# Horse suddenly lacks impulsion?



## MeganMarie (16 December 2017)

Hi all, this is probably going to be a long one. 

Recently over a few months ive found my boy suddenly lacking impulsiion from his hind end, everything feels very flat, and he was the type of horse who had big bouncy strides. 
Hes a 13, warmblood. From what I can see and feel he seems sound. Although he feels awful to ride (but not lame awful) just awful (hard to explain). 
Hes quite resistant to get into trot, and even more resistant if you ask for more power, engagement or to simply ask him to move more forward. Hes worse on corners and circles. His canter is suddenly so so flat and lacks any impulsion. He used to have a massive bounding canter, he now has the canter of a pony, basically. Does shake his head (sideways) in canter sometimes too. Hes also become quite crooked, which im trying to school him out of.
Really struggles to pick up right lead, will run in trot round corner and eventually fall into canter. On the lunge he usually runs and then strikes off on the wrong lead leg (on right rein). All paces on the lunge also completely lack impulsion, even trying to chase him with the whip doesnt warrant much of a reaction (and he used to be very responsive on the lunge). He doesnt go disunited or anything. 

Hes not a lot better out hacking either. The work load is nothing above his current fitness or ability. Its hard to explain, he feels so much worse to me than he might look to others? 
Theres no heat or swelling that I can feel on legs. His back is not sensitive to touch. We are having the physio out on Friday to see what she thinks. Hes had saddle, dentist etc. 
I cant pinpoint it, I just know somethings not quite right. Hes not usually a stubborn or resistant gelding, unless theres a problem or hes uncomfortable, hes a very forgiving chap. He hasnt bucked or reared that I would class as out of character because he does occasionally, but he did that previous to how hes going now. 
I do find his right hind, (when picking his feet out), he really rests it on you, he picks it up fine, but he basically puts all of his weight onto you, (not as bad with other leg). 

Anyway what could it be? or am I just imagining it all!!!!!! 
Id rather him be hopping lame, so id have a clue, but its just to me, he doesnt feel or look right, but no obvious symptom.  anyone any experiences or advice?


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## Pearlsasinger (16 December 2017)

It does sound like pain to me.  I think I'd get the vet, rather than the physio.


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## Pc2003 (16 December 2017)

Hocks?
Definitely full work up with vet required. My horse was never lame as we would know it but had awful soundness issues with his hocks. All okay now as much as can be, but just wanted to say my horse has never been lm&#8217;lame&#8217; but has had multiple joint issues


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## JillA (17 December 2017)

Mine was like that - eventually he came down with acute laminitis but I think he had had subclinical lammi at times for several years. Not lame (with bilateral lameness it's hard to spot anyway) but just not in front of the leg. A bute trail might reveal whether or not it is pain, then all you have to do is find out where!


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## ycbm (17 December 2017)

He's a perfect age for one of the most common causes of bilateral hind lameness, spavins. You need a vet, not a physio.


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## Theocat (17 December 2017)

Agree - you need a vet. Sounds like bilateral lameness.


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## Red-1 (17 December 2017)

I agree you need a vet, but not to visit your yard, I would take the horse to the vet hospital for a performance workup. IME this actually saves money, as it can be fully explored in one go.


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## ycbm (17 December 2017)

Red-1 said:



			I agree you need a vet, but not to visit your yard, I would take the horse to the vet hospital for a performance workup. IME this actually saves money, as it can be fully explored in one go.
		
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Some vets are fully equipped for a performance workup at home, unless you mean a hospital with  CT/MRI and scintigraphy. Mine has a piece of diagnostic kit that most hospitals don't have yet


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## scats (17 December 2017)

Echo what others have said.  This sounds like hocks to me.  Get him in for a full work up and some X-rays.


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## ycbm (17 December 2017)

Why is everyone recommending a 'full work up' these days. In a  horse which is prime age for the number one most common cause of bilateral hind leg lameness that is hard to see, it's most likely got spavin. 

For those with no insurance, the obvious route is to flexion test this horse, which will probably lame it clearly. Take a few x rays to see if any bony changes are visible if you like, but not really necessary at this stage. Scan the proximal suspensories to make sure they aren't involved. Put steroids into the hocks and see if the horse improves. That will sort most of them, the rest need more diagnostics.

It's no wonder insurance is unaffordable for so many people these days if a vet can't just treat the obvious.


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## Apercrumbie (17 December 2017)

Yep you need a vet. When this happened to my old boy we suspected hocks (he was very similar to how you describe) but it actually turned out to be arthritis in his neck. I still think hocks/maybe sacro-iliac for you, but they do occasionally throw us curveballs too.


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## scats (17 December 2017)

ycbm said:



			Why is everyone recommending a 'full work up' these days. In a  horse which is prime age for the number one most common cause of bilateral hind leg lameness that is hard to see, it's most likely got spavin. 

For those with no insurance, the obvious route is to flexion test this horse, which will probably lame it clearly. Take a few x rays to see if any bony changes are visible if you like, but not really necessary at this stage. Scan the proximal suspensories to make sure they aren't involved. Put steroids into the hocks and see if the horse improves. That will sort most of them, the rest need more diagnostics.

It's no wonder insurance is unaffordable for so many people these days if a vet can't just treat the obvious.
		
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A work up with our vets is pretty much what you've just described ycbm- flexion testing, sometimes followed by lunging.  Obviously if the lameness is not easy to locate, they may investigate further via scans, but if it is, they'll go straight for injections or X-rays, if that's what owner wants.


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## Pearlsasinger (17 December 2017)

ycbm said:



			Why is everyone recommending a 'full work up' these days. In a  horse which is prime age for the number one most common cause of bilateral hind leg lameness that is hard to see, it's most likely got spavin. 

For those with no insurance, the obvious route is to flexion test this horse, which will probably lame it clearly. Take a few x rays to see if any bony changes are visible if you like, but not really necessary at this stage. Scan the proximal suspensories to make sure they aren't involved. Put steroids into the hocks and see if the horse improves. That will sort most of them, the rest need more diagnostics.

It's no wonder insurance is unaffordable for so many people these days if a vet can't just treat the obvious.
		
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Ah but for those with insurance *some* vets like to milk the golden goose (mixed metaphor there) for everything possible and *some* owners buy into the myths that are perpetuated that all this sophisticated technology is needed to diagnose something a decent vet could see with their own eyes.


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## nikicb (17 December 2017)

Along with all the other responses above, I wouldn't rule out bilateral lameness in front.  My now 10 year old showed a lot of those symptoms and he was found eventually to have issues within his front feet (I'd like to be more specific, but I can't as even after two separate weeks spent at the vets a year apart at ages 7 and 8, and X-rays, bone scans, MRIs, ultra sound scans, the vets are still unable to pinpoint exactly what his issue is, but know it is limited to his feet).  He never really looked lame, just wrong, and ended up with masses of compensatory hind end issues to stop himself loading on his front end.  He is now turned away unshod, retired and totally field sound, but can't cope with regular work.  Definitely full work up required - and I sympathise, it is so hard not knowing.  xx


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## Tiddlypom (17 December 2017)

Red-1 said:



			I agree you need a vet, but not to visit your yard, I would take the horse to the vet hospital for a performance workup. IME this actually saves money, as it can be fully explored in one go.
		
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This.

My vets aren't out to milk the insured. If they wanted to milk me, they could make numerous home visits and faff about on each one like many HHOers report happen to them. It's cheaper to take the neds into a well equipped and staffed vet hospital.


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## Red-1 (17 December 2017)

Tiddlypom said:



			This.

My vets aren't out to milk the insured. If they wanted to milk me, they could make numerous home visits and faff about on each one like many HHOers report happen to them. It's cheaper to take the neds into a well equipped and staffed vet hospital.
		
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This. I am glad the YCBM has such a wonderful visiting service, and the correct facilities at home to do a proper job.

My vet hosp has; level, hard concrete/tarmac trot up surface; a gentle slope for up and down hill; steep slope for walking; hard lunge circle on level non-slip purpose made enclosed lunge arena; deep surfaced lunge circle; hard core area; huge arena for riding; portable X ray; heavy duty X ray; ultrasound machine; shock therapy machine; PRP lab machinery; brightly lit and rubberised examination areas; stocks; second opinion. 

They do also have fancy scanners, but we have not used those.  

I have just found it cheaper and more efficient to go there and have a full job. Often the visiting vets are more junior, and my facilities are not as good as YCMB's at home. Many people have found a visiting vet does a flexion test, butes and rests, and then you are in the same position 2 weeks down the line when the symptoms are the same. 

If it is a leg that needs stitching or something obvious then the vet comes out, but for something harder to diagnose where it is ore a lack of performance then I would prefer a more rigorous procedure with the top vet under the best of conditions then a flexion and steroid.


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## ycbm (17 December 2017)

Red, you make some good points.

I deliberately use a vet which does not have a hospital. Their policy is that is a horse needs something done which has to be done in a hospital, then they would want that horse seen by an expert in its particular problem, not by a generalist hospital. So unless people are talking about one of the major teaching  hospitals which have experts in most areas, I see nothing to gain by loading my horse up and driving him elsewhere. The diesel and time will cost me a callout anyway. 

The partnership I use has two very senior partners and in the event of anything less than obvious, I will always have one of them come out. With the other practices near me which have hospitals, you are equally likely to have the junior see to your horse at the hospital as a more senior vet. At home or at hospital, seniority of vet is something I have always had to request, and would recommend anyone else to do the same.

Yes, for diagnosis at home you need a strip of hard of flat ground (I use the road), somewhere to lunge and preferably a stable.

My other tip would be never to leave a horse unattended at hospital for diagnostics tests of the size of the bill matters to you.


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## Darlabean (17 December 2017)

A good vet can spot hock arthritis a mile away. Get the most experienced vet at your practice to come over.  If vet suspects hocks, vet is probably right so get him jabbed at home by the same vet, it&#8217;s cheaper than all the explorations. If he doesn&#8217;t come sound you know you then have to resign yourself to big bucks in exploration, I&#8217;m afraid.


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## Goldenstar (17 December 2017)

Classic hock spavin presentation get the vet out and start with some trot ups and hock flexions .


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## LaurenBay (18 December 2017)

I wouldn't bother with the pysio, I'd cancel and get the vet instead. I would ask them to start with the hocks.


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## nikkimariet (18 December 2017)

Could be anything from saddle pinching to PSD?

Vet lameness work up and get saddle feet back teeth checked.

Sorry but he doesn't sound happy to me at all.


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