# Very sad advert



## Magicmadge (12 June 2012)

Dont know how to post an advert link but go on dragon driving an type in tilly in search box. Wish my hubby would let me have more


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## Amymay (12 June 2012)

Ok, who do we know in Lancaster M6 Ju 33.

I'm happy to stump up the money - if someone can give her a forever home.


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## undertheweather (12 June 2012)

You're talking about the fresian filly?
It is normal to wean at 6 months. It is also normal for a foal to have some of what the mare is eating too.

Am I missing something???


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## Mongoose11 (12 June 2012)

amymay said:



			Ok, who do we know in Lancaster M6 Ju 33.

I'm happy to stump up the money - if someone can give her a forever home.
		
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AmyMay - I'll go halves with some set aside for feed..... but that's not the hard bit is it!


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## mightymammoth (12 June 2012)

Magicmadge said:



			Dont know how to post an advert link but go on dragon driving an type in tilly in search box. Wish my hubby would let me have more
		
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I don't want to look at the advert  can someone summarise please?


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## Natz88 (12 June 2012)

Poor girl, I hope she finds a home asap.

Here is the link to advert
http://www.dragondriving.co.uk/horseforsale-36065.html


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## Goldenstar (12 June 2012)

She's sweet she will make a good driving pony in the future hope someone nice gets her.


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## The Fuzzy Furry (12 June 2012)

'Bob' has a lot of adverts on there, many are also known under 'Dave' too, both operating from the same place & same phone number..........
'Richard' also shares the same phone number........


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## meesha (12 June 2012)

Poor thing, wish I hadnt looked as I just want to go and collect her (you would prob have to restrain me from telling owner what i thought though - after poor girl safely in trailer!).  I am too far away to be of much help but would be happy to make a small donation if needed !.  Out of interest do you think there is any reason that filly will have problems long term ?


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## YasandCrystal (12 June 2012)

undertheweather said:



			You're talking about the fresian filly?
It is normal to wean at 6 months. It is also normal for a foal to have some of what the mare is eating too.

Am I missing something???
		
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just look at the photo


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## gracey (12 June 2012)

I so wish i could take on a horse right now, she is going to be stunning in the right hands, i love her eye! 

amy that is so kind of you.. i hope someone on here gets her x


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## mjcssjw2 (12 June 2012)

oh dear, in summary a rather straggly looking thing don't look if you want to keep your money! worryingly I am not that far away !!


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## spottyfilly (12 June 2012)

I think I know where she comes from, they advertise very readily! Im about 20 mins away from there, argh!


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## Goldenstar (12 June 2012)

It's not really sad she has a good chance of being bought by someone who drives as a store for the future .


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## SeasonalSituation (12 June 2012)

If I had the money to keep one I would, with the right person she'll make a stunner  

Things crossed she finds someone.


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## Oddjob's Wife (12 June 2012)

Trouble is if someone did go to pick her up, how many more looking like her would there be?  Poor girl.  As with all other comments, hope she finds a good home


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## Paint Me Proud (12 June 2012)

Oddjob's Wife said:



			Trouble is if someone did go to pick her up, how many more looking like her would there be?
		
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I always think that is a strange thing to say with regards to animals. It makes sense for inanimate objects, ie 'if you keep buying rubbish they will keep making rubbish' but for animals if you dont buy a suffering animal just because they might have another suffering animal doesnt stop the poor thing you wont buy from having to live in a state.

I'm not having a go or anything, just feel sad for her and not buying her just to spite the dealer seems more likely to spite the poor little filly.

I would buy her if i could.


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## Crazydancer (12 June 2012)

*sits on hands*
I just don't have the time for another one, my hands are full already, but wish I did. 
Think she'll be lovely with the right home, hope she finds it.


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## sbennison (12 June 2012)

Poor Girl, Just to help i dont have the funds to buy her but i have land & stables and if someone was to buy her she could come straight to me to a loving home. Pm me if help needed xx


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## Magicmadge (12 June 2012)

Please keep me updated if someone on here gets her. PM me if you prefer. Oh i do hope so!!!!!


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## Oddjob's Wife (12 June 2012)

"I always think that is a strange thing to say with regards to animals. It makes sense for inanimate objects, ie 'if you keep buying rubbish they will keep making rubbish' but for animals if you dont buy a suffering animal just because they might have another suffering animal doesnt stop the poor thing you wont buy from having to live in a state."

This isn't quite what I meant, PMP  .  I agree with you totally and I guess I was just thinking that if it was me who was able to go and pick her up, I would get myself into a heap of problems in that how would I leave the others behind.......


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## HappyHorses:) (12 June 2012)

Be better off reporting the state of the filly to whw.
The trouble is these two a penny breeders know that some sucker (the likes of you and I) will feel sorry and buy them. Sorry to sound harsh


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## Mongoose11 (12 June 2012)

Oddjob's Wife said:



			Trouble is if someone did go to pick her up, how many more looking like her would there be?  Poor girl.  As with all other comments, hope she finds a good home
		
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Look up the story of the star fish for some inspiration - it helps when you feel like you can't make a difference. I know what you mean though, we would turn up and hate to leave the others, but if people let that stop them none of them would get 'rescued' 

http://www.ordinarypeoplechangetheworld.com/articles/the-starfish-story.aspx


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## Rosehip (12 June 2012)

undertheweather said:



			You're talking about the fresian filly?
It is normal to wean at 6 months. It is also normal for a foal to have some of what the mare is eating too.

Am I missing something???
		
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You are Im afraid!!
If you look at the advert properly you will see that she is now 6months, and has been weaned for 4 weeks...therefore weaned at 5months. If she has had any corn (and Id hazard an educated guess the same applies for her mother who is no doubt in foal again) then Im a size 6 and ride like Carl Hester!

That filly will barely have seen hay never mind corn, and is likely to have a hellish worm burden. Its disgraceful that people are churning out ponies like this, and - dare I say it - possibly keeping them 'lean' to tug on the heartstrings of those who actually do give a damn about their animals.


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## pookie (12 June 2012)

I dread to look but as others have suggested can we not chip in together? Someones offered space, someone must be able to collect and I'd happily donate some money. How much are they asking?

Then we report to whw


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## Paint Me Proud (12 June 2012)

Oddjob's Wife said:



			This isn't quite what I meant, PMP  .  I agree with you totally and I guess I was just thinking that if it was me who was able to go and pick her up, I would get myself into a heap of problems in that how would I leave the others behind.......
		
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Oh my mistake, sorry. I wasnt having a go at you, just offering my musing on the subject of what I thought you meant - the real meaning i agree with, i too would come home with a trailer full!!


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## Fools Motto (12 June 2012)

The thing that strikes me more, is that filly doesn't look 6 months. She looks like a very poor yearling. I can't put my finger on it, but she doesn't look 'foaly' at all!!
Just hope that someone nice and kind can care for this poor soul.


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## BlairandAzria (12 June 2012)

Rosehip totally agree with you. Oh if only I had land  she's not that far from me either


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## Mongoose11 (12 June 2012)

sbennison said:



			Poor Girl, Just to help i dont have the funds to buy her but i have land & stables and if someone was to buy her she could come straight to me to a loving home. Pm me if help needed xx
		
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I would be willing to put money in the pot if you are serious! AmyMay what do you say?


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## Magicmadge (12 June 2012)

Fools Motto said:



			The thing that strikes me more, is that filly doesn't look 6 months. She looks like a very poor yearling. I can't put my finger on it, but she doesn't look 'foaly' at all!!
Just hope that someone nice and kind can care for this poor soul.
		
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I thought the same too, her tail looks too long!


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## SarahAndScout (12 June 2012)

Looks like a very poor yearling to me too, she's a few hours drive from me but I have far too much grass which would soon turn her around, that and a good worming programme! Offers there if anyone needs somewhere for her to go.


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## YasandCrystal (12 June 2012)

If 20 of us pledge £20 each then I am sure she could be bought for £400. Count me in too for a donation.


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## pookie (12 June 2012)

Let's do this! Let's organise her being bought and get her out of there. Enough of us can donate, a couple of offers for homes...who has transport?!


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## BlairandAzria (12 June 2012)

I'm sure you could get her for less than 400 too. 

I have transport but I'm Cheshire, depending on where she's going I am willing to help out.


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## Ladybird (12 June 2012)

Wish I could...


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## SarahAndScout (12 June 2012)

I've no transport at present, just oodles of grass and three ponies on restricted grazing...


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## undertheweather (12 June 2012)

Rosehip said:



			You are Im afraid!!
If you look at the advert properly you will see that she is now 6months, and has been weaned for 4 weeks...therefore weaned at 5months. If she has had any corn (and Id hazard an educated guess the same applies for her mother who is no doubt in foal again) then Im a size 6 and ride like Carl Hester!

That filly will barely have seen hay never mind corn, and is likely to have a hellish worm burden. Its disgraceful that people are churning out ponies like this, and - dare I say it - possibly keeping them 'lean' to tug on the heartstrings of those who actually do give a damn about their animals.
		
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This filly is now 6 months and 10 days old, apparently. Which would make her weaned at 5.5 months. However, the amount of mane and tail she has, I would say she could be older. If she was born in January though she won't have had the best possible start, and for a January foal I would actually say she is looking okay. 

For crying out loud though, you do not feed up a weanling/yearling. Their tiny joints are developing. Far rather a filly in this condition than overweight.

This is my opinion. She is growing out of her winter coat a bit late. But remember she is wels.... Actually if she was born in Jan I don't know why she would have a winter coat like that. I think she is older than they say.

Yes she looks poor but I have seen far worse.


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## Archangel (12 June 2012)

I should think £200 cash should cover it in this market.

The gelderlander cross from the same number looks rather smashing.


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## Amymay (12 June 2012)

and for a January foal I would actually say she is looking okay.
		
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Really??

She doesn't look good for any month born.

It's also not a competition on how much worse we may or may not have seen.....


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## Rosehip (12 June 2012)

undertheweather said:



			This filly is now 6 months and 10 days old, apparently. Which would make her weaned at 5.5 months. However, the amount of mane and tail she has, I would say she could be older. If she was born in January though she won't have had the best possible start, and for a January foal I would actually say she is looking okay. 

For crying out loud though, you do not feed up a weanling/yearling. Their tiny joints are developing. Far rather a filly in this condition than overweight.

This is my opinion. She is growing out of her winter coat a bit late. But remember she is wels.... Actually if she was born in Jan I don't know why she would have a winter coat like that. I think she is older than they say.

Yes she looks poor but I have seen far worse.
		
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I too have seen worse, Ive also seen a well nurished 6 month old - and for that matter a well nurished 1year old. Just because you have seen worse doesnt make it accaptable. 
Oh, and she isnt welsh, she's friesian cross. 

I agree, she does have the 'yearling' look to her, but that could be the lack of correct nutrition. I also think the coat coming off her is actually her foal coat rather than winter coat in the truest sense.


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## happyhacking:) (12 June 2012)

I would be surprised if she isn't significantly older than 6 months she certainly looks more like a yearling or poss older still. My 11 month old hasn't got a tail anywhere near that long


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## Troyseph (12 June 2012)

Oh poor baby. I will help with money if needed. If we can get her for200 that's only £10 each between 20?! X


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## Oddjob's Wife (12 June 2012)

I can't help with transport, but will donate - if we go with £20 each, will gladly do my part for her.  Just wish I could do the whole thing...


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## HappyHorses:) (12 June 2012)

What are the other sellers ponies like?
If they are all poor please get the whw before rescuing. 
The seller doesn't deserve a penny.


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

amymay said:



			Ok, who do we know in Lancaster M6 Ju 33.

I'm happy to stump up the money - if someone can give her a forever home.
		
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i live in lancaster! let me have alook at this...


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## Ladydragon (12 June 2012)

Oh bless her... 



Magicmadge said:



			I thought the same too, her tail looks too long!
		
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I was thinking that...  My 13mth Sec D has got a tail of a similar length proportionately - but that's the only thing they have in common...

A hell of a distance from me though and no transport...  And skint...  Not particularly helpful when you see a needy little one like this...


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## SuperCoblet (12 June 2012)

Ladydragon said:



			Oh bless her... 



I was thinking that...  My 13mth Sec D has got a tail of a similar length proportionately - but that's the only thing they have in common...

A hell of a distance from me though and no transport...  And skint...  Not particularly helpful when you see a needy little one like this...  

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She could well be older than 12 months, if shes in poor condition she should be taller and her tail longer!


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

Oh my god. Can we save her? she will be stunning and be so happy in the right hands  i cant help im afraid because im not experienced enough but i live in lancaster if it helps...


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## SuperCoblet (12 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			Oh my god. Can we save her? she will be stunning and be so happy in the right hands  i cant help im afraid because im not experienced enough but i live in lancaster if it helps...
		
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Do you have transport?


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## redriverrock (12 June 2012)

Oh b*****,was just having a innocent scan thru the forums while I had a late lunch and this is what you lot do to me! Will be fretting till this poor soul is sorted...I am more than happy to donate £20. We cant rescue them all but that dosent mean we shouldnt try! How do I donate?


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

No but a friend of mine has and she will transport! Where is she going then?!


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## Ladydragon (12 June 2012)

Different seller name but same location/telephone number...  Looks a bit 'rounder' than the little filly... 

Gelderlander x Friesan


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## RuthM (12 June 2012)

Surely if you hand over cash you just incentivise the same thing happening again and again, like buying from puppy farms. 

I get the heart strings - damn she is cute! But ultimately any money going her owners way will only fund more of the same. 

Better to club together and buy the healthiest best kept youngster you can find and incentivise that instead. Or donate to a charity with big bangs for bucks re bettering equine lives.

It is buying from a puppy farm horse style.


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## SuperCoblet (12 June 2012)

RuthM said:



			Surely if you hand over cash you just incentivise the same thing happening again and again, like buying from puppy farms. 

I get the heart strings - damn she is cute! But ultimately any money going her owners way will only fund more of the same. 

Better to club together and buy the healthiest best kept youngster you can find and incentivise that instead. Or donate to a charity with big bangs for bucks re bettering equine lives.

It is buying from a puppy farm horse style.
		
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Yes, but thats not helping the suffering animal in question is it?


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## redriverrock (12 June 2012)

RuthM said:



			Surely if you hand over cash you just incentivise the same thing happening again and again, like buying from puppy farms. 

I get the heart strings - damn she is cute! But ultimately any money going her owners way will only fund more of the same. 

Better to club together and buy the healthiest best kept youngster you can find and incentivise that instead. Or donate to a charity with big bangs for bucks re bettering equine lives.

It is buying from a puppy farm horse style.
		
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I do agree but there is no reason why they cant be reported as well?


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## SarahAndScout (12 June 2012)

Yes she is poor and there are probably poorer ones out there but that is no excuse! A part bred native (and also crossed with a 'good doing' breed) should not look like that at any time of the year! She is no doubt full of worms and needing a gentle worming programme to eradicate them too!


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## chestnut cob (12 June 2012)

RuthM said:



			Surely if you hand over cash you just incentivise the same thing happening again and again, like buying from puppy farms. 

I get the heart strings - damn she is cute! But ultimately any money going her owners way will only fund more of the same. 

Better to club together and buy the healthiest best kept youngster you can find and incentivise that instead. Or donate to a charity with big bangs for bucks re bettering equine lives.

It is buying from a puppy farm horse style.
		
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^^ This ^^

If the horse is in a bad state or neglected then best to call the BHS Welfare line or WHW.  Buying a horse like this is, IMHO, no different to buying French "rescues" that come from the meat markets.  All it does is create a market and encourage the sellers to keep doing it.  Call the BHS or WHW and then put all the money you're trying to raise together, donate it to whichever organisation you call.


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

i just want her!! i know it would be expensive and alot of time and patience but im on a yard with very experienced people and i actually live where she is, do i arrange a viewing or not?... poor thing


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## RuthM (12 June 2012)

In response to Santa:
But if you remove suffering in a way that only replaces it, even encourages it then it can't be for the horse's good. What about the next one? The one that is bred because there's a market for sorry looking cuties? 

Years ago it was known that starved horses at auctions could attract more sympathy bids than ones that looked healthy - especially if both were fluffy natives. 

It is the same as supporting through custom a puppy farm, they're miserable too.


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## YasandCrystal (12 June 2012)

happyhacking:) said:



			I would be surprised if she isn't significantly older than 6 months she certainly looks more like a yearling or poss older still. My 11 month old hasn't got a tail anywhere near that long
		
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My 2 year old has a tail that touches the ground - I have never seen as long and thick a tail on a youngster. You cannot judge on tail length


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## Ladydragon (12 June 2012)

RuthM said:



			Surely if you hand over cash you just incentivise the same thing happening again and again, like buying from puppy farms.
		
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I agree...  But someone can make a hugely positive difference in her little life...  I guess it might lend some credence to idiotic breeders but stepping in would make a difference for her...  I suppose it depends if you look at welfare from the perspective of the betterment of the species or the individual - or like me, aim for the former but get distracted and need to do something for the latter when they pop up and tug on the heart strings...


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## Amymay (12 June 2012)

or like me, aim for the former but get distracted and need to do something for the latter when they pop up and tug on the heart strings
		
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Basically.


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## Shysmum (12 June 2012)

YES YES YES.

But bare in mind that if you are close by, it may not be such a good idea then reporting ? 

i will chip in too, just let me know where to send the cheque. 

As I was an Inspector, i know you can't save everything, but this little soul could be a mascot for the rest that hopefully do get checked over. There is just something about her. And yes she is older than they say, they are just trying to cover her poor condition. x

Please please let's all do it - we could all adopt her then *grin*


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## Magicmadge (12 June 2012)

When i saw this and posted about her i cried as she reminded me of the yearling filly i rescued exactly one year ago today (it was actually her birthday on the day i found her) Photos can be deceptive but my little girl weighing in at only 40kgs was actually a  whole lot worse in the flesh than in pictures. I expect this little baby will be the same. Come on guys,can we do this? i will of course donate but am too far away to help in any other way.


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## Rowreach (12 June 2012)

I agree with RuthM.

The Bob/Dave/Richards of this world depend on people who want to "rescue" horses like this.  Report him, and end the suffering of more than just Tilly.


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## RuthM (12 June 2012)

Ladydragon said:



			I agree...  But someone can make a hugely positive difference in her little life...  I guess it might lend some credence to idiotic breeders but stepping in would make a difference for her...  I suppose it depends if you look at welfare from the perspective of the betterment of the species or the individual - or like me, aim for the former but get distracted and need to do something for the latter when they pop up and tug on the heart strings... 

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I look at welfare being to reduce suffering and pain, whether I see the animal or not, know the animal or not, whether heart strings are tugged or not. No matter how adorable (and she is) her suffering is no more (or less) important than the horse the buyer funds to exist even if as they're not seen they are easier to ignore. 

Buying like this is supporting this. Buying is always supporting.


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## meesha (12 June 2012)

Def arrange a viewing but make sure you pay (if at all possible) a pittance for her then we may be keeping everyone happy.  Take cash and actually show him it when offering, I am sure he wont be able to resist crisp notes and dont let him see you really want her.  Good luck


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## RuthM (12 June 2012)

meesha said:



			Def arrange a viewing but make sure you pay (if at all possible) a pittance for her then we may be keeping everyone happy.  Take cash and actually show him it when offering, I am sure he wont be able to resist crisp notes and dont let him see you really want her.  Good luck
		
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'Course you may find dealer knows the score, just says no, you or someone else willing to support his horsemanship in order to rescue will come along. It's not like the advert even tries to hide the condition, think about it, it's not a head shot, not even a shot with the photographer crackling a crisp packet, and as others said he's no stranger to selling...


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

F it! im going to arrange a viewing! ringing him right now! we can all adopt her then!


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## Wagtail (12 June 2012)

Fools Motto said:



			The thing that strikes me more, is that filly doesn't look 6 months. She looks like a very poor yearling. I can't put my finger on it, but she doesn't look 'foaly' at all!!
Just hope that someone nice and kind can care for this poor soul.
		
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My thoughts exactly. Just looking at her tail, and the size of her head, she looks way older than 6 months.


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## Amymay (12 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			F it! im going to arrange a viewing! ringing him right now! we can all adopt her then!
		
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Where will you keep her?  Can you afford the livery of an extra horse?


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## ABC (12 June 2012)

If I can be of any help in anyway please will someone PM me. I don't have transport, but have a place for her (or any other pony/horse) to stay and I'm in Lancashire.
I'll also help with a donation. 

I do think the owners should be reported though, else nothing will be done and they'll make some cash at the expense of the horses


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

amymay said:



			Where will you keep her?  Can you afford the livery of an extra horse?
		
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At my livery with my other two, yeah my yard owner is the most nicest person and my bills are very cheap! She also has a friesian who she rescued who looked like this, so once i show her the pictures her heart will melt!


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## thatsmygirl (12 June 2012)

If all falls through pm me, I will buy her but would need her transported to me in Devon if somebody is willing


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## lea840 (12 June 2012)

She is so sweet and only a couple of junctions up from me... I'm really having to stop myself from grabbing the keys and fetching her back...


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

lea840 said:



			She is so sweet and only a couple of junctions up from me... I'm really having to stop myself from grabbing the keys and fetching her back... 

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Where abouts do you live?


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## smellsofhorse (12 June 2012)

I haven't look at advert but will help if I can.
I am willing to contribute to buy her of help with transport if she moves down this way.

The seller(s) should still be reported if they are doing this a lot, get help for the other poor horses.

Also we should use this as an example, set up her own website/ facebook page etc.
Get magazines involved so her from day one and how she progresses.

Get the message across of the situation in the horses workd and the over breeding of horses.


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## Moomin1 (12 June 2012)

...And so everyone plays right into their hands and fuels this type of situation.

Report it and deal with the situation in the bigger picture.


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## Shysmum (12 June 2012)

^^^ THIS

Make her famous, and just show what us HHO's can do 

Better be quick, especially with talk of reporting going on, or he'll get wind and the lot will be "gone".


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

Totally agree! my boyfriend is ringing up to arrange a viewing either tonight or tomorrow (if they can) i want to get her out of there asap, get her looking proper! makes me sick how anybody can do this though! they must think we are thick!


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

Also she is literally around the corner from me!!! i need advice on how to do this.. if i buy her, do i report him afterwards? do i take pictures of her for evidence?


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## Quantock-cob (12 June 2012)

This all concerns me. It's great that so many of you want to rescue Tilly and have her as a HHO mascot, but what about the future. Who will be responsible for vet bills, worming, backing her, tack and when she turns into an adult horse that looks stunning, which one of you will then claim ownership. I think you all need to take a step back and look at the possible legal implications of shared horse ownership - perhaps decide on a contract first before rushing into something which could all go horribly wrong. What if most of you pull out over the next few weeks, claiming lack of funds because your current horses need the money - who will be the one person ultimately responsible for the care of Tilly?

As someone suggested earlier, buying from this sort of dealer is akin to buying a dog from a puppy farm. Would it not be better to send your donations to a local horse charity, who may then be able to go and rescue these foals and give them a more secure future? And then report the dealer/s to the RSPCA so they can be investigated and prosecuted, if they are indeed breaking any laws.


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## Moomin1 (12 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			Also she is literally around the corner from me!!! i need advice on how to do this.. if i buy her, do i report him afterwards? do i take pictures of her for evidence?
		
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The best thing to do is to report her first - don't get involved and let the authorities see her in situ in her current environment.

She doesn't look in bad enough condition for anything drastic to happen to her so there is no dire emergency to get her out of there right this instance.  

Things start getting complicated when money gets handed over.


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## Amymay (12 June 2012)

LIZ66 said:



			This all concerns me. It's great that so many of you want to rescue Tilly and have her as a HHO mascot, but what about the future. Who will be responsible for vet bills, worming, backing her, tack and when she turns into an adult horse that looks stunning, which one of you will then claim ownership. I think you all need to take a step back and look at the possible legal implications of shared horse ownership - perhaps decide on a contract first before rushing into something which could all go horribly wrong. What if most of you pull out over the next few weeks, claiming lack of funds because your current horses need the money - who will be the one person ultimately responsible for the care of Tilly?
		
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However the purchase is funded, I suggest that the keeper will be responsible for all costs thereafter.  And if a sale is made thereafter, I would also suggest that it will be the keepers right to do this in the future.  However, some assurance that there was every intention to keep the horse long term should be sought...

Keeping on livery will be an issue because of costs - and someone who has their own land is a much better option as the keeper, and would be my preference.


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## Moomin1 (12 June 2012)

LIZ66 said:



			This all concerns me. It's great that so many of you want to rescue Tilly and have her as a HHO mascot, but what about the future. Who will be responsible for vet bills, worming, backing her, tack and when she turns into an adult horse that looks stunning, which one of you will then claim ownership. I think you all need to take a step back and look at the possible legal implications of shared horse ownership - perhaps decide on a contract first before rushing into something which could all go horribly wrong. What if most of you pull out over the next few weeks, claiming lack of funds because your current horses need the money - who will be the one person ultimately responsible for the care of Tilly?

As someone suggested earlier, buying from this sort of dealer is akin to buying a dog from a puppy farm. Would it not be better to send your donations to a local horse charity, who may then be able to go and rescue these foals and give them a more secure future? And then report the dealer/s to the RSPCA so they can be investigated and prosecuted, if they are indeed breaking any laws.
		
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Agree with this, although would stress that the horses SHOULDN'T be removed from the owner before they are reported - the RSPCA/WHW/BHS should see them IN SITU and in the environment they are currently kept in.


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

i know but we are all sat here talking about it when we could be giving her a home? i know for a fact i can afford it and there is lots of experienced people at my yard who eventually will back her etc. I just have the time do this and when she is an adult it will be nice to look back on it to see how she has turned out! ive arranged a viewing.. half 7 tonight :|


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## meesha (12 June 2012)

horrible situation, but tbh though once she has gone I would suspect that there is nothing the welfare organisations can do except maybe keep an eye on him in future if they have resources


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## The Fuzzy Furry (12 June 2012)

Moomin1 said:



			...And so everyone plays right into their hands and fuels this type of situation.

Report it and deal with the situation in the bigger picture.
		
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Exactly. Well put.

Please people, these fella's have been selling badly put together ponies for quite a long time. They are (almost) all in a score of 2 - 3 physically and most have confirmation defects due to poor breeding, in-breeding, young breeding - you name it.

Removing 1 pony yearling from a bunch of them is not going to help. It might make you feel better to think you have helped 'rescue' a pony, but you MUST look at the bigger picture. 

Maybe you can get a bit more rational about this - there are literally hundreds of cross-bred poorly put together ponies being sold. 

This one is over meat ££'s value at least!


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## nikCscott (12 June 2012)

Fools Motto said:



			The thing that strikes me more, is that filly doesn't look 6 months. She looks like a very poor yearling. I can't put my finger on it, but she doesn't look 'foaly' at all!!
Just hope that someone nice and kind can care for this poor soul.
		
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I thought this too she doesn't look foallike in the face or coat- its odd!


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## Moomin1 (12 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			i know but we are all sat here talking about it when we could be giving her a home? i know for a fact i can afford it and there is lots of experienced people at my yard who eventually will back her etc. I just have the time do this and when she is an adult it will be nice to look back on it to see how she has turned out! ive arranged a viewing.. half 7 tonight :|
		
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Yes but by doing so you are fuelling and funding the demise of many other horses potentially.  It's all very well  having a knee jerk reaction but the only way things will improve for any horses going through these people's care is to deal with it properly and via the authorities.  That money you hand over will go straight into buying/breeding another one who will end up the same.  

Of course it's entirely up to you if that's what you want to do - but I would never hand money over to fund that.  The authorities are the people to deal with this.  Give them a donation and help horses on a larger scale.


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

so im guessing its a bad idea?


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## ABC (12 June 2012)

Natalieshort - did you get my PM? I sent it, but it's not showing up in my outbox.


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## Amymay (12 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			so im guessing its a bad idea?
		
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People will always have varying opinions on this sort of thing.

However if you have the funds to be able to afford the purchase, long term care and keep of this horse - then the decision is yours to make alone.


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

ABC said:



			Natalieshort - did you get my PM? I sent it, but it's not showing up in my outbox. 

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Its not saying i have one! x


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

Ok well this is weird too right?

I rang, not my boyfriend and i said "Hi im just enquiring about your yearling?" and he went "Which one?" anyway i told him blah blah, then he is meeting us in a pub car park? is that weird or....


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## Moomin1 (12 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			Ok well this is weird too right?

I rang, not my boyfriend and i said "Hi im just enquiring about your yearling?" and he went "Which one?" anyway i told him blah blah, then he is meeting us in a pub car park? is that weird or....
		
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Be VERY careful.


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## Ladydragon (12 June 2012)

RuthM said:



			I look at welfare being to reduce suffering and pain, whether I see the animal or not, know the animal or not, whether heart strings are tugged or not. No matter how adorable (and she is) her suffering is no more (or less) important than the horse the buyer funds to exist even if as they're not seen they are easier to ignore. 

Buying like this is supporting this. Buying is always supporting.
		
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I don't think anyone with a genuine interest in welfare actually needs to see every animal/human/budgerigar that their donations might support or baulk if it goes on other costs - or disagree that complaints about this filly should be forwarded to WHW, BHS etc...  There's nothing written in stone to say that no purchase for this filly will stop the breeder in his/her tracks or garner positive changes for horses as a whole...  She'd probably end up rotting in a field, dumped or flogged for meat - with the eternal hope that the next one will flip some profit...  There's a chance nothing short of being shut down or run over by the #26 bus will stop the foals from coming...

Stupid individuals will continue to churn out babies of one sort or another that might inspire individual intervention despite national organisations working hard to bring overall changes...  If someone wants to step in and help one, that's as genuine to me as someone else aiming to help hundreds...


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## Amymay (12 June 2012)

Do not go on your own Natalie.  Take your bf with you.


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## ABC (12 June 2012)

I've resent 

It could be possible that he doesn't want you to see other horses? And/or he doesn't want you to know where he lives?


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

Yeah my boyfriend is definately coming with me, i find this very odd! Ok il check my inbox now!


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## HappyHorses:) (12 June 2012)

Moomin1 said:



			Agree with this, although would stress that the horses SHOULDN'T be removed from the owner before they are reported - the RSPCA/WHW/BHS should see them IN SITU and in the environment they are currently kept in.
		
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I said this pages back  They won't care once the horse has been removed and is in a nice safe home.
I'll repeat what others have said and that is don't give this guy any money.


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

ABC said:



			I've resent 

It could be possible that he doesn't want you to see other horses? And/or he doesn't want you to know where he lives?
		
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i havent got it STILL! lol!


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## Hollycatt (12 June 2012)

She is not in very bad condition.  A wormy poor yearling by the looks of her but 'foal' gets the sympathy vote. With a bit of luck the pic is a little old and taken  just after winter and she probably looks a lot better now with a bit of grass in her and no winter coat. 

I have no doubt this guy is very well know to WHW and RSPCA and nothing will be done except a chat. 

Having been part of a rescue pool before when we could not get RSPCA, WFW etc to help a youngster at Appleyby (and this was CS 1 and would have been dead ina  few weeks) I would say beware of the following.  keep her well isolated and get the vet to check her. The one we bought had strangles and cost a LOT more than the purchase price in vets fees for him and the ones he infected. And yes agree who owns her and who is liable for costs going forward and get insurance. one bad colic and 'owners' argueing over what to do and no insurance - £5000 bill   A lot to split between you all!

Good luck with her   She has fallen on her feet by the sounds of it


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## Kadastorm (12 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			Ok well this is weird too right?

I rang, not my boyfriend and i said "Hi im just enquiring about your yearling?" and he went "Which one?" anyway i told him blah blah, then he is meeting us in a pub car park? is that weird or....
		
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yes, that is weird and i would be staying away. 

its best to report the filly rather than buying. 
as others have said, its not looking at the bigger picture. 

my advice - dont buy pony, report to BHS, WHW or something and keep pestering them.


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## Magicmadge (12 June 2012)

I agree with amy may about one person offering a long term home, finally having overall ownership even if she is bought initially by a group of us. In my experience with welfare agencies (and they do the best they can i'm sure) unless the conditions are dreadful / animals are at deaths door the owners are at best given warnings 1 or 2 revisits and then forgotten about so the situation continues. I expect this little girl will be bought (if not by a forum user or users) by those that  break them at 1 and are driven hard in to the ground by 2 or covered by a big cob to foal at 2. I agree with many comments above how many more have been born at this dealers this year and will be the same this time next year but Tilly is there now and could do with a break in her short life.


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## Ibblebibble (12 June 2012)

Moomin1 said:



			...And so everyone plays right into their hands and fuels this type of situation.

Report it and deal with the situation in the bigger picture.
		
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so very right, these type of breeders are old hands at putting up pics of sorry looking babies , they are laughing at the well meaning 'rescuers' who are continually buying these foals and funding the whole sorry affair. How many Tillys can you afford to buy? because it won't stop with this one, you buy her and tomorrow there will be another in her place looking just as sad and needy 
If you want to do something positive for all the Tillys of this world then report the breeder and his alias' to BHS and WHW, try trading standards too as it's obviously a business.


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## ILuvCowparsely (12 June 2012)

i will put some money in the pot


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## Clava (12 June 2012)

She looks like a wormy poor yearling to me that would probably be bought by someone who could see her potential. I find this thread rather odd as the Newforest sales are full of far worse ponies, for sale for less who are almost certainly headed for the meat market...so why is this one so special?


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## MotherOfChickens (12 June 2012)

so you buy it, who pays for it long term? vets fees, trimming, hay, insurance? even horses at home aren't free to keep (if they are then I'm doing it wrong!)
if you can afford to do the right thing by her, whatever that may be, then go for it but whoever 'buys' her, please don't rely on long term finanacial help from strangers on a forum. madness.


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

peteralfred said:



			so you buy it, who pays for it long term? vets fees, trimming, hay, insurance? even horses at home aren't free to keep (if they are then I'm doing it wrong!)
if you can afford to do the right thing by her, whatever that may be, then go for it but whoever 'buys' her, please don't rely on long term finanacial help from strangers on a forum. madness.
		
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erm excuse me, if i did buy her why would i want people from a forum to help me fund her? In no way did i say this,  i can afford her and she would be in my responsibility.


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## ILuvCowparsely (12 June 2012)

peteralfred said:



			so you buy it, who pays for it long term? vets fees, trimming, hay, insurance? even horses at home aren't free to keep (if they are then I'm doing it wrong!)
if you can afford to do the right thing by her, whatever that may be, then go for it but whoever 'buys' her, please don't rely on long term finanacial help from strangers on a forum. madness.
		
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Natalie has already said she can afford to keep her if we buy her 

 Whats the best way putting the £20 into a pay pal or what??


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## Amymay (12 June 2012)

I'm assuming that Natalie has the cash available to buy the filly tonight.  And then upon proof of purchase, those wishing to donate could do so via a specially set up pay pal account.


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## RuthM (12 June 2012)

Ladydragon said:



			I don't think anyone with a genuine interest in welfare actually needs to see every animal/human/budgerigar that their donations might support or baulk if it goes on other costs - or disagree that complaints about this filly should be forwarded to WHW, BHS etc...  There's nothing written in stone to say that no purchase for this filly will stop the breeder in his/her tracks or garner positive changes for horses as a whole...  She'd probably end up rotting in a field, dumped or flogged for meat - with the eternal hope that the next one will flip some profit...  There's a chance nothing short of being shut down or run over by the #26 bus will stop the foals from coming...

Stupid individuals will continue to churn out babies of one sort or another that might inspire individual intervention despite national organisations working hard to bring overall changes...  If someone wants to step in and help one, that's as genuine to me as someone else aiming to help hundreds...
		
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Then I take it you'd happily buy a pup from a pup farm? Not worry that it fuels more suffering for ones not yet born, not be concerned it gives others the idea of it's profitability? I take it the most important thing is to save the one you see despite that act funding and supporting those who inflict the suffering? 

Let's hope the better nick gelderlander sells as fast or the dealer will certainly learn which side his bread's buttered!

It can take good breeders an age to sell youngstock - just think about it, you know there are plenty looking for a fast buck and what better way than providing sod all and selling to those who care little about where their money goes and more about being a rescuer.

It isn't new, sympathy buyers have funded all kinds of horrors for an age, and it is known/used.


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## MotherOfChickens (12 June 2012)

Leviathan said:



			Natalie has already said she can afford to keep her if we buy her 

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well, thats alright then  lets hope its 'just' a case of a bad worm burden that won't have caused any long term damage and alot of vets bills down the way.


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## ElleSkywalker (12 June 2012)

Might be daft but how can this be reported with only a mobile number, various names, a vague postcode & a bloke that does business in a pub car park?

I totally agree with not wanting to give this person money & the puppy farm comments BUT if we all had the chance to save one of the horses from Spindles farm before the atrocities that happened........ Not saying this guy is comparable, but......

Ok going back into my box now, Natalieshort, be safe tonight, big hugs, you are very brave xx


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## RuthM (12 June 2012)

ElleSkywalker said:



			Might be daft but how can this be reported with only a mobile number, various names, a vague postcode & a bloke that does business in a pub car park?

I totally agree with not wanting to give this person money & the puppy farm comments *BUT if we all had the chance to save one of the horses from Spindles farm before the atrocities that happened........ *Not saying this guy is comparable, but......

Ok going back into my box now, Natalieshort, be safe tonight, big hugs, you are very brave xx
		
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It would still be in business if all the rescues gave the guys cash and no doubt at all still have some 'out of sight stabling'.


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

peteralfred said:



			well, thats alright then  lets hope its 'just' a case of a bad worm burden that won't have caused any long term damage and alot of vets bills down the way.
		
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Most of you are just being boring now. I CAN AFFORD HER AND I CAN AFFORD THE UPBRINGING OF HER. Do people not understand this? vet bills or not.. personally, i dont have anything to pay for! all my money goes on my horses as im very lucky but thats personal. Ive said i can give this little one a loving forever home so whats the problem?


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## Hollycatt (12 June 2012)

A colic op is at least £5000 - get her insured! No use saying it won't happen to me!  And believe me worms, strangles and anything else infectious she may have can be a big drain on resources!

You may be a multimillionaire for all we know but from personal experience I know how a sob story can add up!


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## ILuvCowparsely (12 June 2012)

H&H members clubbed together once before to rescue  a mare.

 They have done it once they can do it again.


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

ElleSkywalker said:



			Might be daft but how can this be reported with only a mobile number, various names, a vague postcode & a bloke that does business in a pub car park?

I totally agree with not wanting to give this person money & the puppy farm comments BUT if we all had the chance to save one of the horses from Spindles farm before the atrocities that happened........ Not saying this guy is comparable, but......

Ok going back into my box now, Natalieshort, be safe tonight, big hugs, you are very brave xx
		
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Thankyou Elle, il let everyone know tomorrow! big hugs xxx


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## ILuvCowparsely (12 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			Most of you are just being boring now. I CAN AFFORD HER AND I CAN AFFORD THE UPBRINGING OF HER. Do people not understand this? vet bills or not.. personally, i dont have anything to pay for! all my money goes on my horses as im very lucky but thats personal. Ive said i can give this little one a loving forever home so whats the problem?
		
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I am not boring  £ 20  ready for her


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## ABC (12 June 2012)

And if Natalie can't - I can. 

I'm on my phone at the moment Natalie, but I'll try resending my PM on my computer later.


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

Hollycatt said:



			A colic op is at least £5000 - get her insured! No use saying it won't happen to me!  And believe me worms, strangles and anything else infectious she may have can be a big drain on resources!

You may be a multimillionaire for all we know but from personal experience I know how a sob story can add up!
		
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Yes i know, i would definately get her insured as im sure she won't have been treated for anything


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## RuthM (12 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			Most of you are just being boring now. I CAN AFFORD HER AND I CAN AFFORD THE UPBRINGING OF HER. Do people not understand this? vet bills or not.. personally, i dont have anything to pay for! all my money goes on my horses as im very lucky but thats personal. Ive said i can give this little one a loving forever home so whats the problem?
		
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I don't doubt you have enough cash, the problem is the guy selling will also have more cash soon. Hope the 'harder to shift due to looking well' youngster doesn't lose weight next.


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

ABC said:



			And if Natalie can't - I can. 

I'm on my phone at the moment Natalie, but I'll try resending my PM on my computer later. 

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Thankyou ABC, ok yeah!  x


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

RuthM said:



			I don't doubt you have enough cash, the problem is the guy selling will also have more cash soon. Hope the 'harder to shift due to looking well' youngster doesn't lose weight next.
		
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I know but i also said "What is the minimum you would take her for" and he didnt sound bothered he just sounded like he wanted to get rid of her asap! he said he will talk about this tonight so hopefully i have to give him the money.. or not alot of it anyway!


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## ILuvCowparsely (12 June 2012)

Natalieshort  has already said she can afford her , and since she has  horses of her own  I think she is fully aware of running cost of a horse.  If she can do it  we can do our bit too.

 I think we have had enough negativity now , anyone who thinks its full hardy mad etc .  We know  

We only need positive things now  for Tilly  from the member who want to donate.


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## Hollycatt (12 June 2012)

All the best with her   And we will of course be expecting lots of pics once you get her home and settled


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## bensababy (12 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			Totally agree! my boyfriend is ringing up to arrange a viewing either tonight or tomorrow (if they can) i want to get her out of there asap, get her looking proper! makes me sick how anybody can do this though! they must think we are thick!
		
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Sorry i have to ask - you mentioned earlier you were not experienced enough.. and now you will get her "looking proper" - this concerns me more.

I know your heart is in it and you mean well, but if you dont know what your doing its a worry.

Sorry just my opinion.


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## YasandCrystal (12 June 2012)

I think you are all overly optimistic if you really believe that the BHS/RSPCA or WHW would do anything about the filly. There were foals near us repeatedly reported and the answer from the RSPCA - was that they were the most reported qequines in the area - being in full view on a busy road, but they had water and hay so the authorities are powerless unless they are almost dying. Dealers like Bob won#t be ruffled by a welfare organisation. He would have to have a barnfull of starving horses to get a prosecution.

Try visiting Reading market and see the state of the foals sold there with the welfare organisations in attendance.

Good luck tonight Natalie


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## hayinamanger (12 June 2012)

Natalie, I hope everything goes as planned tonight and you can bring this filly home.  She will reward your kindness every day.  Big hugs ()))


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## PercyMum (12 June 2012)

Surely Natalie can look at the filly, make an informed descision about the condition she is in, buy if she feels its a good idea and then report the guy after?  I agree that this sort of poor breeding should not be supported but equally why should one horse (or any horse) suffer for a principle?

And whoever mentioned NF ponies, dont even get me started about that appaling state of affairs 

Good luck Natalie - I am sure you will make the right choice.


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## hairycob (12 June 2012)

If Natalieshort has the cash to pay for her this evening & can afford to keep her why don't you all donate your £20 to WHW or whoever you prefer to avoid complications.

After all - how many of you know anything about Natalie? Not saying she isn't a lovely person because I don't know her & she has only made a few posts - many of them on this thread. But unless you know her in real life she could be any or none of the following:
1) a fantastic horsewoman who can turn this filly's life around.
2) A looney horse collector who will leave her dumped & neglected in a field.
3) Well intentioned but naive who manages to cope with experienced help.
4) Well intentioned but naive who doesn't manage to cope leading to more suffering for Tilly
5) In league with the dealer to get your money.

Natalie may well be the loveliest & most well intentioned horsewoman in the world, but there have been less lovely people who have used this forum for less than well intentioned reasons and for your own sakes it would be wise to be a bit more circumspect. Also if the dealer has got wind of this thread he has probably already decided to up the price.


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## Clava (12 June 2012)

hairycob said:



			If Natalieshort has the cash to pay for her this evening & can afford to keep her why don't you all donate your £20 to WHW or whoever you prefer to avoid complications.

After all - how many of you know anything about Natalie? Not saying she isn't a lovely person because I don't know her & she has only made a few posts - many of them on this thread. But unless you know her in real life she could be any or none of the following:
1) a fantastic horsewoman who can turn this filly's life around.
2) A looney horse collector who will leave her dumped & neglected in a field.
3) Well intentioned but naive who manages to cope with experienced help.
4) Well intentioned but naive who doesn't manage to cope leading to more suffering for Tilly
5) In league with the dealer to get your money.

Natalie may well be the loveliest & most well intentioned horsewoman in the world, but there have been less lovely people who have used this forum for less than well intentioned reasons and for your own sakes it would be wise to be a bit more circumspect. Also if the dealer has got wind of this thread he has probably already decided to up the price.
		
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I was thinking exactly the same things...


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## Goldenstar (12 June 2012)

YasandCrystal said:



			I think you are all overly optimistic if you really believe that the BHS/RSPCA or WHW would do anything about the filly. There were foals near us repeatedly reported and the answer from the RSPCA - was that they were the most reported qequines in the area - being in full view on a busy road, but they had water and hay so the authorities are powerless unless they are almost dying. Dealers like Bob won#t be ruffled by a welfare organisation. He would have to have a barnfull of starving horses to get a prosecution.

Try visiting Reading market and see the state of the foals sold there with the welfare organisations in attendance.
		
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I agree with this , thin 'foal ' just weaned looking poor after a period of terrible wet weather owner probally fully aware of his ' rights ' and how to play the system ( just guessing). I think there's very little that could be done and it has to be said some young ones do look awful at weaning .
It has a lot of hair for its age is that a fresian thing? Does anyone know.


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## Ladydragon (12 June 2012)

RuthM said:



			Then I take it you'd happily buy a pup from a pup farm? Not worry that it fuels more suffering for ones not yet born, not be concerned it gives others the idea of it's profitability? I take it the most important thing is to save the one you see despite that act funding and supporting those who inflict the suffering? 

Let's hope the better nick gelderlander sells as fast or the dealer will certainly learn which side his bread's buttered!

It can take good breeders an age to sell youngstock - just think about it, you know there are plenty looking for a fast buck and what better way than providing sod all and selling to those who care little about where their money goes and more about being a rescuer.

It isn't new, sympathy buyers have funded all kinds of horrors for an age, and it is known/used.
		
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Please don't try and make presumptions about me or my spending habits when I have merely stated that I don't believe not buying this filly will bring about the end to all bad breeding or that I don't condemn anyone who does decide to get her into a better home... Or perhaps you just like sounding judgemental and condescending... 

I don't need to 'think about' your little lecture thank you...


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## Archangel (12 June 2012)

There is another advert for a similar horse from same guy 
Jimbo so just be prepared to find yourself in a field of similar horses all tugging at your heart strings.

Hope it all goes well, offer £150 and be prepared to go to £200.


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## YasandCrystal (12 June 2012)

I think the foal is undisputedly poor.  It's likely really wormy - I expect the mare was poorly fed all winter so the foal won't have had a good start in life.

We have had a rotten early summer and dealers are tight with hay and feed. The foal is lucky to be a filly by all accounts reading of the killed and dumped colt foals story in last week's H&H.


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## Quantock-cob (12 June 2012)

hairycob, you have taken the words out of my mouth (although you have said them better than I would have).  

 I had a lady on my last yard who went around collecting rescue cases. Yes, they were in a terrible state when she got them, but six months later they were even worse. She couldn't afford to have their feet trimmed, worm them or have the two stallions castrated. She was eventually told to leave the yard as she hadn't paid any livery fees for weeks - sadly haven't heard of her since. I do wonder what happened to those poor little ponies. She also had a house full of rescue dogs and cats.

Sadly, sometimes the rescue cases end up needing to be rescued from the well meaning rescuers  Sometimes it is better to let the professionals deal with them.


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

There is way too much negativity about little Tilly, This isnt tillys fault so why should nobody give her a loving home? And yes i dont have ALOT of experience but i rescued my trotter mare from a horrible woman and she was in a stable with NOTHING but her poo, wee no water and no food she couldnt be touched, she put her head in the corner of the stable if you went in, no confidence at all! and you should see her now, she isnt the same horse AT ALL! that horrible woman did that to my horse and it still makes me feel sick! my horse is the most confident horse now! she seems so happy and loves my attention, everybody was shocked when they came to see her because of how different she is! personality and looks wise. And i don't have alot of knowledge no, but on my yard they are very friendly people and are always willing to help, and this will be a project for everyone! and i know we can do this so why not? Im trying to help a little youngster but some of you are being so negative about it, i dont see you helping? I dont care if it concerns you or not because you shouldnt be concerned, i wouldnt take her into my responsibility if i knew i couldnt do this. Anyway, thanks to the people who are supportive, im going to a viewing tonight and i dont have to buy her if i dont feel its the right thing she could look ALOT different than to what she does now hopefully! poor little thing. Thanks again and il let you all know what happens!


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## RuthM (12 June 2012)

Ladydragon said:



			Please don't try and make presumptions about me or my spending habits when I have merely stated that I don't believe not buying this filly will bring about the end to all bad breeding or that I don't condemn anyone who does decide to get her into a better home... Or perhaps you just like sounding judgemental and condescending... 

I don't need to 'think about' your little lecture thank you...
		
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The statement had a ? therefore not an assumption. And I agree fully not buying 1 filly won't end bad breeding, however, surely you admit a quick sale shows demand in the market? Surely you would agree that this is not want most want to see being in demand? 

Meh, there are those who get that and those who don't ergo, the thin filly will likely sell before the plumper one. I accept my attempts to reason the process out don't compete with cute or heroic missions.


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

Just one more thing to you supportive people, i agree - donate your money to a horse charity or keep it for your horses! atleast i have alot of people wanting to help and its really nice of you  Tilly has one huge family already LOL!


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## ElleSkywalker (12 June 2012)

Goldenstar, I have a fresian x welsh x tb yearling, she did get fluffy (wintered out) but not that fluffy! 

She does however have a huge head like this little girl, which makes Tilly filly look odd, but on my well fed youngster looks ok 

I do however have a NF mare, that was in similar condition to Tilly, she had the.same awful strangely coat, similar length tail and was so skinny I could put a finger either side of her neck and touch them together. I think she was around 9 months when I got her, a very late summer foal.

I think she is older than a foal & has had a hard winter with little nutrition, but with time will be as lovely as my black pony


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## meesha (12 June 2012)

good luck with the viewing/buying - doubt he will want to take it back with him from the carpark so you may get her for not alot - we are all talking you are actually doing something about thiis poor girly so  hats off to you ! - would be great if you could let us know how you get on but I agree with some of the others - if you are buying her and bearing all the costs it is nothing to do with anyone else.  Saying that if your bf cant go with you to view maybe someone close by on here can accompany you - def. not good idea to go alone and much better to take a large bloke if you can (sorry to be sexist but better safe than sorry) I would say give her a hug from me but you will probably want to de-lice and bath then hug the gorgeous little person !!


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## ABC (12 June 2012)

Natalie, if you do feel like its the wrong thing to buy her (when you view her) please let me know asap because I'm willing to offer her a home if it falls through.

Good luck x


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## SuperCoblet (12 June 2012)

Natalie- all I can say is good on you! I would have done the same thing if I lived closer!

Good luck and please keep us updated


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## ILuvCowparsely (12 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			There is way too much negativity about little Tilly, This isnt tillys fault so why should nobody give her a loving home? And yes i dont have ALOT of experience but i rescued my trotter mare from a horrible woman and she was in a stable with NOTHING but her poo, wee no water and no food she couldnt be touched, she put her head in the corner of the stable if you went in, no confidence at all! and you should see her now, she isnt the same horse AT ALL! that horrible woman did that to my horse and it still makes me feel sick! my horse is the most confident horse now! she seems so happy and loves my attention, everybody was shocked when they came to see her because of how different she is! personality and looks wise. And i don't have alot of knowledge no, but on my yard they are very friendly people and are always willing to help, and this will be a project for everyone! and i know we can do this so why not? Im trying to help a little youngster but some of you are being so negative about it, i dont see you helping? I dont care if it concerns you or not because you shouldnt be concerned, i wouldnt take her into my responsibility if i knew i couldnt do this. Anyway, thanks to the people who are supportive, im going to a viewing tonight and i dont have to buy her if i dont feel its the right thing she could look ALOT different than to what she does now hopefully! poor little thing. Thanks again and il let you all know what happens! 

Click to expand...



 We will all be waiting to hear how it went   good luck Natalie  fingers crossed


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## mulledwhine (12 June 2012)

Have I seen the correct advert? In it they say ' home bred, parents can be seen' !!

Is he taking them to the pub as well?

All sounds very dodgy 

Good luck all the same 

If she was closer to me, I would have also been tempted


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## bensababy (12 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			There is way too much negativity about little Tilly, This isnt tillys fault so why should nobody give her a loving home? And yes i dont have ALOT of experience but i rescued my trotter mare from a horrible woman and she was in a stable with NOTHING but her poo, wee no water and no food she couldnt be touched, she put her head in the corner of the stable if you went in, no confidence at all! and you should see her now, she isnt the same horse AT ALL! that horrible woman did that to my horse and it still makes me feel sick! my horse is the most confident horse now! she seems so happy and loves my attention, everybody was shocked when they came to see her because of how different she is! personality and looks wise. And i don't have alot of knowledge no, but on my yard they are very friendly people and are always willing to help, and this will be a project for everyone! and i know we can do this so why not? Im trying to help a little youngster but some of you are being so negative about it, i dont see you helping? I dont care if it concerns you or not because you shouldnt be concerned, i wouldnt take her into my responsibility if i knew i couldnt do this. Anyway, thanks to the people who are supportive, im going to a viewing tonight and i dont have to buy her if i dont feel its the right thing she could look ALOT different than to what she does now hopefully! poor little thing. Thanks again and il let you all know what happens! 

Click to expand...

There is no need to be so snipey, i was asking a genuine question as you yourself raised your lack of experience.. not me, as a factor to not get her first off.

I respect what you are doing and will happily contribute towards her being transported/bought, i just questioned whether she would be going out the frying pan into the fire thats all.


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## hairycob (12 June 2012)

Natalie,  If this is going to be a project for everyone on your yard I take it you have discussed it fully with them & they are aware of any time commitments you are expecting from them. I'm sorry if you feel I am being negative but I am old & have many times seen the best intentions go horribly wrong because they haven't been properly thought though. You know the old saying about the road to hell?


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

Thankyou everyone  and ABC i will let you know if my plan doesnt go right!


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## milesjess (12 June 2012)

Wow hasn't this thread taken off! Was 1 page when I last looked... So to sum up foaly has a new home?


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## ILuvCowparsely (12 June 2012)

Ok gotta go do my yard now .

  tells us how it went later


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## Quantock-cob (12 June 2012)

Hmmm...Natalieshort is on another thread today looking for a 14hh grey cob - has to be grey but def no youngsters?!!! Strange...or am I just being a bit pessimistic and doubtful here about her true reasons for wanting Tilly?


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## milesjess (12 June 2012)

Liz66 perhaps she has space for 2? Or for a friend? Sure there are plenty of genuine reasons and she doesn't have to explain herself to all of us lot to be fair.


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## MotherOfChickens (12 June 2012)

PercyMum said:



			but equally why should one horse (or any horse) suffer for a principle?
		
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no principle as far as I'm concerned. I don't know Natalie and I don't wish to criticise her but its easy to get caught up in the moment with a bunch of strangers who after all, not going to be stuck with the cost or responsibility of a young horse. 
if she has  £XXX to spend on a wormy youngster and pay for livery until she can be backed, pay for whatever a badly done youngster might need (and she might only need groceries, she might need alot more) etc etc etc then fine, go for it.


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

Liz it was for a friend if you have to know


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## mulledwhine (12 June 2012)

Replied in impossible thread, but I think this filly has just pulled at her heart strings

Still intrigued how he is going to show you mum and dad in a pub car park


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## hairycob (12 June 2012)

Except on another thread that she started today (but has not responded to) she stated she doesn't want a youngster. So taking on one like this is looking like a snap, not thought through, reaction.


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## mulledwhine (12 June 2012)

She has said the grey was for a friend


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## AMH (12 June 2012)

Sorry, been lurking, but don't like the way this is turning...

Maybe she doesn't want a youngster on the other thread because she might be buying one tonight!!


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

Like i just said.. that was for a friend. She doesnt have this account and she is a novice and wanted a bombproof cob! and for some reason she wants a grey/white one. Why is it such a problemmm lol its boring


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## Hollycatt (12 June 2012)

You won't see the horses in a car park I very much doubt. They will want to take you to where they are located. Be safe and take your own car and just follow them. Don't agree to go in their car and leave yours behind


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## Lady La La (12 June 2012)

The Fuzzy Furry said:



			Exactly. Well put.

Please people, these fella's have been selling badly put together ponies for quite a long time. They are (almost) all in a score of 2 - 3 physically and most have confirmation defects due to poor breeding, in-breeding, young breeding - you name it.

Removing 1 pony yearling from a bunch of them is not going to help. It might make you feel better to think you have helped 'rescue' a pony, but you MUST look at the bigger picture. 

Maybe you can get a bit more rational about this - there are literally hundreds of cross-bred poorly put together ponies being sold. 

This one is over meat ££'s value at least!
		
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This.


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## YasandCrystal (12 June 2012)

Hollycatt said:



			You won't see the horses in a car park I very much doubt. They will want to take you to where they are located. Be safe and take your own car and just follow them. Don't agree to go in their car and leave yours behind
		
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^^This exactly. I have met a dealer in a CP before and they got me to follow to a location. They do that so they don't have to give directions and they can check you out first too


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

Oh yes i know, il definately will be following them! Not getting in his car!


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## rhino (12 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			Like i just said.. that was for a friend. She doesnt have this account and she is a novice and wanted a bombproof cob! and for some reason she wants a grey/white one. Why is it such a problemmm lol its boring
		
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I think people just want to make sure that the horse ends up with someone with the time, money and experience to cope with it - rescues come with a lot of baggage in many cases, both physical and mental. You've admitted on previous threads that you are a complete novice, and that you were wanting to find your own land to rent as your yard is 'bitchy' and 'too expensive', and the 'perfect' lead rein pony you bought at auction less than a month ago now appears to be back up for sale as no-one can handle her... 

It's your decision at the end of the day though, so good luck if you do decide to go for it


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

rhino said:



			I think people just want to make sure that the horse ends up with someone with the time, money and experience to cope with it - rescues come with a lot of baggage in many cases, both physical and mental. You've admitted on previous threads that you are a complete novice, and that you were wanting to find your own land to rent as your yard is 'bitchy' and 'too expensive', and the 'perfect' lead rein pony you bought at auction less than a month ago now appears to be back up for sale as no-one can handle her... 

It's your decision at the end of the day though, so good luck if you do decide to go for it 

Click to expand...

Yes it is my descision and i don't know why your all getting so involved?! how do you not know if ive moved yards or not? and that this pony isnt mine but ive worded it like its mine for someone else for advice? It is non of your business. If i buy her, like i said before she is in my responsibility and i have people who are more than willing to help. I may not buy her? who knows. But atleast i have other people wanting to help and even wanting her.


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## undertheweather (12 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			Oh my god. Can we save her? she will be stunning and be so happy in the right hands  i cant help im afraid because im not experienced enough but i live in lancaster if it helps...
		
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These are you own words Natalie. 
That is all.


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## Princess Jess (12 June 2012)

Personally I think good on Natalie, no it wont change the world, there will always be poorly treated horses but at least this individual will get a better start in life.
Natalie I wish you the best of luck. I'm sure you have considered the financial and time implications carefully before deciding to take the filly on, in which case there is no reason why there should be any trouble later down the line.
As others have said please be careful when viewing her, take your boyfriend if possible and/or someone experienced in buying horses and don't go anywhere with them on your own. I hope it all works out and let us know how you get on!


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## Wagtail (12 June 2012)

Just wanted to say that meeting in a pub car park is very normal. I have bought two dogs (off a reputable breeder) in a pub car park. Also, I insist any livery wanting to sell a trailer or similar, take it off site and meet the buyer down the road in a car park This is to stop certain types coming up here and casing the place.


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## Wagtail (12 June 2012)

Good luck, Natalie. You are putting your money where your mouth is. I hope it goes well for you and Tilly.


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

Thank you princess Jess! Yes I'm not that experienced but like I said before if you actually read this thread I have done it before and I did that on my own! I'm not a complete novice thinking I know what I'm doing! I've had experience but I have really experienced people on my yard! like I said I might not buy her! But this has nothing to do with you. Not commenting to people who are so negative about everything anymore to the People who are actually supportive il do another thread tonight and let you know how it went!


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## rhino (12 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			and that this pony isnt mine but ive worded it like its mine for someone else for advice?
		
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Apologies  I must have got mixed up somehow.



Natalieshort said:



			I found the most perfect lead rein pony at a horse auction for 450!!!!! She's perfect
		
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Natalieshort said:



			I'm looking for a horse which is bombproof in traffic, gentle, loving and which a child could handle. Recently bought a show pony which we didn't know was part Arab at first and she can't handle her at all and neither can we sometimes! Looking for no higher than 15 hands and over 12 years old, a been and done there type! Please help!! 

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Natalieshort said:



			It's not the ponys fault in anyway at all, sorry it sounded like that! She just came from a bad breeder and was sold as a "first ridden, lead rein child's pony" but this isn't, everybody at the yard doesn't even think she is broken!! :/ she hasn't been handled much either, she's gorgeous but she's too much for a novice child who's very soft lol, she doesn't like being firm because she thinks it's "mean" haha, and sychnant we've only had her for nearly a month and my sister is quite tall because the pony is only 11.2hh and she's very tiny and fine! We didn't realise how small she was until we brought her home because it was a suprise for my sister you see. And it looks like she's too big for her already!  I'd try and add a picture but I don't know how haha!
		
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Natalieshort said:



			I bought an absolutely stunning show pony from an auction and I thought it was too good to be true too! She was described as a first ridden lead rein pony. She hasn't even been broken!! She is absolutely stunning and a real show pony.. IN HAND! I still have her after a month but sadly she's for sale :-( annoys me how sellers can say such crap when it could be very dangerous also!
		
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## martlin (12 June 2012)

Mind boggles  that's all.
Very sad for the pony and by the looks of it, it's about to get even sadder.


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## Princess Jess (12 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			Thank you princess Jess! Yes I'm not that experienced but like I said before if you actually read this thread I have done it before and I did that on my own! I'm not a complete novice thinking I know what I'm doing! I've had experience but I have really experienced people on my yard! like I said I might not buy her! But this has nothing to do with you. Not commenting to people who are so negative about everything anymore to the People who are actually supportive il do another thread tonight and let you know how it went! 

Click to expand...

Exactly. If I were you I'd probably leave this thread now and just wait and see how it goes tonight and update those who are interested later. Everyone, horse and human, deserves a chance


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## Lady La La (12 June 2012)

martlin said:



			Mind boggles  that's all.
Very sad for the pony and by the looks of it, it's about to get even sadder.
		
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Couldn't agree more.


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## Clava (12 June 2012)

I suspect Tilly would have found a perfectly good home without this thread... (there are many out there that do, many worse at sales that don't)  I find the whole thing very strange and not necessarily positive, especially after those quotes Rhino.


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## Miss L Toe (12 June 2012)

Corn fed from birth.... yeah!


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## Vixen Van Debz (12 June 2012)

Two of my favourite breeds, in one sad looking little filly. If only I had the money, space, time and expertise she clearly needs... Hope she ends up in the right home, regardless of who that's with.


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## Ladydragon (12 June 2012)

RuthM said:



			The statement had a ? therefore not an assumption. And I agree fully not buying 1 filly won't end bad breeding, however, surely you admit a quick sale shows demand in the market? Surely you would agree that this is not want most want to see being in demand? 

Meh, there are those who get that and those who don't ergo, the thin filly will likely sell before the plumper one. I accept my attempts to reason the process out don't compete with cute or heroic missions.
		
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It was long winded, varied and by the time I got to the ? mark I was a tad hopping and missed it...  

I think a sale could suggest demand or it could suggest a "managed to get rid" or goodness knows what to such idiots...  I personally think the presumption that someone breeds to perceived demand isn't always right... Some people are just plain dumb - they do because they can - no more, no less...  People are complex in what they deem to be 'profit'...

I do understand and actually support your perspective - I've already said this...  But I won't condemn anyone who does get drawn in to 'helping' on an individual basis because I can't (as you _appear_ to be doing) put any responsibility on their shoulders for the breeder's ongoing decision making process...  He/She is the one who should be doing the right thing by their animal and negate the need for any 'sympathy purchase'...  These people are no different to the parent who lets their kid go hungry so they can buy booze or the family who dumps their elderly relative at A&E so they can have a better Christmas...  All 'profit' in some way and all complex creatures...

I do believe in the greater good, but it's not necessarily right or easy to ignore the needs of a single individual either...



Hmmm...apologies for the total waffle...


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

Rhino, im sick of repeating myself just read my other comments again, your getting boring now. I don't have to explain myself to you or anybody! It is non of your business! And no it isn't "poor pony" it is in a home which she needs since her ORIGINAL owner wasnt a show home and that's where she needs to be. But yet again, non of your business but keep stalking my threads if you want you need to get out more! Il let the supportive people know what happens in a seperate thread!


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## AMH (12 June 2012)

I'm really torn on this.

I don't really buy the 'why help this one cos there are loads more out there' argument (surely helping one is better than not helping), or the 'buying this one will just encourage people' argument (cos I reckon they're going to do it anyway).

We have no way of knowing whether Natalie is able to offer this pony a happy, healthy home or not. I get Rhino's point about the previous posts, but it looks like (very much on face value) that that was a case of a pony being bought for a specific job, for which it turned out not to be suitable. I guess this would be slightly different, being a case of just offering the pony 'a way out' and having no expectations as regards health, temperament etc.

The thing that does worry me about the previous threads you posted, Rhino, is that the other pony is now for sale - I can only assume that she's for sale as unbroken and in no way suitable for a child to ride at present.

ETA - I am broadly supportive of such a charitable act, though, and really hope it works out for the best - it's nice that someone is prepared to do something rather than just wring their hands (which I'm not suggesting anyone here has done but you know what I mean!!)


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## DEEDEE83 (12 June 2012)

The pony in question is her sisters lead rein pony sold on lies it seems. She never said it wasnt hers just that it might not be for all we know. However she underestimated how much people want dirt and to fling mud. I agree if the leadrein ponies purpose was for her baby sis, then its not suitable end of. It seems to me people want to find anything to pull a newby apart. We only know what we are told im sure natalie hasnt mentioned what she didnt need to but say she has moved on to a cheaper yard is happy and has time and money for this filly then I say huge pat on the back. For what its worth her parents are possibly financially responsible for sisters pony. I for one am looking forward to update later.


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## Queenbee (12 June 2012)

Let the animal suffer, because helping it would be bettering the bank account of the seller...








Are u serious?! Where is your compassion? Who on earth would make such a statement that we all should look the other way when we can do something to help a suffering animal... I  understand the sentiment, it does  grate on anyone giving money to  people like the seller, but if I had  it id pay anything I could to get a  horse out of such a situation and  give it a chance! 

I'm up to my eyeballs in vets bills with ebony who looks about as malnourished as this filly at the moment, but count me in for a donation... Just say where to send it!


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

The pony, was for sale because a dealer told me she was broken and bombproof for a child and very suitable! She isn't broken, and is NO WAY! Suitable for a child! I doubt even an experienced person could handle her! She is now really happy in the right hands! End of thread now for me!


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## Lady La La (12 June 2012)

Queenbee said:



			but if I had  it id pay anything I could to get a  horse out of such a situation and  give it a chance!
		
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Which is what these bin end dealers reply upon. They keep their horses in such a way to deliberately evoke a knee jerk 'I must rescue it now' reaction from Joe Public. It's how they earn a living.  
To purchase their ponies is to provide them with funds to buy yet more equines that they wont feed, in order to make you feel sorry for it and buy it, etc etc. And so the cycle continues. 

The bigger picture may be harder to tackle, and less gratifying... but until people stop giving in to the knee jerk reactions that these dealers depend upon, it will go on and on and on and on


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## Carefreegirl (12 June 2012)

I think the problem here is Dragon dealers or whatever name they go by. Every week there seems to be a thread on here titled 'Look at this poor horse' and yes normally it's a weanling or a yearling broken to harness etc etc etc.
I'm now at the stage where I don't open the threads but seeing how this one has taken off I was intruiged. It would appear that none of the welfare charities are interested and I'm assuming they don't have passports or are microchipped ? It's a complete mockery of the law and just goes to prove what a pointless law it is - unless of course you are actually law abiding then god forbid you don't get caught flouting the law !
Hopefully Tilly will find a loving home be it with Natalie or someone else but we all know that next week and the week after and the week after there will be another thread exactly the same. For every Tilly there's another 100 waiting for their chance


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## JFTDWS (12 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			Yes it is my descision and i don't know why your all getting so involved?!
		
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because you've posted it all very publically on an open forum full of people who care about welfare - of both the greater population and the individual.



Natalieshort said:



			makes me sick how anybody can do this though! they must think we are thick!
		
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With respect, you are about to give him money for the filly.  I think the point is somewhat proven that you are playing into his business model - and by your own definition "thick".

The filly is poor, yes.  I don't see what makes her special though, there are too many ponies in similar situations.  I certainly wouldn't be perpetuating this sort of breeding and dealing.  Feel free to spend your own money as you please, but don't be under any allusions that this is some sort of "rescue" or you have any form of moral highground, regardless of your motives.


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## milesjess (12 June 2012)

Natalie - personally I'd stop replying as you really don't need to explain yourself to anyone, let people assume and conclude answers. 

See the little filly, if you like her and buy her, good luck  keep us posted, I for one would like to see her updates. 

If you don't buy her, well done for actually giving a damn about the poor thing.


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## Queenbee (12 June 2012)

Lady la la, there will always be those kind of dealers, I'm fully aware of what they do, no matter if the purchaser stopped buying do you really think morons of that mentality would change how they treat their horses? No, because they don't see them as horses, to them horses will always be a meal ticket, whether through the sales or privately, they will never be well cared for... Saying that as purchasers we can make a difference is bull unfortunately. Which is why if I had the money and the land and saw a horse in need... I wouldn't think twice. I'm actually harder than it comes across, I've been to many sales, never purchased one horse, no matter how much it tugged at my heart strings, my view was that they would probably go to meat man looking that bad and that's not a bad outcome for them in that situation. I have however rescued privately 3 ponies and given them new starts, a better life, a loving home and then found them beautiful homes with children to love them and knowledgable owners. I made a loss on all of them... It was nothing to do with money, but it made me so happy to know they were safe and loved and out of such dire situations. Natalie, if you do buy this filly, then take all the advice you can give, diet, worming and handling in the early days will be crucial with this little  one there are some on here who have a lot of experience in this type of thing, if you get her set a new thread up, to get all the advice and support you can. You may have fantastic support at your yard but you can't have too much info and support.


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## Bobbly (12 June 2012)

I'll just put my tin hat on.........Firstly, poor little creature, certainly looks older than claimed to me. Now, IMO only, what a strange cross to choose to breed? Bless her, her conformation is not good, a big Freisan head that will always be big on that frame, no shoulder and no bottom and that's not because she's poor, looks like she might be cow hocked and back at the knee too. Why do people breed such creatures? I applaud all those of you who are willing to take her on and I hope for your sakes she turns into the 'stunner' you all seem to think she will be. No doubt the guy has plenty of others just the same, regretfully I for one would have to walk away and leave it to the authorities if things were that bad there. Sorry.


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## Rowreach (12 June 2012)

JFTD said:



			because you've posted it all very publically on an open forum full of people who care about welfare - of both the greater population and the individual.



With respect, you are about to give him money for the filly.  I think the point is somewhat proven that you are playing into his business model - and by your own definition "thick".

The filly is poor, yes.  I don't see what makes her special though, there are too many ponies in similar situations.  I certainly wouldn't be perpetuating this sort of breeding and dealing.  Feel free to spend your own money as you please, but don't be under any allusions that this is some sort of "rescue" or you have any form of moral highground, regardless of your motives.
		
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I totally agree.  And would add that my experience locally (where I am actively involved in horse welfare) is that whereas a few years ago our local sales ring was filled to the brim with this type of horse, which always sold to the people who thought they were "rescuing" them, or else to someone who shoved them in another market the following week, in recent years with money so tight these buyers have disappeared, and the numbers of these horses being put up for sale has dwindled considerably.  I've heard many a local farmer saying they no longer have horses because they can no longer sell them except to the "factory".  If you provide a market for them, these guys will supply the product.

Much as I feel sorry for all the Tillys out there, I'm afraid emotive buying from this sort of dealer does nothing for horse welfare ime.


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## The Fuzzy Furry (12 June 2012)

Lady La La said:



			Which is what these bin end dealers reply upon. They keep their horses in such a way to deliberately evoke a knee jerk 'I must rescue it now' reaction from Joe Public. It's how they earn a living.  
To purchase their ponies is to provide them with funds to buy yet more equines that they wont feed, in order to make you feel sorry for it and buy it, etc etc. And so the cycle continues. 

The bigger picture may be harder to tackle, and less gratifying... but until people stop giving in to the knee jerk reactions that these dealers depend upon, it will go on and on and on and on 

Click to expand...


Agreed ^  ^

*Please people, for this thread purpose, can we drop the word rescue?*

This pony is advertised 
The pony is for sale.
The pony is priced at double (or more!) than meat money. 
It is certainly NOT a rescue by any means.

Good luck to the potential purchaser, I would like to hope she might have gleaned a little more knowledge in what she might be taking on, from previous posts here...........


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## Goldenstar (12 June 2012)

The Fuzzy Furry said:



			Agreed ^  ^

*Please people, for this thread purpose, can we drop the word rescue?*

This pony is advertised 
The pony is for sale.
The pony is priced at double (or more!) than meat money. 
It is certainly NOT a rescue by any means.

Good luck to the purchaser, I think she might have gleaned a little more knowledge in what she might be taking on, from previous posts here,
		
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Exactly it's a pony for sale agreed its looks odd and I would be looking carefully at its age but it's the would you give a dehydrated man your water bottle or would ignore him while you built a well situation a poorly bred horse from a bottom end dealer has as much right of a chance in life as a one bred further up the ladder.
 If someone wants to give a horse a nice life from a not brillant start it's up to them there's no black and white in tis situation .
And it's not a rescue .its a cheap pony for sale.


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## 'S'teamed (12 June 2012)

Get a grip....loads of ponies are weaned at 4 months...just go to Beaulieu Road sales in the autumn...

And believe me, she looks very well cared for up to some at places like Brecon, Carms and LLany...

It would do well if everyone ignored all of Bob, Richard and tom, dick or harry's Adverts....

No demand, no supply...

And no, it isn't "Rescue"...such an overused, emotive word.


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## Moomin1 (12 June 2012)

....Alarm bells are ringing!!!!!!!

Natalie sounds extremely naive and young.  

...Sigh....I remember a situation involving a highly dangerous mare who had never had handling.  Locals all kept reporting her to the authorities because she was owned by a traveller and they felt sorry she never had any interaction etc etc (nothing wrong condition wise other than cracked hooves due to not being able to handle).  However, one day the mare got an open wound which needed treating - so a vet tried, with owner's consent and payment, to dart the horse in order to treat it.  The tranquilisers didn't work, so said horse was still running around.  Local 'well to do' people decided to rally around between them (the very same people who had repeatedly fed this horse grass cuttings and potato peelings) and pay the dealer a large sum of money to 'rescue' her.  They were advised, quite honestly, by the dealer and numerous other people, that this horse was a danger to handle and had injured a number of people.  They of course believed they could do better than everyone else.  Next week or so, a large article appeared in the paper ASKING for donations to help the buyers care for the horse as they said funds were too low.  

A year later, said buyer tried catching the horse and got kicked in the head.  Unfortunately resulting in severe brain damage.  Authorities were called out to to shoot the horse.


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## Wagtail (12 June 2012)

Moomin1 said:



			....Alarm bells are ringing!!!!!!!

Natalie sounds extremely naive and young.  

...Sigh....I remember a situation involving a highly dangerous mare who had never had handling.  Locals all kept reporting her to the authorities because she was owned by a traveller and they felt sorry she never had any interaction etc etc (nothing wrong condition wise other than cracked hooves due to not being able to handle).  However, one day the mare got an open wound which needed treating - so a vet tried, with owner's consent and payment, to dart the horse in order to treat it.  The tranquilisers didn't work, so said horse was still running around.  Local 'well to do' people decided to rally around between them (the very same people who had repeatedly fed this horse grass cuttings and potato peelings) and pay the dealer a large sum of money to 'rescue' her.  They were advised, quite honestly, by the dealer and numerous other people, that this horse was a danger to handle and had injured a number of people.  They of course believed they could do better than everyone else.  Next week or so, a large article appeared in the paper ASKING for donations to help the buyers care for the horse as they said funds were too low.  

A year later, said buyer tried catching the horse and got kicked in the head.  Unfortunately resulting in severe brain damage.  Authorities were called out to to shoot the horse.
		
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Awful story!

However, hardly comparable to the little Tilly, surely.


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## Moomin1 (12 June 2012)

Wagtail said:



			Awful story!

However, hardly comparable to the little Tilly, surely.
		
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Possibly not, however I wholeheartedly disagree with anyone who admits they don't have the experience, and then a few posts later when the hysteria gets going booking an appointment and going to potentially buy a youngster that will no doubt need an awful lot of money and handling.  It is well meaning, just as it was in my above post, but has the potential to end in disaster.  Reading through Rhino's posts Natalie seems to be a fairly spontaneous character - having brought the lead rein pony home for a surprise, and also slightly worrying that she said she didn't realise how small it was until they got it home.  Seems like impulse buying.  That one didn't last all that long until it was back up for sale.

I hope it works out anyway.


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## Goldenstar (12 June 2012)

Moomin1 said:



			....Alarm bells are ringing!!!!!!!

Natalie sounds extremely naive and young.  

...Sigh....I remember a situation involving a highly dangerous mare who had never had handling.  Locals all kept reporting her to the authorities because she was owned by a traveller and they felt sorry she never had any interaction etc etc (nothing wrong condition wise other than cracked hooves due to not being able to handle).  However, one day the mare got an open wound which needed treating - so a vet tried, with owner's consent and payment, to dart the horse in order to treat it.  The tranquilisers didn't work, so said horse was still running around.  Local 'well to do' people decided to rally around between them (the very same people who had repeatedly fed this horse grass cuttings and potato peelings) and pay the dealer a large sum of money to 'rescue' her.  They were advised, quite honestly, by the dealer and numerous other people, that this horse was a danger to handle and had injured a number of people.  They of course believed they could do better than everyone else.  Next week or so, a large article appeared in the paper ASKING for donations to help the buyers care for the horse as they said funds were too low.  

A year later, said buyer tried catching the horse and got kicked in the head.  Unfortunately resulting in severe brain damage.  Authorities were called out to to shoot the horse.
		
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Can't really see the what that tale has got to do with the sale of a foal/ yearling . I have no idea if Natalie is young but I don't think there's any reason to assume she has no common sense .


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## Moomin1 (12 June 2012)

Goldenstar said:



			Can't really see the what that tale has got to do with the sale of a foal/ yearling . I have no idea if Natalie is young but I don't think there's any reason to assume she has no common sense .
		
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The moral of the story being that these people, all be it well meaning, took on more than they could possibly deal with.  Natalie has said she is inexperienced.  I also as said above, find it odd that someone can buy a lead rein pony as a surprise for someone and only notice how small it was when it came home?


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## Dolcé (12 June 2012)

martlin said:



			Mind boggles  that's all.
Very sad for the pony and by the looks of it, it's about to get even sadder.
		
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This ^^^^, think it says it all!


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## Moomin1 (12 June 2012)

My mare has just turned 20 in January and ive only had her for 4 months. Ive noticed when im bringing her down from the field it seems like she trips up or forgets to pick her feet up, but people have noticed when im riding her and do a trot she doesn't pick her front left leg up properly and kind of hops on it, what is going on with her? We didn't really get on when i first got her because she was mistreated but just when i feel like we are bonding there is something wrong with her  people on the yard think its called navicular or something, ive never heard of this before because im a complete novice as you can probably tell, what do you think is wrong with my mare?  she is insured and the vet is coming out on wednesday to give her her jabs and do her teeth, do i mention it to them? what does it sound like to you? im worrying! 
__________________
Millymoo<3 

And this, from Natalie's recent thread she posted, is precisely why I feel she shouldn't be 'rescuing' any more horses.  Spontaneous buyer muchly.  She doesn't seem to recognise what lameness is, again the horse is a 'rescue' which she has only had 4 months, and she has never heard of navicular because she is a complete novice, and even more worrying she is questioning whether she should mention this lameness or 'navicular' to the vet?!


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## hayinamanger (12 June 2012)

'S'teamed said:



			[Content removed]
		
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This came from the Dragon Driving site, do you think he is the skanky dregs?  Mind you, I am not in my right mind.


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## Goldenstar (12 June 2012)

Moomin1 said:



			The moral of the story being that these people, all be it well meaning, took on more than they could possibly deal with.  Natalie has said she is inexperienced.  I also as said above, find it odd that someone can buy a lead rein pony as a surprise for someone and only notice how small it was when it came home?

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Learning to handle a foal is not hard if she has friends who will help her with it . Its a bit much to think that she would not notice if it was a dangerous vicious foal we can't assume on here that people who may be inexperianced can't quickly wise up when they have to.
I don't know the lead rien story but so want if Natalie is caring for it well .
And for those who say this ponys story is going to get sadder why ?
Natalie says she has the financial resources to look after the pony, I hope if she inexperianced she will take advice and get help .
We were all inexperianced once even if our families taught us.
I was the first horsey one in our family and my first horse ( I had had ponies)
Was a mare Dad bought at a meat sale on a whim that he stopped at when passing when I was fourteen she took me to my first affiliated events and taught my boy friend ( now my husband to ride) and died with us three years after we got married yes it might be a disaster for Tilly but it might be her big chance to .


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## Goldenstar (12 June 2012)

Moomin1 said:



			My mare has just turned 20 in January and ive only had her for 4 months. Ive noticed when im bringing her down from the field it seems like she trips up or forgets to pick her feet up, but people have noticed when im riding her and do a trot she doesn't pick her front left leg up properly and kind of hops on it, what is going on with her? We didn't really get on when i first got her because she was mistreated but just when i feel like we are bonding there is something wrong with her  people on the yard think its called navicular or something, ive never heard of this before because im a complete novice as you can probably tell, what do you think is wrong with my mare?  she is insured and the vet is coming out on wednesday to give her her jabs and do her teeth, do i mention it to them? what does it sound like to you? im worrying! 
__________________
Millymoo<3 

And this, from Natalie's recent thread she posted, is precisely why I feel she shouldn't be 'rescuing' any more horses.  Spontaneous buyer muchly.  She doesn't seem to recognise what lameness is, again the horse is a 'rescue' which she has only had 4 months, and she has never heard of navicular because she is a complete novice, and even more worrying she is questioning whether she should mention this lameness or 'navicular' to the vet?!
		
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Ok fair point but it's not up to us is it.


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## Goldenstar (12 June 2012)

elderlycoupleindevon said:



			This came from the Dragon Driving site, do you think he is the skanky dregs?  Mind you, I am not in my right mind.





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He's cracking .


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## Moomin1 (12 June 2012)

Goldenstar said:



			Learning to handle a foal is not hard if she has friends who will help her with it . Its a bit much to think that she would not notice if it was a dangerous vicious foal we can't assume on here that people who may be inexperianced can't quickly wise up when they have to.
I don't know the lead rien story but so want if Natalie is caring for it well .
And for those who say this ponys story is going to get sadder why ?
Natalie says she has the financial resources to look after the pony, I hope if she inexperianced she will take advice and get help .
We were all inexperianced once even if our families taught us.
I was the first horsey one in our family and my first horse ( I had had ponies)
Was a mare Dad bought at a meat sale on a whim that he stopped at when passing when I was fourteen she took me to my first affiliated events and taught my boy friend ( now my husband to ride) and died with us three years after we got married yes it might be a disaster for Tilly but it might be her big chance to .
		
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It may well be, and I certainly don't mean Natalie any offence, but she has admitted to being a COMPLETE novice on her posts - and you can see it a mile off - she has been pottering around on a lame horse wondering what it wrong with it and if she should mention it to the vet?!  That is where it gets worrying people taking on horses which more than likely will need a lot of knowledge and experience to raise.  People simply shouldn't have horses if they can't recognise basic ailments.  Sorry, like I say this is just my opinion, and I think it's lovely Natalie is thinking of doing what she is doing but I disagree with it being a good thing.


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## DH1 (12 June 2012)

Moomin1 said:



			My mare has just turned 20 in January and ive only had her for 4 months. Ive noticed when im bringing her down from the field it seems like she trips up or forgets to pick her feet up, but people have noticed when im riding her and do a trot she doesn't pick her front left leg up properly and kind of hops on it, what is going on with her? We didn't really get on when i first got her because she was mistreated but just when i feel like we are bonding there is something wrong with her  people on the yard think its called navicular or something, ive never heard of this before because im a complete novice as you can probably tell, what do you think is wrong with my mare?  she is insured and the vet is coming out on wednesday to give her her jabs and do her teeth, do i mention it to them? what does it sound like to you? im worrying! 
__________________
Millymoo<3 

And this, from Natalie's recent thread she posted, is precisely why I feel she shouldn't be 'rescuing' any more horses.  Spontaneous buyer muchly.  She doesn't seem to recognise what lameness is, again the horse is a 'rescue' which she has only had 4 months, and she has never heard of navicular because she is a complete novice, and even more worrying she is questioning whether she should mention this lameness or 'navicular' to the vet?!
		
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I agree with your misgivings Moomin. I appreciate that all we have to go on regarding any poster on here, are previous posts and unfortunately they don't  fill me with confidence in this case. I'm sure Natalie is a lovely girl, but good intentions won't be enough for this animal.


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## milesjess (12 June 2012)

'S'teamed I'm sorry but that's a load of rubbish! There are some cracking horses on there and a handful of poor horses... Biggest false statement ever!


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## Goldenstar (12 June 2012)

'S'teamed said:



			[Content removed]
		
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That does come over as a bit snobby


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## mulledwhine (12 June 2012)

Dons tin hat,,, but,,, Natalie has sice posted that she has a horse that was ill treated, and now doing well, I have to accept that,

Assuming the filly still looks like that, would being put in a field with good food and water be the worst outcome in the world ?

I understand that the ' dealers' rely on people taking pity, but, don't the babies deserve a chance? I am a hypocrit as would never ever buy from a puppy farm! But she has seen this filly, wants to help it, so her money, her choice


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## Dolcé (12 June 2012)

Goldenstar said:



			That does come over as a bit snobby
		
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## Tinseltoes (12 June 2012)

elderlycoupleindevon said:



			This came from the Dragon Driving site, do you think he is the skanky dregs?  Mind you, I am not in my right mind.





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Hes beautiful. There are some nice horses on dragon driving.


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## touchstone (12 June 2012)

Moomin1 said:



			It may well be, and I certainly don't mean Natalie any offence, but she has admitted to being a COMPLETE novice on her posts - and you can see it a mile off - she has been pottering around on a lame horse wondering what it wrong with it and if she should mention it to the vet?!  That is where it gets worrying people taking on horses which more than likely will need a lot of knowledge and experience to raise.  People simply shouldn't have horses if they can't recognise basic ailments.  Sorry, like I say this is just my opinion, and I think it's lovely Natalie is thinking of doing what she is doing but I disagree with it being a good thing.
		
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I'd agree with Moomin1 too I'm afraid.


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## Ibblebibble (12 June 2012)

Moomin1 said:



			My mare has just turned 20 in January and ive only had her for 4 months. Ive noticed when im bringing her down from the field it seems like she trips up or forgets to pick her feet up, but people have noticed when im riding her and do a trot she doesn't pick her front left leg up properly and kind of hops on it, what is going on with her? We didn't really get on when i first got her because she was mistreated but just when i feel like we are bonding there is something wrong with her  people on the yard think its called navicular or something, ive never heard of this before because im a complete novice as you can probably tell, what do you think is wrong with my mare?  she is insured and the vet is coming out on wednesday to give her her jabs and do her teeth, do i mention it to them? what does it sound like to you? im worrying! 
__________________
Millymoo<3 

And this, from Natalie's recent thread she posted, is precisely why I feel she shouldn't be 'rescuing' any more horses.  Spontaneous buyer muchly.  She doesn't seem to recognise what lameness is, again the horse is a 'rescue' which she has only had 4 months, and she has never heard of navicular because she is a complete novice, and even more worrying she is questioning whether she should mention this lameness or 'navicular' to the vet?!
		
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oh lord wheres a face-palm emoticon when you need one
sorry to use you as an example natalie but you've kind of put yourself in the firing line, You are the exact type of person these type of dealers are aiming at, young, inexperienced and impulsive!
 you may think you are doing the right thing and i'm sure you do have the best interests of Tilly at heart but are you really capable of taking on a young filly who may or may not have been handled, you couldn't cope with the unbroken/lead rein pony you got from the sales so how will tilly be any different?


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## Ladydragon (12 June 2012)

Moomin1 said:



			And this, from Natalie's recent thread she posted, is precisely why I feel she shouldn't be 'rescuing' any more horses.  Spontaneous buyer muchly.  She doesn't seem to recognise what lameness is, again the horse is a 'rescue' which she has only had 4 months, and she has never heard of navicular because she is a complete novice, and even more worrying she is questioning whether she should mention this lameness or 'navicular' to the vet?!
		
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But...in all fairness...  She had acquired an 'oldie', insured the horse, was having it vaccinated, dentistry aspects checked and, realising her limitations of knowledge was genuinely asking for suggestions/advice...  There's a lot of 'experienced' horse owners who do far less...  

So she wears her heart on her sleeve a little - it's not always such a bad thing...  With the right advice or guidance, she should manage to take care of a baby...


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## martlin (12 June 2012)

Ladydragon said:



			But...in all fairness...  She had acquired an 'oldie', insured the horse, was having it vaccinated, dentistry aspects checked and, realising her limitations of knowledge was genuinely asking for suggestions/advice...  There's a lot of 'experienced' horse owners who do far less...  

So she wears her heart on her sleeve a little - it's not always such a bad thing...  With the right advice or guidance, she should manage to take care of a baby... 

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Without wishing to sound heartless... oldie is 1 thing, it will be looked after and eventually, in not so distant future it will snuff it, right?
Taking on a weanling ''for life'' is a completely different story, in hands of well meaning, novicey with some help, it has little chance of an allround education it will need to have a chance in hell of a decent home in future.


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## Moomin1 (12 June 2012)

Ladydragon said:



			But...in all fairness...  She had acquired an 'oldie', insured the horse, was having it vaccinated, dentistry aspects checked and, realising her limitations of knowledge was genuinely asking for suggestions/advice...  There's a lot of 'experienced' horse owners who do far less...  

So she wears her heart on her sleeve a little - it's not always such a bad thing...  With the right advice or guidance, she should manage to take care of a baby... 

Click to expand...

Possible yes, although it begs the question, if these 'experienced' horse owners had mentioned navicular to her, why she was still trotting it about and wondering whether she should mention it to a vet.  Either the advice wasn't followed, or they weren't direct enough/knowledgeable enough/bothered enough to ensure she got a vet out straight away.

I don't doubt for one minute that she is a kind hearted person who has the best intentions, but unfortunately, in my experience, that just doesn't cut it when owning horses.


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## Goldenstar (12 June 2012)

Ladydragon said:



			But...in all fairness...  She had acquired an 'oldie', insured the horse, was having it vaccinated, dentistry aspects checked and, realising her limitations of knowledge was genuinely asking for suggestions/advice...  There's a lot of 'experienced' horse owners who do far less...  

So she wears her heart on her sleeve a little - it's not always such a bad thing...  With the right advice or guidance, she should manage to take care of a baby... 

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I think so too , but it may break her heart and cost her a fortune which is why as a hard hearted oldie I would not do so but a little bit of me would like too I have the space ,the experiance , and the resources but the road I walked to get here stops me but i won't condem Natalie was wanting to try if she a creditable plan for the horse..


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## Moomin1 (12 June 2012)

Natalie, I apologise for when you read this you will most likely be upset/offended etc, that is not my intention at all.  As I say, you are probably a lovely person, but if you haven't already done so, I would think twice about buying Tilly.  If you really are wanting to find her a home rather than letting the authorities deal with it, then please find someone more experienced than yourself in bringing up youngsters.


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## vickyb (12 June 2012)

I often look at Dragon Driving because there are some nice types on there, but there are an awful lot of animals that, if they were mine, I would be ashamed to show their picture in a public place. There are a fair few very skinny looking youngsters, especially in the 'under £1000' section. No one can buy them all, and there will always be another to take their place. I just wish people would stop breeding weedy animals with appalling conformation that really have no future in life other than ending up with the meat man.
That was my rant for the evening!


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## Quantock-cob (12 June 2012)

I just hope that Natalie takes someone experienced with her to look at the filly - if she can't recognise lameness would she be able to spot strangles, etc. I also hopes she gets to look at the other animals on the yard to see if they are healthy. And finally, if she buys the filly, I hope her YO insists on putting it in quarantine until it can be checked over by a vet.

If she does buy then good luck to her - she is braver than me to take on a 6 month old filly - who is going to turn into a very strong young mare very soon. Just hope she has lots of experienced help, and we don't see it advertised again for sale very soon.


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## Ladydragon (12 June 2012)

Ibblebibble said:



			you couldn't cope with the unbroken/lead rein pony you got from the sales so how will tilly be any different?

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Shoot me now...  I bought a lead rein/first pony...  Except although he's been great on the lead rein, now my daughter is ready to move of it, he's is more of a 2nd/games pony...  a) I'm not small enough to reschool him and b) daughter isn't old enough or accomplished enough to ride him off lead rein...  I'm having to take advice from someone more experienced and doing some work with him to determine if he can be schooled into being suitable or need to be sold and a more suitable pony purchased...

If discovering that the horse was not as described or unsuitable in practice was the yardstick by which to measure the appropriate horse owning public - this forum would be a lot emptier of the "what do I do" threads and far fewer people would own them...  I guess that wouldn't be a bad thing to some people who believe the only appropriate horse owners are those who came out of the womb fitted with riding boots...



martlin said:



			Without wishing to sound heartless... oldie is 1 thing, it will be looked after and eventually, in not so distant future it will snuff it, right?
Taking on a weanling ''for life'' is a completely different story, in hands of well meaning, novicey with some help, it has little chance of an allround education it will need to have a chance in hell of a decent home in future.
		
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That is heartless...  The 20yr old could pootle along as a ridden for another 15yrs or so...  I think expecting 'for life' for a youngster (or any animal really) is tough even if the intent is there originally...  People's circumstances can change drastically even if they have the best put rescue plan in place...  If she bought it, brought it on with guidance to be a chirpy little healthy youngster, maybe had it professionally broken and at some point needed to sell it to a good home, would that be a bad thing?  People do it all the time...



Moomin1 said:



			Possible yes, although it begs the question, if these 'experienced' horse owners had mentioned navicular to her, why she was still trotting it about and wondering whether she should mention it to a vet.  Either the advice wasn't followed, or they weren't direct enough/knowledgeable enough/bothered enough to ensure she got a vet out straight away.

I don't doubt for one minute that she is a kind hearted person who has the best intentions, but unfortunately, in my experience, that just doesn't cut it when owning horses.
		
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I don't know the time span...wasn't there during any conversations...can't really comment on the verbal advice given...  Other than she did ask for advice on here and had done some things more adequately than many others - my horse owning world is small but I can still rattle off 'horsey families' who don't vaccinate and would rather poke needles in their eyes than have regular dental checks...  Knowledge is a great thing and yes, I agree, it would be a perfect world if every owner knew the basics of care, health, diet, ailments etc before buying even a hamster...  But being realistic, many fall short of that or learn as they go along...  That doesn't mean that they won't or can't learn - or acknowledge when they're out of their depth...



Goldenstar said:



			I think so too , but it may break her heart and cost her a fortune which is why as a hard hearted oldie I would not do so but a little bit of me would like too I have the space ,the experiance , and the resources but the road I walked to get here stops me but i won't condem Natalie was wanting to try if she a creditable plan for the horse..
		
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I agree...but I guess that's a risk with having animals, families or trying 'to do the right thing' full stop sometimes...  I had our first weanling last year and would be considered a 'novice owner'...  The vet, dentist and farrier find him a doddle to work with and we've managed not to kill/sour him yet...  He's also been a total joy to have around and brings a lot of laughter - often much needed as a hard hearted oldie myself...


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## Moggy in Manolos (12 June 2012)

Fools Motto said:



			The thing that strikes me more, is that filly doesn't look 6 months. She looks like a very poor yearling. I can't put my finger on it, but she doesn't look 'foaly' at all!!
Just hope that someone nice and kind can care for this poor soul.
		
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My sentiments exactly. She does not look like a 6month old to me but closer to a yearling, she looks very poor and unloved, poor young lady, I expect she will grow into a nice looking mare, hope someone can help her

ETS:



'S'teamed said:



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What s complete load of rubbish, there are some absolutely stunning horses on there....


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## Moomin1 (12 June 2012)

Ladydragon said:



			Shoot me now...  I bought a lead rein/first pony...  Except although he's been great on the lead rein, now my daughter is ready to move of it, he's is more of a 2nd/games pony...  a) I'm not small enough to reschool him and b) daughter isn't old enough or accomplished enough to ride him off lead rein...  I'm having to take advice from someone more experienced and doing some work with him to determine if he can be schooled into being suitable or need to be sold and a more suitable pony purchased...

If discovering that the horse was not as described or unsuitable in practice was the yardstick by which to measure the appropriate horse owning public - this forum would be a lot emptier of the "what do I do" threads and far fewer people would own them...  I guess that wouldn't be a bad thing to some people who believe the only appropriate horse owners are those who came out of the womb fitted with riding boots...



That is heartless...  The 20yr old could pootle along as a ridden for another 15yrs or so...  I think expecting 'for life' for a youngster (or any animal really) is tough even if the intent is there originally...  People's circumstances can change drastically even if they have the best put rescue plan in place...  If she bought it, brought it on with guidance to be a chirpy little healthy youngster, maybe had it professionally broken and at some point needed to sell it to a good home, would that be a bad thing?  People do it all the time...



I don't know the time span...wasn't there during any conversations...can't really comment on the verbal advice given...  Other than she did ask for advice on here and had done some things more adequately than many others - my horse owning world is small but I can still rattle off 'horsey families' who don't vaccinate and would rather poke needles in their eyes than have regular dental checks...  Knowledge is a great thing and yes, I agree, it would be a perfect world if every owner knew the basics of care, health, diet, ailments etc before buying even a hamster...  But being realistic, many fall short of that or learn as they go along...  That doesn't mean that they won't or can't learn - or acknowledge when they're out of their depth...



I agree...but I guess that's a risk with having animals, families or trying 'to do the right thing' full stop sometimes...  I had our first weanling last year and would be considered a 'novice owner'...  The vet, dentist and farrier find him a doddle to work with and we've managed not to kill/sour him yet...  He's also been a total joy to have around and brings a lot of laughter - often much needed as a hard hearted oldie myself...

Click to expand...

There's being 'novice' and then there's not being able to identify when you are riding a lame horse.  The latter is worrying for any horse owner.  Even more worrying that she was told what it could well be and yet still questioned whether it warranted a vet.  I would class myself as a novice corn snake owner, having never had snakes or even liked them much before getting two in the past couple of years - yet I would still be able to identify when something isn't right - and I wouldn't even question whether I should take them to a vet - I would just do it out of noticing that something is not right.  

As I said earlier - very well meaning, and sounds a lovely person, but no good is to be had from owning horses (particularly 'rescue') when you haven't got the most basic of knowledge which are necessary to ensure the horse doesn't suffer.  

I would have classed myself as novice at lunging properly before I got my current horse - because my previous one wouldn't lunge safely.  I taught myself through watching other people, but that is not likely in the grand scheme of things (unless of course I was thrashing her around in circles for hours on end) to cause her suffering.  Not being able to identify that something is wrong and you shouldn't be riding when your horse is 'hopping' with 'something called navicular' is no joke.


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## milesjess (12 June 2012)

Any news yet? 

Just like others you can't save them all... But you can sure try if you have the experience and space. But you rescue one and another pops up. 

http://www.dragondriving.co.uk/horseforsale-35197.html

... It's an endless, vicious cycle.


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## martlin (12 June 2012)

Ladydragon said:



			That is heartless...  The 20yr old could pootle along as a ridden for another 15yrs or so...  I think expecting 'for life' for a youngster (or any animal really) is tough even if the intent is there originally...  People's circumstances can change drastically even if they have the best put rescue plan in place...  If she bought it, brought it on with guidance to be a chirpy little healthy youngster, maybe had it professionally broken and at some point needed to sell it to a good home, would that be a bad thing?  People do it all the time...
		
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Yes, the 20 year old could live another 15 years or so, but it already had the education, is not going anywhere I presume and doesn't require bringing on. And there is a finite amount of time to the commitment.
With the youngster, it a very rocky road indeed, it isn't easy, although certainly not rocket science. If you leave out the viability of a poorly bred, poorly put together, worm ridden scrap (oops, heartless again ), it still leaves the girl with masses, absolute masses of work and money to spend, for what? It just spells out disaster to me, but maybe I'm a grumpy, cynical sod, that's all.
And BTW, buying that pony certainly is not rescuing.


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## Moomin1 (12 June 2012)

martlin said:



			Yes, the 20 year old could live another 15 years or so, but it already had the education, is not going anywhere I presume and doesn't require bringing on. And there is a finite amount of time to the commitment.
With the youngster, it a very rocky road indeed, it isn't easy, although certainly not rocket science. If you leave out the viability of a poorly bred, poorly put together, worm ridden scrap (oops, heartless again ), it still leaves the girl with masses, absolute masses of work and money to spend, for what? It just spells out disaster to me, but maybe I'm a grumpy, cynical sod, that's all.
And BTW, buying that pony certainly is not rescuing.
		
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I agree with your points here (although maybe worded slightly harshly in areas!!!  ).  There is no comparison from a novice (or COMPLETE novice in her own words) from taking a 20yr horse on than taking a weanling on.  And what Natalie feels was a 'difficult' case with her 20 year old may well be nothing of the sort to many experienced people.  Of course, all speculation and me just thinking out allowed.


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## Munchkin (12 June 2012)

martlin said:



			Yes, the 20 year old could live another 15 years or so, but it already had the education, is not going anywhere I presume and doesn't require bringing on. And there is a finite amount of time to the commitment.
With the youngster, it a very rocky road indeed, it isn't easy, although certainly not rocket science. If you leave out the viability of a poorly bred, poorly put together, worm ridden scrap (oops, heartless again ), it still leaves the girl with masses, absolute masses of work and money to spend, for what? It just spells out disaster to me, but maybe I'm a grumpy, cynical sod, that's all.
And BTW, buying that pony certainly is not rescuing.
		
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Agree with this. I would even go as far as to say that buying ponies like this is 'funding the mistreatment of horses' - that's their business, and by buying ponies like this, you're keeping this man and people like him, in business.

I don't think this story is going to have a happy ending


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## Goldenstar (12 June 2012)

martlin said:



			Yes, the 20 year old could live another 15 years or so, but it already had the education, is not going anywhere I presume and doesn't require bringing on. And there is a finite amount of time to the commitment.
With the youngster, it a very rocky road indeed, it isn't easy, although certainly not rocket science. If you leave out the viability of a poorly bred, poorly put together, worm ridden scrap (oops, heartless again ), it still leaves the girl with masses, absolute masses of work and money to spend, for what? It just spells out disaster to me, but maybe I'm a grumpy, cynical sod, that's all.
And BTW, buying that pony certainly is not rescuing.
		
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Well we are grumpy cynical sods , and you know I have seen worse sows ears turn into silk purses and I just don't think you can assume Natalie wont raise to the task I feel it's more likely it be Natalie that does the suffering not the filly .
There's no way that filly is a rescue poor yes a rescue no and those who say leave it to the authorities from what I have seen from the pictures it's poor not a welfare case I was curious enough to track down some fresian foals online earlier I am amazed if it's six months old but you never know.


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## Moomin1 (12 June 2012)

Goldenstar said:



			Well we are grumpy cynical sods , and you know I have seen worse sows ears turn into silk purses and I just don't think you can assume Natalie wont raise to the task I feel it's more likely it be Natalie that does the suffering not the filly .
There's no way that filly is a rescue poor yes a rescue no and those who say leave it to the authorities from what I have seen from the pictures it's poor not a welfare case I was curious enough to track down some fresian foals online earlier I am amazed if it's six months old but you never know.
		
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It may not be a welfare case, but it may well be a welfare notice that is needed.  I personally don't think it looks so horrendous at all - but it doesn't look great by any means.  I think a visit from the authorities wouldn't go amiss to have a look over the stock.


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## horsesatemymoney (12 June 2012)

s'teamed, you are talking rubbish and showing yourself to be ignorant and snobby....my horse is off there, and was also on many other sites.....you haven't seen him, so you can't assume that you know what he is like..... but, believe me, he's stunning.


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## touchstone (12 June 2012)

Moomin1 said:



			It may not be a welfare case, but it may well be a welfare notice that is needed.  I personally don't think it looks so horrendous at all - but it doesn't look great by any means.  I think a visit from the authorities wouldn't go amiss to have a look over the stock.
		
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I agree, but it wouldn't surprise me if you don't get to even see the premises, he could just turn up with it in a trailer in the pub car park!


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## horsesatemymoney (12 June 2012)

milesjess said:



			Any news yet? 

Just like others you can't save them all... But you can sure try if you have the experience and space. But you rescue one and another pops up. 

http://www.dragondriving.co.uk/horseforsale-35197.html

... It's an endless, vicious cycle.
		
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 Has this one got an open wound on it's offside hind?!


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## rema (12 June 2012)

A very nice Comtois on there...That would go nice with my two shire mares in the shafts.


http://www.dragondriving.co.uk/horseforsale-36131.html


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## Moomin1 (12 June 2012)

horsesatemymoney said:



 Has this one got an open wound on it's offside hind?! 

Click to expand...

Just looks like a bald patch to me.


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## milesjess (12 June 2012)

Think so, looks like a sore? He's skinny too  see his spine. 

Oddly his seller has many others who look really well.


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## ILuvCowparsely (12 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			Rhino, im sick of repeating myself just read my other comments again, your getting boring now. I don't have to explain myself to you or anybody! It is non of your business! And no it isn't "poor pony" it is in a home which she needs since her ORIGINAL owner wasnt a show home and that's where she needs to be. But yet again, non of your business but keep stalking my threads if you want you need to get out more! Il let the supportive people know what happens in a seperate thread! 

Click to expand...

^5  like this


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## horsesatemymoney (12 June 2012)

milesjess said:



			Think so, looks like a sore? He's skinny too  see his spine. 

Oddly his seller has many others who look really well.
		
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Poor boy :-(


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## horsesatemymoney (12 June 2012)

rema said:



			A very nice Comtois on there...That would go nice with my two shire mares in the shafts.


http://www.dragondriving.co.uk/horseforsale-36131.html

Click to expand...

Lovely! Kind of discredits S'teamed's claim about the site too


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## ILuvCowparsely (12 June 2012)

you have to take *S'teamed's*  (BB)  coment with a pinch of salt


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## rema (12 June 2012)

horsesatemymoney said:



			Lovely! Kind of discredits S'teamed's claim about the site too 

Click to expand...

I might have to take a trip up to have a look at it..how exiting it might become two poor ponies that will find a forever home.


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## RuthM (12 June 2012)

It is not going to end and the more money going in the longer it can go on.
http://www.dragondriving.co.uk/horseforsale-35196.html

http://www.dragondriving.co.uk/horseforsale-35594.html

http://www.dragondriving.co.uk/horseforsale-33827.html

There's more too. I don't think buyers are as responsible as the people that have done this but there is NO escaping from the fact that a buyer passes money which can go straight to getting another horse. I could not personally wash my hands of handing money to people to do this and when a person buys that's exactly what they do.


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## muppet (12 June 2012)

Another sad soul. http://www.dragondriving.co.uk/horseforsale-34705.html


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## Goldenstar (12 June 2012)

RuthM said:



			It is not going to end and the more money going in the longer it can go on.
http://www.dragondriving.co.uk/horseforsale-35196.html

http://www.dragondriving.co.uk/horseforsale-35594.html

http://www.dragondriving.co.uk/horseforsale-33827.html

There's more too. I don't think buyers are as responsible as the people that have done this but there is NO escaping from the fact that a buyer passes money which can go straight to getting another horse. I could not personally wash my hands of handing money to people to do this and when a person buys that's exactly what they do.
		
Click to expand...

I really don't see the issue with these horses except perhaps the dark bay who does look poor .
The mule looks fine a little dishevelled but nothing that a bit of TLC would not sort.
I would rather buy two year olds looking like the two coloured horses than a fat two year old show horse or a fat blob of a cob two hundred kilos too fat .


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## horsesatemymoney (12 June 2012)

rema said:



			I might have to take a trip up to have a look at it..how exiting it might become two poor ponies that will find a forever home.
		
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Let me know how you get on, lovely pony


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## Goldenstar (12 June 2012)

muppet said:



			Another sad soul. http://www.dragondriving.co.uk/horseforsale-34705.html

Click to expand...

Now that does look sad .


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## maisie06 (12 June 2012)

Poor mite looks bluddy awful - I doubt she is 6 months old - more like 4 at a push, and I dont agree with her being well wormed, or properly fed. I hope someone nice has her - if I had the space I'd take her on myself, make a nice driving pony.


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## horsesatemymoney (12 June 2012)

Any news on how the OP got on? Aside from the debates, I hope her and the pony are safe, whatever the outcome


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## mightymammoth (12 June 2012)

horsesatemymoney said:



			Any news on how the OP got on? Aside from the debates, I hope her and the pony are safe, whatever the outcome
		
Click to expand...

shes showing as online I'm hoping she will come on to update but she probably can't face another character assassination


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## RuthM (12 June 2012)

I would rather buy two year olds looking like the two coloured horses than a fat two year old show horse or a fat blob of a cob two hundred kilos too fat .
		
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In fairness you might have a point re them. I still think the others look pi** poor. My point is that a sad advert isn't hard to find but giving money to the folk selling is not going do anything towards reducing ill bred stock sold on for a few bucks.


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## Lynsey79 (12 June 2012)

Fools Motto said:



			The thing that strikes me more, is that filly doesn't look 6 months. She looks like a very poor yearling. I can't put my finger on it, but she doesn't look 'foaly' at all!!
Just hope that someone nice and kind can care for this poor soul.
		
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Totally agree defo not a 6 month foal, more like a hungry yearling bless her poor baby.


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## Moomin1 (12 June 2012)

victoria1980x said:



			shes showing as online I'm hoping she will come on to update but she probably can't face another character assassination 

Click to expand...

An observation of level of experience and words of advice can hardly be described as a 'character assassination'.  I don't see any nasty comments about her personality or character anywhere?


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## horsesatemymoney (12 June 2012)

I hope it's all worked out ok


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## Honey08 (12 June 2012)

I got the impression that Natalie had the bit well and truly between her teeth and wouldn't be remotely bothered by the criticism!  

There are actually a lot of nice horses and ponies on that site - even on the same pages as some of the links on this thread.  S'teamed can't see a bargain when its right in front of her perhaps?


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## ezililaur (12 June 2012)

Any news?


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## Ladydragon (12 June 2012)

Moomin1 said:



			There's being 'novice' and then there's not being able to identify when you are riding a lame horse.  The latter is worrying for any horse owner.  Even more worrying that she was told what it could well be and yet still questioned whether it warranted a vet.
<snipped for brevity so I don't take over the page again >
		
Click to expand...

Don't get me wrong...  I understand what you're saying - but sometimes a realisation of being somewhat wide of the mark can be a kick up the backside to get a learning head on...  I just don't want to presume that the lass can't or wouldn't up her game to deal with this little thing...  Particularly when the filly's current circumstances aren't sensational...



martlin said:



			Yes, the 20 year old could live another 15 years or so, but it already had the education, is not going anywhere I presume and doesn't require bringing on. And there is a finite amount of time to the commitment.
With the youngster, it a very rocky road indeed, it isn't easy, although certainly not rocket science. If you leave out the viability *of a poorly bred, poorly put together, worm ridden scrap (oops, heartless again ),* it still leaves the girl with masses, absolute masses of work and money to spend, for what? It just spells out disaster to me, but maybe I'm a grumpy, cynical sod, that's all.
And BTW, buying that pony certainly is not rescuing.
		
Click to expand...

My filly was 16mths when she had to be pts courtesy of a torsion so I don't necessarily presume the time commitments...  Yes, education is important but as you said, it's not rocket science and if a bit is outside your remit - you get someone else involved...  I've got no intention of breaking a horse myself...  People get their first baby at some point - arguably it's an unfamiliar road for anyone first time even if they've had yonks of owning horses or seeing other people's babies...

The bib...  It shouldn't have - but it did make me chuckle rather loudly...  



Moomin1 said:



			It may not be a welfare case, but it may well be a welfare notice that is needed.  I personally don't think it looks so horrendous at all - but it doesn't look great by any means.  I think a visit from the authorities wouldn't go amiss to have a look over the stock.
		
Click to expand...

Agreed...  It's poor but not about to keel over...  Doesn't inspire me with confidence about the husbandry though...


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## ELFSBELLS (12 June 2012)

Any news ??


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

I don't know who the hell some of you think you are! Saying I ride my lame old horse! What a *******ing evil thing to say?! I might be a novice but I'm not freakin cruel!! Some of you are just CRUEL! Get out of your own arses and get out more, bloody boring old farts! Doing a separate thread about the little filly for the people who actually care!


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## Moomin1 (12 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			I don't know who the hell some of you think you are! Saying I ride my lame old horse! What a *******ing evil thing to say?! I might be a novice but I'm not freakin cruel!! Some of you are just CRUEL! Get out of your own arses and get out more, bloody boring old farts! Doing a separate thread about the little filly for the people who actually care!
		
Click to expand...

Err, you posted on your own thread that every time you ride/rode your horse the other people at the yard would say that she doesn't lift her front leg properly and hops on it.  That's lameness.

And I actually retract the comments I have made about you sounding to be a lovely person.  You actually sound like a childish foul mouthed and short tempered person who can't take any constructive advice or criticism.


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## midi (12 June 2012)

brat with more money that sense imo


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## Moomin1 (12 June 2012)

midi said:



			brat with more money that sense imo
		
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Quite.


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## moosea (12 June 2012)

Moomin1 said:



			other people at the yard would say that she doesn't lift her front leg properly and hops on it.  That's lameness.
		
Click to expand...

Impressed at your ability to diagnose lameness via forum posts... now that's what I call experienced


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## hairycob (12 June 2012)

Actually love, you said it.


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## Moomin1 (12 June 2012)

moosea said:



			Impressed at your ability to diagnose lameness via forum posts... now that's what I call experienced 

Click to expand...

It's not hard given the fact her own post said her 'experienced' friends told her that it could be navicular.....Of course, those experienced friends in that case have got it wrong and the horse obviously hasn't displayed any lameness, despite it 'hopping' and not lifting it's foreleg properly when ridden.  These of course would be the very same 'experienced' people helping her with the youngster.


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## moosea (12 June 2012)

Moomin1 said:



			It's not hard given the fact her own post said her 'experienced' friends told her that it could be navicular.....Of course, those experienced friends in that case have got it wrong and the horse obviously hasn't displayed any lameness, despite it 'hopping' and not lifting it's foreleg properly when ridden.  These of course would be the very same 'experienced' people helping her with the youngster.  

Click to expand...

And what did you think when you saw the horse run up?


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## Moomin1 (12 June 2012)

moosea said:



			And what did you think when you saw the horse run up?
		
Click to expand...

Despite whether the horse may have been lame or not - she openly says she doesn't know what navicular is BECAUSE SHE IS A COMPLETE NOVICE.  That is all I have commented on - she shouldn't be taking on a youngster 'rescue' when she hasn't got the experience to look after a horse at this point.  Basic knowledge is lacking.


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## moosea (12 June 2012)

I suppose you were born with all knowledge then?


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## hairycob (12 June 2012)

Moosea,

Moomin is going on the description that Natalieshort has posted asking for advice - if you read the post would you really come to the conclusion that the horse was not lame? Really, honestly, truly would you not think it?
And do you really think that a novive is the best person to take on a very poor baby with unkown issues? Honestly - do you realy think that is a good idea for horse or owner?


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## sallyballybee (12 June 2012)

well cheers guys due to this MASSIVE thread and me having to read the whole thing............................i've missed half of the new CSI!!!


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## moosea (12 June 2012)

hairycob said:



			Moosea,

Moomin is going on the description that Natalieshort has posted asking for advice - if you read the post would you really come to the conclusion that the horse was not lame? Really, honestly, truly would you not think it?
		
Click to expand...

I don't know - I haven't seen it


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## Moomin1 (12 June 2012)

moosea said:



			I suppose you were born with all knowledge then?
		
Click to expand...

No, I went to riding schools for years and attended courses, pony club (as a viewer because I didn't have my own), then got an older experienced horse which I rode UNDER THE SUPERVISION of my riding instructress (it was her horse), then I took him on full time after years of riding and looking after him UNDER her supervision.  I then progressed and started competing locally, before he eventually died aged 40 years.  I then had an 11 year break in horses, other than to do a degree in Equine Science, and bought my current horse two years ago.

I would have never taken on a youngster at the stage where I couldn't identify lameness or have basic knowledge of ailments.


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## horsesatemymoney (12 June 2012)

Doing a separate thread about the little filly for the people who actually care![/QUOTE]

Please, I'd like to know how you got on


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## hairycob (12 June 2012)

Moosea - read the bl**dy description of the horses action & Natalieshorts own description of her abilitry then put your head on the block before you condemn people who take the bother


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## Moomin1 (12 June 2012)

moosea said:



			I don't know - I haven't seen it
		
Click to expand...

Well maybe you should read it then before coming to any conclusions..


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## moosea (12 June 2012)

Moomin1 said:



			No, I went to riding schools for years and attended courses, pony club (as a viewer because I didn't have my own), then got an older experienced horse which I rode UNDER THE SUPERVISION of my riding instructress (it was her horse), then I took him on full time after years of riding and looking after him UNDER her supervision.  I then progressed and started competing locally, before he eventually died aged 40 years.  I then had an 11 year break in horses, other than to do a degree in Equine Science, and bought my current horse two years ago.

I would have never taken on a youngster at the stage where I couldn't identify lameness or have basic knowledge of ailments.
		
Click to expand...


So you built your experience up? over time?


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## moosea (12 June 2012)

Moomin1 said:



			Well maybe you should read it then before coming to any conclusions..
		
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Still wouldn't be able to say it was lame or sound from a forum post


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## moosea (12 June 2012)

hairycob said:



			Moosea - read the bl**dy description of the horses action & Natalieshorts own description of her abilitry then put your head on the block before you condemn people who take the bother
		
Click to expand...

I can't diagnose lameness from a forum post


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## Moomin1 (12 June 2012)

moosea said:



			So you built your experience up? over time?
		
Click to expand...

That's how most people get experience yes.  And I still wouldn't class myself as experienced enough to bring a youngster of that age on without a lot of other help.  

I find it unbelievable people could even suggest or support the idea of someone who in their own words IS A COMPLETE NOVICE to take on a yearling/youngster, particularly one which will not have been best handled and has probably just been pulled from the field.


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## hairycob (12 June 2012)

So if I said my horse was non weight bearing on his off fore and was reluctant to walk you wouldn't realise he was lame? Honestly?


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## Moomin1 (12 June 2012)

moosea said:



			I can't diagnose lameness from a forum post
		
Click to expand...

You're missing the point entirely - it is not about whether the horse is lame or not - it is the point that she says she is a complete novice and doesn't know what navicular is.  The whole fact that her 'experienced' friends have suggested it could be navicular and yet she ponders as to whether that requires EVEN MENTIONING to a vet is not someone who has the knowledge, IMO, to actually own any horse at her stage in time, never mind a youngster.


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## Amaranta (12 June 2012)

moosea said:



			I don't know - I haven't seen it
		
Click to expand...

Whether the horse is lame or not is neither here nor there, the crux of the matter is that the OP is unable to tell (this by her own admission), she also said that the horse 'hopped' on one leg when she brought it in from the field, if this is the case then the lameness is pretty advanced, yet she still wondered if she should point it out to the vet!  Sorry but even the most novice of people would have the common sense to know that something was not quite right, but our OP did not notice a thing until other liveries pointed it out, correction, she did notice it but thought nothing was wrong with it.

Is this really a good owner for a poorly started youngster?  I think not.


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

No. She isn't lame it's an infection because of how her old owner kept her in a **** sodden stable! NOT LAME! She was an ex trotter and apparently this is what she is used to. I shouldn't even be telling all of you this because it is none of your business! I thought some of you would be decent enough to give me advice and yes some are, but not you lot! You jump at any chance to give people **** over the Internet, you need to get a life! Really boring now


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## moosea (12 June 2012)

She wouldn't be the first, or the last, to do so. 

Doesn't mean she would succeed or that she would fail


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## Lady La La (12 June 2012)

"S'teamed cant spot a bargain when its right in front of her" 

Lolling way too much at this...  
I'd have several of her ponies off her before you can say 'bargain'


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## moosea (12 June 2012)

hairycob said:



			So if I said my horse was non weight bearing on his off fore and was reluctant to walk you wouldn't realise he was lame? Honestly?
		
Click to expand...

That's not what she said


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## hairycob (12 June 2012)

My horse was LAME because of a skin  INFECTION. Horses can be LAME because of an abcess which is an INFECTION. Lameness is a SYMPTOM not a complaint in itself. If you don't know that it's agood job the dealer didn't turn up.


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## Mongoose11 (12 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			No. She isn't lame it's an infection because of how her old owner kept her in a **** sodden stable! NOT LAME! She was an ex trotter and apparently this is what she is used to. I shouldn't even be telling all of you this because it is none of your business! I thought some of you would be decent enough to give me advice and yes some are, but not you lot! You jump at any chance to give people **** over the Internet, you need to get a life! Really boring now
		
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Natalie, the horse 'sounds' lame due to the infection. Very basically a horse is considered lame if it can not walk/trot/move 'properly' or function is limited in one or more of it's legs..... a horse can be lame for many reasons x


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## Amaranta (12 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			No. She isn't lame it's an infection because of how her old owner kept her in a **** sodden stable! NOT LAME! She was an ex trotter and apparently this is what she is used to. I shouldn't even be telling all of you this because it is none of your business! I thought some of you would be decent enough to give me advice and yes some are, but not you lot! You jump at any chance to give people **** over the Internet, you need to get a life! Really boring now
		
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She IS lame through an infection, I see you are blaming the previous owner but have had the horse 4 months?  Did you not spot she was uncomfortable before this?  Does she have a punctured sole or is it thrush?  Or don't you know?


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## Moomin1 (12 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			No. She isn't lame it's an infection because of how her old owner kept her in a **** sodden stable! NOT LAME! She was an ex trotter and apparently this is what she is used to. I shouldn't even be telling all of you this because it is none of your business! I thought some of you would be decent enough to give me advice and yes some are, but not you lot! You jump at any chance to give people **** over the Internet, you need to get a life! Really boring now
		
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Oh please god this gets worse.


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## hairycob (12 June 2012)

Moosea  you said you couldn't diagnose lameness from a forum. I gave you a description of lameness that was no less clear than the description Natalieshort gave. If you really can't see that I doubt you could if it was a live horse in front of you.


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## Goldenstar (12 June 2012)

hairycob said:



			Moosea,

Moomin is going on the description that Natalieshort has posted asking for advice - if you read the post would you really come to the conclusion that the horse was not lame? Really, honestly, truly would you not think it?
And do you really think that a novive is the best person to take on a very poor baby with unkown issues? Honestly - do you realy think that is a good idea for horse or owner?
		
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If a novice consults a good equine vet gets an experianced person to help her with the handling then why should it be a disaster it's not the same as a novice saying I bought this thin poor six yo racehorse and I am going to retrain him it's ok because I have had a twenty year old to ride.
Handling horses is not rocket science and one thing I don't like on here is when less experianced people are ridiculed and this thread has verged on that at times Natalie may not be the most experianced HHOer but this filly needs handling the correct food a health check apporiate worming under veterinary supervision and someone to care for her .
When I was a welfare officer I saw many horses who needed a knight in shining armor they usually did not get one I became cynical in the end but I hope perhaps for this little horse there are better times ahead, and from the look of her it's not going to be worse.


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## rhino (12 June 2012)

OP - so I take it you had the vet out today who has diagnosed the infection and started your mare on antibiotics? Well done


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

What the hell has it got to do with you? This is making me laugh now! LOL! If you actually see my horse you wouldn't be saying all of this  infact I should put a before and after picture up! Rub it in your faces abit! Oh and ACTUALLY "amaranta" she isn't lame through an infection I'm sure the vet has more knowledge than you


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## moosea (12 June 2012)

Amaranta said:



			Whether the horse is lame or not is neither here nor there, the crux of the matter is that the OP is unable to tell (this by her own admission), she also said that the horse 'hopped' on one leg when she brought it in from the field, if this is the case then the lameness is pretty advanced, yet she still wondered if she should point it out to the vet!  Sorry but even the most novice of people would have the common sense to know that something was not quite right, but our OP did not notice a thing until other liveries pointed it out, correction, she did notice it but thought nothing was wrong with it.
		
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I've known people who've hunted three times a week that couldn't tell their horse is lame!!

The horse was 'hopping' .. but she came here, god knows why, to the largest bunch of un-supportive nasties in the horse world ... and asked for advice... to try to help her horse.



Amaranta said:



			Is this really a good owner for a poorly started youngster?  I think not.
		
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Probably not the best outcome for the filly, but possibly a little better than where she is now?


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## moosea (12 June 2012)

hairycob said:



			Moosea  you said you couldn't diagnose lameness from a forum. I gave you a description of lameness that was no less clear than the description Natalieshort gave. If you really can't see that I doubt you could if it was a live horse in front of you.
		
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Well you'd be wrong then.


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## Ibblebibble (12 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			I don't know who the hell some of you think you are! Saying I ride my lame old horse! What a *******ing evil thing to say?! I might be a novice but I'm not freakin cruel!! Some of you are just CRUEL! Get out of your own arses and get out more, bloody boring old farts! Doing a separate thread about the little filly for the people who actually care!
		
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Natalieshort said:



			No. She isn't lame it's an infection because of how her old owner kept her in a **** sodden stable! NOT LAME! She was an ex trotter and apparently this is what she is used to. I shouldn't even be telling all of you this because it is none of your business! I thought some of you would be decent enough to give me advice and yes some are, but not you lot! You jump at any chance to give people **** over the Internet, you need to get a life! Really boring now
		
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us boring old farts are the ones that usually end up picking up the pieces after stroppy teens like yourself bite off more than they can chew one thing you'll find on this forum, and in the big wide world is that people will gladly give advice and support to people who bother to listen. perhaps you should take some of your own advice re head and arse !


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## Amaranta (12 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			What the hell has it got to do with you? This is making me laugh now! LOL! If you actually see my horse you wouldn't be saying all of this  infact I should put a before and after picture up! Rub it in your faces abit! Oh and ACTUALLY "amaranta" she isn't lame through an infection I'm sure the vet has more knowledge than you 

Click to expand...

So why was she 'hopping' on one leg if she was not lame to the point that the other liveries suggested navicular?  Do you know where the infection is sited?  Is it in her foot?


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## mightymammoth (12 June 2012)

Goldenstar said:



			If a novice consults a good equine vet gets an experianced person to help her with the handling then why should it be a disaster it's not the same as a novice saying I bought this thin poor six yo racehorse and I am going to retrain him it's ok because I have had a twenty year old to ride.
Handling horses is not rocket science and one thing I don't like on here is when less experianced people are ridiculed and this thread has verged on that at times Natalie may not be the most experianced HHOer but this filly needs handling the correct food a health check apporiate worming under veterinary supervision and someone to care for her .
When I was a welfare officer I saw many horses who needed a knight in shining armor they usually did not get one I became cynical in the end but I hope perhaps for this little horse there are better times ahead, and from the look of her it's not going to be worse.
		
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thank goodness someone is talking sense x


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## rema (12 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			What the hell has it got to do with you? This is making me laugh now! LOL! If you actually see my horse you wouldn't be saying all of this  infact I should put a before and after picture up! Rub it in your faces abit! Oh and ACTUALLY "amaranta" she isn't lame through an infection I'm sure the vet has more knowledge than you 

Click to expand...

Does she have an infection in her foot/hoof like thrush or maybe an abscess?.I would love to see some photo's she sounds a real sweetie..


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

Yeah I did ask for advice but not for nasty people like you! If you actually said it nicely and not comment on everything then fair enough!! But it isn't fair when I'm trying to do somethig good but people still say **** and nasty comments, just pathetic


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## Mongoose11 (12 June 2012)

rema said:



			I would love to see some photo's she sounds a real sweetie..
		
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Naughty Rema or genuine Rema?


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## Amaranta (12 June 2012)

Billie1007 said:



			Naughty Rema or genuine Rema? 

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Naughty methinks


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## moosea (12 June 2012)

Another vote for naughty!


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## rema (12 June 2012)

Billie1007 said:



			Naughty Rema or genuine Rema? 

Click to expand...

Ermmmm not sure what this comment means..There is only one Rema!!.


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## mightymammoth (12 June 2012)

Billie1007 said:



			Naughty Rema or genuine Rema? 

Click to expand...

 

I don't think Natalie should post any photos can you imagine the fall out from that.


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## Ibblebibble (12 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			Yeah I did ask for advice but not for nasty people like you! If you actually said it nicely and not comment on everything then fair enough!! But it isn't fair when I'm trying to do somethig good but people still say **** and nasty comments, just pathetic
		
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the only one being foul mouthed  and nasty is yourself. if you want advice you have to be prepared to have comments that might not be all sweetness and sugar, life is like that, no one is being nasty, just trying to make you see that taking on a young filly when you have already said you didn't think you were experienced enough is probably not a great idea.


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## Littlelegs (12 June 2012)

Amaranta has summed it up pretty well for me. 
  Just to add in, I have a pony who was 'rescued' with her dam by a well meaning person with no experience or back up. The result was it ending in such a state I bought it on impulse as a yearling & brought it home in a car boot late one Sunday evening, an hour after I saw it. The state of tilly is not half as upsetting as the state mine was in after a year with a do gooder who didn't have a clue. Would have bought dam too but had died under the well wishers care when mine was 3 months old. Now 5 & fab though!


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## hairycob (12 June 2012)

Goldenstar, while natalieshort may have the best of intentions, fom her other posts it is clear that :
She does not know when she needs to consult a Vet.  Surely if you are a sensible novice, your horse is hopping & tripping & an experienced person suggests navicular you do 2 things - google it & talk to your vet.
She has also stated that this is a project for the whole yard because she doesn't have the experience but I don't get the impression that she has spent much of today discussing how this will work. See also the above point where she doesn't seem to have taken on board advice from more experienced people.
She also has a history of poor purchasing decisions e.g. not realising how small a pony was until she got it home. 
I agree that a level headed novice who has a very experienced person they can trust & rely on  & is good at asking for & taking advice may actually be a very good owner of a youngster. However natalieshort does not give that impression in her posts & I suspect that if she had managed to buy the filly 3 months down the line she would be a failed project looking for a new home again. I suspect that although she started out with the best of intentions it was an ill thought out kneejerk reaction based on a fantasy outcome.


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## rema (12 June 2012)

Well i'm sorry but i think if this person want to get this filly then it is her money,her choice...I think that if she does then both she and Tilly could benefit from some Parelli work to build up some trust and confidence..I do not expect this filly has had alot of handling in it's poor little life.


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## Dolcé (12 June 2012)

Lady La La said:



			"S'teamed cant spot a bargain when its right in front of her" 

Lolling way too much at this...  
I'd have several of her ponies off her before you can say 'bargain' 

Click to expand...

Yep, made me laugh too, as did the one about her being snobbish!


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## ILuvCowparsely (12 June 2012)

This has gone on long  enough . We have totally digressed away from the original topic which was about  Tilly.  Then Natalie said she would go view her and we were waiting for  the  update .  Now it seems like ever one but a view members  are  s going on  and on at her,

I wish H&H could lock threads like some other forums do so no more can be added too it  once a climax is reached.


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## Mongoose11 (12 June 2012)

There is a separate thread about the viewing that never was.


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## Flame_ (12 June 2012)

Natalie, if you feel you are ready and the time is right to buy a foal (although evidence suggests you may be being rather optimistic) you should go to a reputable breeder and pay the sort of money it costs to breed and raise a healthy, quality animal, not giving a few hundred quid to the muppet who bred this. It would be a wiser investment for you and these are the breeders who deserve support.


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## Goldenstar (12 June 2012)

littlelegs said:



			Amaranta has summed it up pretty well for me. 
  Just to add in, I have a pony who was 'rescued' with her dam by a well meaning person with no experience or back up. The result was it ending in such a state I bought it on impulse as a yearling & brought it home in a car boot late one Sunday evening, an hour after I saw it. The state of tilly is not half as upsetting as the state mine was in after a year with a do gooder who didn't have a clue. Would have bought dam too but had died under the well wishers care when mine was 3 months old. Now 5 & fab though!
		
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This was not a rescue but a purchase and why would anyone assume that Natalie would not feed and care for the filly well .
Every one learns as they go along I dont know how else you gain experiance.


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## Amaranta (12 June 2012)

Dolcé;10796244 said:
			
		


			Yep, made me laugh too, as did the one about her being snobbish! 

Click to expand...

had a little chuckle myself


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## horsesatemymoney (12 June 2012)

Ah, well, me and the other posters who were offended by her comments about DD are obviously not in the 'know', hey?  I take people at face value, on what they post, regardless of who they are in 'real life;' bit hard to identify tongue in cheek comments on a forum, unless I'm especially dumb?!


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## Natalieshort (12 June 2012)

I didn't buy her. There was no viewing.


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## ILuvCowparsely (12 June 2012)

Shame  really .  Would have been a nice end to the day another pony rescued.. At least you tried Natalie.


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## Ladydragon (12 June 2012)

Goldenstar said:



			If a novice consults a good equine vet gets an experianced person to help her with the handling then why should it be a disaster it's not the same as a novice saying I bought this thin poor six yo racehorse and I am going to retrain him it's ok because I have had a twenty year old to ride.
Handling horses is not rocket science and one thing I don't like on here is when less experianced people are ridiculed and this thread has verged on that at times Natalie may not be the most experianced HHOer but this filly needs handling the correct food a health check apporiate worming under veterinary supervision and someone to care for her .
When I was a welfare officer I saw many horses who needed a knight in shining armor they usually did not get one I became cynical in the end but I hope perhaps for this little horse there are better times ahead, and from the look of her it's not going to be worse.
		
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Agreed...

Maybe we should decide that novice parents should be presumed incapable of turning out well rounded humans if bringing on a young horse is such a herculean task... 

I thought experience was a learning process...


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## milesjess (12 June 2012)

Never mind Natalie. Agree, atleast you actually gave it a go at rehoming her. Good on you


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## Littlelegs (12 June 2012)

Sorry if it came across as a direct comparison between Natalie & the previous owner of mine, didn't mean it that way. Granted mine was at the extreme end of the spectrum but the fact is, like Natalie hoped to do, mine was bought out of a desire to help & 'save' for want of a better description. And the owner of mine had less experience than Natalie appears to. But without the knowledge or back up to tell you how to feed or care for them, the best intentions can become monumental screw ups very quickly. No argument everyone has to learn & that a beginner can do well with sufficient help. But on a forum, I can only go off previous posts, & Natalies don't lead me to believe she has either, despite having the best intentions.


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## Ladydragon (13 June 2012)

Numpties everywhere...

Not yet 2 but broken to ride and drive

*heads off to bang head on desk*


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## 'S'teamed (13 June 2012)

Pony is still for sale...

Vendor hadn't had any calls for a viewing yesterday...so who wants to have a go today then?


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## RuthM (13 June 2012)

Cat... pigeons... Someone get the yard brush, I sense feathers all over the place!


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## Dolcé (13 June 2012)

'S'teamed said:



			Pony is still for sale...

Vendor hadn't had any calls for a viewing yesterday...so who wants to have a go today then?



Click to expand...

Aw, and I was soooo tempted to make that call and ask, I thought they would think I was mad. Why am I not surprised, getting intuitive in my old age I think!


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## Lady La La (13 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			There was no viewing.
		
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Would that be because no call was ever made to arrange one?


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## Goldenstar (13 June 2012)

Dolcé;10797112 said:
			
		


			Aw, and I was soooo tempted to make that call and ask, I thought they would think I was mad. Why am I not surprised, getting intuitive in my old age I think!
		
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Oh well it saved me from the housework yesterday sadly it's all still there today.


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## Ibblebibble (13 June 2012)

'S'teamed said:



			Pony is still for sale...

Vendor hadn't had any calls for a viewing yesterday...so who wants to have a go today then?



Click to expand...

hmmm now why isn't that a surprise, i guess a certain poster will have gone back under her bridge.....trip trap trip trap


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## Mongoose11 (13 June 2012)

'S'teamed said:



			Pony is still for sale...

Vendor hadn't had any calls for a viewing yesterday...so who wants to have a go today then?



Click to expand...

 Seems like people may have wasted their time with concern and advice.


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## Feathered (13 June 2012)

Why does this not surprise me... 

What some people will say for a bit of attention. N'owt as funny as folk. As they say.


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## RuthM (13 June 2012)

I feel soooo guilty. I'm clicking refresh to watch when the supporters turn up!

But still, individuals aside, I stand by my 1st post way back on page 6 ish. Animal welfare depends on financially supporting good animal husbandry. Even 50 quid is 50 too much to give where you know it can go straight towards further bad care, and someone that has had many for sale will buy again. Thinking that is not a known factor is verging on willful ignorance. The chances of it not being so are somewhere in the region of a lottery jackpot win!

It's not about sacrificing poor sweet Tilly, it's about wanting fewer Tillys. Boycotting bad traders will certainly not stop it but over time it can have an effect to reduce suffering. Supporting them won't double it overnight but over time is has the effect of increasing suffering. 

I can't click in to watch the fireworks without nailing my own colours where they belong!


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## Amymay (13 June 2012)

Feathered said:



			Why does this not surprise me... 

What some people will say for a bit of attention. N'owt as funny as folk. As they say.
		
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And you've come to this conclusion based on one post, stating that no call was made?


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## Feathered (13 June 2012)

Oh no I've come to that conclusion over years!! 

But I am tending to believe S'teamed's post rather than Natalie's....


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## Ladydragon (13 June 2012)

amymay said:



			And you've come to this conclusion based on one post, stating that no call was made?
		
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Must be some phone tapping ability going on that I don't know about...


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## Amymay (13 June 2012)

Feathered said:



			But I am tending to believe S'teamed's post rather than Natalie's....
		
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Good for you


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## Littlelegs (13 June 2012)

In fairness, even if the dealer says nobody called I wouldn't rate them as a highly believable character.
  And if its true, then is it not possible that Natalie maybe had second thoughts but didn't want to admit it? Her responses to those (including myself) who thought she wasn't best placed to buy the horse show she was a bit sensitive, so unlikely to immediately say 'actually you're right, bad idea'. I'd rather give her the benefit of the doubt & think if she was lying it was to save face, rather than accusing her of attention seeking or being a troll. Until I have reason to believe otherwise, I think her only fault was lack of experience & being a bit thin skinned, not exactly evil crimes.


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## PaddyMonty (13 June 2012)

littlelegs said:



			I think her only fault was lack of experience & being a bit thin skinned, not exactly evil crimes.
		
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....unless on HHO


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## Vixen Van Debz (13 June 2012)

Surely a dealer/seller would want to say there had been calls even if they weren't, to try and get potential leads to snap her up ahead of competiton? Between the dealer bluntly saying no and knowing S'teamed on and off the forum, I believe her when she's realyed to us that no call was ever made.


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## Goldenstar (13 June 2012)

Vixen Van Debz said:



			Surely a dealer/seller would want to say there had been calls even if they weren't, to try and get potential leads to snap her up ahead of competiton? Between the dealer bluntly saying no and knowing S'teamed on and off the forum, I believe her when she's realyed to us that no call was ever made.
		
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She relayed to us that she was told no call was made .i certainly am happy to believe that.


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## Littlelegs (13 June 2012)

Goldenstar has put it very well for me already.


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## SarahAndScout (13 June 2012)

Wow this thread has sure taken some funny twists and turns since I last posted!


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## Wagtail (13 June 2012)

Feathered said:



			Oh no I've come to that conclusion over years!! 

But I am tending to believe S'teamed's post rather than Natalie's....
		
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So you believe the seller would divulge whether he had a phone call yesterday to a complete stranger? 

I don't know about you, but if I am selling something, I like to tell people I have had a lot on interest, not tell people that no one has called if they have. Yes, the plot thickens...


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## rara007 (13 June 2012)

I still don't see why this pony needs to be 'saved' ?  It's for sale, and if anyone wants it they can buy it, but it's hardly a rescue in that case is it


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## SuperCoblet (13 June 2012)

This thread gets wierder and wierder


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## pip6 (13 June 2012)

As an aside, I went on the DD site which I have to confess I would usually avoid like the plague, not liking to see cobs, youngsters broken at silly ages etc. Sorry to all cob owners, but they just don't float my boat. The thing that really made me sad was the heavy chestnut fillt described as having 'severe bog burn'. If it's that bad they put it in the main advert info, you wonder how long this animal has been left without the very basic level of husbandry and vet attention. Poor girl.


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## Fairynuff (13 June 2012)

pip6 said:



			As an aside, I went on the DD site which I have to confess I would usually avoid like the plague, not liking to see cobs, youngsters broken at silly ages etc. Sorry to all cob owners, but they just don't float my boat. The thing that really made me sad was the heavy chestnut fillt described as having 'severe bog burn'. If it's that bad they put it in the main advert info, you wonder how long this animal has been left without the very basic level of husbandry and vet attention. Poor girl.

Click to expand...

I may be wrong, but, bog burn is when the feathers are ruined eg stained/thinned etc. I doubt very much that A, the animal would be in pain and B, a vet would be interested. 

FWIW I dont see the filly needing much more than a good grooming a wormer and a good dose of Doc Green.


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## Paint Me Proud (13 June 2012)

pip6 said:



			As an aside, I went on the DD site which I have to confess I would usually avoid like the plague, not liking to see cobs, youngsters broken at silly ages etc. Sorry to all cob owners, but they just don't float my boat. The thing that really made me sad was the heavy chestnut fillt described as having 'severe bog burn'. If it's that bad they put it in the main advert info, you wonder how long this animal has been left without the very basic level of husbandry and vet attention. Poor girl.

Click to expand...

The trend on DD at the moment is for yards and yards of feather on your cobs. So i have noticed that the sellers, if they have a horse that doesnt have alot of feather, say it is bog burned hence the lack of feather. People buy them and they wonder why they dont grow the feather back.....they never had any in the first place.


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## flump (13 June 2012)

Have only read a few of the posts but just to let you know the little grey mule is sold, i rang him up yesterday and wanted to go up today but he's gone  Hopefully a nice happy home


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## Natalieshort (13 June 2012)

The vendor said he had no calls made for a viewing? :S well thats a damn lie! We went and we stayed for half an hour and he didnt turn up! then he text me at 9ish saying "sorry couldnt turn up, maybe another time" and has actually text my boyfriend again, when would we like another visit!!


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## Ladydragon (13 June 2012)

Wagtail said:



			So you believe the seller would divulge whether he had a phone call yesterday to a complete stranger? 

I don't know about you, but if I am selling something, I like to tell people I have had a lot on interest, not tell people that no one has called if they have. Yes, the plot thickens...
		
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Apparently so... 

Although personally, even if I had rung the seller and they'd said something along those lines, I wouldn't presume it to be factual unless I'd actually had my beady little eye on the phone...


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## Wagtail (13 June 2012)

Ladydragon said:



			Apparently so... 

Although personally, even if I had rung the seller and they'd said something along those lines, I wouldn't presume it to be factual unless I'd actually had my beady little eye on the phone...

Click to expand...

I think S'teamed was just playing a hunch TBH.


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## Moomin1 (13 June 2012)

I take it the excitement and glamour of buying Tilly has worn off for Natalie now then...

No mention of getting back in touch with the seller...

That lasted long!  Dedication at it's finest


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## Ladydragon (13 June 2012)

Moomin1 said:



			I take it the excitement and glamour of buying Tilly has worn off for Natalie now then...

No mention of getting back in touch with the seller...

That lasted long!  Dedication at it's finest
		
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No...but according to her last post, the seller did contact her... 

Gotta be honest though, if I was Natalie whether I decided to go and see/get her or not I wouldn't mention it on here...

Damned if she does and damned if she doesn't...


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## Moomin1 (13 June 2012)

Ladydragon said:



			No...but according to her last post, the seller did contact her... 

Gotta be honest though, if I was Natalie whether I decided to go and see/get her or not I wouldn't mention it on here...

Damned if she does and damned if she doesn't...
		
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I suppose you are right.  If Natalie is that touchy about being told she needs more experience at taking on a youngster then I think she would think twice about posting again!


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## Natalieshort (14 June 2012)

Im not being touchy about the whole experience thing. It's just boring now, that is all


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## Ibblebibble (14 June 2012)

Moomin1 said:



			I take it the excitement and glamour of buying Tilly has worn off for Natalie now then...

No mention of getting back in touch with the seller...

That lasted long!  Dedication at it's finest
		
Click to expand...




Natalieshort said:



			Im not being touchy about the whole experience thing. It's just boring now, that is all 

Click to expand...

this is probably the answer to your question moomin it's all got 'boring' now


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## martlin (14 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			Im not being touchy about the whole experience thing. It's just boring now, that is all 

Click to expand...

And that's why decided to drag this thread back up


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## Jazzy B (14 June 2012)

An fine example of The Horse and Hound forum at its absolute worst!


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## Natalieshort (14 June 2012)

Seriously, how old are you both? And your arguing with someone over the internet trying to be all cocky? LOL  It actually makes me laugh now, just shows how exciting your lives must be!


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## Ibblebibble (14 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			Seriously, how old are you both? And your arguing with someone over the internet trying to be all cocky? LOL  It actually makes me laugh now, just shows how exciting your lives must be!
		
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who? if you use the quote button it will help people know who you're talking to


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## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			Im not being touchy about the whole experience thing. It's just boring now, that is all 

Click to expand...

I don't understand. Just over a day ago you were all moved and fired up, wanting to save the foal asap... but now it's "just boring"? 

The guy didn't turn up, but he did apologize and try to re-arrange. If I wanted that horse, I'd be trying again...


----------



## noodle_ (14 June 2012)

rara007 said:



			I still don't see why this pony needs to be 'saved' ?  It's for sale, and if anyone wants it they can buy it, but it's hardly a rescue in that case is it 

Click to expand...

this ^


i havent read all the posts as its becoming a bit of a joke...

its not a welfare case... if someone wants the horse - buy it. end of


----------



## Natalieshort (14 June 2012)

FionaM12 said:



			I don't understand. Just over a day ago you were all moved and fired up, wanting to save the foal asap... but now it's "just boring"? 

The guy didn't turn up, but he did apologize and try to re-arrange. If I wanted that horse, I'd be trying again... 

Click to expand...


I didnt say anything about the foal is boring? I meant everybody getting to over involved and trying to be funny about it is boring. Yes but not everybody knows my business? I may be going to see it again or i may of ALREADY of seen it, infact the woman who owns the livery im on has a friesian and is OBSESSED is really interested about her.. but yet again, i dont have to tell everybody my business


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## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			I didnt say anything about the foal is boring? I meant everybody getting to over involved and trying to be funny about it is boring. Yes but not everybody knows my business? I may be going to see it again or i may of ALREADY of seen it, infact the woman who owns the livery im on has a friesian and is OBSESSED is really interested about her.. but yet again, i dont have to tell everybody my business 

Click to expand...

No, fair enough, you don't.  Sorry I misunderstood what was boring! 

I do hope it all works out for little Tilly and that someone takes good care of her. I'm in the same area as you, and am having to sit on my hands to stop myself phoning. I couldn't take her on, it would be madness, but sometimes it's hard to sensible.


----------



## Persephone (14 June 2012)

I wouldn't be surprised if the seller or someone they know hasn't seen this thread,and that is why there was no viewing.


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## Natalieshort (14 June 2012)

Persephone said:



			I wouldn't be surprised if the seller or someone they know hasn't seen this thread,and that is why there was no viewing.
		
Click to expand...

No he hasnt seen this thread.


----------



## Persephone (14 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			No he hasnt seen this thread. 

Click to expand...

And you know because?


----------



## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

Persephone said:



			I wouldn't be surprised if the seller or someone they know hasn't seen this thread,and that is why there was no viewing.
		
Click to expand...

Except he apologized and has been texting trying to rearrange. Surely he wouldn't if that was case?


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## Natalieshort (14 June 2012)

Persephone said:



			And you know because?
		
Click to expand...

Have you read this whole thread by any chance? i dont need to tell anybody my business and what me and the seller has talked about do i? No.


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## Persephone (14 June 2012)

FionaM12 said:



			Except he apologized and has been texting trying to rearrange. Surely he wouldn't if that was case?
		
Click to expand...

Perhaps he is having a giggle at your expense? Why didn't he text you at the time the meeting should have been to tell you? Why start texting now?


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## Persephone (14 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			Have you read this whole thread by any chance? i dont need to tell anybody my business and what me and the seller has talked about do i? No.
		
Click to expand...

Just pointing out that a lot of people read the forum, and you would have no clue if your next door neighbour was reading all about it quite frankly!


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## Natalieshort (14 June 2012)

Persephone said:



			Perhaps he is having a giggle at your expense? Why didn't he text you at the time the meeting should have been to tell you? Why start texting now?
		
Click to expand...

He has had a genuine reason actually and he text me that night,anyway like i said, boring. and nothing to do with anybody else   bye


----------



## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			i dont need to tell anybody my business and what me and the seller has talked about do i? No.
		
Click to expand...

If you don't want to discuss your business, I'd really advise you don't come on a forum and keeping feeding peoples' interest then.

You put "he hasn't read the thread" then when someone asks how you know that, you seem outraged they're asking!  Rather rude, really

If you want your dealings to be private, why come on here and keep fuelling the situation? Buy your horse, or not, as you choose. No-one's going to come round to your horse and ask for information!


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## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			like i said, boring.
		
Click to expand...

About twenty times, I think.


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## Natalieshort (14 June 2012)

FionaM12 said:



			If you don't want to discuss your business, I'd really advise you don't come on a forum and keeping feeding peoples' interest then.

You put "he hasn't read the thread" then when someone asks how you know that, you seem outraged they're asking!  Rather rude, really

If you want your dealings to be private, why come on here and keep fuelling the situation? Buy your horse, or not, as you choose. No-one's going to come round to your horse and ask for information! 

Click to expand...

yeah ok zzzzzzz


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## Natalieshort (14 June 2012)

FionaM12 said:



			About twenty times, I think. 

Click to expand...

Sounds like you have a verrrry exciting life


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## Amymay (14 June 2012)

I would have thought, Natalie, that whilst he may not have seen the thread, he may now be aware that a discussion has been going on (basing this on a post made several pages back).


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## Natalieshort (14 June 2012)

amymay said:



			I would have thought, Natalie, that whilst he may not have seen the thread.  He may now be aware that a discussion has been going on (basing this on a post made several pages back).
		
Click to expand...


Yes apparently he has had somebody report him


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## Venevidivici (14 June 2012)

Have just wasted far too long of my life reading all this thread. Will keep my opinions to myself on the subject(it's moot now,anyway but did find it mildly interesting how OP revealed true colours/age as thread went on) but just wanted to say... ABC where are you??? You were raring to step in to buy Tilly-have you secretly whisked her away a la secret lottery winner who requests no publicity?!?


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## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

Venevidivici said:



			ABC where are you??? You were raring to step in to buy Tilly-have you secretly whisked her away a la secret lottery winner who requests no publicity?!?
		
Click to expand...

None of your business, you're just being boring. 


Oh yeah, and you haven't got a life.


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## MileAMinute (14 June 2012)

FionaM12 said:



			None of your business, you're just being boring. 


Oh yeah, and you haven't got a life. 

Click to expand...

 Brilliant!

And thankyou, Natalie, for this thread. I've just come out of hospital and found being at home very boring until I read this thread, it kept me busy for a while!


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## Venevidivici (14 June 2012)

I feel extremely boring having read all 38pages.....must get out more
Come on ABC! If I was one of those sleuthy types and had time,I'd look back on ABC's posts and see if they are friends/in it together...but can't be bothered..cos I'm so boring Off to level manège now-no rest for the 'boring old farts'


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## Moomin1 (14 June 2012)

Cobrastyle said:



 Brilliant!

And thankyou, Natalie, for this thread. I've just come out of hospital and found being at home very boring until I read this thread, it kept me busy for a while! 

Click to expand...

What business is it of yours to read this thread?!  

Urrgh - I'm off to rescue a horse.....

Properly...


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## Tiggy1 (14 June 2012)

I am quite disgusted by this thread.
What started out as a well meaning post turned into a nasty attack.
Will all of you just wind your necks in and have bit more respect for individuals and their opinions!!!


----------



## Fairynuff (14 June 2012)

Tiggy1 said:



			I am quite disgusted by this thread.
What started out as a well meaning post turned into a nasty attack.
Will all of you just wind your necks in and have bit more respect for individuals and their opinions!!!
		
Click to expand...

yes mam!


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## MileAMinute (14 June 2012)

Moomin1 said:



			What business is it of yours to read this thread?!  

Urrgh - I'm off to rescue a horse.....

Properly...
		
Click to expand...

You're boring me now! Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz!


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## Fairynuff (14 June 2012)

anyone know if poor foaly woaly has been 'saved?'


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## Tiggy1 (14 June 2012)

I don't usually rant but his just got my back up


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## Moomin1 (14 June 2012)

Tiggy1 said:



			I am quite disgusted by this thread.
What started out as a well meaning post turned into a nasty attack.
Will all of you just wind your necks in and have bit more respect for individuals and their opinions!!!
		
Click to expand...

If you read the thread properly you will see that everybody was merely offering sane advice about the level of Natalie's SELF PROCLAIMED experience (or lack of) and the suitability of whether she should be taking on a youngster.  Natalie herself was the one who came back in a ball of flames and bad mouthed everyone.  Up until then everybody had commented (including myself) that she seemed like a very well meaning and nice person.

I quickly changed my opinion, as did others, when her true colours came through.  

I am enjoying this thread - and it appears Natalie is too - since she keeps posting.


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## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

Cobrastyle said:



 Brilliant!

And thankyou, Natalie, for this thread. I've just come out of hospital and found being at home very boring until I read this thread, it kept me busy for a while! 

Click to expand...

It's actually Magicmadge who's the OP. 

Get well soon, hope you're soon feeling better.


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## rhino (14 June 2012)

Venevidivici said:



			Come on ABC! If I was one of those sleuthy types and had time,I'd look back on ABC's posts and see if they are friends/in it together...but can't be bothered..cos I'm so boring Off to level manège now-no rest for the 'boring old farts' 

Click to expand...

No, ABC is a really lovely poster who I think would be more than capable of taking on a foal like this  Unlike some, she is experienced _and_ capable of reasonable discussion  I'll pop her a pm, she is normally pretty busy and doesn't come on here all that often. Teenagers aren't all bad you know


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## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

Tiggy1 said:



			I don't usually rant but his just got my back up 

Click to expand...

I do think most people were just friendly and offering advice to the young girl at first, but her behaviour back ruffled a few feathers.


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## Twiggy14 (14 June 2012)

I've just read through this whole thread and had quite a good laugh actually!
I have my opinions...they have changed from the start of the thread to the end, but no comment :')


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## Natalieshort (14 June 2012)

I actually find it hilarious how people are still going on about this and how you judge people through a bloody forum LOL! But im the one whos laughing in the end with all the PM's im getting about you all saying how rude you all are and "old hags" "nasty cows" etc etc wowww if only you lot knew!  OH and yes ABC is interested


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## Moomin1 (14 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			I actually find it hilarious how people are still going on about this and how you judge people through a bloody forum LOL! But im the one whos laughing in the end with all the PM's im getting about you all saying how rude you all are and "old hags" "nasty cows" etc etc wowww if only you lot knew!  OH and yes ABC is interested
		
Click to expand...

You will cringe when you are older and look back at the way you are acting.  But don't worry - we've all been young and defensive.  Been there got the t-shirt.  You will eventually learn in life that older people (and no - I am not THAT old - I am only 31!) do speak, in the main, a lot of sense and are worth listening to.  I only wish I had listened when I was a teenager and I would have saved myself hours of regret and embarrassment.  But it's all part of the learning process.

As for the 'rude' posters, you are the only one who has sworn and been generally offensive to people offering you advice.  Your knee jerk reactions are lightning quick!  

As for judging people from a forum, were you not judging by calling everybody nasty ******* CRUEL people?  And these 'PM's' you seem to have had - are they not judging by calling other posters nasty and 'old hags'??

There's such a word as hypocrisy - look it up.

Oh - and I thought you got bored ages ago and weren't going to come back on this thread?  You say you can't believe people are still posting -yet you are still posting?!


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## martlin (14 June 2012)

Ahhh, that old chestnut ''I have loads of PMs supporting me''


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## Natalieshort (14 June 2012)

Moomin1 said:



			You will cringe when you are older and look back at the way you are acting.  But don't worry - we've all been young and defensive.  Been there got the t-shirt.  You will eventually learn in life that older people (and no - I am not THAT old - I am only 31!) do speak, in the main, a lot of sense and are worth listening to.  I only wish I had listened when I was a teenager and I would have saved myself hours of regret and embarrassment.  But it's all part of the learning process.

As for the 'rude' posters, you are the only one who has sworn and been generally offensive to people offering you advice.  Your knee jerk reactions are lightning quick!  

As for judging people from a forum, were you not judging by calling everybody nasty ******* CRUEL people?  And these 'PM's' you seem to have had - are they not judging by calling other posters nasty and 'old hags'??

There's such a word as hypocrisy - look it up.

Oh - and I thought you got bored ages ago and weren't going to come back on this thread?  You say you can't believe people are still posting -yet you are still posting?!
		
Click to expand...

Ok have you finished?


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## Moomin1 (14 June 2012)

martlin said:



			Ahhh, that old chestnut ''I have loads of PMs supporting me'' 

Click to expand...

She is just showing her age, isn't she?  I actually am starting to feel quite sorry for her - we've all been there and behaved like this when we are young and childish.


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## Natalieshort (14 June 2012)

martlin said:



			Ahhh, that old chestnut ''I have loads of PMs supporting me'' 

Click to expand...

I didnt say supporting  just PM's telling me what they are like thats all!


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## MileAMinute (14 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			I actually find it hilarious how people are still going on about this and how you judge people through a bloody forum LOL! But im the one whos laughing in the end with all the PM's im getting about you all saying how rude you all are and "old hags" "nasty cows" etc etc wowww if only you lot knew!  OH and yes ABC is interested
		
Click to expand...

Well....we do know. You've just told us! 

And I for one, couldn't care. I don't take anything said on here personally. No one on here (par a couple) knows me so I can take what they say with a pinch of salt!

ETA - Thanks, Fiona. Was in for 10 days, but out and feeling ok now! Went to see the horses this morning, less that 12 hours from discharge, think I'm nuts


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## Littlelegs (14 June 2012)

The only rude comments have come from yourself Natalie. Up until you got personal all anyone did was try & point out that right now it wasn't the best plan. And I have no respect for anyone making personal insults via pm, doesn't show much courage in their own convictions, so couldn't care less what anyone has pm'd you & called me or anyone else.


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## Natalieshort (14 June 2012)

Okkkkk. Fair enough, Thanks everyone for your kindness, supportment and critism!   OH and advice!


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## gracey (14 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			I actually find it hilarious how people are still going on about this and how you judge people through a bloody forum LOL!
		
Click to expand...

But you are the one that brought this thread back to life?  it was dead and buried.. anyways .. at the end of the day, I hope Tilly finds herself in a lovely home, she is going to be gorgeous in the right hands.


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## Tiggy1 (14 June 2012)

Twiggy14 said:



			I've just read through this whole thread and had quite a good laugh actually!
I have my opinions...they have changed from the start of the thread to the end, but no comment :')
		
Click to expand...

Safest way


----------



## all about Romeo (14 June 2012)

So is anyone going to buy said pony tilly then??


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## palmermanson (14 June 2012)

I want her  just dont have the money  xx


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## gracey (14 June 2012)

all about Romeo said:



			So is anyone going to buy said pony tilly then??
		
Click to expand...

I hope so, but this thread seems to of become the natalie thread


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## Nightmare before Christmas (14 June 2012)

Well that saved me from revision for 30 min, brill


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## PaddyMonty (14 June 2012)

If she was a 17hh jet black warmblood stallion I would


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## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

Moomin1 said:



			I am not THAT old
		
Click to expand...

I am.  Proper old hag, me. 



Moomin1 said:



			She is just showing her age, isn't she?  I actually am starting to feel quite sorry for her - we've all been there and behaved like this when we are young and childish.

Click to expand...

True, but the trouble with the internet is a person's childish misdemeanours will stay there to haunt them for years to come 



Moomin1 said:



			Oh - and I thought you got bored ages ago and weren't going to come back on this thread?  You say you can't believe people are still posting -yet you are still posting?!
		
Click to expand...





gracey said:



			But you are the one that brought this thread back to life?  it was dead and buried..
		
Click to expand...

Quite


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## Lady La La (14 June 2012)

martlin said:



			Ahhh, that old chestnut ''I have loads of PMs supporting me'' 

Click to expand...

Its a forum fave 



Natalieshort said:



			Yes apparently he has had somebody report him
		
Click to expand...

Marvelous! So, he hasn't made himself any money yet _and_ he's been reported for keeping his animals in an inappropriate way. 
I don't see either of those outcomes as negative


----------



## rhino (14 June 2012)

all about Romeo said:



			So is anyone going to buy said pony tilly then??
		
Click to expand...

I believe there are interested parties, who fairly sensibly don't want to blurt everything out over the internet. I wouldn't be surprised if the dealer gets rid of the filly to a 'friend' or passes her through the sales though to be honest  It's most likely not worth the 'hassle' for him, after all there are plenty more where Tilly came from


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## RuthM (14 June 2012)

To be fair, I think there were a few posters making no comment about Natalie, rather that giving someone you believe to be neglectful money to fund another couple of DD ponies is not helping welfare or rescuing anything.  

Why is it that the negatives prove so much more interesting online?


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## Ladydragon (14 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			Im not being touchy about the whole experience thing. It's just boring now, that is all 

Click to expand...

*sigh* You really don't do yourself any favours...  There really is some merit to the idea of making a decision and getting on with it quietly instead of dragging it out over the internet...



Natalieshort said:



			Yes apparently he has had somebody report him
		
Click to expand...

That would have been a quick visit...

Not that it would be a bad thing if a reputable organisation did stick their beak in and check standards if the photo of the little filly is any guide to general condition...


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## *Maddy&Occhi* (14 June 2012)

42 pages 

Not sure how this thread got so long, I only read the first 2 pages. Has the little foal been bought yet?


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## Natalieshort (14 June 2012)

Its annoying im still getting email alerts now, ive heard of all your opinions, advice, critism etc. can we leave it now il be suprised if there is anything else to talk about


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## Patterdale (14 June 2012)

I'd buy her but she's a bit fat, plus I like loads of feather. 

Does it say if she's good in traffic?


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## *Maddy&Occhi* (14 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			Its annoying im still getting email alerts now, ive heard of all your opinions, advice, critism etc. can we leave it now il be suprised if there is anything else to talk about
		
Click to expand...

I take it she hasn't been bought then?

Hope she finds a good home!


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## rhino (14 June 2012)

*Maddy&Occhi* said:



			42 pages 

Click to expand...

You need to go to User CP > Options > change settings to 40 posts per page. Then there's only 10 pages or so to wade through 



Natalieshort said:



			Its annoying im still getting email alerts now, ive heard of all your opinions, advice, critism etc. can we leave it now il be suprised if there is anything else to talk about
		
Click to expand...

Turn email alerts off then  As it is a public forum, people will tend to keep posting if they want to, that's kind of how they work 

Patterdale


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## Ibblebibble (14 June 2012)

Tiggy1 said:



			I am quite disgusted by this thread.
What started out as a well meaning post turned into a nasty attack.
Will all of you just wind your necks in and have bit more respect for individuals and their opinions!!!
		
Click to expand...

Don't worry Tiggy, Natalie is enjoying every minute of it it's the most attention she's had since she wet her knickers in primary school last week


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## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			Its annoying im still getting email alerts now, ive heard of all your opinions, advice, critism etc. can we leave it now il be suprised if there is anything else to talk about
		
Click to expand...

Strangely, this thread isn't all about you. 

Although to be fair you are a very entertaining contributor.


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## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

rhino said:



			As it is a public forum, people will tend to keep posting if they want to, that's kind of how they work 

Click to expand...





Ibblebibble said:



			it's the most attention she's had since she wet her knickers in primary school last week

Click to expand...

*snorts coffee all over keyboard....*


----------



## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			BORING
		
Click to expand...

...and there it is again.


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## Venevidivici (14 June 2012)

Mwahahaaa! Ibblebibble,I nearly wet mine when I read that!


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## Natalieshort (14 June 2012)

FionaM12 said:



			...and there it is again. 

Click to expand...

Looks like your reading through all the pages on the thread to get my "quotes" which you cut off everything else! haha


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## Venevidivici (14 June 2012)

Go to bed,Natalie....you're clearly overtired....


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## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			Looks like your reading through all the pages on the thread to get my "quotes" which you cut off everything else! haha
		
Click to expand...

 Sorry?


----------



## rhino (14 June 2012)

FionaM12 said:



			...and there it is again. 

Click to expand...

It's better than 'whatever' surely?


----------



## martlin (14 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			Infact, i dont know why the hell im even still here on this forum, some people are absolute keyboard warriors hahahaha.
		
Click to expand...

Flounce bingo, anyone?


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## all about Romeo (14 June 2012)

patterdale said:



			I'd buy her but she's a bit fat, plus I like loads of feather. 

Does it say if she's good in traffic?
		
Click to expand...

Are you being serious??


----------



## Nightmare before Christmas (14 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			WOW LOL!! this is absolutely hilarious, and you all say i was showing my true colours? Infact, i dont know why the hell im even still here on this forum, some people are absolute keyboard warriors hahahaha. Your all really pathetic, immature people who must have the most BORING lives since you must all be older than my own mum and dad and look how childish you are! Don't you have a horses arse to wipe or something? Instead of being on here 24/7 giving a teenager crap? you need to get out more
		
Click to expand...

I think you are the one who looks childish, from an outsiders point of view


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## Wagtail (14 June 2012)

Sometimes it really is hard to spot who are the teenagers on here.


----------



## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

rhino said:



			It's better than 'whatever' surely?
		
Click to expand...

Hmm, close call though.


----------



## Wagtail (14 June 2012)

all about Romeo said:



			Are you being serious?? 

Click to expand...

He/she was joking.


----------



## rhino (14 June 2012)

martlin said:



			Flounce bingo, anyone? 

Click to expand...

Cards at the ready


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## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			LOL @ this again. over tired? No i just have better things to do than sit on a forum all day everyday trying to give a teenager ****, infact go get a job or something because im trying to work but i keep getting stupid emails from all you lot trying to cyber bully a ****ing child! Now get a grip and go do something useful. Im trying to work here  you know, a 17 year old who works full time but yet im still childish!
		
Click to expand...

17? Don't exaggerate please dear. 

Also, I don't believe anyone's emailing you. You've already been advised to turn off your notifications.

This is not _your_ thread, you don't have to keep coming back and shouting.


----------



## Natalieshort (14 June 2012)

badgermyers said:



			I think you are the one who looks childish, from an outsiders point of view
		
Click to expand...

I honestly don't give a crap. These lot are acting younger than me forgod sake


----------



## all about Romeo (14 June 2012)

Ibblebibble said:



			Don't worry Tiggy, Natalie is enjoying every minute of it it's the most attention she's had since she wet her knickers in primary school last week

Click to expand...

Is there really any need for that?


----------



## Nightmare before Christmas (14 June 2012)

rhino said:



			Cards at the ready






Click to expand...

brilliant!


----------



## Venevidivici (14 June 2012)

Forgot to say,thanks Rhino for your earlier post-hope ABC not put off. And am sure most teenagers are more mature and self-effacing(didn't know either of them were teenagers until one of them showed herself up to be and after all,we all were one once


----------



## martlin (14 June 2012)

Oh, yes, we all were teenagers once... luckily for me, no internet to embarrass myself on, then


----------



## Natalieshort (14 June 2012)

FionaM12 said:



			17? Don't exaggerate please dear. 

Click to expand...

No but i cant be that childish if i have a full time job so i can actually PAY for my horse. I dont rely on my mummy and daddy you know. i cant be that bad


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## all about Romeo (14 June 2012)

Wagtail said:



			Sometimes it really is hard to spot who are the teenagers on here.
		
Click to expand...

^^^ lol


----------



## Patterdale (14 June 2012)

All about Romeo - dead serious. 

I have a small trekking centre cum circus training camp. If I'm going to fork out for her she needs to be working pretty bloody sharpish. 

Ps most of my customers are fat so that's why I go for cobs, FYI


----------



## bensababy (14 June 2012)

Wagtail said:



			Sometimes it really is hard to spot who are the teenagers on here.
		
Click to expand...

As above, some people have really let themselves down on this thread and it makes uncomfortable viewing.


----------



## Patterdale (14 June 2012)

As she looks like a good weight carrier


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## pookie (14 June 2012)

martlin said:



			Oh, yes, we all were teenagers once... luckily for me, no internet to embarrass myself on, then 

Click to expand...

^^ This. Just 


Natalieshort - I'm not sure what you hope to achieve with this thread now. It was originally supposed to be about a youngster people felt sorry for (rightly or wrongly), but seems to have turned into something else entirely. I assume you still care about horse welfare today as much as you seemed to when you were first posting about buying Tilly, and I don't think the way this thread is going is doing you or horses like Tilly any favours


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## Wagtail (14 June 2012)

patterdale said:



			All about Romeo - dead serious. 

I have a small trekking centre cum circus training camp. If I'm going to fork out for her she needs to be working pretty bloody sharpish. 

Ps most of my customers are fat so that's why I go for cobs, FYI
		
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## martlin (14 June 2012)

patterdale said:



			All about Romeo - dead serious. 

I have a small trekking centre cum circus training camp. If I'm going to fork out for her she needs to be working pretty bloody sharpish. 

Ps most of my customers are fat so that's why I go for cobs, FYI
		
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I might be able to supply you with a three legged donkey... for a fee, obviously.


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## Natalieshort (14 June 2012)

pookie said:



			^^ This. Just 


Natalieshort - I'm not sure what you hope to achieve with this thread now. It was originally supposed to be about a youngster people felt sorry for (rightly or wrongly), but seems to have turned into something else entirely. I assume you still care about horse welfare today as much as you seemed to when you were first posting about buying Tilly, and I don't think the way this thread is going is doing you or horses like Tilly any favours 

Click to expand...


I totally agree with you. But like somebody said in this thread there is more negativity than positivity and people tend to keep commenting on the negative bits


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## Ibblebibble (14 June 2012)

Wagtail said:



			Sometimes it really is hard to spot who are the teenagers on here.
		
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lol just a bit of fun dear wagtail,us old'uns are allowed to have some as well

I'm loving flounce bingo, i think we're half way to a full house ladies so get ready


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## rema (14 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			LOL @ this again. over tired? No i just have better things to do than sit on a forum all day everyday trying to give a teenager ****, infact go get a job or something because im trying to work but i keep getting stupid emails from all you lot trying to cyber bully a ****ing child! Now get a grip and go do something useful. Im trying to work here  you know, a 17 year old who works full time but yet im still childish!
		
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Can i have fries with my burger please.


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## smokey (14 June 2012)

martlin said:



			I might be able to supply you with a three legged donkey... for a fee, obviously.
		
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Pm Natalieshort, she seems to have a natural talent for picking a wrong 'un, given her previous posts. 
Seriously, I think it may be best to ignore her now, usually the best way to deal with toddler tantrums.
Would be interested to know if anyone does buy Tilly though.


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## RuthM (14 June 2012)

I am boring, seriously, I am genuinely boring with not one worry about it. 

On a boring note (as I don't think Natalie is the devil in disguise), a couple of days ago there were folk encouraging a 17 yr old girl and her boyfriend go meet a scratty dealer in a carpark! 

Only on the internet!


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## martlin (14 June 2012)

smokey said:



			Pm Natalieshort, she seems to have a natural talent for picking a wrong 'un, given her previous posts. 
Seriously, I think it may be best to ignore her now, usually the best way to deal with toddler tantrums.
Would be interested to know if anyone does buy Tilly though.
		
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It's not a wrong 'un, it's the right leg the donkey is missing.


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## pookie (14 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			I totally agree with you. But like somebody said in this thread there is more negativity than positivity and people tend to keep commenting on the negative bits
		
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Fair enough, but you're not obliged to keep replying. No one is. This thread could die a death with what little dignity it might still possess and everyone would forget about it in a week.


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## smokey (14 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			LOL @ this again. over tired? No i just have better things to do than sit on a forum all day everyday trying to give a teenager ****, infact go get a job or something because im trying to work but i keep getting stupid emails from all you lot trying to cyber bully a ****ing child! Now get a grip and go do something useful. Im trying to work here  you know, a 17 year old who works full time but yet im still childish!
		
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Read and re-read before you post, you accused people of bullying a child, 2 sentences on you are denying being childish! Your admission that you are indeed a child means that of course you are childish. Otherwise you would just be a precocious brat, and no-one likes them either.


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## Ibblebibble (14 June 2012)

rema said:



			Can i have fries with my burger please.
		
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  unfair Rema, could have prewarned me so i could have doubled up on the tena lady


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## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

pookie said:



			It was originally supposed to be about a youngster people felt sorry for (rightly or wrongly),
		
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I think we probably all feel sorry for the foal in the ad, the problem is what to do about it.

I fully understand someone wanting to swoop in and "rescue" such a poor little thing. I feel tempted myself, this girl's on my doorstep. Like I've said before, that would be madness though.

Really, if anyone wants to do poor horses in need a favour, I think they'd be better adopting a horse from a reputable charity/welfare organisation though. That way you free up funds and room for another genuinely rescued horse or pony.

It's not so dramatic or exciting maybe, but IMO a more effective way of helping.


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## Patterdale (14 June 2012)

Martlin - can he pull his weight like a 4 legger????

I don't take passengers, they all have to earn. 
Mind you, one less leg = less nutrition required? Quarter off his feed bill?

Hmmm *ponders*


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## Lady La La (14 June 2012)

patterdale said:



			Martlin - can he pull his weight like a 4 legger????
		
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## smokey (14 June 2012)

patterdale said:



			Martlin - can he pull his weight like a 4 legger????

I don't take passengers, they all have to earn. 
Mind you, one less leg = less nutrition required? Quarter off his feed bill?

Hmmm *ponders*
		
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And a saving on farriers bill. You could always fit a bike wheel, I'm sure I saw a tortoise with a wheel once.


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## Ibblebibble (14 June 2012)

patterdale said:



			Martlin - can he pull his weight like a 4 legger????

I don't take passengers, they all have to earn. 
Mind you, one less leg = less nutrition required? Quarter off his feed bill?

Hmmm *ponders*
		
Click to expand...

save on shoeing/ trimming as well, sounds like a good'un to me


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## Flame_ (14 June 2012)

pookie said:



			This thread could die a death with what little dignity it might still possess and everyone would forget about it in a week.
		
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Do you reckon? I think this is quite a memorable one.


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## martlin (14 June 2012)

patterdale said:



			Martlin - can he pull his weight like a 4 legger????

I don't take passengers, they all have to earn. 
Mind you, one less leg = less nutrition required? Quarter off his feed bill?

Hmmm *ponders*
		
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Well, obviously you aren't very clever! His weight is less than a 4 legger - about one leg less, to be precise. He does pulling, carrying and hop skipping.


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## pookie (14 June 2012)

FionaM12 said:



			I think we probably all feel sorry for the foal in the ad, the problem is what to do about it.
		
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I don't know, there were a few towards the start who didn't seem to see what the issue with it was. Bear in mind I first read this thing when it was on page 4ish and came back to it just now (blimey!) 

I'm totally the wrong person to advise anyone else on rescuing or not. I'm the swoop in and rehome type


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## rema (14 June 2012)

smokey said:



			And a saving on farriers bill. You could always fit a bike wheel, I'm sure I saw a tortoise with a wheel once.
		
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Nobody put shoes on anymore.....We are all Barefoot and happy..


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## Natalieshort (14 June 2012)

rema said:



			Can i have fries with my burger please.
		
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Hilarious, really think id be on a computer if i worked at mcdonalds or something? thicko


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## pookie (14 June 2012)

Flame_ said:



			Do you reckon? I think this is quite a memorable one. 

Click to expand...

I'm being charitable


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## smokey (14 June 2012)

martlin said:



			It's not a wrong 'un, it's the right leg the donkey is missing.
		
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My apologies, that makes a huge difference! Is it the back or front leg? Cos I'm guessing that would make a difference too!


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## rema (14 June 2012)

Or is it Every Little Helps?


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## rema (14 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			Hilarious, really think id be on a computer if i worked at mcdonalds or something? thicko
		
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I'm loving it!!.


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## Littlelegs (14 June 2012)

I always wondered why teens got so much stick on here, as the majority I know are lovely. This thread has cleared that up.
  Patterdale, can I join your circus? Can ride my daughters finely built 11.1 mini x nf. In riding stuff I'm 9stone but being experienced I am fine on her. Maybe myself & someone else could double up on her for a juggling act?


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## martlin (14 June 2012)

smokey said:



			My apologies, that makes a huge difference! Is it the back or front leg? Cos I'm guessing that would make a difference too!
		
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Which one would you like it to be? Missing both would be an inconvenience - would need to be propped up against a wall or something.


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## Natalieshort (14 June 2012)

Why do you all think your something special? Just remember you was once a teenager so dont be looking down your nose at me. Now i know what they mean about, snobby "horse owners" who are up there own arses. I know ALOT of people who aren't and im not saying you all are but i can name afew


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## Nightmare before Christmas (14 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			Hilarious, really think id be on a computer if i worked at mcdonalds or something? thicko
		
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I swear I wasnt this rude at 17 :s


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## smokey (14 June 2012)

martlin said:



			Which one would you like it to be? Missing both would be an inconvenience - would need to be propped up against a wall or something.
		
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I have no preference, however 2 on the one side is a major advantage in hilly country. If you go with my aforementioned tortoise-esque wheels.


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## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

littlelegs said:



			I always wondered why teens got so much stick on here,
		
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On a thread recently about members' ages, I was astonished how many teenagers there are here. They post intelligent, knowledgable posts and no-one would suspect their age if it hadn't been for that thread. One regular contributor said she's 15 which amazed me. I'd never have guessed.


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## pookie (14 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			Why do you all think your something special? Just remember you was once a teenager so dont be looking down your nose at me. Now i know what they mean about, snobby "horse owners" who are up there own arses. I know ALOT of people who aren't and im not saying you all are but i can name afew
		
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Nobody's looking down at you because you're a teenager. It's not your age that's causing the problem; it's your posts.


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## Venevidivici (14 June 2012)

This is so not about the OP anymore. It is waaaay funnier


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## Natalieshort (14 June 2012)

badgermyers said:



			I swear I wasnt this rude at 17 :s
		
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Believe it or not, im actually not like this. Annoys though when ADULTS are trying to bully me over a forum? it's pathetic


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## DGeventing (14 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			Why do you all think your something special? Just remember you was once a teenager so dont be looking down your nose at me. Now i know what they mean about, snobby "horse owners" who are up there own arses. I know ALOT of people who aren't and im not saying you all are but i can name afew
		
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Because when we were teenagers we weren't publicly shaming ourselves and claiming to have the knowledge, money and skills to look after a young horse, and then being insulting and abusive.
Just a suggestion there


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## Amymay (14 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			Believe it or not, im actually not like this. Annoys though when ADULTS are trying to bully me over a forum? it's pathetic
		
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If you think you're being bullied, then alert TFC by pushing the button at the bottom of the page.

However, I think you probably realise that people are just having a bit of fun at your expense - and if you stopped posting, so would the fun........


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## SuperCoblet (14 June 2012)

I'm 16 and wouldn't dream of being as rude as she is 

It's always the louder, ruder ones that ruin our reputation and 'society' see us all as arrogant little children and its the minority that speak the loudest because they stand out from the quieter ones


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## Nightmare before Christmas (14 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			Believe it or not, im actually not like this. Annoys though when ADULTS are trying to bully me over a forum? it's pathetic
		
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Well I am not bullying you. Maybe if you walked away now it will all stop. The fact you post back with defensive comments is always going to provoke people who are picking fun.

The decision for them to stop 'bullying' lies in your hands


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## Ibblebibble (14 June 2012)

FionaM12 said:



			I think we probably all feel sorry for the foal in the ad, the problem is what to do about it.

I fully understand someone wanting to swoop in and "rescue" such a poor little thing. I feel tempted myself, this girl's on my doorstep. Like I've said before, that would be madness though.

Really, if anyone wants to do poor horses in need a favour, I think they'd be better adopting a horse from a reputable charity/welfare organisation though. That way you free up funds and room for another genuinely rescued horse or pony.

It's not so dramatic or exciting maybe, but IMO a more effective way of helping.
		
Click to expand...

imo too 
a friend of mine did the 'omg poor baby pony' thing and bought a 'well handled' weanling, well handled with blue pipe maybe but certainly not by kind hands  friend means well but is not overly confident, pony got it's headcollar off in the field and she couldn't catch it for 6 months. i had down at my place for a few months and got it haltered and accepting being caught by my daughter and myself, but then OH said it had to go back as i had another one coming 
last i heard she had given it away to another friend of hers who already has about 18 horses/ponies. it's probably a very common story for these poor little  waifs, bought with the best intentions but when the warm cosy dream of turning them around turns into cold reality they get passed on


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## Suziq77 (14 June 2012)

Goodness, between the British 3DE team being picked and this thread I'm wondering if I'm going to get any work done at all this week....

I'm imagining all kinds of things about who might be behind the name 'Natalieshort' at the moment


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## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			Believe it or not, im actually not like this. Annoys though when ADULTS are trying to bully me over a forum? it's pathetic
		
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Natalie, the subject keeps turning away from you, and you jump in and bring it back to yourself. 

Honestly, no-one's bullying. if you just stopped diving in with the "old hags" "boring" "up your arse" etc insults, you wouldn't get any negative remarks back.


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## smokey (14 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			Believe it or not, im actually not like this. Annoys though when ADULTS are trying to bully me over a forum? it's pathetic
		
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Why do you feel the need to SHOUT in all your posts? No-one is bullying you, if you would stop with the attitude and realise that the majority were giving you good advice perhaps you wouldn't be so quick to jump in with posts which are quite frankly getting more ridiculous with each new one, thus setting you up for ridicule. Can you see a pattern emerging here?


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## Patterdale (14 June 2012)

FARRIER!?? 
You must be joking, how would I ever make a living lining the pockets of those charlatans??

When the feet on mine start to get long, it obviously means they're not working enough, so they get a few days fast trotting on the roads. Which, BTW hardens the legs up too. 

If that doesn't work then I truss them up like a roped steer on their sides, and the dogs gnaw down the excess. 

Simple and cheap.


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## SuperCoblet (14 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			ADULTS are trying to bully me
		
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Did you know theres a big red X at the top right of your screen? It's MAGIC


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## Ibblebibble (14 June 2012)

amymay said:



			If you think you're being bullied, then alert TFC by pushing the button at the bottom of the page.
		
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what and get herself banned for bad language and personal insults now that would be ironic


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## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

FionaM12 said:



			I was astonished how many teenagers there are here. They post intelligent, knowledgable posts and no-one would suspect their age if it hadn't been for that thread. 

Click to expand...

And here's an example:



iamSanta said:



			I'm 16 and wouldn't dream of being as rude as she is 

It's always the louder, ruder ones that ruin our reputation and 'society' see us all as arrogant little children and its the minority that speak the loudest because they stand out from the quieter ones 

Click to expand...


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## Littlelegs (14 June 2012)

Patterdale, you peasant. No way will I be pony squashing for someone too cheap to buy an angle grinder.


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## smokey (14 June 2012)

patterdale said:



			FARRIER!?? 
You must be joking, how would I ever make a living lining the pockets of those charlatans??

When the feet on mine start to get long, it obviously means they're not working enough, so they get a few days fast trotting on the roads. Which, BTW hardens the legs up too. 

If that doesn't work then I truss them up like a roped steer on their sides, and the dogs gnaw down the excess. 

Simple and cheap.
		
Click to expand...




Coffee shower! 
However, if you went the suggestion of 2 legs off on one side, you wouldn't need to rope them, just unscrew their wheels and they would topple.


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## rema (14 June 2012)

smokey said:



			Coffee shower! 
However, if you went the suggestion of 2 legs off on one side, you wouldn't need to rope them, just I screw their wheels and they would topple.
		
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Yeah but if you fitted wheels you would have to start paying road tax..


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## martlin (14 June 2012)

rema said:



			Yeah but if you fitted wheels you would have to start paying road tax..
		
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Maybe, but it would be able to pull more weight, seeing as its weight will be 2 wheels more?


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## smokey (14 June 2012)

rema said:



			Yeah but if you fitted wheels you would have to start paying road tax..
		
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Not if they were BMX wheels, surely?


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## rema (14 June 2012)

smokey said:



			Not if they were BMX wheels, surely?
		
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Oh you might have a point there....I was thinking more of a Ford Ka wheels


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## Patterdale (14 June 2012)

Littlelegs you can join my circus any time, particularly if you bring us an angle grinder. 

2 legs off is fine in theory, but would it eliminate the need for rising trot?? Teaching the 'up, downs,' is one of the mainstays of the business so I'm not sure if that would work for me. 

I think were getting off the important part of this thread - the foal. Has anyone actually found out if it's good in traffic yet!?? Then I won't need martlins cast off.


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## pookie (14 June 2012)

rema said:



			Yeah but if you fitted wheels you would have to start paying road tax..
		
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Depends what its emissions are, doesn't it?


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## rema (14 June 2012)

pookie said:



			Depends what its emissions are, doesn't it?
		
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And brake test....hmmm two wheels on the rolling road and two legs on the side..


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## Patterdale (14 June 2012)

Don't be silly, if it had 2 wheels on one side it would just go round in circles. 

You'd have to either go fronts, or backs.


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## pookie (14 June 2012)

rema said:



			And brake test....hmmm two wheels on the rolling road and two legs on the side..
		
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Put it on rails and we could have a pre-industrial revival. Imagine...a network of rails across the country...


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## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

Ibblebibble said:



			what and get herself banned for bad language and personal insults
		
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Funny you should say that.


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## martlin (14 June 2012)

patterdale said:



			Littlelegs you can join my circus any time, particularly if you bring us an angle grinder. 

2 legs off is fine in theory, but would it eliminate the need for rising trot?? Teaching the 'up, downs,' is one of the mainstays of the business so I'm not sure if that would work for me. 

I think were getting off the important part of this thread - the foal. Has anyone actually found out if it's good in traffic yet!?? Then I won't need martlins cast off.
		
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The 3 legged donkey hasn't got a cast  How rude!


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## rema (14 June 2012)

patterdale said:



			Don't be silly, if it had 2 wheels on one side it would just go round in circles. 

You'd have to either go fronts, or backs.
		
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But if you had a puncture on the front or backs then the horse would fall over as opposed to just lean to one side.


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## smokey (14 June 2012)

rema said:



			Oh you might have a point there....I was thinking more of a Ford Ka wheels
		
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I think this is a pony we are discussing here, Ford Ka wheels would just be stupid, knock the poor wee thing right off balance! Please think before you post, there are some inexperienced people on here who may take your advice and ruin a perfectly good foal by fitting the wrong wheels.


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## rhino (14 June 2012)

FionaM12 said:



			Funny you should say that.
		
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Oh, name's gone dark.


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## smokey (14 June 2012)

patterdale said:



			Littlelegs you can join my circus any time, particularly if you bring us an angle grinder. 

2 legs off is fine in theory, but would it eliminate the need for rising trot?? Teaching the 'up, downs,' is one of the mainstays of the business so I'm not sure if that would work for me. 

I think were getting off the important part of this thread - the foal. Has anyone actually found out if it's good in traffic yet!?? Then I won't need martlins cast off.
		
Click to expand...

Well clearly you would just let the air out of its tyres!


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## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

rhino said:



			Oh, name's gone dark.
		
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On the naughty step?


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## smokey (14 June 2012)

FionaM12 said:



			On the naughty step? 

Click to expand...

No supper for her then!


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## Littlelegs (14 June 2012)

Really I think the best wheels would be those locking ones you get on little kids skates. Lock forwards only for novices, unlock when you want to teach rein back.


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## rema (14 June 2012)

Now look what you have all done!!.Poor girl was only after some support on rescuing that poor filly and you all hounded her until she got upset with you all..Now she is on holiday at his majesty's pleasure.. Pfft.


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## ILuvCowparsely (14 June 2012)

This thread has gone the same way as many others do.

  A genuine post then  rapidly goes downhill not related at all to the poor pony.


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## smokey (14 June 2012)

littlelegs said:



			Really I think the best wheels would be those locking ones you get on little kids skates. Lock forwards only for novices, unlock when you want to teach rein back.
		
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Genius!


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## Wagtail (14 June 2012)

So who's been button pressing then? Not content with ganging up and provoking a teenager eh? Jeez.


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## Wagtail (14 June 2012)

Leviathan said:



			This thread has gone the same way as many others do.

  A genuine post then  rapidly goes downhill not related at all to the poor pony.

Click to expand...

Actually, some of it is quite witty.  

Not the teen baiting though.


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## rema (14 June 2012)

Well to be honest she did break the t&c's so she might of been given a holiday on the Caribbean island of youngpupgotgobby.


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## all about Romeo (14 June 2012)

so what is happening with the pony then??


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## Littlelegs (14 June 2012)

Nobody provoked her initially, just pointed out why buying the foal was a bad idea, to which she responded rudely. I could be wrong but my first guess would be Natalie herself took the advice of reporting it herself if she thought she was being bullied, & forgot that she herself had been swearing at people & making personal insults.


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## Wagtail (14 June 2012)

all about Romeo said:



			so what is happening with the pony then?? 

Click to expand...

Someone said that ABC was still interested.


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## Bikerchickone (14 June 2012)

Crikey, just read 13 pages and still don't know if the pony has a new home! 

TBH though I can't see anyone who commented pushing the button on her since they were all quite happy to respond to her. Maybe she pushed the button because of the "bullying"? 

Does anyone know anything about the foal?


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## vienna (14 June 2012)

Find this thread rediculous.
It started off with some very good intentions and I thought to myself just how decent H and H members could be, offering to donate to tilly or rescue her etc.
Now its become base and something to be embarrassed about.


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## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

rema said:



			Now look what you have all done!!.Poor girl was only after some support on rescuing that poor filly and you all hounded her until she got upset with you all..Now she is on holiday at his majesty's pleasure.. Pfft.
		
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Shocking hey?



rema said:



			Can i have fries with my burger please.
		
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## Patterdale (14 June 2012)

Well if it's 'embarrassing' then I'll take my business concerns elsewhere!
*flounces off to Mumsnet*


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## Patterdale (14 June 2012)

*runs back to collect forgotten wheels*


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## Lady La La (14 June 2012)

patterdale said:



			Well if it's 'embarrassing' then I'll take my business concerns elsewhere!
*flounces off to Mumsnet*
		
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YABU


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## JackDaniels1 (14 June 2012)

We can offer a lovely home ....... poor girl :-(


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## vienna (14 June 2012)

patterdale said:



			Well if it's 'embarrassing' then I'll take my business concerns elsewhere!
*flounces off to Mumsnet*
		
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very witty.
I just hope tilly has not been disposed of cruely because of this thread. It could have done far more harm than good.


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## mightymammoth (14 June 2012)

JackDaniels1 said:



			We can offer a lovely home ....... poor girl :-(
		
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here we go again lol

Seriously though can you give the seller a call and see what he says?


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## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

bikerchickone said:



			Does anyone know anything about the foal?
		
Click to expand...

Probably nothing has changed. The ad's still there on DD.

I still think, however tempting it is, rushing in and paying neglectful owners money isn't a great idea. Okay, Tilly might be given a decent home, but surely we'd have just made it worth his while to get his mare pregnant again, not feed the resulting foal then stick a similar advert up next year?


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## Ibblebibble (14 June 2012)

Wagtail said:



			Actually, some of it is quite witty.  

Not the teen baiting though. 

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i think the teen did a fair bit of baiting herself! if we're gong to ban teen baiting then we have to ban 'boring old fart' baiting as well


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## mightymammoth (14 June 2012)

FionaM12 said:



			Probably nothing has changed. The ad's still there on DD.

I still think, however tempting it is, rushing in and paying neglectful owners money isn't a great idea. Okay, Tilly might be given a decent home, but surely we'd have just made it worth his while to get his mare pregnant again, not feed the resulting foal then stick a similar advert up next year? 

Click to expand...

that's very true but just so heartbreaking to see that sad little soul


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## Suziq77 (14 June 2012)

patterdale said:



			Well if it's 'embarrassing' then I'll take my business concerns elsewhere!
*flounces off to Mumsnet*
		
Click to expand...

Snort


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## smokey (14 June 2012)

Ibblebibble said:



			i think the teen did a fair bit of baiting herself! if we're gong to ban teen baiting then we have to ban 'boring old fart' baiting as well

Click to expand...

And then we would be as well giving up and going home, figuratively speaking.


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## Bikerchickone (14 June 2012)

Must admit I agree with you there Fiona. Unfortunately I think it does encourage these irresponsible breeders to keep going when they know softhearted people are out there waiting to give them more money. Tragic all around really.


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## smokey (14 June 2012)

patterdale said:



			Well if it's 'embarrassing' then I'll take my business concerns elsewhere!
*flounces off to Mumsnet*
		
Click to expand...

There will be prams up on bricks as Patterdale stocks up on spares for the circus


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## JackDaniels1 (14 June 2012)

victoria1980x said:



			here we go again lol

Seriously though can you give the seller a call and see what he says?
		
Click to expand...

How rude! 

I'm not looking to buy but if Tilly needed somewhere to live or stay (even temporarily) I am happy to help.


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## pookie (14 June 2012)

FionaM12 said:



			Probably nothing has changed. The ad's still there on DD.

I still think, however tempting it is, rushing in and paying neglectful owners money isn't a great idea. Okay, Tilly might be given a decent home, but surely we'd have just made it worth his while to get his mare pregnant again, not feed the resulting foal then stick a similar advert up next year? 

Click to expand...

He, and plenty of others, would do that anyway. Given the dearth of people willing to 'rescue'/take on less than ideal animals, lack of buyers doesn't seem to stop these people. As a money-making scheme, relying on people feeling sorry for the horse seems a rather poor business model


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## all about Romeo (14 June 2012)

Wagtail said:



			Someone said that ABC was still interested.
		
Click to expand...

is ABC going to contact the owner then? 

ABC- are you going to buy tilly?  will you keep us updated? x


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## Princess Jess (14 June 2012)

Iamsanta I totally agree, but I think most people are capable of telling the difference between a mature teenager and one who is childish and rude.
Natalie its such a shame you have continued to post. 20 pages back I was willing to give you the benefit of the doubt but it's really getting ridiculous now. Stop posting and let those who enjoy a good argument find something else to get worked up about....


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## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

pookie said:



			He, and plenty of others, would do that anyway. Given the dearth of people willing to 'rescue'/take on less than ideal animals, lack of buyers doesn't seem to stop these people. As a money-making scheme, relying on people feeling sorry for the horse seems a rather poor business model 

Click to expand...

Possibly. But I always think the "if I don't someone else will" arguement is a bit thin.

If there's no market, the trade dies. Every time someone gives money to a rogue dealer they're encouraging him to trade. Awful for the current stock, obviously, but it may be better in the long run if they just can't sell their poorly raised foals. 

Believe me, I'm trying to convince myself as much as anyone. I'm practically walking distance from the foal in the ad, it's taking self control not to pick up the phone.


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## rema (14 June 2012)

Princess Jess said:



			Iamsanta I totally agree, but I think most people are capable of telling the difference between a mature teenager and one who is childish and rude.
Natalie its such a shame you have continued to post. 20 pages back I was willing to give you the benefit of the doubt but it's really getting ridiculous now. Stop posting and let those who enjoy a good argument find something else to get worked up about....
		
Click to expand...


Erm i think you will find that she has been given a holiday!!.


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## all about Romeo (14 June 2012)

55 pages!!  how do you shorten the pages?? 

and whats with all the talk about 3 legged horses??


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## Archangel (14 June 2012)

Now this is a cracking mare and look at the price 
http://www.dragondriving.co.uk/horseforsale-35650.html

Really the market is on its knees


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## rhino (14 June 2012)

JackDaniels1 said:



			I'm not looking to buy but if Tilly needed somewhere to live or stay (even temporarily) I am happy to help.
		
Click to expand...

Every rescue centre in the country is brimming with ponies looking for good homes, could you not offer a home for one of them? 

Not aimed at you, but generally, why are people so desperate to be seen as 'rescuing?'. I don't think this is a true rescue case, although I would be as pleased as anyone if she ended up somewhere lovely.


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## bensababy (14 June 2012)

RebelRebel said:



			Now this is a cracking mare and look at the price 
http://www.dragondriving.co.uk/horseforsale-35650.html

Really the market is on its knees 

Click to expand...

Oh god i really wish i hadnt seen that, the telephone number keeps screaming out to me :-(


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## Moomin1 (14 June 2012)

rhino said:



			Every rescue centre in the country is brimming with ponies looking for good homes, could you not offer a home for one of them? 

Not aimed at you, but generally, why are people so desperate to be seen as 'rescuing?'. I don't think this is a true rescue case, although I would be as pleased as anyone if she ended up somewhere lovely.
		
Click to expand...

This.


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## martlin (14 June 2012)

all about Romeo said:



			55 pages!!  how do you shorten the pages?? 

and whats with all the talk about 3 legged horses??  

Click to expand...

Donkeys, 3 legged donkeys. And I will have you know that it isn't just any 3 legged donkey, it is a 3 legged donkey from the most famous 3 legged donkey family - its grand grand sire was the first 3 legged donkey that managed to get round Badminton... slowly.


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## Princess Jess (14 June 2012)

Haha oops that'll teach me to be too lazy to read all the pages!
Thank god for that though


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## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

RebelRebel said:



			Now this is a cracking mare and look at the price 
http://www.dragondriving.co.uk/horseforsale-35650.html

Really the market is on its knees 

Click to expand...

Maybe it's just the angle, but she does look a bit of a strange shape in the second pic. A long, rather dipped back perhaps? It could be a bad photo, but also the poor lass could have been producing a foal a year since she was foal herself....

I wonder why people don't get a decent pic of a horse standing square when they want to sell?


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## LaurenBay (14 June 2012)

Yes Natalie is showing her young age here and by the looks of things has now been banned, which is a shame as she couldv'e learnt alot from the members on this forum (I know I have!) 

However I think some of the older members on this threads are the ones acting childish. You say she should stop posting and let the thread die, yet you keep replying to her  if you are all so much wiser and older then perhaps start acting like it and not reply at all. Afterall you are meant to be the adults here and should know better. Natalie is acting her age, perhaps you should all try acting yours! 

This isn't aimed at everyone by the way!


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## rhino (14 June 2012)

all about Romeo said:



			55 pages!!  how do you shorten the pages?? 

and whats with all the talk about 3 legged horses??  

Click to expand...

I told you earlier, weren't you listenting?   

Go to User CP > Edit Options > Scroll down to 'Number of posts to show per page' and set to 40. Scroll to bottom of page and click on 'save changes'

Et voila!


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## ILuvCowparsely (14 June 2012)

Wagtail said:



			Actually, some of it is quite witty.  

Not the teen baiting though. 

Click to expand...

Witty or not -  its debatable.  

Still I think her heart was in the right place at the beginning but with the neg feedback she got from some *usual*.   She then threw her teddies out.  
      When you think your doing the best and then get jumped on, this reaction is common and  happens all to often on this forum .   Poor Tilly


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## Ibblebibble (14 June 2012)

LaurenBay said:



			Natalie is acting her age, perhaps you should all try acting yours! 

This isn't aimed at everyone by the way!
		
Click to expand...

well i'm 41 and this is pretty much how i am all the time,  and if you think i'm bad you want to meet my 72 year old dad he's got growing old disgracefully down to a fine art


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## rema (14 June 2012)

Ibblebibble said:



			well i'm 41 and this is pretty much how i am all the time,  and if you think i'm bad you want to meet my 72 year old dad he's got growing old disgracefully down to a fine art

Click to expand...


Life is toooo short to be a stuffed shirt...The day i act my age is the day it's time to nail the lid on.


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## smokey (14 June 2012)

rema said:



			Life is toooo short to be a stuffed shirt...The day i act my age is the day it's time to nail the lid on.
		
Click to expand...

Will you be having a donkey-drawn carriage? Another earner for the 2/3 legged ones!


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## rema (14 June 2012)

smokey said:



			Will you be having a donkey-drawn carriage? Another earner for the 2/3 legged ones!
		
Click to expand...


Oh yes what a fab idea....Black donkeys with pink plumes and pink ribbons woven around the wheels of the donkey's.


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## Littlelegs (14 June 2012)

Can anyone who is defending it being a good plan for her to have bought the foal answer a question for me? If she appeared as a poster looking for help, with little experience or assistance, saying she had just bought a cheap foal from a dealer to rescue it but didn't know what she was supposed to do re feed, worming, handling etc, would you think it was a fantastic idea? We might all offer advice & try to help but would anyone truly think it was a good decision to have bought it? Or would you think she needed more experience first, a nice schoolmaster & knowledgeable help?


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## smokey (14 June 2012)

rema said:



			Oh yes what a fab idea....Black donkeys with pink plumes and pink ribbons woven around the wheels of the donkey's.
		
Click to expand...

We need to calm down here, this could turn into big fat boring old farts funerals! Loving the pink plumes though!


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## smokey (14 June 2012)

littlelegs said:



			Can anyone who is defending it being a good plan for her to have bought the foal answer a question for me? If she appeared as a poster looking for help, with little experience or assistance, saying she had just bought a cheap foal from a dealer to rescue it but didn't know what she was supposed to do re feed, worming, handling etc, would you think it was a fantastic idea? We might all offer advice & try to help but would anyone truly think it was a good decision to have bought it? Or would you think she needed more experience first, a nice schoolmaster & knowledgeable help?
		
Click to expand...

Well put! I personally think she needs a good telling off and sent to bed early!


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## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

smokey said:



			We need to calm down here, this could turn into big fat boring old farts funerals! Loving the pink plumes though!
		
Click to expand...

Hey! Old and boring maybe but who mentioned fat?


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## rema (14 June 2012)

FionaM12 said:



			Hey! Old and boring maybe but who mentioned fat? 

Click to expand...


Fattyboomboom


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## smokey (14 June 2012)

You mis-understood me Fiona, I meant "fat" a la big fat gypsy weddings. Clearly we couldn't have real fat funerals, these are 2/3 legged donkeys we're talking about. We don't want to be reported for cruelty, surely?


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## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

smokey said:



			You mis-understood me Fiona, I meant "fat" a la big fat gypsy weddings. Clearly we couldn't have real fat funerals, these are 2/3 legged donkeys we're talking about. We don't want to be reported for cruelty, surely?
		
Click to expand...

I don't know, it could be an interesting thread title:


"Is my dead body too heavy for my 3 legged donkey?"


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## Littlelegs (14 June 2012)

People misjudge how tough their limb challenged donkeys are nowadays. Ok, maybe someone over 50 stone is too big for 2 legs, but 3 legged donkeys were bred to carry 75 stone pregnant women to Bethlehem. Provided the rider is balanced it is just fattist to deny anyone a fat funeral.


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## smokey (14 June 2012)

FionaM12 said:



			I don't know, it could be an interesting thread title:


"Is my dead body too heavy for my 3 legged donkey?"
		
Click to expand...

Oh please, do it! Hilarious!


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## Ibblebibble (14 June 2012)

smokey said:



			We need to calm down here, this could turn into big fat boring old farts funerals! Loving the pink plumes though!
		
Click to expand...

pmsl absolutely brilliant


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## martlin (14 June 2012)

I think you are all bulling me! You have taken over MY donkey and I haven't seen a penny for it yet


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## Littlelegs (14 June 2012)

I think Patterdale wheeled the donkey to mumsnet, to start a AIBU in my choice of wheels thread.


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## martlin (14 June 2012)

littlelegs said:



			I think Patterdale wheeled the donkey to mumsnet, to start a AIBU in my choice of wheels thread.
		
Click to expand...

That is just theft! I will have to involve the authorities and rescue the donkey, it needs to be reunited with its leg!


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## all about Romeo (14 June 2012)

rhino said:



			I told you earlier, weren't you listenting?   

Go to User CP > Edit Options > Scroll down to 'Number of posts to show per page' and set to 40. Scroll to bottom of page and click on 'save changes'

Et voila!
		
Click to expand...

I saw it but amid all the millions of pages I lost it and couldnt find it again... I am still looking for user CP... lol


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## smokey (14 June 2012)

martlin said:



			I think you are all bulling me! You have taken over MY donkey and I haven't seen a penny for it yet 

Click to expand...




Of course you will be fully re-imbursed for the use of your donkey. Although with the costs incurred for the removal of 2nd leg, the spare wheels and plumes etc, I doubt it'll come to much.  May be enough to get yourself a wee project donkey from DD, then we could drive them in pairs, although could be a problem deciding who the "wheeler" is going to be. The one with the most wheels I suppose.


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## rema (14 June 2012)

martlin said:



			That is just theft! I will have to involve the authorities and rescue the donkey, it needs to be reunited with its leg!
		
Click to expand...


That's what happens when you do shady deals in pub car parks...You left the donk tied up to the car whilst you went for a pee.


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## rhino (14 June 2012)

all about Romeo said:



			I saw it but amid all the millions of pages I lost it and couldnt find it again... I am still looking for user CP... lol
		
Click to expand...

Red bar near top of page, on the left! Under the advertising banner


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## Littlelegs (14 June 2012)

Sorry martlin, you should have been a bhs gold member & you could have got free legal advice & a contract. No sympathy here. And get back & teeth checked on its return, always good advice.


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## all about Romeo (14 June 2012)

rhino said:



			Red bar near top of page, on the left! Under the advertising banner 

Click to expand...

Success!!  Thank you Rhino x


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## MrsElle (14 June 2012)

rema said:



			Life is toooo short to be a stuffed shirt...The day i act my age is the day it's time to nail the lid on.
		
Click to expand...

They screw them on, not nail them on    

I know because I used to to it.  Funerals in general that is, not just screw the lids on


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## s4sugar (14 June 2012)

MrsElle said:



			They screw them on, not nail them on    

I know because I used to to it.  Funerals in general that is, not just screw the lids on 

Click to expand...

See - this thread is still educational!


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## Goldenstar (14 June 2012)

Good heavens I have a couple of busy days with the dressage trainer and you lot seem to have been on IV diamond white .


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## rema (14 June 2012)

MrsElle said:



			They screw them on, not nail them on    

I know because I used to to it.  Funerals in general that is, not just screw the lids on 

Click to expand...

Now that is an interesting Job..Must be dead quiet though..


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## MrsElle (14 June 2012)

rema said:



			Now that is an interesting Job..Must be dead quiet though..
		
Click to expand...

  Ah, if I had a pound for every time I had heard that one!


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## smokey (14 June 2012)

littlelegs said:



			Sorry martlin, you should have been a bhs gold member & you could have got free legal advice & a contract. No sympathy here. And get back & teeth checked on its return, always good advice.
		
Click to expand...

I'll have you know my care of this donkey has been second to none. We had its teeth removed to prevent any future problems, and to allow us to use the 6inch driving bit our old cart horse no longer needs. Donks back is also fine, I only ride it on its days off, and only round mountains (refer to previous post on this subject.)  had him to Kwik-Fit for a full MOT and service just the other day, passed flying colours.


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## rema (14 June 2012)

MrsElle said:



  Ah, if I had a pound for every time I had heard that one!   

Click to expand...

Sorry i couldn't resist.


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## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

rema said:



			Now that is an interesting Job..Must be dead quiet though..
		
Click to expand...

I worked in a funeral director's too, for about 5 years. Yep it is interesting, and you hear all the jokes, dead boring, bored stiff etc etc.


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## pookie (14 June 2012)

FionaM12 said:



			Possibly. But I always think the "if I don't someone else will" arguement is a bit thin.

If there's no market, the trade dies. Every time someone gives money to a rogue dealer they're encouraging him to trade. Awful for the current stock, obviously, but it may be better in the long run if they just can't sell their poorly raised foals. 

Believe me, I'm trying to convince myself as much as anyone. I'm practically walking distance from the foal in the ad, it's taking self control not to pick up the phone. 

Click to expand...

Oh no, I didn't mean I assume someone will buy it...quite the opposite. Plenty are never sold - they die or are shot and then are replaced. Lack of buyers doesn't stop these cretins. There's very little market for decent horses at the moment, let alone worm-riddled messes.


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## rema (14 June 2012)

FionaM12 said:



			I worked in a funeral director's too, for about 5 years. Yep it is interesting, and you hear all the jokes, dead boring, bored stiff etc etc. 

Click to expand...

No seriously what an interesting career...How do you go about getting into such a profession?.I have been to ALOT of family funerals (9) in the last 3 years and the people all are so respectful and nothing was too much trouble..but do you have to be a serious sort of person to do the job..You are handling someones loved one..


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## MrsElle (14 June 2012)

rema said:



			No seriously what an interesting career...How do you go about getting into such a profession?.I have been to ALOT of family funerals (9) in the last 3 years and the people all are so respectful and nothing was too much trouble..but do you have to be a serious sort of person to do the job..You are handling someones loved one..
		
Click to expand...

Found my job through the job centre.  Absolutely loved the job, didn't like the company so much.  If I had the money I would set up on my own, there is no better feeling than when a family thank you for making a sad occasion the very best it could be.


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## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

MrsElle said:



			Found my job through the job centre.
		
Click to expand...

Me too! I enjoyed it a lot of the time, but it was very poorly paid and there were some aspects I didn't like. You do get very close to the families at such a time though, don't you? It's as if all the usual social barriers are down, people just let you in and are themselves when they're grieving and need practical help. That's what I found, anyway.


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## rema (14 June 2012)

How on earth do you deal with all that grief..surrounded by people that are heart broken.


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## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

rema said:



			How on earth do you deal with all that grief..surrounded by people that are heart broken.
		
Click to expand...

Most deaths are a peaceful natural end to a long life. They're only sad to those who loved the person. The trick in working with grief is to empathise and understand but remember it's their grief, not yours. You can help, by offering practical help at a time when most people just don't know what to do.

It's a positive role, and you're helping people, so not sad at all. 

Of course there are tragic deaths of the very young and they do affect everyone who works in the business. Mercifully they're uncommon.


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## Queenofdiamonds (14 June 2012)

Beans2000 said:



			Have only read a few of the posts but just to let you know the little grey mule is sold, i rang him up yesterday and wanted to go up today but he's gone  Hopefully a nice happy home 

Click to expand...

The ride and drive one that Ethan was selling?


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## MrsElle (14 June 2012)

FionaM12 said:



			Most deaths are a peaceful natural end to a long life. They're only sad to those who loved the person. The trick in working with grief is to empathise and understand but remember it's their grief, not yours. You can help, by offering practical help at a time when most people just don't know what to do.

It's a positive role, and you're helping people, so not sad at all. 

Of course there are tragic deaths of the very young and they do affect everyone who works in the business. Mercifully they're uncommon.
		
Click to expand...

Spot on   I did once have to leave a room on the pretence of having to sneeze or something while I had a good cry.  I couldn't cry in front of the family as they were relying on me to be strong for them.  But lots of funerals were celebrations of people's lives, and not all darkness and depression.

I loved it.

Hey, perhaps we can set up our own funeral business Fiona, think we would be pretty good at it!


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## ABC (14 June 2012)

Haven't read all the replies but I noticed a few were aimed at me so here goes 

First of all thanks to rhino for pm'ing me, as far as I was aware Natalie was going to view Tilly and contact me if she didn't buy her so I could arrange a viewing, as Natalie didn't contact me (no doubt the message got lost in all the replies) I assumed Tilly had been bought 


I have since contacted the current owner and arranged a viewing, however apparently there are a couple of viewings inbetween now and my viewing so time will tell.

If I do buy Tilly I will offer her the best care I possible can, I'm not out to make any money, I simply have a field which could happily manage another horse, and it seems a waste not to use it 

If I hear anything of course I'll keep you all updated 

In the meantime, please carry on with your quick-witted jokes, you've made laugh


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## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

MrsElle said:



			Hey, perhaps we can set up our own funeral business Fiona, think we would be pretty good at it! 

Click to expand...

 With a specialist side in donkey carts?


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## ABC (14 June 2012)

And please ignore the spelling mistakes, I'm obviously illiterate


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## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

ABC said:



			I have since contacted the current owner and arranged a viewing, however apparently there are a couple of viewings inbetween now and my viewing so time will tell.
		
Click to expand...

Out of interest, did he ask to meet in a pub car park? 

Have you far to travel? If not we might be neighbours!


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## ABC (14 June 2012)

No he didn't ask to meet on a car park, he gave me his address and I said I'd use google maps or sat nav to find directions, he said if I got lost then just to give him a ring and he'd meet me wherever I was. I'm not going to go alone though, just in case 

I think it'll be a 30 minute drive, but I'm not 100% sure, I'll have to google his post code and see how far away it is, I'm not the best at knowing how far away/how close I am


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## Bikerchickone (14 June 2012)

Hope it goes well ABC. Keep us posted.


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## horsesatemymoney (14 June 2012)

Good luck, ABC 

Look at this:

http://www.preloved.co.uk/adverts/show/105866203/companion-or-light-hack.html

So tempted, but again, sensible head takes over....


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## Littlelegs (14 June 2012)

Glad you've been able to offer a home abc.


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## ABC (14 June 2012)

Thanks everyone, I'll keep you updated


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## all about Romeo (14 June 2012)

ABC said:



			Haven't read all the replies but I noticed a few were aimed at me so here goes 

First of all thanks to rhino for pm'ing me, as far as I was aware Natalie was going to view Tilly and contact me if she didn't buy her so I could arrange a viewing, as Natalie didn't contact me (no doubt the message got lost in all the replies) I assumed Tilly had been bought 


I have since contacted the current owner and arranged a viewing, however apparently there are a couple of viewings inbetween now and my viewing so time will tell.

If I do buy Tilly I will offer her the best care I possible can, I'm not out to make any money, I simply have a field which could happily manage another horse, and it seems a waste not to use it 

If I hear anything of course I'll keep you all updated 

In the meantime, please carry on with your quick-witted jokes, you've made laugh 

Click to expand...

 oh that is fantastic news!!  well done ABC, look forward to hearing how you get on x


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## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

horsesatemymoney said:



			Good luck, ABC 

Look at this:

http://www.preloved.co.uk/adverts/show/105866203/companion-or-light-hack.html

So tempted, but again, sensible head takes over.... 

Click to expand...

Such a sad look on her face in the head shot.  I'm not sure it's fair to be passing her on at all, she's lame and they think it's permenant and can't afford the physio.  Will you, or anyone else, be able to either? And I wouldn't be riding a lame horse, light hack or not. Poor lass.


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## horsesatemymoney (14 June 2012)

I know Fiona, as much as I feel sorry for her, there's no way that I would take her on because I couldn't afford to treat her, but how awful, the advert reads like 'well, I've had her ten months, she's old and needs money spending on her, so who will buy her?' terrible


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## all about Romeo (14 June 2012)

FionaM12 said:



			Such a sad look on her face in the head shot.  I'm not sure it's fair to be passing her on at all, she's lame and they think it's permenant and can't afford the physio.  Will you, or anyone else, be able to either? And I wouldn't be riding a lame horse, light hack or not. Poor lass.
		
Click to expand...

Poor old girl... should be PTS really... I think the owner has a cheek to be asking money for her!!  What is wrong with these people?? poor thing has been used and abused and will now be passed around until someone puts her down ... dreadful behavior!


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## horsesatemymoney (14 June 2012)

I know: the advert mentions no jumping! 

This sort of ad pulls at my heartstring, but I know that I could never take on something which would cost so much and is elderly, but it does make you sad  Poor old girl


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## ILuvCowparsely (14 June 2012)

So sad poor girl .

 10 months??? something smells fishy.  Look how she has tied  her rope directly to the gate so if she pulls back the gate would clang.  Does she not have any twine.

 Shame we  can't save her.  God i wish I had more land  and more money


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## Goldenstar (14 June 2012)

horsesatemymoney said:



			Good luck, ABC 

Look at this:

http://www.preloved.co.uk/adverts/show/105866203/companion-or-light-hack.html

So tempted, but again, sensible head takes over.... 

Click to expand...

Poor lass how's she going to find a nice home, I really don't understand why people don't just PTS in these situations.


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## Mongoose11 (14 June 2012)

http://www.dragondriving.co.uk/horseforsale-35197.html

This lad would be coming home with me if I had a space for him. Look at that face! The little yard next to mine might be coming up (please, please, please) as the tenants owe a fair bit and might be asked to leave. I have decided that if I take it on and when I feel ready, I am going to take a fella like this one, feed him, let him grow, keep him warm, handle him well and when the time is right find a good home for him.

Stupid maybe, waste of money - no.


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## horsesatemymoney (14 June 2012)

Leviathan said:



			So sad poor girl .

 10 months??? something smells fishy.  Look how she has tied  her rope directly to the gate so if she pulls back the gate would clang.  Does she not have any twine.

 Shame we  can't save her.  God i wish I had more and and more money

Click to expand...

Me too If I won the lottery I would set up a rescue centre, but until then the pragmatist in me says no, I agree in this situation PTS might be the best option for the poor girl. So sad


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## horsesatemymoney (14 June 2012)

Goldenstar said:



			Poor lass how's she going to find a nice home, I really don't understand why people don't just PTS in these situations.
		
Click to expand...

I know....you wonder what will happen if nobody buys, will then draw the sensible conclusion and pts or try and pass her on some other way


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## horsesatemymoney (14 June 2012)

Billie1007 said:



http://www.dragondriving.co.uk/horseforsale-35197.html

This lad would be coming home with me if I had a space for him. Look at that face! The little yard next to mine might be coming up (please, please, please) as the tenants owe a fair bit and might be asked to leave. I have decided that if I take it on and when I feel ready, I am going to take a fella like this one, feed him, let him grow, keep him warm, handle him well and when the time is right find a good home for him.

Stupid maybe, waste of money - no.
		
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Aw I think this boy was posted the other day on this thread, he's got the burn/scar on his leg  Bless him hope he gets a good home


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## angelish (14 June 2012)

you can't save them all 

what about this little fella , bottom of page "He can sometimes walk with a slight limp but when he runs its not noticeable at all" 

http://www.dragondriving.co.uk/horseforsale-35197.html


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## horsesatemymoney (14 June 2012)

angelish said:



			you can't save them all 

what about this little fella , bottom of page "He can sometimes walk with a slight limp but when he runs its not noticeable at all" 

http://www.dragondriving.co.uk/horseforsale-35197.html

Click to expand...

'Nice little cob for breeding'..... "He can sometimes walk with a slight limp but when he runs its not noticeable at all"  Great breeding quality stock...terrible


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## asommerville (14 June 2012)

http://www.dragondriving.co.uk/horseforsale-35197.html


oh no wish i hadnt looked :-(


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## Jazzy B (14 June 2012)

so many sad cases


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## Queenofdiamonds (14 June 2012)

asommerville said:



http://www.dragondriving.co.uk/horseforsale-35197.html


oh no wish i hadnt looked :-(
		
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I know the man advertising that, I can't see it being something he's bred himself. I've seen his older mares, 2 and 3 year olds. One of my friends knows him very well. He will have picked that up from someone else.


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## horsesatemymoney (14 June 2012)

Queenofdiamonds said:



			I know the man advertising that, I can't see it being something he's bred himself. I've seen his older mares, 2 and 3 year olds. One of my friends knows him very well. He will have picked that up from someone else.
		
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What, the top one?


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## touchstone (14 June 2012)

Or there's this yearling thats already broken in, driven and shod:-
http://www.dragondriving.co.uk/horseforsale-33824.html


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## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

Queenofdiamonds said:



			I know the man advertising that, I can't see it being something he's bred himself. I've seen his older mares, 2 and 3 year olds. One of my friends knows him very well. He will have picked that up from someone else.
		
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But why not worm, feed up for a few weeks and wash the poor thing before putting it on the site? So sad.

Also, didn't he have a mule for sale who looked pretty poor too? Or was that someone else?


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## Queenofdiamonds (14 June 2012)

Re; Funerals, My YO Has five imported fresians and does the carriage driving with them for funerals. She also does weddings and has 2 lippizanners. They are GORGEOUS. I would give my right arm for one of them.


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## horsesatemymoney (14 June 2012)

touchstone said:



			Or there's this yearling thats already broken in, driven and shod:-
http://www.dragondriving.co.uk/horseforsale-33824.html

Click to expand...

What is 'yoked'?


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## Queenofdiamonds (14 June 2012)

Fiona - I don't know. I don't know him that well. I've met him a few times that's it. As i said, One of my friends knows him quite well. I was just stating that it won't be something he has bred himself.

Also - Proves those thinking no one could possibly find out about a thread on here wrong! It wouldn't be hard for him to find out if i mentioned it to people who know him,  Same for the other bloke


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## touchstone (14 June 2012)

horsesatemymoney said:



			What is 'yoked'? 

Click to expand...

Means put in harness/driven.


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## rhino (14 June 2012)

FionaM12 said:



			But why not worm, feed up for a few weeks and wash the poor thing before putting it on the site? So sad.
		
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Because 'ordinary' youngstock aren't really selling. Quality youngstock are, and the 'pity' buys...

Sad state of affairs when you are more likely to sell something that looks like cr@p, because buyers like to think they think they are 'rescuing' it


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## horsesatemymoney (14 June 2012)

touchstone said:



			Means put in harness/driven.
		
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Thanks  I was wondering if it meant 'something else'


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## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

touchstone said:



			Or there's this yearling thats already broken in, driven and shod:-
http://www.dragondriving.co.uk/horseforsale-33824.html

Click to expand...

"Welcome to come and ride"  

That email address is on a lot of for sale ads in Morecambe. Usually very poor sad things.


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## Queenofdiamonds (14 June 2012)

horsesatemymoney said:



			What, the top one?
		
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Yeah, He lives in derbyshire, He goes to the market (Derby) [Or used to, assuming he still does, idon't go much] That's where i met him.


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## Queenofdiamonds (14 June 2012)

FionaM12 said:



			"Welcome to come and ride"  

That email address is on a lot of for sale ads in Morecambe. Usually very poor sad things. 

Click to expand...

Where does it say anything about riding?

Re-read the top bit about being broken in, but it doesn't say welcome to come  and ride?

I very much doubt it's actually broken in.


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## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

rhino said:



			Because 'ordinary' youngstock aren't really selling. Quality youngstock are, and the 'pity' buys...

Sad state of affairs when you are more likely to sell something that looks like cr@p, because buyers like to think they think they are 'rescuing' it 

Click to expand...

That's an attitude I find beyond belief. Not yours, Rhino, the sellers'. Shame on them, but all the more reason to resist the temptation to pity buy these poor things. Hard I know, but if you buy off such a person, you _are_ part of the problem.


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## FionaM12 (14 June 2012)

Queenofdiamonds said:



			Where does it say anything about riding?
		
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You're right, I misread it.


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## Queenofdiamonds (14 June 2012)

I agree people need to stop buying them, But they won't. I know two people myself who are struggling because of a cheap buy. They thought it would be a cheap way to get a cracking pony buying these sorts. Now they're having their arse handed to them by their horses. It's the same for a lot i imagine.


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## Patterdale (15 June 2012)

...............(bump....?).....


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## smokey (15 June 2012)

patterdale said:



			...............(bump....?).....



Click to expand...

Just as it had all gone quiet!


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## FairyLights (15 June 2012)

Why isnt the RSPCA looking i to these youngsters being ridden?


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## FionaM12 (15 June 2012)

patterdale said:



			...............(bump....?).....



Click to expand...

Withdrawal symtoms Patterdale?


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## FionaM12 (15 June 2012)

Horsesforever1 said:



			Why isnt the RSPCA looking i to these youngsters being ridden?
		
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But surely, the age you start riding a horse isn't set in stone? What about racing?

You and I might think riding a yearling's cruel, but it's our opinion, it's not against the law.


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## Suziq77 (15 June 2012)

patterdale said:



			...............(bump....?).....



Click to expand...

PMSL  I feel like Spudlet's stoned polar bear with this thread!

http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=509843&highlight=STONED+POLAR+BEAR&page=8


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## pookie (15 June 2012)

Horsesforever1 said:



			Why isnt the RSPCA looking i to these youngsters being ridden?
		
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Because they're the RSPCA? No love lost for them with me.


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## FionaM12 (15 June 2012)

pookie said:



			Because they're the RSPCA? No love lost for them with me.
		
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Whatever you think of the RSPCA though, I don't see what any welfare organisation can do about backing young, for the reasons I give above. The very poor physical state and possible poor living conditions of some of these horses is another matter. But they'll only act if someone reports the cases.

If people rush in and buy the horses to "rescue" them, there's no point in reporting to the RSPCA, WHW etc because the problem's solved leaving the dealer to start the job of undernourishing the next one ready for sale.


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## pookie (15 June 2012)

FionaM12 said:



			Whatever you think of the RSPCA though, I don't see what any welfare organisation can do about backing young, for the reasons I give above.
		
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Yep, I've never really understood that. Detrimental to the welfare of the horse is detrimental to the welfare of the horse  If I thought the dealer only had one horse in that condition at any given time I agree there'd be no point in rescuing/buying and then reporting.


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## applecart14 (15 June 2012)

meesha said:



			Poor thing, wish I hadnt looked as I just want to go and collect her (you would prob have to restrain me from telling owner what i thought though - after poor girl safely in trailer!).  I am too far away to be of much help but would be happy to make a small donation if needed !.  Out of interest do you think there is any reason that filly will have problems long term ?
		
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Recent research claims it is better to wean foals at 8 or 9 months of age now.  They have less health problems and a stronger, more resilient nature apparently.


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## FionaM12 (15 June 2012)

applecart14 said:



			Recent research claims it is better to wean foals at 8 or 9 months of age now.  They have less health problems and a stronger, more resilient nature apparently.
		
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I think the same's probably true of human babies. Although lots of perfectly healthy babies are weaned young or bottle fed, the best chance in life seems to be given if mother's milk is available for as long as possible.


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## OldNag (15 June 2012)

FionaM12 said:



			I think the same's probably true of human babies. Although lots of perfectly healthy babies are weaned young or bottle fed, the best chance in life seems to be given if mother's milk is available for as long as possible. 

Click to expand...

Indeed, World Health Organisation research confirms this with regard to human babies. It makes sense to me - if in humans, why not in animals.


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## FionaM12 (15 June 2012)

pookie said:



			Yep, I've never really understood that. Detrimental to the welfare of the horse is detrimental to the welfare of the horse 

Click to expand...

Yet if the RSPCA were to act every time a yearling is ridden, they'd never be out of the racing yards.


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## pookie (15 June 2012)

FionaM12 said:



			Yet if the RSPCA were to act every time a yearling is ridden, they'd never be out of the racing yards. 

Click to expand...

Oh, that'd be a tragedy


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## AMH (15 June 2012)

*puts on tin helmet and pokes head above parapet*

I think, though, that there's a difference between breaking a baby TB late in its yearling year and breaking a baby cob at the same time - the rates of maturation and muscular development are very different...

*ducks back down again and throws Maltesers to distract the scary people*


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## FionaM12 (15 June 2012)

AMH said:



			*puts on tin helmet and pokes head above parapet*

I think, though, that there's a difference between breaking a baby TB late in its yearling year and breaking a baby cob at the same time - the rates of maturation and muscular development are very different...

*ducks back down again and throws Maltesers to distract the scary people*

Click to expand...

That's what people have always told me. But does any research back it up? (Genuine question. I have no idea...).


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## pookie (15 June 2012)

FionaM12 said:



			That's what people have always told me. But does any research back it up? (Genuine question. I have no idea...).
		
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AFAIK, skeletal maturation is not breed specific. No idea about musculature.


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## touchstone (15 June 2012)

AMH said:



			*puts on tin helmet and pokes head above parapet*

I think, though, that there's a difference between breaking a baby TB late in its yearling year and breaking a baby cob at the same time - the rates of maturation and muscular development are very different...

*ducks back down again and throws Maltesers to distract the scary people*

Click to expand...

I'm not scary I hope, but will grab the maltesers,  there is an article that states that the maturity rate of tb's is the same as any other breed.   Will see if I can find it later.

Found it!:- http://www.equinestudies.org/ranger_2008/ranger_piece_2008_pdf1.pdf


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## Parker79 (15 June 2012)

Any news yet?


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## rema (15 June 2012)

Parker79 said:



			Any news yet?
		
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News on what?.


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## Parker79 (15 June 2012)

rema said:



			News on what?.
		
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Whether ABC got to see Tilly?


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## rema (15 June 2012)

Parker79 said:



			Whether ABC got to see Tilly?
		
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Oh i see...No,no news yet ;0)


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## FionaM12 (15 June 2012)

Parker79 said:



			Whether ABC got to see Tilly?
		
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She had an appointment to view (at the seller's address, not a pub car park ) but I don't think she said when, and there were a few viewings booked before hers.


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## Meowy Catkin (15 June 2012)

there is an article that states that the maturity rate of tb's is the same as any other breed
		
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Correct.  There is no such thing as an early or late maturing breed.


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## Patterdale (15 June 2012)

Sorry for the bump but it was getting boring 


.......oh dear, I seem to have done it again...

Personally I like to break them as yearlings. Easier to get on when they're small and tend to be faster, which is always a bonus


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## Littlelegs (15 June 2012)

I think as a yearling they might put up a fight myself. Much better as a foal, ideally before weaning. If you get on while they are feeding they don't notice.


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## pookie (15 June 2012)

patterdale said:



			Sorry for the bump but it was getting boring 


.......oh dear, I seem to have done it again...

Personally I like to break them as yearlings. Easier to get on when they're small and tend to be faster, which is always a bonus
		
Click to expand...

Plus, your feet can reach the ground so you can push them along when they get tired and no need to teach brakes.

Better with wheels, obviously.


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## FionaM12 (15 June 2012)

littlelegs said:



			I think as a yearling they might put up a fight myself. Much better as a foal, ideally before weaning. If you get on while they are feeding they don't notice.
		
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How about standing astride them the first time they get up after being born? Then you're on their back the first moment they stand. I always think starting young's a good idea.


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## Parker79 (15 June 2012)

You lot are funny!


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## Littlelegs (15 June 2012)

Yes, good plan fiona. Now you mention it, if I think a foal might be particularly headstrong I wait astride behind the mare while she's foaling so I can mount right away.


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## smokey (15 June 2012)

And if you position yourself correctly with the bridle in hand, you can get a bit in its mouth before its back end hits the floor. Always best to have good brakes with a youngster.


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## Parker79 (15 June 2012)

I wonder how many people are reading this and having to go backwards at speed to read the thread.

They will think everyone has lost it 

ps.....just stop the foal having any milk...then it will be grateful.... and see you as its master....genius!.....scuttles off to write a book now!


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## gracey (15 June 2012)

Parker79 said:



			I wonder how many people are reading this and having to go backwards at speed to read the thread.

They will think everyone has lost it 

ps.....just stop the foal having any milk...then it will be grateful.... and see you as its master....genius!.....scuttles off to write a book now!
		
Click to expand...

can i become your disciple?  pmsl we could make millions!!!


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## Parker79 (15 June 2012)

gracey said:



			can i become your disciple?  pmsl we could make millions!!!
		
Click to expand...

Do you have the money to buy a ranch? Do you think we could film some DVD's in my field....if I chase my gelding around so the whites of his eyes show...then I will poke him with a stick (he will be intrigued and calm down immediately as he always does) we can make a fortune!


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## Littlelegs (15 June 2012)

Just make sure its not a breach if you are waiting with the bridle. I learnt the hard way when I tried to open its mouth for the bit. Which incidentally is a simple neue schule kk half cheek sprenger happy mullen mouth gag. In sweet iron with lozenge.


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## gracey (15 June 2012)

Parker79 said:



			Do you have the money to buy a ranch? Do you think we could film some DVD's in my field....if I chase my gelding around so the whites of his eyes show...then I will poke him with a stick (he will be intrigued and calm down immediately as he always does) we can make a fortune!
		
Click to expand...

poke him with a carrot stick??? 


hmm write your book first then buy ranch ..then make the dvds!!! sorted!!!


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## Parker79 (15 June 2012)

gracey said:



			poke him with a carrot stick??? 


hmm write your book first then buy ranch ..then make the dvds!!! sorted!!! 


Click to expand...

A carrot stick...gasp! no...ours could be called a 'be nice poker!' make it a happy colour like pink...genius!


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## gracey (15 June 2012)

littlelegs said:



			Just make sure its not a breach if you are waiting with the bridle. I learnt the hard way when I tried to open its mouth for the bit. Which incidentally is a simple neue schule kk half cheek sprenger happy mullen mouth gag. In sweet iron with lozenge.
		
Click to expand...

you'll have to ask the big boss if you can join


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## Parker79 (15 June 2012)

littlelegs said:



			Just make sure its not a breach if you are waiting with the bridle. I learnt the hard way when I tried to open its mouth for the bit. Which incidentally is a simple neue schule kk half cheek sprenger happy mullen mouth gag. In sweet iron with lozenge.
		
Click to expand...

 nearly had a minor accident reading this


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## gracey (15 June 2012)

Parker79 said:



			A carrot stick...gasp! no...ours could be called a 'be nice poker!' make it a happy colour like pink...genius!
		
Click to expand...

..and with that .. you are on your way to your first billion!! lol!!


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## smokey (15 June 2012)

littlelegs said:



			Just make sure its not a breach if you are waiting with the bridle. I learnt the hard way when I tried to open its mouth for the bit. Which incidentally is a simple neue schule kk half cheek sprenger happy mullen mouth gag. In sweet iron with lozenge.
		
Click to expand...

Rofl! That sounds like a nice uncomplicated bit. Naturally you will also have a mango stick in your other hand in order to enjoy all the games you and foalie are going to play


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## Littlelegs (15 June 2012)

I believe the correct equipment is a 'be nice poker' (TM). However my bit is part of my patented 'foal jockey bridle' (TM). Essential to play the 'seven screw ups' (TM).


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## smokey (15 June 2012)

Have just seen " be nice poker" much better than a fruit or veg based training aid. The foal jockey bridleTM looks fab, is that available in a double? With a flash?  No need for the little beggar to be opening its mouth if there is no fruit or veg stick available.


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## Parker79 (15 June 2012)

I see your logic...but no real need for a bridle....provided we can get the foal to run around the flowerpots and walk sideways down a pole using the 'be nice poker' then there is absolutely no reason to think we would need to actually ride this little horse.


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## smokey (15 June 2012)

Are you suggesting that we may not need a saddle either? Surely we will have to do a lot of mounting and dismounting each training session. I'm not suggesting that the foal should actually move during this time, more that it should just stand and allow us to play about for ages while prodding it with the be nice poker to get it to move half an inch to the side.


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## Littlelegs (15 June 2012)

Of course we need a bridle, its a great money spinner, erm that is training aid. And not a saddle a 'foal seat' (TM).


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## smokey (15 June 2012)

Foal seat, what a fab marketing idea! I mean,erm what a good idea to have such a clever and versatile training aid. Of course will need to develope a bespoke storage solution for all equipment, as once the foal has done its 2 weeks intensive screw upTM programme none of it will be needed again.


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## WoopsiiD (15 June 2012)

I can see some very wise posters on here.
Posters who know the right way to start a horse. 
Because of that I'm going to tell you a secret....its all the the halter. After many years of dedicated work and a stint living with a little known group of horsemen in a remote area of the Himilayas I am able to share with you for a bargain price the 'Dufeckally Halter'.
Let me know if you want to purchase any.


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## smokey (15 June 2012)

WoopsiiD said:



			I can see some very wise posters on here.
Posters who know the right way to start a horse. 
Because of that I'm going to tell you a secret....its all the the halter. After many years of dedicated work and a stint living with a little known group of horsemen in a remote area of the Himilayas I am able to share with you for a bargain price the 'Dufeckally Halter'.
Let me know if you want to purchase any.
		
Click to expand...

This sounds like a wonderful piece of kit, and would do everything I would want to do. I am assuming that you will do a decent discount for a fellow professional , and that your price includes a starter pack including a DVD and a cowboy hat?


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## Ladydragon (15 June 2012)

pookie said:



			Plus, your feet can reach the ground so you can push them along when they get tired and no need to teach brakes.

Better with wheels, obviously.
		
Click to expand...

Roller skates...



littlelegs said:



			Just make sure its not a breach if you are waiting with the bridle. I learnt the hard way when I tried to open its mouth for the bit. Which incidentally is a simple neue schule kk half cheek sprenger happy mullen mouth gag. In sweet iron with lozenge.
		
Click to expand...

Oh dear...  Just covered lap, sofa and the cat with coffee...


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## Littlelegs (15 June 2012)

I am sure we could do a deal to say its essential for one of the 'seven screw ups' TM. That is, I believe it would be right & good to allow other horse owners to benefit. Fab idea to include cowboy hat & dvd, adds another £50 to the rrp.


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## WoopsiiD (15 June 2012)

smokey said:



			This sounds like a wonderful piece of kit, and would do everything I would want to do. I am assuming that you will do a decent discount for a fellow professional , and that your price includes a starter pack including a DVD and a cowboy hat?

Click to expand...

I can certainly do you a generous discount. 
The Dufeckally Halter is handcrafted by blind Tibetan monkeys from the finest duck billed platypus beaks.
The pack does include the starter DVD and Log books made from the bottoms of new born peaches and a mini pen stolen from argos-all fit in your cowboy hat!


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## Patterdale (15 June 2012)

And think of the money we'll save on water rates on the ranch....


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## smokey (16 June 2012)

WoopsiiD said:



			I can certainly do you a generous discount. 
The Dufeckally Halter is handcrafted by blind Tibetan monkeys from the finest duck billed platypus beaks.
The pack does include the starter DVD and Log books made from the bottoms of new born peaches and a mini pen stolen from argos-all fit in your cowboy hat!
		
Click to expand...

I assume that these are Fairtrade monkeys we're talking about? I would hate to think that any creature was being taken advantage of here. Exploitation is one of my pet hates! 
The log books and pens sound like a great idea, and all fitted in the hat, genius!


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## Parker79 (16 June 2012)

WoopsiiD said:



			I can certainly do you a generous discount. 
The Dufeckally Halter is handcrafted by blind Tibetan monkeys from the finest duck billed platypus beaks.
The pack does include the starter DVD and Log books made from the bottoms of new born peaches and a mini pen stolen from argos-all fit in your cowboy hat!
		
Click to expand...

Well that is simply outrageous!! stealing a pen from Argos is wrong IMO and for that reason I am going to snub your Dufeckally Halter and will make everyone on this forum aware of how cruel you are! What did Argos do to deserve this?


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## PinkCob (16 June 2012)

...


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## PinkCob (16 June 2012)

shysmum said:



			Please please let's all do it - we could all adopt her then *grin*
		
Click to expand...

Omg, she could be our HHO Mascot ! I want in!


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## HazyXmas (16 June 2012)

Pinkcob, have you read all the posts? We are a very long way from where it started.

Very funny  Kept me away from the housework for hours.


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## PinkCob (16 June 2012)

HazyXmas said:



			Pinkcob, have you read all the posts? We are a very long way from where it started.

Very funny  Kept me away from the housework for hours.
		
Click to expand...

Tbh, no  
hehe, I get bored after the 4th page but I like the ideas at the beginning!


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## HazyXmas (16 June 2012)

Yes, i agree, a nice idea to start with...........then it all went horribly wrong 

Don't know what the outcome was, i think that possibly ABC was going to go & see her but i don't know if that went ahead or not?

Has anyone got any news?


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## FionaM12 (16 June 2012)

WoopsiiD said:



			'Dufeckally Halter'.
		
Click to expand...

Still giggling uncontrollably at this. 



PinkCob said:



			Tbh, no  
hehe, I get bored after the 4th page but I like the ideas at the beginning! 

Click to expand...




HazyXmas said:



			Yes, i agree, a nice idea to start with...........then it all went horribly wrong 

Click to expand...

In a nutshell Pink Cob: A teenage girl wanted to buy the filly (Tilly) and claimed she'd tried to book a viewing. Some folk here pointed out she'd said she hadn't the experience to take on Tilly, and also that giving cruel sellers money encourages the trade. At this, teenager threw a tantrunm which ended up with toys all over the floor, bad language and lots of naughty people laughing at her  and teen got sent to the naughty step by tfc, I assume she's there still.

Meanwhile, a more sensible young person, ABC, is interested in Tilly and will let us know the outcome. The thread then just dissolved in chaos and comedy and mad ideas about riding newborn foals... 

 It was funnier than that though.


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## Carefreegirl (16 June 2012)

I've just spent half an hour reading the last few pages and am now running late at work 

Wonder if this will make the top 5 in next weeks H&H ?


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## smokey (16 June 2012)

carefreegirl said:



			I've just spent half an hour reading the last few pages and am now running late at work 

Wonder if this will make the top 5 in next weeks H&H ?
		
Click to expand...

Never mind top 5 in H&H, we fully expect to be on the top sellers list in both books and dvd's. Having just heard that there is to be a film of our journey to be made, Hollywood loves this kind of thing. Never mind" the horse whisperer", "the foal pokerer" is going to be a blockbuster.


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## Littlelegs (16 June 2012)

Pmsl at 'foal pokerer'. Bagsi I get the role of whoever gets off with fit male lead in the film though. Need a version for games console & a range of toys, accessories etc too.


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## smokey (16 June 2012)

:In talks with a leading fast food establishment with a view to having merchandise given as a gift with their "hysterical meals". Video games is a fab idea, perhaps some interactive foal poking games? Fun for all the family! Little legs, I'm afraid you will have to audition for the role like everyone else. I hear both Katie Price and dame Helen Mirren have expressed an interest


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## Tinseltoes (16 June 2012)

So whats happening with TILLY??????


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## Littlelegs (16 June 2012)

No auditions, I Bagsi'd first. And have the foal squashing knowledge.
Regarding tilly, another poster has arranged a viewing, but there are others before her/him. But until they have viewed & possibly bought, I don't think updates would be wise incase the dealer gets wind.


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## Patterdale (16 June 2012)

Tilly joined the circus, do catch up 

Ps who's Tilly??


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## smokey (16 June 2012)

You could be listed in titles as advisor to the stars. That way you get to impart your knowledge and expertise without all the make up and wardrobe  nonsense. And work closely with the male lead, I understand Mickey Rooney is desperate to be involved.


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## Patterdale (16 June 2012)

Ill be head of puncture repair.


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## smokey (16 June 2012)

patterdale said:



			Ill be head of puncture repair.
		
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Would this be for the wheels on the foals, or if Katie Price gets the lead?


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## WoopsiiD (16 June 2012)

Due to poisonous emails from PETA-Pens Employed To Argos regarding my pilfering of pens I have had to remove the pens from the package.
I am however trying to source new pens made from the shells of the Galapogos Turtles and ink from the bladder of a pufferfish.
As soon as I have a new supplier I will supply the Blind Tibetan monkeys with fairtrade bananas and increase production of the Dufeckally Halters TM.
And NO Katie Price-they do not yet come in pink and crystal but I'm listening.....though not through Derby House and KPE.....need to know the suckers...I mean genius horsemanship foal pokerers are actually receiving their *bargain* priced goodies.


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## HollyWoozle (16 June 2012)

Beans2000 said:



			Have only read a few of the posts but just to let you know the little grey mule is sold, i rang him up yesterday and wanted to go up today but he's gone  Hopefully a nice happy home 

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Thanks for the heads up... my mum had just agreed to let us buy him if not! Hopefully he has a nice home like you say.


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## smokey (16 June 2012)

How awful! Not sure if your proposal to use turtle shell is the best though, surely you will have difficulty matching the quality of the Argos pens with this inferior material? Unless of course you propose using the shell of newly hatched turtles, before the sea water can damage the shell. I can recommend an excellent  Argentinian  turtle wrangler who would be willing to come and train your staff in return for some DufeckallyTM halters for his polo foals.


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## Littlelegs (16 June 2012)

I have some old crayons of my daughters, I mean some writing tools derived from Peruvian bees, and coloured by one winged lesser spotted anteater saliva I could supply as pens?


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## smokey (16 June 2012)

That's a good call, I like that we are using sustainable natural materials. Perhaps this should be stated in our hard sell, I mean enlightened advertising? Although I think the quality of our materials speak for themselves .


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## WoopsiiD (16 June 2012)

I think we have hit it there ladies!
Now to con...I mean advise those with mares about to drop that they need our product and bully and guilt trip, sorry offer advice to those that have not started their foals properly that there is still time for them.


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## smokey (16 June 2012)

WoopsiiD said:



			I think we have hit it there ladies!
Now to con...I mean advise those with mares about to drop that they need our product and bully and guilt trip, sorry offer advice to those that have not started their foals properly that there is still time for them.
		
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I am delighted that we have come this far, and now to get the product out there. Remember ladies, we must be positively evangelical in our approach to this, we must ensure that our bank balances, I mean customers are fully satisfied.


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## Littlelegs (16 June 2012)

Never fear, I have a plan. I have a few dozen mares of indiscriminate breeding, nice colours though so nobody notices the confirmation faults. All kept with previous years colts, so should be in foal. Then to get media cover, I will call the daily mail & complain there's non working single mare mothers, some born outside England & one or two with (fly) veils. Should get us front page cover if I time the reporters & foaling/pokering together.


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## smokey (16 June 2012)

littlelegs said:



			Never fear, I have a plan. I have a few dozen mares of indiscriminate breeding, nice colours though so nobody notices the confirmation faults. All kept with previous years colts, so should be in foal. Then to get media cover, I will call the daily mail & complain there's non working single mare mothers, some born outside England & one or two with (fly) veils. Should get us front page cover if I time the reporters & foaling/pokering together.
		
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This is all good, the foals who don't make the grade as highly trained field ornaments can be extras on "the foal pokerer" . Are we going to market "fly veils" for these foals? Timing will of course be all important for maximum coverage, but I'm sure that all the single mothers can be pokered into compliance.


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## WoopsiiD (16 June 2012)

Please feel free to send any unworking mares my way and I will put them to my foundation stallion, truly an amazing creature and a winner all spheres. 
He has bred many, many quality animals who I am proud to say have been used as stallions as well. Infact Mr DonJuanabee-my stallion id due to be put to his Dam as soon as she drops her current foal who was sired by her brother.
Mr DonJuanabee


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## Littlelegs (16 June 2012)

Fantastic stallion whoopsiid, you certainly have an eye for quality, & you have the right idea, why should his own line miss out on more of his fantastic genes. Unfortunaty, my mares all work in Patterdales circus up till foaling, so none spare sorry.


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## smokey (16 June 2012)

WoopsiiD said:



			Please feel free to send any unworking mares my way and I will put them to my foundation stallion, truly an amazing creature and a winner all spheres. 
He has bred many, many quality animals who I am proud to say have been used as stallions as well. Infact Mr DonJuanabee-my stallion id due to be put to his Dam as soon as she drops her current foal who was sired by her brother.
Mr DonJuanabee





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A quality animal indeed! I don't understand all the nay- Sayers who claim that in-breeding is a bad thing. I personally believe it is the way forward, no introducing the mare and stallion, they already know one another!


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## Patterdale (16 June 2012)

True about the circus. Plus I've got 2 out of action due to an unfortunate lion/trapeze incident (long story) so I'm a bit short myself now


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## Ibblebibble (16 June 2012)

lol you lot are genius i was so busy reading and giggling i managed to scoff a whole big bar of caramel without noticing


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## Patterdale (16 June 2012)

Ps that stallions a mega babe. He looks wise.


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## WoopsiiD (16 June 2012)

Wise beyond his years let me tell you!
He acts like a rock steady 15yr old while out hacking and at a show last week the Air Ambulance landed right next to us to collect an old lady who fainted with shock and fell into the water jump when I told her he was only 6months!
He didn't bat an eyelid! Though this is quite possibly because he was born with out eyelids. It was never a problem for his sire and dam (brother and sister) nor for his Grandsire.


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## smokey (16 June 2012)

patterdale said:



			Ps that stallions a mega babe. He looks wise.
		
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Of course he does, he has been beautifully produced, and has benefitted from foal pokering, which although started late has still had a positive effect. Sorry to hear of your circus troubles Patterdale, although you shouldn't be short for long if you get all the new foals pokered without delay. Perhaps you could get a few tightrope walking, that would surely be more impressive than trapezing tigers?


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## WoopsiiD (16 June 2012)

Patterdale,
As a business partner and a strong believer in Pokering let me lend you MrDonJuanabee's Sire. He is 18months old and a quick learner-all down to the Pokering and Dufeckally Halter TM system. 
Meet TooDamnedDarko out of BuggaroffxRamiro ABCDEFGHIJKLMNOPQRSTUVWXY mare


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## smokey (16 June 2012)

WoopsiiD said:



			Patterdale,
As a business partner and a strong believer in Pokering let me lend you MrDonJuanabee's Sire. He is 18months old and a quick learner-all down to the Pokering and Dufeckally Halter TM system. 
Meet TooDamnedDarko out of BuggaroffxRamiro ABCDEFGHIJKLMNOPQRSTUVWXY mare





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Patterdale, take her hand off, he's exquisite. WoopsiiD does he have andalusian in him? I can imagine he can turn his hoof to any discipline. He is a shining example of what pokering can achieve.


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## WoopsiiD (16 June 2012)

I believe he has!
What an eye you have Smokey!!

As for turning his hoof the vet assures me that this is not a problem as with correct barefoot shoeing we should be able to have it facing forward again very soon!


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## Littlelegs (16 June 2012)

What another fantastic specimen! Looks just like my Olympic poking champ. Fantastic weight carriers too imo, I am 64 stone & hunt mine.


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## smokey (16 June 2012)

WoopsiiD said:



			I believe he has!
What an eye you have Smokey!!

As for turning his hoof the vet assures me that this is not a problem as with correct barefoot shoeing we should be able to have it facing forward again very soon!
		
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I am so glad to hear you are a disciple of the barefoot fraternity. It makes it so much easier to fit wheels for all terrain poking, which I believe will feature as a new event at this years Olympics. Heads up to Littlelegs! 
As far as my eye, well I'm flattered you should mention it, but really it's not difficult to spot the quality of this boy. What would his stud fee be, I doubt I could afford him, but one can dream!


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## myhorsefred (16 June 2012)

What did happen to the pony, Tilly, please?  Does anyone know the outcome?

Sorry, I haven't read all the pages of this thread.


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## smokey (16 June 2012)

myhorsefred said:



			What did happen to the pony, Tilly, please?  Does anyone know the outcome?

Sorry, I haven't read all the pages of this thread.
		
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Obviously!  it's all a bit hazy now, but I think another poster was going to have a look and will update later.


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## myhorsefred (16 June 2012)

Ok, thanks.


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## applecart14 (18 June 2012)

I can't quite believe how many people (including myself) have responded to this post!  Seems like she could have been sold a hundred times to various posters!  There are a lot worse horses and ponies being sold like this at markets all over the country, in a lot worse condition and at a younger age.  Its such a shame, its over breeding gone mad.


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## lpeacock (24 June 2012)

Natalieshort said:



			I didn't buy her. There was no viewing.
		
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I'm guessing with a filly like that you get what you see.. Viewing it won't make much difference as the poor thing is obviously in a terrible state.

Just report them, get the horses removed by an authority and then try and get her through the authority.

Two birds with one stone and all that...


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## ItsAllPoppyCock (2 July 2012)

Tilly is back! Just seen her advert updated on Dragon Driving


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## Patterdale (2 July 2012)

Oh goodness this threads back....! 

Goodbye productive work time!


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## Tinseltoes (2 July 2012)

I have seen the ad yesterday.


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## FionaM12 (2 July 2012)

ItsAllPoppyCock said:



			Tilly is back! Just seen her advert updated on Dragon Driving 

Click to expand...

With slightly better photos.


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## FairyLights (2 July 2012)

The best way to tackle this situation is for us all to contact the Inland Revenue with the phone number of the seller and inform them he is selling under 3 names.


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## SuperCoblet (2 July 2012)

Link? Or is it the same as last time?


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## rhino (2 July 2012)

iamSanta said:



			Link? Or is it the same as last time? 

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http://www.dragondriving.co.uk/horseforsale-36065.html


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## Patterdale (2 July 2012)

'good home only'

Rules out my circus then


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## smokey (2 July 2012)

patterdale said:



			'good home only'

Rules out my circus then 



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Would you have time anyway, with the spider wrangling and the cat rustling?


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## Passionflower (5 November 2012)

Can't believe im bringing this up but did the foal get a home by any chance?


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## Amymay (5 November 2012)

Passionflower said:



			Can't believe im bringing this up but did the foal get a home by any chance? 

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She did.


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## Passionflower (5 November 2012)

amymay said:



			She did.
		
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Aww that's great news! Is the owner a member on here?


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## Amymay (5 November 2012)

No, I don't believe they are.


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