# Irresponsible Owners



## lou246 (4 January 2022)

Hi, first post here!

I was wondering if anyone else has noticed an increase in irresponsible dog owners? Some of our walks have become a bit stressful recently due to people letting their dogs charge over from quite a distance. My smaller dog can be nervous since he was attacked last year and this of course doesn’t help. My setter is now 12 and has arthritis so a dog charging over and jumping about near her could do some damage.

I have no problem with dogs being off the lead if they come back when called. I also have no problem with dogs saying a quick hello to mine when all are off lead and polite. I call mine and pop them on a lead when I see a dog on a lead and I’d expect others to do the same. What I don’t like is when a dog charges over from quite a distance and it’s owners either can’t or won’t call it back. I understand that accidents happen with younger dogs but there are a few walkers I meet who let their dogs do this every time I see them even though my dogs clearly aren’t interested. I have also noticed livestock attacks have increased which is very sad. 

I just don’t seem to remember this happening anywhere near as much as it is now and I wondered if anyone else had noticed too.


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## CorvusCorax (4 January 2022)

It's been a problem for years but even more so now with people getting dogs over lockdown with no to little previous experience.

**This is not an invite for people, including myself, who got dogs during lockdown to tell everyone how perfect they are actually, because most of them, sadly are not, K THX BYE x**


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## Errin Paddywack (4 January 2022)

My friend got so sick of this sort of behaviour that she bought one of these little cans of pressurised air.  Quick squirt will see off a lot of dogs without harming them.  Just make sure it won't upset your own dogs.


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## CorvusCorax (4 January 2022)

They've just put sheep in the field bordering the very busy footpath I use. Fencing is patchy and loads of people let their dogs run in it when it's empty or when the cows are out (I know). I have to admit I shuddered when I saw them.


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## lou246 (4 January 2022)

Errin Paddywack said:



			My friend got so sick of this sort of behaviour that she bought one of these little cans of pressurised air.  Quick squirt will see off a lot of dogs without harming them.  Just make sure it won't upset your own dogs.
		
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Errin Paddywack said:



			My friend got so sick of this sort of behaviour that she bought one of these little cans of pressurised air.  Quick squirt will see off a lot of dogs without harming them.  Just make sure it won't upset your own dogs.
		
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That’s a great idea. I will look into it! It’s a shame that it’s had to come to that but if people won’t control their dogs then needs must.


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## lou246 (4 January 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			They've just put sheep in the field bordering the very busy footpath I use. Fencing is patchy and loads of people let their dogs run in it when it's empty or when the cows are out (I know). I have to admit I shuddered when I saw them.
		
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You can only hope that people will have some common sense and put their dogs on a lead while walking past. There are some sheep in a field next to a footpath where I walk most days. The other day, after just walking past the field, I saw a spaniel running around off the lead. I shouted to the owner that there are sheep in the field and she asked me to grab her dog! It had no recall and very nearly got into the field. I told her that the farmer has put signs up saying your dog could be shot if it worries the sheep and she said “Oh yes, I saw them”. So she had seen the signs but chose to ignore them!


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## Errin Paddywack (4 January 2022)

lou246 said:



			So she had seen the signs but chose to ignore them!
		
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She probably doesn't believe it would actually happen


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## Lynnfigaro (4 January 2022)

Errin Paddywack said:



			My friend got so sick of this sort of behaviour that she bought one of these little cans of pressurised air.  Quick squirt will see off a lot of dogs without harming them.  Just make sure it won't upset your own dogs.
		
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I have been using one of those too. They really do work. I had to use it on an out of control staffy who came bounding towards my five month old pup who was on the lead. 
A quick squirt and the dog backed off and ran back to its owner. 
The one I have has cloves and citronella mixed with water.


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## Karran (4 January 2022)

Was out this morning with my two and a rather over amorous Frenchie was pestering them. Mrs Spaniel suddenly remembered pre-Christmas where the woman had put down bird food and galloped off to see if there was any left. I put Mrs Collie in between my legs and asked her to focus on me which she did quite nicely until Frenchie started trying to hump her face on and rather politely (in my eyes!) she air-snapped at him, which put him off temporarily, he came at her again and she showed her teeth.

"Oooh look at her smiling at him" The woman shrieked with glee. "How lovely, he's made a friend."


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## Amymay (4 January 2022)

Just turn in to a raging harridan - works for me 😉


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## scats (4 January 2022)

My old (nearly 13) Great Dane x was knocked off her back feet the other day by a huge boisterous dog who was absolutely tearing round and leaping over my dogs.  It ran into my hand and really hurt me and then tried to jump over my dog but misjudged the height and took her back end out.  Owners just merrily walked on.  My old dog got to her feet and saw it off then, but she was stiff for a couple of days after that.


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## scats (4 January 2022)

Oh, and my friend and her horse were chased by the same Shar Pei that hassled me back in November.  Dog was on our private land and chased friends horse who took off.  Friend pulled horse up after about 200 yards, with dog still at it’s heels.  She confronted owner, who just walked the other way, muttering.


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## Amymay (4 January 2022)

scats said:



			My old (nearly 13) Great Dane x was knocked off her back feet the other day by a huge boisterous dog who was absolutely tearing round and leaping over my dogs.  It ran into my hand and really hurt me and then tried to jump over my dog but misjudged the height and took her back end out.  Owners just merrily walked on.  My old dog got to her feet and saw it off then, but she was stiff for a couple of days after that.
		
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Hopefully you gave them an absolute mouthfull, and your friend reported her incident to the dog warden.


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## teddy_eq (4 January 2022)

This is a big bug bear of mine.

I have two small rescue dogs (Chihuahua mixes). I walk them on a lead at all times and they are muzzled. Regardless, there is a lady who walks her young Pointer in the same area and she cannot control the dog. It always bounds up to me and my dogs (who are dreadfully aggressive towards other dogs), and I just feel like telling her, if she has no recall with her dog - she should not let it off the lead. Especially given the area in question has a lot of livestock. 

Grr!


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## Amymay (4 January 2022)

teddy_eq said:



			This is a big bug bear of mine.

I have two small rescue dogs (Chihuahua mixes). I walk them on a lead at all times and they are muzzled. Regardless, there is a lady who walks her young Pointer in the same area and she cannot control the dog. It always bounds up to me and my dogs (who are dreadfully aggressive towards other dogs), and I just feel like telling her, if she has no recall with her dog - she should not let it off the lead. Especially given the area in question has a lot of livestock.

Grr!
		
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So tell her?  You are the advocate for your dog.  Why stand for that sort of behaviour and rudeness?? 🤷🏻‍♀️


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## teddy_eq (4 January 2022)

Amymay in a manger said:



			So tell her?  You are the advocate for your dog.  Why stand for that sort of behaviour and rudeness?? 🤷🏻‍♀️
		
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I shall!


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## Escapade (4 January 2022)

Yes. I had a few dogless years before I got my current lurcher at the end of 2020, I’ve never had so many issues. The sense of entitlement people hold is absolutely staggering.
Between larger dogs we don’t know jumping down on my on lead dog without even a “hello” (it’s okay, he’s friendly!), and parents silently watching their children try to hit my ankles with their scooters I’m done with being polite. I try to avoid trouble before it brews but the space is mine to enjoy too. Unfortunately I’m in an urban area with no shortage of muppets at all hours of the day. They seem to spawn out of thin air!


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## CorvusCorax (4 January 2022)

I'm a big fan of yelling CALL YOUR DOG NOW! when the other dog is en route or other associated roaring. I did carry a schooling whip for a while for a particular repeat offender, it got to the stage that a workman had to help me by chasing it away one day while I ran in the other direction, it was a huge Rottie cross and I wouldn't have had a chance if he and my dog got into a proper fight while the owner was miles away, drinking coffee and texting. And it's not like I have a tiny, physically vulnerable dog.
I don't really care if people think I am rude any more, I've had weeks and months of training/conditioning undone by other people on more than one dog. And it's always the same excuses, they're just being friendly, they're a rescue, they need off the lead to have a good run (IE they pull and I can't be arsed training them not to), let them 'sort it out', etc etc, OK chum, you pay the vet bill then....I also whip my camera out and pretend to video if I have the time/enough hands. Certainly sharpens people's focus.


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## teddy_eq (4 January 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			I'm a big fan of yelling CALL YOUR DOG NOW! when the other dog is en route or other associated roaring. I did carry a schooling whip for a while for a particular repeat offender, it got to the stage that a workman had to help me chase it away one day while I ran in the other direction, it was a huge Rottie cross and I wouldn't have had a chance if he and my dog got into a proper fight while the owner was miles away, drinking coffee and texting.
I don't really care if people think I am rude any more, I've had weeks and months of training/conditioning undone by other people on more than one dog. And it's always the same excuses, they're just being friendly, they're a rescue, they need off the lead to have a good run (IE they pull and I can't be arsed training them not to), let them 'sort it out', etc etc, OK chum, you pay the vet bill then....I also whip my camera out and pretend to video if I have the time/enough hands. Certainly sharpens people's focus.
		
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I think I'll take my piaffe whip for this bloody Pointer 🤣 (joking). That is a good idea nonetheless.


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## CorvusCorax (4 January 2022)

I'm not for one moment advocating hitting a dog that hasn't actually connected with yours, but it makes a really good swooshy noise. And the other owner could see it, it was more for them.


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## teddy_eq (4 January 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			I'm not for one moment advocating hitting a dog, but it makes a really good swooshy noise. And the other owner could see it, it was more for them.
		
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Quite, just a deterrent!


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## Cinnamontoast (4 January 2022)

My absolute bugbear after years of owning a reactive dog. He wouldn't dream of approaching other dogs but the amount of idiots I've had allowing their untrained mutts to run up drove me crazy. It's especially difficult when I can't move very fast to avoid them. Yet when I ask them to recall, they become all entitled and tell me I shouldn't be walking my very well trained focused dog in public. 😡 Then teach a fricking recall, idiot!


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## lou246 (4 January 2022)

Karran said:



			Was out this morning with my two and a rather over amorous Frenchie was pestering them. Mrs Spaniel suddenly remembered pre-Christmas where the woman had put down bird food and galloped off to see if there was any left. I put Mrs Collie in between my legs and asked her to focus on me which she did quite nicely until Frenchie started trying to hump her face on and rather politely (in my eyes!) she air-snapped at him, which put him off temporarily, he came at her again and she showed her teeth.

"Oooh look at her smiling at him" The woman shrieked with glee. "How lovely, he's made a friend."
		
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Some peoples lack of understanding when it comes to dogs body language shocks me! If that owner thinks teeth showing means smiling then one day her dog will be bitten when she fails to see that another dog is about to snap 😳 Sounds like your dog gave an appropriate correction. It’s when corrections are ignored that attacks can happen. My youngest dog would appreciate being pestered even less than usual if it was a french bulldog, the only breed he dislikes after he was attacked by one!


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## Karran (4 January 2022)

I'm actually very proud of her reaction. She used to be the sort of dog that other (sensible) owners took a wide berth to avoid. I'd muzzle her and walk her on two leads while she turned herself inside out with hysterics at another dog daring to even look at her. Its taken a long time for her to learn how to focus on me first and then give appropriate warnings rather than just leaping in all guns blazing.
I warned the woman that she would hurt her Frenchie but its SO tiring always being the owner in the wrong  who "shouldn't take dangerous dogs to the park around others." and it has without 100% doubt got so, so much worse since pandemic pups became a thing!


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## lou246 (4 January 2022)

scats said:



			My old (nearly 13) Great Dane x was knocked off her back feet the other day by a huge boisterous dog who was absolutely tearing round and leaping over my dogs.  It ran into my hand and really hurt me and then tried to jump over my dog but misjudged the height and took her back end out.  Owners just merrily walked on.  My old dog got to her feet and saw it off then, but she was stiff for a couple of days after that.
		
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I hope you and your dog are ok now. What an irresponsible owner. Some people think just because their dog is ‘friendly’ that it can’t do damage, which isn’t true at all. My friends 14 year old staffy was bowled over by a ‘friendly’ young Labrador last year and unfortunately because of her arthritis it did a lot of damage. She passed away a month later and her owner is sure it was down to that incident as she just couldn’t walk properly afterwards and shut down. For a 14 year old dog, she had been doing very well up until then. The Labradors owners just said “Oops, he’s just trying to play!” and walked off, leaving her to pick up her elderly dog and carry her back to the car.


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## lou246 (4 January 2022)

Christmascinnamoncookie said:



			My absolute bugbear after years of owning a reactive dog. He wouldn't dream of approaching other dogs but the amount of idiots I've had allowing their untrained mutts to run up drove me crazy. It's especially difficult when I can't move very fast to avoid them. Yet when I ask them to recall, they become all entitled and tell me I shouldn't be walking my very well trained focused dog in public. 😡 Then teach a fricking recall, idiot!
		
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Sounds just like my last dog, who was a lab cross and did not like other dogs (with the exception of a few ones he knew and trusted). He would stay well away from other dogs if he could. There was only a problem if someone let their dog charge over. I have heard the “why are you walking here with an aggressive dog” excuse a few times, even when we were in the middle of nowhere! They failed to see how the problem was their off lead dog with no recall and not my dog who was minding his own business.


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## SaddlePsych'D (4 January 2022)

Thankfully we've not had any 'incidents' with Ivy but I think this is largely down to her being so unfussed by other dogs which is just as well when we've had them running up to her barking, sniffing round her etc. We're careful because she's timid and would hate for her to one day be overwhelmed or to lose her confidence. I think she might have a slight 'scary dog' look when her ears have gone full batman because people do seem to put their dogs on leads a lot of the time as well. She's probably quite good for people we see out training young pups because she ignores them no matter how interested in her they are!

I'm really shocked by some things I've seen on FB in terms of attitudes around on/off lead dogs. One person thinking of giving up their sighthound after it had killed two sheep, got lost on an estuary (or similar), and nearly got itself and it's owner injured from chasing a horse (no mention of the poor horse or rider) but they just 'didn't like the idea' of the dog being kept on lead. I thought 'surely better than an injured or dead dog', turns out not necessarily when I saw on another post a comment that someone would rather risk their dog being hit by a car than 'take away it's freedom' to be off lead - they even mentioned having lost a dog in exactly this manner. Of course there was no mention or thought of the livestock, pets, car drivers, horse riders and other third parties impacted by these various attitudes. 

I realise I'm speaking from the privileged position of having a dog who can be satisfied by all on-lead walks, but still even if we needed to do more with Ivy we'd find a way through training, play, secure field hire, long line etc. There seems to be a lot of options so not wanting to 'spoil their fun' seems like a poor excuse to take such big risks.


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## Alwaysmoretoknow (4 January 2022)

And how many times have you heard 'Oh - it's because yours is on a lead!' excuse when their rude off-lead dog(s) start barking and lunging at your on-lead dog. 

Well, shall I let her off then and we can watch her kill it?


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## Cinnamontoast (4 January 2022)

lou246 said:



			They failed to see how the problem was their off lead dog with no recall and not my dog who was minding his own business.
		
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Exactly. I’m quite happy to ask people to recall, but I always get the ‘Oh, he’s friendly’ or ‘He’s just a puppy’. So? Don’t let him approach mine, you don’t know him or how he’ll react, so you’re endangering your dog and possibly setting him up for being fearful as mine was once attacked. Stupid, stupid.

 I’m being ultra careful with the puppies so they only have positive experiences with dogs I've watched for months. However, there are several new dogs in the past 2 days, also youngsters but who appear to have zero recall/manners, so we’re now keeping well away from others.


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## Lynnfigaro (4 January 2022)

Christmascinnamoncookie said:



			Exactly. I’m quite happy to ask people to recall, but I always get the ‘Oh, he’s friendly’ or ‘He’s just a puppy’. So? Don’t let him approach mine, you don’t know him or how he’ll react, so you’re endangering your dog and possibly setting him up for being fearful as mine was once attacked. Stupid, stupid.

I’m being ultra careful with the puppies so they only have positive experiences with dogs I've watched for months. However, there are several new dogs in the past 2 days, also youngsters but who appear to have zero recall/manners, so we’re now keeping well away from others.
		
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This is what I am now doing with my pup. On his second ever walk after he was allowed out ( 10 weeks old) we were in the park next to my house. I had his ball and he was playing with that and getting used to being out on the lead and seeing all the new sights.
Another dog off the lead came running up to him very aggressively and ignoring the owner. The owner shouted the usual he is friendly rubbish. Aye right!.
It was trying to get my puppy so I picked him up. The dog was then jumping up at me trying to get him. I screamed at the owner to get his f****ng dog and he eventually got it.
He then told me it was my own fault as I had picked up my pup.
I told him that if his dog ever attacked me or my pup again I would boot it into orbit.
He took the huff at that. I really despair of some owners. Every walk is a challenge.
Fortunately it did not affect the pup. He still loves going out.


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## misst (4 January 2022)

To be fair lately it has been better around here. The lab that knocks dogs and people over is the biggest exception. Her owner shouts from afar "don't worry she's friendly" as she runs up to strangers. I put mine on leads when I see her coming but it really annoys me. I have a 2 year old JRT who is brilliant most of the time but does like to play if invited and seems unaware that playing with a large bouncing lab is not the same as playing with her bestie who is a same age and size BT. The lab owner has suggested I "let them play together as they'll love it".

Today we saw several dogs being put on lead as we approached and so I put mine on leads at the same time. Each time it was in case my small dogs would be overwhelmed by their larger dogs, which I found very thoughtful of the owners. All the big dogs  ignored us and my two ignore others if they are on the lead. It was a lovely civilized walk with plenty of squirrel chasing in the woods and lots of swimming in massive puddles and polite interaction (or lack of) with everyone


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## blackcob (4 January 2022)

I have definitely noticed an increase in stressful encounters with off lead dogs and for me it's been a double whammy of going from two large 'scary' dogs to a small fluffy - his space is significantly less respected than that of the big dogs, to an extent I really hadn't anticipated. I am ok with doing shouty harridan but it is tiresome and stressful.

*SaddlePsych'D *I've also observed that 'off lead at all costs' type mentality and cannot understand it at all.


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## lou246 (4 January 2022)

blackcob said:



			I have definitely noticed an increase in stressful encounters with off lead dogs and for me it's been a double whammy of going from two large 'scary' dogs to a small fluffy - his space is significantly less respected than that of the big dogs, to an extent I really hadn't anticipated. I am ok with doing shouty harridan but it is tiresome and stressful.
		
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I have a small dog and a large dog and definitely notice a difference in how other dog walkers behave around them if I walk them separately. People often keep their dogs away from my larger dog but don’t with my smaller one. It’s as if they don’t think he could do damage even if he wasn’t ‘friendly’ so it doesn’t matter. It does matter though as a dog charging at him could really stress him out.


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## Pearlsasinger (4 January 2022)

I am surprised to see that some people notice a difference between the way others react to big and small dogs.  Our Rottweilers were always walked on lead in public places andwewerealways amazed at thenumberof dogs that were allowed to approach them by owners who really didn't seem  to be aware of the damage that a Rott could do.  Fortunately the were both very even-tempered.   The only reason that they were kept on-lead was because their recall was less than reliable.


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## CorvusCorax (4 January 2022)

blackcob said:



*SaddlePsych'D *I've also observed that 'off lead at all costs' type mentality and cannot understand it at all.
		
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I genuinely don't think there's anything more to it than 'my arms are sore' and not being able to admit they can't train.
You never see the same people able to walk their dogs at heel/on a loose line.
I can't imagine caring so little about a dog you'd willingly let it put itself at risk of injury on the roads or in the hands of another dog or a livestock farmer with a gun for the sake of fReeDom.


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## Annette4 (4 January 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			I genuinely don't think there's anything more to it than 'my arms are sore' and not being able to admit they can't train.
You never see the same people able to walk their dogs at heel/on a loose line.
I can't imagine caring so little about a dog you'd willingly let it put itself at risk of injury on the roads or in the hands of another dog or a livestock farmer with a gun for the sake of fReeDom.
		
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With sighthound owners it tends to be 'they are bred to run so they should be able to' which I've given up arguing with. 

I'm sick of Dobby turning himself inside out despite wearing a muzzle, harness and all his other kit to keep him safe. We hire a field when we can so he can free run outside of training and we moved so we have a bigger garden although we have to be careful when we train or nextdoors staff rips through the fence and the metal wire we've put up to keep her out.


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## CorvusCorax (4 January 2022)

In fairness all the houndy people around here are lovely and so are their dogs.


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## skinnydipper (4 January 2022)

So many owners who laugh and say their dog has "small dog syndrome" when its kicking off at mine.  Nah, pet, that's aggression and if my dog did what yours is doing you would be calling the Police.


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## lou246 (4 January 2022)

Pearlsacarolsinger said:



			I am surprised to see that some people notice a difference between the way others react to big and small dogs.  Our Rottweilers were always walked on lead in public places andwewerealways amazed at thenumberof dogs that were allowed to approach them by owners who really didn't seem  to be aware of the damage that a Rott could do.  Fortunately the were both very even-tempered.   The only reason that they were kept on-lead was because their recall was less than reliable.
		
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It’s like they don’t care about their own dogs safety, let alone other dogs! We still get people who don’t seem to care and let their dogs run over anyway but definitely less so than when walking with my smaller dog.


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## lou246 (4 January 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			So many owners who laugh and say their dog has "small dog syndrome" when its kicking off at mine.  Nah, pet, that's aggression and if my dog did what yours is doing you would be calling the Police.
		
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Exactly. Reactivity and aggression in smaller dogs is so often overlooked. I have trained my small and large dog the same way and I treat them both the same way. They are both dogs!


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## SaddlePsych'D (4 January 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			I genuinely don't think there's anything more to it than 'my arms are sore' and not being able to admit they can't train.
You never see the same people able to walk their dogs at heel/on a loose line.
I can't imagine caring so little about a dog you'd willingly let it put itself at risk of injury on the roads or in the hands of another dog or a livestock farmer with a gun for the sake of fReeDom.
		
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Same, I thought it was shocking but it was on a sighthound group so in line with the view Annette describes. They think it's cruel to stop them doing what they are bred to do. I get we need to work to what our dogs like but I still think there are ways to indulge sighthounds that stop short of letting them terrorise local wildlife and pets while putting themselves in danger. 

I also wonder if there's another social media influence from seeing other peope share videos of off lead 'zoomies' making it easy to think 'let's go for it' when you don't see the work that goes into (or ought to go into) making that safe.

Thankfully so far in person I have only met other sighthound owners who have been lovely and very safety conscious. We're off to our first secure space hire (indoor arena) next week and I picked it specifically because the venue owners have greyhounds, it was good to chat to them beforehand as we are so wary of off lead time but it sounds like a great space for us to get started and train safely.


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## Escapade (4 January 2022)

SaddlePsych'D said:



			I'm really shocked by some things I've seen on FB in terms of attitudes around on/off lead dogs. One person thinking of giving up their sighthound after it had killed two sheep, got lost on an estuary (or similar), and nearly got itself and it's owner injured from chasing a horse (no mention of the poor horse or rider) but they just 'didn't like the idea' of the dog being kept on lead. I thought 'surely better than an injured or dead dog', turns out not necessarily when I saw on another post a comment that someone would rather risk their dog being hit by a car than 'take away it's freedom' to be off lead - they even mentioned having lost a dog in exactly this manner. Of course there was no mention or thought of the livestock, pets, car drivers, horse riders and other third parties impacted by these various attitudes.
		
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Dogbook is absolutely bonkers.
I’ve copped some flak irl for walking mine on-lead but it’s always been people with handler-focused breeds. If I have time I’ll let someone finish their sermon, respond “okay” and move on, seeing steam come out the ears gives me joy 🥲
I firmly believe that off-lead time is a privilege which is earned. Mine never will and that’s okay, it just isn’t one of our goals. She has other outlets and runs in short bursts anyway, most places just aren’t safe for her to do that. Our walks are for her brain more than her body. See so many super fit hyper dogs that never get their brains worked!


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## Annette4 (4 January 2022)

Escapade said:



			Dogbook is absolutely bonkers.
I’ve copped some flak irl for walking mine on-lead but it’s always been people with handler-focused breeds. If I have time I’ll let someone finish their sermon, respond “okay” and move on, seeing steam come out the ears gives me joy 🥲
I firmly believe that off-lead time is a privilege which is earned. Mine never will and that’s okay, it just isn’t one of our goals. She has other outlets and runs in short bursts anyway, most places just aren’t safe for her to do that. Our walks are for her brain more than her body. See so many super fit hyper dogs that never get their brains worked!
		
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Exactly this! Ginny and Dobby aren't safe off the lead (for different reasons) outside of sports unless it's a secure private field so that's when they get off lead time. Otherwise they are on a longline or a short lead and they work their brains and their bodies every day. It's a running joke with my friends that I'm useless since I can train my dogs to do backflips but I can't train them to come back 😂

Even Fizz who has good recall is a sighthound at heart so she's only off lead in areas where I have a clear line of sight and there is no wildlife or stock for her to be tempted by.


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## CorvusCorax (4 January 2022)

But it's the prey/chase/hunt drive that makes them good at sports. Swings and roundabouts. My young one likes to dick off and do victory laps, I keep having to shout LINE at my decoy so he can grab it or she's off 😂

Same girl is exhausted after ten minutes working for food in the kitchen earlier, it's not all about the hooning about.


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## CorvusCorax (5 January 2022)

AS IF BY MAGIC I saw the knob with the springer this morning (the one that jumped into the garden and chased her when she was tiny) from a distance so went through a gap in the hedge to avoid and was playing with her. He obviously unclips the line the second he passes my house or thinks I'm not around as the thing came racing through SCREAMING at her and trying to jump on her. I had a tight hold and kept her protected and he just kept walking with the head down while his dog was out of sight barking maniacally then whizzed off again.
Unfortunately I was so close to home I had gone through all the food.
I stayed for ages to make sure it was gone but once we started moving again she started vocalising but got her across the lane.
Time will tell later on how this will impact on all the counter conditioning I've been doing for over a year.....

I did say the last time we had 'words', that I had been very fair and was within my rights to call the dog warden but had not. He then got very aggressive and said I kept my dogs locked up all day (they are in secure, covered kennels for a few hours a day with more floorspace than most of the rooms in my house, he cannot see them but hears them barking BECAUSE THERE'S A STRANGE DOG RUNNING AROUND THE GARDEN).
So obviously he knows where I live and I don't want to put my dogs or myself at risk


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## Pearlsasinger (5 January 2022)

TBH,I think that if you don't follow through your threat to call the DW, you will have endless, escalting trouble as he thinks he can do as he likes, including allowing his dog to run round your garden.


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## CorvusCorax (5 January 2022)

Pearlsacarolsinger said:



			TBH,I think that if you don't follow through your threat to call the DW, you will have endless, escalting trouble as he thinks he can do as he likes, including allowing his dog to run round your garden.
		
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I did after the last time and they asked what time he is likely to be around but there's a pretty large window. I also phoned a couple of councillors and the animal welfare officer as a pre-emptive strike in case he tried to report me.


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## Pearlsasinger (5 January 2022)

Could you put up a very obvious CCTV camera ( or doorbell) as a deterrent?


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## YorksG (5 January 2022)

The "authorities " do get used to these idiots trying to use them in games of tit for tat. Eventually they run out of people to complain to! Cameras are a good idea, then you have both a deterrent and evidence.


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## CorvusCorax (5 January 2022)

I could, but doesn't help when she comes bursting through the hedge when we're out and about. She's done that to the large dogs in the past as well but they are just bemused by it. I do have a headtorch that looks a bit like a hatcam though! There was no way I could have held the small one and got the phone out this morning. I know it sounds daft to say mine is intimidated by a springer but the first incident happened at such an important age for learning/imprinting and she's been extremely guardy/defensive around the property since then and it is something I am always going to have to work on. She's only just stopped barking at people walking past.


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## YorksG (5 January 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			I could, but doesn't help when she comes bursting through the hedge when we're out and about. She's done that to the large dogs in the past as well but they are just bemused by it. I do have a headtorch that looks a bit like a hatcam though! There was no way I could have held the small one and got the phone out this morning. I know it sounds daft to say mine is intimidated by a springer but the first incident happened at such an important age for learning/imprinting and she's been extremely guardy/defensive around the property since then and it is something I am always going to have to work on.
		
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Oh yes, we have had labs get very iffy around jrts, after being attacked by them as pups!


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## Pearlsasinger (5 January 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			I could, but doesn't help when she comes bursting through the hedge when we're out and about. She's done that to the large dogs in the past as well but they are just bemused by it. I do have a headtorch that looks a bit like a hatcam though! There was no way I could have held the small one and got the phone out this morning. I know it sounds daft to say mine is intimidated by a springer but the first incident happened at such an important age for learning/imprinting and she's been extrem
ely guardy/defensive around the property since then and it is something I am always going to have to work on. She's only just stopped barking at people walking past.
		
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I used to have a Lab who hated all  JRT's because one came hurtling out of its garden barking on one of her first walks when she was a pup.  It didn't actually touch her because I got my foot under it and lifted it up -much to the consternation/affront of its owner - but she never forgave the breed, until we got a pair of JRT pups when she was about 13 and she tolerated them because she knew them  when they were tiny..


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## skinnydipper (5 January 2022)

Pearlsacarolsinger said:



			I used to have a Lab who hated all  JRT's because one came hurtling out of its garden barking on one of her first walks when she was a pup.  It didn't actually touch her because I got my foot under it and lifted it up -much to the consternation/affront of its owner - but she never forgave the breed, until we got a pair of JRT pups when she was about 13 and she tolerated them because she knew them  when they were tiny..
		
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Are you saying CC needs a springer pup?


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## L&M (5 January 2022)

Totally agree - we are lucky enough to live by a some lovely riverside paths, but since lockdown they have became so busy it can be quite hairy. Our dogs know most of the 'regulars' but am very wary of unknown dogs, espescially off the lead. 

My whippet is very nervous of strange dogs after being cornered by 2 sharpei's - the owner was over 200 yards away and on his mobile, totally oblivious to me shouting at him to call them off. I now avoid the 'popular' walking times, of just loose them off in the field for a run instead.

Too many dogs, with too many ignorant owners........


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## lou246 (5 January 2022)

L&M said:



			Totally agree - we are lucky enough to live by a some lovely riverside paths, but since lockdown they have became so busy it can be quite hairy. Our dogs know most of the 'regulars' but am very wary of unknown dogs, espescially off the lead.

My whippet is very nervous of strange dogs after being cornered by 2 sharpei's - the owner was over 200 yards away and on his mobile, totally oblivious to me shouting at him to call them off. I now avoid the 'popular' walking times, of just loose them off in the field for a run instead.

Too many dogs, with too many ignorant owners........
		
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It’s a shame that you have to change your walking routes and times just because people won’t control their dogs. I have had to do the same over the past year or two as my smaller dog can be nervous around new dogs after a few unpleasant encounters. We try our best to avoid dogs we don’t know!


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## lou246 (5 January 2022)

This afternoon on our walk we were very nearly charged at by three dogs from the other end of a huge field. Fortunately they were distracted when another dog walker appeared from the woods closer to them (unfortunately for them). I recognised the dogs and they are walked by a ‘professional’ dog walker who has about 7 dogs normally, although I once counted 10. She has absolutely no control over them! I had a chat with the landowner (we often meet as he walks his dogs there too, it’s his land after all) and he’s not happy about it as she is parking up and walking across his private land to get to the footpaths. Other dog walkers have had problems with her too as the dogs just charge over to everyone. I’ve seen them chase deer as well. Of course there are many responsible professional dog walkers but surely there are checks or something that should be done, this woman would fail them all! I wonder if the dogs owners know the person they are trusting to look after their dogs is putting them in danger like that. I’ve no idea how she rounds them up when it’s time to go but it must be difficult!


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## splashgirl45 (5 January 2022)

ive been very lucky for a long time as im, careful where i walk and i avoid any dogs i dont know ... i had been out for 2 hours with my tiny terriers today, had a lovely walk but they were both muddy so i detoured to the river so we could all paddle to get legs and wellies clean.  i put both on the lead so they didnt go off into the mud on the last 5 mins and a dog the size of a large german shepherd came running up and started to intimidate mine, my younger terrier was scared as she couldnt get away and i shouted to the owner to call it, meanwhile pushing it away.  she said its ok shes friendly ,  i dont want to be banned but i didnt say take it away very nicely.  she looked at mine pityingly and said dont you ever let them off lead ?  ignorant person, mine had been off lead for most of my 2 hour walk and she should have put hers on or called it to her  when she saw mine on leads,  that few minutes made me really angry after having such a lovely time in the sunshine..


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## paisley (5 January 2022)

splashgirl45 said:



			ive been very lucky for a long time as im, careful where i walk and i avoid any dogs i dont know ... i had been out for 2 hours with my tiny terriers today, had a lovely walk but they were both muddy so i detoured to the river so we could all paddle to get legs and wellies clean.  i put both on the lead so they didnt go off into the mud on the last 5 mins and a dog the size of a large german shepherd came running up and started to intimidate mine, my younger terrier was scared as she couldnt get away and i shouted to the owner to call it, meanwhile pushing it away.  she said its ok shes friendly ,  i dont want to be banned but i didnt say take it away very nicely.  she looked at mine pityingly and said dont you ever let them off lead ?  ignorant person, mine had been off lead for most of my 2 hour walk and she should have put hers on or called it to her  when she saw mine on leads,  that few minutes made me really angry after having such a lovely time in the sunshine..
		
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Just tell her next time its either a: none of her bloody business when your dogs are off lead or b: they dont bully or harass other dogs when they are.
I like to tell the 'okay he's friendly ' eejits that I'm not asking for a character reference,  just for their dog to be less of a dick


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## splashgirl45 (5 January 2022)

paisley said:



			Just tell her next time its either a: none of her bloody business when your dogs are off lead or b: they dont bully or harass other dogs when they are.
I like to tell the 'okay he's friendly ' eejits that I'm not asking for a character reference,  just for their dog to be less of a dick
		
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i wasnt very polite (slight understatement)  so i think she might avoid me next time


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## Annette4 (5 January 2022)

We had to again today when I took Ginny out. I'm working really hard on her recall around distractions (on a line) and she was doing amazingly then we got charged by a spaniel who didn't get close enough (only because I managed to keep her walking) but owner was just following the damn thing round and not even calling it and letting it approach everyone. Ginny's boundary frustration then kicked in so lots of growling and yapping but managed to get away and get her back focused on me only for the damn thing to reappear after getting another spaniel so wound up it nearly had its owner over. 

I can't work on the issue without taking Ginny to areas where there are likely to be distractions but when I'm being responsible and trying to stop my over friendly dog from approaching others by keeping her on a line and training her it, it's so frustrating to deal with. I'm just thankful it was her not Dobby!


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## CorvusCorax (5 January 2022)

paisley said:



			I like to tell the 'okay he's friendly ' eejits that I'm not asking for a character reference,  just for their dog to be less of a dick
		
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**Stealing**


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## Boulty (6 January 2022)

I'm struggling a bit with the hooligan spaniel where recall is concerned at the moment. With no distractions he'll check in every few minutes for a reward & will stay fairly close with the odd dash off to investigate a nice smell or chase a bird but won't go out of my eyeline.  Generally if I spot a dog before he does he'll come back, be put on lead & then let off again when we've passed (sometimes with a polite hello to the other dog, sometimes not depending on other owners wishes).  Occasionally if we get caught out or surprised he will decide to take himself over to say hi whether he has permission or not ( on which occasions he is swiftly retrieved & I apologize.... He is generally fairly well mannered in his greetings & does tend to back off if another dog tells him to bugger off but in an ideal world would prefer him to always come back.  I am doing a lot of recall training with him using exercises suggested by a trainer / behaviourist but he's only 7 months so sometimes his brain just stops working!) 

He's also twice recently properly sodded off chasing leaves.  The first time he did come back after about 30 seconds of being a bellend but the second time my mum (whose timing & tone aren't always the best) was walking him & he spent a good 5 minutes taking the piss so has earnt himself time back on a longline when not in enclosed spaces until he's decided not to be a stroppy teenager / until we can find a toy or treat more exciting than leaves! (Sadly we think he might have some kind of intolerance to chicken & poultry which narrows our options a bit!)  

Anyway not much point to this other than that I worry I'll be judged as irresponsible when he's having one of his deaf arsehole moments when 30 seconds earlier he could have been doing an impression of the perfect dog & am trying hard & working alongside a trainer to try & get him as close to 100% reliable as I can


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## lou246 (6 January 2022)

Boulty said:



			I'm struggling a bit with the hooligan spaniel where recall is concerned at the moment. With no distractions he'll check in every few minutes for a reward & will stay fairly close with the odd dash off to investigate a nice smell or chase a bird but won't go out of my eyeline.  Generally if I spot a dog before he does he'll come back, be put on lead & then let off again when we've passed (sometimes with a polite hello to the other dog, sometimes not depending on other owners wishes).  Occasionally if we get caught out or surprised he will decide to take himself over to say hi whether he has permission or not ( on which occasions he is swiftly retrieved & I apologize.... He is generally fairly well mannered in his greetings & does tend to back off if another dog tells him to bugger off but in an ideal world would prefer him to always come back.  I am doing a lot of recall training with him using exercises suggested by a trainer / behaviourist but he's only 7 months so sometimes his brain just stops working!)

He's also twice recently properly sodded off chasing leaves.  The first time he did come back after about 30 seconds of being a bellend but the second time my mum (whose timing & tone aren't always the best) was walking him & he spent a good 5 minutes taking the piss so has earnt himself time back on a longline when not in enclosed spaces until he's decided not to be a stroppy teenager / until we can find a toy or treat more exciting than leaves! (Sadly we think he might have some kind of intolerance to chicken & poultry which narrows our options a bit!) 

Anyway not much point to this other than that I worry I'll be judged as irresponsible when he's having one of his deaf arsehole moments when 30 seconds earlier he could have been doing an impression of the perfect dog & am trying hard & working alongside a trainer to try & get him as close to 100% reliable as I can
		
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It sounds like you are trying your best by using a long line and working with a trainer. That’s what matters and that’s a sign of a responsible owner. From what you’ve said you have made the right decision to keep him on a long line for now, it doesn’t sound like he’s ready to be off the lead in public yet and that’s perfectly fine. Better safe than sorry. It’s the people who genuinely don’t care about what their dogs are doing and have no respect for other people & dogs that are the problem. Good luck with your training!


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## Annette4 (6 January 2022)

Boulty said:



			I'm struggling a bit with the hooligan spaniel where recall is concerned at the moment. With no distractions he'll check in every few minutes for a reward & will stay fairly close with the odd dash off to investigate a nice smell or chase a bird but won't go out of my eyeline.  Generally if I spot a dog before he does he'll come back, be put on lead & then let off again when we've passed (sometimes with a polite hello to the other dog, sometimes not depending on other owners wishes).  Occasionally if we get caught out or surprised he will decide to take himself over to say hi whether he has permission or not ( on which occasions he is swiftly retrieved & I apologize.... He is generally fairly well mannered in his greetings & does tend to back off if another dog tells him to bugger off but in an ideal world would prefer him to always come back.  I am doing a lot of recall training with him using exercises suggested by a trainer / behaviourist but he's only 7 months so sometimes his brain just stops working!)

He's also twice recently properly sodded off chasing leaves.  The first time he did come back after about 30 seconds of being a bellend but the second time my mum (whose timing & tone aren't always the best) was walking him & he spent a good 5 minutes taking the piss so has earnt himself time back on a longline when not in enclosed spaces until he's decided not to be a stroppy teenager / until we can find a toy or treat more exciting than leaves! (Sadly we think he might have some kind of intolerance to chicken & poultry which narrows our options a bit!) 

Anyway not much point to this other than that I worry I'll be judged as irresponsible when he's having one of his deaf arsehole moments when 30 seconds earlier he could have been doing an impression of the perfect dog & am trying hard & working alongside a trainer to try & get him as close to 100% reliable as I can
		
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As long as people are obviously trying (I have 2 poor recall delinquents myself) I have plenty of patience and empathy for when things go wrong. It's the people who don't see the behaviour as inappropriate who are the issue 😊


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## Karran (6 January 2022)

Annette4 said:



			As long as people are obviously trying (I have 2 poor recall delinquents myself) I have plenty of patience and empathy for when things go wrong. It's the people who don't see the behaviour as inappropriate who are the issue 😊
		
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Yes. Unless the dog is storming in and behaving completely inappropriately, I will always give strangers the benefit of the doubt. Mrs Spaniel is completely dog neutral so I don't worry about her as her default is to avoid and will pop onto a bench or something similar out of the way if necessary and I will ask Mrs Collie to come to heel or sit between my legs to allow the owner to catch up as she still likes to try to engage other dogs in chase games which I don't like unless I know the owner/dog. Its the idiot owners and the repeat offenders that bother me.


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## skinnydipper (6 January 2022)

Seeing as we are having a little moan.

Polite notice.

No matter how cute and adorable you think your dog is, I do not want it jumping all over me.

Thank you.


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## splashgirl45 (6 January 2022)

another numpty today, woman walking along narrow pavement next to an A road with a bit of traffic, walking her lurcher type dog on an extending lead at full length...i nearly stopped to tell her that if a squirrel appears on the other side of the road she will have a dead dog who is still on a lead so worse than it being off lead completely, at least it would be able to dodge the traffic....i cant believe the stupidity of people these days


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## lou246 (6 January 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			Seeing as we are having a little moan.

Polite notice.

No matter how cute and adorable you think your dog is, I do not want it jumping all over me.

Thank you.
		
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I was once told I was “not a proper dog person” after I had asked someone to stop letting their muddy dog jump all over me!


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## CorvusCorax (6 January 2022)

You know the way that some parents say they love their own kids but aren't fussed about other people's? Same, only dogs


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## Identityincrisis (6 January 2022)

Since i muzzled my dog i found it made other owners a LOT more switched on! So it should as my dog is super aggressive so my warning calls to them to shouldn't be ignored! I have found if I'm confronted with an off lead dog who is not listening to it's owner's screams,  then a foot out in front of me shouting back very firmly refocuses the dog. 3 years of owning an aggressive dog, i have lost my care of upsetting other owners, THEIR dog is out of control, not mine as he is muzzled, 3 point houdini harness and leader, always by my side when other dogs are around


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## stangs (6 January 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			Seeing as we are having a little moan.

Polite notice.

No matter how cute and adorable you think your dog is, I do not want it jumping all over me.

Thank you.
		
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Nor do I want your crowd of terriers barking at me from all sides for over a minute while you do nothing to retrieve them but say a half-hearted "they just love meeting new people".


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## skinnydipper (6 January 2022)

lou246 said:



			I was once told I was “not a proper dog person” after I had asked someone to stop letting their muddy dog jump all over me!
		
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Speaking as a "dog person" , I would argue that the numpty should be able to teach their dog manners.


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## SaddlePsych'D (6 January 2022)

Saw a post of someone literally saying they check out the clothes of oncoming people to gauge how 'okay' it is for their dog to jump up at them. It was in the context of work in progress training efforts, but still I wouldn't like to be one of the chosen guinea pigs for being jumped up at!

Out with share horse the other day and watched a couple with their two little dogs going bonkers off lead, barking at this poor German shepherd on lead with its owners clearly trying to keep it focused/calm. The small dog owners did absolutely nothing to call their dogs away or put them on lead or even just walk past a bit quicker to help the other owners out. Totally oblivious to me riding near behind them (Ivy was also with OH, thankfully pretty oblivious/uninterested in the whole thing) and then when finally their dogs did move on it was to chase another horse and rider. Fantastic. 

Ivy greyhound had her first off lead time with us today - indoor secured arena. It was fantastic fun for her and us, but even if we do get her recall solid I don't think I could ever let her off outside of a secure space - the speed! Really pleased we have a very basic recall in that she gets the idea of 'come' means come to us, so that's a start I guess but with distractions it will be a challenge.


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## CorvusCorax (6 January 2022)

SaddlePsych'D said:



			Saw a post of someone literally saying they check out the clothes of oncoming people to gauge how 'okay' it is for their dog to jump up at them. It was in the context of work in progress training efforts, but still I wouldn't like to be one of the chosen guinea pigs for being jumped up at!

Out with share horse the other day and watched a couple with their two little dogs going bonkers off lead, barking at this poor German shepherd on lead with its owners clearly trying to keep it focused/calm. The small dog owners did absolutely nothing to call their dogs away or put them on lead or even just walk past a bit quicker to help the other owners out. Totally oblivious to me riding near behind them (Ivy was also with OH, thankfully pretty oblivious/uninterested in the whole thing) and then when finally their dogs did move on it was to chase another horse and rider. Fantastic.

Ivy greyhound had her first off lead time with us today - indoor secured arena. It was fantastic fun for her and us, but even if we do get her recall solid I don't think I could ever let her off outside of a secure space - the speed! Really pleased we have a very basic recall in that she gets the idea of 'come' means come to us, so that's a start I guess but with distractions it will be a challenge.
		
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I was walking one of my oldies last night and there was a terrier which literally roared its head off at him the whole way along the street (we were walking in the same direction on opposite sides) although mine didn't seem to notice. Point one, if this was the other way around, it would have been really intimidating, point two...that sort of thing would worry me and I would want to work on it, not ignore it?!


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## MotherOfChickens (6 January 2022)

lou246 said:



			I was once told I was “not a proper dog person” after I had asked someone to stop letting their muddy dog jump all over me!
		
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I’ve had this too-even after I took aversive action to get out of the way as I was dressed up for a meeting. Said dog was apparently a rescue that needed to meet as many strange people as possible to reassure her. stupid woman.


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## Goldenstar (6 January 2022)

splashgirl45 said:



			another numpty today, woman walking along narrow pavement next to an A road with a bit of traffic, walking her lurcher type dog on an extending lead at full length...i nearly stopped to tell her that if a squirrel appears on the other side of the road she will have a dead dog who is still on a lead so worse than it being off lead completely, at least it would be able to dodge the traffic....i cant believe the stupidity of people these days
		
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The idiocy of people using those extending leads never fails to amaze me .
Just before Christmas a lady caused mayhem letting her very excited young dog romp through a crowded pub a older gentleman nearly got pulled over by the lead .


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## Pearlsasinger (6 January 2022)

We were out with our 2 Labs and the 6 month old pup that we look after during the working day.  All were off lead, playing close to us on the Common.   We saw someone with a dog walking on another path, ours  all ignored dog and owner. The next thing we knew, an off-lead whippetty thing was approaching from behind us.  

We called ours to us but the pup hasn't yet got a solid recall, although she is usually pretty good.  Pup went up to the whipetty thing whose owner did put it on a lead.  I collected the pup and apologised. 'Oh',said WT's owner,  'I thought they must be alright as they were off lead'. 

 He must have deliberately cut through some bushes, or speeded up ridiculously, to get to us from where we first saw him.  Yes, ours are 'alright' but we don't want them 'playing' with dogs that they don't know when we meet them out and about. 

We want to be able to take them to parkland where there are plenty of people walking their dogs, without annoying other people.And tbh, if he wants his dog toplay with off-lead dogs, he will.either have to get another of his own or make a proper arrangement to  meet someone else with a dog (not us).


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## Mero (6 January 2022)

I just had an off lead chihuahua come round a corner by itself, right up into my on-lead dogs face, barking and snarling. My dog is not dog friendly to many others. Owner meandered round the corner 30seconds later, whilst I’m fending it off with my foot. ‘Oh sorry, he always does this, I wouldn’t let him off the lead if I thought he would actually hurt another dog, but he’s so small I don’t really worry’. 

…Lucky for you lady my dog maintained some sort of self restraint in not treating your dog like a pre-dinner appetiser.


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## Boulty (6 January 2022)

Will admit that If I'm already muddy from dog or horse I'm not too fussed about other dogs not being 100% perfect & forgetting a few manners as long as they're not total swamp monsters & don't knock me over.  If I'm in "normal" clothes though I prefer not to be jumped on (& so generally don't do anything that might be seen as an invitation if I can help it)

As for the delinquent had a really good training session in the playing field near the house on his longline. Plastic sausages on a rope are much more interesting than a ball apparently  almost to the point of obsession (drop it needs work as that's another casualty of being a teenager apparently!) & he's starting to maybe finally grasp that he doesn't need to bounce up & down like deranged yo-yo when walking to heel.  Only slightly concerning thing is he did some unsure growling at a small child who tried to come up to him.  I THINK it was the fact they had their hood up & he couldn't see their face as he's never done that to a child before although I regularly wear hats, hoods etc so he should be used to seeing them (did it to a very shifty looking / erratically behaving adult a few months ago but there was a definite feeling of bad vibes coming off them) but that's another thing to discuss with trainer. (Just took him to one side away from them & apologized but didn't really want to tell him off as such as worried about making it worse if it is fear based)  Debating if a pheromone collar may be worth a try as he's taken to barking at the TV / at strange noises in the garden when he didn't used to bother so not sure how if going through a bit of a fear period.  (He definitely looks unsure when doing it rather than aggressive & tends to stop if you ignore him... Not that this makes it any more acceptable)


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## CorvusCorax (7 January 2022)

People are asking a lot of dogs to discriminate between people's old mucky clothes and someone's good coat on their way to a job interview or a date etc etc. Best not to let them do it at all and then there is no grey area for them to try and work out.

Same with recall training TBH. If they learn the right thing the first time, rather than being given the benefit of the doubt to dick off and self-satisfy, then there's no need to train over the top of old behaviour with hundreds of repetitions.


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## Nasicus (7 January 2022)

Ivy greyhound had her first off lead time with us today - indoor secured arena. It was fantastic fun for her and us, but even if we do get her recall solid I don't think I could ever let her off outside of a secure space - the speed! Really pleased we have a very basic recall in that she gets the idea of 'come' means come to us, so that's a start I guess but with distractions it will be a challenge.
		
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My Tibbie is like this, fantastic recall when it's just us/the group we're with, but add in any other person/dog and she's off like a rocket to say hello. So in public, she stays* firmly* on the lead! She gets her off lead time at the field or at a local secure dog field for individual hire.
To be honest, I wouldn't let off her off the lead even if she was good with distractions, if purely because the breed is notorious for picking a direction and zooming off into the sunset _just because... _I've had my fill of that from my last Tib!


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## lou246 (7 January 2022)

Just got back from our usual morning walk and lets just say it was not relaxing! As we were walking along the edge of a field I saw an off lead Labrador and it had already seen us. It started stalking and staring and was completely ignoring its owners calls so I thought “great, here we go again”. I called my two and went into the woods. Labrador follows (must have run at some speed) charges up to my smaller dog and as soon as it smells him it’s hackles go up. Now, my smaller dog is intact and I’m wondering if that’s why it took an instant disliking to him (the lab was neutered). My dog goes tense as there is a large unknown dog looming over him. I tell it to shoo, it doesn’t. It then made a very sudden movement towards my dog and my dog gives a correction. Just a small “go away”. Then all hell breaks loose. The dog completely flattens my dog, pins him to the floor and all I can hear is growling. Now bear in mind my dog is a small terrier and this dog is a large male lab. My setter runs over and has a go at the lab because she sees my smaller dog being flattened but the lab doesn’t back off. If it wanted to kill him it would have but it was all teeth and growling. I don’t want my dog to end up with a broken bone from being squashed though so I grabbed the lab by the collar and dragged it back to its owner, who was just standing in the field looking like he’s in a daydream. My small dog follows but just stands there next to me and the dog that was just pinning him down, like he wasn’t scared but knew he couldn’t win that fight! Owner says, “what did you do that for” to his dog (not that he even knows what ‘that’ was as he was miles away) and I walk off. Bizarre.

Sorry, just needed a bit of a rant. I still don’t think I fully understand what happened but the more I think about it the more I wonder if I could have done something differently! I carry a pet corrector spray but it all happened so quickly I forgot about it. Not sure it would have helped though. Did my dog accidentally start that fight by correcting the dog? Or was it inevitable as the lab was already in a sort of fight mode? I wish I had grabbed it sooner but it all happened so fast. Seriously considering not ever walking there again as we so often meet off lead dogs with no recall now. That would be such a shame as we have walked there for years. Even though my two have solid recall I don’t want to put them in a position where they are going to be charged at by dogs we don’t know the temperament of as anything could happen!


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## CorvusCorax (7 January 2022)

That's shocking  as you say these things happen so quickly sometimes that it's hard to do much. Your dog did nothing wrong IMO. He was put in a vulnerable position by the Lab and told it to go away and it chose to up the ante. Your dog was not threatening the Lab, which chose to go out of its way to make the distance and approach yours. It's something I've seen in a few Labs locally (make distance towards other dogs and go into a threatening stance, unprovoked) and because they have a stereotypically sunny disposition and no one can read body language these days, the owners give them a by and think they are just going off to 'mAke fWendS'.


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## lou246 (7 January 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			That's shocking  as you say these things happen so quickly sometimes that it's hard to do much. Your dog did nothing wrong IMO. He was put in a vulnerable position by the Lab and told it to go away and it chose to up the ante. Your dog was not threatening the Lab, which chose to go out of its way to make the distance and approach yours. It's something I've seen in a few Labs locally (make distance towards other dogs and go into a threatening stance, unprovoked) and because they have a stereotypically sunny disposition and no one can read body language these days, the owners give them a by and think they are just going off to 'mAke fWendS'.
		
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Thanks for replying. I’m glad you think that my dog wasn’t in the wrong! I don’t think he was either but it’s good to get a second opinion. He was attacked quite badly when he was young, he was on lead and the dog ran up from behind, picked him up in its mouth and shook him around. It was horrible! He was also attacked last year (he’s 5 now) but the dog didn’t bite, it was more teeth and noise. It knocked his confidence but I worked hard at building it up again and he’s been doing so well… then something like this happens. I’m worried it will set him back. I always try my best to advocate for my dogs but sometimes dogs come out of nowhere and it all happens so fast. Going to stick to walks where dogs are all on leads for a couple of weeks and hopefully book a secure field for a run around.

I understand what you mean about labs and how because they are typically ‘friendly’ some people think they are incapable of aggression. I was once told “he’s a Labrador, he’s harmless” when I asked someone to recall their dog that was not showing positive body language and wouldn’t leave mine alone


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## Amymay (7 January 2022)

Lou, you did nothing wrong.  I’d have done a little more than just walk off though - a few choice words would have been said!


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## SaddlePsych'D (7 January 2022)

lou246 said:



			Thanks for replying. I’m glad you think that my dog wasn’t in the wrong! I don’t think he was either but it’s good to get a second opinion. He was attacked quite badly when he was young, he was on lead and the dog ran up from behind, picked him up in its mouth and shook him around. It was horrible! He was also attacked last year (he’s 5 now) but the dog didn’t bite, it was more teeth and noise. It knocked his confidence but I worked hard at building it up again and he’s been doing so well… then something like this happens. I’m worried it will set him back. I always try my best to advocate for my dogs but sometimes dogs come out of nowhere and it all happens so fast. Going to stick to walks where dogs are all on leads for a couple of weeks and hopefully book a secure field for a run around.

I understand what you mean about labs and how because they are typically ‘friendly’ some people think they are incapable of aggression. I was once told “he’s a Labrador, he’s harmless” when I asked someone to recall their dog that was not showing positive body language and wouldn’t leave mine alone 

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Poor little guy and a horrible situation for you to manage alone as well. I don't think you did anything wrong and you did take action to avoid a situation, there's only so much you can do with the other owner not even trying/being oblivious.

I was out with Ivy a couple of weeks ago and a Lab started approaching us. The owners were just letting it wander over not really paying much attention. I still couldn't tell you now what it was about this dog I didn't like the look of but even with it coming over slowly there was something about its body language I didn't like. I stuck my hand up in the air and shouted out 'no!' and thankfully the owners did then recall it. I probably looked really grumpy and maybe I read something that wasn't there but we just have to do what feels right for our dogs.


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## lou246 (7 January 2022)

Amymay said:



			Lou, you did nothing wrong.  I’d have done a little more than just walk off though - a few choice words would have been said!
		
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I wanted to but I also wanted to get as far away from the dog as possible! Also because I walk on my own I worry about people reacting badly to being confronted. My friend was out with her new rescue dog a few weeks ago and when she asked a man to recall his dog he started shouting abuse and threats at her. It was only because some other dog walkers appeared that he backed off. What is wrong with some people!


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## Amymay (7 January 2022)

I completely understand that xxx


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## CorvusCorax (7 January 2022)

lou246 said:



			Thanks for replying. I’m glad you think that my dog wasn’t in the wrong! I don’t think he was either but it’s good to get a second opinion. He was attacked quite badly when he was young, he was on lead and the dog ran up from behind, picked him up in its mouth and shook him around. It was horrible! He was also attacked last year (he’s 5 now) but the dog didn’t bite, it was more teeth and noise. It knocked his confidence but I worked hard at building it up again and he’s been doing so well… then something like this happens. I’m worried it will set him back. I always try my best to advocate for my dogs but sometimes dogs come out of nowhere and it all happens so fast. Going to stick to walks where dogs are all on leads for a couple of weeks and hopefully book a secure field for a run around.

I understand what you mean about labs and how because they are typically ‘friendly’ some people think they are incapable of aggression. I was once told “he’s a Labrador, he’s harmless” when I asked someone to recall their dog that was not showing positive body language and wouldn’t leave mine alone 

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That's it, these berks walk off thinking, no harm done, what was the crazy lady so upset about, not seeing the weeks and months of work it took to get the dog over a previous bad experience.
I did have a discussion with someone recently, so many people have 'well behaved' dogs through luck, they just bimble through life while pianos crash down inches away behind them, and then they wonder what the rest of us get so het up about.

There is a woman in town with an extremely aggressive Lab who she muzzles and allows to run off miles from her and literally headbutt other dogs growling while she and her friends laugh and call him weakly. The last time it came barrelling over I ROARED at it and it bailed. I shouted over 'maybe try something like that next time, eh?'. Dozy cow.

I did see spangletwat this morning way ahead of me and took the phone out and took some pics of the dog off the lead if he tries to lie next time....


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## skinnydipper (7 January 2022)

I wonder how the people who don't have a problem with dogs jumping up, would feel about my mastiff with her paws on their shoulders.


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## Pearlsasinger (7 January 2022)

I take a walking stick on our dog walks- partly because I can't risk falling again but also I find it extremely useful for getting rid of unwanted dogs.  A couple of yappy, horrible, untrained 'poo-things' have turned up a couple of times recently. 
The first time, we had just the adult Labs and were just ready to gather our dogs and put them back on the leads to go home, when these things appeared round a bush, they charged yapping at our dogs, who chased them off for a few yards, the poos ran away, owner took no notice whatsoever. 
The next time, we had the adults and the pup with us, owner was within sight on another path, poos set off, yapping, towards us from behind.  I turned, lifted my stick and pointed it at them, shouted 'get out of it', poos turned and went, owner shouted  'Oi', I think at me, rather than his dogs.  I was looking forwards to telling him what I thought of his bad mannered dogs (and his own manners) but he disappeared quite quickly.
My neighbour, who also has a Poo, tells me that every-one in the village knows these 2, they are very bad-mannerd and keep frightening her dog.


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## Arzada (7 January 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			'maybe try something like that next time
		
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Here's one for you to enjoy CC


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## CorvusCorax (7 January 2022)

Arzada said:



			Here's one for you to enjoy CC 






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**shops for megaphone**


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## Errin Paddywack (7 January 2022)

lou246 said:



			I understand what you mean about labs and how because they are typically ‘friendly’ some people think they are incapable of aggression.
		
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When my sister first took her dog to training classes back in the 70's she told me the dogs she had most problems with were labs.  One particular one went for her dog as she was leaving one night but got her calf instead.  Made quite a mess of it apparently.  She should have made a fuss but didn't and it was years later she even told me.


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## Cinnamontoast (8 January 2022)

Annette4 said:



			As long as people are obviously trying (I have 2 poor recall delinquents myself) I have plenty of patience and empathy for when things go wrong. It's the people who don't see the behaviour as inappropriate who are the issue 😊
		
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I agree. I cannot understand why owners don’t understand that their lack of control is the issue. I was training Zak and Bear one day, they were 100% focused on me. An English bulldog came pelting across from miles away. I put my 2 on leads but I can’t run and the dog went under Zak, who went nuts. The owner didn’t even try to recall and when he eventually got to me, tried to make out it was my fault because mine had been loose (hard to do retrieves if on the lead!) so he assumed they were friendly. Hmm.



skinnydipper said:



			I wonder how the people who don't have a problem with dogs jumping up, would feel about my mastiff with her paws on their shoulders.
		
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There was a 15 week old mastiff puppy in Pets at Home, 1st time out, being carried. It was 4 times the size of my puppies! Then we met a young Yorkshire terrier which was a quarter of the size of mine, absolutely miniature!


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## skinnydipper (8 January 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			There was a 15 week old mastiff puppy in Pets at Home, 1st time out, being carried. It was 4 times the size of my puppies! Then we met a young Yorkshire terrier which was a quarter of the size of mine, absolutely miniature!
		
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Mine is totally unaware of size difference.  She was playing with a young Westie the other day, who in turn was not concerned about the size of my dog.  It was lovely to see.


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## CorvusCorax (8 January 2022)

This week gets better. I found either a large staff or a small mastiff round the back just now 😳 timing was lucky, 30 seconds earlier and I was swapping dogs around and the eldest was out.


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## Cinnamontoast (8 January 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			Mine is totally unaware of size difference.  She was playing with a young Westie the other day, who in turn was not concerned about the size of my dog.  It was lovely to see.
		
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That is super sweet if both play nicely. There was a cocker in the park with an unfortunate attitude last week, only 6 months but there was no way I was having mine-half it’s size-interacting. Owner was an idiot, IMO, clueless re body language. Conversely, there’s a huge schnoodle youngster who was very polite, lovely owner too.


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## Cinnamontoast (8 January 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			This week gets better. I found either a large staff or a small mastiff round the back just now 😳 timing was lucky, 30 seconds earlier and I was swapping dogs around and the eldest was out.
		
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I have no idea of the size/layout of your place, but could you stockfence? When the neighbours bought a very small puppy, I said there were small holes that mine couldn’t get through but a very small puppy could. They bought quite a lot of chicken wire! It’s very annoying when the other dogs aren’t your responsibility and the owners should just keep them on leads, I know.


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## skinnydipper (8 January 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			That is super sweet if both play nicely. There was a cocker in the park with an unfortunate attitude last week, only 6 months but there was no way I was having mine-half it’s size-interacting. Owner was an idiot, IMO, clueless re body language. Conversely, there’s a huge schnoodle youngster who was very polite, lovely owner too.
		
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I am very particular about who she plays with


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## skinnydipper (8 January 2022)

deleted.  Not everyone shares my sense of humour


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## Cinnamontoast (8 January 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			I am very particular about who she plays with 

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Same, after Zak, I don’t want any unpleasant dogs near them. We’ve met some very polite ones so far.


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## CorvusCorax (8 January 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			I have no idea of the size/layout of your place, but could you stockfence? When the neighbours bought a very small puppy, I said there were small holes that mine couldn’t get through but a very small puppy could. They bought quite a lot of chicken wire! It’s very annoying when the other dogs aren’t your responsibility and the owners should just keep them on leads, I know.
		
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Not really doable and I had opened my gate to drive out, was just locking up when it happened, this one didn't look capable of jumping any walls.
I did go out to check who it was with, a young woman who was already a long way down the lane so didn't see the point in hollering.
When I left she was walking it down the middle of the busy street, off leash, there is no footpath on either side and is lined with cars either side. It did seem to be relatively obedient/responding to hand signals, but why would you....


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## Cinnamontoast (8 January 2022)

I’m almost sure I read something the other day about it being illegal to not leash a dog on a main road? Dunno, might be dreaming. Bear wouldn’t ever run away, but even with him, I put a lead on to come out of the park, despite the car being literally 2 steps away. I catastrophise and imagine him seeing a cat or something.


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## Pearlsasinger (8 January 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			I’m almost sure I read something the other day about it being illegal to not leash a dog on a main road? Dunno, might be dreaming. Bear wouldn’t ever run away, but even with him, I put a lead on to come out of the park, despite the car being literally 2 steps away. I catastrophise and imagine him seeing a cat or something.
		
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I think it is covered by bye-laws, our council has a similar bye-law, not that many people take any notice.


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## skinnydipper (8 January 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			Highway Code.  Rule 56

*Dogs.* Do not let a dog out on the road on its own. Keep it on a short lead when walking on the pavement, road or path shared with cyclists or horse riders.
		
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## Cinnamontoast (8 January 2022)

Thank you both for reassuring me that I haven’t gone crazy!


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## SaddlePsych'D (16 January 2022)

I thought of the thread again today and the thing about advocating for your dog. Ivy is very sweet but a bit timid, we don't stop and say hi to many dogs and often when we do I feel like it's better to keep it really brief then move on. I don't want to teach her that other dogs are a worry but also feel maybe it's better to cut the greetings a little shorter than let them go on too long and to the point she's uncomfortable?

Not sure if I was overreacting today but had a whatsapoo come over to her today. Initially fine but annoying that owner let the extendable lead get tangled round OH's legs. I spotted Ivy reach her point of having had enough so OH moved her away and she was actually quite keen to move away. Other owner ignoring/being oblivious let the stupid extendable lead keep reeling out so their dog just kept coming at Ivy even though all her body language was saying no, she was moving away from it still, and I'd called out to OH that I thought Ivy had had enough. It then put its fron paws up on Ivy (maybe to hump her, not sure) so I shouted "now that IS enough". I don't know if that was the right way to manage the situation or an over reaction on my part? Ivy has been fab with other dogs so far I just feel that we shouldn't take the pee with her good nature. The other dog wasn't aggressive just overly social but with a different dog I can imagine that going wrong quite quickly.


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## skinnydipper (16 January 2022)

SaddlePsych'D said:



			I thought of the thread again today and the thing about advocating for your dog. Ivy is very sweet but a bit timid, we don't stop and say hi to many dogs and often when we do I feel like it's better to keep it really brief then move on. I don't want to teach her that other dogs are a worry but also feel maybe it's better to cut the greetings a little shorter than let them go on too long and to the point she's uncomfortable?

Not sure if I was overreacting today but had a whatsapoo come over to her today. Initially fine but annoying that owner let the extendable lead get tangled round OH's legs. I spotted Ivy reach her point of having had enough so OH moved her away and she was actually quite keen to move away. Other owner ignoring/being oblivious let the stupid extendable lead keep reeling out so their dog just kept coming at Ivy even though all her body language was saying no, she was moving away from it still, and I'd called out to OH that I thought Ivy had had enough. It then put its fron paws up on Ivy (maybe to hump her, not sure) so I shouted "now that IS enough". I don't know if that was the right way to manage the situation or an over reaction on my part? Ivy has been fab with other dogs so far I just feel that we shouldn't take the pee with her good nature. The other dog wasn't aggressive just overly social but with a different dog I can imagine that going wrong quite quickly.
		
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Well done for advocating for your dog.

I hate those silly leads.  My dog had one wrapped round her legs yesterday.  Although she was fine with the other dog, I said to her "lets go before you get your leg broken" and moved away as soon as we could.

If we are being pestered by another dog or mine is uncomfortable I will ask the owner to call their dog, if that's a failure I ask the owner to come and get their dog. After that I ramp it up.


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## Amymay (16 January 2022)

SaddlePsych'D said:



			I thought of the thread again today and the thing about advocating for your dog. Ivy is very sweet but a bit timid, we don't stop and say hi to many dogs and often when we do I feel like it's better to keep it really brief then move on. I don't want to teach her that other dogs are a worry but also feel maybe it's better to cut the greetings a little shorter than let them go on too long and to the point she's uncomfortable?

Not sure if I was overreacting today but had a whatsapoo come over to her today. Initially fine but annoying that owner let the extendable lead get tangled round OH's legs. I spotted Ivy reach her point of having had enough so OH moved her away and she was actually quite keen to move away. Other owner ignoring/being oblivious let the stupid extendable lead keep reeling out so their dog just kept coming at Ivy even though all her body language was saying no, she was moving away from it still, and I'd called out to OH that I thought Ivy had had enough. It then put its fron paws up on Ivy (maybe to hump her, not sure) so I shouted "now that IS enough". I don't know if that was the right way to manage the situation or an over reaction on my part? Ivy has been fab with other dogs so far I just feel that we shouldn't take the pee with her good nature. The other dog wasn't aggressive just overly social but with a different dog I can imagine that going wrong quite quickly.
		
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Of course you weren’t overreacting.

We had a large, young, boisterous lab bound over to ours today.  Jack is not great with large dogs, so we popped him on the lead.  Lab eventually went back to the weak calls of the owner.  Jack let back off the lead, at which point lab came back and was promptly chased off by Jack.

Owner arrived and I warned that his dog was liable to be bitten.  ‘It’ll serve her right’ he said.  ‘No, it will serve you right for not being your dog’s advocate’ I replied.  He looked very puzzled at that one 🤣🤣


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## skinnydipper (16 January 2022)

Amymay said:



			Owner arrived and I warned that his dog was liable to be bitten. ‘It’ll serve her right’ he said.
		
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People who say that are absolutely clueless.  The same as people who say let the dogs sort it out


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## meleeka (16 January 2022)

I also thought of this thread today.  For the THIRD time we’ve just been harassed by the same dog 😡

I live on the edge of a green so have to walk along the short side to get to my car.  My rescue GSD is reactive to other dogs and I’ve worked hard to get her to the point where I can walk 6ft away from a well behaved dog and she doesn’t react.   The offending dog is a teenager.  When he was young, the owner kept him on a longline and trained him to come to a whistle. I saw him most days and was impressed with how well he was going.  Well he’s now decided off lead is ok.  The first time my son had my other dog who loves everyone so he walked in front so she could keep the bouncing dog busy while I tried to remove the GS from the situation.  She just froze and barked so we waited for the owner to catch his dog.  The owner seemed panicked that his dog could have been hurt by my GS so I didn’t say anything when he apologised.  Yesterday I’d just got to the front door when it came over again.  I managed to get GS indoors just in time and left son again to wait for owner to catch it.  Then today,
because the ride dog was playing with another dog, the owner saw us getting out of the car and carried on chatting.  I got my friendly dog out of the car first and the bloody thing came over again, this time with its mate on tow.  It bounces round and even my friendly dog is getting fed up of it.  For the third time he apologised.  He’s clearly not sorry or he wouldn’t keep letting it happen so I will be telling him in no uncertain terms next time.  I’m starting to feel like a prisoner in my own home, having to run the gauntlet every time I want to go somewhere 😡


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## YorksG (16 January 2022)

We took our two labs to the "common" today, chap with a spaniel and a lurcher. When we first saw them, lurcher was on a lead. We made sure we went on a path away from the one he was on and let the girls off.  He then followed us, at speed and both his dogs were off lead.  We called our two and sat them down, idiot man says "they're friendly, but he's nervous" allows lurcher to bounce at the yellow lab, who then snapped at it.  Chap goes off, but his lurcher didn't fancy following him🤦‍♂️. Eventually dog wanders off.  We really don't want ours playing with random dogs they meet and we really don't want other people's rude dogs jumping at them when they are sitting down, doing as they are told!


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## SaddlePsych'D (16 January 2022)

I appreciate the reassurance! Sometimes I wonder if I'm being too precious about our perfect dog that can do no wrong 😂 (I know not true!) But really I just feel very responsible for helping Ivy develop into a happy, confident and well behaved dog. She is so gentle and still very timid at times, but has come so far in just a couple of months. It would be horrible to see that undone by a bad experience.


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## Cinnamontoast (16 January 2022)

Today it was normally very sensible neighbour who upset me, well, her son who currently lives with her since she fell. He got out a toy which shakes and makes a noise. All 3 of mine were terrified of it, Goose was barking, even Bear was unhappy. Fortunately, Bear got brave and picked it up. I heard the crunch before I could take it away.

The neighbour and her son thought it was hilarious. I did not. I don’t see why you’d want to frighten them. I’m so bloody annoyed. Normally, bar too many treats, the neighbour’s house is a safe space for them.


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## Escapade (16 January 2022)

SaddlePsych'D said:



			I don't want to teach her that other dogs are a worry but also feel maybe it's better to cut the greetings a little shorter than let them go on too long and to the point she's uncomfortable?
		
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You’re doing well. If I were to do over the first year with mine I would have been stricter wrt boundaries with greeting dogs. I was far too soft! 😂 A three second “hello” is plenty and we move on
I thought she was well settled at 6 months here, looking back she was just about finding her feet. Have her 14 months now and she’s a different animal!
Hate extendable leads used like that -cheesewire comes to mind!


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## Snowpup (16 January 2022)

My mare was attacked at the beach today, she was tied up and I caught the dogs and took them back to the owner who was on his phone. He apologised and then let them off to attacks her again. Both labs, not their fault but still.


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## Cinnamontoast (17 January 2022)

Snowpup said:



			My mare was attacked at the beach today, she was tied up and I caught the dogs and took them back to the owner who was on his phone. He apologised and then let them off to attacks her again. Both labs, not their fault but still.
		
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Please, please report them to the dog warden. I hope you’re both ok. 😢


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## CrunchieBoi (17 January 2022)

There are four dogs that are walked near us which we actively avoid when we see them and three of them are labs. Not that it's easy to avoid them because they're generally charging towards you at breakneck speed. I'm also a huge fan of those little compressed air canisters funnily enough.


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## lou246 (19 January 2022)

Got a phone call from my very upset Granddad this morning saying an overexcited labradoodle ran over, jumped on and knocked over his nearly 16 year old arthritic Labrador! He had to grab it and hold it until owners made an appearance, he’s in his eighties so not easy for him to keep hold of a large bouncy dog. Poor old lab was completely flattened and struggled to get back up. Owners eventually walked over, said “oops” and gave their dog a treat!


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## CorvusCorax (19 January 2022)

lou246 said:



			Got a phone call from my very upset Granddad this morning saying an overexcited labradoodle ran over, jumped on and knocked over his nearly 16 year old arthritic Labrador! He had to grab it and hold it until owners made an appearance, he’s in his eighties so not easy for him to keep hold of a large bouncy dog. Poor old lab was completely flattened and struggled to get back up. Owners eventually walked over, said “oops” and gave their dog a treat!
		
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Rage!!

I saw a couple the other day, young overweight Rottweiler on a normal harness, man seemed to be coaching woman, making it sit and feeding it. Which was fine, until two older men came walking along the path and the dog dragged the woman over to it so it could have a sniff. They ignored and kept walking.

I'm sorry but I'm sure even the most ardent dog lover probably doesn't want to have a large, unknown, out of control dog come barging over to them....


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## Errin Paddywack (19 January 2022)

lou246 said:



			Got a phone call from my very upset Granddad this morning saying an overexcited labradoodle ran over, jumped on and knocked over his nearly 16 year old arthritic Labrador! He had to grab it and hold it until owners made an appearance, he’s in his eighties so not easy for him to keep hold of a large bouncy dog. Poor old lab was completely flattened and struggled to get back up. Owners eventually walked over, said “oops” and gave their dog a treat!
		
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Your poor Granddad, that could have ended so badly with him being knocked over, broken hip etc and his dog being old could be badly damaged.  These sort of inconsiderate people make me see red.


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## The Fuzzy Furry (19 January 2022)

1 big goal ticked this morning. 
The 3 badly trained lab x dunno breed black dogs came through the only fence from the common and bounded into the yard,  P dog was luckily rootling in the hay store so kicked door shut on her.
Raced over and with happy 'come on guys' noises, I got all 3 into an empty stable and shut them in, called next but 1 YO and she raced over in her work vehicle - as she has had trouble too from them but none of us has caught them yet.... they chase anything,  been seen worrying horses in fields. 

We waited all of 10 mins before we heard owner in the distance bellowing  (never seen him, often heard him). Waited till he came close and enquired as to what he was looking for.  
He was very shocked and angry when I told him they were with the dog warden as not only were they out of control in a public area,  but had also been worrying livestock. (I have caution livestock sign on my gate). YO next but 1 was in her work uniform.....and she walked round out of my yard.
She read him the legal riot act,  then when she found he didnt even possess a lead on him, told him dogs were impounded,  it was going to cost him to redeem them! Over £100 for each dog,  plus cost of microchipping as none were done. All 3 dogs were in her work vehicle...... separate travel cage each.....
I then skedaddled off.  Apparently he paid up by card for each one, she chipped each one and noted numbers on system,  plus sold him 3 leads at £1 each. He's been warned never to let them loose again in a public area and she would put this on file , nice one!


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## MurphysMinder (19 January 2022)

The Fuzzy Furry said:



			1 big goal ticked this morning.
The 3 badly trained lab x dunno breed black dogs came through the only fence from the common and bounded into the yard,  P dog was luckily rootling in the hay store so kicked door shut on her.
Raced over and with happy 'come on guys' noises, I got all 3 into an empty stable and shut them in, called next but 1 YO and she raced over in her work vehicle - as she has had trouble too from them but none of us has caught them yet.... they chase anything,  been seen worrying horses in fields.

We waited all of 10 mins before we heard owner in the distance bellowing  (never seen him, often heard him). Waited till he came close and enquired as to what he was looking for. 
He was very shocked and angry when I told him they were with the dog warden as not only were they out of control in a public area,  but had also been worrying livestock. (I have caution livestock sign on my gate). YO next but 1 was in her work uniform.....and she walked round out of my yard.
She read him the legal riot act,  then when she found he didnt even possess a lead on him, told him dogs were impounded,  it was going to cost him to redeem them! Over £100 for each dog,  plus cost of microchipping as none were done. All 3 dogs were in her work vehicle...... separate travel cage each.....
I then skedaddled off.  Apparently he paid up by card for each one, she chipped each one and noted numbers on system,  plus sold him 3 leads at £1 each. He's been warned never to let them loose again in a public area and she would put this on file , nice one!
		
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Result !    This is what more people need to do with repeat offenders.   There was a labrador up the road who was always wandering.  I suggested to one person who was always returning it that next time she kept it and contacted dog warden ,   sadly the dog was run over and killed before this could happen.


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## The Fuzzy Furry (19 January 2022)

MurphysMinder said:



			Result !    This is what more people need to do with repeat offenders.   There was a labrador up the road who was always wandering.  I suggested to one person who was always returning it that next time she kept it and contacted dog warden ,   sadly the dog was run over and killed before this could happen.
		
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Yes, YO next but 1 advises people catch the dog if safe to do and call dog warden. 
Paying over £100 in this area per dog does make some think.
Apparently tho, most of her dog catching over the past 18 months is dogs under 2 and foreign rescues, some of the latter which dont even have a UK chip or any chip in them. She's v angry about that.


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## Amymay (19 January 2022)

What a result FF!!


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## The Fuzzy Furry (19 January 2022)

Amymay said:



			What a result FF!!
		
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It was! I'm pretty sure it was those 3 that pulled down a fallow hind at the end of last week, but couldn't prove it. I've previously used the lunge whip on them to get them out the yard a fortnight ago. Poor little P dog doesn't stand a chance,  so I keep her even more close in the mornings to me.


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## SaddlePsych'D (19 January 2022)

lou246 said:



			Got a phone call from my very upset Granddad this morning saying an overexcited labradoodle ran over, jumped on and knocked over his nearly 16 year old arthritic Labrador! He had to grab it and hold it until owners made an appearance, he’s in his eighties so not easy for him to keep hold of a large bouncy dog. Poor old lab was completely flattened and struggled to get back up. Owners eventually walked over, said “oops” and gave their dog a treat!
		
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Aw nooo! Poor them, that's so out of order. Glad no harm done but still.

Great result TFF! Unbelievable that people are so unfussed about their dogs repeatedly running riot like that. I hope lesson learned by the owner and less to worry about for little P dog.

I actually had a more positive experience today, just for a bit of balance I guess (I try to notice those too). Someone training their spaniel, had it close to heel but Ivy was clearly too interesting so he lost them for a bit but called and had spaniel back on track straight away. 

Although yesterday I found the end of a nice footpath through a stubble field but from one end to the other could hear the frantic calls of someone whose dog is very not listening to them so thought sod that and left that route for another day!


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## blackcob (19 January 2022)

I really fear my oldies being knocked about like that, how awful. 

Sharing a positive experience, I sat down with a map a few months ago to see if there were any footpaths I didn't know about to try and make up some new walking routes. Most of the stressful encounters we were having were on a couple of circular routes that started and finished in town, both being about 45 minutes, partially fenced and having no livestock, i.e safe easy walk of choice for the 'my dog needs to run' brigade. 

As much as it annoys me to be almost driven out of a place it was not worth the stress, so I started looking for alternatives. I've come up with half a dozen new routes, many of which have incredible views (one passes through acres and acres of orchard I never knew existed) and on which I rarely see a soul. I mean, one of them is 2.5 hours long to make it circular to get back home, but it's doing wonders for my step count 😅


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## scats (20 January 2022)

lou246 said:



			Got a phone call from my very upset Granddad this morning saying an overexcited labradoodle ran over, jumped on and knocked over his nearly 16 year old arthritic Labrador! He had to grab it and hold it until owners made an appearance, he’s in his eighties so not easy for him to keep hold of a large bouncy dog. Poor old lab was completely flattened and struggled to get back up. Owners eventually walked over, said “oops” and gave their dog a treat!
		
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This has infuriated me!  I hope the dog and your grandad are ok xx
My old girl was taken out by a big boisterous dog a few weeks ago when it attempted to jump over her but misjudged.  It took out her back end.  Fortunately my dog was ok, just a bit stiff.


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## On the Hoof (20 January 2022)

The Fuzzy Furry said:



			1 big goal ticked this morning.
The 3 badly trained lab x dunno breed black dogs came through the only fence from the common and bounded into the yard,  P dog was luckily rootling in the hay store so kicked door shut on her.
Raced over and with happy 'come on guys' noises, I got all 3 into an empty stable and shut them in, called next but 1 YO and she raced over in her work vehicle - as she has had trouble too from them but none of us has caught them yet.... they chase anything,  been seen worrying horses in fields.

We waited all of 10 mins before we heard owner in the distance bellowing  (never seen him, often heard him). Waited till he came close and enquired as to what he was looking for. 
He was very shocked and angry when I told him they were with the dog warden as not only were they out of control in a public area,  but had also been worrying livestock. (I have caution livestock sign on my gate). YO next but 1 was in her work uniform.....and she walked round out of my yard.
She read him the legal riot act,  then when she found he didnt even possess a lead on him, told him dogs were impounded,  it was going to cost him to redeem them! Over £100 for each dog,  plus cost of microchipping as none were done. All 3 dogs were in her work vehicle...... separate travel cage each.....
I then skedaddled off.  Apparently he paid up by card for each one, she chipped each one and noted numbers on system,  plus sold him 3 leads at £1 each. He's been warned never to let them loose again in a public area and she would put this on file , nice one!
		
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RESULT!!!


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## LaurenBay (20 January 2022)

I took my Dog on a  long walk in Epping Forest a few weeks back. Mine was off lead and we came across a Lab (also off lead) Couldn't see the owners but luckily Lab seemed fine. Then saw the owners way back so we kept walking and figured the owners would call their Lab back. The Lab then decided he wanted to hump my Dog (who is neutered) and I mean he really went for it. My Dog then bolted with this Dog chasing him. Both went out of sight. I called and my Dog did come back still being chased by the Lab. If my Dog stopped the Lab was on him in seconds. The Lab's owners came running to me at this point as I had managed to grab the Lab's collar and hold him still. They just said "oh sorry, he hasn't done that in a while" I asked which way they were planning to walk and it was the same route as mine. I did tell them they should put theirs on lead and to be fair they did and kept him on his lead the entire route and were very apologetic.


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## SaddlePsych'D (20 January 2022)

Dunno whether it's this thread or I'm just bad at reading Labs that made me notice them more on our walk today. I was so glad to have OH with me and definitely noticed our new route as an example @blackcob described in terms of where's popular. We gave the stubble fields a go that I spotted the other day but didn't do because I could see/hear dogs out of control and couldn't be bothered with the hassle.

We had a classic "don't worry he's friendly!" with a big lab. We'd stopped at the top of the field with Ivy short on her lead, took ages for owner to clock that it might be time to recall their dog and when they did there was absolutely no response from the dog, it was just fixed on Ivy - initially stood frozen and then slowly wandering up, I find it so unsettling. OH stood a way in front of us and it ducked/rushed around him to get to Ivy and we shoo'd it away so we could move in the opposite direction. Owner was apologetic but I can't help but feel that it wasn't just a one off "he's not listening". I missed the opportunity to point out that they had no way of knowing our dog was friendly (she's mostly indifferent, occasionally interested, sometimes timid/worried, but still).

Another lab grumbled at her on the way past even though we moved over to give space, the owner made no attempt to reciprocate. For balance she was also charged and growled at by a terrier (again shoo'd off by OH before it could get too close) so I guess not just the Labs!


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## CorvusCorax (20 January 2022)

It's not that you're bad at reading labs, it's that labs are crap at reading everyone else. Even (especially) the friendly ones, don't get the PISS OFF, DO ONE vibes being given off by other dogs and humans, who don't want a big lab face in their face or up their bum 
I think we can all realise our breeds' failings. Even my best behaved, nicest, politest boy plays like an absolute thug, bodyslams, uses his paw to splat smaller dogs, there is no grace with him whatsoever, it's just a GSD thing, even when other people say 'they can play', I usually say 'no it's OK, he's too big/plays to rough' to be on the safe side. Best not to take a chance with someone else's dog.


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## YorksG (20 January 2022)

We took our two labs and a friends 7 month old lab,  today to a local country park. We saw a number of out of control spaniels and a couple of retrievers, which were running about out of control. The worst aspect though, was the owners who walked directly towards us! Our path must have looked odd, as we took evasive action! We have worked with ours to ensure their focus returns to us, rather than them "playing" with random dogs.


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## splashgirl45 (20 January 2022)

When I was walking yesterday a spaniel suddenly arrived , couldn’t see an owner anywhere and as I was about to leave the fields to go down the road I couldnt leave because he decided he had found some new friends. I caught him easily and he had a collar and a harness on with a tracker but nothing else so I was stuck with another dog.  Luckily I was close to a friends house so I used my lead on him and left one of mine off while I collected a lead from her.  I was on way back when the dog walker ran up puffing as the owner told her where the dog was. The dog owner said to let him off lead as he was fine, well he isn’t!!!!  I did tell the dog walker to make sure the owner gets a disc so other people won’t have to waste their time


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## Pearlsasinger (20 January 2022)

splashgirl45 said:



			When I was walking yesterday a spaniel suddenly arrived , couldn’t see an owner anywhere and as I was about to leave the fields to go down the road I couldnt leave because he decided he had found some new friends. I caught him easily and he had a collar and a harness on with a tracker but nothing else so I was stuck with another dog.  Luckily I was close to a friends house so I used my lead on him and left one of mine off while I collected a lead from her.  I was on way back when the dog walker ran up puffing as the owner told her where the dog was. The dog owner said to let him off lead as he was fine, well he isn’t!!!!  I did tell the dog walker to make sure the owner gets a disc so other people won’t have to waste their time
		
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I would have rung the dog warden!


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## splashgirl45 (20 January 2022)

i was going to take him to the vets so they could scan for a chip, then owner would have had a journey to pick him up as the vets wont give out contact details...


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## CanteringCarrot (20 January 2022)

It's not nearly as wild over here with dogs. We've had the occasional loose dog with delayed or no recall, but one of them is a dog we know atleast, and he plays well with mine. With my Lab she doesn't give some dogs a second look, or even the time of day, other dogs she's a bit excited/interested, and once in a blue moon she will growl at one. She's still under control though.

The moment she sees another dog she stops, waits for my recall, comes, and gets back on the lead. Sometimes I recall her before she sees them. I think it's odd to have your dog off the lead when others are around. Everyone is quite good about putting their dog on the lead when they see another (as they're supposed to here). I feel quite lucky. Hopefully I didn't jinx myself 😅


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## CorvusCorax (20 January 2022)

CanteringCarrot said:



			It's not nearly as wild over here with dogs. We've had the occasional loose dog with delayed or no recall, but one of them is a dog we know atleast, and he plays well with mine. With my Lab she doesn't give some dogs a second look, or even the time of day, other dogs she's a bit excited/interested, and once in a blue moon she will growl at one. She's still under control though.

The moment she sees another dog she stops, waits for my recall, comes, and gets back on the lead. Sometimes I recall her before she sees them. I think it's odd to have your dog off the lead when others are around. Everyone is quite good about putting their dog on the lead when they see another (as they're supposed to here). I feel quite lucky. Hopefully I didn't jinx myself 😅
		
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I agree it's a much more pleasant experience walking dogs over there, between a sense of civic duty and an overall emphasis on better breeding and training, but the ticks the size of zeppelins, I have the issue with 😂


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## Cinnamontoast (20 January 2022)

The Fuzzy Furry said:



			1 big goal ticked this morning.
The 3 badly trained lab x dunno breed black dogs came through the only fence from the common and bounded into the yard,  P dog was luckily rootling in the hay store so kicked door shut on her.
Raced over and with happy 'come on guys' noises, I got all 3 into an empty stable and shut them in, called next but 1 YO and she raced over in her work vehicle - as she has had trouble too from them but none of us has caught them yet.... they chase anything,  been seen worrying horses in fields.

We waited all of 10 mins before we heard owner in the distance bellowing  (never seen him, often heard him). Waited till he came close and enquired as to what he was looking for. 
He was very shocked and angry when I told him they were with the dog warden as not only were they out of control in a public area,  but had also been worrying livestock. (I have caution livestock sign on my gate). YO next but 1 was in her work uniform.....and she walked round out of my yard.
She read him the legal riot act,  then when she found he didnt even possess a lead on him, told him dogs were impounded,  it was going to cost him to redeem them! Over £100 for each dog,  plus cost of microchipping as none were done. All 3 dogs were in her work vehicle...... separate travel cage each.....
I then skedaddled off.  Apparently he paid up by card for each one, she chipped each one and noted numbers on system,  plus sold him 3 leads at £1 each. He's been warned never to let them loose again in a public area and she would put this on file , nice one!
		
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Absolutely fantastic, what a great result!


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## SaddlePsych'D (21 January 2022)

Gah! Ivy had her first grumble at another dog today. It was justified and a proportionate warning but I was so cross with the other owner, who reassured me it was fine as his dog deserved it. I think he thought I was telling Ivy off when I said "that's enough" but actually it came out at the exact same time she growled, he just hadn't clocked we were both telling it do bog off. I wish I'd had words to be honest and I'm usually one for avoiding confrontation. I just think it's crap to let your own dog get in situations it could get bitten for being ott, and I don't appreciate my dog being used to tell other people's dogs off! What a knobchops. 😠


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## CorvusCorax (21 January 2022)

Just say 'it's not mine or my dog's job to train yours'/'that's not our job'.


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## SaddlePsych'D (21 January 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			Just say 'it's not mine or my dog's job to train yours'/'that's not our job'.
		
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I really wish I had said exactly that. I just focused on keeping moving and didn't think of the words in that moment.


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## Pearlsasinger (21 January 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			Just say 'it's not mine or my dog's job to train yours'/'that's not our job'.
		
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You might need to add, 'that's your job' just to make it clear what you mean to such idiots.


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## CorvusCorax (21 January 2022)

SaddlePsych'D said:



			I really wish I had said exactly that. I just focused on keeping moving and didn't think of the words in that moment.
		
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Yeah it depends on which dog I'm with, as to how smart mouthed I can be in the moment


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## SaddlePsych'D (23 January 2022)

SaddlePsych'D said:



			I just think it's crap to let your own dog get in situations it could get bitten...
		
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Well this was trumped today by Mrs "oh well then he'll just have to get kicked then" (in reference to her own dog) when my hacking companion pointed out for her to be careful letting her dog get around the horse's legs.


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## CorvusCorax (23 January 2022)

I had a LET THEM SAY HELLO man yesterday. It did not end well.


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## YorksG (23 January 2022)

We had three, one the 7 month old pup, sitting on their picnic rug, outside a popular dog walking cafe. An idiot woman allowed her lab x greyhound to come up right into their faces!!!!! We'd already seen it running out of control, also had a poox of some description twice leave its owner and refuse to return to her, when it did get to her the first time she gave it a treat,presumably because it did eventually remember who it belonged to, but then it turned round and raced back into the middle of our three, to try and steal one of their balls.


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## SaddlePsych'D (23 January 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			I had a LET THEM SAY HELLO man yesterday. It did not end well.
		
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Oh no! Do you mean didn't end well for him or the dog/s? I hope not the latter


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## CorvusCorax (23 January 2022)

SaddlePsych'D said:



			Oh no! Do you mean didn't end well for him or the dog/s? I hope not the latter 

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Nah it was fine, mine was being contained (straddled, me stroking her chest) he with hairy terrier said LET THEM SAY HELLO, I said, "they are saying hello, this is close enough", he let terrier come forward/in her space, mine barked a warning, his barked back, I corrected mine then moved on quickly and gave her food for checking back in, I said 'I told you it was too close' over my shoulder and his continued to bark as he tried to drag it away, muttering 'he was only saying hello'.


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## Mero (23 January 2022)

I have to admit that as much as I adore the companionship my dog gives me, I’m not sure I’ll get another. It’s just not as fun as it used to be, having to say dodge other dogs and their owners. Although I will say I met a group of gundogs today, 3 labs and a spaniel. The owners called them the second they saw me reeling mine in, and their dogs went immediately to heel and passed us so politely, nice quiet interested but not trying to engage. I said a profuse thank you for clocking that mine was on lead. It put my mind so much at ease as I see them often at a distance and have tried to avoid as they are always off lead.


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## Cinnamontoast (23 January 2022)

I saw an owner training his lab to the whistle today. Would have loved to say hello, but before the training, he was letting both his dogs rip round with another. We're focusing on recall and retrieving currently so distractions are useful. I don't want my lot involved in no boundaries play.


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## meleeka (23 January 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			It's not that you're bad at reading labs, it's that labs are crap at reading everyone else. Even (especially) the friendly ones, don't get the PISS OFF, DO ONE vibes being given off by other dogs and humans, who don't want a big lab face in their face or up their bum 
I think we can all realise our breeds' failings. Even my best behaved, nicest, politest boy plays like an absolute thug, bodyslams, uses his paw to splat smaller dogs, there is no grace with him whatsoever, it's just a GSD thing, even when other people say 'they can play', I usually say 'no it's OK, he's too big/plays to rough' to be on the safe side. Best not to take a chance with someone else's dog.
		
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Yep, my GSD is exactly the same.  My other dog is a terrier and the GSD would love them to play.  The terrier however, gave her one chance and decided she was too rough so won’t have any of it.  One thing terriers do well is hold a grudge 😂


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## Boulty (23 January 2022)

I f'd up again yesterday.  A friend & her lovely dog came over for a walk with us.  This dog has unfortunately been attacked in the past & is now sometimes a bit wary with strange dogs.  I knew all this but as I've only known him to be lovely & fine & the demon child is actually normally fairly polite when greeting new dogs I stupidly allowed their initial greeting to go on a little longer than the few seconds generally considered "safe" & the spaniel pillock invited his new friend to play in a slightly rude / space invadery way by putting a paw on him & got himself snapped at.  No contact was made & it had the desired effect of making divhead back up & watch his manners but feel bad that I didn't see it coming & that we put them in a situation where the other dog felt uncomfortable.  We did then have a lovely long walk where they were both on long leads together (& briefly off lead a few times in more secure areas) with no further incidents. Both of them also managed to behave beautifully when a man leading a slightly "fresh" (read leaping into the air, bucking & I do believe it reared up at one point as well!) horse down the road went past us (thankfully it's a dead end road & the only traffic tends to be dogwalkers parking up near the footpath entrance) so erm I guess it's nice to have one animal on the "things my dog does NOT want to chase" list right? 

In other news had a fairly productive play in the field with him today messed about with recall, loose lead walking, fetch & lots of playing with his squeaky rabbit tug toy.   Still don't trust him off lead with distractions though as sadly the squeaky chaser currently loses all its power if there's too much going on


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## SaddlePsych'D (24 January 2022)

Boulty said:



			I f'd up again yesterday.  A friend & her lovely dog came over for a walk with us.  This dog has unfortunately been attacked in the past & is now sometimes a bit wary with strange dogs.  I knew all this but as I've only known him to be lovely & fine & the demon child is actually normally fairly polite when greeting new dogs I stupidly allowed their initial greeting to go on a little longer than the few seconds generally considered "safe" & the spaniel pillock invited his new friend to play in a slightly rude / space invadery way by putting a paw on him & got himself snapped at.  No contact was made & it had the desired effect of making divhead back up & watch his manners but feel bad that I didn't see it coming & that we put them in a situation where the other dog felt uncomfortable.  We did then have a lovely long walk where they were both on long leads together (& briefly off lead a few times in more secure areas) with no further incidents. Both of them also managed to behave beautifully when a man leading a slightly "fresh" (read leaping into the air, bucking & I do believe it reared up at one point as well!) horse down the road went past us (thankfully it's a dead end road & the only traffic tends to be dogwalkers parking up near the footpath entrance) so erm I guess it's nice to have one animal on the "things my dog does NOT want to chase" list right?

In other news had a fairly productive play in the field with him today messed about with recall, loose lead walking, fetch & lots of playing with his squeaky rabbit tug toy.   Still don't trust him off lead with distractions though as sadly the squeaky chaser currently loses all its power if there's too much going on
		
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At least you were trying to be mindful/careful and intervened even if it didn't quite work out right that time. Your friend might also have been able to step in sooner if they were worried about their so don't beat yourself up too much.

Ivy has one of those rabbit chaser toys as well. We bought it for helping recall practice but our problem is going to be that she doesn't want to go away from it in the first place for us to need to call her back (good for focus I guess?!). Even hidden I think she will know we have it on us!



A dog of the same colour description (granted not very specific and waiting to find out about breed) as the one OH shoo'd away the other day has attacked another dog in the same area at a similar time of day that we were there. Really hope it's not the same one! Feel very sorry for the person whose dog was injured (minor it sounds like but still  )


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## NinjaPony (24 January 2022)

Honestly this thread reminds me why I feel very conflicted about getting a dog. I love dogs, I love training them, exercising them, having them around, but when you have a dog you have to deal with other peoples dogs and their bloody owners and that is just a nightmare.
I’ve shared this before but after watching my little papillon (family dog) get nearly killed by an off lead out of control dog, she was on a lead and minding her own business, it makes me very wary of other off lead dogs and it’s just not enjoyable. She was lucky to survive, still needs regular physio and hydrotherapy and surprise surprise, doesn’t want strange dogs in her face. She won’t kick off unless the dog is right next to her, which should never happen as she’s on a lead and we ALWAYS try to get out the way to protect her. Yet you still have idiots letting their dog run up to her, and I’m not afraid to get shirty now, pick her up, or get her out the way because enough is enough. I just want to walk my little dog in peace and if you can’t keep your dog away from strange dogs, don’t let it off a lead. Seriously makes me think about whether I want to own again in the future because it just sucks all the fun out of walking.


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## P3LH (24 January 2022)

Due to covid implications ive been leaving work earlier than usual, so see more people than I think I usually would. I also only park walk in the week so this adds to it too.

I am overwhelmed by idiocy on a daily basis, but today takes the biscuit. A mixed group up ahead. A lady with a very bouncy off lead staff. A chap with a young cockerpoo looking pup, very small and young but also off lead, an older chap with a huge lurcher that was on lead, then on extending lead then off lead, and a lady with a spaniel - very bouncy and off lead. Not an ounce of recall between them. All the dogs were non stop rough housing, at one point it looked like it was getting a little spicy between them. None of them had basic etiquette. It actually hurt me to see the little manners and the treatment that this was the norm.

They effectively held up my entire walk. I found myself hanging back and putting the dogs in a sit to allow some distance between us. I noted several other owners doing the same. Then later they ambushed us round a corner. Bouncy staff charges at us with laughing owner chasing her calling her name and assuring me she’s friendly. I lied ‘they aren’t, that’s why they’re on lead’ and I was assured ‘she only wants to play’. Not getting it at all. I was then held prisoner for nine minutes whilst the staff and poo puppy charged around us in a wide circle, barking and rushing at us, whilst owners chased them calling their names. There was headbutting, bowling over snd the old man even ended up with his head in a mouth. All the time I am stood still with mine on leads, the elder two unphased but Gus at five months now completely mind blown. Not even an apology.


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## Pearlsasinger (24 January 2022)

I liked your post P3LH but I don't really, I feel your pain.

I am very cross today.  YorksG wrote yesterday about our experience with our friend's 7 month old Lab pup and the bl**dy stupid owner who allowed her big black Labxlurcher type thing to put its face in the pups, while she was sitting minding her own business outside a cafe. Well today, pup has been terribly reactive on our usual walk, barking at anything and everything out of the ordinary.  Fortunately we actually only saw one dog on the same path and it was on a lead but we now have a lot of work to do getting her to the 'dogneutral'state that we want. She is not helped by the fact that when she is at home,a neighbour's dog barks at her everytime she sets foot in her own garden. However we settled its hash yesterday evening.  Our dogs were with us there and when the neighbour barked, ours barked back -yappy little things shot back into the houseand we heard the door slam shut!


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## P3LH (24 January 2022)

Well I have a very old man who’s had the shits all evening since, and a very young puppy terrified of every noise since. Then there’s one in the middle who, in true tank fashion - acknowledged something has happened, acts unbothered by something that’s happened and quietly plots revenge on those guilty and plans for plagues upon all their houses.


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## Parrotperson (25 January 2022)

Was on the beach just after Xmas. Nobody around. (It was a cold day). Pup on long line. Practising recall and bless him he’s excellent. Comes when called. Trots alongside. Still at the stage where the sight of another dog is very interesting but that’s what the long line is for. He’s asked to walk past quietly.

well. Out of nowhere I hear ‘ come back!’  several times. Look around. The biggest dog on the planet (Great Dane/mastiff cross 😳) has pulled its lead out of its owners hands and is galloping towards us.

in this instance I pick up pup. (He’s tiny jrt so he would’ve be flattened). Big dog has long lead flapping behind it luckily so I instruct husband to stand on it. He somehow managed to do so. Owner puffs up and says…..yes you’ve guessed it. The five words that should put a dog owner in prison 

he only wants to play. 😳🤬🤬

luckily pup looks on but is unconcerned. And when the wife of owner arrived she had another big dog on a long line with her.

life is sometimes an assault course.


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## CorvusCorax (25 January 2022)




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## Errin Paddywack (25 January 2022)

Parrotperson said:



			he only wants to play.
		
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They would have been getting a very terse reply from me.


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## CorvusCorax (25 January 2022)

"Me too! I love taking penalty kicks!"
(No dogs were harmed in the imagining of this sick burn)


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## Parrotperson (25 January 2022)

Errin Paddywack said:



			They would have been getting a very terse reply from me.
		
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indeed it did. He was full of apologies of course. Get control I said. You don’t have any at present. Because if he does that again he could literally kill someone. He’d only need to knock someone off their feet.

honestly. 🙄


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## skinnydipper (25 January 2022)

I think a big problem is that people forget what they are out for.  

They are walking their dog, the dog should be their focus.  Not be so engaged in a "mother's meeting" huddle that they haven't a clue what their 4 legged friend is up to.


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## Moobli (25 January 2022)

blackcob said:



			I really fear my oldies being knocked about like that, how awful.

Sharing a positive experience, I sat down with a map a few months ago to see if there were any footpaths I didn't know about to try and make up some new walking routes. Most of the stressful encounters we were having were on a couple of circular routes that started and finished in town, both being about 45 minutes, partially fenced and having no livestock, i.e safe easy walk of choice for the 'my dog needs to run' brigade.

As much as it annoys me to be almost driven out of a place it was not worth the stress, so I started looking for alternatives. I've come up with half a dozen new routes, many of which have incredible views (one passes through acres and acres of orchard I never knew existed) and on which I rarely see a soul. I mean, one of them is 2.5 hours long to make it circular to get back home, but it's doing wonders for my step count 😅
		
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What a great result!  Sometimes we are pushed into doing things we don't really want to but actually there are often unexpected positives that come out of it. 
I am very lucky to have lots of empty countryside on my doorstep (empty in so much as it's mostly devoid of other people and their dogs) but I do enjoy taking my dogs to the beach, woods and other more populated places outside my bubble on occasion.  Now, thanks to the world in generally suddenly having dogs and all the popular walks are full of them, I go to the beach etc at the crack of dawn, especially in spring/summer.  It might be a drag hauling ass out of bed so early but some of the incredible sunrises I have seen and the joy of being relaxed and not worrying about bumping into others, more than makes up for it.  If I hadn't been so keen to avoid others I would have missed out without even realising it.


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## Moobli (25 January 2022)

CanteringCarrot said:



			It's not nearly as wild over here with dogs. We've had the occasional loose dog with delayed or no recall, but one of them is a dog we know atleast, and he plays well with mine. With my Lab she doesn't give some dogs a second look, or even the time of day, other dogs she's a bit excited/interested, and once in a blue moon she will growl at one. She's still under control though.

The moment she sees another dog she stops, waits for my recall, comes, and gets back on the lead. Sometimes I recall her before she sees them. I think it's odd to have your dog off the lead when others are around. Everyone is quite good about putting their dog on the lead when they see another (as they're supposed to here). I feel quite lucky. Hopefully I didn't jinx myself 😅
		
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Where are you?  Sounds like a good place to be


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## Moobli (25 January 2022)

Mero said:



			I have to admit that as much as I adore the companionship my dog gives me, I’m not sure I’ll get another. It’s just not as fun as it used to be, having to say dodge other dogs and their owners. Although I will say I met a group of gundogs today, 3 labs and a spaniel. The owners called them the second they saw me reeling mine in, and their dogs went immediately to heel and passed us so politely, nice quiet interested but not trying to engage. I said a profuse thank you for clocking that mine was on lead. It put my mind so much at ease as I see them often at a distance and have tried to avoid as they are always off lead.
		
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I couldn't imagine a life without dogs because my whole world kind of revolves around them, but the busier everywhere gets I do occasionally find myself considering a smaller, more sociable breed which might make me feel less anxious when walking in busy places.  I doubt it will happen though but I will just become less and less sociable and find more obscure walks where I see nobody


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## CanteringCarrot (25 January 2022)

Moobli said:



			Where are you?  Sounds like a good place to be 

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Germany. It has it's pros and cons. However, they're quite ok with dogs. Many dog schools around and in general, people take it a bit more serious. Encounters such as those in this thread are quite rare. I've had a loose dog encounter and an unruly dog encounter (on a leash), but they were a far cry from others tales and my dog was fine/didn't realize anything amiss really.

In the two regions I've lived in, both have been very civil dog wise.


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## Moobli (25 January 2022)

meleeka said:



			Yep, my GSD is exactly the same.  My other dog is a terrier and the GSD would love them to play.  The terrier however, gave her one chance and decided she was too rough so won’t have any of it.  One thing terriers do well is hold a grudge 😂
		
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I go on holiday every year with my sister, her border terrier and my GSDs.  I do have to referee to make sure things don't get out of hand.  I am actually thinking of just taking my bitch away this year as she is less barge, bang, splat than my male


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## TheresaW (25 January 2022)

I do most of our walks very early or late. More to avoid people than dogs, as Bo gets anxious of some men.

Harder in summer as more people around and we like to go out during the day when it’s nice, but not too hot. I will be honest and say we’ve had hardly any incidences with other dogs.

This was taken on holiday last year. Only two Collies are ours 🤣


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## SaddlePsych'D (26 January 2022)

I'm not sure what the protocol is for when another dog is pelting it's way across a playing field directly at you and your dog but this morning I reacted instinctively and hoped for the best. I stepped in it's direction, stood firm, held my hand up and shouted 'no!' In a tone I did not know I had available to me! I don't know who was more shocked, the dog or me that it actually stopped! Looked at me, looked at it's owner calling from a distance, back to me, then trotted off to owner. Phew!


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## Clodagh (26 January 2022)

SaddlePsych'D said:



			I'm not sure what the protocol is for when another dog is pelting it's way across a playing field directly at you and your dog but this morning I reacted instinctively and hoped for the best. I stepped in it's direction, stood firm, held my hand up and shouted 'no!' In a tone I did not know I had available to me! I don't know who was more shocked, the dog or me that it actually stopped! Looked at me, looked at it's owner calling from a distance, back to me, then trotted off to owner. Phew!
		
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Absolutely spot on. Make yourself a square physical barrier.
Fwiw I’m quite happy to batter other peoples dogs if it helps mine. But it’s generally quite undignified.


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## SaddlePsych'D (26 January 2022)

Clodagh said:



			Absolutely spot on. Make yourself a square physical barrier.
Fwiw I’m quite happy to batter other peoples dogs if it helps mine. But it’s generally quite undignified.
		
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I was annoyed that it happened but walked away giggling to myself just at the shock of my response and that it actually worked. Dignity will head out the window I'm sure, I've already given up caring if I look grumpy, I just care about keeping Ivy (and other dogs) safe and happy on her walks. Yesterday it was "can you not?!" that emerged from my mouth, which also looking back makes me chuckle at myself.


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## skinnydipper (26 January 2022)

Clodagh said:



			Absolutely spot on. Make yourself a square physical barrier.
Fwiw I’m quite happy to batter other peoples dogs if it helps mine. But it’s generally quite undignified.
		
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and don't forget shouting like a fish wife at the owners, complete with swear words as felt necessary - I'm sure she will soon perfect the art


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## Cinnamontoast (26 January 2022)

P3LH said:



			Due to covid implications ive been leaving work earlier than usual, so see more people than I think I usually would. I also only park walk in the week so this adds to it too.

I am overwhelmed by idiocy on a daily basis, but today takes the biscuit. A mixed group up ahead. A lady with a very bouncy off lead staff. A chap with a young cockerpoo looking pup, very small and young but also off lead, an older chap with a huge lurcher that was on lead, then on extending lead then off lead, and a lady with a spaniel - very bouncy and off lead. Not an ounce of recall between them. All the dogs were non stop rough housing, at one point it looked like it was getting a little spicy between them. None of them had basic etiquette. It actually hurt me to see the little manners and the treatment that this was the norm.

They effectively held up my entire walk. I found myself hanging back and putting the dogs in a sit to allow some distance between us. I noted several other owners doing the same. Then later they ambushed us round a corner. Bouncy staff charges at us with laughing owner chasing her calling her name and assuring me she’s friendly. I lied ‘they aren’t, that’s why they’re on lead’ and I was assured ‘she only wants to play’. Not getting it at all. I was then held prisoner for nine minutes whilst the staff and poo puppy charged around us in a wide circle, barking and rushing at us, whilst owners chased them calling their names. There was headbutting, bowling over snd the old man even ended up with his head in a mouth. All the time I am stood still with mine on leads, the elder two unphased but Gus at five months now completely mind blown. Not even an apology.
		
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This is sadly what I see a lot of in the park over the past couple of years. Clueless puppy pandemic people letting the dogs rough house but teaching them zero manners.



skinnydipper said:



			I think a big problem is that people forget what they are out for. 

They are walking their dog, the dog should be their focus.  Not be so engaged in a "mother's meeting" huddle that they haven't a clue what their 4 legged friend is up to.
		
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Oh yes, plenty of this round my way! Drives me nuts!



SaddlePsych'D said:



			I'm not sure what the protocol is for when another dog is pelting it's way across a playing field directly at you and your dog but this morning I reacted instinctively and hoped for the best. I stepped in it's direction, stood firm, held my hand up and shouted 'no!' In a tone I did not know I had available to me! I don't know who was more shocked, the dog or me that it actually stopped! Looked at me, looked at it's owner calling from a distance, back to me, then trotted off to owner. Phew!
		
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I am keen on this, my OH prefers to walk away, but when their dog is harassing mine or going to cause a problem, I’m going to use my voice to defeat dogs. They rely on me to keep them safe, particularly when they are behaving nicely.


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## SaddlePsych'D (26 January 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			and don't forget shouting like a fish wife at the owners, complete with swear words as felt necessary - I'm sure she will soon perfect the art 

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Work in progress 😂 currently just at the grunting/blanking them completely stage. I couldn't be bothered to get into it with the owner and I didn't care about the sorry they called out because they only started paying attention once I'd already intervened.



Cinnamontoast said:



			I am keen on this, my OH prefers to walk away, but when their dog is harassing mine or going to cause a problem, I’m going to use my voice to defeat dogs. They rely on me to keep them safe, particularly when they are behaving nicely.
		
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I usually like to just keep walking if possible but heard it coming pelting along from behind us so knew that wasn't going to work this time. OH has previously stood between us and other dogs as well when we've been particularly keen to keep them away. There was one time she growled at another dog and I wished I'd stepped in instead of trying to keep walking.


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## Cinnamontoast (26 January 2022)

Defeat dogs? I mean defend! Jeez.


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## Amymay (26 January 2022)

SaddlePsych'D said:



			I'm not sure what the protocol is for when another dog is pelting it's way across a playing field directly at you and your dog but this morning I reacted instinctively and hoped for the best. I stepped in it's direction, stood firm, held my hand up and shouted 'no!' In a tone I did not know I had available to me! I don't know who was more shocked, the dog or me that it actually stopped! Looked at me, looked at it's owner calling from a distance, back to me, then trotted off to owner. Phew!
		
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Absolutely bang on.  I rarely have a problem with other dogs. I walk quite remotely, or on local beaches at quiet times. Obviously we do come across other dogs, but problems are far and few between.  Mine stay with me, and any ‘visiting’ dogs are usually seen off by Jack 🤓. However large dogs bowling towards us at speed are usually met with a strong word from me that mostly stops them in their tracks.  It’s not unheard of for me to have mine, and ‘others’ sat waiting patiently for a treat whilst an owner arrives to collect their dog.


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## SaddlePsych'D (27 January 2022)

Well it didn't take long for a swear to emerge from me! Started off well, other owner put both (large!) dogs on lead, but as they got closer it was clear she has little to no control. I said I really appreciated her putting them on lead as they passed, only for them to take her skiing and come running barking up behind us. "Ah ah!" I shouted, before "effing hell!" and walking off. It was actually quite scary to me. I dont like to breed discriminate but a really big gsd coming at us like that was frightening.

Bumped into them again further round the loop of track, stopped and waited for her to leash them and thought great this is going to be a pita on a narrower track. She only leashed one leaving the gsd to start heading over. Out came the "don't worry he just wants to play" and I got really cross and shouted I do not care (twice because for some reason she thought it was a debate and only listened after asking if my dog was nervous, which is not really the point) and shouted no at her dog (same as yesterday). She then recalled it and I've no idea where they disappeared to but at least we didn't have to pass at close range.

I feel really down about it, I dont feel like I should have to justify everything with my dog being nervous. She's not massively nervous, mostly indifferent, but who would like two huge strange dogs piling on them? I certainly didn't appreciate it for myself regardless of my dog. It's making me dread walks more and more 😩


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## ellieb (27 January 2022)

SaddlePsych'D said:



			I feel really down about it, I dont feel like I should have to justify everything with my dog being nervous. She's not massively nervous, mostly indifferent, but who would like two huge strange dogs piling on them? I certainly didn't appreciate it for myself regardless of my dog. It's making me dread walks more and more 😩
		
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I used to feel a lot like this with Joe as well. Unlike Ivy he was genuinely reactive and also not small-dog-safe, but was always on lead and with a muzzle. I used to let other owners get away with their dogs running up to him when he'd react, saying things like 'oh it's okay, he's nervous' 'he's never seen other breeds of dog before' etc, until it really clicked with me that THEY were to blame, not him. You're doing everything right SP! She'll trust in you to keep her out of harm's way.

I had to do a LOT of positive reinforcement with Joe, following other dogs at a safe distance, taking evasive manoeuvres, and lots of treats for looking/disengaging, and positive interactions. He's not reactive any more, years later (unless he gets bum-rushed or jumped on, which is fair enough) but I still give him treats to this day for good dog interactions, I think it's important to keep these things topped up and also it makes me feel happier on walks/keeps me interesting to him/balances out the bad interactions with stupid people!


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## Clodagh (27 January 2022)

Don’t let the bastards get you down. You be Ivy’s champion and make the world a safe one for her. You’ll soon be known as the complete nutter with the black dog and people will avoid you, job done. 
Also, don’t tense up yourself. They read signals down the lead. Calm, confident and courageous is what you send to them at all times. If you bluster it often enough it becomes true.


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## Amymay (27 January 2022)

Clodagh said:



			Also, don’t tense up yourself. They read signals down the lead. Calm, confident and courageous is what you send to them at all times. If you bluster it often enough it becomes true.
		
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Again, absolutely this x


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## blackcob (27 January 2022)

Clodagh said:



			You’ll soon be known as the complete nutter with the black dog and people will avoid you, job done.
		
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I have already achieved that title but absolutely there’s plenty of capacity for others to join 😁

I don’t mean entirely to make light of the situation, I know exactly how it feels, just adding weight to the idea that it is absolutely fine to advocate for your dog. There are times when other people won’t like it but meh, I care more about preserving my dog’s opinion of me than theirs.


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## SaddlePsych'D (27 January 2022)

I really feel for owners with reactive dogs, at least with Ivy I don't have to worry too much about her but I'd like to keep it that way! There are a few dogs we pass regularly where the owners are clearly working on their reactivity and focus etc., we always give them room and I always ask strangers if it's okay to pass if not much space. It must be so frustrating to have all the hard work undone!

Today was the first time I actually felt frightened, usually it's more annoying than anything else, but I tried not to show it. I think it channelled out through the tone of my "I do not care!"


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## paisley (27 January 2022)

I feel really down about it, I dont feel like I should have to justify everything with my dog being nervous. She's not massively nervous, mostly indifferent, but who would like two huge strange dogs piling on them? I certainly didn't appreciate it for myself regardless of my dog. It's making me dread walks more and more 😩[/QUOTE]

You absolutely dont have to put up with other dogs out of control behaviour. I have even less tolerance now that the mostly whippet is 12 and has some muscle issues so one wrong shove from another dog could really hurt him.

Its not up for other people to decide whats the level of interraction your dog should have. Your dog, your choice and tough titties to everyone else.

The mostly whippet got a gold star the day he walked off lead, by my side on a footpath that went by a garden containing 2 large labradors effing and jeffing at him behind a fence after being told  'not your business' after he'd looked at me.

I was known as 'The Whippet Lady' . Draw your own conclusions 😂


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## CorvusCorax (7 February 2022)

Oh well. Spangletwats' missus let it run in my garden twice this evening and ignored me when I said 'excuse me?' so I went for a walk at a surreptitious distance. They know where I live, so I know where they live. Fair's fair.


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## Pearlsasinger (7 February 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			Oh well. Spangletwats' missus let it run in my garden twice this evening and ignored me when I said 'excuse me?' so I went for a walk at a surreptitious distance. They know where I live, so I know where they live. Fair's fair.
		
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  I hope you let at least 1 GSD run round their garden.


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## CorvusCorax (7 February 2022)

Pearlsasinger said:



			I hope you let at least 1 GSD run round their garden.
		
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It's a town house style, opening onto the street, sadly.

Would you believe, she went inside and shut the dog out/left it on the step on a street and pulled the curtains. As I walked past (looking at my phone) it came bombing over to me. WTAF. Who does that?! Anybody could lift it/it could get hit by a car.


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## Parrotperson (7 February 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			Oh well. Spangletwats' missus let it run in my garden twice this evening and ignored me when I said 'excuse me?' so I went for a walk at a surreptitious distance. They know where I live, so I know where they live. Fair's fair.
		
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have you copyrighted ‘spangletwat’ CC?
 Is I’d like to licence it from you please!


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## CorvusCorax (7 February 2022)

Parrotperson said:



			have you copyrighted ‘spangletwat’ CC?
 Is I’d like to licence it from you please!
		
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You can have it for free.


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## Parrotperson (7 February 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			You can have it for free.
		
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👍👍thanks!


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## Unicorn (7 February 2022)

Can I nominate the one I met in the park this afternoon?  The one with the baby dachshund that had no lead or collar?  The one who made no effort to stop it running up to my on lead gsd x, despite me asking? 

I pointed out that my dog wasn't friendly - apparently my dog grumbling and our hasty detour off the path wasn't enough of a clue - and got sworn at in return.
It's left me feeling like I'm somehow the bad guy.   Could/should I have done something else?


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## SAujla (8 February 2022)

Had an incident with dog walker this morning, small compared to some stories on here. She had 3 GSD on leash and what looked like a Bull Mastiff off leash, who promptly came over and started intimidating Clover. 

I began blocking him off and gesturing to the woman, she was calling him and being ignored so I shouted he's becoming too much now, still just calling his name but not coming any closer (will give her some benefit of the doubt in that she maybe didn't want to come closer with 3 on lead dogs who might react) and eventually he moved off. No apology from the woman and after 10 minutes in the field she put the dogs back into the van and drove off. I can't imagine that is enough time for them, have seen her occasionally and it's always a few minutes then gone


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## CanteringCarrot (8 February 2022)

Unicorn said:



			Can I nominate the one I met in the park this afternoon?  The one with the baby dachshund that had no lead or collar?  The one who made no effort to stop it running up to my on lead gsd x, despite me asking?

I pointed out that my dog wasn't friendly - apparently my dog grumbling and our hasty detour off the path wasn't enough of a clue - and got sworn at in return.
It's left me feeling like I'm somehow the bad guy.   Could/should I have done something else?
		
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You're definitely not the bad guy. You acted appropriately in my opinion. I cannot believe you got sworn at as a response 🤦‍♀️ ridiculous and rude.


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## Archangel (8 February 2022)

Walking the dog in the dark the other night, I could see a human shape with small dog shape approaching. 

I really thought small dog was on a lead plus we were getting near the road so put mine on.  Small dog (not on lead as it turns out) comes charging over, starts humping my dog (without so much as a hello, how very rude), my dog just shrugs him off in a good natured way and the dog really went for her.  She shook him off and he came back 3 times.  

Woman comes up whacks her small dog really hard with a torch and tells me it is my fault as seeing a dog on a lead makes her dog aggressive.  
What?  Why didn't she put her ruddy dog on a lead then if he is known to be a shagger and a snapper?  We could have just passed like ships in the night.  

As I got back to the car I could see the light from her torch and she was coming back across the field that isn't a footpath and has a huge sign NO DOGS.  Ignorant baggage.


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## SAujla (8 February 2022)

Archangel said:



			Walking the dog in the dark the other night, I could see a human shape with small dog shape approaching.

I really thought small dog was on a lead plus we were getting near the road so put mine on.  Small dog (not on lead as it turns out) comes charging over, starts humping my dog (without so much as a hello, how very rude), my dog just shrugs him off in a good natured way and the dog really went for her.  She shook him off and he came back 3 times. 

Woman comes up whacks her small dog really hard with a torch and tells me it is my fault as seeing a dog on a lead makes her dog aggressive. 
What?  Why didn't she put her ruddy dog on a lead then if he is known to be a shagger and a snapper?  We could have just passed like ships in the night. 

As I got back to the car I could see the light from her torch and she was coming back across the field that isn't a footpath and has a huge sign NO DOGS.  Ignorant baggage.
		
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Seeing a dog on lead makes him aggressive????? That is a new one and one of the most outrageous things I've heard describing off leash dogs. Unbelievable


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## Unicorn (8 February 2022)

SAujla said:



			Seeing a dog on lead makes him aggressive????? That is a new one and one of the most outrageous things I've heard describing off leash dogs. Unbelievable
		
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Yep, I've had this one too.  Apparently I should let her off and then it will all be fine.  The mind boggles.


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## SAujla (8 February 2022)

Unicorn said:



			Yep, I've had this one too.  Apparently I should let her off and then it will all be fine.  The mind boggles.
		
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I'm not sure what I would say to that, I'm just baffled by it. Also do these people expect you to know this? The woman above wasn't apologetic did she think Archangel should know this, with that logic she could soon find herself up for being a government advisor to the current PM


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## CorvusCorax (8 February 2022)

Wow, there really are loads of different ways to say 'I'm a lazy sod with no recall'.


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## Pearlsasinger (8 February 2022)

I have started taking a walking stick with me on dog walks since breaking my leg.  I have found it extremely useful when loose dogs come pestering ours. I can recommend and if all else fails, it can be waved towards the owner.


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## Arzada (22 February 2022)

Devastating. Dawlish: one of the resident black swans taking his turn sitting on 7 eggs murdered by an owner unable to control their on lead dog  https://www.dawlishbeach.com/2022/02/dad-swan-killed-by-dog-in-dawlish/ There are just too many attacks on swans and it's time that dogs were totally banned from areas like this. That way there's no 'my dog is only playing' opportunity.


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## Pegasus5531 (22 February 2022)

There has absolutely been an increase in this due to lockdown dogs and more first time owners impulsively getting dogs and not socialising or training them correctly during the pandemic. I also think there is an increase in people getting high energy dogs but not knowing how to train/work them. There seems to have been a huge rise in the amount of spaniels I see out and about now and although I have always known horse and farm type people to have them they seem to be very popular now with families and people who aren't very dog savvy. Dogs like that need more exercise, stimulation and training but when they don't get it they become a nightmare. Many times I've had them pestering my on lead reactive dog or chasing my off lead, friendly dog who is trying to walk away from them.


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## ellieb (22 February 2022)

Arzada said:



			Devastating. Dawlish: one of the resident black swans taking his turn sitting on 7 eggs murdered by an owner unable to control their on lead dog  https://www.dawlishbeach.com/2022/02/dad-swan-killed-by-dog-in-dawlish/

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That's terrible. And the dog was on lead, so either someone was seriously not paying attention or not strong enough to control it. It's really time muzzles were de-stigmatised, I've had so many people over the years say 'what a shame' it is that my greyhound wears one and that they would 'never be able to do that'. Okay, well then you'd have several dead cats on your hands, is that worse? Not saying that muzzles save the day in all cases but they certainly help/give you a bit of time to react.


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## CorvusCorax (22 February 2022)

There are people in my town who let their dogs run at the ducks/swans/geese at the marina and think it's funny. Several have been attacked/bitten.
And a man that lives across the river from me frequently lets his spaniel charge at the ducks on the bank...


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## CanteringCarrot (22 February 2022)

I don't know what's wrong with a properly fitted muzzle. It isn't a "shame" nor does it necessarily mean the dog wearing it is super aggressive in all respects.

I do not let my Lab go after wildlife. Since she's very interested in ducks it's imperative that she follow commands when swimming because inevitably some ducks wander over or land in the water nearby while she's swimming. If the swans come (2 that live at one lake we go to) I often stop or move. I'm super cautious about giving wildlife space and most are very serious about this here.

Blows my mind.


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## Annette4 (22 February 2022)

I muzzle 2 our of 3 of mine on walks and I'm muzzle training the little ginger terror (not a typo 🤣). I would rather every dog had to be muzzled but I appreciate much like needing to wear collars with tags it wouldn't be enforced.

I was told recently while out with Dobby who was on lead, on the pavement when we were charged at with teeth by a lab that it was my fault for muzzling him because their dog hates them 🤦‍♀️


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## Cinnamontoast (22 February 2022)

Annette4 said:



			I was told recently while out with Dobby who was on lead, on the pavement when we were charged at with teeth by a lab that it was my fault for muzzling him because their dog hates them 🤦‍♀️
		
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That's just ridiculous! 

Zak wore a muzzle in the woods cos if he escaped, I would imagine he'd bite something so on went the muzzle if we were somewhere he wasn't retrieving. Fortunately, he never approached other dogs. 

I just read in my local Neighbourhood group that a lady had her dog jumped on by a bunch of dog walker's dogs in our local woods, I'm too scared to go there now! I don't want the pups to have a bad experience but it seems almost inevitable from what I read on here and elsewhere. (Plus mine are nowhere near ready for off lead shenanigans yet!)


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## P3LH (22 February 2022)

I gave in with nice offlead walks a long time ago. I recently did let them off, and kept the corgis leads trailing behind them as we don’t do much recall outside as none of the dogs are ever off anymore. It was the middle of nowhere. We were then accosted by a pair of Weims who ‘just wanted to play’ but then quickly escalated into a full on brawl.

Barring then, I can’t remember the last time I really even thought about it. Mine are all dog neutral and quite enjoy a good romp around with others - I find it too stressful having to watch not just my own dogs but every other dog in the vicinity to decipher who’s going to kick off, who’s generally got no manners and who’s under no control. I began to HATE dog walks at one point - so just stopped letting them off. We still get hassled on average every walk, no matter where we go - by something but at least I can just keep on walking as mine are taught from little if on lead, we ignore.

A few years ago I’d never have imagined walking dogs in lead 99% of the time as mine were never on really, but it genuinely isn’t worth the stress anymore or feeling like you no longer enjoy one of your favourite things.


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## Clodagh (22 February 2022)

I’ve got an amazing bruise and cut (through thick jeans) given to me by a chocolate Labrador in some remote woods last week. He just ran at me and launched, I honestly thought he’d broken my leg, it definitely did something to my hip. He then did another go round and went to do it again and I held my hand up like a policeman and yelled ‘stop’. He was so surprised he did, at least long enough for me to get organised. He calmed down then and played nicely with my lot.
The owner said ‘gosh you are so lucky, he normally launches at faces’. I mean FFS! My mum walks our dogs near those woods, it would have put her in hospital.


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## Arzada (22 February 2022)

Clodagh said:



			The owner said ‘gosh you are so lucky, he normally launches at faces’. I mean FFS! My mum walks our dogs near those woods, it would have put her in hospital.
		
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I think that needs reporting to the Dog Warden. You might well be adding to other reports of this dangerous dog.


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## P3LH (22 February 2022)

Clodagh said:



			I’ve got an amazing bruise and cut (through thick jeans) given to me by a chocolate Labrador in some remote woods last week. He just ran at me and launched, I honestly thought he’d broken my leg, it definitely did something to my hip. He then did another go round and went to do it again and I held my hand up like a policeman and yelled ‘stop’. He was so surprised he did, at least long enough for me to get organised. He calmed down then and played nicely with my lot.
The owner said ‘gosh you are so lucky, he normally launches at faces’. I mean FFS! My mum walks our dogs near those woods, it would have put her in hospital.
		
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Bit like when latest pup was much younger and still really quite small, furry and squeaky and two rather large, rather switched on, bull lurchers pursued us steadily for quite some time as they ‘just wanted to play with the baby’ said owner so glammed up and kitted out in branded country attire it was like a Barbour catalogue had thrown up on her.


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## SaddlePsych'D (22 February 2022)

Clodagh said:



			I’ve got an amazing bruise and cut (through thick jeans) given to me by a chocolate Labrador in some remote woods last week. He just ran at me and launched, I honestly thought he’d broken my leg, it definitely did something to my hip. He then did another go round and went to do it again and I held my hand up like a policeman and yelled ‘stop’. He was so surprised he did, at least long enough for me to get organised. He calmed down then and played nicely with my lot.
The owner said ‘gosh you are so lucky, he normally launches at faces’. I mean FFS! My mum walks our dogs near those woods, it would have put her in hospital.
		
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I know someone who had her leg broken, proper fully broken by a dog running at her (I think a Lab or retriver). She wasn't particularly young/old/vulnerable but it still took her clean out and did a lot of damage on the way.

Policeman hand and a booming "No!" seems quite effective I've found!


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## Karran (22 February 2022)

I tore my hamstring, knee and ankle ligaments in 2017 by a chunk of a golden retriever clattering me from behind. You had a lucky escape!


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## Clodagh (22 February 2022)

Well I warned a lady I passed on the same walk and if I ever see it again I’ll hide behind a tree and yell at the owners, not the dog. I can do shitty really well.


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## Millionwords (22 February 2022)

I have a rescue JRTx he has been knocked out, picked up by the back legs, bitten, bowled over, bounced upon and snapped  on so many occasions that hes now a reactive dog.

Every single time the excuses were "only playing" or the owner had no recall, no interest, on the phone or all three.

Bad dog owners need the dogs removing so that everyone (dogs, public and other dogs) have the life and experience they deserve.

(I shall resume my long time lurking again now 🤣)


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## Arzada (22 February 2022)

Update on the murder of the Dawlish cob.

The unbelievably selfish owner of the on short lead dog which killed the resident black cob sitting on his 7 soon to hatch eggs is 'utterly distraught'. There is a pathetic reason that this was an unforeseen occurrence. Hardly a unique occurrence and therefore foreseeable. There is zero need for any dog to be within killing distance of a swan. I'd like to think that the book is thrown at this person but there's no point really is there.

Let's spare a thought and a ton of sympathy for the cob's life partner who would have seen her mate killed and who no longer has him in her life or her eggs to sit on. I hope that she finds another partner but it's not like there are tons of black swans around.

A photo of the cob on their nest https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1570102/Black-swan-dog-attack-Tucks-Plot-Dawlish-Council-Devon


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## skinnydipper (22 February 2022)

...


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## Nasicus (23 February 2022)

Arzada said:



			Update on the murder of the Dawlish cob.

The unbelievably selfish owner of the on short lead dog which killed the resident black cob sitting on his 7 soon to hatch eggs is 'utterly distraught'. There is a pathetic reason that this was an unforeseen occurrence. Hardly a unique occurrence and therefore foreseeable. There is zero need for any dog to be within killing distance of a swan. I'd like to think that the book is thrown at this person but there's no point really is there.

Let's spare a thought and a ton of sympathy for the cob's life partner who would have seen her mate killed and who no longer has him in her life or her eggs to sit on. I hope that she finds another partner but it's not like there are tons of black swans around.

A photo of the cob on their nest https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1570102/Black-swan-dog-attack-Tucks-Plot-Dawlish-Council-Devon

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Local to me and bloody tragic, always a treat to see the swans when I go to dawlish.


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## Lacuna (23 February 2022)

Nasicus said:



			Local to me and bloody tragic, always a treat to see the swans when I go to dawlish.
		
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Not local to me but a treasured childhood holiday haunt. Absolutely gutted me about the swan


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## Books'n'dogs (23 February 2022)

Arzada said:



			Update on the murder of the Dawlish cob.

The unbelievably selfish owner of the on short lead dog which killed the resident black cob sitting on his 7 soon to hatch eggs is 'utterly distraught'. There is a pathetic reason that this was an unforeseen occurrence. Hardly a unique occurrence and therefore foreseeable. There is zero need for any dog to be within killing distance of a swan. I'd like to think that the book is thrown at this person but there's no point really is there.

Let's spare a thought and a ton of sympathy for the cob's life partner who would have seen her mate killed and who no longer has him in her life or her eggs to sit on. I hope that she finds another partner but it's not like there are tons of black swans around.

A photo of the cob on their nest https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1570102/Black-swan-dog-attack-Tucks-Plot-Dawlish-Council-Devon

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One of my brothers is a very enthusiastic birder (he has an international reputation) and these kind of incidents have turned him against most dog owners. The fact that the dog was on lead almost makes it worse. What on earth was the owner thinking?! 😠


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## Nasicus (24 February 2022)

Books'n'dogs said:



			One of my brothers is a very enthusiastic birder (he has an international reputation) and these kind of incidents have turned him against most dog owners. The fact that the dog was on lead almost makes it worse. What on earth was the owner thinking?! 😠
		
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I suspect an attempted selfie with the bird (whilst still holding the dog) gone very wrong.


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## skinnydipper (24 February 2022)

My sweet natured big girl falls into the giant size category.  I take my big dog owner responsibilities seriously and do my utmost to make sure that she is never in a position where she would feel pushed to defend herself.

Today on our morning walk a red lab ran up behind us growling. The dog's owner was slouching along hands in pockets, hoodie with hood up.  I shouted to him to call his dog, he ignored me though he did take a different path and the dog followed him, along with his other dog.

Unfortunately we met him again when he was coming towards us on the loop as we made our way back to the car.  When I saw him coming I took her up a bank onto a higher level and well off the path.  His dog did the same thing again, ran at her growling, I shouted at it and chased it off.  I called to him that he should put his dog on a lead when he knows it will do that and he told me I was an idiot and it was a park!  In my view being in a park doesn't mean you can allow your dog to start a fight.

The second time the big girl tensed and her body language changed and I felt she could have retaliated if it tried to attack her.

I'm so bloody annoyed that she should be put in that position and it makes me feel sick when I think what might have happened if she had been off lead at the time.


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## CorvusCorax (24 February 2022)

Nasicus said:



			I suspect an attempted selfie with the bird (whilst still holding the dog) gone very wrong.
		
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I dunno, some dogs are just ninjas and a lot of owners are not aware of their surroundings. See the woman with the spaniel who I was able to follow home a couple of weeks ago and didn't even notice (DISCLAIMER, THERE IS A BACK STORY AND I AM NOT A WEIRD CREEPY STALKER). 
Once a dog has clamped onto something can be hard to get it off if you don't know what you are doing, most people instinctively pull back, which causes opposition reflex, and with something as delicate as a swan's neck (for example) crush injuries alone or bleeding out would be catastrophic very quickly or the bird could have gone into shock with just one bite before owner was able to drag it away.
I am not excusing the actions for one minute but I can totally see why a dog can still attack when on leash.
It could have been a rubbish chain leash or a flexi etc.


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## CorvusCorax (24 February 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			My sweet natured big girl falls into the giant size category.  I take my big dog owner responsibilities seriously and do my utmost to make sure that she is never in a position where she would feel pushed to defend herself.

Today on our morning walk a red lab ran up behind us growling. The dog's owner was slouching along hands in pockets, hoodie with hood up.  I shouted to him to call his dog, he ignored me though he did take a different path and the dog followed him, along with his other dog.

Unfortunately we met him again when he was coming towards us on the loop as we made our way back to the car.  When I saw him coming I took her up a bank onto a higher level and well off the path.  His dog did the same thing again, ran at her growling, I shouted at it and chased it off.  I called to him that he should put his dog on a lead when he knows it will do that and he told me I was an idiot and it was a park!  In my view being in a park doesn't mean you can allow your dog to start a fight.

The second time the big girl tensed and her body language changed and I felt she could have retaliated if it tried to attack her.

I'm so bloody annoyed that she should be put in that position and it makes me feel sick when I think what might have happened if she had been off lead at the time.
		
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Don't you just love it when other people are happy to leave you in the position of being stuck in between two large, scrapping dogs and walk off in the other direction.
I wish there was a way to quickly, succinctly and snarkily shout: "IF I GET BITTEN AND CAN'T WORK I AM GOING TO SUE YOU FOR LOSS OF EARNINGS"


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## Nasicus (24 February 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			I dunno, some dogs are just ninjas and a lot of owners are not aware of their surroundings. See the woman with the spaniel who I was able to follow home a couple of weeks ago and didn't even notice (DISCLAIMER, THERE IS A BACK STORY AND I AM NOT A WEIRD CREEPY STALKER).
Once a dog has clamped onto something can be hard to get it off if you don't know what you are doing, most people instinctively pull back, which causes opposition reflex, and with something as delicate as a swan's neck (for example) crush injuries alone or bleeding out would be catastrophic very quickly or the bird could have gone into shock with just one bite before owner was able to drag it away.
I am not excusing the actions for one minute but I can totally see why a dog can still attack when on leash.
It could have been a rubbish chain leash or a flexi etc.
		
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That's very true! Maybe I'm just jaded and cynical


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## skinnydipper (24 February 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			Don't you just love it when other people are happy to leave you in the position of being stuck in between two large, scrapping dogs and walk off in the other direction.
I wish there was a way to quickly, succinctly and snarkily shout: "IF I GET BITTEN AND CAN'T WORK I AM GOING TO SUE YOU FOR LOSS OF EARNINGS"
		
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There is an increase in people who take their dog out and leave their brain at home.  I'm p1ssed off with it.


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## SaddlePsych'D (24 February 2022)

It's bad enough they don't care about/have any respect for other people and their dogs, but also seem to not really care about what would happen to their own dog if they were to get in a fight. 

I'll jinx it now but touch wood we've not had any 'incidents' recently. I'm still feeling shaken by the GSD and collie skiing owner so don't feel safe to go that route again which is sad because it was otherwise a really nice walk. Most of it is on narrow track and I just wouldn't feel happy coming across them at close quarters.


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## Chuffy99 (24 February 2022)

Oh he’s only a puppy, just a year, my stock reply as mine sits at my side, mine is 9 months but I’ve spent the last nine months training mine


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## Cinnamontoast (24 February 2022)

Clodagh said:



			I’ve got an amazing bruise and cut (through thick jeans) given to me by a chocolate Labrador in some remote woods last week. He just ran at me and launched, I honestly thought he’d broken my leg, it definitely did something to my hip. He then did another go round and went to do it again and I held my hand up like a policeman and yelled ‘stop’. He was so surprised he did, at least long enough for me to get organised. He calmed down then and played nicely with my lot.
The owner said ‘gosh you are so lucky, he normally launches at faces’. I mean FFS! My mum walks our dogs near those woods, it would have put her in hospital.
		
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Omg, I missed this! Hope you’re ok. That dog absolutely needs to be on lead around people. Honestly, the more I read, the more terrified I am to take my little ones out. 

I’m teaching Mitch not to rear at people. He’s very light currently and doesn’t put any weight on the leg, but I certainly don’t want an adult dog that thinks that behaviour is acceptable.


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## Clodagh (24 February 2022)

Chuffy99 said:



			Oh he’s only a puppy, just a year, my stock reply as mine sits at my side, mine is 9 months but I’ve spent the last nine months training mine
		
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Or ‘well you are so lucky to have well behaved dogs’. Nope, it’s not down to luck. What was it ‘the harder I work the luckier I get?’ Or similar.


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## planete (24 February 2022)

I had a lab run at me out of nowhere and start humping my leg on the heath here while the two elderly male half-wits with him sniggered..The damn thing felt nearly as heavy as I am too.  The dog's behaviour I could forgive but not that of his two attendants.


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## Pearlsasinger (24 February 2022)

Since I broke my leg, I take a walking stick with me when dog walking, in order to avoid slipping and breaking something else. However, I have found it most useful for seeing off annoying dogs, in particular a couple of yapping terriers whose owner really didn't like my pointing the stick at them and telling them to 'get out of it' in my best 'teacher in the playground voice', when he was a lot further away from them than I and my dogs were.  Tough!  I can recommend carrying a stick.


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## Pippity (24 February 2022)

Clodagh said:



			Or ‘well you are so lucky to have well behaved dogs’. Nope, it’s not down to luck. What was it ‘the harder I work the luckier I get?’ Or similar.
		
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My mum has two spaniels living on her street. One is out of control - tows its owners everywhere, is constantly escaping, barks non-stop, etc.. The other sits neatly at the edge of the unfenced garden, walks perfectly at heel whether on-lead or not, recalls immediately, and is just a delightful dog.

You can guess which owner tells the other that they're 'lucky'.


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## Millionwords (25 February 2022)

Someone in my localities dog has died today due to an irresponsible owner.
The owners off lead sighthounds chased a small terrier, it bolted and was hit by a car and killed.
I don't know the owners but I'm so angry and upset for the dog and them.


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## Amymay (25 February 2022)

Had a cracker today. 

I was sat on a bench, off the main path, with my dogs on leads.  Lady with dog walks past and says to her dog, ‘ok, go and say hello then’.  One of my dogs does not like big dogs - and this one was _big_.

‘My black dog is not friendly’ says I.  Big dog came over to say hello anyway. It was on a lead.  My dog went for him.  ‘I told you he wasn’t friendly’ I said calmly.  ‘No need to get angry with me’ she says 🤷🏻‍♀️😳🤣


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## scats (26 February 2022)

Last Sunday I was at the sand dunes with the dogs and there was a gorgeous but rather out of control show cocker, whose male owner was pathetically calling its name in an attempt to get it to come to him.  It was just running up to every dog to play and then following them and their owner instead of following the bloke.
It ran over to my girls to play and promptly ran straight into my legs at high speed and nearly took me out.  If that had been my mum, it would have had her right over.  Owner never said a thing, just continued to call its name over and over while being ignored.


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## Sandstone1 (26 February 2022)

The other day on arriving at one of my walking spots in the car with dogs in the back,   two ladies with dogs were talking together about 20 yards away.  I pulled in to the parking space and started to get my dogs out of the car.  On leads and under control.    Two of the dogs belonging to one of the women chatting up the road the decided to run down the road and come up to my dogs.  I just said to the owner that one of mine is not that friendly to other dogs.  ( not completely true but she can be a bit grumpy with rude dogs)   She then very rudely replied I shouldnt have got mine out of the car then!    My dogs were on lead and under control.  Hers were off lead and out of control!
I told her she should have her dogs under control to which the reply was several swear words beginning with F!
She then walked away down the road dogs still off lead.  I continued to walk a way behind her with my dogs on lead.    One of her dogs pooed and she didnt pick it up.      So many rude, ignorant and lazy dog owners around that think their dogs can do what they like.


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## ycbm (26 February 2022)

I am blind to my far right and downwards on half that side.  Many times when I have explained to people that their loose dogs or extended leads are a big threat to me if they let their dog run to my feet,  I've been told "walk somewhere else then". 
.


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## cauda equina (26 February 2022)

Millionwords said:



			Someone in my localities dog has died today due to an irresponsible owner.
The owners off lead sighthounds chased a small terrier, it bolted and was hit by a car and killed.
I don't know the owners but I'm so angry and upset for the dog and them.
		
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So sad, poor little dog

Some years ago at Sandringham a woman asked me if I'd seen her greyhounds
I told her Yes, they've just killed a deer
You're joking! she said; I wasn't, and although upset about the deer was very relieved that they hadn't killed my terrier


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## Errin Paddywack (26 February 2022)

ycbm said:



			I am blind to my far right and downwards on half that side. Many times when I have explained to people that their loose dogs or extended leads are a big threat to me if they let their dog run to my feet, I've been told "walk somewhere else then".
		
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They would be getting a very strong reply if that was me.


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## Cinnamontoast (26 February 2022)

I met a Dogue de Bordeaux and Frenchie last week (Goose was scared of the Frenchie who was smaller than him) Saw the owner again today whilst out with Bear (he told off the DdB) and she said an old guy with a walking stick smacked the DdB over her back and told her to get her effing dog away from him. I don’t think she was doing anything, certainly doesn’t jump up. The owner was very calm, don’t think I would have been!

 I walked past him, Bear totally focused on the ball in my hand. His grand daughter was in the fenced off play park, why didn’t he go there if he was bothered. People are strange.


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## ycbm (26 February 2022)

Errin Paddywack said:



			They would be getting a very strong reply if that was me.
		
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I ask them where I can walk where there are no dogs and they tell me to **** off.
.


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## BSL2 (3 March 2022)

Forgive me, I may rant on a bit. I am so sick of numpty dog owners who have no control. I have two chihuahuas. One is not good with other dogs. I use yellow leads with "nervous dog" printed on them. I politely ask people with dogs off leads to recall, as mine are nervous. "Oh mines friendly" is the usual reply. I want to say,  "Well mine aren't, so sod off". I try to stay polite, but I have had a row with a woman who accused me of being the reason my dog reacted when her springer came bounding over and I picked them up. " No love, it's because of people like you, who don't have a clue on how to control their dogs". All I want is to quietly walk my dogs and be left alone. I've taken to going out really early to avoid people and im fortunate enough to let them come up the field with me when I do horses. There's a paddock they can be separate in.


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## Amymay (3 March 2022)

I try to stay polite
		
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I’m never polite any more 🤗


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## skinnydipper (3 March 2022)

Feel free to rant, BSL2.

I was talking to someone the other day who told me that all dogs should be off lead.  He said it was the on lead dogs not being allowed to socialise that caused the problem.  I told him 'socialisation' was overrated and listed a number of reasons why a dog might be on a lead and not appreciate another dog in its face.

You have to hand it to them though, that degree of stupidity must take some practise


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## Cinnamontoast (3 March 2022)

Amymay said:



			I’m never polite any more 🤗
		
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My OH is very keen for me to remain polite in public. He doesn’t want me in trouble, apparently swearing at people is a public order offence but I see red if someone allows their dog to go for mine or annoy them. I think it will take me quite some time to get over the whole keep Zak (and other dogs!) safe.

Goose is very submissive with other dogs, Mitch is more into people. Recall is pretty amazing with Mitch, still working on Goose, but I want it solid for any situation.


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## SaddlePsych'D (3 March 2022)

I'm not sure where I am on the politeness scale, I try to be polite. I do think having a dog is doing my assertiveness skills a lot of good! 

I've noticed actually some pretty good experiences with other owners lately, both out with Ivy and with share horse (where we hack is a dog walking hotspot and there's usually some kind of incident, annoying but usually minor at least). I hope it lasts! I did get a bit worried about a dog walker with a large group of off lead dogs today but Ivy didn't care and they had pretty good recall. A couple of the dogs bounded toward us and got an "Ah Ah!" from me which I'm not sure the other person appreciated but it interrupted the dogs enough for them to then recall so I'd call that a win all round.


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## Pearlsasinger (3 March 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			My OH is very keen for me to remain polite in public. He doesn’t want me in trouble, apparently swearing at people is a public order offence but I see red if someone allows their dog to go for mine or annoy them. I think it will take me quite some time to get over the whole keep Zak (and other dogs!) safe.

Goose is very submissive with other dogs, Mitch is more into people. Recall is pretty amazing with Mitch, still working on Goose, but I want it solid for any situation.
		
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It's all in the tone! No need to swear at the idiots, they get what you think of them anyway


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## Clodagh (3 March 2022)

Pearlsasinger said:



			It's all in the tone! No need to swear at the idiots, they get what you think of them anyway

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Although I saw the choc lab today, my leg still has a cut on it. But he was on a lead! She was being towed but progress none the less. I’d have sworn if it had come at me again.


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## Escapade (3 March 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			Feel free to rant, BSL2.

I was talking to someone the other day who told me that all dogs should be off lead.  He said it was the on lead dogs not being allowed to socialise that caused the problem.  I told him 'socialisation' was overrated and listed a number of reasons why a dog might be on a lead and not appreciate another dog in its face.

You have to hand it to them though, that degree of stupidity must take some practise
		
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It’s beyond belief.
Walking in the field behind my estate a few days ago and I had a man shout abuse at me from a distance… for having mine on lead! His two ran up to me teeth bared and growling, they won’t do anything of course 🙄 well I got his reg no. as he was leaving and they’re the same dogs that killed a resident’s cat last month!


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## CrunchieBoi (4 March 2022)

Even when you try your best to be responsible, idiot owners still somehow manage to spoil things.

We have a now 2yo Christmas reject puppy who grew too big. He has a reasonable prey drive so isn't able to be safely walked off-lead at the moment. As a result we hire a secure field a few times each week to let him have a proper run around. Went to our most local one last night and as it was damp I took a walk around the field with him. We were at the opposite end of the field to the gate when he suddenly shot off in the direction we'd come from. It turned out someone had turned up, somehow missed my car in the loading bay and had just decided to wander in. 

My 32kg boy was chasing this tiny little froo-froo dog (attached to an extended lead) round and round one of its owners while the other tried to pick it up. Meanwhile the woman is screaming at me to control my dog and I'm running over as fast as a busted knee will allow.

I actually can't control him hen, that's why I hired this bloody field in the first place. 

Turned out they'd read the hire times on the email wrong, but never would admit to whether or not they saw me in the field before entering. Its on a slope so its certainly possible I was hidden from view but surely to God the car being in the loading dock was a bit of a giveaway. Our lad didn't actually make any sort of move to attack the smaller dog but it's quite scary to think how badly that could have gone.


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## fiwen30 (4 March 2022)

CrunchieBoi said:



			Even when you try your best to be responsible, idiot owners still somehow manage to spoil things.

We have a now 2yo Christmas reject puppy who grew too big. He has a reasonable prey drive so isn't able to be safely walked off-lead at the moment. As a result we hire a secure field a few times each week to let him have a proper run around. Went to our most local one last night and as it was damp I took a walk around the field with him. We were at the opposite end of the field to the gate when he suddenly shot off in the direction we'd come from. It turned out someone had turned up, somehow missed my car in the loading bay and had just decided to wander in.

My 32kg boy was chasing this tiny little froo-froo dog (attached to an extended lead) round and round one of its owners while the other tried to pick it up. Meanwhile the woman is screaming at me to control my dog and I'm running over as fast as a busted knee will allow.

I actually can't control him hen, that's why I hired this bloody field in the first place.

Turned out they'd read the hire times on the email wrong, but never would admit to whether or not they saw me in the field before entering. Its on a slope so its certainly possible I was hidden from view but surely to God the car being in the loading dock was a bit of a giveaway. Our lad didn't actually make any sort of move to attack the smaller dog but it's quite scary to think how badly that could have gone.
		
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Gosh, that is a scary thought.

If the field doesn’t have clear line of sight, then perhaps there should be some sort of sign you put up when it’s in use, or a coded entry of some kind? A friend of mine rents out time in a field to run her greyhound, and there’s no way the hound wouldn’t have caught that little dog.


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## CrunchieBoi (4 March 2022)

fiwen30 said:



			Gosh, that is a scary thought.

If the field doesn’t have clear line of sight, then perhaps there should be some sort of sign you put up when it’s in use, or a coded entry of some kind? A friend of mine rents out time in a field to run her greyhound, and there’s no way the hound wouldn’t have caught that little dog.
		
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There is a code you have to put in to get in but once you're in there you can't lock it again from the inside if that makes sense. 

There's another slide bar lock that you use to close the gate behind you.


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## CanteringCarrot (4 March 2022)

CrunchieBoi said:



			There is a code you have to put in to get in but once you're in there you can't lock it again from the inside if that makes sense.

There's another slide bar lock that you use to close the gate behind you.
		
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Yes, I think a "this space has been hired and is in use, do not enter" sign may help. Even if you bring your own, if that's alright. Would be clear notice directly at the gate. Maybe that might help?


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## Pearlsasinger (4 March 2022)

If there was a car already there, the other dog's owners are simply idiots.  A sign would be equally invisible to them.
 We have taken our dogs to a secure field which has a hidden area.  We have always checked that the field is empty before letting our Rottweiler loose in the field, as it is known to be used by people on foot.


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## CrunchieBoi (4 March 2022)

CanteringCarrot said:



			Yes, I think a "this space has been hired and is in use, do not enter" sign may help. Even if you bring your own, if that's alright. Would be clear notice directly at the gate. Maybe that might help?
		
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Nah, I'm not going to be going to the hassle of making a sign to take for when I use the field at the time I've hired it. The terms and conditions of using it are clearly set out on the website you book it on and we've never had a problem before now. It's not like you turn up when you feel like it and use it if it's empty, you have to book a slot on a website and pay in advance.

There were two owners there, if they'd had two brain cells to rub together one of them could have wandered in to check it out first if they thought someone was in (which should have been obvious given my car was in the loading bay and they had to have opened two gates to get in). It's not a humongous field so walking a couple of meters into it would have been enough to confirm whether someone else was there.


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## Amymay (4 March 2022)

Just feed it back to the fields owner that a sign would be useful @CrunchieBoi


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## CrunchieBoi (4 March 2022)

Amymay said:



			Just feed it back to the fields owner that a sign would be useful @CrunchieBoi

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I emailed the providers so will see what they say. The ability to lock it from the inside would be more useful which is what I said in my email.


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## CanteringCarrot (4 March 2022)

Ok, sorry for making the suggestion. I suppose it isn't necessarily and possibly would not work anyway. The lock from inside might be more useful. I didn't think before I posted and people around here know how to read and respect signs.


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## CrunchieBoi (4 March 2022)

CanteringCarrot said:



			Ok, sorry for making the suggestion. I suppose it isn't necessarily and possibly would not work anyway. The lock from inside might be more useful. I didn't think before I posted and people around here know how to read and respect signs.
		
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My post probably came across as totally snippy so apologies for that. The other owners were utterly in the wrong and it feels a bit defeatist to pander to their stupidity. 

Originally they tried to say that they had come at the correct time but when we both checked emails they admitted they should have been in the half hour slot before us. 

Hopefully the ability to lock the field from the inside is something the providers consider.


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## Nasicus (4 March 2022)

CrunchieBoi said:



			My post probably came across as totally snippy so apologies for that. The other owners were utterly in the wrong and it feels a bit defeatist to pander to their stupidity.
Originally they tried to say that they had come at the correct time but when we both checked emails they admitted they should have been in the half hour slot before us.
Hopefully the ability to lock the field from the inside is something the providers consider.
		
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Our local one has a 'occupied' slider on the gate, which seems to help. Not always mind, had some moron wander in before my slot was up.


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## CanteringCarrot (4 March 2022)

CrunchieBoi said:



			My post probably came across as totally snippy so apologies for that. The other owners were utterly in the wrong and it feels a bit defeatist to pander to their stupidity.

Originally they tried to say that they had come at the correct time but when we both checked emails they admitted they should have been in the half hour slot before us.

Hopefully the ability to lock the field from the inside is something the providers consider.
		
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Ah, no worries. I am possibly a bit too sensitive at the moment anyway 😅 with all of life's struggles and the feeling of WW3 looming 🙄 

Anyway, I hate pandering to stupidity and feel as though I shouldn't have to, but sometimes I do it in order to get myself just a moments peace. It's a bit soul destroying at times and I cannot believe some people. I'm fortunate that people around here are fairly sensible, if not strict, when it comes to their dogs. 

Hopefully an inner lock can be installed and that'll be the end of it. I don't know why some people are just so blasé.


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## Annette4 (4 March 2022)

That's my worst nightmare CB, although I pull into the field we use most often so they would be hard pressed to say they didn't see my giant truck in the gateway 🤣


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## SaddlePsych'D (4 March 2022)

Hopefully a simple catch or slide bolt could be installed at the secure field and problem solved. Good to report it/feed it back. The one we take Ivy to can be bolted from the inside and you bring the key in with you so it can't be unlocked from the outside when in use. I'd be livid if someone just came wandering in with their dog (at least come in without the dog first to check if you really must!) and although Ivy (greyhound) hasn't shown any tendency to chase or interest in small dogs I would be highly uncomfortable with testing her out in that way. The example(s?) on here of greyhounds chasing/attacking small dogs remind me why we need to be careful, it's just not worth the risk. Last time we were there a pheasant made a pheasanty noise a field over and her reaction was so quick, she'd already clocked it and teleported to the other side of the field by the time it had really registered with me so we certainly have work to do on the recall!

A further owner annoyed by my "Ah Ah!/No!" intervention today (with an "I said No!" this time because their red setter didn't want to listen the first couple of times). I need to get over people not liking this and doubting myself. I get probably people aren't going to like their dog being 'told off' by a stranger but there's a good reason I do it. In fairness they did try to put their dog on a lead but it ran away each time they stepped towards it, and at least they didn't wheel out the classic "it's okay..."


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## Amymay (4 March 2022)

I need to get over people not liking this and doubting myself. I get probably people aren't going to like their dog being 'told off' by a stranger but there's a good reason I do it
		
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I absolutely wouldn’t worry about it.


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## CorvusCorax (4 March 2022)

We actually had a really good day today and I was able to stop her boiling over every time we met a dog. She didn't even lose her shit at any spaniels. It's taken us so long to get here, people like Spangletwat don't realise the damage they can cause.
(Weirdly in training she doesn't give a crap, it's dogs who she perceives are on 'her manor').

I did laugh this evening, there was an elderly cocker who came bowling up to her father and was SO HAPPY about it, head up arse and in face etc and squealing with happiness and the oul fella was like 'meh, whatever'.
Years ago that would have been an 'airs above the ground' type reaction 😂


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## Karran (8 March 2022)

Here's one for this morning.
Enter park and see Staffy X on way out. I keep Mrs Collie on the lead, move off of the path. It's too close to engage distraction mode so i'm trying damage limitation, she starts lunging, screaming and spinning at Staffy.
The woman actually tries to bring her dog closer to mine.
'Oh let them make friends, she'll get over it then.'

She did not like my reply! 🤬🤦‍♀️


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## CorvusCorax (8 March 2022)

At the weekend I was returning from a short walk and saw a a golden retriever puppy running around in a field of donkeys. Then in the car park, an older one came over to mine and started sticking it's head up his ass. I had to grab mine in the collar as he wanted to climb on it to assert his MANLY MANNESS.
Luckily I had a stick in my pocket so I heeled him back to the car.
Remaining two dogs in my car are going biccies.
So it transpires the owner is parked right beside me, she doesn't have a leash on her and she is trying to get two loose dogs into the back of a small car boot and as soon as one gets in, the other jumps out.
So I then have to wait for the circus to conclude before I can go near my own vehicle/put my dog away.
But hey it's goldies, so 'cute' rather than the cops being called if my dogs had been allowed to behave that way....


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## Pearlsasinger (8 March 2022)

I feel your pain, CC, we are trying to teach the pup not to bark at dogs we pass on our walks.  She is doing well but we had a hiccup yesterday.  
A very few minutes into our walk yesterday (2x adult Labs and 1 x 8 month Lab pup), all on leads on a quiet residential road without pavements, we saw a blonde woman in her 40s with some sort of poodle-x wearing a pink fleece but no lead. 
We first spotted the woman standing by a neighbours field gate, weren't sure if she had a dog or not.  She walked on and we saw the dog, so don't know whether, she 'forgot' to pick up after it, or she was waiting for it to come out of the field.   
Then it chased a cat across the road. We sat ours down to allow her to pass but the dog came across the road towards us. I asked her if she was going to get hold of it.  She was extremely rude, told us to mind our own business, 'he didn't get it it' (the cat) and that she walks through this village every day.   Not sure of the relevance, or veracity of this, as we also walk up there every day at pretty much the same time and certainly didn't recognise her/the dog.  
She doesn't care (her words) that there is a local bye-law that says that all dogs should be on a lead on the highway.  We miss the Rottweiler even more at times like this


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## Clodagh (8 March 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			.
Luckily I had a stick in my pocket so I heeled him back to the car...
		
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Did you…
1. Beat goldie with stick?
2. Beat goldie’s owner with stick (more tempting)
3. Wave stick in your dogs face?
4. Bung it in his gob?
5. Bung it in your gob so you couldn’t verbalise your thoughts?
😀


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## skinnydipper (8 March 2022)

Pearlsasinger said:



			She was extremely rude, told us to mind our own business, 'he didn't get it it' (the cat) and that she walks through this village every day. Not sure of the relevance, or veracity of this, as we also walk up there every day at pretty much the same time and certainly didn't recognise her/the dog.
She doesn't care (her words) that there is a local bye-law that says that all dogs should be on a lead on the highway. *We miss the Rottweiler even more at times like this*

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I am not sure it would help.  Some people are just born stupid.


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## Pearlsasinger (8 March 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			I am not sure it would help.  Some people are just born stupid.
		
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You are quite right!  It probably wouldn't have helped, when we had 2 Rotts on lead we got several spaniel owners allowing their off-lead dogs to approach, on a regular basis.


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## Clodagh (8 March 2022)

I had a Doberman x Kelpie in Oz. He was fine with dogs on the whole but he did have a very narrow parameter for unacceptable greeting behaviour.
So he’d be on a lead with his ball and other dogs would try to hump his face or mount him. Tbh he could spit his ball and swap it for a mouthful of dog very quickly. When he lost his temper he then did not let go very easily. It was so rarely his fault. I imagine CC’s dogs give off the same masculine vibe that makes other dogs want to be a big boy.


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## skinnydipper (8 March 2022)

Who else has heard the excuse, given by the owner of the rabid dog trying to attack your dog, "its not his fault, he was a lockdown pup"?


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## CorvusCorax (8 March 2022)

Clodagh said:



			Did you…
1. Beat goldie with stick?
2. Beat goldie’s owner with stick (more tempting)
3. Wave stick in your dogs face?
4. Bung it in his gob?
5. Bung it in your gob so you couldn’t verbalise your thoughts?
😀
		
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No I just held it in my left hand and told him to Fuß, he does focus heeling for a stick, he's very easily pleased


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## Archangel (8 March 2022)

Had an interesting walk yesterday.  

A GSD running after a ball from a thrower, like solidly for 40 minutes.  The dog was so lame in front  As the dog came over to see mine I said "oh he's limping"  like I only just noticed.  Apparently he always limps.  Good idea to continually throw a ball then.

Then we met an odd dog.  I couldn't get a fix on what it was.  I was staring, my dog was staring.  The guy was a bit prickly - I think he thought he had a 'hard' dog but it was a mess (apart from the colour which was lovely). I've googled and it looks like an Micro Bully.   Honestly poor dog, you could drive a bus through its back legs.


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## skinnydipper (8 March 2022)

Another excuse given for the dog straining at the leash who would clearly like to take a chunk out of your dog "its okay he's friendly, he just doesn't know how to greet other dogs properly"


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## SaddlePsych'D (8 March 2022)

Yesterday I saw a pic of a "flat nosed" breed. The skin fold above its nose protruded beyond the nose. Flat faced now becoming inverted face. In the same group I read someone who, in fairness was seeking advice which is better than nothing, needed to be told perhaps don't have their reactive doberman off lead after it had had a go at a passing jogger. Felt a bit sick reading that tbh. Especially after the recent thread on here about someone quite seriously injured by a random dog biting them.

I posted elsewhere about the group walks I do and tbh I'm not feeling to sure about the most recent one. It's a huge number of dogs, and there are some reactive ones among the group which I do understand given the breeds (sighthound) and that the walks have helped a number of dogs with problems gain their confidence. I just feel uncomfortable when people perhaps aren't ensuring enough space from others both within the group and people walking dogs not with the group. I know reactivity is tricky and must be so stressful so I don't want to judge unfairly, but equally I'm thinking if you know your dog is highly likely to go off at other dogs maybe don't let them get close enough to sniff? They might just be insecure but I'm sure quite frightening to be on the receiving end of even with muzzle and leads on.

Yesterday I watched from afar as what I suspect was a professional dog walker with far too many off lead dogs had two of them pelting off to another dog. Thankfully share horse and I were far away from the chaos but it's one of the reasons I'm reluctant to take Ivy over to walk in the area, and if share horse wasn't so solid around dogs it would be a nightmare to hack at times.


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## SaddlePsych'D (8 March 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			Another excuse given for the dog straining at the leash who would clearly like to take a chunk out of your dog "its okay he's friendly, he just doesn't know how to greet other dogs properly"
		
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Ugh so scary! This was what happened with the lady whose on lead GSD and collie brought her skiing towards us, barking at Ivy. Then she was questioning my dog's nervousness when we came across them again off lead further round the loop of our walk, like that's the issue here. I was extremely firm in responding "I do not care!" to her "it's okay he just wants to play." Not with my dog lady, and certainly not like that!


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## Cinnamontoast (8 March 2022)

Clodagh said:



			Did you…
1. Beat goldie with stick?
2. Beat goldie’s owner with stick (more tempting)
3. Wave stick in your dogs face?
4. Bung it in his gob?
5. Bung it in your gob so you couldn’t verbalise your thoughts?
😀
		
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I am wetting myself! 



skinnydipper said:



			Who else has heard the excuse, given by the owner of the rabid dog trying to attack your dog, "its not his fault, he was a lockdown pup"?
		
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Haven't heard that one, but the lockdown pups round our way are all just let to rip so we avoid assiduously! 



CorvusCorax said:



			No I just held it in my left hand and told him to Fuß, he does focus heeling for a stick, he's very easily pleased 

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Ooh, Bear does this for dummies/balls. Equally easily pleased, or as the dogwalker says 'A star'. 



skinnydipper said:



			Another excuse given for the dog straining at the leash who would clearly like to take a chunk out of your dog "its okay he's friendly, he just doesn't know how to greet other dogs properly"
		
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And I'd be replying 'And it isn't my dog's job to teach him, it's yours!' Idiots!


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## Smitty (8 March 2022)

Too many dogs are being killed by out of control dogs with their appalling owners who generally just walk off and sadly yesterday another human (3 month old baby) lost their life when attacked by a dog in some woods.


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## skinnydipper (8 March 2022)

Smitty said:



			Too many dogs are being killed by out of control dogs with their appalling owners who generally just walk off and sadly yesterday another human (3 month old baby) lost their life when attacked by a dog in some woods.
		
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It's tragic.

Odd time of day to be taking a baby for a walk in the woods.


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## CorvusCorax (8 March 2022)

Does anyone actually know the circumstances yet?

Chief Superintendent Andy Cox said: "This is an exceptionally sad incident, and one that we know will impact the local community, or indeed anyone hearing about it. 
"There may be a temptation to speculate about what happened while people attempt to understand this tragedy, and we’d ask people to avoid doing so, particularly on social media where facts can become distorted.
"We will do everything we can to establish what has happened, and we’d like to thank everyone for their support. "


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## skinnydipper (8 March 2022)

I think I can report one better than the "it's okay he's friendly" and that is to announce to other owners what their dog is going to do - that their dog who is lying in wait, is going to run at your dog and pounce on it but he is only playing.

Witnessed this afternoon. Woman with poo-type dog, letting the owners of the elderly JRT know what her dog intended to do. Nearly knocked the old JRT off his feet.

Tried the same thing with the big girl but thought better of it at the last moment.


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## Pearlsasinger (8 March 2022)

This is beginning to feel rather like victim-blaming.   You should be able to take your baby out for a walk at any time of the day or night and bring him/her home safely.  Some babies sleep better on the move.


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## CorvusCorax (8 March 2022)

DISCLAIMER: This is *nothing to do with the case mentioned*!! And I am not trying to blame anyone or justify anything. But worth thinking about going forward. But something I have thought of pointing out for a while so it might as well be now.

So, in the case of people being killed by cattle, there is a big trend for tabloids to describe someone being 'gored to death' when in fact the inquest reveals they were trampled or suffered crush injuries. Most cattle aren't even allowed to have horns to gore anyone with. But yeah, snappy headlines over facts.
Equally, when a person dies due to an interaction with a dog, it does not always follow that they were 'mauled'. Some people can suffer complications from a seemingly innocuous bite or scratch, go into shock or have a heart attack etc, some people can be knocked over and hit their head or suffer a clot. I know when I was lying on the floor in a heap when my ***ing dog dragged me up some concrete steps and was still too numb to feel anything, I thought 'Wow, is this it, am I going to die here, like this?!'
It's best not to attribute injuries or circumstances until more is known.


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## bonny (8 March 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			DISCLAIMER: This is *nothing to do with the case mentioned*!! And I am not trying to blame anyone or justify anything. But worth thinking about going forward. But something I have thought of pointing out for a while so it might as well be now.

So, in the case of people being killed by cattle, there is a big trend for tabloids to describe someone being 'gored to death' when in fact the inquest reveals they were trampled or suffered crush injuries. Most cattle aren't even allowed to have horns to gore anyone with. But yeah, snappy headlines over facts.
Equally, when a person dies due to an interaction with a dog, it does not always follow that they were 'mauled'. Some people can suffer complications from a seemingly innocuous bite or scratch, go into shock or have a heart attack etc, some people can be knocked over and hit their head or suffer a clot. I know when I was lying on the floor in a heap when my ***ing dog dragged me up some concrete steps and was still too numb to feel anything, I thought 'Wow, is this it, am I going to die here, like this?!'
It's best not to attribute injuries or circumstances until more is known.
		
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As far as I can remember every case I’ve read of when a walker is killed by cattle they are described as being trampled to death, never gored. Very few cattle have horns which I suspect is common knowledge and the baby who died yesterday has been reported as killed by a husky type dog.


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## CorvusCorax (8 March 2022)

bonny said:



			As far as I can remember every case I’ve read of when a walker is killed by cattle they are described as being trampled to death, never gored. Very few cattle have horns which I suspect is common knowledge and the baby who died yesterday has been reported as killed by a husky type dog.
		
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Well that's not my experience, but thank you for your valuable input. There's also a few farmers who have been killed by their own cattle in crush-type situations. 'Killed by' can mean a lot of different things, which is what I was trying to explain in the post, and hopefully you can read the disclaimer.


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## blackcob (8 March 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			I think I can report one better than the "it's okay he's friendly" and that is to announce to other owners what their dog is going to do - that their dog who is lying in wait, is going to run at your dog and pounce on it but he is only playing.

Click to expand...

Had one of these not an hour ago - also a poo type - it froze, eyeballed, stalked and then plopped itself down in the middle of the path to wait. Owner carried on merrily ahead until I stepped off the path in an obvious big semi circle to avoid stalking dog, at which point she said ‘oh, my dog will bounce, is yours not friendly?’ 

I replied that he really would not like to be bounced on, but too late, our talking was enough to set it off. Thankfully unlike the owner I was actually keeping an eye on it, saw it launch and stepped between it and my dog so it collided with my knee instead. No apology 🙄


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## skinnydipper (8 March 2022)

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/17871430/baby-girl-dies-dog-attack-arrests/


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## Clodagh (8 March 2022)

skinnydipper said:



https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/17871430/baby-girl-dies-dog-attack-arrests/

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That is so unbelievably sad. Poor baby.


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## skinnydipper (9 March 2022)

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/17889696/baby-killed-dog-husky-training/


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## Smitty (9 March 2022)

I have no idea how they will live with that.  When I first read about the case I thought it was just some random dog being walked by a third party. 

What would the dog be crossed with I wonder ...  and why did it turn and kill.  Presumably not the first time with the baby?   Just so awful and like the majority of these cases, probably did not need to happen.


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## skinnydipper (9 March 2022)

Smitty said:



			I have no idea how they will live with that.  When I first read about the case I thought it was just some random dog being walked by a third party.

What would the dog be crossed with I wonder ...  and why did it turn and kill.  Presumably not the first time with the baby?   Just so awful and like the majority of these cases, probably did not need to happen.
		
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I would imagine that the dog was hyper aroused if it anticipated racing or had been racing.

Huskies have a high prey drive so a baby crying could have triggered that.

The parents have paid a helluva price.


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## CorvusCorax (9 March 2022)

Nobody knows what happened or why it happened except for the people who were there, that's what inquests are for and why people get asked not to speculate.


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## skinnydipper (9 March 2022)

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/baby-mauled-death-husky-dog-26422483


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## CorvusCorax (9 March 2022)

Without wishing to labour the point, all of the people quoted in those articles apart from the police are still just guessing what happened.
Also Transits and Sprinters are two different makes/models and the Mirror reporter doesn't even know enough to cap them up...
Nitpicking I know!!


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## skinnydipper (9 March 2022)

Point taken.


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## Clodagh (9 March 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			I would imagine that the dog was hyper aroused if it anticipated racing or had been racing.

Huskies have a high prey drive so a baby crying could have triggered that.

The parents have paid a helluva price.
		
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They really have. I agree that you’ve got the likely scenario. It’s just awful.


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## skinnydipper (9 March 2022)

Rishton, a guide dog, on Twitter


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1501532668609105920


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## CorvusCorax (15 March 2022)

Just dumping this here/having a moan as not worth starting a new thread over and we're probably both irresponsible 
Anyway, young one is in season and I was out cleaning her at about 11.45pm, up a lane, when I could see torchlight coming behind me, I recognised it was a neighbour who I get on with really well so I shouted 'sorry, she's in season, please don't come up here!' but the torchlight continued, so I came out onto the main road and went back on myself down the other side of the hedge, sure enough the torchlight kept coming and neighbour caught up with me really breathless saying the dog had 'dragged him like a wild horse'. There was a good gap between us to begin with and it's...a very small terrier. Which was now beside itself and I was having to contain mine from jumping all over his head.
He's a really nice guy but really? I can hold a 30kg male, or, you know, just tell the dog to knock it off...

(To add - I live in a small bungalow with small front and rear gardens, my concession to not keeping her under house arrest/wrecking my house through boredom is taking her out at antisocial times or driving her somewhere remote, always on lead, I have two entire males who are being annoying and bitch wherever she has peed but come on...I still don't let them drag me around)


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## Moobli (15 March 2022)

Saw on my Insta feed yesterday where an on-lead border collie had been badly attacked by three bull breeds in Devon.  It sounds as though the male owner was also very aggressive towards the poor lone female owner of the collie and blamed her for her dog being an entire male!  The collie is now recovering from numerous puncture wounds after seeing the vet and having to be stitched back up.  He actually sounds quite lucky to be alive.  The police were informed.  
Dreadful!


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## YorksG (15 March 2022)

I am 5'6" and was 9 and a half stone and B rotter weighed about 8 and a half stone ( she was very muscley) and we worked very hard on not letting  her pull anyone, but it didn't stop idiots letting their any sort of dog come pestering her!
Only today we had 3 on lead labs, with a pug in their midst, while it's owner pootled off on his mobility scooter. We sat ours down and he still ignored it!!!!


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## ellieb (15 March 2022)

Yeah I'm 5'6 and Joe is 39kg and likes to lunge/pull out of the blue with all his muscly force at cats/squirrels/rabbits/etc (usually just as I've lost concentration) and I've never lost control of him either 😄


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## Clodagh (15 March 2022)

OH just reading to me about a pet dog being shot chasing livestock in Cheshire on Sunday. The owner is ‘distraught’. Interesting that Cheshire police posted along the lines of ‘if you cannot control your dog do not enter fields of livestock’ . The lead it slipped obviously wasn’t working. Stupid people.


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## skinnydipper (15 March 2022)

Clodagh said:



			OH just reading to me about a pet dog being shot chasing livestock in Cheshire on Sunday. The owner is ‘distraught’. Interesting that Cheshire police posted along the lines of ‘if you cannot control your dog do not enter fields of livestock’ . The lead it slipped obviously wasn’t working. Stupid people.
		
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I saw that yesterday, C.

Here is what Sgt Simpson of Cheshire Police Rural Crime scene had to say:

Please let me be clear on this as there are no positive bits to this post and this is a very sad event which has resulted in significant injury to a lamb and the death of a dog. One of our most complained about social media lines is YOUR DOG, YOUR RESPONSIBILITY - mainly because this subject can be very emotive. However it's a message we stand by.

Earlier today in Disley a dog broke free of its lead and went on to worry a number of sheep injuring one, leaving it with bite marks to its nose and under its chin.

This horrific incident was witnessed by the owner who tried to recall the dog, but it wouldn't return. Numerous attempts were made by the dog's owner and the farmer who arrived on scene, before they were left with no other option. Again the action taken was witnessed by everyone present and it's upsetting for all involved.

No-one wants to shoot a family pet, but it's clear in law that someone protecting their livestock have this option available to them.

Ask yourself, if my dog broke free from its lead, am I happy that it will listen to my commands? Have I really got 'control'?

If you're not sure, please keep it away from livestock, even if you're using a lead.

My thoughts in general and not specific to this sad incident, is that any dog under your control should be suitably trained before opting to rely on a lead when near livestock.

Essentially, a lead shouldn't be thought of as your primary control method.

This crime of worrying livestock is being dealt with by the attending officer and those involved.

Thanks all,

Sgt Simpson


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## Clodagh (15 March 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			Essentially, a lead shouldn't be thought of as your primary control method.
		
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He didn’t read all that. What an interesting statement, and makes you think is the lead the only thing between you and chaos?
With the labs it’s fine. I wouldn’t need a lead. With previous lurchers and terriers I couldn’t say yes with certainty.


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## Clodagh (15 March 2022)

OH (as someone who absolutely could shoot a dog if needed) said you’d have to be a good shot with a cool head in that sort of situation.


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## skinnydipper (15 March 2022)

Also in Cheshire.

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/farmers-emotional-note-dog-owners-26464868


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## blackcob (18 March 2022)

I shut a gate on a loose dog today and made it squeal - not sure if I got it on the foot or the head, and to be honest I don’t much care, as it was gunning for my dog and beyond the gate the field had cattle in. 🙄 First day of really nice weather and out they come…


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## CorvusCorax (18 March 2022)

YES where the hell were all these people in the depths of winter? Or even just, like last week, when it was lashing....


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## Errin Paddywack (18 March 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			Also in Cheshire.

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/farmers-emotional-note-dog-owners-26464868

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This was on facebook.  The amount of people slagging off the farmer saying all he cared about was the money lost.  Anyone who breeds animals for slaughter is cruel and uncaring and only in it for the money.  I let myself get drawn in on this being in the mood for an argument.  Not a good idea.


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## Clodagh (18 March 2022)

I’ve been there, EP. Picking a fight seems a good idea at the time x


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## Moobli (21 March 2022)

My turn to post about my run in with some irresponsible owners.  Had a fab walk yesterday in the sunshine but of course a sunny Sunday brings all the numpties out too   Firstly met a pair of GWPs along a forest track with no owners in sight.  The ran up to our dogs but hubby's two pups barked and the two GWP ran away a distance and started barking at us (our dogs were all on lead).  The owner must have heard the noise and he came running around the corner and apologised and collected his dogs - fair enough.  It didn't overly bother us.  On this particular walk you have to go through a farmyard that is notorious locally for having loose sheepdogs and my old dog did get bitten by one of them a few years ago, so we were a bit wary but there was no other way around.  Most of their dogs were safely shut in a paddock - phew!  But there was one collie stalking about.  I let my dog bark back at it, and it thought twice about approaching us after that.  Most farm collies are essentially cowards, this one especially without the back up of his mates.  Just as we were nearing the end of the walk, we saw a couple walking three black dogs in an empty field.  There seemed to be quite a bit of shouting and calling and the two off lead dogs seemed to be taking absolutely no notice whatsoever.  No worries, they were in a field and we were walking down the single track road (with ours on lead) to the right of the field, and the lane sits higher up.  We stopped to talk to the farmer that my OH knows for a few minutes so unfortunately that delayed us passing the entrance to the field.  By the time we were approaching the entrance the couple and their dogs were in sight.  Still not too concerned, as thought they have definitely seen us and will no doubt recall their dogs and put them on leads.  Nope!  Their staffie and patterdale came barrelling straight over, out the gate into the lane (and we were also now near the busier B road) and straight into the midst of our four dogs, growling and posturing.  FFS!  The owners also had a french bulldog on a lead and made virtually no attempt to collect their dogs other than shouting loudly.  I tried to just keep moving but the staffie had it in for my male GSD and kept running over and into his face!  I am quite surprised my boy didn't take a chunk out of it tbh.  Eventually the owners caught up to their dogs, but there was no word of apology - in fact they stayed completely mute!  Unbelievable.  
So despite having a really enjoyable walk in gorgeous countryside on a beautiful sunny day it was marred by idiot irresponsibles.


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## Pearlsasinger (21 March 2022)

Moobli, I have no idea how you managed to keep quiet!  I have started saying to people 'Will you call your dog?' Or 'will you put your dog on a lead?'
We had a lovely walk in the country park yesterday, a couple of dogs got a bit too close to the pup for comfort but none tried to join us.The worst owners were those who allowed their dogs to get up to ours when we were sitting outside the cafe, mostly those on extending leads!


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## Smitty (21 March 2022)

The owners very rarely apologise though do they?   Is is down to embarrassment I wonder?    

And ughh, the people with dogs on stretchy leads that just want to say hello 😬😬.   In fact, all the owners of dogs that just want to say hello, stretchy leads or not ...


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## BallyJ (21 March 2022)

Pearlsasinger said:



			Moobli, I have no idea how you managed to keep quiet!  I have started saying to people 'Will you call your dog?' Or 'will you put your dog on a lead?'
We had a lovely walk in the country park yesterday, a couple of dogs got a bit too close to the pup for comfort but none tried to join us.The worst owners were those who allowed their dogs to get up to ours when we were sitting outside the cafe, mostly those on extending leads!
		
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Extending leads are the Bane of my Life! Nearly fell over a GSD puppy in pets at home Saturday, 3 times! Why does the dog need to mooch around, especially while i'm carrying 15kg of dog food.


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## Moobli (21 March 2022)

Pearlsasinger said:



			Moobli, I have no idea how you managed to keep quiet!  I have started saying to people 'Will you call your dog?' Or 'will you put your dog on a lead?'
We had a lovely walk in the country park yesterday, a couple of dogs got a bit too close to the pup for comfort but none tried to join us.The worst owners were those who allowed their dogs to get up to ours when we were sitting outside the cafe, mostly those on extending leads!
		
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It was one of those times that I was really lost for words, just dumbstruck at how utterly stupid these people were.  Of course afterwards I kept running through all the things I should have done differently and the "conversation" I should have had with them.


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## Amymay (21 March 2022)

Moobli said:



			It was one of those times that I was really lost for words, just dumbstruck at how utterly stupid these people were.  Of course afterwards I kept running through all the things I should have done differently and the "conversation" I should have had with them.
		
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It’s always the way isn’t it?  I can think of some great responses _after_ whatever incident required one 🤣🤣


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## Books'n'dogs (21 March 2022)

I have only once received an apology after a run in with irresponsible owners, usually they look at me like I'm the one with a problem because I and my dog(s) don't want their out of control dog(s) in our space.


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## Lynnfigaro (22 March 2022)

I am just back from a rather eventful walk. My cairn pup is now 9 months old and the training is going very well. His recall is very good, but I keep him on a long line lead just in case .
Today we were in a parklike area and I was practicing retrieve with him with his squeaky ball.
I noticed a woman with a cockapoo sitting on a bench so I called him to me and shortened the lead so I had full control of him.
The other dog came bounding up,the woman was blowing a whistle and shouting on it all in vain.
I told my dog to sit and he was such a good boy  he sat and ignored it. 
The dog wouldn't leave him alone. The owner eventually appeared and I suggested more training was in order probably using the type of long line lead I had.
She told me it was my fault as I had been using a squeaky ball and demanded that I stop using it. 
I eventually shouted at her dog to leave mine alone and she told me to stop shouting at it.
I told her that if that was her attitude I was leaving by the busy road so she should get her dog on the lead before that.
The dog followed me for a bit and then went after a german shepherd who was also playing with a squeaky ball.
Last I heard was the owner whistling away to absolutely no avail.
These people are so entitled they think everything is the person with the dog which is obedient and under control's fault.


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## Smitty (22 March 2022)

The ones that have me absolutely seething are the owners who think that as a field has a footpath through it, they are entitled to go anywhere they like in that field.  I see them flinging balls, having picnics and on one occasion there appeared to be a small dog training group taking place.   There are now notices on the gates to that field saying dogs on leads and keep to footpath.

I am sure farming is hard enough without morons trampling all over your land.


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## Clodagh (22 March 2022)

I walked in Eggesford Forest yesterday. Met two other people with dogs. Both, like me, kept them to heel until it was confirmed it was ok and then we let them release. Then the man with 2 labs threw a ball while all the dogs were in together. Of course they all went after the ball. Thankfully no fracas but what a stupid thing to do.
Today I’ve been up to the coast, I had 2 on leads and one to heel. Two women walked towards me with 3 dogs, who rushed me and started persecuting my girls. I used my foot to get one from under Ffee, and then again when it came back for more. ( under as in it’s face attached to her fanny). I very politely didn’t punt it into next week but just scooted it away. The owner was absolutely outraged! No more public walks until winter for me.


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## CorvusCorax (22 March 2022)

On that note, here's a tip for anyone who has dogs they don't want to be pestered or are working on things and don't want that work to be undone by people who have no control over their dogs: If it's a nice day and you arrive somewhere and it is clear that it is hiving with people with offlead dogs....go somewhere else. I never go to a park or popular beauty spot with my young dog if I know it is going to be busy, because I have come to the conclusion that you cannot legislate for idiots.
On Saturday the football was over earlier than I thought so I had a choice - go up the road a short distance to an extremely busy park or drive back where I had been and walk around the country roads instead, so I chose the latter.

If you want to work on distractions but be reasonably sure that other people have control over their dogs, join a good training club 

I have enough bother outside my own front gate without it leeching into nice relaxing walks as well.


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## Clodagh (22 March 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			On that note, here's a tip for anyone who has dogs they don't want to be pestered or are working on things and don't want that work to be undone by people who have no control over their dogs: If it's a nice day and you arrive somewhere and it is clear that it is hiving with people with offlead dogs....go somewhere else. I never go to a park or popular beauty spot with my young dog if I know it is going to be busy, because I have come to the conclusion that you cannot legislate for idiots.
On Saturday the football was over earlier than I thought so I had a choice - go up the road a short distance to an extremely busy park or drive back where I had been and walk around the country roads instead, so I chose the latter.

If you want to work on distractions but be reasonably sure that other people have control over their dogs, join a good training club 

I have enough bother outside my own front gate without it leeching into nice relaxing walks as well.
		
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Fair point but there were only 6 other people on a huge beach… if you didn’t go anywhere you might meet a dog you’d never leave your garden.


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## CorvusCorax (22 March 2022)

Clodagh said:



			Fair point but there were only 6 other people on a huge beach… if you didn’t go anywhere you might meet a dog you’d never leave your garden.
		
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I did say hiving/busy


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## skinnydipper (22 March 2022)

Clodagh said:



			Then the man with 2 labs threw a ball while all the dogs were in together.
		
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An old favourite of mine (heavy sarcasm) when I had the big lad, was people throwing their ball directly towards us so that it looked to my dog as if another dog was charging right at him.


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## blackcob (22 March 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			I never go to a park or popular beauty spot with my young dog if I know it is going to be busy, because I have come to the conclusion that you cannot legislate for idiots.
		
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It absolutely boils my piss that there are places I have to avoid completely/at certain times of day/at certain times of year but there's no point arguing with idiots and it's better for my blood pressure to take CC's advice. 

Happily idiots tend to be quite predictable in their choices and in my experience, once you've also excluded the obvious lure of parks and National Trust type places: they seldom go further than 30 minutes (1hr circular) walk out of town, are put off by things that mean they might have to put their dog on a lead like road crossings or livestock, and they choose flat over hills. I've said this before but I sat down with a map a while back and plotted out routes on this basis, which has eliminated many a 'he's friendly' from our outings and has also forced me to walk a lot further which has rather done me some good too.


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## CorvusCorax (22 March 2022)

Good one tonight. Couple with two kids and a westie, who saw I was in the field and that I was headed out the way they came in, blocked the exit hole for the dog with the kids' scooters, presumably to keep their dog in the field. I moved them and left them on the floor. I'm sorry but I'm not dissassembling scooter barrier, sitting dog, climbing stile, calling dog through, sitting dog, climbing stile, reassembling scooter barrier and climbing stile. Not irresponsible as such but bloody rude.


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## limestonelil (22 March 2022)

Smitty said:



			The ones that have me absolutely seething are the owners who think that as a field has a footpath through it, they are entitled to go anywhere they like in that field.  I see them flinging balls, having picnics and on one occasion there appeared to be a small dog training group taking place.   There are now notices on the gates to that field saying dogs on leads and keep to footpath.

I am sure farming is hard enough without morons trampling all over your land.
		
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Thanks so much for this reminder Smitty. We recently decided we had to let people know our fields (with footpaths) are not doggy exercise areas as there's been a huge increase in the number of dog walkers with multiple badly behaved pooches using them as such. Most people are astonished the dog should also remain on the footpath. The rudest owners will insist it doesn't matter the dogs are hoolying about because 'there's no sheep in here' lf I can be bothered I'll point out I fed them all 20 minutes previously and the dogs have caused them to run down/up out of sight, and the next people's dogs who come in at a different place cause them to run up/down in the opposite direction. Not good for heavily inlamb sheep. 
OH (knackered old farmer) was less than impressed with a 'woke' vegan  villager who attempted the currently fashionable argument that dogs chasing livestock doesn't matter in the slightest because the livestock is only killed for farmers' financial gain.


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## MagicMelon (22 March 2022)

Personally I think all dogs should be kept on leads in public areas. Id say 90% of dogs (or owners) think nothing of letting their dogs rush up to people and my dog. My dog is reactive on the lead after being attacked by an off lead dog, but not just that, I cant stand owners allowing their dogs to bound up to my young children and get right in their faces, shouting "they love kids" or whatever else to suggest theyre friendly means nothing. I dont know you, I dont know your dog and I certainly dont think my young child needs a large strange animal running up them! Any I meet, very few have any recall. My dog hasnt got good recall so I would never dream of letting her off anywhere outwith my own property. Why on earth do others think its ok.


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## Amymay (22 March 2022)

Why on earth do others think its ok.
		
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I wouldn’t have dogs if they had to be kept on a lead (they have excellent recall).


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## usaequestrian (22 March 2022)

Ohh I have an interesting one that kind of corresponds with previous posts about off-leash dogs.
I was at a competition last Saturday and there was a well-known trainer at the show. She had a small little corgi, I believe with her. I was watching a few riders go when the corgi ran into the show arena because the trainer DIDN'T HAVE A LEASH. At a show. With fifteen horses around her. Thank goodness the horse was at the other end of the arena and someone was able to grab the dog. A bit later when I was in the ring showing, I could see the trainer waiting by the arena entrance with her dog wandering away from her! I think it's fine to bring a well-trained dog to a show as long as you have some means of restraint. Horses you don't know and off-leash dogs aren't to be trifled with.


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## CorvusCorax (22 March 2022)

Amymay said:



			I wouldn’t have dogs if they had to be kept on a lead (they have excellent recall).
		
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Everyone thinks that, until the day they don't and I'm not going to take the chance and put my dogs at risk in public....around traffic, livestock, other dogs, people who could be scared of them etc. Personally, as the owner of big dogs, I know no one wants to see them charging about offlead in public. They get loads of exercise on leash, off leash in safe places and of course lots of training.
They are fitter and more stimulated than a lot of dogs that are allowed to bimble offlead and self-entertain.
Sure I have to walk them a bit further some days but it's no biggie.


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## ellieb (22 March 2022)

Same with mine.


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## Clodagh (22 March 2022)

Amymay said:



			I wouldn’t have dogs if they had to be kept on a lead (they have excellent recall).
		
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I’m with you. I accept leads when needed. But the thought of no pleasant mooching walks is sad to me. Never seeing Pen and Ffee chase each other on the beach. Never having dogs just being dogs. Not for me.


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## ellieb (22 March 2022)

A lot of it depends on your breed preference really, doesn't it. I've got a hound with great recall to the whistle except he's a hound so he likes to chase and go from 0 to 40mph much quicker than your average dog/quicker than I could grab him if needed. If I had a lab or something with similar recall skills to his but without the acceleration/prey drive I would let it off.


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## CorvusCorax (22 March 2022)

In what way would dogs not be dogs because they only get let off in safe, secure or quiet areas with very good visibility? Does that mean they turn into elephants 😉😂
I'm sure all the owners of the many dogs that have gone missing up mountains or in the woods thought they had good recall. We had a very pleasant mooch tonight once we broke through the scooter barrier, just with a leash attached.


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## Clodagh (22 March 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			In what way would dogs not be dogs because they only get let off in safe, secure or quiet areas with very good visibility? Does that mean they turn into elephants 😉😂
I'm sure all the owners of the many dogs that have gone missing up mountains or in the woods thought they had good recall. We had a very pleasant mooch tonight once we broke through the scooter barrier, just with a leash attached.
		
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No sniffing, no eating sheep poo (that would be ok 🤣). No rolling in dead things… I like them chilling. Just MO.


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## Clodagh (22 March 2022)

ellieb said:



			A lot of it depends on your breed preference really, doesn't it. I've got a hound with great recall to the whistle except he's a hound so he likes to chase and go from 0 to 40mph much quicker than your average dog/quicker than I could grab him if needed. If I had a lab or something with similar recall skills to his but without the acceleration/prey drive I would let it off.
		
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That’s true, but the statement was all dogs on leads always, not ‘dogs that can’t be trusted on lead always.’ I’ve had a lurcher and I understand. 😁


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## CorvusCorax (22 March 2022)

Clodagh said:



			No sniffing, no eating sheep poo (that would be ok 🤣). No rolling in dead things… I like them chilling. Just MO.
		
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Er....my dogs do all of these things on lead, it's not a garrotte.


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## ellieb (22 March 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			Er....my dogs do all of these things on lead, it's not a garrotte.
		
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Hah, yes mine was chowing down on rabbit poo earlier.


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## Amymay (22 March 2022)

Clodagh said:



			I’m with you. I accept leads when needed. But the thought of no pleasant mooching walks is sad to me. Never seeing Pen and Ffee chase each other on the beach. Never having dogs just being dogs. Not for me.
		
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100% agree.  It’s a perfect joy.


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## Nasicus (22 March 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			In what way would dogs not be dogs because they only get let off in safe, secure or quiet areas with very good visibility? Does that mean they turn into elephants 😉😂
I'm sure all the owners of the many dogs that have gone missing up mountains or in the woods thought they had good recall. We had a very pleasant mooch tonight once we broke through the scooter barrier, just with a leash attached.
		
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I'm with you, can't let the wee Gremlin off the lead as she'll bugger off into the sunset the moment something more interesting than me comes along. Thought we'd at least cracked it in the field until she ran across the entire field, under the gate and down the main road. She's lost all off leash privileges unless we are in a secure, fenced area like the local dog field for hire. My heart (and short legs) can't take it!

And we have plenty of pleasant mooches, if it's just us/an appropriate situation she'll be on the flexi lead or longline and allowed the 10m length of it (so a 20m circle around me) to sniff, eat 'country raisins' and (unfortunately) roll in crap. If not, she's on a 2m lead and yet we still enjoy our mooches together, I tend to do 'sniff-fari' type walks with her when she's on a short lead as sniffing is her passion, so we amble along as she sniffs ALL the things. We might not go far, sometimes just the 500m up the lane and back, but it can take a good while and she's worn out from all the sniffing. Walking on a lead doesn't have to be akin to yomping, it can still be chilled and relaxing. Well, certainly a lot more relaxing to me than chasing an obstinate fluffy slipper down the road


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## Pearlsasinger (22 March 2022)

Amymay said:



			I wouldn’t have dogs if they had to be kept on a lead (they have excellent recall).
		
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Then it is to be hoped that you don't  walk in sheep country.


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## Amymay (22 March 2022)

Pearlsasinger said:



			Then it is to be hoped that you don't  walk in sheep country.
		
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Oh come on, you know exactly what I meant. The dogs are always on a lead if we’re around stock, or there’s any chance of stock.


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## usaequestrian (22 March 2022)

Pearlsasinger said:



			Then it is to be hoped that you don't walk in sheep country.
		
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My GSD had to be kept on a leash anytime we were around sheep, otherwise she would run under fences and try and 'herd' the sheep. It happened once and then I was more vigilant about her not mixing with farm animals.


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## ellieb (22 March 2022)

Nasicus said:



			Well, certainly a lot more relaxing to me than chasing an obstinate fluffy slipper down the road 

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Haha, love that description 😂


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## limestonelil (22 March 2022)

'Sniff-fari' 😂😂Just love the picture.


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## CorvusCorax (22 March 2022)

ellieb said:



			Haha, love that description 😂
		
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My old one is The Infernal Bogbrush of Doom.

And in case anyone wondered if they're not being allowed to be dogs, the child got an extra hour out of me last night by steadfastly refusing to do a dump and just now presented me with a deceased bird.


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## SaddlePsych'D (23 March 2022)

On apologies... OH was apparently the bad guy for not responding after a huge dog went at Ivy. I wasn't with him but sounds like he was just trying to move on and away from the situation. He got a sarcastic "you're welcome then" like they were doing him a favour after their dog had come flying out of their car with no lead, squaring up and barking at Ivy. OH rarely gets riled by anything but he was so annoyed.

I ignored an apology too last week. No harm done just ott spaniel running up. I didn't say anything partly because I was still half asleep but also because I'd just watched it do exactly the same thing to an on-lead chihuahua which had got upset (understandably). I thought stop keep saying sorry and actually do something to stop your dog hassling others. Even just an attempt at recall would have been appreciated.

The problem with let dogs be dogs is a lot of people seem to think that means letting them do whatever they like, wherever they like.


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## Clodagh (23 March 2022)

I know this is a debate that has been had before and people won’t agree but I love seeing this…

I put them on a lead when we got near numpty corner/ the car park but I really enjoy them playing and running.


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## Errin Paddywack (23 March 2022)

I watched 'Dogs Behaving Badly' last night and those owners were so unbelievably stupid.  None of them had apparently taught their dogs any commands whatsoever.  All three dogs just thought their owners were joining in with the game.  No wonder there are so many badly behaved dogs and children about.


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## Moobli (23 March 2022)

I love seeing my dogs run free - in appropriate places and at a time it’s not going to impinge on anyone else.  A good run on an empty beach, like in your photo Clodagh, is an absolute pleasure.  
I invariably leash up my dogs if we meet other people and dogs, near livestock, roads etc.  I purposefully avoid taking mine to busy places.  I would not like to see a blanket on-lead law in public areas but can see, with all the negative associations around dogs, how it might be coming.  If only common sense were actually common we might not be facing the reality of a future of on lead only.


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## paisley (23 March 2022)

My favourite recently- off lead big chunky Staffy something giving us the "I'm going to do you over " stare with a far away oblivious owner. Once they realised, it was a full 5 minutes of yelling "DARREN!", followed with "THIS WAY!!".  Because thats the winning command isn't it? 🤣


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## skinnydipper (23 March 2022)

Clodagh said:



			I know this is a debate that has been had before and people won’t agree but I love seeing this…

I put them on a lead when we got near numpty corner/ the car park but I really enjoy them playing and running.
		
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I wouldn't like there to be a law where dogs must be leashed at all times.

It makes me happy to see my dog running and wrestling with doggy friends, this morning 2 labs and a labradoodle, and if I still had a dog who liked to retrieve a ball then I would like to be able to do that.

I only have the one dog now and she loves to play with other dogs, so when and where it is appropriate she is allowed off lead to play.


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## BBP (23 March 2022)

I think there are a couple of categories of off lead dog walkers:

Dog owner who puts in the work and has a well mannered dog with excellent recall that causes no risk or menace in approaching other dogs or hazards without permission (perhaps with the odd blip as dogs are not machines). They proactively monitor the dogs they are walking. I’m guessing Clodagh and Amymay fall in to that category.

Dog owner who is too lazy to put dog on lead. The walk is a task to be completed and they want to get it done whilst talking with friends or messing on the phone. These are the ones who also conveniently don’t see their dog take a sh*t and so don’t clean up after it because they aren’t paying any attention whatsoever. For me having a dog on lead just takes effort that many people aren’t prepared to go to in order for the dog to have a fulfilled life, it’s easier for them to let the dog run riot. For us an on lead walk can be a stop start sniffari where you have to be prepared to give the dog time to read the paper. It can be reeling a long line in and out whilst he sniffs and then trots around doing his thing. It can be running with him to ensure he gets enough exercise and puts in enough miles. It can be going to secure areas frequently to give them full zooming time. It takes a lot of effort. 

I’ve admitted frequently that my training skills clearly aren’t up to the task with the dog that I have so he is on lead to keep himself and others safe. The only thing I wish for is that other dogs and people give us space. It’s not a big ask, it shouldn’t be hard, I’m not asking for all dogs to be kept on lead everywhere, just don’t come up to us, give us enough space and time for him to feel safe.

But I fully admit with my previous collie, when I was a teenager, I didn’t give it any thought at all, she was completely dog neutral, not reactive at all, extremely resilient, not remotely interested in anything but her humans and her toys. Other dogs didn’t cross her radar at all, or mine, and as Clodagh said above it was a real joy to see her off lead.


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## CorvusCorax (23 March 2022)

I met spangletwat this morning and we did not have a meltdown. That has taken over a year of work. Came shooting through an underpass straight into her face but then whizzed off again quickly and I was able to get her back up the lane and ply her with food 
I had left my gate open so it probably had a run around the garden before I got that far, but progress is progress.....


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## Amymay (23 March 2022)

spangletwat
		
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Best word ever!! 🤣🤣🤣


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## Parrotperson (23 March 2022)

Had a great one yesterday.
In the pub. Finished eating paid getting ready to leave.

we walk past woman on her phone with large pointer at a table. Rocky is wagging his tail as usual but just walking toward the door.

pointer dog decides to walk towards us (to say hello I guess) at which point his lead catches two full pints of beer on the table and over they go.

woman is on her phone.  Gets an absolute soaking. Looks up at me but I have my ‘don’t try and say that was my fault for walking past’ face on!

had a right good laugh when we got outside. Oh very dear!


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## AShetlandBitMeOnce (23 March 2022)

It just never ends, how horrific is this!! It feels like I see a post like this every other day in our corner of the south downs. The farmer should have shot them both, it may sound old fashioned but once they get a taste for it it's game over. This isn't the behaviour of any old livestock chasing dog.


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## Nasicus (27 March 2022)

Spotted whilst driving home today, by a pedestrian crossing.
Two huge bullies with cropped ears, lunging at a small bichon with the owner barely able to hold them back.
Bichon's crime was... walking past with it's owner. Owner had to scoop her dog up and and hightail it up the hill.
Spoke to the owner to check she was okay as I ran into her outside the local shop, thankfully she was.
I looked down the hill to see the bully owner letting them off the lead to run free around the playing fields, packed with people, kids and dogs of all shapes and sizes...


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## Amymay (27 March 2022)

Christ!


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## Nasicus (27 March 2022)

Amymay said:



			Christ!
		
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Mental note was made to avoid the playing fields with my small fluffy dog for the time being.


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## fiwen30 (27 March 2022)

‘Accidental litter’ of golden retriever/German Shepard pet animals - still charging £850 per pup, for a litter of 7. Not a word said about the health of either parent. No idea where people dream up these prices from. For a one-off, accidental litter, from uncertain quality of parentage, it should be more like £100 as a token.


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## YorksG (27 March 2022)

fiwen30 said:



			‘Accidental litter’ of golden retriever/German Shepard pet animals - still charging £850 per pup, for a litter of 7. Not a word said about the health of either parent. No idea where people dream up these prices from. For a one-off, accidental litter, from uncertain quality of parentage, it should be more like £100 as a token.
		
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They will be German retrievers, or golden shepherds, before any of us know it!


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## fiwen30 (28 March 2022)

YorksG said:



			They will be German retrievers, or golden shepherds, before any of us know it!
		
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Oh, they’re already golden shepards! A popular ‘breed’ in the US, apparently, which I suppose justifies the price tag!


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## Arzada (28 March 2022)

YorksG said:



			They will be German retrievers, or golden shepherds, before any of us know it!
		
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Golden Shepherds and others https://forums.horseandhound.co.uk/threads/golden-type.816748/#post-14874365


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## [139672] (28 March 2022)

Had a rubbish short walk just now. Guy walking two small poodle crosses, along the road, both off lead. They came from behind a parked car. I only saw one first of all. It started coming straight to my dog so I picked him up. Went down the footpath, guy carrying along road. Walked about 30 metres and put my dog down. Heard guy shouting the other dog belted up to my dog. My dog growled. Put my foot out to just keep his dog away and picked my dog up. He said don’t kick m dog, said I didn’t. Told him it’s illegal to walk a dog next to a road, off lead. He said it’s illegal to kick a dog. His dog still following me, jumping up, running around us. Told him I did not kick his ******g dog. His dog then ran off, across a road to a small field, when he saw another dog. Don’t feel well and didn’t need this ☹️


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## Amymay (28 March 2022)

Why did you pick your dog up?


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## Clodagh (28 March 2022)

LR said:



			Had a rubbish short walk just now. Guy walking two small poodle crosses, along the road, both off lead. They came from behind a parked car. I only saw one first of all. It started coming straight to my dog so I picked him up. Went down the footpath, guy carrying along road. Walked about 30 metres and put my dog down. Heard guy shouting the other dog belted up to my dog. My dog growled. Put my foot out to just keep his dog away and picked my dog up. He said don’t kick m dog, said I didn’t. Told him it’s illegal to walk a dog next to a road, off lead. He said it’s illegal to kick a dog. His dog still following me, jumping up, running around us. Told him I did not kick his ******g dog. His dog then ran off, across a road to a small field, when he saw another dog. Don’t feel well and didn’t need this ☹️
		
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I’d happily boot a dog that was bugging mine. Don’t feel bad.


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## CorvusCorax (28 March 2022)

I felt awful the other day, this woman walks multiple dogs, generally well behaved, she recently got a deerhound lurcher type 'rescue' puppy, it's already as large as my female, it does run up to people/dogs but it is a big soft thing, no harm in it, the boys don't care. Came gambolling over the other day, my female was right beside me, I was holding her in the collar and feeding her but the pup got too close and she snapped at it....but in fairness....she shouldn't **really** be letting it gallop up to strangers....I did tell mine off, as it was a witchy bitchy thing to do but I can understand why she did it, as it came right direct into her face.


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## StableMum (28 March 2022)

I've just had some very distressing pictures come up on my Facebook of a 16 month labradoodle who has had to undergo surgery to repair his eyelid bitten through in two places by an off lead dog while he was out walking next to his owner on his lead.  He has also suffered an ulcerated eye and the vet thinks he'll need help with anxiety following this as well. The owner of the attacking dog failed to stop the attack and wouldn't engage and just walked away.  It makes me so angry and very sad that you can't seem to be able go for a walk these days without worrying what might be around the corner. This was not in an open space or park, they were walking along a pavement.


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## Amymay (28 March 2022)

😢😢😢😢😢


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## nagblagger (28 March 2022)

My last dog was one of lifes dog haters, he only became like this when attacked by another dog while he was on the lead when he was young, so not really his fault.
Every time I took him out it was a nightmare but in Ireland there seemed to be more dogs 'allowed to roam' so i started taking a walking stick with me to prevent dogs coming too close for their safety -  now our present dogs are friendly i still do take the stick for my dogs protection, i perceive the roaming dogs as a threat now!
How things change, or is it my perception of risk, due to my dogs different nature.?

( be reassured my doghater dog had at least daily runs in secure private fields)


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## Amymay (28 March 2022)

nagblagger said:



			My last dog was one of lifes dog haters, he only became like this when attacked by another dog while he was on the lead when he was young, so not really his fault.
Every time I took him out it was a nightmare but in Ireland there seemed to be more dogs 'allowed to roam' so i started taking a walking stick with me to prevent dogs coming too close for their safety -  now our present dogs are friendly i still do take the stick for my dogs protection, i perceive the roaming dogs as a threat now!
How things change, or is it my perception of risk, due to my dogs different nature.?

( be reassured my doghater dog had at least daily runs in secure private fields)
		
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I can hand on heart say that I rarely, really rarely, have a problem with other dogs.  But it pays to be cautious, obviously.


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## Clodagh (28 March 2022)

Amymay said:



			I can hand on heart say that I rarely, really rarely, have a problem with other dogs.  But it pays to be cautious, obviously.
		
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I agree with you, but I think we are both blessed by our walk locations!


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## Amymay (28 March 2022)

Clodagh said:



			I agree with you, but I think we are both blessed by our walk locations!
		
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Without a doubt. And I do appreciate how lucky I am.


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## nagblagger (28 March 2022)

Yesterday our 2 were on leads when a big young dog just rushed up to play 'rough and tumble'  luckily with our lab x beagle so she was solid enough to roll over without getting hurt, the owner was calling his dog back to no avail. He did apologise, but when I commented about recall he did say his dog didn't have any, yet he was letting it run loose  - aaahhh  !!!


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## Cinnamontoast (28 March 2022)

fiwen30 said:



			‘Accidental litter’ of golden retriever/German Shepard pet animals - still charging £850 per pup, for a litter of 7. Not a word said about the health of either parent. No idea where people dream up these prices from. For a one-off, accidental litter, from uncertain quality of parentage, it should be more like £100 as a token.
		
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I can see that this might be a popular cross, possibly quite useful? I’d be looking for hipscores on that cross, tho.



CorvusCorax said:



			I felt awful the other day, this woman walks multiple dogs, generally well behaved, she recently got a deerhound lurcher type 'rescue' puppy, it's already as large as my female, it does run up to people/dogs but it is a big soft thing, no harm in it, the boys don't care. Came gambolling over the other day, my female was right beside me, I was holding her in the collar and feeding her but the pup got too close and she snapped at it....but in fairness....she shouldn't **really** be letting it gallop up to strangers....I did tell mine off, as it was a witchy bitchy thing to do but I can understand why she did it, as it came right direct into her face.
		
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She’s lucky that’s all that happened. Zak would have gone to full fight mode if an unknown dog came raving up. 



nagblagger said:



			Yesterday our 2 were on leads when a big young dog just rushed up to play 'rough and tumble'  luckily with our lab x beagle so she was solid enough to roll over without getting hurt, the owner was calling his dog back to no avail. He did apologise, but when I commented about recall he did say his dog didn't have any, yet he was letting it run loose  - aaahhh  !!!
		
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Bonkers. Goose is not yet trusted to be totally off lead yet, recall is essential for me, for the puppies’ sake and for ours, I don’t want anyone getting upset at them or them approaching unknown dogs.


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## MotherOfChickens (28 March 2022)

Tbh i can see why people want a dog that looks like this (I know they won’t always look like this one)

https://pin.it/4uHNPRY


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## Clodagh (28 March 2022)

Amymay said:



			Without a doubt. And I do appreciate how lucky I am.
		
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We get a lot of free range farm collies. Fly from next door charges at us every day, occasionally she overcooks it and ends up the wrong side of enemy lines, there is then an embarrassed stand off until she can slink back to her yard 🙄


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## Clodagh (28 March 2022)

MotherOfChickens said:



			Tbh i can see why people want a dog that looks like this (I know they won’t always look like this one)

https://pin.it/4uHNPRY

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It looks like a mongrel 😃


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## MotherOfChickens (28 March 2022)

Clodagh said:



			It looks like a mongrel 😃
		
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yes, a proper one .


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## CorvusCorax (28 March 2022)

It looks like a Hovawart


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## TheresaW (28 March 2022)

I am with Clodagh and Amymay, and for me I don’t think it’s location based. I can count on one hand the bad experiences we’ve had, and all have been at Luna, the on lead one. I do walk in popular dog walking areas, early mornings when we see no one, and afternoon/evenings when we meet all sorts.


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## CrunchieBoi (28 March 2022)

We're now up to 5 dogs that I'll be avoiding in future and the fifth dog is a lab (along with three of the others, must be the dog of choice for numpties around here). 

I was out walking our old girl in the woods and she was off lead, no issue because she's one of these mongrels that's just a great all-round family dog. Doesn't run off, only greets other dogs if permitted and generally just potters about close to whoever is walking her. 
Suddenly heard thundering paws and this yellow lab came charging up the path towards us. I could hear the owner shouting it but couldn't see them. 

At first it was being what I'd describe as just a little over the top but still polite enough but when our girl ignored it he started trying to mount her and was being pretty insistent. She came over to me because ilthe lab was a fair bit bigger than her (she's 16kg and sort of the size of a large collie) I was struggling to bend down to fend it off and our girl was starting to get vocal when the owner finally showed up. She was apologetic but didn't seem to see the problem because her dog was "learning". Our girl is used to young dogs and doesn't make a fuss but she was properly screaming at this lab and hiding behind me. She hasn't got an aggressive bone in her body and won't offer up a half decent correction. Not that the ordeal seemed to have any lasting effect on her, maybe she's just too old to be bothered.

To the untrained eye, the lab looked very much like a dog that wasn't just lacking recall but lacking in any foundation of recall and totally over-aroused by a simple walk. I'm trying to remember how long we waited until our dogs were allowed off lead but there was a lot of secure dog park visits and walks in very uninteresting places at first. Is that a step that other folk are missing out these days?


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## Cinnamontoast (28 March 2022)

Labs are usually numerically the biggest breed registered (although I think I heard that frenchies were surpassing this recently?) so unfortunately they probably are prevelant re attacks/unfortunate incidents. A massive show idiot dog used to always go for one of ours back in the day. Drove me nuts.


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## SaddlePsych'D (2 April 2022)

We've been doing quite well with walks recently. A couple of times fending off incoming dogs with a No! but otherwise pretty good. Today was a different story. I didn’t handle things that well and let myself get frustrated which probably didn't help. I'm not sure what's wrong we me today.

First owner at least asked if I minded her taking her dog off lead before it ran straight at us. She informed beforehand he'd want to say hello. Tough I thought. At least they did go off in another direction. Next one I think did actually have recall but the ignorant chap walking it just didn't bother to use it despite mine and Ivy's clear signals we'd had enough of his dog. We had the joy of bumping into them again and he let it do the same thing. Then we had a point of around 3 or 4 dogs from different groups surrounding us and one owner getting all excited to say hello to Ivy who was having a 'statue' moment. I had to say 'actually can we just not?!' and a little 'ffs' slipped out because I just felt so bombarded and fed up. I thought we'd be safe in the field marked on lead dogs only this time of year (for the ground nesting birds), but apparently no one is paying attention to that bit.

On the plus side we saw an owner doing some nice long line training with their doodly, and a lab that was so focused on it's owner it brushed past Ivy up close but didn't pay her the slightest bit of attention. The owner had a magic stick I think! I wanted to call out how grateful I was as he was clearly doing this to pass us before letting his dog go on again.


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## P3LH (2 April 2022)

Regretfully I was one today! Picking burrs from elderly rough collies fluffy trousers and youngest’s lead slipped out of my hand - he took himself off tearing around after a standard poodle, barking his head off and being bratty! Apologised profusely but felt awful! I don’t know how others, for whom this is every day, have such brass necks! It ruined my walk!


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## fiwen30 (3 April 2022)

Is this the thread which is also for terrible dog adverts? Have quite lost track.

’Cavacockerpoochon’, for 1.2k each. Cavalier/bichon frise / cocker/poodle, apparently. Incredibly expensive mutts.


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## splashgirl45 (3 April 2022)

i had one tonight,  women came up behind me with a springer on lead and one off lead, my little terriers were both off lead in front of me.  the off lead springer galloped past me and jumped on my youngest terrier,  he was growling and had his hackles up, my dog started yelping in fear and i kicked the dog away while i put mine on leads.  during this the women said nothing, didnt call her dog off even though mine was yelping,  all she said was, he only wants to play!!!!  i dont know how i didnt swear at her, i just   walked away.  i can read dog body language and he wasnt playing,  my terrier plays with other larger dogs quite happily and she knew he wasnt playing...


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## SaddlePsych'D (3 April 2022)

fiwen30 said:



			Is this the thread which is also for terrible dog adverts? Have quite lost track.

’Cavacockerpoochon’, for 1.2k each. Cavalier/bichon frise / cocker/poodle, apparently. Incredibly expensive mutts.
		
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Blimey. Pricey pups indeed! 

Unrelated but I recently saw someone refer to their 'double doodle' - what is that? A something doodle and another something doodle, where the something is the same, or different? Confused. 

Today I thought, am I being oversensitive? Does it really matter if dogs run up to Ivy? Maybe it doesn't, maybe it does and I'm just having a wobble about it. Inspired by fending off a terrier who ran straight at us with 'big' body language/energy, and instead of stopping as most do when I say no it ran circles around us and would not quit trying to get to Ivy. The owner bloke muttered something under his breath as he walked past, no idea what, and I just thought to all the people around at the time I looked like a mad woman repeatedly calling out no to this dog while going round in circles with the owner not doing anything to even attempt recall. Maybe I should have just tried to walk on but then it would have got to Ivy head on. Not enjoying walks these last couple of days.


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## MagicMelon (3 April 2022)

fiwen30 said:



			Is this the thread which is also for terrible dog adverts? Have quite lost track.

’Cavacockerpoochon’, for 1.2k each. Cavalier/bichon frise / cocker/poodle, apparently. Incredibly expensive mutts.
		
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Strange as people dont get so arsey about cross breeds when its a horse?  Would you pay far less for a equally good cross breed horse?  Probably not!  I have a labradoodle and she is the most perfect family dog I could have ever imagined. Worth her weight in gold and Id have happily paid double for her. Couldnt care less that shes not a pure bred and I find it bizarre some people can be so snobby about it. Horse-wise I also only have cross breeds currently in my field!


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## fiwen30 (3 April 2022)

MagicMelon said:



			Strange as people dont get so arsey about cross breeds when its a horse?  Would you pay far less for a equally good cross breed horse?  Probably not!  I have a labradoodle and she is the most perfect family dog I could have ever imagined. Worth her weight in gold and Id have happily paid double for her. Couldnt care less that shes not a pure bred and I find it bizarre some people can be so snobby about it. Horse-wise I also only have cross breeds currently in my field!
		
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As the owner of a most impractical (accidental!) cross breed dog, who comes from a part of the country where he was likely either sold for £50 or traded for a case of beer, I’m hardly a pure-breed snob! What I do get arsey about though, is when people get away with charging extortionate amounts of money for a thoroughly mongrel pup - especially when the only credentials the parentage have to show for themselves is a working reproductive system. It’s absolutely criminal, and shouldn’t be encouraged.


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## P3LH (3 April 2022)

Controversially here I’m sure but…I generally have an issue with the price of most dogs in recent years whether pedigree or crossbreed! (Have had both, and non recognised breeds too)


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## scats (4 April 2022)

Older man who walks through our farm on the footpath has recently got a young Rottie.  It’s a gorgeous dog, but he has absolutely no control over it and it near on pulled him over last night trying to get our yard cat.  It’s a beautiful dog, but when you go to say hello to it it leaps up at you and instantly mouths your hand.  He said that everyone is frightened of it but it’s just being friendly.  I have no doubt that it doesn’t mean any harm to people it meets and genuinely is just playing, but it will harm someone one day, intentionally or not.  Or it’s going to pull the owner over and injure him.


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## cauda equina (4 April 2022)

scats said:



			Older man who walks through our farm on the footpath has recently got a young Rottie.  It’s a gorgeous dog, but he has absolutely no control over it and it near on pulled him over last night trying to get our yard cat.  It’s a beautiful dog, but when you go to say hello to it it leaps up at you and instantly mouths your hand.  He said that everyone is frightened of it but it’s just being friendly.  I have no doubt that it doesn’t mean any harm to people it meets and genuinely is just playing, but it will harm someone one day, intentionally or not.  Or it’s going to pull the owner over and injure him.
		
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'Just being friendly' is such an over-used excuse
I wonder if owners actually believe that that's what's happening, or are too lazy or lacking tools to fix the problem


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## maya2008 (4 April 2022)

One of our local dog walkers has an equally disobedient dog and child. You can hear the parent coming from a mile off as both are constantly being yelled at, to no apparent effect!


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## Cinnamontoast (4 April 2022)

We very carefully avoided a huge mastiff yesterday. The owner, a big bloke, was having trouble controlling it. I was quite concerned about it as the guy was clearly having an issue  with it. He’d brought it to the football training which is not ideal, making the dog hang round doing nothing. There was a cockerpoo puppy which at least was being walked round the pitch. We let Mitch say hello, he was zooming on a longline, playbowing to it. All it wanted to do was jump on him, tho, which I won’t allow, it’s ill-mannered. 

I’m another who thinks the price of random crossbreeds is outrageous. Why would I want to pay a couple of grand for a poo cross  with zero health tests and which has been produced purely because the current trend leans towards cutesy crosses? They dont seem to have a purpose other than being cute, on trend and allegedly ’hypoallergenic’. I was delighted to hear that a colleague has a Wheaten terrier puppy, non-shedding and not a poo cross!


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## CorvusCorax (4 April 2022)

Training dogs to hang around and relax and not have to have entertainment on tap is actually a good idea IMO. I do a lot of hanging around sporting events.


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## Pearlsasinger (4 April 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			Training dogs to hang around and relax and not have to have entertainment on tap is actually a good idea IMO. I do a lot of hanging around sporting events.
		
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We do a lot of that but we usually do the sitting about after exercise and have a 'picnic rug' for them to sit on, if it's a planned interval.  They do have to learn to sit quietly if we just stop for a chat with someone we pass on a walk, whether they have had their exercise, or not.


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## CorvusCorax (4 April 2022)

I can't bring a picnic rug to competitions or do too much exercise before a full routine, the dog just has to wait and be a good dog


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## Clodagh (4 April 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			I can't bring a picnic rug to competitions or do too much exercise before a full routine, the dog just has to wait and be a good dog 

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Rather the same as shooting. They have to just get out of car. Walk to heel. Sit. While adrenalised to the eyeballs. But they do learn how to do that through training first.


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## Cinnamontoast (4 April 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			Training dogs to hang around and relax and not have to have entertainment on tap is actually a good idea IMO. I do a lot of hanging around sporting events.
		
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Didn’t look like he’s done much with the dog at all! Asking a dog to hang round is all very well, but personally i’d start by exercising mine first.  He came in, kept it on the lead, thank god and just hauled it round with him. It was very barky.


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## Cinnamontoast (4 April 2022)

Went for a chill training session with the pups earlier (Goose is  starting to cock, god knows where he learnt that!) We were asking them to do a sit/stay then putting balls in the rough for them to find. Lots of distractions, including puppy pandemic group, notably a retriever with a Happy Birthday bandana who spotted the pointer bitch, ignored his owner to go and hump her. We didn’t interact with the group. They probably think we’re horrible antisocial owners but we have our own pack and don’t need to socialise beyond a polite sit to say hello in passing.


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## CorvusCorax (4 April 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			Didn’t look like he’s done much with the dog at all! Asking a dog to hang round is all very well, but personally i’d start by exercising mine first.  He came in, kept it on the lead, thank god and just hauled it round with him. It was very barky.
		
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We've all got to start somewhere. That's the sort of owner I might engage in chat and see if I can offer or if they want any advice rather than rush straight to judgement.


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## Cinnamontoast (4 April 2022)

Round my way, you’re  more likely to be given a mouthful. There was no way I was going near what looked like a barely under control dog 5 times the size of my skinny little pup and I’ll judge away, but wouldn’t tell the owner! Pretty sure we all judge, I read enough of it on here, this thread is all about judging! We are allowed to vent/judge on here.


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## CorvusCorax (4 April 2022)

True, but it sometimes has the effect of mellowing me out a bit 
I drive to sports pitches rather than walk as that's more representative of what would happen 'in real life' so I would be able to pop the dog away and have a chat. I appreciate I am speaking in hypothetical situations here.
I have been told to butt out before now but my training has made me tough to correction, lolz.


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## AFishOutOfWater (4 April 2022)

Our old bitches used to get dragged about all over the place, on leads not loose though, mostly to car shows.... The current ones are too sometimes now, but  muzzled as well as harness and lead (except the baby who doesn't need the muzzle).
They barked and pulled a bit at first, then they just get used to the format of stuff and amble along next to us. (Though it's been a while since we've had anything but bitches so you do get to know when they're about to cock their leg and move them pronto when there's millions of pounds worth of classic cars about 😂😂).

It is stressful when loose dogs run up though, and I hate how people think 'oh he's just being friendly/just wants to play' is somehow an excuse for letting their animal cause havoc.... Although this thread is making me think maybe I haven't encountered any real arses yet after all!


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## Karran (5 April 2022)

My turn to be a bad owner. Our morning park is a small straight path that opens to a walk around a couple of football pitches. Lollipop shaped so lots of vantage points to keep out of trouble.
Or so I thought letting Mrs Collie off as a GSD appeared. Off she sailed into battle as all GSD's are devilspawn in her eyes and need eliminating...

Owner was more understanding than I would have been when I apologised and had the feral fool under some semblance of control


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## Pearlsasinger (5 April 2022)

Karran said:



			My turn to be a bad owner. Our morning park is a small straight path that opens to a walk around a couple of football pitches. Lollipop shaped so lots of vantage points to keep out of trouble.
Or so I thought letting Mrs Collie off as a GSD appeared. Off she sailed into battle as all GSD's are devilspawn in her eyes and need eliminating...

Owner was more understanding than I would have been when I apologised and had the feral fool under some semblance of control
		
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I think the apology is key!  None of us has a perfect dog, none of us is the perfect owner but recognising when you have made a mistake and inconvenienced/upset someone else and their dog goes a long way to making amends, ime. The irresponsible owners are the ones who never acknowledge that they could/should have done something differently.


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## Moobli (5 April 2022)

MagicMelon said:



			Strange as people dont get so arsey about cross breeds when its a horse?  Would you pay far less for a equally good cross breed horse?  Probably not!  I have a labradoodle and she is the most perfect family dog I could have ever imagined. Worth her weight in gold and Id have happily paid double for her. Couldnt care less that shes not a pure bred and I find it bizarre some people can be so snobby about it. Horse-wise I also only have cross breeds currently in my field!
		
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I don't really understand the often derogatory comments regarding crossbreeds either - whether they be cockerpoo, labradoodle, whatever.  A dog, like anything else, is worth what someone is willing to pay for it.  The so called designer crossbreeds have shot up in popularity and seem to make very good pet dogs for active families.  If a breeder is conscientious in health testing before breeding, rearing their pups correctly and selling to appropriate homes then I can't get too upset about the fact they cost as much as a pedigree dog.


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## Moobli (5 April 2022)

Pearlsasinger said:



			I think the apology is key!  None of us has a perfect dog, none of us is the perfect owner but recognising when you have made a mistake and inconvenienced/upset someone else and their dog goes a long way to making amends, ime. The irresponsible owners are the ones who never acknowledge that they could/should have done something differently.
		
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Definitely this!  Nobody (or their dog) is perfect and we all have lapses of control, accidents happen etc and as long as a sincere apology is forthcoming then most people will forgive and forget.


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## Karran (5 April 2022)

I do always feel very responsible though, having a neurotic toad in Mrs Spaniel, who acts as if the world is ending at the slightest confrontation, human or canine. 
I realise how it can affect other dogs and they might not know that GSD's are big triggers for Mrs Collie, but I do, so I end up consumed with guilt that I should have been more aware of my surroundings before letting her off lead and that its my fault for letting the situation happen!
She does look very scary with teeth and hackles raised when she goes into full on gobsh1te! mode. I still recall days where I've sat on her to stop her hurting people, so when she does go into idiot mode I tend to fear the worst!


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## AShetlandBitMeOnce (5 April 2022)

Karran said:



			I do always feel very responsible though, having a neurotic toad in Mrs Spaniel, who acts as if the world is ending at the slightest confrontation, human or canine.
I realise how it can affect other dogs and they might not know that GSD's are big triggers for Mrs Collie, but I do, so I end up consumed with guilt that I should have been more aware of my surroundings before letting her off lead and that its my fault for letting the situation happen!
She does look very scary with teeth and hackles raised when she goes into full on gobsh1te! mode. I still recall days where I've sat on her to stop her hurting people, so when she does go into idiot mode I tend to fear the worst!
		
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This may be an unsavoury opinion and please don't take it as any judgement on your dog ownership skills or similar, but from your post it doesn't sound like either of your dogs are candidates for off lead walking in any circumstances - unless in a fenced dog walking field on your own or similar. You cannot micromanage your surroundings and if you have had to sit on your dog to stop her hurting people, what happens if the person you don't see that's just walked around the bush near you is a toddler..


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## Odyssey (5 April 2022)

fiwen30 said:



			Is this the thread which is also for terrible dog adverts? Have quite lost track.

’Cavacockerpoochon’, for 1.2k each. Cavalier/bichon frise / cocker/poodle, apparently. Incredibly expensive mutts.
		
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I can see them selling quickly, an ideal choice for those who can't choose between most of the popular smaller breeds/crosses. 😀


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## Karran (5 April 2022)

AShetlandBitMeOnce said:



			This may be an unsavoury opinion and please don't take it as any judgement on your dog ownership skills or similar, but from your post it doesn't sound like either of your dogs are candidates for off lead walking in any circumstances - unless in a fenced dog walking field on your own or similar. You cannot micromanage your surroundings and if you have had to sit on your dog to stop her hurting people, what happens if the person you don't see that's just walked around the bush near you is a toddler..
		
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Hmm. Maybe. I can totally see why you'd think that, perhaps a bit of mild hyperbole on my part!

Mrs Spaniel is completely dog neutral, she wants to be left alone to sniff, occasionally fetch a ball and mind her own business. She is very much a dog-introvert, polite Hello and then moves on to do her own thing. She doesn't have it in her to tell a dog off politely or otherwise when the pushy ones come over to her and often finds herself in situations I have to step in and tell the other dog to leave her alone. She isn't a chaser, a scavenger or a fighter and has reasonable obedience. She just wants to be left alone to do Spaniel things and so she is fine off lead. A dog that is too pushy about being friends makes her genuinely uncomfortable and she will go out of her way to avoid said dog if she spots them. She has Dog Friends to a degree, that we walk with although she doesn't play with them. It's a quick, "how are you? Can't stop, I'm super busy." type arrangement and she's happy with that. She does her flyball and agility and helps at the stables and is absolutely fine interacting with other dogs as they are all in work mode, other dogs have come to stay with us and she is happy with them in her house/car but will take herself upstairs out the way if she feels like too much energy is going on with being sociable. At nearly 8, this won't change.

Mrs Collie was a completely different kettle of fish and yes, for the first few months I had her, she was not allowed off lead at all. Not in enclosed safe spaces or my local parks and she was muzzled. I have worked really hard with her over nearly three years and she is actually at the point where I can have her off lead working, either doing retrieves or her heelwork/obedience work while Park Run goes on around us. She was aggressive and I was told to have her PTS by my first attempt at taking her to training classes and that she wouldn't be offlead safely ever by a behavorist. I don't have small children in my life. The youngest that she associates with are 9, have been around dogs all their lives and are respectful to her. But I also take appropriate precautions, never leaving her alone with them etc. She has been handled by them around novelty dog shows and have a go activities and at high arousal situations like flyball and agility and if they were strong enough to hold her I would have no problem at all with them running her in the activity - but again, its monitored. I know her. I know them and I have worked incredibly hard, and shed many tears to make her this way. She goes to weekly obedience classes, has done the odd KC obedience comp and trains agility and flyball and can be walked on a normal collar and lead combo now in high arousal situations. I dont let anyone, even my adult friends who have probably forgotten more than I know about dogs handle her when she is in trigger mode which is thankfully less and less and more and more manageable as she ages.

As for meeting people in the park she will remove herself from the situation if toddlers or strange children make a beeline for her and now retreats between my legs in "middle" to be safe. I've taught her this as a safe space, so she's out of harms way and I can take her by the collar and stop any child. Lunging with teeth was a first resort but now she has learnt appropriate behaviours and will do them first.

She has a thing about GSD's as there is a large one in the local park where we happened to be this morning, who's owner is very much in the category of "irresponsible owner" I have seen it first-hand launch itself at other dogs. The owner boots it, it moves on and will have a pop at the next unwary dog to go near it and I've reported it to the Police (not having a Dog warden in the area.) The dog has launched itself at Mrs Collie on several occasions and left her with the idea that all GSD's are out to get her, so defence is the best tactic in her eyes. In the winter months, I am limited by park closure times and work hours as to where I can walk and so we occasionally clash.

I probably do micromanage her and worry about her more than what I need to now, I think, because I don't want anyone hurt by her, even though its been over 18 months since the day where I had to sit on her but I keep working, learning what I can and training her and 97% of our walks are incident free because she can now be trusted - as is reasonably possible - to behave like a proper member of society and when I know she can't, she goes back on her lead. I didn't have the experience or knowledge of a truly reactive dog when I adopted her and I will hold my hands up and say that I probably made things worse before I managed to make things better with her and things ARE better and will continue to get better.


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## YorksG (8 April 2022)

Took our two and the pup we dog sit for down into the local wood late morning. The path down runs alongside fields, which people use as dog walking area, although they may get a bit of a shock in the coming weeks when the cattle are turned out! Saw one of the "professional dog walkers" with about half a dozen varied sized dogs running wild, in the field. We sat ours down to let her get out of the way, we had just set off to follow at a distance, when a greyhound came bombing out of the field, after the walker. She appeared to be oblivious of the fact that she was one down. Then there was the golden who also got very left behind at the gate into the wood. 
Having made sure of which way she was going, we went in another direction. Five minutes later a spaniel came up the path towards us, absolutely screaming, either chasing wildlife, or being chased by another dog, we called ours back and got hold of them. She turned and went another way, but was no where near the did she was "walking". 
We think she's the same person who lost the doodle that we ended up finding the owner of late last year. 
I am sure that the owners believe that they are doing the responsible thing by employing this woman, but she's a disaster waiting to happen! She was also on the phone most of the time that we could see her.


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## cauda equina (8 April 2022)

How can anyone be so cavalier with someone else's beloved (presumably) dogs?


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## YorksG (8 April 2022)

cauda equina said:



			How can anyone be so cavalier with someone else's beloved (presumably) dogs?
		
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That was exactly what we said! We are paranoid enough about the friends dog that we walk with ours!


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## Cinnamontoast (8 April 2022)

I don’t let my dog Walker let the youngsters off lead and probably won’t even now their recall is pretty good. I’m way too paranoid! Bear is extremely reliable so he can go off, but I don't think I’d be happy to hear mine had been running riot.


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## YorksG (8 April 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			I don’t let my dog Walker let the youngsters off lead and probably won’t even now their recall is pretty good. I’m way too paranoid! Bear is extremely reliable so he can go off, but I don't think I’d be happy to hear mine had been running riot.
		
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I doubt that the owners have any idea of the chaos that their dog walking is! I do wonder how many people walk with the dog walker, prior to deciding to leave their dogs with her.


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## Cinnamontoast (8 April 2022)

YorksG said:



			I doubt that the owners have any idea of the chaos that their dog walking is! I do wonder how many people walk with the dog walker, prior to deciding to leave their dogs with her.
		
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I bet not many people really think of that. I was super lucky with mine, she’s all singing all dancing (dbs cleared, fully insured) Her Facebook page is very thorough! We see her out and about, she kept her distance the other day when the OH was working on recall, which I thought was sensible, although we quite like distractions, it’s all grist to the mill.


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## Shutterbug (8 April 2022)

Absolutely does my nut in. I have 2 dogs, a huge black lab and a Belgian malinois cross GSD who is a rescue and very reactive to off leash dogs who just barge up. She was attacked by a bully breed in our local park who wasn’t off leash, but had pulled the leash out of her hand and sprinted over with the pure intention of attacking her. And when she starts barking and lunging so does my other dog. I can handle them both but it’s frustrating as hell. And so annoying to get the “oh she just wants to play” from the owner. Im not above telling them to leash up either. But they get so defensive. One guy told me it’s not his dogs fault my dog is out of control…..on a leash. 🙄 My dogs get off leash every day in a secure field behind a forest we walk in. I never let them off leash in busy places. Although sometimes I feel like just letting her go and seeing how my dog feels about theirs wanting to play 🙄


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## SaddlePsych'D (8 April 2022)

YorksG said:



			Took our two and the pup we dog sit for down into the local wood late morning. The path down runs alongside fields, which people use as dog walking area, although they may get a bit of a shock in the coming weeks when the cattle are turned out! Saw one of the "professional dog walkers" with about half a dozen varied sized dogs running wild, in the field. We sat ours down to let her get out of the way, we had just set off to follow at a distance, when a greyhound came bombing out of the field, after the walker. She appeared to be oblivious of the fact that she was one down. Then there was the golden who also got very left behind at the gate into the wood.
Having made sure of which way she was going, we went in another direction. Five minutes later a spaniel came up the path towards us, absolutely screaming, either chasing wildlife, or being chased by another dog, we called ours back and got hold of them. She turned and went another way, but was no where near the did she was "walking".
We think she's the same person who lost the doodle that we ended up finding the owner of late last year.
I am sure that the owners believe that they are doing the responsible thing by employing this woman, but she's a disaster waiting to happen! She was also on the phone most of the time that we could see her.
		
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Noooo! I've been thinking I need to stop being too precious and sort a dog walker for Ivy but I've read so many things like this, plus seen a couple in action when hacking share horse. Even on some of the websites it's like 'eek!' The good ones I felt comfortable to approach are all booked up.

I'm the irresponsible owner this week. Ivy came to work again and struggled to settle like she had before. She's had a rubbish couple of days and it's my fault. I should have just brought us both home but pushed through and it wasn't fair on her.


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## CorvusCorax (8 April 2022)

I was in the park for work earlier. Doodlepocalypse. Every one offlead, miles away from owner and running up to dogs/people and there's a 1m leash rule.
(There is a designated dog park area for running them which I stay on the other side of a very tall fence from and use as a Massive Distraction 😂)


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## palo1 (11 April 2022)

I had a very poor experience yesterday!  I was in my garden with my dog who has really great recall and is polite with other dogs.  A neighbour of mine was walking 3 dogs so I stopped for a chat.  Red IT was hunting in the undergrowth so didn't pay any attention at that point.  Neighbour was literally just telling me how fed up she was with off lead dogs, dogs with bad manners, owners that couldn't hold their dog etc when Red trundled out the gate to say hello.  Off lead...He was very polite to the 3 dogs; 2 of which he knows well but not the third which was a strong collie/GSD type on a harness.  I called Red to me as he had started to 'drift' down the lane a bit away from the neigbour and dogs.  Neighbour's dog no 3 just went for him, pulling her almost over in the process.  Red scarpered very sensibly without any attempt to get into a scrap and I turned on my heel to retreat also.  Neighbour was apologising of course but clearly rather shame faced...I am glad however that dog was in a harness but he really hasn't got very nice manners!!


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## Moobli (11 April 2022)

palo1 said:



			I had a very poor experience yesterday!  I was in my garden with my dog who has really great recall and is polite with other dogs.  A neighbour of mine was walking 3 dogs so I stopped for a chat.  Red IT was hunting in the undergrowth so didn't pay any attention at that point.  Neighbour was literally just telling me how fed up she was with off lead dogs, dogs with bad manners, owners that couldn't hold their dog etc when Red trundled out the gate to say hello.  Off lead...He was very polite to the 3 dogs; 2 of which he knows well but not the third which was a strong collie/GSD type on a harness.  I called Red to me as he had started to 'drift' down the lane a bit away from the neigbour and dogs.  Neighbour's dog no 3 just went for him, pulling her almost over in the process.  Red scarpered very sensibly without any attempt to get into a scrap and I turned on my heel to retreat also.  Neighbour was apologising of course but clearly rather shame faced...I am glad however that dog was in a harness but he really hasn't got very nice manners!!
		
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Personally I’m not sure what she had to be shamefaced about when it was Red who approached her?  Unless I’m missing the point.


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## skinnydipper (11 April 2022)

Not an owner, a guide dog puppy walker.

My dog was playing with a group of dogs the other day, the guide dog youngster was part of the group.  It was jumping up at me unchecked which I didn't think was brilliant behaviour for a future guide dog but not my problem.

Today it left the walker and headed straight for my dog who was on her lead.  I can only describe the pup's behaviour as pushy and obsequious - submissive but not really submissive, I'm not describing it very well but you guys will know what I mean.  My dog could not move for it, it was all over her, and she was not happy and gave a quiet, low growl.  The walker made no attempt to call it so I told OH to grab its collar before things escalated, when he let go it went back to her.

So we get into the parkland proper with the woman on our heels with the dog now on its lead and she asked me if I was going to let my dog off to play and I said no.  I said your dog completely overwhelmed her and she doesn't want to play.

Silly woman told me to let her off and that my dog would put the pup in its place.  I told her that was really not a good idea.

We headed off in another direction.

On our way back here it is again, racing across the parkland to harass the dogs of a couple with children.  A small dog was rapidly picked up, it stole the ball off another and two of the couple's dogs were going nuts on their leads.  So that was their walk ruined.

It then ran at us again.  OH grabbed its collar and I kept walking with the big girl before she took matters into her own hands, so to speak.

The dog will be no good for anything by the time the silly woman has finished with it.


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## cauda equina (11 April 2022)

It's a shame there's no way to report guide dog walkers to Guide Dogs if they're doing a rubbish job


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## Amymay (11 April 2022)

cauda equina said:



			It's a shame there's no way to report guide dog walkers to Guide Dogs if they're doing a rubbish job
		
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Isn’t there?


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## cauda equina (11 April 2022)

Well perhaps there is
And if not there should be!


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## CorvusCorax (11 April 2022)

That will probably turn out to be one of the many which is washed from the programme.


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## Books'n'dogs (11 April 2022)

What a waste of a potentially good dog, not to mention the aggravation for all the people and dogs it harasses.


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## CorvusCorax (11 April 2022)

Honestly though, people wait a long time for a Guide Dog and can go through the pain of getting an unsuitable dog and having to let it go or worse, things go wrong - and there is a hell of a lot of money being spent on training, food and vet care, a lot of which comes from donations.

It's with the puppy walker to learn how to be a good dog and see the world, not run amok and do whatever it likes.


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## cauda equina (11 April 2022)

Presumably the walkers get vetted before puppies are placed with them?
As CC says, it's a long expensive process turning a dog into a Guide Dog. They'd want to give everyone the best chance of success


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## skinnydipper (11 April 2022)

Yes, you would think puppy walkers should have some idea of acceptable dog behaviour and undergo training to raise the dog to guide dog standards.

When she said let the big girl put the pup in its place I knew it was a lost cause.


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## Clodagh (11 April 2022)

I’m disgusted about the guide dog pup, a friend of mine walks them and they are basically treated the same as her Gundogs at all times, very polite and mannerly.


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## Cinnamontoast (11 April 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			Silly woman told me to let her off and that my dog would put the pup in its place.  I told her that was really not a good idea.
		
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I really hate that attitude. I don’t want my pups scared by another dog. It’s not the adult’s dog’s job to discipline a puppy, it’s for me to train them. I’ve heard it so much over the years. Drives me nuts.

There must be a way to report her total lack of control?


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## Pearlsasinger (11 April 2022)

We met 2 dogs today on our lunchtime walk, first one was a neighbour bringing his young collie home for lunch on his lead. Ours sat down while we all had a chat  -good manners all round.  

Then just coming out of the wood, as we were going in was a black Lab dog, about the same age as our adults.  Our 3 were all on leads, other owner carrying a lead, as he climbed over the stile but he never spoke a word to his dog who came up to ours who were sitting at the side of the path to allow them to pass.  Dog looked nervous, our pup growled at him, owner laughed and eventually moved his dog on.  I was still trying to get my head around what had just happened, so didn't say anything (at all) to him. Wait 'til next time!


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## SaddlePsych'D (11 April 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			When she said let the big girl put the pup in its place I knew it was a lost cause.
		
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Awful! Really unfair on both dogs.


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## Arzada (11 April 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			There must be a way to report her total lack of control?
		
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There will be a puppy walking supervisor for the area. I'd have a couple of photos just in case but I'd start with a phone call to the relevant supervisor.


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## blackcob (11 April 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			Silly woman told me to let her off and that my dog would put the pup in its place.
		
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My absolute pet hate, and got me intro trouble once when I responded to a repeat offender that it wasn't my dog's job to teach theirs - the woman was absolutely apoplectic - apparently my saying that was the rudest thing she'd ever heard. 🤔


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## SaddlePsych'D (11 April 2022)

blackcob said:



			My absolute pet hate, and got me intro trouble once when I responded to a repeat offender that it wasn't my dog's job to teach theirs - the woman was absolutely apoplectic - apparently my saying that was the rudest thing she'd ever heard. 🤔
		
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People are so weird. Why would someone be happy at having totally unknown dogs having a pop at their dog?!


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## skinnydipper (11 April 2022)

blackcob said:



			My absolute pet hate, and got me intro trouble once when I responded to a repeat offender that it wasn't my dog's job to teach theirs - the woman was absolutely apoplectic - apparently my saying that was the rudest thing she'd ever heard. 🤔
		
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"Let the dogs sort it out" is something else that anyone with a functioning brain cell would not say


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## Nasicus (11 April 2022)

Witnessed a bit of a weird one on saturday. Took smol dog to a local meadow, paths through it and very popular dog walking spot in that particular village. Shortly after we got there, a guy come in with a Pointer of some kind, and he proceeded to powerwalk around the meadow with his mobile phone glued to his ear, dog off lead and wandering all over the place.
In the far corner, on a path that splits off the main as a kind of lump and rejoins, there was a guy sat on the bench, throwing a ball for his dog, some sort of staffy terrier cross thingy.
I stuck to the main path, but as I went by, Phone guy powerwalked his way towards Bench Guy, followed by Pointer. Bench Guy calls Terrier to him and grabs his collar. Pointer starts to move over towards Terrier, Terrier loses his mind. Bench Guy is yelling Stay Back! Away! to Pointer whilst Terrier snarls and thrashes around. Phone Guy gives a short whistle (which doesn't do much) and continues striding post on the phone. Pointer get closer then loses interest and waders vaguely after his owner.

Found out from another walker that both are regulars, Bench Guy's dog is apparently a rescue and dog aggressive.

I've been mulling it over since then, as to who was 'in the wrong' so to speak. Having a dog aggressive dog off lead in a popular dog walking field does seem a bit silly, but then he did tuck himself away off the main path and the dog was fine until the Pointer started approaching them. Phone Guy was definitely a moron, he should have stopped, recalled his dog and gone around once it became obvious there was going to be an issue, not continue past almost oblivious.

I had enough braincells to understand that Bench Guy was off to the side for a reason and give him space, I wonder if Phone Guy would have done the same if he weren't on his phone and actually paying attention to his dog?


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## Cinnamontoast (11 April 2022)

Nasicus said:



			Witnessed a bit of a weird one on saturday. Took smol dog to a local meadow, paths through it and very popular dog walking spot in that particular village. Shortly after we got there, a guy come in with a Pointer of some kind, and he proceeded to powerwalk around the meadow with his mobile phone glued to his ear, dog off lead and wandering all over the place.
In the far corner, on a path that splits off the main as a kind of lump and rejoins, there was a guy sat on the bench, throwing a ball for his dog, some sort of staffy terrier cross thingy.
I stuck to the main path, but as I went by, Phone guy powerwalked his way towards Bench Guy, followed by Pointer. Bench Guy calls Terrier to him and grabs his collar. Pointer starts to move over towards Terrier, Terrier loses his mind. Bench Guy is yelling Stay Back! Away! to Pointer whilst Terrier snarls and thrashes around. Phone Guy gives a short whistle (which doesn't do much) and continues striding post on the phone. Pointer get closer then loses interest and waders vaguely after his owner.

Found out from another walker that both are regulars, Bench Guy's dog is apparently a rescue and dog aggressive.

I've been mulling it over since then, as to who was 'in the wrong' so to speak. Having a dog aggressive dog off lead in a popular dog walking field does seem a bit silly, but then he did tuck himself away off the main path and the dog was fine until the Pointer started approaching them. Phone Guy was definitely a moron, he should have stopped, recalled his dog and gone around once it became obvious there was going to be an issue, not continue past almost oblivious.

I had enough braincells to understand that Bench Guy was off to the side for a reason and give him space, I wonder if Phone Guy would have done the same if he weren't on his phone and actually paying attention to his dog?
		
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Having had a very fear/dog aggressive dog, I’d say both owners were at fault.  Pointer should have better recall, rescue owner could maybe be in a less populated area.

Zak would never go up to other dogs, but if one got in his face, there’d be bother, so I avoided peak times/areas. A bulldog came over one day, both mine were by then on leads, owner didn’t even try to recall. It went _under_ Zak and of course Bear defended him. The owner said I shouldn’t have Zak off lead (training, doing retrieves, needed a job) and thought he was ok to unleash his dog as mine were free. He had the dog on a lead originally so I thought we were safe.


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## Pearlsasinger (11 April 2022)

IMO, it is *never* ok to allow your dog to approach another without asking the owner first. Accidents do happen, obviously, but the owner of the dog which makes an unwanted approach should, at the very least, apologise and remove their dog asap.


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## CorvusCorax (11 April 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			"Let the dogs sort it out" is something else that anyone with a functioning brain cell would not say
		
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Or someone who loves paying vets' bills


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## AFishOutOfWater (11 April 2022)

Karran said:



			I do always feel very responsible though, having a neurotic toad in Mrs Spaniel, who acts as if the world is ending at the slightest confrontation, human or canine.
I realise how it can affect other dogs and they might not know that GSD's are big triggers for Mrs Collie, but I do, so I end up consumed with guilt that I should have been more aware of my surroundings before letting her off lead and that its my fault for letting the situation happen!
She does look very scary with teeth and hackles raised when she goes into full on gobsh1te! mode. I still recall days where I've sat on her to stop her hurting people, so when she does go into idiot mode I tend to fear the worst!
		
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Edited - just seen your response to ASBMO


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## Cinnamontoast (11 April 2022)

Pearlsasinger said:



			IMO, it is *never* ok to allow your dog to approach another without asking the owner first. Accidents do happen, obviously, but the owner of the dog which makes an unwanted approach should, at the very least, apologise and remove their dog asap.
		
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Absolutely. I’ve asked every single person before allowing the youngsters to say hello. There’s a lady who has 2 terriers, one on, one off lead. The off lead approaches us and she gets all angsty about it. Why not put it on lead, then? It’s friendly but if you don’t want your dog approaching others, the solution is pretty easy!


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## palo1 (12 April 2022)

Moobli said:



			Personally I’m not sure what she had to be shamefaced about when it was Red who approached her?  Unless I’m missing the point.
		
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Red was nowhere near her dogs at the point the one nearly pulled her over to try to get to him.  I think she was shame-faced because she had just been telling me how awful it was that people couldn't hold their dogs or control their behaviour.   She wasn't making a veiled comment about Red as she knows him well and has said a number of times to me that he is a good lad.  When Red had initially walked out of the gate he was very polite to all 3 dogs but then wandered off slightly to investigate something else.  It wasn't  a dreadful incident by any means though I am still not sure why her dog no 3 decided to have a go.  Red was off his lead which I guess could have made her dog (on a lead) uncomfortable.  I very rarely have Red on a lead in fact but he is very dog neutral and will recall very easily if I do see other dogs and I will put him on a lead then.  It is virtually a non-occurence though as I hardly ever walk Red where we meet other people or dogs.    Her dog trying to pull her over whilst snarling at mine (who had his nose down in a clump of grass) was the thing I think she was embarrassed about and tbh I was a bit ???? as to my view my dog was not causing an issue.  Perhaps I was in the wrong though? 

I think I get that as Red was essentially wandering about and walked up to the 3 dogs being walked initially (though that was without any tension at all)  I should have removed him immediately?  I guess I thought that as he knows 2 of the dogs well and I was at my garden gate it wasn't an issue.  It is interesting to hear that people think this is an issue actually though the chances of that very scenario happening again are incredibly rare.  I often meet dogs walking loose or with horses or sheepdogs with their vehicles so it doesn't feel 'odd' to me to have a dog off lead.


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## ycbm (12 April 2022)

Yesterday's path was 15 feet wide. Three walkers coming towards us,  two dogs on extendable leads. One person in the middle of the path, the other two with dogs at the outer edges of the path. Dog on the lead of the person on the left was at the far right edge of the path. Dog on the lead of the person on the right was at the far left edge of the path. And they did nothing about that until we were forced to stop and stand still to avoid being tangled up in their mess.

Bad use of extendable leads is too common for comment, but that one took the biscuit.  I can't quite decide what punishment is good enough for owners that stupid and antisocial.  Offers? 
.


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## fiwen30 (12 April 2022)

ycbm said:



			Yesterday's path was 15 feet wide. Three walkers coming towards us,  two dogs on extendable leads. One person in the middle of the path, the other two with dogs at the outer edges of the path. Dog on the lead of the person on the left was at the far right edge of the path. Dog on the lead of the person on the right was at the far left edge of the path. And they did nothing about that until we were forced to stop and stand still to avoid being tangled up in their mess.

Bad use of extendable leads is too common for comment, but that one took the biscuit.  I can't quite decide what punishment is good enough for owners that stupid and antisocial.  Offers? 
.
		
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Controversial(?) opinion, but I think extendable leads should be banned. I’ve never seen or heard of a reasonable argument for their use, which wouldn’t be solved by the use of a long line instead.

Far too often they’re used dangerously, incorrectly, and at a risk to others. Attached to collars instead of harnesses, head collars or chain collars instead of harnesses, used loose on dogs with no recall and so no way to reel the dog back in, used loose and so no way to control a lunging dog, they’re a trip and tangle hazard for people and dogs alike, not to mention the awful stories of dogs stepping off pavements and being hit by cars. There’s absolutely no difference between a dog being on an extendable lead, and being off-lead. So if they need/are being put in an extendable, then it should be a long line instead, to maintain some modicum of control.


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## BBP (12 April 2022)

I was driving down a road with a national limit the other day and came over the brow of a slight hill to find person walking in the direction of traffic movement (so with her back to me not able to see me coming) with a retriever. Fine, she was off on the verge and I had seen them both so no problem. Until my eye was drawn to something else, which turned out to be a small brown terrier merrily trotting down the other side of the road, with its extendable lead at full stretch.🙄 so lucky it didn’t get squished.


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## Clodagh (12 April 2022)

I can’t see how you can teach a dog to heel and also use a long line. Surely it learns to pull to get to smells and items of interest?


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## Tiddlypom (12 April 2022)

fiwen30 said:



			There’s absolutely no difference between a dog being on an extendable lead, and being off-lead.
		
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Responsible extendable lead user here . They are very useful things *if* used correctly, and are very different to being off lead, and much handier than a long line.

The JRT has suspect recall, and would leg it after any small furry, so she is always walked on lead. The extendable lead is locked to normal short lead length in any situation which demands it, such as walking on the road, or walking by other dogs or walkers. They do have a lock button, but unfortunately many extendable lead owners either are unaware that it exists or never use it.

She's allowed full extension in areas where it is safe, such as open woodland or moorland or crossing a field with no stock or crops. She can stop and sniff to her heart's content, but gets reeled in immediately if necessary. We never let her barrel up to anyone/anything.

She enjoys her walks and sniffs much more than if she was on a short lead or a long line dragging along the ground, and we have control of her.

The purists can raise their hands in shock and horror, but it can be done well.


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## Pearlsasinger (12 April 2022)

Clodagh said:



			I can’t see how you can teach a dog to heel and also use a long line. Surely it learns to pull to get to smells and items of interest?
		
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You don't have to have the dog on the longline all the time!


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## fiwen30 (12 April 2022)

Clodagh said:



			I can’t see how you can teach a dog to heel and also use a long line. Surely it learns to pull to get to smells and items of interest?
		
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I’ve never had a problem, personally. These days we mostly do pavement walking, with grass time in the middle, and he can stop and sniff whenever he wants. But when he was younger, and on the same long line, he could be asked to heel for whatever period was necessary, and then released forwards again on the line, just like being off-lead, but with more control on a fixed line vs an extendable lead. When asked to heel, there was no tugging just because he was on lead. But then again, I’ve never required him to constantly walk at heel, so your mileage may vary.


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## Pearlsasinger (12 April 2022)

Clodagh said:



			I can’t see how you can teach a dog to heel and also use a long line. Surely it learns to pull to get to smells and items of interest?
		
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Do you not teach your dogs to walk to heel off-lead?  It's very similar.


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## Clodagh (12 April 2022)

Pearlsasinger said:



			Do you not teach your dogs to walk to heel off-lead?  It's very similar.
		
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They heel on or off lead, but I wouldn’t want them to think that pulling got them to where they wanted to go.


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## Clodagh (12 April 2022)

fiwen30 said:



			I’ve never had a problem, personally. These days we mostly do pavement walking, with grass time in the middle, and he can stop and sniff whenever he wants. But when he was younger, and on the same long line, he could be asked to heel for whatever period was necessary, and then released forwards again on the line, just like being off-lead, but with more control on a fixed line vs an extendable lead. When asked to heel, there was no tugging just because he was on lead. But then again, I’ve never required him to constantly walk at heel, so your mileage may vary.
		
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Sorry by long line I mean extendable, just realised why so much confusion! 😃


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## fiwen30 (12 April 2022)

Clodagh said:



			Sorry by long line I mean extendable, just realised why so much confusion! 😃
		
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Doh! Yes, I thought you meant a long line, as in similar to a lightweight lunge line.


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## CorvusCorax (12 April 2022)

I love my 10m flexi on a flat collar 😂 my dogs do come back when I call them and have distance control (can go into a position away from me) and walk beside me on a loose line.
I used to hate them until I learned how to use them properly and the tape ones are best.
They are invaluable for travel IMO.
I saw a dog pop off the pavement onto the road yesterday on a normal lead. I think idiots are the problem rather than the equipment.

I am teaching my young dog competition heeling and formal recall, she has a very thin biothane long line on/dragging on the ground, it's just there in case I need to stand on it but she hasn't fecked off in weeks. I do this in a fenced training ground.


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## Nasicus (12 April 2022)

Tiddlypom said:



			Responsible extendable lead user here . They are very useful things *if* used correctly, and are very different to being off lead, and much handier than a long line.
The JRT has suspect recall, and would leg it after any small furry, so she is always walked on lead. The extendable lead is locked to normal short lead length in any situation which demands it, such as walking on the road, or walking by other dogs or walkers. They do have a lock button, but unfortunately many extendable lead owners either are unaware that it exists or never use it.
She's allowed full extension in areas where it is safe, such as open woodland or moorland or crossing a field with no stock or crops. She can stop and sniff to her heart's content, but gets reeled in immediately if necessary. We never let her barrel up to anyone/anything.
She enjoys her walks and sniffs much more than if she was on a short lead or a long line dragging along the ground, and we have control of her.
The purists can raise their hands in shock and horror, but it can be done well.
		
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Same here! There's nothing wrong with a flexi-lead when used correctly and responsibly! Unfortunately most people seem to think that as long as the dog is technically connected to them by the lead, then what does it matter if that's 1 meter or 10 meters?
It's the perfect solution for the wee terror that likes to zoom off into the sunset. Longlines are great, but she's so small that the line hitches on things like stalky plants, roots etc and she's not strong enough to unhitch them herself like a bigger dog would.
With the flexi, she gets to have a 20m circle of freedom when appropriate, but is quickly and easily reeled in and locked when needed.


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## Clodagh (12 April 2022)

I have no issue with long lines or extendable leads. Btw. I just wouldn’t use them for the dogs I have now, in the situation I’m in here.


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## Tiddlypom (12 April 2022)

If you've got solid recall installed then you wouldn't need a flexi lead. We have selective recall which goes out of the window if there's a better offer, such a bunny, a cat or a squirrel .


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## Pearlsasinger (12 April 2022)

Clodagh said:



			Sorry by long line I mean extendable, just realised why so much confusion! 😃
		
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Oh, I wondered what you were on about!


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## Nasicus (12 April 2022)

Tiddlypom said:



			If you've got solid recall installed then you wouldn't need a flexi lead. We have selective recall which goes out of the window if there's a better offer, such a bunny, a cat or a squirrel .
		
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Exactly that. It's not through lack of trying, I've spent hours working on recall since she was tiny, but she's just not reliable and extremely independent. She'll stop, look back at you, and weigh it up. Even the tastiest of treats, the maddest of dancing and the most excited of calling means zilch to her if she decides she's doing her own thing thankyouverymuch. She can be excitedly recalling back to you for a little party, delicious meats lovingly cooked and chopped alongside heaps of praise, and then the next recall she sticks two fingers up and buggers off.
To be honest, it's not a surprise to me, the breed is notorious for being unable to be trusted off lead. You look up breed descriptions from breed societies and almost all of them warn readers as such! I knew what I was getting into after my last one 🤣
But the flexi lead is godsend, allows her the freedom she craves, whilst keeping her safe and under control. Plus there's no chance of it getting dragged through something unsavoury like a longline 🤢


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## TheresaW (12 April 2022)

I use a flexi with Luna. I would say 90% of the time she has good recall, but it only takes a squirrel/rabbit, anything that runs, and the prey drive kicks in. Just not worth the risk. I used to use a long line, but in busier areas, the flexi is easier to pull her in whilst putting the two collies on their leads as needed.

We still use the long lead (longer than the flexi) when in open fields, at the beach etc.


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## Cinnamontoast (12 April 2022)

Clodagh said:



			I can’t see how you can teach a dog to heel and also use a long line. Surely it learns to pull to get to smells and items of interest?
		
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Depends, I think. Mitch tends not to get to the point of being at full stretch, but I’m deffing the longlines, it’s really difficult with 2! They were good recalling today but there were far more people than usual which was distracting and they were very keen to say hello, of course encouraged by the people seeing a cute pair of puppies. One bloke lay down to play! More work needed. I want 100%, not 80%.


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## Odyssey (12 April 2022)

Nasicus said:



			Witnessed a bit of a weird one on saturday. Took smol dog to a local meadow, paths through it and very popular dog walking spot in that particular village. Shortly after we got there, a guy come in with a Pointer of some kind, and he proceeded to powerwalk around the meadow with his mobile phone glued to his ear, dog off lead and wandering all over the place.
In the far corner, on a path that splits off the main as a kind of lump and rejoins, there was a guy sat on the bench, throwing a ball for his dog, some sort of staffy terrier cross thingy.
I stuck to the main path, but as I went by, Phone guy powerwalked his way towards Bench Guy, followed by Pointer. Bench Guy calls Terrier to him and grabs his collar. Pointer starts to move over towards Terrier, Terrier loses his mind. Bench Guy is yelling Stay Back! Away! to Pointer whilst Terrier snarls and thrashes around. Phone Guy gives a short whistle (which doesn't do much) and continues striding post on the phone. Pointer get closer then loses interest and waders vaguely after his owner.

Found out from another walker that both are regulars, Bench Guy's dog is apparently a rescue and dog aggressive.

I've been mulling it over since then, as to who was 'in the wrong' so to speak. Having a dog aggressive dog off lead in a popular dog walking field does seem a bit silly, but then he did tuck himself away off the main path and the dog was fine until the Pointer started approaching them. Phone Guy was definitely a moron, he should have stopped, recalled his dog and gone around once it became obvious there was going to be an issue, not continue past almost oblivious.

I had enough braincells to understand that Bench Guy was off to the side for a reason and give him space, I wonder if Phone Guy would have done the same if he weren't on his phone and actually paying attention to his dog?
		
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Both were at fault. Phone Guy should be on the ball and have his dog under control, not approaching other dogs. Regarding the Staffie cross, a dog that's aggressive should be kept on lead and muzzled at all times, no ifs or buts. It's irrelevant that he was out of the way, he was in a public area. Dogs run up to dogs that are on lead all the time, sometimes you have to pass in close proximity, and leads can be dropped etc so a muzzle is necessary too.  He was very irresponsible to have a dog like that in a position to attack and injure or even kill other dogs. People like him make me really angry. I've had one of my dogs and my mum's dog attacked by Staffies, mine needed stitches. My mum's would have been injured had he not been small enough to pick up. The dog was still jumping up trying to bite him, till its owner sauntered over after I yelled at him to get it. Both incidents were terrifying, and have ruined dog walking for me. I only do road walks now, I'm too scared to walk where there are loose dogs, and my onlead dog can now be reactive when dogs run up. That's the effect people like him have on other people and dogs, it's not just the injury and trauma at the time, though that's awful enough.

I had one that was unpredictable with other dogs, and he was always on lead and muzzled, I'd never take any chances. Even though I always kept well away from other dogs when walking him, as we know most people have little control of their dogs, and think it's fine for them to run up to others. It used to drive me mad when I was obviously having a problem with my (large) dog, and owners of said dogs did nothing to remove them, grrr!


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## Moobli (12 April 2022)

I fairly recently bought a flexi lead (tape one) to use when I’m away from home and there are likely to be deer/hares etc.  My young bitch has good recall in most instances but will still occasionally take off if said wildlife jumps up in front of her nose.  I also have a long line for the same purpose but I’ve found the flexi lead really handy instead of reeling a long line in and out.
It’s definitely the people that use them and not the leads themselves that can cause an issue.


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## SaddlePsych'D (12 April 2022)

Completely Utterly Blooming Oblivious Phone Guy today. Pointer all over the field that's supposed to be leads on for birds this time of year. We stopped well away to give time for owner to even be aware we were there and try to plan our route round them. Absolutely nothing from owner so opted to go as wide as physically possible from the dog. Obviously pointer came straight over and either 'smiled' or curled it's lips or silently growled on nearing, I'm not sure which and I was so glad OH was there to give space for me to move Ivy on. Owner still oblivious. I should have shouted to call his dog but we were too busy keeping it away. I hate when they circle around and won't quit. Most dogs seem to stop in their tracks, think about it then bog of back to their owner but we've had a few really persistent ones recently.


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## fiwen30 (12 April 2022)

Ad on gumtree for a 10(!!!) year old golden lab, being gotten rid of as they don’t have time to walk him with the new baby(!), so he’s being sold on for £50. Was tempted to message asking if they’d get rid of the child as easily, if it turned 10 and another baby came along. Absolutely ghastly. If it hadn’t stated he was bad with cats, he’d already be here on our sofa.


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## maisie06 (13 April 2022)

fiwen30 said:



			Controversial(?) opinion, but I think extendable leads should be banned. I’ve never seen or heard of a reasonable argument for their use, which wouldn’t be solved by the use of a long line instead.

Far too often they’re used dangerously, incorrectly, and at a risk to others. Attached to collars instead of harnesses, head collars or chain collars instead of harnesses, used loose on dogs with no recall and so no way to reel the dog back in, used loose and so no way to control a lunging dog, they’re a trip and tangle hazard for people and dogs alike, not to mention the awful stories of dogs stepping off pavements and being hit by cars. There’s absolutely no difference between a dog being on an extendable lead, and being off-lead. So if they need/are being put in an extendable, then it should be a long line instead, to maintain some modicum of control.
		
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I would love to see these vile things banned too. Thye cause serious injuries when they tangle around the les of dogs and humans - and during 1 horrible incident a horse...Dogs getting hit by cars because of thick stupid people using them next to a road...


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## maisie06 (13 April 2022)

Stupid person this morning - walking in a park (not my usual haunt but need to get springer working around distractions and strange dogs) 2 fat little pugs come rushing over, I sit up the springer, he's not at all nasty but gets very very excited by strange dogs, I call over please call your dogs back - idiots reply why?? I say because my dog is in training and I don't want him leapt all over - they reply he should be muzzled then WTF????? So I said get your dog on a lead, why says the gobby husband, beause you have just demonstrated beautifully that you have ZERO recall, then I turned and walked off springer being very good and ignoring irritating mutts, bloke had to come running up and grab them he was yelling at me to stop and wait, I was fed up by that point so just kept walking!!!!


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## maisie06 (13 April 2022)

SaddlePsych'D said:



			Completely Utterly Blooming Oblivious Phone Guy today. Pointer all over the field that's supposed to be leads on for birds this time of year. We stopped well away to give time for owner to even be aware we were there and try to plan our route round them. Absolutely nothing from owner so opted to go as wide as physically possible from the dog. Obviously pointer came straight over and either 'smiled' or curled it's lips or silently growled on nearing, I'm not sure which and I was so glad OH was there to give space for me to move Ivy on. Owner still oblivious. I should have shouted to call his dog but we were too busy keeping it away. I hate when they circle around and won't quit. Most dogs seem to stop in their tracks, think about it then bog of back to their owner but we've had a few really persistent ones recently.
		
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I carry a pop bottle filled half full with gravel - shake it or chuck it at annoying dogs - works a treat for me!


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## Cinnamontoast (13 April 2022)

So back to longlines after totally ignoring a recall this morning. Luckily, it was a nice dog they ran to see, had it been one like Zak, they’d be screwed. The nice dog was then approached by bouncy lurcher from yesterday who bowled it over, making the nice dog cry. Zero attempt at recall from the lurcher owner. Wtf?! We put a good distance between it and us.


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## fiwen30 (13 April 2022)

maisie06 said:



			Stupid person this morning - walking in a park (not my usual haunt but need to get springer working around distractions and strange dogs) 2 fat little pugs come rushing over, I sit up the springer, he's not at all nasty but gets very very excited by strange dogs, I call over please call your dogs back - idiots reply why?? I say because my dog is in training and I don't want him leapt all over - they reply he should be muzzled then WTF????? So I said get your dog on a lead, why says the gobby husband, beause you have just demonstrated beautifully that you have ZERO recall, then I turned and walked off springer being very good and ignoring irritating mutts, bloke had to come running up and grab them he was yelling at me to stop and wait, I was fed up by that point so just kept walking!!!!
		
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My favourite is when off-lead dogs want to come and pester, I march off with my dog focused on a treat or ball rather than the pesterer, and the owner kicks up a stink at having to come and physically retrieve their dog which is following us down the street instead of recalling back to them. And it’s always our fault, of course!


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## BallyJ (13 April 2022)

fiwen30 said:



			My favourite is when off-lead dogs want to come and pester, I march off with my dog focused on a treat or ball rather than the pesterer, and the owner kicks up a stink at having to come and physically retrieve their dog which is following us down the street instead of recalling back to them. And it’s always our fault, of course!
		
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This is my favourite thing to do


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## Tiddlypom (13 April 2022)

So now the local village Whatsapp group is in a flurry of disapproval after a man in a hi viz jacket walking a dog apparently kicked out unprovoked at two other dogs on a canal tow path . There is a photo of this horrid man, taken from the rear.

That man is my OH, who this morning was walking our always-on-lead JRT . Another walker with two medium sized off lead dogs was about 100 yards ahead, going the same way. One dog ran back to ours, who had been put on short lead, and initially the encounter was friendly. Then the other dog ran back, and the other two started barking aggressively at ours, one on each side. OH moved one away with his foot (not a kick) to get in between them and the JRT. He called to the other owner to fetch her dogs, but they ignored her calls.

Eventually she got them on a lead, and OH politely apologised for having to shout at her dogs. She's now playing the victim card.

OH is just posting up his version of what happened. What a palaver.

If you havent got solid recall, then keep the feckers on a lead, especially if they will have a go at other dogs.


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## Cinnamontoast (13 April 2022)

Excellent that he’s posting his own version. Is she doing this because she’s a poor little female and he’s a big scary bloke? Reverse sexism! I would not allow her to get away with lying.


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## Cinnamontoast (13 April 2022)

BallyJ said:



			This is my favourite thing to do 

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The amount of times I had to recall Jake and Brig in the woods back in the day was insane! Their recall was rock solid, zero incidents ever, must think about what we did with them! They’d be out of sight, I’d call, they’d come along with whoever’s dog had followed them.


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## SaddlePsych'D (13 April 2022)

Tiddlypom said:



			So now the local village Whatsapp group is in a flurry of disapproval after a man in a hi viz jacket walking a dog apparently kicked out unprovoked at two other dogs on a canal tow path . There is a photo of this horrid man, taken from the rear.

That man is my OH, who this morning was walking our always-on-lead JRT . Another walker with two medium sized off lead dogs was about 100 yards ahead, going the same way. One dog ran back to ours, who had been put on short lead, and initially the encounter was friendly. Then the other dog ran back, and the other two started barking aggressively at ours, one on each side. OH moved one away with his foot (not a kick) to get in between them and the JRT. He called to the other owner to fetch her dogs, but they ignored her calls.

Eventually she got them on a lead, and OH politely apologised for having to shout at her dogs. She's now playing the victim card.

OH is just posting up his version of what happened. What a palaver.

If you havent got solid recall, then keep the feckers on a lead, especially if they will have a go at other dogs.
		
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I remember seeing almost the exact same post on a Facebook group once. Woman taken a picture of a man who kicked (or 'kicked', who knows) her dog. This was well before we'd ever even considered getting a dog of our own and remember thinking I wonder what the other side of that story is.

Fair play to your OH putting his side across. I would think/hope people will understand. 

Yesterday local FB page someone posted about a dog repeatedly jumping up and knocking down her toddler in a play park. Lots of people on at her because she had her own dogs in there too. Fair enough probably shouldn't have been but assuming they were under control as she described I dont see how that's remotely in the same league as letting your dog go run up to someone else's child and knock them over. More than once!


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## Tiddlypom (13 April 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			Excellent that he’s posting his own version. Is she doing this because she’s a poor little female and he’s a big scary bloke? Reverse sexism! I would not allow her to get away with lying.
		
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I'm glad to say that, once posted up, OH's version of events has stopped the baying mob in its tracks 👍.

I fact checked and proof read it before he put it up. It debunks her claims and clearly explained exactly what happened, and went on to say that he now regards the incident as closed. The dogs' owner did come back with a few more lame mutterings, but no one backed her up.

Horrible thing to happen, though.


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## Cinnamontoast (13 April 2022)

Tiddlypom said:



			I'm glad to say that, once posted up, OH's version of events has stopped the baying mob in its tracks 👍.

I fact checked and proof read it before he put it up. It debunks her claims and clearly explained exactly what happened, and went on to say that he now regards the incident as closed. The dogs' owner did come back with a few more lame mutterings, but no one backed her up.

Horrible thing to happen, though.
		
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Really worrying and very unfair. Hopefully his sensible version will lay it all to rest.


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## Tiddlypom (14 April 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			Really worrying and very unfair. Hopefully his sensible version will lay it all to rest.
		
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It seems to have done. It does make you think that a go pro might be a good idea to wear when out walking the dog. The other dogs' owner was also playing the hidden disability card - she apparently has a medical condition that restricts mobility. So she was whipping up outrage against some nasty bloke who kicks and shouts at dogs who have a disabled female owner.

I inserted a sentence acknowledging her mobility issues with suitable noises of regret, but they do not absolve you from walking dog aggressive dogs off lead in public who do not come to call. Her dogs ran 100 yards back down the path to ours.

Poor OH. While he certainly shouted at her dogs when they were both close by barking aggressively at ours, he apologised immediately to the owner for the shouting once she'd eventually got them on leads. The JRT didn't bark back, she was worried and bemused, she did nothing to provoke the other dogs.

Blimmin' people.


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## Smitty (14 April 2022)

The problem is nowadays the owners can be as aggressive, or more so, than the dogs if you take issue with their dog attacking yours.

On the Facebook page Protect Our Pets, there are instances of people being punched, in one instance by a couple of men, for daring to try and rescue their dog from being mauled.   There has also been an assault when someone used the K9 spray to defend themselves and their dog.

I try and stay off the beaten track with my trusty walking stick and generally see no one and only venture to more popular places when in company.


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## fiwen30 (17 April 2022)

Can anyone tell me what a ‘show type cockapoo puppy’ is? Especially when it’s only 1st generation cocker/poodle?


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## CorvusCorax (17 April 2022)

Maybe a show cocker cross rather than a working cocker cross.


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## CorvusCorax (17 April 2022)

Yesterday I could see a very wiggly young lab come barrelling up to my oldest boy and I shook my head/waved my hand, as in 'don't let that dog come over here'.
Owner shouts name (WHY DO PEOPLE DO THAT, REPEATING A NAME ISN'T A RECALL COMMAND) uselessly and my old dog ends up with a young lab up his arse.
So as they pass I smile and say 'Lucky he's mellowed in his old age' and I just got a dirty look, not an apology or anything....


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## cauda equina (17 April 2022)

Why is calling the dog's name not a recall command?
If the dog's name is what you have taught as a recall command, then it's a recall command
It's obviously not what you teach CC but I don't understand why you say it can't work for anyone else either

Of course it's neither here nor there if recall has not been taught at all


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## CorvusCorax (17 April 2022)

Cause it's their name/an intial attractor and if you use it all the time with no consequence, good or bad, then it's meaningless and most people don't make the correct link.
The vast majority of people I meet with no recall are the ones who are just shouting a name over and over and over again.

And if I shouted CAUDA EQUINA CAUDA EQUINA CAUDA EQUINA at you repeatedly, would you immediately come over to me, or wonder what all the annoying shouting is about? 

If I want the dog's **attention** I'll use the name, if I want it to come to me, it's quickly followed by a recall command.


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## Sandstone1 (17 April 2022)

A whistle is best for recall,  you can use the name then the command come.  It doesnt really matter what word you use really but it should be one you do not use for anything else.   A lot of dogs get de sensitised to their name.  What ever word you use they should come to you straight away.


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## cauda equina (17 April 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			Cause it's their name/an intial attractor and if you use it all the time with no consequence, good or bad, then it's meaningless and most people don't make the correct link.
The vast majority of people I meet with no recall are the ones who are just shouting a name over and over and over again.

And if I shouted CAUDA EQUINA CAUDA EQUINA CAUDA EQUINA at you repeatedly, would you immediately come over to me, or wonder what all the annoying shouting is about?

If I want the dog's **attention** I'll use the name, if I want it to come to me, it's quickly followed by a recall command.
		
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If I were your dog and you had trained me to come to my name then I expect I would, yes


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## Arzada (17 April 2022)

Have I ever mentioned  (amongst my occasional posts of dog attacks on me, swan murders etc) the evening pub meal when the 2 adults at the adjoining table let their 2 adult JRTs *onto *the table to finish their meals and lick the plates? Preceded earlier by one of the JRTs launching off the seat to attack the dead fox head gracing the wall just above my friend's head? (bench seating against the wall) Luckily it aimed well and missed friend's head. Never ever sit near a dead fox when there's a JRT sitting on a seat nearby.


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## Cinnamontoast (17 April 2022)

I call name then come. I want to train to come on the whistle too but my OH isn’t bothered and he does most walks due to his shifts.


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## Clodagh (17 April 2022)

Arzada said:



			Have I ever mentioned  (amongst my occasional posts of dog attacks on me, swan murders etc) the evening pub meal when the 2 adults at the adjoining table let their 2 adult JRTs *onto *the table to finish their meals and lick the plates? Preceded earlier by one of the JRTs launching off the seat to attack the dead fox head gracing the wall just above my friend's head? (bench seating against the wall) Luckily it aimed well and missed friend's head. Never ever sit near a dead fox when there's a JRT sitting on a seat nearby.
		
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I work at a pub which is often full of dogs. I thought I had seen it all, but obviously not.
I hate dogs in pubs as much as small children, unless they know sit down ( out if the way) and shut up.


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## YorksG (17 April 2022)

Yesterday saw us back at the country park, three women and three labs. Most people were sensible and we kept out of the way.  Then some idiot of a man *ran*towards our sitting down dogs, with his Bassett hound! He then told his dog that she didn't have the manners that ours did, poor creature was then dragged away. 
Then sitting waiting for our bacon and egg sandwiches, tucked well out of the way, another idiot man brought his snappy terrier, on its flexi lead, towards ours. Sister said "don't bring it to them" he ignored her and let it get nearer, till sister banged her stick infront of his dog! He then took it back to where it started from, where it then snarled and snapped at a passing French bulldog!!
We don't think we look very approachable, but our dogs must do!


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## Clodagh (17 April 2022)

I’m rarely at locations with other dogs but was working at a rugby festival today and they were all there, mainly spaniels on every form of harness/halti/ multi lead combos.


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## Pearlsasinger (17 April 2022)

YorksG said:



			Yesterday saw us back at the country park, three women and three labs. Most people were sensible and we kept out of the way.  Then some idiot of a man *ran*towards our sitting down dogs, with his Bassett hound! He then told his dog that she didn't have the manners that ours did, poor creature was then dragged away.
Then sitting waiting for our bacon and egg sandwiches, tucked well out of the way, another idiot man brought his snappy terrier, on its flexi lead, towards ours. Sister said "don't bring it to them" he ignored her and let it get nearer, till sister banged her stick infront of his dog! He then took it back to where it started from, where it then snarled and snapped at a passing French bulldog!!
We don't think we look very approachable, but our dogs must do!
		
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It was very noticeable that he didn't approach the mastiff with its owner, who was a big bloke, waiting for his wife to come out of the loo.  He (idiot) did seem to be on his own, perhaps he thought it was 'singles hour'. Not that he would have much chance, friend is gay and sis and i are choosy!


ETA, just to be clear, gay friend is also choosy!


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## View (17 April 2022)

Earlier we were treated to an hour of next door neighbours trying to catch their dog in in the shared driveway, complete with increasingly despairing calls of Fido No, and Fido Come. I eventually got fed up with this as I needed to go out but had wanted to give them a chance to catch dog without interference.

This dog has not had any effective or consistent training, as you might have worked out.

I walked out of the door, said firmly and quietly “Fido sit”, Fido sa, I walked up to him and held his collar..  No fuss, no drama.  Praised him for doing what I told him.  Which is what I do every time I retrieve him from the road, forest etc.

And then they asked why he does what I tell him.  More than once I have suggested that they get a trainer to work with them.


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## Tiddlypom (17 April 2022)

The one benefit to come out of the canal tow path incident is that OH has stopped moaning about the dual annual membership (£90) that I had just bought for the gardens and grounds of our local country estate .

There is a strict 'dogs on leads' policy. The grounds and open parkland are truly beautiful, and a nice meander round takes a couple of hours. It's only open Weds/Thurs/Sun/Bank Holidays March - Oct, but that's the Weds and Thurs walks sorted from now to end Oct. Sundays are too busy.

Good shady parking too - that's OH walking towards us from our white car.







OH was on the point of being reported to the police for his utterly falsely described actions towards the two other dogs on the tow path. Fortunately, to help back up his much more accurate account of what really happened, he is very well regarded locally so that when the others realised just who the 'bogey man' was, they will have been much more inclined to believe his version. 

Some equally innocent but unknown poor beggar from outside of the area would not have been so lucky, though.


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## CorvusCorax (17 April 2022)

cauda equina said:



			If I were your dog and you had trained me to come to my name then I expect I would, yes
		
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I had a boss that just used to shout people's names across the office. We all ignored him until he added 'can you come over here, please?' 😉
It was a much better incentive.


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## cauda equina (17 April 2022)

Yes but that's people, not dogs!


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## CorvusCorax (17 April 2022)

cauda equina said:



			Yes but that's people, not dogs!
		
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Yep, and we can understand there is a clear difference between:

CorvusCorax
Can you come over here please?
Can you go and put the kettle on?

Equally, IME it is much clearer for the dog, to teach:

Fido
Sit
Come

Etc etc.

Great if you get recall on a sixpence for a name alone, but so many people use the name on a daily basis for so many reasons with no reinforcement, Hi Fido, I'm home Fido, has anyone fed Fido? then it loses meaning/importance/becomes white noise.
There's no other command (sit/down/heel) etc where you would reasonably expect the dog to interchange that with their name.

ETA I was wondering why I have such a pole up my backside about this 😂 and I've also realised in my sport you will almost always get point deduction for using name AND a command as it's seen an extra command/handler help, it's either/or. So I guess I've always avoided it socially too.
'Come here' and 'sit down' are also bugbears, those are two commands each.


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## skinnydipper (17 April 2022)

cauda equina said:



			If I were your dog and you had trained me to come to my name then I expect I would, yes
		
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When you call Fido's name you might not want him to come.  You might want him to wait, or sit, or down, close or at a distance.  For instance, "Fido, wait"

So calling Fido's name means look/listen to me, further instruction will follow.

Also, if you have multiple dogs you may wish to ask one specific dog to perform a behaviour.

ETA.  Sorry, cross posted - multitasking


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## ellieb (17 April 2022)

I taught my greyhound recall with a whistle (three 'pips') - he learned it so quickly and well (small furry distractions aside) it makes me wonder why I see people with much more biddable breeds struggling to get theirs to come back 😄


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## cauda equina (17 April 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			Yep, and we can understand there is a clear difference between:

CorvusCorax
Can you come over here please?
Can you go and put the kettle on?

Equally, IME it is much clearer for the dog, to teach:

Fido
Sit
Come

Etc etc.

Great if you get recall on a sixpence for a name alone, but so many people use the name on a daily basis for so many reasons with no reinforcement, Hi Fido, I'm home Fido, has anyone fed Fido? then it loses meaning/importance.
There's no other command (sit/down/heel) etc where you would reasonably expect the dog to interchange that with their name.

ETA I was wondering why I have such a pole up my backside about this 😂 and I've also realised in my sport you will almost always get point deduction for using name AND a command as it's seen an extra command/handler help, it's either/or. So I guess I've always avoided it socially too.
'Come here' and 'sit down' are also bugbears, those are two commands each.
		
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I think 'in my sport' probably nails our disagreement about this 
When my dog (now sadly gone) was at a distance, I only got in touch with him if I wanted him to come to me
So I could say/shout his name, or a version of his name, or whistle, it all worked

I completely get that if you want your dog to do more actions than just come to you you need more precise commands, but for me and I guess a lot of owners that's all we want, and if the name works why not use it?


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## CorvusCorax (17 April 2022)

Not a disagreement, more of a debate 

Others have actually articulated what I mean, better, with far less words 😂

But even socially, away from sports sit, down, wait etc are really important for me and the formal/competition recall (come fast and straight and sit in front) and 'get over here now in whatever style you prefer' recall are two separate things.


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## Clodagh (17 April 2022)

I know I work mine, so different, but my OH drives he bloody mad by reciting their name. So Ffee will walk too far ahead on a walk ‘Ffee wait’, I would say but he just says ‘Ffee, Ffee, Ffee, Ffee’ while sounding progressively more disgruntled. Then he complains they don’t listen to him 🤷‍♀️


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## Amymay (17 April 2022)

I say ‘Daisy/Jack, wait; Come See; This Way, wait; Stand etc.

So their name and then command.


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## skinnydipper (17 April 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			'Come here' and 'sit down' are also bugbears, those are two commands each.
		
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Yeah, which is it 'sit' or 'down'.

Also "sit, sit, sit, sit, sit, sit".  FGS say it once, the dog isn't stupid.  Unless of course you are trying to teach him to sit after the umpteenth time of asking.

And asking the dog to do something and wandering off before the task is complete - like he's going to bother listening to you again.


Not you personally, of course, CC


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## CorvusCorax (17 April 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			Not you personally, of course, CC  

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I'm the one doing the shouting 😂

JUST SAY IT ONCE!
STOP TALKING!
PUT YOUR PAUSES IN!
PRETEND YOU LIKE HIM!


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## Cinnamontoast (17 April 2022)

ellieb said:



			I taught my greyhound recall with a whistle (three 'pips') - he learned it so quickly and well (small furry distractions aside) it makes me wonder why I see people with much more biddable breeds struggling to get theirs to come back 😄
		
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I love using the whistle in the woods, I can hear crashing, so Bear, ninja dog that he is (not) can't be far, but I don't want to shout, so the whistle is useful.


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## rabatsa (18 April 2022)

I live next door to "irresponsible owners".  For years their dogs have been allowed to wander, without knowing their property boundaries and the owners not always knowing where they are.

After an incident with the next neighbours along the lane, where the loose dogs attacked a "poodog" puppy that was on lead, resulting in a large vet bill, new latest iphone and a lot of grovelling next door asked if the neighbour wanted the dogs putting down.  His reply was no, it was not the dogs fault that they had an irresponsible owner, they just wanted him to keep his dogs under control and not let them wander.

Since then these dogs have been kept at home and only allowed to leave the yard with the owners present.  However they are still not under control.  During the day all four dogs lived together in a large run, until the day that there were only three dogs as they killed one of the terriers.

Still these dogs are not always under control. Three/four weeks ago one of their ridgebacks, while out on a walk with the owner, came through our closed gate (meshed 2' at the bottom, railed above) and attacked our GSD who was pottering about the yard.  Fortunately both of us were also in the yard and well aimed missile distracted the intruder long enough for our dog to escape behind a trailer and the dog to be caught by Mr R, who returned it to the owner who had reached the outer gateway of our property.

All the flippin owner has dared to suggest is that we take all our dogs for an off lead walk somewhere away from home.  My dog has never been allowed off lead away from home, except when doing off lead work at training classes, we have fields a plenty for off lead walks here and since covid she has never left our premises.

The owners have been away for a week and a house sitter has been looking after the dogs.  There have been leads and well behaved dogs which have been under control, life has been so less stressful.  They are back today .


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## Cinnamontoast (18 April 2022)

At this stage, Rabatsa, I would be phoning the dog warden/police and speaking to the owner re putting their dogs in the cages and only allowing them out strictly on leads. Any more incidents, surely they would need to consider re-homing if they can’t manage to control them properly.


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## Clodagh (18 April 2022)

🙈 . next door have about 5 or so dogs. One, a very old collie, lives out. She barks from dawn. A repetitive woof woof. Breathe. Woof woof. Breathe. I don’t get too bothered as Scout whinges from about the same time and my 5 cockerels all crow.
But she also does it all day if they go out. We were just out in the garden having coffee and she was on constant drone. Then I heard music as well. So I said to OH, if they can hear that music you think they could hear that poor dog. Immediately the back door opened and they let her in. So whoops they heard me. I’m pleased actually!


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## CorvusCorax (18 April 2022)

Clodagh said:



			🙈 . next door have about 5 or so dogs. One, a very old collie, lives out. She barks from dawn. A repetitive woof woof. Breathe. Woof woof. Breathe. I don’t get too bothered as Scout whinges from about the same time and my 5 cockerels all crow.
But she also does it all day if they go out. We were just out in the garden having coffee and she was on constant drone. Then I heard music as well. So I said to OH, if they can hear that music you think they could hear that poor dog. Immediately the back door opened and they let her in. So whoops they heard me. I’m pleased actually!
		
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The GSD over the fence from me 'nonsense' barks at nothing, for hours. I shout at it to shush from time to time and I can hear the patio door slide open and shut again, barking stops. The first time it happened I didn't realise they were in and I was affronted, but I do it all the time now, it has woken me on any of the meagre amount of days off I have and is very annoying if one is out in the garden.

I have NEVER heard them tell it to be quiet, engage with it at all, have any fun with it, etc.
I can't see over fence but I think it gets out rarely and has been the one that has run up to both of my male dogs barking and aiming sneaky snaps. Not once has the owner told it to stop (er, sorry, but he's another RepetitiveNameShouter 😳)


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## SaddlePsych'D (18 April 2022)

rabatsa said:



			During the day all four dogs lived together in a large run, until the day that there were only three dogs as they killed one of the terriers.
		
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That's horrifying, poor dog. I'm glad yours was okay, sounds like a lucky escape. I too would report, especially given the prior incident. 

Our neighbours' JRT's barking/growling/snarling at Ivy is wearing a little thin. To be fair they do call her in and it doesn't seem to bother Ivy at all. I am giving the fence extra checks though as I wouldn't like for it to get in to our garden!

The Beagle on the other side escalated from poking his face through a slipped down fence slat to chewing bits of fence off yesterday 😳 He usually just hangs out there whining for Ivy's attention. She has not once paid him any notice, poor boy 😂


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## SaddlePsych'D (18 April 2022)

Ivy would like to nominate us a irresponsible owners today. Giving her a (very quick!) bath was a clear violation of her hound rights and delayed her very important nap. A pig's ear persuaded her not to call the rspca on us but she's considering relisting herself on the rescue website for new owners. 😁


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## SAujla (18 April 2022)

I'm afraid to say I'm one of these owners, my dogs recall has regressed so its back to the long line and retraining.


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## Cinnamontoast (18 April 2022)

SAujla said:



			I'm afraid to say I'm one of these owners, my dogs recall has regressed so its back to the long line and retraining.
		
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Is she about 2? Brig and Jake at that age decided they would start ignoring instructions, so we re-started them. I remember stamping a foot would make them go behind to get into a perfect heel position. I really must think what we did, Goose is proving ‘deaf’ re recall, he is back on the longline.


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## SAujla (18 April 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			Is she about 2? Brig and Jake at that age decided they would start ignoring instructions, so we re-started them. I remember stamping a foot would make them go behind to get into a perfect heel position. I really must think what we did, Goose is proving ‘deaf’ re recall, he is back on the longline.
		
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She turned 2 in February, there was one particular occasion when she ran halfway to an on lead dog, stopped and looked back at me 3 times. I'd called her but she then decided to go forward anyway, it was a real low point. I've got some advice from Clodagh so I'm putting that into practice now. Clover just thinks everyone is as friendly and gentle as she is so no harm in saying hello


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## Nasicus (18 April 2022)

SAujla said:



			I'm afraid to say I'm one of these owners, my dogs recall has regressed so its back to the long line and retraining.
		
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You're not irresponsible though, you've recognised that your dog has taken a bit of a backslide in her training (totally normal btw!), and are addressing it


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## Cinnamontoast (18 April 2022)

SAujla said:



			She turned 2 in February, there was one particular occasion when she ran halfway to an on lead dog, stopped and looked back at me 3 times. I'd called her but she then decided to go forward anyway, it was a real low point. I've got some advice from Clodagh so I'm putting that into practice now. Clover just thinks everyone is as friendly and gentle as she is so no harm in saying hello
		
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My two are exactly the same. Mitch wanted to run over to a cropped ear pitbull lookalike today, there’s just no way! It was my absolute nightmare with Zak, friendly looking spaniel who’d want to kill any dog who bounced up to him.



Nasicus said:



			You're not irresponsible though, you've recognised that your dog has taken a bit of a backslide in her training (totally normal btw!), and are addressing it 

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That‘s the opposite of irresponsible!


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## SAujla (19 April 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			My two are exactly the same. Mitch wanted to run over to a cropped ear pitbull lookalike today, there’s just no way! It was my absolute nightmare with Zak, friendly looking spaniel who’d want to kill any dog who bounced up to him.



That‘s the opposite of irresponsible!
		
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The irresponsible part comes from letting it happen as her recall has been fading for a few weeks and I've not addressed it up until now. She usually is brilliant at coming back to me on  her own accord but I neglected to reinforce an actual recall where she listens to me. We are making progress though


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## Tiddlypom (19 April 2022)

Anyone got any suggestions of a collapsible walking stick/pole that would be beefy enough to use fend off the unwanted attentions an unwelcome dog or dogs if needed?

A traditional wooden stick would be good and sturdy, but neither OH nor I want the hassle of one.

OH was left fending off the tow path pair of dogs with a foot for an uncomfortably long  time. He could have got bitten or overbalanced. A defensive implement (hopefully never to be needed) would be better.


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## Clodagh (19 April 2022)

I know you say you don’t want a walking stick but I have a lightweight thumb stick and it’s no trouble at all.


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## Tiddlypom (19 April 2022)

Have you got a pic or a link, Clodagh? I was envisioning a heavy clumpy thing.


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## CorvusCorax (19 April 2022)

A dressage whip also makes a nice swooshy noise. I found even waving one focused the mind of both large dog bombing towards me and their owner.

Some sports training vests have a long, thin stick pocket for stowing heeling sticks/touch point 'wands' and are lightweight/can be worn over a t-shirt or a thick jacket.

My Bende vest has one, also IQ Dogsport (although they are very expensive).

You can get telescopic hiking sticks off the internet.

I had dinner with a friend last night who runs. She says dogs chase/run up to her frequently, she has been clawed/had clothes ripped, knocked over and pushed over into a barbed wire fence, ripping her top and cutting her. This sounds like a fairly frequent thing for her...why are people such idiots??


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## Smitty (19 April 2022)

I can't recommend B+M hiking poles:   I bent one on a lab that was troubling us and whose owner was nowhere in sight.  You need something sturdy to fend off the owners as well 😶


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## The Fuzzy Furry (19 April 2022)

TP, want me to lend you little A for a bit?

Took her out with P dog for potter walk this morning,  met badly trained Weim that ALWAYS tries to jump on old P dog. Owner is a useless piece of #@$t. I've kicked the blooming thing before....
It made the error of bounding up to little A,  I bellowed at owner who just shrugged!
It had to happen.... dog came in too close,  A whipped her bum out sideways and kicked dog squarely in the ribs,  it shot off screaming.....
Little A, despite her pretty looks and diminutive stature st 32ins tall,  detests loose dogs and is even more brave when attached to her human.

It's quite rare to meet eejit owners before 8am on my local patch across the track from my yard tho, apart from this one.

I take my hunting whip when I walk P from the yard.


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## Moobli (19 April 2022)

I have a shepherd's crook that I take on walks.  It is in the car at the moment but I will get a photo later.  You get used to carrying it so it is no real bother (and can be helpful for crossing streams and for balancing on uneven bits of hill, as well as for walloping errant dogs and their idiot owners).


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## maisie06 (19 April 2022)

Clodagh said:



			I know I work mine, so different, but my OH drives he bloody mad by reciting their name. So Ffee will walk too far ahead on a walk ‘Ffee wait’, I would say but he just says ‘Ffee, Ffee, Ffee, Ffee’ while sounding progressively more disgruntled. Then he complains they don’t listen to him 🤷‍♀️
		
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My OH is the same! Just yells their name louder each time.... I work mine so will use the name then command if they are both with me! Generally I use the whistle to recall, that means come back NOW, no option! If they don't come I go and grab!!


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## CorvusCorax (19 April 2022)

maisie06 said:



			My OH is the same! Just yells their name louder each time.... I work mine so will use the name then command if they are both with me! Generally I use the whistle to recall, that means come back NOW, no option! If they don't come I go and grab!!
		
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Shout his name at him repeatedly and he'll soon get the message


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## Moobli (19 April 2022)

My moan about the irresponsible today is other people not picking up their dog poop!  
I took my two for a walk along a lovely stretch of river where the local community have used wind turbine funds to create a community walk.  There is a bit of work involved in its upkeep, as the local Estate staff mow the grassy trails, have put wood steps on steeper sections and made wooden platforms for the muddy bits.  There are signs at both ends of the walk about picking up poo and there are bins provided.  I am fairly local to the area and know the farm manager on the estate (it neighbours ours) and the last thing I want is for him to think it is me that is too lazy to pick up after my dogs, so I always take extra poo bags just incase.  Today I collected two large dog dumps before we had even gone ten minutes from the car park.  It is infuriating.  Don't these owners realise they give us all a bad name


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## maisie06 (19 April 2022)

SAujla said:



			I'm afraid to say I'm one of these owners, my dogs recall has regressed so its back to the long line and retraining.
		
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your'e not irresponsible though as you know and are addressing it! If your dog ran up to mine and you caught it and said sorry - Like the majority of us on here would - there would no problem just a thankyou for grabbing your dog!!


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## Pearlsasinger (19 April 2022)

I have a folding lightweight walking stick that  I bought from Amazon, I had a similar one from Argos until I left it on a train, or somewhere.  I have used this one for dog-walking in the wood successfully and fended off unwanted dogs and their owners without it breaking.  It takes too long to extend when you see the dog coming though, it has to be extended for the whole walk, which suits me as I am walking the same route as when I fell and broke my leg but it might not suit your OH so well.


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## skinnydipper (19 April 2022)

SAujla said:



			I'm afraid to say I'm one of these owners, my dogs recall has regressed so its back to the long line and retraining.
		
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Sorry, you don't meet the criteria to qualify for an irresponsible owner award. 

You either need to be on your phone and oblivious to what your dog is doing or you don't think there is a problem and just shout "it's okay she's friendly" and make no attempt to retrieve your dog.


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## SAujla (19 April 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			Sorry, you don't meet the criteria to qualify for an irresponsible owner award. 

You either need to be on your phone and oblivious to what your dog is doing or you don't think there is a problem and just shout "it's okay she's friendly" and make no attempt to retrieve your dog.
		
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Thank you! I think she's hitting adolescence as she's being a bit of a bitch occasionally (pun intended). She went swimming today and was very stubborn. Her third season could be starting anytime now as well which will obviously mean no off leash time or anywhere near a field


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## Tiddlypom (19 April 2022)

The Fuzzy Furry said:



			TP, want me to lend you little A for a bit?
		
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Lend me little A, TFF? That's a very kind offer, I'd pay good money to hire an attack mini shetland 🤣.

I hope that the unruly Weim knows not to mess with you lot again. What a numpty owner the poor dog has.


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## The Fuzzy Furry (19 April 2022)

Tiddlypom said:



			Lend me little A, TFF? That's a very kind offer, I'd pay good money to hire an attack mini shetland 🤣.

I hope that the unruly Weim knows not to mess with you lot again. What a numpty owner the poor dog has.
		
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She's only any good if they approach from front or side tho 🤣 has absolutely no speed to run away nor to chase.
I do have to ensure P dog is never bumbling around if A is out tho as A has tried to stamp on her in the past.
I don't discourage little A from flicking a hoof up behind at errant dogs if we are out marching, as I keep P dog in front of me at all times if they are together.


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## Clodagh (19 April 2022)

@Tiddlypom 
Thumb stick. It is light although mum has an even lighter one made of twisted hazel. You can get plastic ones too, like walking poles? I like wood though.


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## Tiddlypom (19 April 2022)

Clodagh said:



@Tiddlypom
Thumb stick. It is light although mum has an even lighter one made of twisted hazel. You can get plastic ones too, like walking poles? I like wood though.
		
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Thanks, I can see some nice looking thumb sticks for sale on ebay. They are quite tall, about 50", so rather longer than a conventional lean on type walking stick? ETA just found size guide on t'internet.

_What height should a thumbstick be? Here's a good rule on sizing: Standing with your arms at your side, the stick should be *about 6 or 8 inches taller than your elbow*. Pick a longer stick if you'll be tackling steep terrain._

Trying to envisage how you walk with one?

OH may have suggested carrying a cricket bat. Joke. I think.


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## Clodagh (19 April 2022)

You can cut them to height and get a ferrule for the end from hardware shops. As for walking I don’t think I can explain it 😀


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## Clodagh (19 April 2022)

And the pointy end, if you got an antler one, would be a good weapon 😌


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## Tiddlypom (19 April 2022)

I had indeed noted the pointy end!


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## Pearlsasinger (19 April 2022)

I should add that the folding stick did NOT collapse, as I feared it might, when I banged it on the ground in front of numpty's dog at the country park, the other day.  I felt sorry for the dog but not enough to allow it to approach ours who were all sitting waiting patiently on a picnic rug for our lunch to arrive.


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## SaddlePsych'D (19 April 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			I had dinner with a friend last night who runs. She says dogs chase/run up to her frequently, she has been clawed/had clothes ripped, knocked over and pushed over into a barbed wire fence, ripping her top and cutting her. This sounds like a fairly frequent thing for her...why are people such idiots??
		
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Runners always look wary when they pass us and I think this is probably a common issue for them with dogs. I always bring Ivy's lead short to reassure them than for worry about her because I also have a friend who has been chased and bitten when out running. What is wrong with people?! Sometimes I feel bad for fending off incoming dogs from Ivy but then I remember I actually also don't want random dogs running up to _me_ either!

Well done Little A, TFF. Although I'm sorry to read that happened. Sounds like the right thing in that moment but I feel sorry for the dog to have such a careless owner.

On differences of approach with OHs (which is probably a whoooole other thread)... my OH is driving me nuts with pandering to Ivy. She is a sweet dog and I love her dearly but she's pushing boundaries and if we're not careful we're going to reinforce behaviour we don't want and lose that politeness about her we've enjoyed so much. He's just not hearing it. That and to stop flinging himself in her direction every time she picks something up in her mouth that's not hers. At best it's making her realise it's incredibly effective for getting our attention, at worst I'm sure it just makes her chew/eat them with more gusto and be more protective which I've worked hard to try to get her to chill out about!

ETA: Found a picture of OH in action!


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## Tiddlypom (20 April 2022)

Thumb stick experts, does this look like a comfortable handle to hold when walking? It's a red deer antler. Not quite as sharp as Clodagh's, but maybe more beginner friendly . It's plenty long enough for OH, who is tall. He's on board with buying one and giving it a go.

We'll be buying on line, so won't be able to try it out first.


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## Clodagh (20 April 2022)

Looks nice. Also looks more comfy than mine which has rather a sharp edge between points.


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## Errin Paddywack (20 April 2022)

Talking about runners reminds me of an incident a good few years ago when I was walking my then dogs along a big stretch of grass.  A big bunch of runners appeared who were running zigzags up and down the stretch I was walking on.  My dogs were loose but totally ignored the runners, I was so pleased with them.


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## Clodagh (20 April 2022)

Errin Paddywack said:



			Talking about runners reminds me of an incident a good few years ago when I was walking my then dogs along a big stretch of grass.  A big bunch of runners appeared who were running zigzags up and down the stretch I was walking on.  My dogs were loose but totally ignored the runners, I was so pleased with them.
		
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And yours are collies? So even better job that they didn’t herd?


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## fiwen30 (22 April 2022)

Would like to nominate the complete pillock with his little orange-red terrier-type in the busy public park this afternoon. The pillock, out for a gentle stroll, lead swinging nonchalantly in his hand. The terrier out to cover as much ground as possible, in as little time, and doing most of this barking at the top of it’s lungs and charging with absolute murderous intent at all the birds - pigeons, ducks, and even the geese, as they all rested on the paths and grass by the ponds and waterways.

‘Fido!’, the pillock would occasionally call out, as the terrier scattered more terrified waterfowl hundreds of meters away. Not quite sure what the aim of that was. The aim of the terrier was to catch and eat whatever it could, and it came damn close - especially to the poor sleeping geese who were slower to get up and fly off.

It’s bad enough when people let their toddlers chase pigeons, IMO, it would’ve been considerably less cute had Fido actually caught and ripped something to shreds in front of all the kids and their mothers at the pond, in the middle of the afternoon.


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## CorvusCorax (22 April 2022)

Awww, cuuuute! He just playing!!!


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## fiwen30 (22 April 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			Awww, cuuuute! He just playing!!! 

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I’m sure more people would’ve had something to say if it had been a husky/Akita/GSD/Doberman wildly out of control, running at top speed, barking at the top of it’s voice, teeth out, with foam flying out it’s mouth, as it tried desperately to kill something.

Frustratingly, a quick search doesn’t tell me if dogs have to be kept on lead in the park, or who I might be able to inform about it (if anyone).


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## CorvusCorax (22 April 2022)

If it is council owned they will have info on any dog control orders. There's a 1m leash order in our local park which everyone ignores, plus two free dog park areas, one for large dogs, one for small dogs.
And yet several swans a year get injured or killed......


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## Clodagh (22 April 2022)

It would take a game dog to take on a swan. (Not saying they don’t). My kelpie got ideas above her station once in Oz and ran at a black swan, it sat up and hissed at her and it made her recall excellent for ever more.


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## CorvusCorax (22 April 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			I felt awful the other day, this woman walks multiple dogs, generally well behaved, she recently got a deerhound lurcher type 'rescue' puppy, it's already as large as my female, it does run up to people/dogs but it is a big soft thing, no harm in it, the boys don't care. Came gambolling over the other day, my female was right beside me, I was holding her in the collar and feeding her but the pup got too close and she snapped at it....but in fairness....she shouldn't **really** be letting it gallop up to strangers....I did tell mine off, as it was a witchy bitchy thing to do but I can understand why she did it, as it came right direct into her face.
		
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Ok so I don't feel awful now. This just happened again, the dog is now a good deal bigger than mine (yes, she is a mini GSD apparently 🙄) so apparently having her face snapped at didn't work as a deterrent.
Ignored whistles and only retreated when mine had a meltdown and shouted at her to eff off.
Owner says 'all the way back' as if dog is fluent in the English language.
But didn't think to shout 'whoops, sorry'.
So the dog is being allowed to approach other dogs repeatedly with no consequence and will one day no doubt get hurt by a dog less smol and easy to wrangle than mine.


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## skinnydipper (22 April 2022)

.


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## blackcob (22 April 2022)

The thing that absolutely boils my piss about those encounters is that the other owner is probably faintly pleased that their dog got a telling off, as if it will teach them a lesson. They give zero consideration to the dog forced into giving the lesson, by having all their signals ignored and forced into a stressed, scared, or over-aroused state, where they have no recourse but to snap and shout. 

There was an attack on sheep here (near my place, not on the farm, thank goodness) over the easter weekend, leaving a ewe with its entire lower jaw bitten off. Somebody must have known it happened and walked off leaving her to suffer.


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## Amymay (22 April 2022)

blackcob said:



			The thing that absolutely boils my piss about those encounters is that the other owner is probably faintly pleased that their dog got a telling off, as if it will teach them a lesson. They give zero consideration to the dog forced into giving the lesson, by having all their signals ignored and forced into a stressed, scared, or over-aroused state, where they have no recourse but to snap and shout.
		
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But if it had been my small dog, there would have been no telling off - just fear, and probably run - and lurcher things chase instinct would kick in.  Great for lurcher thing, awful for my dog and for the owner of bloody lurcher thing.  I’d be apoplectic.




			There was an attack on sheep here (near my place, not on the farm, thank goodness) over the easter weekend, leaving a ewe with its entire lower jaw bitten off. Somebody must have known it happened and walked off leaving her to suffer.
		
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Horrific


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## Clodagh (22 April 2022)

Similar sheep thing in Essex, a ewe was chased into the river, owner got her dog off and vanished leaving the ewe to drown. Was seen by the farmer but by the time he got to the ewe she was past saving.


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## Cinnamontoast (22 April 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			.
	View attachment 91317

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Every park needs that sign-every few feet!


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## CorvusCorax (22 April 2022)

blackcob said:



			The thing that absolutely boils my piss about those encounters is that the other owner is probably faintly pleased that their dog got a telling off, as if it will teach them a lesson. They give zero consideration to the dog forced into giving the lesson, by having all their signals ignored and forced into a stressed, scared, or over-aroused state, where they have no recourse but to snap and shout.
		
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Yep, that's what is so frustrating. We passed a couple more dogs on the way home with no histrionics, but that's luck/ongoing training....but it's a really good point.
That woman probably thinks she is a dog lover. I don't think it's very fair to put her own dog in the position where it might get hurt, or someone else's in the position where they feel they have to snap/growl/bark/run.

When the dog does meet a dog that wants to run and play, the high that it gets will cancel out any training the owner is trying to do or any warning it might receive from a dog like mine. If it wasn't being reinforced, it wouldn't be happening.


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## BBP (23 April 2022)

We had a wire haired vizla puppy come wiggling up to us today. Owner has no lead, not even a collar on the pup. It’s about 1.5x the height of my collie. Lovely dog, super friendly. But my dog is not. Mine is on a lead. My dog goes rigid, eyes wide. I tell the owner my dog will start something. ‘Don’t worry, it’s fine’. Puppy starts sniffing mine, who keeps his cool for about 6 seconds then decides that’s enough. Puppy decided my dog clearly wants to play and bounces straight back. My dog lunges at him again. Puppy thinks this is great and barrels back in for a wrestle. My dog pins him to the floor. I feel like crap for not having better control of him and giving the puppy a bad experience. And it makes me really cross at myself that I didn’t do more to help prevent my dog from being put in that position. But owner is so laid back he really wasn’t bothered. (I sort of know him, nice guy and the pup is to fill the void of an old dog he just lost which just free roamed the farm. Now my brain is wondering how this pup will respond to my dog in future when he’s fully grown and still roaming around free.)


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## Cinnamontoast (23 April 2022)

BBP said:



			We had a wire haired vizla puppy come wiggling up to us today. Owner has no lead, not even a collar on the pup. It’s about 1.5x the height of my collie. Lovely dog, super friendly. But my dog is not. Mine is on a lead. My dog goes rigid, eyes wide. I tell the owner my dog will start something. ‘Don’t worry, it’s fine’. Puppy starts sniffing mine, who keeps his cool for about 6 seconds then decides that’s enough. Puppy decided my dog clearly wants to play and bounces straight back. My dog lunges at him again. Puppy thinks this is great and barrels back in for a wrestle. My dog pins him to the floor. I feel like crap for not having better control of him and giving the puppy a bad experience. And it makes me really cross at myself that I didn’t do more to help prevent my dog from being put in that position. But owner is so laid back he really wasn’t bothered. (I sort of know him, nice guy and the pup is to fill the void of an old dog he just lost which just free roamed the farm. Now my brain is wondering how this pup will respond to my dog in future when he’s fully grown and still roaming around free.)
		
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Come on, none of that was your fault. Not even a collar on the puppy and clearly zero recall? All the owner’s fault, not yours. You told him, he made no effort to get him back. As I keep saying, it’s not your/my dog’s job to control an untrained dog, that’s the owner’s responsibility.


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## hazelnut (24 April 2022)

Yeah, I’m getting more


BBP said:



			We had a wire haired vizla puppy come wiggling up to us today. Owner has no lead, not even a collar on the pup. It’s about 1.5x the height of my collie. Lovely dog, super friendly. But my dog is not. Mine is on a lead. My dog goes rigid, eyes wide. I tell the owner my dog will start something. ‘Don’t worry, it’s fine’. Puppy starts sniffing mine, who keeps his cool for about 6 seconds then decides that’s enough. Puppy decided my dog clearly wants to play and bounces straight back. My dog lunges at him again. Puppy thinks this is great and barrels back in for a wrestle. My dog pins him to the floor. I feel like crap for not having better control of him and giving the puppy a bad experience. And it makes me really cross at myself that I didn’t do more to help prevent my dog from being put in that position. But owner is so laid back he really wasn’t bothered. (I sort of know him, nice guy and the pup is to fill the void of an old dog he just lost which just free roamed the farm. Now my brain is wondering how this pup will respond to my dog in future when he’s fully grown and still roaming around free.)
		
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Yeah, I feel for you, it’s terrifying and not your fault. I keep having this recently. Dogs bounding across the park to us when mine is on lead. It always seems to be teeny tiny dogs too. My dog is friendly enough but on lead gets nervous when his space is invaded at speed. He’s only 8 months old and when their world is one meter squared it’s understandable. It’s terrifying as yesterday it was what looked like a mini westie did this. My guy wouldn’t really have to ‘do’ anything but is a Mal so big and powerful so really it could result in the mini dog getting hurt when mine hasn’t been aggressive at all. I just really shorten the lead, ask him to down and give a treat afterwards. Am considering a vest cam as it’s so frequent now.


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## SAujla (24 April 2022)

I've had a brilliant week with Clover, topped off today by her recalling away from a dog she knew. I get such a good feeling when she comes when I call her, I'd been relying on her coming back on her own accord too much. However when she was on lead we did get approached by 2 dogs with the owner not bothered, an off leash dog approaching an on lead dog is just unacceptable


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## CorvusCorax (24 April 2022)

At the reservoir. Mine stalked and eyeballed by a big black thing the oblivious owner brought way too close, mine boiled over and I got given the dirty look 🙄

Anyhoo rest of it was fine, at the end some guy appeared with two tiny Yorkies, no leads, smallest one made a beeline for a bigger terrier on leash with a young family and wouldn't leave it alone, cue him calling NAME x33,000 and being ignored, had to go over, pick it up and go back to his car, two walks ruined, well done mate.

Plus there was dog poo EVERYWHERE. Not a good advert for dog owners.


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## skinnydipper (24 April 2022)

It was an eventful day for us too, you couldn't make it up.

I walked from home this afternoon, for what I hoped would be a pleasant walk.

A couple with a small terrier crossed the road to walk into us, remarking on big girl's size and asking what breed she is as they approached.  I assumed their dog was friendly as they chose to walk into our path.  Nope, the little b*stard kicked off at her when it got within launching distance.  She barked a couple of times in retaliation and the woman said "it's nice to see that big dogs bark as well"  I retorted that she is normally very good but she didn't like the attitude of her dog. As I was walking away the woman said should we try again?  WTAF.  I said "if you mean a repeat of that performance, no thank you".

We continued to make our way home when I could hear what sounded like a dog fight ahead.  This is a street walk by the way.  I crossed the road to keep out of the way and just round the corner of a side road opposite was an off lead French bulldog attacking an on lead border collie.  The bulldog was going nuts. The elderly owner of the BC was doing nothing but hold the lead as her dog got attacked. There was also a man who had picked up and was carrying another dog, possibly staff. The woman with the FB took it by its hind legs and pulled it off the BC and then let it go again, it resumed its attack.  It had no collar or harness that I could see.  She managed to get it again and picked it up and carried it away, it was still rabid and shrieking.  She appeared to be with the bloke with the staffy.  They walked off together each carrying a dog.  Where on earth were their leads?

The woman with the collie stood shell shocked for a moment and then followed them.  I wondered if she was going to follow them to see where they lived.

The world has gone mad.


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## SAujla (24 April 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			It was an eventful day for us too, you couldn't make it up.

I walked from home this afternoon, for what I hoped would be a pleasant walk.

A couple with a small terrier crossed the road to walk into us, remarking on big girl's size and asking what breed she is as they approached.  I assumed their dog was friendly as they chose to walk into our path.  Nope, the little b*stard kicked off at her when it got within launching distance.  She barked a couple of times in retaliation and the woman said "it's nice to see that big dogs bark as well"  I retorted that she is normally very good but she didn't like the attitude of her dog. As I was walking away the woman said should we try again?  WTAF.  I said "if you mean a repeat of that performance, no thank you".

We continued to make our way home when I could hear what sounded like a dog fight ahead.  This is a street walk by the way.  I crossed the road to keep out of the way and just round the corner of a side road opposite was an off lead French bulldog attacking an on lead border collie.  The bulldog was going nuts. The elderly owner of the BC was doing nothing but hold the lead as her dog got attacked. There was also a man who had picked up and was carrying another dog, possibly staff. The woman with the FB took it by its hind legs and pulled it off the BC and then let it go again, it resumed its attack.  It had no collar or harness that I could see.  She managed to get it again and picked it up and carried it away, it was still rabid and shrieking.  She appeared to be with the bloke with the staffy.  They walked off together each carrying a dog.  Where on earth were their leads?

The woman with the collie stood shell shocked for a moment and then followed them.  I wondered if she was going to follow them to see where they lived.

The world has gone mad.
		
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There are so many levels of insanity there, first owner was bizarre and bad enough but the second situation is scary, especially if the dog came towards you after yours had already been stressed out by the first moron


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## skinnydipper (24 April 2022)

SAujla said:



			There are so many levels of insanity there, first owner was bizarre and bad enough but the second situation is scary, especially if the dog came towards you after yours had already been stressed out by the first moron
		
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I'll let you into a secret.  I'm fed up with all this crap.

We were enjoying a quiet walk one day when an aggressive large mongrel ran at big girl, as a team we saw it off and I told the owner in no uncertain terms that I would boot it if it came near her again.  It made an impression and next time we saw her she hastily leashed her dog and headed in the opposite direction.

I am getting to the point now where if an aggressive dog made contact, like the Frenchie with the collie,  I would not hold her, I would allow her to defend herself.


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## SAujla (24 April 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			I'll let you into a secret.  I'm fed up with all this crap. 

We were enjoying a quiet walk one day when an aggressive large mongrel ran at big girl, as a team we saw it off and I told the owner in no uncertain terms that I would boot it if it came near her again.  It made an impression and next time we saw her she hastily leashed her dog and headed in the opposite direction.

I am getting to the point now where if an aggressive dog made contact, like the Frenchie with the collie,  I would not hold her, I would allow her to defend herself.
		
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At a certain point you are going to have to do so. Its alarming because that first owner who wanted to try meeting again is the type of owner you might encounter more often.


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## skinnydipper (24 April 2022)

SAujla said:



			At a certain point you are going to have to do so. Its alarming because that first owner who wanted to try meeting again is the type of owner you might encounter more often.
		
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We can deal with the likes of the terrier, it's a frequent occurrence, I ask her to walk on.

If she were attacked,  another dog making contact with teeth, that's a different matter entirely.


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## Cinnamontoast (24 April 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			It was an eventful day for us too, you couldn't make it up.

I walked from home this afternoon, for what I hoped would be a pleasant walk.

A couple with a small terrier crossed the road to walk into us, remarking on big girl's size and asking what breed she is as they approached.  I assumed their dog was friendly as they chose to walk into our path.  Nope, the little b*stard kicked off at her when it got within launching distance.  She barked a couple of times in retaliation and the woman said "it's nice to see that big dogs bark as well"  I retorted that she is normally very good but she didn't like the attitude of her dog. As I was walking away the woman said should we try again?  WTAF.  I said "if you mean a repeat of that performance, no thank you".

We continued to make our way home when I could hear what sounded like a dog fight ahead.  This is a street walk by the way.  I crossed the road to keep out of the way and just round the corner of a side road opposite was an off lead French bulldog attacking an on lead border collie.  The bulldog was going nuts. The elderly owner of the BC was doing nothing but hold the lead as her dog got attacked. There was also a man who had picked up and was carrying another dog, possibly staff. The woman with the FB took it by its hind legs and pulled it off the BC and then let it go again, it resumed its attack.  It had no collar or harness that I could see.  She managed to get it again and picked it up and carried it away, it was still rabid and shrieking.  She appeared to be with the bloke with the staffy.  They walked off together each carrying a dog.  Where on earth were their leads?

The woman with the collie stood shell shocked for a moment and then followed them.  I wondered if she was going to follow them to see where they lived.

The world has gone mad.
		
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That's just insane 😡


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## Smitty (25 April 2022)

Well, I had a lovely walk yesterday with my Meetup group.   We walked along the canal side which was very busy, but every single dog we encountered was on a lead and well behaved.  The only blight was the number of discarded poo bags in this beauty spot.   If you choose to have a dog it can come as no surprise that you are required to clean up after it and dispose responsibly of the stuff that comes out of its rear end.


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## SaddlePsych'D (25 April 2022)

Saw the runner thing in action today. Did the Lab get put on lead after completely blowing off the recall to chase (and actually caught up to) the running person? Of course not. Did we give the dog and owner a massive swerve across the park because it would absolutely have come our way? Yes, yes we did. 

On space giving - it so annoys me when, like in the example above, I give as much space as physically possible when I pass other dogs whether they are on or off lead. But people then just move closer anyway. Like in the example above, by meandering across a huge playing field directly at back at us with the Lab and about four other dogs with little to no control. Or a young Visla (I think) on lead (at least!) already more than able to pull the owner wherever it liked 'saying hello' to another dog. I'm not into random saying hello to other dogs generally, so again moved right over to make that clear. It pulls over to us with owner going 'ooh look another one to say hello to'. Nooo! One group of about 8 off-lead dogs I just turned around and walked the other way. They saw us and then stopped which was kind of good but in a way that I would still have to have got close enough to pass that I am 99% sure would have set them all off in our direction. This is the price paid for the mistake of walking in our local green space at lunch time!


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## misst (26 April 2022)

Well todays walk was a disaster. I usually have lovely walks on our common and almost everyone has well socialised dogs. If someone is on a lead then other owners (including myself) clip a lead on their dog. I know most of the local dogs and people anyway. Not had problems for ages.

Today I was out with Moti (rehomed stray terrier mix quite unsociable ie does not want to play so ignores other dogs whenever possible but reactive if they get in his face), and Ruby (small 2yo super social but well behaved JRT). We see ahead of us a lady walking a large heavy "doodle" of some sort. It was brown so likely choc lab x poodle. It was a big one. He did a big "play bow" and crouched down a good distance away. Owner (60 something lady same as me) shouted he's friendly..... he likes to play. Clipped Ruby on a lead as I don't like her playing with big heavy dogs - she is 5.5kg. and has no self preservation! Moti walked next to me ignoring big dog. 
As I approached I said to the lady she's friendly but too small to play as the lady looked as if she wanted my dogs to play with hers. Big dog bounds over and rolls Ruby over even though she is on a lead. He then starts nosing Moti who crouched down tail tucked in and growled. Big dog then starts racing round me like a lunatic. Moti now on a lead too and I asked the lady to stop her dog as mine were not up for playing....

Big dog continues to run away and race back to us almost knocking me over twice and rolling Ruby over again. He then was very frustrated and began frantic loud barking. I again asked woman to stop her dog and put him on a lead. She STILL said he's playing even though he sounds fierce! When he ran back again I fended him off with my leg/foot but was actually afraid he would knock me flying as he was heavy and fast and I am not very big. I growled and shouted at her dog saying ENOUGH NO! several times and she was quite shocked I think. We couldn't walk away as he was racing around us. By this time Moti was shaking (he's never done that before) and Ruby was actually leaping at his throat snapping! 

Somehow we walked away and I heard her shouting for her dog and shouting "sorry" to me. I am tough and quite self contained but I was so upset I just kept my two on the lead and took them home. Luckily no one was injured but if I see that lady again I will avoid her and hopefully I will have the presence of mind to give a good kick to the dog next time.

Rant over


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## maisie06 (26 April 2022)

Beach walk this morning - quite nice , passed a lady with 2 well behaved labs, and some other nice dogs and owners all pleasant and polite - great! Then a few minutes from home the prat with the schnauzer appears, he's a plonker always wanting to shove his dog in other dogs faces - I cross the road, so does he, I cross back so does he .... "whatever it's name was wants to say hello" he annouces, I said " I crossed TWICE to avoid you doesn't that say enough?" He muttered something about me being a miserable cow so I replied well now you know Bloody wellleave us alone!!!  I don't think he'll be trying that again!!


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## misst (26 April 2022)

maisie06 said:



			Beach walk this morning - quite nice , passed a lady with 2 well behaved labs, and some other nice dogs and owners all pleasant and polite - great! Then a few minutes from home the prat with the schnauzer appears, he's a plonker always wanting to shove his dog in other dogs faces - I cross the road, so does he, I cross back so does he .... "whatever it's name was wants to say hello" he annouces, I said " I crossed TWICE to avoid you doesn't that say enough?" He muttered something about me being a miserable cow so I replied well now you know Bloody wellleave us alone!!!  I don't think he'll be trying that again!!
		
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Why ?? just Why ?? One of my dogs is friendly and likes to play with other similar terrier types but I am super careful and only with dogs we know and have good understanding with, owners and the dogs. I would never force my dogs onto anyone. I just don't get it. Why would you go out of your way to do this? I was really upset today and cannot understand why I wasn't more like you Maise06 - I think she just took me by suprise.


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## Pearlsasinger (26 April 2022)

misst said:



			Why ?? just Why ?? One of my dogs is friendly and likes to play with other similar terrier types but I am super careful and only with dogs we know and have good understanding with, owners and the dogs. I would never force my dogs onto anyone. I just don't get it. Why would you go out of your way to do this? I was really upset today and cannot understand why I wasn't more like you Maise06 - I think she just took me by suprise.
		
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I can recommend carrying a walking stick when walking your dogs. Other owners seem to understand that you mean business when you wave it in their dog's direction, with a very firm 'No!'


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## misst (26 April 2022)

Pearlsasinger said:



			I can recommend carrying a walking stick when walking your dogs. Other owners seem to understand that you mean business when you wave it in their dog's direction, with a very firm 'No!'
		
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I am seriously considering this as I trip over a lot anyway and acutally fell a few months ago!!! I have every excuse to carry one. I am not usually such a woose so I think I was more shaken than I realised.


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## Cinnamontoast (26 April 2022)

misst said:



			Well todays walk was a disaster. I usually have lovely walks on our common and almost everyone has well socialised dogs. If someone is on a lead then other owners (including myself) clip a lead on their dog. I know most of the local dogs and people anyway. Not had problems for ages.

Today I was out with Moti (rehomed stray terrier mix quite unsociable ie does not want to play so ignores other dogs whenever possible but reactive if they get in his face), and Ruby (small 2yo super social but well behaved JRT). We see ahead of us a lady walking a large heavy "doodle" of some sort. It was brown so likely choc lab x poodle. It was a big one. He did a big "play bow" and crouched down a good distance away. Owner (60 something lady same as me) shouted he's friendly..... he likes to play. Clipped Ruby on a lead as I don't like her playing with big heavy dogs - she is 5.5kg. and has no self preservation! Moti walked next to me ignoring big dog.
As I approached I said to the lady she's friendly but too small to play as the lady looked as if she wanted my dogs to play with hers. Big dog bounds over and rolls Ruby over even though she is on a lead. He then starts nosing Moti who crouched down tail tucked in and growled. Big dog then starts racing round me like a lunatic. Moti now on a lead too and I asked the lady to stop her dog as mine were not up for playing....

Big dog continues to run away and race back to us almost knocking me over twice and rolling Ruby over again. He then was very frustrated and began frantic loud barking. I again asked woman to stop her dog and put him on a lead. She STILL said he's playing even though he sounds fierce! When he ran back again I fended him off with my leg/foot but was actually afraid he would knock me flying as he was heavy and fast and I am not very big. I growled and shouted at her dog saying ENOUGH NO! several times and she was quite shocked I think. We couldn't walk away as he was racing around us. By this time Moti was shaking (he's never done that before) and Ruby was actually leaping at his throat snapping!

Somehow we walked away and I heard her shouting for her dog and shouting "sorry" to me. I am tough and quite self contained but I was so upset I just kept my two on the lead and took them home. Luckily no one was injured but if I see that lady again I will avoid her and hopefully I will have the presence of mind to give a good kick to the dog next time.

Rant over 

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You sound like you were very restrained. I would have been very vocal and extremely annoyed. If I'd had Zak, there would have been hell.


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## misst (26 April 2022)

CT I'm not sure why I was so polite. I am surprised at how upset I was. I am usually quite an outspoken assertive person but I was so surprised by this woman's casual attitude and quite scared of being taken out by her dog , I was at a bit of a loss. Next time....


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## SaddlePsych'D (26 April 2022)

It's genuinely a bit disturbing how unwilling people are to hear the word 'No!' Dogs aside, crossing the road multiple times to interact with a total stranger clearly avoiding you is creepy af. Adding dogs into the mix does not make that okay!

Uneventful today, just a terrier of some sort snuck up behind us and was sniffing Ivy. She was completely oblivious and it was annoying but not really rude so we just kept walking and gave her lots of praise for ignoring it and focusing on us. Pick them battles well I think.

On a lighter note, first outing of Ivy's new raincoat yesterday had me in stitches laughing (E.T. anyone?!) and wondering how to square my grumpy 'keep-away-from-me-and-my-dog' lady (or miserable cow?) persona with walking my dog dressed like this...😂


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## Tiddlypom (27 April 2022)

We went for a half day walk at Delamere Forest yesterday.

Lots of dogs, most of whom were on leads.

Saw a man with the lurcher and a mali type thing from a long way off, on a wide main path near a viewpoint. The dogs were on leads which were too long. He was walking by a field of young cattle, which was fenced off from the path just by electric wire. The mali thing kept hurling itself to the end of its lead towards the cattle, whereon the bloke would shout at it and yank it back. Rinse and repeat. We kept over to our side of the path as far as we could and kept walking. When we drew level, quelle surprise the mali thing crossed the path to hurl itself at us, but the lead stopped it short, so bloke yanked it back yet again. He was a burly chap, but was in danger of being pulled off his feet every time it yanked the lead.

Then later a woman behind us with a young off lead lab. It was constantly running ahead of and behind for 100 m at a time and out of her sight, and she was ineffectually calling it back. It kept disappearing down side tracks and doing its own thing. When it became clear that she seemed to be coming her way and catching us up, I politely asked her if she wanted to overtake us. I told her that the JRT can be nervous of labs after previously being bitten by one (that incident needed two vet visits). She looked completely gobsmacked at the concept of a lab biting anything, or needing to have it under some sort of control in a busy forest. Left her trying to recall the lab which was barrelling up and down past other parties of walkers whilst ignoring her, and luckily she took a different route.

Meanwhile we are loving the strict 'dogs on leads' rule at Cholmondeley, where we've got an annual pass. It is the most lovely setting. The roads are all private estate roads, and it's very quiet mid week, so she can be allowed to have long lead for long periods. The daily entrance fee per adult is £8.50, which IMHO is rather steep for what is effectively just a half day, but an annual pass is £45. Worth it for us.

The JRT was well socialised before we got her at age nearly 3 on Black Friday 2019, she was a town dog from Bolton. We tease her about being a town dog. She used to mince around muddy patches or puddles, but she's got used to them now.


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## Moobli (27 April 2022)

That looks a beautiful place to walk Tiddlypom.


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## misst (28 April 2022)

Well a walk on Wednesday with my good friend and her 3 - everyone we met was sensible and polite (and so were we). Today a lovely walk just me and my two. A lady with a large standard poodle and 2 large doodle types appeared on the woodland path coming towards us. I snapped leads on looked up and wondered where she had gone. As I got nearer I realised she had all 3 sitting to attention facing her away from the path in the trees to allow me to pass. I thanked her and she just said "they're a bit playful and a bit big for your two". She waited for us to pass and we all continued happily. Why is it not always like this, it was a lovely day, in a lovely setting with excellent people around .


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## BallyRoanBaubles (28 April 2022)

Met a completely irresponsible owner today  we were walking along the canal with my dog on lead at heel when a woman with a black lab and a golden retriever (both off lead), comes along makes no attempt to recall her dogs, the black lab is sniffing mines bum so he spins round and I say 'come on lets go'  when the black lab goes for mine getting him on the top of his neck! 

I shout at it and it gets off, then comes back again! No apology from the owner and I was to shocked to say anything. It wouldve got a boot if it hadnt got off when I shouted at it. Luckily no damage to my dog (also a lab) but couldve been different with a smaller dog.


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## misst (28 April 2022)

BallyRoanBaubles said:



			Met a completely irresponsible owner today  we were walking along the canal with my dog on lead at heel when a woman with a black lab and a golden retriever (both off lead), comes along makes no attempt to recall her dogs, the black lab is sniffing mines bum so he spins round and I say 'come on lets go'  when the black lab goes for mine getting him on the top of his neck!

I shout at it and it gets off, then comes back again! No apology from the owner and I was to shocked to say anything. It wouldve got a boot if it hadnt got off when I shouted at it. Luckily no damage to my dog (also a lab) but couldve been different with a smaller dog.
		
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Honestly what is wrong with people! Why can they not see how unruly their dogs are? 

I did meet an adorable silky haired (??) dachshund today in the woods with a lovely older couple. He was super friendly and went to sniff Ruby. As they were same size and friendly I just watched and said to the owners that Ruby will probably play if that is ok. They said he didn't ever play. I called her away and he followed, playbowed, sniffed and barked so they had a little run back and forth. The old couple were amazed. After a couple of minutes I called Ruby and we carried on our way with Moti who does not socialise. After about 100 yards I heard a dog behind us and it was him. No sign of the old couple, no calling for him. He was very keen on Ruby (she is spayed)  and following us so I stopped and turned round. Found the old couple sort of waiting for him on the path where I had left him. Set off again - he followed again. I took him back and suggested a lead. They didn't have one "because we never need one!" bless them. I suggested they hold his collar until we were out of range. 
They were so lovely and he was a super little chap but I did think there is fair amount of "dog knapping" around here and he is ripe for the picking! I think they must drive to the woods and then let him out of the car directly but why would you not have a lead!


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## cauda equina (28 April 2022)

Lack of imagination?


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## Cinnamontoast (28 April 2022)

I don't understand these people who meander round with no lead. I don’t need one with Bear, but he’s not allowed to be near a road unless on the lead, even though he’d just amble alongside me. Coming out of the park at the weekend, I met a huge Rottweiler, the dog had no collar, let alone a lead!


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## Sandstone1 (28 April 2022)

A dog walking group appears to being set up in my local area according to facebook....The joy of lots of out of control dogs.


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## Cinnamontoast (29 April 2022)

Was poopicking the garden, filling up the bird feeders etc and next door’s happy thing barked the whole time. Apparently it just wants to play. It can‘t see ours. If mine bark (very rare), they come in. I refuse to let them be a noise nuisance. Would you take the dog indoors?


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## Amymay (29 April 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			Would you take the dog indoors?
		
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Nope, I wouldn’t.  But I would tell her to pack it in.


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## View (29 April 2022)

So, today’s brainless individual.

She was walking along the pavement in the same direction that I was driving, phone clamped to one ear, other hand on the buggy and also holding one of those wretched flexy leads with some tiny dog on the end.    Not paying any attention to what is going on around her as she is walking beside a bus stop in a lay-by.

As I go to pull into this bus stop to drop off, l see the dog dart off the pavement into the road abut to go under my bus.

I can’t just stand on the brake or I will have kids in a pile up on the floor of the bus because they are standing up ready to alight.

Mirror check, and pull up in the road, as I hit the horn.

She drops the phone, which was my fault.

Words fail me.


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## Amymay (29 April 2022)

I rarely gripe. Have little need to really. Live and let live and all that, and I’m pretty relaxed about meeting other dogs as I really don’t see it as a big deal.

But twice this weekend We’ve had an issue with bleddy Collies.  One yesterday who decided to take a swipe at Daisy (after spending a very pleasant five minute chat with the owners 🤷🏻‍♀️  And then today.  Dog turning itself inside out at mine prior to entering the woods.  ‘Which way are you going?’ I asked, so that I can avoid you.  ‘Oh it’s fine when it’s off the lead’ was the response.  Bloody thing made a full on attempt at mine when we unfortunately bumped in to them later.  It got a swift boot in the ribs for its effort, as its owner casually sauntered on.

My gob is always ready for action - shocked or not- so a mouthful was given!


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## Cinnamontoast (29 April 2022)

Amymay said:



			Nope, I wouldn’t.  But I would tell her to pack it in.
		
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They never tell it. It seems to spend a lot of time on its own out there.


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## Alwaysmoretoknow (15 May 2022)

So todays arse of the week award goes to the lovely family with the hysterically boisterous golden retrevier who thought it was perfectly acceptable to let it run up to my elderly and increasingly frail on-lead dog and bounce around her barking and trying to jump on her despite being told to go away in no uncertain terms. After some pretty ineffectual attempts at recall while I was shouting 'go away' (or words to that effect) while trying to restrain my poor old girl from giving it what for without hurting her I had to shout  'call your dog' where upon they produced a whistle and peeped it a few times and the dog thankfully returned. I shouted 'my dog is old and frail and I don't want her knocked over' to which the reply was 'oh - well that's ok' WTAF! I wasn't apologising - I was pointing out your lack of reponsibility and consideration for other dog owners you absolute muppit. Can't believe they just stood and watched the shit-show from 80m away without feeling they should take any kind of action. Next time I won't be so polite and will point out their flaws in no uncertain terms even if I have to hunt them down.


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## CorvusCorax (15 May 2022)

...


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## SaddlePsych'D (16 May 2022)

I don't know if this counts as irresponsible (we were in our own garden) but somehow it feels irresponsible. I let Ivy out for her late night wee and followed her out just in time to spot a cat sitting on the fence. Ivy spotted it at the same time and ran at the fence, scrambled up a raised bed wall, then tried to get on the roof of the log store. All I could do was shout OHs name repeatedly while trying to get a hold of her. I think the cat got away unharmed but Ivy has a skin graze - not actively bleeding but will need to keep a close eye. 

I wish I had gone out first, we always step out the front door first but got into our routine of letting her potter out to the back garden for a wee while we follow on behind. It just caught me off guard and shook me up. It happened so fast I'm really not sure if she stopped because the cat initially stood it's ground and she thought twice or because I stopped her. 

She's never off lead outside of the secure field but she's not 'getting over' cats in the same way as squirrels or rabbits (we can pass them on lead with no issues now, cats are special as she's still finding them very exciting). I think we need to seriously think about using a muzzle for a while after tonight's incident.


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## Tiddlypom (16 May 2022)

You weren't being irresponsible at all, SPD. Cats venture onto other people's property at their own risk. Many dogs will chase an unknown cat out of their own garden, even if they live amicably with a cat.

Current JRT does just that, despite now living with a cat. The garden is dog proof, and there are various trees etc that a feline can shimmy up to escape, but the dog can't. It's up to the cat whether to brave crossing the garden or not.

Cat owners have to decide whether let their pets roam, or to keep them in.


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## Errin Paddywack (16 May 2022)

We had to put chicken wire above all the fences in my mum's garden to stop her little dog scaling them after cats.  She would go over a 5' fence by running at getting as high as she could and scrambling over the rest.  Garden looked like Fort Knox when we had done it but at least she couldn't get out.  It was up to the cats to keep out of her way, we didn't try to stop her chasing them, her garden after all.  In later life this dog palled up with one of my cats and they used to chase each other up and down the hall.
In your shoes I would just make sure Ivy can't get out and the cats can take their chance.


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## Clodagh (16 May 2022)

Errin Paddywack said:



			We had to put chicken wire above all the fences in my mum's garden to stop her little dog scaling them after cats.  She would go over a 5' fence by running at getting as high as she could and scrambling over the rest.  Garden looked like Fort Knox when we had done it but at least she couldn't get out.  It was up to the cats to keep out of her way, we didn't try to stop her chasing them, her garden after all.  In later life this dog palled up with one of my cats and they used to chase each other up and down the hall.
In your shoes I would just make sure Ivy can't get out and the cats can take their chance.
		
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This completely.


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## fiwen30 (16 May 2022)

I think a lot of different things are true here.

Outdoor cats will often roam into gardens. It is a cat owner’s choice whether to let their cat roam or not. Some cats don’t tolerate indoor living, and vice versa. Some dogs will chase cats in their own gardens.

I believe all of the above are true, however I still couldn’t use any of those statements to logic away how wretched and guilty I would feel if a dog of mine killed a cat - even if it was ‘on my property’ - for the sake of me not having a quick check first.

You can go back and forth on who would be right and who would be wrong, but for me, if I knew I had a high drive dog who would kill a cat, I’d do everything I could to make sure that didn’t happen.


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## SaddlePsych'D (16 May 2022)

I would be really distressed if she got hold of a cat, it was a reminder just to do a quick check when we go out there. Chasing is one thing but with her speed, catching up is a very real possibility - I don't know if she would go for the kill but I certainly do not want to leave it to find out. We never see cats up this end of the garden, on the rare occasion we see one they are right down the far end which is fenced off to her. My copy of the Total Recall book is due to arrive today 😏 We didn't think about the climbing potential of the raised bed and log store, tbh she wasn't haven't great success scrambling up there but her height got her close to the top. We rent so there's not much we can do but will be checking more carefully before she goes out and supervising even more closely while she's outside. 

Her graze looks okay this morning, no bleeding and doesn't seem to be bothering her but will keep an eye and keep it clean.


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## Pearlsasinger (16 May 2022)

I think this takes the biscuit for irresponsible dog owners!

On Thursday we took our own 2 Labs and the 10 month old that we look after while her owner is at work to a local park.  One of ours was still recovering from her spay and was still wearing her vest, so only  allowed on-lead exercise and we had been taking them out and about to provide mental stimulation, instead of off-lead walking.
The park has a dog-friendly cafe, where you can sit in a conservatory or at outside tables.  We opted for inside and made for the disabled-friendly door.   Unfortunately  the outside table near to the door was inhabited by 2 women with 2 pug-type dogs, which were at the walkway end of their table.  The pugs started barking, snapping and snarling as we approached, looking for the push device on the wall to open the door.  Women laughed 'shut up' but did nothing to remove them out of our path..
We  settled ours at a table with sister and while I went to order, I heard the pugs barking and snapping again.
Later that day the pup's owner told us about a fb post where the owner of 2 pugs was boasting and laughing that her dogs had 'got an Asbo' at the cafe.   We assume that means that they are banned even from the outside tables.

What I really don't understand is why the 2 pugs hadn't been sat at the opposite end of the table, out of the way of passersby.  Goodness knows how a wheelchair user or someone with an assistance dog would have managed in that situation.


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## SaddlePsych'D (16 May 2022)

Turns out, nothing to worry about, I should just let Ivy get on with chasing stuff because that's what she wants to do and it will meet her needs so she magically won't want to do it anymore. Now I get the concept of giving appropriate outlets for dogs' various drives/jobs, but this was said in context of a social media 'dog trainer' whose philosophy seems to be just don't train your dog because it's mean to not let them be dogs. And was accompanied by a video of his sighthound chasing deer, with the caption 'how I stopped ny dog running off'... while it ran off. Admittedly it did give up halfway across the field but seems very unfair on the deer!

With 'professionals' like this no wonder there are so many owners who don't know/care about what their dogs are doing.


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## ellieb (18 May 2022)

I absolutely love greyhounds but the 'cat issue' is a big downside to them for me - with the usual caveat that I know some of them are fine with cats, but a lot of them are not - mine is a menace for them and as @SaddlePsych'D says they're fast enough to catch them. Leaving him unsupervised in the (secure) back garden is a worry and I generally choose not to do it because I've had cats jump down off the fences while he's been snoozing and had some very close calls. And it's sad, because he loves sunbathing and sleeping outside but despite assurances that it's his garden and would be a cat's fault for coming into 'his territory', I would still be so upset to have to tell a neighbour he'd killed one. Not to mention it probably wouldn't be in one piece when handing it over.


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## SaddlePsych'D (25 May 2022)

'Don't fling that in our direction' I thought on seeing ball launcher in hand of terrier's owner as they approached along the grass track. It was flung but not too far. 'Hmm' I thought, but surely not again as we got closer to passing each other? Ball was flung again, hit the ground near us and then rolled right at us with terrier flying after it, who then got grumpy at Ivy for being too close to the ball (very not Ivy's fault!) Owner apologised but did get a sharp 'yes thank you for that' from me. Like, can your dog not wait 10 seconds longer rather than flinging the ball at other people and their dog?!

On the plus side I was so pleased Ivy wasn't interested in joining the chase and didn't react to being ran and grumbled at.


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## Parrotperson (25 May 2022)

oh god yes. this. balls flung at you continually even when they have no idea how your dog will react and when you have it on a lead. 🙄


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## scats (25 May 2022)

Just out with my girls and we stopped and moved out the way so a rather flustered lady could get through a narrow bit with her lab.  Mine were on leads and her lab was. Lady seemed rather flustered as her dog pulled her over towards mine, telling me, “if he starts jumping, I can’t stop him” in an almost accusatory tone, like I shouldn’t be on the path. My dogs were nicely waiting and didn’t react when he shoved his face in theirs and invaded their space, while flustered woman attempted to drag lab away.
I felt like I’d done something wrong for daring to walk the same path!


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## Ratface (25 May 2022)

"Where it ain't,  you can't find it!". Quote from my granny.  I tend to agree.  "Let it pass, dear; let it pass". Another of granny's sayings.  Yep.  That one, too.


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## Smitty (25 May 2022)

AND another:  64 yo man killed whilst looking after his son's AB in N Wales.  Dog has been put down, even though according to daughter in law, "It was only playing"...   Apparently the dogs owner bred Abs.   

Hmm, my terrier is a bit uncouth and rough when he plays, but I have never been to the practice nurse, let alone died, as a result of injuries from him.


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## cauda equina (26 May 2022)

What was it playing, Squid Game?


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## AShetlandBitMeOnce (26 May 2022)

Smitty said:



			AND another:  64 yo man killed whilst looking after his son's AB in N Wales.  Dog has been put down, even though according to daughter in law, "It was only playing"...   Apparently the dogs owner bred Abs.  

Hmm, my terrier is a bit uncouth and rough when he plays, but I have never been to the practice nurse, let alone died, as a result of injuries from him.
		
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A bit of a dim question - by AB do you mean an American Bully? 
I wish I was shocked.. Saying it was only playing when someone has died is a new level of denial though I have to admit!


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## Tiddlypom (26 May 2022)

It was a American Bulldog. It bit him on the leg hard enough for his dil to see the blood through his clothing when she came through from the next room, and she tried to stem the bleeding by applying pressure. He then had a cardiac arrest. It's not clear yet if that was directly caused by the blood loss/injury or not.


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## CorvusCorax (26 May 2022)

I think it was a pocket bully. Unless things have changed dramatically, it looks a lot smaller than what I know as an American Bulldog. They used to be big rangy things.

Been bred from at least once.


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## AShetlandBitMeOnce (26 May 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			I think it was a pocket bully. Unless things have changed dramatically, it looks a lot smaller than what I know as an American Bulldog. They used to be big rangy things.

Been bred from at least once.
		
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One of these things?   Less than knee height but I'd still think they could put a sizeable dent in a leg!



Whereas this is an American Bully as I would recognise one:


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## bonny (26 May 2022)

The dog is described as an XL Bully, something needs to be done quickly to stop so many of them being bred.


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## Pearlsasinger (26 May 2022)

An elderly couple, their daughter and a Yorks terrier-type dog came to the next table.  At no point did any of them tell the dog to sit and it was wandering about, round their chairs/under the table.  Until, it sat on one of the chairs.  I'm not sure whether it jumped up or was picked up but I certainly heard the elderly woman say "That's better, you can see all around now".


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## CorvusCorax (26 May 2022)

I don't know if 'Bullies' and 'American Bulldogs' are the same thing or maybe they are sized differently.
A guy who was trying to introduce American Bulldogs to the UK/IRL stayed with us for a while, his female was large and white and looked like a massive boxer with a slightly longer snout/a Pit Bull on stilts. With a tail. Definitely taller than my own dogs and the one in the pic. Like I say, maybe things have changed, it was about 20 years ago.


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## Clodagh (26 May 2022)

I think, although I’m no expert on ‘killing dogs’ that an AB is as you describe, CC. Like the photo above.
An XL bully is a mutant looking thing, basically a giant version of a pocket bullie.


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## CorvusCorax (26 May 2022)

Actually what am I talking about I **do** know people who own/bred American Bulldogs in the UK 🙄
Looking at pics, they would be bigger/longer legged and more athletic than the pixtures of Cookie in the press, have full tails and ears etc but I suppose it's hard to tell from pictures.
I guess I am just confused by all the variants of 'bull' breeds/types.


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## Errin Paddywack (26 May 2022)

I see the dog concerned had cropped ears and was a fancy colour.  It was a pretty big dog, not one I would want to tangle with.  Her comment that her fil was the only person apart from her husband and herself that could handle it was worrying.


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## skinnydipper (26 May 2022)

Cookie's owner breeds XL bullys.

XL bully is a mix of pitbull and American bulldog.


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## CorvusCorax (26 May 2022)

Just saw on FB, what looks like a Mali crossed with a bull type or Akita, big old head on it, which is being rehomed, it was taken as a rescue by a family who were told it was a Labrador. Sigh.


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## Tiddlypom (26 May 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			Cookie's owner breeds XL bullys.

XL bully is a mix of pitbull and American bulldog.
		
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Cookie was a seriously ugly and unappealing dog, whatever breed he was . Just looking at the pic gives me the willies.


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## AShetlandBitMeOnce (26 May 2022)

What amazes me is that they were in possession of an illegally cropped dog, which has killed someone and thus is a dangerous dog.  Why on earth were they able to keep the other dogs in the household without any ramification or second thought at all?! Although looking at the owners, I am not one bit surprised that they felt they had to own a status dog. I don't think the dog looks horrible, just awfully mutilated and mis-trained clearly - not to mention obviously bred for colour. Poor thing. 
And yes, I know that it's not illegal to import cropped dogs, but it should be.


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## Cinnamontoast (26 May 2022)

Goose was attacked today by an off lead Belgian Malinois. Apparently it's been attacked by another dog and has since been funny with other dogs. I have a lot of sympathy, this is the same story as Zak, but we kept him away from other dogs. My OH just rang to tell me. He's on late shift this week so I don't see him unless he's sleeping. He said there was lots of squealing, he ran at the dog shouting.

Goose seems fine and knowing him, won't be bothered, his love for other dogs will never die, but I'm already wary of GSDs and Malinois after some unfortunate encounters over the years. I hope he is more resilient than Zak and doesn't 'turn'.


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## Amymay (26 May 2022)

Oh CT, that’s awful.  Hope there’s no lasting effects.  Why was it (the mal) off lead? 😡


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## SaddlePsych'D (26 May 2022)

CT that's so rubbish, poor Goose. I hope no serious injuries. Why are people so stupid!? I just don't understand.


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## Cinnamontoast (27 May 2022)

Amymay said:



			Oh CT, that’s awful.  Hope there’s no lasting effects.  Why was it (the mal) off lead? 😡
		
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The owner said it used to be fine. Well it’s bloody well not now, is it? Tosser. He needs to change his management of the dog. Goose is still so little. 😢 I’m so cross. He seems fine, no bite marks, running round like a lunatic as usual as evidenced in the photo thread. 

I’m sympathetic, honestly I am, if a dog got in Zak’s face, there would be a problem, but I’d leave the park if I saw a dog I know would be in his face. Our whole time out with him was thinking ahead and keeping other dogs safe. It’s half term next week, so I’ll be walking in the woods. The bit I go to isn’t full of other dogs. Hopefully we can have relaxing walks.


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## scats (27 May 2022)

Man with Rottweiler, who I have complained about on here before, let his JR chase my yard cat the other day.  Off lead on the yard (public footpath) and cat disappeared afterwards and I had to go home having not seen her.  Man was also almost pulled over, again, by Rottie.  He ‘jokingly’ blames me for getting the cat and trying to have him ‘killed’ everyday when the Rottie pulls to get the cat.  In this instance he’d let the JR off lead and it ran after my cat, so Rottie went to follow and man nearly ended up on the floor.  

When I expressed concern about my cat being chased by his off lead JR, he told me the dog is as slow as a tortoise and won’t catch her.  Oh, so that’s ok then.  My cat running frightened in her own home.

He then told me that the Rottie had broken two leads in the last few weeks and got away from him.  Great.  It’s a sweet dog but totally out of control and leaps all over you and mouths your arms and hands. 
He also trespasses on the private land of our yard but just argues when you tell him and says he’s walked it for years and he can do what he likes.


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## CorvusCorax (27 May 2022)

That's great that he can do what he likes, just ask if he and the dogs are insured if anything goes wrong, as he's not legally allowed to be there


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## YorksG (27 May 2022)

scats said:



			Man with Rottweiler, who I have complained about on here before, let his JR chase my yard cat the other day.  Off lead on the yard (public footpath) and cat disappeared afterwards and I had to go home having not seen her.  Man was also almost pulled over, again, by Rottie.  He ‘jokingly’ blames me for getting the cat and trying to have him ‘killed’ everyday when the Rottie pulls to get the cat.  In this instance he’d let the JR off lead and it ran after my cat, so Rottie went to follow and man nearly ended up on the floor. 

When I expressed concern about my cat being chased by his off lead JR, he told me the dog is as slow as a tortoise and won’t catch her.  Oh, so that’s ok then.  My cat running frightened in her own home.

He then told me that the Rottie had broken two leads in the last few weeks and got away from him.  Great.  It’s a sweet dog but totally out of control and leaps all over you and mouths your arms and hands.
He also trespasses on the private land of our yard but just argues when you tell him and says he’s walked it for years and he can do what he likes.
		
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Do either of his dogs every get in with stock(including horses)? If so, then report him to the police, as its an offence to allow out of control dogs to worry stock.


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## AShetlandBitMeOnce (27 May 2022)

Idle musing really but I was having a scroll through the Dogs Trust yesterday (I'm not targeting them, that's just who I looked at) and they had a few dogs with very specific management needs, for example a 2yo Cane Corso that had a muzzle agreement requirement, a Doberman that was strictly no children as it reacted badly to being roused when sleeping and a couple of American Bulldogs who were known not dog friendly, or nervous of strangers in the house and thus they said the dog needed to be walked in quiet areas and strangers introduced to the dog specifically.   

I was wondering whether it's the socially responsible thing to do to rehome these dogs rather than PTS - and I don't mean this based on breed, but the dog behaviour. I saw a chow chow and several Shar Pei's with nervous personality descriptions, and whilst I know they do their best, you cannot guarantee that people will always be as knowledgable as they seem, or will micro manage and not become complacent. They have hundreds and hundreds of dogs that need good homes, I think there needs to be some more scrutiny as to what dogs will be able to make good pets with the average owner. 

I also noticed a huge amount of 1-2 year old dogs of very expensive breeding on there where the description basically outlined a dog who cannot cope with life, being left alone or change - we are definitely seeing the outcome of the Covid morons already. Some of these dogs would have been £4000+ during lockdown..


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## Caol Ila (27 May 2022)

AShetlandBitMeOnce said:



			Idle musing really but I was having a scroll through the Dogs Trust yesterday (I'm not targeting them, that's just who I looked at) and they had a few dogs with very specific management needs, for example a 2yo Cane Corso that had a muzzle agreement requirement, a Doberman that was strictly no children as it reacted badly to being roused when sleeping and a couple of American Bulldogs who were known not dog friendly, or nervous of strangers in the house and thus they said the dog needed to be walked in quiet areas and strangers introduced to the dog specifically.  

I was wondering whether it's the socially responsible thing to do to rehome these dogs rather than PTS - and I don't mean this based on breed, but the dog behaviour. I saw a chow chow and several Shar Pei's with nervous personality descriptions, and whilst I know they do their best, you cannot guarantee that people will always be as knowledgable as they seem, or will micro manage and not become complacent. They have hundreds and hundreds of dogs that need good homes, I think there needs to be some more scrutiny as to what dogs will be able to make good pets with the average owner.

I also noticed a huge amount of 1-2 year old dogs of very expensive breeding on there where the description basically outlined a dog who cannot cope with life, being left alone or change - we are definitely seeing the outcome of the Covid morons already. Some of these dogs would have been £4000+ during lockdown..
		
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I just had an idle scroll through the Glasgow Dog's Trust site, and it seems as though over half the dogs require a garden with a 5 or 6ft fence, no children in the house, and they specify that it should be walked on-lead and muzzled, preferably in "dog-free" areas. Who can rehome these dogs? This is a city of 1.2 million people, most of whom live in flats, and most of the local parks are pretty busy with other dogs. 

Last year, a friend was thinking of getting a dog and we were scrolling through the rescue sites together. There weren't as many dogs who needed to be muzzled in public. People's poorly socialized lockdown animals are piling up at the rescues.


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## Clodagh (27 May 2022)

AShetlandBitMeOnce said:



			Idle musing really but I was having a scroll through the Dogs Trust yesterday (I'm not targeting them, that's just who I looked at) and they had a few dogs with very specific management needs, for example a 2yo Cane Corso that had a muzzle agreement requirement, a Doberman that was strictly no children as it reacted badly to being roused when sleeping and a couple of American Bulldogs who were known not dog friendly, or nervous of strangers in the house and thus they said the dog needed to be walked in quiet areas and strangers introduced to the dog specifically. 

I was wondering whether it's the socially responsible thing to do to rehome these dogs rather than PTS - and I don't mean this based on breed, but the dog behaviour. I saw a chow chow and several Shar Pei's with nervous personality descriptions, and whilst I know they do their best, you cannot guarantee that people will always be as knowledgable as they seem, or will micro manage and not become complacent. They have hundreds and hundreds of dogs that need good homes, I think there needs to be some more scrutiny as to what dogs will be able to make good pets with the average owner.

I also noticed a huge amount of 1-2 year old dogs of very expensive breeding on there where the description basically outlined a dog who cannot cope with life, being left alone or change - we are definitely seeing the outcome of the Covid morons already. Some of these dogs would have been £4000+ during lockdown..
		
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They should be pts. I actually agree with the US and Australian rehoming policy of behaviour test and if in doubt it’s pts. Yes it’s sad but not anywhere near as sad as if they kill someone’s pet or, heaven forbid, a person. I suspect it’s an unpopular view on here though!


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## Archangel (27 May 2022)

Clodagh said:



			I suspect it’s an unpopular view on here though!
		
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Not with me, I am meeting quite a few dogs now that look like they should be guarding sheep in the Carpathian Mountains.  The most recent appeared out of nowhere to chase me on my bike.  I tried to get off the bike but it was right on top of me and I am not sure how that would have ended had my dog not appeared out of the trees and body slammed it so hard it ran off.


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## smolmaus (27 May 2022)

I agree there are enough homeless dogs that the effort would be better spent finding homes for the ones without major behavioural issues. Putting a dog to sleep that finds it difficult or impossible to function in a normal family home is sad but so is living in a kennel for years, or being bounced around homes that think they can cope, and the dog will change... until the dog is there and they have to actually deal with the problem and can't.  

Plenty of well meaning people would howl and scream at the thought of a young and healthy dog being put down by a rescue but wouldn't take the time and resources to make *their* home fit. They just think someone else should do it.


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## AShetlandBitMeOnce (27 May 2022)

smolmaus said:



			I agree there are enough homeless dogs that the effort would be better spent finding homes for the ones without major behavioural issues. Putting a dog to sleep that finds it difficult or impossible to function in a normal family home is sad but so is living in a kennel for years, or being bounced around homes that think they can cope, and the dog will change... until the dog is there and they have to actually deal with the problem and can't. 

Plenty of well meaning people would howl and scream at the thought of a young and healthy dog being put down by a rescue but wouldn't take the time and resources to make *their* home fit. They just think someone else should do it.
		
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Agree, I'm also going to say that a dog that cannot cope with life/change to the level that some of these dogs can't (as per the decription on their profile thing) isn't and won't ever be a truly happy dog. It is living a constant state of fear/anxiety, even if managed as you can't remove all triggers forever.


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## Nasicus (27 May 2022)

Clodagh said:



			They should be pts. I actually agree with the US and Australian rehoming policy of behaviour test and if in doubt it’s pts. Yes it’s sad but not anywhere near as sad as if they kill someone’s pet or, heaven forbid, a person. I suspect it’s an unpopular view on here though!
		
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Unfortunately due to the amount of 'rescues' in the US pulling dangerous dogs out of the pounds, it's becoming more and more common for these PTS candidates to be allowed into inexperienced peoples homes, and out into the world. Usually of a certain type and breed too... The 'save them all' mentality is pervasive and detrimental.


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## CorvusCorax (27 May 2022)

AShetlandBitMeOnce said:



			Agree, I'm also going to say that a dog that cannot cope with life/change to the level that some of these dogs can't (as per the decription on their profile thing) isn't and won't ever be a truly happy dog. It is living a constant state of fear/anxiety, even if managed as you can't remove all triggers forever.
		
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This



smolmaus said:



			I agree there are enough homeless dogs that the effort would be better spent finding homes for the ones without major behavioural issues. Putting a dog to sleep that finds it difficult or impossible to function in a normal family home is sad but so is living in a kennel for years, or being bounced around homes that think they can cope, and the dog will change... until the dog is there and they have to actually deal with the problem and can't. 

Plenty of well meaning people would howl and scream at the thought of a young and healthy dog being put down by a rescue but wouldn't take the time and resources to make *their* home fit. They just think someone else should do it.
		
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And this.


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## splashgirl45 (27 May 2022)

I am another who thinks these dogs who need such specific conditions should be PTS.  They will never be happy in a normal home and it’s kinder to them and much better for other dog


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## splashgirl45 (27 May 2022)

Should say other dogs or people, don’t know why it missed out the last bit


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## Karran (27 May 2022)

Just been commenting on a Facebook group photo of a dog carrying a snail in his mouth and loads of people agreeing about them being a tasty snack for their dogs and me being a worry wart over nothing when I mentioned lungworm....


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## Pearlsasinger (27 May 2022)

Karran said:



			Just been commenting on a Facebook group photo of a dog carrying a snail in his mouth and loads of people agreeing about them being a tasty snack for their dogs and me being a worry wart over nothing when I mentioned lungworm....
		
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OMG!  My parents dog made herself quite ill crunching  snails before she could be stopped from doing so, nothing  to do with lungworm, they poisoned her, according to the vet.


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## scats (27 May 2022)

YorksG said:



			Do either of his dogs every get in with stock(including horses)? If so, then report him to the police, as its an offence to allow out of control dogs to worry stock.
		
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Fortunately no, or at least not that I’ve seen.  He does have to pass my fields quite close and then the footpath runs through my friends field but he does put the dogs on lead then.


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## SAujla (27 May 2022)

Karran said:



			Just been commenting on a Facebook group photo of a dog carrying a snail in his mouth and loads of people agreeing about them being a tasty snack for their dogs and me being a worry wart over nothing when I mentioned lungworm....
		
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Can't cure stupid (the other people, not you)


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## stangs (27 May 2022)

Karran said:



			Just been commenting on a Facebook group photo of a dog carrying a snail in his mouth and loads of people agreeing about them being a tasty snack for their dogs and me being a worry wart over nothing when I mentioned lungworm....
		
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The dangers for the dog aside, what happened to not letting pet dogs injure/kill wildlife? Completely irresponsible, liable to escalate, and shouldn’t constitute as a dog being under control imo.


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## Clodagh (27 May 2022)

stangs said:



			The dangers for the dog aside, what happened to not letting pet dogs injure/kill wildlife? Completely irresponsible, liable to escalate, and shouldn’t constitute as a dog being under control imo.
		
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Well it might be in their garden!?
Scout used to eat snails, it was a scramble to stop him. Thankfully he seems to have grown out of it.


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## TheresaW (27 May 2022)

stangs said:



			The dangers for the dog aside, what happened to not letting pet dogs injure/kill wildlife? Completely irresponsible, liable to escalate, and shouldn’t constitute as a dog being under control imo.
		
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I do let Luna (husky) kill the mixy rabbits at the field. Do my absolute best not to just let her kill Willy Nilly though.


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## Cinnamontoast (27 May 2022)

I'm sure all of mine have crunched up snails, much to my horror. I panicked about lungworm. Dunno how they all survived! Given I used to put down pellets/salt for slugs/snails before I had dogs, I can't be too bothered re them being killed. 

They've all caught birds in the garden. Brig went through a phase of bringing me a mangled pigeon (that he'd somehow caught) every time we went to the park. I was wrestling one one off him and wrangling Zak who promptly picked it up when another dog walker went past looking properly horrified.

My fil's dog used to fetch ducks from a far flung pond when we took him out. They never appeared harmed so were let go.


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## Moobli (27 May 2022)

This video is a good (if horrid) example of why it’s important not to let your off lead dog approach an on lead dog.

https://vm.tiktok.com/ZMLo657xK/?k=1


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## cauda equina (28 May 2022)

I don't know if the Dogs Trust still have the 'We never put a healthy dog down' policy
If so it would be worth thinking about their dogs' mental health, as in their ability to lead a fairly normal life, and not just physical health


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## The Fuzzy Furry (28 May 2022)

I posted this on the 'morning thread' but thought it worth duplicating here, from my hack out about 9.30 this morning:

Met 3 badly behaved dogs with appalling owners, 2 of which didn't even have a lead.
Was fortunately rescued from the last one by furious male owner of a gsd who popped his dog on a down stay and rushed over to grab the harness of the staffy that was trying to bite B.
My god he was on it immediately and clipped the dog onto his own lead and shoved a branch in its mouth in 2 quick manoeuvres! He then gave serious shyte to the hapless young man who was 'walking' it and called up the local nick. He took my details before I pootled off. V v glad he was out there!
According to another yard neighbour that same dog had chased two horses last weekend and caused 1 rider to come off, requiring medics out. Glad I have a very sensible B!


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## Cinnamontoast (28 May 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			Goose was attacked today by an off lead Belgian Malinois. Apparently it's been attacked by another dog and has since been funny with other dogs. I have a lot of sympathy, this is the same story as Zak, but we kept him away from other dogs. My OH just rang to tell me. He's on late shift this week so I don't see him unless he's sleeping. He said there was lots of squealing, he ran at the dog shouting.

Goose seems fine and knowing him, won't be bothered, his love for other dogs will never die, but I'm already wary of GSDs and Malinois after some unfortunate encounters over the years. I hope he is more resilient than Zak and doesn't 'turn'.
		
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I am delighted to say that we met several dogs in the woods today-it’s not normally that busy-and Goose was keen to say hello, although very intimidated by a Giant Schnauzer who begged him to play, lots of bouncy play bows. We spent a while with a beagle, his owner is a dog walker and was smitten by the puppies. It’s lovely to be able to speak to other owners!


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## cauda equina (28 May 2022)

The Fuzzy Furry said:



			I posted this on the 'morning thread' but thought it worth duplicating here, from my hack out about 9.30 this morning:

Met 3 badly behaved dogs with appalling owners, 2 of which didn't even have a lead.
Was fortunately rescued from the last one by furious male owner of a gsd who popped his dog on a down stay and rushed over to grab the harness of the staffy that was trying to bite B.
My god he was on it immediately and clipped the dog onto his own lead and shoved a branch in its mouth in 2 quick manoeuvres! He then gave serious shyte to the hapless young man who was 'walking' it and called up the local nick. He took my details before I pootled off. V v glad he was out there!
According to another yard neighbour that same dog had chased two horses last weekend and caused 1 rider to come off, requiring medics out. Glad I have a very sensible B!
		
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GSD man sounds like a complete star
I hope the police deal effectively with the idiot owner so he can't carry on letting his dog terrorise people


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## The Fuzzy Furry (28 May 2022)

cauda equina said:



			GSD man sounds like a complete star
I hope the police deal effectively with the idiot owner so he can't carry on letting his dog terrorise people
		
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I *think* gsd man might have been off duty plod, they do often pop out on the common for exercise. Here's hoping!


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## Amymay (28 May 2022)

The Fuzzy Furry said:



			I *think* gsd man might have been off duty plod, they do often pop out on the common for exercise. Here's hoping!
		
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Wouldn’t that be a bit of luck. Either way, what an amazing guy. So pleased you’re ok.


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## The Fuzzy Furry (28 May 2022)

Amymay said:



			Wouldn’t that be a bit of luck. Either way, what an amazing guy. So pleased you’re ok.
		
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It would be amazing,  but whoever he was, am v v grateful!


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## Moobli (28 May 2022)

The Fuzzy Furry said:



			I *think* gsd man might have been off duty plod, they do often pop out on the common for exercise. Here's hoping!
		
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My immediate thoughts were, I bet he’s an off duty policeman.


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## CorvusCorax (28 May 2022)

Def a peeler lol. My old trainer once left his twat of a Mali in a ten minute down stay while he fished a kid out of the water. He was most proud of the down stay.


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## fiwen30 (28 May 2022)

The Fuzzy Furry said:



			I posted this on the 'morning thread' but thought it worth duplicating here, from my hack out about 9.30 this morning:

Met 3 badly behaved dogs with appalling owners, 2 of which didn't even have a lead.
Was fortunately rescued from the last one by furious male *owner of a gsd who popped his dog on a down stay* and rushed over to grab the harness of the staffy that was trying to bite B.
My god he was on it immediately and clipped the dog onto his own lead and shoved a branch in its mouth in 2 quick manoeuvres! He then gave serious shyte to the hapless young man who was 'walking' it and called up the local nick. He took my details before I pootled off. V v glad he was out there!
According to another yard neighbour that same dog had chased two horses last weekend and caused 1 rider to come off, requiring medics out. Glad I have a very sensible B!
		
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I’d say anyone who can put their dog in a reliable down stay, especially while there are shenanigans going on(!), could easily be a professional of some description these days!


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## The Fuzzy Furry (28 May 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			Def a peeler lol. My old trainer once left his twat of a Mali in a ten minute down stay while he fished a kid out of the water. He was most proud of the down stay.
		
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I know most of them tho, plus the retired ones out exercising,  I just hadn't seen this chap before. 
I used to be v proud of my v sharp GSD when she would do a down stay anywhere,  she was a fab dog for bringing in the ponies from the top fields in winter as knew her cast left and right commands too 😎


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## Clodagh (28 May 2022)

Hopefully if he was a policeman they might actually do something about the dog, as well!


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## Clodagh (28 May 2022)

I was the irresponsible owner today. I went to see my mum and took Pen and Ffee. They get very excited as they sit on her sofa and eat their own body weight in biscuits. I parked outside, checked the street was clear and let them out. They ran to her ground floor apartment but next door (upstairs) was open so they bowled in there and belted up the stairs. 🙈. Next door were sitting down to breakfast with their two cats. 🙈🙈🙈. Thankfully the labs were so appalled by the strange people they belted back down the stairs again. Poor cats. 
Luckily mum is good friends with them and I apologised like mad.


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## Pearlsasinger (28 May 2022)

Ours are not allowed upstairs at home but if they ever get the opportunity to run upstairs when we are visiting, they love to explore!  Not helped by the fact that when the pup who we dog-sit got too big for the owner to carry upstairs, she asked our 2 to show the pup how to do stairs. They were more than happy to oblige!


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## Clodagh (28 May 2022)

Pearlsasinger said:



			Ours are not allowed upstairs at home but if they ever get the opportunity to run upstairs when we are visiting, they love to explore!  Not helped by the fact that when the pup who we dog-sit got too big for the owner to carry upstairs, she asked our 2 to show the pup how to do stairs. They were more than happy to oblige!
		
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Now Scout, who is no mental giant, once got upstairs and could not work how to get down again. 😳


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## Pearlsasinger (28 May 2022)

Clodagh said:



			Now Scout, who is no mental giant, once got upstairs and could not work how to get down again. 😳
		
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We had an over-sized black Lab dog who found that he couldn't do the stairs to get down from the top deck of a bus!  He ended up going down backwards.  Quite  a feat really


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## Moobli (28 May 2022)

Clodagh said:



			Now Scout, who is no mental giant, once got upstairs and could not work how to get down again. 😳
		
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😂. I rehomed a 3 year old sheepdog whose owner sadly died.  He had never been in a house, never mind upstairs.  He followed me up and then didn’t have a clue how to get down again. I tried  coaxing, food, put a lead on him but nope!  I ended up carrying him down but the next time he went up, he just followed me back down again as though it had never been a problem 😂


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## Caol Ila (28 May 2022)

Today's irresponsible dog owner was a woman with a terrier. Announced we were "her first horse" as we went past, but did not put doggie on a lead. Next thing I know, terrier is running after me, nipping at Fin's heels. I stopped him and turned to face dog. It backed off, but kept barking while dodging its owner's attempts to catch it and ignoring her recalls. I tried slowly walking on again, and it was back under my horse's feet, yapping. I didn't want to end up a mile away from the owner with this damned thing, so I had to wait around until she caught it. Luckily, Foinavon found the terrier pretty unthreatening and was calm and sensible about the whole thing.


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## Cinnamontoast (28 May 2022)

Clodagh said:



			Now Scout, who is no mental giant, once got upstairs and could not work how to get down again. 😳
		
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I‘m wetting myself at this! Poor lad!

I‘m probably being very cautious, but bar accidental (read naughty) incursions, I’m keeping the creatures downstairs. They’re very good to be fair, particularly when Bear is very familiar with upstairs 😳You never take a bath alone when you have a springer. 😂


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## fiwen30 (29 May 2022)

Speaking of ASBO collies over on the collie thread, my boy and I just got harassed by an unaccompanied border collie in the middle of our concrete suburban route. Neither one of us saw or heard it coming, until it had it’s nose up under my lad’s tail, and then it got a gob full from both of us. No collar or tags on it, even if I had been inclined to try and secure it.

Kept following us up the road, though I kept turning to body block it as my boy was giving it low growls. Had to chuck the end of my long lead at it and use my ‘stop that right now’ voice at it, before it would go away. It barely glanced at me the whole time, it was just focused solely on my dog, which was quite intimidating.

I’m sure it’s probably a local one which just got out of the garden, but I wouldn’t want to have met it with a less tolerant dog.


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## Clodagh (30 May 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			I‘m wetting myself at this! Poor lad!

I‘m probably being very cautious, but bar accidental (read naughty) incursions, I’m keeping the creatures downstairs. They’re very good to be fair, particularly when Bear is very familiar with upstairs 😳You never take a bath alone when you have a springer. 😂
		
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A don’t even ask, but I rode my horse up a flight of steps once and she couldn’t get back down either. It was terrifying, she was the boldest hunter but just couldn’t work it out. I thought she was going to try to jump. I had to dismount and lead her back down, very slowly indeed. Never again 🙈


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## Cinnamontoast (30 May 2022)

Clodagh said:



			A don’t even ask, but I rode my horse up a flight of steps once and she couldn’t get back down either. It was terrifying, she was the boldest hunter but just couldn’t work it out. I thought she was going to try to jump. I had to dismount and lead her back down, very slowly indeed. Never again 🙈
		
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You need to explain that one!


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## rabatsa (31 May 2022)

Clodagh said:



			A don’t even ask, but I rode my horse up a flight of steps once and she couldn’t get back down either. It was terrifying, she was the boldest hunter but just couldn’t work it out. I thought she was going to try to jump. I had to dismount and lead her back down, very slowly indeed. Never again 🙈
		
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Terry Pratchett had a donkey up a minaret in one of his books.


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## Cinnamontoast (31 May 2022)

Is it an urban myth about taking a horse upstairs for luck-in Ireland?


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## CorvusCorax (31 May 2022)

Most things about Ireland, especially Ireland and horses, are.


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## cauda equina (31 May 2022)

Going up, I don't know if they come down the same way


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## The Fuzzy Furry (31 May 2022)

cauda equina said:



			Going up, I don't know if they come down the same way






Click to expand...

Staff college RMA 😊

Edit. Not usually,  big enough hall behind and decent corridors so can exit in various places.
We used to love the hunt ball there, was a great setting, tho this was a good 18-20 years ago when we last went.


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## quizzie (31 May 2022)

I ”think “ they use a wooden ramp to come down afterwards!


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## MurphysMinder (31 May 2022)

A pub near me used to have medieval banquets in an upstairs banqueting hall approached by steep stone stairs.   The highlight was a stuntmen riding a horse up the stairs and round the hall.   His name was Gerald Naprous and he went on to form the Devils Horsemen, a stunt team which do a lot of film work .


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## Nasicus (31 May 2022)

My first mare would happily storm up and down stairs when ridden, we used to joke she could have gone down into the garden if not for a tight turn and her wide gut!


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## Cinnamontoast (31 May 2022)

The woods I've been taking the dogs to this week has some very set apart steps. We've always called them the horse steps. There's a yard with a track to the woods (I had lots of lessons there back in the day). I did a hack round there one day. The steps are shallow for a horse, but quite steep for humans. I'll take a picture if ever we go that way. Currently, I'm doing the flat bit, I'm too unfit for the steep bits!


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## Snowfilly (2 June 2022)

There’s some steps in Bristol that the mounted police seem to positively enjoy riding up and down for no reason other than the hell of it!


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## fiwen30 (3 June 2022)

15 week old collie x Pomeranian (of all things), being flogged on gumtree. It’s owner has apparently only just realised that they have to go to work, and it’s ‘not fair on the dog’. Why they only came to this conclusion a scant few weeks into owning a puppy, I don’t know. I suspect it’s starting to look less cute, the older it gets. At least they’re only asking £100, as opposed to the 1k plus that most things are listed for right now.

Poor sod, it looks sweet too.


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## fiwen30 (3 June 2022)

Or how about the breeder of ‘frenchie peis’, the questionable cross between a French bulldog and a shar pei. The actual advert itself describes this ‘breed’ as being stand-off, apt to guard beds and toys in the home, and have ‘a tendency to sniffle and snort, due to their respiratory issues, and short snouts’(!!!). These stellar qualities can be yours for the low low (reduced several times) price of £400.


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## Clodagh (3 June 2022)

fiwen30 said:



			Or how about the breeder of ‘frenchie peis’, the questionable cross between a French bulldog and a shar pei. The actual advert itself describes this ‘breed’ as being stand-off, apt to guard beds and toys in the home, and have ‘a tendency to sniffle and snort, due to their respiratory issues, and short snouts’(!!!). These stellar qualities can be yours for the low low (reduced several times) price of £400.
		
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I suppose you can only be thankful that the market has collapsed. But poor dogs.


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## skinnydipper (3 June 2022)

https://scontent-lhr8-1.xx.fbcdn.ne..._nOfPRfhiwsid1gogG6QgL2tz7EHq3WNQ&oe=62A02161


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## Moobli (3 June 2022)

skinnydipper said:



https://scontent-lhr8-1.xx.fbcdn.ne..._nOfPRfhiwsid1gogG6QgL2tz7EHq3WNQ&oe=62A02161

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Wtf! 😳


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## cauda equina (3 June 2022)

Bloody hell!


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## SilverLinings (3 June 2022)

I hope that photo makes it's way to social services, what the actual %^&$ was the parent/carer thinking?!


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## limestonelil (3 June 2022)

Oh glory be. Wait for the next savaged child and bewildered parents news report. Where has common sense disappeared to. For the sake of a cutesy video clip.


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## CorvusCorax (3 June 2022)

JFHC


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## SAujla (3 June 2022)

That is worse than being irresponsible, that is disgraceful


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## skinnydipper (3 June 2022)

117 k likes.


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## Cinnamontoast (3 June 2022)

skinnydipper said:



https://scontent-lhr8-1.xx.fbcdn.ne..._nOfPRfhiwsid1gogG6QgL2tz7EHq3WNQ&oe=62A02161

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That’s absolutely horrific. Just why? Not big or clever.


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## Pearlsasinger (3 June 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			117 k likes.
		
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The only thing I can think of to say is 'Why?.  Does nobody have a brain cell?'


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## splashgirl45 (7 June 2022)

i was out walking with my puppy in a pet stroller and my 2 little terriers when i saw an off white german shepherd type who i have seen before and i dont like his body language so i got to the edge of the path to leave him plenty of room to pass with my 2 terriers next to me.  the blooming thing came bounding over with its hackles up, my older terrier ignored it but my younger one ran as she was scared.  i asked the twit to call his dog away as mine was scared and he ignored my request and said he is ok he is only getting to know other dogs, so i said i have asked you politely would you please call your dog as mine is frightened, so he said well it should be on a lead.....he had to grab his dog as it didnt come to call.....spoilt my morning, i know when a dog is harmless but this one is an accident waiting to happen due to the idiot owners behaviour....


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## skinnydipper (7 June 2022)

This is one of my posts from 3 years ago.

_I was at a community woodland when I saw a woman approaching with the tiniest of poodles complete with hair bows, attached to their ears! I called my dog and took him to one side (I thought that was a good clue that we didn't want to interact)._

_I waited for her to put her dogs on leads to pass. One dog totally ignored her pleas to return to her and continued towards us. She called to me "It's okay, he'll sort it out" Me - "Who? who will sort it out?" She said "The big dog. The big dog will tell her off, she'll take notice of that"_

_I wanted to say "Are you mad?" Her dog was the size of my dog's head and she wanted my dog to "sort it out". Where do you start with that?_

_I pointed out that actually it was quite unfair to my dog to expect him to do any such thing._

_I often get "it'll do her/him good to get told off, he/she needs to learn". Well bloody well teach it then, don't expect my dog to train it, that's your job._

So today, same woodland, I was with my GSD's successor, she is somewhat larger than he was. Guess who we saw. Now she has 3 tiny poodles. They were about 50 yards away when all 3 rang at the big girl, barking at her. This time I detected a note of panic in the owner's voice as she frantically shouted for the little darlings.  Big girl clearly exceeded the size threshold.

We stood quietly waiting for them all to return to the owner, one was fairly persistent.  The owner then turned and went the other way. 

On the face of it the big girl was calm throughout but I knew by her shake off that she had found the encounter stressful.  It's such a shame that she has to put up with this nonsense.

Could the people who would call today's display "small dog syndrome" tell me what they would call it if my dog had done it?


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## splashgirl45 (7 June 2022)

As an owner of small dogs if I see another dog on lead I call mine and put them on
Leads till we are past… I do it out of politeness and in case my little dogs get hurt,  the last thing I want is a dog fight, a friend of mine doesn’t do this and calls out to the other dogs owner, it’s ok she’s friendly..I have tried to explain why she is wrong but it falls on deaf ears. This friend also can’t understand why I won’t let my puppy walk in the park with other dogs who may or may not be vaccinated.  We almost fell out as she insisted that as soon as they have had their first vaccination it’s fine to walk them  , which is not what my vet has said..


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## CrunchieBoi (7 June 2022)

I often wonder if folks with small dogs think they have less of a requirement to teach them to behave around other dogs as the approach taken here always seems to be to just whip them away when they start up (thats if they're on a lead). 

Harder to do with a big mutt and so perhaps more pressure for an owner to sort out. Certainly doesn't apply to all small dog owners but a 5-7kg dog making a lunge is easier to keep hold of than a 30-40kg dog doing the same.

There used to be a small black and white shitzu type dog that we bumped into occasionally if we were in town and it was always off lead and always trying to pick fights with bigger dogs, running around them snapping and barking. I never see it now, and often wonder if it decided to try it on with the wrong dog.


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## splashgirl45 (7 June 2022)

I try very hard to have mine well trained but it’s a challenge.. if you want an easy dog don’t go for a terrier😀😀my collie cross was born trained  and my lurchers have been fine as long as there is no wild life, I had a terrier when I was young and don’t remember her being so independent as my latest 2 ..


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## skinnydipper (7 June 2022)

CrunchieBoi said:



			I often wonder if folks with small dogs think they have less of a requirement to teach them to behave around other dogs as the approach taken here always seems to be to just whip them away when they start up (thats if they're on a lead).

Harder to do with a big mutt and so perhaps more pressure for an owner to sort out. Certainly doesn't apply to all small dog owners but a 5-7kg dog making a lunge is easier to keep hold of than a 30-40kg dog doing the same.

There used to be a small black and white shitzu type dog that we bumped into occasionally if we were in town and it was always off lead and always trying to pick fights with bigger dogs, running around them snapping and barking. I never see it now, and often wonder if it decided to try it on with the wrong dog.
		
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To be fair, we do meet some lovely small dogs and a little Shih Tzu met her yesterday.  They very politely greeted each other and the owner told me that the little chap is normally frightened of large dogs.


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## Amymay (7 June 2022)

CrunchieBoi said:



			I often wonder if folks with small dogs think they have less of a requirement to teach them to behave around other dogs as the approach taken here always seems to be to just whip them away when they start up (thats if they're on a lead).

Harder to do with a big mutt and so perhaps more pressure for an owner to sort out. Certainly doesn't apply to all small dog owners but a 5-7kg dog making a lunge is easier to keep hold of than a 30-40kg dog doing the same.

There used to be a small black and white shitzu type dog that we bumped into occasionally if we were in town and it was always off lead and always trying to pick fights with bigger dogs, running around them snapping and barking. I never see it now, and often wonder if it decided to try it on with the wrong dog.
		
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Owner of two small breed dogs here. Impeccably behaved around other dogs. I adore them too much not to have trained them.


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## The Fuzzy Furry (7 June 2022)

Amymay said:



			Owner of two small breed dogs here. Impeccably behaved around other dogs. I adore them too much not to have trained them.
		
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Yup, owner of 1 small very well behaved Shih Tzu here too


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## maisie06 (7 June 2022)

The Fuzzy Furry said:



			I *think* gsd man might have been off duty plod, they do often pop out on the common for exercise. Here's hoping!
		
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Sounds like it from the description of the way he dealt with the staffy...


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## Cinnamontoast (7 June 2022)

Amymay said:



			Owner of two small breed dogs here. Impeccably behaved around other dogs. I adore them too much not to have trained them.
		
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Mine are good with other dogs, too good, they are desperate to say hello. It’s an ongoing thing to take them past other dogs and praise them when they stop trying to go back to them. I hope they’ll eventually realise that they don’t have to socialise with every single other dog on the planet. It’s funny, but if they come across a dog they’ve already met, it’s a quick sniff to say hello and move on. Eventually, we’ll have met all the dogs in the woods (in about 10 years!)


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## Caol Ila (8 June 2022)

Out on a walk with my horse, my friend, and her dog, and OH. Friend's dog was attacked by a dog a couple years ago, so he's wary and defensive with strange dogs. She keeps him on a lead when there are lots of dogs around. Another dog walker approached with a small fluffy thing, off-lead, which made a beeline towards friend's dog.  Friend's dog showed all the unhappy body language, but Small Fluffy Thing kept coming. Owner called it, to no avail, then attempted to catch it, but it had zero recall and kept evading owner's attempts to grab it. Friend's dog snarled and lunged when it got too close. But it would just dodge his teeth and come straight back. Not aggressive (as far as I could tell), just overly friendly and dumb as a box of rocks. It had enough sense to not get too close to the horse, so I positioned him in front of my friend and her dog and used him to drive it back to the owner. Owner laughed, saying, "She's so daft. She just doesn't understand dog body language." Or recall, apparently, which means it probably should not be off lead in a super busy park.

It's no wonder that most trail systems in Boulder require all dogs to be on lead all the time. It's a shame for all the well-trained dogs, but there are too many idiot owners out there.


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## asmp (9 June 2022)

Out hacking on a lane near us with daughter yesterday afternoon.  Could see a woman with a pug (?) dog on a lead in the distance straining and barking at us. She started shouting at us and when we got closer (at a walk) we could hear she was telling us to keep away and even told us to turn around and go the other way.  We refused as we were on a public road and it would have meant a long backtrack.  She dragged straining/barking dog into a driveway and then proceeded to shout at us while we were passing and for the next few minutes as she followed us as we rode down the road.  

We’ve seen the dog before in the next village in its garden and it barks like hell at anyone riding past.  

Just wanted to vent!


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## DirectorFury (9 June 2022)

asmp said:



			Out hacking on a lane near us with daughter yesterday afternoon.  Could see a woman with a pug (?) dog on a lead in the distance straining and barking at us. She started shouting at us and when we got closer (at a walk) we could hear she was telling us to keep away and even told us to turn around and go the other way.  We refused as we were on a public road and it would have meant a long backtrack.  She dragged straining/barking dog into a driveway and then proceeded to shout at us while we were passing and for the next few minutes as she followed us as we rode down the road. 

We’ve seen the dog before in the next village in its garden and it barks like hell at anyone riding past. 

Just wanted to vent!
		
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I had this on a bridlepath with a footpath that runs parallel to it. Nutter lady claimed her dog was scared of horses (her dog didn't look like it gave a single sh1t) and got very abusive when I asked why she was on the bridlepath and not the footpath!


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## Archangel (9 June 2022)

asmp said:



			Could see a woman with a pug (?) dog on a lead in the distance straining and barking at us. She started shouting at us and when we got closer (at a walk) we could hear she was telling us to keep away and even told us to turn around and go the other way.
		
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I like pugs but their owners do seem to be a bit bonkers and prone to shouting.


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## asmp (9 June 2022)

DirectorFury said:



			I had this on a bridlepath with a footpath that runs parallel to it. Nutter lady claimed her dog was scared of horses (her dog didn't look like it gave a single sh1t) and got very abusive when I asked why she was on the bridlepath and not the footpath!
		
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She did say he was scared of horses - didn’t look like it to me.  Think he wanted to take a chunk out of one of them 😡


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## SaddlePsych'D (10 June 2022)

I was the shouty owner today. 😳 In fairness the westie had come racing up behind us, having just passed each other on lead a few moments before with seemingly no issue. It was properly barking and growling, repeatedly rushing in trying to get to Ivy who was completely oblivious as usual! I'm never quite sure if I'm doing the right thing in these situations but there was a lot of blocking and shouting "oi!" to fend it off. At least the owner did promptly get it back on lead and seemed to genuinely apologise.


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## skinnydipper (10 June 2022)

Our walk yesterday was spoilt again by hoodie man and his 2 dogs.  He makes no attempt to call them and lets them run at other dogs barking aggressively.  It's not nice.


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## Clodagh (10 June 2022)

This is just a general moan. We went to the Royal Cornwall show yesterday. It was heaving. It seemed compulsory to have at least two dogs, maybe up to five. Dachshunds very popular, why anyone would think something 6” high would want to walk in a crowd.
And the number of cocker spaniels having meltdowns, and the number of muzzled dogs. And chronically lame ones. 
Our dogs stayed at home btw. They’d have hated every minute.


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## Pearlsasinger (10 June 2022)

Clodagh said:



			This is just a general moan. We went to the Royal Cornwall show yesterday. It was heaving. It seemed compulsory to have at least two dogs, maybe up to five. Dachshunds very popular, why anyone would think something 6” high would want to walk in a crowd.
And the number of cocker spaniels having meltdowns, and the number of muzzled dogs. And chronically lame ones.
Our dogs stayed at home btw. They’d have hated every minute.
		
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We went to Bramham yesterday with our dogs, who enjoyed it!  Thursday is a quiet day there, so we used it to introduce them to more people than they are used to.  We didn't actually see much of the dressage ourselves, because we were concentrating on the dogs but they sat quietly at the side of the dressage rings, where they got to talk to a little girl, who isn't confident with dogs but donated some ice-cream to them, and then we took them to the food area where they thoroughly enjoyed some chips. After a short walk between the shops, we went home.  It was a very useful day but as busy as they can cope with currently.  We shall continue their education at local agricultural shows, hopefully.


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## Cinnamontoast (11 June 2022)

I’ve had multiple notifications from my neighbourhood app about dogs being attacked in the park we were going to take the pups to for their first swim. I’m looking elsewhere therefore.


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## Clodagh (11 June 2022)

Pearlsasinger said:



			We went to Bramham yesterday with our dogs, who enjoyed it!  Thursday is a quiet day there, so we used it to introduce them to more people than they are used to.  We didn't actually see much of the dressage ourselves, because we were concentrating on the dogs but they sat quietly at the side of the dressage rings, where they got to talk to a little girl, who isn't confident with dogs but donated some ice-cream to them, and then we took them to the food area where they thoroughly enjoyed some chips. After a short walk between the shops, we went home.  It was a very useful day but as busy as they can cope with currently.  We shall continue their education at local agricultural shows, hopefully.
		
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I did actually think of you while we were there, which shows I’m struggling with my real v forum life balance. 😄


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## Pearlsasinger (11 June 2022)

Clodagh said:



			I did actually think of you while we were there, which shows I’m struggling with my real v forum life balance. 😄
		
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We would have taken the Rottweilers, who grew up going to shows from 12 weeks old, to Cheshire Show this year but we won't be taking the Labs, they need much more gentle exposure to gradually increasing numbers of people, before we do that, if we ever do.  The Rotts loved going to shows because everyone wanted to talk to them but Labs are 2 a penny, as witnessed at Bramham, this year, so don't attract anywhere near as many admirers.  We were extremely pleased by their behaviour at Bramham, though, as, of course, they hardly went anywhere during the last 2 years - they are good at going out for breakfast/lunch, though!


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## Clodagh (11 June 2022)

Mine have all been to point to points this year but it bores them to tears so I have given up. Scout quite enjoys himself, he’s young enough to embrace stuff. 
the olds all get hysterical as they think we are going shooting and then are very disappointed when we arrive 😄


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## Pearlsasinger (11 June 2022)

Clodagh said:



			Mine have all been to point to points this year but it bores them to tears so I have given up. Scout quite enjoys himself, he’s young enough to embrace stuff.
the olds all get hysterical as they think we are going shooting and then are very disappointed when we arrive 😄
		
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Yes, I'm not sure that ours would enjoy p-t-p, there wouldn't be enough happening.  And what about food?   They do love going anywhere in the car, though.  Next experience is a trip to the coast.  Ours went last year but it will be new to the 3rd one.


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## CorvusCorax (11 June 2022)

I used to take mine to P2P, there's usually a few food vans or I took sandwiches.


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## Pearlsasinger (11 June 2022)

Well yes, I expect there will be.  It might be something to bear in mind for the winter, as whenever I have been p-t-p, there certainly hasn't been a crowd.


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## Boulty (11 June 2022)

Was at Bramham today. Counted 3 loose dogs (luckily only 1 was when a horse was going past), 1 on lead dog nearly ran over by loose horse as owners not paying attention (they had soooo much time to clock it was coming their way & get the dog on a shorter lead) & countless dogs barking (normally small packs them) at every horse / dog that went past.  

I took Hen on Friday & he was mostly good (a bit excited & he also doesn't quite get that stalls are "inside" & not for peeing in so we only went into ones where I had a definite want to buy something & he was kept away from walls & merchandise!) but would not have dreamt of taking him today as although he's generally good with horses he's not worked out they can go fast / gallop yet.  Don't want him to find out until we're totally on top of his car chasing as worried he'll become one of the barky annoyances.  Going to have to take him tomorrow when ideally I wouldn't due to busyness as have as nobody to look after him (but at least I'll have someone else with me so we can take turns & one of us can take him to explore the empty XC course if he gets a bit overwhelmed or bored.) He's pretty good at tucking away under a bench tbf, just tends to get bored & need to go for a wander every few hours


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## Boulty (12 June 2022)

To be fair to the hooligan he was a very good boy today.  Chewed on a bully stick for a while then had a nap. Had a minor panic attack when there was a sudden burst of applause when he was fast asleep under a bench but cuddles made it better (& then took him away from the ring before the prize giving so he didn't end up in the middle of loads of noise)  He definitely enjoyed doing some dog & people watching but also enjoyed having a mooch around some of the XC course & watching a bit of arena eventing where it was a lot quieter in terms of crowds.  Also had a go at some agility in a rather overenthusiastic, bull in a China shop way.


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## blackcob (14 June 2022)

A man and a woman have been jailed after a 10-year-old boy was mauled to death by a dog near where he lived.
Jack Lis died following the attack at a house in Caerphilly on 8 November 2021.
Brandon Hayden, 19, from Penyrheol, Caerphilly, was jailed for four-and-a-half years at Cardiff Crown Court after admitting owning or being in charge of a dangerously out of control dog.
Amy Salter, 29, of Trethomas, Caerphilly, was jailed for three years for the same offence.
The court was shown CCTV of Brandon Hayden and Amy Salter with their dog, Beast in Caerphilly.
		
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Sorry, I couldn't find the previous thread where this dog was discussed, but this is the first time I've seen this CCTV footage in full and thought it worth sharing. The person who'd shared it on FB described it as 'the gradual process of weaponising a dog' which is just such an awful concept.


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## Amymay (14 June 2022)

I think the dog was already ‘weaponised’. I’ve struggled with the fact that it had bitten two people (while in this man’s care, in the days leading up to this poor boys death.  Were the incidents reported? And if so, why did he still have ‘Beast’?

Wow, it was totally fixated on that little girl.


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## Alwaysmoretoknow (14 June 2022)

What total scum. They absolutely deserved the prison sentence they got - wish it had been longer. That poor dog was turned into something as dangerous as an AK-47 by their horrific treatment of it.


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## Amymay (14 June 2022)

Alwaysmoretoknow said:



			That poor dog was turned into something as dangerous as an AK-47 by their horrific treatment of it.
		
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In no way defending them, or the behaviour shown, but they’d only had him a very short time. He arrived like that.


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## Cinnamontoast (14 June 2022)

I always tell people that a dog aggressive animal does not automatically equate to one which will attack a child (some hysteria on the neighbourhood app after a dog on dog attack this week) but omg, that dog definitely wants that little girl. 😢The whole thing is tragic.


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## CrunchieBoi (14 June 2022)

Amymay said:



			In no way defending them, or the behaviour shown, but they’d only had him a very short time. He arrived like that.
		
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Is it not the new owners that can be seen kicking and punching the lights out of it on the CCTV then? I'm a bit confused.


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## Amymay (15 June 2022)

CrunchieBoi said:



			Is it not the new owners that can be seen kicking and punching the lights out of it on the CCTV then? I'm a bit confused.
		
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Yes it is.


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## AShetlandBitMeOnce (15 June 2022)

skinnydipper said:



https://scontent-lhr8-1.xx.fbcdn.ne..._nOfPRfhiwsid1gogG6QgL2tz7EHq3WNQ&oe=62A02161

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I'm late to the party, sorry! What was this video of?

ETA: That was a terrible turn of phrase for a thread like this, sorry!


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## SAujla (15 June 2022)

Walking my dog down the canal today and saw a mother with her teenage son and their dog. The dog was looking into the water and the son pushed her into the canal, it was squealing and had to be helped out whilst the son was laughing. As we walked past I said I don't think she liked that and got told she was fine and loved it


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## AShetlandBitMeOnce (15 June 2022)

Clodagh said:



			This is just a general moan. We went to the Royal Cornwall show yesterday. It was heaving. It seemed compulsory to have at least two dogs, maybe up to five. Dachshunds very popular, why anyone would think something 6” high would want to walk in a crowd.
And the number of cocker spaniels having meltdowns, and the number of muzzled dogs. And chronically lame ones.
Our dogs stayed at home btw. They’d have hated every minute.
		
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Oh my god, the South Of England show was horrendous...  one lady had two dog reactive staffies she could barely hold, unmuzzled. I saw them try to lunge and snap at dogs at least three times. People with 4 dogs, dogs ringside on for the showjumping barking and jumping at the end of their lead, people with stupid extendable leads getting wrapped around legs, people with Pom's/Chow Chows/Brachy dogs just sitting in the blazing sunshine for hours rather than in the shade. One woman who was spraying a water spray in the face of her Shit Zhu every time it barked at something/someone (about every 2 mins), someone with 4 small dogs crammed in a push chair, lame dogs, elderly dogs and lots of foot squashable size dogs... I genuinely despair.


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## BallyRoanBaubles (15 June 2022)

SAujla said:



			Walking my dog down the canal today and saw a mother with her teenage son and their dog. The dog was looking into the water and the son pushed her into the canal, it was squealing and had to be helped out whilst the son was laughing. As we walked past I said I don't think she liked that and got told she was fine and loved it
		
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Wow I have no words for this!


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## skinnydipper (15 June 2022)

AShetlandBitMeOnce said:



			I'm late to the party, sorry! What was this video of?

ETA: That was a terrible turn of phrase for a thread like this, sorry!
		
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It was a still taken from a video of a baby's 'caregiver' throwing a cheese slice onto baby's head for a husky to take it and eat it.


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## CorvusCorax (15 June 2022)

blackcob said:










Sorry, I couldn't find the previous thread where this dog was discussed, but this is the first time I've seen this CCTV footage in full and thought it worth sharing. The person who'd shared it on FB described it as 'the gradual process of weaponising a dog' which is just such an awful concept.
		
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It's chilling to watch.


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## CorvusCorax (15 June 2022)

This is a trifling matter and will probably sound like breedism but there you go, I'm doing it anyway.

Doing a bit of work with my bitch off to the side of soccer training, a couple of dogs walk past, she clocks them and I distract her, later, a couple walk past with a collie (which is allowed to run offlead in the athletics stadium, where there is a dog control order, sigh) again, I manage to engage her.
They walk past a while later, by which time bitch's belly is a bit fuller, so they let their dog come right to the end of the line, on the other side of a fence and just...stare her out. And so her bucket is full, she boils over and growls and barks at it. And they laugh and then keep walking, but just for good measure let it come through the gate a bit just to let it eyeball her some more.
I was so cross and I just shouted 'WHY DID YOU JUST LET THAT HAPPEN??'. Then I had to do a stupid dance to shake it out and not let my dog think I was cross at her, so all the footballers will now think I am a mad cow, if they didn't already lol.


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## Cinnamontoast (15 June 2022)

SAujla said:



			Walking my dog down the canal today and saw a mother with her teenage son and their dog. The dog was looking into the water and the son pushed her into the canal, it was squealing and had to be helped out whilst the son was laughing. As we walked past I said I don't think she liked that and got told she was fine and loved it
		
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Total idiot. Canals are filthy, I would not want mine in water that doesn’t flow and he’s probably made her even more scared. 

Ours went for their first swim on Sunday, at a shallow bit of river just to get them used to water. Mitch was a flat out no, so we didn’t push it. We’ll keep asking, but I’m not going to force it.


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## Chuffy99 (15 June 2022)

I was so hoping you were going to accidentally have pushed laughing boy into the canal


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## Pearlsasinger (15 June 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			Total idiot. Canals are filthy, I would not want mine in water that doesn’t flow and he’s probably made her even more scared.

Ours went for their first swim on Sunday, at a shallow bit of river just to get them used to water. Mitch was a flat out no, so we didn’t push it. We’ll keep asking, but I’m not going to force it.
		
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We walk along a canal path to get to the river where our dogs can swim. I am always very careful to keep Yellow Lab away from the edge of the path as she is so very interested in the canal water.  I would hate her to jump into the filthy water, which has all sorts of rubbish dumped in it and which we would struggle to get her out of, even though they always wear harnesses to go swimming..


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## SAujla (15 June 2022)

Chuffy99 said:



			I was so hoping you were going to accidentally have pushed laughing boy into the canal
		
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Its bothered me all day, I should have said something a bit more forceful than what I did but I just wanted to get past them with Clover. The canal is not clean at all either. Even if she wanted to go in being pushed from behind is disgusting.


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## SAujla (15 June 2022)

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/weird-news/man-backed-refusing-pay-puppy-27239225.amp?fr=operanews


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## GSD Woman (16 June 2022)

That video is appalling.  That dog should have been immediately removed from the situations where is he was lunging and locked on.


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## Cinnamontoast (17 June 2022)

SAujla said:



https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/weird-news/man-backed-refusing-pay-puppy-27239225.amp?fr=operanews

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Totally the fault of the bitch’s owner. How stupid.


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## CrunchieBoi (17 June 2022)

SAujla said:



https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/weird-news/man-backed-refusing-pay-puppy-27239225.amp?fr=operanews

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Ah, another one of those "accidental, on purpose" litters.


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## SAujla (17 June 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			Totally the fault of the bitch’s owner. How stupid.
		
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Stupid is the perfect word, reckless as well.


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## SAujla (17 June 2022)

CrunchieBoi said:



			Ah, another one of those "accidental, on purpose" litters.
		
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We have a park near us where a lot of that has happened, obviously I never go there now. My breeder said she never makes a profit on any litter she produces


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## GSD Woman (17 June 2022)

SAujla said:



			We have a park near us where a lot of that has happened, obviously I never go there now. My breeder said she never makes a profit on any litter she produces
		
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Both Freddie and Rudy's breeders occasionally make money unless you count the raising, titling, feeding and health tests and lifetime care of the bitches. Of course sometimes they lose money especially if emergency care is needed.


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## Cinnamontoast (18 June 2022)

Took Bear to the river today. We were walking along the bank when a family with a French bulldog on an extendable lead approached. The woman holding the lead allowed it to come towards Bear who was heeling me backwards-useful trick (because I had a ball in my hand). I signalled him to the side and they were quick to reassure me that ‘theirs is fine’. I said ‘Mine isn’t’ and they hurriedly pulled it away. Engage your brain! If I put my dog in a sit to one side, I don’t want yours allowed to get in his face, duh! He wouldn’t actually do anything, he was totally focused on me/his ball.


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## SaddlePsych'D (19 June 2022)

OH got involved in trying to round up a loose terrier today. No idea what the correct protocol in this situation is but it ended up hiding under a parked car while he tried to pull it out by the collar. Understandably it went for him as it was so frightened (not helped by owners' kids shouting and screaming the whole time) and it got away. Thankfully it dashed inside its house eventually but it was like watching my worst nightmare unfold - the roads are fairly busy with a main road just the other end of the street where the poor thing wouldn't have stood a chance against the traffic. The owner seemed to find it all funny.


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## Clodagh (19 June 2022)

This is a different form of irresponsible but my niece does hydrotherapy and she’s currently working with a dog that is a tetraplegic after an RTA. He might, one day, be able to stand with support. I really hate that, I love our dogs far too much to ‘play’ with them in that way.


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## asmp (19 June 2022)

I thought it was bad form of Tom McEwan to throw a tantrum (and his hat) after he came off at Luhmuhlen yesterday until I heard the reason why.  A silly woman had a dog on an extendable lead and it had gone on the course in front of the fence and caused his horse to jump off it’s line.  She’s very lucky neither horse nor rider had a serious accident.


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## Clodagh (19 June 2022)

asmp said:



			I thought it was bad form of Tom McEwan to throw a tantrum (and his hat) after he came off at Luhmuhlen yesterday until I heard the reason why.  A silly woman had a dog on an extendable lead and it had gone on the course in front of the fence and caused his horse to jump off it’s line.  She’s very lucky neither horse nor rider had a serious accident.
		
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They need banning from events. Presumably when someone dies as a result of negligence they will be.


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## Amymay (19 June 2022)

Clodagh said:



			They need banning from events. Presumably when someone dies as a result of negligence they will be.
		
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They really, really do!


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## Cinnamontoast (19 June 2022)

Clodagh said:



			This is a different form of irresponsible but my niece does hydrotherapy and she’s currently working with a dog that is a tetraplegic after an RTA. He might, one day, be able to stand with support. I really hate that, I love our dogs far too much to ‘play’ with them in that way.
		
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When we had Jake’s cancer diagnosis, we got talking to one of the vet nurses who had had a similar diagnosis. We made the decision to pts the day after the diagnosis because he couldn’t walk due to the tumours in his spine. The vet nurse told us some months later how her dog hadn’t recovered and had stayed, unable to get out of its bed, incontinent for weeks. I was so sad.


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## Pearlsasinger (19 June 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			When we had Jake’s cancer diagnosis, we got talking to one of the vet nurses who had had a similar diagnosis. We made the decision to pts the day after the diagnosis because he couldn’t walk due to the tumours in his spine. The vet nurse told us some months later how her dog hadn’t recovered and had stayed, unable to get out of its bed, incontinent for weeks. I was so sad.
		
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Why would you do that to a dog?


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## Cinnamontoast (19 June 2022)

Pearlsasinger said:



			Why would you do that to a dog?
		
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I just don’t know. Maybe it wasn’t as severe as Jake’s, the interleaving tumours were a pretty obvious reason for pts, he fell over one day and couldn’t walk, was pts 2 days later after an emergency referral/MRI to the RVC.


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## Tiddlypom (19 June 2022)

Clodagh said:



			They need banning from events. Presumably when someone dies as a result of negligence they will be.
		
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Dogs, or just extendable leads?

I'll go full on for a dog ban on or near the course at all equestrian events.


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## Clodagh (19 June 2022)

Tiddlypom said:



			Dogs, or just extendable leads?

I'll go full on for a dog ban on or near the course at all equestrian events.
		
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Dogs.


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## On the Hoof (20 June 2022)

Well today my little BC was overwhelmed by a large young Rottweiller who had no collar on. The owner had a smaller Rottie with him (also without a collar) and was holding one collar in his hand. He called and shouted at his dog to go to him to no avail and I suggested that he needed another approach.  He put the collar on the dog with him (??) claiming that this dog by his side was responsible for pulling the collar off the other dog - well fine but why only one collar between two of them - he then said that they had run out of the house so I suggested he should have picked up another collar and two leads before chasing after them....  meanwhile my dog , bears the brunt of the other dogs attentions. Another hapless dog walker walks into the middle of this and Rottie 1 turns attention to her puppy so I start to escape and then felt bad about the little puppy so went back, took the shoulder strap off my dog bag, put it round Rottie 1 neck and let it back to owner who then seemed to want to give me his life story - eh no mate Im outa here and you cant have my shoulder strap so why dont you ring someone to bring a lead - he has no phone .... he claims....  I give up and walk away with my dog and shoulder strap while he lies on the ground on top of his Rottie......     1 hour later I m walking back roughly in that direction and am telling a woman about the man and she says she had just seen him wandering around asking people if they had seen two Rotties.....  
I have no words


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## Nasicus (20 June 2022)

Local drug dealer has taken to going out late at night the last few weeks, leaving behind his Mastiff x Bordeaux and 'Staffy' (a bloody pit/bully thing if ever I saw it).
We've been treated to howling, barking, screaming, shrieking and crying from the pair of them for hours on end from 10pm onwards. Made all the better thanks to him leaving the back door open for them to shriek and howl outside to echo all around the valley. 'Staffy' in particular going absolutely mental.
And believe it or not, this was a particularly quiet moment for them:





Reported to the council, but doubt any action will be taken. DD is an absolute blight upon the street and nothing ever seems to happen to him despite reports.


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## scats (20 June 2022)

There was an incident on a local beach this weekend. Large dog attacked a horse.  Both horse and rider went down and rider was injured and on the ground.  Dog owner put lead on dog and left the scene!  Thankfully there was a couple nearby who rang an ambulance and one of them stayed with the rider while the other pursued the dog owner (young woman) and asked her to stay to talk to police who had been called. She actually filmed the woman walking away as evidence of the person involved. Woman refused to stay.  She was going to leave an injured person on the ground. 
Anyway, rider is ok, but shaken. She was stretchered into an ambulance with blood all over her face. Horse ok, just swollen leg apparently.


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## Cinnamontoast (20 June 2022)

scats said:



			There was an incident on a local beach this weekend. Large dog attacked a horse.  Both horse and rider went down and rider was injured and on the ground.  Dog owner put lead on dog and left the scene!  Thankfully there was a couple nearby who rang an ambulance and one of them stayed with the rider while the other pursued the dog owner (young woman) and asked her to stay to talk to police who had been called. She actually filmed the woman walking away as evidence of the person involved. Woman refused to stay.  She was going to leave an injured person on the ground. 
Anyway, rider is ok, but shaken. She was stretchered into an ambulance with blood all over her face. Horse ok, just swollen leg apparently.
		
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That’s absolutely outrageous. Her dog has caused someone to come off and she’s walked away? Leaving the rider on the ground? Gobsmacking. 😢🤬


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## Cinnamontoast (20 June 2022)

Nasicus said:



			Local drug dealer has taken to going out late at night the last few weeks, leaving behind his Mastiff x Bordeaux and 'Staffy' (a bloody pit/bully thing if ever I saw it).
We've been treated to howling, barking, screaming, shrieking and crying from the pair of them for hours on end from 10pm onwards. Made all the better thanks to him leaving the back door open for them to shriek and howl outside to echo all around the valley. 'Staffy' in particular going absolutely mental.
And believe it or not, this was a particularly quiet moment for them:





Reported to the council, but doubt any action will be taken. DD is an absolute blight upon the street and nothing ever seems to happen to him despite reports.
		
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I wonder if the RSPCA would come out? Maybe worth giving them a call?


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## Nasicus (20 June 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			I wonder if the RSPCA would come out? Maybe worth giving them a call?
		
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They'd be no use. By all accounts, the dogs are decently well looked after. They're fed (well, if you consider Bakers a food lmao), watered and otherwise fit and healthy, so the RSPCA would have nothing to go on. He's just the epitome of irresponsible dog owner.


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## CorvusCorax (20 June 2022)

They have their Five Freedoms. Freedom to make all the neighbours eardrums explode. I'd also have to roar at them like you did.


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## Cinnamontoast (21 June 2022)

Nasicus said:



			They'd be no use. By all accounts, the dogs are decently well looked after. They're fed (well, if you consider Bakers a food lmao)
		
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That alone should be worth a cruelty conviction! 🤣


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## Smitty (21 June 2022)

scats said:



			There was an incident on a local beach this weekend. Large dog attacked a horse.  Both horse and rider went down and rider was injured and on the ground.  Dog owner put lead on dog and left the scene!  Thankfully there was a couple nearby who rang an ambulance and one of them stayed with the rider while the other pursued the dog owner (young woman) and asked her to stay to talk to police who had been called. She actually filmed the woman walking away as evidence of the person involved. Woman refused to stay.  She was going to leave an injured person on the ground.
Anyway, rider is ok, but shaken. She was stretchered into an ambulance with blood all over her face. Horse ok, just swollen leg apparently.
		
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But that is exactly what you should do if your dog attacks, maims, kills or causes an accident.  Get away as quickly as you possibly can in the hope that you will never be held responsible for your dog' s behaviour and you can just carry on causing more mayhem and misery🙄


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## Lynnfigaro (21 June 2022)

I was in my garden earlier this morning waiting to speak to the postman.
He was coming towards me when from across the other end of the park infront of my house a vizsla ran up and started barking, growling and lunging at him.
The poor man froze he looked absolutely terrified. 
The owner appeared shouting on the dog. It totally ignored her. I shouted on her to get the dog on a lead so she started shouting and swearing at me.
By this point I had retreated to my porch, the dog then ran at me and tried to get into my house. 
I have a small dog ornament on the inside of my door and I picked it up and was going to lob it at the dog. The owner continued screaming at me and at the dog.
She eventually caught it and headed off across the park cursing and swearing.
The poor postman was absolutely shocked, but said he was OK.
This dog is never on the lead, it has caused problems before with other people and has  ran up and growled at me before when I was out with my own dog.
I have reported the matter to the local dog warden and tried to report it to the police .
The police stated that they cannot get involved because no one was bitten.
Next week is the school holidays in Scotland and the park has a swing park which is usually full of small children I  can only imagine the carnage that dog could cause, but hey-ho the police need to wait until someone is bitten. Wonder how long that will take.


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## Nasicus (21 June 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			They have their Five Freedoms. Freedom to make all the neighbours eardrums explode. I'd also have to roar at them like you did.
		
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Oh how I wish I could have truly given them the 'voice', but it was late at night and didn't fancy upsetting the neighbours further!


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## cauda equina (21 June 2022)

Lynnfigaro said:



			I was in my garden earlier this morning waiting to speak to the postman.
He was coming towards me when from across the other end of the park infront of my house a vizsla ran up and started barking, growling and lunging at him.
The poor man froze he looked absolutely terrified.
The owner appeared shouting on the dog. It totally ignored her. I shouted on her to get the dog on a lead so she started shouting and swearing at me.
By this point I had retreated to my porch, the dog then ran at me and tried to get into my house.
I have a small dog ornament on the inside of my door and I picked it up and was going to lob it at the dog. The owner continued screaming at me and at the dog.
She eventually caught it and headed off across the park cursing and swearing.
The poor postman was absolutely shocked, but said he was OK.
This dog is never on the lead, it has caused problems before with other people and has  ran up and growled at me before when I was out with my own dog.
I have reported the matter to the local dog warden and tried to report it to the police .
*The police stated that they cannot get involved because no one was bitten.*
Next week is the school holidays in Scotland and the park has a swing park which is usually full of small children I  can only imagine the carnage that dog could cause, but hey-ho the police need to wait until someone is bitten. Wonder how long that will take.
		
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Is that right, though?
The Dangerous Dogs Act says that a dog is considered dangerously of out control if it injures somone, or makes someone worried that it might injure them


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## Clodagh (21 June 2022)

cauda equina said:



			Is that right, though?
The Dangerous Dogs Act says that a dog is considered dangerously of out control if it injures somone, or makes someone worried that it might injure them
		
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The police would certainly have looked very foolish if it had jumped the fence and attacked next door.


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## Lynnfigaro (21 June 2022)

cauda equina said:



			Is that right, though?
The Dangerous Dogs Act says that a dog is considered dangerously of out control if it injures somone, or makes someone worried that it might injure them
		
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You are correct. I have checked the Act in case Scotland was different  but it is  much the same.
There would corroboration from me and the post man and both of us were worried about it attacking us.
Unfortunately South Lanarkshire police are a law unto themselves. The person on the phone couldn't get rid of me quickly enough
All phone calls to the police are recorded so if anyone is seriously injured by this dog there should hopefully be a record of my call.


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## GSD Woman (21 June 2022)

Lynnfigaro,

Would it be worth posting some signs around the swings area to be aware of the Vizla? Years ago there was a woman with off lead out of control Rottweilers walking at a local park. A sign was posted in parking areas that warned of the dogs and how it was attacking other dogs. I knew the woman's name and address and wrote them on the signs.


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## Lynnfigaro (21 June 2022)

GSD Woman said:



			Lynnfigaro,

Would it be worth posting some signs around the swings area to be aware of the Vizla? Years ago there was a woman with off lead out of control Rottweilers walking at a local park. A sign was posted in parking areas that warned of the dogs and how it was attacking other dogs. I knew the woman's name and address and wrote them on the signs.
		
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I am thinking of contacting the local newspaper about this, but I will need to speak to the postman first.
In the meantime I have started warning the neighbours and other people whose houses border the park along with anyone I see in it when I am walking my own dog. 
I am still shaking about the whole thing.
I can't believe the dog tried to get into my house.


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## CorvusCorax (21 June 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			Ok so I don't feel awful now. This just happened again, the dog is now a good deal bigger than mine (yes, she is a mini GSD apparently 🙄) so apparently having her face snapped at didn't work as a deterrent.
Ignored whistles and only retreated when mine had a meltdown and shouted at her to eff off.
Owner says 'all the way back' as if dog is fluent in the English language.
But didn't think to shout 'whoops, sorry'.
So the dog is being allowed to approach other dogs repeatedly with no consequence and will one day no doubt get hurt by a dog less smol and easy to wrangle than mine.
		
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Met these guys just now and dear hound gallumphed towards us.

I made my usual Steve Irwin-style mitigations and called out PLEASE DON'T LET HER COME OVER SHE'LL GET BIT ON THE FACE

Owner uses whistle and calls to no effect then this time shouts back at me SORRY IF ANYTHING HAPPENS!

I mean.. just...what??


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## Cinnamontoast (21 June 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			Met these guys just now and dear hound gallumphed towards us.

I made my usual Steve Irwin-style mitigations and called out PLEASE DON'T LET HER COME OVER SHE'LL GET BIT ON THE FACE

Owner uses whistle and calls to no effect then this time shouts back at me SORRY IF ANYTHING HAPPENS!

I mean.. just...what??
		
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Neither use nor ornament, as my dad would have said. 🤬


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## Parrotperson (22 June 2022)

I had a right one yesterday. 

We were up on the ramparts in Berwick. Lovely day lovely walk. Rocky was on his lead because there's a big sign that says "dogs on leads". 

Along trots (and I swear he looks just like a Shetland pony) a big hairy beast. Woman fully 50 yards behind. He comes up to us and says hello. He's friendly so all ok. rocky says hello. We give him a pat til his owner arrives. Ascertain he's a lab/crossed with something big and hairy.  

Now remember at this point she's let him wander up to us and say hello, she says

"Move along then (to dog) Then to me "you shouldn't have said hello to him". 

Well. What exactly was I supposed to do? he was so big it would've quite difficult to go round him!

Silly inconsequential I know bit was annoyed!  Keep up with your bloody dog then and put it on a lead. 🙄


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## SAujla (22 June 2022)

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1538597489569214464
So this video is going viral today, whilst it looks amusing the actions of the golden retriever suggests something is wrong neurologically. Few people have said it but more people don't realise. How can the owner not think that's wrong?


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## Amymay (22 June 2022)

More likely that that is how it’s been told to sit ☹️


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## SAujla (22 June 2022)

Amymay said:



			More likely that that is how it’s been told to sit ☹️
		
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Still bad but I guess better than having a brain issue? I read that a cat or dog pushing their head into the wall is a major red flag


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## GSD Woman (22 June 2022)

SAujla said:



			Still bad but I guess better than having a brain issue? I read that a cat or dog pushing their head into the wall is a major red flag
		
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It is.  Also very bad sign in horses.  It can signal some really bad neuro problems.


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## Clodagh (22 June 2022)

I’m sure TW will be along soon but her Bo presses his head to the wall when stressed. He was very badly shut down at his last home and I think it was how he opted out. He used to sit with his head pressed to the kennel mesh all day. Now he only does it if there’s shouting or similar.


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## Cinnamontoast (22 June 2022)

Putting the head against the wall can be an indication of something super serious, but as per, I can’t remember what, but I recall being told to get the dog to the vet if it did this.


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## Clodagh (22 June 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			Putting the head against the wall can be an indication of something super serious, but as per, I can’t remember what, but I recall being told to get the dog to the vet if it did this.
		
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I’ve known Bo for years, it’s his opt out.


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## TheresaW (22 June 2022)

He will run to a corner if something happens he doesn’t like, and sit with his head hung down. It could be fireworks, one of the other dogs getting told off for something. Me and OH shouting at each other, be it an argument or mucking about.  He’s been with us for over 3 years now, and seen vet regularly for check ups etc.


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## Clodagh (22 June 2022)

Why would you take your dog aggressive Great Dane to a small pub where lots of dogs go? 🤔


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## Smitty (23 June 2022)

I've just returned from a solo 7 day camping trip to Devon and have lost count of the number of people who commented on how good my dog is.  I previously thought he was roughly average, but having experienced dogs barking more or less continually on the camp site, one old lady being completely towed around by whatever large hairy animal it was and a shrieking and hyped up fox terrier opposite us, I'm inclined to agree.

The last encounter with irresponsible/rude/pig ignorant owners came on Tues lunchtime when I walked down some steep steps in an old pub to be greeted at the bottom by a large dog shooting out from under a table between its owners legs, barking at us.  I nearly spilled my drink, my chap ignored it, as did its owners who just carried on looking at their phones.  It turned out to be a large overweight Goldie.  I would have been mortified and apologised but I guess they are just too embarrassed by their dog's behaviour?😕


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## Nasicus (23 June 2022)

SAujla said:




__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1538597489569214464
So this video is going viral today, whilst it looks amusing the actions of the golden retriever suggests something is wrong neurologically. Few people have said it but more people don't realise. How can the owner not think that's wrong?
		
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Also a symptom of something liver related the name of which escapes me, hang on I'll google it. Hepatic Encephalopathy, that's the one. Toxins from the non-functioning liver build up and travel up unto the brain and cause swelling.


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## Cinnamontoast (23 June 2022)

TheresaW said:



			He will run to a corner if something happens he doesn’t like, and sit with his head hung down. It could be fireworks, one of the other dogs getting told off for something. Me and OH shouting at each other, be it an argument or mucking about.  He’s been with us for over 3 years now, and seen vet regularly for check ups etc.
		
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I wasn’t referring to Bo. It’s clearly a coping mechanism he’s developed.



Nasicus said:



			Also a symptom of something liver related the name of which escapes me, hang on I'll google it. Hepatic Encephalopathy, that's the one. Toxins from the non-functioning liver build up and travel up unto the brain and cause swelling.
		
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I think that’s what I was thinking of, where the dog just walks into the wall.


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## CorvusCorax (23 June 2022)

I always thought the head pressing was liver related.

If it's a trained behaviour, please someone tell me how


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## Pippity (23 June 2022)

Lynnfigaro said:



			I was in my garden earlier this morning waiting to speak to the postman.
He was coming towards me when from across the other end of the park infront of my house a vizsla ran up and started barking, growling and lunging at him.
The poor man froze he looked absolutely terrified.
		
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I'm a member of a union that also covers postal workers (CWU). Dog attacks on postal workers are a major issue, and they've been trying for years to get some kind of legislation passed about it. Sadly, unless the worker is actually attacked, it's never taken seriously. Even when the worker is attacked, it's often treated as a, "Haha, dog bites postman!" thing.


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## Clodagh (23 June 2022)

I’ll see if my friend can send me the photos of her husband after he was attacked by a St Bernard. He’s a postie.


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## Lynnfigaro (23 June 2022)

Pippity said:



			I'm a member of a union that also covers postal workers (CWU). Dog attacks on postal workers are a major issue, and they've been trying for years to get some kind of legislation passed about it. Sadly, unless the worker is actually attacked, it's never taken seriously. Even when the worker is attacked, it's often treated as a, "Haha, dog bites postman!" thing.
		
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It is ridiculous. The dog warden visited me today and I gave her all the details and roughly where the dog lives.  Unfortunately it has been a different post person the last two days so I have been unable to speak to him.
Postal workers have had a difficult enough job over the last 2 years without having to put up with dog attacks.
When I got my pup one of the first things I did was introduce him to our postman.


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## Clodagh (23 June 2022)

The dog really meant it.


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## The Fuzzy Furry (23 June 2022)

Clodagh said:



			The dog really meant it.
		
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Cripes!


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## Lynnfigaro (23 June 2022)

Clodagh said:



			The dog really meant it.
		
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Was the owner prosecuted ?
I really hope so.


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## Clodagh (23 June 2022)

Lynnfigaro said:



			Was the owner prosecuted ?
I really hope so.
		
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She hasn’t replied to that question, she just sent the pics. Will let you know.


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## Amymay (23 June 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			I always thought the head pressing was liver related.

If it's a trained behaviour, please someone tell me how 

Click to expand...

I saw a video on YouTube a couple of years ago (I think it was Chinese) where a dog was being trained to stand upright with its back to a wall.  It was terrified ☹️  The picture of the Goldie reminded me exactly of that.


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## AShetlandBitMeOnce (23 June 2022)

I abolutely despair.. why is the mirror writing articles like this?!

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/rare-litter-fluffy-puppies-grow-27288340

We shouldn't be advertising and glorifying such huge, serious guarding dog breeds as pets. Yes, the content of the article is written well, but many will just see cute puppies and the advertisement of them. The comments under the post on Facebook where so face-palm worthy I had to stop reading.One woman is proud that her Kangal lives in her flat and has never bitten anyone...


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## GSD Woman (24 June 2022)

Clodaugh, that is horrible.



Pippity said:



			I'm a member of a union that also covers postal workers (CWU). Dog attacks on postal workers are a major issue, and they've been trying for years to get some kind of legislation passed about it. Sadly, unless the worker is actually attacked, it's never taken seriously. Even when the worker is attacked, it's often treated as a, "Haha, dog bites postman!" thing.
		
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What about having the people on that street having to pick up the mail at the post office? IIRC, that happened in one area where I live. The gun violence had gotten so bad that the post office decided it wasn't worth the risk.  It may have even helped curb the violence.  Gun stupidity is one of the things I hate in about this country.


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## Smitty (24 June 2022)

AShetlandBitMeOnce said:



			I abolutely despair.. why is the mirror writing articles like this?!

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/rare-litter-fluffy-puppies-grow-27288340

We shouldn't be advertising and glorifying such huge, serious guarding dog breeds as pets. Yes, the content of the article is written well, but many will just see cute puppies and the advertisement of them. The comments under the post on Facebook where so face-palm worthy I had to stop reading.One woman is proud that her Kangal lives in her flat and has never bitten anyone...
		
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Once again, the people who commented below the article, were bang on.


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## Clodagh (24 June 2022)

Smitty said:



			Once again, the people who commented below the article, were bang on.
		
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They were very good comments. All that crap about gentle giants.


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## skinnydipper (24 June 2022)

Clodagh said:



			They were very good comments. All that crap about gentle giants.
		
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Ah, but "fluffy puppies", Clodagh.  Furbaby mummies will be queuing up for one.


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## CorvusCorax (24 June 2022)

One breed where I'm never comfortable until I'm as far away as possible.
Sorry, they're another one that haven't really evolved and in my experience they are extremely civil (target people not prey movement) and they make the ground shake when they walk past. They should be out roaming the Steppes, not stuck in a suburban environment with well meaning but ill equipped fur moms who won't be able to cope on the day the dog turns round and says 'nah, make me'.
Police marksmen have already had to be deployed on them before now.

Anyhoo, this popped up on Faceache. Some details removed but a cross of two bracchy breeds so obviously bred for cash and temperament be damned.
WHERE are there homes like this?
Does he sound happy in the head?

'Please do not apply unless you are ready to work with these issues and ourselves.
He has separation anxiety.
He is nervous of new people.
He is reactive to dogs.
He cannot be rehomed with children.
He needs a constant routine.
He needs to start most of his training from scratch.
He can be a loyal loving dog but he will need time and work.

What he needs is
A secure garden where he can enjoy off lead playtime and can continue practising his recall.
Someone willing to attend several meets before going to his forever home so potential adopters must be willing to travel to the area where he is currently in foster for this.
Someone around for most of the day.
A home with NO CHILDREN
A home with NO PETS - we will consider other dogs in the home but only after successful meetings. Again he is nervous of other dogs.
Someone who has experience of behavioural issues/training and happy to work to help him.
Routine, structure and Training.'


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## skinnydipper (24 June 2022)

I remember watching a documentary years ago on Russia's toughest prisons.  Ovcharkas were used for control.

I managed to find this clip.

Here you go, fluffy puppies:

https://fb.watch/dRfXmqBeXB/


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## smolmaus (24 June 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			Anyhoo, this popped up on Faceache. Some details removed but a cross of two bracchy breeds so obviously bred for cash and temperament be damned.
WHERE are there homes like this?
Does he sound happy in the head?
		
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Shall we begin taking bets on whether or not he has snapped at a child already and thats why he's being rehomed 😬😬


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## CorvusCorax (24 June 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			I remember watching a documentary years ago on Russia's toughest prisons.  Ovcharkas were used for control.

I managed to find this clip.

Here you go, fluffy puppies:

https://fb.watch/dRfXmqBeXB/

Click to expand...

There's a well-known YT video of a pair of berks doing 'protection' with one, doing civil work with only a Schutzhund sleeve and normal overalls on the 'helper' and the dog does a half-mouthed bite on the sleeve and then just lets go, comes right over it and grabs the guy's chest.


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## GSD Woman (24 June 2022)

Clodagh said:



			They were very good comments. All that crap about gentle giants.
		
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I've seen 2 of them.  They are scary and need a very strong and determined owner.  This is NOT a pet for the average owner.  These things scared the crap out of me and that was before the pit bull attack.


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## Nasicus (24 June 2022)

Can't wait for them to be inflicted on the innocent public when they're fully grown and more than likely out of control....


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## stangs (24 June 2022)

Not that I'm a fan of the Dangerous Dogs Act, but I'll never understand how the Caucasian Shepherd didn't make it on the list. Is it just a bias towards fluffy dogs?


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## fiwen30 (24 June 2022)

Thoughts?

Border collie born with a heart condition so severe, it can’t walk more than 50 yards without collapsing due to oxygen depravation. Owner has been pushing it around in a pram since it was 7 weeks old, and it’s just turned 5.


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## Amymay (24 June 2022)

No words


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## KittenInTheTree (24 June 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			There's a well-known YT video of a pair of berks doing 'protection' with one, doing civil work with only a Schutzhund sleeve and normal overalls on the 'helper' and the dog does a half-mouthed bite on the sleeve and then just lets go, comes right over it and grabs the guy's chest.
		
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Well, to be fair, one can hardly blame the dog for being more intelligent than the humans who were pestering it.


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## Pearlsasinger (24 June 2022)

fiwen30 said:



			Thoughts?

Border collie born with a heart condition so severe, it can’t walk more than 50 yards without collapsing due to oxygen depravation. Owner has been pushing it around in a pram since it was 7 weeks old, and it’s just turned 5.
		
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My thoughts would get me banned if I wrote them on here. Wtaf?


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## fiwen30 (24 June 2022)

Glad it wasn’t just me overreacting. Looks like the owner has been crowdfunding its treatment multiple times, to boot.


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## Clodagh (24 June 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			I remember watching a documentary years ago on Russia's toughest prisons.  Ovcharkas were used for control.

I managed to find this clip.

Here you go, fluffy puppies:

https://fb.watch/dRfXmqBeXB/

Click to expand...

I’m not sure that program can be regarded as intelligent, balanced reporting! 😄


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## TheresaW (24 June 2022)

fiwen30 said:



			Thoughts?

Border collie born with a heart condition so severe, it can’t walk more than 50 yards without collapsing due to oxygen depravation. Owner has been pushing it around in a pram since it was 7 weeks old, and it’s just turned 5.
		
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Watching how active our two are, who are both purely pets, and one almost 13, I just couldn’t. Ever.


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## skinnydipper (24 June 2022)

...


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## Cinnamontoast (24 June 2022)

Clodagh said:



			The dog really meant it.
		
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Holy crap. I hope the dog was pts. Saying that, the Akita x that bit Brig then the owner of a rough collie who tried to get it off his dog (trip to Casualty/stitches needed) wasn’t, so I doubt it was. It has been seen in a nearby park. I’m avoiding parks now that pups are up and running. 



fiwen30 said:



			Thoughts?

Border collie born with a heart condition so severe, it can’t walk more than 50 yards without collapsing due to oxygen depravation. Owner has been pushing it around in a pram since it was 7 weeks old, and it’s just turned 5.
		
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They’re not children. That’s no life for a dog. What a shit life for a dog.


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## Clodagh (24 June 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			...
		
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Obviously I don’t know what you said but I wasn’t intending to rubbish there point they are not good pets, just that they probably were riled up for the cameras. I am sure that Russian prison wardens use them over, say, Malinois, for a reason.


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## Clodagh (24 June 2022)

Lynnfigaro said:



			Was the owner prosecuted ?
I really hope so.
		
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NSFASK. The police were involved, and asked him if he wanted the dog pts and he said no, he loves dogs. It was a rescue and the owners hadn’t shut the door properly so when it threw itself against it the door opened.
His union is totally crap and were no help so there was no recompense for the bite.


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## skinnydipper (24 June 2022)

Clodagh said:



			Obviously I don’t know what you said but I wasn’t intending to rubbish there point they are not good pets, just that they probably were riled up for the cameras. I am sure that Russian prison wardens use them over, say, Malinois, for a reason.
		
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I was pulling your leg, asking if you had your name down for a pup 

and I found the programme in its entirety and posted the link.

15.23 Vladimir Central.  19.32 kennel block. 






Then I thought what a pointless post and deleted it


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## CorvusCorax (24 June 2022)

Clodagh said:



			Obviously I don’t know what you said but I wasn’t intending to rubbish there point they are not good pets, just that they probably were riled up for the cameras. I am sure that Russian prison wardens use them over, say, Malinois, for a reason.
		
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Nah a lot of them are just like that, I've seen one like that at a five bar gate in the middle of the countryside with people walking past minding their business, they're naturally defensive.


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## skinnydipper (24 June 2022)

I am not a wimp around dogs but if I see an Ovcharka when I'm out with my dog, I'll turn and go a different way.

Someone is advertising a litter. Parents can be seen but only at a distance.  Hmm, no thanks.


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## Clodagh (25 June 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			I am not a wimp around dogs but if I see an Ovcharka when I'm out with my dog, I'll turn and go a different way.

Someone is advertising a litter. Parents can be seen but only at a distance.  Hmm, no thanks.
		
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Just the sort of ad to appeal to the absolute idiot who shouldn’t own such a dog.


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## Lynnfigaro (25 June 2022)

Clodagh said:



			NSFASK. The police were involved, and asked him if he wanted the dog pts and he said no, he loves dogs. It was a rescue and the owners hadn’t shut the door properly so when it threw itself against it the door opened.
His union is totally crap and were no help so there was no recompense for the bite.
		
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Failings on a number of counts there and not by the poor man who was bitten.


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## Cinnamontoast (25 June 2022)

Talking of postman, ours just rang the bell. Bear did not react, pups have been taught not to react. He said he expected the dogs to bark, I explained that Bear is losing his hearing and the pups have been trained not to bark. All three were kept shut in the lounge, mostly because they are way too fond of running into the neighbour’s garden-the council put insulation on her house and destroyed both gates into her garden and have yet to replace them, months later, so the boys can go from our drive to her garden, luckily they don’t go anywhere else!


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## Clodagh (25 June 2022)

Lynnfigaro said:



			Failings on a number of counts there and not by the poor man who was bitten.
		
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I don’t understand why he was asked his opinion, why put the onus on him?


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## Lynnfigaro (25 June 2022)

Clodagh said:



			I don’t understand why he was asked his opinion, why put the onus on him?
		
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Neither do I.  The matter of whether the dog was destroyed should have been for the sentencing judge if the owner was convicted.


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## Esmae (25 June 2022)

fiwen30 said:



			Thoughts?

Border collie born with a heart condition so severe, it can’t walk more than 50 yards without collapsing due to oxygen depravation. Owner has been pushing it around in a pram since it was 7 weeks old, and it’s just turned 5.
		
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Cruelty.


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## Clodagh (25 June 2022)

Mine bark madly when anyone comes to the door, that’s fine by me. If they have access to the yard and a courier comes through the gate they are intimidating but the person is quite safe. I can’t imagine having a dog that would bite like that and being casual about its containment


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## Errin Paddywack (25 June 2022)

I allow mine to bark when someone comes to the door.  They have to walk past the front room window so can see the dogs.  I would rather they were a bit wary of the fact I have dogs, makes me feel a bit safer.  Dogs don't have access to the front garden so no-one has to run the gauntlet of barking dogs.  They don't have a clue how to bite so no-one would be at any risk from them anyway.


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## Pippity (25 June 2022)

Clodagh said:



			Mine bark madly when anyone comes to the door, that’s fine by me. If they have access to the yard and a courier comes through the gate they are intimidating but the person is quite safe. I can’t imagine having a dog that would bite like that and being casual about its containment
		
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The thing is, would you enjoy being intimidated while doing your job? Constantly wondering whether this barking dog is safe or if this is the one that will attack you if it gets loose? It's stressful.


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## Clodagh (25 June 2022)

Pippity said:



			The thing is, would you enjoy being intimidated while doing your job? Constantly wondering whether this barking dog is safe or if this is the one that will attack you if it gets loose? It's stressful.
		
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Oh yes, but they don’t have access to the yard unless we are in it with them, and the postie  delivers to a mailbox. If we are expecting a delivery they aren’t out there. I meant I wouldn’t want to stop them barking.
But if there was a perfect storm of mistakes and a determined courier opened the gate and bashed his way to the door (unlikely) he still wouldn’t get bitten.


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## CorvusCorax (25 June 2022)

My lawn was being cut this morning, two were in kennels and one was in crate in kitchen. Gardener did come in for a cuppa but there was no direct contact/dog wasn't bothered. He apparently slept through my friend calling over to price some work in the house the other week. But still, I'd rather not put anyone in an uncomfortable position.

The two postwomen live really close and they know they are safe, I assured them from day one that the dogs are secure. I agree that they should be able to do their jobs without second guessing other people's dog management skills and risking life altering injuries which would impact their ability to work and earn.

One courier did walk right around my back and leave an M&S gift pack in the doorway right beside the black dog's kennel, which I found surprising/brave.


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## SaddlePsych'D (3 July 2022)

Not really irresponsible as it turned out the owner probably needed muzzling more than the dog in the end but just had a man have a go at me for dodging his dog. I absolutely own my bias against large bully looking dogs. I've met some lovely staffies but larger bully types I am wary of. That said, I give pretty much every dog we pass space because you have no way to know which are reactive, aggressive or whatever. So we dodged this dog as it came over and the guy had a pop about how he wouldn't have it off lead if it wasn't okay. I tried to point out that some people do let their not okay dogs off lead and not to take it personally as I have literally no way of knowing which is which. He just continued having a go and going on about it not being fair on his dog (who had already moved on). Really unpleasant. 

Also if someone is genuinely scared of your dog having a go at them isn't really going to help! I try to give all people space where I can but sometimes you see people who are worried about dogs, Ivy doesn't know or care so why should I do anything except keep her out of the way?

Then we passed a genuinely scary something (no idea what mix/breed, some kind of shepherd in there maybe) being walked on a big chain. Thank feck I spotted it quick as we came round the corner and dived straight to the other side of the road. No doubt in my mind it would have gone for us. Grim.


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## maisie06 (3 July 2022)

I've had a similar experience with an idiot with a large Bully type, I avoid them too. I crossed over and he started gobbing off saying "my dog is fine why are you assuming it's not?"  I just yelled back saying I'm not interested in your dog I'm giving MINE the space he needs so bog off!!!


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## KittenInTheTree (3 July 2022)

I just point out that it isn't the dog that I'm avoiding.


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## Amymay (3 July 2022)

SD, why to you feel the need to justify to strangers why you’ve avoided their dog.  You quite simply don’t….


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## Cinnamontoast (3 July 2022)

maisie06 said:



			I've had a similar experience with an idiot with a large Bully type, I avoid them too. I crossed over and he started gobbing off saying "my dog is fine why are you assuming it's not?"  I just yelled back saying I'm not interested in your dog I'm giving MINE the space he needs so bog off!!!
		
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I think saying that _your _dog needs space is better than justifying in any other way. I tell people that Bear can be grumpy, my OH normally takes him off if I’m talking to other dog owners with the little ones. He’s a little defensive of the others, but relaxes the second he’s told.

I got bored of trying to avoid the bouncy untrained types with Zak. I found if I told the owners he wasn’t friendly, I got an interrogation about why I had an aggressive dog out in public.


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## Amymay (3 July 2022)

Ok, so thoughts on this.

Last weekend friends witnessed a 6 month old staffy launch an unprovoked and stained attack on a small terrier.  It took 15 minutes for the dog to be released from the puppy’s grip.

The puppy will now be castrated and muzzled.

What would the collective do (if anything) with the puppy.

(For info, nice ‘ordinary’ couple own him).


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## Tiddlypom (3 July 2022)

PTS

Did the terrier survive?


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## Amymay (3 July 2022)

Tiddlypom said:



			PTS

Did the terrier survive?
		
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Yes, terrier survived, surprisingly unscathed.

The first words out of my mouth was that it would have been a one way trip to the vets.


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## GSD Woman (3 July 2022)

Sometimes I hate people. Years ago I was walking in a park known for people walking their dogs off lead.  My dogs were fine there.  I was talking to some other owners while the dogs were having a bit of play when I saw an owner walking their dog on lead.  I called mine over and told the other owners to do the same.  One woman had the nerve to tell me that the owner of on lead dog should control their dog since it was on lead.  My head about blew off. I informed her that technically we were the ones violating the leash laws. Her male companion had made sure their dog was by his side.

My dogs had such a good reputation there.  On Tuesdays during the summer there were bike races.  I always had my dogs "pack up" when the bikes went by.  One day some men were setting up for the races and one man pointed out my dogs.  Another man told him not to worry that these were good, under control dogs.  It did my heart good.  

When I'm walking my dogs I always try and give other people room.  My breed has a bad reputation and I don't want to add to it. I'm sure the other GSD owners here agree.


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## KittenInTheTree (3 July 2022)

I'd expect it to be kept on a lead and muzzled when out in public until it had learned how to behave. I wouldn't write it off at that age - most puppies go through a stage of being horrible as they hit puberty. My opinion may be biased though, as I've had to pry one too many "harmless" small breed dogs off my long-suffering collie's face and/or neck. These days, I tend to presume the worst of them.


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## Moobli (3 July 2022)

Amymay said:



			Ok, so thoughts on this.

Last weekend friends witnessed a 6 month old staffy launch an unprovoked and stained attack on a small terrier.  It took 15 minutes for the dog to be released from the puppy’s grip.

The puppy will now be castrated and muzzled.

What would the collective do (if anything) with the puppy.

(For info, nice ‘ordinary’ couple own him).
		
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I’m always slightly bemused that bull breeds genetics aren’t taken into consideration in the same way as herding, pointing, guarding breeds.  I personally wouldn’t have a Staffie or any other bull breed or type but if I did find myself with one then it wouldn’t be encouraged to mix freely with strange dogs, in fact quite the opposite.  I don’t think that particular puppy should be put to sleep for the unprovoked attack on the terrier but it should be on a lead in future and the owners need to do some serious research into the breed and it’s management and training.


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## SaddlePsych'D (3 July 2022)

Amymay said:



			SD, why to you feel the need to justify to strangers why you’ve avoided their dog.  You quite simply don’t….
		
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Such a good point. I think I was trying to make the situation better somehow but it really was not worth my time or energy!


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## Cinnamontoast (3 July 2022)

Amymay said:



			Ok, so thoughts on this.

Last weekend friends witnessed a 6 month old staffy launch an unprovoked and stained attack on a small terrier.  It took 15 minutes for the dog to be released from the puppy’s grip.

The puppy will now be castrated and muzzled.

What would the collective do (if anything) with the puppy.

(For info, nice ‘ordinary’ couple own him).
		
Click to expand...

I don’t think castration will change the behaviour, it just removes their brave pants, which may lead to them becoming fear aggressive. Muzzling is going to be essential but may also lead to poor behaviour if the puppy becomes frustrated. I can’t imagine a dog that young being so aggressive. I wonder if there’s something wrong with it mentally/neurologically. I’d want a scan done, I think, although that would be extremely expensive. Did the owners meet the mum?


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## Amymay (3 July 2022)

I don’t know anything of his background @Cinnamontoast.  The aggressive behaviour in such a young dog shocked me.


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## Rokele55 (3 July 2022)

I offended a Staffie owner the other day. At the beach with loads of dogs playing, m y terrier running about in and out of the sea with the children, some dogs said hello and most not, no issues a all. Lovely! Back in the car park and lead on, met a staffii e so I moved my dog well away and told mine not to get near  that one. They were rather offended and a bit shirty. I did explain about the amount of people I had met who shouted to keep away as their staffie was very agressive but it didn't seem to help


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## Pearlsasinger (3 July 2022)

Amymay said:



			I don’t know anything of his background @Cinnamontoast.  The aggressive behaviour in such a young dog shocked me.
		
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Tbh if the terrier escaped virtually unscathed after 15 minutes, I can only think that the Staffy didn't mean it. The owner however should take responsibility and keep it on a lead when out in public, muzzled if they can't control it on the lead.

I simply do not understand those owners who want their dogs to play with others that they see out and about but don't know. My dogs are not there to provide a playmate for theirs, if they don't know someone with a dog to play with theirs, then get a second, or make some other arrangement!


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## Cinnamontoast (3 July 2022)

Pearlsasinger said:



			I simply do not understand those owners who want their dogs to play with others that they see out and about but don't know. My dogs are not there to provide a playmate for theirs, if they don't know someone with a dog to play with theirs, then get a second, or make some other arrangement!
		
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I would agree with you if we still had Zak, but with the little ones, we really want them to be good with other dogs. I kept them away from most of the Covid puppy pack in the park, because they have no discipline or training or aim. Since we’ve been back in the woods, tho, it’s normal to come across other off lead nice dogs and to stop to chat. Today, we met a springer bitch who wanted to play, a collie, same, 2 cockers (separately) and 2 samoyeds.

I’m enjoying being able to be social and not be terrified if another dog appears. My primary aim isn’t to socialise, me or them, it’s to exercise the dogs, but the park no longer cuts it, they need to be able to properly run/explore. The social aspect is a lovely bonus for all of us. (We are normally extremely anti-social!)


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## Pearlsasinger (3 July 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			I would agree with you if we still had Zak, but with the little ones, we really want them to be good with other dogs. I kept them away from most of the Covid puppy pack in the park, because they have no discipline or training or aim. Since we’ve been back in the woods, tho, it’s normal to come across other off lead nice dogs and to stop to chat. Today, we met a springer bitch who wanted to play, a collie, same, 2 cockers (separately) and 2 samoyeds.

I’m enjoying being able to be social and not be terrified if another dog appears. My primary aim isn’t to socialise, me or them, it’s to exercise the dogs, but the park no longer cuts it, they need to be able to properly run/explore. The social aspect is a lovely bonus for all of us. (We are normally extremely anti-social!)
		
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Our local wood is the place to avoid most irresponsible owners and their dogs, almost everybody that we bump into, calls their dogs to them, so that we can all pass without incident. Sometimes we stand and chat but the dogs sit down and wait patiently. The exception is the 'professional' dog walker who just let's about 8 dogs run allover the place. 
The shorter walk is too near to traffic to risk ours playing with other dogs whose recall could be dodgy. That seems to be where we meet more owners who think our dogs should entertain theirs.


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## Annette4 (3 July 2022)

Amymay said:



			Ok, so thoughts on this.

Last weekend friends witnessed a 6 month old staffy launch an unprovoked and stained attack on a small terrier.  It took 15 minutes for the dog to be released from the puppy’s grip.

The puppy will now be castrated and muzzled.

What would the collective do (if anything) with the puppy.

(For info, nice ‘ordinary’ couple own him).
		
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We did PTS our own dog after a unprovoked, sustained attack on our other dog who was asleep.....post mortem revealed a large brain tumour. They tried to get us to surrender to a rescue but I am forever grateful we made the right choice and I would do it again.


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## Cinnamontoast (3 July 2022)

Pearlsasinger said:



			Our local wood is the place to avoid most irresponsible owners and their dogs, almost everybody that we bump into, calls their dogs to them, so that we can all pass without incident. Sometimes we stand and chat but the dogs sit down and wait patiently. The exception is the 'professional' dog walker who just let's about 8 dogs run allover the place.
The shorter walk is too near to traffic to risk ours playing with other dogs whose recall could be dodgy. That seems to be where we meet more owners who think our dogs should entertain theirs.
		
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Seems to be unspoken code in these woods (absolutely vast) that dogs are off lead and friendly. We started going nearly 20 years ago with Jake and Brig! There are routes you can take to mostly avoid others and the big circle of the periphery allows horses. I've avoided that bit so far, no idea what the little ones would make of horses, they didn't meet Beau when I took them to the yard. He hated dogs.


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## Nasicus (3 July 2022)

*They tried to get us to surrender to a rescue* but I am forever grateful we made the right choice and I would do it again.
		
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ARRRGGHHH!!! 
(Thank you for doing the right thing and not caving to emotional manipulation!)


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## SaddlePsych'D (3 July 2022)

Nasicus said:



			ARRRGGHHH!!!
(Thank you for doing the right thing and not caving to emotional manipulation!)
		
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Absolutely! 

I am not sure what the solution is for the owners of the dog in question but to me that sounds quite extreme behaviour. I would not think badly of someone to have a dog humanely euthanized instead of passing it on.


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## GSD Woman (4 July 2022)

Annette4 said:



			We did PTS our own dog after a unprovoked, sustained attack on our other dog who was asleep.....post mortem revealed a large brain tumour. They tried to get us to surrender to a rescue but I am forever grateful we made the right choice and I would do it again.
		
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Thank you for doing the right thing. I hate it when rescues pass on dogs that are known biters of humans and/or animals. 

There was a case in the last year of two that centered on a dog that was a known biter and was moved from shelter to shelter, moving the dog through several states.  At one time the dog was sent to a board and train for retraining and was declared fixed. It ended up in Virginia Beach, VA, USA. It killed the elderly woman who adopted it.  There were so many red flags it makes me want to bang my head. That dog should have been put down after the first bite.

My niece has the same denial going on.


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## Smitty (4 July 2022)

Hmm.  Waiting at a bus stop.  Dog on lead comes up and sniffs me.  I say please get it away, middle aged owner says its OK, its friendly, I say I'm scared of dogs.  A bit of a grumble and off they go.   No apology.  

This is NOT good.  According to someone I met whilst away a couple of weeks ago and bemoaning the number of poo bags in a beauty spot, dogs are banned in one city in Australia.   I think a lot of people with dogs feel entitled.


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## Moobli (4 July 2022)

It’s difficult to properly assess what the owners of the Staffie pup should do without having seen what happened.  Dogs bite for all sorts of reasons.  If the terrier was entirely unharmed after what sounds like quite a prolonged “attack” then it doesn’t sound like there was serious intent. It’s a wake up call to the owners for sure, but pts seems extreme in this case imo.

The collie pup I’ve rehomed from a FB page was thought by his previous owner and their dog trainer to be aggressive.  He’d bitten both of them and the owner’s mother.  Put to sleep for aggression had been mentioned.  If that had happened it would have been an absolute travesty.  The poor pup was just entirely misunderstood and in the wrong environment with people who meant well but didn’t have a clue about his genetics, the likely inherent behaviours and what to expect from a frustrated hard wired working dog.  So while I do understand there’s not always a solution for a dog that’s bitten, I don’t agree with putting to sleep any dog who’s bitten a person or other dog no matter the circumstances.

Edited : typos!


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## Tiddlypom (4 July 2022)

Pearlsasinger said:



			I simply do not understand those owners who want their dogs to play with others that they see out and about but don't know. My dogs are not there to provide a playmate for theirs, if they don't know someone with a dog to play with theirs, then get a second, or make some other arrangement!
		
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This.

It's the fur baby brigade whose eyes light up when they see the JRT and coo to their spoilt mutt(s) 'Ooo, look, here's a little friend for you to play with'.

Nope.



Moobli said:



			So while I do understand there’s not always a solution for a dog that’s bitten, I don’t agree with putting to sleep any dog who’s bitten a person or other dog no matter the circumstances
		
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Collies are different, though, mostly they need to work and they get frustrated in pet homes. Well done on taking that collie pup on, but he needs to work, and you can give him that outlet.

What job could a dog aggressive staffie do? I'd never trust it again.


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## CorvusCorax (4 July 2022)

My dogs are not there to act as playmates/entertainment/climbing frames for other peoples', nor do I expect them to exercise or entertain themselves/each other, that's my job. Vocation. Whatever


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## skinnydipper (4 July 2022)

Moobli said:



			It’s difficult to properly assess what the owners of the Staffie pup should do without having seen what happened. Dogs bite for all sorts of reasons. If the terrier was entirely unharmed after what sounds like quite a prolonged “attack” then it doesn’t sound like there was serious intent. *It’s a wake up call to the owners for sure, but pts seems extreme in this case imo.*

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^This^

A dog can inflict massive damage in seconds. 

Yet this incident is alleged to have lasted for 15 mins and not so much as a puncture.

ETA.  Also I would not neuter.  Why would anyone think his balls are a problem?


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## Amymay (4 July 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			^This^

A dog can inflict massive damage in seconds.

Yet this incident is alleged to have lasted for 15 mins and not so much as a puncture.

ETA.  Also I would not neuter.  Why would anyone think his balls are a problem?
		
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_Relitavely _unscathed.  Not unscathed.


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## skinnydipper (4 July 2022)

Amymay said:



_Relitavely _unscathed.  Not unscathed.
		
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Before doing anything hasty I would suggest the owners ask their vet for referral to Kendal Shepherd, veterinary behaviourist.

https://www.kendalshepherd.com/


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## splashgirl45 (4 July 2022)

He is too young to neuter and who knows what the JR said to him.  At his age I would think he could be made into a better citizen by a competent owner , personally the bull breeds do not appeal to me but PTS seems a bit harsh


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## GSD Woman (4 July 2022)

Moobli said:



			So while I do understand there’s not always a solution for a dog that’s bitten, I don’t agree with putting to sleep any dog who’s bitten a person or other dog no matter the circumstances.[

Moobli, I believe that we generally agree on dog matters. On this I totally disagree. Having recently gone through a dog attack myself I say with my whole background that yes, that was stupid on both myself and my niece, but that dog needs to be put down.  They were incredibly lucky that the dog bit a family who isn't going to sue. I could have won everything.
		
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## KittenInTheTree (4 July 2022)

I am so very tired of little barky bitey dogs. Had yet another one kick off at my collie this morning. Thankfully, it was on lead, but the owner was _determined_ to try and convince me that it didn't usually act that way towards other dogs. Apparently, it was only because "He's on the lead!" - erm, so do you mean my dog who's politely walking beside me on his lead and avoiding making any eye contact, or yours who's straining at the end of its lead and growling at us? Because I don't feel at all convinced that letting yours off would improve things, and mine is happy as he is, thanks.

I want to go and live somewhere with no other humans.


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## Moobli (4 July 2022)

GSD Woman said:



			Moobli, I believe that we generally agree on dog matters. On this I totally disagree. Having recently gone through a dog attack myself I say with my whole background that yes, that was stupid on both myself and my niece, but that dog needs to be put down. They were incredibly lucky that the dog bit a family who isn't going to sue. I could have won everything.
		
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And having been through what you have recently I may well feel the same.  I hope you’re on the mend.


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## maisie06 (5 July 2022)

Smitty said:



			Hmm.  Waiting at a bus stop.  Dog on lead comes up and sniffs me.  I say please get it away, middle aged owner says its OK, its friendly, I say I'm scared of dogs.  A bit of a grumble and off they go.   No apology. 

This is NOT good.  According to someone I met whilst away a couple of weeks ago and bemoaning the number of poo bags in a beauty spot, dogs are banned in one city in Australia.   I think a lot of people with dogs feel entitled.
		
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There are dog free zones on our local beaches in the summer (actually perfect as dogs get the nicer beaches east and west of the horrible touristy bit in the middle!) but I have lost count of the number of owners who just ignore the regs and continue to walk wherever they like...


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## GSD Woman (5 July 2022)

maisie06 said:



			There are dog free zones on our local beaches in the summer (actually perfect as dogs get the nicer beaches east and west of the horrible touristy bit in the middle!) but I have lost count of the number of owners who just ignore the regs and continue to walk wherever they like...
		
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The beaches near here don't allow dogs at all during the tourist season.  I can't blame them.  Too many people feel as though they don't need to clean up.  I've offered bags to a few of them.  Some are amazed since they grew up in the country and no one cleaned up. So I just point out that now they're in a public park. 

Where I walk the dogs some people actually let their dogs poop on the paths and don't bother to stick and flick or just pick up.  Argh.


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## SaddlePsych'D (5 July 2022)

maisie06 said:



			There are dog free zones on our local beaches in the summer (actually perfect as dogs get the nicer beaches east and west of the horrible touristy bit in the middle!) but I have lost count of the number of owners who just ignore the regs and continue to walk wherever they like...
		
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I wish stuff like this was better enforced. By who I dont know tbh but still. We used to walk Ivy in a space supposed to be on lead only seasonally for the ground nesting birds, and now in a local greenspace covered in signs saying keep your dog on a lead in theory should be a nice place to go but nope.


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## GSD Woman (5 July 2022)

SaddlePsych'D said:



			I wish stuff like this was better enforced. By who I dont know tbh but still. We used to walk Ivy in a space supposed to be on lead only seasonally for the ground nesting birds, and now in a local greenspace covered in signs saying keep your dog on a lead in theory should be a nice place to go but nope.
		
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I haven't walked at the one park in eons but when it was getting ready to open the closed roads for the Azalea Garden season the animal wardens would hang around and ticket the owners of off lead dogs.


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## SilverLinings (5 July 2022)

SaddlePsych'D said:



			I wish stuff like this was better enforced. By who I dont know tbh but still. We used to walk Ivy in a space supposed to be on lead only seasonally for the ground nesting birds, and now in a local greenspace covered in signs saying keep your dog on a lead in theory should be a nice place to go but nope.
		
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A few years ago I found a lovely spot to walk the dogs on the edge of local moorland. During spring and summer dogs needed to be kept on the lead because of ground nesting birds (including a couple of endangered breeds), and to stop people becoming 'blind' to the signs they were only put out during the months leads were required. After a few trips I stopped walking there as I found it ridiculously stressful to watch almost every other walker set their dogs free, and a large proportion of them then chase any bird they saw. There were so many other places in the area where you could walk off-lead; I really don't understand this selfish and stupid behaviour. 

I heard recently that the landowner (one of the utilities companies) has been in talks with the RSPB about banning all dogs from the area, and possibly blocking it to walkers too and turning it into some kind of protected nature area. It is such a shame to loose a lovely place to walk, but I can't see another option if so many people find it impossible to keep their dogs on a lead when told.


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## fiwen30 (5 July 2022)

Posted on fb ‘Dog was in accident and can no longer walk, does anyone have a buggy so I can still take them on a walk?’. Post doesn’t specify the extent of ‘can’t walk’. I hope it’s temporary rehab, but know it’s just as likely to be not…


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## SilverLinings (5 July 2022)

fiwen30 said:



			Posted on fb ‘Dog was in accident and can no longer walk, does anyone have a buggy so I can still take them on a walk?’. Post doesn’t specify the extent of ‘can’t walk’. I hope it’s temporary rehab, but know it’s just as likely to be not…
		
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I really hope it's been seen by a vet, saying it 'can no longer walk' rather implies it might be permanent and I can't imagine a vet leaving an animal in that condition


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## maisie06 (6 July 2022)

Not an irresponsible dog owner this morning but an irresponsible parent...walking slightly later this morning back from the beach walk we enjoy and come around the corner and a mum with 3 loose brats around 4-6 years  old, they see the dogs and run towards them arms outstreched screaming, springer crapped himself and shot behind my legs, cocker stood up tail erect, Im in what is a narrow alleyway between buildings, so I say don't touch the dogs VERY firmly in a pony club instructor tone, Mum is not impressed and said I had no right to be out in public if my dogs are vicious - well, Ermmmm I lost it, and told her in no uncertain terms that her parenting was the issue, I don't want to be put in a situation and I have every right to walk my dogs in peace without being pounced on by out of control children, I didn't let her get a word in at all, bloody silly woman who's kids will grow up to be self entitled brats with no respect.


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## fiwen30 (12 July 2022)

It’s a holiday in NI today, and the amount of found and lost dogs is astonishing - 3 different staff types found loose in our town alone.

We got accosted by 1 of them on our way home, partner was carrying a full shopping bag in 1 hand and had the lead in the other, and I had my hands full eating ice cream. Group of men stood on the corner, with a loose staff around their feet, and it came dashing across the road at my dog. My lad didn’t hear it coming, but as soon as he saw it he was NOT pleased - snapping and growling at it, without making contact, very much ‘get away from me’ noises. The staff seemed more overly excited and rude than aggressive, but of course that can easily change when over stimulated.

Partner panicked and kept tripping over them both, and I downed my ice cream and told him to keep our dog forwards and moving, while I body blocked and shouted at the staff. It wasn’t put off that easily, so I grabbed it by the collar and dragged it squirming back to the blokes, shouting at them to come and get the damn thing. It wasn’t even their dog! Just none of them had the common sense to secure it in any way.

It’s the second time in as many months that we’ve been badgered by loose dogs, in a busy enough residential area. The first one was a collie, I was by myself and managed to drive it off. But both times my dog has growled and snapped, and I feel awful that he feels he has to defend himself. In hindsight, I also know I shouldn’t have put my hands on the staff. It gives me the fear knowing how badly that couldve gone. Or if the staff had been dog aggressive, my boy wouldn’t have stood a chance - he talks big, but he’s also senior and arthritic.

Everyone walked away shaken but in 1 piece, which is the most important thing.

Just still not quite sure what the ideal type of reaction and response should be, in a situation like those?


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## GSD Woman (12 July 2022)

fiwen30,  if you can keep your head and be quick about it on an intact male twist the testicles and then get the h3ll out of there. If your dog is attacked grab the attacking dog by the hind legs. If you carry an extra slip lead you can try and use that.  I had to do that once.  The dog (pit bull) was lovely and friendly until I went to remove my good leather leash.  The dog got to keep it. if nothing else, make yourself as large as you can. Spread out your arms and use a low growly voice. It may or may not work.
Good Luck


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## CanteringCarrot (12 July 2022)

Happenings are very rare around here re irresponsible dog owners, but yesterday was just a bit annoying.

Walking up a path where it branches off in 3 different directions and there's a bench in the middle. Two older men are there with their 3 small dogs. My Lab notices them, and one is coming toward us. It doesn't respond to it's name being called and approaches us. Then a JRT comes running over too. We do know the JRT (but he wasn't with his owner, I'm assuming one of these men were walking him with their dog for whatever reason).

Lab is now super excited because two loose dogs are on her and they're small dogs. Small dogs are very interesting to her. So I can't quite get her to ignore them and she's just sort of bouncing around with them at our feet. We keep walking and eventually they wander off.

But what if my Lab was not friendly? Those two little dogs could've been torn apart or attacked. My Lab was on her leash (as she should be when you see another dog) and they didn't know her. I also didn't enjoy being pestered by the small dogs.

I also know the owner of the JRT (well, he's owned by an older couple), and the woman would've been quite annoyed that her dog was allowed to run up to another. She's very strict with him, especially about passing other dogs and behaving/not taking notice. I haven't told her because I don't want to stir the pot.

Fortunately my Lab is rather friendly and curious, but she has growled and taken offense in the past. Idk why people think it's ok to let their dogs ambush someone.


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## KittenInTheTree (12 July 2022)

GSD Woman said:



			fiwen30,  if you can keep your head and be quick about it *on an intact male twist the testicles* and then get the h3ll out of there. If your dog is attacked grab the attacking dog by the hind legs. If you carry an extra slip lead you can try and use that.  I had to do that once.  The dog (pit bull) was lovely and friendly until I went to remove my good leather leash.  The dog got to keep it. if nothing else, make yourself as large as you can. Spread out your arms and use a low growly voice. It may or may not work.
Good Luck
		
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DO NOT ATTEMPT TO GRAB RANDOM DOGS BY THE TESTICLES! To do so, you would be placing your face and neck on a level with the animal's mouth whilst groping around, and dogs are _much_ faster than humans.


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## StableMum (12 July 2022)

Pottering with my old lad on lead outside our field gate (no through road in front of Church leading to footpath) the other evening, while OH and daughter were sorting the horses we got rushed at by three whippets off lead and owners way off round the corner with no idea what they were up to. It's not the first time and I've asked the man who owns them before not to do it because we ride, and lead out horses from the field to the stable along there and horses could be spooked and his dogs risk being kicked. Anyway handed OH my dog to have a word, the bloke was a bit contrite said he didn't normally let them off now BUT his wife just stood there and laughed in my face. Her attitude was appalling she was speaking down to me as if I was an idiot for asking. Anyway she didn't bargain for my response because she got both barrels. Where my dog is concerned I don't hold back.


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## skinnydipper (12 July 2022)

KittenInTheTree said:



			DO NOT ATTEMPT TO GRAB RANDOM DOGS BY THE TESTICLES! To do so, you would be placing your face and neck on a level with the animal's mouth whilst groping around, and dogs are _much_ faster than humans.
		
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Yeah, I was thinking 'best of luck with that one'.


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## MurphysMinder (12 July 2022)

Saw this beauty on a Fb page today.   "is such a pain on and off the lead with other dogs and lone men walking. But we just let him off the lead and let him be told off by other dogs! He’s so aggressive on the lead otherwise! "   Myself and another member from on here were the only ones who told this owner that this is not the way to go.   It is a small breed and they can have a bit of attitude and need firm training,  but the idea is for the owner to train the dog not other peoples dogs!    I suspect they think I'm a miserable sod now.


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## skinnydipper (12 July 2022)

MurphysMinder said:



			Saw this beauty on a Fb page today.   "is such a pain on and off the lead with other dogs and lone men walking. But we just let him off the lead and let him be told off by other dogs! He’s so aggressive on the lead otherwise! "   Myself and another member from on here were the only ones who told this owner that this is not the way to go.   It is a small breed and they can have a bit of attitude and need firm training,  but the idea is for the owner to train the dog not other peoples dogs!    I suspect they think I'm a miserable sod now.
		
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Why they would want to risk their own dog being bitten is beyond me.  Clearly some numpty owner who has never seen the damage that one dog can do to another in the blink of an eye. 

Aside from they should not be expecting other people's dogs to train theirs, they are being really very unfair to the other dog who, for a variety of reasons, may not want another dog in its face.


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## CorvusCorax (12 July 2022)

Unfortunately my female has decided to deal with strange dogs rushing up to her by going straight for their faces. She's on a leash beside me so if someone else's dog is so out of control that they end up in her space, that's their problem.


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## AShetlandBitMeOnce (12 July 2022)

I was browsing 'borrow my dog' this evening and one of the adverts was someone who is looking for a family with children to come out with them and their dog, they want to socialise it with kids and make sure he is alright.. He's an 11 month old, 45kg, entire male Antolian Shepherd they have just rescued from Macedonia. Erm.. no thank you. I wouldn't be risking my childs face to find what trauma your dog is still holding.

I also scrolled past an American account on Tik Tok, he has a staffy and lets her off lead and jokes about how she has no recall at all and is extremely reactive. Apparently if a dog approaches her then it's that dogs fault and their owners problem. He lost her the other day and found her 12 miles away waiting for him at his home. I blocked the account as it was winding me up. The mind boggles at such idiocy.


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## Amymay (12 July 2022)

MurphysMinder said:



			Saw this beauty on a Fb page today.   "is such a pain on and off the lead with other dogs and lone men walking. But we just let him off the lead and let him be told off by other dogs! He’s so aggressive on the lead otherwise! "   Myself and another member from on here were the only ones who told this owner that this is not the way to go.   It is a small breed and they can have a bit of attitude and need firm training,  but the idea is for the owner to train the dog not other peoples dogs!    I suspect they think I'm a miserable sod now.
		
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If we did that with Jack it would be carnage!

We’re on holiday at the moment. Lots of dogs, but all is good. No issues at all - except for Cane Corso that charged us on the beach yesterday. I was beyond horrified.


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## Caol Ila (12 July 2022)

Dog poop baggies hanging on trees. Why???

Why would you go through the trouble of bagging it, then leave it? Are you expecting magic poop fairies? I guess some people don't want to carry it around, so they leave it on a tree, thinking they will collect it, then forget about it. But it still makes no sense because I see poop baggies attached to trees less than 10 meters from a bin.


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## GSD Woman (13 July 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			Yeah, I was thinking 'best of luck with that one'.
		
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It will work, especially if they are committed to the fight. May not be a first choice but it can work.




Caol Ila said:



			Dog poop baggies hanging on trees. Why???

Why would you go through the trouble of bagging it, then leave it? Are you expecting magic poop fairies? I guess some people don't want to carry it around, so they leave it on a tree, thinking they will collect it, then forget about it. But it still makes no sense because I see poop baggies attached to trees less than 10 meters from a bin.
		
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If I was that close to a bin I would just carry the bag to the bin.  I occasionally hang bags in  trees knowing I'll be going be that way and I can pick up on the way back. I'm not fond of carrying poop about for our entire walk if I can do something simple with the  poop.


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## KittenInTheTree (13 July 2022)

People who leave bagged up poo lying or hanging in their wake are just as disgusting as the ones who don't bother lifting it at all, only with plastic pollution added into the mix.


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## GSD Woman (13 July 2022)

KittenInTheTree said:



			People who leave bagged up poo lying or hanging in their wake are just as disgusting as the ones who don't bother lifting it at all, only with plastic pollution added into the mix.
		
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Gee, thanks.  At least I retrieve my poo bags on the way back to the car. And what am I supposed to use to pick up the poo? Or should I throw the poop into one of the creeks that drains to the Chesapeake Bay?


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## skinnydipper (13 July 2022)

GSD Woman said:



			Gee, thanks.  At least I retrieve my poo bags on the way back to the car. And what am I supposed to use to pick up the poo? Or should I throw the poop into one of the creeks that drains to the Chesapeake Bay?
		
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Thing is, over here people decorate trees and shrubs with used poo bags and they remain a permanent fixture.

If I am going on a walk where I know bins will be few and far between, I don't find it a problem to carry something to put the filled poo bags in until I reach a bin.  We have bags like a MucBag or Dicky bag available here.  We can also buy Doo Doo Tubes from Amazon UK, a US import.

When I had a few dogs I used a MucSac which was a largish rigid plastic  container with a hinged sealed lid and shoulder strap, though I can't see them for sale now.

Now I use a waterproof bumbag, something like this -
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/394153902794?hash=item5bc56742ca:g:k80AAOSw2YVix5Nj


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## Tiddlypom (13 July 2022)

We've got a blue Tupperware type pot with a snaplock lid which we put the filled poo bags in. The blue pot is not used for anything else. If the dog performs just after we've set off, I'll pop back to the car and put the bag just under the car, and make sure that I retrieve it before we set off for home.

Blue pot goes in a mini rucksack on the walk.


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## skinnydipper (13 July 2022)

Picking my way through other people's dog's shit to clear up after my own dog is a pet hate.  It annoys me even more when people don't clear up after their dog in parks where children play.

Picking up poo is part and parcel of dog ownership and if people can't be ar$ed to do it then they shouldn't get a dog.


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## GSD Woman (13 July 2022)

Tiddlypom said:



			We've got a blue Tupperware type pot with a snaplock lid which we put the filled poo bags in. The blue pot is not used for anything else. If the dog performs just after we've set off, I'll pop back to the car and put the bag just under the car, and make sure that I retrieve it before we set off for home.

Blue pot goes in a mini rucksack on the walk.
		
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I like this Tupperware idea.   I often stick and flick but there are times I can't. I'll probably stick with hanging on trees though. Not many people walk where I do at the time I do.  When I walk in neighborhoods I carry it with  me but at those times I'm not using a Chuck-It to throw tennis balls. (That takes my hands.)


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## Cinnamontoast (13 July 2022)

My trainer taught me a handy trick-trap the handles of the poo bag under a windscreen wiper when no bins are available. But it smells!


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## BBP (13 July 2022)

GSD Woman said:



			Gee, thanks.  At least I retrieve my poo bags on the way back to the car. And what am I supposed to use to pick up the poo? Or should I throw the poop into one of the creeks that drains to the Chesapeake Bay?
		
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One of these clipped to the lead! 🙂 I never leave home with the dog without it. Must be a US equivalent.
https://www.dickybag.com/shop/dicky-bags


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## CorvusCorax (13 July 2022)

I just have a training vest, they have big pockets.


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## Pearlsasinger (13 July 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			My trainer taught me a handy trick-trap the handles of the poo bag under a windscreen wiper when no bins are available. But it smells!
		
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I hope the trainer meant your own windscreen wiper


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## GSD Woman (14 July 2022)

BBP said:



			One of these clipped to the lead! 🙂 I never leave home with the dog without it. Must be a US equivalent.
https://www.dickybag.com/shop/dicky-bags

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I would love to find something like this. It would solve the problem of how to carry poo.
I put my poop bags onto the rear windshield wiper if I need to carry that to a bin. I tried to do the front wipers but phew it was nasty stinky.


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## BBP (14 July 2022)

GSD Woman said:



			I would love to find something like this. It would solve the problem of how to carry poo.
I put my poop bags onto the rear windshield wiper if I need to carry that to a bin. I tried to do the front wipers but phew it was nasty stinky.
		
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These are such a good solution, no smell and no carrying an icky stinky poo bag by the handles for miles, and can carry it home in the car without it smelling. The empty poo bags store inside it. I clip it to my running belt when I go running with the dog too.


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## skinnydipper (14 July 2022)

GSD Woman said:



			I would love to find something like this.
		
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Choice of size and colour -

https://dogdootube.com


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## Annette4 (14 July 2022)

We have a Dickie bag which comes everywhere on walks, really handy and no carrying smelly poo bags.


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## Karran (14 July 2022)

This has just reminded me that I put two poo bags in the car last night. They will still be there by the time I get home at 6.30 tonight, with the car parked in full sun all day.....


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## CorvusCorax (14 July 2022)

I have a friend who hangs them on the tow bar and frequently forgets about them. Tis fun in a convoy.


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## Millionwords (14 July 2022)

Just Use a carabena clipped to the lead handle...and then clip the poo bag to that.


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## Unicorn (14 July 2022)

Millionwords said:



			Just Use a carabena clipped to the lead handle...and then clip the poo bag to that.
		
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Unless you're planning on walking through gorse and brambles.  That was not nice.


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## GSD Woman (14 July 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			Choice of size and colour -

https://dogdootube.com

Click to expand...

Amazon carries these and I just ordered a large purple one.


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## SaddlePsych'D (14 July 2022)

Karran said:



			This has just reminded me that I put two poo bags in the car last night. They will still be there by the time I get home at 6.30 tonight, with the car parked in full sun all day.....
		
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We did this a little while ago. Never so grateful for the Covid induced loss of smell at the time. OH had to suffer though!


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## Cinnamontoast (14 July 2022)

Pearlsasinger said:



			I hope the trainer meant your own windscreen wiper

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Ha, don’t give me ideas! 



GSD Woman said:



			I would love to find something like this. It would solve the problem of how to carry poo.
I put my poop bags onto the rear windshield wiper if I need to carry that to a bin. I tried to do the front wipers but phew it was nasty stinky.
		
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Why did I not think of that?! Except people will probably try to stop me and tell me I have something attached, whilst popping it on the front means it can be discretely tucked under the bonnet (hood).



GSD Woman said:



			Amazon carries these and I just ordered a large purple one.
		
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Best colour.


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## Nasicus (15 July 2022)

Re: Wiper Poo Bags, I did come across this, the Kurgo Tailgate Dumpster, a magnetic box that sticks onto your car to put poo bags in:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Kurgo-Tailgate-Dumpster-Garbage-Bags/dp/B075VDX7K7

Reviews are mixed in regards to how well it sticks, but I thought it was interesting none the less!
Personally I just go for the rear wiper method, of if it's a very short drive I'll chuck the bag in the divot between base of the windshield and top of the bonnet. But then I have a 5kg dog, so only teeny tiny poops to deal with.


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## SaddlePsych'D (16 July 2022)

Yesterday we got ran at by two off lead dogs, no one in sight for them. Turns out they were part of a big group running around the woods while the two pro dog walkers stood having a natter not paying attention to either of their packs. 

Today we came across what I assume is a foreign rescue dog. We've seen it before, it's really anxious/reactive and even us being on the other side of the road is too much for it to tolerate. I know the barking is not necessarily aggressive but still wasn't mad impressed the owner decided to being it into the green space we were in, let it off lead, and then sit smack bang in the middle of the space instead of to the other end (we'd moved to one end to give them more space).

Also found out today that the scary walked on a chain dog is in fact a shepherd x pit and has some kind of DDA thing so it's supposed to have a muzzle on (but doesn't) and it's going to carry on this way until it attacks another dog again. We met the owner of a dog who it leapt over a fence to attack. Felt sorry for them having to walk around knowing it lives just round the corner (it stands at the wide open first floor window barking, I remember it from when we first moved thinking jfc would it jump out).


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## Cinnamontoast (16 July 2022)

Pups were loose-always within sight in the big woods, Bear and Milo on the lead and we stopped to allow someone to go past on the narrow windy path we were on. He came to tell us his rescue dog was ‘a little bit reactive’ and we could just go past. Popped the youngsters on the lead and walked past the whippet/lurcher with the man’s wife hiding in the trees. It went nuts at ours. It’s not the track to take an aggressive dog.


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## CorvusCorax (16 July 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			Pups were loose-always within sight in the big woods, Bear and Milo on the lead and we stopped to allow someone to go past on the narrow windy path we were on. He came to tell us his rescue dog was ‘a little bit reactive’ and we could just go past. Popped the youngsters on the lead and walked past the whippet/lurcher with the man’s wife hiding in the trees. It went nuts at ours. It’s not the track to take an aggressive dog.
		
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Sorry what was the problem here? He was being responsible.


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## Nasicus (18 July 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			Sorry what was the problem here? He was being responsible.
		
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Possibly the track being so narrow that it puts the reactive dog in a situation where it has to pass other dogs at very close proximity. I can think of a few tracks locally where it's impossible to pass another person/dog without bumping a few limbs, lest you want to clamber into the 6ft high bank of nettles/brambles either side.
That's just a guess though, if there's space to pass or get off the track and remove the reactive dog from that situation then the guy was pretty good to go ahead and give a warning.


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## CanteringCarrot (18 July 2022)

I am the irresponsible owner.

Left the dog out in the garden on Saturday while I washed my car (garden visible from driveway), and she got into a bucket of bird seed balls that were on the terrace. She was quick and I don't know how many she ate. Could've been 4 or 5.

She hasn't really been able to keep food down, or water if she drinks too much, but is acting normal and not dehydrated according to the vet. We went there this morning for some imaging and meds. Going to see what happens with the meds today, and if it still continues, then she's in for some imaging with contrast tomorrow morning and possible an op.

Exactly no one was surprised that a Labrador did this 🙄

She doesn't really chew her food, which is why she has a slow feeder bowl, so I was worried that she just had straight up balls of seed and fat in her. Honestly, I'm surprised it took 3 years before something like this happened. She's sooo piggy and the container happened the be in reach and the lid loose, apparently.


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## GSD Woman (18 July 2022)

CanteringCarrot,

I am so not surprised that a Labrador did something like this. What I'm surprised about is that it has upset her tummy. 

I hope she'll be OK.


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## LadyGascoyne (18 July 2022)

There is someone walking their Dobermann, nowhere near the footpath, through a field of sheep, on the farm right now.

It is 36 degrees.


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## The Fuzzy Furry (18 July 2022)

I expect to get glared at when I leave the office in around 20 to 30 mins - handbag over a shoulder and clasping the dog to my front. I figured that being in a aircon office all day and chilled tea towels to sit on in the car for a 10 to 15 min journey to the yard then 15 mins or so home, was more preferable to being at home all day with no air con.
Thank goodness she is small enough to pick up tho. (but gets heavier by the step!)


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## CorvusCorax (18 July 2022)

Nasicus said:



			Possibly the track being so narrow that it puts the reactive dog in a situation where it has to pass other dogs at very close proximity. I can think of a few tracks locally where it's impossible to pass another person/dog without bumping a few limbs, lest you want to clamber into the 6ft high bank of nettles/brambles either side.
That's just a guess though, if there's space to pass or get off the track and remove the reactive dog from that situation then the guy was pretty good to go ahead and give a warning.
		
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Sounds the the dog had been taken off the track/into trees and there was room to pass. I have one dog who I have to do this with.
She's can be gobby (it's insecurity rather than aggression) and I do my best to keep her with me and manage the situation, I'd hate to be judged as irresponsible for that....


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## CorvusCorax (18 July 2022)

GSD Woman said:



			CanteringCarrot,

I am so not surprised that a Labrador did something like this. What I'm surprised about is that it has upset her tummy.

I hope she'll be OK.
		
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It'll just be pure fat, it would give a lot of dogs the runs.


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## skinnydipper (18 July 2022)

GSD Woman said:



			I am so not surprised that a Labrador did something like this. What I'm surprised about is that it has upset her tummy.
		
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CorvusCorax said:



			It'll just be pure fat, it would give a lot of dogs the runs.
		
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could also cause pancreatitis.


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## skinnydipper (18 July 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			Sounds the the dog had been taken off the track/into trees and there was room to pass. I have one dog who I have to do this with.
		
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That wouldn't do you much good round here, too many dense owners.

I was more than a bit cross and disappointed last week.

I was walking along in a park with 2 people I'd bumped into, and their dogs, when a couple with a very nervous spaniel were coming along the path towards us.  They took her off the path and up a bank to a higher level.  Any fool could see they were trying to avoid us.

The two dogs left their owners and ran up to the poor spaniel who had sunk to her belly, immobilised by fear. The owners did nothing, just casually watched, totally unconcerned,  as their dogs stood over her, sniffing from top to tail. I pointed out that the poor little thing was terrified, thinking this might spur them on to call their dogs. Nope. Neither of them called or went and removed their dog.   I was disappointed too,  that the owners of the spaniel didn't advocate for their dog and ask them to call their dogs.

I had to walk away before I said too much.


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## CanteringCarrot (18 July 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			It'll just be pure fat, it would give a lot of dogs the runs.
		
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And that's what I thought too, except there's been nothing out of the back end. It's all come out of the front end yesterday and today. She kept down a bit of chicken and rice earlier. So she'll have her meds and a bit more again tonight.


She's not the first Lab I've had that thinks their a walking garbage disposal but can't actually stomach anything other than their "sensitive" dog food diet.


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## Cinnamontoast (18 July 2022)

Nasicus said:



			Possibly the track being so narrow that it puts the reactive dog in a situation where it has to pass other dogs at very close proximity. I can think of a few tracks locally where it's impossible to pass another person/dog without bumping a few limbs, lest you want to clamber into the 6ft high bank of nettles/brambles either side.
That's just a guess though, if there's space to pass or get off the track and remove the reactive dog from that situation then the guy was pretty good to go ahead and give a warning.
		
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I agree they were good to move the dog, but I think choosing the track is a bit silly. The whole place is known as 'safe' ie you can usually let dogs off without fear of attack. There's a notice at each entrance saying dangerous dogs should wear a muzzle. I have no doubt it would have gone for Mitch had the owner not wrestled it away.


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## CorvusCorax (18 July 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			I agree they were good to move the dog, but I think choosing the track is a bit silly. The whole place is known as 'safe' ie you can usually let dogs off without fear of attack. There's a notice at each entrance saying dangerous dogs should wear a muzzle. I have no doubt it would have gone for Mitch had the owner not wrestled it away.
		
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But having had a dog that you indicate wasn't good with others at times, I presume you A) took him out B) managed him appropriately. Other people are also allowed to do this and the guy had the manners and foresight to take the dog off the track and warn you.
There's a lot if 'what ifs' here that didn't actually happen. But I'm sure he knows now to walk somewhere else.


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## GSD Woman (19 July 2022)

CanteringCarrot said:



			And that's what I thought too, except there's been nothing out of the back end. It's all come out of the front end yesterday and today. She kept down a bit of chicken and rice earlier. So she'll have her meds and a bit more again tonight.


She's not the first Lab I've had that thinks their a walking garbage disposal but can't actually stomach anything other than their "sensitive" dog food diet.
		
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So I took a few cucumbers over to my neighbor this evening. The dogs walked over with me. I turned around to see Rudy checking out something in the shrubbery. Robbie told me he had just dumped vegetable oil there. Rudy much have been a Labrador in a former life. 

Seriously, I don't think he had enough to cause any trouble.


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## skinnydipper (19 July 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			I agree they were good to move the dog, but I think choosing the track is a bit silly. The whole place is known as 'safe' ie you can usually let dogs off without fear of attack. There's a notice at each entrance saying dangerous dogs should wear a muzzle. I have no doubt it would have gone for Mitch had the owner not wrestled it away.
		
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I would take "a little reactive" to mean that the dog might be vocal when asking for space.

I haven't forgotten what it is like to have a dog who didn't enjoy having unfamiliar dogs in his face and try to treat others with the courtesy and consideration that we always appreciated.


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## Cinnamontoast (19 July 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			I would take "a little reactive" to mean that the dog might be vocal when asking for space.

I haven't forgotten what it is like to have a dog who didn't enjoy having unfamiliar dogs in his face and try to treat others with the courtesy and consideration that we always appreciated.
		
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Did you not read my post where I said it went nuts? Mine were nowhere near it because we put them on a lead and took them past. 

Given I spent 11 years keeping other dogs safe from Zak, I think you know how courteous and considerate I am. This was not a 'little reactive', this was a dog like Zak that seemed very aggressive. You seem to be implying that I should have tried harder or something in the situation. I avoided those woods for years because of Zak. I certainly wouldn't have deliberately put him in a situation where he'd be confronted with other dogs and had a job to get away.

A 'little reactive' was a gross understatement from the owner. I know that behaviour, I've lived with it for years.


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## skinnydipper (19 July 2022)

...


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## skinnydipper (19 July 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			Did you not read my post where I said it went nuts? Mine were nowhere near it because we put them on a lead and took them past.

Given I spent 11 years keeping other dogs safe from Zak, I think you know how courteous and considerate I am. This was not a 'little reactive', this was a dog like Zak that seemed very aggressive. You seem to be implying that I should have tried harder or something in the situation. I avoided those woods for years because of Zak. I certainly wouldn't have deliberately put him in a situation where he'd be confronted with other dogs and had a job to get away.

A 'little reactive' was a gross understatement from the owner. I know that behaviour, I've lived with it for years.
		
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I've changed my mind - I will respond to your post.

The owners of the dog in the wood took their reactive, on lead,  dog off the path out of the way, a responsible thing to do IMO.

Whereas this dog was off leash in a park?

_It was my absolute nightmare with Zak, friendly looking spaniel who’d want to kill any dog who bounced up to him.  _

_Hes fine as long as nothing comes up to him, hell try to kill it if it does. _

_I'm afraid that Zak is the big problem. He's extremely reactive to other dogs and will try to drag me to kill other dogs. _

_His dog was on the lead and the OH put Zak into a sit which he normally holds. For once, he didn’t and went for the on lead dog. The other owner booted him, gave my OH a mouthful and threatened to effing kill Zak next time. _

_He isnt muzzled because we train every time we go out. _

What is it that I didn't understand?


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## Cinnamontoast (19 July 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			I've changed my mind - I will respond to your post.

The owners of the dog in the wood took their reactive, on lead,  dog off the path out of the way, a responsible thing to do IMO.

Whereas this dog was off leash in a park?

_It was my absolute nightmare with Zak, friendly looking spaniel who’d want to kill any dog who bounced up to him.  _

_Hes fine as long as nothing comes up to him, hell try to kill it if it does. _

_I'm afraid that Zak is the big problem. He's extremely reactive to other dogs and will try to drag me to kill other dogs. _

_His dog was on the lead and the OH put Zak into a sit which he normally holds. For once, he didn’t and went for the on lead dog. The other owner booted him, gave my OH a mouthful and threatened to effing kill Zak next time. _

_He isnt muzzled because we train every time we go out. _

What didn't I understand?
		
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About what? He wasn’t muzzled because we trained every single walk, tricky to pick up when muzzled. He had never broken a sit before. He never went anywhere we knew there’d be lots of loose dogs, hence we haven’t been to the woods for years.

We had 2 incidents in the past 5 years, the one above and another one because (well, obviously Zak’s fault and mine because I can’t run due to the accident) another owner had no recall and despite Zak being on the lead, a dog came running at him and went under him. As another poster said, a reactive dog has to walk somewhere.

My issue is not that the very responsible owner held him off the track, it’s that they chose the narrowest, most twisty path in an area renowned for being the place to let your dog run loose. Had I been alone, they wouldn’t have known I was there. Luckily, I was talking to my OH, they heard me and very considerately let me know their dog was up ahead.


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## CorvusCorax (20 July 2022)

Happy to see that the man on my street who pretends he's a nice guy who luuuurves dogs (IE he gets the keys to people's houses so he can 'walk them') get absolutely dragged on the town Facebook yesterday for hauling a fat old terrier around in the peak of the heat on Monday when it could barely walk.
He's the same guy who pushes an obese, lame Lab around in a pram because it can't walk and thinks acupuncture and taking it to the toilet by holding it up with yoga bands will do the trick.


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## Pearlsasinger (20 July 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			Happy to see that the man on my street who pretends he's a nice guy who luuuurves dogs (IE he gets the keys to people's houses so he can 'walk them') get absolutely dragged on the town Facebook yesterday for hauling a fat old terrier around in the peak of the heat on Monday when it could barely walk.
He's the same guy who pushes an obese, lame Lab around in a pram because it can't walk and thinks acupuncture and taking it to the toilet by holding it up with yoga bands will do the trick.
		
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That sounds like one of the most irresponsible set ups ever. What on earth are the owners thinking?


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## CorvusCorax (20 July 2022)

He doesn't speak to me at all. Even if he's talking to someone I know and I stop and say hi.

OMG lol he's just walked up behind me. I think I heard him call me a bitch 🤣 
He's one of those people who starts talking really loudly to the dogs when he thinks people are in earshot and doesn't at all otherwise. Like just now after muttering 'bitch' under his breath he started going OH GOOD DOG, WHAT A GOOD DOG.
Cause mine are bad dogs, you see, because one of them took exception to being jumped on by a collie when I had put him in a down stay, seven years ago. At least I clear up after mine.


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## skinnydipper (20 July 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			Happy to see that the man on my street who pretends he's a nice guy who luuuurves dogs (IE he gets the keys to people's houses so he can 'walk them') get absolutely dragged on the town Facebook yesterday for hauling a fat old terrier around in the peak of the heat on Monday when it could barely walk.
He's the same guy who pushes an obese, lame Lab around in a pram because it can't walk and thinks acupuncture and taking it to the toilet by holding it up with yoga bands will do the trick.
		
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In my opinion, it isn't kind to allow a dog to get to the point where it is unable to go out for a walk, whether that be due to non painful progressive paralysis (DM) or, even worse, due to pain.  To me, caring for a dog includes knowing when to let them go.


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## MurphysMinder (20 July 2022)

Pearlsasinger said:



			That sounds like one of the most irresponsible set ups ever. What on earth are the owners thinking?
		
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In my opinion it is far too easy for people to set up as dog walkers with absolutely no knowledge and very little experience of dogs.   I see it regularly on local fb pages,  people asking for suggestions and folks being recommended who seem to have very little idea I've seen photos proudly posted by a so called dog walker of a dog with a flexi attached to  a halti style headcollar,  in a pack of  others all off lead!   This person's name comes up regularly as highly recommended because she "loves" dogs.


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## Caol Ila (20 July 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			My issue is not that the very responsible owner held him off the track, it’s that they chose the narrowest, most twisty path in an area renowned for being the place to let your dog run loose. Had I been alone, they wouldn’t have known I was there. Luckily, I was talking to my OH, they heard me and very considerately let me know their dog was up ahead.
		
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Maybe he was new to the place and didn't deliberately "choose" it. Until you become familiar with the trails in any given park or area, you don't necessarily know how narrow or twisty a trail is going to get until you're on it.


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## Cinnamontoast (20 July 2022)

Caol Ila said:



			Maybe he was new to the place and didn't deliberately "choose" it. Until you become familiar with the trails in any given park or area, you don't necessarily know how narrow or twisty a trail is going to get until you're on it.
		
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Very possible. He said the dog had been in rescue for 7/8 years, bless! He did seem very knowledgeable, was talking about it only liking other 'pointy' dogs. He's probably on here! I was happy he spoke to me, I would have been really upset if young bouncy dogs had pelted up to Zak, so absolutely fair play to him.


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## SaddlePsych'D (20 July 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			Very possible. He said the dog had been in rescue for 7/8 years, bless! He did seem very knowledgeable, was talking about it only liking other 'pointy' dogs. He's probably on here! I was happy he spoke to me, I would have been really upset if young bouncy dogs had pelted up to Zak, so absolutely fair play to him.
		
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Having been out walking with someone with a reactive greyhound (a big one!) I can see how them going off can be really intimidating. It used to annoy me watching this person repeatedly let his dog get too close to other non sighthounds and then react, in spaces where it really was avoidable. He did at least have this dog muzzled at all times but even then I think the reaction would understandably be worrying to those on the other end of it.

Last night saw a video of someone training their malinois. Great stuff except...they were being prasied on their precision correction just before a lunge, preventing said lunge at just normal passers by on a not very wide path. I'm not sure I fancy involuntary being the guinea pig for someone's training session within easy striking distance of a non muzzled dog!

Today have just read there's an Akita in the neighbourhood that's quite often just left to roam the streets and has previously attacked other dogs. Genuinely considering selling and moving house. We've only been back a month and I'm sick of feeling like wherever I go it's not going to be safe. Bring back the annoying doodles and poos! It's one thing putting yourself between them and your dog, here it's some quite serious dogs and I'm just not sure my policeman's hand manoeuvre is going to cut it. Probably lose my hand.


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## Cinnamontoast (20 July 2022)

I'm quite frankly scared of Akitas. We stopped going to one field because the owner let it run free while he cycled, so not very much control from what I could see. Then one bit Brig so I really wasn't happy. It was meant to be muzzled after ripping open another owner's arm, but never was. I didn't see it again cos I knew where he took it. 

It"s probably stupid, but I'm also wary of GSDs, despite the neighbour's very soppy one. One attacked Brig once, another field we avoided!


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## Amymay (20 July 2022)

Oh, Akita’s are definitely on my ‘to avoid’ list!


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## CorvusCorax (20 July 2022)

Absolute classic of the genre just now.
Bitch in van with tailgate up after her run, car gate open before we go training, while I run the lads. Middle dog was taking ages to finish a pee so I just walked around the corner of the house with the flexi fully extended to wait for him to join me.
See a woman outside the wall on the lane staring at me.
Look to my left and see a JRT just toddling into the drive towards back of van, bitch starts barking like mad so I say 'er, there's a dog there'.
She says 'oh, sorry' and whistles then I remember Pissing Pete and blurt out 'there's a dog here too' whereby the Absolute Unit comes galloping around the corner.
**Then** she actually calls her dog, which then goes round to the pedestrian gate and stands there barking at mine, who barks back.

It's a recurring theme around here, but people seem very put out that my dogs and I have the temerity to not enjoy strange dogs in their gaff.
She was standing there staring at me because she was literally just waiting for her dog to finish whatever it was doing on someone else's property.
Is it not incredibly rude to just let your dog wander into other people's gardens? I personally would be affronted. None of mine have the opportunity to do any harm to interlopers (I have to keep them on a line in the garden because of cats), but would you not find the mere possibility of your small dog getting milled by a larger one, a deterrent?!


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## skinnydipper (20 July 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			Is it not incredibly rude to just let your dog wander into other people's gardens?
		
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Wait till they crap on your drive, that always ruins my day.  It's to be hoped for their sake I never find out who it is.


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## Arzada (20 July 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			Wait till they crap on your drive, that always ruins my day.  It's to be hoped for their sake I never find out who it is.
		
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Here's one way of dealing with it


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## Cinnamontoast (20 July 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			Wait till they crap on your drive, that always ruins my day.  It's to be hoped for their sake I never find out who it is.
		
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Fox this morning, I think, right by the bins I had fortunately put out last night. It used to the neighbour’s staff who would run up the drive, crouch behind the car and crap on the doorstep. We asked the neighbour to stop letting it run up!


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## misst (20 July 2022)

I was walking with my 2 little terriers and daughters daxie x jrt at the weekend. We were stopped chatting with the owner of an on lead french bulldog when 3 massive off lead dogs came bounding over. Frenchie owner grabbed his and picked it up as recently injured by a big dog jumping on it. Daughter shortened lead on daxie x as she is a bit reactive with bouncy dogs. I got hold of small jrt as she is over friendly with with others and too small to play with mastiff x types. Little terrier x put himself behind a bush as he dislikes dogs he doesn't know but won't react unless they are right up in his face. Huge dogs - 2 mastiff x type and a ridgeback almost knock us over. Then one of the bigger ones starts barking in my jrts face and pawing at her with his front legs which are massive - my dog weighs 5.5kg. I have hold of her collar but by now she is frightened. Frenchie owner and my daughter and I say these dogs are too small for yours to play with the two owners of big dogs. Daughter also says my dog is reactive and so is this one (the Frenchie). All three big dogs start dancing around pawing at my little one and barking a lot.  Owners of big dogs laugh and say ... guess what ... "oh they're only playing" . No calling them off no putting them on leads. By now I was furious and looking around for my little 6kg boy - who comes roaring out of the bushes to protect his pack!!! He saw them off - no contact just lots of growling and yapping and rushing around. Normally I would of course sanction this behaviour but this time I was all "good boy Moti" "well done" which I know is not really the thing to do but I was very shaken. 
At best it was unpleasant but these "friendly" dogs could have injured our dogs easily and also were intimidating and likely to knock people over as well as dogs. Never seen any of these dogs in our woods before and hope never to see them again. A nice peaceful walk upset quite needlessly by ignorant owners.


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## Cinnamontoast (20 July 2022)

I used to get this all the time, owners actively encouraging their dog to run up or doing nothing and banging on about them just playing. Idiots. If a dog is on lead, I really think other owners should realise that it’s for a reason. Allowing huge dogs 5 times the size of little ones to paw at them is appalling behaviour. I hope your lot are ok.


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## misst (20 July 2022)

Thanks CT they are fine but it could have been different. My little lad was super brave but I don't usually encourage this behaviour as it could go wrong for him and I don't want him to be any more reactive than he is already.  The Frenchie owner was very upset as the Frenchie had been squashed and his back hurt two weeks previously. My little jrt is tough as old boots and seems impervious to most things luckily. I don't encourage play with dogs they don't know of any size and she is only 2 so still quite playful. She was off lead but has good recall. I was happy to just lightly hold her collar but these dogs were quite worrying as they surrounded us and I hate pawing at the best of times. It might be playful but it comes across as quite dominating/aggressive.


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## Cinnamontoast (20 July 2022)

Mine are not happy with big dogs, Goose is really submissive, but no wonder given how terrifying bigger dogs must be.


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## HashRouge (20 July 2022)

I will start by saying that I don't own a dog, and do not consider myself especially knowledgeable about them either. BUT...

I am on holiday in Wales at the moment. On Monday it wasn't as hot as the rest of the country, but it still got up to about 33 degrees and felt utterly boiling. We spent the day at the beach, but popped up to the nearby beach cafe for the hottest part of the day to eat lunch and sit in the shade. About 1.30pm a woman with a small dog arrived from the beach, asking if she could sit inside with the dog and did they have a water bowl for it because "she's absolutely boiling". Well, I thought, don't take her to the beach in the middle of the day on the hottest day of the year you absolute moron . We also saw a couple heading down towards the beach with their two thick coated dogs, just as we were sitting down for lunch. They were walking down the tarmac road instead of through the shady woods, and I thought the poor dogs' paws were probably cooking! I just can't understand why anyone would think their dog wants to go to the beach in those sorts of temperatures. Surely you'd sacrifice your own beach day for your dog's well being?

On the plus side, when I was at the beach on Tuesday afternoon, when it was quite a bit cooler, there was a lovely mongrel dog there with his "dad" and the dad's baby, and the dog was clearly obsessed with the sea, he was swimming lengths parallel to the shore for about 20 minutes without stopping while the owner built a sand castle for his baby! Every now and then the dog would get out of the sea, run up to help with digging the sandcastle moat, and then go straight back into the sea. I thought it was probably still a bit hot on the beach for a dog tbh, but I suppose if your dog is so obsessed with being in the water, it's less of an issue!!


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## Amymay (20 July 2022)

misst said:



			I was walking with my 2 little terriers and daughters daxie x jrt at the weekend. We were stopped chatting with the owner of an on lead french bulldog when 3 massive off lead dogs came bounding over. Frenchie owner grabbed his and picked it up as recently injured by a big dog jumping on it. Daughter shortened lead on daxie x as she is a bit reactive with bouncy dogs. I got hold of small jrt as she is over friendly with with others and too small to play with mastiff x types. Little terrier x put himself behind a bush as he dislikes dogs he doesn't know but won't react unless they are right up in his face. Huge dogs - 2 mastiff x type and a ridgeback almost knock us over. Then one of the bigger ones starts barking in my jrts face and pawing at her with his front legs which are massive - my dog weighs 5.5kg. I have hold of her collar but by now she is frightened. Frenchie owner and my daughter and I say these dogs are too small for yours to play with the two owners of big dogs. Daughter also says my dog is reactive and so is this one (the Frenchie). All three big dogs start dancing around pawing at my little one and barking a lot.  Owners of big dogs laugh and say ... guess what ... "oh they're only playing" . No calling them off no putting them on leads. By now I was furious and looking around for my little 6kg boy - who comes roaring out of the bushes to protect his pack!!! He saw them off - no contact just lots of growling and yapping and rushing around. Normally I would of course sanction this behaviour but this time I was all "good boy Moti" "well done" which I know is not really the thing to do but I was very shaken.
At best it was unpleasant but these "friendly" dogs could have injured our dogs easily and also were intimidating and likely to knock people over as well as dogs. Never seen any of these dogs in our woods before and hope never to see them again. A nice peaceful walk upset quite needlessly by ignorant owners.
		
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Hopefully you let rip with some timely expletives!


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## misst (21 July 2022)

Amymay said:



			Hopefully you let rip with some timely expletives!
		
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unfortunately the owners were too far away to benefit from our full opinions but they may have heard a few


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## fiwen30 (28 July 2022)

Going to have to set some boundaries about hearing of a dog belonging to an acquaintance of mine, because it’s becoming too upsetting.

It’s a small toy-size mixed breed, at least 14 years old. The poor dog has spent most of the last few years back and forth to the vet for a litany of reasons I’ve long since lost track of. The stand out bits were an uncontrollable scrabbling at the face, seemingly not cause by allergies, which somehow led to multiple teeth removal, and eventually removal of both eyes last year. Since then, the dog has gone downhill massively - doesn’t sleep for longer than an hour, can’t settle unless the owner is holding it constantly, won’t walk outside the house, screams in the car, and has grand mal seizures every month.

And every month, the owner practically rends her clothes and flogs herself, with prayers sent like bullets that the dog will ’eventually be stable again’, and after hearing about it for so long I’ve had enough. This poor little dog is the owner’s lifeline, and unfortunately I think it’s gone well past the point of the owner needing the dog so much that they’ll never have it put to sleep.

Animals live utterly in the moment. Even if this wasn’t a 14 year old on incredibly borrowed time, just knowing how distressing and painful every day must be for this dog makes me sick. I also don’t know how seemingly no one in the owner’s life has gently taken them aside and said some loving but firm words about the dog.

Owner has started bleating about ‘quality of life’ in the last few months, but then the dog had another seizure a few days ago, and now it’s back to praying it ‘gets better’. I despair.


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## cauda equina (28 July 2022)

That's so sad fiwen30, poor little dog
You wonder why their vet is facilitating all this


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## SAujla (28 July 2022)

cauda equina said:



			That's so sad fiwen30, poor little dog
You wonder why their vet is facilitating all this
		
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That was my thought as well regarding the vet. I guess they are duty bound to do what the owner pays for but its a very sad situation for all involved


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## Amymay (28 July 2022)

cauda equina said:



			That's so sad fiwen30, poor little dog
You wonder why their vet is facilitating all this
		
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Really sad.

Have you had a blunt conversation with her?


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## Clodagh (28 July 2022)

It’s very hard for vets to say no more. They would be abused, berated and vilified


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## Amymay (28 July 2022)

Clodagh said:



			It’s very hard for vets to say no more. They would be abused, berated and vilified
		
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Absolutely.  I had this conversation with my vet when Daisy was sick earlier this year.  When it was thought she may have a tumour I said that I would only treat palliatively (no chemo, surgery).  My vet was visably relieved.


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## CorvusCorax (28 July 2022)

Oh Fiwen, that post makes me feel ill. That poor poor dog


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## P3LH (28 July 2022)

The saddest part of that post it…how common is this now? I never ever knew anyone who let dogs just keep on going before, now it just seems the norm.


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## fiwen30 (28 July 2022)

It’s desperately sad. The owner isn’t someone I speak directly to, which is why I’m going to have to ask others to stop relaying info to me, when there’s nothing I can do, and it’s just distressing to hear about.

It sounds like it started a few years ago with small things that never really got solved, and the owner started down a rabbit hole of investigation and diagnostics which never really ‘fixed’ anything, and then more and more problems kept arising.

It’s unnerving to see the owner having the same low-key reaction to the dogs current symptoms, as they did to the very early symptoms - it’s like they can’t see the wood for the trees now, and they’re carrying on like it’s still only minor issues, rather than a debilitating quality of life.

To my knowledge, none has had a frank conversation with the owner, and even if they did I don’t think the owner has the capacity to hear, believe, or act appropriately on it. It sounds callous, but every time this dog crops up in conversation, I hope it’s because it’s passed peacefully in its sleep.


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## cauda equina (28 July 2022)

Not callous at all, it sounds the best possible outcome for the poor dog


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## CorvusCorax (28 July 2022)

P3LH said:



			The saddest part of that post it…how common is this now? I never ever knew anyone who let dogs just keep on going before, now it just seems the norm.
		
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My Mum will tell anyone who asks that she kept one of our females on too long, with CDRM, she was dragging her back legs about and could only really lie on the sofa and be helped around, the dog had been very successful in the show ring, had been with her through my birth and childhood, her separation and divorce, this was in the mid 80s, and she has vowed ever since not to do that again. She knows she was keeping the dog alive for 'herself' and has felt guilt about it ever since. Her kennel mate was PTS the first day she showed signs of struggling to get up unaided (at 14, having broken a front leg in youth/had it pinned, the older female went at 12).

I just can't imagine a dog that is essentially trapped inside its' own head, with no eyesight and at 14 years probably not much hearing to speak of and little awareness of what is going on around it, and also suffering fits, and not understanding any of it


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## P3LH (28 July 2022)

fiwen30 said:



			It’s desperately sad. The owner isn’t someone I speak directly to, which is why I’m going to have to ask others to stop relaying info to me, when there’s nothing I can do, and it’s just distressing to hear about.

It sounds like it started a few years ago with small things that never really got solved, and the owner started down a rabbit hole of investigation and diagnostics which never really ‘fixed’ anything, and then more and more problems kept arising.

It’s unnerving to see the owner having the same low-key reaction to the dogs current symptoms, as they did to the very early symptoms - it’s like they can’t see the wood for the trees now, and they’re carrying on like it’s still only minor issues, rather than a debilitating quality of life.

To my knowledge, none has had a frank conversation with the owner, and even if they did I don’t think the owner has the capacity to hear, believe, or act appropriately on it. It sounds callous, but every time this dog crops up in conversation, I hope it’s because it’s passed peacefully in its sleep.
		
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Not callous. I’ve had several fall outs with in laws re one of theirs. Time overdue. Same with other relatives and friends. I hear to often ‘I keep just hoping X just goes to sleep and doesn’t wake up’ aka can suffer on and on.


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## P3LH (28 July 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			My Mum will tell anyone who asks that she kept one of our females on too long, with CDRM, she was dragging her back legs about and could only really lie on the sofa and be helped around, the dog had been very successful in the show ring, had been with her through my birth and childhood, her separation and divorce, this was in the mid 80s, and she has vowed ever since not to do that again. She knows she was keeping the dog alive for 'herself' and has felt guilt about it ever since. Her kennel mate was PTS the first day she showed signs of struggling to get up unaided (at 14, having broken a front leg in youth/had it pinned, the older female went at 12).

I just can't imagine a dog that is essentially trapped inside its' own head, with no eyesight and at 14 years probably not much hearing to speak of and little awareness of what is going on around it, and also suffering fits, and not understanding any of it 

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Mum did the same with one of our terriers many moons ago - and I’m quite confident she experienced terrible pain prior to being PTS, which came after suffering a stroke/heart attack type affair which was inevitable and should have been prevented by PTS sooner.

I know there are people in my life who think I’m cold when it comes to pts. With last rough, we went through ten days (not great ones either) investigating the issue and once it was clear where we were at and there was no come back, he went on his way. Our vets would have kept him going. I moved vets as a result of this. Terrier before him had encephalitis misdiagnosed as epilepsy, his last attack episode lasted six minutes and he wasn’t quite right after, and it then became clear that we were dealing with something incurable and therefore pointless to keep going until a time when he was visibly unwell (well more visibly unwell) - he was pts within two days. These episodes terrified him and he was never ‘a normal
Dog’ which it became clear as to why in the end. Terrier before him was diagnosed with a cancerous mass and all kinds of management treatments were offered - she came home, had all the things she shouldn’t, and we walked back in the next day and she went on her way. Tail high, still with dignity. And that’s how I’ve tried to ensure all of them have gone. I’ve actively argued with family members and friends on the ‘but they look fine’ and ‘they still seem happy’ - which is exactly my point but that many don’t see, if I know they’ve got something either life limiting/debilitating or that is terminal, I have no desire to wait to a point where their day to day life is at all compromised. Let them go when still happy, none the wiser and when their lives haven’t changed too much. We all go in the end, best it’s quick and at the right time.

My current old man will go the same way before the end of this year I would think, unless I see a dramatic pick up.


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## Nasicus (28 July 2022)

Mum let the family dog drag on too long, and when she finally booked him for PTS, he absolutely crashed that weekend and had to be whisked in then and there to be PTS. It was awful watching him decline, and even back then as a late teen I would have had him peacefully pts a lot sooner, and did try to broach the topic with her a few times to no effect. It was quite an eye opener for her, and till this day she still carries the guilt of being 'the day too late'.
When the time came to have my old man put to sleep, he just started seizing on and off that morning, and I made the decision then and there and had him booked in for that afternoon. The vet, who no longer works there, tried her hardest to convince me to give this 15yo dog with dementia and now seizures medication to keep him going, despite me saying I'd made my mind up. It wasn't until I pointed out he had a heart murmur too (something she'd have known if she looked at his records) that she conceded, because the medication for seizures wasn't compatible with a heart murmur. It really irked me that she didn't trust my own judgement as this dogs owner. I went in, laid out the facts, explained that his quality of life was declining and that it was time, and she wanted me to limp him along with drugs and for what? To what end? To be PTS down the line when his declining quality of life would have declined even further? Eurgh, rant over...


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## MurphysMinder (28 July 2022)

That poor dog.   I like to think I have always let mine go that "day too soon",  and I have never had a vet try to persuade me otherwise,  however I think it is very difficult for a vet to force pts when the owner won't accept it.   When I lost my Freya earlier this year, very suddenly to a massive bleed due to hemangiosarcoma,  the vet did say to me after scanning that pts was the best option and I have to admit I was shocked as I had taken in an only slightly off colour dog.   However,  I could see her going downhill in front of me so it was definitely the right thing to do,  the vet did say surgery was a possibility but in her opinion would not work,  but I suspect if I had asked for it she would have gone ahead albeit reluctantly.   She is a fairly young vet and I really do admire her for having the confidence in her opinion and the best interests of Freya to make pts her first suggestion.


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## CorvusCorax (28 July 2022)

Luckily we've never had a vet try and persuade us otherwise, even for behavioural issues in an otherwise physically healthy animal (that's only happened twice since my Mum started owning GSDs in the 60s).
With our 14 year old, the vet had been at school with Mum/she'd ridden with him and he had treated the dog for her whole life, through all her ups and downs and he actually came out to the house to do it, and took her back to his farm for burial. He loved her to bits, she was allowed to sit with the receptionist behind the counter any time she had to stay in.


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## blackcob (28 July 2022)

That poor dog. Cases like that upset and anger me (and 90% of my job being in pet insurance these days, I get to read about it all the time too) and so I think you are absolutely right to set a boundary and not engage any further with discussion about that particular dog.

I had a very clear idea in my head that no dog of mine would be allowed to go 'off their legs'. Making that decision for my old boy, when he could still get about but had had a bad couple of days where I believe we were starting to not manage his pain, was the hardest thing I have ever done but I would never have forgiven myself for letting him experience unrelenting pain or fear. The idea of letting that go on for months or years is absolutely abhorrent.


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## Karran (28 July 2022)

Poor thing. Our childhood lab had hip dysplasia, she made it to 14 and then one day her legs went from under her when eating and then a few times off and on over that weekend. I remember the argument between her and Dad as he wanted to keep her going a bit longer, saying it was a one off and her arguing back that it had happened once and would be happening again more and more frequently. She got her own way and the dog went twenty four hours later. 

She confessed to me later when I was a bit older about how guilty she felt especially when she trotted into the car and into the vets happily but it 100% was the right decision and I hope I am that brave enough when the time comes.


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## GSD Woman (28 July 2022)

cauda equina said:



			That's so sad fiwen30, poor little dog
You wonder why their vet is facilitating all this
		
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In my state the vet is supposed to follow the treatment that the owner chooses.  Some vets are better at making it clear that euthanasia is not a wrong answer.  I've seen all sorts of people hanging on, especially when they are alone and the pet is the only thing keeping them going.  I remember a case many years ago when a client had such a tight bond with his dog that after he had the dog put down that he thought about going to join Popeye. The lead vet was crying when he was speaking on the phone to the client telling him that wasn't what the dog would want.

And again, 1 day too early vs 1 day too late.

p.s. and now I'm crying, thinking of Popeye and his owner.


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## SAujla (28 July 2022)

Karran said:



			I hope I am that brave enough when the time comes.
		
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I think about this a lot, its easy for me to judge others for not showing their dogs a final kindness but I'm not sure I'd be brave or selfless enough to do it. Would probably need the right people around me to make me see sense but I believe I'd listen if certain people told me it was time


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## Cinnamontoast (31 July 2022)

It’s a year today that we took Zak to be pts. I think it was several days too late, but he wanted to go for a walk and have treats during his walk on his last days. My OH found it extremely hard to lose another dog to cancer. Both Jake and Zak were ‘his’, just as Mitch is now. I would not tolerate keeping a dog going because it’s painful for the owners. So selfish.


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## Nasicus (1 August 2022)

Riding along the shared forest path yesterday, we were accosted by a Lurcher, barking, running around us and lunging at Pony's back legs. Owners wrestled him back, and held onto him as we trundled past, with said lurcher flailing about and straining against his owner to get back to us. Thankfully they clipped him onto the lead and waited for Pony and I to be long gone before letting him back off.

Oh wait.
No they didn't.
They let dog go when we were about 20 meters away, still in plain sight, and of course the Lurcher came thundering over, barking, snapping, lunging. Pony getting fed up by now and giving little 'bugger off' flicks of her hinds, but otherwise being a superstar about this dog. Owners screaming dogs name to no avail, until eventually they were able to distract it by throwing sticks, whereby Pony and I bid a hasty exit.

The first encounter, okay not ideal but it happens. But come on, anyone with half a braincell could see the dog was still very interested and keen to get to the pony, just pop it on a lead for a few minutes, I promise it'll damage the dog a lot less than a hoof to the skull will!


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## Cinnamontoast (1 August 2022)

Lurcher owners would have had such words from me! Beau hated dogs and tried to stamp on the yo’s jrt last time she took him into the field. 😱

My lot have all been taught a strong ‘leave it’ command, it has proved extremely useful with getting us past other dogs/ignoring squirrels etc. I think recall and leaving are my top two commands. Goose met up with my OH the other day as he was doing the other half of the circular walk, but spun round when he heard me calling him. I’m really proud of that.


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## blackcob (1 August 2022)

Off lead at all costs mentality isn't it, after all keeping it on the lead for two minutes would be an affront to the dog's right to run. 🙄


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## CanteringCarrot (1 August 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			Lurcher owners would have had such words from me! Beau hated dogs and tried to stamp on the yo’s jrt last time she took him into the field. 😱

My lot have all been taught a strong ‘leave it’ command, it has proved extremely useful with getting us past other dogs/ignoring squirrels etc. I think recall and leaving are my top two commands. Goose met up with my OH the other day as he was doing the other half of the circular walk, but spun round when he heard me calling him. I’m really proud of that.
		
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Same. A strong leave it command is so valuable.


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## Cinnamontoast (1 August 2022)

blackcob said:



			Off lead at all costs mentality isn't it, after all keeping it on the lead for two minutes would be an affront to the dog's right to run. 🙄
		
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So bonkers. I took Bear on a separate walk today-he’s a bad example to the puppies and comes back like this 🥵) and we came across a group of primary kids with their play worker. One of them screamed so I popped Bear on the lead rather than let him walk past them. I don’t see the point in upsetting anyone, particularly in an enclosed area.


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## Nasicus (1 August 2022)

blackcob said:



			Off lead at all costs mentality isn't it, after all keeping it on the lead for two minutes would be an affront to the dog's right to run. 🙄
		
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I think this was more plain old stupidity and a several lack of dog sense in this situation. But I've definitely encountered my fair share of 'It's my dogs right to be off the lead' types over the years and they're just as unpleasant! I've been threatened with murder if my pony did anything to hurt some morons precious wolf-a-likes when they decided to go for us.


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## CorvusCorax (1 August 2022)

Saw my twatty neighbour hauling poor lab from buggy to house on way home from work....front legs walking, back end being held up with a lead, back feet completely powerless and dragging on the tarmac. I found it really disturbing and won't be able to get that image out of my head.

Then when I caught up and passed his house the poor thing was just lying there having been plonked in the open doorway, the **look** it gave me


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## Pearlsasinger (1 August 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			Saw my twatty neighbour hauling poor lab from buggy to house on way home from work....front legs walking, back end being held up with a lead, back feet completely powerless and dragging on the tarmac. I found it really disturbing and won't be able to get that image out of my head.

Then when I caught up and passed his house the poor thing was just lying there having been plonked in the open doorway, the **look** it gave me 

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That just pure cruelty imo.  I can't understand why vets for it.


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## Caol Ila (1 August 2022)

I was hacking alone today, and a lab puppy ran at my horse, barking. The owner was on a mountain bike, and he slammed on his brakes, which squealed like a dying thing, and the bike skidded on gravel. Six months ago, that would have launched my horse into the stratosphere but he just stood there, staring at the guy. Good Fin! Puppy had nothing resembling recall, and owner stood there yelling uselessly at it, then he turned and raced off down a different trail. In fairness to him, that did sort of work. Thinking it was being left, the puppy ran after him, and Fin and I continued on with our ride.

(1) Why is it that so many dog owners stand 10-20m away from you, yelling their dog's name over and over when it's clear that the dog gives zero sh1ts? Very few of them actually move towards their animal or make an effort to grab it. 

(2) I'm sure I remember reading somewhere that you have to be careful with exercising young puppies, as too much too soon can damage their joints. This dog looked like it was only three or four months old. The owner was a fast, aggressive mountain biker, and the pup had to run flat-out to keep up with him. Is that irresponsible or alright?


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## Clodagh (1 August 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			Saw my twatty neighbour hauling poor lab from buggy to house on way home from work....front legs walking, back end being held up with a lead, back feet completely powerless and dragging on the tarmac. I found it really disturbing and won't be able to get that image out of my head.

Then when I caught up and passed his house the poor thing was just lying there having been plonked in the open doorway, the **look** it gave me 

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Can’t like that. Awful. Poor dog.


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## fiwen30 (1 August 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			Saw my twatty neighbour hauling poor lab from buggy to house on way home from work....front legs walking, back end being held up with a lead, back feet completely powerless and dragging on the tarmac. I found it really disturbing and won't be able to get that image out of my head.

Then when I caught up and passed his house the poor thing was just lying there having been plonked in the open doorway, the **look** it gave me 

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That is grim. Buggies have their purpose, but being used as an excuse for dogs who can no longer weight bear is not one of them. Or shouldn’t be, at any rate.


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## teapot (1 August 2022)

Stumbled on this post despite not being a dog owner. I’ve noticed a huge difference in both how many dogs there are and how badly they’re controlled on my local beach, especially since the first lockdown. 

I’ve lost count of the number of times I’ve had to give a wide berth to dogs ‘playing’ with each other, and have developed a very strong ‘no’ and growl. Had too many ‘he’s just being friendly’ to which my reply is ‘I’m not’ to put up with it anymore.

My all time fave though - people throwing stones for Fido. So not only do you run the risk of being taken out by the stone, but the overweight uncontrollable lump of canine hurtling at your legs too. Usually followed by that that fake laugh and ‘oh, sorry’ comment. Ffs.

I actually don’t mind dogs, but only those with manners. Give me a working dog any way.


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## splashgirl45 (1 August 2022)

apart from the harm it will do to the dogs teeth and the danger of it swallowing a stone while running..whats wrong with using a tennis ball?


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## Cinnamontoast (1 August 2022)

Caol Ila said:



			I was hacking alone today, and a lab puppy ran at my horse, barking. The owner was on a mountain bike, and he slammed on his brakes, which squealed like a dying thing, and the bike skidded on gravel. Six months ago, that would have launched my horse into the stratosphere but he just stood there, staring at the guy. Good Fin! Puppy had nothing resembling recall, and owner stood there yelling uselessly at it, then he turned and raced off down a different trail. In fairness to him, that did sort of work. Thinking it was being left, the puppy ran after him, and Fin and I continued on with our ride.

(1) Why is it that so many dog owners stand 10-20m away from you, yelling their dog's name over and over when it's clear that the dog gives zero sh1ts? Very few of them actually move towards their animal or make an effort to grab it.

(2) I'm sure I remember reading somewhere that you have to be careful with exercising young puppies, as too much too soon can damage their joints. This dog looked like it was only three or four months old. The owner was a fast, aggressive mountain biker, and the pup had to run flat-out to keep up with him. Is that irresponsible or alright?
		
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Actually going to get your dog really helps!

Massively irresponsible, imo. I’m probably over-cautious, but no way I’d do this.


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## Caol Ila (2 August 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			Actually going to get your dog really helps!
		
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Almost nobody does that. It’s like the fourth law of Newtonian physics here: a stationary dog owner at any distance from their dog accosting a horse or another dog remains stationary while screaming, “Fido, come here!!!!”


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## GSD Woman (2 August 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			So bonkers. I took Bear on a separate walk today-he’s a bad example to the puppies and comes back like this 🥵) and we came across a group of primary kids with their play worker. One of them screamed so I popped Bear on the lead rather than let him walk past them. I don’t see the point in upsetting anyone, particularly in an enclosed area.
		
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The other evening I had ordered Chinese for delivery.  The man delivering it was terrified and kept looking over his shoulder walking to his car.  I waited until he had driven away before I opened the door to retrieve my food.  My dogs know a wait back and know that breaking it is very bad. It was only considerate to to wait.


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## Karran (2 August 2022)

Caol Ila said:



			Almost nobody does that. It’s like the fourth law of Newtonian physics here: a stationary dog owner at any distance from their dog accosting a horse or another dog remains stationary while screaming, “Fido, come here!!!!”
		
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Oh god I have been guilty of this. Mrs Collie can be headshy and me trying to grab her when the red mist has descended and she's fully engaged in chase/herd mode can result in a game of keep away with her still doing laps around whatever it was that set her off. So i used to just stand and yell for fear of making situation worse. Thankfully Happens less and less the older she's got and my distraction/observation skills have improved to get the recall and back on lead before anything can happen.


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## SOS (2 August 2022)

GSD Woman said:



			The other evening I had ordered Chinese for delivery.  The man delivering it was terrified and kept looking over his shoulder walking to his car.  I waited until he had driven away before I opened the door to retrieve my food.  My dogs know a wait back and know that breaking it is very bad. It was only considerate to to wait.
		
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I always put my dogs in another room when answering the door to delivery drivers or anyone new. Yes mine will stand back and wait but it’s not very nice for someone nervous of dogs to have to stand there whilst a door opens and the dogs stare at them in the background (especially if delivering food!).

I also always ask tradesmen if they are okay with dogs/cats before they come in. I just think it’s the polite thing to do and any worries I put them all away.


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## Cinnamontoast (2 August 2022)

Caol Ila said:



			Almost nobody does that. It’s like the fourth law of Newtonian physics here: a stationary dog owner at any distance from their dog accosting a horse or another dog remains stationary while screaming, “Fido, come here!!!!”
		
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Or worse, saying nothing! One bloke told me it was my fault his dog had run _under_ Zak one day (who was on the lead by the time the thing got to us) because he’d been off lead-hard to retrieve on lead. He didn’t even call for the dog, then told me he needed to work on recall! Yeah, mate, like by calling for your dog!


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## Cinnamontoast (2 August 2022)

SOS said:



			I always put my dogs in another room when answering the door to delivery drivers or anyone new. Yes mine will stand back and wait but it’s not very nice for someone nervous of dogs to have to stand there whilst a door opens and the dogs stare at them in the background (especially if delivering food!).

I also always ask tradesmen if they are okay with dogs/cats before they come in. I just think it’s the polite thing to do and any worries I put them all away.
		
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Mine get shut in the lounge, last thing you want is 3 excited springers saying hello!


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## splashgirl45 (2 August 2022)

My front door is a stable door so that my dogs can’t get to anyone who knocks.  I find it really useful and wish I had thought of it with my previous house.. if I have anyone who is going to do any work I ask if they are ok with dogs, if not they either get shut in the garden or put on leads so they can’t jump all over them.  Mine are always happy to say hello to visitors but can be a bit over the top so I can imagine they might frighten some people even though they are small.  It’s only good manners which seem to be lacking these days..


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## daydreamer (2 August 2022)

The other day I was driving home from the yard through a village and saw a big dog off lead right next to the road. I couldn't see a person so kept looking and managed to pull in. This was right opposite a turning to a slip road for a dual carriage way. I got out, got a lead rope and tried calling to the dog. He backed away and then took off into a large stubble field. I then saw an anxious women coming towards me so shouted to ask if she had lost a dog because I had seen one. She said "which one?" It turns out the big dog (Great Dane!) I had seen had chased her Border Collie so she'd had to let it go and she didn't know where it was.

So I set about trying to find the owner of the Great Dane - thinking they might be worried about their dog. I called a friend of mine who walks her dog near there a lot, she called a friend of hers. I went and asked in the village shop who gave me a road name, then I went to that road and asked the post man I saw. He knew the house it belonged to (which was very close to the stubble field) and said it can get out and that he had told the owners before. My friend had also managed to find out who owned it and said it had got out before and that they had someone to walk it but they struggled to hold it/it didn't get walked any more.

So I went and knocked at the house and was met by 2 barking dogs in the other side of the door. A teenage lad appeared (I'd guess about 17/18) and then came out of a side door. I said that there was a Great Dane loose, did he know where another one lived as clearly his was in the house. He said "err, well it might have been him, I don't know - I was inside". When pushed a bit he said that it most likely was his dog that had been loose. So I was like "well your dog just attacked another dog which is now loose and some poor women is looking for it!". He was then really quite rude to me and seemed completely unconcerned that his dog had been loose right next to the road and had chased another dog. Not the concerned owner I was expecting!!

I then went looking for the Border Collie owner, found her, and then her sister who had been helping her search appeared with the lost dog who was fine. Phew! The Collie was apparently quite young and it must have been very scary for the dog and the very petite owner!


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## blackcob (2 August 2022)

Anyone who is unconcerned about dogs being loose near roads can never have seen what happens when a dog is hit by a car, and although I wouldn't wish that on anyone I do wonder if it would give them the teensiest ounce of perspective. 

Only slightly related but it makes me laugh when people suggest that reactive dogs shouldn't be walked where you might reasonably expect to find off lead dogs, the usual meaning being parks/fields/woodland, when they are absolutely everywhere, pavements and roads included.


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## TooScaredToJump (2 August 2022)

Amymay said:



			Absolutely.  I had this conversation with my vet when Daisy was sick earlier this year.  When it was thought she may have a tumour I said that I would only treat palliatively (no chemo, surgery).  My vet was visably relieved.
		
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I had the same experience with my vet and horse, you could see in her face she wanted to tell me it was time but couldn't, so I said it for her. She is the only "horsey" vet in our area (mainly small pets and agri) and the weight she must carry on her shoulders from owners like this must be suffocating.


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## GSD Woman (2 August 2022)

If I have workmen in I don't even ask.  I just crate the dogs.


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## BSL2 (2 August 2022)

I have given up. I have two chihuahuas. One is tiny but very reactive due to bad start in life. The other is just nervous. I've tried to let them interact with others, but my town is full of numpties who have no control over their dogs, plus really dont have a clue re animals and it always nearly ends in carnage. I will not put them at risk anymore. Enough is enough. I have bought a stroller. We now use stroller to get to my field. They have a blast around off lead, then sit in stroller and wait to he pushed home. No more stress, no more tears or arguments with ****** dog owners....I am that old lady with two Chi's in a pram, all I need now is the plastic head scarf..😁


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## Amymay (2 August 2022)

..I am that old lady with two Chi's in a pram, all I need now is the plastic head scarf..
		
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They can be quite glamorous…… 🤣🤣


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## BSL2 (2 August 2022)

Amymay said:



			They can be quite glamorous…… 🤣🤣

View attachment 97011

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😂😂😂😂


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## Landcruiser (4 August 2022)

It's very hard for vets when owners refuse to PTS. We've had some very difficult situations at work, for example the dog brought in for PTS (long overdue) then another family member turned up and shouted the odds and refused to let the vet go ahead. Difficult situation for everyone in practice. We have had other variations on this theme too, along similar lines. One night recently the clinical staff waited hours for a family member to turn up and say goodbye, which took out a consult room (1 of 2) for most of the evening surgery, but the owners refused the PTS to go ahead until the other family member arrived. 

Or the non ambulatory ancient labrador that the owners fed and toiletted in his basket, the owners of which received calls every few days from our head nurse (free of charge) to check up on him and try to persuade the owners it was time to let him go. This almost had to go to enforcement on welfare grounds - finally, long overdue, they allowed a home visit and the poor thing was allowed to end his sorry life.

This is from RCVS guidelines:" 8.11  Where a veterinary surgeon is concerned about an owner's refusal to consent to euthanasia, veterinary surgeons can only advise their clients and act in accordance with their professional judgement. Where a veterinary surgeon is concerned that an animal's welfare is compromised because of an owner's refusal to allow euthanasia, a veterinary surgeon may take steps to resolve the situation, for example, an initial step could be to seek another veterinary opinion for the client, potentially by telephone." 

In practice, this can be very difficult, and the threat of legal action is very real.


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## CorvusCorax (4 August 2022)

This guy was telling all and sundry (not me!!!) about how much he'd spent on vets and they weren't able to do anything for him. Sigh. Then he took it to a chiro and an acupuncturist and they were amazing.
The dog has no use of it's back end FFS and is morbidly obese. Not ranting at anyone on here, it just makes me ill thinking of that poor dog.


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## ycbm (4 August 2022)

Just got home from a walk to the shops.  This happened a few minutes ago.  

Man walking 3 Jack Russells. One approaches my feet so I stop and quietly explain to him that I am partially sighted at my feet and feel his dog is a threat.  It won't return to him when he calls it. He eventually comes over and drags it away from my feet, whereupon the second dog climbs up my leg.  I tell him to get the dog off me or I will kick it in the ribs and he says if I do that he will do the same to me. That dog leaves me and the 3rd dog takes its place scrabbling up my jeans,  at which point I explode and tell him to put his dogs on a f[><_/g lead.  He tells me not to swear at him so I tell him to control his f[=</÷g dogs in a public place.  He asks where it says that he has to do that and I tell him it's the law.  At this point he says he'll now have to wash his dogs because they've been in contact with me. 

Honestly,  I feel so sorry for responsible dog owners when people like this are out in public. 
.


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## Smitty (4 August 2022)

ycbm said:



			Just got home from a walk to the shops.  This happened a few minutes ago. 

Man walking 3 Jack Russells. One approaches my feet so I stop and quietly explain to him that I am partially sighted at my feet and feel his dog is a threat.  It won't return to him when he calls it. He eventually comes over and drags it away from my feet, whereupon the second dog climbs up my leg.  I tell him to get the dog off me or I will kick it in the ribs and he says if I do that he will do the same to me. That dog leaves me and the 3rd dog takes its place scrabbling up my jeans,  at which point I explode and tell him to put his dogs on a f[><_/g lead.  He tells me not to swear at him so I tell him to control his f[=</÷g dogs in a public place.  He asks where it says that he has to do that and I tell him it's the law.  At this point he says he'll now have to wash his dogs because they've been in contact with me.

Honestly,  I feel so sorry for responsible dog owners when people like this are out in public.
.
		
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Perhaps if they had been on a lead in the first place, he would not have to wash them (were you very grubby?😂).   Walks must be very hard work for him as no doubt they accost everyone, resulting in the necessity to bath them on return home (just as if!!).   Sadly, another entitled dog owner ....


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## Smitty (4 August 2022)

ycbm said:



			Just got home from a walk to the shops.  This happened a few minutes ago. 

Man walking 3 Jack Russells. One approaches my feet so I stop and quietly explain to him that I am partially sighted at my feet and feel his dog is a threat.  It won't return to him when he calls it. He eventually comes over and drags it away from my feet, whereupon the second dog climbs up my leg.  I tell him to get the dog off me or I will kick it in the ribs and he says if I do that he will do the same to me. That dog leaves me and the 3rd dog takes its place scrabbling up my jeans,  at which point I explode and tell him to put his dogs on a f[><_/g lead.  He tells me not to swear at him so I tell him to control his f[=</÷g dogs in a public place.  He asks where it says that he has to do that and I tell him it's the law.  At this point he says he'll now have to wash his dogs because they've been in contact with me.

Honestly,  I feel so sorry for responsible dog owners when people like this are out in public.
.
		
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Perhaps if they had been on a lead in the first place, he would not have to wash them (were you very grubby?😂).   Walks must be very hard work for him as no doubt they accost everyone, resulting in the necessity to bath them on return home (just as if!!).   Sadly, another entitled dog owner ....


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## skinnydipper (4 August 2022)

Sadly, I think responsible dog owners are in the minority.

I don't go out walking the dog in cashmere and pearls but I do go out clean and tidy and resent coming home looking like I've been mud wrestling because of someone else's ill mannered dog jumping up or climbing my legs.  Don't anyone tell me it's part and parcel of owning a dog, it isn't.


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## Amymay (4 August 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			Don't anyone tell me it's part and parcel of dog ownership, it isn't.
		
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Oh, God. Isn’t it 😱🤣


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## GSD Woman (4 August 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			Sadly, I think responsible dog owners are in the minority.
		
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Yes we are.  I try my hardest to avoid other people and dogs when walking.  I've had enough dogs run up and start trouble with mine when the owners aren't even in sight to know I have to be the one to avoid them.


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## CorvusCorax (4 August 2022)

It's a sunny day. We have met 7 dogs on a narrow path. All on leash and/or under control. No meltdowns. Someone pinch me 🤣


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## Cinnamontoast (4 August 2022)

ycbm said:



			Just got home from a walk to the shops.  This happened a few minutes ago. 

Man walking 3 Jack Russells. One approaches my feet so I stop and quietly explain to him that I am partially sighted at my feet and feel his dog is a threat.  It won't return to him when he calls it. He eventually comes over and drags it away from my feet, whereupon the second dog climbs up my leg.  I tell him to get the dog off me or I will kick it in the ribs and he says if I do that he will do the same to me. That dog leaves me and the 3rd dog takes its place scrabbling up my jeans,  at which point I explode and tell him to put his dogs on a f[><_/g lead.  He tells me not to swear at him so I tell him to control his f[=</÷g dogs in a public place.  He asks where it says that he has to do that and I tell him it's the law.  At this point he says he'll now have to wash his dogs because they've been in contact with me.

Honestly,  I feel so sorry for responsible dog owners when people like this are out in public.
.
		
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Oh gawd, the idiot. The puppies did this one time, I was absolutely mortified, not everyone is a fan of dogs clambering up them. There is no way I’d be aggressive towards a member of the public when my dogs were doing the wrong thing. I hope you don’t encounter him again. Might be worth finding out if you have a local dog warden?


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## View (4 August 2022)

And today I met a lovely dog owner with a beautifully behaved Boxer.

I had a four hour train journey, with a reserved seat.  Except the train company’s tech totally messed up.  Leading to me being told my ticket was invalid and so on.  Despite having the emails with the booking!

Given that my reason for the journey was upsetting in the first place, this tipped me over the edge.

This lovely boy knew I was upset and spent most of the journey wrapped around my legs trying to comfort me, after his owner had asked if I was happy for him to be with me.

What a kind pair.


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## Smitty (4 August 2022)

I think all dog owners should be aware that in 2022 it is a privilege to have a dog out in public, and restrict (prevent) it's access to other people.   
I'm sure 200 years ago it was acceptable to have dogs roaming and off lead but please wise up general dog owning public, dogs will end up not welcome anywhere in our time if people don't cotton on to the fact that it is not going to kill the dog to be on a lead for however long is necessary.


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## Clodagh (4 August 2022)

I’ve said in here before my mum had a hospital trip after a dog jumped up on her. She has steroids long term and her skin just tears. Like ycbm with her eyes that’s a major safety issue.
I boot any dog that jumps up, including my own. Nicely btw but they get down.


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## CorvusCorax (4 August 2022)

Smitty said:



			I think all dog owners should be aware that in 2022 it is a privilege to have a dog out in public, and restrict (prevent) it's access to other people.  
I'm sure 200 years ago it was acceptable to have dogs roaming and off lead but please wise up general dog owning public, dogs will end up not welcome anywhere in our time if people don't cotton on to the fact that it is not going to kill the dog to be on a lead for however long is necessary.
		
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Yep and we live in an extremely litigious society these days. More a-holes = more restrictions and implications for the rest of us.


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## SilverLinings (5 August 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			Yep and we live in an extremely litigious society these days. More a-holes = more restrictions and implications for the rest of us.
		
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I thought humans were supposed to have the ability of theoretical foresight and a comprehension of action=consequence, but it seems that more and more of the human race lack these basic skills, and are only interested in what makes them feel good/happy/vindicated/whatever *now*. There also seems to be an alarmingly widespread lack of common sense and decency, let alone knowledge of things like the law and dog behaviour. 

(not aimed at you CC, I'm agreeing with you!).


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## Cinnamontoast (5 August 2022)

Smitty said:



			I think all dog owners should be aware that in 2022 it is a privilege to have a dog out in public, and restrict (prevent) it's access to other people. 
I'm sure 200 years ago it was acceptable to have dogs roaming and off lead but please wise up general dog owning public, dogs will end up not welcome anywhere in our time if people don't cotton on to the fact that it is not going to kill the dog to be on a lead for however long is necessary.
		
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Trouble is, owners who don’t control their dogs don’t tend to be on AAD. I’d like to think that us lot are sensible and read the situation, even if only to keep our own dog safe.


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## fiwen30 (8 August 2022)

The little dog I posted about the other week has had 2 more seizures since then - they’re getting much more frequent, and the dog continually trembles now. Owner is still talking about trying more, or different combinations, of medicines to give the dog ‘some relief’. It seems as though their family are mostly of the opinion that the dog should’ve been PTS at various previous stages in it’s illnesses, but the owner is so delusional that they’re actually talking about handing in their notice at work, so that they can be with the dog at all times.

I’m not sure what kind of magic bean they’re holding out for, there’s nothing that can give the poor dog the lifespan of a human, and the owner doesn’t seem to be able to settle for anything less than.

I can very easily imagine the dog dying whilst fitting, or in the car being rushed to the emergency vets. Terrible thing, when the owner could help it pass peacefully, in it’s own home.


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## GSD Woman (8 August 2022)

fiwen30, there are days I hate humans.


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## YorksG (17 August 2022)

Of you are walking your large lab, on a choke chain and two people with three labs sitting on the verge do you:
1. Walk past with your dog under control and say good evening. 
2. Wrestle your dog past
3. Allow your dog to stick its face into the face of the first dog, ignoring the one who has started to bark hysterically and get annoyed when asked to take your dog away?
Guess which happened to us this evening😯


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## Cinnamontoast (17 August 2022)

We encountered excellent dog walkers (near Birtley, up north) today and yesterday. They kept their dogs out of the way despite the pups going deaf and not hearing a recall today. Saw the same lot yesterday, in control, popping all 8 dogs back into a huge van in cages. Very different from a couple of walkers down here.

We also met a 6 month old lab puppy and I was sad, it was really overweight.


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## Clodagh (22 August 2022)

I’ve not met many idiots thankfully, rural living has many benefits.
At the pub on Saturday I took some food out to people in the garden and was at their table when a long haired GSD leapt up from underneath it and bayed in my face. Amazingly I didn’t drop the food, maybe I could see deep down that he was only shouting, it made me jump though. 
Then they beat it with fists and lead while yelling at it. 🤷‍♀️.

And there’s a couple who take their DA Great Dane into the (tiny) bar and hang on to its lead while it glares and intimidates any other dogs in there.


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## Esmae (22 August 2022)

Clodagh said:



			I’ve not met many idiots thankfully, rural living has many benefits.
At the pub on Saturday I took some food out to people in the garden and was at their table when a long haired GSD leapt up from underneath it and bayed in my face. Amazingly I didn’t drop the food, maybe I could see deep down that he was only shouting, it made me jump though.
Then they beat it with fists and lead while yelling at it. 🤷‍♀️.

And there’s a couple who take their DA Great Dane into the (tiny) bar and hang on to its lead while it glares and intimidates any other dogs in there.
		
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I never understand why people take their dogs to the pub.  It's not as if you are going to live there. Leave them at home. Will do no harm.


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## Cinnamontoast (22 August 2022)

Came across a very reactive poo cross yesterday. I’d just retrieved Bear who’d zipped off from my OH who does a different walk then meets up with me and the pups. He’d come to find me as usual. Mitch wanted to investigate the poodog and wasn’t coming away-definitely need to work on this, it’s completely unacceptable. The lady was frantically asking if they were neutered while her husband half strangled the dog to get it away from us. I was the bad owner, bit of a dilemma, Bear on lead, pups loose, my OH thankfully appeared and Mitch ran up to him. They normally have a quick sniff then move on which I’ve been massively encouraging.


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## Cinnamontoast (22 August 2022)

Esmae said:



			I never understand why people take their dogs to the pub.  It's not as if you are going to live there. Leave them at home. Will do no harm.
		
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Socialisation? New situations? We’ve taken ours a couple of times to the garden of a pub near their woods walk. The OH fancied a pint in the sunshine and the first time was literally to give them the new situation on quite a busy day. They couldn’t have cared less, they just wanted the crisps! On holiday last year, we had to take Bear, couldn’t leave him in the accommodation alone. He wasn’t happy the first time, then just went to sleep under the table in the next one.


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## YorksG (22 August 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			Came across a very reactive poo cross yesterday. I’d just retrieved Bear who’d zipped off from my OH who does a different walk then meets up with me and the pups. He’d come to find me as usual. Mitch wanted to investigate the poodog and wasn’t coming away-definitely need to work on this, it’s completely unacceptable. The lady was frantically asking if they were neutered while her husband half strangled the dog to get it away from us. I was the bad owner, bit of a dilemma, Bear on lead, pups loose, my OH thankfully appeared and Mitch ran up to him. They normally have a quick sniff then move on which I’ve been massively encouraging.
		
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I have to say I get very annoyed with people who allow their dogs to come up to ours for a quick sniff, but that's when we have ours next to us, either sitting or on leads. It is a bit different if no one has their dog close to them, but we teach ours that they stay with their own pack.


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## Cinnamontoast (22 August 2022)

YorksG said:



			I have to say I get very annoyed with people who allow their dogs to come up to ours for a quick sniff, but that's when we have ours next to us, either sitting or on leads. It is a bit different if no one has their dog close to them, but we teach ours that they stay with their own pack.
		
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I’ve written about this before: it’s an area where it’s loose dogs mostly, I’ve met a few people who want to chat, but mostly I move my lot on, they’re very young still, 11 months and I think they’re mostly really good. I’ve moved them on every time there’s an on lead dog, despite me wanting to talk to the Finnish laphund etc. They will follow me or run on but I’d just put Bear on lead and I was caught between not wanting to go near an obviously reactive dog with Bear on the lead, so necessarily close to me, and wanting to grab Mitch who was unusually not doing as asked. The youngsters mostly stay together. Had I not had Bear, it would have been easier.


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## Amymay (22 August 2022)

Esmae said:



			I never understand why people take their dogs to the pub.  It's not as if you are going to live there. Leave them at home. Will do no harm.
		
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My dogs love coming to the pub.  And are beautifully behaved when they do come.


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## cauda equina (22 August 2022)

We used to love walks with a beer along the way


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## Pearlsasinger (22 August 2022)

Esmae said:



			I never understand why people take their dogs to the pub.  It's not as if you are going to live there. Leave them at home. Will do no harm.
		
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We take ours to the pub, cafes, dog friendly shops, garden centres, anywhere where they are allowed basically. You never know what life will throw at you and if you need to ask for help from somewhere, in an emergency, you don't want to have to deal with an agitated dog as well. They enjoy it, too, especially if it involves bacon sandwiches


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## Amymay (22 August 2022)

Pearlsasinger said:



			We take ours to the pub, cafes dig friendly shops, garden centres, anywhere where they are allowed basically. You never know what life will throw at you and if you need to ask for help from somewhere, in an emergency, you don't want to have to deal with an agitated dog as well. They enjoy it, too, especially if it involves bacon sandwiches
		
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Exactly.  Ours go everywhere with us (bar shopping).


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## Marnie (22 August 2022)

Esmae said:



			I never understand why people take their dogs to the pub.  It's not as if you are going to live there. Leave them at home. Will do no harm.
		
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My pup loves the pub, it is more or less at the bottom of the garden, the landlady has a Westie puppy and her and Bunny play for hours. It has got Bunny used to people and sitting quietly and means that I can spend more time with her.


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## Pearlsasinger (22 August 2022)

Amymay said:



			Exactly.  Ours go everywhere with us (bar shopping).
		
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The only shop ours go into really is Pets at Home but it does mean that they know how to behave in a supermarket. Otherwise, they have learned to sit quietly by a table, indoors/
outdoors, ignore other dogs, people approaching the table with food/drinks and wait until we have finished for a tid-bit or 2.
Cautionary tale though; do not give your dog cheesy chips, or they will not be happy with plain chips ever again. Lesson learned with Rottweilers.


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## Amymay (22 August 2022)

Cautionary tale though; do not give your dog cheesy chips, or they will not be happy with plain chips ever again
		
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Good to know 👍🤣


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## CorvusCorax (22 August 2022)

I go to the pub to get away from mine 

**downs a shot**

You'll not believe what she did this time!!


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## Clodagh (22 August 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			I’ve written about this before: it’s an area where it’s loose dogs mostly, I’ve met a few people who want to chat, but mostly I move my lot on, they’re very young still, 11 months and I think they’re mostly really good. I’ve moved them on every time there’s an on lead dog, despite me wanting to talk to the Finnish laphund etc. They will follow me or run on but I’d just put Bear on lead and I was caught between not wanting to go near an obviously reactive dog with Bear on the lead, so necessarily close to me, and wanting to grab Mitch who was unusually not doing as asked. The youngsters mostly stay together. Had I not had Bear, it would have been easier.
		
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At the risk of sounding difficult. I don’t let my perfectly good natured dogs approach other dogs on walks. Even if we are out in very doggy orientated places. I sit them up to the side, Scout gets the lead slipped on as he’s a year old and sometimes forgets his manners. It does seem a couple of times now you’ve had issues so maybe if the other dog is on a lead you definitely shouldn’t let them approach? I find it easier to decide who they can approach and who not by applying a blanket ban.


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## Cinnamontoast (22 August 2022)

Clodagh said:



			At the risk of sounding difficult. I don’t let my perfectly good natured dogs approach other dogs on walks. Even if we are out in very doggy orientated places. I sit them up to the side, Scout gets the lead slipped on as he’s a year old and sometimes forgets his manners. It does seem a couple of times now you’ve had issues so maybe if the other dog is on a lead you definitely shouldn’t let them approach? I find it easier to decide who they can approach and who not by applying a blanket ban.
		
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I was trying, C! I'd just captured Bear who was therefore on lead right next to me,  I'd just finished speaking to a bloke whose dog was trying to hump Mitch-I had just asked him if he'd seen Bear when Bear came round the corner.  Mitch ran back to the T junction where the reactive dog had appeared (didn't hear them approach) and I didn't want to approach the reactive dog with Bear.  Mitch came away as soon as A appeared.  I don't think I could have done more,  tbh. The only other time we've seen a reactive dog,  they went on the lead and past asap.



Clodagh said:



			At the risk of sounding difficult. I don’t let my perfectly good natured dogs approach other dogs on walks. Even if we are out in very doggy orientated places. I sit them up to the side, Scout gets the lead slipped on as he’s a year old and sometimes forgets his manners. It does seem a couple of times now you’ve had issues so maybe if the other dog is on a lead you definitely shouldn’t let them approach? I find it easier to decide who they can approach and who not by applying a blanket ban.
		
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I was trying, C! I'd just captured Bear who was therefore on lead right next to me,  I'd just finished speaking to a bloke whose dog was trying to hump Mitch-I had just asked him if he'd seen Bear when Bear came round the corner.  Mitch ran back to the T junction where the reactive dog had appeared (didn't hear them approach) and I didn't want to approach the reactive dog with Bear.  Mitch came away as soon as A appeared.  I don't think I could have done more,  tbh. The only other time we've seen a reactive dog,  they went on the lead and past asap.

Edit to say, I am very sensitive to owners with reactive dogs, given Zak’s history and how careful we had to be walking him. If I could have grabbed Mitch, I would have done, obviously. He has been really good on walks, so this was (I hope) an anomaly. Also, there was no ‘letting’ him approach, the dog appeared from the path behind where Mitch had gone after I hauled the humper off him.


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## Pearlsasinger (22 August 2022)

We have trained all ours to ignore *all* other dogs  on or off lead by taking them to places where there are plenty of other dogs and keeping them away from the others. We use balls as a distraction and lots of treats. Going to agricultural shows etc where all dogs should be on a lead has helped in the past. They just get used to walking past neutrally. There has been the odd mishap, of course, but mainly when other dogs have approached ours. We are currently training the brown one(6 mths) that she doesn't need to bark at other dogs.


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## Clodagh (22 August 2022)

Scout is testing his teenagerdom at the moment. I can’t tell if he wants to defend his women or just sniff butts and say hi, but whatever the reason it’s boring. He’s absolutely fine if another dog comes up to him while he’s sat up ( on lead) but is struggling to learn that no one wants or needs his opinion! He will come back if another dog comes into sight while he’s free ranging but it’s a bit slow and reluctant. I hope he’ll grow out of it.


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## Clodagh (22 August 2022)

And I can’t think why anyone takes their dog to an agricultural show, but you and I PAS have discussed that before 😃. 
I might take two max in the pub if I’m out and need a drink but never more than that. They have to fit out of sight.


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## Pearlsasinger (22 August 2022)

Clodagh said:



			Scout is testing his teenagerdom at the moment. I can’t tell if he wants to defend his women or just sniff butts and say hi, but whatever the reason it’s boring. He’s absolutely fine if another dog comes up to him while he’s sat up ( on lead) but is struggling to learn that no one wants or needs his opinion! He will come back if another dog comes into sight while he’s free ranging but it’s a bit slow and reluctant. I hope he’ll grow out of it.
		
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It's interesting because I don't remember this barking phase happening before with other dogs but  'Daycare dog' also went through a similar barking phase at the same age, fortunately she has grown/been trained out of it now. Actually one of the Rotts was a bit that way inclined when we walked directly from home, she seemed to think that she owned the whole hamlet.  She grew out if that, too.


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## Pearlsasinger (22 August 2022)

Clodagh said:



			And I can’t think why anyone takes their dog to an agricultural show, but you and I PAS have discussed that before 😃.
I might take two max in the pub if I’m out and need a drink but never more than that. They have to fit out of sight.
		
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It does depend on the show - and I seem to remember that you have taken yours to p-t-p meetings.


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## Cinnamontoast (22 August 2022)

Pearlsasinger said:



			We have trained all ours to ignore *all* other dogs  on or off lead by taking them to places where there are plenty of other dogs and keeping them away from the others. We use balls as a distraction and lots of treats. Going to agricultural shows etc where all dogs should be on a lead has helped in the past. They just get used to walking past neutrally. There has been the odd mishap, of course, but mainly when other dogs have approached ours. We are currently training the brown one(6 mths) that she doesn't need to bark at other dogs.
		
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To be fair, we were delighted with the youngsters last week, they went past other dogs with barely a look, notably a huge liver dobie. I’m hoping today was a one off. Goose is far better at just ignoring.


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## Clodagh (22 August 2022)

Pearlsasinger said:



			It does depend on the show - and I seem to remember that you have taken yours to p-t-p meetings.

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And as you pointed out. There’s only ever 10 people there 😃.


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## Clodagh (22 August 2022)

Pearlsasinger said:



			It's interesting because I don't remember this barking phase happening before with other dogs but  'Daycare dog' also went through a similar barking phase at the same age, fortunately she has grown/been trained out of it now. Actually one of the Rotts was a bit that way inclined when we walked directly from home, she seemed to think that she owned the whole hamlet.  She grew out if that, too.
		
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I hope so too with S, he doesn’t bark but he does put his hackles up. I’m not sure if boys just do that, testicles seem to cause all sorts of behaviour 😃


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## splashgirl45 (22 August 2022)

Pearlsasinger said:



			We have trained all ours to ignore *all* other dogs  on or off lead by taking them to places where there are plenty of other dogs and keeping them away from the others. We use balls as a distraction and lots of treats. Going to agricultural shows etc where all dogs should be on a lead has helped in the past. They just get used to walking past neutrally. There has been the odd mishap, of course, but mainly when other dogs have approached ours. We are currently training the brown one(6 mths) that she doesn't need to bark at other dogs.
		
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I am now having problems with my 2 year old terrier who is barking at other dogs if she is on the lead..it’s been since she had a big dog jump on her and although it didn’t bite her she was petrified.  Now If she is off lead she comes back to me and hides behind me if she sees big dogs she doesn’t know..I’m hoping she will improve with time, I can distract her with a ball as she is ball obsessed but if another dog comes closer she won’t even look at the ball..I hate her being scared. and am struggling.  Do you just distract your young one or is there anything else that is working for you ?


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## Pearlsasinger (22 August 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			To be fair, we were delighted with the youngsters last week, they went past other dogs with barely a look, notably a huge liver dobie. I’m hoping today was a one off. Goose is far better at just ignoring.
		
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They are dogs in training, so every step in the right direction is a win! We were warned that brown dog liked to attach herself to others when out walking  but that hasn't been much of a problem for us. She stays with the others and has moved on into the barking phase. Her recall is superb and she lives the idea of checking in for a treat. If there are 3 of us walking, she will go round us all to get a 'coming back' treat


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## Cinnamontoast (22 August 2022)

Clodagh said:



			I hope so too with S, he doesn’t bark but he does put his hackles up. I’m not sure if boys just do that, testicles seem to cause all sorts of behaviour 😃
		
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Mitch puts up his hackles, they’re extremely long, he has what looks like a narrow blanket along his back to his tail of differently textured hair, as does Goose. Hackles don’t necessarily mean aggression, his is pure excitement.


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## Pearlsasinger (22 August 2022)

splashgirl45 said:



			I am now having problems with my 2 year old terrier who is barking at other dogs if she is on the lead..it’s been since she had a big dog jump on her and although it didn’t bite her she was petrified.  Now If she is off lead she comes back to me and hides behind me if she sees big dogs she doesn’t know..I’m hoping she will improve with time, I can distract her with a ball as she is ball obsessed but if another dog comes closer she won’t even look at the ball..I hate her being scared. and am struggling.  Do you just distract your young one or is there anything else that is working for you ?
		
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Just distraction and treats as other dogs go past without her barking but she hasn't been frightened by a big dog, so her barking is a bit different. It can be hard to rebuild their confidence.


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## Cinnamontoast (22 August 2022)

Pearlsasinger said:



			They are dogs in training, so every step in the right direction is a win! We were warned that brown dog liked to attach herself to others when out walking  but that hasn't been much of a problem for us. She stays with the others and has moved on into the barking phase. Her recall is superb and she lives the idea of checking in for a treat. If there are 3 of us walking, she will go round us all to get a 'coming back' treat

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True, I keep forgetting they are ‘unfinished’, still cooking! For 11 month olds, I think they’re brilliant. They turn on a sixpence on command, recall brilliantly, bar the reactive dog incident, but considering I was stood right next to the humper I’d hauled off, maybe I can see why Mitch wouldn’t come to me but sprinted past to my OH (thicko CT is just working out why he wouldn’t come back to me!)

I know lots of people want to have their dogs move on and when I had Zak with me, I’d be zooming past, but when we had Jake and Brig, walking for us was a sociable event. We met up with 2 older ladies and used to go round the woods with them (they were both really keen on my OH and happily admitted it!) and we’d always stop and speak to people and get their dogs back by recalling ours. I’ve missed that and since going back to these woods, I’ve had loads of conversations with other owners. I hope I can carry on doing that, I‘m really enjoying the walks, for the social thing and the exercise.


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## babymare (22 August 2022)

Esmae said:



			I never understand why people take their dogs to the pub.  It's not as if you are going to live there. Leave them at home. Will do no harm.
		
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When we are out and about with our Tess we may stop for lunch at a pub. Whether we sit inside or outside Tess will go under the table and lay down just watching the world go by or sleep. Most times we get up to leave and people around us didn’t realise we had a dog 😃 Tasty titbits help lol. Plus snuggles with the staff


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## Pearlsasinger (22 August 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			True, I keep forgetting they are ‘unfinished’, still cooking! For 11 month olds, I think they’re brilliant. They turn on a sixpence on command, recall brilliantly, bar the reactive dog incident, but considering I was stood right next to the humper I’d hauled off, maybe I can see why Mitch wouldn’t come to me but sprinted past to my OH (thicko CT is just working out why he wouldn’t come back to me!)

I know lots of people want to have their dogs move on and when I had Zak with me, I’d be zooming past, but when we had Jake and Brig, walking for us was a sociable event. We met up with 2 older ladies and used to go round the woods with them (they were both really keen on my OH and happily admitted it!) and we’d always stop and speak to people and get their dogs back by recalling ours. I’ve missed that and since going back to these woods, I’ve had loads of conversations with other owners. I hope I can carry on doing that, I‘m really enjoying the walks, for the social thing and the exercise.
		
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We do stop and chat with various neighbours /dog owners but we sit the dogs down beside us, either on or off lead, so that we know exactly where they are.


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## skinnydipper (23 August 2022)

Pearlsasinger said:



			We are currently training the brown one(6 mths) that she doesn't need to bark at other dogs.
		
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Clodagh said:



			I hope so too with S, he doesn’t bark but he does put his hackles up.
		
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Cinnamontoast said:



			Mitch puts up his hackles, they’re extremely long, he has what looks like a narrow blanket along his back to his tail of differently textured hair,
		
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Forgive me for butting in guys.

With these youngsters, do you think the barking/raised hackles/unsure could be due to going through a fear period?  (fear periods can occur up to about 18 months)


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## Cinnamontoast (23 August 2022)

I think that Mitch is excited, possibly wary. Goose will go past other dogs, maybe engage then move on, Mitch is more likely to not approach, he holds back and assesses the situation. He has had no run ins with other dogs until the humper the day before yesterday, which made him move away and not come when asked. He puts up his hackles even with known dogs, it strikes me as excitement. He does it playing with Goose in the garden too, when they’re playing hard. Everything I’ve read indicates hackles being raised is indicative of a rush of adrenaline, obviously there are various causes.


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## splashgirl45 (23 August 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			Forgive me for butting in guys.

With these youngsters, do you think the barking/raised hackles/unsure could be due to going through a fear period?  (fear periods can occur up to about 18 months)
		
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mine is 2 years old and I know why she is doing it. It is fear based , my other 2 are very relaxed ..


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## Clodagh (23 August 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			Forgive me for butting in guys.

With these youngsters, do you think the barking/raised hackles/unsure could be due to going through a fear period?  (fear periods can occur up to about 18 months)
		
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It would be good. Probably actually, I’ve never especially noticed it in the bitches by a year old but generally he is very babyish compared to them at the same age. In a few months he’s going to be having an awful lot of contact with an awful lot of strange dogs so I hope he gets over it!
Do dog’s understand reasons for erect hackles in another dog? Or is it always a challenge? He doesn’t bark or anything.


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## CorvusCorax (23 August 2022)

Hackles up is insecurity/lack of sureness, whatever way you want to put it and very occasionally, arousal/anticipation of something happening, (IE I have seen a few dogs hackling in heeling wondering if a ball is going to appear, or unhappy about a distraction). This is my firm belief informed by watching multiple dogs, not just my own, over quite a few years. 
For instance, if a dog comes round the hide to bark at a helper, and it is hackling, it will usually lose marks and it's not something anyone really wants to see.


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## Clodagh (23 August 2022)

Well I’d rather S was thinking WTF than kill now!


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## skinnydipper (23 August 2022)

splashgirl45 said:



			mine is 2 years old and I know why she is doing it. It is fear based , my other 2 are very relaxed ..
		
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You could try a combination of desensitisation and counter conditioning.

Briefly,  start at distance from other dogs far enough away not to cause any sign of fear or anxiety and reward your dog with something that she loves.

Gradually decrease the distance and consistently pair the fearful stimuli (other dog) with the reward.

The idea is that over time you will change her emotional response.

Hope this helps.

Taken from an old post of mine:




skinnydipper said:



_For behaviour modification to be successful it is important that the dog is kept under threshold***. She cannot learn when she is frightened and already reacting. She sounds very stressed and I would suggest giving her a little break from her trigger (other dogs) and let her relax._

_When she does go out she should not be pressured to meet and interact with other dogs._

_***Below threshold is when the lab is still coping and happy to take treats. If you observe her body language and she is showing signs of stress she is over threshold. If she is barking she is way over threshold._

_Her owner needs to know at what distance she becomes stressed and maintain a distance from other dogs which is greater than that. Distance is important._

_*#* Desensitisation and counter conditioning. Use extra special treats, cooked chicken for example, and use it only to reward the desired behaviour. For example when she sees another dog at a distance she is comfortable with and doesn't react, "good girl" in a happy voice, reward with chicken and move away - not towards the other dog. Moving away is also a reward._

_If another dog is approaching and it would be difficult to maintain distance, don't panic and show stress instead say (jolly voice again) "lets go" and walk/run the other way, cross the road or whatever. Make a game of it. Reward a successful escape game but not with the "very special treat", keep that for the counter conditioning._

_The dog needs to know that she can trust her owner to keep her safe._

_Basically what you are aiming for is for the lab to see another dog and look to her owner for her special reward. Pairing the scary thing with something positive (counter conditioning)._

_Gradually you will be able to decrease the distance between her and other dogs but it is important not to rush things._

_In the early days I would avoid busy areas where it is more difficult to control her environment. You don't want her to be overwhelmed._

_The owner might find it helpful to buy a Yellow Dog vest or leash sleeve stating that the dog needs space._

_Also useful to teach is "watch me", for the times when a close encounter is unavoidable it gives the dog an alternative behaviour to perform instead of focusing on the scary thing._

_*#* Lab's owner could enlist the help of doggy friends and set up training sessions as above._

_I know from experience that behavioural modification does work. It doesn't happen overnight and your friend will need a lot of patience but she can celebrate each small success and know that by helping her dog to change her emotional state and decrease her stress, she is improving her dog's quality of life._

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## CorvusCorax (23 August 2022)

Clodagh said:



			Well I’d rather S was thinking WTF than kill now!
		
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It's not about killing, it's about confidence/assuredness


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## Clodagh (23 August 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			It's not about killing, it's about confidence/assuredness 

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I see that. He’s a dippity doughnut dog.


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## CorvusCorax (23 August 2022)

Clodagh said:



			I see that. He’s a dippity doughnut dog.
		
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I jokingly refer to mine as Braveheart. She looks like a bog brush when she comes out of the gate some mornings and there might be INTRUDERS who needs to be TOLD TO GO AWAY.


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## Clodagh (23 August 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			I jokingly refer to mine as Braveheart. She looks like a bog brush when she comes out of the gate some mornings and there might be INTRUDERS who needs to be TOLD TO GO AWAY.
		
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I suspect if there were real intruders Scout would hide 😄


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## skinnydipper (23 August 2022)

This is interesting. 

It seems that the pattern of piloerection (raised hackles) correlates with different emotional states.

Thin line from shoulder to tail correlates with more confident dogs, higher likelihood of aggression.

Broad patch over neck and shoulders, low confidence and fear.

Raised patches over shoulder and hips, dogs who are ambivalent, often more reactive and unpredictable.


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## Clodagh (23 August 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			This is interesting. 

It seems that the pattern of piloerection (raised hackles) correlates with different emotional states.

Thin line from shoulder to tail correlates with more confident dogs, higher likelihood of aggression.

Broad patch over neck and shoulders, low confidence and fear.

Raised patches over shoulder and hips, dogs who are ambivalent, often more reactive and unpredictable.







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That’s what I wondered, would dogs know the difference. And they obviously would.


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## CorvusCorax (23 August 2022)

Interesting, hackling up in the hide would never be associated with confidence IME, 'pure' aggression is not what judges are looking for.
Not (sorry Clodagh!) kill now! but 'I've got this, I will easily best you, do not move'.
But I suppose that is dog vs human so slightly different.
My female does literally go from withers to croup and I don't perceive it as confidence.


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## Clodagh (23 August 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			This is interesting. 

It seems that the pattern of piloerection (raised hackles) correlates with different emotional states.

Thin line from shoulder to tail correlates with more confident dogs, higher likelihood of aggression.

Broad patch over neck and shoulders, low confidence and fear.

Raised patches over shoulder and hips, dogs who are ambivalent, often more reactive and unpredictable.







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Scout is very broad patch over neck and shoulders


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## Pearlsasinger (23 August 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			Forgive me for butting in guys.

With these youngsters, do you think the barking/raised hackles/unsure could be due to going through a fear period?  (fear periods can occur up to about 18 months)
		
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Ours is almost certainly going through a developmental phase. We have to bear in mind that this dog was passed on to us aged 5 months + a few days, has been with us since 3rd July and has only found her voice in the last couple of weeks. I am sure that as we continue to take  her out and about and  build her confidence in new situations  she will grow out of it. She has stopped barking at those neighbours that we pass regularly and with whom she has become familiar.

Eta, she doesn't raise her hackles at those times, just occasionally when playing with the other dogs.


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## Cinnamontoast (23 August 2022)

Clodagh said:



			It would be good. Probably actually, I’ve never especially noticed it in the bitches by a year old but generally he is very babyish compared to them at the same age. In a few months he’s going to be having an awful lot of contact with an awful lot of strange dogs so I hope he gets over it!
Do dog’s understand reasons for erect hackles in another dog? Or is it always a challenge? He doesn’t bark or anything.
		
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Very likely, so when Mitch has his hackles up approaching other dogs, they have all been keen to meet him. They don’t seem to perceive a challenge. I’ve watched him and the other dogs each time, obviously I’m paranoid after puss cat. 



Pearlsasinger said:



			Ours is almost certainly going through a developmental phase. We have to bear in mind that this dog was passed on to us aged 5 months + a few days, has been with us since 3rd July and has only found her voice in the last couple of weeks. I am sure that as we continue to take  her out and about and  build her confidence in new situations  she will grow out of it. She has stopped barking at those neighbours that we pass regularly and with whom she has become familiar.

Eta, she doesn't raise her hackles at those times, just occasionally when playing with the other dogs.
		
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Like mine, so I think hackles may just=excitement. Mine bark at one thing and that’s the neighbour behind using their back gate. They’ve beebrought in twice for that, I don’t want barking. Mitch barked in frustration at Goose yesterday because Goose was refusing to try to steal his toy.


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## Pearlsasinger (23 August 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			Very likely, so when Mitch has his hackles up approaching other dogs, they have all been keen to meet him. They don’t seem to perceive a challenge. I’ve watched him and the other dogs each time, obviously I’m paranoid after puss cat.



Like mine, so I think hackles may just=excitement. Mine bark at one thing and that’s the neighbour behind using their back gate. They’ve beebrought in twice for that, I don’t want barking. Mitch barked in frustration at Goose yesterday because Goose was refusing to try to steal his toy.
		
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One of the funniest things I have ever seen was when Rotter 1 refused to want a Kong Wubba toy that we called Mr Pink, when Rotter 2 thought she should. Rotter 2 did everything she could think of to make it desirable, throwing it up in the air, pouncing on it etc and then finally, in desperation threw it across the room at her sister  hitting her right between the eyes, (goodness knows how she managed that!) and still Rotter1 ignored it!


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## Cinnamontoast (23 August 2022)

Pearlsasinger said:



			One of the funniest things I have ever seen was when Rotter 1 refused to want a Kong Wubba toy that we called Mr Pink, when Rotter 2 thought she should. Rotter 2 did everything she could think of to make it desirable, throwing it up in the air, pouncing on it etc and then finally, in desperation threw it across the room at her sister  hitting her right between the eyes, (goodness knows how she managed that!) and still Rotter1 ignored it!
		
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Mitch tried everything yesterday, bouncing at him, play growling, parading around. Trouble is, Goose had the identical toy. Mitch gave up, Goose promptly stole both toys and laid down with them prominently displayed to await Mitch’s reaction. They make me die!

I stupidly introduced them to plastic bottles in Newcastle and they were ecstatic, but every time I get out a drink, they think they should have it.


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## teapot (26 August 2022)

Can I add people walking three abreast down a private road (no pavement) with four dogs in tow, who just let a dog wander out on a long lead in front of my bonnet.

Once I'd removed my eyebrows from my roof, I got a vague 'oh sorry' shrug FFS.


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## Tiddlypom (27 August 2022)

Local foxhound pack has a new huntsman for this season.

His wife's dogs are roaming and causing a nuisance in the local village. She does not think that this a problem . This screenshot has been posted on an anti's page.





How to fit into a new area when you move with your job - not.


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## Amymay (27 August 2022)

What a pillock!


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## Clodagh (27 August 2022)

What a very stupid woman.


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## Amymay (27 August 2022)

Hopefully the dog warden will catch up with her.  But of course someone could contact the hunt Chairman and get them to have a word with his hunt staff about how to win friends and influence people 🤔🙄


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## Cinnamontoast (27 August 2022)

Who lets their dog roam these days? I’d be terrified if mine got out. At the max, they run int9 Aunty Barbara’s garden or house. Bear scampered in and sat by the cupboard until her son gave him a treat. 🤣 

A local park had a dog attack a girl’s dog and the girl when she tried to help her dog. No owner in sight. Think I’ll be avoiding there for a while, which is a shame, because it’s our nearest decent park, the one where the woods are totally enclosed so useful for Bear.


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## Tiddlypom (27 August 2022)

I know that the hunt monitors the local anti's pages, so I presume that they are now aware of how their new appointment's wife is making efforts to fit in with the locals.


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## Amymay (27 August 2022)

Tiddlypom said:



			I know that the hunt monitors the local anti's pages, so I presume that they are now aware of how their new appointment's wife is making efforts to fit in with the locals.
		
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Well, that’s something.


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## Clodagh (28 August 2022)

You get a lot of dogs roaming round here, mainly farm collies. I’d be far too paranoid.


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## Tiddlypom (28 August 2022)

Doing a bit more digging, these dogs are not just straying close to home, they are being found further away on the other side of two busy A roads - the A49 and the A556 for those who are local.

It's crazy. I would be reporting them to the rural police/dog warden if I came across them myself. How can people be so entitled, and so oblivious of the danger that they are putting both their dogs and the public in - a car swerving to avoid running them over on the road could cause a serious accident.


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## ycbm (28 August 2022)

Tiddlypom said:



			on the other side of two busy A roads - the A49 and the A556 for those who are local.
		
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😲🤯😲

Forget the dogs,  someone going to die in a road accident at that rate, those are fast and furious roads!


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## CorvusCorax (29 August 2022)

Sorry, you can't 'love' your dogs and willingly let them spend prolonged periods of time out of sight and out of control/not contained.


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## CorvusCorax (29 August 2022)

Tiddlypom said:



			Doing a bit more digging, these dogs are not just straying close to home, they are being found further away on the other side of two busy A roads - the A49 and the A556 for those who are local.

It's crazy. I would be reporting them to the rural police/dog warden if I came across them myself. How can people be so entitled, and so oblivious of the danger that they are putting both their dogs and the public in - a car swerving to avoid running them over on the road could cause a serious accident.
		
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I hope she has good insurance.


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## Errin Paddywack (29 August 2022)

She is breaking the law just letting them roam and I doubt any insurance company would pay out as she is clearly negligent.  I hope no one gets killed avoiding them on the roads.


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## CorvusCorax (29 August 2022)

Errin Paddywack said:



			She is breaking the law just letting them roam and I doubt any insurance company would pay out as she is clearly negligent.  I hope no one gets killed avoiding them on the roads.
		
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Yeah I was more thinking about what she's going to have to pay out when someone gets wiped out on the road trying to avoid her dogs.

She's actually put it on writing on the Internet that she doesn't keep them securely/lets them roam and is liable AF for anything that goes wrong. There's wiser eating grass.


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## SilverLinings (29 August 2022)

As she is knowingly allowing her dogs to repeatedly roam on/across public roads would it not be in the interest of the local dog warden/PCSO/policeman to have a word with her before she is the cause of a serious RTA? TBH I don't really get how SM works (other than HHO, obvs), but can someone not tag the warden/pcso/police in on any posts that show her acknowledging her dogs roam, and/or posts from locals who've spotted the dogs on roads?

She shouldn't have dogs if she's that unbothered that they could get squashed, but I'm amazed she also doesn't seem to care that a person could be killed in an RTA caused by their roaming.


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## Amymay (29 August 2022)

Not an irresponsible owner post…

I walk a very nervy, reactive dog. She’s always put on a lead when we meet other dogs.  She’s not aggressive, but does a good impression of being so.  

Met a lady yesterday with an equally nervy, reactive dog. Also on the lead.

We acknowledged each other with a cherry ‘hello’.  Both rolled our eyes over the dogs, and then stood chatting at distance for several minutes.  Both dogs calmed down. And we each moved a little closer, and continued chatting.  Dogs now totally ignoring each other.

We were both grateful that we could take the time to create a safe, calm environment for these dogs, diffusing any stress they may have felt.

Both dogs met again an hour later, and passed each other calmly and politely.

There are some really good eggs out there 😄


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## SilverLinings (29 August 2022)

Amymay said:



			Not an irresponsible owner post…

I walk a very nervy, reactive dog. She’s always put on a lead when we meet other dogs.  She’s not aggressive, but does a good impression of being so. 

Met a lady yesterday with an equally nervy, reactive dog. Also on the lead.

We acknowledged each other with a cherry ‘hello’.  Both rolled our eyes over the dogs, and then stood chatting at distance for several minutes.  Both dogs calmed down. And we each moved a little closer, and continued chatting.  Dogs now totally ignoring each other.

We were both grateful that we could take the time to create a safe, calm environment for these dogs, diffusing any stress they may have felt.

Both dogs met again an hour later, and passed each other calmly and politely.

There are some really good eggs out there 😄
		
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That sounds very civilised, and an excellent opportunity for both the dogs to learn how to ignore others without getting stressed about it . It is so nice to read about an interaction that didn't end up with 'but he only wants to say hello...' followed by a very upset dog in it at some point!


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## Tiddlypom (29 August 2022)

I've not witnessed the two dogs loose myself, but I have now caught up with numerous posts on local FB pages stating that they are always getting out, plus the useless owner's responses stating that there's not much that she can do about it, and that her dogs are having fun. They are indeed crossing the A roads on their travels, and it has been going on for months.

Various posts re these dogs are on an open village FB page and are up and still visible.




I am going to see if I can report them. That particular council doesn't seem to have a way of directly contacting the dog warden, though my neighbouring council does. Everything is shut today for the bank holiday of course.

This is so dangerous, I don't want to read of a horrible road smash caused by these dogs.


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## Amymay (29 August 2022)

What group is it @Tiddlypom ?


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## Tiddlypom (29 August 2022)

Although I'm bleddy furious about it, I won't publicly share the link as it does clearly identify the offender.

I'll PM it to anyone who is interested, though. PM is already being sent to Amymay.


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## Amymay (29 August 2022)

Tiddlypom said:



			Although I'm bleddy furious about it, I won't publicly share the link as it does clearly identify the offender..
		
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Of course, fair enough.


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## Cinnamontoast (29 August 2022)

Tiddlypom said:



			I've not witnessed the two dogs loose myself, but I have now caught up with numerous posts on local FB pages stating that they are always getting out, plus the useless owner's responses stating that there's not much that she can do about it, and that her dogs are having fun. They are indeed crossing the A roads on their travels, and it has been going on for months.

Various posts re these dogs are on an open village FB page and are up and still visible.

View attachment 98528


I am going to see if I can report them. That particular council doesn't seem to have a way of directly contacting the dog warden, though my neighbouring council does. Everything is shut today for the bank holiday of course.

This is so dangerous, I don't want to read of a horrible road smash caused by these dogs.
		
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I’d be shovelling them both in the car and putting up a post saying ‘Anyone know these two? Can be collected from the dog warden at x cost’. Hitting her in the pocket might make her change her mind. If they have tags on their collars, they would mysteriously disappear, god knows I’ve had plenty come off during walks.


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## CorvusCorax (29 August 2022)

I was going to say, repeatedly having to pay them out of the pound might change her mind.


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## Cinnamontoast (29 August 2022)

Possibly a quiet word with neighbours, TP?! A few times paying to get them back might work a treat.


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## Tiddlypom (29 August 2022)

That's a good call, but they're a bit off my patch, and I don't know of anyone who lives thereabouts. It all came to my notice because of the screenshot of one of her responses to her loose dogs being posted by an anti hunting group - she's the horsey hunting wife of the new huntsman to my local hunt. He'll have only been in post since May 1.

I posted elsewhere that the masters must have been having a brain f@rt when they appointed him, he has form, but I hadn't anticipated this.

I'll start trying to contact the dog warden tomorrow, and see how it goes.

ETA I have finally found a phone number for the dog warden - they don't make it easy!


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## scats (30 August 2022)

Tiddlypom said:



			Local foxhound pack has a new huntsman for this season.

His wife's dogs are roaming and causing a nuisance in the local village. She does not think that this a problem . This screenshot has been posted on an anti's page.

View attachment 98445



How to fit into a new area when you move with your job - not.
		
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What an idiot!  I hope they don’t cause an accident while off on their own ‘having fun’!  

I was told my dogs were beautifully behaved by a lady yesterday.  All off lead and walking in a very dog populated part of the sand dunes. I felt like a proud parent 😂


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## Tiddlypom (30 August 2022)

Tiddlypom said:



			I'll start trying to contact the dog warden tomorrow, and see how it goes.

ETA I have finally found a phone number for the dog warden - they don't make it easy!
		
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An hour spent on hold to the council and then to police 101, and I'm not any further forward .

Very sympathetic responses from both, and they'd have gone out if the dogs were currently straying on the road, but no route from either dog warden or police to speak to the known named owner and to warn her to stop her dogs from straying.

I reiterated that the dogs are regularly crossing over to the other side of the A49, and both agreed that it was very dangerous, but it is not in their remit to have a chat with the owner before the inevitable road crash happens.

Bah humbug.


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## SilverLinings (30 August 2022)

Tiddlypom said:



			An hour spent on hold to the council and then to police 101, and I'm not any further forward .

Very sympathetic responses from both, and they'd have gone out if the dogs were currently straying on the road, but no route from either dog warden or police to speak to the known named owner and to warn her to stop her dogs from straying.

I reiterated that the dogs are regularly crossing over to the other side of the A49, and both agreed that it was very dangerous, but it is not in their remit to have a chat with the owner before the inevitable road crash happens.

Bah humbug.
		
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I can't stand that sort of bureaucracy/avoidance of responsibility- it's like when a council won't put up a road sign or pedestrian crossing until there has been a serious accident, surely the point is to prevent one?! Good on you for trying to get someone to intervene, not sure how much help the sympathy you got was though!


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## CorvusCorax (30 August 2022)

Clucking bell I'm cross.

Had worked out a way to let other dogs pass in close proximity on narrow path which was working really well, by doing a massive food drop on the ground on the verge.
Until tonight when some teenagers walking a really fugly blue and brown bulldog let it come right over in her face, IT had a go at her, minding her own business and eating and if course she retaliated.
They laughed so I'm not sorry to say I gave them a right mouthful. And the next time I see them they'll get told if it comes anywhere near us, it'll get my boot up it's backside.
(No flaming, I'm pissed off, I've worked so hard on this female and I just hope it hadn't bolloxed my tactic).

Plus a dog I've been working with for nearly two years got attacked by a mastiff last week and the owner thought he was doing the right thing by 'letting him defend himself' and 'he gave as good as he got' but I wish he'd have advocated for the dog a bit more. I'll see tomorrow how much mental damage has been done.


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## SaddlePsych'D (30 August 2022)

Tiddlypom said:



			An hour spent on hold to the council and then to police 101, and I'm not any further forward .

Very sympathetic responses from both, and they'd have gone out if the dogs were currently straying on the road, but no route from either dog warden or police to speak to the known named owner and to warn her to stop her dogs from straying.

I reiterated that the dogs are regularly crossing over to the other side of the A49, and both agreed that it was very dangerous, but it is not in their remit to have a chat with the owner before the inevitable road crash happens.

Bah humbug.
		
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That seems like nonsense, or at least it should be. How does this not fit under the DDA? Like under serious risk of harm being caused by these dogs not being under control.

Eta sorry if that sounded like having a go at you, it's not just frustration at useless dog legislation.


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## Cinnamontoast (30 August 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			Clucking bell I'm cross.

Had worked out a way to let other dogs pass in close proximity on narrow path which was working really well, by doing a massive food drop on the ground on the verge.
Until tonight when some teenagers walking a really fugly blue and brown bulldog let it come right over in her face, IT had a go at her, minding her own business and eating and if course she retaliated.
They laughed so I'm not sorry to say I gave them a right mouthful. And the next time I see them they'll get told if it comes anywhere near us, it'll get my boot up it's backside.
(No flaming, I'm pissed off, I've worked so hard on this female and I just hope it hadn't bolloxed my tactic).

Plus a dog I've been working with for nearly two years got attacked by a mastiff last week and the owner thought he was doing the right thing by 'letting him defend himself' and 'he gave as good as he got' but I wish he'd have advocated for the dog a bit more. I'll see tomorrow how much mental damage has been done.
		
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Is she very reactive, I take it?


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## CorvusCorax (30 August 2022)

She's fine if given space and there's not a lot of space on this path. Had too many rude dogs with no recall crashing in on top of her and a very bad experience where a spaniel jumped into the garden and chased her as a pup which has coloured her judgement, as you would expect.


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## CorvusCorax (31 August 2022)

Food drop still working this morning, phew....


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## Caol Ila (31 August 2022)

Pottering through the park yesterday, and my horse suddenly jumped forwards. I looked behind me, and saw a poodle thing barking and racing up his backside. No owner in sight. I yelled some swear words, and poodle thing ran away. Good.

Continued on our way, and about 15-20 minutes later, poodle thing appeared again. This time with its owners. Sort of. It ran at me, barking, and they danced and dove while trying to catch it and put it on a lead. I stood still, looking very unimpressed. They caught it, but they had an extendable lead so it lunged at us again. Glaring, I rode away. Then, just as we were leaving the park, the horse did another small spook and there was poodle thing, hurtling around the corner. I rode into the carpark and it followed. I kept going and owners caught it, but not before owner's kid, who looked about 10, gave us the finger. Kid was as well behaved as the dog.


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## Cinnamontoast (31 August 2022)

Caol Ila said:



			Pottering through the park yesterday, and my horse suddenly jumped forwards. I looked behind me, and saw a poodle thing barking and racing up his backside. No owner in sight. I yelled some swear words, and poodle thing ran away. Good.

Continued on our way, and about 15-20 minutes later, poodle thing appeared again. This time with its owners. Sort of. It ran at me, barking, and they danced and dove while trying to catch it and put it on a lead. I stood still, looking very unimpressed. They caught it, but they had an extendable lead so it lunged at us again. Glaring, I rode away. Then, just as we were leaving the park, the horse did another small spook and there was poodle thing, hurtling around the corner. I rode into the carpark and it followed. I kept going and owners caught it, but not before owner's kid, who looked about 10, gave us the finger. Kid was as well behaved as the dog.
		
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Bloody hell! Kid gives you the finger because his dog is misbehaving?! I despair! That could be a call to the dog warden (if you can ever ruddy find one!) re dog dangerously out of control/making you fear it might attack. There’s a notice to that effect on the gate to the woods we go to. Do you have a go-pro?


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## BBP (1 September 2022)

This thread and my own experiences make me question if I will ever have another dog. Thanks to offlead aggressive dogs mine is now dog reactive, I do everything in my power to keep him safe and comfortable but I feel it’s driven me into a corner of hating the sight of other dogs. I walk at 5am to actively avoid others and no longer go to parks or the woods that I used to love so much, or anywhere that is popular for dog walking, all for fear of off lead dogs out of control. It has really taken the fun out of having a dog. I don’t think either my dog or I are resilient enough to cope. Last year I took a footpath between farm buildings and was accosted by 3 massive GSD’s all running loose, protecting their territory, no human in sight. I’m lucky that my dog realised he would be punching above his weight if he started anything, but it was pretty terrifying being circled by such big dogs on their own property with no humans to call them off. Thankfully they appeared to be extremely well socialised and were just doing their job of checking out the intruder without any significant aggression, and then let us back away, but it has put me off exploring the great unknown with him. I’m super lucky that back before the cost of living crisis and splitting with my partner I was able to invest in fencing a paddock for him to play off lead without fear of interacting with anyone but I feel like I’m relying on it more and more.


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## cauda equina (1 September 2022)

I feel the same way about off-road hacking; what used to be a complete delight is now marred by the thought of meeting the wrong dog/owner


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## Cinnamontoast (1 September 2022)

BBP said:



			This thread and my own experiences make me question if I will ever have another dog. Thanks to offlead aggressive dogs mine is now dog reactive, I do everything in my power to keep him safe and comfortable but I feel it’s driven me into a corner of hating the sight of other dogs. I walk at 5am to actively avoid others and no longer go to parks or the woods that I used to love so much, or anywhere that is popular for dog walking, all for fear of off lead dogs out of control. It has really taken the fun out of having a dog. I don’t think either my dog or I are resilient enough to cope. Last year I took a footpath between farm buildings and was accosted by 3 massive GSD’s all running loose, protecting their territory, no human in sight. I’m lucky that my dog realised he would be punching above his weight if he started anything, but it was pretty terrifying being circled by such big dogs on their own property with no humans to call them off. Thankfully they appeared to be extremely well socialised and were just doing their job of checking out the intruder without any significant aggression, and then let us back away, but it has put me off exploring the great unknown with him. I’m super lucky that back before the cost of living crisis and splitting with my partner I was able to invest in fencing a paddock for him to play off lead without fear of interacting with anyone but I feel like I’m relying on it more and more.
		
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I feel your pain and quote honestly think Zak would have taken on all three. It’s so difficult walking a reactive dog. I met a bloke with a very reactive dog this week, unfortunately turned a corner in the woods and ran straight into him. I say unfortunately, but my lot moved on when told, bloke panicked, he reminded me of me with Zak. If I see him again, I’m going to ask if he could just carry on walking. Stopping and doing the panic dance whilst shouting at my lot is exactly what I would have done, but walking away like my OH used to de-escalates that kind of situation.


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## scats (2 September 2022)

Run in with idiotic dog walker who uses the public footpath that runs through yard.  I had a run in with him last winter about letting his Sharpei bark at my horses at the gate.  Then the dog chased my friend riding her horse a few months later when dog walker was trespassing on the land and turned a corner and bumped into friend riding.  Friends cob spun and bolted, dog at his heels.  How friend didn’t come off, I don’t know.  Man scuttled off.
Today I caught him trespassing once again, dog off lead.  I told him he was trespassing to which he replied that he knew and he’s always getting told off for it.  The I asked if his dog was ok with horses, as it was approaching us.  His response was “is your horse ok with dogs?”.  He then told me “Elsie (dog) is going to die soon.”  He repeated this three or four times, to the point that I was actually about to ask if there was something wrong with it.  Then it went right up to Millie’s back legs and sniffed her heels.  He then said “that’s why she’s going to die soon, she just can’t leave horses alone”. He made no attempt to stop her, despite me asking him firmly to get his dog away.  In fairness to the dog, I didn’t feel it was going to do anything, but it was in seriously danger of being kicked and if Millie had kicked out, how did I know that the dog wouldn’t retaliate and bite her?  After about 15 seconds of me telling him to get his dog away and me trying to get Millie away from it, to which dog just followed Millie’s heels, the man eventually turned and walked off, muttering something.  Dog then followed.
I am so fed up of these idiots.  Gold star to Millie though, it was one of those moments that I realised she is very, very special.


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## Cinnamontoast (2 September 2022)

scats said:



			Run in with idiotic dog walker who uses the public footpath that runs through yard.  I had a run in with him last winter about letting his Sharpei bark at my horses at the gate.  Then the dog chased my friend riding her horse a few months later when dog walker was trespassing on the land and turned a corner and bumped into friend riding.  Friends cob spun and bolted, dog at his heels.  How friend didn’t come off, I don’t know.  Man scuttled off.
Today I caught him trespassing once again, dog off lead.  I told him he was trespassing to which he replied that he knew and he’s always getting told off for it.  The I asked if his dog was ok with horses, as it was approaching us.  His response was “is your horse ok with dogs?”.  He then told me “Elsie (dog) is going to die soon.”  He repeated this three or four times, to the point that I was actually about to ask if there was something wrong with it.  Then it went right up to Millie’s back legs and sniffed her heels.  He then said “that’s why she’s going to die soon, she just can’t leave horses alone”. He made no attempt to stop her, despite me asking him firmly to get his dog away.  In fairness to the dog, I didn’t feel it was going to do anything, but it was in seriously danger of being kicked and if Millie had kicked out, how did I know that the dog wouldn’t retaliate and bite her?  After about 15 seconds of me telling him to get his dog away and me trying to get Millie away from it, to which dog just followed Millie’s heels, the man eventually turned and walked off, muttering something.  Dog then followed.
I am so fed up of these idiots.  Gold star to Millie though, it was one of those moments that I realised she is very, very special.
		
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He's always getting told off for it?! What a tw*t! I'd be very direct and tell him to keep the hell off the land. Don't suppose you have a dog warden? They seem to be a rare breed these days!


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## scats (3 September 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			He's always getting told off for it?! What a tw*t! I'd be very direct and tell him to keep the hell off the land. Don't suppose you have a dog warden? They seem to be a rare breed these days!
		
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I can’t work out if there’s something not quite right with him.  He doesn’t respond in the way that a ‘normal’ (whatever that is!) person would and he has an odd manner about him.  I wouldn’t want to meet him in a dark alley, I’ll say that much!


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## P3LH (3 September 2022)

The very posh elderly ladies who parked next to me at a country pub earlier this week probably fit the title. They pulled up as we did and an hour later when we left to go back to the car, we were deafened by barking. Four dogs, toy breeds, some brachy - in crates barking and whining in the back of the car. It was hot. Hot enough to feel sweaty just being sat outside for a drink and something to eat.

Went inside to speak to the duty manager - knew exactly who the dogs and car belonged too. The irony? They were inside running a breed club committee meeting. There were two other cars of that same meeting with dogs left inside cars too. It was a dog friendly pub, I had dogs with me. The pub even has a dog that is often present. People are morons.


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## Cinnamontoast (3 September 2022)

Raaaant! We’re doing longer walks to build up the pups. Came to the path that goes straight on or you turn left. I wanted to go left to complete a circular walk. Two other owners with 5 dogs, 2 samoyeds I’ve met before (owner says they’re ’grumpy’), all blocking the left turn, a narrow gate. I couldn’t go straight on, there are no turns to get back.

Tried to shovel my lot through, one Samoyed started humping Bear, Bear had a pop, owner says ‘Yeah, the dogs will sort it out’ I told him it’s not my dog’s job to ‘sort out‘ another dog, carried on, but then the Samoyed blocked Mitch so I shoved it out of the way while the owner said ‘Yes, you have to move him’. Bloody hell, move your dog! I’m relieved Bear stops immediately when told. 

Luckily, we met multiple other dogs after that, all lovely, but then Bear went after a fox and was springing up and down through cover. I stuck him on the lead, the dog doesn’t know his limits, despite being 12!


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## Pearlsasinger (3 September 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			Raaaant! We’re doing longer walks to build up the pups. Came to the path that goes straight on or you turn left. I wanted to go left to complete a circular walk. Two other owners with 5 dogs, 2 samoyeds I’ve met before (owner says they’re ’grumpy’), all blocking the left turn, a narrow gate. I couldn’t go straight on, there are no turns to get back.

Tried to shovel my lot through, one Samoyed started humping Bear, Bear had a pop, owner says ‘Yeah, the dogs will sort it out’ I told him it’s not my dog’s job to ‘sort out‘ another dog, carried on, but then the Samoyed blocked Mitch so I shoved it out of the way while the owner said ‘Yes, you have to move him’. Bloody hell, move your dog! I’m relieved Bear stops immediately when told.

Luckily, we met multiple other dogs after that, all lovely, but then Bear went after a fox and was springing up and down through cover. I stuck him on the lead, the dog doesn’t know his limits, despite being 12!
		
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I would have had to say,  'Why haven't you moved him out of my way?'. There really are some dimwits out there!


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## Amymay (3 September 2022)

Pearlsasinger said:



			I would have had to say,  'Why haven't you moved him out of my way?'. There really are some dimwits out there!
		
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I would have said ‘Can you move it!’


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## Cinnamontoast (3 September 2022)

Pearlsasinger said:



			I would have had to say,  'Why haven't you moved him out of my way?'. There really are some dimwits out there!
		
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Not even an attempt to call her dog off Bear, she’s bloody lucky he’s so responsive to commands, then no attempt to move the other one out of the way. I’m afraid I walked off saying something about unpleasant dogs.


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## Amymay (3 September 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			Not even an attempt to call her dog off Bear, she’s bloody lucky he’s so responsive to commands, then no attempt to move the other one out of the way. I’m afraid I walked off saying something about unpleasant dogs.
		
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CT, I think you’re far too nice.

I told a woman that both she and her dog were F!ng rude the other day, much to her surprise  🤣🤣


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## Cinnamontoast (3 September 2022)

Amymay said:



			CT, I think you’re far too nice.

I told a woman that both she and her dog were F!ng rude the other day, much to her surprise  🤣🤣
		
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I think I do need to be harsher. Her dog had 2 shots at annoying Bear and she just laughed. 🤬 I used to really advocate for Zak and I will protect my three to the death, but I need to be more vocal. I just wanted to get past asap.

On a positive note, Bear’s hearing appears to have improved: he’s hearing normal volume in the house, head tilting, responding to me coming downstairs. Odd, but I’m delighted! He’s taken to sleeping on the recliner in the kitchen away from the pups who are in crates still, so he’s not taking a cue from them.


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## cauda equina (8 September 2022)

deleted


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## scats (9 September 2022)

Altercation again this evening with Sharpei owner. Trespassing off the public footpath and was in a private field belonging to our yard. He saw me riding towards him, to which he turned and scuttled off and left his dog off lead which came bounding down to Millie at full pelt. Thankfully it stopped about 20 yards away and then turned and ran after the owner, because I think there could have been an accident if it hadn’t. I am sick to death of this man and his constant trespassing and disregard for anyones safety. Millie is good but we have one horse on our yard who is as sharp as a tack and terrified of dogs and if this dog ran under him like it does Millie, I think there would be a serious accident.

What can we do about this? I know trespassing is a civil matter, but the out of control dog is a serious concern.


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## Amymay (9 September 2022)

What can we do about this? I know trespassing is a civil matter, but the out of control dog is a serious concern.
		
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You could start with the Dog Warden


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## SilverLinings (9 September 2022)

That sounds awful Scats, and tiring and stressful that you keep having to put up with his irresponsible and antisocial behaviour.

I'm not sure about the legalities, but could you print out the legislation that allows farmers to shoot dogs worrying livestock and make it into signs to put on the fences/gates? And ask the Dog Warden for advice as Amymay says.


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## Cinnamontoast (9 September 2022)

He clearly knows he’s in the wrong if he’s scuttling off. Could you print and laminate a few notices at key entry points? I know you shouldn’t have to, but it might get through his thick head.


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## My_old_warmblood (9 September 2022)

i see bad dog walkers when I’m both riding and walking my dog! Hence why I don’t let my dog off the lead anymore, and why I avoid dog walking rush hour. He’s too friendly, unfortunately, and will try to greet every living creature- much easier if we only see the occasional dog. 

Most dog walkers are fab where I am, although i had someone let their dog approach my horse the other day when I was riding alone with my neddy- off lead. Fair enough that their dog was pleasant, but I didn’t know that! I was admittedly ready to spring from my poor pony’s back, brandishing my whip, to beat the life out of the dog if it so much as growled. ned wouldn’t have fought back, which frightened me more- he would have rather have sat their and take it than cause a scene, or hurt me


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## scats (9 September 2022)

I’ve just filled in a form on the council website to report it.  He is such an odd man, gives off very strange vibes. I pulled my phone out tonight to record him, even though he was quite far away, but I mustn’t have pressed record on my phone 🙈 Still, he looked back and saw me so he thinks he’s been filmed.


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## CrunchieBoi (10 September 2022)

Had to make a visit to the vets yesterday and was unfortunate enough to be in at the same time as a chap with a small froo-froo dog. Not entirely sure what breed it was (shitzu maybe). 

Quickly realised it was growing at everyone that walked past it so gave it a wide berth with no eye contact etc, and stood further along the front desk to pay our bill. 

This little sod marched to within a couple of feet of me on its flexible lead and stood there growling and air snapping the entire time I was chatting to the receptionist. At no point did I pay it any heed, but was about ready to volley it across the waiting room if it came any closer. Meanwhile the owner was telling the other receptionist all about how this sort of thing is a regular occurance.

I wonder how acceptable it'd be if my big dogs behaved like this in public. I don't claim to be a behaviour expert but surely to goodness you would do what you could to prevent a dog, any dog, from practicing that sort of behaviour.


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## Pearlsasinger (10 September 2022)

CrunchieBoi said:



			Had to make a visit to the vets yesterday and was unfortunate enough to be in at the same time as a chap with a small froo-froo dog. Not entirely sure what breed it was (shitzu maybe).

Quickly realised it was growing at everyone that walked past it so gave it a wide berth with no eye contact etc, and stood further along the front desk to pay our bill.

This little sod marched to within a couple of feet of me on its flexible lead and stood there growling and air snapping the entire time I was chatting to the receptionist. At no point did I pay it any heed, but was about ready to volley it across the waiting room if it came any closer. Meanwhile the owner was telling the other receptionist all about how this sort of thing is a regular occurance.

I wonder how acceptable it'd be if my big dogs behaved like this in public. I don't claim to be a behaviour expert but surely to goodness you would do what you could to prevent a dog, any dog, from practicing that sort of behaviour.
		
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And at the very least haul the lead in to the shortest extent possible


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## CorvusCorax (10 September 2022)

Or just keep it in the car/outside until it's your turn.


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## splashgirl45 (10 September 2022)

It seems that people with small grumpy dogs just accept that is how they behave.. a flexi lead has its place but not in a vets waiting room. Mine are always on short leads anywhere indoors and I only used the flexi while my pup was young on walks round the fields .he is 5 months now but even as a small puppy he was on a short lead in the vets..


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## CrunchieBoi (10 September 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			Or just keep it in the car/outside until it's your turn.
		
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That would have my choice ahd I been the owner. Reduce the stress for the dog a bit.


splashgirl45 said:



			It seems that people with small grumpy dogs just accept that is how they behave.. a flexi lead has its place but not in a vets waiting room. Mine are always on short leads anywhere indoors and I only used the flexi while my pup was young on walks round the fields .he is 5 months now but even as a small puppy he was on a short lead in the vets..
		
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Aye, we quite often get something along the lines of "oh don't mind him, he just has wee dug syndrome" from the owners when we run into these types.


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## splashgirl45 (10 September 2022)

I’ve got 2  tiny terriers and they would never growl at anyone,  I wouldn’t allow it if they did,  they would be corrected


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## Amymay (10 September 2022)

CrunchieBoi said:



			That would have my choice ahd I been the owner. Reduce the stress for the dog a bit.


Aye, we quite often get something along the lines of "oh don't mind him, he just has wee dug syndrome" from the owners when we run into these types.
		
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That would be me then… 🙄


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## CorvusCorax (10 September 2022)

Yes but if a large dog behaved that way the owners would soon get a knock at the door and rightly so.

It's upsetting for a dog of any size, or a human who dislikes dogs, to have other dogs behave like this towards them.

It's also not fair on the small dog left in a situation where they feel they've got to behave in this way in order to protect themselves or their space.


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## fiwen30 (10 September 2022)

I’ve written before about the Jack Russell type that moved in to the semi next door - the one who is allowed to race up and down the shared fence line barking, or who stands by their front door window barking. The one whose owner just shouts ‘Fido!’ at it, with no follow up command, and seemingly no knowledge or inclination to train it.

Well we came home from our own walk, sat in the garden for a little bit, and the Jack Russell came out to bark at us. Heard the owner holler at it to ‘come in and get your collar on’, and I thought happy days, they’ve at least started to walk the thing, and to use distraction to minimise the barking.

The dog didn’t come to call, owner dragged it in, and then it came back out again…wearing an anti-bark collar.

It’s poor behaviour is hugely annoying, but no animal deserves to have one of those things strapped to it. No wonder it wouldn’t come when called, even if it had been trained to recall. I feel so bad for it, it still stood and stared and trembled, and growled a little, but clearly wasn’t able to bark without the pain of the collar.

Really don’t know if there’s anything I can do.


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## Pearlsasinger (10 September 2022)

fiwen30 said:



			I’ve written before about the Jack Russell type that moved in to the semi next door - the one who is allowed to race up and down the shared fence line barking, or who stands by their front door window barking. The one whose owner just shouts ‘Fido!’ at it, with no follow up command, and seemingly no knowledge or inclination to train it.

Well we came home from our own walk, sat in the garden for a little bit, and the Jack Russell came out to bark at us. Heard the owner holler at it to ‘come in and get your collar on’, and I thought happy days, they’ve at least started to walk the thing, and to use distraction to minimise the barking.

The dog didn’t come to call, owner dragged it in, and then it came back out again…wearing an anti-bark collar.

It’s poor behaviour is hugely annoying, but no animal deserves to have one of those things strapped to it. No wonder it wouldn’t come when called, even if it had been trained to recall. I feel so bad for it, it still stood and stared and trembled, and growled a little, but clearly wasn’t able to bark without the pain of the collar.

Really don’t know if there’s anything I can do.
		
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I would report that to whatever the NI equivalent of RSPCA is.


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## SilverLinings (10 September 2022)

scats said:



			I’ve just filled in a form on the council website to report it.  He is such an odd man, gives off very strange vibes. I pulled my phone out tonight to record him, even though he was quite far away, but I mustn’t have pressed record on my phone 🙈 Still, he looked back and saw me so he thinks he’s been filmed.
		
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If you are ever at the yard on your own and the 'strange vibes' are words or behaviour that you can describe then I would contact the local PCSO/police for advice. 

I had problems from a similar type of man a few years ago (no dog though), he would come on to the small yard I was on when I was there alone and make very strange- and slightly threatening- conversation. I started locking the gate so he started to shout for me from behind the gate (this bit is key). I contacted the PCSO for advice as I was starting to get quite concerned about being there in the dark on my own (I was usually there alone), they took it very seriously and sent a police officer round to my house the next day to take a statement. 

The police said that because some of the weird behaviour had happened whilst he was on the road side of the gate they were able to get involved, and wanted information about everything he'd done on the property too. It turned out that he had a habit of fixating on lone women and the police were desperate to be able to arrest and charge him, but he seemed to know just how far he could go. A harassment order was served on him which meant he couldn't approach or talk to me, and it did eventually solve the problem (he broke it once and needed to be threatened with arrest).

The man you are having trouble with may already be known to the police, and they won't mind you at least asking for advice on how to deal with him/the situation.


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## SaddlePsych'D (10 September 2022)

SilverLinings said:



			If you are ever at the yard on your own and the 'strange vibes' are words or behaviour that you can describe then I would contact the local PCSO/police for advice.

I had problems from a similar type of man a few years ago (no dog though), he would come on to the small yard I was on when I was there alone and make very strange- and slightly threatening- conversation. I started locking the gate so he started to shout for me from behind the gate (this bit is key). I contacted the PCSO for advice as I was starting to get quite concerned about being there in the dark on my own (I was usually there alone), they took it very seriously and sent a police officer round to my house the next day to take a statement.

The police said that because some of the weird behaviour had happened whilst he was on the road side of the gate they were able to get involved, and wanted information about everything he'd done on the property too. It turned out that he had a habit of fixating on lone women and the police were desperate to be able to arrest and charge him, but he seemed to know just how far he could go. A harassment order was served on him which meant he couldn't approach or talk to me, and it did eventually solve the problem (he broke it once and needed to be threatened with arrest).

The man you are having trouble with may already be known to the police, and they won't mind you at least asking for advice on how to deal with him/the situation.
		
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Wowza that's really scary. Thank goodness the police took it seriously. 

We came across 'small dog syndrome' today. Not much room to pass by where the owner was sitting but I put myself between the dogs thinking we could scoot past but no...the owner let the lead extend to take up the whole path. I didn't fancy squishing past the barking, growling, snarling pug so we turned around and diverted. Owner completely oblivious!

Also went to a park the other day (not our usual green space) at peak dog walking time. Why folks, why did I do this to myself?! Fended off French bulldog pelting it's way at us although at least the owner was somewhat apologetic and actually put it back on its lead. Then someone telling my dog to 'tell' their dog who wouldn't leave her alone and I very firmly said no actually I don't like them to do that. 

I probably looked like the irresponsible owner today because Ivy, who has been to horse events before and been the perfect hound, decided cross country was very exciting and let out some of the loudest, most high pitched barks (if you can even call them that) I've heard her do. Thankfully only a couple and we swiftly moved on to a quieter spot to do some 'watch' and then she settled down very nicely.


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## scats (11 September 2022)

SilverLinings said:



			If you are ever at the yard on your own and the 'strange vibes' are words or behaviour that you can describe then I would contact the local PCSO/police for advice.

I had problems from a similar type of man a few years ago (no dog though), he would come on to the small yard I was on when I was there alone and make very strange- and slightly threatening- conversation. I started locking the gate so he started to shout for me from behind the gate (this bit is key). I contacted the PCSO for advice as I was starting to get quite concerned about being there in the dark on my own (I was usually there alone), they took it very seriously and sent a police officer round to my house the next day to take a statement.

The police said that because some of the weird behaviour had happened whilst he was on the road side of the gate they were able to get involved, and wanted information about everything he'd done on the property too. It turned out that he had a habit of fixating on lone women and the police were desperate to be able to arrest and charge him, but he seemed to know just how far he could go. A harassment order was served on him which meant he couldn't approach or talk to me, and it did eventually solve the problem (he broke it once and needed to be threatened with arrest).

The man you are having trouble with may already be known to the police, and they won't mind you at least asking for advice on how to deal with him/the situation.
		
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Gosh how scary!

I will admit that our yard is quite spooky at night in winter.  The yard part is lit but the walk to the muck heap and my fields is in pitch blackness and the public footpath heads that way so I often encounter random people in the dark on my own.
I first met this strange man with the sharpei last winter, as it was going dark, by my field gateway.  He was letting his dog circle and bark at my horses while I was trying to get them in and when I asked him to move them, he gave me the “she’s going to die one day” party line that he still uses today.  I remember thinking he was odd then…

The dog is actually really sweet and I don’t think it would harm a horse, it’s just curious, but its curiosity could cause an accident and I just can’t get that through to the man at all.

Annoyingly it has made me a bit wary of hacking Polly out that way now, because I can’t trust her as much as I can Millie.  Millie will stand solid while this thing is under her legs, but I can’t say the same for Polly, she’d try to kill it and then god knows what would happen. Fortunately we have paths the other way to ride, but it is frustrating.


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## fiwen30 (11 September 2022)

Pearlsasinger said:



			I would report that to whatever the NI equivalent of RSPCA is.
		
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I’ve put in a report with the USPCA, but given that shocks collars aren’t illegal here, I doubt it’ll come to much. I just feel so sad for the poor dog, it spends all it’s days being ignored, and then gets a shock collar slapped on it because its self-amusement behaviour is ‘annoying’.


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## cauda equina (11 September 2022)

Makes you wonder why some people have a dog at all


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## Cinnamontoast (11 September 2022)

Glad to say we did not meet any irresponsible owners today, just the biggest gsd I have ever seen, all black, very friendly ’here is my bum’ type and the owners wanted to chat. Goose is just not very interested in other dogs, Mitch was intimidated by its size, but it was totally calm and reassured him, basically. Bear had a sniff, I’m ecstatic he’s gone back to being neutral/unbothered.


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## Caol Ila (16 September 2022)

Tonight's award goes to.....

The proud owner of two cockapoodle things who saw our horses and raced towards them, barking like mad barky things. Owner stood back shouting uselessly. One of the dogs nipped at Fin's heel, and he threw a kick. Not a panicked kick, but very much a "get tae f**ck, mate" kick. How would you say that in Doric? Can anyone from Aberdeenshire answer? Anyway, owner somehow got his dogs back and went off ahead of us. Did he put them on a lead? Of course not! Why would he do that?

The trails go in loops in the park, so we encountered cockapoo man again. Were the dogs on a lead? Obviously not. They ran up to us, barking, and I waved my dressage whip in an angry manner to keep them away from Fin's back end. Maybe I should have been less aggressive and let fate play out. If the pony had booted the dog into next week, its owner might have learned to put his bloody animals on a lead. Surely you don't need to be bloody Monty Roberts to see that the horse has tried kicking your dog once that day.


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## CorvusCorax (16 September 2022)

We had a poo type run at us tonight while owner screeched at it (NAME, COME HERE - one useless command and an ignored double command ), her friend's one was throttling itself on a leash. Was able to nip through a gap in the hedge, I had the old boy and he won't do much these days apart from growl.
The young one would have gone straight into bitey-face mode.


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## YorksG (16 September 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			We had a poo type run at us tonight while owner screeched at it (NAME, COME HERE - one useless command and an ignored double command ), her friend's one was throttling itself on a leash. Was able to nip through a gap in the hedge, I had the old boy and he won't do much these days apart from growl.
The young one would have gone straight into bitey-face mode.
		
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Is it that the poo things are innately difficult to train, or that their owners are more likely to be numpties, does anyone know?


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## Caol Ila (16 September 2022)

YorksG said:



			Is it that the poo things are innately difficult to train, or that their owners are more likely to be numpties, does anyone know?
		
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No clue, but my last whinging post on this thread was about a different poo thing. There is clearly a pattern.


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## CorvusCorax (16 September 2022)

Combination of drives, genetics/breeding and (this is a generalisation!) their popularity with first time or novice dog owners, IME.


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## Caol Ila (17 September 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			Combination of drives, genetics/breeding and (this is a generalisation!) their popularity with first time or novice dog owners, IME.
		
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What’s in the genetics/breeding that makes them awkward?


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## CorvusCorax (17 September 2022)

Caol Ila said:



			What’s in the genetics/breeding that makes them awkward?
		
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Not awkward per se but just both breed traits can lend themselves to being high in hunt/chase drive and a bit of independence/working away from the handler, these things don't make for lightning recall without good training.


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## asmp (17 September 2022)

Caol Ila said:



			Tonight's award goes to.....

The proud owner of two cockapoodle things who saw our horses and raced towards them, barking like mad barky things. Owner stood back shouting uselessly. One of the dogs nipped at Fin's heel, and he threw a kick. Not a panicked kick, but very much a "get tae f**ck, mate" kick. How would you say that in Doric? Can anyone from Aberdeenshire answer? Anyway, owner somehow got his dogs back and went off ahead of us. Did he put them on a lead? Of course not! Why would he do that?

The trails go in loops in the park, so we encountered cockapoo man again. Were the dogs on a lead? Obviously not. They ran up to us, barking, and I waved my dressage whip in an angry manner to keep them away from Fin's back end. Maybe I should have been less aggressive and let fate play out. If the pony had booted the dog into next week, its owner might have learned to put his bloody animals on a lead. Surely you don't need to be bloody Monty Roberts to see that the horse has tried kicking your dog once that day.
		
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I just shout loudly that my horse will kick your dog (he will).  He surprised me the other day by striking out with his fore leg at a rabbit that ran in front of him while out hacking.

I assume I’m not allowed to post pics from someone else’s FB site but have just seen on a local site a photo of a horse that has stitches all down its side with two drainage tubes after a dog attack in its field.  😮


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## rabatsa (17 September 2022)

Here it is the poo dog that keeps getting attacked by the neighbours muts.  Both times the fluffy one has been on lead.  The first attack was by the two ridgebacks, the one this week was by the jack russell.  Neighbours dogs do not even wear collars and have zilch recal to the lady owner but do not put a toe out of line with the man.

In both cases the neighbours dogs have gone a couple of hundred yards from their yard where they have been out unsupervised and with no gates shut.


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## Amymay (17 September 2022)

@rabatsa 😢😢

Have you reported the attacks?


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## Arzada (17 September 2022)

YorksG said:



			Is it that the poo things are innately difficult to train, or that their owners are more likely to be numpties, does anyone know?
		
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We have an 'oodle' as a neighbour. He arrived during lockdown as a puppy. I didn't enjoy his puppyhood when we didn't need our alarm clocks thanks to him waking the neighbourhood. Though thinking back he had a rather cute puppy high pitched 'oof' before he learned to increase the volume. He is now a very well behaved dog both at home and out and about and we rarely hear him nowadays. His sane sensible owners are both teachers and have spent time training him.


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## SilverLinings (17 September 2022)

YorksG said:



			Is it that the poo things are innately difficult to train, or that their owners are more likely to be numpties, does anyone know?
		
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Based on the large number of them near where I live (still an admittedly small sample size ) they are commonly bought by novice owners, the sort who don't want a tiny thing like a chi or a french bulldog, but are still heavily influenced by what breeds are 'in fashion' and what their friends own, rather than what breed would suit them/their lifestyle (or indeed whether they can actually provide a good home for a dog). 

There are six that I see on a regular basis - all different owners - and five were bought since the start of the pandemic. Only one of them has been taught any manners (she actually appears to be very well trained), the rest of the owners have absolutely no idea, and just aimlessly call the dog's name whilst being ignored by said dog. The two who live on my road I worry about on a regular basis as 90% of the time the owners open their front doors the dogs run straight out onto the road and don't want to come back; funnily enough they don't appear to be taken for walks very often. The road is quiet, but it will only take one car for a disaster, and the owners don't seem to be particularly bothered 

A few years ago there were a couple of cockerpoos in my agility training group and they did very well with an aim and an outlet for their energy. They were definitely as high energy as my cockers, so I don't think it's a breed for owners who think a walk every weekend with the family is enough*.

* for the record, I don't think that's enough for any breed, but it turns the more high-energy ones into a bigger nightmare.


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## rabatsa (17 September 2022)

Amymay said:



@rabatsa 😢😢

Have you reported the attacks?
		
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No.  

The mad prof is very good with words and after the ridgeback incident when asked if he wanted the dogs putting down his reply was no, he wanted the neighbours to be responsible dog owners.  Since then things have much improved and the dogs do not wander at will anymore.

Both when they have invaded my yard and this time up the lane they have been under Mrs neighbours control, which is nil.  I am sure that the mad prof will have serious things to say to them.

If I personally witnessed the attacks on the small dogs then report I will, I only get told about them afterwards.  Two chihuahua, a jack russell and the mad prof's cavapoo have all given the neighbours the vet bills.  One of the chihuahuas was several visits for a wound on its back that would not heal.  Unfortunately the neighbours believe that they can buy their way out of trouble.

Worse they keep breeding from their bitches, as the ridgebacks have won in the show ring.  The jr's mum, which got killed by their other dogs, was the most badly conformed beastie going.


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## CorvusCorax (21 September 2022)

Another classic of the genre.

Met a friend in the park. Their dog was attacked a few weeks ago.
To my mind, first mistake was made when dog was allowed to ride up front and look out window so was already in wrong frame of mind as had seen lots of other strange dogs and was already on his toes.
Not long out, man gets out of car with cocker. It locks on to friend's dog.
Man turns it and POINTS IN THE OTHER DIRECTION THEN LETS IT OFF LEAD.
It of course comes running back over barking and friend's dog gets very stressed so I go at the cocker and say AH-AH! and every time it comes near other dog I go into it's space again.
Owner is as much use as a wet sock and just keeps saying it's name over and over, which is ignored and telling me 'it's OK'. It finally thinks better of barking at me and runs off back to him.
They disappear around corner, we hear more barking. It comes back later on a lead.
Fully expect to turn up on the local town Facebook page as the dog-abusing harridan.

So then I get my dog out. Suddenly there are three tiny white things in coats at the back of my van, barking at my dog. She's not a big fan of this scenario. I'm having to hold her up as she stands on her hind legs like Aleksandr the Meerkat.
My friend and the couple who 'own' them then do a Marx Brothers-style sketch to try and round them up, at no point do they try to, you know, put a lead on any of them. A tennis ball goes ignored. I say FUKKINELL quite a lot while Meerkat Wrangling and they say 'sorry about that'.
On the plus side she then worked really well.

My friend and I watched countless people pull up in a car park, pop their boots and just let their dogs jump out with no leads and no recall before they were even out of the car themselves sometimes, and not even **looking** for any potential moving vehicles, other dogs, young kids etc.
I just....don't think I could do that do a dog I liked?!


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## SaddlePsych'D (21 September 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			Fully expect to turn up on the local town Facebook page as the dog-abusing harridan.
		
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I feel like this is going to happen to me sooner or later! 

It's been a while since I've done it as I lost my nerve when we moved house but I pulled out my 'stop hand' and shouted no at a dog yesterday in a way I think might have made two completely unrelated people sit up and listen , they were just chilling out in the field no dogs with them. I'd tried the 'ignore and just walk on' while calling out 'no thank you' to this dog and another dogs owner as they both came over uninvited. Saw the one owner again in another field on my way back to the car so made my very clear manoeuvre to the other hedge line to put as much space between us as possible and guess what...bloke meanders into the middle of the space and his dog runs over to us again. So it got shouted at. I did also swear a bit 'I said no the first fecking time!' because I am just so fed up right now of struggling to find easy walks in green spaces where we can just enjoy each others' company, being in nature, decompression for us both, and not have various uninvited/unwanted interactions.


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## BBP (22 September 2022)

Just watched a man forced to walk his tiny little fluffy white dog out into a busy high street road to avoid it getting its head ripped off by a massive raging Akita that was barely being contained by two grown humans. I was genuinely terrified for small dog either being hit by a car or if the Akita broke loose from its collar and grabbed it.

My dog is also reactive so I feel for the owners, but I would have taken steps to get my dog away from small fluffy.


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## Karran (23 September 2022)

English Setter followed mine for 15 minutes tonight, taking turns to try and hump both mine until Mrs Collie showed him her teeth and then just zoned in on Mrs Spaniel who is far too shy to do anything other than close eyes and ears and hope it goes away.
I shooed it away a couple of times but it followed us and even tried to get in the car with us.
I mistakenly thought it belonged to two teenagers who appeared 5 minutes later but they were just lost and a bit gormless in general.
Dog had no tag and I wasn't sure what to do with him. (We don't have a dog warden locally). Didn't particularly want him in my car to drop off at vets to microchip either as no way of separating him from my two in transport.
Was going to just hang out with him and a ball/treats for a bit longer in case an owner came panting up the hill when he turned sharply and disappeared through bushes. 
I'm a bit Deaf after covid so assumed he had heard his owner and went back to find her.
I was just about to get back in my car when a woman with a cockerpoo asked me if I'd seen it.
It wasn't hers but a woman nowhere near us had lost it.
I walked up to her, told her where it has been 
"Impossible he was with me at X point"
"Well yes but he met me at Y point and I lost him at Z point so I suggest you retrace your steps as he will be and loop back around both points."
"Oh my this is ridiculous. I wish you'd just done the responsible thing and held on to him for me."
I was pretty annoyed at this point, told her it wasn't my responsibility to teach it recall and walked off, I retraced my steps along the path where it met us and then back to where it left us where I bumped into Cockerpoo owner again.
I asked her if it had been spotted and she said no.
I feel really guilty that the dog is now lost and that I should have held its collar and waited(?) For nearly 20 minutes for an owner to appear. 
I looped around again, meeting Cockerpoo owner who still hadn't seen it and gave up and went home.
Setter owner was still where I saw her last (another 15/20 minutes later) calling for him.
I wound down my window, suggested again she goes back to where she last saw him and that I'd looked for him.
"Well this is all your fault, for losing him. (Yes really!) You should be helping me look for Setter."

I really do feel guilty and responsible and hope he blunders out of a Bush to her and if she hadn't been rude I'd have stayed and helped her find him but I was so annoyed I just left.


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## CorvusCorax (23 September 2022)

Don't feel guilty, it's not your problem and I would have put my boot up it's backside if it had tried to hump my dogs, never mind babysit it.
Cheeky cow.


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## SaddlePsych'D (23 September 2022)

Karran said:



			English Setter followed mine for 15 minutes tonight, taking turns to try and hump both mine until Mrs Collie showed him her teeth and then just zoned in on Mrs Spaniel who is far too shy to do anything other than close eyes and ears and hope it goes away.
I shooed it away a couple of times but it followed us and even tried to get in the car with us.
I mistakenly thought it belonged to two teenagers who appeared 5 minutes later but they were just lost and a bit gormless in general.
Dog had no tag and I wasn't sure what to do with him. (We don't have a dog warden locally). Didn't particularly want him in my car to drop off at vets to microchip either as no way of separating him from my two in transport.
Was going to just hang out with him and a ball/treats for a bit longer in case an owner came panting up the hill when he turned sharply and disappeared through bushes.
I'm a bit Deaf after covid so assumed he had heard his owner and went back to find her.
I was just about to get back in my car when a woman with a cockerpoo asked me if I'd seen it.
It wasn't hers but a woman nowhere near us had lost it.
I walked up to her, told her where it has been
"Impossible he was with me at X point"
"Well yes but he met me at Y point and I lost him at Z point so I suggest you retrace your steps as he will be and loop back around both points."
"Oh my this is ridiculous. I wish you'd just done the responsible thing and held on to him for me."
I was pretty annoyed at this point, told her it wasn't my responsibility to teach it recall and walked off, I retraced my steps along the path where it met us and then back to where it left us where I bumped into Cockerpoo owner again.
I asked her if it had been spotted and she said no.
I feel really guilty that the dog is now lost and that I should have held its collar and waited(?) For nearly 20 minutes for an owner to appear.
I looped around again, meeting Cockerpoo owner who still hadn't seen it and gave up and went home.
Setter owner was still where I saw her last (another 15/20 minutes later) calling for him.
I wound down my window, suggested again she goes back to where she last saw him and that I'd looked for him.
"Well this is all your fault, for losing him. (Yes really!) You should be helping me look for Setter."

I really do feel guilty and responsible and hope he blunders out of a Bush to her and if she hadn't been rude I'd have stayed and helped her find him but I was so annoyed I just left.
		
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What on earth?! 

Definitely no guilt on your part. Her dog, her responsibility. Projection much?!


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## Karran (23 September 2022)

SaddlePsych'D said:



			What on earth?!

Definitely no guilt on your part. Her dog, her responsibility. Projection much?!
		
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Cockerpoo owner said as much on our 3rd meeting. She was elderly and walking slowly so said if she met it on that loop she'd return it. Her little dog was an absolute darling and completely Well behaved and attentive to make sure he didn't outstride her. If only others could be as responsible!


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## blackcob (23 September 2022)

Apart from anything else how does she know you were in a position to hang on to the bloody thing if you had wanted to? Having been followed and humped my dog would be frothing at it, and who among us carries a spare lead unless you're near enough to the car.


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## Cinnamontoast (23 September 2022)

Just considering Zak’s reaction if I caught and held onto a loose dog 😱 I love English setters 😍


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## GSD Woman (24 September 2022)

YorksG said:



			Is it that the poo things are innately difficult to train, or that their owners are more likely to be numpties, does anyone know?
		
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Owners are more likely to be numpties.  Seems to be the way of the "designer" dog owners.


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## Smitty (24 September 2022)

Perhaps if the stupid owner had put a tag on the collar, which is a legal requirement, you could have rung her and told her where her effing dog was.   Alternatively, you could have just driven off with it, sold it and been in pocket instead of instead of having to deal with her selfish dimness.


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## Pearlsasinger (24 September 2022)

Must be something about English setters, or their owners! Last week when we took our Labs to a country park, we had 2 separate pairs of ES come up to us and take no notice whatsoever of their owners trying to call them back. The 2nd pair were fat, too!


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## Clodagh (24 September 2022)

Oh I want an English setter, my mum used to work them on the moors. If someone can grab me a bitch I’ll give them a fiver?


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## skinnydipper (24 September 2022)

Owners who can't see that their dog is asking for space.

People who can't see that someone else's dog is asking for space

Owners of lame, grossly obese dogs who think they don't need to lose any weight.


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## ArklePig (24 September 2022)

A friend of mine was walking her dachshund on the beach on lead (you know, being responsible as beach busy and recall not great) and they were approached and harassed by 3 GSPs. She said 'sorry you couldn't call your dog please?' and apparently the owner just kept saying 'come here, come here' in monotone and was unable to catch them until they lost interest. Honestly if you've one dog with bad recall keep it away from distractions, but 3! Christ alive.


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## Cinnamontoast (24 September 2022)

Pearlsasinger said:



			Must be something about English setters, or their owners! Last week when we took our Labs to a country park, we had 2 separate pairs of ES come up to us and take no notice whatsoever of their owners trying to call them back. The 2nd pair were fat, too!
		
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Few and far between when I looked for a litter-two based in Ireland.



Clodagh said:



			Oh I want an English setter, my mum used to work them on the moors. If someone can grab me a bitch I’ll give them a fiver?
		
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Ha, you’ll be lucky! My OH refused to contemplate one when I showed him a litter. He said ‘they look funny’. I think he meant they don’t look like springers 🤣


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## Cinnamontoast (24 September 2022)

ArklePig said:



			A friend of mine was walking her dachshund on the beach on lead (you know, being responsible as beach busy and recall not great) and they were approached and harassed by 3 GSPs. She said 'sorry you couldn't call your dog please?' and apparently the owner just kept saying 'come here, come here' in monotone and was unable to catch them until they lost interest. Honestly if you've one dog with bad recall keep it away from distractions, but 3! Christ alive.
		
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Utter nightmare. I’m delighted to say that Mitch now just walks away from other dogs. Goose doesn’t care, Bear is too busy crashing through cover to care.


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## Pearlsasinger (24 September 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			Few and far between when I looked for a litter-two based in Ireland.



Ha, you’ll be lucky! My OH refused to contemplate one when I showed him a litter. He said ‘they look funny’. I think he meant they don’t look like springers 🤣
		
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I was surprised to see them tbh.  We sometimes see a group of people with a number of all 3 breeds of Setters, which are well-behaved and mannerly, all playing together but these 2 pairs appeared to be completely separate from each other and both had irresponsible owners.  When I was growing up there used to be an ES which lived about a mile from the centre of the village, regularly escaped from home and came to visit our house.  I was told later that ES were easier to train than IS!


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## Cinnamontoast (24 September 2022)

Pearlsasinger said:



			I was surprised to see them tbh.  We sometimes see a group of people with a number of all 3 breeds of Setters, which are well-behaved and mannerly, all playing together but these 2 pairs appeared to be completely separate from each other and both had irresponsible owners.  When I was growing up there used to be an ES which lived about a mile from the centre of the village, regularly escaped from home and came to visit our house.  I was told later that ES were easier to train than IS!
		
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Lots of breeders on Champdogs-been down a mini internet wormhole-but no puppies available.


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## GSD Woman (25 September 2022)

Give me an Irish red and white or a Gordon over the other 2 any day! Though friends of my family have always had nice IS and theirs have always been nice dogs.


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## Caol Ila (25 September 2022)

Clodagh said:



			Oh I want an English setter, my mum used to work them on the moors. If someone can grab me a bitch I’ll give them a fiver?
		
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I could have got you one the other week. No idea what sex it was, though. A setter, all on its lonesome, charged past my horse in the park. Running flat-out. Luckily it paid no attention whatsoever to me. About five minutes later, a woman asked me if I had seen a brown English setter. Yes, legging it in the opposite direction at a rate of knots. Good luck catching that.


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## GSD Woman (25 September 2022)

Clodagh said:



			Oh I want an English setter, my mum used to work them on the moors. If someone can grab me a bitch I’ll give them a fiver?
		
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You missed a great deal in my local paper.  A hunter crossed his field English and Gordon.  His aim was good dogs for shooting.  I bet I could have grabbed one for you.  How it would get to you would have been your problem. ;-)


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## Cinnamontoast (26 September 2022)

Ireland is your go to for an English setter.


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## CorvusCorax (26 September 2022)

There is/was an excellent breeder in Shopshire but I don't think they really advertise.


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## Clodagh (27 September 2022)

Thank you but I wouldn’t really get one. I don’t do enough on moors to justify it.


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## fiwen30 (27 September 2022)

Partner’s parent’s 13ish year old golden continues to make me sad.

He came home after visiting them on Sunday afternoon, all sad himself - his mum had told him how the golden hadn’t eaten all day, hadn’t got out of his bed, and had generally been down all day. When partner came in, the golden perked up and was very visibly pleased to see him.

I said that sounds very sad, and that I had some thoughts about that, if he wanted to hear them. He agreed. I very carefully said that it sounds like the golden is in pain, and that his parents could really do with covering the vast swathes of slippy laminate floors that the dog slides around on, on his increasingly unsteady back end. I said that it’s a shame that the golden is uncomfortable, when it could be managed better than it is currently - not just head shaking over ‘how sad’ it is.

Partner didn’t like to hear it, which I expected. I don’t think he believes that it’s untrue, more the fact that it’s his ‘family dog’, but that he’s not able to have any decision in its care or treatments, as it lives with his parents.

I think he’s starting to more clearly see the differences in how I insist that my senior dog is managed, compared to his parents. It’s a shame, all round.


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## Clodagh (27 September 2022)

@fiwen30 . It’s scarily common though. Relatives of mine are very proud of how long lived their dogs are. They are also very anti vets and repeat medications. So their elderly dogs are visibly suffering, they have one now that lies in its own mess as it can barely stand. But they love him so much that it’s ok.


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## AShetlandBitMeOnce (27 September 2022)

fiwen30 said:



			Partner’s parent’s 13ish year old golden continues to make me sad.

He came home after visiting them on Sunday afternoon, all sad himself - his mum had told him how the golden hadn’t eaten all day, hadn’t got out of his bed, and had generally been down all day. When partner came in, the golden perked up and was very visibly pleased to see him.

I said that sounds very sad, and that I had some thoughts about that, if he wanted to hear them. He agreed. I very carefully said that it sounds like the golden is in pain, and that his parents could really do with covering the vast swathes of slippy laminate floors that the dog slides around in on his increasingly unsteady back end. I said that it’s a shame that the golden is uncomfortable, when it could be managed better than it is currently - not just head shaking over ‘how sad’ it is.

Partner didn’t like to hear it, which I expected. I don’t think he believes that it’s untrue, more the fact that it’s his ‘family dog’, but that he’s not able to have any decision in its care or treatments, as it lives with his parents.

I think he’s starting to more clearly see the differences in how I insist that my senior dog is managed, compared to his parents. It’s a shame, all round.
		
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I know just how hard this is, I had a similar problem with mum and our 23yo cat in that she would do everything to help like steps up to the sofa, carry her feed to her and various medication etc but the cat was visibly in significant pain and mum would say 'oh she's just old and stiff' or 'she still eats and drinks'. I had to do a couple of tough love speeches like 'do you really want the 'x' to be in such pain that she stops eating' and things like that, and then gently but persistently ask for her to be taken to a vet at least to assess; as it's an impartial and professional opinion - plus I think the fact our other 23yo cat is in perfect health wasn't helping as "therefore 'x' must be okay if her sister still is". She was PTS a  few weeks ago once mum had thought it through and the vet had supported that it was the right thing to do here. Sometimes people aren't willing to see, sometimes people 'love them too much', and sometimes people get used to a behaviour over time and don't see how bad it is. It;s a really tough place to be in and I don't envy you, but sometimes you have to be the bad guy as you have found out!


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## fiwen30 (27 September 2022)

Clodagh said:



@fiwen30 . It’s scarily common though. Relatives of mine are very proud of how long lived their dogs are. They are also very anti vets and repeat medications. So their elderly dogs are visibly suffering, they have one now that lies in its own mess as it can barely stand. But they love him so much that it’s ok.
		
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It’s such a shame, and really upsetting. Active ageing seems so rarely discussed in some circles, especially in owners who have always brought up animals in a certain way.

I know I can’t force his parents to do anything, and I know that, deep down, partner knows as well as I do - he’s learnt alongside me, while we care for and manage our senior boy. He’s powerless to do anything about it too, or at least not able to bring up the subject with them, in a constructive manner.

It’s just such a shame that the dog isn’t getting the adaptions and support that it needs in it’s old age. And it would be so simple - his parents aren’t hard off. They could afford to medicate the golden to keep it comfortable for these last years, they could cover the slippy floors, they could teach the dog how to use the ramp we lent them (and replaced out of pocket) so it could get in and out of the car, they could manage the dog’s exercise better and not run it ragged so it can’t move for the rest of the day. Say nothing for them also being retired and time-rich for things like massage, heat therapy, and hydro sessions.

I’d go to the moon for my dog, and will never understand why others would could, won’t.


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## CorvusCorax (27 September 2022)

I mean we've had the conversation on here about management on multiple occasions, I recall a poster getting very irate when I suggested running young dogs ragged even though they LOVE IT would store up problems in later life.
Having my older dogs with me is a privilege and I owe it to them to try and keep them sound, fit and as pain free as possible.
The day I have to heavily medicate them to keep them mobile is the day I have to have a word with myself about the future and I think I've made my feelings clear on dogs that cannot toilet themselves or get up without assistance.

I consider my dogs athletes but I do think a lot of pet dogs seem to have a heavier 'workload'.
It boggles my mind that on a forum where people painstakingly observe their horse's fitness and weight, the same consideration is sometimes sadly not afforded to dogs.

ETA: being slightly more charitable 
On the flipside I do find people from horsey backgrounds that move into dog sports are more into developing fitness and are aware of the importance of warm up and cool down etc.


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## blackcob (27 September 2022)

You've reminded me that the 'Christmas clear out' - an uptick in elective euthanasia around Christmas time - used to get to me a bit. I know there's debate in veterinary circles as to whether it is a real phenomenon, or if it's just looking for patterns around that time of year to reinforce belief in it as a thing. It did seem to be a thing that relatives coming home for Christmas who hadn't seen the animal in months would be the ones to point out just how much the dog had deteriorated, the pre-emptive shame of 'what will son/daughter think' forced owners into taking action, or the realisation dawned that the dog was now too poorly to travel or go into kennels.

Often went hand in hand with some weekend warrior stuff as well, demanding NSAIDs that the dog hadn't received in the previous 12 months because visiting relatives wanted to go out for a lengthy walk and repetitive ball-chuck and the dog can't move the following day.


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## fiwen30 (27 September 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			I consider my dogs athletes but I do think a lot of pet dogs seem to have a heavier 'workload'.
It boggles my mind that on a forum where people painstakingly observe their horse's fitness and weight, the same consideration is sometimes sadly not afforded to dogs.
		
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Absolutely this. A large part of managing my senior dog is paying close attention to how I ‘work’ him, in order to maintain his fitness and build small, realistic, improvements where possible. He is not an athlete, never has been, but I owe it to him to take care of his body as it needs more management in older age.

His ‘work’ is not strenuous, but it’s being mindful of his stamina, and doing things like walking down hills to not jar joints, trotting uphill to strengthen legs and back end, making sure he’s doing a quality, 4-beat collected walk, not ambling along with both ends disjointed and tripping or twisting his back. He’s allowed to slow down, stop, and sniff, for as long as he likes on walks; but he also has his fast speeds capped so he doesn’t overdo it, and has all his gaits managed so he’s placing his feet and using his body properly, just as I would for getting a horse fit.


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## GSD Woman (27 September 2022)

Clodagh said:



			. It’s scarily common though. Relatives of mine are very proud of how long lived their dogs are. They are also very anti vets and repeat medications. So their elderly dogs are visibly suffering, they have one now that lies in its own mess as it can barely stand. But they love him so much that it’s ok.
		
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That is so sad.
I have relatives that have said they want their animals to die on their own so that they don't have to put them down. Others have wanted ME to take their dogs to the vet to be put down. 

I have an old dog that I have to be careful about how much he does.  When we work on getting him back in shape we do more walking than running after tennis balls.
He is on carprofen twice a day and it has made a huge difference for him.  If it hadn't I would have had to think long and hard.


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## splashgirl45 (27 September 2022)

It’s so sad when people are selfish about their dogs.  Some people would have kept my dogs going but I wasn’t prepared to let them have painful investigations or operations when they were old.  I have never regretted my decisions to PTS but miss them every day.  it’s hard to let them go but IMO it’s the right thing to do


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## CorvusCorax (27 September 2022)

I am so bloody cross.

Currently trying to help home a smashing dog I have put a lot of work into, because dickheads keep allowing their dogs to run up to him, he (always on leash) has a go back and owner has lost all confidence.
He lives across the road from the park where I had that total cluster a week ago.
Beautiful dog, great with people and fine with other dogs he knows/neutral dogs, but just one incident too many for a young person who's nerves are shot to pieces because of absolute tosspots and has decided the dog would be better off somewhere else.

Yeah, I wish people would think about that when they unclip their leash and think little Fluffy is 'jUsT beInG a dOG'....


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## skinnydipper (28 September 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			Owners of lame, grossly obese dogs who think they don't need to lose any weight.
		
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So, ignore all the signs that the poor dog is in pain and wait until he is hobbling before finally seeking veterinary advice.

Don't  leash walk, because he will run around just as much on his extending lead. Leave him off leash (see excuse) and let him try to run with his mates and exacerbate the problem, that's a good idea .

Stop the Metacam after 2 weeks because you don't want the dog to get used to it. FFS it doesn't work like that.

This is doing my head in. I'll have to walk somewhere else.


PSA, for the benefit of dogs.

Learn to recognise when your dog is in pain:

Facial tension
Panting
Lowered tail
Appears stiff
Slow getting up and lying down
Hesitant to go up and down stairs
Reluctant to jump in/out of the car
Playing less
Walking slower
Lazy sit
Unwilling to be touched
Signs of aggression

See your vet.  Get a diagnosis.

If a dog is in pain he deserves appropriate evidence-based pain relief.

Arthritis can cause 3 different types of pain - inflammatory joint pain, muscle and myofascial pain, neuropathic pain/central sensitisation, and therefore could need treatment with a combination of 3 types of medication.

If something exacerbates the problem - jumping out of car, stairs, running after a ball, whatever, then for FFS stop him doing it.

Young dogs can have arthritic joints, they deserve  treatment too.


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## Morwenna (28 September 2022)

I recently got into an argument with a lab owner who walks their 12 week old pup for 40 minutes twice a day as “it’s the only way to tire him out and stop him biting but he’s just getting worse so I’m going to up it to an hour twice a day”. Apparently I’m the bad owner as I don’t even walk mine every day (we do other things instead).


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## CorvusCorax (28 September 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			So, ignore all the signs that the poor dog is in pain and wait until he is hobbling before finally seeking veterinary advice.

Don't  leash walk, because he will run around just as much on his extending lead. Leave him off leash (see excuse) and let him try to run with his mates and exacerbate the problem, that's a good idea .

Stop the Metacam after 2 weeks because you don't want the dog to get used to it. FFS it doesn't work like that.

This is doing my head in. I'll have to walk somewhere else.


PSA, for the benefit of dogs.

Learn to recognise when your dog is in pain:

Facial tension
Panting
Lowered tail
Appears stiff
Slow getting up and lying down
Hesitant to go up and down stairs
Reluctant to jump in/out of the car
Playing less
Walking slower
Lazy sit
Unwilling to be touched
Signs of aggression

See your vet.  Get a diagnosis.

If a dog is in pain he deserves appropriate evidence-based pain relief.

Arthritis can cause 3 different types of pain - inflammatory joint pain, muscle and myofascial pain, neuropathic pain/central sensitisation, and therefore could need treatment with a combination of 3 types of medication.

If something exacerbates the problem - jumping out of car, stairs, running after a ball, whatever, then for FFS stop him doing it.

Young dogs can have arthritic joints, they deserve  treatment too.
		
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Amen.


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## CorvusCorax (28 September 2022)

Morwenna said:



			I recently got into an argument with a lab owner who walks their 12 week old pup for 40 minutes twice a day as “it’s the only way to tire him out and stop him biting but he’s just getting worse so I’m going to up it to an hour twice a day”. Apparently I’m the bad owner as I don’t even walk mine every day (we do other things instead).
		
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I know people who did this with their GSD pup and his elbows ended up looking like a Jackson Pollock painting.


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## Errin Paddywack (28 September 2022)

Some years back I used to regularly see someone cycling with a very young GSD and not slowly either.  Poor dog.


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## CorvusCorax (28 September 2022)

I do (did, lazy bitch lol) bike mine but not until at least 18mo and hips and elbow x-rays already taken.


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## Errin Paddywack (28 September 2022)

Nothing wrong with that as long as dog old enough and yours is.  This pup would have been no more than about 5 months.


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## GSD Woman (28 September 2022)

This is so timely.  Last night I had a CE webcast on OA.  The presenter went over things that can contribute to the problem. Achondroplastic( blanking on the term so I hope that is correct spelling) conformation, too rapid of growth, being overweight, inappropriate exercise.  These were some of the top reasons for OA.


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## Cinnamontoast (28 September 2022)

I sometimes see a Shiba Inu on the drive home. It’s very stiff, obviously struggling. Today the owner seemed to be almost holding it up-standard collar and lead (really slow traffic today). I’m hoping it’s being walked gently on vet’s advice, but omg, it looked fed up today. 😢

I sometimes see an incredibly obese staffie, teats hanging, they’ve obviously had a litter or more off her in the past. She can hardly move, it breaks my heart. I worry when Bear is a kilo overweight, I don’t know how a dog gets to look like that-zero exercise, maybe a health issue (trying to be fair, I have no idea of her history)? I’m always in the car when I see her.


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## CorvusCorax (28 September 2022)

It's generally too much/the wrong food. Even for dogs that do a lot of running around.


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## P3LH (28 September 2022)

Whenever i see semi immobile dogs it breaks my heart when I think of my lovely rough last year - I couldn’t imagine having him still here hobbling and dragging himself around. As much as I wish I still had him.


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## Cinnamontoast (28 September 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			It's generally too much/the wrong food. Even for dogs that do a lot of running around.
		
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That’s what I figure, it’s normally too much food.

Bear’s dropped a kilo recently, I weigh his food and he’s decided following the pups is fun. I’m enjoying watching them run together.


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## CrunchieBoi (28 September 2022)

Our young boy has put on a bit over the past 2 weeks because we've struggled to do off-lead walks with him and haven't really adjusted his food accordingly. 

He still looks positively slim compared to half the dogs I see in the city.


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## GSD Woman (29 September 2022)

A vet that I no longer use for various reasons told me that one of my dogs was a bit thin.  I looked at him and said the dog is a performance dog and that most pet dogs are overweight.  He had to agree I was right.

When I teach obedience classes where there is jumping I insist that the dogs be appropriate weight and I don't care what the vet told them.  If I can't easily feel ribs those dogs aren't jumping.


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## CorvusCorax (29 September 2022)

My Mum has always let dogs run to fat (food = love) and therefore I've never had am overweight dog - as I have seen how many associated health issues can develop.


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## YorksG (29 September 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			My Mum has always let dogs run to fat (food = love) and therefore I've never had am overweight dog - as I have seen how many associated health issues can develop.
		
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When we were kids both parents were very strict about not feeding the dog/ dogs anything that was not dog food. Their labs were fit healthy animals, however the two they got after just mum and dad were at home, were fat! They were show bred and fed god only knows what rubbish and had toast and bacon every morning from parents plates😱. Parents would not be told that their dogs were fat, needless to say none of ours have ever been fat.


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## fiwen30 (30 September 2022)

I’m in a WhatsApp group with a bunch of about 20 colleagues who started at the same time. I’m friendly with most of them, but don’t post in the group.

A girl from another team had a female golden cocker spaniel, about 2 years old, and then picked up another female golden cocker of about the same age from the pound, a few months ago.

I’ve been keeping away from conversations about them, since I heard that the two had started out by fighting, before eventually ‘quieting down’.

This girl posted a short video clip in the group chat of one of the dogs, where the cocker is backed against a wall and showing a whale eye, and the girl is saying BAD DOG and pointing a finger at it. The dog then lunges towards her hand, and when she screams, the dog then stands off, barking at her.

I just can’t even.


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## CorvusCorax (30 September 2022)

And then the dog will bite her and it will get put to sleep or moved on.

As an aside, I can't abide pointing at dogs, it's often one of the first things I have to stamp out with new people.


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## Pearlsasinger (30 September 2022)

fiwen30 said:



			I’m in a WhatsApp group with a bunch of about 20 colleagues who started at the same time. I’m friendly with most of them, but don’t post in the group.

A girl from another team had a female golden cocker spaniel, about 2 years old, and then picked up another female golden cocker of about the same age from the pound, a few months ago.

I’ve been keeping away from conversations about them, since I heard that the two had started out by fighting, before eventually ‘quieting down’.

This girl posted a short video clip in the group chat of one of the dogs, where the cocker is backed against a wall and showing a whale eye, and the girl is saying BAD DOG and pointing a finger at it. The dog then lunges towards her hand, and when she screams, the dog then stands off, barking at her.

I just can’t even.
		
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Just why!


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## Titchy Pony (30 September 2022)

fiwen30 said:



			I’m in a WhatsApp group with a bunch of about 20 colleagues who started at the same time. I’m friendly with most of them, but don’t post in the group.

A girl from another team had a female golden cocker spaniel, about 2 years old, and then picked up another female golden cocker of about the same age from the pound, a few months ago.

I’ve been keeping away from conversations about them, since I heard that the two had started out by fighting, before eventually ‘quieting down’.

This girl posted a short video clip in the group chat of one of the dogs, where the cocker is backed against a wall and showing a whale eye, and the girl is saying BAD DOG and pointing a finger at it. The dog then lunges towards her hand, and when she screams, the dog then stands off, barking at her.

I just can’t even.
		
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That sounds awful. Poor dog. 
I have to look away from my neighbour and her dog. The dog spends most of its day chained by the front door about 10m from the road, no fence, and then it gets shouted and ranted at for barking at passing people and dogs. I don't think I've ever heard my neighbour say anything nice to the dog, only crazy rants along the lines of "if you don't shut up at the count of three, I'm going to wallop you!", "I'm going to turn you into a fly and swat you", "why can't you be nice like that other dog". The last one is referring to my dog who is walking past quietly (he knows the dog is chained and can't get to him), but to be fair will be jumping and barking at the gate with the best of them if another dog walks by.
She does walk the dog about 100m down the road once a day until its had a poo (left right where it was produced) and turns back for home. I won't go anywhere near that dog because I'm pretty sure its terrified of humans (can't blame it) and it's most certainly reactive to other dogs and its owner doesn't look like she can hold it. But I feel so sorry for it.


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## splashgirl45 (30 September 2022)

I’m glad I don’t have anything like that where I live as I would blow my top and fall out with them….why on earth have a dog if you can’t be bothered to look after it properly.  I would be very tempted to take a pic when the dog poops and she doesnt Pick it up and a nice video with sound when she is ranting at it just to illustrate to the dog warden what is happening.


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## Clodagh (30 September 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			And then the dog will bite her and it will get put to sleep or moved on.

As an aside, I can't abide pointing at dogs, it's often one of the first things I have to stamp out with new people.
		
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Oh dear! I point at mine sometimes. If they are about to break a stay a point and the hard eye makes them rethink. That is at a distance if that helps.


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## CorvusCorax (30 September 2022)

So it's your eye that makes them rethink? 

Yeah a lot of dogs (and humans) find pointing at close quarters confrontational and it's a good way to get bitten by a certain sort of dog (and person ).


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## skinnydipper (30 September 2022)

The situation Fiwen describes is another example of bullying.  It doesn't make her colleague look good, rather it highlights her inadequacies.

I think a tough, confident dog wouldn't stand for it and a fearful dog backed up and threatened would feel it had no choice but to bite.


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## Clodagh (30 September 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			So it's your eye that makes them rethink? 

Yeah a lot of dogs (and humans) find pointing at close quarters confrontational and it's a good way to get bitten by a certain sort of dog (and person ).
		
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If I didn’t point they might hope I was glaring at the others 🤣


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## Smitty (30 September 2022)

Often went hand in hand with some weekend warrior stuff as well, demanding NSAIDs that the dog hadn't received in the previous 12 months because visiting relatives wanted to go out for a lengthy walk and repetitive ball-chuck and the dog can't move the following day.[/QUOTE]

But, this is what the majority of people think dogs do:.   Go for long walks and chase balls.

I can't believe a friend of mine who absolutely worships her 11 yo Weimaraner X and can't imagine life without her, lets her run round chasing balls with 2 young labs for approximately 5 hours!!!😮 and thinks that's brilliant.  Even when it's really stiff the next day.

When I told her about some ball survey where they should have larger balls thrown or something, she said well what can you throw for them then ... Err, well, me nothing.  But then I'm mean.

An awful lot of people don't recognize a subtle lameness, never mind when the dogs are totally hopping.  I had a brief conversation with someone who was trying to tug their whippet along back in the summer.  It was very slightly lame but apparently was lazy.🙄


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## Smitty (30 September 2022)

Sorry Blackcob, I wiped your name out unintentionally trying to pare your post down to the bit I needed ...


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## blackcob (30 September 2022)

I'll live 😜

Had another classic today: "He's a bit lame but he's not in any pain."


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## Smitty (30 September 2022)

blackcob said:



			I'll live 😜

Had another classic today: "He's a bit lame but he's not in any pain."[/QUOTE

Oh well, that's good then 🙄. It does seem a lot of dogs aren't... ☹️

My chap had X rays and physio ...  No amount of dogs apparently had similar but never taken to vet as nothing wrong with them and they were not in any pain, they had always done it and anyway all terriers hop.
		
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## CorvusCorax (30 September 2022)

My young female has never had a ball lashed, just a short distance, into her gob or dropped at my feet or she can get it from me and play with it, with me.
She is naturally high prey and a natural running dog, I have no need to hype her up any further or make the energy she brings from nature, any higher.
Also you end up making all the fun over in the distance, away from you.

I've seen too many stupid, unnecessary injuries and too many dogs sent boogaloo by ball flinging (I inadvertently made her father much loopier than he needed to be because I was so delighted to have a dog with DRIVE!)

Plus, throwing style matters.
Running rabbit, not flying bird.


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## GSD Woman (30 September 2022)

Had another classic today: "He's a bit lame but he's not in any pain."[/QUOT

Takes me back to a deceased club member with an overweight, lame sheltie.  Supposedly her vet said the dog wasn't in pain. Sure. She had never been excused from the obedience ring even though she should have been.  finally a judge excused her and the woman grumbled that she hadn't been excused before, blahblahblah.


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## CorvusCorax (30 September 2022)

Famous family story, my Mum DID excuse a dog from the conformation ring and her handler said 'she's only a bit lame'.


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## fiwen30 (30 September 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			The situation Fiwen describes is another example of bullying.  It doesn't make her colleague look good, rather it highlights her inadequacies.

I think a tough, confident dog wouldn't stand for it and a fearful dog backed up and threatened would feel it had no choice but to bite.
		
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It made very uncomfortable viewing.

I just watched it back a couple of times there, and there’s a pause where the cocker goes from watching, then curls it’s lip and growls for just a second, then when the pointing finger comes back down again, that’s when it lunges with a snarl. It looks like the girl is sitting on a bed above the dog, and so it has to jump to go for her hand. Probably a good job, or it would’ve made contact.


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## AShetlandBitMeOnce (30 September 2022)

blackcob said:



			I'll live 😜

Had another classic today: "He's a bit lame but he's not in any pain."
		
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This drives me nuts and I have to correct it *all the time* about so many types of animal.. 'it's not pain they're just a bit stiff'  'it's not pain, they're just old' 'oh he's been walking like this for a long time, it's just how he walks'   no!  aaaargh!!


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## SilverLinings (30 September 2022)

AShetlandBitMeOnce said:



			This drives me nuts and I have to correct it *all the time* about so many types of animal.. 'it's not pain they're just a bit stiff'  'it's not pain, they're just old' 'oh he's been walking like this for a long time, it's just how he walks'   no!  aaaargh!!
		
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I can't stand it, mainly hear it about dogs and horses and nothing you say seems to have any effect on people like that 

I wonder whether they'd say the same if they started limping all of a sudden...


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## AShetlandBitMeOnce (30 September 2022)

SilverLinings said:



			I can't stand it, mainly hear it about dogs and horses and nothing you say seems to have any effect on people like that 

I wonder whether they'd say the same if they started limping all of a sudden...
		
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This is my usual response to the 'it's just a bit of arthritis, they're old' POV... I say that I have arthritis and in the cold, after exercise or just on a bad day it's absolute agony and it's constant pain. So put that on an animal who also doesn't understand and can't tell you how bad it is that day and you then might just understand what you are putting your pet through.


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## splashgirl45 (30 September 2022)

My lurcher was diagnosEd with arthritis in her hips and after trying pain relief she was no better and didn’t even try and chase a squirrel who crossed the path a couple of yards in front of us.  I knew then that quality of life was not good and I made that final decision.  I have had arthritis in my hips and suffered for many years so I know what that pain is like but I have had hip replacements which has improved my quality of life but that wasn’t something I would have put her through..  it’s really hard to take that final step and even though it was 6 years ago I still get upset thinking about her and I have her photo as my screen saver so I see her every day..


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## SilverLinings (30 September 2022)

AShetlandBitMeOnce said:



			This is my usual response to the 'it's just a bit of arthritis, they're old' POV... I say that I have arthritis and in the cold, after exercise or just on a bad day it's absolute agony and it's constant pain. So put that on an animal who also doesn't understand and can't tell you how bad it is that day and you then might just understand what you are putting your pet through.
		
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I tried that a couple of times and got 'but he still likes to go for a walk/tries to run around so he can't really be in pain'. Maybe I should have given them a dead leg to see if that drove the point home


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## GSD Woman (30 September 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			Famous family story, my Mum DID excuse a dog from the conformation ring and her handler said 'she's only a bit lame'.
		
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Good on your mum!

I wonder if the thinking the animal isn't in pain is thinking the animal is faking or else sheer ignorance. Not in all instances of course but some.


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## Titchy Pony (1 October 2022)

splashgirl45 said:



			I’m glad I don’t have anything like that where I live as I would blow my top and fall out with them….why on earth have a dog if you can’t be bothered to look after it properly.  I would be very tempted to take a pic when the dog poops and she doesnt Pick it up and a nice video with sound when she is ranting at it just to illustrate to the dog warden what is happening.
		
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Unfortunately, I live in rural France where dog wardens don't exist and this kind of behaviour towards dogs is relatively normal and mild. Here most hunting dogs don't leave their kennels for 6 months a year (and I'm not entirely sure what use they are the rest of the year as none of them seem to be trainned for anything). Lots of peoples idea of walking a dog is to get it to run behind a car. Things are changing but slowly, give us another 30 years or so. Strangely, lots of peoples answer when I moan is but I wouldn't be able to have a dog if it couldn't roam (illegal here)/I had to stop it barking/I had to walk it 3 times a day... well don't have a dog then, they're not mandatory!


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## Cinnamontoast (1 October 2022)

Bloody lab x mastiff or something similar went for Mitch today in the woods, growling like it really meant it, owner futilely calling it back and trying to smack it with the lead. Mitch came to call, he isn’t happy with bigger dogs anyway. My lot walked on as told.

I totally get why it was loose, it was probably perfectly fine bopping round til it came across mine, but I do think a solid recall is bog standard. If Bear had seen it, he might have defended Mitch. Luckily, he was off to the side in cover.

Goose was being slow to come back last week, the OH came home properly furious that he’d not come back despite being in view. He has employed hot dogs to great success, there’s much more voluntary recalls, trouble is, the slobber is horrific! I used fallen wet leaves, couldn’t have driven home without a clean up! 🍃💧🤣


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## AShetlandBitMeOnce (1 October 2022)

if anyone wants to feel completely despondent about the future of dog breeding have a look at silver_star_frenchies on Instagram… ‘big rope’, wire haired, hairless, micro frenchies and they’re all a complete mess. They should be jailed for what they are doing to these dogs..


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## CrunchieBoi (1 October 2022)

AShetlandBitMeOnce said:



			if anyone wants to feel completely despondent about the future of dog breeding have a look at silver_star_frenchies on Instagram… ‘big rope’, wire haired, hairless, micro frenchies and they’re all a complete mess. They should be jailed for what they are doing to these dogs..
		
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Hopefully they are advising new owners of the potential dangers of feeding their new "puppy" after midnight.


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## GSD Woman (2 October 2022)

AShetlandBitMeOnce said:



			if anyone wants to feel completely despondent about the future of dog breeding have a look at silver_star_frenchies on Instagram… ‘big rope’, wire haired, hairless, micro frenchies and they’re all a complete mess
		
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OMG!  That is nauseating. Most of those animals are obviously mixed with other breeds.  Several of them look like they have demodex.


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## Tiddlypom (2 October 2022)

The two spaniels owned by the wife of the new huntsman to our local pack have got out onto the main A49 road again . Their owner is unbothered, just so long as her dogs are out having fun.

As I posted previously, neither the police nor the dog warden will act on this unless they catch them straying themselves.


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## Arzada (2 October 2022)

Tiddlypom said:



			The two spaniels owned by the wife of the new huntsman to our local pack have got out onto the main A49 road again . Their owner is unbothered, just so long as her dogs are out having fun.

As I posted previously, neither the police nor the dog warden will act on this unless they catch them straying themselves.

View attachment 100162

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Rather than running up and down the A49 risking their life it's a shame that this kind person didn't phone the police.


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## cauda equina (2 October 2022)

The best thing for those dogs would be to get 'lost'
I expect it's only a matter of time before they don't make it home anyway


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## The Fuzzy Furry (2 October 2022)

A pro active dog warden charging the owners every time might help? Ours works on charge twice, 3rd time it's off to kennels and potentially seized.


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## Pearlsasinger (2 October 2022)

The Fuzzy Furry said:



			A pro active dog warden charging the owners every time might help? Ours works on charge twice, 3rd time it's off to kennels and potentially seized.
		
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In the absence of a dog warden (I know some councils have done away with the role), anyone who can catch those dogs on/near the road should take them to the nearest police station, deny all knowledge of where they might belong and leave the police to sort it out.


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## CorvusCorax (2 October 2022)

I've just realised I haven't seen the spangle twat or his wife for months.

I saw the dog with who I presume was a daughter, strangulating itself at the end of a flexi leash a couple of times, but nothing since.

Hopefully nothing bad happened to it, but it wouldn't surprise me if it had been hit by a car, the way it was allowed to run out of control.


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## Tiddlypom (2 October 2022)

The Fuzzy Furry said:



			A pro active dog warden charging the owners every time might help? Ours works on charge twice, 3rd time it's off to kennels and potentially seized.
		
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I've spoken to the dog warden.

He can only act if the dogs are still loose, even though the owner is known. Police said the same. As soon as a well meaning member of the public catches the dogs up and restrains them, they can't act. The dogs have identity discs so the finders ring the number on that and the owners eventually come and collect them.

Best thing would be that the finders takes the dogs straight to the dog warden saying they can't contact the owner, then she'd have to pay ££££s to get them released. She might just sort her sh1t out if it costs her.

Btw the dog warden said to prevent the straying from happening again is a police problem, and the police said it is a dog warden problem 🙄.


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## The Fuzzy Furry (2 October 2022)

Tiddlypom said:



			I've spoken to the dog warden.

He can only act if the dogs are still loose, even though the owner is known. Police said the same. As soon as a well meaning member of the public catches the dogs up and restrains them, they can't act. The dogs have identity discs so the finders ring the number on that and the owners eventually come and collect them.

Best thing would be that the finders takes the dogs straight to the dog warden saying they can't contact the owner, then she'd have to pay ££££s to get them released. She might just sort her sh1t out if it costs her.

Btw the dog warden said to prevent the straying from happening again is a police problem, and the police said it is a dog warden problem 🙄.
		
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I find.... if you catch the repeated lost dog, chuck it in a stable and accidentally mislay the collar, (or pop baler twine round neck if safe) the authorities will collect 😉
I only heard this, never done it..... 🙃😉


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## Amymay (2 October 2022)

Tiddlypom said:



			I've spoken to the dog warden.

He can only act if the dogs are still loose, even though the owner is known. Police said the same. As soon as a well meaning member of the public catches the dogs up and restrains them, they can't act.
		
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I think this is absolute rubbish.

Part of a DW’s role is to enforce legislation in relation to *straying*


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## skinnydipper (3 October 2022)

When you have demonstrated that you are unable to recall your dog then don't just walk away - come and get the flipping thing.


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## Nasicus (3 October 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			When you have demonstrated that you are unable to recall your dog then don't just walk away - come and get the flipping thing.
		
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Or the alternative, stand there feebly calling it's name instead of coming and getting aforementioned flipping thing! Gah!


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## Karran (3 October 2022)

One for you. 
A flyball friend has a lovely male Merle collie. Decided to breed it to another active sporty collie, all done properly, health tests etc, unfortunately pups didn't happen but word locally got out that it was up for stud. Someone tracked them down on Facebook and asked if they would be interested in mating with their bitch.
Upon questioning, poor bitch turned out to be a Jack Russell and owner had heart set on a collie x JR for no real reason other than they reeallllly liked collies but thought a full one would be too much work. 😱
Needless to say they were politely turned down


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## Dexter (3 October 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			When you have demonstrated that you are unable to recall your dog then don't just walk away - come and get the flipping thing.
		
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Walking away is one of the thing recommended to do if your dog wont recall though?


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## skinnydipper (3 October 2022)

Dexter said:



			Walking away is one of the thing recommended to do if your dog wont recall though?
		
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I would say that depends on what the dog is doing when the owner abandons attempts to recall.

If it is being a nuisance to other dogs then the owner should be running to retrieve their dog not walking away.


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## CorvusCorax (3 October 2022)

Dexter said:



			Walking away is one of the thing recommended to do if your dog wont recall though?
		
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Yeah but not if it's milling/climbing over/generally being a dick to someone else's dog and/or it clearly doesn't care if the owner has left it?
Dogs that like being with their owners generally don't have to be begged to come back.


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## scats (4 October 2022)

Yet another altercation with Sharpei man on the private farmland.  Merrily smoking and chucking a ball for the dog, who then made a beeline for Millie, barking and growling at her heels.  Man just stood smoking while I told him to get hold of his dog and leave the land. He then very slowly walked off, ignoring the dog, who continued to run at Millie growling.
I am sick of this idiot.  He is two fields away from the public footpath and knows dam well he is trespassing.  Have had a reply from the council environmental health department (that was where the website sent me when I searched what to do about out of control dogs) so hoping someone is going to call me in the next few days.


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## CorvusCorax (4 October 2022)

Have you filmed him or pretended to film him? And/or shout out I'M LIVE-STREAMING THIS!

And/or carry a big stick/water pistol.


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## scats (4 October 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			Have you filmed him or pretended to film him? And/or shout out I'M LIVE-STREAMING THIS!

And/or carry a big stick/water pistol.
		
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Yep, I film him most times.  As soon as my phone comes out and I start filming he just walks away with his head down, doesn’t say anything, or call the dog.


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## Pearlsasinger (4 October 2022)

scats said:



			Yep, I film him most times.  As soon as my phone comes out and I start filming he just walks away with his head down, doesn’t say anything, or call the dog.
		
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Does anyone on the yard have a gun? An air rifle would do. It is legal to shoot a dog worrying your livestock and while I'm not suggesting that you do shoot it, reminding him of that with a gun in your hand might just get the point across.


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## CorvusCorax (4 October 2022)

scats said:



			Yep, I film him most times.  As soon as my phone comes out and I start filming he just walks away with his head down, doesn’t say anything, or call the dog.
		
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And have you ever put the situation/him on the local area Facebook page?


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## Cinnamontoast (4 October 2022)

Dexter said:



			Walking away is one of the thing recommended to do if your dog wont recall though?
		
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It worked when Mitch was too fascinated to come immediately. I would normally grab him, but if I walk off, he follows. I absolutely don't allow him to pester other dogs (he is growing up, yay!) and if the other dog is on lead, my lot are taken away. 

I am happy to get in between them and other dogs who are being a pain. There was a massive golden the other day, clearly playful but 3 times Mitch' s weight and barging him, useless owner. I was not quiet about getting him off my dog.


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## ArklePig (4 October 2022)

A work colleague of mine has a bull terrier (I might have that wrong, but the cute weird looking ones with the long wide noses) and recently, on a whim, purchased a collie x French bulldog puppy and is thinking about breeding from them. I'd blocked this from my memory when she told me but the comment up thread reminded me. I asked her what she thought the market would be for a collie, French bulldog, bull terrier and she looked at me like I was stupid and was like 'but they'll be so cute'. 😕


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## CorvusCorax (4 October 2022)

A collie...crossed with a French bulldog....whut??

English Bull Terriers are the ones with the convex facial profile.


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## ArklePig (4 October 2022)

Thank you @CorvusCorax I get very confused buy all the different dogs with bull in their name!

I know, apparently mum was the collie which is... Something? I guess. I asked where she got it from and obviously the answer was gumtree. I really hope she doesn't mate her two dogs but can you imagine the pups.


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## scats (5 October 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			And have you ever put the situation/him on the local area Facebook page? 

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Im so tempted, but there’s something about this bloke that makes me think he might do something horrible to the horses if provoked.  I honestly don’t think he’s quite right, his responses and reactions are very odd.
Coz he had a fag in his hand yesterday I had visions of him burning the yard down.  He really gives me the creeps.


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## cauda equina (5 October 2022)

scats said:



			Im so tempted, but there’s something about this bloke that makes me think he might do something horrible to the horses if provoked.  I honestly don’t think he’s quite right, his responses and reactions are very odd.
Coz he had a fag in his hand yesterday I had visions of him burning the yard down.  He really gives me the creeps.
		
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Does the yard have security cameras?
I'm wondering what else he gets up to, when you're not around to see


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## scats (5 October 2022)

cauda equina said:



			Does the yard have security cameras?
I'm wondering what else he gets up to, when you're not around to see
		
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Yes we have CCTV on the yard.  I was thinking of swapping my girls round last night to being in overnight but I actually changed my mind because I had a horrible feeling he might come back and set the barn on fire.  Probably me being ridiculous but that’s the vibe he gives me, especially now I’ve seen him smoking.


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## Clodagh (5 October 2022)

ArklePig said:



			'but they'll be so cute'. 😕
		
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Tbh they really would. I can’t altogether see what else they’d bring to the party but cute they would be 🤣


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## ArklePig (5 October 2022)

I think English bull terriers are kind of cute, just because they're so strange looking, collies are obviously adorable, but I can't find it in myself to admire French bulldogs and the like, they kind of creep me out, despite the fact that I'm the squeeee type with most dogs.


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## GSD Woman (5 October 2022)

Scats, trust your gut.


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## CorvusCorax (5 October 2022)

scats said:



			Im so tempted, but there’s something about this bloke that makes me think he might do something horrible to the horses if provoked.  I honestly don’t think he’s quite right, his responses and reactions are very odd.
Coz he had a fag in his hand yesterday I had visions of him burning the yard down.  He really gives me the creeps.
		
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Yeah I understand, I don't tackle people near the house if I can help it, just in case.


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## SaddlePsych'D (5 October 2022)

@scats that sounds horrible. As well as the trespassing and dog out of control it seems like it's becoming like a bit of a harassment thing. Not nice.


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## CorvusCorax (6 October 2022)

Not irresponsible per se, more ineffectual...but the second German Shepherd passed me this week gobbing off like crazy and generally being a dickhead.

I've been there, I have, and I've found something that works and it took me a while to get there, but it's frustrating that the owners are doing little to nothing to stop it...no talking, poor line handling, poor handling in general, no food or toy to try and distract them, just letting it happen, dog rearing up on the end of a crap chain lead and useless harness.
I have to say my little girl was great both times and just lay down and concentrated on her food while a dog was going off at her a few feet away.
I managed to have a shouted conversion with the first guy, as he instigated it, and I was able to give him a bit of advice and our email address if he wants some help, but the dog today just sounded...not good...and I wanted to concentrate on making mine feel secure.


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## BBP (7 October 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			Not irresponsible per se, more ineffectual...but the second German Shepherd passed me this week gobbing off like crazy and generally being a dickhead.

I've been there, I have, and I've found something that works and it took me a while to get there, but it's frustrating that the owners are doing little to nothing to stop it...no talking, poor line handling, poor handling in general, no food or toy to try and distract them, just letting it happen, dog rearing up on the end of a crap chain lead and useless harness.
I have to say my little girl was great both times and just lay down and concentrated on her food while a dog was going off at her a few feet away.
I managed to have a shouted conversion with the first guy, as he instigated it, and I was able to give him a bit of advice and our email address if he wants some help, but the dog today just sounded...not good...and I wanted to concentrate on making mine feel secure.
		
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I had almost an identical experience today. Came across the pair of collies that had attacked mine at the start of lockdown and triggered his reactivity. The super reactive one was throwing itself around desperately trying to shed its halter thingy to get to mine. It was on a flexilead which came unlocked and the older gent holding him was shouting and swearing at the dog as the cord tore up the skin on his hands as he desperately grabbed at it.

I have never been so proud of my dog, he can be a bit of an arse towards other dogs now, but on this occasion he clearly felt outgunned and walked beautifully past at heel on a loose lead, looking up at me and taking treats. Generally if allowed to he goes into sniper mode, locks his gaze on and is hard to shift and will then react, so I was extremely glad to be the one with the good dog this time.


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## stangs (7 October 2022)

More irresponsible breeder than irresponsible owner but found on an ad selling xl bully puppies:
"we pleased to announce 9 Healthy beautiful puppy there was 11 unfortunately some died" 

No information provided as to why two died.


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## GSD Woman (8 October 2022)

The other day I was walking mine on the nature trail.  I always look for other humans or dogs and do my best to avoid them.  The dogs are good with their recalls and will turn and go in the other direction and/or wait up if needed.  I jumped out of my skin because Freddie suddenly wasn't there.  A man and his large pit bull were off the path just sitting on a log. Fred came back as soon as I called but I was embarrassed. The man was fine and said his pit liked other dogs as long as they didn't try and sniff his back end. Overall a nice dog and man.  I hadn't gone but a few yards and there was another man trying to get his dogs on lead. I hollered back to pit bull man that some more dogs were coming.  I took mine off of the trail and put Rudy on lead and had him sit.  Freddie was playing catch me if you can but I did get her lead on. When the new man came by one dog was practically strangling itself while standing on his back legs and trying to get to my dogs. I felt bad for the man and dog.  He probably thought no one else would be on the trail at that time of the day.


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## Cinnamontoast (8 October 2022)

Went to do our usual walk in the woods. There was an Akita leaving the car park as I was getting out my lot. It‘s owner was having trouble holding onto it and kept it on the lead. I decided to avoid it and went the other way. Unfortunately came across it again, rearing on the lead so I put my 3 on the lead and stepped off the path to let the guy go past. He came to let it say hello! He was like ‘Oh, he’s fine, just bouncy’. I told him to take it away from mine, that it was really dangerous to let an on lead dog approach other on lead dogs. I was astonished that i had clearly put mine on the lead to let him go past then he came right up!

Bear has previously defended the youngsters although hasn’t reacted for months, so I don’t think he would have done anything, but that could’ve been messy. Rightly or wrongly, I don’t like the breed. One bit Brig cue multiple antibiotics then an op. It then attacked another dog and bit the owner who had to go to A&E, his arm was all torn up. 

Im glad they were on the lead because a reactive onlead dog then walked up. I haven’t seen him in this bit of the woods before. I might change my route.


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## GSD Woman (8 October 2022)

Cinnamontoast,
That is scary. there was a pair of Akitas getting loose and killing cats and small dogs in a nearby neighborhood decades ago. Those dogs are no joke.


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## Cinnamontoast (8 October 2022)

GSD Woman said:



			Cinnamontoast,
That is scary. there was a pair of Akitas getting loose and killing cats and small dogs in a nearby neighborhood decades ago. Those dogs are no joke.
		
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He looked like he wanted to play, but the owner wasn’t really in control, Mitch is scared of bigger dogs and Bear might have kicked off-unlikely, given how chill he is but I don’t think forcing a meet between onlead dogs is the best idea!


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## DabDab (9 October 2022)

Sorry in advance to all Labrador owners, but why is it always Labradors/Labrador owners?! And it's never the nice, svelte, sporting type Labradors either, it's the great bucket-headed "who ate all the pies?" ones who look like they've killed the odd chihuahua in their time just by sitting on it.

Was out walking on mixed use path popular with dog walkers, walking past/with/behind a variety of different dogs on lead and off lead with no bother. Off lead dogs were all non reactive and under control, on lead dogs either non reactive or were being managed well by their owners allow others to pass without drama. And then along comes a man calling two dogs that are not in sight. Eventually one chocolate lab comes lolloping round the bend and makes a bee-line for my Phoebe who is one lead and at heel. It crowds in almost on top of P in that slightly oblivious was that Labs do and she scuttled away from it to the other side of me. It came to crowd in on her again so I put my leg out in front of P, that it promptly lumbered into but it gave me time to pick P up out of the way as it negotiated it's way around my leg. I turned to look back at its ineffectual owner and he pointed finger at me and said "oi. Don't ever make contact with a dog with your leg." In the tone of a teacher telling off a child. I replied that his dog is a lot bigger than mine and was crowding her, and at that point my not insubstantial OH who had been some way behind with the other two dogs appeared at Labrador man's shoulder and snarled something at him so he scuttled off sheepishly with lab 1 . Lab 2 that he was still calling for did eventually pass us further down, heading in the general direction of its owner. How oblivious do you have to be to be reprimanding someone who's dogs are behaving while yours are barely more than feral? And if you can't train a Lab to recall then you are definitely no authority on anything dog.

Later in the day on the beach all owners seemed generally lovely and could recall their dogs (majority of dogs off lead, incl ours), but it's still only the labs that do that crowding in thing where other breeds just say hello in normal dog language.


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## Clodagh (9 October 2022)

I’m not sure why it’s labs, and tbh I only see them out shooting where they are generally great. There’s often one sex pest/ personal space one but usually he’s owned by a human version of same. 
I wonder if being an ‘easy’ dog people decide they don’t need to put any effort in with them?
There’s two labs free range on one of my morning walks, there have been a lot of problems with them. The young one approaches in a very aggressive way (and has apparently scared or even attacked several walkers). It came out at mine last time , I had them all on the lead so I was able to control everything, and I may have made contact with it with my leg or foot. Quite firmly. Twice. It was scary though.
I did email the council.


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## DabDab (9 October 2022)

Yeah I think you're right. I also suspect that because Labs are generally quite amenable you can get some superficial training success even with quite ineffectual training attempts. So they appear reasonably trained but it disguises some fairly big gaps.

But yes, only ever pet labs that are an issue, the working ones are a delight. Who would have thought breeding selection for soundness of body and mind combined with decent training was a good idea eh 😬


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## Errin Paddywack (9 October 2022)

GSD Woman said:



			That is scary. there was a pair of Akitas getting loose and killing cats and small dogs in a nearby neighborhood decades ago. Those dogs are no joke.
		
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We had a problem locally some years back too with a pair of Akitas.  They got loose and attacked my friend's TM and I heard of other cases too.  We think they were eventually put down.  They were a brother and sister kept in a pen in someone's back garden.


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## Cinnamontoast (9 October 2022)

I think maybe because labs are so popular so it’s commonly that breed that people might see as a pita, plus the whole ‘labs are born half trained, spaniels die half trained’ or whatever the saying is. There was one in the woods back in the day when we had Jake and Brig, big show type, very aggressive towards Jake. Saying that, at the same time, there was a bloke with 3 springers, one of whom always made a beeline for Jake, who was a victim, bless him and never retaliated. 

I met nobody today bar an ancient jrt we see frequently and 3 (I’m assuming) film students-one in a leotard-with a huge scary light reflector. Bear was best boy, but only because I had hot dogs. 🌭


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## SilverLinings (9 October 2022)

scats said:



			Im so tempted, but there’s something about this bloke that makes me think he might do something horrible to the horses if provoked.  I honestly don’t think he’s quite right, his responses and reactions are very odd.
Coz he had a fag in his hand yesterday I had visions of him burning the yard down.  He really gives me the creeps.
		
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Scats, If you haven't already then please contact your local PCSO (or police officer if you have one), explain that you feel unsafe and why, and ask for their advice. The guy sounds decidedly odd, and the fact he makes you feel frightened shouldn't be ignored. If the man is actually entirely innocent then asking for advice from the police won't have done any harm, but if he is a threat (or turns into one) then the advice could be the difference between you being safe or not.

I don't mean this in an alarmist way, I just think that a lot of us (particularly women) are conditioned not to make a 'fuss' when actually we should be listening to our instincts. You have posted quite a few times about this situation (as it has happened more than once) and I think most/all of us reading those posts would also think that he is displaying odd behaviour, so the police should also be able to see that it is coming across as threatening.


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## GSD Woman (9 October 2022)

Scats,  I agree with SilverLinings.  Report it to your local police or the equivalent.  At least then there is a paper trail.  There is a book written by Gavin Somebody, "The Gift of Fear." It gives examples of when people have listened to their gut and have been spared some pretty gruesome situations.  
is it possible to manage to take a picture of this man to show to the police?  Every little bit will help.


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## skinnydipper (16 October 2022)

Our afternoon walk today.

Narrow path, woman with JRT coming towards us.  Experience led me to ask "is your little one okay with other dogs?".  "No", she laughed, (laughed!) "he's very naughty". I took the big girl to the side and stood in front of her.

Round the corner on to a road, pavement each side.  Woman approaching with 2 border terriers, same side of road as me.  Again I call "are your dogs okay with other dogs?". "No, they're a bit yappy".  I crossed the road.  A bit yappy translated means they were yapping wildly, throwing themselves around on their leads, tying themselves in knots trying to get to my dog.

Give me strength.


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## Cinnamontoast (16 October 2022)

I am delighted with Mitch today. Several people with a big doodle thing approaching on the narrow path and he took himself to the side and did not approach it! Then ignored a frenchie behind us. I’m delighted!


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## Pearlsasinger (16 October 2022)

We took the 4 Labs to a country park, which had very few people/dogs around today. They were all playing with a couple iof balls and/or enjoying sniffing around the bases of trees. We saw a woman with a small poodly-thing on lead so we made sure to mot cross their path. The next thing we knew, woman had let poodle thing off lead and it had joined ours. One of ours bowled it over, it yelped and ran back to its Owner. I felt sorry for the poor thing but what an idiotic woman. There was a whole almost empty park to go at, so why on earth did she decide to let it off the lead so close to ours?


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## Clodagh (16 October 2022)

We walked up on the moor today. Being a sunny Sunday we met more people than usual. Everyone’s dogs were off lead and perfectly behaved, just a passing sniff, sort of ‘hi’ at ours as they went past. I did put Scout on a lead as he’s big and bouncy and a bit in your face, he’s only being friendly but he needs to just get his personal space a bit more refined.


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## skinnydipper (16 October 2022)

@Pearlsasinger
When I had a multiple dogs people would go out of their way to walk into us so their dog could play with mine - without having any idea if mine were all friendly.


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## SilverLinings (16 October 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			Our afternoon walk today.

Narrow path, woman with JRT coming towards us.  Experience led me to ask "is your little one okay with other dogs?".  "No", she laughed, (laughed!) "he's very naughty". I took the big girl to the side and stood in front of her.

Round the corner on to a road, pavement each side.  Woman approaching with 2 border terriers, same side of road as me.  Again I call "are your dogs okay with other dogs?". "No, they're a bit yappy".  I crossed the road.  A bit yappy translated means they were yapping wildly, throwing themselves around on their leads, tying themselves in knots trying to get to my dog.

Give me strength.
		
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You were very thoughtful (and sensible) to move out of the way, but I REALLY don't understand why someone who has an anti-social dog(s)- like the second woman you saw- wouldn't have crossed the road herself as soon as she saw your dogs coming. She is the one with a problem (un-socialised dogs) so she should be the one putting herself out to take precautions to keep them and dogs they meet calm and safe. Some people seem to have absolutely no manners today (or common sense, or sense of responsibility etc...)


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## skinnydipper (16 October 2022)

Clodagh said:



			We walked up on the moor today. Being a sunny Sunday we met more people than usual. Everyone’s dogs were off lead and perfectly behaved, just a passing sniff, sort of ‘hi’ at ours as they went past. I did put Scout on a lead as he’s big and bouncy and a bit in your face, he’s only being friendly but he needs to just get his personal space a bit more refined.
		
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We don't mind friendly dogs.  I am sure she and Scout would get on fine, some of her playmates are labs.

This morning we made a new friend, a Newfie.  She was on lead, he wasn't.  He ambled over to say hello.  She was a complete tart, bouncing about, into the play bow.  Unfortunately we weren't in an area safe to let them run around and play.


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## skinnydipper (16 October 2022)

SilverLinings said:



			You were very thoughtful (and sensible) to move out of the way, but I REALLY don't understand why someone who has an anti-social dog(s)- like the second woman you saw- wouldn't have crossed the road herself as soon as she saw your dogs coming. She is the one with a problem (un-socialised dogs) so she should be the one putting herself out to take precautions to keep them and dogs they meet calm and safe. Some people seem to have absolutely no manners today (or common sense, or sense of responsibility etc...) 

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The first one was antisocial, too.  I guess 'naughty' sounds better than saying your dog is reactive or aggressive.


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## Parrotperson (16 October 2022)

Rocky (jrt but thinks he’s a lab!) play bowed the parrot. (Blue fronted Amazon. Name of William. Thinks he’s a human!) the other day. 🙄. He’s obviously got I/D issues…..


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## misst (16 October 2022)

Today was perfect with no incidents and Ruby got to play with her friend Leo who is the same size as her and is a terrier x of some sort. Moti just takes himself off to one side as not interested in being sociable with people/dogs he doesn't know. Leo always ignores him and just plays with Ruby in the woods.

Two days ago narrow path large GSD and a terrier coming towards us, we've not seen them before. I don't like Ruby getting playful with big dogs as she only weighs 5.5kg and also we didn't know this dog. Moti can be reactive if a big dog "investigates" him too much. He usually walks off if it does happen or he will growl if the dog doesn't take no for an answer. He tucks his tail down and puts his ears back so clearly is saying go away.

GSD and terrier off lead so put my two on as we approached and stood to once side on short leads. GSD runs up to Ruby and she wags and sniffs but then it starts nosing at Moti. I was trying to walk on past around bushes but he follows Moti. Owner of GSD shouts "he's friendly he likes small dogs" so I shout "but mine isn't". My concern is if Moti air snaps (the worst thing he does - he never makes contact) it could trigger the GSD to retaliate. This would not end well for anyone.

I asked if she could take her dog away from mine and she told me I should socialise mine more! He's an ex stray, he is small he is nervous and he is very good with small dogs and dogs and people he knows. I truly don't feel I should inflict big bouncy dogs he doesn't know on him even if they are good with small dogs! I went home feeling very disgruntled.


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## skinnydipper (16 October 2022)

misst said:



			GSD and terrier off lead so put my two on as we approached and stood to once side on short leads. GSD runs up to Ruby and she wags and sniffs but then it starts nosing at Moti. I was trying to walk on past around bushes but he follows Moti. Owner of GSD shouts "he's friendly he likes small dogs" so I shout "but mine isn't". My concern is if Moti air snaps (the worst thing he does - he never makes contact) it could trigger the GSD to retaliate. This would not end well for anyone.

I asked if she could take her dog away from mine and she told me I should socialise mine more! He's an ex stray, he is small he is nervous and he is very good with small dogs and dogs and people he knows. I truly don't feel I should inflict big bouncy dogs he doesn't know on him even if they are good with small dogs! I went home feeling very disgruntled.
		
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I don't blame you for being cross.  Moti should be allowed to enjoy his walks without feeling stressed.

Socialisation doesn't mean a free for all.  Some people are clueless.


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## misst (16 October 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			I don't blame you for being cross.  Moti should be allowed to enjoy his walks without feeling stressed.

Socialisation doesn't mean a free for all.  Some people are clueless.
		
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Thank you! 
He is actually a really good little family dog. Given a choice he takes himself away from strange dogs. He will wait behnd a bush or tree until they pass if off lead. 

If I stop to chat with another dog owner Ruby will be happy to sniff and socialise with their dogs, but Moti will stand slightly away and turn his back. To me he is coping well with a situation he does not want to be involved with. He will air snap if body language and growling don't get rid of a nosy dog but I don't think he is badly trained. He is just nervous and small. He never ever instigates anything and I am careful to put him on lead if strange dogs look as if they could cause him problems. Picking him up is easy but makes it worse as he gets snappy if they try to nose at him if I am holding him. I can distract him with treats but if an overly "friendly" dog is annoying him bringing food out often makes the other dog even more "friendly".  
I have had Ruby since she was a puppy and she is a very straightforward well socialised typical confident JRT.  Moti is a foreign rescue who had a dreadful start in life on the streets. He has grown in confidence and trust with people and dogs but he has a way to go yet even after 6 years.


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## GSD Woman (16 October 2022)

misst said:



			GSD and terrier off lead so put my two on as we approached and stood to once side on short leads. GSD runs up to Ruby and she wags and sniffs but then it starts nosing at Moti. I was trying to walk on past around bushes but he follows Moti. Owner of GSD shouts "he's friendly he likes small dogs" so I shout "but mine isn't". My concern is if Moti air snaps (the worst thing he does - he never makes contact) it could trigger the GSD to retaliate. This would not end well for anyone.
		
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I had a dog aggressive GSD years ago.  It got to the point where I couldn't even walk her in one of the public parks due to ill mannered, off lead dogs. I found a better place to walk her and one day ran into some people who let their off lead dogs run up towards her. I asked them to call their dog.  Of course their answer was that their dog just wanted to sniff.  My response was she'll just leave holes.  You may want to try that.


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## misst (16 October 2022)

GSD Woman I am not sure he'd leave holes. My worry is that at about 6kg if he snaps at a large dog it could end very badly for him. I just don't know why people want their dog to "play" with a dog who is clearly trying to say p1ss off.


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## skinnydipper (16 October 2022)

misst said:



			but Moti will stand slightly away and turn his back.
		
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It is disappointing that other dogs and their owners are unable to see that he is clearly indicating that he doesn't want any interaction.


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## misst (16 October 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			It is disappointing that other dogs and their owners are unable to see that he is clearly indicating that he doesn't want any interaction.
		
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It's odd isn't it. I know he is my dog and I know him but he tucks his tail, puts his ears back and crouches down when he is nosed at by another dog. He growls if they continue and if I don't intervene in time he has air snapped in the past. If they are ignoring him he just takes himself off quietly. I don't think he could say it more clearly unless I tie a notice to him saying "leave me alone". He does wag and greet dogs belonging to friends that he is confident with. As I say maybe I am biased but he is not a bad dog he is just a dog who is happier pootling about on his own or with other family dogs.


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## skinnydipper (16 October 2022)

@misst 

Have you thought about a yellow bandana asking for space, although given he is so tiny it might swamp him.

ETA.  Or a little harness  https://www.bellascollars.co.uk/collections/harness


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## Clodagh (16 October 2022)

skinnydipper said:



			We don't mind friendly dogs.  I am sure she and Scout would get on fine, some of her playmates are labs.

This morning we made a new friend, a Newfie.  She was on lead, he wasn't.  He ambled over to say hello.  She was a complete tart, bouncing about, into the play bow.  Unfortunately we weren't in an area safe to let them run around and play.
		
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I’m sure he’d love her. I’m going to be sizest now but if we meet a equal or bigger dog off lead and chilled I leave him off. I just do t want him squashing something small.


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## misst (16 October 2022)

skinnydipper said:



@misst

Have you thought about a yellow bandana asking for space, although given he is so tiny it might swamp him.

ETA.  Or a little harness  https://www.bellascollars.co.uk/collections/harness

Click to expand...

For heavens sake why have I never thought of that!!! He will be happy in a harness and those are small enough for him 
Thank you 
Will order him one tonight! 
Thank you as always x


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## Cinnamontoast (16 October 2022)

Pearlsasinger said:



			We took the 4 Labs to a country park, which had very few people/dogs around today. They were all playing with a couple iof balls and/or enjoying sniffing around the bases of trees. We saw a woman with a small poodly-thing on lead so we made sure to mot cross their path. The next thing we knew, woman had let poodle thing off lead and it had joined ours. One of ours bowled it over, it yelped and ran back to its Owner. I felt sorry for the poor thing but what an idiotic woman. There was a whole almost empty park to go at, so why on earth did she decide to let it off the lead so close to ours?
		
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That’s really stupid of her, it could have ended very badly for her dog, she couldn’t know your lot are nice. I remember a bloke letting his collie off to run across a mini footbridge through my 3 onlead boys: they were side by side, across the width of the bridge. I didn’t understand why he’d do that whilst telling me she was nervous and barging into Brig who reacted badly, unusually. People are weird.


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## CorvusCorax (16 October 2022)

Saw a 'just saying hello' today turn into a dog fight between two terriers, one accompanying a pram.
We took a shortcut through a hedge to avoid any drama.

The dog I was trying to place is now staying put, he was up at the club today and was around multiple dogs with no issue, it's not a Him problem, it's a Stupid People with Rude Dogs problem.


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## SaddlePsych'D (17 October 2022)

Just popped to local shop. Guy coming the other way on pavement with French bulldog and I think a Shih Tzu on leads. Plenty of room to pass but woman in front of me clearly wary of dogs so stopped to make more room and I stopped behind her. Both dogs came barking at us, owner made no effort to move away and the bulldog jumped up at me with its snappy little mouth. Owner got a grumble from me. Sorry but if your dogs can't tolerate just walking past people you need to be getting off the pavement out of the way not the other way around.


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## Pearlsasinger (17 October 2022)

misst said:



			GSD Woman I am not sure he'd leave holes. My worry is that at about 6kg if he snaps at a large dog it could end very badly for him. I just don't know why people want their dog to "play" with a dog who is clearly trying to say p1ss off.
		
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I don't know why people want to let their loose dogs approach on lead dogs. Surely it is obvious that, for whatever reason, owner doesn't want their dog to interact.


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## CorvusCorax (17 October 2022)

Two cockers passed today going bananas barking. The owners say their names and 'no' in the most beige way possible, just normal talking voice, keep walking (while I step off the path and mitigate) and get ignored. 

Like...if your dog is doing something less than desirable, do you just do nothing at all? Or do some people take 'ignore the bad' literally?


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## Clodagh (17 October 2022)

Perhaps you didn’t see them clicking and giving them a biscuit?


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## CorvusCorax (17 October 2022)

Clodagh said:



			Perhaps you didn’t see them clicking and giving them a biscuit?
		
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I wouldn't mind if they were doing anything/at least trying to be honest...I do literally put my dog in a down and feed her when we see another dog, that's what works for her, otherwise she would probably being a knob right back but...I don't want her to?! Why would you just keep letting it happen?


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## Clodagh (17 October 2022)

No idea, it would drive me nuts!


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## snowcloud (18 October 2022)

I’m appreciating this thread due to an incident I had yesterday! My 8 month working cocker spaniel was on a lead and we were merrily going about our walk. Then, a GSD sees us, runs towards us barking (off the lead), pins my dog down - by the throat, my dog screaming his little heart out. I pull the GSD off - owner was trying to call it back but it wasn’t listening. She tells me ‘it’s playing’ I said it’s not, keep it on a lead (this has happened twice before with the same GSD but this time it was a lot worse).

My dog was unhurt, mainly because I pulled the GSD off, though was worried for my own safety. No apology from the owner. I took a picture of her and the dog and reported them to the council and the police. I’m surprised at how shook up I am, I didn’t think it would get to me in the way that it has. 

I have purchased some pet corrector and will go out with a walking pole too - not sure what else I can do! Honestly, some people shouldn’t have dogs!


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## GSD Woman (19 October 2022)

snowcloud, these stories make me think it must be bad in the UK. I do have to walk a few quiet places if I want to let the dogs chase tennis balls and I have to be ready to put them on lead if needed. There are a few other parks where we walk where everyone has their dogs on leash.  Ticketing for unleashed dogs is not uncommon. And don't get me started on people who don't clean up after their dogs, not even a stick and flick.


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## Caol Ila (19 October 2022)

GSD Woman said:



			snowcloud, these stories make me think it must be bad in the UK. I do have to walk a few quiet places if I want to let the dogs chase tennis balls and I have to be ready to put them on lead if needed. There are a few other parks where we walk where everyone has their dogs on leash.  Ticketing for unleashed dogs is not uncommon. And don't get me started on people who don't clean up after their dogs, not even a stick and flick.
		
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I think it's a bit of an availability heuristic thing - this is a predominantly UK-based forum, the majority of anecdotes will come from the UK. just because the vast majority of posters are.

But there are also a hell of a lot more laws controlling how people behave on public lands in the Land of the Free. Like in Boulder County, there are a bazillion trail systems in the Open Space, the public recreational lands owned by the county. But out of those bazlillion trail systems, I think there are like four which allow you to have your dog off-lead. If you are on any trail which is in not those four areas, which is most of them, you're unlikely to have problems with off-lead dogs.

Then there's the whole presence of apex predators like mountains lions thing. If your dog buggers off into the woods, you're probably not seeing it again.


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## scats (19 October 2022)

Out at local beach yesterday and had gone up onto the fields above the cliffs.  Suddenly this huge pointer cross comes bounding over and makes a beeline for my old dog, who is 13 and was minding her own business.  It came flying up behind her and crashed into her back end.  She spun and in doing so lost her back end and went down.
I looked around for owner of this dog and he was cycling at the other side of the field, just whistling the dog to come (and being ignored).  Dog continued to bound around upsetting my dogs and JD was starting to look panicked.  I chased it off but it came flying back.  By this point the owner was way ahead.  It did eventually follow him but I was so annoyed.  Why should my elderly dog, minding her own business, be knocked over by someone else’s dog?!

I never used to have to worry about JD because I genuinely knew she could hold her own with any dog (extremely dominant bitch), but she has arthritis now and is a lot more vulnerable than she was.


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## Smitty (19 October 2022)

snowcloud said:



			I’m appreciating this thread due to an incident I had yesterday! My 8 month working cocker spaniel was on a lead and we were merrily going about our walk. Then, a GSD sees us, runs towards us barking (off the lead), pins my dog down - by the throat, my dog screaming his little heart out. I pull the GSD off - owner was trying to call it back but it wasn’t listening. She tells me ‘it’s playing’ I said it’s not, keep it on a lead (this has happened twice before with the same GSD but this time it was a lot worse).

My dog was unhurt, mainly because I pulled the GSD off, though was worried for my own safety. No apology from the owner. I took a picture of her and the dog and reported them to the council and the police. I’m surprised at how shook up I am, I didn’t think it would get to me in the way that it has.

I have purchased some pet corrector and will go out with a walking pole too - not sure what else I can do! Honestly, some people shouldn’t have dogs!
		
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I am so sorry to hear this, what a horrible experience.  Do have a look at the website Protect Our Pets who are campaigning to make dog on dog attacks a criminal offence. 

I hope you and your dog are OK and get over this.  I always take a walking stick now and have used it. 

Many years ago my collie x lab was pinned down by 2 GSDs who were only playing  He was screaming  and their owner would  not call them back until I asked him politely (apparently get your effing dogs off him you w*****r was not going to work) 
so I was forced to grovel.  Grrrr.   

I just don't get how people seem to be uncaring when their dogs upset another.  I would be mortified and apologetic.


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## skinnydipper (19 October 2022)

I heard before I saw the poor little mite.  Barking and twirling on its lead, terrified, trying to chase away all potential threats from every direction.

I don't know why anyone would force their very frightened dog to walk in an area where every few minutes they will pass another dog.  Poor little thing, stress hormones off the scale.

It makes me very sad but doesn't surprise me that dogs end up like this.

I see owners of apprehensive puppies, and dogs, allowing other dogs to crowd them, allowing other owners* to tower over them, forced to endure  unwanted attention.   Don't do it.

*If a dog is telling you, sometimes quite loudly, to keep out of his space please don't think you are the exception, that it couldn't possibly apply to you.  If you are the owner of that dog, speak up for your dog and move away,


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## sarah.oxford (19 October 2022)

There have been rumours buzzing around here for a few days, but today I happened upon the daughter of an eyewitness, who called the police.  
Last week in the local park a 4 month old puppy was attacked and killed by 2 off lead dogs.  These dogs are described as merle, and large pit bull types.
I have noticed a rapid increase recently of XL Bullies around the area including some in a washed out shade of red merle, accompanied by young men who like to hang around outside shops looking like they are up to no good.

The police are asking for witnesses to come forward and as this happened in the middle of the day in the park opposite the shop (and school) there will be people who saw, I hope they are able to provide information anonymously and someone is held to account for this.

As if this whole incident wasn't bad enough, the dead puppy was put in the bin, in front of it's distressed owner.

I feel physically sick typing this.


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## Amymay (19 October 2022)

Jesus 😢


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## Cinnamontoast (19 October 2022)

That's making me tear up. Bloody awful. 😢


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## Smitty (20 October 2022)

That is so horrible.   I hope the police are able to find these absolute morons and hopefully sieze their dogs and destroy them.   Their calous behaviour is sadly becoming too common amongst the tough guy/muscle dog element of our society.

It would  be great if they are made to pay for any therapy this poor lady may need as a result of their actions.   I just cannot imagine what she went through.


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## Errin Paddywack (20 October 2022)

My worst nightmare, poor poor puppy and poor owner.


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## misst (20 October 2022)

Yesterday walking with my 2 terriers and my 5 year old granddaughter on the local common. Out of the blue a grey/blue staffie (maybe a cross as very short and very heavily built) came charging from behind. A lady was shouting I'm sorry before he got to us. He was not aggressive but was out of control and jumping up at my granddaughter. She would have fallen if I had not held onto her. The woman had a JRT and another small dog also off lead. The other two ignored everything going on. The staffie was fixed on my granddaughter who was actually frightened and started to cry. I caught him by his harness and he was SO strong. He continued to prance about on the end of my arm trying to get to the child.

The woman came up so I handed him to her expecting her to put him on a lead. She said "Barry you wait until I tell your mum what you've done" " He's not mine I'm a dog walker". I know most of the local dog walkers both good and bad and I have never seen her before. She then let go of him so he started doing it all over again leaping and jumping at granddaughter. By now my two are fed up and started growling so I am trying to control a heavy staffie x, my 2 terriers and a small child. Dog then snatched a soft toy out of the childs hand and ran off with it. 
I lost the plot and was shouting at the woman "you better get that back right now it's her favourite toy." As she was so ineffectual I offered her some treats to try and "swap" for the toy. "Don't worry I have some" she said.
I said "well bloody well use them then". But she didn't, she just kept shouting "Barry Barry stop".

She did catch him eventually and we retrieved Bunny the toy. No apology - just - you guessed it - he was only playing.... I was so angry. Granddaughter is now very wary of strange dogs coming towards her. She'll be fine as she has a dog at home and is not usually afraid but this one was so out of control and so heavy. If I knew where the owner lived I would be going round as I would not want my dog walked by such a useless person.


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## Clodagh (20 October 2022)

I’d have gone totally ballistic. Totally. I’d have hit her I think!


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## cauda equina (20 October 2022)

misst said:



			Yesterday walking with my 2 terriers and my 5 year old granddaughter on the local common. Out of the blue a grey/blue staffie (maybe a cross as very short and very heavily built) came charging from behind. A lady was shouting I'm sorry before he got to us. He was not aggressive but was out of control and jumping up at my granddaughter. She would have fallen if I had not held onto her. The woman had a JRT and another small dog also off lead. The other two ignored everything going on. The staffie was fixed on my granddaughter who was actually frightened and started to cry. I caught him by his harness and he was SO strong. He continued to prance about on the end of my arm trying to get to the child.

The woman came up so I handed him to her expecting her to put him on a lead. She said "Barry you wait until I tell your mum what you've done" " He's not mine I'm a dog walker". I know most of the local dog walkers both good and bad and I have never seen her before. She then let go of him so he started doing it all over again leaping and jumping at granddaughter. By now my two are fed up and started growling so I am trying to control a heavy staffie x, my 2 terriers and a small child. Dog then snatched a soft toy out of the childs hand and ran off with it.
I lost the plot and was shouting at the woman "you better get that back right now it's her favourite toy." As she was so ineffectual I offered her some treats to try and "swap" for the toy. "Don't worry I have some" she said.
I said "well bloody well use them then". But she didn't, she just kept shouting "Barry Barry stop".

She did catch him eventually and we retrieved Bunny the toy. No apology - just - you guessed it - he was only playing.... I was so angry. Granddaughter is now very wary of strange dogs coming towards her. She'll be fine as she has a dog at home and is not usually afraid but this one was so out of control and so heavy. If I knew where the owner lived I would be going round as I would not want my dog walked by such a useless person.
		
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Can you name and shame on FB? There can't be many dogs of that description called Barry


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## MurphysMinder (20 October 2022)

cauda equina said:



			Can you name and shame on FB? There can't be many dogs of that description called Barry
		
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I was going to suggest this.   Hopefully the owner will be horrified that the dog walker is letting him off when she has no control over him.   You would be quite entitled to report to the dog warden and the dog/owner would be in a whole load of trouble.


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## skinnydipper (20 October 2022)

I was furious this morning.  My lovely dog was crying, trying to get away from the persistent red lab who was all over her and whose hackles were up from neck to tail.  I tried to grab it, then shouted to chase it away.

Meanwhile the owner was saying I'm sorry, I'm sorry, over and over, like that's going to help.

I have never known things as bad as they are now.  Out of control dogs.  Ignorant, useless owners.

*If you have no control of your dog, any dog, never mind one who could so easily tip over into aggression - keep it on a fecking lead.  Is that really so hard?*


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## CorvusCorax (20 October 2022)

I know all the OOC dogs' names locally as there's this really neat correlation between out of control dogs and having owners who think shouting their name will make them come back/stop trying to mill mine.


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## ArklePig (20 October 2022)

@misst your poor granddaughter that's horrible. I'm afraid I would have either gave the walker or the dog a shoe up the hole. Probably the walker.


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## Pearlsasinger (20 October 2022)

ArklePig said:



@misst your poor granddaughter that's horrible. I'm afraid I would have either gave the walker or the dog a shoe up the hole. Probably the walker.
		
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A walking stick is a really useful, legitimate addition to a dog walk.


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## ArklePig (20 October 2022)

This thread actually frightens me, especially as mine is no where near being ready to be off lead in public but I'm so scared of what other dogs may do. I'd be so embarrassed and probably upset if I had caused any dog/owner the distress some on this thread have had.


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## skinnydipper (20 October 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			I know all the OOC dogs' names locally as there's this really neat correlation between out of control dogs and having owners who think shouting their name will make them come back/stop trying to mill mine.
		
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This one was called _I'm sorry_, apparently.

I'll know them again.


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## CorvusCorax (20 October 2022)

I think I did once shout 'STOP APOLOGISING AND COME AND GET YOUR DOG'. and one memorable one was 'I'LL JUST KEEP SUSPENDING MY DOG HERE WHILE YOU ENJOY YOUR WALK'
(I was having to hold his head/front legs off the ground to stop him having a go at the westie and husky snapping at his rear - the two elderly owners just carried on walking down the beach)


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## GSD Woman (20 October 2022)

misst said:



			Yesterday walking with my 2 terriers and my 5 year old granddaughter on the local common. Out of the blue a grey/blue staffie (maybe a cross as very short and very heavily built) came charging from behind. A lady was shouting I'm sorry before he got to us. He was not aggressive but was out of control and jumping up at my granddaughter. She would have fallen if I had not held onto her. The woman had a JRT and another small dog also off lead. The other two ignored everything going on. The staffie was fixed on my granddaughter who was actually frightened and started to cry. I caught him by his harness and he was SO strong. He continued to prance about on the end of my arm trying to get to the child.
		
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This makes me so angry. A dog like that could have knocked down your granddaughter. And since small children are at dog face level, well, I would have been arrested.


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## babymare (20 October 2022)

misst said:



			Yesterday walking with my 2 terriers and my 5 year old granddaughter on the local common. Out of the blue a grey/blue staffie (maybe a cross as very short and very heavily built) came charging from behind. A lady was shouting I'm sorry before he got to us. He was not aggressive but was out of control and jumping up at my granddaughter. She would have fallen if I had not held onto her. The woman had a JRT and another small dog also off lead. The other two ignored everything going on. The staffie was fixed on my granddaughter who was actually frightened and started to cry. I caught him by his harness and he was SO strong. He continued to prance about on the end of my arm trying to get to the child.

The woman came up so I handed him to her expecting her to put him on a lead. She said "Barry you wait until I tell your mum what you've done" " He's not mine I'm a dog walker". I know most of the local dog walkers both good and bad and I have never seen her before. She then let go of him so he started doing it all over again leaping and jumping at granddaughter. By now my two are fed up and started growling so I am trying to control a heavy staffie x, my 2 terriers and a small child. Dog then snatched a soft toy out of the childs hand and ran off with it.
I lost the plot and was shouting at the woman "you better get that back right now it's her favourite toy." As she was so ineffectual I offered her some treats to try and "swap" for the toy. "Don't worry I have some" she said.
I said "well bloody well use them then". But she didn't, she just kept shouting "Barry Barry stop".

She did catch him eventually and we retrieved Bunny the toy. No apology - just - you guessed it - he was only playing.... I was so angry. Granddaughter is now very wary of strange dogs coming towards her. She'll be fine as she has a dog at home and is not usually afraid but this one was so out of control and so heavy. If I knew where the owner lived I would be going round as I would not want my dog walked by such a useless person.
		
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Oh dear god how frightening for you both. Please speak to your local dog warden or police just to log it. I hope you granddaughter is ok


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## SaddlePsych'D (20 October 2022)

@misst that is awful, I would be raging! I would also be considering making a post in a local FB group. It is absolutely not on for anyone to be letting their dog behave like that let alone someone calling themselves any kind of dog 'professional'.


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## SaddlePsych'D (20 October 2022)

Genuine question... am I being too precious about my dog?

She's nervous but getting better. Generally dog indifferent but we always give space to dogs we don't know. We don't have concerns about her being reactive or aggressive towards other dogs but so many owner seem to not know about their own dogs' behaviour I'm cautious. Today we went into an enclosed green space. I wasn't sure as a few other people in their with a dog each, two sighthounds and a mix I'm not sure of (probably Heinz 57!) I said our dog is okay with other dogs but is nervous. Next thing I know all three are heading our way so I said "maybe not all at once!" not in a shirty way just 'please can we not'. I think they think I'm being OTT but I tried to be more relaxed once and then a big bull mix kind of pounced of Ivy (playful but really boisterous) and then we went through the phase of her not wanting to walk. I don't think that solely caused it but now we're back on track I'm so keen we don't undo all the progress helping Ivy relax and enjoy her walks a bit more. 

Am I being too cautious or was it sensible to be wary of three unknown dogs coming over to us?


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## splashgirl45 (20 October 2022)

I feel very lucky as haven’t had experiences like many on here.  I walk in and near a local park and know most of the dogs and its only at weekends when I encounter one’s I don’t know so I tend to walk the fields rather than deal with any problems ..


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## Annette4 (20 October 2022)

SaddlePsych'D said:



			Am I being too cautious or was it sensible to be wary of three unknown dogs coming over to us?
		
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Not too cautious at all, even Ginny who is bold as brass and too dog friendly would struggle with that......its my worst nightmare with Dobby and why we avoid green spaces now.


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## Amymay (20 October 2022)

Not too cautious at all @SaddlePsych'D. However in your shoes I’d actively avoid enclosed areas like you describe above. If Ivy isn’t interested in other dogs, and is nervous then environments like that will be of no benefit at all to her or you.


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## SaddlePsych'D (20 October 2022)

Amymay said:



			Not too cautious at all @SaddlePsych'D. However in your shoes I’d actively avoid enclosed areas like you describe above. If Ivy isn’t interested in other dogs, and is nervous then environments like that will be of no benefit at all to her or you.
		
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I don't know why I didn't stick with my usual plan to avoid it and only go in there when it's empty. I think I second guess myself and think it will be okay, the owners seem nice, the dogs seem okay etc. I need to stop doing that. Last week she met a small dog and another greyhound but that was one dog per visit and both were equally as uninterested in her as she was them after an initial sniff so we stayed. She did play a tiny bit with the greyhound which was nice to see as she hasn't had the chance to do that off lead since we have had her.

ETA: sometimes it is a real free for all in there and then we really do avoid it completely.


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## Clodagh (20 October 2022)

SaddlePsych'D said:



			I don't know why I didn't stick with my usual plan to avoid it and only go in there when it's empty. I think I second guess myself and think it will be okay, the owners seem nice, the dogs seem okay etc. I need to stop doing that. Last week she met a small dog and another greyhound but that was one dog per visit and both were equally as uninterested in her as she was them after an initial sniff so we stayed. She did play a tiny bit with the greyhound which was nice to see as she hasn't had the chance to do that off lead since we have had her.

ETA: sometimes it is a real free for all in there and then we really do avoid it completely.
		
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If I meet someone and they are off lead and chilled I still make mine walk to heel so they greet politely. If I say ‘go say hi,’ they barrel along together, it must be horrible for the other dog even though they are genuinely calm and friendly.


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## SaddlePsych'D (20 October 2022)

In the end the two sighthounds were okay but I did step between the other dog and Ivy because it kept coming back to 'say hi' (sniffing her) and it was too much. The other owner wasn't seeing it and I'm sure had no idea what my problem was but I will always try to step in to say enough before Ivy has to. Didn't quite get it right this time but hopefully intervened in time.


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## Morwenna (20 October 2022)

Not too cautious at all. My puppy still thinks all dogs and people are friends and wants to meet everyone but she is very submissive when she actually meets dogs so I only let her interact with dogs I know, in controlled situations, and not every time. I don’t want to be *that* lab owner whose dog bounds across the field to “play” with all dogs. My old boy was attacked by two “friendly” boxers which was awful to watch and he was a fear reactive dog anyway so I am very cautious of unknown dogs that approach us. Having had a reactive dog I know how hard it is and how frustrating when you put your dog on a lead and other people still let their dogs approach yours and then judge you when your dog snarls / snaps at them.


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## misst (20 October 2022)

cauda equina said:



			Can you name and shame on FB? There can't be many dogs of that description called Barry
		
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I don't do facebook!!


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## GSD Woman (20 October 2022)

SaddlePsych'D said:



			Am I being too cautious or was it sensible to be wary of three unknown dogs coming over to us
		
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Not in the least little bit. When my dogs are off lead I make sure to keep them away from other dogs.  It is only polite.  If there is no way to go the other way I put mine on lead. I think too many people don't have the sense god gave a goat.

Now my rant.  A friend and I went to a large public park to track our dogs.  We saw many off lead dogs. The last one was a large pit bull type.  The owner had no off lead control, was on her phone and didn't notice when her dog left her, went into the middle of a field while she walked on out of sight. You can't fix stupid.


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## scats (21 October 2022)

misst said:



			I don't do facebook!!
		
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Do you have a friend who can put it on FB for you?  Sometimes dog walkers take photos of the dogs they walk and post them on their pages for owners to see, so someone could perhaps check the pages of your local dog walkers to try and find out who it was?

Id be absolutely raging if that had happened to a child I was with!  I hope she is ok.


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## Annette4 (22 October 2022)

I failed Dobby today but thankfully it wasn't a negative experience. He came with me to take OH to work as he missed out on training. We went for a wander but I don't know the area. Came across a park, there was a group of labs and goldens the other side of the park. They were concentrating on their owners and ignored us so I didn't think anything of it. We went further around the estate and came to what I thought was an alley which would take me back to his work.......I was wrong. 

We were in the middle of the group of labs and goldens before I realised and they understandably said hello. Thankfully they were all polite and their owner was mortified when she spotted his muzzle and lead sleeve. I explained that he was nervous post attack and I hadn't realised where it was going to bring me out so wasn't her fault and actually, it gave him a positive interaction as they all just briefly sniffed then recalled to their owner. I still feel awful for putting him in that position.


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## GSD Woman (23 October 2022)

Annette4, I'm glad it turned out to be a positive experience.


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## maisie06 (23 October 2022)

sarah.oxford said:



			There have been rumours buzzing around here for a few days, but today I happened upon the daughter of an eyewitness, who called the police. 
Last week in the local park a 4 month old puppy was attacked and killed by 2 off lead dogs.  These dogs are described as merle, and large pit bull types.
I have noticed a rapid increase recently of XL Bullies around the area including some in a washed out shade of red merle, accompanied by young men who like to hang around outside shops looking like they are up to no good.

The police are asking for witnesses to come forward and as this happened in the middle of the day in the park opposite the shop (and school) there will be people who saw, I hope they are able to provide information anonymously and someone is held to account for this.

As if this whole incident wasn't bad enough, the dead puppy was put in the bin, in front of it's distressed owner.

I feel physically sick typing this.
		
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Makes me feel sick reading it. I'm sorry but it's about time American XL Bullies were banned, so many fatal attcks involving this breed, they are basically a wild animal, I avoid walking locally even though we have lovely parks and beaches because the area is flooded with them having been churned out by a couple of local backstreet breeders. They are far too big and powerful to fend off once they have latched on, but it seems we'll have a repeat of what has happened in Liverpool, and wales before anyone in authority takes notice.


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## SaddlePsych'D (23 October 2022)

Oh I could just cry! I was really looking forward to a nice decompressing walk with Ivy, drove to a bigger local green space where there are dogs but it's nice and big so easy enough to find some space. I've not had any problems before so it seemed like a good pick. 

Spotted a french bulldog on flexi lead had fixed on Ivy and laid down. It was already quite a distance off but I gave a bit more room. Unsure if I read it right but to me that's a dog either overly interested in mine or not happy about mine and making room was no bother. All was fine I thought as we passed and it seemed to move along with its owner the other way. Wrong! The bloody thing can absolutely pelting straight at Ivy, lead trailing behind. Absolutely no hesitation in its mind just...running at us.

I stepped in between before it reached Ivy, often this is enough to get them to have a think but not for this one so it got a _very_ assertive "Ah Ah Ah!" Still not backing off so I kept stepping between it and Ivy then managed to get the lead. 

Stupid sodding owner bloke then tells me off for 'needing to learn how to react'. I told him it's not safe and he was like what are you talking about. Adrenaline and rage couldn't help me articulate fully all the reasons we know letting your dog steamroller at a dog (and person) it doesn't know is a bad idea so all I could find was to roar "You don't know me, or my dog. LOOK AFTER YOUR DOG!!" He wandered off muttering something under his breath.

Honestly if getting shouted at is the worst thing that happens to your out of control dog then frankly count yourself lucky. There is absolutely no way in hell I am letting any dog approach Ivy (or me actually) like that.


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## CorvusCorax (24 October 2022)

This morning we met BELLA!BELLA!BELLA! and LUNA!LUNA!LUNA! the charming cockapoos, who delightfully charged up to my dog barking and sweetly ran off into the housing estate out of their owner's sight to chase squirrels.

Luckily it was my nice neutral dog so he did nothing more than make confused Scooby Doo noises/facial expressions.

At no point did owner attempt to put leashes on, apologise or, you know, indicate to the dogs that this was perhaps not desirable behaviour.
Such cute. Very teddy bear.
There was another one who politely remained at heel and didn't require their name screeched at them.


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## ArklePig (24 October 2022)

Mr AP got bitten just now by some lab/staffy thing. Fodhla was on the lead and the other dog was too and he jumped up at him. The owner said 'oh so sorry did he nip you?' nip?! He was pumping blood but the wound itself isn't so bad. He's so not the type to make a fuss though he just came home and was like 'oh I got bitten?'

I can't imagine being anything other than mortified and horrified if my dog bit someone.


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## skinnydipper (24 October 2022)

That's terrible, AP.   That bloke can call it a nip but it's a bite.

Keep an eye out for infection, if in doubt seek medical advice, Mr AP may need antibiotics.


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## ArklePig (24 October 2022)

My husband is such a weirdo he just said 'it's a shame cause he seemed like a nice enough dog all the same he was probably just overwhelmed.' He's annoyingly and stupidly tolerant. 
Agreed though, to me bleeding=bite, definitely not a nip. 

Have just shoved the NHS page on bites into his face and he's promised to keep an eye on it. He's the type that would let his finger fall off (whereas I am the total opposite).


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## skinnydipper (24 October 2022)

Here is Ian Dunbar's dog bite scale for info, AP.

https://apdt.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/ian-dunbar-dog-bite-scale.pdf


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## ArklePig (24 October 2022)

Thanks SD, I wasn't aware of that but it's interesting. Was probably a level 3 which is good for the dog I guess, based on that. Hopefully the owners actually do something about his behaviour to fix /mitigate the chances of him doing it again. It OH was a child it could have been eye height.

I freaked out when he came in because the dog had blood on her but I was slightly relieved to find it was his 😂


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## skinnydipper (24 October 2022)

The owner dismissing it as a nip doesn't sound very promising from the point of view of training and behaviour modification.


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## GSD Woman (24 October 2022)

ArklePig said:



			Mr AP got bitten just now by some lab/staffy thing. Fodhla was on the lead and the other dog was too and he jumped up at him. The owner said 'oh so sorry did he nip you?' nip?! He was pumping blood but the wound itself isn't so bad. He's so not the type to make a fuss though he just came home and was like 'oh I got bitten?'
		
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I freely admit I don't know how reported dog bites go in your area but my niece's oh so lovely pit bull has one strike since I had to report the bite. I believe another one and he'll be confiscated with a case to put him down.  Which is a long way of saying he needs antibiotics and to report the dog. A bite that draws blood like that is a BAD THING.


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## GSD Woman (24 October 2022)

BTW, CC your post about BELLA!BELLA!BELLA! and LUNA!LUNA!LUNA! made me smile.


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## CorvusCorax (24 October 2022)

ArklePig said:



			Mr AP got bitten just now by some lab/staffy thing. Fodhla was on the lead and the other dog was too and he jumped up at him. The owner said 'oh so sorry did he nip you?' nip?! He was pumping blood but the wound itself isn't so bad. He's so not the type to make a fuss though he just came home and was like 'oh I got bitten?'

I can't imagine being anything other than mortified and horrified if my dog bit someone.
		
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That's not on.

Speaking as someone who deals with big dogs and gets bitten sporadically, I really do urge him to get it cleaned properly and an antibiotic. Dog's mouths are stinking and an infection in the hand, when most of us use our hands for pretty much everything, is a right PITA.


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## ArklePig (24 October 2022)

He is currently on hold to the out of hours doc at my insistence and now that he's come round and the shock has worn off he's calling the owners every name under the sun. Thanks


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## CorvusCorax (24 October 2022)

Also it will probably hurt more/later when adrenaline wears off. Arnica and a bath in/or soaking the hand in warm water with Dettol or Savlon also helps.

ETA just seen your last. Yeah they can sting like anything, especially in fingers and if there's bruising that'll come up later 🙄


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## Clodagh (24 October 2022)

It really does need reporting. That dog is dangerous.


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## ArklePig (24 October 2022)

I think I've just convinced him on that front @Clodagh

Tbf when he came in I think he was in a mild shock but now he's rightly fuming.


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## Cinnamontoast (24 October 2022)

ArklePig said:



			Mr AP got bitten just now by some lab/staffy thing. Fodhla was on the lead and the other dog was too and he jumped up at him. The owner said 'oh so sorry did he nip you?' nip?! He was pumping blood but the wound itself isn't so bad. He's so not the type to make a fuss though he just came home and was like 'oh I got bitten?'

I can't imagine being anything other than mortified and horrified if my dog bit someone.
		
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Definitely call the police. That’s appalling. 🤬


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## skinnydipper (25 October 2022)

ArklePig said:



			He is currently on hold to the out of hours doc at my insistence and now that he's come round and the shock has worn off he's calling the owners every name under the sun. Thanks 

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How is Mr AP today?


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## ArklePig (25 October 2022)

He is grand thanks, he got it cleaned out yesterday evening and is on a prophylactic course of antibiotics. The wound itself isn't overly deep so should heal up nicely he didn't need stitches or anything so I'm sure he'll be grand.


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## GSD Woman (25 October 2022)

That's great news.


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## Cinnamontoast (25 October 2022)

Aggressive little podenco chased my two in the woods today, barking, growling, I bo//ocked the ar$e off it, verbally only, the owner struggled to grab it and put the lead on. Why have it loose if it goes for other dogs?

Then another owner gave me fair warning, I suppose, telling her companion she was going to put MILOMILOMILO on the lead. Milo had already bounced at mine, I told her not to worry, I’d put mine on the lead. They all came nicely, sat, had leads put on and heeled past her three leaping lunatics.


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## GSD Woman (26 October 2022)

I had one that took off and didn't come back and was nasty to another dog.  Guess what?  That was the last time she was off lead. I was also horrified.


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## ArklePig (26 October 2022)

GSD Woman said:



			I freely admit I don't know how reported dog bites go in your area but my niece's oh so lovely pit bull has one strike since I had to report the bite. I believe another one and he'll be confiscated with a case to put him down.  Which is a long way of saying he needs antibiotics and to report the dog. A bite that draws blood like that is a BAD THING.
		
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GSD Woman I'm so sorry I hadn't seen your helpful advice. I have just realised you were accidentally on ignore (I have clumsy fingers and have previously  accidentally done so to others). Thank you


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## SaddlePsych'D (26 October 2022)

Slightly different flavour from the unwelcome, rapidly incoming off-lead dogs... there is something particularly cruel about stepping in another dog's poo _immediately_ after clearing up after your own dog.


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## CorvusCorax (26 October 2022)

SaddlePsych'D said:



			Slightly different flavour from the unwelcome, rapidly incoming off-lead dogs... there is something particularly cruel about stepping in another dog's poo _immediately_ after clearing up after your own dog. 

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All the bloody time and the most infuriating is the ones right beside the effing bin.


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## GSD Woman (26 October 2022)

SaddlePsych'D said:



			Slightly different flavour from the unwelcome, rapidly incoming off-lead dogs... there is something particularly cruel about stepping in another dog's poo _immediately_ after clearing up after your own dog. 

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That and people who leave the poo in the middle of the path/trail.  for crying out loud at least stick and flick. There is enough poison ivy and porcelain berry vines that no one will step into unless very dire circumstances.

AP, no worries.  I also have clumsy fingers.


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## Cinnamontoast (28 October 2022)

Not an irresponsible owner (met lots of lovely ones today) but a jogger! He was on the narrow path, I’d just given the dogs treats for voluntary recall, then bent down to pick up when he came up behind me, slightly barged me. I hadn’t heard him, so I was very shocked. AIBU to think he could have called out/coughed?!


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## GSD Woman (28 October 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			I hadn’t heard him, so I was very shocked. AIBU to think he could have called out/coughed?!
		
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I would be shocked too. He's lucky your dogs didn't react.


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## Cinnamontoast (28 October 2022)

GSD Woman said:



			I would be shocked too. He's lucky your dogs didn't react.
		
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They like people, I don’t think they’d react if a serial killer was strangling me! Typical spaniels. Mitch is the wariest of the 3, I had to call him when he was frightened by a trio of bikes on the same path 10 minutes later. I’d warned the cyclists there were 3 dogs on the track. One said ‘Yes, I can hear them working in the rough’. I told him they were all self taught! 🤣


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## SAujla (1 November 2022)

Clover on lead and dog coming towards us on lead, that dog proceeded to lunge at her and tried to bite Clover who screamed out. No damage done but hearing her scream was unnerving. She ran around with another dog she knows later so don't think there is any trauma there. Its a week before her spay so wanted to make it happy not her being attacked


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## Smitty (1 November 2022)

Well, I had an interesting altercation with 2 women ýestrday.  Apparently lunging and barking at strange dogs is what aĺl dogs do.   It helps if you grin as the dogs are towing you ...   I muttered a few expletives under my breath whilst readying walking stick and was told that all dogs bark and behave like that and I was b.......y effing rude.  I pointed out mine was also a dog and did none of those things and their dogs were rude, not me.  I don't think I will  die of natural causes .....


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## Chuffy99 (1 November 2022)

I’ve cracked it, I’ve found a way to stop people in the vets letting their dogs on flexileads come and bother my dogs who like to sit quietly between my legs.
You say quite loudly, I wouldn’t advise contact my dog has ringworm 
It works a treat


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## Amymay (1 November 2022)

I’ve seen two women recently who I really hope are holiday makers who will be wobbling their equally large frames back home with their equally overweight dogs very soon.

They think it’s perfectly acceptable to let their ‘bulls in a china shop’ labs riot all over my small little dog.  I thought it was perfectly acceptable to yell at them to get their overweight yobs under control and the feck away from my dog.   They didn’t quite see it like that and were most ‘upset at my attitude’.  Sadly neither owner drowned in yesterday’s high seas when retrieving one of the dogs coats that had come off while it was swimming.

Both labs were actually lovely (no malice) but huge, totally out of control and all over Daisy.  They’d have caused some serious damage if I hadn’t got between them and yelled in my best voice to ‘leave it!’  Which they duly did.

Apparently I ruined everyone’s fun 🙄


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## BallyRoanBaubles (1 November 2022)

I know this is an irresponsible owners thread but I actually met a very responsible owner!

I was cycling along the track my dog was just ahead off lead, the other owner came onto the track with her large young looking dog on a long line, I called my dog and popped his lead on, got off my bike and walked along. The other owner had pulled off the track and got her dogs attention on her. She called out ‘my dogs friendly just young’, we both passed without issue, it was great 😆


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## Karran (1 November 2022)

Chuffy99 said:



			I’ve cracked it, I’ve found a way to stop people in the vets letting their dogs on flexileads come and bother my dogs who like to sit quietly between my legs.
You say quite loudly, I wouldn’t advise contact my dog has ringworm
It works a treat
		
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I did this in despair once! I got a "wossat then?" And then a mouthful of abuse about having an infectious dog in the park 🤣🤣 and how I should be keeping it away from others and it certainly wasn't the fault of the terrier trying to hump Mrs Collie 🤦‍♀️


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## Morwenna (2 November 2022)

Just took my 5 month old puppy to the park for her walk. An out of control spaniel ran the length of the football pitch straight towards her. Now she’s met other dogs but in a controlled manner and is not used to them charging at her. She was trying to hide behind me so I cued her to sit between my legs and flicked the lead at the spaniel and threw some treats out. Its owner then appeared saying “sorry. He’s only 5 months old. His recall is brilliant but when he sees another dog he’s off, doesn’t matter if I call, whistle or anything”. Well then his recall isn’t brilliant is it and he certainly shouldn’t be off the lead around other dogs. We then went over to a quiet corner and did some recall practice as she’s learning to recall to the whistle and she was absolutely perfect. I saw the woman watching us looking a bit put out.


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## Crugeran Celt (4 November 2022)

I had a bad experience with my pup last year which I posted on here at the time. I learned my lesson that day and became much more aware of how some owners who think they know it all have absolutely no control of their dogs and firmly believe it is everyone elses problem not theirs. I was recently walking with my parents in a local park without my dog thank goodness as there was a lady walking a very handsome staffy who was in incredible condition and obviously very well cared for, he was lose and was attempting to hump every other dog he came across. He was entire and when I asked if she had considered having him neutered due to his amorous personality she said she didn't believe in neutering/speying as it was cruel and that her dog was such a perfect example of his breed that if he impregnated any other dog their owners should be delighted! i honestly did not know what to say. Just very glad I heve now had mine speyed having had her first season.


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## Amymay (4 November 2022)

😳😳😳😳😳


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## Cinnamontoast (5 November 2022)

I was in the woods today (fell over onto hardcore the farmer has put in the gateway, have really hurt my good leg cos I fell onto bits of concrete), 2 women behind checked I was ok. They had a pack of dogs, one of which kept coming up and barking at me. I met them going back to the car park where they remarked on how calm the pups were for youngsters then let one of theirs run across the lane to the car park! It is a quiet lane but I just wouldn’t risk it, my lot go on the lead 20 yards before the lane.


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## ArklePig (6 November 2022)

The F***ING dog who bit my husband was in the dog park today (we were walking by as we only go in if it's empty or there's dogs we know) attempting to ride every bitch he could get his dirty little paws on while his stupid gormless owners just sat drinking coffee on the bench. This is a dog that bites passers by with no provocation and it's off lead in a park full of dogs kids and owners. I despair. There was about 12 dogs in there no one was paying any attention to theirs and it was carnage. 
It's situated in a bigger park and we just walked by but it gave me heebie jeebies.


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## Amymay (7 November 2022)

ArklePig said:



			The F***ING dog who bit my husband was in the dog park today (we were walking by as we only go in if it's empty or there's dogs we know) attempting to ride every bitch he could get his dirty little paws on while his stupid gormless owners just sat drinking coffee on the bench. This is a dog that bites passers by with no provocation and it's off lead in a park full of dogs kids and owners. I despair. There was about 12 dogs in there no one was paying any attention to theirs and it was carnage.
It's situated in a bigger park and we just walked by but it gave me heebie jeebies.
		
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Did you report the incident to the police at the time?


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## ArklePig (7 November 2022)

Yes OH did but they weren't overly interested as he wasn't mauled. I guess they'll just wait til he bites worse the next time 🙄


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## Amymay (7 November 2022)

ArklePig said:



			Yes OH did but they weren't overly interested as he wasn't mauled. I guess they'll just wait til he bites worse the next time 🙄
		
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That’s pretty appalling ☹️


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## Marnie (7 November 2022)

Compared to what others go through, it is very tame but I am really fed up of people not sticking to footpaths and just going wherever they want - both when I am out walking on other people's land and on the farm that I live on. We have had to put chains and locks on gates as people go through them and don't shut them properly meaning that cows (with bulls) in different fields can mix or get out onto the main track and ultimately onto the road. People are now climbing over the gates and they are starting to drop. The number of people who go through the fields with their dogs off leads too, I'm always telling people and they say things like there are no cows in the field - no, but there are in the field that joins it and they could come through at any time!


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## Clodagh (7 November 2022)

Marnie said:



			Compared to what others go through, it is very tame but I am really fed up of people not sticking to footpaths and just going wherever they want - both when I am out walking on other people's land and on the farm that I live on. We have had to put chains and locks on gates as people go through them and don't shut them properly meaning that cows (with bulls) in different fields can mix or get out onto the main track and ultimately onto the road. People are now climbing over the gates and they are starting to drop. The number of people who go through the fields with their dogs off leads too, I'm always telling people and they say things like there are no cows in the field - no, but there are in the field that joins it and they could come through at any time!
		
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When we sold the farm and bought a house OH number 1-5 must haves were no public access. People have no idea how privileged they are to have public footpaths.


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## Cinnamontoast (7 November 2022)

Clodagh said:



			When we sold the farm and bought a house OH number 1-5 must haves were no public access. People have no idea how privileged they are to have public footpaths.
		
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If I see public footpath mentioned on a property, I just move on. I couldn’t cope.


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## Clodagh (7 November 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			If I see public footpath mentioned on a property, I just move on. I couldn’t cope.
		
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We had them right round the farmhouse, outside the garden but front and rear. A man’s dog killed a chicken and he said it was my fault for having them free ranging. He gave me £20 though. I was quite angry and waving a still twitching dismembered corpse at him. 😳


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## Cinnamontoast (7 November 2022)

Clodagh said:



			We had them right round the farmhouse, outside the garden but front and rear. A man’s dog killed a chicken and he said it was my fault for having them free ranging. He gave me £20 though. I was quite angry and waving a still twitching dismembered corpse at him. 😳
		
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I couldn’t do with it. There was a lovely property the OH sent me but there was a footpath at the end of the couple of acres, but nobody respects the paths. We used to have people pitching tents in the horses’ field, wandering round, all ar$ey when told it was private land.


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## Clodagh (7 November 2022)

Cinnamontoast said:



			I couldn’t do with it. There was a lovely property the OH sent me but there was a footpath at the end of the couple of acres, but nobody respects the paths. We used to have people pitching tents in the horses’ field, wandering round, all ar$ey when told it was private land.
		
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I think you’d do better in a more rural location. Although the cows opposite are forever being let out as people are incapable of shutting a gate 🤷‍♀️


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## Errin Paddywack (8 November 2022)

We have a footpath along the far side of our field.  Makes a very popular circular walk for the villagers and us.  We fenced the horses away from it and it has kissing gates both ends.  Ours causes very little trouble and in fact can be a help as the villagers know who owns it and will alert us to problems with our animals.  So not all footpaths are bad, depends so much on where they are and who uses them.


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## P3LH (8 November 2022)

Marnie said:



			Compared to what others go through, it is very tame but I am really fed up of people not sticking to footpaths and just going wherever they want - both when I am out walking on other people's land and on the farm that I live on. We have had to put chains and locks on gates as people go through them and don't shut them properly meaning that cows (with bulls) in different fields can mix or get out onto the main track and ultimately onto the road. People are now climbing over the gates and they are starting to drop. The number of people who go through the fields with their dogs off leads too, I'm always telling people and they say things like there are no cows in the field - no, but there are in the field that joins it and they could come through at any time!
		
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Here, it’s awful. We are on the edge of the urban area leading into the open country. Most of our walks are further in. We count ourselves exceptionally blessed to live somewhere where within ten minutes you can walk for hours and see nobody, yet still order a take away! Other people don’t seem to respect this. And I genuinely pity the farmers and land owners with footpaths where we walk. I witnessed two dogs shot in front of me in the summer - i say in front of me, I was on the footpath and they and their owners were not. Even then, the dogs had ranged far away from their owners and were ‘only playing’ with the sheep according to their owners. We’ve had alpacas, ponies, poultry, sheep and goats all affected around here. There is even a footpath which cuts alongside the garden of a very remote house where a very very elderly couple live - they have a wonderful garden and keep rare breed chickens, so the view of their garden is almost as wonderful as the countryside around it. Several times I’ve seen dogs charge into their garden either under the gate or even leaping over the fence. They then either harass the chickens or piss all over the plant pots - I really feel for them. People really can be dicks.


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## fiwen30 (8 November 2022)

‘Only playing’ with the sheep! I despair.


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## YorksG (8 November 2022)

fiwen30 said:



			‘Only playing’ with the sheep! I despair.
		
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That happens more often than you'd think! One evening the horses were going nuts, so I went out to check and there was a woman in the field next to ours, calling a poo Cross which was in with our sheep. No recall at all and when I got a bit cross, she did apologise, but told me the dog liked sheep. She looked a bit affronted when I told her the sheep didn't like dogs!


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## Marnie (8 November 2022)

I am just so cautious and just find it ridiculous that others aren't the same! Bunny's recall is ok, but only ok. I won't let her off anywhere near livestock fields that she could potentially get into under fences or gates. I don't really like extendable leads, but when I am walking by myself they mean that she can mooch around doing what she wants and I can still get her back. She does go into our cow fields and the cow sheds looking for rats but after being chased once or twice, doesn't bother them - only to lick their noses or hunt for calf poo  I am still cautious though and wouldn't let her do the same anywhere else.


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## fiwen30 (8 November 2022)

YorksG said:



			That happens more often than you'd think! One evening the horses were going nuts, so I went out to check and there was a woman in the field next to ours, calling a poo Cross which was in with our sheep. No recall at all and when I got a bit cross, she did apologise, but told me the dog liked sheep. She looked a bit affronted when I told her the sheep didn't like dogs!
		
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Christ on a bike! I’m mortified enough if my dog stops beside someone’s front garden and toilets on the pavement, I’d absolutely die if he ever went charging off over someone else’s property.


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## CorvusCorax (8 November 2022)

When I was on holiday earlier this year and walked around the grounds of a big hotel beside a popular tourist feature, there was a woman letting an adult and puppy retriever run in a field with horses. No recall. One also kept running up to my dog. I couldn't then get my dog back in the van because she was parked beside me and when she finally got one dog in the car, the other one jumped out and vice versa and kept circling my van, which had my other two other dogs in it going bananas. Never thought to, you know, put a lead on either of them.
Because we were parked beside each other and she was causing quite a kerfuffle I told several passers by that she and her dogs had nothing to do with me.


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## SilverLinings (9 November 2022)

It's bad enough that some dog owners don't appear to care a jot about the sheep/horses/etc that they allow their dogs to harass, but you'd think that the owners would care that they are risking their dog being shot, kicked or trampled to death. But, I suppose like the people who allow their dogs to run loose on roads, they don't actually care about the wellbeing of their dogs either. 

Poor dogs, poor chased livestock and poor farmers, all because of the sense of entitlement and lack of responsibility held by a proportion of the population.


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## Smitty (9 November 2022)

Very un PC but are they just 'thick'?


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## Crugeran Celt (10 November 2022)

We don't have paths through our land but it doesn't stop people walking through anyway and we even have some people who were opening the gates and just letting their dogs in to have a run about and a poo as then the owner didn't have to pick it up!  All gates locked now but still some will climb over and seem somewhat surprised that we ask them not to. They don't understand that the horses can and probably will chase their dogs.


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## Morwenna (10 November 2022)

Another idiot in my local park. We were in a quiet corner practising sit stays and loose lead walking and there was only one other dog in there at the time pootling round the other end. Suddenly notice a man making a beeline towards us with a goldendoodle. His dog was about the same age as my pup and he wanted to introduce them as his dog ‘loves making friends’. I’ve been working on getting her to disengage so let her say hello briefly on lead then called her and she came straight back to me and we turned away. At that point he told his dog to say hello properly and let it off the lead so it came bowling up to us and knocked mine over. He did eventually get the circling barrel of fluff back on the lead and we just walked off. Why do people think this is ok? This is why I prefer walking her at 6am but I am trying not to fix walk times too much for her. I’ll definitely stick to unsocial hours in future.


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## CorvusCorax (13 November 2022)

Not irresponsible, just annoying and nowhere else to vent 🤣

I say 'I'll be there from 1ish' (actually a bit earlier) someone arrives at 2.20pm, takes their dogs for a walk, in the interim everyone else who has been there since 1pm gets their bits done and goes home, said person finally starts training at close to 3pm and gets a bit sniffy when I say I'm starving and will be leaving at 4pm.
We all pay the same fee, I give all of my time voluntarily and have my own dog to train.
Said person has a 'but' for everything/generally ignores any advice anyway...


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## blackcob (13 November 2022)

Sympathy as I've had new venue/new starter woes last couple of weeks. Letting your dog run up to the dogs waiting on the sideline is Not Cool; letting it happen three times, including nicking a water bowl and sending the dog you were warned was a bit spicy into an apoplectic shitfit as a result? Seriously Not Cool.


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## SaddlePsych'D (13 November 2022)

Saw a post on FB group about someone's dog getting kicked by another dog owner. I think there are extremely limited circumstances I would think it okay to kick a dog (like to prevent/stop an actual attack and even then I'm not sure that would be effective), but the way the post was worded made me _reeeeally_ want to know what the other version of events was. I still don't think kicking the dog was warranted (cannot emphasise that enough) but I do wonder if the flipside of the 'my dog was just playing and hadn't had a chance to come back after I called it' could be 'this dog wouldn't stop harassing mine, I'd been shouting at the owner to recall for ages and even when they did it came pelting all the way back after mine ran back to me'. Reason 235353436 to not let your dog wander up to unknown people/dogs/children/animals.


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## Clodagh (13 November 2022)

SaddlePsych'D said:



			Saw a post on FB group about someone's dog getting kicked by another dog owner. I think there are extremely limited circumstances I would think it okay to kick a dog (like to prevent/stop an actual attack and even then I'm not sure that would be effective), but the way the post was worded made me _reeeeally_ want to know what the other version of events was. I still don't think kicking the dog was warranted (cannot emphasise that enough) but I do wonder if the flipside of the 'my dog was just playing and hadn't had a chance to come back after I called it' could be 'this dog wouldn't stop harassing mine, I'd been shouting at the owner to recall for ages and even when they did it came pelting all the way back after mine ran back to me'. Reason 235353436 to not let your dog wander up to unknown people/dogs/children/animals.
		
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Tbh I’d boot another dog with relatively little provocation. Not wearing steel toe caps and not deliberately to hurt but tbh whatever it takes for mine to be and feel safe.


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## Amymay (13 November 2022)

Clodagh said:



			Tbh I’d boot another dog with relatively little provocation. Not wearing steel toe caps and not deliberately to hurt but tbh whatever it takes for mine to be and feel safe.
		
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Me too.  If my dog is being hassled in what I deem to be an unacceptable way (or obviously aggressively), I have no hesitation.

Sorry if that offends SD.  But my dog is small and I 100% advocate for her and her alone.


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## SAujla (13 November 2022)

I regret not booting a dog that went for Clover, I wish I had done but had to move her away to check she wasn't hurt.


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## SaddlePsych'D (13 November 2022)

Amymay said:



			Me too.  If my dog is being hassled in what I deem to be an unacceptable way (or obviously aggressively), I have no hesitation.

Sorry if that offends SD.  But my dog is small and I 100% advocate for her and her alone.
		
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I think if you perceive a threat to you and/or your dog you have every right to fend this off. There's been one time I thought about it as the dog was so damn persistent and had been staring us down from a distance. If it hadn't had it's lead still attached to it I might not have had another choice. It's partly why if anyone gets cross about me shouting at their dog I have: 'me shouting at your dog is the least of your worries if you can't keep it under control' ready to come back.

The comments on the FB post were unanimously 'oh poor you'. I daren't stick my head above this particular parapet!

ETA - I thought the kicking in the FB sounded unwarranted from the description but of course this was written from one side and I expect I might have thought differently if I did have the other version of the story.


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## MurphysMinder (13 November 2022)

My agility training is at a riding school/livery yard .   The owners have a new dog which last week got into the indoor arena and was attacking all our dogs . I freely admit I had my leg forward to keep it away from my little guy , and if that hadn’t worked it would have felt my toe !


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## Cinnamontoast (13 November 2022)

I would use my feet/crutch/whatever I had to hand, plenty of big fallen branches lying round. I’ll protect my lot and worry about the consequences later.

Sorry, very upsetting: I was horrified last week to hear (from my OH) about a dog attacking a smaller one, breaking it’s spine and opening up the stomach, it died at the vets. It’s very upsetting to think that it only takes seconds for something to happen and you lose your pet. You can make as much noise as you like and do the best you can, it won’t necessarily help.


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## Tiddlypom (13 November 2022)

I posted back in April about a woman whipping up a storm of outrage about a nasty man on the canal tow path who had kicked her dogs. She posted a photo of him.

Luckily she kicked up this storm on the local whatsapp group, of which the 'dog kicker', my OH, is an active and respected member. He put his side of the story just as the lady of the manor (yes, really) was demanding that he be reported to the police.

Our on lead dog was being harassed by this woman's two off lead dogs, while she very slowly made her way the 200 yards back along the tow path calling them ineffectively back. Yes, he did fend them off with his foot - what else was he supposed to do? Once the villagers realised that this horrid dog kicker was in fact the very kind and helpful Mr TP they shut up and slunk off, deserting the owner of the two aggressive dogs.

Defo two sides. This tale was growing bigger by the minute before OH put his side of it in.


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## ArklePig (13 November 2022)

I saw this on Facebook earlier and.... Just no. I don't feel bad posting it, they were stupid enough to do it and put it on a public page.


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## SaddlePsych'D (13 November 2022)

JFC just...why?!


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## splashgirl45 (13 November 2022)

OMG!!!  That is horrific ,  they must be mad, hope we don’t read bad news about this baby


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## skinnydipper (13 November 2022)

Aside from the obvious - brainless owners putting precious child at risk, that dog has hard eyes/hard stare.


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## Cinnamontoast (13 November 2022)

ArklePig said:



			I saw this on Facebook earlier and.... Just no. I don't feel bad posting it, they were stupid enough to do it and put it on a public page.
		
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Unbelievable 🤬 I don’t care how soppy it is and how well you know your dog, that’s just thick. The parent has no chance of getting the baby away if it accidentally pokes the dog and the dog reacts badly. ☹️ ‘Responsible’ dog owner?! Sad joke.


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## Smitty (14 November 2022)

Wow.  Just wow.  That's a disaster in the offing ...


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## On the Hoof (14 November 2022)

Tiddlypom said:



			I posted back in April about a woman whipping up a storm of outrage about a nasty man on the canal tow path who had kicked her dogs. She posted a photo of him.

Luckily she kicked up this storm on the local whatsapp group, of which the 'dog kicker', my OH, is an active and respected member. He put his side of the story just as the lady of the manor (yes, really) was demanding that he be reported to the police.

Our on lead dog was being harassed by this woman's two off lead dogs, while she very slowly made her way the 200 yards back along the tow path calling them ineffectively back. Yes, he did fend them off with his foot - what else was he supposed to do? Once the villagers realised that this horrid dog kicker was in fact the very kind and helpful Mr TP they shut up and slunk off, deserting the owner of the two aggressive dogs.

Defo two sides. This tale was growing bigger by the minute before OH put his side of it in.
		
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Well I had to use my foot to try and stop a large aggressive dog from keeping coming into my dog who i was struggling to control as she wanted to fly at the other dog, owner not there until last minute, calls his dog (great) but then shouts back at me , dont ever f****** kick my dog again......   I didnt bother to say anything, I assumed he was embarrased at his dogs  behaviour and shouted this to try and take back the moral high ground.


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## Moobli (14 November 2022)

I have heard all sorts of spurious reasons for dogs being off lead in an area signed with “Livestock.  Dogs on Leads”.  My dogs are stock broken but I’d never have them off lead around anyone else’s livestock. It’s a matter of courtesy as well as understanding all dogs, even well trained, can act unpredictably and my dogs are too precious to risk.

Edited original reply as the conversation had moved on.


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## Smitty (14 November 2022)

On the Hoof said:



			Well I had to use my foot to try and stop a large aggressive dog from keeping coming into my dog who i was struggling to control as she wanted to fly at the other dog, owner not there until last minute, calls his dog (great) but then shouts back at me , dont ever f****** kick my dog again......   I didnt bother to say anything, I assumed he was embarrased at his dogs  behaviour and shouted this to try and take back the moral high ground.
		
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I'm with you every inch of the way.  I do wonder if people are just plain embarrassed.  

And DON'T kick people's dogs, however horrid they are 😄.  (Dogs or humans)


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## SilverLinings (21 November 2022)

ArklePig said:



			I saw this on Facebook earlier and.... Just no. I don't feel bad posting it, they were stupid enough to do it and put it on a public page.
		
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The fact they are asking other 'responsible dog owners' to post pictures of their dogs too is a serious worry, I don't understand how they think what they've done with their dog is responsible- it is the complete opposite


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## CorvusCorax (2 December 2022)

Again just putting this here as no other relevant thread. 

Bimbling along the lane, literally just outside my gate, old boy on flexi but no more than a metre/normal lead length, head torch and mobile phone torch on me but in top pocket (for once 🤣)

Hear a noise, look around, see a light and there is a fella almost on top of me. I call out 'watch yourself there's a dog' and he keeps going and almost falls over him, makes a weird noise and carries on running.
Phone in hand, no warning, nothing, just heavy breathing.

As well as being shocked, I would also like to say that anyone who thinks a dog trained in bitework who completed in multiple working trials over many years is a dangerous animal, always on a hair trigger looking to bite someone...think again, he didn't even seem to notice 🤣😳


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## The Fuzzy Furry (2 December 2022)

CC, I liked your post for the final sentence 🤣


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## CorvusCorax (2 December 2022)

The Xmas Furry said:



			CC, I liked your post for the final sentence 🤣
		
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Honestly. Once I got over the shock of it I was like 'well thanks very much, pal, just as well it wasn't a mad axe murderer!!'


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## Cinnamontoast (4 December 2022)

Not irresponsible and we’ve come across these 3 labs before, they’re all nice, but at the ‘junction’, a 4 way bit in the woods, a lady with 3 labs had stopped to talk to a bloke with 2 labs. The dogs were milling round in the wooden kissing gate. Goose (Mr couldn’t care less about other dogs) went past no bother but Mitch needed a bit of encouragement, he’s wary of bigger dogs. It’s an awkward place to stop for a chat.

I’ve met 2 of my Year 7s in the deepest part of the woods this weekend, plus lots of lovely dogs. I’m glad Mitch is getting more confident and both of them just go past without interacting unless the other dog wants to play.


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## SaddlePsych'D (4 December 2022)

In a very large, very dog populated park yesterday. A surprising number actually on-lead which was kind of good to see. Most doing their own thing not bothering others. 

Two people walked past, a lead round the neck and a vague whistle (the kind that made me think it's just the noise you make to call a dog, not an actually trained cue) suggested they had a dog with them...somewhere. There were three candidates off-lead running around each other and I couldn't work out which was theirs. Unfussed, they carried on walking and nattering completely oblivious to their dog. Eventually they clocked it was actually quite far away from them and then stood their waving at it like a long-lost friend across the park. Folks, your dog knows exactly where you are, it does not care! They sort of started heading towards it as it bombed even further away from them. If it had come in our direction we could so easily have popped a spare lead on it and wandered off to our car; they were that far away before it had occurred to even check where their dog was let alone try recalling it.


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## Amymay (4 December 2022)

Christmascinnamoncookie said:



			Not irresponsible and we’ve come across these 3 labs before, they’re all nice, but at the ‘junction’, a 4 way bit in the woods, a lady with 3 labs had stopped to talk to a bloke with 2 labs. The dogs were milling round in the wooden kissing gate. Goose (Mr couldn’t care less about other dogs) went past no bother but Mitch needed a bit of encouragement, he’s wary of bigger dogs. It’s an awkward place to stop for a chat.

I’ve met 2 of my Year 7s in the deepest part of the woods this weekend, plus lots of lovely dogs. I’m glad Mitch is getting more confident and both of them just go past without interacting unless the other dog wants to play.
		
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I always stop in situations like that with an impassive ‘get out of the way’ look on my face.


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## Cinnamontoast (4 December 2022)

Amymay said:



			I always stop in situations like that with an impassive ‘get out of the way’ look on my face.
		
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The owners were off to the side, it was the 5 labs milling round that were bugging me. I call my lot out of the way to let other dogs past, it’s a bit intimidating to have that many all interested, although to be fair, 2 weren’t interested really. Bear was with Mitch-they’d overshot the gate slightly so came through together.

My OH came across the 2 samoyeds this week and they were annoying Bear. He doesn’t hold back, he was cross, one was trying to hump Bear!


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## Clodagh (5 December 2022)

Irresponsible sheep owners… the farmer has turned his ewes into my training field. (He does own it). That’s so inconsiderate. 🤣. He doesn’t mind me still training in there but my dummy throwing is rubbish and it feels a bit unfair on the sheep.


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## Moobli (5 December 2022)

Clodagh said:



			Irresponsible sheep owners… the farmer has turned his ewes into my training field. (He does own it). That’s so inconsiderate. 🤣. He doesn’t mind me still training in there but my dummy throwing is rubbish and it feels a bit unfair on the sheep.
		
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How big is the field?  If you train down one end the sheep will likely move to the other so no undue stress for either party 🙂


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## MurphysMinder (5 December 2022)

Clodagh said:



			Irresponsible sheep owners… the farmer has turned his ewes into my training field. (He does own it). That’s so inconsiderate. 🤣. He doesn’t mind me still training in there but my dummy throwing is rubbish and it feels a bit unfair on the sheep.
		
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Snap !   Looked out of the window this morning to see sheep in the field I have been doing baby tracks with my youngster.  Very inconsiderate.


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## wren123 (5 December 2022)

Walking our lab in the park yesterday this dog was sniffing her bottom intently I called her to me and we were walking, slowly to give the owner a chance to catch up and grab him, the owner calling him but he was taking no notice. The dog then tries to mount my 14 year old lab so I shouted at him to which he did respond, this happened a few times, eventually the owner caught up and grabbed him, not one word of apology, all I needed was a simple sorry.

I'm afraid I did lose it and as she walked off yelled at her that she should control her dog and apologise if she can't! My husband was horrified but it made me feel a lot better.

And yes I would have kicked the dog to get him off my bitch if necessary.


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## Clodagh (5 December 2022)

Merry Moobli said:



			How big is the field?  If you train down one end the sheep will likely move to the other so no undue stress for either party 🙂
		
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It’s a big old field. With hedges down the middle as well. I was feeling bad making them move away though, although they are pretty used to my lot from various field meets over the summer.


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## Landcruiser (5 December 2022)

Client at the vet where I work have just lost a lovely 10 yr old spaniel to an unprovoked attack by another dog. Staffie type apparently. The owner took his off lead dog and ran off, leaving our client's dog with terrible injuries. Their poor dog lasted for a few days but despite thousands of pounds worth of specialist veterinary care, the dog didn't make it. There are some real b@stards out there.


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## cauda equina (5 December 2022)

God poor owner and poor dog


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## Cinnamontoast (5 December 2022)

Landcruiser said:



			Client at the vet where I work have just lost a lovely 10 yr old spaniel to an unprovoked attack by another dog. Staffie type apparently. The owner took his off lead dog and ran off, leaving our client's dog with terrible injuries. Their poor dog lasted for a few days but despite thousands of pounds worth of specialist veterinary care, the dog didn't make it. There are some real b@stards out there.
		
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That's so awful. The poor owner, poor dog too to have suffered. I would honestly beat sh!te out of any dog that attacked mine, plenty of lumps of hardcore/stones/branches hanging round.


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## blackcob (5 December 2022)

Merry Moobli said:



			How big is the field?  If you train down one end the sheep will likely move to the other so no undue stress for either party 🙂
		
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We have fat spoiled pet sheep so the opposite happens, they come running and mug for food. 🤭

Sheep have been turned out on one of my home walks and I'm pleased as it means hardly anyone will use that route while they're there, for some reason 10 minutes on a lead to pass through that field is unacceptable even though the remaining 40 minutes of the circular route can be off lead. I think most people don't go further than the gate and just stand and fling a ball.


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## SaddlePsych'D (5 December 2022)

Landcruiser said:



			Client at the vet where I work have just lost a lovely 10 yr old spaniel to an unprovoked attack by another dog. Staffie type apparently. The owner took his off lead dog and ran off, leaving our client's dog with terrible injuries. Their poor dog lasted for a few days but despite thousands of pounds worth of specialist veterinary care, the dog didn't make it. There are some real b@stards out there.
		
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My god that is awful! It makes me so cross that people can do this/allow this and then walk away with absolutely no conscience or consequences.


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## CorvusCorax (5 December 2022)

So I admire the young fella with the staffie that goes running with him in the dark but FGS shout a warning or slow down when you see another light in the distance...the first pass took me totally by surprise and the staff was already barking and growling so little one went ballistic, was better prepped on the return leg with a handful of food and the leash my dominant hand 🤣


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## Cinnamontoast (5 December 2022)

Not an owner, but a polite jogger in the woods called out 'Comjng round to your right' but went round my left (both facing in the same direction 😂) so I reciprocated by telling him '3 on the track ahead' as Goose nearly went under his feet. 😱😳


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## maisie06 (7 December 2022)

Landcruiser said:



			Client at the vet where I work have just lost a lovely 10 yr old spaniel to an unprovoked attack by another dog. Staffie type apparently. The owner took his off lead dog and ran off, leaving our client's dog with terrible injuries. Their poor dog lasted for a few days but despite thousands of pounds worth of specialist veterinary care, the dog didn't make it. There are some real b@stards out there.
		
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Horrific, really upsets me posts like this...no need for it. I must admit if it were my dog I'd be searching for the attacker and I would  not hold back when I caught up with the owner...


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## skinnydipper (10 December 2022)

So fella, come through the park gate, let your delinquent dog off lead, spend the next 5 minutes whistling and shouting for it as it is rushes from dog to dog totally ignoring you, knocks a young cockerpoo off its feet, and then tell me it would be good for your dog to be told off by my dog.

Big mistake, fella.


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## Caol Ila (10 December 2022)

Not really irresponsible, just a bit clueless.

Out riding on a trail that goes next to reservoir along a high berm, with a slope on one side dropping into the reservoir, and a steeper grassy slope on the other side dropping towards the road. There's a high wall between the bottom of the large bank and the road. I do keep an eye out for dogs, though, because they like to run up and down the steep hill, and one popping up suddenly could startle the horse.

We had a guy with two collies approaching us. He was playing fetch with them, throwing a ball down the hill. Guy saw us and called the collies to him. Dogs seemed well trained, focused on owner and glued to his feet. Great! Then, as we were right beside him on a trail that's like two meters wide and not many places to go on either side, he chose that very moment to fling his ball down the bank. Fin startled and jumped forward at the sudden movement of the ball throwing and dogs taking off after it, more or less under his feet. Really, you could not have waited 20 seconds?


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## Smitty (10 December 2022)

He was probably trying to get the dogs out of your way in case the horse was scared of them!!  The next time you encounter him he will be hiding, with the dogs, in a bush so as not to startle your horse 😐


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## Cinnamontoast (10 December 2022)

My OH came across an xl bully today. It was being looked after by a friend of the owner. An off lead terrier approached it, xl bully (on the lead) had a pop. Off goes the terrier, back comes the terrier for another approach. Bully has another go, terrier is likely to lose its leg and an ear. Terrier’s owner apparently couldn’t recall it. 😢


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## wren123 (10 December 2022)

Omg that's awful @Christmascinnamoncookie


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## SEL (10 December 2022)

My brother was out for a run this afternoon and got bitten on his back. GS type, on a lead but lunged and he went past. 

Got a "oh he didn't really get you" type apology from the owners. Except it did get him and once he'd realised the skin was broken he went to the NHS drop in 

Second of my relatives to be bitten this year. I'd be mortified if I owned a dog which bit someone unprovoked


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## CorvusCorax (10 December 2022)

SEL said:



			My brother was out for a run this afternoon and got bitten on his back. GS type, on a lead but lunged and he went past.

Got a "oh he didn't really get you" type apology from the owners. Except it did get him and once he'd realised the skin was broken he went to the NHS drop in

Second of my relatives to be bitten this year. I'd be mortified if I owned a dog which bit someone unprovoked
		
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I always try and make my dogs sit and pay attention when bikes and joggers pass and the effusive thanks I usually get means I guess I am in the minority 
Apart from anything, it's good optics, NO ONE wants to see a German Shepherd off leash or out of control, even me.

My usual advice: arnica and a Dettol or Savlon bath as it will hurt more tomorrow.


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## Arzada (10 December 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			I always try and make my dogs sit and pay attention when bikes and joggers pass and the effusive thanks I usually get means I guess I am in the minority 

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You are and thank you (from someone whose experiences on shared paths include being attacked by a Doberman whose owner was out of view in a field, run into by an out of control oodle who ignored its pathetic owner and ambushed and taken down by a Springer (some distance behind its owner) who appeared from nowhere out of a ditch in front of the front wheel stopping the bike dead sending me flying and luckily rolling uninjured along the tarmac. This owner did apologise and offered to pay for damage to the bike). I check all walkers for a lead in their hand, slow for all pedestrians, children, dogs, horses, guinea fowl etc and thank everyone who shows consideration. Interestingly I very rarely receive thanks from those I have slowed for and even stopped. This thread has actually helped me because it seems that dog owners get an even worse time than I do on my bike. I don't know how you all cope.


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## Kunoichi73 (10 December 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			I always try and make my dogs sit and pay attention when bikes and joggers pass and the effusive thanks I usually get means I guess I am in the minority 
Apart from anything, it's good optics, NO ONE wants to see a German Shepherd off leash or out of control, even me.

My usual advice: arnica and a Dettol or Savlon bath as it will hurt more tomorrow.
		
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Many years back we got 2 GSDs from a local breeder. The first time we took them for a walk, we realised the male was reactivate towards joggers. We always kept him on a short lead and distracted him if a jogger approached. He was the biggest coward on the planet and would have run away if the jogger had faced up to him! However, obviously, joggers didn't know this, so for everyone's sake it was safer to keep him on the lead.

As a jogger, I try to cross the road or walk when approaching a dog. I've lost count of the number of people who think that their dog is under control on a long, extendible lead. I've also noticed, that dogs seem to react worse to me if I'm running in a baseball cap .


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## CorvusCorax (10 December 2022)

Arzada said:



			You are and thank you (from someone whose experiences on shared paths include being attacked by a Doberman whose owner was out of view in a field, run into by an out of control oodle who ignored its pathetic owner and ambushed and taken down by a Springer (some distance behind its owner) who appeared from nowhere out of a ditch in front of the front wheel stopping the bike dead sending me flying and luckily rolling uninjured along the tarmac. This owner did apologise and offered to pay for damage to the bike). I check all walkers for a lead in their hand, slow for all pedestrians, children, dogs, horses, guinea fowl etc and thank everyone who shows consideration. Interestingly I very rarely receive thanks from those I have slowed for and even stopped. This thread has actually helped me because it seems that dog owners get an even worse time than I do on my bike. I don't know how you all cope.
		
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I used to cycle with my dog, that was a nightmare on stilts!!

I know I am probably regarded as uptight but I do not let my dogs out of my sight. Partly to do with owning a breed that people are often fearful of/I want to enhance their reputation not ruin it, partly because...I love my dogs and don't want them to come to any harm?!

Sorry you've had crap experiences...it's a narrow path here for the most part and generally everyone thanks everyone for moving aside.
It was worse during lockdown when there were loads of newbies and some very rude folk on foot/running/wheels/with dogs....it's really helpful for me if someone calls out/rings a bell etc, I've been shouted at by people who've come up behind me very suddenly, but I don't have eyes in my arse 🤣


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## CorvusCorax (10 December 2022)

Kunoichi73 said:



			Many years back we got 2 GSDs from a local breeder. The first time we took them for a walk, we realised the male was reactivate towards joggers. We always kept him on a short lead and distracted him if a jogger approached. He was the biggest coward on the planet and would have run away if the jogger had faced up to him! However, obviously, joggers didn't know this, so for everyone's sake it was safer to keep him on the lead.

As a jogger, I try to cross the road or walk when approaching a dog. I've lost count of the number of people who think that their dog is under control on a long, extendible lead. I've also noticed, that dogs seem to react worse to me if I'm running in a baseball cap .
		
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My two boys are very laid back (see post the other night when a silent jogger nearly fell over him in the dark lol) but the female is very fixated on movement and would try and chase but....I don't give her the opportunity/have hopefully trained her not to.


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## Cinnamontoast (10 December 2022)

One of my Year 11s was bitten just under her glute by a Rottweiler on the way to school the other week. She needs a skin graft. 😢 The doctor told her they’d have trouble sourcing the graft as she’s so skinny.


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## Moobli (10 December 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			I always try and make my dogs sit and pay attention when bikes and joggers pass and the effusive thanks I usually get means I guess I am in the minority 
Apart from anything, it's good optics, NO ONE wants to see a German Shepherd off leash or out of control, even me.

My usual advice: arnica and a Dettol or Savlon bath as it will hurt more tomorrow.
		
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I’m the same and today when there were people and dogs all over the place, we put ours on the lead every time when passing others, making sure their focus was on us.  It’s a common courtesy and even more so when you own a breed that scares lots of people.
Hope your brother is ok SEL.


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## Moobli (10 December 2022)

Christmascinnamoncookie said:



			One of my Year 11s was bitten just under her glute by a Rottweiler on the way to school the other week. She needs a skin graft. 😢 The doctor told her they’d have trouble sourcing the graft as she’s so skinny.
		
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Poor kid 😞


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## Cinnamontoast (10 December 2022)

Merry Moobli said:



			Poor kid 😞
		
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She stood for days in lessons, it’s obviously on the bit where any sitting would impact on the wound.


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## Caol Ila (11 December 2022)

Arzada said:



			You are and thank you (from someone whose experiences on shared paths include being attacked by a Doberman whose owner was out of view in a field, run into by an out of control oodle who ignored its pathetic owner and ambushed and taken down by a Springer (some distance behind its owner) who appeared from nowhere out of a ditch in front of the front wheel stopping the bike dead sending me flying and luckily rolling uninjured along the tarmac. This owner did apologise and offered to pay for damage to the bike). I check all walkers for a lead in their hand, slow for all pedestrians, children, dogs, horses, guinea fowl etc and thank everyone who shows consideration. Interestingly I very rarely receive thanks from those I have slowed for and even stopped. This thread has actually helped me because it seems that dog owners get an even worse time than I do on my bike. I don't know how you all cope.
		
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I always thank cyclists who slow down for horses. All two of them. Most of them bomb past you. My horses are pretty good with bikes, but there's one trail that is a steep climb, with big rocky steps, blind corners, and mountain bikers take it downhill at _speeeed_. I get it. It's fun, and the trail is not that commonly used by horses. If I am riding Fin up it, it's pretty much a 'kiss your ass goodbye' moment if you run into a mountain biker descending it. The only safe way to take it on him is to have a foot soldier or bombproof horse in front of you if ascending, or behind you if descending.

Outwith that trail, my horses are very tolerant of cyclists, but when I am on a bike, I never pass horses I don't know with the speed and chutzpah of some of these people.

We had both horses out today (OH leading Hermosa) and watched a dog owner tackle their dauschound when it tried to run up to the horses. Comedy gold.


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## skinnydipper (11 December 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			I know I am probably regarded as uptight but I do not let my dogs out of my sight. Partly to do with owning a breed that people are often fearful of/I want to enhance their reputation not ruin it, partly because...I love my dogs and don't want them to come to any harm?!
		
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Merry Moobli said:



			I’m the same and today when there were people and dogs all over the place, we put ours on the lead every time when passing others, making sure their focus was on us. It’s a common courtesy
		
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That's experience. Thinking ahead, anticipating problems. Being aware that you have to think for others who seem incapable of thinking for themselves.

I live in town. We have a greater number of dog owning idiots per square mile than those lucky enough to live in a rural area so I get plenty of practise.


I don't think this forum is typical of the dog owning public.  We have many experienced owners and our forum first time owners are awesome


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## SEL (11 December 2022)

Merry Moobli said:



			I’m the same and today when there were people and dogs all over the place, we put ours on the lead every time when passing others, making sure their focus was on us.  It’s a common courtesy and even more so when you own a breed that scares lots of people.
Hope your brother is ok SEL.
		
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Thank you. Bruised and sore - he's also worried about taking his young daughter out in that area. 



Christmascinnamoncookie said:



			One of my Year 11s was bitten just under her glute by a Rottweiler on the way to school the other week. She needs a skin graft. 😢 The doctor told her they’d have trouble sourcing the graft as she’s so skinny.
		
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That's horrendous. Are the dog owners aware?


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## Sandstone1 (11 December 2022)

More of a inconsiderate runner today.   Was walking my dogs on a country footpath.  Both dogs off lead but under control.  Walking along minding our own business when almost taken out by a runner who charged past at full pelt.  No call of warning or anything.  wide path but he almost touched me as he ran past.  He had ear buds in and simply charged past.  Luckily my dogs took no notice but had they reacted Im sure he would have blamed me.  Dont think its much to ask for a warning call out.   He nearly mowed me down.


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## Cinnamontoast (12 December 2022)

SEL said:



			That's horrendous. Are the dog owners aware?
		
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Yes, I think mum was with her and is following up.


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## Crugeran Celt (14 December 2022)

ArklePigInBlanket said:



			I saw this on Facebook earlier and.... Just no. I don't feel bad posting it, they were stupid enough to do it and put it on a public page.
		
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It seems people never learn. How many times are we going to hear of a dog injuring or killing a child before they realise that doing this is not cute but really dangerous. Just why would anyone think that is ok?


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## SaddlePsych'D (14 December 2022)

Crugeran Celt said:



			It seems people never learn. How many times are we going to hear of a dog injuring or killing a child before they realise that doing this is not cute but really dangerous. Just why would anyone think that is ok?
		
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Because they used to be called 'nanny dogs' don't you know?

In all seriousness I have no idea but I do think there is something going on with some parents where they seem to have more affinity (not sure if that's quite the word I'm looking for) for their dog than their own children, so it's far more important to show off how great the dog is/how much of a protector it is than to do _their_ job of protecting their child. Is one hypothesis I have. Of course there's loads of possibilities. I don't think it's ignorance in many examples I've seen but wilful ignorance - they simply refuse to hear otherwise.


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## P3LH (17 December 2022)

Today we met a very alpha male dog owner with a pair of very boisterous twelve month old working line GSD litter brothers (no comment).

They were off lead playing wonderfully with my young male corgi, who was quite forgiving of the fact they had no manners or etiquette despite their owners military style approach to them. 

I gently warned him, several times, that my bitch was not so forgiving when they kept hassling her - he had a ‘she’s a small dog, they’re ‘proper’ dogs’ mentality without saying it. I think his ego was very bruised when my tiny Pembroke pinned one down and sat on its neck as she does with dogs she feels have no manners. I think it was even more of a bruised ego for the chap when that same dog then came skulking back up to her, head down and looking sheepish afterwards.

We headed off in the other direction at this point. He didn’t have a clue. Shame as both dogs were wonderful with lots of potential, just needed to be treated more like pups/adolescents with more basic manners and less bondage gear and bellowing. I imagine by summer I’ll only see him with one.


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## skinnydipper (21 December 2022)

skinnydipper said:



https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/baby-mauled-death-husky-dog-26422483

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Parents of baby Kyra King in court after Lincolnshire dog maul tragedy

https://www.itv.com/news/calendar/2...-mauled-to-death-by-husky-dog-appear-in-court


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## Clodagh (21 December 2022)

They haven’t had the dog put down? Dogs fault or not how could you bear to keep it?


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## Cinnamontoast (21 December 2022)

Bloke, possible dogwalker, 2 spitz/gsd on lead, several off lead, including a huge gsd, a huge show springer, a sibe. Goose said hello politely and was put on his bum with the gsd growling. Not gonna lie, I had a bit of a shout, he’s a wuss, not as much as Mitch, but he just got up and walked off when I told him. I’m not ecstatic that the guy didn’t say anything to the gsd. I don’t think there was anything too awful, but I’m probably overprotective after Zak.


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## Cinnamontoast (21 December 2022)

Clodagh said:



			They haven’t had the dog put down? Dogs fault or not how could you bear to keep it?
		
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Dexter said:



			trying again!

https://www.doggytreat.co.uk/anco-naturals

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I’m surprised it wasn’t immediately pts, the one with the lady in Caerphilly was, I think. Surely it’s been seized?


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## blackcob (21 December 2022)

Clodagh said:



			They haven’t had the dog put down? Dogs fault or not how could you bear to keep it?
		
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Back in November when this story was last reported it was noted to be seized, in kennels and an order was being sought to euthanise it.


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## splashgirl45 (22 December 2022)

Surely it should have been put down immediately, doesn’t really matter whose fault it was the dog killed a child and can’t be rehomed so why wait.  It’s better for the dog to be PTS quickly,  no one knows what sort of a life that dog had, maybe he had been starved or beaten and had a miserable life and now he is in kennels on his own , much more humane to be put down quickly..


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## ycbm (22 December 2022)

blackcob said:



			Back in November when this story was last reported it was noted to be seized, in kennels and an order was being sought to euthanise it.
		
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This is unbelievable.  The dog killed their child and they won't give permission for it to be PTS?  Perhaps they don't actually own it and the owner is refusing. The dog should have been dead months ago.  
.


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## skinnydipper (22 December 2022)

ycbm said:



			This is unbelievable.  The dog killed their child and they won't give permission for it to be PTS?  Perhaps they don't actually own it and the owner is refusing. The dog should have been dead months ago. 
.
		
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https://www.lincolnshireworld.com/n...at-woodhall-spa-appear-at-crown-court-3950546


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## CorvusCorax (22 December 2022)

Could I suggest that people don't make baseless suppositions about the lifestyle of the dog during a live court case? It'll all come out eventually without any of us stretching.


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## splashgirl45 (22 December 2022)

If that was directed at me I was trying to say that the dog MAY have had a bad time and was now , as has been stated, being kept in isolation, not good for any dog IMO, and it would be more humane for the dog to be PTS straight away.  I do realise that the exact details may be released eventually


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## CorvusCorax (22 December 2022)

Or we could wait for the people who's job it is to find out the details/facts and make the decisions, do that. None of us know anything yet.


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## skinnydipper (23 December 2022)

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-lincolnshire-64078112


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## CrunchieBoi (23 December 2022)

skinnydipper said:



https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-lincolnshire-64078112

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Who in the ever-loving f**k thinks walking 19 dogs at a time is a perfectly normal thing to do?


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## splashgirl45 (23 December 2022)

I have enough on my hands with 3.  You can’t possibly watch all 19 as I assume many of them were off lead, and to have a child with you as well, it’s unbelievable and tragic.

out walking in the pouring rain today I met a woman with a young rottie on lead. I usually see her husband with it and mine have all said hello and it’s a lovely friendly dog but not confident,  as we were walking round  the fields I asked if she was letting hers off, she said not at the moment so I said I would go a different way as I wanted to let mine off.  She then said she’s friendly so you can let yours off.  I went the other way as I feel that to let my 2 terriers and young lurcher harass the on lead rottie that is the way to make a friendly ,not confident dog into a non friendly dog.  I met her again and she was off lead and all went ok ..


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## Amymay (23 December 2022)

I have enough on my hands with 3. You can’t possibly watch all 19 as I assume many of them were off lead, and to have a child with you as well, it’s unbelievable and tragic.
		
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To be clear, these were huskies out on a training run.  Not being ‘walked’


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## splashgirl45 (23 December 2022)

so are they all on leads or were they pulling a rig.?


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## Amymay (23 December 2022)

splashgirl45 said:



			so are they all on leads or were they pulling a rig.?
		
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No idea what they were doing at the specific time.


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## splashgirl45 (23 December 2022)

I have no idea what is involved with huskies on a training run so was curious


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## blackcob (23 December 2022)

IME it's most usual for the dogs to be either in the (caged) van or tethered on stakeouts, then hitched up to the training vehicle in smaller teams. They are not walked off lead.


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## splashgirl45 (24 December 2022)

Thankyou Black cob,  I didn’t know that was what happens so I can understand why 19 dogs could have been managed , but obviously something went badly wrong in this case


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## MurphysMinder (24 December 2022)

The report I read said the dogs were being put in the van at the time of the attack.


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## Ceifer (25 December 2022)

Didn’t want to start a new thread but had to have a rant 🤣.

Staying with my in-laws over Christmas. They’re quite elderly and miss having a dog so found a solution when their neighbour suggested borrowing their dog.

For context the neighbours purchased this dog as a puppy when they were told they couldn’t have children. Two years later They then did conceive and were paranoid about the dog hurting the baby so it spends about 80% of its life with my in-laws now.

The owners have gone on holiday and left it with my in-laws.

I am staggered at how badly behaved the dog is through lack of training.

It barks incessantly, everything that moves it barks. Even things that don’t move it barks. A high pitched screechy yap.

It barks in the night. It doesn’t sleep through the night and gets my MIL up every 2 hours to let it out. No wonder the owners dump it round here every night.

My in-laws are incapable of walking the dog so the agreement is it’s owners walk it. We’ve discovered it only goes out once round the block for exercise once a day (approximately 3 mins walk) as the owners say it’s vicious.
I took it out for a good walk today and would say it’s nervous out and about and a bit vocal but was fine. Clearly needs a lot more exercise than it’s getting.

I really can’t understand why they have this poor dog.


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## CorvusCorax (27 December 2022)

This is why you sort this stuff out. Quickly. I'm not her biggest fan but a dog 'only being friendly/just playing' can lead to a life changing injury for someone else.

https://www.mirror.co.uk/3am/celebrity-news/im-celebs-edwina-currie-rushed-28819959


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## skinnydipper (27 December 2022)

Today I was told of a Frenchie, off lead, being walked on the pavement who ran in front of a car and was killed.  The owner was very abusive to the car driver and was kicking the car.

Walking your friend off lead near a road isn't smart.


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## paddy555 (27 December 2022)

CorvusCorax said:



			This is why you sort this stuff out. Quickly. I'm not her biggest fan but a dog 'only being friendly/just playing' can lead to a life changing injury for someone else.

https://www.mirror.co.uk/3am/celebrity-news/im-celebs-edwina-currie-rushed-28819959

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I read that in another paper and without doubt the dog should have been on a lead. I was surprised when I read it that she had a totally mashed hip and was on the floor in agony. I have known people who have fallen and broken their hips. They have had to stay exactly were they fell until the ambulance arrived, they couldn't move. They were in too much pain.  They definitely wouldn't have been able to hobble around for 12 days before doing something about it.


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## Errin Paddywack (28 December 2022)

paddy555 said:



			They definitely wouldn't have been able to hobble around for 12 days before doing something about it.
		
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A woman I worked with had an operation on her bladder, afterwards she was in tremendous pain and struggling to walk.  Several weeks later the doctor finally took her seriously and sent her for x-ray.  Both hips were broken and had to be replaced.  She had osteoporosis and it was thought the way she was handled for the bladder op broke her hips.  So, yes some people can walk around with a broken hip.


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## splashgirl45 (28 December 2022)

I switched channels to see it’s me or the dog and a family are having trouble with their new puppy.  They are first time dog owners and have bought a pocket bully…..it’s scarey but hopefully Victoria will put them straight..


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## Amymay (28 December 2022)

splashgirl45 said:



			I switched channels to see it’s me or the dog and a family are having trouble with their new puppy.  They are first time dog owners and have bought a pocket bully…..it’s scarey but hopefully Victoria will put them straight..
		
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Wonderful woman


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## SaddlePsych'D (31 December 2022)

Ivy would like to nominate me as irresponsible owner today. Specifically me as it was 100% my grand idea to 'take advantage' of the torrential rain in the hopes of finding it quieter so we could give Ivy some off lead time. Her raincoat did a great job but there was much stopping and RSPCA face on the way. She did at least get some good runs in. We're now home and she's smoothing her face all over everything, occasionally looking at me in disgust. She is taking applications for new owners 😂

Annoyingly it wasn't actually that quiet out despite the really awful weather so a little trickier to find an off lead spot than I hoped, not helped by high speed collie after ball flinger - big no for our recall practice! Amazingly no incidents though.


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## Landcruiser (31 December 2022)

SaddlePsych'D said:



			Ivy would like to nominate me as irresponsible owner today. Specifically me as it was 100% my grand idea to 'take advantage' of the torrential rain in the hopes of finding it quieter so we could give Ivy some off lead time. Her raincoat did a great job but there was much stopping and RSPCA face on the way. She did at least get some good runs in. We're now home and she's smoothing her face all over everything, occasionally looking at me in disgust. She is taking applications for new owners 😂
		
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My OH is out with our 3 right now, "before it rains again." Except it's peeing down, torrential, in sheets


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## SaddlePsych'D (31 December 2022)

Usually I wouldn't take her in heavy rain as she really does hate it. And the mud. It was only because she did full zooms round the house yesterday so I thought she'd benefit from burning off the Christmas excitement a bit more.

There were some completely soaked through dogs absolutely loving it and then Ivy, stood there, deeply unimpressed and considering her revenge.


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## Cinnamontoast (31 December 2022)

OH just got back with our three: everyone is soaked and filthy. I’ll be getting out the hairdryer once the towelling robes have soaked up the worst of it.


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## DressageCob (1 January 2023)

paddy555 said:



			I read that in another paper and without doubt the dog should have been on a lead. I was surprised when I read it that she had a totally mashed hip and was on the floor in agony. I have known people who have fallen and broken their hips. They have had to stay exactly were they fell until the ambulance arrived, they couldn't move. They were in too much pain.  They definitely wouldn't have been able to hobble around for 12 days before doing something about it.
		
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It's amazing how some people manage. My grandma had a fall last year and the hospital fobbed her off. She kept going until she fell again (she was walking fine for an 84 year old, going up and down stairs, in and out of the bath etc) around 6 months later. The hospital that time did an x-ray followed by a CT (I think) and found that she broke her hip in the new fall, and had 7 healing fractures in her pelvis from the earlier one. It was basically shattered but because it wasn't displaced she was coping.


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## Smitty (2 January 2023)

Well, I met some friends for lunch in a dog friendly pub yesterday.   I was so embarrassed.   I am  used to my friends dogs licking plates, eating off forks and getting on tables, but a dog behaviourist  who was staying with a friend, took it to a completely new level by allowing her dog to roam free in the pub and introduce itself to all the other customers dogs who were attempting to sit quietly under their owners tables.  At one point there was a bit of barking and growling, but even this did not elicit any attempt to restrain said dog, she merely said someone was telling someone else off but she didn't know who ...    

I was very glad I had left my dog at home and next time I will ask who's going !!!


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## cauda equina (2 January 2023)

Blimey, when I read 'dog behaviourist' I assume it's to do with good behaviour but that's obviously not always the case!


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## Clodagh (2 January 2023)

Smitty said:



			Well, I met some friends for lunch in a dog friendly pub yesterday.   I was so embarrassed.   I am  used to my friends dogs licking plates, eating off forks and getting on tables, but a dog behaviourist  who was staying with a friend, took it to a completely new level by allowing her dog to roam free in the pub and introduce itself to all the other customers dogs who were attempting to sit quietly under their owners tables.  At one point there was a bit of barking and growling, but even this did not elicit any attempt to restrain said dog, she merely said someone was telling someone else off but she didn't know who ...   

I was very glad I had left my dog at home and next time I will ask who's going !!!
		
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I work in a pub and apparently it’s absolutely fine to let your dog wander loose, or even on a long line (both are fabulous news for very busy wait staff). Extra points for it sitting and dribbling by another persons table.


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## MurphysMinder (2 January 2023)

I've seen people in pubs with dogs on flexis making no attempt to control them, even though they are annoying other people and nearly tripping staff.  A friend and I will sit outside pubs/cafes with our 2 GSDs but they are just too big to take in, not fair on other customers or staff.


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## Kunoichi73 (2 January 2023)

Flexi leads are the worst! I'm sure idiot people think that having a dog on one means it's fully under control, even when it's on the other side of the room/pavement! When I go for a run, I dread seeing a dog on one of these!


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## Sussexbythesea (3 January 2023)

I’ve met this woman out riding and out walking my dog on several occasions. Saw her today so it reminded me. She has an enormous Rottweiler unmuzzled. When she spots you she stops and ties the dog to something and then stands with it getting it to sit. So far it’s been ok but to my mind if you can’t control your dog without tying it to something you shouldn’t be walking it in a public place. The fence is rotten where she tied it and I dread to think what could happen if it launched itself and the fence broke.


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## misst (3 January 2023)

SussexbytheXmasTree said:



			I’ve met this woman out riding and out walking my dog on several occasions. Saw her today so it reminded me. She has an enormous Rottweiler unmuzzled. When she spots you she stops and ties the dog to something and then stands with it getting it to sit. So far it’s been ok but to my mind if you can’t control your dog without tying it to something you shouldn’t be walking it in a public place. The fence is rotten where she tied it and I dread to think what could happen if it launched itself and the fence broke.
		
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Terrifying! It just beggers belief that people keep dogs like this. To my mind it must be a nightmare trying to cope with this. I know there are people on here who are able to manage/micromanage their dogs environments well, I have no beef with them. But for goodness sake the average person needs a well behaved manageable sized friendly companion that does not need them to "manage" it constantly. I could not live like this. I am small, in my 60s and know I do not have the skills or physique to manage a large breed. I have 2 small terriers who have good recall and manners though one is reactive if pushed as a rehome from being a stray.

My dogs are not perfect but they do not attack dogs, children, horses, people, postmen, cars, bikes etc. I put them on lead around big boisterous dogs and on roads, near car parks etc. I would be mortified if either of them or my previous dogs behaved aggressively. I cannot see how anyone gets pleasure from keeping dogs that cause other people fear and misery.


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## blackcob (3 January 2023)

Got stalked by a big, Australian-style doodle today - plonked itself down in the middle of the path a long way off from its owners and stared, leaving me in absolute and certain knowledge that it would launch as we passed. Unfortunately this is #1 fear of small dog, who froze on the spot. I was reassured twice that the dog was very friendly, and responded twice that my dog was not, no really, we do not want to be jumped on, please. A standoff with some ineffectual pipping of a whistle ensued before I gave up waiting and handbagged small dog to get past it. Sodden wet bastard thing did launch and collided with my leg.


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## Clodagh (3 January 2023)

blackcob said:



			Got stalked by a big, Australian-style doodle today - plonked itself down in the middle of the path a long way off from its owners and stared, leaving me in absolute and certain knowledge that it would launch as we passed. Unfortunately this is #1 fear of small dog, who froze on the spot. I was reassured twice that the dog was very friendly, and responded twice that my dog was not, no really, we do not want to be jumped on, please. A standoff with some ineffectual pipping of a whistle ensued before I gave up waiting and handbagged small dog to get past it. Sodden wet bastard thing did launch and collided with my leg.
		
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I think you are being very unreasonable and interfering with doodledogs interactions with other dogs in a negative way. 
🤪


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## blackcob (3 January 2023)

I'm not sure I'd consider him a dog in that scenario, more of a furious, weaponised fruitbat. It was better off with the knee 😜


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## Gloi (3 January 2023)

MurphysMinder said:



			I've seen people in pubs with dogs on flexis making no attempt to control them, even though they are annoying other people and nearly tripping staff.  A friend and I will sit outside pubs/cafes with our 2 GSDs but they are just too big to take in, not fair on other customers or staff.
		
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I had my scone stolen by a dog on a Flexi lead in a cafe. I did persuade the owner to get me another one though. I wasn't missing out even though I had been in a world of my own and not notice the approach.


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## Smitty (4 January 2023)

Gloi said:



			I had my scone stolen by a dog on a Flexi lead in a cafe. I did persuade the owner to get me another one though. I wasn't missing out even though I had been in a world of my own and not notice the approach.
		
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You did better than I did when a lab towed a woman over to where sis and I were sitting by the SJ ring at some horse trials and started scoffing my chips.  It was a tank and it took a few seconds for me to regain control of the chips.   No apology, oh no, she said the dog had only eaten a few.   What I wish I had done was smeared them in her face and told her to eat them along with the dog slobber 🤢


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## Clodagh (4 January 2023)

Smitty said:



			You did better than I did when a lab towed a woman over to where sis and I were sitting by the SJ ring at some horse trials and started scoffing my chips.  It was a tank and it took a few seconds for me to regain control of the chips.   No apology, oh no, she said the dog had only eaten a few.   What I wish I had done was smeared them in her face and told her to eat them along with the dog slobber 🤢
		
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😳.
Mind you I lost my kelpie, many years ago at a point to point and found her eating quails eggs in the members car park. I confess I grabbed her and bolted. There were no witnesses 😁


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## MurphysMinder (4 January 2023)

Many years ago I was walking round Weston Park horse trials with my GSD and she managed to remove the ice cream from a cone being carried by a small child,  I swear she didn't even break stride.   Luckily the parents thought it was hilarious,  and I did buy the little one another ice cream.


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## Cinnamontoast (4 January 2023)

Years back, Brig was loose on the playing field, nice sunny day. A woman came up to me and told me he’d nicked her little boy’s sausage roll. I was shamed and apologised repeatedly. I offered to go and get some money, I had nothing with me. She declined and said she just wanted me to know.

Another time, he knocked over a fisherman’s tin of sweetcorn and started to inhale it. So embarrassing!


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## Pearlsasinger (4 January 2023)

Many years ago, we had a Lab bitch who went to join a family party as we walked past a house!  The footpath went through the garden, we had called the dogs to heel, as usual, to go through the garden. It was a long house with all doors at the front.
Lab peeled off and ran in through the kitchen  door, went through the house and out through the open French windows to rejoin us as we went through the gate j to the wood.  We have no idea what she did inside but we knew the family quite well, they had dogs of their own, and they insisted afterwards that they hadn't noticed her.


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## skinnydipper (4 January 2023)

Christmascinnamoncookie said:



			Another time, he knocked over a fisherman’s tin of sweetcorn and started to inhale it. So embarrassing!
		
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I blame the fishermen 

They lay out their bait - hotdogs, spam, cheese, bread and sweetcorn - it's like a smorgasbord for dogs.


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## skinnydipper (4 January 2023)

skinnydipper said:



			I was furious this morning. My lovely dog was crying, trying to get away from the persistent red lab who was all over her and whose hackles were up from neck to tail. I tried to grab it, then shouted to chase it away.

Meanwhile the owner was saying I'm sorry, I'm sorry, over and over, like that's going to help.

I have never known things as bad as they are now. Out of control dogs. Ignorant, useless owners.

*If you have no control of your dog, any dog, never mind one who could so easily tip over into aggression - keep it on a fecking lead. Is that really so hard?*

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Well, it seems she wasn't really sorry because she allowed the dog to do exactly the same thing to another dog that I know.

A friend's dog recently had a stroke and following a week in a specialist referral hospital getting her back on her feet,  she is home and slowly regaining mobility. Improving but still unsteady she was enjoying a quiet lead walk when she was accosted by the lab who she gamely tried to see off, twice.


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## YorksG (4 January 2023)

At the Cheshire show, B rotter, very politely, offered to demonstrate, to a very little girl, how to eat ice cream. Fortunately I realised what she was doing and moved her out of the way, but she obviously thought that the child didn't know what to do, as she was waving the cone about.  She did have her 15 minutes of fame, while eating an ice cream, she was on the local news on their round up of bramham🤣


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## maisie06 (4 January 2023)

CorvusCorax said:



			This is why you sort this stuff out. Quickly. I'm not her biggest fan but a dog 'only being friendly/just playing' can lead to a life changing injury for someone else.

https://www.mirror.co.uk/3am/celebrity-news/im-celebs-edwina-currie-rushed-28819959

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That's awful - she should sue, I would, 

Did anyone else notice how badly written the article was though!!


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## maisie06 (4 January 2023)

blackcob said:



			Got stalked by a big, Australian-style doodle today - plonked itself down in the middle of the path a long way off from its owners and stared, leaving me in absolute and certain knowledge that it would launch as we passed. Unfortunately this is #1 fear of small dog, who froze on the spot. I was reassured twice that the dog was very friendly, and responded twice that my dog was not, no really, we do not want to be jumped on, please. A standoff with some ineffectual pipping of a whistle ensued before I gave up waiting and handbagged small dog to get past it. Sodden wet bastard thing did launch and collided with my leg.
		
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my boot would have collided with it's arse!!


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## misst (4 January 2023)

My current dogs will try a crafty attempt to steal from family members but out and about don't get the opportunity. My old JRT was a brilliant opportunist and ate a live fish from a bucket next to a fisherman. She sort of ran over stuck her head in the bucket and swallowed the fish head first with her neck extended like a heron. It was amazing to watch but we had to beat a hasty retreat as the fisherman was not amused and was not very graciously accepting of my profuse apologies. 

She was a cracking little dog but ate anything and everything. She ate the farriers marmite sandwiches in his van including the cling film, she entered a tent (wild campers that I had not noticed) and came out with a packet of ?sausages?meat of some sort? and headed off into the distance only returning after a few minutes looking very satisfied. She ate a whole chocolate orange one Christmas (a lot for a 5kg dog) and a large packet of fudge another year. I still miss her.


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## Marnie (Saturday at 17:37)

I'm just looking some thoughts... To give a bit of background I live on a beef farm that has a footpath running through the middle along a hardstanding track, part way along, the path splits and goes left across one field and right across another. At the moment, the only animals out are my two ponies - all the cows are in. In the summer, when cows are grazing, I either avoid walking through the grazing fields or Bunny is on a lead. At the moment, I take advantage of there being nothing out to take Bunny round the farm off lead - we go up the first part of the footpath and then tend to walk the fields off the footpath checking fences and gates, crop growth, ditches etc. We bump into the odd person walking their dog, generally people and dogs that we know. 

Today, Bunny and I were on the hardstanding track checking the ponies when someone came up from the bottom of the track with a lab on a lead (makes a change, people don't normally bother - a whole other story!). Bunny was off lead and she ran towards the man and dog, she didn't bark and she didn't reach them - she is very friendly with other dogs but I fully appreciate that the man's dog may not be. I hadn't noticed him approaching straight away as I was talking to the ponies. As soon as I did, I called Bunny back - she should have come back quicker than she did but she did come back. However, the man and dog turned round and went back the way they came.

My question is was I being irresponsible? Bunny and I were 'at home' on our own farm, should she be on a lead while on the footpath bearing in mind that although her recall is generally very good she can be a bit slow as she was today. If we weren't on our own farm then she would definitely be on a lead. Thoughts welcomed!


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## Amymay (Saturday at 17:44)

No you weren’t being irresponsible.


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## Errin Paddywack (Saturday at 18:53)

No you weren't being irresponsible.  I never have mine on lead on our own land, we also have a footpath along one side.  One of mine can also be a bit slow to respond though getting better and I know she won't have a go as she is very wary about getting too close.


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## Escapade (Saturday at 19:46)

Not irresponsible imo, you took action when you noticed him. It's the ones who are completely oblivious to the world around them and do nothing to gather their dogs when they cause trouble that I get annoyed with 🤣


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## BBP (Saturday at 20:58)

It is tricky where a farm dog is off lead as the owner usually isn’t paying full attention to the dog so may not clock the situation quickly, but it sounds like you handled it well. However like that man I would also have turned and gone the other way if I was approached by an off lead dog, just to keep mine away from any trouble.

I had a scenario where I was walking on a footpath between some farm buildings with my dog reactive collie on lead and 3 (or may have been 4?!) large German shepherds came running out from the farm barking. One stopped at a distance and the other 2/3 came charging up to my dog and I and circled us sniffing him. I shouted for someone to call the dogs off but there was no one to be seen. I must have been there for 5 mins or so (which felt like a lifetime!) before I was able to back away and go back the way I came. Thankfully the GSD’s actually appeared to be well socialised and were just checking out the intruder into their territory and my dog clearly realised he was massively outgunned and decided it would be in his best interests not to take a pop at anyone. In that circumstance I did think the owners were irresponsible, no matter how well socialised their dogs it is still a public footpath with no warning signs so to have 4 GSDs running loose with no person keeping eye on them didn’t feel responsible.


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## Marnie (Sunday at 08:10)

Thank you, it's the first time it has really come up and it's really helpful to get people's thoughts. I try really hard not to be irresponsible as I see so much of it out and about on the farm - dogs off lead in fields with cows and calves, people not on the footpath (in some cases in different fields!), leaving internal and external gates open (that aren't on footpaths, we've had to put locks on as we've ended up with groups of cows mixing) dogs off lead on the track with no recall getting in the way of the tractor and JCB when feeding or doing fieldwork etc.


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## Moobli (Sunday at 08:49)

I don’t think you were being irresponsible at all.  You called your dog back quickly.  
I live on a farm too and there’s the right to responsible access in Scotland (so you get people in the most unlikely places sometimes!), as well as a heritage trail that runs close to my cottage and on to the hills behind.  Inevitably occasionally the sheepdogs have been let out the kennels just as walkers, runners or mountain bikers appear 🙈.  We always call them back immediately, and they are never left roaming free but I’m sure on a few occasions over the years the dogs may have given people cause for slight alarm.  Recently we’ve put up kennel sections between our garden and the kennel area/yard so we can let dogs out and clean kennels without the fear of the dogs accosting anyone (as you can’t see the footpath from the yard) and that’s working really well.


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## Moobli (Sunday at 08:55)

BBP that must have been pretty frightening.  As you know, I have GSDs myself and love the breed, but they are scary to a lot of people and I would also have felt pretty intimidated by being surrounded by them on their own territory.
Similar happened to me when following a footpath that took me through a farmyard.  No farmer in sight and I got surrounded by 4/5 collies and working beardies all barking and one tried to bite my GSD.  Thankfully he had hold of his precious ball and was a fairly non confrontational dog but it wasn’t a pleasant experience.  The farmer eventually came out of his house and shouted at the dogs who all skulked away and he apologised so no real harm done, but next time I walked that way I carried a stick 😂. I don’t know if he’d had complaints over the lockdown period when every man and his cat were out walking but his dogs were now in a pen except one male collie that just followed us cocking his leg up everything.


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