# Clueless stud dog?



## Paint Me Proud (27 June 2012)

Has anyone ever heard of an entire male failing to mate an in season bitch who is happy to stand and present?

Both dogs are 4 years old, maiden breeders.


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## Dry Rot (27 June 2012)

Yes. Not unusual. I generally leave them together in a large run, if possible, and leave them to it for a few days! Sometimes bitches appear to be receptive but the dog knows they are not spot on and won't risk getting bitten. Others need an introduction period (fore play). Others are just fussy! But leaving well alone together often works for mine.


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## RLD (27 June 2012)

When my dog had her litter we tried to use a dog that had only sired one litter previously. Although the enthusiasm was there the technique wasn't! In the end we used that dog's father as we had tried for a couple of days and didn't want to miss the window. 

The dog was used on some more experienced bitches after and now has no trouble. I have also heard about other dogs that show little interest or some that have needed a 'helping hand' to get them started in their stud careers!


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## UnaB (27 June 2012)

Oooh, dont get me started!!!

Travelled all the way to scotland (from gloucestershire) to mate my bitch and the dog had NO clue, didnt even try to "mount" her, just sniffed her a lot then went and led on the sofa  

Due to that disaster we decided to use his father, took her there the following day, mated her within 2 mins of her walking through the door and had a 40 minute tie resulting in 4 pups 

Other dog, now about 3 i think, has yet to sire any pups and they have just bought in another male so think he's just refusing to do the deed...


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## suzysparkle (27 June 2012)

Dry Rot said:



			Yes. Not unusual. I generally leave them together in a large run, if possible, and leave them to it for a few days! Sometimes bitches appear to be receptive but the dog knows they are not spot on and won't risk getting bitten. Others need an introduction period (fore play). Others are just fussy! But leaving well alone together often works for mine.
		
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Exactly this!! Whilst the bitch will flirt constantly she may well not be exactly ready, and the dog (even without experience) is programmed to know this. When she's really ready she won't take no for an answer. I feel your pain - been there, done that, thought the dog was gay etc etc!!


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## Paint Me Proud (27 June 2012)

thanks. i did wonder if perhaps bitch not quite ready. Trying again tomorrow so fingers crossed


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## Kaylum (28 June 2012)

How far into her season is she?


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## Alec Swan (28 June 2012)

Be they two legged or four,  two maidens together,  aren't generally a very good idea. 

Alec.


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## MurphysMinder (28 June 2012)

I agree with Alec, 2 maidens are never a good idea.  He may get the idea when the bitch is spot on ready but if she is slightly awkward he is likely to lose interest.  Far better to have an experienced tart of a bitch for a young dogs first stud, and an equally experienced, but sensible dog for a maiden bitch.  Hope you have some success at your next attempt but I would have another dog lined up as back up.


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## kimberleigh (28 June 2012)

A friend asked to use my male over a bitch he bred, and up until that point (despite some good success in the show ring) I had said no to him being used as I hadnt felt comfortable with the situation of dogs in rescue etc (he is a Stafford). However I really liked this bitch and knew if she had any bitch pups my friend would be keeping them or placing them with trusted friends of his so I agreed to the mating. 
She was a maiden bitch and as I've said my male hadn't been used either

First attempt, he was extremely excited and it was kind of over before he started, he wasted a lot of energy on 'getting to know her' and only managed a quick slip mating.

Second attempt he was much more on the ball and they had a good 20 minute tie

Both of these were assisted matings, to ensure it went as smoothly and stress free as possible for them both. It wouldve been impossible to leave them together to get on with it, as both can be dog aggressive and the consequences if they had decided to go at each other wouldve been unbearable!

Result was a healthy litter of 4, 3 dogs and 1 bitch (all dogs have been neutered and live as pets, bitch has been placed in a show home but will only be bred if she makes her mark showing so I know theres no contribution to overpopulation issues which was my main concern!)

Kim


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## Cinnamontoast (28 June 2012)

Alec Swan said:



			Be they two legged or four,  two maidens together,  aren't generally a very good idea. 

Alec.
		
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This. A girl I know of breeds Rottweilers and has trained her stud dog (in as much as you can, I suppose) to perform. Keep hearing how the stud dog owner should be prepared to handle the dog and ensure neither are hurt.


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## EAST KENT (28 June 2012)

Indeed,nothing is more aggrevating than travelling four hours with a bitch bang on ready (by bloodtest) and find an incompetent owner and a dopey dog.Having stud dogs is a service, the dog must be trained/the owner competent or else do not waste people`s time and money.
  In  fact I would not use a pet dog because of this problem,far better a fertile health tested dog for your money.


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## suzysparkle (28 June 2012)

Any success today?

I will add that my experience was with two of our own and they already knew each other well (and I knew them well too of course!!). The only interference I had was to hold the bitch during the tie to make sure she didn't try to pull away. The dog just stood there - but I expected that. No problems at all when it did happen. Of course I can't speak for any other breed as I wouldn't know. So my own experience of 2 maiden's may well be different to others. That said I do know of other's (same breed) with the same experience. Whilst I left them alone I was close by and keeping a close eye 'just in case', which is simply common sense 

Their attitudes towards each other since have never changed - still good pals, and the pups (not pups anymore mind you) adore their dad. We are thrilled with them and they have turned out just as we hoped (showing excellent potential in harness....but so they should!!).


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## suzysparkle (28 June 2012)

EAST KENT said:



			Indeed,nothing is more aggrevating than travelling four hours with a bitch bang on ready (by bloodtest) and find an incompetent owner and a dopey dog.Having stud dogs is a service, the dog must be trained/the owner competent or else do not waste people`s time and money.
  In  fact I would not use a pet dog because of this problem,far better a fertile health tested dog for your money.
		
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I bet this happens a lot given all the so called 'stud dogs' advertised in free ad papers. Makes me so angry.


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## gunnergundog (28 June 2012)

Also, males that have been told off during adolesence for humping cushions/peoples' legs or other dogs can be reluctant to 'perform' as they think they are going to be due a telling off.


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## Paint Me Proud (28 June 2012)

suzysparkle said:



			Any success today?
		
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Went a little better today. Male managed to mount the bitch and penetrated twice but no tie was achieved.
The bitch squealed the second time and i think it put the dog off a little but overall a better reaction from both.

We are trying again tomorrow and will keep trying until the bitches receptive period is over (we are local to each other).

If the deed isnt done by then we will admit defeat.


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## Star_Chaser (29 June 2012)

sometimes a dog not choosing to mate a bitch can be an indication of something being wrong.  Maiden dogs do need a little extra time and you have to be careful not to over exert them.

Are you using anything to test the ovulation of your bitch premate or something of that ilk?


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## EAST KENT (29 June 2012)

If he fails again get the bitch checked for a stricture,easily dealt with.


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## Paint Me Proud (3 July 2012)

They did it!

I am happy to announce that a successful 10 minutes tie was achieved this evening 

It was obviously far too early for the bitch last week (as i had thought) but today was spot on. Bitch was ecstatic to see the dog and tie was achieved after just 5 minutes.

Both maiden dogs looked a little perplexed during the tie but remained calm and sensible. 

The bitch's behaviour change after the tie was adorable, she went all happy and loving and relaxed. The dog was equally as chilled and just wanted some fuss.

For those experienced breeders - would you advise a second visit in a couple of days for a second tie to be sure or will one be sufficient?


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## Star_Chaser (3 July 2012)

yes second mating within 48 is fine if both dog and bitch are ok


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