# Will vets put down for old age?



## Llewellyn (9 March 2017)

Hideous topic for a post I know:
In the last 3 months my just 11 year old cocker has suddenly got old. Walks longer than about 20minutes leave her stiff for 3 or so days (despite doggy ibuprofen), a garden 'dash around' means she needs to sleep for the rest of the day. It's not that she is not taking part in these activities with her usual exuberance but her recovery time is poor and obviously uncomfortable. Getting on and off chairs is difficult as are the stairs. I was hoping warmer weather would perk her up but it's had little effect so far.
She is struggling to hear the door go so often comes in to be surprised by visitors. And I'm pretty sure her eyesight has suffered, walking past treats on the floor, struggling to find the tennis ball etc. 
This is a question for the future but do vets put down due to old age alone? (Or does this vary from vet to vet) 
If she continues on her current decline (which is steep) I doubt she'll still be fit by next winter. My hope is Spring/summer will see a transformation along with making sure the children don't make her jump and taking things a bit slower means we can keep her going longer but I don't want to have to isolate her from family life to achieve this as for the last 7 years she has been the children's go to companion and she's is stressed if we so much as feed the chickens without her overseeing it. 
(I think she knows I'm writing this- she is dozing in the sun peering at me over the arm of her favourite armchair- heartbreaking)


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## MotherOfChickens (9 March 2017)

yes of course, if you have a decent vet. Last year people posted up some good sites that evaluate older dogs' quality of life-as a sort of checklist/guide. They are objective and I found them quite helpful. I can't remember them (worse than useless) but hopefully someone else will have them.


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## JillA (9 March 2017)

Vets will put down on your instructions at whatever age - I know it distresses them with a young healthy dog but if the owner insists they have to abide by that. Hope you can manage the "better a day too soon" rule, it's never easy.


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## ihatework (9 March 2017)

Yes they will, but I would say pick your vet carefully, and make it clear from the outset your intentions. I have experienced young vets particularly try and change my mind / guilt trip me into persisting in the past.


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## tda (9 March 2017)

I hope so.  Our 14 yr old border collie is slow to get up sometimes, can't jump in the car anymore etc.  When I decide its time, I will not take no for an answer if the vet queries.


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## Exploding Chestnuts (9 March 2017)

tda said:



			I hope so.  Our 14 yr old border collie is slow to get up sometimes, can't jump in the car anymore etc.  When I decide its time, I will not take no for an answer if the vet queries.
		
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Correct, the dog's quality of life is paramount. 
I've told several vets they are doing things wrong [as subtle as only I can be], they don't like it. But on certain subjects and with certain vets I have more ......... experience........... in certain things.
But with my three pts pets things have been worked out OK,  we have a chat, and that's that. I think I decided my old lab would be pts if she had a problem, and I was with her.
I once had a horse diagnosed with grass sickness, and the second opinion vet operated, it was not a good death. He was not a pet, but he deserved better.


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## Clodagh (9 March 2017)

As ihatework says, they will but pick your vet. The last thing you need, on the day you decide, is to have an argument. 
With my old lurcher I discussed it with the vet on my last visit with her, and so he knew that the next one would be the last. It also means you can say if they want them to do it in your car or whatever, if they get distressed at the vets.
I would, if I were you, take her for one last check up and a med review, I did with Sash, just to set my mind at rest that the end was in sight.


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## PorkChop (9 March 2017)

Any Vet I have ever used definitely would have, sorry to hear shes is not doing too good at the moment.


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## ycbm (9 March 2017)

JillA said:



			Vets will put down on your instructions at whatever age - I know it distresses them with a young healthy dog but if the owner insists they have to abide by that. Hope you can manage the "better a day too soon" rule, it's never easy.
		
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This wasn't true for my mother. A vet refused to put down her poodle with colitis and insisted he could rehome it.  She had to find another vet to do it. The vet was right in all probability, it was my mother's behaviour causing the dog the issues (toy poodle apparently prone to this?). But the refusal was absolute, he told her that he would not do it.

The case of the frozen puppies this week is another. The vet refused to put the puppies down because they were healthy, so she froze them.



Glad to hear that you are planning ahead for your dog, OP. Sorry you are having to, though.


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## Cinnamontoast (9 March 2017)

My vet won't put down an animal that is healthy. I thought that was normal? 

Big dog went to the vet today, he was in a bad way yesterday, obviously overdone it. I was relieved to see him trotting round place wanting to play tug when I got home. Apparently a visit to the vet perked him right up! I won't have him PTS until he no longer has a good quality of life. So far, he's enjoying life still. 

Someone froze a litter of puppies? That's appalling


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## honetpot (9 March 2017)

I have mine PTS at home, just book over the phone. Never been asked the reason why.


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## CorvusCorax (10 March 2017)

cinnamontoast said:



			My vet won't put down an animal that is healthy. I thought that was normal? 
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Physically or mentally?


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## Aru (10 March 2017)

Its down to the Vets discretion.
They can chose to refuse to euthanise for ethical reason  if they feel it isnt something they can live with. Simple as that.Everyone one has a different place where they draw the line.

Im not surprised to here that a dog with colitis was offered rehoming instead of euthanasia. Thats usually an easily managed condition and poodles tend to be easy to rehome as the rescue networks quite good.I wouldnt sleep well at night had I put to sleep a dog in that sort of scenario either....
Even euthanising sick animals for financial reasons cuts me up a bit inside tbh.

Its different with elderly animals who have a poor quality of life or when suffering is involved regardless of age.
I dont know of any vet who will refuse to euthanise an elderly dog whos already on meds and beginning to struggle.

It is better to go a day to early rather then a day to late....but only if the animal is going to suffer as an alternative.


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## asmp (10 March 2017)

JillA said:



			Vets will put down on your instructions at whatever age - I know it distresses them with a young healthy dog but if the owner insists they have to abide by that. Hope you can manage the "better a day too soon" rule, it's never easy.
		
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Agree with this.  My parents  cat needed to be PTS as was elderly and had lots of problems.  Vets persuaded them to try various things and even suggested they brought her home for a last weekend when it wasn't kind to the cat.


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## ycbm (10 March 2017)

Im not surprised to here that a dog with colitis was offered rehoming instead of euthanasia. Thats usually an easily managed condition and poodles tend to be easy to rehome as the rescue networks quite good.I wouldnt sleep well at night had I put to sleep a dog in that sort of scenario either....
		
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I just want to add that I completely agreed with the vet. At a family gathering some time later my mother wailed 'I had Pippie murdered'  expecting us all to say 'oh no, Mum, you didn't'.  The whole room went silent.  I offered to take the dog and rehome him at the time as well, but she didn't want him alive reminding her that her own behaviour was making him ill. She was in the middle of a campaign to force my father to move somewhere he didn't want to go to and the dog couldn't take the stress, poor little mite.


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## Moobli (10 March 2017)

Aru said:



			It is better to go a day to early rather then a day to late....but only if the animal is going to suffer as an alternative.
		
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Complete agree with the above.

Sorry your older dog is not doing so well   It is absolutely heartbreaking to try and decide when to say goodbye.  My old collie is 14 years and my husband's is 15 years.  Both have health issues due to old age - arthritis, deafness etc.  While they both still enjoy a walk and potter outside, eat their tea with gusto and enjoy a fuss and groom then I believe they still have a decent quality of life.  Both are on daily metacam to help any pain or inflammation.  I know they are both on borrowed time though, and know my vets well enough to hope they will respect my judgement with regard to the timing.  It is a difficult enough decision to make without being questioned about it


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## ycbm (10 March 2017)

Aru said:



			It is better to go a day to early rather then a day to late....but only if the animal is going to suffer as an alternative.
		
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Aru, I'm sorry, I usually really like what you write. But this makes no sense. The saying means that it is better to destroy an animal before it needs to be destroyed, taking away from it time that it would have enjoyed,  than it is to leave the decision too late and cause suffering.

The saying in the UK is actually 'better a week too early than a day too late'. Then there's my version. Better a month too early than an hour too late.

Imo, fwiw, too many people are waiting to long to have their animals put to sleep. Animals need us to have the courage to make the decision while they still have quality life left.

It breaks my heart when I read threads on here sometimes about incontinent dogs that can't walk, horses that people are having to help to their feet, and so on.


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## Cinnamontoast (10 March 2017)

CorvusCorax said:



			Physically or mentally?
		
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I'd say both. They won't PTS a horse for financial reasons or because someone doesn't want to risk a re-home and would prefer peace of mind by having it PTS. 

My previous vet agreed to PTS an older cat who I think had a form of dementia, was incontinent and beginning to look emaciated. They also PTS a dog who couldn't walk, despite the RVC giving us steroids and hope. 

YCBM: I can't agree with you. I'd far rather PTS a day early than an hour late. Saying that's time they could have had is putting off the inevitable in a case where an owner/vet thinks an animal should be be PTS due to health/mental issues.


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## Clodagh (10 March 2017)

YCBM: I can't agree with you. I'd far rather PTS a day early than an hour late. Saying that's time they could have had is putting off the inevitable in a case where an owner/vet thinks an animal should be be PTS due to health/mental issues.[/QUOTE]

I understood ycbm said the same as you?


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## ycbm (10 March 2017)

CT I think you have misunderstood me? I would rather PTS a month early than an hour too late.  I think we agree completely


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## Cinnamontoast (10 March 2017)

I did, sorry, only read first part, apologies. :redface:3


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## ycbm (10 March 2017)

cinnamontoast said:



			I did, sorry, only read first part, apologies. :redface:3
		
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No worries, I've spent all day telling my OH that I want my birthday dinner at a restaurant I hate!  Keep confusing two names, I hope he books the right one.


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## CorvusCorax (10 March 2017)

cinnamontoast said:



			I'd say both. They won't PTS a horse for financial reasons or because someone doesn't want to risk a re-home and would prefer peace of mind by having it PTS.
		
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I'm just thinking of two dogs we have had over the years who were outwardly young, fit and healthy, one was downright dangerous/untrustworthy and the other was disturbed/unhappy. But I doubt a vet would have known that by looking at them in a room in a surgery, the issues weren't presenting themselves there.


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## rara007 (10 March 2017)

I would say 'old age' is the most common reason for PTS! Its not always the younger vets who are the ones pushing for more tests/treatment options. If anything I'd say it is the reverse!


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## Aru (11 March 2017)

Ycbm I think we proabley mean the same thing just phrased differently.

I have no issues pts animals that are suffering or will suffer and follow the above motto with no guilt...dogs with mental illness and severe anxiety causing aggression also count as suffering in my eyes btw.

I added the suffering comment as there is something called convenience euthanasia.....where an animal who is healthy becomes inconvenient to the owner and they want them pts.
The big one we see is when elderly parents go into a nursing home and none of the kids want to take on the dog...often middle aged and healthy...just unwanted and they dont want to rehome them as its hassle and difficult to do/they worry about being judged. 

Or the people who want to euthanise an older cat as it isnt getting along with the new kitten and is mean....ie showing normal cat behaviour when you introduce another cat!
you occaionally see the same scenario with a dog and pup...but less often as dogs tolerate newcomers more frequently.

Or the moving house euthanaisa...without massive effort put into finding pets a new home.....

An elderly animal who wont cope well with change or an animal with underlying health issues...is an entirely different ball game to friendly dog whos only issue is having an irresposible owner....The friendly dog isnt suffering in my eyes so the day to early rule doesnt apply to them! 

However if its a case that theres nowhere for them to go I would still say pts rather then have then languish in a kennel for the rest of their miserable lives...but thankfully most of the rescues I have worked with use a foster system....and in many convenience euthanising situations rehoming the animal hasnt always been tried with much effort.


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## Alec Swan (11 March 2017)

If you have a vet who won't put down a dog,  when asked,  you find a vet who will.  The reason why the owner wants the dog PTS is immaterial,  and equally if a vet can't cope with putting a dog down when they decide that there's no valid reason,  then that must be their stance and their choice.  Were I a vet,  which obviously I'm not,  I wouldn't see it as my place to refuse to carry out a request because should I,  then the owner will obviously go somewhere else.  In the event that a young dog with no obvious problems came in then I may well counsel that perhaps another answer be considered,  but should I meet with a wall,  then I'd carry out the procedure.

When the time comes,  I always put my own dogs to sleep,  it's quicker than any vet,  it's clean and there's no stress whatsoever.  The dog is alive one moment,  unaware of it's future and then the next,  the light is switched off;  it's that quick.  It isn't a job which I enjoy but one which I see as a responsibility.  I don't expect others to feel as I do,  which brings us back to the truth that we all have the freedom of choice.

Alec.


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## popsdosh (11 March 2017)

In the same camp Alec i never expect anybody to do what i cant do myself!  Its a lot better for the animal too . Not the nicest part of keeping animals but the kindest thing we ever do for them!


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## Equi (11 March 2017)

Dogs let you know when it is time too. I had two older rescues and when they were approx 13 the younger one had a random stroke..totally fine and healthy the day before. She was pts then and there, and the other pined so much he deteriorated very quickly and a day or so later we had him pts too because he was struggling to stand and just looked totally depressed. 


My current older dog is 12, which isnt bad going for a staffy. Shes got a hip injury from getting hit by a car a year or so ago, that never quite healed, but the vet said that amputating the leg was unnecessary as it was still technically healthy..she just walks funny. Shes still active and interested in life but she does use a bit of effort to get out of bed in the mornings. When she needs help to get out of a normal dog bed i think thats when we will be calling it..im sure she will let us know when its time.


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## ycbm (11 March 2017)

popsdosh said:



			In the same camp Alec i never expect anybody to do what i cant do myself!  Its a lot better for the animal too . Not the nicest part of keeping animals but the kindest thing we ever do for them!
		
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I actually envy both you and Alec. What a great way for a dog to go. I would do it too if I had a powerful enough gun.


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## ycbm (11 March 2017)

I think so much of this debate hinges around your own attitude to the value of life. If you take away love for the animal and wanting it to be alive for your own sake, then you are left only with whether you feel that any animal intrinsically values 'being alive'. For me, that would have to include a belief that an animal looks forward to a future in the same way that humans do, and I just don't believe that to be the case. If an animal does not know it has a future life, what is the problem with taking that away, for whatever reason?


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## MotherOfChickens (11 March 2017)

ycbm said:



			. If an animal does not know it has a future life, what is the problem with taking that away, for whatever reason?
		
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I have no problem putting an animal down that needs it but they are not disposable.


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## Alec Swan (11 March 2017)

MOC,  the simple fact is that animals are possessions and so,  disposable.  Whether the _'should'_ be,  or not,  is up to the owner and their conscience.

Alec.


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## MissTyc (11 March 2017)

A sad thread but really highlights the importance of a good relationship with one's vet, preferably a longer-term relationship where possible. 

I can pick up the phone and have this conversation with either my equine or my dog vet ... or go to the clinic, without the animal, to have the conversation in person. 

I have every confidence my vets are both ethical and realistic. Their evaluation of physical and mental health aligns with my own and that's very reassuring.


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## Moobli (11 March 2017)

MotherOfChickens said:



			I have no problem putting an animal down that needs it but they are not disposable.
		
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Agreed.  

Along with Aru's comments about euthanasia of convenience, there are also cases of a dog suffering a minor ailment due to aging such as deafness, loss of full vision or slight incontinence which may require certain medications or for the owner to make adjustments in their lives to accommodate the conditions and it becomes an inconvenience and so, although the animal still has a decent quality of life, it is euthanised.  Of course it is the owners decision and I would never interfere in a decision like that, but I just can't understand those that won't go the extra mile for their animals.  If the conditions mentioned ARE causing stress and unhappiness to the dog, then fair enough.

What I absolutely can't stand though, and thought was a thing of the past, was those who in working spheres (usually sheepdogs or gundogs) who shoot dogs who don't work - without any effort made to find them a home where they could live happily as a pet.  Just last week I was informed of a young (less than 12 month old) collie that was shot because she wasn't suiting her owner/handler and he has enough dogs who will work   For a young and healthy dog to have its life taken in such a way is completely abhorrent to me.  But sorry, that is going off topic.

If at all possible, I will always have my vet come to my house to have my dogs put to sleep.


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## ester (11 March 2017)

Aru said:



			Ycbm I think we proabley mean the same thing just phrased differently.

I have no issues pts animals that are suffering or will suffer and follow the above motto with no guilt...dogs with mental illness and severe anxiety causing aggression also count as suffering in my eyes btw.

I added the suffering comment as there is something called convenience euthanasia.....where an animal who is healthy becomes inconvenient to the owner and they want them pts.
The big one we see is when elderly parents go into a nursing home and none of the kids want to take on the dog...often middle aged and healthy...just unwanted and they dont want to rehome them as its hassle and difficult to do/they worry about being judged. 

Or the people who want to euthanise an older cat as it isnt getting along with the new kitten and is mean....ie showing normal cat behaviour when you introduce another cat!
you occaionally see the same scenario with a dog and pup...but less often as dogs tolerate newcomers more frequently.

Or the moving house euthanaisa...without massive effort put into finding pets a new home.....

An elderly animal who wont cope well with change or an animal with underlying health issues...is an entirely different ball game to friendly dog whos only issue is having an irresposible owner....The friendly dog isnt suffering in my eyes so the day to early rule doesnt apply to them! 

However if its a case that theres nowhere for them to go I would still say pts rather then have then languish in a kennel for the rest of their miserable lives...but thankfully most of the rescues I have worked with use a foster system....and in many convenience euthanising situations rehoming the animal hasnt always been tried with much effort.
		
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I know people move horses on more than we do other pets but I am curious about this given that we often encourage those with older horses that PTS at least secures their future and personally I don't think I take issue with the same view being taken on the equivalent in dogs and cats. Rehoming isn't just hassle it is very hard to do correctly with confidence if you cannot get the animal a place in a good charity. 

The we got a younger version issue does bother me but having been through it recently dealing with an elderly parent situation can be stressful and upsetting enough and can happen very rapidly so that advanced plans for a pet cannot be made.


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## twiggy2 (11 March 2017)

popsdosh said:



			In the same camp Alec i never expect anybody to do what i cant do myself!  Its a lot better for the animal too . Not the nicest part of keeping animals but the kindest thing we ever do for them!
		
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Why is it a lot better for the animal?


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## Clodagh (11 March 2017)

twiggy2 said:



			Why is it a lot better for the animal?
		
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No stress, out with their owner, if they are a gundog they think they are going out shooting. Why would a stranger coming and clipping their leg and injecting them be less stressful? They know absolutely nothing about what is happening and if you have seen a horse shot you know how much quicker it is than injection.


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## ycbm (11 March 2017)

MotherOfChickens said:



			I have no problem putting an animal down that needs it but they are not disposable.
		
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But what is that even supposed to mean?  If the animal doesn't care, and I don't believe they do, then what harm is done? A dog/horse/cat could live twenty years and only lives ten. So what? 

I'm not talking about putting a cat down so you can get a kitten, but I certainly am talking about putting a horse down so you can get one that can be ridden, for example.


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## ycbm (11 March 2017)

I went to a presentation by the Dogs Trust recently. I was unaware that they will take any old/ill persons dog in, either to foster or to rehome. You just have to call them. Hope that helps people in this situation.


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## MotherOfChickens (11 March 2017)

ycbm said:



			But what is that even supposed to mean?  If the animal doesn't care, and I don't believe they do, then what harm is done? A dog/horse/cat could live twenty years and only lives ten. So what? 

I'm not talking about putting a cat down so you can get a kitten, but I certainly am talking about putting a horse down so you can get one that can be ridden, for example.
		
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I am not going to get into this in a big way but horses I believe are somewhat different unless you have your own land and due to being less likely to cope with ongoing treatment/procedures. This is a thread about dogs though.

I also don't believe that animals 'know/care' about their own mortality. So no harm might be done to that animal but as soon as people/society believes they are purely disposable then society has a problem imho. go to those countries that believe dogs are purely disposable and then come back and tell me its fine.

We all draw our own lines do we not? 

its also not the job of a vet to put to sleep your animal on a whim. And if you are putting to sleep an animal that you took on because you can't be bothered with a little inconvenience then its a whim. I've probably been with more animals being PTS in one way or another than many people on this forum. I've heard all kinds of lame excuses as to why they don't want that animal anymore and I've heard some perfectly reasonable ones.

And shooting is all very well if you can but thats out of reach for most (thank god!). Its much harder to kill an animal than some might think so I'd rather the general public didn't just give it a go with any old firearm they can get hold of. Bar one rescue (who I sedated for the vet to PTS), all of my dogs have loved the vets-its not difficult to get that bit right when they are young.


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## Moobli (11 March 2017)

MotherOfChickens said:



			I am not going to get into this in a big way but horses I believe are somewhat different unless you have your own land and due to being less likely to cope with ongoing treatment/procedures. This is a thread about dogs though.

I also don't believe that animals 'know/care' about their own mortality. So no harm might be done to that animal but as soon as people/society believes they are purely disposable then society has a problem imho. go to those countries that believe dogs are purely disposable and then come back and tell me its fine.

We all draw our own lines do we not? 

its also not the job of a vet to put to sleep your animal on a whim. And if you are putting to sleep an animal that you took on because you can't be bothered with a little inconvenience then its a whim. I've probably been with more animals being PTS in one way or another than many people on this forum. I've heard all kinds of lame excuses as to why they don't want that animal anymore and I've heard some perfectly reasonable ones.

And shooting is all very well if you can but thats out of reach for most (thank god!). Its much harder to kill an animal than some might think so I'd rather the general public didn't just give it a go with any old firearm they can get hold of. Bar one rescue (who I sedated for the vet to PTS), all of my dogs have loved the vets-its not difficult to get that bit right when they are young.
		
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We need a LIKE button.


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## twiggy2 (11 March 2017)

Clodagh said:



			No stress, out with their owner, if they are a gundog they think they are going out shooting. Why would a stranger coming and clipping their leg and injecting them be less stressful? They know absolutely nothing about what is happening and if you have seen a horse shot you know how much quicker it is than injection.
		
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My dogs were all put to sleep by people they knew in a farmers field in the sunshine,  you and I have to realise how privileged we are with our options at such times.
I have seen horses go both ways and because they are so big the drugs can take time but we are speaking momentary and of course unexpected reactions to drugs do occur, I would always choose a bullet for a horse if I knew the person welding the gun was efficient. I have however seen it go horrendously wrong with a horse and a bullet.
I would not and did not choose a bullet for my dogs as the target is smaller and they move so much quicker I feel the margin for error is too great. I know many people who do their own this way and likes yours they are used to guns so less stressed, the best thing is very individual.


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## Clodagh (11 March 2017)

twiggy2 said:



			My dogs were all put to sleep by people they knew in a farmers field in the sunshine,  you and I have to realise how privileged we are with our options at such times.
I have seen horses go both ways and because they are so big the drugs can take time but we are speaking momentary and of course unexpected reactions to drugs do occur, I would always choose a bullet for a horse if I knew the person welding the gun was efficient. I have however seen it go horrendously wrong with a horse and a bullet.
I would not and did not choose a bullet for my dogs as the target is smaller and they move so much quicker I feel the margin for error is too great. I know many people who do their own this way and likes yours they are used to guns so less stressed, the best thing is very individual.
		
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Agree with you there.


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## ycbm (11 March 2017)

go to those countries that believe dogs are purely disposable and then come back and tell me its fine.
		
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I think you are referring to countries which mistreat animals?  I don't think those countries are relevant to this discussion. 

My view, which I'm happy to accept is different from yours, is that we owe animals a well cared for life and a swift death.  I don't accept that my mother was right to refuse to have her poodle rehomed. But I do accept that it was her right to refuse to have her poodle rehomed. And I don't think the poodle cared one way or the other. I struggle to understand what is supposed to be so beneficial to the dog to live another five years he didn't know he had. If I die suddenly in my sleep tonight, I'm not going to be worrying about the years I have been robbed of. For animals, I think death is like that. The only animal really affected is the keeper.  

It all hinges around an individual's view of the sanctity of life, really.


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## Alec Swan (11 March 2017)

twiggy2 said:



			Why is it a lot better for the animal?
		
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Others may have dogs which enjoy a trip to the vet.  Over the years I've never yet had a dog which has enjoyed it,  one bit.  My current vet is what I'd call a dog-man.  He shoots,  trains his own gundogs and understands the animal.  He's 'good' with a dog too,  if that makes sense.  Just as we wouldn't expect our GP to understand the vagaries of the human brain,  so it would be rare in my experience for a vet to even recognise a stressed dog.  

At home,  with sheepdogs,  and when their time has come,  I generally take them to sheep so that they're focussed,  stand the dog still,  walk up bedside it and with a glove on my left hand to save me getting burned by the muzzle flash,  I stroke the face and cover the dog's eyes.  I use a humane killer (a captive-bolt pistol),  place the gun on the poll directing the rod towards the base of the tongue,  and press the trigger.  No needle would be so instant and the dog is saved from the visit to the vet and the attendant fear.

A C_B pistol is very quiet,  more of a pop than a bang,  sometimes the dog will bleed from the nose,  but that's about it.  I've never known the procedure to be anything other than simple and importantly,  stress free.  

Though the description may sound rather ghoulish,  I suspect that it's a bit like when we go to the dentist,  it's never as bad as we imagine!  The important point though,  and back to your question,  the dog is totally unaware of what's going on,  and I'd suggest that my route is more humane and to be preferred.  As with most things in life,  I suppose that we do what we feel most comfortable with.

Alec.


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## ester (11 March 2017)

You mostly seem to be suggesting the why is because of a vet trip, I've not known a vet yet not do home visits and I think that was what twiggy was getting at? As she says all hers have gone in field.


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## Moobli (11 March 2017)

We have a captive bolt for putting sheep down but, personally, I could never consider using it on one of the dogs (also there is no muzzle flash with a captive bolt Alec).  My vet is happy to come out to our cottage and euthanise in a place of choice - my 14 year old GSD was pts in the field overlooking the reservoir on a sunny day whilst being fed sausages and roast beef.  There was no stress involved and it couldn't have been more peaceful.


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## cobgoblin (11 March 2017)

Alec Swan said:



			Others may have dogs which enjoy a trip to the vet.  Over the years I've never yet had a dog which has enjoyed it,  one bit.  My current vet is what I'd call a dog-man.  He shoots,  trains his own gundogs and understands the animal.  He's 'good' with a dog too,  if that makes sense.  Just as we wouldn't expect our GP to understand the vagaries of the human brain,  so it would be rare in my experience for a vet to even recognise a stressed dog.  

At home,  with sheepdogs,  and when their time has come,  I generally take them to sheep so that they're focussed,  stand the dog still,  walk up bedside it and with a glove on my left hand to save me getting burned by the muzzle flash,  I stroke the face and cover the dog's eyes.  I use a humane killer (a captive-bolt pistol),  place the gun on the poll directing the rod towards the base of the tongue,  and press the trigger.  No needle would be so instant and the dog is saved from the visit to the vet and the attendant fear.

A C_B pistol is very quiet,  more of a pop than a bang,  sometimes the dog will bleed from the nose,  but that's about it.  I've never known the procedure to be anything other than simple and importantly,  stress free.  

Though the description may sound rather ghoulish,  I suspect that it's a bit like when we go to the dentist,  it's never as bad as we imagine!  The important point though,  and back to your question,  the dog is totally unaware of what's going on,  and I'd suggest that my route is more humane and to be preferred.  As with most things in life,  I suppose that we do what we feel most comfortable with.

Alec.
		
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That's gruesome Alec!

Guess it's you and the RSPCA that does it this way.


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## LD&S (11 March 2017)

ycbm said:



			CT I think you have misunderstood me? I would rather PTS a month early than an hour too late.  I think we agree completely 

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I agree completely


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## dollyanna (11 March 2017)

Going back to the original dog, whilst I agree with a month too early being better than a day too late, have you had any checks to see if there is a simple reason why he has aged so rapidly? I've been thinking my boy was just getting old, similar symptoms to you plus coat changes and spookiness (which I had put down to eyesight changes, he's always been deaf) but blood tests showed he was rock bottom for thyroid function. 2 weeks in to a very simple treatment and he has picked up remarkably, and much of the old age stuff has disappeared. You may already have done so, but it might be worth a simple blood panel to check there isn't anything simple going on that isn't just "age".


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## Alec Swan (11 March 2017)

cobgoblin said:



			That's gruesome Alec!

&#8230;&#8230;...
		
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Alec Swan said:



			&#8230;&#8230;.. .  As with most things in life,  I suppose that we do what we feel most comfortable with.

Alec.
		
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&#8230;. Whether the dog is put to sleep,  or sent off to heaven,  or gone over the rainbow,  the end result is always the same.

Alec.


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## Llewellyn (11 March 2017)

Thank you for all the replies. 
I wouldn't rehome her as she is a very quirky dog to start with especially with men (we got her at 4 as a failed gundog). It won't be an act of convenience when I do make the decision I can promise that, she's been there for the last seven years through divorce, a new relationship, 4 house moves, twice in labour (including once coming all the way to the hospital door with me. I am at home most of the time so she's not left for more than an hour at a time (if that) so frequent loo breaks etc aren't an issue. 
She was out in the garden playing with the children today. Standing at the bottom of the slide steps (she's convinced it's not safe) in and out of their den they've built, rolling in disgusting things and you think 'ye she's slower but seems fine' and she came in so stiff my OH had to carry her upstairs and put her in the bath and carry her back down and she didn't come up for the kids bedtime and your heart sinks again. 
It's her MOT next month so I'll speak to the vet but last time they handed me doggy ibuprofen tablets for after long walks- and they do very little. They didn't seem keen on further investigations. I'll push more this time as I would be chuffed if it was that straight forward.
Thanks again all.


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## Bearsmum (11 March 2017)

Is she on anything for her joints? I have a just turned 14yro cocker and for a number of years have had her on Vetvits flexi joints and I honestly think they keep her mobile - not saying she hasn't slowed down and she can't make our full flight of stairs, but that's only because they are wood and she slips,  (she made her way up to my mums bedroom when she was dog sitting recently) but she still loves a decent walk round the cross country course at the yard.
Hope you get some answers, it's so hard trying to judge what is best for an older dog.
JDx


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