems but got very little feedback for my mare who just popped everything. I imagine the people that get the most out of it are people with problems xc.
		
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How does Chris compare price wise with LG?
Sounds like he is an excellent trainer.


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## Decision_Tree (13 March 2012)

Fourlegsgood said:



			I am afraid that all of these comments just reinforce by belief that it is best to stick with a regular trainer that gets to know you and your horse. Going to one off clinics is rarely as much help as the equivalent amount of money spent on regular lessons.
		
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I have to agree with this, I have heard more negative stories about clinics with "names" than postive stories. Alot of people can get over faced or asked to do exercises which result in a loss of confidence. For 120pounds (without counting fuel) you would get alot of lessons with some1 who knows you more and also, has more of a interested in you enjoying the lesson as you go back to them time again.


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## Spangie (13 March 2012)

I did one of the petplan clinics with LG last year entitled 'xc the safe way' to boost my confidence before my first BE.  

It was horrid.

LG wasn't massively helpful, at the outset i'd said my horse could be nappy, and we had a ditch issue..... (more mine than the horses).  anyway, did all the skinny exercises no problem, then we came to a double of ditch and trakenher, well he didn't like that, after trying a few times unsuccessfully to get horse anywhere near it, she and the rest of the group left me, and i was told 'not to re-join them until i had jumped both'.  Good plan, leave not very experienced rider, with prone to being nappy and now wound up horse in the middle of xc course!

anyway, to my relief a camera man was there, and he evented, so he stayed with me and asked if he could give me some tips.  He did, and 15 mins later we had jumped both fences in both directions a few times.  On rejoining group (who were now at water complex) LG said ' i suppose you can't do water either?' to which i (metaphorically) stuck 2 fingers up and turned around, cantered into water, out over fence, then did same thing the other way.

When i pulled up her helpful advice to me ' you should give your horse to a man to ride??!'  (not sure how that's helpful.  he's a TBxID 16.1, i'm 5'9 and weigh wrong side of 11st, so i wouldn't describe myself as being overhorsed in terms of physical size compared to a man!

fuming i was.  More confident about xc i wasn't.

I also complained, to petplan, but never heard anything back.  Lesson learnt.  i would NEVER recommend her though.


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## Horsemad12 (13 March 2012)

Another vote for Chris Bartle.

I also had a FAB XC lesson with Leslie Law a number of years ago.  Very quickly picked out my faults and really good advice on dealing with them along with asking what I wanted to get out of the lesson and ensuring that was looked at as well.


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## TheoryX1 (13 March 2012)

Thats a huge shame, and a waste of money.  FWW I always think clinics are a bit of an expensive luxury and unless it was going to be a once in a lifetime never to be repeated experience, I wouldnt pay for something like this for Mini TX, or even myself.  The best 'clinics' both Mini TX and I have gone to have been ones where our ususal instructor comes to our yard and teaches the whole yard.  We all end up watching and learning, having a good old laugh and beer and pizza afterwards with instructor.


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## TableDancer (13 March 2012)

Spangie said:



			I did one of the petplan clinics with LG last year entitled 'xc the safe way' to boost my confidence before my first BE.  

It was horrid.

LG wasn't massively helpful, at the outset i'd said my horse could be nappy, and we had a ditch issue..... (more mine than the horses).  anyway, did all the skinny exercises no problem, then we came to a double of ditch and trakenher, well he didn't like that, after trying a few times unsuccessfully to get horse anywhere near it, she and the rest of the group left me, and i was told 'not to re-join them until i had jumped both'.  Good plan, leave not very experienced rider, with prone to being nappy and now wound up horse in the middle of xc course!

anyway, to my relief a camera man was there, and he evented, so he stayed with me and asked if he could give me some tips.  He did, and 15 mins later we had jumped both fences in both directions a few times.  On rejoining group (who were now at water complex) LG said ' i suppose you can't do water either?' to which i (metaphorically) stuck 2 fingers up and turned around, cantered into water, out over fence, then did same thing the other way.

When i pulled up her helpful advice to me ' you should give your horse to a man to ride??!'  (not sure how that's helpful.  he's a TBxID 16.1, i'm 5'9 and weigh wrong side of 11st, so i wouldn't describe myself as being overhorsed in terms of physical size compared to a man!

fuming i was.  More confident about xc i wasn't.

I also complained, to petplan, but never heard anything back.  Lesson learnt.  i would NEVER recommend her though.
		
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Wow! I have to say, that's a pretty shocking story  

I have stayed out of this debate till now, as I've had many good experiences with Lucinda, both a few clinics myself over the years (she was very involved in the "2*plus" ones they introduced after there were all those deaths ) and most recently when my daughter did the Pony Programme one with two ponies a few weeks ago and had a truly wonderful, inspirational time.

I think it would be simplistic to assume you only get something out of it if you are having problems XC: as an example, both T's ponies are fab XC and neither had the slightest problem at anything in the clinic, yet T still felt she got a lot out of it, more in terms of the philosophy of XC riding etc than anything else, perhpas, plus the exercises with the skinnies really made the ponies think: with the more advanced group she had a skinny course set, by the end, within a say 20m by 25m box, and including a bounce (angled) 1.5 strides to another one on the turn...

However, I have heard a few other stories of people not having a good time (a pupil of mine did one a few years ago and hated it). Maybe sometimes she gets fed up/tired etc and goes through the motions a bit - but still no excuse for the above


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## EventingMum (13 March 2012)

Definitely echo what others have said re one off clinics. It's hard to establish a rapport with a trainer in a one off session so these clinics can either be fantastic or a big let down.  Back in the dark ages when I competed regular trainers weren't so common but clinics were often run over a 3 days which allowed the trainer to get know the participants better. 3 days with Dick Stillwell was quite something and I still regularly use many of the exercises I learnt then today. 

My son had a xc clinic with Blyth Tait which was great - horse had no real issues but it gave him confidence that he was tackling things the right way. For show jumping he found John Leddingham good too. He has also been a guinea pig at demos on a few occasions and got a huge amount out of ones with Chris Bartle and Kenneth Clawson - others maybe not so much from but as a guinea pig you're not paying so expectations perhaps shouldn't be as high.

We tend to view clinics as extra experience from which we can pick and chose what to take away from but rely on our regular trainers for consistency.  Having attending an L  G clinic for coaches I must say I didn't find it as valuable as many others I have been to and thought her approach to some problems was somewhat inflexible and not designed to boost confidence.


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## Marydoll (25 March 2012)

Spangie said:



			I did one of the petplan clinics with LG last year entitled 'xc the safe way' to boost my confidence before my first BE.  

It was horrid.

LG wasn't massively helpful, at the outset i'd said my horse could be nappy, and we had a ditch issue..... (more mine than the horses).  anyway, did all the skinny exercises no problem, then we came to a double of ditch and trakenher, well he didn't like that, after trying a few times unsuccessfully to get horse anywhere near it, she and the rest of the group left me, and i was told 'not to re-join them until i had jumped both'.  Good plan, leave not very experienced rider, with prone to being nappy and now wound up horse in the middle of xc course!

anyway, to my relief a camera man was there, and he evented, so he stayed with me and asked if he could give me some tips.  He did, and 15 mins later we had jumped both fences in both directions a few times.  On rejoining group (who were now at water complex) LG said ' i suppose you can't do water either?' to which i (metaphorically) stuck 2 fingers up and turned around, cantered into water, out over fence, then did same thing the other way.

When i pulled up her helpful advice to me ' you should give your horse to a man to ride??!'  (not sure how that's helpful.  he's a TBxID 16.1, i'm 5'9 and weigh wrong side of 11st, so i wouldn't describe myself as being overhorsed in terms of physical size compared to a man!

fuming i was.  More confident about xc i wasn't.

I also complained, to petplan, but never heard anything back.  Lesson learnt.  i would NEVER recommend her though.
		
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I hope you got your money back, thats bloomin ridiculous, and not safe either


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