# Foaming at the mouth



## Eloisee (16 July 2014)

Hi, in new to this site and really need some help/advice, it's going to be a long post!
3 weeks ago my pony Arab X started foaming at the mouth along with really chewing/chomping all the time. Previously he is a tooth grinder but that's not the issue..
He was constantly foaming thick white froth and it was up the walls and over his stable door and also in field. He wasn't grazing as much was was eating his dinner but very slowly and not eating much hay. And all the while chomping/grinding his teeth. 
2 weeks ago he really went downhill, not his usual grumpy self, really unenthuastic, not eating etc
 I have had the dentist out twice in a week and his mouth is causing no problem. 
Then the vet who said his soft pallet looked swollen. 
Today he had an endoscope done and they found nothing! They used two different endoscope and then conducted and ultra sound. 
In the last week he isn't foaming copious amounts as before and is grazing and eating his hard feed better but he's still not right. Does anyone have any idea  what it could be? Or experienced anything similar? The vet has put him on a 3 week bute trial


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## Pingypo (16 July 2014)

Hi!

I have heard that this is common in Arabs although I am not entirely sure why so maybe research that one! Also I know of a horse with the same problem that was checked out by dentist, vet, etc. and discovered a while later that the horse had an ulcer deep inside the mouth, way behind the molars. If an ulcer is present, the horse may foam at the mouth because of sucking at the ulcer to relieve discomfort. This may also cause pain for the horse while eating. Has your horse lost weight? 

A form of clover (Trifolium Pratense) can also be responsible, in some horses, for foaming at the mouth although this depends on where you live!! What age is your horse?

Hope some of this might help!!


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## Tiffany (16 July 2014)

If he's out in the field it could be an allergic reaction to something or even a wasp/bee sting


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## Pingypo (16 July 2014)

good point! Could also be reaction to something poisonous that the horse has eaten, although most symptoms of poisoning would be apparent v soon after it has been consumed, wouldn't they? rabies is also a possibility, but I think you would know if your horse had rabies because of other symptoms. You case doesn't sound like it and foaming of the mouth is usually one of the last symptoms of it ... so no reason to panic about that I don't think!!!


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## Eloisee (17 July 2014)

How would we be able to find a deep ulcer? He has lost a slight bit of weight but normally he is fairly round so many haven't noticed 
Yes, I've heard about the clover but he has been on same yard for 2 years and ate it last year no problem .. 
Also, on the endoscope there was foam all the way down? Does that mean anything? All the way to his stomach was thick spilt like foam 
He is 16 years old 

Thanks for the help


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## NZJenny (17 July 2014)

Having owned and ridden Arabians for over 20 years, I have heard a lot of drivel about them.  But foaming at the mouth, as suggested by Pingypo, has to be about the worse.

Eloisee, I have no idea about your boy, but good luck.


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## Surreydeb (17 July 2014)

Found this?

Slobber cases commonly occur in the spring and fall and are associated with humid, wet weather and the presence of clover in pastures and fields. Red clover is important because the fungus Rhizoctonia leguminicola preferentially infects this type of clover and, given the optimal conditions of temperature and moisture, produces the mycotoxin slaframine (1-acetoxy-6-amino-octahydroindolizine), also called slobber factor. Slaframine causes excessive salivation, lacrimation and weight loss with long-term exposure and may even cause diarrhea and colic in some individuals. Clover and other plants affected with R. leguminicola exhibit bronze to black patches or rings on their stems and leaves. Slaframine poisoning has consequently also been referred to as black patch disease.

The mycotoxin slaframine can be active in stored hay for up to 10 months, but its biologic activity decreases with time. Fresh hay may contain 50 to 100 ppm of slaframine, and concentrations above 10 ppm have been associated with clinical signs in horses.

Atropine has been used to provide some relief from diarrhea and salivation, and electrolyte supplementation is important to offset the high potassium losses in saliva. Most horses experience no significant clinical signs, however, and this "poisoning" quickly resolves (48 to 72 hours) after withdrawal from the contaminated forage or weather changes that no longer support the growth of R. leguminicola in pasture.


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## Exploding Chestnuts (17 July 2014)

I would try him in the stable for a few days on a plain diet,  if it is ongoing reaction to a poison in the field then this should stop. Sorry no other suggestions, except vet should be doing some homework for you.
It looks more like a physical problem, but one can't be sure.


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## Pingypo (17 July 2014)

Sorry, just going by what I've heard. I think that ulcer I was saying about was found after a few previous visits by the dentist. It was in an awkward place, and not very visible. I'm sure your dentist has had a really good check but if you get no further with this, it might be a good idea to suggest it to the dentist? Also have heard this common in older horses (16 isn't that old just older!!) The clover thing sometimes depends on the weather/climate etc so sometimes may affect a horse more one year compared to another. Also, the clover could be in the hay??  Definitely talk to your vet and ask some more questions!!

Good luck!!!!


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## Zuzzie (17 July 2014)

Surreydeb said:



			Found this?

Slobber cases commonly occur in the spring and fall and are associated with humid, wet weather and the presence of clover in pastures and fields. Red clover is important because the fungus Rhizoctonia leguminicola preferentially infects this type of clover and, given the optimal conditions of temperature and moisture, produces the mycotoxin slaframine (1-acetoxy-6-amino-octahydroindolizine), also called slobber factor. Slaframine causes excessive salivation, lacrimation and weight loss with long-term exposure and may even cause diarrhea and colic in some individuals. Clover and other plants affected with R. leguminicola exhibit bronze to black patches or rings on their stems and leaves. Slaframine poisoning has consequently also been referred to as black patch disease.

The mycotoxin slaframine can be active in stored hay for up to 10 months, but its biologic activity decreases with time. Fresh hay may contain 50 to 100 ppm of slaframine, and concentrations above 10 ppm have been associated with clinical signs in horses.

Atropine has been used to provide some relief from diarrhea and salivation, and electrolyte supplementation is important to offset the high potassium losses in saliva. Most horses experience no significant clinical signs, however, and this "poisoning" quickly resolves (48 to 72 hours) after withdrawal from the contaminated forage or weather changes that no longer support the growth of R. leguminicola in pasture.
		
Click to expand...

Great post!


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## Exploding Chestnuts (17 July 2014)

Zuzzie said:



			Great post!
		
Click to expand...

If someone is pasting stuff they should give us the source, it could be Wikpedia which is not always correct.


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## applecart14 (17 July 2014)

Grass slobers - isn't it a reaction to too much clover in the grass?  This can also cause ataxia, especially red clover.

Can also be due to ingesting other poisons including creasote.


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## starry23 (17 July 2014)

Pingypo said:



			good point! Could also be reaction to something poisonous that the horse has eaten, although most symptoms of poisoning would be apparent v soon after it has been consumed, wouldn't they? rabies is also a possibility, but I think you would know if your horse had rabies because of other symptoms. You case doesn't sound like it and foaming of the mouth is usually one of the last symptoms of it ... so no reason to panic about that I don't think!!!
		
Click to expand...

We don't have rabies in the UK. So, if you are in the UK, I'd say you can rule that out. No other ideas but I hope you can get to the bottom of it and it is nothing worrying.


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## Eloisee (17 July 2014)

I hope it's nothing to serious and I feel if it was they would have more of an idea. 
Going to ask around the yard about the clover thing but I don't know that it's the cause since he's been in the same field two years. Though I won't rule it out! 
Vet said maybe behavioural, but why now? And surely if it was behavioural he would still still be eating and not be out of character? 
I'm going to try and get a video up tonight and I'll post back here with it


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## Madabouthorses (17 July 2014)

So sorry to hear about your horse. Hope he is better but in reading the posts about clover and in hay. Two years ago my horse was eating his hay, not foaming but a lot of saliva found the hay had horse nettle in it. It was supposed to be good quality hay that I bought but that year a lot of other people saw horse nettle in the hay to. May not be that but worth looking into also if you think it might be an ulcer why not start him on u-guard it comes in pellet form and a tiny scoop morning and night might do the trick it certainly doesn't hurt them. Good luck hope you find the answer soon!


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## Eloisee (17 July 2014)

Can you get u-guard for from good tack shops? My yard can be a bit critical at times and don't want to use anything I'm insure about


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## CNcoyote (18 July 2014)

A lot of times horses start to foam because of the material the bit is made of. Copper and lead bits are common materials that cause foaming. For the grinding, I ride a mare that resists any contact by grinding but I'm not really sure


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