# OK here we go. Your views



## horses13 (1 April 2010)

Spill all what you have to say, what you know and what you think you know.
I will not be back until tuesday so i will let you know who is right.
Should be interesting!


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## aimeejay (1 April 2010)

Im a bit confused what are you asking? (sorry if Ive missed it completely!)
And wow your a 'yearling' ive never seen that before-only seen junior member and senior member


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## BBH (1 April 2010)

I'm not sure what you're asking us tbh.

 The horse is clearly starved but without more details who knows how to respond. I would hazzard a guess its not your horse because I can't imagine anyone on here keeps their horse in such a way.  

Have you rescued it ?


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## horses13 (1 April 2010)

I asked about intelligent worming and received comments about this horse which i did not mentioned. I just opened up this for people to give their comments and then i will tell them the real story.


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## chestercharlie (1 April 2010)

somewhat vague OP but are you saying weight loss is due to worm burden and mistreatment or does it have some underlying issue, health issue or is it ancient??

Either way, I'd say it could do with a good meal!!!!

My own opinion of intelligent worming? Dont believe in it...as far as herbal worming etc.  

If you are talking chemical worming following worm counts then yes I subscribe to that.


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## horses13 (1 April 2010)

chestercharlie said:



			somewhat vague OP but are you saying weight loss is due to worm burden and mistreatment or does it have some underlying issue, health issue or is it ancient??

Either way, I'd say it could do with a good meal!!!!

My own opinion of intelligent worming? Dont believe in it...as far as herbal worming etc.  

If you are talking chemical worming following worm counts then yes I subscribe to that.



Click to expand...

I have not said a word about this horse. People were commenting so i opened it up for comments. Where have they all gone?


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## Persephone (1 April 2010)

OP posting this and then stating that you will not be back until next Tuesday is ridiculous.

I can only assume that you are deliberately trying to cause a furore.

Pointless and juvenile.


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## ester (1 April 2010)

not sure i can be bothered to guess, but I assumed it was one of the animal (s) found alive with the dead mare recently.


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## rosie fronfelen (1 April 2010)

all i can say and see, is starvation and therefore neglect, whatever other reasons, there could be a myriad!! horrific pics. anyway- sorry!


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## kibob (1 April 2010)

Ok here we go.....  

I know - it's a really skinny pony.

I think I know - there must be some sort of worming/intelligent worming relevance?

My view - haven't got a clue cos I don't know what I am being asked to have a view on


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## kibob (1 April 2010)

aimeejay said:



			And wow your a 'yearling' ive never seen that before-only seen junior member and senior member 

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aimeejay - I've just seen a foal too


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## Kat (1 April 2010)

horses13 said:



			Spill all what you have to say, what you know and what you think you know.
I will not be back until tuesday so i will let you know who is right.
Should be interesting!

Click to expand...

I'll spill all what I have to say then; 

Your grammer is bloomin awful! 

And you haven't actually asked a meaningful question so there can be no right answer. So I'm thinking troll like behaviour!


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## horses13 (1 April 2010)

I am asking for general comments.
When pics are seen such as this people make up their own minds and comment on the horse/pony what condition they think it is in, what it needs doing it, who needs to see it etc.
O.k. imagine i put up a photo and this pony was in the background. I am asking for the same comments that would be given.
Somebody has already said it needs a good meal, any expansion on that?


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## martlin (1 April 2010)

Wellll, it is skinny...
How observant of me, isn't it?


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## MissMincePie&Brandy (1 April 2010)

OK, so the poor animal is either starved and neglected, or terribly ill. 

If lack of worming has reduced the pony to this level, I would say there's damage inside the gut. 

I saw a grass sickness case once and the pony became quickly emaciated looking before it was put down (but I don't think cases of that generally happen this time of year). 

So, what's the story?


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## quirky (1 April 2010)

I'm confused.

It is obvious to anybody, you don't need to be horsey, that it is painfully thin.

Are you asking us to tell you how to care for it?


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## MontyandZoom (1 April 2010)

I'm guessing (forgive me if I'm wrong) that this is some sort of snidey reference to your last post when people assumed, perhaps wrongly, that your worming questions were about this horse.

TBH, it would probably have been easier to simply explain what was wrong with the horse/the story rather than being so cryptic. At the end of the day....on a forum of horse lovers.....people are going to say something about a horse in that condition!


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## posie_honey (1 April 2010)

my first thought was needs feeding up gradually - possible teeth checking to ensure it can chew properly... possiblly bloods taken to find out why so thin if unknown - unless it's obvious neglect... maybe recovering from grass sickness... the sores on the withers suggests either ill fitting saddle or - and prob more probable imho - rug - goes with sore on rump too then... rescue case maybe? 

i actually think i understand why you put this up = i figure you replied to a thread about intelligent worming - or maybe started a thread asking what people thought of it? and instead of getting constructive responses i figure you got asked about the piccies in your signature - so instead of taking the intelligent worming thread off topic you decided to post thses piccies so people could jump to conlusions about the horse on this thread instead of the original thread... am i right?


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## Black_Horse_White (1 April 2010)

Firstly he/she needs urgent vet treatment, if it has not recieved any. Then correct me if i'm wrong. Moving to a field or livery yard. It looks to me by the picture it is kept in a back yard.


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## trundle (1 April 2010)

Since you havent bothered to ask a sensible question, its quite hard to give a sensible answer. I havent read the worming thread, so don't know what point you are trying to make but here are my initial thoughts.

The horse needs medical attention and a good meal

Why is it in this condition - assuming its a rescue, perhaps the RPSCA/WHW need to be involved in bringing a prosecution against the owner. I cant see any justification for EVER letting a horse get to that state. If its ill and losing weight and condition whatever you do, then do the decent thing and have the poor creature PTS in a dignified fashion. 

So what point ARE you trying to make?


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## DiablosGold (1 April 2010)

Perhaps it would have been easier for readers of the intelligent worming thread if OP had stated 'not to do with rescue case in sig' or something along those lines, rather than getting annoyed with people offering helpful advice/expressing their shock at unexplained photos of seriously skinny horse.

I would really appreciate an explanation of those photos before Tuesday though, as I'm sure other members would.


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## R2R (1 April 2010)

My view is a horse should never be allowed to get in that state, whether by worming (intelligent or not) neglect or letting health issues go on until the horse appears as the one in your photos. 

Regardless of how it got there in the first place, it is (IMHO) unethical, cruel and not in the horses best interest to let it get in that state. 

There is a case for questioning whether it would be more humane to have it PTS &#8211; if it is a case of neglect/starvation then intensive rehabilitation is hard enough, let alone if it has liver/kidney damage or any other underlying health issue.


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## ester (1 April 2010)

tbf OP the reason I thought it was the horse involved in the worming thread is that when the pictures in your sig were huge I thought they were pictures posted not a sig.


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## MissMincePie&Brandy (1 April 2010)

OK. I've just read the intelligent worming thread, which I hadn't seen before. The OP doesn't answer everyone's questions about this horse's condition on that thread either, so I am perhaps assuming this person is trying to court controversy and wants to create a huge long running thread and will continue to wind us all up.

My initial thoughts are that the OP is very inexperienced and could do with some good advice, but by winding us all up, she isn't going to get the help she needs.

I will be blocking this OP. There is nothing more I can add that won't be said by everyone else and I get terribly upset seeing neglected horses.


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## gable (1 April 2010)

Is this some kind of joke? I find it terribly upseting and sick if it is.

What is your point?


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## russianhorse (1 April 2010)

OP has also put a thread on SB about people jumping to conclusions (and was apparently somebody else on here........)


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## martlin (1 April 2010)

russianhorse said:



			OP has also put a thread on SB about people jumping to conclusions (and was apparently somebody else on here........)
		
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Silver Florin per chance?


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## horses13 (1 April 2010)

ester said:



			tbf OP the reason I thought it was the horse involved in the worming thread is that when the pictures in your sig were huge I thought they were pictures posted not a sig.
		
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Ester, you were a great help. This is not aimed at you at all.
I just find it interesting how people jump to conclusions and attack people before they know the story.
I do not wish in anyway to have this thought of in any way with intelligent worming. I was asking a genuine question.

I have read other things on here where people have attacked a member over a horse without knowing anything about it.
I will tell the story when i have peoples views on this, why its skinny, what should be done etc Some people seem to think they know more than they do.

This is not a wind up or attack on anyone, its just for people to air their views and thoughts as they have in the past on many other peoples horses.

I will then tell the story - without saying anyone is right or wrong, but it may make the odd person think before attacking.

I was playing around with signature in the worming one thats probably why the confusion as it ended up huge.

Some good advice was given which i am grateful for, i was just ignoring comments on the picture as i was not talking about that.

I am now late as i could not resist being nosey


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## ischa (1 April 2010)

ive breifly read the other post ,and can say i think alot of people have jumped to the wrong concluesion  without asking full story which is why the poster has reply in this manor .  
i do think this horse could possibly be a rescue case beause poster is  or was  from a small charity . i would say possibly the owners have releyed on Intelligent worming and as we know majority of time worm counts can not pick up some worms which can be left if we dont use the correct wormer obversly we worm with what we told to worm with . if not not to worm  which could possibly be the reason for the horse being underweight 
i might be totaly wrong


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## horses13 (1 April 2010)

gable said:



			Is this some kind of joke? I find it terribly upseting and sick if it is.

What is your point?
		
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No joke just asking for peoples views on this horse


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## MontyandZoom (1 April 2010)

I'm sorry but if you work for a rescue.....you should be grateful that people ask questions when they see a horse in this condition!!!!  We have seen cases where people do not realise how poor their horse is and if it weren't for people jumping to conclusions, the horses would remain that way.

All it would have taken is a short explanation. FGS, would you prefer us to walk past a field with a horse in seriously bad condition and think 'there is probably a good explanation so I'll just leave it'.


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## horses13 (1 April 2010)

Can i just make it clear this horse is nothing to do with intelligent worming. Comments such as that could be damageing for the company. It was a seperate question.


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## russianhorse (1 April 2010)

martlin said:



			Silver Florin per chance?
		
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Yep, that'll be the one


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## horses13 (1 April 2010)

russianhorse said:



			Yep, that'll be the one
		
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Yes i am a friend of Silver Florin, what is the problem in that?


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## russianhorse (1 April 2010)

horses13 said:



			Yes i am a friend of Silver Florin, what is the problem in that?
		
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I havent a problem with that, and I'm not bothered if you are silver Florin or a friend - there just appears to be some confusion over it.

I just cant understand why you are popping threads all over the joint deliberately getting posters to jump to conclusions, when it would be far nicer just to give a quick answer about that horse/pony/donkey/mule/camel rather then playing guessing games.


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## MontyandZoom (1 April 2010)

I notice you have completely ignored my post. Ho hum!


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## spaniel (1 April 2010)

If this is some sort of silly game please ignore the PM I sent you offering help.  Im not here to be mucked about and there are horses out there who genuinely warrant my time.


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## bitlessbill (1 April 2010)

Bound to make people suspicious when one minute you ARE Silver Florin, the next you are a FRIEND of Silver Florin and you start contraversial antagonistic posts all over the place that are obviously designed to wind us all up with no understandable explanation!!


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## Irishlife (1 April 2010)

You are exploiting that horse - whatever the horse's story is and the outcome - shame on you.


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## teddyt (1 April 2010)

horses13 said:













Spill all what you have to say, what you know and what you think you know.
I will not be back until tuesday so i will let you know who is right.
Should be interesting!

Click to expand...

I dont know what all this is about.

What i think about the state of the horse- 
1) its old and has been fed inappropriately.
2) neglected
3) seriously ill

I shouldnt think its grass sickness because i would expect it to be dead if it were but that is a slight posibility.

The growth rings on the feet suggest starvation to me, if not long term then certainly periods of it. This is either intentional or as said, inappropriate feeding that the horse cant chew or digest.

The sore on the withers from rugs also suggests neglect- its quite big although not raw. There are ways to prevent this, which havnt been done.

Whatever the cause i really hope that the horse is under close veteinary supervision and its lucky to be alive. I hope that its state is not man made but i strongly suspect it is.


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## R2R (1 April 2010)

Irishlife said:



			You are exploiting that horse - whatever the horse's story is and the outcome - shame on you.
		
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Ditto - completely agree.


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## Achinghips (1 April 2010)

Go and play your sillygame of "I know something you don't and I will have power over you all, by smugly withholding" somewhere else.


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## SpruceRI (1 April 2010)

My question is, why is the horse living in an outside yard with straw?  How are you going to keep that bed dry when it rains?

Very strange post, as others have said on here.  Perhaps you can tell us the story then??


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## Queenbee87 (1 April 2010)

Having read the other thread (re: worming) I don't feel that any of the posts were inappropriate. People were asking what had happened with the horse. (Yet when someone did ask, you posted something about them jumping to conclusions and that if they had asked you would have told them. This is clearly untrue as they DID ask)

Surely you can see why people assumed the problem related to worms? You started a thread about the worming programmes then those pictures appear at the bottom (you have since said that they were due to you playing round with your signature but, as noted, people did not realise this) People were merely expressing their concern and wanting to help- as indicated by some very kind people offering to help.

When someone did ask about the horse, you also became very defensive. Most people would, at this point offer some explanation instead of opening, ANOTHER pointless post. To be honest, I hope this horse isn't yours as, based on these two topics, you seem to be a bit odd and lacking in maturity. (NOTE (as you seem the type of person to wilfully misunderstand) You may be the nicest, kindest, most dedicated horse owner ever, I am merely stating the opinion I have formed based on these two topics. I will be willing to admit I am wrong about this if that is the case!)


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## FestiveBoomBoom (1 April 2010)

My view - the poor thing is emaciated and needs urgent treatment


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## joeanne (1 April 2010)

Well as you didnt see fit to ANSWER any of the questions on the other thread i'll ask again
Is the horse old? 
Have bad teeth?
Have a terribly neglectful owner perhaps?
Whether it was caused by you or someone else, the end result is the same. That horse needs to see a vet, and a dentist....in that order.
Cr*p like that does not happen overnight, it takes many months unless there has been a serious underlying medical issue which could possibly cause it.
Either way you are being less than honest yourself. You could have answered the questions asked on the other thread.
And as has been pointed out before, unless you have a split personality, you have already admitted on another post you are indeed Silver Florin. You may have a problem with your short/long term memory, but please do not assume we all suffer from it too!


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## itsme123 (1 April 2010)

I haven't read all the replies, but I would hazard a guess that this is something to do with red worms? The worms lie dormant and can attack at a later date and no amount of worming will save this animal. And worm counts don't show them. 

We had a horse with this on a yard I worked on, he was given all the treatment money could buy, but sadly died. No amount of food (and he was getting bucketfuls) made a difference. His worm counts showed clear, but after his death it showed a different story. 

Worm counts show bog all...... never in my life have I seen an animal go through what that horse did. And all down to incorrect worming at some point in his short life. The vets, experts, everyone was baffled until after he died and he was cut open. 

If it is what I think it is then I suspect this horse won't recover.


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## Thelwell_Girl (1 April 2010)

OP is just trying to be antagonistic and troll-y.

Let's keep the forum a place where everyone is comfortable and friendly, and not filled with arguments.

And OP? Adding a  after everything doesn't make what you're saying less provocative.


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## asbo (1 April 2010)

Ace of Spades said:



			My view - the poor thing is emaciated and needs urgent treatment
		
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ditto, poor thing, whoever let it get in that state needs shot!


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## benson21 (1 April 2010)

instead of wasting your time playing silly games on here, use your time in getting the poor thing sorted out!!!


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## Puppy (1 April 2010)

What a strange, attention seeking thread....


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## reindeerlover (1 April 2010)

Wow, everyone is harsh today! The pony is seriously thin, looks like it has been severely neglected. Needs a Vet to see it, needs some decent nutrition. Don't know if it's old- its tail looks like it might just be a baby. Sad to see but it looks like it has just been rescued as it has a bucket of feed, clean straw and just been brushed. Hope it gets better soon.


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## jensheff26 (1 April 2010)

i did think that this forum was a place to talk about horses and seek advice if needed, in the past few days there seems to be more biatching going on than the worse livery i know of whats going on??? i personally think people should ignore this and any other thread of its nature as it gets overheated and personal. come on guys lets just all be friendly


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## Shysmum (1 April 2010)

The problems here are

- that these pictures have been posted which are going to shock any horse lover.
- that the OP has decided to play a riddle/game with us
- possibly to slag off a welfare organisation or a member here
- that people are biting ? 

Although I hope to god that the horse is ok, I will slam this thread in the troll drawer, as the suspense is NOT killing me.... I have an idea what it's about. I will also flame the original post.


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## pastie2 (1 April 2010)

shysmum said:



			The problems here are

- that these pictures have been posted which are going to shock any horse lover.
- that the OP has decided to play a riddle/game with us
- possibly to slag off a welfare organisation or a member here
- that people are biting ? 

Although I hope to god that the horse is ok, I will slam this thread in the troll drawer, as the suspense is NOT killing me.... I have an idea what it's about. I will also flame the original post.
		
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Well I dont know what is going on, but Ifindthose photos shocking. I am concerned that a pony looking in that state can be part of any trollism, I want to know that something has been done about this poor animal.


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## Tinkerbee (1 April 2010)

Franch or some other pish?


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## AFlapjack (1 April 2010)

Poor pony  However, it looks like it's now getting the care it needs.


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## Vixxy (1 April 2010)

Bizarre posting strategy, horrifying pics, what is she on is all I can say? I am not being bitchy but why do what she has done this way? It is upsetting for people to see those pics...I certainly did not expect to open this thread and see them, I have not even read OP in regards to worming 

Not the way to start trying to become involved with a forum. Off on wrong foot springs to mind. Stupid games to prove what? I guess the fact I have posted she is winning, hmm note taken on that thought, I am off to go read something forum worthy from decent forum members ;-)


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## Toffee44 (1 April 2010)

I know this is a forum and although we know eachother by user name we don't all know each other off here ( I know some do) but when there is a thread like this (and the cob one) where are the moderators or is this a free for all?? Sorry bit peeved there seems to be a few stirring threads recently. I came on here for advice and horse chat not a bitch fight!


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## lauraandjack (1 April 2010)

Trip Trap Trip Trap

Who's that trotting over MY bridge............................???????


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## ester (1 April 2010)

toffee, no mods which IMO is one of the good things about hho. 

a search through OPs previous threads might help a few people out and I suspect that they are trying to discredit a welfare organisation.


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## horses13 (2 April 2010)

posie_honey said:



			i actually think i understand why you put this up = i figure you replied to a thread about intelligent worming - or maybe started a thread asking what people thought of it? and instead of getting constructive responses i figure you got asked about the piccies in your signature - so instead of taking the intelligent worming thread off topic you decided to post thses piccies so people could jump to conlusions about the horse on this thread instead of the original thread... am i right?
		
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Yes you are right.


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## Django Pony (2 April 2010)

lauraandjack said:



			Trip Trap Trip Trap

Who's that trotting over MY bridge............................???????
		
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Hahahaha! love it. Agree......

​TROLL


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## AFlapjack (2 April 2010)

horses13 said:



			Yes you are right.
		
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Ok great. Now we know why you posted the thread. Please could you tell us about the pony? x


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## posie_honey (2 April 2010)

AliceFlapjack said:



			Ok great. Now we know why you posted the thread. Please could you tell us about the pony? x
		
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i've done a quick search of the user name(s - hada  previous one too) - seemingly a rescue center - which would explain it all...


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## teddyt (2 April 2010)

posie_honey said:



			i've done a quick search of the user name(s - hada  previous one too) - seemingly a rescue center - which would explain it all...
		
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Maybe explains the horse but doesnt explain the deliberately cagey and provocative posts. Not really sure what OP has to gain by this? She maybe wants to draw attention to something but all shes doing is alienating members and making them think shes strange. Cant see how this will help the poor horse


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## T_K (2 April 2010)

horses13 said:



			Ester, you were a great help. This is not aimed at you at all.
I just find it interesting how people jump to conclusions and attack people before they know the story.
I do not wish in anyway to have this thought of in any way with intelligent worming. I was asking a genuine question.

I have read other things on here where people have attacked a member over a horse without knowing anything about it.
I will tell the story when i have peoples views on this, why its skinny, what should be done etc Some people seem to think they know more than they do.

This is not a wind up or attack on anyone, its just for people to air their views and thoughts as they have in the past on many other peoples horses.

I will then tell the story - without saying anyone is right or wrong, but it may make the odd person think before attacking.

I was playing around with signature in the worming one thats probably why the confusion as it ended up huge.

Some good advice was given which i am grateful for, i was just ignoring comments on the picture as i was not talking about that.

I am now late as i could not resist being nosey

Click to expand...

You seem to be writing this as if we are all a bunch a busybodies telling people what to do - but based on these pictures no-one can force that advice upon you as they don't actually know the history of the horse, it's age, illness etc..... I'm somewhat confused.


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## arwenplusone (2 April 2010)

horses13 said:



			Yes you are right.
		
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Instead of putting up a thread DELIBERATELY to cause people to start an argument/debate why not put up the pictures with a simple explanation of why the horse looks this way and a view of how you are treating it.

IMO that would have been a far more mature & reasonable way to deal with this.

Yes, people jump to conclusions, but if you give them the full story then the conclusions are less likely to be wrong.

Unless of course you are attention seeking - then, yes using a horse to do this is a bit sick, and pointless.


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## Holly831 (2 April 2010)

OP - thought you weren't back till Tuesday............

Now I know why I tend to stay on the breeding board!


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## Happy Horse (2 April 2010)

What an odd thread!  I am intrigued to find out the full story.  The horse clearly has problems, which could be down to any number of things either from illness or neglect.  The impression I get is that this is not a sudden deterioration but something which has happened over a long period of time.  I would hope the horse is now under the care of an Equine vet and farrier and being fed and cared for with a view to restoring the horse to health or if there is an underlying condition causing this body condition that the horses welfare is in the forefront of the current owners mind and that it will not be allowed to suffer.


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## ShellCoburn (2 April 2010)

This thread is making my brain bleed...... 

Seriously though, I really hope the poor animal in question has either been put to sleep or has received care and is on its way back to full health.

If presented with photographs like this I would want to know what the background of the animal was, do a worm count and then have appropriate worming done, have bloods taken to check for other issues, get teeth looked at and if needed have work done on them, start the animal on hay, hay and more hay, and introduce a mineral block and over time slowly introduce some easily digestable pellets in small amounts and often.

Or I would put the poor thing out of its misery asap.

I would like to know the real story behind the horse, but if the OP is going to be cagey about it, like I said - I just HOPE that the horse has either been put down or helped.


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## Booboos (2 April 2010)

I don't really see the point of this OP.

A number of people responded to your thread about intelligent worming and they addressed the issue directly. Then your siggie appeared which showed a severely emaciated horse - in a horse lovers forum it's fairly normal that people would be shocked and asked about this poor horse. If you had explained the photos then that would have been the end of it (I imagine a number of people would have offered advice and help if you had needed it). Instead the photos as being used to generate discussion - why? What is the point of this? 

If you have rescued this animal, good on you!!!! Please post more pics of his/her progress, I am sure we would all like to see the improvement. If you need advice/help looking after this animal do ask, there are many knowledgeable people on here, many of them kind enough to offer their time so perhaps someone can come out and help you. If you are struggling to cope with this animal you need to talk to a rescue centre ASAP or consider PTS.


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## MurphysMinder (2 April 2010)

I think you will find the OP is a rescue, centre, although she does seem to be denying it now.


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## Mabel98 (2 April 2010)

This isn't Dunroamin come back under a different user name is it?! Another attention seeking thread?


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## Sarah Sum1 (2 April 2010)

OP why come on here to play pointless mind games!! talking in riddles! Bloody stupid and pointless. Horse is painfully thin, needs help. end of. Grow up or piss off.

ANGRY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! you should have explained properly what this was about. Foolish, damn foolish!!!!


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## Booboos (2 April 2010)

MurphysMinder said:



			I think you will find the OP is a rescue, centre, although she does seem to be denying it now.

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I am even more lost now! Why would anyone deny running a rescue centre? I thought that was an admirable thing?


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## Gentle_Warrior (2 April 2010)

The poor animal, beyond that no comment about the whole post.


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## Toady (2 April 2010)

I am disgusted at the pictures that were posted by the OP. There was no need of it and it is just an attention seeking post.


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## RSL (2 April 2010)

I saw you other post and yes some did jump to conclusions.

Unless they were posted on that thread, they were in your siggy so there was no reason to jump to conclusion, she had no reason to explain to us on a Worming thread about her horse.

All I see is someone trying to bring this starved horse back to health, "follow my progress" aka watch me become healthy again.


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## Sarah Sum1 (2 April 2010)

Perhaps the OP should have explained that! Mind games just get peoples backs up! saying i'm not coming back till tues! pointless. Maybe my saying P*** off was a bit harsh and i apologise for that(to op) but it makes me angry that people come on here to mess with peoples heads, when a horse is clearly starving, teloing the story of whats going on and why et would have gained far much more respect.


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## AFlapjack (2 April 2010)

Hmmmm confusion..


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## pastie2 (2 April 2010)

This is a truly nasty and conveluted post to stir us all up. We are allhorse lovers and to see the pictures on her sig are upsetting to all of us. What point is this OP trying to make? Is she going to drag this out until tuesday?To what point FGS


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## *hic* (6 April 2010)

'Tis Tuesday. I see OP popped back in on Friday but I don't think we have any good explanation of whether she is Silver_Florin or a friend of Silver_Florin's - she has claimed to be both - or how the horse got to be in this state.

So OP, without my jumping to conclusions, what IS the situation?


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

LHS said:



			I'm not sure what you're asking us tbh.

 The horse is clearly starved but without more details who knows how to respond. I would hazzard a guess its not your horse because I can't imagine anyone on here keeps their horse in such a way.  

Have you rescued it ?
		
Click to expand...

Yes it was a rescue.


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

chestercharlie said:



			somewhat vague OP but are you saying weight loss is due to worm burden and mistreatment or does it have some underlying issue, health issue or is it ancient??

Either way, I'd say it could do with a good meal!!!!

My own opinion of intelligent worming? Dont believe in it...as far as herbal worming etc.  

If you are talking chemical worming following worm counts then yes I subscribe to that.



Click to expand...

I was not saying what the weight loss was. It was 3 yrs old.
Good meal was actually wrong at that time but if you were saying it in the sense of its weight and not actually giving it a good meal, i see your point and agree.


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

Persephone said:



			OP posting this and then stating that you will not be back until next Tuesday is ridiculous.

I can only assume that you are deliberately trying to cause a furore.

Pointless and juvenile.
		
Click to expand...

No not trying to cause a furore. People wished toair their views so i gave a place for them to do it. I was away until today, couldn't be avoided.


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

ester said:



			not sure i can be bothered to guess, but I assumed it was one of the animal (s) found alive with the dead mare recently.
		
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Spot on, and left to die!


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

rosiefronfelen said:



			all i can say and see, is starvation and therefore neglect, whatever other reasons, there could be a myriad!! horrific pics. anyway- sorry!
		
Click to expand...

Correct on both, starvation and neglect.
I will apologise for the horrific pics. I did not mean to shock.
I see so much of this helping SF in her work i suppose i have got used to it, but never get used to the neglect or anger.


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

kibob said:



			Ok here we go.....  

I know - it's a really skinny pony.

I think I know - there must be some sort of worming/intelligent worming relevance?

My view - haven't got a clue cos I don't know what I am being asked to have a view on

Click to expand...

There is a worming relevence or lack of. No relevence to intelligent worming.


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## benson21 (7 April 2010)

and the necessecity of you not saying all of this when you originally pit the post up? I am sorry, I just dont get it!


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

Katt said:



			I'll spill all what I have to say then; 

Your grammer is bloomin awful! 

And you haven't actually asked a meaningful question so there can be no right answer. So I'm thinking troll like behaviour!
		
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I did not say i was a English teacher


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

martlin said:



			Wellll, it is skinny...
How observant of me, isn't it?

Click to expand...

lol 100% correct


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

Misinterpreted said:



			OK, so the poor animal is either starved and neglected, or terribly ill. 

If lack of worming has reduced the pony to this level, I would say there's damage inside the gut. 

I saw a grass sickness case once and the pony became quickly emaciated looking before it was put down (but I don't think cases of that generally happen this time of year). 

So, what's the story?
		
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Yes starved, neglected and was terribly ill on Thur eve/Fri morn lack of worming did cause damage inside the gut.


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

MontyandZoom said:



			I'm guessing (forgive me if I'm wrong) that this is some sort of snidey reference to your last post when people assumed, perhaps wrongly, that your worming questions were about this horse.

TBH, it would probably have been easier to simply explain what was wrong with the horse/the story rather than being so cryptic. At the end of the day....on a forum of horse lovers.....people are going to say something about a horse in that condition!
		
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I was not being snidey, i leave that to others. Yes comment when you know the truth.


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

posie_honey said:



			my first thought was needs feeding up gradually - possible teeth checking to ensure it can chew properly... possiblly bloods taken to find out why so thin if unknown - unless it's obvious neglect... maybe recovering from grass sickness... the sores on the withers suggests either ill fitting saddle or - and prob more probable imho - rug - goes with sore on rump too then... rescue case maybe? 

i actually think i understand why you put this up = i figure you replied to a thread about intelligent worming - or maybe started a thread asking what people thought of it? and instead of getting constructive responses i figure you got asked about the piccies in your signature - so instead of taking the intelligent worming thread off topic you decided to post thses piccies so people could jump to conlusions about the horse on this thread instead of the original thread... am i right?
		
Click to expand...

Yes she did need feeding gradually, Her teeth were awful for a 3 year old through malnutrition, bloods were taken showing malnutrition and a protein level of 10, 1/3 of what it should have been, liver and kidneys fine but body packing up due to lack of protein through gut damage through worms.

Sores were from a rug.
It was true neglect. Yes a rescue. Left to die as were three others that died or were put down in similar states.

You are spot on why i started a new thread. I was genuinly interested in intelligent worming and did not wish to go off course.


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

Black_Horse_White said:



			Firstly he/she needs urgent vet treatment, if it has not recieved any. Then correct me if i'm wrong. Moving to a field or livery yard. It looks to me by the picture it is kept in a back yard.
		
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Urgent vet treatment was given with blood tests.
It was moved. It was put in that place in an emergancy and whilst the vet came. She dfeinately was not kept in a back yard but i do accept your point.


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

trundle said:



			Since you havent bothered to ask a sensible question, its quite hard to give a sensible answer. I havent read the worming thread, so don't know what point you are trying to make but here are my initial thoughts.

The horse needs medical attention and a good meal

Why is it in this condition - assuming its a rescue, perhaps the RPSCA/WHW need to be involved in bringing a prosecution against the owner. I cant see any justification for EVER letting a horse get to that state. If its ill and losing weight and condition whatever you do, then do the decent thing and have the poor creature PTS in a dignified fashion. 

So what point ARE you trying to make?
		
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If you read the worming thread you may have understood my not wishing taking that thread off course. I started this for people to pass their comments and ask questions as they were in the other thread.
I will not comment on those involved in this case, it is a long story but i wholly agree the owner needs prosecuting at least or beeter treating as he treated his horses.


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

Misinterpreted said:



			OK. I've just read the intelligent worming thread, which I hadn't seen before. The OP doesn't answer everyone's questions about this horse's condition on that thread either, so I am perhaps assuming this person is trying to court controversy and wants to create a huge long running thread and will continue to wind us all up.

My initial thoughts are that the OP is very inexperienced and could do with some good advice, but by winding us all up, she isn't going to get the help she needs.

I will be blocking this OP. There is nothing more I can add that won't be said by everyone else and I get terribly upset seeing neglected horses.
		
Click to expand...

Not trying to wind anyone up. Those that get wound up do it themselves. I will not be bait for a pack of dogs. I am open to discussion but not attack, hence asking for views but the pack of dogs do not wish to show their ignorence at last.

Please note that is not all, just a few!!!!!


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

DiablosGold said:



			Perhaps it would have been easier for readers of the intelligent worming thread if OP had stated 'not to do with rescue case in sig' or something along those lines, rather than getting annoyed with people offering helpful advice/expressing their shock at unexplained photos of seriously skinny horse.

I would really appreciate an explanation of those photos before Tuesday though, as I'm sure other members would.
		
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I do realose my mistake on that one. I was playing around at the time and was still working on it.


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

R2R said:



			My view is a horse should never be allowed to get in that state, whether by worming (intelligent or not) neglect or letting health issues go on until the horse appears as the one in your photos. 

Regardless of how it got there in the first place, it is (IMHO) unethical, cruel and not in the horses best interest to let it get in that state. 

There is a case for questioning whether it would be more humane to have it PTS  if it is a case of neglect/starvation then intensive rehabilitation is hard enough, let alone if it has liver/kidney damage or any other underlying health issue.
		
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I agree. Sadly she was put to sleep Fri morning battling for life that was impossible to give her.


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

martlin said:



			Silver Florin per chance?
		
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SF is my friend. I use her computer. I help her and she is now back with the internet. I have said before i am SF'S friend. How many times do i have to say it? 
SF signed up for me, problem?


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## hannah9000 (7 April 2010)

horses13 said:



			I agree. Sadly she was put to sleep Fri morning battling for life that was impossible to give her.
		
Click to expand...

If she was PTS surely your sig is irrelevant now? We couldn't possibly follow her progress...one of the first things i'd have removed would be the sig, out of respect for the poor horse and to stop people jumping down your neck. But you seem to enjoy it. I don't understand some people.


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## hannah9000 (7 April 2010)

And you've already claimed to be Silver FLorin, hence why people are getting very very confused!!




			Originally Posted by horses13  
Hi,
i was previously Silver Florin on here. Just got the internet back, signed up and found this.
I must be mad - well people who knew me before on here know i cannot keep my mouth shut when it comes to horses- but i do tend to act first, think later.
This story is actually a long story i am not aloud to speak about as i would like. 
This last mare should not have been left to die. 
It was heartbreaking. She had been partially eaten by animals whilst laid dieing.
We are a small charity. Horse and Hound members have helped us in the past and given huge support to me.
I was actually giving up as we cannot carry on.
When i get my camera back i will put on the photo of our latest resident. Shocking is not the word.
She had laid down to die. I do not know how she is still alive.
I am in a rush but hi to everyone, i have missed you all.
		
Click to expand...


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

ischa said:



			ive breifly read the other post ,and can say i think alot of people have jumped to the wrong concluesion  without asking full story which is why the poster has reply in this manor .  
i do think this horse could possibly be a rescue case beause poster is  or was  from a small charity . i would say possibly the owners have releyed on Intelligent worming and as we know majority of time worm counts can not pick up some worms which can be left if we dont use the correct wormer obversly we worm with what we told to worm with . if not not to worm  which could possibly be the reason for the horse being underweight 
i might be totaly wrong
		
Click to expand...

Nice to find another of the few sensible people i have come across on here.
You are right about people jumping to conclusions, which is why i did this.
This is a rescue case that was taken in by a small charity. Unfortunately the only wormers this pony has ever seen was when it came to SF the first time. Unfortunately she had to give it back and found it dieing with another horse a couple of weeks ago.


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

MontyandZoom said:



			I'm sorry but if you work for a rescue.....you should be grateful that people ask questions when they see a horse in this condition!!!!  We have seen cases where people do not realise how poor their horse is and if it weren't for people jumping to conclusions, the horses would remain that way.

All it would have taken is a short explanation. FGS, would you prefer us to walk past a field with a horse in seriously bad condition and think 'there is probably a good explanation so I'll just leave it'.
		
Click to expand...

Asking questions is one thing, jumping to conclusions and making up your own story is another!

Seeing a horse that looks unwell etc, i would make enquiries and find out if help is needed, if everything was being done, or if it was neglect. I would not wade in guns blaring making up a story to fit what i wished to believe.


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

russianhorse said:



			I havent a problem with that, and I'm not bothered if you are silver Florin or a friend - there just appears to be some confusion over it.

I just cant understand why you are popping threads all over the joint deliberately getting posters to jump to conclusions, when it would be far nicer just to give a quick answer about that horse/pony/donkey/mule/camel rather then playing guessing games.
		
Click to expand...

No confusion SF is my FRIEND!!!! I help her. How many times does it have to be said?
It is people jumping to conclusions not be causing it.


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

MontyandZoom said:



			I notice you have completely ignored my post. Ho hum!
		
Click to expand...

I hope i have answered it now. My apologies.


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

spaniel said:



			If this is some sort of silly game please ignore the PM I sent you offering help.  Im not here to be mucked about and there are horses out there who genuinely warrant my time.
		
Click to expand...

It is not a silly game i i greatly apreciate your offer of help. I would not muck a genuine person about. Thankyou for your offer. I will pm you soon.


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

bitlessbill said:



			Bound to make people suspicious when one minute you ARE Silver Florin, the next you are a FRIEND of Silver Florin and you start contraversial antagonistic posts all over the place that are obviously designed to wind us all up with no understandable explanation!!
		
Click to expand...

I am one person SF is another


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

Irishlife said:



			You are exploiting that horse - whatever the horse's story is and the outcome - shame on you.
		
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I was not exploiting any horse. I was playing with the signature with the intention of putting on followups as she improved.


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

teddyt said:



			I dont know what all this is about.

What i think about the state of the horse- 
1) its old and has been fed inappropriately.
2) neglected
3) seriously ill

I shouldnt think its grass sickness because i would expect it to be dead if it were but that is a slight posibility.

The growth rings on the feet suggest starvation to me, if not long term then certainly periods of it. This is either intentional or as said, inappropriate feeding that the horse cant chew or digest.

The sore on the withers from rugs also suggests neglect- its quite big although not raw. There are ways to prevent this, which havnt been done.

Whatever the cause i really hope that the horse is under close veteinary supervision and its lucky to be alive. I hope that its state is not man made but i strongly suspect it is.
		
Click to expand...

She was 3 years old but i see why she looked old. She was not fed, she lived off dead brambles.
Yes she was neglected.
Yes she became seriously ill and sadly lost her battle Fri morning. SF put a stop to her suffering.
The growth rings are from starvation. I would say it is
The sore was from a rug. intentional as the owner did nothing.
She was under close veterianery care when rescued. She showed inprovement but the worm damage was too severe for her to survive.
I do regret putting the photo's up. When she was rescued it looked like she would not pull through but then grew stronger and improved greatly giving us hope.
I wanted to do pics for SF showing her improvement but it has backfired, which i truly regret.


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

Rotchana said:



			Go and play your sillygame of "I know something you don't and I will have power over you all, by smugly withholding" somewhere else.
		
Click to expand...

No silly game, there are many people who think they know everything on here when they know nothing. They make up what they wish to believe. 
Not everyone may i add again. Most people are genuine and i am in no way having a dig at you.


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

madhossy said:



			My question is, why is the horse living in an outside yard with straw?  How are you going to keep that bed dry when it rains?

Very strange post, as others have said on here.  Perhaps you can tell us the story then??
		
Click to expand...

Does this horse live in outside yard with straw?
No it didn't. It was there for 3 hours in an emergancy awaiting vet and transport.


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

Ace of Spades said:



			My view - the poor thing is emaciated and needs urgent treatment
		
Click to expand...

That is what SF said before she took it in when it was left to die. Others did not agree.


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

joeanne said:



			Well as you didnt see fit to ANSWER any of the questions on the other thread i'll ask again
Is the horse old? 
Have bad teeth?
Have a terribly neglectful owner perhaps?
Whether it was caused by you or someone else, the end result is the same. That horse needs to see a vet, and a dentist....in that order.
Cr*p like that does not happen overnight, it takes many months unless there has been a serious underlying medical issue which could possibly cause it.
Either way you are being less than honest yourself. You could have answered the questions asked on the other thread.
And as has been pointed out before, unless you have a split personality, you have already admitted on another post you are indeed Silver Florin. You may have a problem with your short/long term memory, but please do not assume we all suffer from it too!
		
Click to expand...

I did not answer in the other thread as i did not wish the tread to go off course.
No the horse was not old she was 3.
She did have bad teeth through malnutrition.
She did have a neglectful owner as did the other 3 that died in the same field.
She did see a vet when rescued. She saw a vet before being rescued actually, a different vet.
It did take time for her become in that state bless her. Which makes it worse i think, she syuffered for longer.

I do not suffer with memory. Maybe you need to learn to read or live in a land of make believe


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

itsme123 said:



			I haven't read all the replies, but I would hazard a guess that this is something to do with red worms? The worms lie dormant and can attack at a later date and no amount of worming will save this animal. And worm counts don't show them. 

We had a horse with this on a yard I worked on, he was given all the treatment money could buy, but sadly died. No amount of food (and he was getting bucketfuls) made a difference. His worm counts showed clear, but after his death it showed a different story. 

Worm counts show bog all...... never in my life have I seen an animal go through what that horse did. And all down to incorrect worming at some point in his short life. The vets, experts, everyone was baffled until after he died and he was cut open. 

If it is what I think it is then I suspect this horse won't recover.
		
Click to expand...

You are so spot on.
She had a masses of red worms. They caused so much internal damage she could not be saved no matter how much the vet insisted she was going to save her.
The vet also said the same about worm counts.
She treated a horse that passed pure redworms as droppings yet the worm count was clear.
SF said she would die after she wormed her. SF wanted her shot Thur but other people got involved and she was not put out of her suffering until Fri.
The poor horse battled for life but her body gave up.


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

asbo said:



			ditto, poor thing, whoever let it get in that state needs shot!
		
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They need to receive what this poor horse did first and then sot, startuing with tthe little toe


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

benson21 said:



			instead of wasting your time playing silly games on here, use your time in getting the poor thing sorted out!!!
		
Click to expand...

The poor thing was being sorted


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

Puppy said:



			What a strange, attention seeking thread.... 

Click to expand...

Could not be further from the truth


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

Farrierlover said:



			Wow, everyone is harsh today! The pony is seriously thin, looks like it has been severely neglected. Needs a Vet to see it, needs some decent nutrition. Don't know if it's old- its tail looks like it might just be a baby. Sad to see but it looks like it has just been rescued as it has a bucket of feed, clean straw and just been brushed. Hope it gets better soon. 

Click to expand...

You are spot on.


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

jensheff26 said:



			i did think that this forum was a place to talk about horses and seek advice if needed, in the past few days there seems to be more biatching going on than the worse livery i know of whats going on??? i personally think people should ignore this and any other thread of its nature as it gets overheated and personal. come on guys lets just all be friendly
		
Click to expand...

I was told this was a friendly place but with a pack of hunting dogs I always seem to attract hunting dogs I have also received some extremely nice pm's and some logical replies on here from people that seem very nice.


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## MurphysMinder (7 April 2010)

hannah9000 said:



			And you've already claimed to be Silver FLorin, hence why people are getting very very confused!!
		
Click to expand...


Quote:
Originally Posted by horses13 
Hi,
i was previously Silver Florin on here. Just got the internet back, signed up and found this.
I must be mad - well people who knew me before on here know i cannot keep my mouth shut when it comes to horses- but i do tend to act first, think later.
This story is actually a long story i am not aloud to speak about as i would like. 
This last mare should not have been left to die. 
It was heartbreaking. She had been partially eaten by animals whilst laid dieing.
We are a small charity. Horse and Hound members have helped us in the past and given huge support to me.
I was actually giving up as we cannot carry on.
When i get my camera back i will put on the photo of our latest resident. Shocking is not the word.
She had laid down to die. I do not know how she is still alive.
I am in a rush but hi to everyone, i have missed you all.  


It seems the only post you haven't answered is Hannah900s so I will ask the question again, how do you explain your post in LN claiming to be Silver Florin.


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

shysmum said:



			The problems here are

- that these pictures have been posted which are going to shock any horse lover.
- that the OP has decided to play a riddle/game with us
- possibly to slag off a welfare organisation or a member here
- that people are biting ? 

Although I hope to god that the horse is ok, I will slam this thread in the troll drawer, as the suspense is NOT killing me.... I have an idea what it's about. I will also flame the original post.
		
Click to expand...

The pictures were not put on to shock. I have apologised for that.
I am not playing a game just asked what people had made up.
Hunting dogs bite


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

shysmum said:



			The problems here are

- that these pictures have been posted which are going to shock any horse lover.
- that the OP has decided to play a riddle/game with us
- possibly to slag off a welfare organisation or a member here
- that people are biting ? 

Although I hope to god that the horse is ok, I will slam this thread in the troll drawer, as the suspense is NOT killing me.... I have an idea what it's about. I will also flame the original post.
		
Click to expand...

I do not slag off anyone, i leave that to the dogs. I prefer to find out the reasoning behind welfare organisations. I do not slag off without "KNOWING and UNDERSTANDING" the full story


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

pastie2 said:



			Well I dont know what is going on, but Ifindthose photos shocking. I am concerned that a pony looking in that state can be part of any trollism, I want to know that something has been done about this poor animal.
		
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Something was being done about this poor mare.


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

AliceFlapjack said:



			Poor pony  However, it looks like it's now getting the care it needs.
		
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She was, thankyou


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

toffee44 said:



			I know this is a forum and although we know eachother by user name we don't all know each other off here ( I know some do) but when there is a thread like this (and the cob one) where are the moderators or is this a free for all?? Sorry bit peeved there seems to be a few stirring threads recently. I came on here for advice and horse chat not a bitch fight!
		
Click to expand...

Exactly why i looked into here


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

JustJasper said:



			Hahahaha! love it. Agree......

​TROLL

Click to expand...

How boring, the pack of dogs can't make a meal of me so i am a troll snore snore


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

arwenplusone said:



			Instead of putting up a thread DELIBERATELY to cause people to start an argument/debate why not put up the pictures with a simple explanation of why the horse looks this way and a view of how you are treating it.

IMO that would have been a far more mature & reasonable way to deal with this.

Yes, people jump to conclusions, but if you give them the full story then the conclusions are less likely to be wrong.

Unless of course you are attention seeking - then, yes using a horse to do this is a bit sick, and pointless.
		
Click to expand...

As i said before i now realise it was thoughless to put up the pic in my first thread. I have apologised. As we deal with such things daily i think i have become immune to the sight but not the horse if you understand that. I see the picture as it were and go into motion of treatment.
I was going to put up pictures of recovery.
I did not wish to cause argument but when attacked i will stand my ground. The dogs went away when i did.


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## Amymay (7 April 2010)

So what is the story here with this poor mare?  I see that she has now been pts, but how did she come to be in such a state - and were other horses involved and also rescued??


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

Holly831 said:



			OP - thought you weren't back till Tuesday............

Now I know why I tend to stay on the breeding board!
		
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I know, i am a day late oops


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

ShellCoburn said:



			This thread is making my brain bleed...... 

Seriously though, I really hope the poor animal in question has either been put to sleep or has received care and is on its way back to full health.

If presented with photographs like this I would want to know what the background of the animal was, do a worm count and then have appropriate worming done, have bloods taken to check for other issues, get teeth looked at and if needed have work done on them, start the animal on hay, hay and more hay, and introduce a mineral block and over time slowly introduce some easily digestable pellets in small amounts and often.

Or I would put the poor thing out of its misery asap.

I would like to know the real story behind the horse, but if the OP is going to be cagey about it, like I said - I just HOPE that the horse has either been put down or helped.
		
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This is more what i would expect by someone seeing a horse such as this. Much more helpful and correct in the feeding.


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

Booboos said:



			I don't really see the point of this OP.

A number of people responded to your thread about intelligent worming and they addressed the issue directly. Then your siggie appeared which showed a severely emaciated horse - in a horse lovers forum it's fairly normal that people would be shocked and asked about this poor horse. If you had explained the photos then that would have been the end of it (I imagine a number of people would have offered advice and help if you had needed it). Instead the photos as being used to generate discussion - why? What is the point of this? 

If you have rescued this animal, good on you!!!! Please post more pics of his/her progress, I am sure we would all like to see the improvement. If you need advice/help looking after this animal do ask, there are many knowledgeable people on here, many of them kind enough to offer their time so perhaps someone can come out and help you. If you are struggling to cope with this animal you need to talk to a rescue centre ASAP or consider PTS.
		
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Thankyou for your comments. I have had some very kind comments and advice which is truly apreciated.


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

MurphysMinder said:



			I think you will find the OP is a rescue, centre, although she does seem to be denying it now.

Click to expand...

I am not a rescue centre, i am a person. I do help out at a rescue centre


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

Mabel98 said:



			This isn't Dunroamin come back under a different user name is it?! Another attention seeking thread?
		
Click to expand...

No, never heard of them


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

sarahsum1 said:



			OP why come on here to play pointless mind games!! talking in riddles! Bloody stupid and pointless. Horse is painfully thin, needs help. end of. Grow up or piss off.

ANGRY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! you should have explained properly what this was about. Foolish, damn foolish!!!!
		
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lol don't get involved then der


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

Booboos said:



			I am even more lost now! Why would anyone deny running a rescue centre? I thought that was an admirable thing?
		
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There has been no denial, just another person making up what they want to believe.


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

RSL said:



			I saw you other post and yes some did jump to conclusions.

Unless they were posted on that thread, they were in your siggy so there was no reason to jump to conclusion, she had no reason to explain to us on a Worming thread about her horse.

All I see is someone trying to bring this starved horse back to health, "follow my progress" aka watch me become healthy again.
		
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Thankyou for your reply, you have got it spot on


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## horses13 (7 April 2010)

benson21 said:



			and the necessecity of you not saying all of this when you originally pit the post up? I am sorry, I just dont get it!
		
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Due to the hunting dogs making up what they wanted and insisting it was true. Some peole on here attack people without knowing what they are on about.
I was trying to show those people the error of their ways, not that they would care.


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## Sarah Sum1 (7 April 2010)

I apologised for my initial post. I still do not (same as a lot of people on here!) agree with the way you went about this post,  I am entitled to 'get involved' and air my opinion. Just because you do not like it does not mean i should not get involved......DER!!!! 

P.s i also think you will find that a huge percentage of people prefer others to be upfront, mind games never go down well, hense the replys on here.


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## The_snoopster (7 April 2010)

I am pleased that someone rescued this poor animal, but what is still confusing me is why you are avoiding the point that on one thread you stated YOU was silver florin if you are not why say you was ?.

Why say you were silver florin if you are not ?

Personally I don,t really care which you are horse 13 or silver florin, I am just extremely nosey !

People on the forum will not take you seriously if they think you are playing games, and surely after what that poor animal has suffered you would want people to understand what you/silver florin did to help this horse. And possibly what people could do to help stop cruelty to any animal.


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## KingCharles (7 April 2010)

I bought a foal from a dealer in kent back in 2003, i bought him unseen, and had him delivered. However the dealer was well known and had a good web site ,offering all these terms ect. Back in the days when buying un seen and getting the horse delivereed was the done thing i suppose (for foals anyway) I was sent photos and a video , i also sent loads of emails for info and spoke on the phone. When the foal arrived it was evident that all was not well. The foal was meant to be a 7 month strong little colt, corn fed, wormed and well handled. The foal i got was so weak it practically fell off the horse wagon. 

Under the huge coat it had grown there was just a bag of bones. The mucus membranes where a horrible pale colour and he was just very listless and weak. I got my vet out who did blood tests and had them back to me asap. It showed that he was bleeding internally, probably from a damaged gut, from red word damage. the vet was amazed the foal was still alive. The blood work was very grim. he also felt the foal was only 4 monts old if a day and the dam was almost definatly dead by now. He felt that to have such a huge worm burden as thsi foal had, the mare must of been at deaths door her self. It was liekly the mare died and the foal was just taken and never wormed either.  I was given 2 options at that point. They where put to sleep, or worm but he woudl probably die if i wormed him. if we didint worm him he would die.  I decided to try and worm him, and give him the chance. The vet gave him corticosteroids to help suppport his liver and gut and then we wormed him with equest over the weekend. Remarkably he servived the worming. That was unfortunatly the start of a very long battle. He had no muscle or fat he was so weak, he had nothing to keep him warm. His case was reffered to newmarket where they advised steroids to try and build him up. I also had him on a special diet of procell and ultimate balancer. We coudl nto over load him but we needed to feed him gradually. Grass was too much for him to deal with. I had to feed him 4 little feeds a day, and he was rugged up to hsi eye balls. He had bloods taken monthly to monitor how he was doing. they also took a gut biopsy to see the extent of the damage.  I was nto insured for any of this as i bought him in the condition. Over time he went from strength to strength and as long as he was wormed on time and with equest he was fine. I had tried panacure equien guard when i first bought him. It did not even touch the burden. The dealer was shut down, after i had tradeing standards and 2 horse welfare charities involved. The dealer was actually in the toen of kent and was keeping the horse son an industrial estate in an old air hanger. She admitted she had bought most of her stock off travellers from the back of a wagon or at sales. However she was then selling them on as healthy foals and nto getting them the care they needed. I knwo a few horses where seized at the time. The dealer did try and re start again under different names. 

The foal grew up to be a strong healthy young man, and i sold him to a good home. I spent well over a grand on vet bills. Worm counts do not show encysted red worms! People dont seem to understand this. 

Its a shame the horse in the photos was nto given the same chance. If they are goign to die anyway, why not try and worm them and try and get them back on track. iIm not saying its an easy process but there is always a small chance.

i have not got the horrible photos of him when he first arrived to hand. however this is how he ended up after all the hard work. he is rising 2 in this photo. He was stunted as a reasult of his bad start. The vet felt he shoudl of grown more than what he did, and he looked out of proportion. However he was very lucky to have servived in the first place.


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## joeanne (7 April 2010)

horses13 said:



			I do not suffer with memory. Maybe you need to learn to read or live in a land of make believe

Click to expand...

Well perhaps you need to go back and re-read a few of your old threads, which clearly state you ARE Silver Florin.
Dont insult my intelligence my dear, just because you are lacking in any.
Glad that poor beast is now no longer suffering, but shame on you for using her suffering to try and instigate the reactions you have, just so you can sit back and take the moral high ground. You could have stated long ago what had happened.
Nasty little Troll.


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## MurphysMinder (7 April 2010)

The silence from SF or whoever is deafening suddenly!  Whoever it is they certainly aren't doing Silver Florins rescue any favours as they  have lost any credibility now imo.


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## Irishlife (7 April 2010)

You have missed an opportunity here. If you genuinely wanted to have an airing of views forum, why did you not state the little pony's case and open up the floor. You could have raised awareness of red worm damage, given the rescue centre some good PR and possibly got some support from it. 

Instead people on here have been alienated and now do not trust you. The job you do is both heartbreaking and worthwhile. I still see this as exploitative and done for shock value and find it quite sinister you choose this way of going about what is a very serious issue. This is not a personal attack on the work you are doing, just regret you have done welfare and rescue people a lot of damage by your approach.

Good luck with your future rescues.


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## Booboos (7 April 2010)

Having read both threads I think this is all making a mountain out of a molehill!!

I think this is right: OP you had an original thread on intelligent worming. By coincidence your siggie came up during that thread showing the very poorly horse. Some people on that thread assumed the two were related. Instead of explaining the misunderstanding you posted the second thread which seemed a bit cryptic about the poorly horse. Turns out the poorly horse was a rescue that has passed away. 

Can't see anything objectionable about any of this other than the time it has taken to decipher it! Maybe a more direct and clear approach would be helpful in the future!


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## chestercharlie (7 April 2010)

Where are you based?? I am sure I recognise that building......


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## Achinghips (7 April 2010)

Irishlife said:



			You have missed an opportunity here. If you genuinely wanted to have an airing of views forum, why did you not state the little pony's case and open up the floor. You could have raised awareness of red worm damage, given the rescue centre some good PR and possibly got some support from it. 

Instead people on here have been alienated and now do not trust you. The job you do is both heartbreaking and worthwhile. I still see this as exploitative and done for shock value and find it quite sinister you choose this way of going about what is a very serious issue. This is not a personal attack on the work you are doing, just regret you have done welfare and rescue people a lot of damage by your approach.
		
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Too true ....  
OP, not impressed Mrs Fagin, you're untrustworthy, attention seeking and underhand.


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## Queenbee87 (7 April 2010)

horses13 said:



			How boring, the pack of dogs can't make a meal of me so i am a troll snore snore

Click to expand...

This proves that you posted this topic intending to antagonise people which does somewhat detract from the suffering of the poor horse.

You also state that the so called "hunting dogs" insisted that what they were saying was right (not a direct quote, just something to that effect). Have some posts been deleted because the posts I wrote didn't seem to be nasty, just people expressing their concern about the horse. Can you not see why people thought the case may be due to intelligent worming? (Because the pictures suddenly appeared in the post and people didn't realise they were your signature) I understand that you may not have wanted to go off topic but surely a simple post saying that the horse was in that state for whatever reason but it is getting care, that you did not want to get off topic so you would appreciate it if people sent you a PM if they had any further concerns? Or even starting a new post simply explaining what you have drip fed to people over the last few days. Surely you can see that these ways would have been the mature and simple way to deal with it and would not leave people both worried about the horse over the weekend and thinking you have some attention seeking disorder (not saying you have, just stating the impression this post has given me. I have no idea who you are and only have what you have written to form an opinon. I will be happy to apologise if it turns out I am wrong )


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## Whoopit (7 April 2010)

fumanchu said:



			as you are SF's friend, could you ask her to return my entry fee for the fake "photo-comp" from a few years back?

as i believe, obtaining money by deception is fraud.
 thank you.
		
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You can report things like that to the police and they can have an IT expert trace the IP address for PC the information was posted from, which in turn means they can locate the person. . .


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## Whoopit (7 April 2010)

I have read the whole thread and am now at the end. And completely fail to see the point of it. OP asked for peoples opinions on the pictures - it's a horse that is extremely thin. I'm not sure how people can jump to much more of a conclusion other than that with or without a full story!


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## muddy boots (7 April 2010)

Like some other posters I am really confused about the conclusions we were supposed to jump to??????

Really sad about the little mare, I can see the OP was in some previous conflict in another thread but the start to this thread didn't do anyone any favours.

Gool luck with your rescue - helping your friend or whatever. I hope the damage to your credibity on here doesn't stop you doung your work.

Poor little mare. I think it would have been better to start the thread as a raising awareness of red worms rather that get peoples' backs up.


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## horses13 (9 April 2010)

hannah9000 said:



			And you've already claimed to be Silver FLorin, hence why people are getting very very confused!!
		
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No., i have never claimed to be SF. I have said - once again i am her friend, she signed up and told me i could use it.
To be honest you could be the yorkshire ripper for all i know. No-one knows who is on the keybourd.


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## horses13 (9 April 2010)

MurphysMinder said:



			Quote:
Originally Posted by horses13 
Hi,
i was previously Silver Florin on here. Just got the internet back, signed up and found this.
I must be mad - well people who knew me before on here know i cannot keep my mouth shut when it comes to horses- but i do tend to act first, think later.
This story is actually a long story i am not aloud to speak about as i would like. 
This last mare should not have been left to die. 
It was heartbreaking. She had been partially eaten by animals whilst laid dieing.
We are a small charity. Horse and Hound members have helped us in the past and given huge support to me.
I was actually giving up as we cannot carry on.
When i get my camera back i will put on the photo of our latest resident. Shocking is not the word.
She had laid down to die. I do not know how she is still alive.
I am in a rush but hi to everyone, i have missed you all.  


It seems the only post you haven't answered is Hannah900s so I will ask the question again, how do you explain your post in LN claiming to be Silver Florin.
		
Click to expand...

It was SF no-claiming to be her, it was her and this me, good gracious me


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## rosie fronfelen (9 April 2010)

there is no SFin the members list now.


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## pinktiger (9 April 2010)

R2R said:



			Ditto - completely agree.
		
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#


i agree also!! ridiculas attention seeking!!!  put a awful picture of an emactiated horse on a forum full of horsey peeps, n then pop in and out to put teaser threads to get more attention!! sad and shame on you!!!!!


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## horses13 (9 April 2010)

amymay said:



			So what is the story here with this poor mare?  I see that she has now been pts, but how did she come to be in such a state - and were other horses involved and also rescued??
		
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She was one of seven horses. The first horse was pts around 13th December, in the same state as this one. The other six were left including the dead mares 3 month old foal. We took in the foal and asked for the others to be rescued. 1 week later another was found frozen. Again the remaining horses were left. We cared for them but the owner took most of them leaving two. We notified those that had attended and asked for the remaining two to be taken into care. They were left and one was found dieing and had been partly eaten alive. The pony in the photo was again left. The only comment it was a bit thin. SF took the pony and tried to save it but it was impossible.
SF said it would die. I and others told her it wouldn't and i wanted to give her encouragement and look back on here when she had improved. I was wrong again.
SF is extremly distressed at the minute. She has witnessed some horrific scenes. She is also angry and brewing to do something.

The horses were on rough land at best and only had dead brambles to eat. They were all in this condition. Never fed or cared for, only when SF tried when it was too late.

They cannot be hurt or abused anylonger.


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## rosie fronfelen (9 April 2010)

at last- a decent tidy reply to what everone has been querying these weeks, coudn't you tell all this before for heavens sake?


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## horses13 (9 April 2010)

KingCharles said:



			I bought a foal from a dealer in kent back in 2003, i bought him unseen, and had him delivered. However the dealer was well known and had a good web site ,offering all these terms ect. Back in the days when buying un seen and getting the horse delivereed was the done thing i suppose (for foals anyway) I was sent photos and a video , i also sent loads of emails for info and spoke on the phone. When the foal arrived it was evident that all was not well. The foal was meant to be a 7 month strong little colt, corn fed, wormed and well handled. The foal i got was so weak it practically fell off the horse wagon. 

Under the huge coat it had grown there was just a bag of bones. The mucus membranes where a horrible pale colour and he was just very listless and weak. I got my vet out who did blood tests and had them back to me asap. It showed that he was bleeding internally, probably from a damaged gut, from red word damage. the vet was amazed the foal was still alive. The blood work was very grim. he also felt the foal was only 4 monts old if a day and the dam was almost definatly dead by now. He felt that to have such a huge worm burden as thsi foal had, the mare must of been at deaths door her self. It was liekly the mare died and the foal was just taken and never wormed either.  I was given 2 options at that point. They where put to sleep, or worm but he woudl probably die if i wormed him. if we didint worm him he would die.  I decided to try and worm him, and give him the chance. The vet gave him corticosteroids to help suppport his liver and gut and then we wormed him with equest over the weekend. Remarkably he servived the worming. That was unfortunatly the start of a very long battle. He had no muscle or fat he was so weak, he had nothing to keep him warm. His case was reffered to newmarket where they advised steroids to try and build him up. I also had him on a special diet of procell and ultimate balancer. We coudl nto over load him but we needed to feed him gradually. Grass was too much for him to deal with. I had to feed him 4 little feeds a day, and he was rugged up to hsi eye balls. He had bloods taken monthly to monitor how he was doing. they also took a gut biopsy to see the extent of the damage.  I was nto insured for any of this as i bought him in the condition. Over time he went from strength to strength and as long as he was wormed on time and with equest he was fine. I had tried panacure equien guard when i first bought him. It did not even touch the burden. The dealer was shut down, after i had tradeing standards and 2 horse welfare charities involved. The dealer was actually in the toen of kent and was keeping the horse son an industrial estate in an old air hanger. She admitted she had bought most of her stock off travellers from the back of a wagon or at sales. However she was then selling them on as healthy foals and nto getting them the care they needed. I knwo a few horses where seized at the time. The dealer did try and re start again under different names. 

The foal grew up to be a strong healthy young man, and i sold him to a good home. I spent well over a grand on vet bills. Worm counts do not show encysted red worms! People dont seem to understand this. 

Its a shame the horse in the photos was nto given the same chance. If they are goign to die anyway, why not try and worm them and try and get them back on track. iIm not saying its an easy process but there is always a small chance.

i have not got the horrible photos of him when he first arrived to hand. however this is how he ended up after all the hard work. he is rising 2 in this photo. He was stunted as a reasult of his bad start. The vet felt he shoudl of grown more than what he did, and he looked out of proportion. However he was very lucky to have servived in the first place. 






Click to expand...

You have me in tears.
That was one lucky foal finding you. You have restored my faith it can be done,
 It must have had such a small chance of survival. Why is there not more peole like you in this world.


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## horses13 (9 April 2010)

fumanchu said:



			as you are SF's friend, could you ask her to return my entry fee for the fake "photo-comp" from a few years back?

as i believe, obtaining money by deception is fraud.
 thank you.
		
Click to expand...

Just because you did not win a prize is there realy a need for slander? The winners were very happy.


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## Berkeley (9 April 2010)

Jesus Christ!


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## Achinghips (9 April 2010)

horses13 said:



			No silly game, there are many people who think they know everything on here when they know nothing
		
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So you're the self elected person who's teaching them a "lesson" then, are you?


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## Tiffany (9 April 2010)

Not sure what you are asking although clearly there is something seriously wrong with that pony. It's either got grass sickness or some other disease or it's been starved. Either way it's a very upsetting photo


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## Amymay (12 April 2010)

Horses13 - many thanks for answering my question so succinctly.

So I wonder what action is now being taken, and also investigations being carried out into the welfare organisation that deemed that no action need be taken.  

Have the BHS been involved in this at any time, and have the RCVS been informed of the lack of veterinary care and advice offered by the vet on the scene?


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## *hic* (12 April 2010)

horses13 said:



			Just because you did not win a prize is there realy a need for slander? The winners were very happy.
		
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Sadly the winners were not so happy that any one of them ever claimed to have won, nor did any of them come forward on any of the "Has anyone been able to contact Silver_Florin" threads. Apologies were, however, posted by others who had been instrumental setting up the "competition" with Silver_Florin.


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## horses13 (12 April 2010)

amymay said:



			Horses13 - many thanks for answering my question so succinctly.

So I wonder what action is now being taken, and also investigations being carried out into the welfare organisation that deemed that no action need be taken.  

Have the BHS been involved in this at any time, and have the RCVS been informed of the lack of veterinary care and advice offered by the vet on the scene?
		
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No the BHS were not involved. We have thinking about reporting it but trying to work out who to and how to put it.
These horses were seen 3 times - at the death of others.
Trouble is when you stand up against multi-million pond organisations you get attacked yourself and they make stories up.


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## horses13 (12 April 2010)

jemima_too said:



			Sadly the winners were not so happy that any one of them ever claimed to have won, nor did any of them come forward on any of the "Has anyone been able to contact Silver_Florin" threads. Apologies were, however, posted by others who had been instrumental setting up the "competition" with Silver_Florin.
		
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I did not realise it was that horse and hound photo comp. Silver Florin was uncontactable at the time. Sincere thanks was given by her before she lost contact.

A pm or new thread would have been nice as this thread is not about a photo competition!


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## Amymay (12 April 2010)

horses13 said:



			No the BHS were not involved. We have thinking about reporting it but trying to work out who to and how to put it.
These horses were seen 3 times - at the death of others.
Trouble is when you stand up against multi-million pond organisations you get attacked yourself and they make stories up.
		
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Please contact the BHS and they will help you, I have no doubt.  SlinkyUnicorn here was involved (as were others) in the rescue of two ponies that had been seen by the RSPCA and their vet and deemed in adequate condition.  The BHS involvement ensured that the correct actions were taken and the horses saved.

I am also assuming that the police were involved, so it would be good to follow up with them to see what action they are taking against the owners.


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## horses13 (12 April 2010)

Thankyou AmyMay i will contact the BHS. A very nice committee member lives close to me so she would be a start.
The police involved unfortunately did not have a clue about horses and were less inclined to seek the owner.
Others involved made up their own stories and were deaf to the truth.
It is so hard to get someone to lissen.
There shouls not have been 1 death, but when one died everything possible shouls have been done to save the rest.
SF treid her best but she was limited in what she could do and left it in the hands of those of authority, which she regrets.
Knowing SF she will come fighting back when the anger sets in after the horrific traumas she has been through.


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## *hic* (12 April 2010)

Ah but you're very selective about which of the threads you have posted you are replying to, you are on here talking, someone has already asked you about it, I was quoting that reply so why start a new thread?

So, Silver_Florin thanked people but no list of winners was ever published although other organisers did manage to contact her I believe, no winners ever came forward on here either. Might you feel fit to comment on that?

If you want my views on the original topic personally I can see the horse is very thin but I think its short and unhappy life is being exploited for some reason. I also find it disturbing that once the horse was "rescued" it was kept alive against the advice of vets, and, as you have posted, yourself, by Silver_Florin. That in my book is prolonging suffering unnecessarily and whilst it's a terrible shame to lose a horse so young sometimes what they would have to go through to survive is just too much - as of course you felt.


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## Amymay (12 April 2010)

SF treid her best but she was limited in what she could do and left it in the hands of those of authority, which she regrets.
		
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I'm suprised actually that SF didn't pursue this harder - she would have been very aware of which organisations to consult with in order to get things moving.  




			Knowing SF she will come fighting back when the anger sets in after the horrific traumas she has been through.
		
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Well the best way to recover is to take affirmative action.


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## JavaJaneW (12 April 2010)

jemima_too said:



			Ah but you're very selective about which of the threads you have posted you are replying to, you are on here talking, someone has already asked you about it, I was quoting that reply so why start a new thread?

So, Silver_Florin thanked people but no list of winners was ever published although other organisers did manage to contact her I believe, no winners ever came forward on here either. Might you feel fit to comment on that?
		
Click to expand...

I think there was a winners thread, I'm sure there was (I think I remember putting the winning photos up, but correct me if I am wrong). I tried to contact SF at this time but had no reply. 

added as found the link: http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=239693&highlight=photo+comp

I am sorry to all those who feel miffed by the whole thing (me included)


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## *hic* (12 April 2010)

J_J said:



			I think there was a winners thread, I'm sure there was (I think I remember putting the winning photos up, but correct me if I am wrong). I tried to contact SF at this time but had no reply. 

added as found the link: http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=239693&highlight=photo+comp

I am sorry to all those who feel miffed by the whole thing (me included)
		
Click to expand...

In that case I extend my apologies to horses13 and Silver_Florin for my questions re the photo competition, I hadn't seen that thread and on looking for threads related to Silver_Florin had seen only those from posters who were as miffed as you.

Thank you for clarifying that J_J.


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## black_horse (12 April 2010)

QR
Im refusing to read the whole thread as it seems that the OPs grudge (in her eyes) is more important than the plight of that poor animal!

Shame on you OP for using the suffering of a poor defenceless animal to try and prove a point.

The horse itself looks like it has suffered for a while, with untreated sores and depressed demeanor. Instead of trying to prove a point why dont you help?


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## horses13 (16 April 2010)

If you want my views on the original topic personally I can see the horse is very thin but I think its short and unhappy life is being exploited for some reason. I also find it disturbing that once the horse was "rescued" it was kept alive against the advice of vets, and, as you have posted, yourself, by Silver_Florin. That in my book is prolonging suffering unnecessarily and whilst it's a terrible shame to lose a horse so young sometimes what they would have to go through to survive is just too much - as of course you felt.[/QUOTE]
How was her life being exploited exactly? She was not at any time kept alive against the advice of vets, how do you people make these things up. The vet carried on trying to save her against sf's wishes!!!!! SF wanted her shot on the thur the vet tried in vain through Thur and Fri morn to save her causing further suffering. SF pleaded for them to stop!!!!
Were you a rat watching on the yard reporting back the wrong story?


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## horses13 (16 April 2010)

amymay said:



			I'm suprised actually that SF didn't pursue this harder - she would have been very aware of which organisations to consult with in order to get things moving.  



Well the best way to recover is to take affirmative action.
		
Click to expand...

She tried extremly hard to deaf ears.


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## horses13 (16 April 2010)

jemima_too said:



			In that case I extend my apologies to horses13 and Silver_Florin for my questions re the photo competition, I hadn't seen that thread and on looking for threads related to Silver_Florin had seen only those from posters who were as miffed as you.

Thank you for clarifying that J_J.
		
Click to expand...

Apologies not needed. Goes over our heads. We actually have a laugh at what people make up.

Just one thing, make sure you know the FACTS before spreading false accusations.

Thankyou for the apology thow, it is apreciated.


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## horses13 (16 April 2010)

Black_Horse said:



			QR
Im refusing to read the whole thread as it seems that the OPs grudge (in her eyes) is more important than the plight of that poor animal!

COULDNT BE FURTHER FROM THE TRUTH

Shame on you OP for using the suffering of a poor defenceless animal to try and prove a point. WRONG AGAIN>

The horse itself looks like it has suffered for a while, with untreated sores and depressed demeanor. Instead of trying to prove a point why dont you help?
		
Click to expand...

I did help!


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## horses13 (16 April 2010)

P>S> This is now closed. I will not be reading/replying to anymore


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## Sarah Sum1 (16 April 2010)

Thank heavens for that!!!


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## joeanne (16 April 2010)

horses13 said:



			P>S> This is now closed. I will not be reading/replying to anymore

Click to expand...

Thank god for small mercies.
Back to your bridge troll!!!!


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## siennamum (16 April 2010)

I would love to know the chronology of this 'incident'. Why WHF & the RSPCA didn't rescue this horse in December, as I'm sure SF would have brought all the heavy hitters in when it was apparent that their efforts weren't working.....


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