# Strangles - Please help (photos included)



## vicm2509 (24 April 2008)

Strangles has been going round our yard. All infected horses are now clear, then last monday Baron stopped eating and his temp was 41. Next day I noticed this lump






And all he did in his stable was stand like this facing the back wall. Would not eat or drink anything











Then the lump spread into one huge rock hard patch






Vet came out to swab him on Sunday. Since then he has been turned out as he is eating grass and only grass (he is in an isolated field with only those who have been infected already as company). This grass is really long as it was supposed to be a hay field. He refuses to eat anything from floor level. He still would not eat and his temp is still up and has been every day. He would eat nothing but grass and hand fed carrots until today when he managed a little hard feed. He was a little happier in him self today but he looked awful. The main abcess (which is now the full lenth of the underside of his head) is starting to seep. It has been getting hot poulticed every day. But he has a huge swelling round his lips and other swelling developing. His breathing is very noisy, he has nasal discharge and a cough.

Is this normal?

His initial swab was inconclusive and vet came back yesterday to swab him again. He was not overly worried. Rang him today to tell him about new swelling and he said they could be swollen glands. If they get worse to ring him.

I am really worried. Here are some pics of him today.

As you can see the abcess is the full length of his head and all bone defenition has dissapeared. It is starting to seep in the place the original lump was






He has a huge swelling on the side of his mouth and one that has come up in the crease between his head and neck (these only appeared today). I also think there is one coming behind his left ear. As you can see his head looks terrible











This side not as bad but shows the one in the crease of his neck (top of jawbone)






Snot (it is usually really thick and yellow)





All the others on the yard have been really mild. Only one abcessed and the others were a bit snotty but seemed to get over it quickly. It seems he has every symptom going. Its been 10 days now and he just looks worse every day. Does this look like a bad case or I am getting really stressed about nothing. I hate seeing him like this and I am so worried incase it gets worse and cant be fixed


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## sqippa (24 April 2008)

Strangles takes all sorts of forms and symptoms can vary enormously between horses. it looks like your poor guy has the old typical symptoms. Pain kills, hot poultices and lots of TLC (for both of you) is what is needed. 

Sympathy and hugs to you both. Don't worry too much just keep monitoring and keep vets informed.

Squip


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## TGM (24 April 2008)

I'm no expert on strangles (thankfully 
	
	
		
		
	


	




) but can you email these photos to your vet, so he can judge whether to come back out to re-examine your horse?


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## brightmount (24 April 2008)

Like TGM I thankfully have no first hand experience, but your poor boy, I'm so sorry for you both. What a wretched condition this is, photos like yours really hit it home.

I understand horses feel so much better once the abcesses have burst - do Baron's need a vet to intervene perhaps?

Big vibes going out to you both ((((( Viki and Baron)))))


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## dozzie (24 April 2008)

I have not had experience of strangles but if i was in your situation i would ask the vet to visit tomorrow irrespective of what they say. Particularly as Strangles has been on the yard. 

If it isn't Strangles then fine! You are happy. If it is then your horse is treated and you have done your best whatever the outcome.

I am not one to call the vet at the first opportunity, but with the history of the yard and the pics i would definitely ask for a visit. Just to put my mind at rest.


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## flowerlady (24 April 2008)

How old is Baron?


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## cobdonkey (25 April 2008)

Your poor horse, I hope he starts to get better soon. 

Are you going to speak to your vet again? Will give you piece of mind then either way.

I hate strangles!


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## sqippa (24 April 2008)

Painkillers! sorry!


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## seabiscuit (24 April 2008)

Goodness.. this looks and sounds dreadfull.I think you have every right to be extremely worried. I'd be tearing my hair out with this vet. If your vet is not concerned I'd get a second opinion ASAP, have you got an equine hospital near you? 
	
	
		
		
	


	








Is he on antibiotics? If he is not alreay on antibio's I think that is unvbelievable. 
Remember that although he hasnt tested positive for the strangles virus, a virus can come in many different strains and forms, so he may well have a different 'strain' of the strangles virus.

Sorry I am no vet and in which case people may think that I am being unecessarily OTT but I do think that your horse sounds /looks in a very bad way and I dont think this vet is recommending adequate treatment.


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## brighteyes (25 April 2008)

Holy Bggr! 
	
	
		
		
	


	




  Poor lad.  If that's not strangles then I don't know what is.

He's 10 days in and should be starting to get through the to far side of the feeling yakky.  I'd be giving him painkillers and easy to eat/swallow mush and be keeping him comfy in any way possible.  

Also, I would be keeping the pus wiped away and his open wounds clean. I know he doesn't want to, but he needs to keep his head down when eating, to facilitate drainage of the abscesses.  I bet the noise is due to swelling of his throat - possibly pressing on the soft palate.

Tia has had vast experience of the disease and might give you some guidance/anecdotal advice based on her encounters with it.  

I'd be out of my tree with worry, so you aren't alone.  My youngish pony had it at six and just had the one abscess under his chin.  That and a very high temp for three days, but it was enough for me.  

He's going to need a lot of time to recuperate when he's over the worst.  Looks like he's had a real stinker of a case.

I hope he gets well soon and you manage to cope with the next few days, but I do think I'd be getting some professional advice if you are that worried, even if it's just a phone call to his vet initially to update him and check you don't need him to come out.

Bless him and some soothing &lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;vibes&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; to his head.  A (((hug))) to poor, frazzled you as well.


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## Llwyncwn (25 April 2008)

Poor Baron and poor you, you have my sympathies  
	
	
		
		
	


	




  He has it like my old boy did years ago.  You are doing right by hot poulticing the abcessess.  I found my boy couldnt comfortably lower his head to eat or drink, but would do so if I lifted the bucket for him.  The depression is quite normal, he looks pretty fed up with it all.   *Do not*  give him antibiotics as this can supress any abcessess which havnt burst - only give them afterwards and on vets instructions.

Sending lots of healing vibes to Baron and to you.  Try not to worry too much and keep the vet posted.

Do let us know how he is.

Hx


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## Bedlam (25 April 2008)

[ QUOTE ]
Goodness.. this looks and sounds dreadfull.I think you have every right to be extremely worried. I'd be tearing my hair out with this vet. If your vet is not concerned I'd get a second opinion ASAP, have you got an equine hospital near you? 
	
	
		
		
	


	








Is he on antibiotics? If he is not alreay on antibio's I think that is unvbelievable. 
Remember that although he hasnt tested positive for the strangles virus, a virus can come in many different strains and forms, so he may well have a different 'strain' of the strangles virus.

Sorry I am no vet and in which case people may think that I am being unecessarily OTT but I do think that your horse sounds /looks in a very bad way and I dont think this vet is recommending adequate treatment. 

[/ QUOTE ]














Strangles is a bacterial infection, not a virus. That's why antibiotics are effective. This horse has strangles - I'm not sure why there is a question over it having seen the pics.


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## brighteyes (25 April 2008)

AB's are contra-indicated in strangles because they delay/inhibit the progress of abscessing which needs to happen for the strangles to resolve.  It really should run its course without interference I believe.  But yes, I'd be wanting some confirmation that he is exhibiting no worse than just a full-blown case.  Perhaps some IV vitamins or fluids if he's not eating or drinking.

A vet hospital will not admit any horse with suspected strangles for obvious reasons.


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## Tia (25 April 2008)

QR -

Looks like a mild form of strangles/strep.  I personally would never get a vet out just for this.  You run the risk of it spreading if you have a vet enter the premises.  The bacteria will come out, the abscess with drain, the snot will leave and your horse should be good as new in no time.  I certainly wouldn't be giving antibiotics and I'm really not sure what anyone expects the vet to do now?  The condition just has to run it's course; obviously if complications arise then is the time to call the vet.

If it is any help to you, here is a photo of my pony when she had a mild form of a strep variation a few years ago.


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## Tia (25 April 2008)

I meant to post this photo too but was side-tracked.

Once my lots abscesses burst, I used gauze saturated in Povidone Iodine and bandaged it around their throats.   Povidone kills streptococcus on contact so is the best thing to use in my opinion.  I changed these dressings about 5 or 6 times per day until no serum oozed out anymore.  I also used Povidone to kill of any bacteria which may have been lurking on any feed buckets, fences, troughs and also wiped their noses with it.  Be careful how you dispose of all of the gauze though.  I placed them immediately in sealed bags and then in a sealed container.  Afterwards, I burned them all.

Anyway, here is how I attached the bandages.  Good luck, please don't worry.  It is very rare for horses to have complications with strangles.


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## vicm2509 (25 April 2008)

Wow, didnt expect this many replies. Thanks everyone.

Just to clarify the vet has been to see him twice to take swabs, first swab inconclusive, 2nd swab taken wednesday. Then it got much worse thrusday.

I rang him last night and he has told me not to worry and if I am really concerned then give him another ring (hence the post as I am not sure how concerned I should be). He also wants me to call as soon as abcess bursts. When he does come to see him I have to be his last call as he has 'special clothes' for our yard. 

I just wondered how bad he really is as most none of the others on the yard have been this bad at all. He has to go and do one better than all the others doesnt he!

Thank you so much for the advice, especially Tia, those photos have made me realise that perhaps his is normal and all the others have been very mild. That bandage is fab, I have some of that in the first aid kit  
	
	
		
		
	


	





I know he needs to keep his head down which is the reason he is out, if I stable he he will not eat.

Obviously I am still worried sick as my poor horse is ill but the replies have really helped. Thanks. It makes you realise how much you take for granted when your horse is well doesnt it? 

Went down this morning and he was so happy to see me. The one around his mouth has gone down a little and the seeping one is seeping loads more, hopefully it will burst tonight or in the morning. I am hot poulticing it to help it surface quicker.

Oh and he is being given bute.

And he is 8 years old.


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## brighteyes (25 April 2008)

That's _exactly_ how I bandaged Sidney's abscess!  His was sublingual, like Cloud's (?) and he never got any behind his jaw.  I didn't realise the povidone was that effective - but that's what I used.  Reading back through your posts, I did everything the same as you would.  I am much cheered by that.


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## katie_and_toto (26 April 2008)

Poor Baron  
	
	
		
		
	


	




 Hope he's feeling better soon x


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## xxxbettyboopxxx (26 April 2008)

Oh I hope he is feeling better. Furgos has it, well is just getting over it and he is fine now, bouncing around in the field like a nut! 
Ask you vet to blood test him, swabs are only about 40% conclusive and you need 2 or 3 clear but the blood test which has only just come out is about 99% positive. Our whole yard has had one and it tells you the carriers, the borderlines, the positives the whole lot.


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## vicm2509 (27 April 2008)

Thanks. Vet said if this test is inconclusive (like the last one was) he will be blood tested. 

I dont think it would be very cost effective for the whole yard to have one as there are about 50 horses there. Would be a great idea on a smaller yard though. I think we are just waiting for the last one to clear up (which is him atm if he is positive of course), and get clear swabs done.


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## amandaco2 (27 April 2008)

poor boy he looks so unhappy
lets hope it clears up soon.even mild strains can produce quite ill horses, they all react differently to it.
a local rising school got a mild strain a very years ago-even one of the horses got a snotty nose apart from one who got abcessed and sepicaemia.and he was fit and only 7 years old.so i wouldnt take it lightly.its more supportive therapy for him-antibiotics make things worse.just try to keep him eating and drinking-try feeding warm mashes etc.


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## xxxbettyboopxxx (27 April 2008)

We have 70 on our yard, all blood tested and thanks to that there are only 6 that have positive tests and another 6 that are showing borderline, swabs are inconclusive. It is an indivdual yard decison that the yo needs to make. I would say 100% your horse has it, although there is another thing that can present like strangles my vet said, so fingers crossed, furgos came back neg with 2 swabs and positive with the blood test.


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## vicm2509 (30 April 2008)

He has now had his swab back and it is positive. His abcess burst last night and he was looking a little brighter than usual this morning, hopefully things can only let better now and we will have no complications along the way.

Thanks everyone for the support, especially Tia who has been fantastic and given me loads of advice.

Will keep you all updated with his recovery x


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## CBFan (30 April 2008)

Hi, our yard is currently in the middle of an outbreak of strangles.  Your boy is in no-where near as bad a way as one of ours was, who is now back, right as rain!... most of the horses affected have had a high temp, slightly runny nose (mostly clear and watery) and been off their food (particularly if fed at ground level) most have been treated successfully with Norodine, some have needed stronger antibiotics.  The blood test is very accurate (comes back either positive or negative) as it tests for antibodies against the bacteria. Swaps are only about 60% accurate which is why they do 3, 7 days apart. Our vet said he once swabbed 100 horses all of which came back negative and yet the yard still had another bout of strangles a short time later - it's all so frustrating.

fingers crossed your boy makes a speedy recovery XX


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