# Heavy Rider School



## rainbowsntoffee (10 May 2011)

I've been daydreaming as you do..
What would you think the market would be for a heavy rider school, say advertising specifically at 12-13st -18st?
I know several people who ended up buying horses before they were really ready having ridden as kids, given up in their teens, had their own kids and wanted to start riding again. With baby weight and the obvious eating too much! they couldn't go to local riding schools (weight limit max 13.5st in these parts). 
My ardennes boy would carry anyone up to 20st without blinking if he didn't have a dodgy set of hips. He's not expensive to keep at all and has a great temperament etc. Shoes are more expensive but if he didn't have the hip issue wouldn't need them anyway neccessarily. 
I know beginners are heavier to carry, but I don't see why you couldn't do half hour lessons until rider is balanced and horse not do more than one total beginner a day or something. No mounting from the ground ever, although maybe some sort of set up with a saddle stand for practising the theory! Plus perhaps combine that half hour of ridden lesson with half an hour mucking out/stable management lesson which would also help the riders get fitter and maybe loose a bit of weight as a bonus.
I'm presuming the horses were all extremely well boned and confirmationally good themselves, fit and healthy with well fitting tack.

I realise running a riding school isn't cheap by any stretch-  rent/mortgage for yard, horse cost, dentist, back checks, tack, insurance (Lots of insurance!) and the like..

At the riding school I learnt at the horses didn't do more than an hour-two a day anyway, so I sort of think it *should* be possible.  Plus you wouldn't exclude light riders, just cater specifically more towards extremely chunky cobs.
I guess to balance the books you would need to increase charges a little. 

Can you possibly list pluses and minuses and why noone has done it? Excluding the animal activists placcarding the gate of course 
Ta! (back to work now.. hohum)


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## millreef (10 May 2011)

"Oh Mary, haven't seen you for ages", "Yes I've been really busy horse riding".  "Where do you ride Mary"?  "Oh the fat persons yard down the road"!   

Not sure if people would want to be associated with riding at a specialist overweight club.  Just a thought.  Sorry if that's negative.


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## fizzer (10 May 2011)

I think its a great idea in theory, there are alot of people 12stone and over that ride or would love to ride.


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## CHH (10 May 2011)

Sorry if I sound awful, but are horses really built to carry that kind of weight?

Their skeletal structure et al. I'm certainly no vet, but I would be checking out this firstly.

A beginner at 18stone will feel to the horse a whole lot heavier than 18stone, given they are not 'carrying' themselves etc... and in and out of balance. Even a novice rider still learning balance will have an effect on the horse.

Firstly I would checking to see what horses can carry for their own welfare, regardless of their physical appearance.

The breed you is big but what was it bred for? 
Perhaps pulling horse, and often these breeds are used for meat as well, for the obvious reasons.

After satifiying myself on the above I would then ask:
Would there be a big enough demand in the area?
And are they willing to pay your premium?
if there is a suitable horse - is it able to actually teach someone in terms of schooling, or is someone simply going to pay to be a hacking passenger ride?
Yard costs, staff costs, (or if no staff you do it yourself, what happens when you are ill etc...)
Purchasing the horses
Insurance (would insurers be happy with your business)
So start up captial needs to be understood, and plans made to meet all the above should business be slow.

Good luck in your venture if you do go ahead!


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## ironhorse (10 May 2011)

Well, when my friend ran a riding school, he did have some big horses and could find something for most riders. With one possible exception though, they were all quite fit and either hunted or competed/ done so in their earlier lives so were not ideal for beginners or very unfit people.
The horse that I used to hunt was also hired from time to time by a 16st, 6ft 4in guy, and they had a great time together. The one we did run into difficulty with was a friend's OH who was 6ft 6in, 17st and a complete beginner. A couple of the horses could just about cope with him for half and hour a week!
Very big horses (and by that I mean substantial as well as tall) take a bit of keeping sound when in this type of work on any commercial scale, and you do need a very good farrier. Ideally you need a big school too - our guys were not much fun in a 40x20 although we had a lot of fun on hacks, and of course out hunting! That is another point - they also get sour quite quickly, so you need some big horse-loving friends (like me!) who are prepared to take them out for some fun on a regular basis.
The hunter was a case in point, and I would regularly get a phone call in the winter to say that he needed a day's hunting before he bucked someone off


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## charlie76 (10 May 2011)

without wishing to be rude( I am not a skinny minnie by any stretch of the imagination) but riding is a sport,. unless you are in the sport of Sumo wrestling, you don't see 20 stone people competing in any other sport so why is it widely accepted in the equestrian world?
If you want to partake in sport then surely you should ensure you are fit enough to do it?


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## sherbet (10 May 2011)

Small point that not all heaver people are fat, if you are tall you would weigh more. I would say that it would be quiet easy for a tallish bloke to weigh 12/13 stone and not be fat

I know some rugby players are fat but some are pure muscle so would weight a tad more than normal bloke but be a lot fitter

Ithink most people who are over weight know they are and I would think that that most would be happy to say they go the xx riding school at least they are doing something about it


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## Syrah (10 May 2011)

I think it's a great idea.

Haven't got anything to add on the pros and cons, but the school where I normally go to has a limit of 12st with full gear on.

I'm 5'7 or 8, a size 12 and still weighed just under the 12st with all of the gear on.  A pound or 2 more and I would have been overweight.

I would imagine alot of guys are excluded weight wise who aren't overweight as such.


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## JosieB (10 May 2011)

Well looking at the cumbrian horse site which uses clydesdales, the prices are not cheap and they always book up their rides etc..  might be worth checking out their site and what they offer ..


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## nixxyz (10 May 2011)

charlie76 said:



			without wishing to be rude( I am not a skinny minnie by any stretch of the imagination) but riding is a sport,. unless you are in the sport of Sumo wrestling, you don't see 20 stone people competing in any other sport so why is it widely accepted in the equestrian world?
If you want to partake in sport then surely you should ensure you are fit enough to do it?
		
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i agree with the 20st part, i dont think many horses could easily carry that however not all heavy people are unfit. my oh is a rugby player whos 5ft11 and weighs 17st!!! and trust me hes very very fit and healthy. i dont think there are many places who would take a well built man


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## charlie76 (10 May 2011)

I am a riding school manager, we have a 16 stone weight limit. If you actually saw what a horse has to put up with being ridden day in day out by heavy riders then you would change your mind. Its all well and good a heavier rider having their own horse that they ride once a day but not in a riding school. We had a lovely big kind ISH who took all the novice heavy riders (and face it, most RS cater for novices). We have to have his back treated non stop when we had him in the school, he was always suffering and he coped as he was kind.
We since sold him to a heavier lady, however, she is balanced and she rides him once a day.
Also bear in mind the weight of the tack on top of the riders weight.


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## Spudlet (10 May 2011)

I don't know about the overweight thing, but a yard aimed at adults (and therefore having bigger horses by default) might possibly work... it can be hard to find a riding school that can cater for the tall, I am ok weight-wise but I feel flipping ridiculous tooling round on a 13hh-ish pony!

I think you would need to offer more variety than just lessons, hacks, half and full day rides, beach trips etc would all be good. I definitely think you'd need liveries in to make ends meet too. I don't know if there is enough of a market for this sort of thing, given the economy at the moment.


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## Spudlet (10 May 2011)

Just to add - I used to ride at a place in Surrey which did do kids lessons, but also had a good selection of bigger horses for adult lessons and hacks. They never seemed to have trouble filling their hacks up as there were lots of people like me - living and working in London, well paid enough to afford a 2 hour hack a week, but not quite able to stretch to their own horse. I think the area of the country you are in would affect your business, in some areas you may find that adult will get their own horses as it is relatively cheap to do so, but in areas where livery etc is very pricey you may find a market for the middle ground people - not broke, but not flush either.


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## el_Snowflakes (10 May 2011)

I can see your sentiment although i feel it would be highly unethical! You would have to turn away clients if they didnt fit the bill weight -wise which is highly descriminitive. Plus, without sounding rude I dont think horseriding is the best activity for obese people. Of course some 'bigger' folk are fabulous riders and most of them have no qualms riding at a normal school. An RS aimed at large people would therefore only get obese people coming in and how many seriously huge horse riders are there out there? nott enough to make money anyway! i only know 1 very large rider and i hate to say it but she is dreadful. I dont know why she even has a horse as she is so terrified to get on it. Presumebly as she doesnt have much staying power or coordination.

ps. I think this would be a terrible idea in terms of business. Why would you want to narrow your market when you could provide lessons for all ans have a few large horses suitable for larger people. If I were the targeted client (aka a large person) I would be embarrassed to go to a RS for 'big' people. It would make me feel terrible! no one wants to feel different afterall and I think this would end up knocking the clients confidence instead of boosting it.

From a view of the horses, you would probably spend any money you made on having horses backs done by the vet/back man as theres not many horses who would be able to take very heavy bouncy novice riders on their backs for very long...


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## kerilli (10 May 2011)

sherbet said:



			Small point that not all heaver people are fat, if you are tall you would weigh more. I would say that it would be quiet easy for a tallish bloke to weigh 12/13 stone and not be fat

I know some rugby players are fat but some are pure muscle so would weight a tad more than normal bloke but be a lot fitter
		
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a tall muscular guy with big shoulders can easily weigh waay more than that! i let my cousin (6'5", then young and not fat at all, v sporty) hack out on one of my horses once (16h id x tb Adv eventer), it didn't even occur to me to ask his weight, it was only when we were 1/2 way round the loop that he mentioned in passing that he was 17 stone, i'd guessed him at about 13 stone! we only walked after that...! he wasn't a beginner though. the mare was fine btw... 

OP, i think it's a good idea, and the demand is there. i think you'd need strong, short-backed horses with really great temperaments for teaching big heavy riders on. no way around it, a heavy person will fall harder than a light one, so you don't want people hitting the deck! 
simulators would be a good start of course, no riding on a real horse allowed until instructor was happy with balance, progress etc.
definitely no mounting from the ground, ever.. but then, i'd stipulate that anyway, for any rider of any weight unless they can vault on...
i don't want to start the usual debate here, or set anyone off, or insult anyone, but i'd differentiate between a big-framed tall person who happens to weigh a lot, and someone of the same weight who is very overweight for their height and frame... imho the former is going to find it a lot easier to be a decent rider, not hurt/hamper the horse, and stay on, which is ultimately what it's all about.


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## Shysmum (10 May 2011)

I may be going serious mad here, but I am really nervous about replying to first time posters, who have put a somewhat contraversial topic on for that first post   Can it be............another...........

I think it's a ridiculous idea btw, and the school would probably never get a licence.


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## kerilli (10 May 2011)

shysmum said:



			I may be going serious mad here, but I am really nervous about replying to first time posters, who have put a somewhat contraversial topic on for that first post   Can it be............another...........

I think it's a ridiculous idea btw, and the school would probably never get a licence.
		
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Oh gawd, i didn't look... not another troll. i hope not, but you're probably right. i wonder if their house is on fire...


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## rainbowsntoffee (10 May 2011)

ah no, I'm not a troll. 
I was just wondering about it in general and figured this is the biggest horsey forum around! I normally read it but don't comment. 
I realise it's controversial. There are opinions both ways, always very heartfelt as is everything horsey. 
If your opinion is no, not fair on horses under any circumstances please feel free to say so but if we could keep it to a straight "no- too heavy" and avoid the usual argument that would be great!


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## Shysmum (10 May 2011)

"avoid the usual argument"  

You've only just joined, how can you tell us to avoid a usual argument. 

I smell something under a bridge my lovely.......clip clop.


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## rainbowsntoffee (10 May 2011)

I should also point out I'm not exactly intending to go for starting a heavy rider school, no backing funds for starters, but I was more interested in what other people saw as the pros and cons. 
Thanks 

Oh, and I would think you would happily take smaller riders, just that the horses would be weight carrier types if possible. No point blocking a friend because shock horror she's not heavy.. giving horses a rest is always a good thing.


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## Camel (10 May 2011)

I 'know' Rainbowsandtoffeee from another forum ... she aint no troll!  

I like your idea, perhaps not a specific school for chubbers, just one with big fit horses that welcomes the larger rider - I like the idea of the simulator until your balanced enough to ride 'kindly'

xx


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## rainbowsntoffee (10 May 2011)

Thanks Mrs O! 

Yes, simulators are a very good idea - even if you did 20mins simulator, 10 mins horse..
I think a big part of it would be advertising your weight limit- anyone on the heavier side knows how hard it can be to ring up and ask.
Perhaps driving lessons too although to be honest I haven't the foggiest what the weight limit is for driving - always *looks* like it's heavier than for riding!

Thanks for everyones input.


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## AnotherNewbie (10 May 2011)

I couldn't leave this without commenting - especially as a newcomer to posting in these forums. I don't think calling people a 'troll' is overly adult now is it??

I see no reason why this couldn't work - i mean look at Cumbrian Heavy Horses. They have masses of publicity, and get people visiting from all over the country. Obviously it would never be the most easy thing to set up, but would any riding school? I'm not going into too much detail as everyone else has already done it.


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## Pampered Ponies (10 May 2011)

Being 5' 10" and not a waif, I was limited when I came back to riding, so I think it would be a good idea.  As you said, there is nothing stopping people who weigh less riding the same horses.

I too have a Rugby Playing OH who I had to buy a horse for far sooner than I would ideally have liked due to the limitation of finding him school horses that he could ride.  Luckily for me, my purchase has turned out to be a true star but I would definitely have come to a yard as you outlined had you been around at the time.

In my next life I'm coming back as a jockey - they don't have the problem!!


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## TheEquineOak (10 May 2011)

anothernewbie said:



			I see no reason why this couldn't work - i mean look at Cumbrian Heavy Horses. They have masses of publicity, and get people visiting from all over the country. Obviously it would never be the most easy thing to set up, but would any riding school? I'm not going into too much detail as everyone else has already done it.
		
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I have been to Cumbrian Heavy Horses several times

The only person I have ever seen there over the usual weight was my partner... who is 6ft2 and muscular - not overweight

Cumbrian Heavy Horses is popular because of their fast beach/forest/lakes rides and not because they cater for overweight novices.  They do not have a school and offer very little 'schooling' when out and about.  They are fabulous because they cater for experienced riders looking for a superb ride on strong, young heavy horses.  They are only open between March and September.



I think opening a school catered for the overweight is a ridiculous idea (not aiming anything at you OP just offering an opinion).  As others have mentioned, there may be welfare implications, it's discriminative and IMO unethical.
I very much doubt you would get enough interest from this 'niche' market to keep a riding school going.  The only heavy riders I know are men.  As someone has already mentioned - horse riding is a demanding, physical sport.  Surely a rider must be prepared to be 'fit' before contemplating starting?

Just my opinion


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## Liviaa'x (10 May 2011)

I agree and disagree with this.

Some people are larger built due to health problems, which may then seem that the only joy to them is horse riding.
People who can control their weight but choose not too is a different matter.

I'm 5ft 10" and i'm a big girl. I have problems all down my fathers side with weight issues and health problems. The only joy I had was riding, I rode a gorgeous shire horse, we'd travel out for hours through the country, even did schooling sessions. Due to stuck up people at the yard I left, all they could say 'your too heavy for him'.

I've got over all that now, but if I was 'too heavy' why did my instructor set me up to ride him?? I admit, I was scared too at first but she re-assured me saying good points about my riding, I had a light seat. I've been riding since I was 7, always have been a big girl and always will. 

Everyone is entitled to their own opinions, but some need to think logically about why some people may be on the bigger side.

Just to gloat, a picture of me and the big boy warming up


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## TheEquineOak (10 May 2011)

Liviaa'x said:



			Just to gloat, a picture of me and the big boy warming up 






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He's beautiful!!!!  Looks like my old shire horse


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## Natch (10 May 2011)

I think it would be a good idea but I wouldnt market it as such. If such a place could teach carriage driving then that would be fab and another way for heavier people to have fun with horses.


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## NeilM (10 May 2011)

TheEquineOak said:



			The only heavy riders I know are men.
		
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Erm 6'1" 12.5 stone male rider here, and I see a LOT of female riders, who weigh an awful lot more than me.

The riding school for the fuller figured rider is an interesting one, but I do think it's a testament to our modern way of living that such an idea should even be considered. That said, if the demand is there and the business case works, then provided to welfare and health of the horses comes right at the top of the list then there is no real reason why it could not work.

As for discrimination, I am not a 'fuller filly' does that mean a clothing company is discriminating against me? Possibly, but that's not the way I see it; as far as I am concerned they are just catering to a given market.


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## Liviaa'x (10 May 2011)

TheEquineOak said:



			He's beautiful!!!!  Looks like my old shire horse 

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Thanks! Aww, really?!

Think this boy's retired now, he was named Oliver!
We were a match, Olivia and Oliver!


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## davkt (10 May 2011)

12 1/2 stone is within the healthy weight range for an average (ish) height  (5ft10 to 6ft) chap!


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## Red30563 (10 May 2011)

JosieB said:



			Well looking at the cumbrian horse site which uses clydesdales, the prices are not cheap and they always book up their rides etc..  might be worth checking out their site and what they offer ..
		
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Interestingly, Cumbrian Heavy Horses have a weight limit of around 16 stone. (Although apparently they are flexible if you are an experienced and balanced rider.)...

http://www.facebook.com/note.php?note_id=171467262872230


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## Heucherella (10 May 2011)

I agree that a school aimed solely at bigger riders would be odd, unethical, and probably unsuccessful, but I do think that if a school can advertise that it has sturdy horses capable of taking riders up to say 16 or maybe even 18 stone, it has a much larger possible clientele.

I am 15 stone, and have been for the all the 5 years I have been riding. my fitness has improved hugely since I learned to ride, and muscle had replaced fat, but the weight has stayed the same. I had to look at several riding schools before I found one that would take me, and even then I had to ask if they had a suitable horse. It would have been so much easier to have found a website or advert that stated "Riders up to 16 stone very welcome".

Since then I have had two share horses, have ridden a friends horse, and finally now have my own. All have carried me easily on long hacks, jumping lessons, and hunting. None have had back problems. They were a 15'3 Friesian,







a 17hh ISH, 







my own 16hh Clydesdale x ID, 







and a 14'3 coloured cob.







So yes, 15 stone 'curvy' women are fit enough to ride. There are plenty of horses out there that can carry us. And I would love to see all riding schools catering for us.


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## NeilM (10 May 2011)

davkt said:



			12 1/2 stone is within the healthy weight range for an average (ish) height  (5ft10 to 6ft) chap!
		
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If this is directed at me then thanks; but the point I was making is that there are a fair few female riders who weigh more than me, so that to say the only heavy riders are men is obviously incorrect.


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## little_critter (10 May 2011)

nixxyz said:



			i agree with the 20st part, i dont think many horses could easily carry that however not all heavy people are unfit. my oh is a rugby player whos 5ft11 and weighs 17st!!! and trust me hes very very fit and healthy. i dont think there are many places who would take a well built man 

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Or even an averagely built man. Where I used to ride there was a man in our lesson who was approx 6 foot tall and 'average' build. He was fit (was in the army) so the muscles were what made up his weight - not fat......There was only 1 horse at the school big enough for him to ride!


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## TheEquineOak (10 May 2011)

NeilM said:



			If this is directed at me then thanks; but the point I was making is that there are a fair few female riders who weigh more than me, so that to say the only heavy riders are men is obviously incorrect.
		
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I didn't say that the only heavy riders, are men. I said the only heavy riders I KNOW are men.  I'm not stupid nor uneducated enough to make such an assumption 

And, to say you weigh 12.5 stone doesn't really class you as 'heavy' IMO, far from considering your height.  I know plenty of female riders that are around 12 stone.  My interpretation of 'heavy' is 15-18 stone, above the weight limit in most riding schools.
Refering back to my original post, the only people I know that ride and fit within this weight criterea are men, I do not know of any women that are over 15 stone that ride.


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## Auslander (10 May 2011)

It wouldn't be for me, but I do think it's a good idea.

I lost my horse (17.2hh warmblood by Ramiro Z) two years ago, and haven't ridden since. I'm 5"10, and 14.5st, so yep, I'm overweight. The only horses I'm likely to be permitted to ride are riding school weight carriers, who, much as I hate to be mean - are generally a bit ploddy and not much fun for an educated rider - I trained at Talland, then went to Germany and spent 5 years riding amazing dressage horses. 
I've always been heavy, even when I was thin, but never thought twice about getting on 15.2hh TB's, none of whom had a problem doing days hunting, or cross country schooling - probably because I'm a balanced rider and can support my own weight. I wouldn't dream of getting on a small TB nowadays, but would happily eat my own left foot to ride a nice big'un again. Seems that even they have now been deemed incapable of carrying anyone over 12st. It sucks...


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## brighteyes (10 May 2011)

I can possibly see more in the way of H&S problems getting an 18st person onto a Shire than horse welfare issues.

*NielM* you hatrack, you!


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## jodie3 (10 May 2011)

My sister had a lovely cob who she kept at working livery in a riding school and she had to move him as it broke her heart to see him being hacked out by large, unbalanced novice riders with heavy hands 

My very overweight friend (20 stone plus) rode out at the local trekking centre and was mortified by them insisiting that she had considerable help to dismount.  Because of her size she looked very unstable in the saddle and she admitted that if the horse stumbled or put its head down she would be unable to stop herself falling off.


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## lexiedhb (10 May 2011)

Being a bigger (15-16 stone) rider, who shares a 17hh warmblood,  I actually think it would be a better idea for riding schools to acknowledge that there are folk out there over 13stone (I know not all have this weight limit but it seems a lot do) who want to ride and have horses capable of carrying them.

Yes horses should not be ridden by 17 stone novices for 6 hours a day, 7 days a week,  as obviously this will cause problems but once/twice a day with the rest of their work load being made up by lighter/more experienced riders? cant see the harm in that. Not all weight carriers are plods, so it would work out well IMO


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## NeilM (10 May 2011)

brighteyes said:



*NielM* you hatrack, you! 

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One tries one's best


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## ClobellsandBaubles (10 May 2011)

when i helped at a treking yard we had quite a few horses capable of carrying heavy weights as lots of tourist were not fit and IMO quite heavy they had two  shire x giants several highland tanks and a highland clydie x but the novices only rode for 45 mins max at walk couple of times a week during the summer and they were schooled by wee things like me (aged 12) and the 2 shire x's were often taking as spare showjumpers if the posh warmbloods went lame so they had quite a varied life 
don;t really have much to add whether it would be a viable business plan but it has been my experience as someone who loves riding big horses riding schools only have 1 or 2 at best who arent tiny ponies


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## dominobrown (10 May 2011)

If it would work potential clients should have to pass a fittness test, infact that would be a good idea for any riding school!

Harsh it may be, but you shouldn't ride unless you have a reasonable level of fittness. I do understand that some people can be 13 stone and still be actually quite fit, thats fair enough, not everyone is tiny, but again, basic level of fittness is needed.
However over a certain weight, there is no way a person can fit!


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## much-jittering (10 May 2011)

Not much to add, except to pick up on the comment somebody made about "can't see it getting a licence" - I disagree. I've encountered various different vets with totally different standards and things they do/don't want to see on the day doing RS council licensing inspections - and not one has ever been remotely interested in what actually sits on the ponies he is looking at/whether yard has a weight limit/etc. This is in the case of a stud based riding school with only the one breed in the school, which do only go up to a certain height - so far more likely to raise the question than the average riding school with horses of all shapes and sizes. They have never asked about weight, and they do not check the pony's backs either - check heart, eyes and watch a trot up, then some see tack on and some prefer to see it off so they can examine horse for saddle sores etc. There's a tick box for number of horses on site under the age of 3 (which I would have expected to be nigh on zero in your average RS?), not for the number of 18 stone riders riding 14h ponies. Bizare, but true.

With re also people of quite average weights saying riding schools don't have the big horses, try a Where to Train centre instead - they need to have the horsepower to provide the training to people up to stage 4 in some cases, so you're far more likely to find a nice big ex eventer type.

Final thing, Cloball that's what I was hoping! OH wants to start riding, have been putting him off for over a year as I haven't got anything big enough - so was planning on just going to trekking centre when we're on holiday as they're used to all shapes and sizes of novice turning up!


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## ElleSkywalker (10 May 2011)

Interesting idea, with good tuition, suitible horses and limits on how much work each horse did with a v heavy rider it sounds like a great idea! 

On the other hand... advertising would be hard, as even if you gave lessons to all sorts, on turning up and school to find most of the horses were weight carring types it would be quite obvious it wasa school for fatties. 

I like the idea of ride on simulator for 20 mins then 10 mins on horse or similar, and also then getting the folks to muck out after to help with weight loss, maybe thats the best way forward,  horses are used as therapy, maybe you could do some sort of weight loss club for folks who like horses, using the stable work as cardio excercise and the riding as a sort of reward/goal for them????


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## Pearlsasinger (10 May 2011)

The RS where our RDA group is based certainly caters for heavyweight riders.  The vast majority of the riders has learning difficulties, often combined with physical disabilities, or at least limitations. 
The horses and ponies only ever did 2 RDA sessions twice a week and were ridden by YO's family, hunting, showing, SJing etc as well as 'normal' RS work.  Now the YO has reitred and closed the RS,  the only clients are RDA.
In 25 yrs I cannot remember one truly 'heavy horse', although there have been heavyweight hunters, strong cobs, P2Pers and a good few WHs.  Every horse has coped well, even though these riders tend to be  heavy, nervous and unbalanced.


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## Tnavas (11 May 2011)

I would so love to have a place like that near me - I am overweight and I'd like to get riding fit before getting stuck in to schooling my Clydesdale.

The heavier built horses will carry those weights with no problem at all. Correctly fitting saddles, mounting blocks and sensible instruction will not cause them problems.

HAving taught for decades - rarely do riders start riding fit for riding - that comes with riding.

For all the skinny stick insects/gym bunnies - some of us have to start our fitness programme somewhere and riding is very good for getting fit as it uses so many muscles - it's also far more enjoyable than slogging around the block or endless walking on a treadmill and for those of us with sore joints it is far kinder to our systems. 

I used to be a stick insect - but the years have slowly added the weight.


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## Devonshire dumpling (11 May 2011)

sherbet said:



			Small point that not all heaver people are fat, if you are tall you would weigh more. I would say that it would be quiet easy for a tallish bloke to weigh 12/13 stone and not be fat

I know some rugby players are fat but some are pure muscle so would weight a tad more than normal bloke but be a lot fitter

Ithink most people who are over weight know they are and I would think that that most would be happy to say they go the xx riding school at least they are doing something about it
		
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Yeah good point, my hubby is 6 foot 2, as skinny as a rake and 12.5 stone, my friends hubby is 6 foot 6, also not an ounce of fat on him and 18 stone, just a big built bloke, he would love to learn to ride.


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## davkt (11 May 2011)

NeilM said:



			If this is directed at me then thanks; but the point I was making is that there are a fair few female riders who weigh more than me, so that to say the only heavy riders are men is obviously incorrect.
		
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Nope, just a general statement of fact! I'm sure plenty of us average heigh and healthy weight chaps don't have a problem finding somewhere to ride! First time on a horse in twentysome years last weekend having a polo lesson, 12 1/2 stone 46 year old me lighter than several of the 20something year old young ladies in the lesson and the instructor (school owner) explained weight distribution by telling us he had 8 stone on each foot.


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## ChesnutsRoasting (11 May 2011)

rainbowsntoffee said:



			I've been daydreaming as you do..
What would you think the market would be for a heavy rider school, say advertising specifically at 12-13st -18st?
I know several people who ended up buying horses before they were really ready having ridden as kids, given up in their teens, had their own kids and wanted to start riding again. With baby weight and the obvious eating too much! they couldn't go to local riding schools (weight limit max 13.5st in these parts). 
My ardennes boy would carry anyone up to 20st without blinking if he didn't have a dodgy set of hips. He's not expensive to keep at all and has a great temperament etc. Shoes are more expensive but if he didn't have the hip issue wouldn't need them anyway neccessarily. 
I know beginners are heavier to carry, but I don't see why you couldn't do half hour lessons until rider is balanced and horse not do more than one total beginner a day or something. No mounting from the ground ever, although maybe some sort of set up with a saddle stand for practising the theory! Plus perhaps combine that half hour of ridden lesson with half an hour mucking out/stable management lesson which would also help the riders get fitter and maybe loose a bit of weight as a bonus.
I'm presuming the horses were all extremely well boned and confirmationally good themselves, fit and healthy with well fitting tack.

I realise running a riding school isn't cheap by any stretch-  rent/mortgage for yard, horse cost, dentist, back checks, tack, insurance (Lots of insurance!) and the like..

At the riding school I learnt at the horses didn't do more than an hour-two a day anyway, so I sort of think it *should* be possible.  Plus you wouldn't exclude light riders, just cater specifically more towards extremely chunky cobs.
I guess to balance the books you would need to increase charges a little. 

Can you possibly list pluses and minuses and why noone has done it? Excluding the animal activists placcarding the gate of course 
Ta! (back to work now.. hohum)
		
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Why not? Go for it! I can see it now "Heavy Horses for Heavy Riders! If there's a market, there's money to be made. There are fitness classes  specifically for the overweight or self conscious person, so why not riding lessons.  We in the western world are obsessed with body weight and image and if those who are overweight avoid exercise because they are embarassed, then its a pity.  Suitable weight-carrying horses are out there and perfectly capable of carrying the larger sized person.


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## ChesnutsRoasting (11 May 2011)

Forgot to add - muscle weighs more than fat, at least thats what I tell myself when I (very rarely) weigh myself!


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## ChesnutsRoasting (11 May 2011)

dominobrown said:



			If it would work potential clients should have to pass a fittness test, infact that would be a good idea for any riding school!

Harsh it may be, but you shouldn't ride unless you have a reasonable level of fittness. I do understand that some people can be 13 stone and still be actually quite fit, thats fair enough, not everyone is tiny, but again, basic level of fittness is needed.
However over a certain weight, there is no way a person can fit!
		
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I disagree. Fitness is built through controlled exertion. Any decent instructor will not over stress their client or their horse to the point of exhaustion.


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## Bryndu (11 May 2011)

rainbowsntoffee said:



			I've been daydreaming as you do..
What would you think the market would be for a heavy rider school, say advertising specifically at 12-13st -18st?
I know several people who ended up buying horses before they were really ready having ridden as kids, given up in their teens, had their own kids and wanted to start riding again. With baby weight and the obvious eating too much! they couldn't go to local riding schools (weight limit max 13.5st in these parts). 
My ardennes boy would carry anyone up to 20st without blinking if he didn't have a dodgy set of hips. He's not expensive to keep at all and has a great temperament etc. Shoes are more expensive but if he didn't have the hip issue wouldn't need them anyway neccessarily. 
I know beginners are heavier to carry, but I don't see why you couldn't do half hour lessons until rider is balanced and horse not do more than one total beginner a day or something. No mounting from the ground ever, although maybe some sort of set up with a saddle stand for practising the theory! Plus perhaps combine that half hour of ridden lesson with half an hour mucking out/stable management lesson which would also help the riders get fitter and maybe loose a bit of weight as a bonus.
I'm presuming the horses were all extremely well boned and confirmationally good themselves, fit and healthy with well fitting tack.

I realise running a riding school isn't cheap by any stretch-  rent/mortgage for yard, horse cost, dentist, back checks, tack, insurance (Lots of insurance!) and the like..

At the riding school I learnt at the horses didn't do more than an hour-two a day anyway, so I sort of think it *should* be possible.  Plus you wouldn't exclude light riders, just cater specifically more towards extremely chunky cobs.
I guess to balance the books you would need to increase charges a little. 

Can you possibly list pluses and minuses and why noone has done it? Excluding the animal activists placcarding the gate of course 
Ta! (back to work now.. hohum)
		
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You know what?......I LIKE the idea...but I don't think it would work.
Why?
Well if they all came on a regular basis....they would get thinner and wouldnt need a chunky beast!!!!!!
Bryndu


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## Tnavas (11 May 2011)

Bryndu said:



			You know what?......I LIKE the idea...but I don't think it would work.
Why?
Well if they all came on a regular basis....they would get thinner and wouldnt need a chunky beast!!!!!!
Bryndu 

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But by then they would be so happy at being streamlined again they would continue on riding the big beasties. Plus they would have fallen in love with them.

I love my Clydesdale - she is so gentle and enormous.


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## Bryndu (11 May 2011)

Evelyn said:



			But by then they would be so happy at being streamlined again they would continue on riding the big beasties. Plus they would have fallen in love with them.

I love my Clydesdale - she is so gentle and enormous.
		
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Evelyn....I know where you are coming from.....but then Rainbowsntoffee would have to start a second school called Lighter Riders!!!!!!

Bryndu


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## SophieLouBee (11 May 2011)

I think it's a good idea in theory. I'm sure that there are alot of bigger riders out there embarrased to go to general riding schools in fear of being told they are too heavy or that other people in the lesson will laugh at them. 

I agree with the simulator idea, will make sure that balance is better, and seat is better before you get on a real horse. Mounting block essential, well fitting tack with good polypads etc, possibly even treeless (although not sure how these would be for balance?), lessons to start with should be done in walk only, moving onto trot when good balanced is established, thus hopefully helping to avoid accidents. Lessons 1hr max, pref 30 mins. Quiet horses who are kept fit by other people, regularly rotated, with regular days off and visits from vet/back person just to make sure! Damn good insurance, myself i'd stipulate that riders had their own! I'd still think that you'd have to have a weight limit? This applies to the novice rider, as I'm sure it's a lot different for an experienced one!

So inpractice, very expensive and unrealistic perhaps?


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## HollyWoozle (11 May 2011)

I do think it's good if a riding school can cater for riders up to a certain weight, bearing in mind that some tall, fit, healthy people can be quite a weight but fit enough for horse riding. However, I don't think that a riding school specifically catering to this is viable. I presume that most riding schools wouldn't wish to limit their clientele with a weight limit unless they had a reason for doing so. 

I think it would be better to start a fitness club for riders, encouraging members to partake in exercise which would help them with their riding. By this I mean activities for improving cardio fitness, yoga for flexibility, exercises to improve core strength and balance etc. but all provided in a friendly environment and amongst likeminded people.


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## madeleine1 (11 May 2011)

charlie76 said:



			without wishing to be rude( I am not a skinny minnie by any stretch of the imagination) but riding is a sport,. unless you are in the sport of Sumo wrestling, you don't see 20 stone people competing in any other sport so why is it widely accepted in the equestrian world?
If you want to partake in sport then surely you should ensure you are fit enough to do it?
		
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bl**dy b*llcks sorry but that makes me angry you clearly have never met a rugby player at top level or weight lifter or numerous other sports where people are unbelievably fit and often 20st. i personally have a 16hh horse and im 18st and i play rugby and my horse happly clears 1.20m with me on and my riding school have loads of horses they are happy for me to ride for often well over an hour. 
and in answer to other comments made i wouldnt mount from the ground regularly even if i was 5 stone. its jst not neccasery every time and doesnt help the horse.


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## Auslander (11 May 2011)

alligator40 said:



			i know of 2 blokes who regularly hunt twice a week during Season and both must be 17 stone
they ride heavyweight hunters..around 16.3/17hh
so yes, why shouldn't "fat" people ride?
A very good friend of mine is a hefty lump and she is a lovely "light" rider...

in reply to the poster who said horses aren't built to carry weight...of course they are, they are "beasts of burden"..sadly their purpose in life has been lost over the past 30 yrs
		
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Absolutely agree with this - and not just because I am also a hefty lump!


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## JenJ (11 May 2011)

Nice idea in theory, but if there are loads of heavier people wanting to ride but being denied at their local school, presumably they are still scattered around the country?

Where would you have it? You would be catering to a niche market, with a service that probably wouldn't justify people travelling long distances for. Would there be enough demand locally?

The yard I am at has quite a few weight carriers, I'd estimate that in terms of school horses/hirelings, they could quite happily mount 8-10 15+ stone people out hunting on any given day. Guess we're just lucky


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## Yertis (11 May 2011)

I keep this as a reminder of what working army horses, usually between 14.3 & 15.2, used to carry and stay sound.


The late Major Wilton kept the cutting, as an example of what the troop horse was actually carrying on active service.



South Africa. Weighed in the Field, from The Times of the 7th March 1901. Name of the Regiment not given.



Saddle, wallets carbine bucket, etc   31lb 6oz 
Bridle   7lb 
Shoes and nails   2lb 
Lance   4lb 8oz 
Carbine   8lb 
Sword   3lb 14oz 
Ammunition for carbine, 150 rounds   9lb 6oz 
Bandolier, mess tin and waterbottle (full)   7lb 4oz 
Knife, etc. and towel   8oz 
2 days' groceries and 1 days meat   3lb 4oz 
1 days' corn (horse feed)   10lb 
Great coat, forage nets, saddle blanket and numnah   27lb 
Emergency ration   1lb 
Total   115lb 2oz 

Average weight of man   166lb 

Grand Total   281lb 2oz 
    Or 20 stone 1lb


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## MissMincePie&Brandy (11 May 2011)

Reading through the posts, I didn't realise many RS's have an uper weight limit of just 12 stone.  I'm 5ft 8, and I take a size 12 in clothes. I look very slim, and I am quite fit; but I actually weigh 11 stone, so with riding kit on I probably wouldn't be far off the maximum weight limit!   That's crazy.


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## RunToEarth (12 May 2011)

madeleine1 said:



			bl**dy b*llcks sorry but that makes me angry you clearly have never met a rugby player at top level or weight lifter or numerous other sports where people are unbelievably fit and often 20st. i personally have a 16hh horse and im 18st and i play rugby and my horse happly clears 1.20m with me on and my riding school have loads of horses they are happy for me to ride for often well over an hour. 
and in answer to other comments made i wouldnt mount from the ground regularly even if i was 5 stone. its jst not neccasery every time and doesnt help the horse.
		
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Rugby players and weight lifters at 20st do not sit on top of other animals. 
I agree there are light larger riders, but 20st is 20st, light rider or not, you have to question a 20st person's fitness and their effect on the horse they are competing on, seriously.


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## marmalade76 (12 May 2011)

TheEquineOak said:



			As someone has already mentioned - horse riding is a demanding, physical sport.  Surely a rider must be prepared to be 'fit' before contemplating starting?

Just my opinion 

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I agree with you, that a rider should be prepared to be fit before riding, but in reality, people will do what they want to do regardless.

For example (about 1 minuet in )

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jtRCq2HCliE


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## marmalade76 (12 May 2011)

Misinterpreted said:



			Reading through the posts, I didn't realise many RS's have an uper weight limit of just 12 stone.  I'm 5ft 8, and I take a size 12 in clothes. I look very slim, and I am quite fit; but I actually weigh 11 stone, so with riding kit on I probably wouldn't be far off the maximum weight limit!   That's crazy.
		
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I was told by a friend who has worked at an RS for over twenty years that they have a similarly low weight limit because so many people simply lie about their weight.


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## ozpoz (12 May 2011)

You don't need much knowledge of physics to understand why a riding school would limit their weight to 12 stones. ..

There wasn't much awareness of back lameness until recently - it isn't an 'in your face' thing. I think anything which causes pain  should be avoided.

Sorry, not in favour of a heavy rider school.


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## gnubee (12 May 2011)

I think the 12st limit does make it difficult for many men to learn to ride. Even the places that will take them generally only have 1 or 2 horses which are suitable, and even if they are quite good and capable horses, it means they aren't getting the breadth of experience which lighter (or even just shorter) riders are able to get. 
To get round this, your options are generally either to go somewhere so bad that they dont care what weight of rider they put on the horses (where generally the quality of teaching makes it difficult to learn), or somewhere training at quite a high level with plenty of 16hh plus horses, which will get you good training but tends to have the kind of prices that would put beginners off. 

If you wanted to run it as a business, you would need to be around a big city, where plenty of people have access to choose to come to you. As a local riding school, the majority of customers are kids, and ponies are much cheaper to keep, so it doesnt really make sense as a business plan to cater excessively for the larger rider. 
I also think that you would have to pitch it as riding for adults, rather than riding for tubbies, and let people draw their own conclusions.


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## Tnavas (12 May 2011)

Being a heavyweight - I'd love to get back into riding my Clydesdale BUT where can I get jodphurs big enough? They just don't seem to make them.


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## Ladylina83 (12 May 2011)

B'Jesus my ned is going to love this snippit of info no more work for her ... 

I am 5'9" a size 12 and training to be a yoga instructor so not overly flabby but I weighed 11st 12pounds this morning butt naked stood on the scales on 1 foot !!!! :-0 


Good job I have a grey as I won't look out of place riding Gadiva style !!!


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## Ladylina83 (12 May 2011)

Evelyn said:



			Being a heavyweight - I'd love to get back into riding my Clydesdale BUT where can I get jodphurs big enough? They just don't seem to make them.
		
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I don't know if you can get them to ship to you out there in paradise but there is a company here called "fuller fillies" do clobber for the slightly softer of us ladies


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## Ranyhyn (12 May 2011)

I wouldn't like a riding school to cater to heavier people specifically, those poor horses dealing with it day in day out.  BUT if your average yard had a few - the load *oh god sorry lol* would be more spread out and people would have choice and variety as would the horses.

I can only think that I feel sorry for horses that would have that strain on them 2/3/4 times a day.  That I don't think is fair.  But I do think heavier people need somewhere to learn and if every riding school had a choice of appropriate horses for heavier people, that might be good.


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## aimsymc (12 May 2011)

I believe most sound fit horses are more than able of carrying 13 stone ish.  I went up to about this weight after having my daughter and my mare a 16hand tb was still as spritely as ever. I actually thought once I lost the weight I would see a difference in her but she didn't seem to notice.  Although I have to admit I find the idea of an 18 stone beginner on a horse horrific!


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## AnotherNewbie (12 May 2011)

Evelyn said:



			Being a heavyweight - I'd love to get back into riding my Clydesdale BUT where can I get jodphurs big enough? They just don't seem to make them.
		
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I just got a pair of size 22 on ebay, and they were only £15!! Bargain!


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## Dandycandy (12 May 2011)

though this is interesting, i dont know how i feel about it. i mean someone thats 10 st beginner flapping about on the saddle the horse will feel but double that and i think its unfair on the horse.
however some people who are overweight dont seem to think they are. (experience from rs)
what noone seems to have noticed is that would they fit in the saddle without damaging it?? we had to turn someone away as she would not have got her bottom into the saddle and it was an 18'' saddle. 
I'm sorry but if we are keeping on pushing for riding to be considered a sport why dont we have the criteria for it being a sport. how fit com someone 18 st be?? and really how much weight will they loose walking on a horse for half an hour once a week? will they ever really loose any. i know its not pc but i do think its unfair on the horse to have to put up with that. though some larger people can ride really well and carry themselves lightly on the horses back but somone that is larger and a beginner cant do that and will be putting strain on their knees and joints and the horses joints.
like i said above would someone 20 st fit in a normal saddle and if the saddle was bigger would it fit the horse properly?? i dont know i think people might be looking through rose tinted glasses. yes a rs can accept bigger people but i think bigger people need to accept they are bigger and things may be more difficult for them.
i hope i havent caused offence, just my opinion. they have weight limits on fairground rides but i dont see anyone complaining about that.


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## AnotherNewbie (12 May 2011)

Evelyn said:



			Being a heavyweight - I'd love to get back into riding my Clydesdale BUT where can I get jodphurs big enough? They just don't seem to make them.
		
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Ah, sorry just seen you are in NZ! Not sure if ebay would post that far! Shall i come deliver you a pair instead? I'm desperate to come back over!


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## aimsymc (12 May 2011)

Dandycandy I completely agree with you! Its a difficult one though because people who weigh the same can look so different guy at my yard is 16 stone and looks slim,  and at 13 stone I looked like a ball!  X


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## Dandycandy (12 May 2011)

but wont someone who is heavier because of muscle mass be able to hold and support themselves better in the saddle?


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## much-jittering (12 May 2011)

As somebody mentioned it I agree some people will lie about their weight going to a new riding school, but that's no different and equally as potentially harmful as the people who lie about their ability - and that's gone on for ever.

Fortunately the yard I work on I've never had to turn away anybody for turning up and not being the size they said they were, and it is very much a visual assessment. Some tall skinny minny mum of a current rider will go 'oh I'd love to start again, but I'm over your weight limit' and you make the judgement that they're fine - our weight limit is very low as we only have one breed of pony in the school, BUT that staff are all over the limit  So I'll be equally discretionary when accepting clients.

Equally I've recently spent some time doing training at a Where To Train yard, where they don't feel the need to weigh people and do it on the information the client gives and on visaul assessment - overheard a phone call while waiting around the other day, obviously client requesting a certain horse "I'm sorry but on our system I've got that you're a little too heavy for X, as he has back problems he has a lower weight limit. Why not try Y horse instead?" which I'm sure nobody could be offended by!

On the other hand, I'm also on a course at another venue where there apparently make every rider get on the scales in full kit. Considering it's predominantly kids that seems a little excessive to my mind - I wouldn't fancy it much as a potential client and I'm a 5ft6 size 10-12 so would be under most places limits.


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## sidesaddlegirl (12 May 2011)

I personally find the weight limits for riding schools too low and am just glad that I learned to ride as an overweight 12 year old in the 80's and not now as a tall but a-bit-overweight woman. 

I'm 5'9" and 13 1/2 stone and am no porker, but do have ample boob and hip! I cycle many miles a day, ride my horse (who is a TB in a heavy side saddle and has never suffered from lameness issues), muck out, don't sit around all day shoving cakes in my mouth, don't drink pop/wine/beer, don't eat much meat and I always place at shows so obviously being a stone overweight isn't affecting my riding! 

I'm a size 16 but people are always amazed when I tell them that but I suppose my tallness stretches pout the fat and I suppose no one here who has seen pics of me posted here in the past would think I'm that big but I'm just naturally a good doer and have never been thin no matter I do even as a kid whilst my sister has always been a stick despite being fed the same things as a kid. 

My lowest weight has been 12 stone which any lower, I would have looked like sickly but even at 12 stone, I still would have been on the border of being over the weight limits!!!

This topic of anyone being over 12 stone not being able to ride is a sensitive one for me as sometimes I would just like to go a riding school occasionally to have a tune up lesson on me on a different horse or if we go away to somewhere like London, I can't just for a ride at Hyde Park Stables as they have a stupidly low weight limit too.

I think weight limits at schools should be a discretionary thing depending on a ability, build and sex of a person. When we went to Devon several years back and I still had my 15 1/2 stone weight after giving birth to my son, I inquired at a holiday hack stable if I could ride and the woman put me on a 15hh native breed and took a look at my riding and said "There is nothing wrong with your riding love!!. I will be forever grateful for that woman saying that and if made me feel like a human again to get back into riding instead of being made to feel like a lazy blob "not worthy" of being near horses due to my weight.


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## Camel (12 May 2011)

OH having a lesson, by the laws of some of you - he shouldn't be riding as he is nearly 15stone  

xx


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## aimsymc (12 May 2011)

Well that horsey certainly looks happy enough!  Lol  x


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## charlie76 (12 May 2011)

but your OH looks fit toned and balanced. Not fat, unbalanced and heavy.


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## aimsymc (12 May 2011)

Charlie76 I think that is the difference, heavy and fit or fat!  X


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## Johnny999 (12 May 2011)

This all very interesting. I'm a student on a school yard that has 45 natives. We have everything from a minature shetland to a suffolk. It doesn't matter if your short, tall, fat or thin. If you can get on the block and get your leg over to mount, theres probably something to ride. But then I think there's very few schools with as many horses to choose from.


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## much-jittering (12 May 2011)

sidesaddlegirl said:



			I personally find the weight limits for riding schools too low and am just glad that I learned to ride as an overweight 12 year old in the 80's and not now as a tall but a-bit-overweight woman.
		
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Whether or not they're too low I don't know - BUT I definitely agree they seem to be getting lower and more in your face 'our weight limit is THIS'.

I know the arguement is people are getting fatter, that there are more people of 20 stone turning up wanting to start riding a horse than there are used to be because there are a higher pecentage of people of that weight around etc - but I'm not all that sure I buy that too much. I teach mainly kids, all averages sizes for ages with maybe a couple who are tall for their age, and a couple who are overweight for their age/height, and on the other hand some who are super skinny or shorter - I don't see it being any different distribution than it would have been 30 years ago, the majority are average and a minority aren't. That said these are after all people who want to get outside and do exercise, you're not pulling from the pool of teenagers that apparently exist who spend all day prostrate in front of a PS3 stuffing their faces - but to be honest I don't buy that the group of them is as big as the media would like it to be either  I know when I'm trying to arrange lessons for half of these kids they can't do such and such a day because they're playing a different sport each day of the week - and I think I've taken from a pretty broad sample of interests, ages, financial situations etc.

All that said though you've got to remember though that the riding schools are in a totally unenviable position  They can't say 'our weight limit is 13 stone if you can't ride but 16 stone if you're a fit muscly 6 foot plus bloke, or somebody who knows what they're doing' which is what we're all saying on here  They have to nail some colours to the mast, and they all do have to say SOMETHING because the majority of schools won't have a horse you can put a 20 stone beginner on - and everybody's frightened to death of what might happen if they DON'T have a displayed weight limit and it all ticks on fine being discretionary until one day the 20 stone beginner DOES turn up and demand a lesson, and the school has to say with no displayed weight limits etc 'sorry, you're too fat'.


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## TheMule (12 May 2011)

We give lessons on schoolmasters and as such are a 'riding school', we do cater for lw adult beginners.

We have a set weight limit as it is not fair on our horses to have to carry heavy people. I'm rather of the thought that if you want to ride and you are too big for local riding places, lose some weight first until you are easier for the horses to carry and probably fitter/ more balanced.


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## Spudlet (12 May 2011)

It's always interesting on these threads, seeing what people perceive as 'overweight' and 'normal' in terms of numbers. 12 stone is a low limit, unless this is a riding school with only small ponies or finer types, IMO. I weigh somewhere between 10.5 and 11 stone, so I would be close to this limit, but I am a fit and healthy size 10-12 - I'm just tall with it. I would argue that I could ride most horses safely, at least as far as my height and weight goes, and even larger native-type ponies. I also think of all the you see blokes out hunting - I doubt many of them weigh under 12 stone especially in all their kit, and I would argue that a fair few would not fall into the 'expert well balanced rider' category either, with all due respect. Yet there seems to be much less angst about that?


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## TheMule (12 May 2011)

much-jittering said:



			They have to nail some colours to the mast, and they all do have to say SOMETHING because the majority of schools won't have a horse you can put a 20 stone beginner on - and everybody's frightened to death of what might happen if they DON'T have a displayed weight limit and it all ticks on fine being discretionary until one day the 20 stone beginner DOES turn up and demand a lesson, and the school has to say with no displayed weight limits etc 'sorry, you're too fat'.
		
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We always ask for a person's height and weight on the phone and I have no problem telling someone that unfortunately we cannot offer them a lesson as none of our horses would be up to carrying that weight. People generally understand, some come back to us a few months later when they are a suitable weight


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## aimsymc (12 May 2011)

How would u ever know if your horse can carry 20 stone?  I wouldnt fancy bein the first person on board or infact teaching them to find out! ;-)


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## much-jittering (12 May 2011)

TheMule said:



			We always ask for a person's height and weight on the phone and I have no problem telling someone that unfortunately we cannot offer them a lesson as none of our horses would be up to carrying that weight. People generally understand, some come back to us a few months later when they are a suitable weight
		
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Same here, and as I say I'm really lucky that have never had to deal with anybody who's lied and turned up a totally different size from what I was expecting. But big yards with shiny bells and whistles websites and internet booking need to have some 'official' weight limit displayed because when they're just 'proccessing people', rather than spending 15 minutes on the phone having a chat like you obviously do (and I do too), they need to have a line of defence of 'this is clearly our policy, and you don't fit into it'. The same as us having a clearly displayed health and safety notice about reserving the right to turn away people we consider to be unsuitably/unsafely dressed for riding - theoretically the bit of paper has to be there, because otherwise potentially the person can turn round when you tell them to go away and say 'but it wasn't made clear'. You know what riding schools are like in terms of fear of litigation from accidents these days, and I think that sort of panic of 'but somebody might sue us' has spread a bit far into other areas. That's why the weight limits are so in your face I reckon - because of this (probably entirely misplaced) fear of somebody crying 'discrimination'.


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## YasandCrystal (12 May 2011)

Gosh emotive topic this one is!! IMO a heavier person who can ride competently is no problem on a mature balanced horse. But a heavy novice is a different story.

I know everyone has to start somewhere, but I really feel for riding school horses; they lead a hard life. A simulator is a great idea. So many people lack balance - I have a friend who has been riding at an RS for years and she still balances with her hands on the poor horses mouth. You cannot necessarily teach lightness and athleticism.
I also believe lunge lessons with no rein contact should be a necessity when you start riding and lots of no stirrup work. Also videoing the person riding and replaying to show where things are good and bad and need working on. If teaching riding was taken to a more thorough and serious level one would hope that this could only be beneficial for everyone particularly the horses.


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## Flame_ (12 May 2011)

I've not read much, so sorry if this has been said already, don't regular riding schools want to make money out of and meet the demands of heavier riders? I'm surprised at least the larger schools don't have a handful of real weight carriers. 

OP, if most schools really do only cater for up to 12 - 13 stone riders, then yes its probably a good idea. People are getting bigger so the demand is likely to be there IMO.


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## Brandy (12 May 2011)

It is a hard one, I am 5ft 7 and weigh just inder 13 stone this morning. Admittedly I am dieting to lose a stone, but honestly, no one who saw me would say i was nearly 13stone. I am not really fat, quite muscular and am a competant rider with a reasonable seat. My pony (yes pony!!) manages very well at hacking, schooling, dressage, and jumping up to 2ft 6 (i'm a wimp at jumping) He is a 13.2 very chunky welsh. 

Shold I go to a fatties RS?


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## JessnGeorge (12 May 2011)

To be honest, I would base it very much on individual cases. For example, my boy is lightish weight 16hh Thoroughbred and I know for a fact that he would prefer a heavier weight rider, sitting correctly, in the right position with sympathetic hands, rather than a lighter weight rider hauling him all over the place (not dissing beginners because we were all one once, nevertheless, there are riders of all shapes and sizes and levels of skill who will or will not be instructed.

Some horses are more tolerant than others. I'm 5ft 4 and just over 9 and a half stone, I would like to be lighter, on saying that, I am an experienced rider but some horses I have ridden have viewed me as a "pea on a mountain" and disregarded me.........

Different horses for different people, if you can make a match with a regular larger clientele, reckon it'd be fab. Have you been in touch with Fuller Fillies to see if you could get any marketing feedback?


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## lexiedhb (12 May 2011)

With regards the lying about weight thing:

I was very upfront when looking for my share- In my add i said "must be capable of carrying 16 stone +"

ALL three owners of the horses I tried said "there is no way you are 16 stone"...... I was 15 and a half at the time.

I am surprised riding schools do not insist folk get on the scales prior to them getting on their horses.


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## imr (12 May 2011)

I dont think that marketing a riding school as aimed at heavy people is a good idea but I do think it is a good idea to be able to cater for people over 12 stone. As several posters above have said a lot of people are over that weight. 

Horses can carry some 20% of their bodyweight. Now I appreciate that its different with novices and horses who are working several hours a day than having your own horse and being a competent rider, but nevertheless 12 stone is only about 78kgs which will be a lot less than 20% of the bodyweight of many horses. Im very glad I dont have to deal with this, as I have my own horse. I wouldnt sit on anything under 16hh or that I didnt think was up to carrying me even though I am a good rider. I am a heavy person (but Im less than 20% of my horse's bodyweight!). Having been to the dietician I have about another 2 stone (12kgs) to lose on top of what I have already lost (about 2 stone) and that will take me to a normal bodyfat percentage and importantly is what the dietician said would be about right for me and I should aim for. I do need to lose that fat (and its not easy!!) but I am pretty muscular and presumably my bones are made of lead or something - the lightest I have been as an adult was at uni when I weighed around 13 stone - and you could see and feel my ribs.


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## brighteyes (12 May 2011)

anniearab said:



			I keep this as a reminder of what working army horses, usually between 14.3 & 15.2, used to carry and stay sound.

The late Major Wilton kept the cutting, as an example of what the troop horse was actually carrying on active service.

South Africa. Weighed in the Field, from The Times of the 7th March 1901. Name of the Regiment not given.

Saddle, wallets carbine bucket, etc   31lb 6oz 
Bridle   7lb 
Shoes and nails   2lb 
Lance   4lb 8oz 
Carbine   8lb 
Sword   3lb 14oz 
Ammunition for carbine, 150 rounds   9lb 6oz 
Bandolier, mess tin and waterbottle (full)   7lb 4oz 
Knife, etc. and towel   8oz 
2 days' groceries and 1 days meat   3lb 4oz 
1 days' corn (horse feed)   10lb 
Great coat, forage nets, saddle blanket and numnah   27lb 
Emergency ration   1lb 
Total   115lb 2oz 

Average weight of man   166lb 

Grand Total   281lb 2oz 
    Or 20 stone 1lb
		
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If they lived long enough to be assessed, that is!  Who really cared/was able to speak up for the unable ones anyway?  It was a tough and urgent job and I would imagine a bullet would be the answer to those unfit or unable to cope.  Poor things.  We at least have humanity nowadays and consideration for their comfort under saddle and bridle.

I do not have any doubts a properly bred and well put together animal of substance and fitness IS up to carrying 17 stone of reasonably adept rider, but a 16 hand misfit with dodgy legs and a lardy novice? Asking for trouble IYAM. Put it this way, _I'd_ buck one off!


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## brighteyes (12 May 2011)

MrsO said:









OH having a lesson, by the laws of some of you - he shouldn't be riding as he is nearly 15stone  

xx
		
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He shouldn't be riding a Section B, but he isn't!


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## unicornleather (12 May 2011)

MrsO said:



			I 'know' Rainbowsandtoffeee from another forum ... she aint no troll!  

I like your idea, perhaps not a specific school for chubbers, just one with big fit horses that welcomes the larger rider - I like the idea of the simulator until your balanced enough to ride 'kindly'

xx
		
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Another one here who knows rainbowsandtoffee from the other forum, she's not a troll!
Oz


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## meandmyself (12 May 2011)

charlie76 said:



			without wishing to be rude( I am not a skinny minnie by any stretch of the imagination) but riding is a sport,. unless you are in the sport of Sumo wrestling, you don't see 20 stone people competing in any other sport so why is it widely accepted in the equestrian world?
If you want to partake in sport then surely you should ensure you are fit enough to do it?
		
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Because there are people out there who would love to ride, but can't at a riding school because they're too heavy. I'm one of them. I am overweight- not from stuffing my face all day but because of a couple of stupid health problems. 

If I could ride, it would give me added incentive to get fitter- it's very hard to think 'oh, yeah. I'll be able to start riding again once I drop a few more stone,'. Plus, riding and the work that comes with it is exercise in itself. Now, I'm not twenty stone, but I am over the limit for every riding school in my area. 

(Before anyone bashes- I am working to lose weight, and have dropped three pounds in the last week. I have a pair of bad knees and a bad ankle which makes too much walking interesting. )

I think that short lessons on properly prepared horses would do the rider good and the horses no harm. The key thing is to chose horses that are suitable, and make sure they're well conditioned enough to cope with the work. For example, quiet hacking may be better for the horse than riding in the school, because there's not so much turning involved. 

You could also include stuff like stable management skills, lunging and groundwork. Honestly, I would love something like that.


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## shadowboy (12 May 2011)

20 stone. Thats a lot. No offence- but 20 stone is too much in my opinion for riding- once youve added the tack, the body protector and hat etc thats 21 stone. Riding is effectivly a sport. I have a tall, muscular OH and he rides abd weighs 13stone. If he was 20 stone and a complete novice most horses would stuggle.


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## Jondi (12 May 2011)

Sorry and not advertising but I am a tall slim 6'2" man who weighs 13.5 stone, surely this is not too heavy


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## EAST KENT (12 May 2011)

Maybe hire out dromedary`s for the "overweight",don`t inflict them on horses though.


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## Syrah (12 May 2011)

lexiedhb said:



			I am surprised riding schools do not insist folk get on the scales prior to them getting on their horses.
		
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The riding school I went to does   I was just under the permitted weight of 12st with all my gear on including bp


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## meandmyself (12 May 2011)

EAST KENT said:



			Maybe hire out dromedary`s for the "overweight",don`t inflict them on horses though.
		
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Well, that's a lovely attitude to have. 

Maybe all of us 'overweight' fatties should just go and live in a cave somewhere, were we can shovel food down our gullets 24/7? /sarcasm

I honestly don't see what's so wrong with an overweight person riding, so long as they're properly mounted on a well prepared horse.


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## madeleine1 (12 May 2011)

RunToEarth said:



			Rugby players and weight lifters at 20st do not sit on top of other animals. 
I agree there are light larger riders, but 20st is 20st, light rider or not, you have to question a 20st person's fitness and their effect on the horse they are competing on, seriously.
		
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some of us do. with advice from vet and farriers and back experts taken into account they all said its fine and my mare says its fine to

i have been riding since iwas two btw and ive had my 16hh sport horse mare a year and been riding her for 2 and a half she has never been lame and never had any heath issues. i am 18 stone with all my tack in hand and clothes and she as i said before clears 1.20m and loves it. she can also gallop with ease and always comes to the gate to be tacked up willingly. she has also worked in a riding school where the weight limit is 16stone but this is not enforced if the staff think the horse can manage. i rarely comment on these fat posts as they just wind me up but i really want people to realise that being 11stone for some people isnt going to happen and doesnt need to. btw i was 11 stone about 4 years ago and it makes me a size 6 which is rediculous as im only 5,7 im just suppost weight more then the average person and if you took my horse of my i would kill myself so please stop judging and commenting. i think the riding school is a good idea but i dont know how practical it is.


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## meandmyself (13 May 2011)

madeleine1 said:



			some of us do. with advice from vet and farriers and back experts taken into account they all said its fine and my mare says its fine to

i have been riding since iwas two btw and ive had my 16hh sport horse mare a year and been riding her for 2 and a half she has never been lame and never had any heath issues. i am 18 stone with all my tack in hand and clothes and she as i said before clears 1.20m and loves it. she can also gallop with ease and always comes to the gate to be tacked up willingly. she has also worked in a riding school where the weight limit is 16stone but this is not enforced if the staff think the horse can manage. i rarely comment on these fat posts as they just wind me up but i really want people to realise that being 11stone for some people isnt going to happen and doesnt need to. btw i was 11 stone about 4 years ago and it makes me a size 6 which is rediculous as im only 5,7 im just suppost weight more then the average person and if you took my horse of my i would kill myself so please stop judging and commenting. i think the riding school is a good idea but i dont know how practical it is.
		
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Well said.


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## Gentle_Warrior (13 May 2011)

hhhmmm

my horse has a lot of bone, never measured but more than a cobs, he is always seen as a weight carrier.  I got him vetted when I purchased him and was told he should not carry more than 12stone !  horses with big bone etc are generally bred for pulling not for riding.

I am not saying it is not viable, but you may want to factor in that the horses you have only do a max of 2 years of the heavy weight workespecially if they do several ours each day.  This way there will be no lasting damage on their bones etc and have a chance to recover from it.  Dont go for young horses, get ones where they are fully grown and strong already.  Also ensure they have a fullfilled life, it will help if they are taken for a blast experiences rider etc, spons rides.

Mine got wise and went lame everytime a saddle was put on him, retired him and has never been lame since.  

He was in a riding school and used as a weight carrier before I purchased him, his legs will be the first thing to go on him, farrier and saddler say each time I have them out, he is not designed to be ridden.

It is a good idea, i see that everyone should have the opportunity to ride no matter what, but of you have no horses you have no business


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## lacey111 (13 May 2011)

My partner was competing Intermediate team chasing on his TB weighing 13 stone. He is quite a small built guy of average height, i'd guess about 5'7" ish and fit and its all muscle. We have 2 TB's and they both carry him with ease, even over the size of intermediate team chase fences!

Not all people who "weigh" more are big people, but I do understand how hard it can be for a horse to carry an unbalanced "heavier" person.

Personally I think it all depends on the height/weight/shape of the person. I think its very difficult to have specific weight limits without meeting the person in question.


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## Batgirl (14 May 2011)

JosieB said:



			Well looking at the cumbrian horse site which uses clydesdales, the prices are not cheap and they always book up their rides etc..  might be worth checking out their site and what they offer ..
		
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these guys have a 12st weight limit too, I am sad becasue I am 16.5 st and love clydesdales, if you check my pics in my sig I am hardly a puffing blowing fatty, I play badminton 3 times a week and netbal twice a week and ride 5 times a week.  I had a 14"3 cob who I rode at this weight whose back I had checked regularly, no problems and I now ride a 17"2 ISH who also has no back problems. (PS I was a novice when I got the cob).

Problem is that weight isn't everything, I weighed 12st at a size 12, I have a muscular body from lots of sport.

From a business point of view I think you would struggle to keep the animals in good health and get the business to make it worth while though it is an admirable idea.


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## JessPickle (14 May 2011)

My dad is just over 6ft3, he is very fit and healthy ran a half marathon in a decent time recently, however in theory he couldn't ride at many riding schools.  We have a 17.1hh clydesdale x and I would no longer let very heavy beginners on him.  He is now 18 years old and has had lameness issues.  I think it would need a lot of horses in order to be viable and older schoolmasters generally have a lower weight limit.


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## spottydottypony (14 May 2011)

Ive been following this thread and it is close to my question about weight.  I want to buy a horse for my OH who is 6ft and 13 stone.  What height, breed would be appropriate? Dont really want a big clydesdale type just a chunky cob type?


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## TheEquineOak (14 May 2011)

spottydottypony said:



			Ive been following this thread and it is close to my question about weight.  I want to buy a horse for my OH who is 6ft and 13 stone.  What height, breed would be appropriate? Dont really want a big clydesdale type just a chunky cob type?
		
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We bought a 17.3hh TB 

That was when my OH was around 13.5 stone.  Now, after all the lambing/farm work he's done his muscle is up and he weighs 15 stone.... so I am bending his ear trying to get him to buy himself another horsey


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## Batgirl (14 May 2011)

spottydottypony said:



			Ive been following this thread and it is close to my question about weight.  I want to buy a horse for my OH who is 6ft and 13 stone.  What height, breed would be appropriate? Dont really want a big clydesdale type just a chunky cob type?
		
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The YO where I ride's husband is 6"2 and 14st and he rides all sorts, Just make sure you get a well put together heavyweight type, a good hunter type, ISH all sorts will be suitable.


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## AprilBlossom (15 May 2011)

Would these riding schools turn away a FBHS if she wanted to ride at their yard? She's not small, but gets fantastic results out of any horse she gets on!

http://www.offasdykeegb.co.uk/photos/caradoc 08 - 8 - web.jpg


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