# 'Arthur' BSJA Name 'Dukes Crest' 16.1/16.2hh Reg ISH Grey Gelding



## PFM22 (17 July 2012)

Hi, i am desperately seeking the whereabouts of Arthur - a stunning grey Irish Sports Horse Gelding, green passport, can't remember passport number but his D.O.B is 17/04/95 and was bred in Co. Monaghan. My details were hand written in his passport but never officially lodged.
I sold him in May 2004 to Mrs Sara Jackson who lived in Ipswich for her daughter Katie Jackson who was a member of the Essex & Suffolk Hunt Pony Club. He then may have been taken on by their younger daughter Laura.
He has a scar (a grey line) on his nearside shoulder from a wire scratch and also on his nearside hind at the top of his white sock there is a slight mark and tiny bump (or there was)! 
He had stunning long white eyelashes and 4 white socks. Will probably be fleabitten grey now, was lightly dappled when i sold him aged 9, but was freckly in parts.
He was registered as Duke's Crest with the then BSJA and his stable name was Arthur. He was a Rolls Royce of a hunter, a real look at me type, who was cheeky but SO talented...I would LOVE to find out where he is and how he is doing...if anyone knows anything at all, please contact me. 
I imported him from Ireland from *Goresbridge Sales* as a 4yo and owned him for 5 years!
Thanks
I will try to upload some pictures of him.


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## sophie1981 (16 March 2013)

Can you upload some pics please? X


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## applecart14 (20 March 2013)

PFM22 said:



			He was registered as Duke's Crest with the then BSJA and his stable name was Arthur. .
		
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http://www.britishshowjumping.co.uk...eOrigin=&searchFormBtn.x=45&searchFormBtn.y=8

Could you not see if you could try to locate him through the BS?  If you can find out whereabouts he is competing (if you buy the record from the BS) then at least you will have some idea where he is competing and narrow it down to show centres, maybe go and visit a BS show at their show centre and thus find your horse.  Or is that a bit stalker - ish?   That is only if he is still competing. You will only know if you buy the record.  As you probably know it costs over £500 to change a horses name with the BS and I don't think you can, only add prefixes.  So at least you will have an answer.  At age 18 there is a slight chance he may still be competing if he's been looked after well.
At least you know he is still alive or he would have a D against his name like mine do!


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## Little Nell (20 March 2013)

A friend of a friend has an 18 yo irish sports by cruising that came to her as a problem horse.  Sounds very similar, name is different but not sure what his bsja name is.  Can you post a pic so as i can see if its the same horse.  Is yours by Cruising??


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## SillySausage (20 March 2013)

applecart14 said:



http://www.britishshowjumping.co.uk...eOrigin=&searchFormBtn.x=45&searchFormBtn.y=8

Could you not see if you could try to locate him through the BS?  If you can find out whereabouts he is competing (if you buy the record from the BS) then at least you will have some idea where he is competing and narrow it down to show centres, maybe go and visit a BS show at their show centre and thus find your horse.  Or is that a bit stalker - ish?   That is only if he is still competing. You will only know if you buy the record.  As you probably know it costs over £500 to change a horses name with the BS and I don't think you can, only add prefixes.  So at least you will have an answer.  At age 18 there is a slight chance he may still be competing if he's been looked after well.
At least you know he is still alive or he would have a D against his name like mine do!
		
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It does NOT cost £500 to change a name with BS!!!!!

Dukes Crest has not been registered since 2005, with his last recorded competition with Mrs Lambert riding.

He would only show up as deceased if the office have been informed, so you can't rely on that.


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## sport horse (21 March 2013)

Actually his last recorded result with BS was in July 2005 a Double Clear in a Discovery with a Mr T. Davies riding at Norton Heath. Might be Tim Davies one of the top national show jump riders?


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## applecart14 (21 March 2013)

SillySausage said:



			It does NOT cost £500 to change a name with BS!!!!!

.
		
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Hate to say it but you are partly wrong!!!!! (five explanation marks like you gave me)  .  *It does cost £500 *if the horse is from the continent. If it is from Ireland I presume its classed as not from the continent and therefore would be £188.00.

On page 19 of the 2010 year book, (the only one I can find on line at the moment) *and this is not verbatim* - it states that it costs £188 to change a name for a horse born in this country.  

Rule 50.8.3: Once an international horse passport (i.e. for an import) has been approved by the FEI and issued for any horse or pony a fee of £566 + vat is payable to the FEI for any alternation to name.  I know it was this as I had a Grade B and we were searching for an answer in order to &#8216;legally&#8217; down grade the horse as I wanted to jump unaffiliated and at the time the rules meant I was only allowed to jump in an open class at an unaffiliated competition due to the horses winnings (we rang the BSJA and they confirmed this to us).  We were not intending to sell it on by the way, it was intended as a lifelong horse.  We were told to change its name as no one would ever know.  We did not feel that we could do this, all I wanted to jump was 2ft 3 classes, not big open classes at the end of the day when everyone had gone home, and there was no one in the class and the horse in question had been jumping 1.30 and 1.40m speed classes and derbys abroad and to be honest, we were really stuck for an answer.  A lot of unscrupulous people would have just pretended they didn't know but we are not like that.

  We did not want to pursue this change of name idea but as a matter of interest years later when I affiliated for the first time with a new horse out of interest we looked in the BSJA rule book we had been sent and found out that the fee was £500.  I know if the horse in question was imported from Ireland its not classed as international but as I say, I remember it was a high fee as we looked into it.

On page 44 rule 50.8.1 it clearly states that all horses and ponies once registered in Grade C may be changed only by notice in writing to the BSJA office.  Such changes of name are not encouraged and a relatively high fee will accordingly be payable for each change of name.

Page 19 of the BSJA rule book under prefix fees state that it costs £250 to add a prefix to 1-5 horses.

Sorry to hijack the OP's post but I am annoyed that Silly Sausage obviously feels I am stupid  and not qualified to talk about this subject


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## SillySausage (21 March 2013)

applecart14 said:



			Hate to say it but you are partly wrong!!!!! (five explanation marks like you gave me)  .  *It does cost £500 *if the horse is from the continent. If it is from Ireland I presume its classed as not from the continent and therefore would be £188.00.

On page 19 of the 2010 year book, (the only one I can find on line at the moment) *and this is not verbatim* - it states that it costs £188 to change a name for a horse born in this country.  

Rule 50.8.3: Once an international horse passport (i.e. for an import) has been approved by the FEI and issued for any horse or pony a fee of £566 + vat is payable to the FEI for any alternation to name.  I know it was this as I had a Grade B and we were searching for an answer in order to &#8216;legally&#8217; down grade the horse as I wanted to jump unaffiliated and at the time the rules meant I was only allowed to jump in an open class at an unaffiliated competition due to the horses winnings (we rang the BSJA and they confirmed this to us).  We were not intending to sell it on by the way, it was intended as a lifelong horse.  We were told to change its name as no one would ever know.  We did not feel that we could do this, all I wanted to jump was 2ft 3 classes, not big open classes at the end of the day when everyone had gone home, and there was no one in the class and the horse in question had been jumping 1.30 and 1.40m speed classes and derbys abroad and to be honest, we were really stuck for an answer.  A lot of unscrupulous people would have just pretended they didn't know but we are not like that.

  We did not want to pursue this change of name idea but as a matter of interest years later when I affiliated for the first time with a new horse out of interest we looked in the BSJA rule book we had been sent and found out that the fee was £500.  I know if the horse in question was imported from Ireland its not classed as international but as I say, I remember it was a high fee as we looked into it.

On page 44 rule 50.8.1 it clearly states that all horses and ponies once registered in Grade C may be changed only by notice in writing to the BSJA office.  Such changes of name are not encouraged and a relatively high fee will accordingly be payable for each change of name.

Page 19 of the BSJA rule book under prefix fees state that it costs £250 to add a prefix to 1-5 horses.

Sorry to hijack the OP's post but I am annoyed that Silly Sausage obviously feels I am stupid  and not qualified to talk about this subject 

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I'm sorry that you feel that way but I did not for one moment think you are stupid!!! I think you have misunderstood the exclamation marks, they were purely shock that you thought it cost quite that much. 

Some clarification, if it helps:

Initial Registrations: For British and Irish bred horses they must stick with their passport name if there is breeding recorded in the passport, this may be changed if there is no breeding present. For foreign bred horses they can be registered with whatever name you wish. (Horses with FEI passports have to have their FEI name)

Already Registered Horses: You cannot change a British or Irish bred horse with breeding from its passport name - prefixes/suffixes can be applied for a fee that must be renewed every year (£250 for 1-5 horses as you quoted). If you want to change a foreign horse's name it is £189, or free if you are reverting to the original passport name.

I think from reading your post applecart that your horse has/had an FEI passport (apologies if I have read that wrong) these are an entirely different ball game that I don't deal with, not the norm for most 'ordinary' passports. Therefore you were not at all wrong, but that applies to specifically FEI issued passports.

Horses cannot be downgraded with BS like you said, only jumped in open classes or grade specific classes. You can jump amateur classes so long as the rider does not feature on the rider rankings list.


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## SillySausage (21 March 2013)

sport horse said:



			Actually his last recorded result with BS was in July 2005 a Double Clear in a Discovery with a Mr T. Davies riding at Norton Heath. Might be Tim Davies one of the top national show jump riders?
		
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Yes you are right I'm not sure why that didn't show on my account!!! I double checked today for you, it was the Tim Davies suggested above.


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