# Leukocytoclastic vasculitis treatment



## xStephx (1 December 2015)

Desperate to hear of any successful treatments of this horrible condition. 

Finally in October my horse (21) was diagnosed with this after years of me telling the vets it wasn't mudfever (only suffered in summer) and it was getting more and more immune to treatments. I've tried all sorts to now no avail.

This summer has been the worst and I haven't managed to clear it. He finished his third lot of steroids the other week which helped a bit but now it's getting worse again. This morning I brushed the mud off and took a load of skin with it. We have clay mud which is evil and sticks to the skin like glue. I can't wash as this does then give him mudfever as I experienced in February with both hinds one black and one white.

I really don't know what to do next. Steroids aren't an option long term I've already spent about 400 and just can't afford a 120 pot every week and a half. I could keep him in or ask our yard owner if I can have use of the small coral and turn my other one out separately. I'm just worried that eventually this is only going to lead down one path which I obviously I want to avoid but I haven't got a pot of gold and I want him to have the best quality of life possible. 

Anyone able to treat successfully? I want to stay away from topical stuff if possible as I think this just makes it worse.


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## Meowy Catkin (1 December 2015)

I feel your pain as my gelding suffers from this and the first year he had it, the treatment came to £800 and he still had sore legs on pretty much every square inch of pink skin that he possesses.  It did clear while he was out 24/7 in the autumn (at that point I was putting honey on, or hypocare if he wouldn't let me slap the honey on) and his legs were grand over the winter. His diet was also changed (no alfalfa, no molasses) and I was advised to spray the field with headland polo as soon as it was the right time of year for spraying.

The following spring/summer I managed to mostly get sun cream on his legs and the horses were moved to a small paddock so that the field could be sprayed. That year he had no LV.

This year he was a bit of a sod to sun cream and the LV did start up on his heel bulbs/ bottom of the back of the pasterns, but this time I left it completely alone and it didn't get worse (which is what happened the first year where the scabs were removed etc...). It's been gone a while now and I'm planning to pop over reach boots on him if he's a pain to get sun cream on next spring/summer as they would shade that area that seems particularly susceptible on him.


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## soloequestrian (1 December 2015)

I've not managed to clear it from my boy fully, but it is at least under control and not sore (he has a line of it around each of his hind coronet bands).  I use honey and UV boots.  My belief is that he's allergic to anything oil-based, so I don't use any soap on it or anything else oil based.  I do have neoprene boots that I used to use in the winter, but this year I'm swithering about using them because I'm pretty sure he reacted to vetwrap in the summer, so worried the neoprene will set the condition back.  If yours has a different trigger factor though, these would be good - the Equilibrium ones - because they reduce the mud coverage.  If you really want to keep the mud at bay, wrap with vetwrap and gaffa tape and use the turnout boots (my summer experiment!).


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## xStephx (1 December 2015)

Thanks for the replies. I've reluctantly turned him out this morning in a neoprene turnout boot although modified by myself to only cover up to the fetlock. I modified this one summer when I tried honey and needed it to stop drying out as was just drying and cracking his skin and the boot left long made the cannon part sweat. He gets unbelievably sweaty legs really easy and always has done. I don't like using these much as although they do keep mud off it does get underneath which I don't think helps when it gets warm under there.

I had been using a thin layer of sudocream to keep soft when it was warmer but have not put this on for a few weeks as I don't really think it helps. Just spreads it if anything. I think anything topical just about spreads it apart from powder. I'm wondering whether to try the keratex mud powder just as barrier to stop any potential mudfever but I think our mud would just get through this.

I was going to buy UV boots for next spring. Although i tried keeping it covered this summer and have just not been able to get it under control as when i do it just all of a sudden comes back with a vengeance. Or he cuts himself (always this leg never any other!) and it flares up. I've even tried a hair analysis and giving the bespoke remedy for him from holistic remedies. I wasn't expecting it to work but was hoping it might just do something and it hasn't as far as I can tell and he's coming up to the five weeks I've been told to give it for.

He's currently fed hi-fi lite and speedi beet with linseed seaweed and turmeric and zeolite which is good for removing toxins. I'm trying to keep sugar to a minimum and I had wondered about trying to remove alfalfa. 

I'm just so worried I won't be able to get this under control and it's going to go down a no return path. I've had him 11 years and he's never had great health and I just hate not being able to fix him and see his leg like this. It's the worst it's ever been. It's never spread up his fetlock and the cannon bone but now it is and I've never put anything on his cannon bone.


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## soloequestrian (1 December 2015)

Might be worth getting UV boots now - they are much cooler than the turnout boots and they do keep a fair bit of mud off.  Mine was the same with flare-ups until I came up with the 'oil-based product' hypothesis.  It took me ages to realise because there was always a lag period before he reacted to anything new.  He hasn't had a flare now for over a year, but it's definitely a case of management rather than cure for him.
I have used Keratex powder in the past to treat mud fever (on a different horse) and it was brilliant stuff - definitely worth a try.


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## mightymammoth (1 December 2015)

Also battling this dreadful condition. What stage are his scabs at and how bad are they? On my horse luckily it's just on his heels and one in particular. I can't give him steroids as he has a high acth,possible cushings. 

He was in a hell of a state last year and it was just a mass of weeping wet sores, he had antibiotics and I managed to dry these out with mud fever powder (keratex). I was also treating it as mudfever . 

Since then the only thing that has kept it in check is using diprabase (sp) or aqueos cream. To keep the skin supple and protected. I also use cortavance spray from the vet when it really starts to flare up. I use plastic gloves and really massage it down to the skin.

I tried filtabac which is sun lotion and sudacrem type cream however this caused a flare up as his skin is so sensitive and damaged!

It's a dreadful chronic condition and I wish there was more known about it.


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## Jim bob (1 January 2016)

My boy also suffers with this too. It's an awful condition and very frustrating for myself and my horse I have been battling this since last may. 
At first me and my vet did try steroid injections, cold hosing and covering his legs from the sun and gently trying to pick the scabs off under cold water along with antibiotics. 

A month later they had covered his outside of his cannon bones on both hinds I had to call my vet back down as they were getting much worse not better and making my boy very very sore. We then went onto oral steroids and had a few scary times with possibly lami. 
However after around 6-8 weeks of covering his legs ( uncovered them with anything sometimes it was gamgee and bandages other it's was fly boots) and steroids we were making progress! They were slowly coming off. 

Sadly they left there mark as the last scabs to form from that are still here!! My vet ( big hospital in North East,  is a expert in internal medicine ) said at least with my horses case once it is gone it doesn't come back. However getting rid of it is hard! Mt vet suggested keeping my horses skin clean,dry and healthy. 

I have done a lot of research into this. It seems treatment is individual to each horse. That yellow plants seem to be a cause whether their eaten or the horse touches then. It appears that there is more then one cause and they all have to happen at the same time for LV   Eg yellow plants, stress, uv rays, gut health. 

I am still battling this though they are much better. There is a vet at  liver pool who is a expert is skin conditions. He has two horses at the vets that had LV and they completely stopped the light they were stabled I think and within 6 week the scabs were gone. It seems 6-8 weeks is how long it takes for the scabs to drop off etc.  Hope that helps


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## Nudibranch (1 January 2016)

I have two with it, which is a bit wierd. No sign until this summer despite nothjng changing. We have been through the works with the vet and tried pretty much everything. Currently at the doing nothing stage and most of the scabs have dropped off by themselves. This may be just because it is winter of course, so less UV. I am keeping them in the barn over the holiday to let the skin have a couple of weeks of proper dry, and they're looking good now. The vet is hopeful they may not reoccur once their immune systems have got on top of it, but we still don't know what the trigger is, and he said we may just have to manage it.


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## alibali (2 January 2016)

Things that I found helped; leave the scabs alone, excluding Alfa Alfa from diet, UV protect sun chaps, spraying off buttercups before flowering, antibiotics for the secondary infection.

Things I found made it worse; removing scabs (any method including picking and softening with creams first), any topical 'gloopy' creams, washing legs, brushing legs

Things that didn't help but didn't make it worse; topical powders, box rest

Obviously these are just what worked for my boy. He is now maintained on an Alfa free diet and the field regularly spray for buttercups, he no longer needs his sun chaps. I'm on clay soil, I NEVER wash, brush or cream his legs summer or winter. The mud chips off once dry with no help from me. He gets the occasional small (smaller than 5p piece) scab these are never touched and tend to persist for 2-3 months.

I found the hardest thing to do was to leave the legs alone especially as well meaning people are just dying to help by telling you all about their fail-safe remedy....


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## millmo (2 January 2016)

My granddaughters pony suffered from it a few years ago. We covered his legs with cream anything that's thick so you can get a good layer on i.e sudacream. Then we put turnout boots on. We repeated this morning and night. We didn't wash his legs or pull any of the scabs off we left it to nature. It did take a while but it did clear up and touch wood hasn't returned. For some time after we turned him out in UV boots just because his legs were sensitive to the sun etc.


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## xStephx (2 January 2016)

Thanks for all your replies. Really helpful. 

Just before Christmas I thought I was going to lose him. I'd hosed his leg off one night as it was plastered in thick mud under his boot. The next morning it was swollen and weeping so I decided to leave him in the coral so he was out of the mud but could move around. Big mistake. He ended up with colic symptoms and lymphangitis as he didn't move all day. A nice out of hours call out lots of bute a shot of metacam and cortisone and he was ok. I was instructed no matter what he had to be turned out. And advised the mud had to be washed off. Our mud is clay and does not wash off without scrubbing or brush off without vigorous grooming. Vet also said it sounded like steroids dis not help much and that she had lost a horse with very similar skin problems in the fact it just kept recurring and nothing helped.

Anyway I've been trying something very alternative as it was looking like he may not be around much longer as the size and extent of the sores was just getting worse. I now have him on cbd oil which comes from the hemp plant. It is legal and is grown without the substance that makes people high. I started this on the 18th December and The difference in his sores is undeniable. It is finally healing. It is not cheap but an awful lot cheaper than steroids with no nasty side effects! He may need a maintenance dose for the rest of his life but I honestly believe this miracle oil has saved his life and for that i am happy to keep him on a maintenance dose if needed. I will see if I can get some pictures up at some point later today. But to say I am relieved is an understatement!


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## Nudibranch (2 January 2016)

Just to mention, we are on clay and yes, its hard not to remove it but leave it we must. It's the only thing which has helped. Ie not washing or brushing off.


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## xStephx (2 January 2016)

I now only brush about once a week. Leave it alone as much as I can as messing with it just aggravates it. But brushing about once a week at the minute now it's healing means that scabs are coming off when brushed and I'll do this as gently as I can. I won't wash at all any more not since that night i washed it last and it ended up a mess and me needing to call the vet out.


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## soloequestrian (2 January 2016)

That's really interesting - are you feeding the oil (as opposed to applying it to the skin)?  Where do you buy it?


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## xStephx (2 January 2016)

Feeding it. Actually putting the drops on to treats and feeding that way as he tends to throw his food around and i want to make sure he has it all! Haven't tried applying it to the skin as most things make it worse. I'm sure it would help applied just nervous about trying and now it's healing I don't really want to make it worse. I buy it online from love cbd. They have various strengths and the one I've got is 7%. I'll get some pictures up later.


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## Britestar (2 January 2016)

Mine has had a big flare up this least two days. He has been rubbing his leg on his water bucket and broken the skin.
I also discovered he's putting his leg into to bucket at night - the cold water must take the sting out of it.
One leg is bad, the other hasn't broken the skin yet.
Back on the steroid cream for now. He goes all squishy if you touch it, the itch must be maddening.


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## supagran (2 January 2016)

Just a thought - we have a mare who suffers as well, and after trial and error, we have discovered that she seems allergic to neoprene - at last its clearing up, just a few small patches left and the hair is regrowing.  When ridden she now wears bandages, which are washed regularly.  We had gone down the steroids and anti-biotics route but didn't make any difference.


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## xStephx (3 January 2016)

Finally got round to pictures for anyone that's interested. Here's the link https://drive.google.com/file/d/1xHGvIlRgwoJwFv6Bb7xJqlF0_9LJmts4Ww/view?usp=docslist_api 

Hope that works. The bottom row was taken on 18th Dec and the top row on 1st Jan. I have not seen improvement like this since the betnovate cream worked (which no longer does). There were more scabs and sores further up his leg but not as bad as the bottom in the pictures.


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## Jim bob (5 January 2016)

Me and my boy aren't doing very well at the moment. I haven't been able to wash the mud of his legs for the last 4 days to a week I would say and I have finally been able to today. However the scabs are pretty thick,hard and I can remove them yet I almost get kicked each time   I left them alone and they got worse. Vet is down next week anyway.


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## xStephx (5 January 2016)

Sorry to hear that Jim Bob &#128532; I know just how you feel. Fred hates me going anywhere near his leg now for fear of me picking at it like i had been advised to do in the past. I soon learnt to just leave it as trying to keep it clean or scab free just made it worse. This wet weather making it really muddy just doesn't help either. I honestly thought I was going to lose fred to this as it just wouldn't go and I was so scared he would end up with a very bad infection and at 22 he isn't covered on insurance. Steroids never really helped him and at £120 every week and a half it was breaking the bank. If you've had at look at my link on his skin as it was and is now you'll see just how different it is using this oil. There is still a way to go but I have left his leg alone since taking those last pics and will leave it till the weekend when I brush the mud off and will take more pics. The oil is the only thing that has made an improvement for him. I only hope it continues. If nothing works for your boy it might be worth a try. It was a stab in the dark for me. It's not very well known about and I don't know of anyone that has used it on horses but I had to try and so far with trial and error I think we will get it healed. No nasty side effects like steroids either just a wealth of benefits.


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## mightymammoth (5 January 2016)

jim bob are they dry or wet scabs? how many does he have and where? If they're wet what about using the keratex mud powder to dry them out? whats your situation is your horse in at night?


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## Jim bob (5 January 2016)

Thank you! The steroids did work for my boy after around 8 weeks. Due to other issues he has been on steroids for around 5 months with a 3 week gap off them in the middle.. He has.. on his hind right ... its hard as there all around then each of the previous lot... 20 very small scabs but these are increasing... on his left hind Idk I would say 20 small scabs again. There dry generally he is in on a night.


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## mightymammoth (7 January 2016)

If it was me (and this is what i did) rinse off the mud if needed, pat dry if possible. put on the ketatex powder to dry them out then in the morning out on a cream. I used diprabase or aqueos cream. However as you well know what works for one horse doesn't for another. I found sudmcrem thick barrier creams made it worse.


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## AdorableAlice (7 January 2016)

There is another thread about this problem that ran through the summer, with some good advice on it.

A horse of mine had it all summer and got into a real mess, I braced myself for the worst.  He is cushingoid and very sensitive skinned.

Steroids were a big risk and only used once.  Bute and a half pill increase in prescend to 1 and a half daily saw no improvement.  I used every cream known to man to no avail.  Sudacream just clogged everything up.  Another horse of mine has mallendars/sallendars which responded to Johnsons pink lotion.  I tried that on the vasculitis horse and got good results.  The scabs softened and gradually dropped off revealing healthy skin beneath.

Both his hinds were looking good as winter hit.  The skin around the pastern and fetlock started to come off in big pieces, almost like a degloving injury and underneath was pink but healthy skin with the first signs of hair growing.  At that point I left the legs alone, kept him on the 2 bute daily and as the weather turned his paddock into a swamp, I put hoof to heel in his pasterns.

This is an elderly horse who has very specific requirements in how he lives.  He has a large bedded down shelter and his own paddocks, he must have the door open and he pleases himself what he does so he does get wet legs.  So far he legs are holding together and I am ready with uv boots for the Spring.  All I have to do now is get him to Spring.


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## chillipup (7 January 2016)

I'm so sorry to hear about your horses with this dreadful condition. I can understand how terribly concerned you are and do wish you well in coping with such an ongoing problem. I do hope they all improve.


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## Jim bob (7 January 2016)

AA I think it was me who started the thread in the summer as that's when my boys first appeared. I have found, atleast with my horse covering his legs from the uv rays helps a lot. Sadly there was a week I two I wasn't able to and they have become worse. I don't want him back on the steroids and I don't really want this options but I cant risk his legs getting into the state they were in before. 

This was his legs in the summer. in the end the four big .. scabs all merged into one


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## Britestar (9 January 2016)

Mine has had a horrible flare up since new year, and he's just been self harming on both back legs. Ended up getting the Vet out yesterday and he got a steroid injection and a long acting antib, to try and break the cycle of him itching and causing wounds.


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## mightymammoth (10 January 2016)

jimbob, I know that looks bad but they look dryish? A bit of the keratex powder may help to dry them out further.


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## Daisy99 (10 January 2016)

Horse chestnut tincture, fed twice daily, approx 10 drops. Not much time to reply at present but this worked on a very bad case I knew. Cheap to try.


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## Daisy99 (10 January 2016)

Google horse chestnut tincture and it all makes sense!


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## mightymammoth (10 January 2016)

thanks will have a look as not heard of this. Has it worked for your horse?


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## Daisy99 (11 January 2016)

It was a horse I looked after and yes it really helped.
If you reasearch it you will see it makes sense in a lot of ways.
I think the main thing is you are treating it from the inside rather than putting lotions and potions on it which often seem to irritate it more.
We stopped all other treatment other than an occasional clean with just warm water and gave him the chestnut tincture and it gradually healed.
Of course I cannot say 100% it was the cure but I saw a difference if we ever ran out of it or it was missed from his feed.
Worth a try surely??
Good luck!


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