# Piggy French Yellow Carded



## Velcrobum (5 September 2019)

Was gobsmacked to see Piggy French has been yellow carded by FEI for misuse of whip during her round at the Europeans. I have just watched her round again and she only used her whip twice on the broadcasted coverage, that was after Quarrycast Echo went very backwards on her at the hanging log water complex. She rode hard with her legs all the way through and then gave him two smacks to remind him about the job in hand. I think any pro rider would do exactly the same on an experienced horse and the commentators commentated that. I did not see her use the whip anywhere else on the course. I really do not think 2 wake up smacks is abuse IMHO.


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## milliepops (5 September 2019)

I don't think it's abuse either in principle, but if she left a mark as reported then the yellow card is correct IMO.

There was a bit of a discussion on this earlier in the week at the end of the Euros xc tv thread  

https://forums.horseandhound.co.uk/threads/cross-country-on-tv-today.779779/page-4#post-14082315


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## ycbm (5 September 2019)

The yellow card was for marking the horse with the whip, an automatic yellow card, if the mark is spotted.

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## AdorableAlice (5 September 2019)

ycbm said:



			The yellow card was for marking the horse with the whip, an automatic yellow card, if the mark is spotted.

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We will soon see unclipped patches left on spur areas and bottoms.


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## scats (5 September 2019)

Iâ€™m not a bunny hugger by any stretch of the imagination, but I did watch the couple of belts she gave it and feel a little bit uncomfortable.  I totally understand that the horse was a bit sticky over the previous fence and from a safety point of view, it probably did need sharpening up a bit, but I felt that the two whacks looked a little out of temper.  I could be totally wrong though and can only go by what I felt sitting on my couch watching (which is a far cry from being out there riding it!)


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## {97702} (5 September 2019)

Gemma Tattersall got one too, this was at Millstreet when she was riding Quicklook, also for excessive use of the whip too - which seems equally unlikely given that this is one of her top horses that she knows inside out.  But those are the rules I suppose


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## splashgirl45 (5 September 2019)

scats said:



			Iâ€™m not a bunny hugger by any stretch of the imagination, but I did watch the couple of belts she gave it and feel a little bit uncomfortable.  I totally understand that the horse was a bit sticky over the previous fence and from a safety point of view, it probably did need sharpening up a bit, but I felt that the two whacks looked a little out of temper.  I could be totally wrong though and can only go by what I felt sitting on my couch watching (which is a far cry from being out there riding it!)
		
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i am also not a BH  and would have been ok if she had just given him one but to give two in succession didnt look right to me...but if he marked she must have put a bit of force into  as well it so yellow card was right IMO


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## Velcrobum (5 September 2019)

ycbm said:



			The yellow card was for marking the horse with the whip, an automatic yellow card, if the mark is spotted.

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Fair enough. IMHO she was quite correct to do what she did as he is an experienced horse and did go very green on her. She had to really ride hard through that water. She is a very sympathetic rider and a pleasure to watch she must be mortified.

I missed the conversation on another thread!!


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## hihosilver (5 September 2019)

if it had have been Oliie though it would have been fair?!  she is a lovely rider and doesn't make mistakes like that often BUT rules are rules. You cant have one rule for one rider and a different one for another.  Its a sport that seems to declining. So lets make it a nice fair and happy eventing sport.


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## Velcrobum (5 September 2019)

hihosilver said:



			if it had have been Oliie though it would have been fair?!  she is a lovely rider and doesn't make mistakes like that often BUT rules are rules. You cant have one rule for one rider and a different one for another.  Its a sport that seems to declining. So lets make it a nice fair and happy eventing sport.
		
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If any rider marks a horse rules have to be applied regardless of who they are as I said she must be mortified!!

Its a pity the same scrutiny is not made of endurance horses but that is another topic entirely and a HUGE can of worms welfare wise.


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## Goldenstar (5 September 2019)

If she marked the horse she marked it .
Itâ€™s very easy to mark a very hot wet horse but I think the rule is right .


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## Bojingles (5 September 2019)

Funny how 'bunny hugger', suggesting perhaps over-sentimentality and kindness is always viewed as a bad thing on this forum.


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## Goldenstar (5 September 2019)

I can think of no circumstances where being overly sentimental is useful


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## Red-1 (5 September 2019)

Bojingles said:



			Funny how 'bunny hugger', suggesting perhaps over-sentimentality and kindness is always viewed as a bad thing on this forum.
		
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I guess it depends on how you view the phrase 'bunny hugger' as, as far as I know bunnies don't enjoy being hugged. To me, bunny hugger is someone who may have good intentions but does the wrong thing.

As far as the X country round goes, I am not averse to a smack where it is needed, but it did make me go "oooh" when I saw it/them. I am not surprised that it left a mark and then I think it is right and proper that it gives a yellow card.

No one means to mark a horse. 

I would not judge it just from the TV view though, and if there had been no mark I would not have been writing in to complain anywhere, as the TV view is a distorted one.  The mark is there though and it has been dealt with.


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## MyBoyChe (5 September 2019)

Whilst in principal I agree with the ruling, I also would acknowledge that some horses will mark easier than others, just down to musculature, coat, condition etc.  I would have thought there would be a better way to determine "over agressive" use of the whip, spurs etc.  I saw the incident and at the time my first impressions were that she picked a spot on the course where she hoped it wouldnt get picked up, thats just my opinion but it did look a bit too handy for my liking and was just as she had ridden away and before she rounded a corner into trees.  Its true, he did back off and he did need a reminder to concentrate, but Im not sure he needed a couple of really quite hard whacks at that point after the event.  Based on the principal that he wouldnt associate the telling off with the poor jump would it have been better to give him a couple of short smacks to set him up for the next fence?  Maybe those who ride at this type of fence could answer that!


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## ycbm (5 September 2019)

I'm not certain hers was, but most of the elite riders are riding with air cushioned whips. It takes a hell of a belt to mark with an air cushiobed whip, that's the whole point of them. They were originally introduced for thin skinned race TBs.  Marking, number of strokes and use at an inappropriate time seem the right criteria to judge on. 

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## scats (5 September 2019)

Bojingles said:



			Funny how 'bunny hugger', suggesting perhaps over-sentimentality and kindness is always viewed as a bad thing on this forum.
		
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I suppose I just meant it in that Iâ€™m not one of those who believes that people shouldnâ€™t ride with whips/spurs etc, but even I felt that those two belts were unnecessary.


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## Bellaboo18 (5 September 2019)

Firstly I hate the term bunny hugger! I think it's a patronising way of describing someone that is showing concern and care. 
I didn't watch the Europeans so will try and catch a replay but basically I think it's right that the rule is 'black and white' and any mark should result in a yellow card.


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## Barton Bounty (6 September 2019)

True if she marks it she marks it, ðŸ¤·ðŸ¼â€â™€ï¸ 

Where on earth do all these names come from tho ðŸ˜‚ðŸ˜‚ðŸ˜‚


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## ohmissbrittany (6 September 2019)

The unclipped spur patches are already pretty common?


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## milliepops (6 September 2019)

ohmissbrittany said:



			The unclipped spur patches are already pretty common?
		
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def see them a lot with the SJers.


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## ester (6 September 2019)

yup, not really seen on eventers as yet though?


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## Mrs B (6 September 2019)

Bellaboo18 said:



			Firstly I hate the term bunny hugger! I think it's a patronising way of describing someone that is showing concern and care.
		
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Bunny hugger origin:





As someone said before, bunnies do not like to be hugged. A bunny hugger is someone for whom emotion triumphs over reality, often to the detriment of the animal involved. A bunny hugger doesn't see when their horse is over-rugged, over-fed or mollycoddled to their detriment. They don't understand what a horse IS.

A bunny hugger actually shows the opposite of care and concern for the animal they look after, as their only care and concern is for their own human-centric view of the world. "I am cold, therefore my horse needs a rug" whereas it should be "I am cold. He is a horse".


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## Bellaboo18 (6 September 2019)

Mrs B said:



			Bunny hugger origin:





As someone said before, bunnies do not like to be hugged. A bunny hugger is someone for whom emotion triumphs over reality, often to the detriment of the animal involved. A bunny hugger doesn't see when their horse is over-rugged, over-fed or mollycoddled to their detriment. They don't understand what a horse IS.

A bunny hugger actually shows the opposite of care and concern for the animal they look after, as their only care and concern is for their own human-centric view of the world. "I am cold, therefore my horse needs a rug" whereas is should be "I am cold. He is a horse".
		
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I'm afraid you're wrong. That's your definition. Look up the actual definition.


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## Mrs B (6 September 2019)

Bellaboo18 said:



			I'm afraid you're wrong. That's your definition. Look up the actual definition.
		
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Fascinating. Do tell me what you think it is? And according to whom? Please tell me it's not Google ...


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## Bellaboo18 (6 September 2019)

Mrs B said:



			Fascinating. Do tell me what you think it is? And according to whom? Please tell me it's not Google ...
		
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I've got an Oxford dictionary here. It's an animal lover.


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## Mrs B (6 September 2019)

Bellaboo18 said:



			I've got an Oxford dictionary here. It's an animal lover.
		
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Really? Then the OED must have its tongue firmly in its cheek.


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## {97702} (6 September 2019)

Mrs B said:



			Bunny hugger origin:





As someone said before, bunnies do not like to be hugged. A bunny hugger is someone for whom emotion triumphs over reality, often to the detriment of the animal involved. A bunny hugger doesn't see when their horse is over-rugged, over-fed or mollycoddled to their detriment. They don't understand what a horse IS.

A bunny hugger actually shows the opposite of care and concern for the animal they look after, as their only care and concern is for their own human-centric view of the world. "I am cold, therefore my horse needs a rug" whereas it should be "I am cold. He is a horse".
		
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And the cartoon is - if I remember rightly - straight from Steinbeckâ€™s Of Mice and Men?

A google search is actually quite funny - I agree with your definition however MrsB ðŸ˜Š


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## Mrs B (7 September 2019)

Levrier said:



			And the cartoon is - if I remember rightly - straight from Steinbeckâ€™s Of Mice and Men?
		
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Borrowed from it and squeezed a bit, but ... yup!


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