# Horse with Cushings  Feeding and supplements ?



## Sadiemay (16 September 2010)

Hi there, 

I was wondering if you could give me any advice of feeding supplements to my 23 year old mare who has Cushings for which she is on daily Pergolide.  She is also prone to laminitis if not managed carefully (even before the Cushings was diagnosed)

Given her age she is a little stiff in general but nothing severe at all, so for the last couple of years I have been added Liquid Devils Claw to her feed but now I have decided to swap this for a specific joint supplement as but I am unsure as to what supplements should be avoided in a horse with Cushings if any? 

I have decided to try her on Aviform Suppleze Gold (awaiting delivery) as after some research this seems to be pretty effective and seems popular on this forum.  Also is there anything I can give her supplement wise in general which would be beneficial?  I heard some things about Chaste Berry good for horses with Cushings, any experience with this?  

Also can I ask those with horses with Cushngs are feeding their horses daily?  Sadie is currently on Safe and Sound (Dodson and Horrell) and I am happy to keep her on that but wondered what others may feed their older Cushings horses and ponies.  

Sadie is a 14.1hh NF x TB and a very good doer, she has 2 feeds a day ( each feed = 1 small scoop Safe and Sound, garlic granuals, devils claw and apples and carrots and an extra apple slice to disguise the pergolide in&#8230;..fed by hand) and two wedges of hay (from small bales) each night in a small holed haynet.  Turned out (on rotation) in one of three small paddocks of approx 1/2 to 3/4 of an acre each to minimize her grass intake as advised by my vet.

I sometimes wonder if she is fed enough despite the fact she looks very well and healthy, the vet sometimes advises me she could do with losing a little more but I don&#8217;t think I could feed her any less without her being very hungry a lot of the time 

Is there anything else I can do feed/supplement wise that is better than my current regime? 

Sadiemay


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## Oliver12 (16 September 2010)

I feed my 19 year old TB Agnus Castus (chasteberry) when I first suspected he might have Cushings. He started losing muscle mass and was taking longer to lose his winter coat. He also suffered from abscesses which apparently is one of the symptoms. I am very pleased with the results and he looks as bright as a button.

Your best bet would be to contact Jackie Taylor at the Metabolic Horse Co. She is an expert on Cushings and would be able to help you with diet, etc.


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## LadyRascasse (16 September 2010)

My lad has NAF cushinaze, which has been so good for him, he used to drink very heavily (2 tubtrugs a night) he now drinks 1/2 a tubtrug. he had the massive pot belly and that when within 2 weeks. and he was hanging on to his winter coat and that started falling out 3/4 days after starting on it. it is quite expensive but i have found it really work for him. when this tub has finished i am going to stop and see if that makes any difference to him to see if he still needs it so if you are interested i will let you know. if you want to know anything else feel free to pm me

eta my lad is 23yrs old too


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## madhoss (17 September 2010)

Another vote for NAF Cushinaze. We have a pony who is looking better than ever after being on it for 1 1/2 months. She is gleaming, seems spritely and her coat is improving slightly. 

It sounds like you're managing Sadie well. We feed the pony daily. She only has Hi Fi lite - this might be something for you to consider- my vet says they burn more calories chewing it, so effectively you are filling their bellies but they are not getting any calories. It can be used as a hay replacer so if she seems hungrier than usual we may give her a bigger bucket of Hi Fi lite. But always feed very wet!

She in stabled during day in summer (grass sugar levels are higher between 9am and 4pm *I think*) during the day she gets a small haynet- 2 small slices which have been soaked (overnight). Do you soak your hay? Also, Horsehage do a hay/ledge (Hi Fibre- the blue one) which is suitable for laminitics, doesn't need soaking, dust free and all round lovely stuff- but it's pricey!

I know how tricky it is when they could do with losing a little more but you feel they aren't eating enough. Hi Fi lite, soaked hay and Horsehage (must be the one suitable for laminitics) are fab for this. The horse gets the essential fibre but without the calories. Both my non cushings mare and cushings pony have been on this diet with restricted grass and both are looking fab, yet have not been hungry (or at risk of lami) at all, to lose the weight.


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## Sadiemay (17 September 2010)

Hi all,

Many thanks for the replies.

Can I ask those of you feeding chasteberry and the NAF Cushinaze, do you also give your neds Pergolige also?  If not I guess I need to find out if I can feed such supplements on top of the Pergolide.  

As we know Laminitis is a big threat to horses with Cushings and I see that NAF do a Laminaze as well as a Cushinaze...I wonder if its beneficial to feed both or does the Cushinaze also have some of the benefits of Laminaze....VERY 

Also if you dont mind me asking, if your horses isnt on Pergolide, what is the reason why?  Was it that you wanted to try other things to manage the Cushings firstly?  

I worry about the long term effects of the drug, although she was only diagnosed in the Spring so only been on a few months so far but with phenominal results both to her character and physical appearance (its like the clock has turned back 10+ years) so I am very pleased but wonder if the same could be achieved without giving her what are basically human drugs daily.

Thanks Oliver12 for the suugestion to contact Jackie Taylor at Metabolic Horse Co, I will see if I can find her email address on the web or do you have her contact details at all?

LadyRascasse, Please would you let me know how your boy gets on when he comes of the Cushinaze, I would be very interested to hear 

Madhoss, I dont soak Sadie's hay as the vet didnt deem it necessary but I wonder if I soak it for a period of time I can feed her a little more as opossed to 2 sections of dry hay.  I have fed Hi Fi Lite in the past many many moons ago but Sadie wasnt really keen, she isnt a fan of chaff based feeds or chaff itself really.  The only thing she seems to enjoy is the Safe and Sound.  I tried her on Happy Hoof before but she wasnt keen 


Thanks for your replies 
Sadiemay


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## Oliver12 (17 September 2010)

I don't use Pergolide as I thought I'd see what the results were using Agnus Castus. I have been very pleased but if he started to deteriorate then I would use Pergolide.

Jackie Taylor's contact is:

Tel/Fax: 01959 571312 Mobile 07795 680640
Email: 2009@MetabolicHorse.co.uk

Office Address: Metabolic Horse Co, Highlands, Ricketts Hill Road, Tatsfield, Westerham, TN16 2NF

Or there is a Yahoo self help group: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TheMetabolicHorse


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## Sadiemay (17 September 2010)

Thank you Oliver12, I will drop an email today


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## LadyRascasse (17 September 2010)

no pergolide as his symptoms are relieved with cushinaze. interestingly he came back as not having cushings on the blood test but i am waiting to speak to the naf rep to find out if this is possible as he has been on the cushinaze so long and blood test taken without a withdrawal period. (i treated on symptoms after a conversation with the naf rep and vet)

ETA the pergolide can have negative effects on the liver and as my horse has enough medical issues i would avoid long term use with him if at all possible.


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## LadyRascasse (17 September 2010)

this was him before the cushinaze






and this is him about 2 weeks ago











when the first photo was taken he was total "dead" inside. so depressed almost put him to sleep as he had lost his spark.


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## Tamski (17 September 2010)

i feed Vital Equids on top of pergolide to my pony. He's improved no end and is very sprightly.

He's had no lami this year, lost his winter coat without needing clipping and in general feels very well.

He's out 24/7 but on restricted turnout supplemented with hay/blue horsehage. He's fed hi fi lite and one mug of baileys lo cal balancer.

This is working at the moment and in winter he'll get some hi fi cubes as well.

Good luck- it's a bit trial and error!


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## nativepony (17 September 2010)

My 19 year old NF was diagnosed with cushings in May and started off on 1mg of pergolide, this was increased to 2mg a day and the vet was really pleased with how she was doing.  I did ask about putting her on herbs rather than the pergolide but for whatever reason she didn't advise it.  I do now actually feed CushingSustain from Equinatural alongside the pergolide (which is completely safe to do) as I figured it won't do any harm and hopefully will lower her ACTH levels even more (they were at 40 when last tested, which is still slightly high).  The herbs contain amongst other things, Agnus Castus, Nettle, Milk Thistle (can't remember any more!) and are very palatable.  She also has HiFi lite, Spillers H&P cubes, NAF pink powder, magnesium and have been feeding speedibeet up until today but the vet came yesterday to see her and couldn't believe how much better she was looking, topline come back but also thought she was now bordering on being overweight (was very skinny before!) and recommends I cut the speedibeet out for the time being.  She also has 2-3 sections soaked hay with her tea and a section in the morning.  She is ridden most days and has gone from being very depressed and lethargic to back to her old self and full of energy!

Lady Rascasse your before and after photo's are amazing!  

Good luck SadieMay!


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