# This has gone on too long.



## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (22 May 2013)

Hello.
I need your advice again.
http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=453829
I posted this thread 2 years ago and got lovely advice. I've been calling every rescue organisation around but i face excuses every time.
The horse in question is on deaths door. Sometimes he lays for hours, attempting to get up. I'll call his owner in tears and get the same 'I'll be down soon' yet he won't.
I'll call rspca, redwings, world horse welfare, essex horse rescue to be faced with similar b*lls*it excuses.
Monday the RSPCA came down, I was riding, after 15 mins they got out of the car and shouted to me 'is this your horse', 'no' i answered and he went to get back in his car, I ran over to him, giving owners name, horse age, state ect (none of which he wrote down) and he left. Next day a different officer arrives, this time not even going to look at the horse, leaves 15 mins later. No compliance notice, no action taken.

This has been going on for 2 years, i've stood by this horse in the snow, with no rugs on, no fat or muscle, trying to fed him hay that i've bought, i've taken rugs off my own horses back because he needed them more. Food out of my own horses bucket, because i know that his owner isn't going to come.

I'm not an RSPCA basher, they do some incredible work with animals all over the country, but i want them to know, i want this thread to prove that they have let this horse down.

This is a difficult one for me. Due to my user name and pictures it's very obvious who i am. The owner may find out, but this poor creatures life is worth it.

***I'm going to attach some pics and a video.
Please look away if the sight of skinny horses upsets you, i will take them down if you wish.***

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OhiyIAP0Fsw&feature=youtu.be
video taken mid june 2012, its not cold and i don't think he has any trapped nerves. this video was forwarded in an email to the rspca officer on his case.

The rest of these pictures were taken yesterday while i was giving him some food, his owner said he's gone on holiday and has left half a bag of feed out. I got a note saying i was to feed him. ( I was not asked)


















http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zkeN-Iq-LJo&feature=youtu.be
http://tinypic.com/r/2v3jvoy/5
http://tinypic.com/r/2u8dtt3/5
I honestly don't know what else to do short of getting a vet to put the poor creature down myself, but that's probably impossible and is certainly the job of an owner or welfare team.


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## Amymay (22 May 2013)

Oh love, it's so sad - and I feel your frustration.  

The one place that do seem to pull their fingers out of their backsides are the BHS.

Give Lee Hackett a buzz - and also PM him on here.


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (22 May 2013)

I will do. what organisation does he work for?
The usual i get from horse specific organisation is 'the RSPCA are handling this case and it is under investigation'
Similar from the RSPCA i'll get 'thanks for your concern, i'll pass that on to the relevant case worker'.

But for two years now this has been under investigation and nothing has been done, i fear everyones' just waiting for him to quietly die


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## Amymay (22 May 2013)

BHS_Lee is on line now.

He works for the BHS.


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## Goldenstar (22 May 2013)

Do try the BHS .
I simply don't understand someone like that has a horse.
Horrible for you OP.


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## rowan666 (22 May 2013)

Im not a fan of the rspca atall they are clueless but how old is this horse? I havnt watched the videos but from the pics i agree horse is clearly not in good condition atall and ide be ashamed if it was one of mine but to me dosnt exactly look on deaths door imo


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## Aarrghimpossiblepony (22 May 2013)

Poor horse, well done for trying to make his life better.

Only thing I can think of is to target the owner socially as you know them.

Send the pictures to their workplace, around their social circle, start a facebook page to name and shame?
Shame them into looking after him properly.
Or contact the local newspaper, they are often looking for animal interest stories.

Obviously that could open a whole can of very nasty worms for yourself so I'm not recommending it, just it is something you can do.


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## Amymay (22 May 2013)

Just reading through your original post, and see that this horse is on a livery yard.

Why hasn't the YO done anything??


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## BBH (22 May 2013)

To me he looks like he needs a good feed programme , farrier  and some TLC.

I've seen worse tbh.


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (22 May 2013)

He is late teens. Around 17 i'm told.
Have pm'd Lee with my details and link to the thread.


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## Perfect_Pirouette (22 May 2013)

BBH said:



			To me he looks like he needs a good feed programme , farrier  and some TLC.

I've seen worse tbh.
		
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This.

He doesn't look horrendous tbh but clearly there is a lack of care there and the poor boy DEFINITELY looks like he needs to be rugged in winter in snow etc and obviously every horse needs feeding and watering every day.

Hopefully you can get some action taken as must be awful for you though.


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## Amymay (22 May 2013)

Jessi&Magic said:



			He is late teens. Around 17 i'm told.
Have pm'd Lee with my details and link to the thread.
		
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Brilliant.

So what is YO's take on this situation??


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## JillA (22 May 2013)

Have you called the WHW welfare hotline? I presume so from your comment about other organisations but if you haven't, then the number is 08000 480180 - just don't mention any prior RSPCA involvement. If the horse needs removing to a place of safety you can get the local police involved - a constable is one of the people in the Animal Welfare Act who can remove it, on instruction from a vet. But is it acute enough to be considered at risk?


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## Perfect_Pirouette (22 May 2013)

amymay said:



			Brilliant.

So what is YO's take on this situation??
		
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This, presumably the land is rented off somebody? Have you contacted them? I would not want a case of neglect on my yard. 

Why does this man have the horse? Does it have access to water everyday?


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (22 May 2013)

Okay, i understand people have seen worse but for 2 years? bearly any grass as it hasn't been picked in years, he's well known to eat fences and poo.

Not on a livery yard, rented fields with horses either side. We all rent a paddock each. Owner of the land is an elderly lady in her late 80's has spoken to him before but she has more pressing health issues on her mind.
People are scared to talk to him, he gets on well with me. I've offered to take him off his hands, to buy him, to work with him ect.
We had a nice little set up last year where he'd bring down food and i'd feed him 3 times a day but he said i was wasting food and stopped it.

I understand my first post could have been more detailed and people want questions answered but i have to go out soon, sorry.


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (22 May 2013)

water yes, he does is occassionally, but he's like the wind, there for a second then gone.
Its not unusual for him to have no water and the others renters to have to fill it up.


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## Amymay (22 May 2013)

Let us know if Lee can help.  He was brilliant a few years ago with two horses in desparate need of help.

I'm sure some people have seen worse - however that's no consolation to you or the horse that clearly is doing really badly.


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## rowan666 (22 May 2013)

Poor horse hes obviously neglected but there are much worse cases. Sadly while it sounds like its you thats been keeping him going the rspca wont do a thing, if you left him to go without so he was on deaths door they might actually step in but no horse lover could really do that so your damed if you do and damed if dont  
Why is nobody else on yard kicking up a fuss? YO does have a duty of care surely?


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (22 May 2013)

I'm waiting for him to get back to me.
I will not leave this. I don't want to walk past his field and find him dead due to noone wanting to say anything.

in regards to the feet, i have been here just under 3 years and have never seen a vet, farrier or wormer in sight. I've seen him trim the fronts about a year and a half ago but he can bearly pick his back feet up without wobbling on them. Not lame in any but he never really has the energy to go faster than a fast walk.


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## Morgan123 (22 May 2013)

God why does he shake like that? Is that common for him? That's so sad. Poor guy. Well done you for doing your best for him.


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## Perfect_Pirouette (22 May 2013)

Is it just you and this man or are there other liveries on the land too?

Could you all not gang up on him? Get the owner to write an eviction notice, stating that unless he starts attending to the horse daily on x date she will have no choice but to ask him to leave (hopefully he wouldnt do that!) 

I agree it is absolutely awful and I would be in floods of tears most days down there looking at him too if it was me. 

If the poor boy doesn't even have access to water some days then I would say he _must_ be a case for neglect surely? 

Hopefully the BHS will help, if not start a FB campaign on FB or something and name and shame RSPCA and any other bodies that have ignored this case, post on their FB pages etc. Action must be taken.


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (22 May 2013)

I've done some snooping and found photos of prince from around 8-10 years ago. A stark reality. He's also a Anglo arab.


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## Amymay (22 May 2013)

What a wonderful looking horse he was. Poor old lad.


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (22 May 2013)

One other livery besides me, not willing to speak up to him.
The owner is the scary sort, i was always told to stay on the right side of him or my horse would be the one to suffer.
We get on well, i give him nudges but i have to word things carefully like 'the weather means the grass is terrible, im having to feed my horse up, hows prince doing and whats he on?'

or 'I've just had the vet out for jabs, £150 that set me back, how much of a whole does yours make?'

ect.


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## The Fuzzy Furry (22 May 2013)

I agree that this is a poor horse.
However, there is indications that he is surviving. He is upright, he is eating, his feet to not look that terrible. Yes, he is scabby, he has had rainscald.

The first line of report from any of the agencies would be to give advice to the owner as to keeping the horse in a reasonable manner. 
Not one of the agencies would sieze or prosecute from these pictures - there are MUCH worse horses & ponies all over the country.

Its very hard for those who keep their animals in one way to even comprehend how others do not lavish the same with theirs.

Yes, speak to the BHS, the animal will be inspected and advice given - with follow-up calls as and when required by the local welfare officer.


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## Aarrghimpossiblepony (22 May 2013)

Local paper might be interested as you have a good record of the last two years and good photos that show neglect clearly to people who don't know anything about horses.

You need to provide them with as many facts as you can so they can present the story.

If it's anything like our local paper, they are always looking for local stuff to fill up the paper.


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (22 May 2013)

The Fuzzy Furry said:



			I agree that this is a poor horse.
However, there is indications that he is surviving. He is upright, he is eating, his feet to not look that terrible. Yes, he is scabby, he has had rainscald.

The first line of report from any of the agencies would be to give advice to the owner as to keeping the horse in a reasonable manner. 
Not one of the agencies would sieze or prosecute from these pictures - there are MUCH worse horses & ponies all over the country.

Its very hard for those who keep their animals in one way to even comprehend how others do not lavish the same with theirs.

Yes, speak to the BHS, the animal will be inspected and advice given - with follow-up calls as and when required by the local welfare officer.
		
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I understand, We've all see the skinny minis on the tv but this is so close to home i can't look at him without my heart dropping.
My issue with it is, the rpsca may be giving improvements but i can assure you he still doesn't get fed, his field has not been cleaned and he still has no access to shelter, all in two years. I would have thought there'd be a 7 day or 14 day deadline to improve conditions. last year redwings (i think) may have been whw, Came out and did a report on him, took bloods and a poo sample to determine whether he was unhealthy or had a kidney, liver problem ect. owner told me these all came back clear and healthy, just needed food.

I just wonder why its taking so long. A full 2 years this month.


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## zaminda (22 May 2013)

When you spoke to him about buying him, what did he say? If it was me, and no one was doing anything, I'm afraid I would poo pick, and give him some of my own hay, but that is just me.


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## Amymay (22 May 2013)

zaminda said:



			If it was me, and no one was doing anything, I'm afraid I would poo pick, and give him some of my own hay, but that is just me.
		
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Which is exactly what the OP has been doing.


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (22 May 2013)

I told him i was going to poo pick and i did so in december. 31 barrows most of it has disintegrated down into white fluff. Im on route to feed him now, il let you know what feed hes left me


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## zaminda (22 May 2013)

31 barrows is a hell of a lot! How much land is he on? I really do feel for you, it must be horrid. Hopefully he has left you something, obviously you have quite a bit to do with him, how do his teeth look?


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## tabithakat64 (22 May 2013)

Well done for stepping in and helping, whilst not a neglect case, the poor horse could clearly do with being looked after better/more regularly 

What I am going to say is that if the RSPCA did decide to prosecute, both you (as you're helping take care of the horse) and also the field owner are as liable as the horses actual owner for it's welfare.  Hopefully the BHS will be able to step in and help resolve this situation.


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## Gracie21 (22 May 2013)

Bless you  good on you for stepping in. What a stark contrast the old pictures of him are!


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## The Fuzzy Furry (22 May 2013)

Jess, do contact the BHS Welfare dept, the staff there are really helpful & the horse WILL get a visit. Yo can be updated if you wish & they will also let you know any course of action.
If you have any probs, drop me a PM


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## Amymay (22 May 2013)

tabithakat64 said:



			Well done for stepping in and helping, whilst not a neglect case, the poor horse could clearly do with being looked after better/more regularly 

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How is this not neglect?




			What I am going to say is that if the RSPCA did decide to prosecute, both you (as you're helping take care of the horse) and also the field owner are as liable as the horses actual owner for it's welfare.  Hopefully the BHS will be able to step in and help resolve this situation.
		
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Please don't spout rubbish.  OP would not be liable for any prosecution/charge or otherwise.


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (22 May 2013)

1/4 of a bag of mole valley cooling cubes and 1/4 of a bag of hifi original, no idea when hes coming back, dont know if it will last


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (22 May 2013)

Field isnt massive but neither is my barrow. Took the best part of 4 hours, including being chased around by him. Im going to ignore my being liable, after calling well over 50+ times to various national and local organisations i think im the only person in the world trying to help.
In regards to his teeth hes got worn down fronts, but told hes had them years after chewing the fences to peices. Lived here all his life since 10 months old, never been anywhere, never moved, never had company.
The gate to his field was unlocked last year to let the redwings vet team in and has since never been locked or shut properly. I hoped gypsys would take him but i doubt that'd ever happen lol. I cant see his story ending well. Calling bhs now


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## Amymay (22 May 2013)

Jessi&Magic said:



			Im going to ignore my being liable, after calling well over 50+ times to various national and local organisations i think im the only person in the world trying to help.
		
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Do, because you're not.


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## zaminda (22 May 2013)

Think you have done more than many would have, somehow doubt that feed is going to last long!


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (22 May 2013)

If it runs out il replenish it. A tiny part of me is annoyed because i cant afford to feed a skinny horse as well as my own!


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## SNORKEY (22 May 2013)

Oh the poor thing. Does he always shake when he eats? 
Call world horse welfare, they are great and really do care. They also know about horses unlike the RSPCA. My local RSPCA officer didn't know what to look for when I called about a lice infested horse, I don't think the RSPCA should be involved with horses personally.


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## Jackster14 (22 May 2013)

Well done on trying to help and for so long, I hope for his sake it gets resolved soon.


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## poiuytrewq (22 May 2013)

Poor poor boy- He's lucky to have you around.
Your not liable, of course your not sadly though I fear the RSPCA's case will be (I know ive been there) as someone is looking out for the horse (ie you) even though its not the correct person there is nothing to be done about it.
I once reported something really horrible but as the horse was given assistance by someone else the RSPCA said its needs had been dealt with.  
Im not saying stop by any means, he needs you just I don't think you can count on the RSPCA to intervene. 
Can I buy him a bag of feed or something? Sorry I cant afford much but I can do that.


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## HashRouge (22 May 2013)

BBH said:



			I've seen worse tbh.
		
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So have I but that doesn't mean this is okay 

OP have you tried World Horse Welfare? I don't know how good they are in cases like this but it might be worth a try. I feel so bad for you, not being able to do anything. Poor pony doesn't look like a happy bunny 

ETA just seen that other horse welfare organisations have been involved. I hope the BHS can help xx


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (22 May 2013)

Bhs has been called and im meeting a welfare officer in the morning. Unfortunatly she remembers meeting me before at this location. I told her i want things done this time.
To the lovely person that wanted to donate feed, thats an extremely kind gesture but he's okay for the moment. If the bhs manage to help him then thats where my monthly donation to the rspca is going to go instead.

Also he does not always shake when eating, for the month of june he did it pretty much all the time he was stood up.


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (22 May 2013)

amymay said:



			What a wonderful looking horse he was. Poor old lad.
		
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I always tell him that if Mary King had seen him, he'd be an eventer by now


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## FlaxenPony05 (22 May 2013)

Jessi&Magic said:



			I always tell him that if Mary King had seen him, he'd be an eventer by now 

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Aww bless him- he looks like a sweet old chap. Hope the officer actually listens tomorrow and something is done.


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## poiuytrewq (22 May 2013)

If you change your mind let me know. Things like this make me sick


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## cbmcts (22 May 2013)

Possibly the problem stopping anything official being done is that you are doing enough to keep him legal...topping up his water, feeding him and so on.

I don't blame you for doing so - I would and have done the same - but the result is that poor horse isn't actually bad enough to seize and prosecute.

If you really can take him on it might be worth working with the welfare authorities to get them to put enough pressure on the owner to give him to you. If they think that they won't have to find and fund a rescue space they may be willing to niggle his owner enough for him to want rid?Also, maybe your YO can also help by complaining to him about the hassle she's receiving as 80 years old or not, strictly speaking she is liable for his state too.  In the meantime, I would keep up the watering and feeding (document all you do to prove that the owner isn't IYSWIM) but stop the poo picking etc. to emphasise the neglect. Also try and stay on the right side (somehow!) of the owner as A) you've got to protect your own horse and B) you want him to see you as his saviour rather than an enemy if that makes sense?


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (22 May 2013)

Sound advice cbmtcs.

I've stopped the poo picking, i did it in december because he's started leaning across the fence to eat my horses poo  so i cleaned it up and freed up some grass space.
Last year i steeled myself for months, i didn't touch him, feed him but he got very low and still they did nothing so i stepped back in.

I would love to take him on, i looked after him when i was 14 (possibly younger) i remember a friend was loaning him and offered me a ride. He was  a lovely ride, he was the first horse i jumped over 3ft on, and the last! That was the last time he was ridden and the last loan he had.

He's become nasty ( i know he doesn't mean to be but hunting for a better word) around people. If you walk in his field he will run at you and go for a kick. 

Me and him have an understanding. He doesn't kick, headbutt or bite me and in exchange i love him. Suits us well.


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## babymare (22 May 2013)

Jessi your last post "cause i love him " actually brought lump to throat. a simple phrase but means so much. bless you and i so so hope this ends well for both you and horse x


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## Amymay (22 May 2013)

Thanks for the update. Let us know how you get on xx


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (22 May 2013)

babymare said:



			Jessi your last post "cause i love him " actually brought lump to throat. a simple phrase but means so much. bless you and i so so hope this ends well for both you and horse x
		
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Many thanks but i'm doing no more than any of you would but believe me it's difficult to love him!

Here's a video following the other one from yesterday, he was chasing me away from his hay. I'm not scared of him and he knows this well but his angry faces make me smile.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pLGX_dIVeJs&feature=youtu.be

We've just spent an hour listening to johnny cash while i plaited his pathetic tail (no offence to him, it just makes me laugh against my mares fluffy native brush!) and took a walk round the field.

Theres something about him that screams to you. He's so stubborn, a horse that would try to the hide pain yet at the same time he greets me everyday regardless of whether i carry food or not, he will stand for me, he trusts me to touch him, rug him and groom him. all from a horse with minimum social contact for about 8 years.


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## Mrs C (22 May 2013)

Aw how sad. Do keep us updated and good luck x


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## TandD (22 May 2013)

why wont his owner sell him to you?


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (22 May 2013)

TandD said:



			why wont his owner sell him to you?
		
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He just always says no. I've said it in jest, in a serious meeting and even left a note on his car haha!

In 2011 a previous loaner who hadn't seen him in years offered him £1,500 cash that day. He said no without hesitation. He has money, he's certainly not poor! Maybe he thinks he's worth money.


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## Bettyboo1976 (22 May 2013)

I'd be tempted to move the horse somewhere safe and when the owner returns tell him he had died in the field ...


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## Ibblebibble (22 May 2013)

I'm not normally a soppy sap but the sight of this poor chap and your desperation to help him has made me tearful, he is lucky to have you looking out for him.x


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## MillyMoomie (22 May 2013)

Here is a thought. Call a vet, if he is a removable the vet will call the RSPCA who will then attend and go through the process with the police. It is the vets say so. Or if not removable in vets opinion the vet can issue advice and charge it to the RSPCA. This is a very common situation. So if you are that worried call a vet!!


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## MillyMoomie (22 May 2013)

Whilst undoubtably underweight I would be surprised if this horse is removable under section 4 awa. You say the owner had left half a bag of food? And albeit in a not great way, has arranged feeding responsibility through you? So the owner is taking SOME responsibility then? And now the owner is aware you are the person responsible? 
Now you are obviously a caring responsible person for being quite rightly concerned but is there more to the story? Can you be absoloutly sure that advice hasn't been given to the owner? Sometimes these things take time... at the end of the day the vet that supports suffering on a animal has to stand up in court and be totally convinced that NO REASONABLE STEPS HAVE BEEN TAKEN by the person responsible to ensure the needs are met. There is now 2 years of potential evidence that is damaged every time someone else feeds/waters the horse... Hard to say but true. 
Would be very interested to know what happens tomorrow. Either way I hope something gets done.


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## Goldenstar (22 May 2013)

MillyMoomie said:



			Here is a thought. Call a vet, if he is a removable the vet will call the RSPCA who will then attend and go through the process with the police. It is the vets say so. Or if not removable in vets opinion the vet can issue advice and charge it to the RSPCA. This is a very common situation. So if you are that worried call a vet!!
		
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Vets can't just go to see horses and send bills to the RSPCA it just does not work that way.
OP I can't think of anything to say to help you , could you take him on perhaps between the BHS and the RSPCA the owner could be strong armed into giving him to you.
I used to do quite a lot of nice welfare person , nasty welfare person with the RSPCA to get changes made .
I had hoped the new welfare act was going to help in cases like this it seems it must not be doing so.
Poor old boy you both deserve better.


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (22 May 2013)

MillyMoomie said:



			Whilst undoubtably underweight I would be surprised if this horse is removable under section 4 awa. You say the owner had left half a bag of food? And albeit in a not great way, has arranged feeding responsibility through you? So the owner is taking SOME responsibility then? And now the owner is aware you are the person responsible? 
Now you are obviously a caring responsible person for being quite rightly concerned but is there more to the story? Can you be absoloutly sure that advice hasn't been given to the owner? Sometimes these things take time... at the end of the day the vet that supports suffering on a animal has to stand up in court and be totally convinced that NO REASONABLE STEPS HAVE BEEN TAKEN by the person responsible to ensure the needs are met. There is now 2 years of potential evidence that is damaged every time someone else feeds/waters the horse... Hard to say but true. 
Would be very interested to know what happens tomorrow. Either way I hope something gets done.
		
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I've called various vet practices, all will tell you to call a welfare organisation and they will get their own vets out. Owner has been given advice countless time yet nothing changes. no feed, no clean field, no rugs, no vet. Yet the welfare officers never come back to check again.
Also, he has arranged nothing with me! leaving me a note telling him to feed his horse is hardly an arrangement. what if im not free? what if im going on holiday?
The horse would be dead by now if i left him more than 2-3 days without water in the middle of summer. I have dated pics of empty water buckers day after day after day.
Im not saying i want him shipped off to a rescue, i just want a better life for him. No creature with a wealthy owner deserves to starve to death due to negligence.


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (22 May 2013)

To add, im not a yard owner, yard manager or hired groom. 
I simply rent the field beside him. If for instance your neighbours went on holiday without telling you but on the day they went left a note on your door saying you had to feed their skinny cat, what would you do? 

my choices was feed the animal, the first hard feed he's had this year and call the welfare organisations. What did i do wrong?


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## Goldenstar (22 May 2013)

J and M who owns the field he's in?


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## TandD (22 May 2013)

Jessi&Magic said:



			He just always says no. I've said it in jest, in a serious meeting and even left a note on his car haha!

In 2011 a previous loaner who hadn't seen him in years offered him £1,500 cash that day. He said no without hesitation. He has money, he's certainly not poor! Maybe he thinks he's worth money.
		
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has anyone ever asked him why not? it seems pretty rude to ask, but considering the lack of wanting the horse....i think really he should answer it...


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## MillyMoomie (22 May 2013)

Goldenstar, yes it can work like that. There is even a specific vet phone line to the call centre where treatment for wildlife and domestics that get taken to vets by members of public will get authorised to be paid for by the RSPCA. Most of the time vets won't do a thing until they know its paid for, even when it's not RSPCA generated.

OP I understand your frustration. It's a horrible situation especially as you have to see it every day. Just think though, the horse is on the radar, he is KNOWN. Just remember that everything has to be proved, and sometimes that takes time. It all comes down to the vet. The vet has the say so. My advice, tomorrow demand a equine vet comes out and has a look. Then try and be there to talk to the get yourself.


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## Goldenstar (22 May 2013)

MillyMoomie said:



			Whilst undoubtably underweight I would be surprised if this horse is removable under section 4 awa. You say the owner had left half a bag of food? And albeit in a not great way, has arranged feeding responsibility through you? So the owner is taking SOME responsibility then? And now the owner is aware you are the person responsible? 
Now you are obviously a caring responsible person for being quite rightly concerned but is there more to the story? Can you be absoloutly sure that advice hasn't been given to the owner? Sometimes these things take time... at the end of the day the vet that supports suffering on a animal has to stand up in court and be totally convinced that NO REASONABLE STEPS HAVE BEEN TAKEN by the person responsible to ensure the needs are met. There is now 2 years of potential evidence that is damaged every time someone else feeds/waters the horse... Hard to say but true. 
Would be very interested to know what happens tomorrow. Either way I hope something gets done.
		
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I have to agree that I don't on the limited evidence of the photos this horse is not removable.
I totally agree that people keeping horses going does muddy the waters as far as having a strong case in court.
But what does a loving horse person do water her horse while the other looks on its reasonable to expect someone to do this no clearly it's not .
What gets me here is that numerous agency's have seen this horse but have not made it clear to the person on the ground what they have done to try to make things better.
Why people who are not interested in horses keep them I don't know it's completely beyond me.
The owner of the land has a duty of care however pissing of field owners can quickly result in the the land owner getting rid of the problem and then the poor old horse has lost the support network with although not satisfactory was all he had, it's not easy to be the welfare officer in the middle of these situations.
If it where me I would be working to persuade the owner that it was a great idea to have a more formal arrangement for Op to care for the horse i gently lean on the land owner on the duty of care angle.
But you can't get it right for them all and a lot of HHOers would be horrified how many horses live I was in the end it got to me and had to give it up.


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (22 May 2013)

Goldenstar said:



			J and M who owns the field he's in?
		
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Local land owner. Elderly lady. She's tried speaking to him, but she's a frail old dear and knows nothing of horses. She's spoken to rspca inspectors when they come and i direct them to her house, he's kept prince there 17 years so she has more info than i do but she's scared to speak to him. He has rough social circles and she knows he has history. She supports me in everyway however and is happy to speak to inspectors or officers but kicking him off the yard leads to questions like 'where will he put him?' 'will the rspca ect lose him?' and 'what comebacks will she have'?


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## Goldenstar (22 May 2013)

MillyMoomie said:



			Goldenstar, yes it can work like that. There is even a specific vet phone line to the call centre where treatment for wildlife and domestics that get taken to vets by members of public will get authorised to be paid for by the RSPCA. Most of the time vets won't do a thing until they know its paid for, even when it's not RSPCA generated.

OP I understand your frustration. It's a horrible situation especially as you have to see it every day. Just think though, the horse is on the radar, he is KNOWN. Just remember that everything has to be proved, and sometimes that takes time. It all comes down to the vet. The vet has the say so. My advice, tomorrow demand a equine vet comes out and has a look. Then try and be there to talk to the get yourself.
		
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MM this is not a wild animal or a pet  a member of the public has found after a RTA it's a horse with a known owner that many agency's have seen already if OP calls the vet she will be paying the call out .


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## Goldenstar (22 May 2013)

Jessi&Magic said:



			Local land owner. Elderly lady. She's tried speaking to him, but she's a frail old dear and knows nothing of horses. She's spoken to rspca inspectors when they come and i direct them to her house, he's kept prince there 17 years so she has more info than i do but she's scared to speak to him. He has rough social circles and she knows he has history. She supports me in everyway however and is happy to speak to inspectors or officers but kicking him off the yard leads to questions like 'where will he put him?' 'will the rspca ect lose him?' and 'what comebacks will she have'?
		
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Ok not a lot of leverage there scaring old ladies is bad for buisness but it's great you have a good relationship with her .


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## russianhorse (22 May 2013)

I'm sorry that I can't think of much more to contribute than what has already been discussed, but was just musing. You say you've tried to buy him, but a friend used to loan him many years ago. Would the owner therefore not "loan" him to you instead?

Poor horse and a horrid situation for you to be in.....


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (22 May 2013)

Goldenstar said:



			I have to agree that I don't on the limited evidence of the photos this horse is not removable.
I totally agree that people keeping horses going does muddy the waters as far as having a strong case in court.
But what does a loving horse person do water her horse while the other looks on its reasonable to expect someone to do this no clearly it's not .
What gets me here is that numerous agency's have seen this horse but have not made it clear to the person on the ground what they have done to try to make things better.
Why people who are not interested in horses keep them I don't know it's completely beyond me.
The owner of the land has a duty of care however pissing of field owners can quickly result in the the land owner getting rid of the problem and then the poor old horse has lost the support network with although not satisfactory was all he had, it's not easy to be the welfare officer in the middle of these situations.
If it where me I would be working to persuade the owner that it was a great idea to have a more formal arrangement for Op to care for the horse i gently lean on the land owner on the duty of care angle.
But you can't get it right for them all and a lot of HHOers would be horrified how many horses live I was in the end it got to me and had to give it up.
		
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I agree with what you've said but as you've put it, it's hard not to muddy the waters. I don't want to see him dehydrated, in the baking sun while i top up my mares water, and then the next day to have nothing but a dead horse to walk by.
It would haunt me for life that it would have taken minutes to fill a bucket up. He's looked alot worse than this. and i agree, theres worse welfare cases around but for two years? with all agencies working on it. and nothing has changed. last year the RSPCA removed these two horses from directly opposite princes field! They are in fine condition! Yet no one looks over to prince, he's partially concealed from the road.

http://www.gazette-news.co.uk/news/9476387.RSPCA_act_over_the_plight_of____abandoned____horses/


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## MillyMoomie (22 May 2013)

Goldenstar... I have had visits and sinple treatment paid where the call has come from a mop and the equines where already 'monitored'. 

If the horse is in such a state that needs removing then the bills would generally go to the RSPCA anyway.

It prob is very dependant on what area of the country you are in and what the vet/RSPCA/WHW relationships are like. I'm my experience everyone talks to each other.


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## MillyMoomie (22 May 2013)

JM you have just hit the nail on the head, the article you have posted states the horse were removed after being 'abandoned'. This means that the RSPCA were able to provide evidence to the vet and the police that their needs were not being met. So even though prince may be worse, his his ARE kind of being met aren't they? 
I'm sorry I know it's hard. I think you deserve a proper conversation with all the people dealing to be given a clear idea of what's happening.


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## ridefast (22 May 2013)

Well, I'm a little confused, as you're saying horse is costing you money and it sounds as if you can't really afford the time or the money (I might be wrong, this is just how it comes across) 
And yet you would be more than happy to buy the horse off the owner, costing you atleast the same amount of money if not more. Why not just feed the horse and poo pick the field and care for the horse regardless, as the owner doesn't seem to mind, you clearly love the horse, the relelvant authorities aren't doing anything, and the horse gets to end his days happy and well fed?
Would the owner let you loan him if you want to make things official?


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (22 May 2013)

They weren't abandoned though  this news article was written by fools. I'll get the next part where they say the horse had a crack in its hoof and risked having the leg amputated 

These horses were signed over to me by their previous owner who didn't fancy a conviction. but by no means had abandoned them! Both now have lovely owners (perm loans) but still live together!

http://www.gazette-news.co.uk/news/local/9484865.Rescuer_Alan_gives_abandoned_horses_a_new_life/

Notice how im not even mentioned!! they took my picture and interveiw! The gentleman has taken sonny and belle has a little girl that rides her.


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (22 May 2013)

ridefast said:



			Well, I'm a little confused, as you're saying horse is costing you money and it sounds as if you can't really afford the time or the money (I might be wrong, this is just how it comes across) 
And yet you would be more than happy to buy the horse off the owner, costing you atleast the same amount of money if not more. Why not just feed the horse and poo pick the field and care for the horse regardless, as the owner doesn't seem to mind, you clearly love the horse, the relelvant authorities aren't doing anything, and the horse gets to end his days happy and well fed?
Would the owner let you loan him if you want to make things official?
		
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No worries, i'll try harder to explain  I offered to buy him before i had bought my mare, last year.
He's not costing me money at all, but i was saying if the feed he's left runs out i'll have to buy more i suppose.
I'm coming to the conclussion that at the end of the year i might have to sell up and move out. I wouldn't be able to care for him if i wasn't coming down to do my horse. I just want him happy.


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## MillyMoomie (22 May 2013)

So they weren't abandoned? Ok I will find out through some contacts exactly what the reason was.


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## competitiondiva (22 May 2013)

personally I feel there is alot more going on here, Redwings have attended previously with a vet team. You've either spoken to or had BHS attend previously and RSPCA have been out both today and yesterday???  and the horse is still there....

Phone the RSPCA and ask the officer dealing gives you a little information, by law they cannot give alot (data protection), but maybe they can give you a bit of an idea of what's happening if you inform them of the time span of this.  

I agree that I think you're interventions whilst helping him short term, may have been hindering him long term as I don't from those photos think a vet would deem him to be in a suffering state and therefore warrant immediate removal.  But then I am not a vet, so if at the  end of the day you are not happy with what all the charities are doing.  Call a vet out yourself and see what they say.  If suffering is given, have the vet phone the RSPCA or police direct......


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (22 May 2013)

MillyMoomie said:



			So they weren't abandoned? Ok I will find out through some contacts exactly what the reason was.
		
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Nope, owner only lived down the road. They were for sale but the owner signed them over for no fee. I even have the reciept 
Rspca were bearly involved, had no follow ups from them when i got the horses and none since.

Find out through contacts what reasons?


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## ridefast (22 May 2013)

Jessi&Magic said:



			No worries, i'll try harder to explain  I offered to buy him before i had bought my mare, last year.
He's not costing me money at all, but i was saying if the feed he's left runs out i'll have to buy more i suppose.
I'm coming to the conclussion that at the end of the year i might have to sell up and move out. I wouldn't be able to care for him if i wasn't coming down to do my horse. I just want him happy.
		
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Ok, yes that makes more sense. Well would he be happy to loan the horse to you? Maybe he's worried about what happens to the horse if he were sold (He might consider himself a good owner!!) But as the horse has been loaned before would that be an option?


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (22 May 2013)

competitiondiva said:



			personally I feel there is alot more going on here, Redwings have attended previously with a vet team. You've either spoken to or had BHS attend previously and RSPCA have been out both today and yesterday???  and the horse is still there....

Phone the RSPCA and ask the officer dealing gives you a little information, by law they cannot give alot (data protection), but maybe they can give you a bit of an idea of what's happening if you inform them of the time span of this.  

I agree that I think you're interventions whilst helping him short term, may have been hindering him long term as I don't from those photos think a vet would deem him to be in a suffering state and therefore warrant immediate removal.  But then I am not a vet, so if at the  end of the day you are not happy with what all the charities are doing.  Call a vet out yourself and see what they say.  If suffering is given, have the vet phone the RSPCA or police direct......
		
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I understand, If i call the rspca they say the case is pending investigation.  I'm not on a witch hunt but i just hope the charities are doing all that they can. Two years just seems like too long for a horse to be constantly underweight. I'm not a vet either, I've seen off the track racehorses looking worse than him, i'll agree but i'd be happy with his owner feeding him and slapping a rug on in the minus temps, thats all.


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (22 May 2013)

ridefast said:



			Ok, yes that makes more sense. Well would he be happy to loan the horse to you? Maybe he's worried about what happens to the horse if he were sold (He might consider himself a good owner!!) But as the horse has been loaned before would that be an option?
		
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I wouldn't mind loaning him, just to potter about and talk to but all previous loans have simply been part loans, the horse has never left the field or exchanged hands. If i do have to leave the yard, he'll just go back to being uncared for and maybe no one will call the welfare organisations


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## lurcher98 (23 May 2013)

How did the meeting go? Any news on this lad?


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (23 May 2013)

Bhs lady came down, wrote lots down and asked alot of questions. Alot more than anyone else and she actually went in the field to see him! Has given me a compliance note to give the owner when he returns. It states that the horse is a 1.5 body condition and has very split hooves and the field needs cleaning and de- ragworting.
The lady was very kind, but i did stress that now was the time to act, not so i have to call again in six months because he's still loosing weight, not being fed and his field is still covered in muck.
Just a waiting game now i suppose.


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## JillA (23 May 2013)

That sounds promising - good for you. I hope it does make a difference for that poor horse.


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## CeeBee (23 May 2013)

Well done for not letting this drop. I hope this story has a happy ending now


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## Amymay (23 May 2013)

Thanks for the update Jessi


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## Penny Less (23 May 2013)

well done for hanging in there, however, does the bhs lady have any power to make owner do something , or would she have to pass to rspca ?


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## The Fuzzy Furry (23 May 2013)

alma said:



			well done for hanging in there, however, does the bhs lady have any power to make owner do something , or would she have to pass to rspca ?
		
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BHS Welfare, WHW and RSPCA have the same powers & all have training, just that the RSPCA has limitless funds for some instances (IMHO) and they wear uniforms.

The ones that DO have immediate legal powers are: Animal Welfare person at your council offices (usually based in the environmental health dept), Vet or Police


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## moodymare123 (23 May 2013)

Good luck!!


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## Tern (23 May 2013)

I actually came upon a horse similar to this except he has a grey gelding by his side too, they were tethered with chains, and as you said were led down for hours all skin and bone only sometimes having a rug, there was a bay and a grey, the ponies got moved before we could make a complaint


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## Tern (23 May 2013)

And let me tell you something - The RSPCA are not acting because he's not going to drop dead, they like to help at the last minute and make it look like they saved the horse asap like in that condition


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## smellsofhorse (23 May 2013)

A horse was as bad as you say and no one will help.
The kindest thing being to put horse down.
I would lie to vet or hunts man.
Say it was my horse and have it put down.
I would accept the consequences.

This horse may not be at that stage yet.

Try and get media coverage, start a Facebook page. 
Write to a politician.


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## moodymare123 (23 May 2013)

Im sorry but  having a horse put down that isnt yours you would need full passport etc, and i think it would be rather inconsiderate to not let owner know wether or not they care for it!! He looks like a lovely boy, and he seems to have your best interests at heart!!


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## Moomin1 (23 May 2013)

CobbyHoofs said:



			And let me tell you something - The RSPCA are not acting because he's not going to drop dead, they like to help at the last minute and make it look like they saved the horse asap like in that condition 

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Yeah, course. 

On that note - how come WHW haven't acted?


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## Gingerwitch (23 May 2013)

moodymare123 said:



			Im sorry but  having a horse put down that isnt yours you would need full passport etc, and i think it would be rather inconsiderate to not let owner know wether or not they care for it!! He looks like a lovely boy, and he seems to have your best interests at heart!!
		
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I have never been asked for a passport when having a horse pts


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## Moomin1 (23 May 2013)

Gingerwitch said:



			I have never been asked for a passport when having a horse pts
		
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How would you feel if someone just pts your horse out of the blue without any consultation?

I think this is the most ridiculous suggestion (not by you, but by the poster who suggested it) I have ever heard.

OP, the police have all the powers which NO charity or organisation have - if that horse is suffering, then on the advice of a vet, they can authorise his pts without owners, or anyone's, consent.  Why not just get a vet out, and see what the vet says?


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## Polos Mum (23 May 2013)

Gingerwitch said:



			I have never been asked for a passport when having a horse pts
		
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Neither have I - why would the passport be needed unless the horse is at a slaughter house?


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## Goldenstar (23 May 2013)

alma said:



			well done for hanging in there, however, does the bhs lady have any power to make owner do something , or would she have to pass to rspca ?
		
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Neither the BHS lady or the RSPCA have any power to make the owner do anything that you I or OP could not get him to do they have exact the same powers as anyone.
A compliance notice is just a piece of paper that proves the owner was advised of certain things it might help in the future however as it was not given to the owner the line of evidence is muddied.
OP well done just hang on in there for the poor old boy.
It so frustrating its supposed to be Ilegal not to meet a pets needs it seems the law is still not working.


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## Goldenstar (23 May 2013)

Moomin1 said:



			How would you feel if someone just pts your horse out of the blue without any consultation?

I think this is the most ridiculous suggestion (not by you, but by the poster who suggested it) I have ever heard.

OP, the police have all the powers which NO charity or organisation have - if that horse is suffering, then on the advice of a vet, they can authorise his pts without owners, or anyone's, consent.  Why not just get a vet out, and see what the vet says?
		
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Because the vet will say the horse is a 1.5 on the condition score needs xyz to eat and it's teeth doing worming etc etc then send her a bill .
And I think just having a horse PTS that does not belong to you when it's owner is on holiday  is about the most barking suggestion I have ever heard on HHO .


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## moodymare123 (24 May 2013)

You always need to tell the passport company that the horse has been put to sleep anyway! Wether or not passport has been asked for, from my experience it has always been asked as vet need to be a hundred percent that it is there horse because of it wasnt they would be liable!! And also to write down everything they have been injected with so they cant be sent to slaughter!!


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## honetpot (24 May 2013)

The welfare organisations will not act because in relation to a lot of what they see he is not that bad. I know that sounds callous but they are full to the gills with rescues and he would have to be at deaths door before they will prosecute and that costs money.
 I would have to say you either have to ignore him, try social net work or neighbours to put pressure on the owner or just keep on feeding him yourself.
 There have been so many welfare cases this winter that its hard for all the horse welfare organisations, I am not saying this horse is well cared for but it definitely not the worst I have seen. We all have to stop thinking the RSPCA is going to save them, they are not.


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## Amymay (24 May 2013)

honetpot said:



			The welfare organisations will not act because in relation to a lot of what they see he is not that bad.
		
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Thankfully it would appear that they are acting.


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## MillyMoomie (24 May 2013)

OP was the bhs person a vet? If not it is ill advised to state a body score. A vets opinion is the only one that matters at the end of the day. 
Also slightly worrying that they gave the notice to you, to give to the owner? Very odd practice.


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## Tnavas (24 May 2013)

Threaten SPCA that you will go to the newspaper unless they get onto it and remove the horse.

Poor thing looks terrible and that is awful rain scald he has on his back.

The more public fuss that is made the more the Horse Rescue people do - they don't like bad publicity.


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## MillyMoomie (24 May 2013)

Tnsvas people could go to every newspaper in the world, but 3 organisations have seen the horse and 3 have not removed it. Does this not tell you something? 

Very simple. Get a vet. If a vet will support suffering the horse will be removed. The RSPCA or anyone else cannot remove the horse unless this is the case. So whatever newspapers say is utterly irrelevant


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## Amymay (24 May 2013)

MillyMoomie said:



			OP was the bhs person a vet? If not it is ill advised to state a body score. A vets opinion is the only one that matters at the end of the day. 
Also slightly worrying that they gave the notice to you, to give to the owner? Very odd practice.
		
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The BHS _person_ was a welfare professional, well able to make a judgement on the condition score of the animal.

As for handing the notice to the OP - well as the owner is on hols, a bit difficult to hand it to him.  At least with the OP there is an assurance that owner will see the notice on his return from holiday - rather than it getting blown away.....


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (24 May 2013)

Sorry, had driving test.
1, im not getting him put down, silly advice, you can't just go round having horses shot. His owner would also subsequenty put me down.
2. I dont know if the bhs lady was a vet. I didnt ask to see her qualifications or school leavers book. She took out a peice of paper with a picture for each number of the scale. She circled 1 and put a note saying 1.5, i think, i wasnt watching. I was too busy stopping prince eating her lovely bag.
3, action is being taken. Yay! Have been in contact with a few of the bhs workers and been told how they are going to take action. Im not going to repeat it in here as i was asked not to!
4, the notice of compliance was given to me and i will put it on the fence closer to the day he's here, simply so it doesnt wash away with the rain. Im keeping my eyes peeled for him car around but in laminate the notice with selotape none the less.

As it stands prince is currently still there. About to have some munch and very soggy ): he's hiding behind his tree which is literally just a few twigs! Similar to a tree you'd find in the desert!


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## Tnavas (24 May 2013)

MillyMoomie said:



			Tnsvas people could go to every newspaper in the world, but 3 organisations have seen the horse and 3 have not removed it. Does this not tell you something? 

Very simple. Get a vet. If a vet will support suffering the horse will be removed. The RSPCA or anyone else cannot remove the horse unless this is the case. So whatever newspapers say is utterly irrelevant
		
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Yes it does tell me something that half the time the people who work for RSPCA don't know one end of a horse from the other! The condition of the horse is a disgrace.

A few years ago we had a case of two neglected mares - SPCA went to see them and when the person complained again advised that they had seen them and were keeping an eye on them - we got together and collectively wrote an email to the relevant place - we (readers on a NZ forum) sent money to the local feed store for food for these horses while the person who had made the complaint went and fed them. One had the most horrendous fistular on her wither as a result of the ripped and ill fitting rug she had on. Following the bombardment of emails SPCA finally uplifted the horses and they went to a rescue centre where one of the mares died - the other with the terrible fistula battled for many months to regain her health and is now a much loved member of the rescue centre.


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## MillyMoomie (24 May 2013)

Tnavas the fact you are stating the SPCA tells me you are not in the Uk? In which case it is possible that where you are the SPCA have actual powers? That is totally different. 
Here the RSPCA have no powers and it wouldn't matter how many people wrote to a newspaper if a vet wouldn't support in accordance with the animal welfare act. 

Some particular inspectors I regularly work with are very capable in equines. They are considered equine officers and I personally have met some who are a mixture of previous national hunt jockeys, eventers, respected showing judge etc.

Amymay, regardless of a Bhs welfare officer being CAPABLE of accurately judging a body score, they wouldn't be considered a expert witness in court and therefore not useful evidence. In fact I have seen a bhs welfare officer ripped to shreds by a defence on this very fact. It doesn't mean they can't note it, just a note that its not always wise too. 

My point of handing the notice to the OP is that it's kind of confusing the while situation further. If the BHS then contact the owner in say 2 wks time when the owner is back and ask what they done to rectify the pints on the notice, the owner can simu point a finger to the OP to say they never received the notice, unless the OP or the BHS can prove this there is no point what's so ever in giving it. Unless the BHS explained this to the OP? I personally feel sorry for the OP


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## Goldenstar (24 May 2013)

MillyMoomie said:



			OP was the bhs person a vet? If not it is ill advised to state a body score. A vets opinion is the only one that matters at the end of the day. 
Also slightly worrying that they gave the notice to you, to give to the owner? Very odd practice.
		
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Nonsense I was trained to body score when a welfare officer it's not rocket science .
However I would never have told OP my score it would have recorded it with my observations and shared with colleagues .
I would not have given notice to OP I would have found where the owner lived and put it through his door .
When he returned from holiday I would be visiting him.
A vets opinion is not the only thing that matters in such cases this case may well be solved by a welfare officer who prepared to go and knock the owners door and then do it again and again and again until something ( loan to OP in this case I think) gets sorted.
No one going to be in a rush to remove this horse it has an owner who can afford to keep it and a friend who's trying to help it it's in a better place than many, things are crap out there at the moment .


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## Amymay (24 May 2013)

Really, is there any need for this?

The OP is trying to help an animal in need.

She has gone down the correct route of asking welfare organisations for help.

This is now in hand and an action plan put in place.

There really is very little more to say other than we all await the outcome.


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## Goldenstar (24 May 2013)

You know MM in court an expert witness can be many things a vet yes on the veterinary side and in my case an expert in whats the normal way for a good owner to handle horse care I was a witness in a case where the main evidence was mine , telling the magistrates how a good normal horse owner approaches their horse having lice the person was given a life ban.


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (24 May 2013)

MillyMoomie said:



			My point of handing the notice to the OP is that it's kind of confusing the while situation further. If the BHS then contact the owner in say 2 wks time when the owner is back and ask what they done to rectify the pints on the notice, the owner can simu point a finger to the OP to say they never received the notice, unless the OP or the BHS can prove this there is no point what's so ever in giving it. Unless the BHS explained this to the OP? I personally feel sorry for the OP
		
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I'll take a dated picture. My problem is putting it on his fence, its knowing when to do it as I rarely see him, as he's rarely down. I think i'll just ahve to keep an eye out for his car (he lives up the road from the horse, do not know address however) and as soon as i see his motor i'll pop it on the fence.


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## MillyMoomie (24 May 2013)

Goldenstar I know exactly what an expert witness is, I am one!  You have misunderstood me. You can be a witness and a expert witness. Of course the expert witness evidence is not the only evidence there is. Whichever welfare officer that originally dealt with any animal in question would be required to give a statement. A horse having lice and advising what a reasonable person would do is quite different to stating in court the body score, explaining that body score and backing it up with blood tests etc EVIDENCE that only the vet can provide.
However there is nothing to stop a welfare officer interviewing the owner and presenting them with the codes of practice (which has body score in it) and asking them what they think their horse is, and then the officer agreeing or disagreeing with them. 
Of course anyone else that has dealt with this horse is also potential evidence, now this is my point with the OP, potentially they will have quite valuable evidence in proving that the owner received a notice.


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## Tnavas (24 May 2013)

MillyMoomie said:



			Tnavas the fact you are stating the SPCA tells me you are not in the Uk? In which case it is possible that where you are the SPCA have actual powers? That is totally different. 
Here the RSPCA have no powers and it wouldn't matter how many people wrote to a newspaper if a vet wouldn't support in accordance with the animal welfare act. 

Some particular inspectors I regularly work with are very capable in equines. They are considered equine officers and I personally have met some who are a mixture of previous national hunt jockeys, eventers, respected showing judge etc.

Amymay, regardless of a Bhs welfare officer being CAPABLE of accurately judging a body score, they wouldn't be considered a expert witness in court and therefore not useful evidence. In fact I have seen a bhs welfare officer ripped to shreds by a defence on this very fact. It doesn't mean they can't note it, just a note that its not always wise too. 

My point of handing the notice to the OP is that it's kind of confusing the while situation further. If the BHS then contact the owner in say 2 wks time when the owner is back and ask what they done to rectify the pints on the notice, the owner can simu point a finger to the OP to say they never received the notice, unless the OP or the BHS can prove this there is no point what's so ever in giving it. Unless the BHS explained this to the OP? I personally feel sorry for the OP
		
Click to expand...

SPCA has the same powers as your RSPCA - they had to act - we emailed the head of SPCA en masse!


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## hihosilver (24 May 2013)

poor you how horrid having to face this every day. I had a very similar story. A horse was at my livery yard and owner was elderly and sick. YO did not want to know so I called the RSPCA who were brilliant came in a week and talked calmly to YO who was so embarrassed she took steps to feed the poor horse and then he went to someone who could look after him until the owner was better. The RSPCA often get slated but in reality they are dealing with thousands like the horse in the photos...made so much worse by the harsh winter. If I were you I would keep ringing them and even send a photo in anonymously. I would be careful of naming and shaming on facebook as this could make your life hell.


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## Amymay (24 May 2013)

hihosilver said:



			If I were you I would keep ringing them and even send a photo in anonymously. I would be careful of naming and shaming on facebook as this could make your life hell.
		
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The BHS are now involved.


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## MillyMoomie (24 May 2013)

Tnavas ok so which SPCA? I can only think of the Scottish/oz/NZ/us all of which have powers. Unless I'm mistaken?


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## Tnavas (24 May 2013)

MillyMoomie said:



			Tnavas ok so which SPCA? I can only think of the Scottish/oz/NZ/us all of which have powers. Unless I'm mistaken?
		
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NZ SPCA have no powers to seize - they have to get a court order to do so - our SPCA rules are the same as UK's. By emailing we made them get their posterior into gear and get the relevant documents done.


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## MillyMoomie (24 May 2013)

Tnavas oh? I thought the animal welfare officers of the SPCA are approved under the act? 
http://www.biosecurity.govt.nz/legislation/animal-welfare-act/guide/index.htm#appointment


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## Amymay (24 May 2013)

What point are you trying to make MillyMoomie?


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## Tnavas (24 May 2013)

MillyMoomie said:



			Tnavas oh? I thought the animal welfare officers of the SPCA are approved under the act? 
http://www.biosecurity.govt.nz/legislation/animal-welfare-act/guide/index.htm#appointment

Click to expand...

WOW - they are really sneaky at changing things! 

Well despite what they are allowed to do they still don't do it! The people they sent to wee the horses in my previous post felt that they were OK - the fact that one of the mares had a huge and very infected fistular didn't seem to bother them. 

I wonder how much of the 'what you are allowed to do' actually filters down to the people sent to inspect.


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## MillyMoomie (24 May 2013)

Tnavas well at least they all got sorted in the end, seemingly thanks to your actions. Like you say writing letters etc worked for you, in my experience it doesn't really work here..
Yes it would be interesting how the officers feel about using their powers?

Amymay I don't understand your question? Point about what?


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## tabithakat64 (24 May 2013)

OP I'm really pleased the BHS have stepped in and action is now being taken, well done for continuing to help the poor horse


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (8 August 2013)

I've got him!


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## Goldenstar (8 August 2013)

Do you mean you have ownership of him now ?.


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## Meowy Catkin (8 August 2013)

Goldenstar said:



			Do you mean you have ownership of him now ?.
		
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I hope so.


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## Goldenstar (8 August 2013)

Faracat said:



			I hope so.
		
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So do I .


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## Merrymoles (8 August 2013)

Me too! Only been lurking but want to thank you for everything you've already done for this boy


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## Mariposa (8 August 2013)

Don't leave us hanging! More details needed!!


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## starryeyed (8 August 2013)

Yes more details! I've only just caught up on this thread, just wanted to say a huge well done to you for all you've done to try and help this lovely boy. He does look stunning in those older photos, would be so nice to see him that way again. x


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## zaminda (8 August 2013)

Good luck with him, he has fallen on his feet at last.


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (8 August 2013)

Apologies! Sister got the spirit stallion of the cimmaron dvd delivered today and i had to uhh....Make sure it worked  yup, hes all mine! All paperwork being sorted tomorrow but ive got a scrap of paper with the transaction on it!
Many thanks to the BHS. Without the pressure you put on the owner to get him sorted this wouldnt have happened. I know it wasnt easy, coming down everyweek and advising with nothing done.

Owner finally admitted that the horse isn't ill, just hungry and he'll be fattened up by me.
Back up procedures in place, vet (and farrier) coming down and if serious health complications found then that decision will be made. If in the future i cannot keep him the local horse ranger have got my back and say he can be a permanent nanny horse, living out his days in peace.


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## Amymay (8 August 2013)

Wonderful, wonderful, wonderful!!


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## MrsMozart (8 August 2013)

No idea how I missed this 

Bloody brilliant m'duck! Just bloody brilliant. 

Got to go. Screen gone blurry.


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## ghostie (8 August 2013)

Just seen this for the first time and read from start to finish. What a lucky horse to have you to fight for him. Fingers crossed for a happy ending now he has you to look after him. Keep us posted please


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## Goldenstar (8 August 2013)

Fantastic , OP you are a white knight I met some wonderful white knights in my time as a welfare officer , that's someone who goes to an animals help and follows through whatever .
Well done and I hope he recovers well and enjoys his care .


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## Goldenstar (8 August 2013)

OH and well done BHS as well it's unglamorous  and hard work dealing with a case through pester power but well done to the welfare officer as well.


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## starryeyed (8 August 2013)

What fantastic news, you are amazing!!! Make sure you keep us all updated on his progress, what a lucky boy to have found you!


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (8 August 2013)

And there shall be updates!

The lovely, lovely! BHS lady gave me some brilliant feed advice and he's having speedi beet up to his eyeballs in as many small feeds as i can manage a day.

When i went to tell him (because horses need to know these things) he was in his usual spot, head down, tail limp. Not even bothering to swipe at the many flies buzzing all over him. I walked past, as usual, and he bearly lifted his head. I walked straight to the tack room, gathered my grooming tools, fly fringe, fly spray and a bucket of soaked feed and went back to him. I gave him the feed and proceeded to remove the matts, mud and winter coat. Cleaned his thrushy feet with hibi, frog disinfectant and stockholm tar and dealt with the flies. The final touch was a brand new headcollar and for once in many, many years he actually looked like someones horse.


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## Slightly Foxed (8 August 2013)

Jessi&Magic said:



			And there shall be updates!

The lovely, lovely! BHS lady gave me some brilliant feed advice and he's having speedi beet up to his eyeballs in as many small feeds as i can manage a day.

When i went to tell him (because horses need to know these things) he was in his usual spot, head down, tail limp. Not even bothering to swipe at the many flies buzzing all over him. I walked past, as usual, and he bearly lifted his head. I walked straight to the tack room, gathered my grooming tools, fly fringe, fly spray and a bucket of soaked feed and went back to him. I gave him the feed and proceeded to remove the matts, mud and winter coat. Cleaned his thrushy feet with hibi, frog disinfectant and stockholm tar and dealt with the flies. The final touch was a brand new headcollar and for once in many, many years he actually looked like someones horse.
		
Click to expand...

You've just brought tears to my eyes and I'm a wizened old bird. Well done you, and the best of luck to you both!


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## jrp204 (8 August 2013)

Very well done, he is lucky to have you.


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## BeanyG (8 August 2013)

This is a brilliant end to this! Hope he's said to be in good health other than the obvious when the vet comes


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## kinnygirl1 (8 August 2013)

Slightly Foxed said:



			You've just brought tears to my eyes and I'm a wizened old bird. Well done you, and the best of luck to you both!
		
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A tear came to my eye too. What a wonderful happy ending.. Well done OP!


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## Goldenstar (8 August 2013)

Jessi&Magic said:



			And there shall be updates!

The lovely, lovely! BHS lady gave me some brilliant feed advice and he's having speedi beet up to his eyeballs in as many small feeds as i can manage a day.

When i went to tell him (because horses need to know these things) he was in his usual spot, head down, tail limp. Not even bothering to swipe at the many flies buzzing all over him. I walked past, as usual, and he bearly lifted his head. I walked straight to the tack room, gathered my grooming tools, fly fringe, fly spray and a bucket of soaked feed and went back to him. I gave him the feed and proceeded to remove the matts, mud and winter coat. Cleaned his thrushy feet with hibi, frog disinfectant and stockholm tar and dealt with the flies. The final touch was a brand new headcollar and for once in many, many years he actually looked like someones horse.
		
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Ok I admit it that's got me in tears.


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (8 August 2013)

The RSPCA ordered him to have a extensive health check and he used my vet so i found out the results. All okay, slightly worm count high, bloods fine but signs of liver damage.
But living in a field chock full of ragwort will do that to a horse!


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## Cazzah (8 August 2013)

Slightly Foxed said:



			You've just brought tears to my eyes and I'm a wizened old bird. Well done you, and the best of luck to you both!
		
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mine too. Brilliant ending! Everything crossed with the vet. Xx


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## PolarSkye (8 August 2013)

Jessi&Magic said:



			Apologies! Sister got the spirit stallion of the cimmaron dvd delivered today and i had to uhh....Make sure it worked  yup, hes all mine! All paperwork being sorted tomorrow but ive got a scrap of paper with the transaction on it!
Many thanks to the BHS. Without the pressure you put on the owner to get him sorted this wouldnt have happened. I know it wasnt easy, coming down everyweek and advising with nothing done.

Owner finally admitted that the horse isn't ill, just hungry and he'll be fattened up by me.
Back up procedures in place, vet (and farrier) coming down and if serious health complications found then that decision will be made. If in the future i cannot keep him the local horse ranger have got my back and say he can be a permanent nanny horse, living out his days in peace.
		
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Hurrah!  I am so glad to read this lovely update and to hear that this boy has landed on his feet with you . . . best of luck with him and I can't wait to see pictures of him looking all glossy and gorgeous in a few months time .  Very well done xx

P


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## SatansLittleHelper (8 August 2013)

Absolutely amazing, fantastic, brilliant. ..!!!! Grinning from ear to ear now


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## Fjord (8 August 2013)

Well done! I am so pleased, your story has made me mist up. He is going to love being loved by you.


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## dianchi (8 August 2013)

In 4 weeks we need a it's gone on too long the next chapter post!

Well done!


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## jcberry (8 August 2013)

Just read all of this and I am so glad it had a happy ending what a caring person you are! X


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## ester (8 August 2013)

Brilliant, well done you for persevering too


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## Clare85 (8 August 2013)

Jessi&Magic said:



			Me and him have an understanding. He doesn't kick, headbutt or bite me and in exchange i love him. Suits us well.
		
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I've just read through this entire thread and misted up round about the time you said this &#708;&#708;&#708;&#708;&#708;

So glad you kept fighting for the poor boy and that he gets to live out his days being loved and cared for! Well done OP :biggrin3:

This has really put a smile on my face this evening. Looking forward to more updates on him soon


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## Ibblebibble (8 August 2013)

damn you jessi you've reduced me to blubbing in  really happy way I am so very pleased for you and for the old lad.x


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## Amaranta (8 August 2013)

Slightly Foxed said:



			You've just brought tears to my eyes and I'm a wizened old bird. Well done you, and the best of luck to you both!
		
Click to expand...


Me too!  So glad for this horse that you were there for him!


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## Meowy Catkin (8 August 2013)

Awwwwww - what a lucky boy he is. 

Well done J&M - you're a star!


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (8 August 2013)

We'll you'll have another joining you with the crying on sunday. Kyra (queen of the yard) is coming back from a week at a riding schools pony club and i can only imagine her face when she sees this skinny old man hanging around her palace. Oh the squealing that will occur.

Very excited to see his passport tomorrow. I hear he has champion lines on his thoroughbred side and very interested in his actual age, i've been told all the numbers from 15 - 27 and it'd be nice to find out who's lying 

Ice cream (mint choc chip) and bottled water (to even it out ) for all the readers.

And a special thanks to AmyMay. You were the one who Pm'd me and pushed me to contact the BHS, you gave me support and advice.

I've told prince he'll be famous!


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## The Fuzzy Furry (8 August 2013)

Nice one, so pleased for you - and a huge well done to your local BHS officer


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (8 August 2013)

And here's a token picture from earlier in the year.


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## MochaDun (8 August 2013)

I hope he will now live out his days in peace and happiness with you, well done for all your efforts and being there for him.


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## Clare85 (8 August 2013)

Oh, he looks so sad and vulnerable! Just made me cry all over again! Thank goodness he has you!


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## Bestdogdash (8 August 2013)

I cannot remember the last time I was so moved - I am in absolute admiration of you Jess - so many talk the talk, you have done the walk. I am so ashamed that I don't do more. Good luck to you - this should be a movie


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## Merrymoles (8 August 2013)

Fantastic news and well done you and the lovely BHS lady. Another one here who has filled up at this. I hope you have many, many happy years together.


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## Cooperfam (8 August 2013)

Very well done Jess! How wonderful of you to persevere and do your best for this poor boy. I will keep everything crossed for you and him in the future. Look forward to updates.


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## Queenbee (8 August 2013)

Fan-boody-tastic!!!!!

Well don op, congratulations xxx

Now if we had a 'like' button


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## dawn m (8 August 2013)

congratulations, all your hard work has paid off.  I hope the Prince has a long and happy life with you.  Some day you will be repaid for all you compassion and kindness shown to this old boy.


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## CambridgeParamour (8 August 2013)

Have just read this whole thread and just wanted to say youre awesome 

What a lovely boy!


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## Regandal (8 August 2013)

That picture! Just got me bawling.  You must promise to post updates regularly, please.  Well done.


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## babymare (8 August 2013)

You talked the talk but by heck lass you kept at it. another in admiration of you . well done and a hug x


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## Perfect_Pirouette (8 August 2013)

Ahh, I remember commenting on this thread and funnily enough was only thinking of him the other day!

Well done you, this is utterly fab news!


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## LittleGinger (8 August 2013)

Jessi&Magic said:



			I gave him the feed and proceeded to remove the matts, mud and winter coat. Cleaned his thrushy feet with hibi, frog disinfectant and stockholm tar and dealt with the flies.
		
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Lucky Prince! He will be so delighted and amazed when he realises this is going to be a regular occurrence 
Just read the thread all the way through and your support, determination and unconditional adoration of this horse has shone through. Well done you.




Jessi&Magic said:



			The final touch was a brand new headcollar and for once in many, many years he actually looked like someones horse.
		
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*Sniff*! Picture of Prince in new headcollar please


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## mulledwhine (8 August 2013)

Amazing news  pictures please !!

Although pleaed note not all horses that look like that are not looked after and not loved 

My old boy came back from loan a bag of bones , I spent £100's if pounds per month on feed and supplements trying to fatten him up


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## Ladyinred (8 August 2013)

Another who has just read the whole thread. Seems there is now something wrong with my computer screen as it has gone all blurred for some reason...
Well done OP, many would have given up long ago. x


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## noodle_ (8 August 2013)

well done 

what a lucky lucky lad to have found someone who cares as much as you do


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## Jayzee (8 August 2013)

well done for persevering 
he is extremely lucky to have you


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## 9tails (8 August 2013)

Jessi, well done!  I'm in Essex, if he's around 6'6 I'm sure I can dig out a few excess turnout rugs for you.  PM if interested.


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## WelshDiva (8 August 2013)

Massive well done to you!!
Hope he continues to progress and gets all the love that he deserves from  such a great person- you!!
We defo need updates and pictures!!


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## Amymay (8 August 2013)

Jessi&Magic said:



			And a special thanks to AmyMay. You were the one who Pm'd me and pushed me to contact the BHS, you gave me support and advice.
		
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You're very kind. All I did was give you a little pointer.

I am genuinely so thrilled for you and Prince. I will look forward to the updates xxx


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (8 August 2013)

9tails said:



			Jessi, well done!  I'm in Essex, if he's around 6'6 I'm sure I can dig out a few excess turnout rugs for you.  PM if interested.
		
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Hiya! I honestly have no idea what size he is, i put an old 6'0 on him last winter but his entire bum hung out! If you'd be willing to do that i'd be very grateful. He literally has nothing with him but his old headcollar, which i gave him 2 years ago anyway! and im assuming i might get the water buckets if im lucky lol!

As bloody always my first was a pony sized in everything, kyra is a cob and prince is a full so hardly anything can be reused lol!


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## Cortez (8 August 2013)

Very well done for persisting in getting this poor horse some help, I wish you all the best of luck in getting him back to health. Kudos for being so kind and CARING  about him. I have fallen in to a few rescues myself, and there has to be somebody to say "this will not happen". There isn't always a happy ending to these stories; this is just the beginning of making him well.


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## Uliy (8 August 2013)

Wahee! Well done well done well done


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## sarahann1 (8 August 2013)

Yay for happy endings!! We need more pics please


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## glamourpuss (8 August 2013)

Hi Jess, I have tons of rugs(all kinds)/headcollars/bridles/bandages/boots etc hanging around so if you need anything please let me know


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (8 August 2013)

Thank you everyone for such kind words and messages. I've never done something like this before, but i've know prince for so many many years and i've watched keenly by his fence as a young child all the way up to moving my own horse beside him. I promise to update when i've taken some pictures, i did go down today on my break but i was like a person possessed, i just wanted him to be clean and comfortable. I know being scruffy is least of his problems but it seemed all i could do in the short 2 hours i had.


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## Mrs C (8 August 2013)

Fantastic and well done. i so look forwards to pics and updates on the lovely man xxx


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## 9tails (8 August 2013)

Jessi&Magic said:



			Hiya! I honestly have no idea what size he is, i put an old 6'0 on him last winter but his entire bum hung out! If you'd be willing to do that i'd be very grateful. He literally has nothing with him but his old headcollar, which i gave him 2 years ago anyway! and im assuming i might get the water buckets if im lucky lol!

As bloody always my first was a pony sized in everything, kyra is a cob and prince is a full so hardly anything can be reused lol!
		
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PM your whereabouts, I'll be happy to deliver them to you.  I've got a rainsheet, a showerproof rug with a bit of fill and a heavyweight all in good nick.


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## FionaM12 (8 August 2013)

What a lovely story. 

Prince has no idea how his life is all going to change for the better now. Well done Jessi.


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## babymare (8 August 2013)

As always the good side of HHO  shines through. this forum never fails to  amaze me. I applaude all with offers of rugs etc. Outstanding x


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (8 August 2013)

babymare said:



			As always the good side of HHO  shines through. this forum never fails to  amaze me. I applaude all with offers of rugs etc. Outstanding x
		
Click to expand...

Its truly amazing! I appreciate it so so much! I don't want to appear as a charity case or anyone to think im begging for things but i didnt wake up this morning thinking i'd have prince! The phonecall was so out of the blue, last thing i heard he was trying to find people willing to shoot and dispose of him as he was 'ill'!

In unrelated news, i contacted his old loan and she said he's related to Tamerillo. Whos that?


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## Shadow the Reindeer (8 August 2013)

Jessi&Magic said:



			In unrelated news, i contacted his old loan and she said he's related to Tamerillo. Whos that?
		
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Could this be his relative? http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/news/william-fox-pitt-to-retire-tamarillo-at-badminton-horse-trials/


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## 9tails (8 August 2013)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tamarillo_(horse)


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## Shadow the Reindeer (8 August 2013)

Oh and I have to say, I'm so pleased this ol' man gets to get the retirement and love he so really deserves.. well done Jessi


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## 9tails (8 August 2013)

You've not asked for anything, we've offered so don't worry about it.  I have unused rugs, your new horse needs rugs.  Nags aren't cheap, especially thin ones.

If that ruddy Tesco ad takes up my screen once more, I'm going to scream!


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## Marydoll (8 August 2013)

Just saw this and as others, my eyes are leaking like a rusty bucket,  but what goes around comes around, op something good must be in the future for you, well done


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (8 August 2013)

Wowee. Thats one famous horse. I'll find that out when i get a peek at his passport. The story is the champion stallion was sent to the wrong mare at stud or vice versa and prince was the result. Bought to race but has lived in the same field since he was 10months old. Oh the joys of trying to get him in a horsebox if i ever needed to!

Another fun fact! Prince as a yearling once spooked, ran through the fencing then again through the yard owners 9ft evergreen fence and into a brand spanking new swimming pool. Apparently he had to be rescued by the firebrigade!

Tesco is cutting that one alittle fine, isn't it? Is it for burgers?


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## bumper (8 August 2013)

Jessi&Magic said:



			And there shall be updates!

The lovely, lovely! BHS lady gave me some brilliant feed advice and he's having speedi beet up to his eyeballs in as many small feeds as i can manage a day.

When i went to tell him (because horses need to know these things) he was in his usual spot, head down, tail limp. Not even bothering to swipe at the many flies buzzing all over him. I walked past, as usual, and he bearly lifted his head. I walked straight to the tack room, gathered my grooming tools, fly fringe, fly spray and a bucket of soaked feed and went back to him. I gave him the feed and proceeded to remove the matts, mud and winter coat. Cleaned his thrushy feet with hibi, frog disinfectant and stockholm tar and dealt with the flies. The final touch was a brand new headcollar and for once in many, many years he actually looked like someones horse.
		
Click to expand...

That's lovely. My screen is misty! 

What an amazing young person you are J&M. Your perseverance is extraordinary. Well done you!


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## _GG_ (8 August 2013)

This has to be one of the best threads i have ever read on HHO.

Bleedin well done to you OP xx


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## star26 (8 August 2013)

Jessi- I have just read this entire thread, mainly with tears in my eyes- first from sadness, then from happiness! I am soooooooooooo pleased that Prince is now yours, what a sad life he has had, being neglected and basically staying in a small paddock for his whole life- it's heartbreaking. 
You really are a special person to persevere and keep on caring for the old boy despite his difficult circumstances and idiot of an owner, plus your own horse to do as well.  
I am really looking forward to following his progress and seeing lots of pics on here soon!


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## TheSylv007 (9 August 2013)

Fantastic news - well done for your determination.


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## Big Ben (9 August 2013)

Another misty eyed reader here, what a great story, kudos to you for fighting for this guy, and I wish you two a great life together.


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## NaeNae87 (9 August 2013)

Aww yay! 

Congrats Jessi. Glad to know all your hard work has paid off. I am yet another who has shed a few tears this morning.  What a lovely start to my Friday. Thank you for sharing both Prince & your story. 

Keep us all updated, I am sure you will inundated with update requests and picture requests. 
Give him a hug and a carrot from me


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## Kenzo (9 August 2013)

Arrrr wonderful news, you are saint sent from horsey heaven!


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## MrsMozart (9 August 2013)

Jessi&Magic said:



			Hiya! I honestly have no idea what size he is, i put an old 6'0 on him last winter but his entire bum hung out! If you'd be willing to do that i'd be very grateful. He literally has nothing with him but his old headcollar, which i gave him 2 years ago anyway! and im assuming i might get the water buckets if im lucky lol!

As bloody always my first was a pony sized in everything, kyra is a cob and prince is a full so hardly anything can be reused lol!
		
Click to expand...

If you need anything let me know. I have more spare gear than you could shake a stick at! Happy to have couriered or deliver.


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## Fransurrey (9 August 2013)

Oh OP, I remember this thread well and to see he's finally come to you is amazing. Got more than a little speck of sentiment in my eye. Well done to all involved, but mostly you. I think you're a diamond. X X X


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## samisheen (9 August 2013)

this has brought tear to my eyes well done op, I am going to have a look at the yard and see what i have i can send you, I know i have a head collar and lead rope and am sure there are other bits i dont use x


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## meesha (9 August 2013)

Such a wonderful outcome and all down to your perseverance. Can't wait to see pics of him over the next couple of months, what a lucky boy to have you x


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## AngieandBen (9 August 2013)

_GG_ said:



			This has to be one of the best threads i have ever read on HHO.

Bleedin well done to you OP xx
		
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Hear hear


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## doriangrey (9 August 2013)

It's so obvious you love him OP, what a happy outcome well done for persevering.  The picture of him curled up in the field like a foal brought a lump to my throat.  Can't wait to see updates.


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## ralph and maverick (9 August 2013)

Well done!!! I wish you both lots of happiness, what a brilliant result, and what a lucky boy to have you in his life.
Pictures required of prince in his new headcollar!  x


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## MochaDun (9 August 2013)

Feeling very annoyed with myself as feel like I gave away a decent m/w rug on eBay earlier this week for an utter bargain - was only 5'6" so may have been too small but if timings had been different I'd have hauled it off and sent it to you to try on him - would rather Prince had had it for free!


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (9 August 2013)

Good morning  haven't been to see him yet as im live in at work until 4 today, but someone's going down to feed at 8, 12 then il feed at 4 and 8. Then i'l be off for a week for pampering and much needed appointments.

To the kind souls that want to send things, thank you so much! If anyones got a spare pair of large overreach boots knocking around i'd be grateful. He makes this god awful noise when he walks, im sure its his back hooves hitting his front ones and it makes your whole body cringe! Its like having someone with tapdancing shoes stamping around the field!
He's currently wearing kyra's too small (and dare i say it, fluffy) ones but with feet the size of dinner plates they are just sitting pertly on top like teacups on a saucer!
Also thank you all. i've probably bitten off more than i can chew but im not scared, i've got such wonderful support on here and we love you all.
Its amazing to think he's not going to go hungry for days at a time anymore and he's just going to get fatter!


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## MrsMozart (9 August 2013)

I have a pair. Pm me 

Let me know what rug size and I'll send a couple. If you get more than you need, feel free to give to a charity


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## Hetsmum (9 August 2013)

Just wanted to say well done for not giving up on this horse!  I read the original thread and have wondered what the outcome would be.  Well what a fabulous turn of events.  I took on a rescue case and it is the most rewarding thing ever.  Sorry no help with the large over reach boots - all mine are only a medium but I will ask at the yard later.  You will probably find with a decent farrier that the forging (guessing that's what he's doing) will stop anyway.  Huge pat on back to you and hope you have done a little happy dance.......I know I have!


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## loopiesteff (9 August 2013)

Just spent the last 45 minutes reading the whole story. Blubbed more times than there are pages! 

Well done for sticking by him!

Definitely need pics of him in his new headcollar


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## Embo (9 August 2013)

So heartwarming. Prince will finally lead a comfortable life from now on, thanks to you. It's the least any horse deserves, poor thing.

And what a lovely gesture that other HHOers are offering their spare equipment. How generous! This whole story has really tugged on the old heart strings!! 

You are Prince's saviour, well done. You should be proud of yourself. Looking forward to updates


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## Feathered (9 August 2013)

Just read this whole thread... I don't really know what to say... I'm welling up. 

Brilliant, just brilliant. 
Please keep us updated!


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## stencilface (9 August 2013)

Just caught up with this - well done OP, looks like a lovely future is in store for him.  Hows the feeding going?  Our old boy (29yo TB) is on speedibeet and fast fibre nuts this summer, have to say he's only been on the fast fibre for a few weeks and on no new grass and he has picked up a huge amount in that time - might be worth asking about too (apologies if I've missed other feeding things).  It seems very palatable, and is soaked so easy for old teeth - plus ours is prone to choke so its great feeding him something virtually impossible to choke on!


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (9 August 2013)

Stencilface said:



			Just caught up with this - well done OP, looks like a lovely future is in store for him.  Hows the feeding going?  Our old boy (29yo TB) is on speedibeet and fast fibre nuts this summer, have to say he's only been on the fast fibre for a few weeks and on no new grass and he has picked up a huge amount in that time - might be worth asking about too (apologies if I've missed other feeding things).  It seems very palatable, and is soaked so easy for old teeth - plus ours is prone to choke so its great feeding him something virtually impossible to choke on! 

Click to expand...

He's on speedi beet and hay at the moment, just to get him used to regular feeds. He's very very prone to choke, he doesnt seem to think to chew when i goes in his mouth! I have a feeling his teeth will be foul but my vet is a registered dentist so il ask her to take a look. Fast fiber is a good shout though. I'm off to the tack shop later to pick up a wormer, no doubt his first. so i'll get some advice and a feed list from them  Thank you!


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## paulineh (9 August 2013)

If he is prone to colic you need to give him some probiotics with and after you worm him.

If anyone could get some rugs I have up to you , you can hav them. They are stable rugs and turn out. They came from a horse that was dumped on me. They will fit a 16hh plus.

I will Pm you


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## Holding (9 August 2013)

Where in Essex are you, OP? PM if you like. If you are near my shop come up and see me and I'll donate some feed/supplies.


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (9 August 2013)

Holding said:



			Where in Essex are you, OP? PM if you like. If you are near my shop come up and see me and I'll donate some feed/supplies.
		
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I'm in Colchester, feed would be amazing, thats what im most worried about!


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## ester (9 August 2013)

I'd stick with the speedibeet over fast fibre as it has a higher DE .


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## Ruth_Cymru (9 August 2013)

Op- you're a star x x  Prince now has a secure future because of you, you should be proud of what you've achieved.


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## Mariposa (9 August 2013)

Another good food for older horses - Old Faithful from Allen and Page, my 19 yr old really bulks up on it. Its easy to eat, which helps him as his teeth aren't great.

So pleased it has all worked out


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## trottingon (9 August 2013)

Well done OP what a great result!!! Lucky Prince!
What rug size is he? I have a spare brand new still in the bag 6'3 heavyweight stable rug with neck going spare - got it last year, too big for my horse and I never got round to taking it back to the shop - if you'd like it, PM me your address and I'll post it to you.


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## paulineh (9 August 2013)

Simple Systems are a very good feed for putting weight on. Their grass nuts and Lucie nut together give a nice big bucket and if made really wet helps the hydration. SS is the feed of choise of the EMW (Equine Market Watch) here is a link to a case on Arabian Lines http://arabianlines.com/forum1/topic_new.asp?TOPIC_ID=51511. It shows how a very bad neglect case can be turned around. 

As he is an Anglo Arab I would be interested in his breeding ,more the Arab side tha the TB side.


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (9 August 2013)

paulineh said:



			Simple Systems are a very good feed for putting weight on. Their grass nuts and Lucie nut together give a nice big bucket and if made really wet helps the hydration. SS is the feed of choise of the EMW (Equine Market Watch) here is a link to a case on Arabian Lines http://arabianlines.com/forum1/topic_new.asp?TOPIC_ID=51511. It shows how a very bad neglect case can be turned around. 

As he is an Anglo Arab I would be interested in his breeding ,more the Arab side tha the TB side.
		
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Yes the BHS lady, said that simple systems greengold? (i think) would be good when his feeds get abit more regular. Right now he's so confused about being fed more than once every few days that he doesn't seem to no whats going on when the food arrives!

As soon as i get his passport i'll post the bloodlines on here.


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## Tobiano (9 August 2013)

Just wow.  What a wonderful girl you are Jessi.  I do hope Prince brings you as much joy as you clearly will do him.  I just wonder too whether given the vet's comments about his liver it might be worth seeing if there is a good supplement for that - people on here will know!  Good luck to you both x x


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## Tinsel Town (9 August 2013)

Jessi&Magic said:



			And there shall be updates!

The lovely, lovely! BHS lady gave me some brilliant feed advice and he's having speedi beet up to his eyeballs in as many small feeds as i can manage a day.

When i went to tell him (because horses need to know these things) he was in his usual spot, head down, tail limp. Not even bothering to swipe at the many flies buzzing all over him. I walked past, as usual, and he bearly lifted his head. I walked straight to the tack room, gathered my grooming tools, fly fringe, fly spray and a bucket of soaked feed and went back to him. I gave him the feed and proceeded to remove the matts, mud and winter coat. Cleaned his thrushy feet with hibi, frog disinfectant and stockholm tar and dealt with the flies. The final touch was a brand new headcollar and for once in many, many years he actually looked like someones horse.
		
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tears in eyes, lump in throat. Well done Jessi  cant wait to see pictures in the near future of him!!


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## Cortez (9 August 2013)

I am quite sure you already know this, but perhaps be a bit careful in the beginning as it is a delicate thing feeding up extremely underweight horses. Suddenly giving large amounts can cause all sorts of problems, including colic, choke, liver problems, etc. Worming can also be problematic if there is a large worm burden. It's quite important to get the vitamin/mineral balances right in the beginning, and protein levels need to be kept under 12%. Very good quality carbohydrate and oil are a good way to up the calories - could you perhaps talk to one of the feed companies nutritionists, or one of the equine rescue charities?

ETA I see you've already spoken to the BHS about this; good idea.


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## Jaycee (9 August 2013)

What an amazing story of true grit and determination!  Hats off to you Jess for sticking by him for so long, perfect ending.  Hope you both have many happy years together!


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (9 August 2013)

Cortez said:



			I am quite sure you already know this, but perhaps be a bit careful in the beginning as it is a delicate thing feeding up extremely underweight horses. Suddenly giving large amounts can cause all sorts of problems, including colic, choke, liver problems, etc. Worming can also be problematic if there is a large worm burden. It's quite important to get the vitamin/mineral balances right in the beginning, and protein levels need to be kept under 12%. Very good quality carbohydrate and oil are a good way to up the calories - could you perhaps talk to one of the feed companies nutritionists, or one of the equine rescue charities?

ETA I see you've already spoken to the BHS about this; good idea.
		
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All advice is taken in!
He's on around 3/4 scoop on speedi beet as many times a day as possible, just small potions and ad lib hay. BHS suggested mirconised linseed and eventually simply systems greengold. They told me to keep away from molasses.
In regards to worming i was going to speak to the lady at the tack shop that administers them but last time my friend got a wormy underweight colt we were advised panacur 5 day so i assume they may suggest that. I've got to get a worm count kit for Kyra anyway so i'll get him checked.
thank you


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## Bennions Field (9 August 2013)

well done jess for continuing to try, and with a fabulous result  

with regard to the liver results, milk thistle is fabulous for helping the liver cope and recover.  my old girl (30 years old) had some liver issues a couple of years ago and vet advised to use milk thistle, it helped  a huge amount and is totally safe which is more important.  feed wise i would stick with what your'e doing, the BHS officers will know what to suggest and it sounds like they have been prince's life line finally.  

best of luck with him and look forwrd to updates on his progress.


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## ShadowHunter (9 August 2013)

Just caught up with this thread. Another one who's all misty-eyed  Well done OP for battling for him, Prince will now have the life he deserves in his old age. Regular updates will be needed, of course


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## MaHats (9 August 2013)

Wow, what a fantastic outcome.  I'm so pleased for you, and Prince.  You really are a Star.  Would be so nice to see his progress.  You are quite amazing.  Can hardly wait for more news and pictures


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## hessy12 (9 August 2013)

well done for all the work you've put in. xxx


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## zandp (9 August 2013)

Really shouldn't have read this at work as I'm all teary now, well done !


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## unbalanced (9 August 2013)

Ditto what BF said about milk thistle for liver damage. My 23 year old had signs of liver damage last year and we put her on a pill called heptasyll (sp?) and milk thistle. She was awful about taking the pill and it was also really expensive and never really lowered the enzymes so she came off that and it was the milk thistle and a careful diet that did the trick (low fat and low protein) in the end.
Good luck - another that thinks you have done a brilliant job


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## montysmum1 (9 August 2013)

If it's any consolation, I've seen worse and seen them recover with the right care and tlc, hopefully if the BHS can help get him out of his current situation he'll be looking and feeling much better soon x


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## fatpiggy (9 August 2013)

Hopefully your lovely boy is now on the road to recovery.  If he has liver damage stick to low protein food, so unfortunately that means low oil.  Sugar beet is great stuff, and as you are already aware, feed little and often.  I took over the care of a 39 year old pony who was like a hat rack.  Owner told me she always lost weight in the winter (so would they if they weren't given anything to eat!), didn't like sugar beet, couldn't be stabled because she didn't like it blah blah.  When I took her on she weighed 550lbs.  The following winter she came out of it weighing over 700lbs.  I soaked everything for her as she had no functioning grinding teeth, and yes, she had and enjoyed, lots of sugar beet.  I made her hay ration in grass nuts and chop.  Her owner agreed to buy her a quality new rug.  She went from being a loner (because she knew she was vulnerable being so thin) to a bossy, sassy little old lady who lasted to her mid-40s.  At last she knew she was loved and had status, a proper routine and had horsey friends.  She even grew back her tail which was lost to untreated chronic but low level sweetitch.  Some homemade fly spray and black wound powder was all it took.  Your boy will appreciate everything you do for him. Even 5 minutes of love and attention after years of neglect means everything to an animal.  There is a sad but lovely video on youtube about a very elderly dog that was found dying in the street by a couple who took him home and gently cared for him, showed him kindness and sat through the night with him until he died. But that dog would have known that someone cared about him, possibly for the first time in his life.  Animals ask for so little.


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## Gracie21 (9 August 2013)

Amazing update!! Massive well done OP. Amazing advice and support on here. Can't wait to see some pics of him in his new headcollar  xxx


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## threeponies (9 August 2013)

Well done to you!  I'm pretty sure I have a tub of milk thistle at the yard, my pony refused to eat it after the first tub.  I'll double check it's still there later and if it is, you and Prince are very welcome to it


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (9 August 2013)

threeponies said:



			Well done to you!  I'm pretty sure I have a tub of milk thistle at the yard, my pony refused to eat it after the first tub.  I'll double check it's still there later and if it is, you and Prince are very welcome to it 

Click to expand...

That's exceptionally kind! Thank you very much!


Also that you for all the kind comments! i'm so so grateful for the support!


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## kirstys 1 (9 August 2013)

Hope he has a long and happy life with you!

I seem to have something in my eye . . . . . . . .


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## Bills (9 August 2013)

What a wonderful thing you have done for this horse, well done.

I hope you both have many happy years together


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## Ladyinred (9 August 2013)

fatpiggy said:



			Hopefully your lovely boy is now on the road to recovery.  If he has liver damage stick to low protein food, so unfortunately that means low oil.  Sugar beet is great stuff, and as you are already aware, feed little and often.  I took over the care of a 39 year old pony who was like a hat rack.  Owner told me she always lost weight in the winter (so would they if they weren't given anything to eat!), didn't like sugar beet, couldn't be stabled because she didn't like it blah blah.  When I took her on she weighed 550lbs.  The following winter she came out of it weighing over 700lbs.  I soaked everything for her as she had no functioning grinding teeth, and yes, she had and enjoyed, lots of sugar beet.  I made her hay ration in grass nuts and chop.  Her owner agreed to buy her a quality new rug.  She went from being a loner (because she knew she was vulnerable being so thin) to a bossy, sassy little old lady who lasted to her mid-40s.  At last she knew she was loved and had status, a proper routine and had horsey friends.  She even grew back her tail which was lost to untreated chronic but low level sweetitch.  Some homemade fly spray and black wound powder was all it took.  Your boy will appreciate everything you do for him. Even 5 minutes of love and attention after years of neglect means everything to an animal.  There is a sad but lovely video on youtube about a very elderly dog that was found dying in the street by a couple who took him home and gently cared for him, showed him kindness and sat through the night with him until he died. But that dog would have known that someone cared about him, possibly for the first time in his life.  Animals ask for so little.
		
Click to expand...

Thanks Fatpiggy.. thats got the tears flowing again.x

Jessi, it sounds like the BHS have been amazing. The ony thing I would question is the Greengold, great stuff but very coarse if his teeth aren't perfect. Also, unless you have a supplier nearby the cost of getting a relatively small amount might prove prohibitive. We switched to Top Chop Lite for these reasons and have found it excellent.


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## Annagain (9 August 2013)

If he does turn out to be related to Tamarillo, it may be worth letting William Fox Pitt know his story? With everything he gets from sponsors he may be able to give you some feed/equipment? It would be a great PR opportunity for them and I'm sure he'd want to help the half-brother of one of his best ever horses (if not the best - I'm sure I read an interview where he said Tamarillo was his horse of a lifetime).


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## hayinamanger (9 August 2013)

Epic thread!  Jessi, I missed this in May and have just read it from start to finish.  I am so impressed by you and the fact that you never gave up on this horse, very well done.  I have lots of rugs, boots and tack in various sizes, send me a message of anything you need.


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## ozpoz (9 August 2013)

Really well done - so happy with the result and reading all the kind offers of help is completely heartwarming. I hope you both bring each other much joy in the future.x


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## mulledwhine (9 August 2013)

ester said:



			I'd stick with the speedibeet over fast fibre as it has a higher DE .
		
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I would steer clear if fast fibre, it did my boy no good at all 

I ended up feeding speedi beet, barley rings, alfalfa, and build up, with added pink powder, if he gets choke I would probably leave out the alfalfa.

Ps I have had a look and my oR boots have had it, but I have a couple of 6'3 rugs, one is still in good condition ( a LW) and the other is a medium weight and has a few rips, but you are welcome to them if they are of any good to you x


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## Cyberchick (9 August 2013)

I've just read the whole thread. I don't really know what I can say other than well bloody done! x


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## Po Knee (9 August 2013)

I have come to this thread late, but just wanted to say what a gorgeous boy he was, and under your care hopefully will be again. Well done for your perseverance - I take my hat off to you!


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (9 August 2013)

Hello everyone! First off. Wow, just wow! Such lovely responces! I've just got back from meeting Holding at her tack shop Greenstead Green Animal Feeds because she has very kindly donate many many things to prince! I was awestruck that she cared so so much and was willing to pay out of her own pocket! Im at the yard currently doting to the man himself hand and foot. Pics tonight but heres one of the wonderful things Holly gave prince!


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## Spring Feather (9 August 2013)

How very kind of everyone (and you!) for helping this horse :smile3:


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## Cortez (9 August 2013)

Oh, that's a lovely picture! He's going to love getting rid of all that! He looks desperately poor, but not starving/endangered, so you have a really good chance of bringing him back to full health and condition. I was involved in a rescue several years back in which many of the horses were given a 50/50 chance of survival (all did!), but it took nearly 3 years to get them looking "normal", and a further 2 to build the large muscles back up. Best wishes; he's a lucky boy.


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## Gingermonkey (9 August 2013)

You've done a good thing, I wish there was an award we could give you. All the people who've offered kind help as well, restores my faith in human kind. He may not have the weight and condition yet but you've given him hope. Well done.


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## Ladyinred (9 August 2013)

And more tears because of the kindness of Holding. 

This has got to stop before there is a major tissue shortage..

That picture shows how poor he is but I think you will get him to a reasonable weight for winter.


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## Holding (9 August 2013)

Bless him - what a sweetie, and how lovely he has a proper home at last.

Please keep us updated with loads of pics.


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## mulledwhine (9 August 2013)

Wow what a very kind and lovely person she is 

And another well done to you x


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## PollyP99 (9 August 2013)

Such a lovely thread , I've joined the blubbers, well done jess!


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## MrsMozart (9 August 2013)

Sorted


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (9 August 2013)

Update and pictures on the way! Just got home, i love him but he's so stinky! my dogs wont even go near me!


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## HeresHoping (9 August 2013)

My eyes are leaking.  What a wonderful, wonderful update. Jessi, you are a start and well done for fighting for so long. And Holding, you are a saint!


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## Meowy Catkin (9 August 2013)

Oh wow! There are some wonderful people in the world. 

Holly/Holdings you are wonderful! 

J&M - you have saved this horse, he now has a bright future.


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## nicolenlolly (9 August 2013)

wow...just did all of this in one blow and it is like a hollywood film! good luck to you both  xx


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (9 August 2013)

Pictures from today!


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## mulledwhine (9 August 2013)

Lovely photos 

Watch your tootsies


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## MrsMozart (9 August 2013)

Lovely pictures indeed


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## Uliy (9 August 2013)

Fantastic! He looks much happier already


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (9 August 2013)

I did post an explanation about my footwear but my internet was down so i could only manage 4 pictures on the phone. I got all suited thinking i'll just finish work and my riding boots will be in the car i'll look all professional for pictures but needless to say, they are hiding! After the first pic i did put my yard dublins on (without socks i may add, eww!) 
Got a few vids to upload when i have time and tomorrow or sunday im going to trot him up and let you guys tell me what you think. His trot is so pretty! Im used to tiny ponies with legs that move faster than your eyes can, but his is so floaty and elegant!


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## Adopter (9 August 2013)

So pleased for you and Prince.  Thank you for caring and being prepared to keep going till you got a result.

Delighted that you finally got support to tackle the situation, well done BHS.


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## Ladyinred (9 August 2013)

Bless him. He must wonder what's going on to get all this love and attention. Hard to explain but he already looks happier.

So very glad he is now yours.


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## star26 (9 August 2013)

Great pics, esp the last one, he looks so happy! 

Just amazing that Holding donated all that stuff- what a kind heart. 

Thanks for the update, will look forward to the videos and watching him progress.


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## Hetsmum (10 August 2013)

Holding - you absolute super star!!! I hope everybody local shops and shops and shops some more to make up for this!  Jessi - he doesn't look good does he but as vet has said nothing basically wrong I bet he will look a different horse in 4 weeks.......  My lad was a bit worse than him when I got him and 6 weeks later was unrecognisable.  Little and often - just as you are doing will get you there.  Thank you for not giving up...he is one lucky lad and already looks loved! x


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## TrasaM (10 August 2013)

What an amazing story. He looks like a lovely horse and it beggars belief how someone could just plonk him in a field and neglect him like this. Well done you. I'm sure he will make a speedy recovery with all the love, care and yummy feeds. A horse at a  friends yard wasn't far off this condition during the winter but once the new grass came through he transformed back really quickly.


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## MrsMozart (10 August 2013)

Overreach boots will be with you Monday/Tuesday


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## Carlosmum (10 August 2013)

Cyberchick said:



			I've just read the whole thread. I don't really know what I can say other than well bloody done! x
		
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Me too!


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## bumper (10 August 2013)

Bliddy brilliant


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## RutlandH2O (11 August 2013)

Just read the whole thread...leaky eyes, runny nose, wet cheeks, and a lump in my throat that won't let me swallow! And it's all been so worth it!!

Jessi, well done you!! You have given me renewed faith in humanity! The Tamarillo connection is very exciting...I think annagain's suggestion is well-taken. Prince is a handsome boy, and, with your loving care, will be even more so.

I think I've got a bottle of milk thistle that I can send your way.


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## xDundryx (11 August 2013)

Sniff..Amazing! And he is gorg..eo..us!! Such a kind face and eyes.. Hugs to you both x


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## Alyth (11 August 2013)

Tamarillo was bred by Finn Guiness at Biddesden Stud, so it may be that he will be able to provide some information.....does he have a brand?  Wonderful that you have been able to do this....


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## Armas (11 August 2013)

Jessi&Magic said:



			And here's a token picture from earlier in the year.






Click to expand...




AngieandBen said:



			Hear hear 

Click to expand...

What a super story well done OP thats so moving had me blubbing away ! Happy days ahead


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## hayinamanger (11 August 2013)

Wonderful :'-)


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## Fools Motto (11 August 2013)

A lovely story. You need to write a book about him. I bet you could, and I bet it will be a sad, yet happy read. All the very best with him, and I'm another that is looking forward to future updates and photos. x


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## BlackRider (11 August 2013)

What a wonderful story.

Well done Jessi, I hope you are Prince have many happy years together


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## GeorgeyGal (11 August 2013)

I've just read the whole thread and cheered out loud when I saw you have him! Fantastic outcome. Just a shame neglectful owners just get away with it so easily.


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## Rosiejazzandpia (11 August 2013)

Just read the whole thread. Cried a lot but what a happy ending  well done to you OP and what a beautiful horse!


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## Milanesa (11 August 2013)

I too have just read the whole thread, well done Jessie for not giving up on him, and what a wonderful outcome- this has to be the best thread ever on hho. So what are his bloodlines do post when you get his passport  what a lucky lucky horse - you should feel very proud of yourself and so should everyone offering donations too, stories like this are so heart warming   look forward to more updates on prince xx


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## JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic (11 August 2013)

Updates Thread is here!

http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?628390-I-am-Prince


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## lurcherlu (28 August 2013)

Jessi&Magic said:



			and for once in many, many years he actually looked like someones horse.
		
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Jessiandmagic...you've made me cry, horses don't ask fr a lot and don't know of things such as potential etc, but they know of love and food. All horses in captivity deserve to be someone's horse, someone's pride and joy and for someone to be proud of them. Please be proud of yourself


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