# Marestare - Mare looks like she is in labour (?)



## chameleon (12 February 2011)

Tail bandaged up ready, holding her tail out, pacing the box, pawing the ground, been dripping milk for a few days.....is she in labour?????

http://www.marestare.com/fcam.php?alias=elements

Hope so!


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## spike123 (12 February 2011)

I hope so! Certainly looking very uncomfortable.


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## spike123 (12 February 2011)

I don't think she is going to be too long.Owner in and out checking on her and she is definitely straining a fair bit now.


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## moody_mare (12 February 2011)

looks fairly uncomfortable bless her, hope it isn't too long!


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## chameleon (12 February 2011)

Think I will be spending Saturday night in front of the laptop!

I have missed 4 births at Mulligans Farm on marestare so I am determined to see this one through!


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## stroppy (12 February 2011)

Looks like its all systems go!!


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## BSJAlove (12 February 2011)

well, it says shes dripping milk now so hopefully soon!!!


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## Spring Feather (12 February 2011)

Yes she does appear to be in 1st stage labour.  That stage can last a couple of hours though.


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## abi31 (12 February 2011)

I got 2 DVD's in for tonight and now I'm glued to the computer! Can't wait as never seen a mare foal live before!!xx


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## sadiedeb (12 February 2011)

Heather put comment on her mulligans farm thing to say she part owns this horse and she is in early labour - also Sadie at mulligans is very close apparently


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## muddygreymare (12 February 2011)

Been watching this mare for days, I saw Fanali from Elements foal the other week on marestare and my sister saw KZ from there foaling, so will be watching this one closely tonight  Hopefully she has a less traumatic time than Fanali


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## Cloud9 (12 February 2011)

i have been watching her since last friday - never seen a foal born and determined not to miss her now - warned OH i will sit up all night if i have too!!


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## Kokopelli (12 February 2011)

Sorry if I'm being very dim but is she going to come back?



Never mind she's back


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## Allover (12 February 2011)

She is back and has just had a poo for the camera!!!


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## caitlin95uk (12 February 2011)

Kokopelli said:



			Sorry if I'm being very dim but is she going to come back?



Never mind she's back 

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oh i clicked quote to say shes back now and then never mindshes back appears


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## lannerch (12 February 2011)

checked her about an hour ago and she was just standing there looking a lot more restless now how exciting


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## silverstar (12 February 2011)

lannerch said:



			checked her about an hour ago and she was just standing there looking a lot more restless now how exciting 

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Yes she does. Bless her she looks fed up.


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## Kokopelli (12 February 2011)

I'm loving the fact I have windows 7 atm  I have both HHO and marestare up on the screen as I can't take my eyes off it, so worried I will miss it.


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## china (12 February 2011)

i watched one foal the other but looking at the local time underneath they all foal at odd times of the day. usually its middle of the night, but all are different u guess.


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## abi31 (12 February 2011)

Gah! Another pooh. As a foaling virgin (pardon the pun) how long is an average labour time for a horse? I have wine, a hot water bottle and my toast just pinged so am in for the long haul.


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## muddygreymare (12 February 2011)

Haha koko, I forgot you could do that, now have it on multiscreen thingy too haha. Saves switching windows, thanks  I hope i dont miss her foaling, the computer will be on all night with barn alarm methinks


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## Freya (12 February 2011)

Oh I wish I hadn't seen this post, I watched Fanali give birth and that had me spellbound and anxious all the way through it!  It should have an addiction warning on the website 

I think April still has some hours to go, best get the wine on the go


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## JenniferS (12 February 2011)

Is the camera flickering for anyone else?


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## Spring Feather (12 February 2011)

abi31 said:



			Gah! Another pooh. As a foaling virgin (pardon the pun) how long is an average labour time for a horse?
		
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Well enjoy your vino  as she most likely will not foal with all that commotion going on around her.  The stages of labour vary depending on the mare and the environment she is in.  My mares are normally pretty speedy once they start stage 1.  We always keep well away from them when they are in this stage and it seems to work as they don't hang on for too long.


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## Kokopelli (12 February 2011)

muddygreymare said:



			Haha koko, I forgot you could do that, now have it on multiscreen thingy too haha. Saves switching windows, thanks  I hope i dont miss her foaling, the computer will be on all night with barn alarm methinks 

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I forgot I could do it aswell  
Gotta' love windows 7 sometimes


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## sadiedeb (12 February 2011)

JenniferS said:



			Is the camera flickering for anyone else?
		
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Yep keeps happening to me to


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## silverstar (12 February 2011)

Just checking, she's still not had the foal.


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## Kokopelli (12 February 2011)

She looked close a few times, I have my eyes glued to the screen.


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## comet&joe (12 February 2011)

oh come on foal! all you need to do it pop out ! Lol


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## muddygreymare (12 February 2011)

Does anyone know what the random furry black thing is on the wall near the camera? Mare is looking more uncomfortable and keeps pawing the ground and walking around alot and stuff


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## Spring Feather (12 February 2011)

It's the black cat that was wandering around the stable a little while ago


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## muddygreymare (12 February 2011)

Oh right haha. I just saw it move and i was like argh haha. I was downstairs making cheese on toast (and burnt my thumb cooking it on the aga haha) and came back and mare was fine but some random black thing had appeared haha.
Ooh now its gone..


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## Kokopelli (12 February 2011)

Lets hope he's not an unlucky black cat


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## Laafet (12 February 2011)

You could be in for a long wait though, I'm on foal watch here, have been for two weeks now and still no foal, we've got one mare that is 368 days pregnant, sigh. No wax just big boobies and slack (well you guess). That mare on marestare is eating so might be holding on for a bit, but then she has been lip curling too!


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## ShowJumperBeckii (12 February 2011)

is her tail up? or is it just the way shes standing?


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## chameleon (12 February 2011)

ShowJumpingBeckii123 said:



			is her tail up? or is it just the way shes standing? 

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It was earlier, she doesnt look as restless as she was earlier either. Looks like I am in for a late night - I'm determined to see this one through to the end

So can anyone tell me what to watch out for next? I know Heather on Barnmice says that you may see "butt dipping" when the contractions kick in properly but is there anything else, will she do a lot of laying down and getting up.....?


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## Laafet (12 February 2011)

Depends on the mare, typically most of mine do a fair amount of walking about, thinking about lying down then walking about some more. She doesn't look that likely right now. Once she breaks waters and hopefully lies down then it doesn't take that long.


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## BonneMaman (12 February 2011)

She looks completely chilled.  It is only 4pm there though so expect we need to wait for nightfall.....


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## Kokopelli (12 February 2011)

Come on April! I'm getting tired but want to stay up 
She seems to be having a nap atm though


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## CanadianGirl (12 February 2011)

She's looking a little more restless and someone is there checking on her right now...  I'm getting excited!


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## stroppy (13 February 2011)

Don't think baby will be make an apperance tonight, she's happily munching away!


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## chameleon (13 February 2011)

She is such a tease!!!


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## Rudolph's Red Nose (13 February 2011)

she is very fidgety ..... bless her....


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## SuperCoblet (13 February 2011)

Has she popped?! I can't see the footage


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## Rudolph's Red Nose (13 February 2011)

DanniHignett said:



			Has she popped?! I can't see the footage 

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nooooo, and i wish she would hurry up, have lots to do today


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## Kokopelli (13 February 2011)

I can't believe she hasn't foaled yet!! Hurry up April


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## Chellebean (13 February 2011)

Kokopelli said:



			I can't believe she hasn't foaled yet!! Hurry up April 

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I was just thinking that after logging back on lol


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## JessandCharlie (13 February 2011)

She keeps teasing us! I'm sure she's finding it very amusing poring the ground and pacing around  Very funny April 

J&C


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## comet&joe (13 February 2011)

why wont she foal yet!! my patience are going to hit the roof


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## LadyRascasse (13 February 2011)

she's waiting until april


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## comet&joe (13 February 2011)

LadyRascasse said:



			she's waiting until april 

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knew it


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## Hacked_Off (13 February 2011)

She's not due till the 25th 

http://sonny.marestare.com/calendar/month.php


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## stroppy (13 February 2011)

Yeah but she's been running milk and showing signs of early labour for the last few days,


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## Kokopelli (13 February 2011)

Rachiie said:



			She's not due till the 25th 

http://sonny.marestare.com/calendar/month.php

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I could be wrong but I think that was her original due date which has now changed as on their facebook they were expecting the foal 2 nights ago.

I hope she isn't waiting 'till April though


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## Perissa (13 February 2011)

I am positive I just saw a foot poking out, it went back in but I'm sure I saw something!!!


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## Hacked_Off (13 February 2011)

Kokopelli said:



			I could be wrong but I think that was her original due date which has now changed as on their facebook they were expecting the foal 2 nights ago.

I hope she isn't waiting 'till April though 

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Ah  I hope she hurries up, i've been watching her for at least a week :/


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## Vixstar (13 February 2011)

She is really restless now, kicking at her belly, pacing etc

Fingers crossed today is the day!


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## Kokopelli (13 February 2011)

Apparently she's had day births before so hopefully it's today


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## Vixen Van Debz (13 February 2011)

I've been watching her pacing, pawing the ground, kicking at her belly and her tail is almost constantly up... hopefully it won't be long!  Dawn has broken there though by the looks of it.


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## Spring Feather (13 February 2011)

Let's hope the foal arrives today, so that she can have that tail bandage taken off.  

I think the biggest problem here is that the mare appears to be in the main part of the stable block so she's seeing lots going on.  Shame they don't have a quiet stable to put her in, away from the main goings on.  She looks like she has gone back into stage 1 again, let's hope that this time she doesn't cancel it out again.


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## Perissa (13 February 2011)

Has anyone seen anyone checking on her?

Last night they were in there constantly but this morning (I saw this morning because it just after 7.30am there) I haven't seen anyone.


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## Dolcé (13 February 2011)

They were in and mucked her out about 5.30 their time, checked her over, think they may have fed as she was 'troughing' again and then have left her quiet, wish she would hurry up!  They do have the cameras in the house to watch them too so know what is going on all the time.


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## lannerch (13 February 2011)

Just logged on again after last night cannot believe she has not had the little one, surely now it is imminant I know I said this yesterday but now she i really restless and stamping! come on!


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## Jenna500 (13 February 2011)

I know what will happen - she'll have it when I have to go out and do my horses.  That's what happened with the last one we were watching.


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## tillytime (13 February 2011)

Got my fingers crossed that I see this foal arrive. Tried watching some of the others, but always seemed to miss the 'action'
She does look really close to foaling now, although reading through the posts, thats nothing new!


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## Janah (13 February 2011)

On a different note, lambs expected on my yard tomorrow!!!  Can't wait to see them.

Jane


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## Janah (13 February 2011)

Turned away for 1 minute and she has gone!


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## JessandCharlie (13 February 2011)

Janah said:



			Turned away for 1 minute and she has gone!
		
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Same! 

J&C

ETA: Cat's back


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## BSJAlove (13 February 2011)

hello cat  haha


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## lannerch (13 February 2011)

Shes gone outside for some excercise!

Just been reading on marestare the owner cancelled the low alert that had been triggered sounding like we may have to wait yet!


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## Kokopelli (13 February 2011)

The cats just taken a dump in her stable I think 

Janah- awww lambs so cute!!!


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## Janah (13 February 2011)

Cat just 'performed' in her bed!


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## lannerch (13 February 2011)

Ahh two kittys


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## Janah (13 February 2011)

So has the other cat!  How rude!


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## Janah (13 February 2011)

the cats around here treat the arena as a giant litter box!


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## Groom42 (13 February 2011)

Oh - I sooo want to tell her where the cat "went"!


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## Kokopelli (13 February 2011)

So is she meant to be coming back or is there another camera?


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## JenHunt (13 February 2011)

I was wondering the same!!


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## chameleon (13 February 2011)

You can see the outside area on http://www.marestare.com/fcam.php?alias=elements2   but its not very clear. Think that means that the foal is not imminent 

Was hoping it would be soon as my OH is getting a tad grumpy with me sat infront of the laptop!


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## Allover (13 February 2011)

She is back!!!!


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## Janah (13 February 2011)

Just back from yard and twin lambs born.  Saw both suckle for the first time.  One boy and one girl.

Wish mare would hurry up!


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## Allover (13 February 2011)

Awwww 

I wish she would too, and that man can leave her alone, unless he is the father he has no right to be there?


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## BSJAlove (13 February 2011)

please have your baby soon  my eyes hurt!


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## Kokopelli (13 February 2011)

She seems so unsettled bless her, and looks ready to pop! If she doesn't have it soon I will be so suprised


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## lannerch (13 February 2011)

looks promising they have just posted in elements that she is staying outside unless she goes into active labour, and just after this she is back in!


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## stroppy (13 February 2011)

I really thought i'd get in from the donks and baby would hae popped out, but nope, come on April!!


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## JessandCharlie (13 February 2011)

I think I may have to go down there personally with some castor oil and a curry for her soon  I can't believe she hasn't popped yet! 

J&C


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## BSJAlove (13 February 2011)

anyone getting a funny screen?


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## sadiedeb (13 February 2011)

BSJAlove said:



			anyone getting a funny screen?
		
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yea me whats happening?


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## JessandCharlie (13 February 2011)

Yep 

Hope it comes back soon! 

J&C


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## treacle_beastie (13 February 2011)

noooo the camera not working again - she better not be having it - I have been watching for nearly 24 hours now!


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## spike123 (13 February 2011)

yep screen has gone all fuzzy and multicoloured for me! I wonder if she has knocked the camera somehow. Lets hope she hasn't decided on a spot of privacy and decided to give birth while we can't see lol!


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## SuperCoblet (13 February 2011)

BSJAlove said:



			anyone getting a funny screen?
		
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Me  its all colourfull fuzzyness


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## Groom42 (13 February 2011)

pretty colours, but I'd rather see the mare!


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## Hacked_Off (13 February 2011)

I refreshed it and it's now saying 'stream not found' :/


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## GypsyGirl (13 February 2011)

Rachiie said:



			I refreshed it and it's now saying 'stream not found' :/
		
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Same here  I dont want to miss her having her foal!!  Were all glued to this screen lol


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## Kokopelli (13 February 2011)

Same for me 
I swear if shes having the baby now I will be gutted!


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## BSJAlove (13 February 2011)

my cams back on


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## maisiemoo (13 February 2011)

Same here, been glued to the lappy when possible, just finished all my chores, including fitting new toilet seat  [ while hubby couch potatoe lays on sofa watching tv] , time to settle down and begin my vigil only to find it's not visible , pray it's fixed soon !!


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## SuperCoblet (13 February 2011)

Its come back on a bit funny... but the mare's not in there?! :O


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## Katd66 (13 February 2011)

Camera back on but pony is missing!


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## GypsyGirl (13 February 2011)

Mines back on now too .. but looks like shes outside now .. http://www.marestare.com/fcam.php?alias=elements2

Or shall I say she was outside lol


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## Kokopelli (13 February 2011)

Is that snow? I know its in Colorado but don't know what the weather is like there


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## SuperCoblet (13 February 2011)

is she the one thats furthest away in the outside pen?


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## MissMistletoe (13 February 2011)

That black cats there again!. Wonder what it's called, it's becomming quite a celebrity!


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## JessandCharlie (13 February 2011)

Pod77 said:



			That black cats there again!. Wonder what it's called, it's becomming quite a celebrity!
		
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There were two earlier! Shifty looking... they're the ones that have been sabotaging the cameras if you ask me 

J&C


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## SuperCoblet (13 February 2011)

is pawing the ground a good sign?


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## JessandCharlie (13 February 2011)

DanniHignett said:



			is pawing the ground a good sign? 

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She's teasing us  She seems to be going through stages of pawing and being unsettled and settling down again. 

Poor girl, bet she's getting fed up  Can't wait!

J&C


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## BonneMaman (13 February 2011)

That horse has a seriously itchy bum


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## Hacked_Off (13 February 2011)

Pod77 said:



			That black cats there again!. Wonder what it's called, it's becomming quite a celebrity!
		
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Damn! I keep missing the cat


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## JessandCharlie (13 February 2011)

Back in her stable now  

J&C


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## MissMistletoe (13 February 2011)

There's TWO cats then?  like partners in crime!!!

 I agree, they do look shifty!, 

Im convinced that one of the cats climbed up onto the beams where the camera is sat (this was in the other stable, where the colicky mare with foal at foot was a couple of weeks ago) and stared into the screen, then the picture went fuzzy. 

Little monkey!


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## JessandCharlie (13 February 2011)

One climbed up onto the wall late last night, went to turn around, and nearly fell off. 

I think he was thoroughly embarrassed 

J&C


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## Kokopelli (13 February 2011)

May sound like a very silly question but is it damaging having the tail bandage on so long?


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## Rudolph's Red Nose (13 February 2011)

I dont think its going to be long


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## JessandCharlie (13 February 2011)

Kokopelli said:



			May sound like a very silly question but is it damaging having the tail bandage on so long?
		
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It can be! But I'm sure they wouldn't have it on tight  

J&C


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## westparc (13 February 2011)

shes in


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## stroppy (13 February 2011)

I'm thinking baby will appear sometime tonight


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## muddygreymare (13 February 2011)

Surely if it was hurting her they'd take it off?
Hopefully she will foal tonight  Another sunday baby hopefully, like Fanali's one Yoni 
Got h+h and the cam on multiscreen again, i dont want to go downstairs incase something happens haha


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## QUICKFIRE (13 February 2011)

Can someone please post a link, thankies


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## Kokopelli (13 February 2011)

I'm on my mums netbook now so carrying it around with me 

Ahh okay I was just wondering as she must have had it on for 24 hours now, it doesn't seem to be bothering her though.


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## B_2_B (13 February 2011)

http://www.marestare.com/fcam.php?alias=elements


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## JessandCharlie (13 February 2011)

I'm not sure I can take much more of this! 

J&C


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## Kokopelli (13 February 2011)

So excited for this! It has to be soon, surely?


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## JessandCharlie (13 February 2011)

Me too! I can't imagine how exiting it is if it's one of your own! 

J&C


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## Gucci_b (13 February 2011)

I think with-in the hour.....


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## Kokopelli (13 February 2011)

It makes me want to have a foal now aswell, sadly I don't think Andy is up to it


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## JessandCharlie (13 February 2011)

Lucky for Len he won't be having any foals soon either 

Molly and Tink on the other hand...  

Not sure they'd forgive me, both being ex-broodies I reckon they've had their time 

J&C


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## QUICKFIRE (13 February 2011)

Any another link? that one didn't work:-(


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## JessandCharlie (13 February 2011)

Man, somebody's lightning quick on poo-picking duty!

J&C


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## Kokopelli (13 February 2011)

http://www.marestare.com/fcam.php?alias=elements
It should be working..

I might have to encourage my friend with a mare to have a foal now


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## muddygreymare (13 February 2011)

My estimate is before 10pm our time.. 
Poor mare is looking quite agitated now. Is it normal for them to keep like kicking like she is and not standing still for long and pawing the ground? Sorry for the stupid questions haha, apart from Fanali i've never seen a mare foal before.


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## QUICKFIRE (13 February 2011)

Thanks Kokopelli x


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## JenniferS (13 February 2011)

I've never seen a mare foaling before, does her tail being that high mean she'll probably foal soon?


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## BonneMaman (13 February 2011)

As she is an arab she will naturally carry her tail very high but she really does seem a bit distressed - well she did look pretty distressed earlier kicking her belly and pacing but is now happily munching on her bed...


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## Laafet (13 February 2011)

LOL at you lot, you should come over to mine and watch my cameras - maybe not though as you'd be call the boss out on false alarms all the time! I have to say I don't agree with that mare having had a bandage on for so long, we only put the bandage on when the mare starts to foal. She doesn't look in discomfort really, and is resting her leg a lot and eating so while she may foal later tonight she doesn't look too far along just yet.


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## JessandCharlie (13 February 2011)

Laafet, you big meanie, you 

I admit to being a little over exited about it though. 

J&C


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## BallyshanHorses (13 February 2011)

I have to agree with Laafet regarding the bandage.If that has been on since yesterday then that is ridiculous as I have seen horses been docked like this by mistake by someone being too lazy to take it off.
We have 6 or 7 foals a year and a tail bandage goes on when the mare is in proper first stage labour.


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## Laafet (13 February 2011)

Well I'm just grumpy as I've got one mare who is over a year in foal now and I've been watching her all night every night for two weeks now! I've only got marestare on to satisfy my foaling crave.


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## JessandCharlie (13 February 2011)

Totally off topic but BH, the horse in your Sig is stunning! Is it one of yours?

Laafet, omg! Hope she foals soon! My post was tongue in cheek  hope you didn't take it the wrong way 

J&C


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## BallyshanHorses (13 February 2011)

You poor thing.How many have you this year??
We have 3 already.2 were a few days early and one 11 days over.I dont envy you one bit.I bet your waiting for the first to kick so that you will be up and running.


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## SuperCoblet (13 February 2011)

I think the cameras threatning to go off again!
Im going off the pc now, can someone post updates as i will constantly be on my ipod all night checking this page!


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## BallyshanHorses (13 February 2011)

Thanks JessandCharlie.Yes we bred him and he is sunning it up in florida at the moment at the WEF show the lucky thing.


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## JessandCharlie (13 February 2011)

Ahh, I think I'm in love! He's like an oil painting 

Quite jealous of him too, Florida! Can't wait for some sun 

J&C


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## MM&PP (13 February 2011)

Sorry if this has been posted before and is a bit OT, but I've been looking at a couple of the vids of the births and WHY do they interfere and pull out every single foal?? The feet pop out and they're dashing over to yank the poor thing out. And I mean every single video I've watched they've done the same thing?


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## brighteyes (13 February 2011)

I think the mucker outer is a bit sloppy - that last poo was there for _at least _five seconds...


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## BSJAlove (13 February 2011)

brighteyes said:



			I think the mucker outer is a bit sloppy - that last poo was there for _at least _five seconds...
		
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haha its brilliant. 5* service this!


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## Kokopelli (13 February 2011)

brighteyes said:



			I think the mucker outer is a bit sloppy - that last poo was there for _at least _five seconds...
		
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 five seconds! He should be fired


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## JessandCharlie (13 February 2011)

MM&PP somebody said that on their facebook page too. Haven't watched any before so I can't say, but there was a bit of a discussion 

J&C


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## LadyRascasse (13 February 2011)

brighteyes said:



			I think the mucker outer is a bit sloppy - that last poo was there for _at least _five seconds...
		
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what is this world coming to! the poor mare is probably traumatised as she had to look at the poo for sooo long pmsl. i wish she would hurry up i am getting tired and still gotta go check my lad, don't want to leave just in case i have never seen a live birth!


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## ISH_lover (13 February 2011)

She looks so close and she's definitely straining now


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## Laafet (13 February 2011)

J&C - not offended LOL, am not looking forward to another long night, am just off out on Booby check to see if anything has waxed up. We don't mess about with them as much as they seem to marestare!
Ballyshan, we were meant to have the first foal in Newmarket but have none whatsoever, everything is crossing its legs. We even had the vet out to check the mare that is way over 340 days but she does usually carry for over a year so its all normal so far.


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## JessandCharlie (13 February 2011)

I bet! Let's hope for an easy foaling tonight then 

J&C


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## SuperCoblet (13 February 2011)

LadyRascasse said:



			what is this world coming to! the poor mare is probably traumatised as she had to look at the poo for sooo long pmsl. i wish she would hurry up i am getting tired and still gotta go check my lad, don't want to leave just in case i have never seen a live birth!
		
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Its probs more traumatised the amout of times people come in and out of the stall! 
Is her tail normal? its a bit crooked and its been bandaged up for days 

Dont you just want to prod her and tell her to hurry up?!


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## MM&PP (13 February 2011)

After looking into this Elements Arabian I have closed the camera. I am not going to be adding to their numbers after reading about the extent of their interference, high level of foal deaths (vs. average), high levels of colic in mares post birth and their entire reasons behind breeding!!! Shocking.


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## rachi0 (13 February 2011)

MM&PP said:



			After looking into this Elements Arabian I have closed the camera. I am not going to be adding to their numbers after reading about the extent of their interference, high level of foal deaths (vs. average), high levels of colic in mares post birth and their entire reasons behind breeding!!! Shocking.
		
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can you elaborate?? Just wondering where you got your info from.. - that's quite interesting!!! ( sad.. but interesting)


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## Kokopelli (13 February 2011)

MM&PP said:



			After looking into this Elements Arabian I have closed the camera. I am not going to be adding to their numbers after reading about the extent of their interference, high level of foal deaths (vs. average), high levels of colic in mares post birth and their entire reasons behind breeding!!! Shocking.
		
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Oh really? 

I might do a bit of googling!


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## Gucci_b (13 February 2011)

I must say... am not liking very much what I'm seeing on their live web cam ...


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## Laafet (13 February 2011)

I know what you mean Gucci_b, it is totally different to how we do it here.


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## Kokopelli (13 February 2011)

Can someone send links to the info on the place as I can't find anything?


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## Gucci_b (13 February 2011)

I can't understand why the owner would want to poo pick so quickly when the owner has stated on f.book that her mare is in the 1st stage of labour (since yesterday) the tail bandage has been on for nearly a day, and she has just tried to pull the mare out of her stable to pop out to graze, I always thought you should never disturb a mare showing signs of foaling as she can hold on to the foal... please correct me if I'm wrong


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## JessandCharlie (13 February 2011)

I've never seen a foaling, but there does seem to be a lot more faffing than I expected 

J&C


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## BSJAlove (13 February 2011)

im going agaisnt the grain. i admit to knowing nothing off breeding despite working at a stud for a year haha. but to me the mare looks as happy as she would coming in to foaling and shes obviously happy with her owners. i almost feel like people are looking for problems sometimes. to me, they look like they are doing their best, staying close incase she foals and making sure everything is going okay. but hey, as i said above. i know nothing


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## LadyRascasse (13 February 2011)

http://www.equine-world.co.uk/horse-forums/showthread.php?t=20797&page=9 start from the beginning makes and interesting read


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## Laafet (13 February 2011)

It is preferable to leave the mare as quiet as possible until she actually breaks waters. The shy mares will tend to 'hold' on for as long as possible if they don't feel safe. I only go in minimally at night but leave their heat lamps on so that I can see them without having to turn the white lights on.


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## tillytime (13 February 2011)

I've been watching all day and the arrival doesn't seem imminant .... shes not progressed at all. (If anything she looks 'less' in labour then before!)

I too would like to know where the information about inappropriate treatment is, as I'd like to check it out, and too would turn off and go against the breeders if the accusations are correct!


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## Spring Feather (13 February 2011)

You should never disturb a mare when she goes into stage 1 labour because at this stage the mare is able to stop labour if she decides to.  I never ever ever bother my mares when they are in stage 1 but I watch them like a hawk for stage 2.  The moment stage 2 comes, that's when I go to them as I know that at this stage they are unable to halt labour.

As I mentioned earlier, if they could find a quieter place in their stable, well away from all the goings on then the mare might get on with it.  All this mucking out after every poo isn't helping.

I've just read on marestare that they don't milk test at Elements, I assumed they did.  This mare could go on like this for days at this rate.  I don't know why they don't test her and then they'd have a much better idea of when the foal will make its arrival.  Oh and I wish they would plait the tail and get that tail bandage off.


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## Kokopelli (13 February 2011)

http://www.threedayranch.com/Foals_III.htm

Scroll quite far down and she is accused of stealing a horse


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## LadyRascasse (13 February 2011)

http://forums.ablackhorse.com/lofiversion/index.php?t10220.html


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## WoopsiiD (13 February 2011)

Found another site based in USA and they have nothing nice to say about her!


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## Vixen Van Debz (13 February 2011)

http://www.ripoffreport.com/animal-...f-wi/stephanie-wind-of-windsong-sab-a2ay2.htm


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## Kokopelli (13 February 2011)

Well this has put a real downer on it.

I was very much looking forward to the birth but not so much now.
If anyone knows of any other horses on marestare due to go into labour soon and the owners are better would love to see


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## westparc (13 February 2011)

is that a poo
have they left her alone 
does that mean she might have it now!!


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## Spring Feather (13 February 2011)

westparc said:



			is that a poo
have they left her alone 
does that mean she might have it now!!
		
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Nope.  Let's all rush in there yet again and pick it up


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## Groom42 (13 February 2011)

It certainly surprised me how busy it all is. I did think mares were supposed to be left in peace? I have watched a video of another mare foaling here and it made me feel very uncomfortable, particularly the over-keen pulling and interference.  I've now done the obligatory googling, and this woman doesn't seem to have many fans!


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## treacle_beastie (13 February 2011)

Spring Feather said:



			You should never disturb a mare when she goes into stage 1 labour because at this stage the mare is able to stop labour if she decides to.  I never ever ever bother my mares when they are in stage 1 but I watch them like a hawk for stage 2.  The moment stage 2 comes, that's when I go to them as I know that at this stage they are unable to halt labour.

As I mentioned earlier, if they could find a quieter place in their stable, well away from all the goings on then the mare might get on with it.  All this mucking out after every poo isn't helping.

I've just read on marestare that they don't milk test at Elements, I assumed they did.  This mare could go on like this for days at this rate.  I don't know why they don't test her and then they'd have a much better idea of when the foal will make its arrival.  Oh and I wish they would plait the tail and get that tail bandage off.
		
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Earlier they did get a sample and then held it up to the light or something - is that milk testing?


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## Laafet (13 February 2011)

http://fhotd64476.yuku.com/topic/58586/I-think-this-mare-is-colicing-anyone-else?page=2

Start at page 1, hmm no enemas given, which is personal choice but we always do and sometimes help the colts manually with a well lubricated finger. Not sure if I want to watch now. I've done 40 foalings so far and only had one difficult one so far. We might just be lucky but this lot do seem to have a lot of problems.


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## Munchkin (13 February 2011)

This is making me angry! I hate watching factory farmed horses which is why I promise myself every year I will not watch Marestare - then I get hooked.

They are in there with her every 2 minutes. Her tail's been tightly bandaged for days and did anyone see how headshy she was?

Before anyone starts, I am not claiming to be a breeding expert, but a little common sense seems to be absent from this stud.


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## BSJAlove (13 February 2011)

i take back my earlier post


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## Kokopelli (13 February 2011)

I just watched the video of her foal 2 weeks ago and I've never seen a birth before and know little about breeding but I'm sure it didn't look 'right', I've now switched off Aprils camera.


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## MM&PP (13 February 2011)

Well, I spoke to a few friends who have been following this longer than I have, but there are a few threads here http://fhotd64476.yuku.com/search/text/forum/7?q=elements+arabians&submit=Search+Forum

And if you watch this video of one of her other horses foaling, the mare appears aggitated and distressed at the poking, proding and general interference (if you don't want to watch whole thing, it's around 5 mins in) from the annoying woman: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GGzrh-mIYwU&feature=related

If you chose to watch the other videos on the right, you will see that EVERY foal is yanked out, and often with disregard to the contractions!!!


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## Munchkin (13 February 2011)

Waters just broke


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## rebchico (13 February 2011)

i think its comingg!
still exciting, even if the owners a bit odd..


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## NJM53 (13 February 2011)

Groom42 said:



			It certainly surprised me how busy it all is. I did think mares were supposed to be left in peace? I have watched a video of another mare foaling here and it made me feel very uncomfortable, particularly the over-keen pulling and interference.  I've now done the obligatory googling, and this woman doesn't seem to have many fans!
		
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I've watched this too.. I know nothing about breeding, and have never seen a mare foal before but something about this video made me feel really uncomfortable. I don't think I can stomach watching another one!


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## Spring Feather (13 February 2011)

All systems go!  She's having it!!


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## RoseGrey (13 February 2011)

She is foaling right now !!!!!!!


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## Kokopelli (13 February 2011)

My curiosity got the better of me, I'm watching again and no one has come in yet!


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## Munchkin (13 February 2011)

And someone's interfering... again


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## westparc (13 February 2011)

and they are there again


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## Vixstar (13 February 2011)

Go on girlie - push!!


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## Kokopelli (13 February 2011)

Hmm :/

She looked more comfortable until they came in


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## JenniferS (13 February 2011)

They're in the corner!?


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## SuperCoblet (13 February 2011)

I can't believe I'm missing it  what happening guys?!


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## rebchico (13 February 2011)

she does seem a bit disturbed by the person 

but go on girlll!  babyss comingg


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## stroppy (13 February 2011)

Oh for god sake get off your soap boxes, you would be in there to if your mare where in labour!! she is not remotely bothered about them being in with her and they are not interfering!


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## MurphysMinder (13 February 2011)

Can't comment on the mares as not much experience of foaling, but there was a GSD whelping on marestare a couple of weeks ago (different owner I know) and it really upset me the amount of interference, they just didn't leave the poor bitch alone at all, pushing pups on to feed then taking each one away .  Maybe it is just the american way of doing things.


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## RoseGrey (13 February 2011)

On Cam 1, the person is just observing as mare is fine so far !


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## Kokopelli (13 February 2011)

They're leaving her alone though, atm 
Come on April!!!


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## MrsMozart (13 February 2011)

How long does this bit usually take?

I'm used to dogs whelping, but never seen a horse born.


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## chameleon (13 February 2011)

Am I being thick? I thought the front legs come out first, but all I can see is a large round lump - is this normal??


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## MrsMozart (13 February 2011)

That's the sack


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## Kokopelli (13 February 2011)

Is she meant to be walking around like that?


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## RuthnMeg (13 February 2011)

poor mare, needs some quiet. Looks like something 'interesting' is going on outside, and she is getting wound up!


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## Spring Feather (13 February 2011)

MrsMozart said:



			How long does this bit usually take?

I'm used to dogs whelping, but never seen a horse born.
		
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This bit is usually over and done with really quickly.  Not sure what is going on but mare is quite upset.  I can't see the leg, just the bubble and a little round thing (hoping not the muzzle).  It must be a leg though otherwise the watcher would have called for help.  It's a bit difficult to see exactly what's what in that light.


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## Groom42 (13 February 2011)

I've never had experience of foaling, but my gut thought is....."Get out of her chuffin' stable!"


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## Vixstar (13 February 2011)

What's going on around her?  She seems very agitated.

And to answer your question, it should be feet first - what your seeing is the sack - can someone confirm that?  I haven't loads of breeding experience


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## MrsMozart (13 February 2011)

The mare certinaly seems to have her attention on the outside world.

When our dogs whelped, they were very introverted. We stayed close in case they needed help, but it was almost as though we weren't there.

Looks like foaly has decided he/she isn't coming right now.


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## SuperCoblet (13 February 2011)

Arnt they supposed to lie down? I can't see it but it sounds like she's upset


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## el_Snowflakes (13 February 2011)

what a pretty mare


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## JenniferS (13 February 2011)

And she's down again


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## BSJAlove (13 February 2011)

the woman is right to be in the stable. someone has to make sure its going right. shes got the best view to make sure things are going okay. looks normal so far, mare just seems to be aggitated.


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## el_Snowflakes (13 February 2011)

shes down!!


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## Hacked_Off (13 February 2011)

She needs to turn around!


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## Gucci_b (13 February 2011)

what the F... is the owner doing...


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## el_Snowflakes (13 February 2011)

Gucci_b said:



			what the F... is the owner doing...
		
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what should they be doing?


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## RuthnMeg (13 February 2011)

Gucci_b said:



			what the F... is the owner doing...
		
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I thought she was eating something like noodles!?!


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## el_Snowflakes (13 February 2011)

RuthnMeg said:



			I thought she was eating something like noodles!?!
		
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popcorn? lol


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## Hacked_Off (13 February 2011)

RuthnMeg said:



			I thought she was eating something like noodles!?!
		
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I thought she was reading a book


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## JenniferS (13 February 2011)

go away owner!


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## rebchico (13 February 2011)

and shes pulling..


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## Kokopelli (13 February 2011)

Does April seem tired to anyone else?


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## 3Beasties (13 February 2011)

rebchico said:



			and shes pulling..
		
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Looks like she was checking the foal was in the correct position to me.


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## Hacked_Off (13 February 2011)

What colour do you think the foal will be? I'm gonna guess black...


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## Spring Feather (13 February 2011)

rebchico said:



			and shes pulling..
		
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No, she was checking presentation.


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## rebchico (13 February 2011)

3Beasties said:



			Looks like she was checking the foal was in the correct position to me.
		
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Oh ok


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## stroppy (13 February 2011)

JenniferS said:



			go away owner!
		
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Why? would you leave your mare to foal un observed?? I SURE AS HELL WOULDN'T what if something goes wrong aye? 


She's not pulling, , My god most of you lot are so judgemental!!


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## Kokopelli (13 February 2011)

Apparently its definatly going to be bay or black


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## JenniferS (13 February 2011)

Now that was pulling...


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## MM&PP (13 February 2011)

stroppy said:



			Why? would you leave your mare to foal un observed?? I SURE AS HELL WOULDN'T what if something goes wrong aye? 


She's not pulling, she's breaking the bag which needs to be done, My god most of you lot are so judgemental!!
		
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Every single other foal born has been yanked out. Look at the threads all over the internet and videos on youtube.


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## JenniferS (13 February 2011)

MM&PP said:



			Every single other foal born has been yanked out. Look at the threads all over the internet and videos on youtube.
		
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Yeah this..


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## Spring Feather (13 February 2011)

stroppy said:



			Why? would you leave your mare to foal un observed?? I SURE AS HELL WOULDN'T what if something goes wrong aye? 


She's not pulling, , My god most of you lot are so judgemental!!
		
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Actually the sac does not need to be broken until the foal is out.  It usually breaks anyway once the foal comes out.  She was pulling a little while ago ... not in time with Aprils contractions.


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## MileAMinute (13 February 2011)

Did anyone else see the poor mare's legs wobble then as she lay down? Bless her, she's so tired!


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## SuperCoblet (13 February 2011)

Anything happening?! How far out is it?
I predict a black colt


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## rebchico (13 February 2011)

when she does the jerky movements does it mean she's pushing?
sorry complete foaling newb


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## JenniferS (13 February 2011)

Poor foal.. I wish the owner would stop yanking


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## Munchkin (13 February 2011)

******* me! I cannot believe what I'm seeing!


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## Spring Feather (13 February 2011)

Disgusting.


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## stroppy (13 February 2011)

Spring Feather said:



			Actually the sac does not need to be broken until the foal is out.  It usually breaks anyway once the foal comes out.  She was pulling a little while ago ... not in time with Aprils contractions.
		
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The sac does not always break by itself, April looks exhausted therefore help is needed.


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## MM&PP (13 February 2011)

I couldn't resisit and logged back on and the way she is pulling AGAINST the contractions is making me feel sick.?


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## JenniferS (13 February 2011)

That is sick


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## RuthnMeg (13 February 2011)

Surely pulling against the contractions is a breeding no no. I've never had to pull anything out, but seen my share of foalings.


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## Munchkin (13 February 2011)

Hopefully she'll double barrel her in the face soon so she can get on with it naturally


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## Spring Feather (13 February 2011)

stroppy said:



			The sac does not always break by itself, April looks exhausted therefore help is needed.
		
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The sac almost always breaks on its own.  If not when it's a bubble then it certainly will once the foals legs come out.  

I cannot believe what I am seeing here!  This is shocking abuse!


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## jrp204 (13 February 2011)

I have no problem with the foal being helped out but would prefer he just holding the pressure and pulling downwards more, it can he............ooo what shes doing now


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## JenniferS (13 February 2011)

Coloured foal?!!


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## MurphysMinder (13 February 2011)

MM&PP said:



			I couldn't resisit and logged back on and the way she is pulling AGAINST the contractions is making me feel sick. No wonder the mare is attemping to get up, she wants the woman to get the **** away from her. ****.
		
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This ^^ from my limited knowledge I thought you should always pull WITH the contractions, as you say this is not pleasant to watch.


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## Hampshire (13 February 2011)

A new Baby !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## Kokopelli (13 February 2011)

Its sabiano (sp) isn't it?


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## MileAMinute (13 February 2011)

Am glad that was over with.
But gorgeous little foal!


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## QUICKFIRE (13 February 2011)

whoopsi breech, good job she was giveing a hand then


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## JenniferS (13 February 2011)

Colt!!


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## Bedlam (13 February 2011)

Wow - that was amazing!


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## B_2_B (13 February 2011)

Coloured colt 

Not going to comment on the delivery methods!


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## 3Beasties (13 February 2011)

JenniferS said:



			Coloured foal?!!
		
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I bet that wasn't ordered!

Looks like a gorgeous BIG colt 


Wasn't comfortable viewing though


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## lurcher98 (13 February 2011)

its a colt


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## RoseGrey (13 February 2011)

That poor mare !!!  Nice little foaly with stretched legs !


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## JessandCharlie (13 February 2011)

Thank god it's over.

J&C


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## Hacked_Off (13 February 2011)

Well i was half right


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## vikkiandmonica (13 February 2011)

Deleted


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## Fire_Fly (13 February 2011)

That was very hard to watch.


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## Spring Feather (13 February 2011)

Cute little tobiano though


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## jrp204 (13 February 2011)

I have calved loads of cow and we are in the middle of lambing so have done a fair bit of 'helping'. I couldn't see anything majorly wrong apart from her jolting it a bit whilst pulling. If the mum is tired, getting the baby is out is to boths benefits, the foal will be fine, she didn't use ropes or anything. Better to help than to lose the foal.


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## RuthnMeg (13 February 2011)

I think the daddy was Sabino, so it was always a high possibility.
Big colt, love the 'towel ''colt''!


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## Paint Me Proud (13 February 2011)

blimey no wonder she had problems delivering it, that foal is MAHOOSIVE!


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## MM&PP (13 February 2011)

To those who missed my earlier post, this pulling out of foals occurs in 100% of the births. They have NEVER left the mare to it.


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## Kokopelli (13 February 2011)

I won't comment on methods as I am not experienced...

But I so want that colt isn't he just the cutest!! And the cats have made another appearence


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## BSJAlove (13 February 2011)

the lady cant do anything right. on marestare, they let us know what sex the foal is. i doubt the mare is that fussed about having it on just after just giving birth. absolutly lovely colt. lovely seeing mum and foal bond. they both look pretty fine to me.


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## Spring Feather (13 February 2011)

QUICKFIRE said:



			whoopsi breech, good job she was giveing a hand then
		
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It wasn't breech.


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## MrsMozart (13 February 2011)

How long 'till the foal is moving/up?

Again, I only have dogs to go by, I know nothing about horses foaling.


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## MM&PP (13 February 2011)

Is it normal for foal to be that lifeless?


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## WoopsiiD (13 February 2011)

There's helping and then there is whatever the hell was going on in there!
Pulling before the contraction is not helping. Its painful and can lead to all sorts of internal problems afterwards.


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## el_Snowflakes (13 February 2011)

absolutely beautiful....didnt expect it to be coloured


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## SillySausage (13 February 2011)

Speaking from my own experience, it's not rare to give the mare a helping hand. But, I found that quite uncomfortable, she was in there from the word go, and not pulling with the contractions as far as I could see.

However congrats to the mare, what a beautiful big colt and hope all is well!


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## RuthnMeg (13 February 2011)

April looks very tired, bless her.


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## QUICKFIRE (13 February 2011)

Spring Feather said:



			It wasn't breech.
		
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Forgive me if I am wrong, but looked to me as the back legs came out first!


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## Groom42 (13 February 2011)

I've never seen a "live" foaling, but lots of videos.  That was awful to watch, just awful.  Beautiful foal, lovely to see them bonding, but I never want to see another foaling like that, ever.


ETA: at one point I thought it was breech, but then realised it was just the angle - saw the woman go behind and lift quarters away from mare.


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## Bedlam (13 February 2011)

OK, she really needs to back off now.....


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## Maesfen (13 February 2011)

MurphysMinder said:



			This ^^ from my limited knowledge I thought you should always pull WITH the contractions, as you say this is not pleasant to watch.
		
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You're right MM; always with.   I wouldn't like her foaling mine.  Have to say though the mare didn't shape up much either, she wasn't a lot of help herself.
Why couldn't she just drape the towel on the bars, poor mare.


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## JessandCharlie (13 February 2011)

QUICKFIRE said:



			Forgive me if I am wrong, but looked to me as the back legs came out first!
		
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I don't think so 

J&C


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## MileAMinute (13 February 2011)

Why does she keep coming back to towel the foal??


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## BallyshanHorses (13 February 2011)

I think they made a good decision to help as the mare and foal are exhausted and the foal is massive by the looks of him.I agree the helper was not pulling while the mare was pushing all the time but when your in that situation and it could mean life or death then you do what you think is right.Dont agree with taking the foal out completely as I am sure it lost some vital last blood but I dont own the mare or foal so that at the end of the day is the owners decision.


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## martlin (13 February 2011)

Good job you lot haven't seen me lambing


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## BSJAlove (13 February 2011)

Bedlam said:



			OK, she really needs to back off now.....
		
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woa  all she done was towel the foal down, which needed doing.


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## MrsMozart (13 February 2011)

QUICKFIRE said:



			Forgive me if I am wrong, but looked to me as the back legs came out first!
		
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I thought it was front legs. The foal was still laid in the position that followed its direction of travel into the world


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## MM&PP (13 February 2011)

MM&PP said:



			Is it normal for foal to be that lifeless?
		
Click to expand...

Anyone?


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## SillySausage (13 February 2011)

QUICKFIRE said:



			Forgive me if I am wrong, but looked to me as the back legs came out first!
		
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The front legs came first from where I was watching!

Again, from experience I would want the foal up in about 10 mins(ish)


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## Kokopelli (13 February 2011)

They both look knackered! All the best to them and I hope they get that tail bandage off soon


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## jrp204 (13 February 2011)

We have been watching the mare, on and off since last evening, i don't blame them for helping her, she is obviously knackered as is the foal. Since the cost of not helping can often result in a foal/calf/lamb been born dead or brain damaged or taking on a whole load of fluid and getting pneumonia i would rather intervene. OK, to non farmers that may have looked brutal but i can assure i have seen far far worse.


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## sdoherty (13 February 2011)

That was rough!!! Why cant she leave them alone now that its out.


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## SuperCoblet (13 February 2011)

Can someone take a snip of the foal off the video and post it? Would love to see it!


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## lurcher98 (13 February 2011)

ive never seen one take so long to start  moving


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## Spring Feather (13 February 2011)

QUICKFIRE said:



			Forgive me if I am wrong, but looked to me as the back legs came out first!
		
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No, it was a normal presentation.  What you saw may have been when the owner was yanking the hind legs out instead of leaving them in the mare for the rest period.


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## RatzFatz (13 February 2011)

Looks like the baby has  white socks,they both look tired!!!


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## BSJAlove (13 February 2011)

tbh i feel sorry for the lady. she cant do anything right. she helps the mare. but shes doing it wrong. she checks on the foal. but she should leave him alone. she told us it was a colt. she shouldnt have told us. i think she done a bloody good job. well done to mare and foal and all those involved.


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## jrp204 (13 February 2011)

Actually, i think he's taking so long to get up as hes trying to work out how to control those sodding long legs!!


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## MurphysMinder (13 February 2011)

Gawd knows how he is going to get those hind legs under him to stand up, they are ridiculously long!

Ets. Snap JRP


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## QUICKFIRE (13 February 2011)

Fair enough, I should have gone to specsavers lol,


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## Paint Me Proud (13 February 2011)




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## MM&PP (13 February 2011)

jrp204 said:



			We have been watching the mare, on and off since last evening, i don't blame them for helping her, she is obviously knackered as is the foal. Since the cost of not helping can often result in a foal/calf/lamb been born dead or brain damaged or taking on a whole load of fluid and getting pneumonia i would rather intervene. OK, to non farmers that may have looked brutal but i can assure i have seen far far worse.
		
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Fair enough, but yanking *every single* foal born regardless of contractions and whether the mare actually needed help?!


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## el_Snowflakes (13 February 2011)

BSJAlove said:



			tbh i feel sorry for the lady. she cant do anything right. she helps the mare. but shes doing it wrong. she checks on the foal. but she should leave him alone. she told us it was a colt. she shouldnt have told us. i think she done a bloody good job. well done to mare and foal and all those involved.
		
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i agree....and i think people expect it to just pop out as they are animals. We too are animals but usually even we need some help! i actually thought the mare seemed comforted when she was talking to her and stroking her leg


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## Hacked_Off (13 February 2011)

Paint Me Proud said:








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Is it just me or does his white patch look a bit like a heart?


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## MrsMozart (13 February 2011)

Gawd. I want to go to bed, but I want to see him up first


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## JenniferS (13 February 2011)

Paint Me Proud said:








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Am I the only one that thinks that its marking looks like Pacman? Or am I being silly?


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## MileAMinute (13 February 2011)

BSJAlove said:



			tbh i feel sorry for the lady. she cant do anything right. she helps the mare. but shes doing it wrong. she checks on the foal. but she should leave him alone. she told us it was a colt. she shouldnt have told us. i think she done a bloody good job. well done to mare and foal and all those involved.
		
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This is the problem when you have a live webcam stream on the internet - you leave yourself open to criticism from anyone who can access it.

I can't personally pass comment as I'm not experienced in breeding/foaling, but seeing this birth it certainly made uncomfortable viewing.


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## 3Beasties (13 February 2011)

MrsMozart said:



			Gawd. I want to go to bed, but I want to see him up first 

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Ditto!!

I was about to go to bed when she started foaling!  My poor beast will be wondering where his supper is


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## Kokopelli (13 February 2011)

Rachiie said:



			Is it just me or does his white patch look a bit like a heart?
		
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No it is! How cute! He's going to have all the ladies after him


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## Bedlam (13 February 2011)

BSJAlove said:



			woa  all she done was towel the foal down, which needed doing.
		
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No - I agreed with the intervention with the birth - mare was tired. But I would have left them alone once the foal was out a little longer. The mare would have cleaned the foal - doesn't need so much towelling. If they had been left alone as soon as the foal was out the umbilical cord may have stayed attached for a little while longer giving the foal a vital blood transfusion. 

I really hope that they give them a few hours to bond now (under passive supervision). It's obviously necessary for the foal to get colostrum, but also really important for them to bond and for the foal to struggle to its feet on its own if it can.


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## jrp204 (13 February 2011)

I think if the mare was up fussing over him he would be more likely to get moving, she is pretty knackered though.


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## Maesfen (13 February 2011)

lurcher98 said:



			ive never seen one take so long to start  moving
		
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Joey and Irish were exactly the same; she was very tired even though it had been a quick birth and he was just an idle sod who didn't want to get up even though he'd suck on anything that passed near him.  When he did get up, TWO HOURS later, he didn't lurch or stagger once but went straight to the milk bar and latched on.  Never had one so quick to know what and where he had to go or what to do.  It sure beats the heart in the mouth times while they get up, stagger around, fall over and lurch about until they finally find the milk bar.  Let's hope this boy's just as quick to learn.


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## MM&PP (13 February 2011)

JenniferS said:



			Am I the only one that thinks that its marking looks like Pacman? Or am I being silly? 

Click to expand...

I see the pacman!

Should there be more movement? Or is this normal?

ETA just saw the above.


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## MrsMozart (13 February 2011)

3Beasties said:



			Ditto!!

I was about to go to bed when she started foaling!  My poor beast will be wondering where his supper is   

Click to expand...


Ah ha! On the iPad and I can wander round the house easily with that


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## 3Beasties (13 February 2011)

Is this normal behaviour for a foal?


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## RatzFatz (13 February 2011)

Loving the fact that they helped the mare out when she was foaling but have now left her alone to get to know her baby!!!  Could any of you have just stood back and not helped if she was your mare !!!!


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## Spring Feather (13 February 2011)

jrp204 said:



			We have been watching the mare, on and off since last evening, i don't blame them for helping her, she is obviously knackered as is the foal. Since the cost of not helping can often result in a foal/calf/lamb been born dead or brain damaged or taking on a whole load of fluid and getting pneumonia i would rather intervene. OK, to non farmers that may have looked brutal but i can assure i have seen far far worse.
		
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I'm a horse breeder and there was no risk of damage to this foal as far as I could see.  It was a totally normal presentation and at the stage she started pulling backwards instead of downwards and against the contractions, not with them, there was no reason to intervene at that stage.  I'd say that was a pretty brutal delivery for this mare.

And to answer the earlier question, no it is not usual for a foal to be as listless as this, however given the awful birth I'm not too surprised.  Our foals are crawling around while their hind legs are still in their dams and they are all up by this stage.  I presume the foal is incredibly tired at this point.


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## MM&PP (13 February 2011)

RatzFatz said:



			Loving the fact that they helped the mare out when she was foaling but have now left her alone to get to know her baby!!!  Could any of you have just stood back and not helped if she was your mare !!!!
		
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Maybe not in this instance, but I would have gone WITH the contractions. A big factor in this for me is that they intervene EVERY time and yank EVERY foal out - totally unnecessary IMO.

Agree entirely with Spring Feather.


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## WoopsiiD (13 February 2011)

Spring Feather said:



			I'm a horse breeder and there was no risk of damage to this foal as far as I could see.  It was a totally normal presentation and at the stage she started pulling backwards instead of downwards and against the contractions, not with them, there was no reason to intervene at that stage.  I'd say that was a pretty brutal delivery for this mare.

And to answer the earlier question, no it is not usual for a foal to be as listless as this, however given the awful birth I'm not too surprised.  Our foals are crawling around while their hind legs are still in their dams and they are all up by this stage.  I presume the foal is incredibly tired at this point.
		
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^^^^^This! Much better put then I have just tried and deleted!
As a breeder this woman should know that if you are going to 'help' you go with the flow-you pull with the contraction never against.


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## jrp204 (13 February 2011)

Well. its no good, i only turned it on for 10mins after coming in from checking the ewes which are due to lamb, giving the twin rams born by C section at 5 this evening  some colustrum and getting covered in blood from the ewes fleece (the vet didn't clean her up) and now its nearly midnight!! No doubt both these 2 will be looking rather different in the morning.
Night all.


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## brighteyes (13 February 2011)

Damn, I missed it!


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## RatzFatz (13 February 2011)

Agree!!!!


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## MrsMozart (13 February 2011)

MrsMozart said:



			Ah ha! On the iPad and I can wander round the house easily with that 

Click to expand...

Scratch that idea. iPad doesn't do Flash 

Foal looking a little livelier


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## Groom42 (13 February 2011)

Cobrastyle said:



			This is the problem when you have a live webcam stream on the internet - you leave yourself open to criticism from anyone who can access it.

I can't personally pass comment as I'm not experienced in breeding/foaling, but seeing this birth it certainly made uncomfortable viewing.
		
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I agree with both comments here, but I do think she is being more closely scrutinised because it has become apparent that this is a NORMAL foaling for her, not an unusual, necessary intervention.  People far more experienced than most of us have commented that the majority of foalings are trouble free and the mare copes perfectly well on her own.  I have spent time lambing and it is much more intense, due to numbers, but even with sometimes several onoing at once, if the ewe can manage alone, she's left to it!


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## rebchico (13 February 2011)

looking a tad more lively?


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## Fire_Fly (13 February 2011)

I don't think anyone is arguing that animals sometimes need help, but what happened then wasn't conducive to a productive and happy birth. The mare was clearly agitated by her interference and kept trying to get up, and she was pulling against the contractions, even laymen know that's wrong.


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## jrp204 (13 February 2011)

I'm a horse breeder and there was no risk of damage to this foal as far as I could see. It was a totally normal presentation and at the stage she started pulling backwards instead of downwards and against the contractions, not with them, there was no reason to intervene at that stage. I'd say that was a pretty brutal delivery for this mare.

Actually I did say i would rather she kept pressure on the pulling, not yanking and that she pulled downwards, which she then did as i was typing.


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## Kokopelli (13 February 2011)

brighteyes said:



			Damn, I missed it!
		
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They normally put it on youtube afterwards.

ETA: Is this normal for her to be helping him up like that?


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## Bedlam (13 February 2011)

This is sooo not necessary.....


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## Maesfen (13 February 2011)

MM&PP said:



			Maybe not in this instance, but I would have gone WITH the contractions. A big factor in this for me is that they intervene EVERY time and yank EVERY foal out - totally unnecessary IMO.

Agree entirely with Spring Feather.
		
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This is the first I've seen a foaling from there and if this is the norm then I won't watch again.  I'm all for helping the mare if necessary but she wasn't a good helper for me, got stuck in far too quickly and harshly although I'm the first to agree that being an armchair critic is mightily different from being there yourself.


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## MM&PP (13 February 2011)

Mare looks utterly confused by the woman carrying the foal around the stable... Surely he's more likely to hurt himself panicing to get away from her?!?!??


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## rebchico (13 February 2011)

baby looks like its having a hard time trying to stand by itself?
is that normal?


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## Bedlam (13 February 2011)

Oh I see - they moved the foal and mare a few minutes after birth so they could muck out.......?


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## BSJAlove (13 February 2011)

i think im going to sleep without opening my mouth again. ill come back and read all the crit comments in the morning. well done to april, foal and lady. i personally think you done a great job and its one heck of a lovely looking foal


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## MrsMozart (13 February 2011)

Again, showing my ignorance... Does one normally muck out after a foaling?


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## MM&PP (13 February 2011)

Maesfen said:



			This is the first I've seen a foaling from there and if this is the norm then I won't watch again.  I'm all for helping the mare if necessary but she wasn't a good helper for me, got stuck in far too quickly and harshly although I'm the first to agree that being an armchair critic is mightily different from being there yourself.
		
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http://fhotd64476.yuku.com/search/text/forum/7?q=elements+arabians&submit=Search+Forum

About 5 mins in. Other yanking videos are also available...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GGzrh-mIYwU&feature=related


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## Fire_Fly (13 February 2011)

What a perfect time to muck out the mess! Surely that could be left a couple of hours.


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## WoopsiiD (13 February 2011)

Maesfen...I did a quick google and several US based forums actually refer to this type of birth as an 'Element Yanking'


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## lurcher98 (13 February 2011)

ive been watching marestare for a few years and it does seem to be the norm for them(and not just with the horses) to go straight in and pull when the mare/dog/goat goes down.


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## MrsMozart (13 February 2011)

The mare must trust the handler, to allow her in there and to be handling the foal?


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## Bedlam (13 February 2011)

Fire_Fly said:



			What a perfect time to muck out the mess! Surely that could be left a couple of hours.
		
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Maybe she goes home at 5pm.....?


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## rebchico (13 February 2011)

is it normal for the foal to be having so much trouble standing?
is it just because its tired??


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## Maesfen (13 February 2011)

Lol, thanks for those, will watch again.

Please remind me never to send one there to foal.
From my perspective, no, mucking out is not the norm; I prefer to just get the afterbirth, when passed, put in some clean straw and muck out in the morning when the foal is more able and I'm not likely to disturb the mare either.  For me, they need peace and quiet, not all this plus of course, mare would be having a small bran mash too.


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## MM&PP (13 February 2011)

BSJAlove said:



			i think im going to sleep without opening my mouth again. ill come back and read all the crit comments in the morning. well done to april, foal and lady. i personally think you done a great job and its one heck of a lovely looking foal 

Click to expand...

Agree the mare potentially needed help. Absolutely disagree about the way in which the baby was yanked out against the contractions.

As above has posted, they are well-known in the US for yanking out every single foal that is born regardless of whether it is necessary. Youtube to see examples!

Lady is totally wrong in her conduct.


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## MrsMozart (13 February 2011)

I know I'm going on and asking lots of question. Sorry!

But, are his hindlegs showing much control/movement? The front end seems active enough, but not the back end.


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## el_Snowflakes (13 February 2011)

im surprised 
so many folk are unhappy by the way the lady has removed soiled bedding from the stable. If she had left it she would have been critisised for that too! also, moving the mare and foal to the other side of stable seemed to perk the foal up so that cant be bad


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## QUICKFIRE (13 February 2011)

OMG why don't she leave the poor little thing alone for its mum to look after,


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## Kokopelli (14 February 2011)

The cat is back! 
When is it normal to take the bandage off? Thats been on for more then 24 hours now.


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## MileAMinute (14 February 2011)

MrsMozart said:



			I know I'm going on and asking lots of question. Sorry!

But, are his hindlegs showing much control/movement? The front end seems active enough, but not the back end.
		
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I wondered that too MrsMozart! When he first came out his back legs looked oddly arranged on the floor.

Dunno, am a complete novice at this!


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## Bedlam (14 February 2011)

Actually, I wish the mare would kick her now........


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## rebchico (14 February 2011)

yay! standing


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## brighteyes (14 February 2011)

What the hell is that groom doing?


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## Elsbells (14 February 2011)

I thought the foals head was turned back and not presenting between the legs as it should, therefore it was a long and arduous labour for the mare who did need help. The helper appeared to unravel it although it was difficult to see at that camera angle.
We used to use ropes and broom handles to pull calves out on the farm!

Safe colt, safe mare. I say well done!


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## MileAMinute (14 February 2011)

For the experienced breeders on here, for my (and prob others on here!) satisfaction:

Would you be happy with how both the mare and colt are presenting? Behavioural, physical etc?


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## Spring Feather (14 February 2011)

Foals are often born with legs which don't cooperate .  They sometimes need help to get their balance initially.  You can leave them to it themselves but you risk them slamming into the stable walls.  Once the foal is wobbling on all 4s that's usually all you need to do (if you feel it necessary to help).

Yes I do muck out the afterbirth quite quickly after foaling as it is incredibly sticky and will dry onto the mare or foal if left.  

She didn't tie up the sac though and that is something she certainly should have done.  I don't think the mare stood on it but it's not good to leave them hanging on the ground like that as it can cause all sorts of problems internally for the mare if it snags.

No, this woman did a dreadful job of foaling this little mite but if that is what they are used to doing then they probably see nothing wrong with it.


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## Baggybreeches (14 February 2011)

The poor foal is exhausted from his slightly traumatic arrival, added to the fact his legs are so long, he has stood, but for now after a little feed I would let him rest.
Re: the mucking out, I can't help but think the woman was just being productive, it's neither here nor there (but  at the amount of straw she took out!)


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## Spring Feather (14 February 2011)

Cobrastyle said:



			For the experienced breeders on here, for my (and prob others on here!) satisfaction:

Would you be happy with how both the mare and colt are presenting? Behavioural, physical etc?
		
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Yes I would be happy with the way the mare and foal are presenting (considering the trauma both have just had) at the moment.  The foal can stand unaided which is what you want.  It hasn't fed yet and I would want that to be happening within the next hour.  I think both are incredibly tired so it's understandable that not everything has gone as clockwork as my foalings usually do.


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## MrsMozart (14 February 2011)

Thank you to all the experts for answering our questions . It is much appreciated


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## vikkiandmonica (14 February 2011)

Is there a reason why the mare is just standing there, digging?


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## Kokopelli (14 February 2011)

MrsMozart said:



			Thank you to all the experts for answering our questions . It is much appreciated  

Click to expand...

Was just about to say this! I have learnt a lot so thanks to all those experts. 

I'm so glad I don't need to get up early tomorrow so I can stay up watching them.


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## 3Beasties (14 February 2011)

vikkiandmonica said:



			Is there a reason why the mare is just standing there, digging?
		
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I think she is in the process of passing the after birth but could be wrong.


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## vikkiandmonica (14 February 2011)

3Beasties said:



			I think she is in the process of passing the after birth but could be wrong.
		
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Ah, ok, thanks


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## Spring Feather (14 February 2011)

3Beasties said:



			I think she is in the process of passing the after birth but could be wrong.
		
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You're right .  Mare still hasn't delivered the placenta yet but she looks like she will shortly.


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## 3Beasties (14 February 2011)

Nawwww the foal is just adorable!! I want him


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## MM&PP (14 February 2011)

Why is the foal 'chewing?'


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## MrsMozart (14 February 2011)

Lol. I think he's bypassed the whole milk drinking thing and gone straight to eating his bed


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## Groom42 (14 February 2011)

I wish she would just P off now, and leave them to it!  I'm sure the mare would get her foal up, and in the right place - nature has a funny way of sorting things out!

So, if this woman has/ever has a baby........
"Yep, can just see the head crowning - let's get those forceps on, and pull it out now.  Right, she's had the baby, let's get the midwife straight in, no nonsense, stick it on the boob, change the sheets, stick the boy/girl balloons up.  What? You want a quiet half hour or so with your baby? You're tired? You want to rest?  Bonding? Cuddles? Don't be ridiculous, that's MY job!"


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## 3Beasties (14 February 2011)

MrsMozart said:



			Lol. I think he's bypassed the whole milk drinking thing and gone straight to eating his bed 

Click to expand...

And the wall


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## Elsbells (14 February 2011)

MrsMozart said:



			Lol. I think he's bypassed the whole milk drinking thing and gone straight to eating his bed 

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Ha, ha, ha! Love it!


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## MrsMozart (14 February 2011)

Ah! You were there for the birth of D1!

Not quite that bad, but along those lines.

Ah well. She's turned out to be a cracker, so


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## MrsMozart (14 February 2011)

3Beasties said:



			And the wall   

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A quick learner! It's taken Dizzy six and a half years to realise that walls taste good!

Spot the hoss that has taken to knawing on her door frame. Ho hum.


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## MM&PP (14 February 2011)

MrsMozart said:



			A quick learner! It's taken Dizzy six and a half years to realise that walls taste good!

Spot the hoss that has taken to knawing on her door frame. Ho hum.
		
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Lol! Was he chewing the bed then? I wasn't sure! How long should it take for the afterbirth to be delivered?


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## HashRouge (14 February 2011)

I can't believe it, I must have missed the birth by about ten minutes! If only I hadn't chosen that exact moment to watch the finale of Friday Night Lights. Ah well, Texas Forever


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## Kokopelli (14 February 2011)

Right its final Andy is having a foal, a cute one like this colt. 

How, I do not know but it will happen!


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## Spring Feather (14 February 2011)

MM&PP said:



			Lol! Was he chewing the bed then? I wasn't sure! How long should it take for the afterbirth to be delivered?
		
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It can take a couple of hours for the placenta to be delivered.  My girls are usually quite quick with theirs and they're normally out within 10 or 20 minutes.


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## MrsMozart (14 February 2011)

What is the handler doing with the placenta/sac?

When do they take the bandage off?


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## Spring Feather (14 February 2011)

MrsMozart said:



			What is the handler doing with the placenta/sac?

When do they take the bandage off?
		
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She's tied the sac/umbilical cord up so that it isn't trailing on the ground.

I can't answer you on the tail bandage question sorry.  I never use tail bandages.  I plait my mares tails up and I usually unplait them the following day once all the yucky stuff is out and mare is all nice and clean again.  You don't want all that sticky stuff on the mares tail as it's a nightmare to get out.


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## MrsMozart (14 February 2011)

Ah. Yes, that makes sense . Still looks dangly to me . See, I know nothing about this!  

Will mean the bandage has been on a while in this instance (from what I've seen/read).

Right. That's it. I'm off to bed. I was trying to hold on until he'd had a drink, but my eyes are putting in serious complaints to the management, so I'm orff.

Sweet dreams y'all


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## Spring Feather (14 February 2011)

MrsMozart said:



			Ah. Yes, that makes sense . Still looks dangly to me . See, I know nothing about this!  

Click to expand...

LOL!  I didn't say she'd tied it up well .  To give her her due though, they're slippery suckers so sometimes difficult to tie.  I don't tie with string, I tie the cord/sac onto itself and that tends to hold better.  

Little foaly is doing grand now!  I like him .  Mumma just needs to deliver her placenta and by then I think the little one will be able to find the milk bar and all will be well with the world


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## chameleon (14 February 2011)

Well, first time seeing a foal being born and have to say I felt a bit sick at times!!! Looked very painful to me - now I know why I its called labour and that I'm 40 and dont have kids!!

Thanks for the explanations re the lump / bulge I saw at the beginning -I was expecting the waters to break before the sac comes out with the front feet but it seems from the replys that the sac can come out with fluid in it and then break...

Another silly question does milk bar = teat???


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## chameleon (14 February 2011)

Looks like someone just came into the stable and gave an injection to the mare in her neck - any ideas what that might have been??


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## gillianclaude (14 February 2011)

chameleon said:



			Looks like someone just came into the stable and gave an injection to the mare in her neck - any ideas what that might have been??
		
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Was just wondering this myself!


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## Laafet (14 February 2011)

It was probably Banamine, they seem to like using it a lot on that farm. I just got back in from foaling myself to see that the mare had foaled. Bet they are disappointed it is not a coloured given their breeding plans.


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## Fire_Fly (14 February 2011)

Could it be to help deliver the placenta along, I've not noticed her pass it yet, but then I haven't be watching constantly.


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## Fire_Fly (14 February 2011)

Laafet said:



			It was probably Banamine, they seem to like using it a lot on that farm. I just got back in from foaling myself to see that the mare had foaled. Bet they are disappointed it is not a coloured given their breeding plans.
		
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Ah yes, Banamine helps the milk come down as well if I recall correctly?


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## Fire_Fly (14 February 2011)

Colt has been named Nitecap, and mum is low on colostrum according to the woman on the cam.


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## Laafet (14 February 2011)

Hmm well ironically enough my mare decided to break waters just as this mare started to foal so missed it all, but did watch a few of her other foalings and I have to say I wouldn't want her foaling with me. For a start there is always two of us, just in case we get a problem, we don't hang about in the stable. My mare tonight broke waters and foal was out 10 minutes later, we only assisted to guide the foal's head out safely, she did the rest herself and she is an expensive TB. Once foal is out we left her to it for a while, once we had sprayed the navel and tied up that placenta. There is no need to towel down a foal. We do help ours stand but minimally. Having read some of the threads on other forums her method of foaling is reknowned as the Element Yank, mind you they said watching miniatures foaling was worse, which I can imagine.


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## penhwnllys_stardust (14 February 2011)

I'm not sure if this has been said already because i am on my phone and it takes too long for me to check the whole thread but on element arabians facebook page the owner says the foal was born upside down which is probably why the poor mare had a tough time, im glad it all worked out okay in the end.


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## Laafet (14 February 2011)

If that was the case then it was probably due to the early intervention and pulling of the foal. It is unlikely the foal came out upside down, and if it was then a vet should have been there.

Editted to add - just looked at the facebook page - foal was presented upside down not foaled upside down, she turned it manually, which is possible. So you do need to be careful on what you say


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## penhwnllys_stardust (14 February 2011)

Laafet said:



			Editted to add - just looked at the facebook page - foal was presented upside down not foaled upside down, she turned it manually, which is possible. So you do need to be careful on what you say 

Click to expand...

My apologies, like i said i am on my phone so i must of read it wrong, i must still be in shock over what i have been watching


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## Spring Feather (14 February 2011)

That's what she says on marestare but that isn't what I saw.  She didn't turn the foal manually, she just tried to yank it out from the word go.  That's not how you try to turn upside down foals.

Anyhow the foal does not appear well at all now.  The mare lashed out when they restrained her to get a rope around the foal.  The foal bolted with the rope around it and the mother became very upset when they tied her up.  They've just shut the camera down when things started getting out of hand and she's linked to another forum who were also watching.  There are speculations on there that the foal may be a dummy foal or have crushed ribs.  I hope neither of those are the case .


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## gillianclaude (14 February 2011)

Another mare foaling. 

http://www.marestare.com/fcam.php?alias=noblesfarm


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## Laafet (14 February 2011)

Spring Feather said:



			That's what she says on marestare but that isn't what I saw.  She didn't turn the foal manually, she just tried to yank it out from the word go.  That's not how you try to turn upside down foals.

Anyhow the foal does not appear well at all now.  The mare lashed out when they restrained her to get a rope around the foal.  The foal bolted with the rope around it and the mother became very upset when they tied her up.  They've just shut the camera down when things started getting out of hand and she's linked to another forum who were also watching.  There are speculations on there that the foal may be a dummy foal or have crushed ribs.  I hope neither of those are the case .
		
Click to expand...

Like I said I didn't see it - but certainly sounds likely, apparently there is a high rate of broken ribs etc at this place and TBH am not surprised. Just watched the other link from a different farm and it looked a far better operation, apart from the door opening into the box not outwards! They wore gloves too and are in no hurry to pull foal round.


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## muddygreymare (14 February 2011)

I missed it as fell asleep and barn alarm didnt go off  and when i woke up at 3am the cams had been shut off  Hope foaly is doing well though


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## GypsyGirl (14 February 2011)

Ahh noo!! I can't believe I missed it! Lol!


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## Gucci_b (14 February 2011)

seems the CCTV is off line because of comments made on another thread...
http://fhotd64476.yuku.com/topic/59092/Elements-April-going-NOW?page=1


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## Kokopelli (14 February 2011)

They called him Captain!

The other link someone gave to the grey mare foaling is gourgeous!!


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## Fire_Fly (14 February 2011)

I even found after the birth hard to watch, the mare was getting increasingly agitated everytime she came into the stable, she was pacing round her and tried a few times to get between the foal and her. When they tied the poor girl up was sad while mum was getting so stressed. 

Steph said on the Marestare forum that she had internet issues and the cam might end up going down during the night, the cynic in me wasn't quite sure about that being true.

Before the cam went at 3am the foal was down again and just not moving at all and still hadn't suckled.


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## Maesfen (14 February 2011)

Gucci_b said:



			seems the CCTV is off line because of comments made on another thread...
http://fhotd64476.yuku.com/topic/59092/Elements-April-going-NOW?page=1

Click to expand...

It makes interesting reading too!  Suffice to say I won't watch another foaling from Elements, they're a disaster area, their poor mares.


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## Kokopelli (14 February 2011)

Maesfen said:



			It makes interesting reading too!  Suffice to say I won't watch another foaling from Elements, they're a disaster area, their poor mares.
		
Click to expand...

I'm considering joining that forum! It seems you can talk about what you want without button pushers, although everyone does seem a bit scary on there


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## Sadiemay (14 February 2011)

How can I watch the cams on Mare Stare, when I click on the links I can see the video screen but nothing plays.  Just a header screen shows.

Do I need to install some S/W?

Many thanks
Sadiemay


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## BonneMaman (14 February 2011)

I have to say I watched the last foaling at elements and thought that the woman was way too in the mare's face.  She came in and mucked out and then proceeded to wash down all the walls.  The foal was still on the ground!

I have heard of imprinting but that is rediculous!


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## QUICKFIRE (14 February 2011)

Wonders if we will ever find out what happend to the poor foal last night? from what I can make out, that was posted on the other forum, the foal wasn't thriving, and hadn't had its first drink after 4 hrs, and the mare hadn't passed the afterbirth, camera's was shut down, because of what was being said on forum,


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## noodle_ (14 February 2011)

if you go on the fb page - she said they were waiting for the vet

i missed the cam (glad i did)..... sounds very distressing


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## FairyLights (14 February 2011)

Any news?


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## Vixen Van Debz (14 February 2011)

I stopped watching before the birth, having read a varity of the information online. I don't know how much is true about thefts and things, but when people on studs whom opinions I respect say she's not 'helping' with the foaling and is causing welfare problems, and that every video on youtube and other source confirms that's the norm for her with birthing mares, that was enough for me. However I'm looking forward to watching a live birth in full soon, so keep posting the links people!  Or is there a way of searching for high barn alerts on their website?


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## WoopsiiD (14 February 2011)

http://www.facebook.com/#!/pages/Elements-Arabians/222243998942

Amazingly it seems that 'Captain' and April will be just fine.

Can't believe the amount of idiots blowing sunshine up this womans arrse.


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## ruby1512 (14 February 2011)

Must admit I found it rather uncomfortable to watch.


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## rebchico (14 February 2011)

Won't be watching her farm again


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## Janah (14 February 2011)

I watched the whole thing.  Birth in a large animal is always 'brutal' .  I well remember owning an in calf jersey cow, having sucessfully dealt with numerous goat births, several of which they insisted on having  there babies on my lap. The minute I saw the sheer size of the calfs feet emerging I phoned the local farmer, in the middle of the night!!!  Bless him, he attended within 10 minutes.  All was well but I couldn't get to grips with the sheer enormity of it all.

I do realise that on a stud farm they are used to horses foaling.  I wasn't sure about the pulling as best left to nature, having said that we were'nt THERE and we can only do what we feel best at the time.

I do know that if it was my mare I would be there, unless she showed clearly she wanted to be on her own.  Three years ago I  helped my bitch whelp a litter of labradors puppies.  If for one moment I thought she wanted to be on her own I would have left her to it, albeit closely monitered.

Hope both are well.

Haven't read all of the posts.


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## brighteyes (14 February 2011)

Hilariously, the cam was apparently shut down due to 'asinine' comments on a (not HHO) forum!

ETA Their own forum at Elements is defending the foaling procedures and that thread is 123 pages long...


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## Always Blue (14 February 2011)

I feel quite sorry for the woman that runs elements. quite shocked actually to some's responses and abuse here and on other forums. she obviously had to intervene as was rather a large foal and quite a little mare..I too would have helped if the need had arisen. I am sure she doid what she felt was right for her mare and her foal.


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## lannerch (14 February 2011)

Except she always has to intervene!


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## Alexart (14 February 2011)

I watched it and was gob smacked - it made me so angry - it was a perfect example of what NOT to do - I am seriously worried that so many people CAN'T see what she has done wrong - doesn't bode well for horses - or any living domestic animal for that matter!!!!!  

Foaling a horse is VERY different from calving a cow or delivering puppies/kittens etc - the only similarity is they are all mammals and that's it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:O

This poor mare showed every sign that she was stressed out, this awful lady was far to rough and jumped in with no idea what she was doing at all and interfered to the point that I'm surprised the foal didn't die or that the mare rejected it - I was hoping the mare would go for her and teach her a lesson!!  
The mare had been in labour for 2 days and was never allowed some peace and quiet to get on with it, not constantly being pooper scooped/mucked out/turned out/poked/prodded and in a busy barn!!  Horses are lucky in that they can postpone foaling if they feel threatened, which this mare did, but can't do it indefinitely without risking loosing the foal - this womans horses all seem on edge and reluctant to foal - now I can see why!!! 

There is nothing wrong with monitoring a mare foaling - I've watched all of mine - BUT from a discreet distance, making no noise and only going into the stable/or if outside from a good 30ft away if the mare is one I know very well and monitor her reactions, to check the presentation when the mare is down/bag off nose/mouth clear and free from cleft palate at the same time and then leave well alone to watch and keep time - 9 out of 10 times the mares don't need help and stay down for upto half an hour just chilling with foals back legs still in the mare and umbilical cord attached absorbing all the placental blood and chatting to mum, then there is that small window when mare and foal bond which is VERY important to both and if screwed up will have lasting affects.  Not gung-ho like this idiot who was pulling all over the place and in all the wrong directions and against the mares contractions - how the mare is not torn I don't know!!!  And she was all over it to see what cool markings it had and wether it was a colt or filly with no regard for wether it was OK! - shocking!!!

She may have lots of mares foaling and have seen lots born but it is VERY obvious she has learnt NOTHING at all from those experiences!! - she can't even get the basics right - I wouldn't want her near any of my animals let a lone a horse!!!
It always amazes me when people use the excuse 'I've had horses for X number of years therefore I know everything and I've always got away with it before...' - they soon show themselves up and in this case all over the internet, but it's usually the animals that pay the price for incompetence!!!!  
She should be banned from owning anything with a pulse!!!


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## lannerch (14 February 2011)

I agree.

And I did not see this foaling, I saw her continuously pester, and the mare hold on however I did see a previous foaling and she was just the same.
I am no expert but I could see her continuous pulling must be wrong, she cared nothing for disintfectant. I too anyone who viewed could not see and yes it does not bode well for horse or any living domestic animal.

Experiance does not always equate with expertise this is a prime example.


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## Snoozinsusan (14 February 2011)

Webcam back on!

Vet been and Captain up on his feet, seems happy enough now.


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## QUICKFIRE (14 February 2011)

Was just going to post that the web cam was back on, mare and foal looking a lot happier now,even if foal is still a bit wobberly, hope this good news continues.


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## Perissa (14 February 2011)

OK so I've only been involved with about a dozen or so foalings/new born foals and none move like Captain does at 24 hrs old. What is going on?


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## QUICKFIRE (14 February 2011)

The vet just left, and Captain got a thorough going-over! His IgG was low, as we expected, so he got a bag of plasma into him. He also got some antibiotics and vitamins. Last, but not least, he got a tet. shot for the tight tendon in his back foot and the vet made him a little splint to wear

this was just posted on the facebook page!


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## Perissa (15 February 2011)

Thanks for that.

So that explains why he's walking in an odd way but my next question is why would he get a tet shot for a tight tendon?


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## bexandspooky (15 February 2011)

Its not a Tetnus shot Perissa, is is another drug that begins with Tet that helps loosen tendons - It's on the marestare message board. I thought the same!


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## minime (15 February 2011)

The web cam was taken off because too many people on hear criticize and are very rude!! This mare was scanned and it was found that the foal was not presented in a good position for  birth. This is the reason they were so keen to be there and HELP the mare and foal. Her vet is on line watching all births and she DOES know what she is doing. 
If you don't agree with her methods then don't Bloody watch.


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## mcnaughty (15 February 2011)

minime said:



			The web cam was taken off because too many people on hear criticize and are very rude!! This mare was scanned and it was found that the foal was not presented in a good position for  birth. This is the reason they were so keen to be there and HELP the mare and foal. Her vet is on line watching all births and she DOES know what she is doing. 
If you don't agree with her methods then don't Bloody watch.
		
Click to expand...

You are talking rot!  This woman is an absolute menace - I have seen two mares foal at her yard now and both were harassed so much the mares were stressed beyon belief.  I cannot believe you are sticking up for this idiot.  She has poked and prodded both mare and foal when they needed to be left alone I was surprised she wasn't attacked by the mare!  There is absolutely no reason for her to be mucking out and wiping down walls when the mare still has the afterbirth hanging from her behind!


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## lurcher98 (15 February 2011)

minime said:



			The web cam was taken off because too many people on hear criticize and are very rude!! This mare was scanned and it was found that the foal was not presented in a good position for  birth. This is the reason they were so keen to be there and HELP the mare and foal. Her vet is on line watching all births and she DOES know what she is doing. 
If you don't agree with her methods then don't Bloody watch.
		
Click to expand...

it had nothing to do with this forum anyway, it was the yuku/fhotd one that she objected too. i doubt steph even knows this one exists


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## BSJAlove (15 February 2011)

i dont see what the problem is. everyone is getting so wound up by this story. the foal is getting vetinary care. hes in the best hands. from my eyes, she was a little OCD on the mucking out but really. it wasnt like she was beating them up! the response has been mad. the replys are like shes gone in, kicked the foal and slapped the mare about. all she done was help the mare give birth, towel the foal and help it stand. i worked at a very well known stud and she did nothing different to how they did it. if it was a mare of mine, id be in the stable making sure everything is going okay! the same as if i gave birth my mum would be making sure me and the baby where okay. if something happened, you would kick yourself for not regualry checking. i really think its been blown out of proportion. there is no cruelty going on.


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## Always Blue (15 February 2011)

BSJAlove said:



			i dont see what the problem is. everyone is getting so wound up by this story. the foal is getting vetinary care. hes in the best hands. from my eyes, she was a little OCD on the mucking out but really. it wasnt like she was beating them up! the response has been mad. the replys are like shes gone in, kicked the foal and slapped the mare about. all she done was help the mare give birth, towel the foal and help it stand. i worked at a very well known stud and she did nothing different to how they did it. if it was a mare of mine, id be in the stable making sure everything is going okay! the same as if i gave birth my mum would be making sure me and the baby where okay. if something happened, you would kick yourself for not regualry checking. i really think its been blown out of proportion. there is no cruelty going on.
		
Click to expand...

agreed! why dont people get on their soapbox about real life cruelty and neglect!


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