# Anyone else just think they can't do this?



## Cedars (14 November 2011)

Having a really bad day so I apologise in advance for how moany this will be. I have flu so am really rough.

We have four horses. One is mine, two are my OHs, and one is his mother's. I am a university student, doing a full time course training to be a teacher. My OH works very hard, 2hrs drive away from here. His mother is only here at weekends due to work. We are on our own yard with nobody else, so there is no extra help, just the three of us.

Because I am at university, my boyfriend obviously financially supports me, and he definitely has much more than his fair share of house bills. We split all the food costs, pet costs etc, its just things like the electrics and the gas that he pays. Because of this, I am aware that I will do more than my 'fair share' of the animals, in payment, so to speak.

His mother is interesting. She owns the yard, and we don't pay livery, so clearly we are very much indebted to her in that sense. However, she just doesn't do anything with her horse and it is getting to the point where I'm going to really lose my temper. Her husband is not at all horsey, so, I appreciate that one day a weekend (of the three they're here) she spends solely with him - thats fine by me. During the week though, I have her horse full time, with all the crapola that comes with that (literally...) so is it too much to expect that when she is here on the weekends, she actually does something? Take, for example, this weekend. She was here all day Friday - and all she did was sweep the yard, once. No mucking out, no poo picking (despite us asking her). Saturday she went out all day (as her 'nonhorsey day') - fine by me. Sunday, she always has two riding lessons. She literally (this is no exaggeration) turned up at 12pm for her lesson at 12.15pm, got on her horse, rode for an hour and got off. Then she did, to be fair to her, half arsedly help around the yard - but she went in for lunch (her house is on site, ours isn't, I wasn't invited in), did a grand total of a wheelbarrow worth of poo picking, held open some haynets. I did EVERYTHING else (my boyfriend was at work).

Then, yesterday evening, she told tales on me to my boyfriend (I am aware how young that sounds) saying that I hadn't even bothered get to the horses until 11am (I did - they had breakfast nets before I turned out later, but she wouldn't know this as she didn't get out of bed until 10am), and basically she'd be spying on my movements all weekend, telling my OH what I had and had not been doing. So my OH comes home with a temper on him yesterday, kicking off that he doesn't know the full picture about what I'm doing with his horses.

Today, I was meant to be going in to uni, but I didn't because his horse has a swollen leg. Fine, I thought, day off, sucks but not the end of the world. Started to poo pick (which hasn't been done all week because I've been on placement and I'm the only person who does any really) and didn't stop - 18 wheelbarrows I've done today. I'm ill and the ground is absolutely disasterous, clay soil so you might as well drag a stone through it rather than a wheelbarrow, but EIGHTEEN WHEELBARROWS. 

Final straw was that OH came home from work, has gone absolutely nuts that there is still 2 wheelbarrows to do in the field, and he needs to fill up water buckets. That is IT, I've done everything else. Its his day off tomorrow, and he's kicking off because 'he'll have to do all the mucking out on his day off'.

Am I unreasonable to be thinking, I NEVER get time with my horse, I'm not allowed to ride any of their horses and mine is a baby, I had half hour with her this weekend when I sat on her and I'm being made to feel like I'm a devil for spending that time not mucking out. It feels like they both expect me to do everything, and that when they turn up on their days off everything should be done. Whereas I feel like actually, they wanted horses, their days off should be filled with doing the stuff that I do EVERY DAY!

Sat here in tears thinking, I just can't do this this winter. But I can't walk away either - because I'll lose my horse (who is in my OHs name) and I'll lose my OH because he's told me in no uncertain terms before that if I walk away from the horses, I can get out of the house and out of the relationship.

I know that the finances are difficult because I don't pay my way with bills/livery, but I feel like I definitely do the lion's share of the work and I just don't think I can do it any more.

Cookies if this makes sense to anyone.

 xx


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## Sheep (14 November 2011)

Can't really offer any advice but it sounds like a really tough situation. I hope things improve for you soon.


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## darkhorse123 (14 November 2011)

If its upsettign you that much leave and start to pay for your own livery ?


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## Cedars (14 November 2011)

With what horse, and with what money? My horse is in my boyfriends name, and I'm a full time student! And should I just walk out on my 5year relationship?


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## Trot_On_Dressage (14 November 2011)

Sounds like a tough situation for you.  

Can you not talk to you OH about how you feel?


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## PooJay (14 November 2011)

that's awful! 

Well, i know what i'd be refusing my other half cos "i'm waaaaay too tired" if he treated me like that. 

Think that's pretty disgusting - if it were me, i'd have flipped already and more than likely exploded in a flurry of tears and screams at how much i had to do and how little time and enjoyment i got out of it. No advice really there except maybe it's time to say something and let your oh know how you're feeling? 

Good luck whatever happens though!


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## fatpiggy (14 November 2011)

Do you actually want to spend a number more years with his mother looking over your shoulder all the time?  He will invariably take her side in an arguement, I can guarantee that.  They have both got you over a barrel in reality because "your" horse is basically his and his "there's the door" threat rather shows he seems to feel more for the horses than you.  If you turn that around and think that if he said his dinner wasn't on the table in the evenings, he would chuck you out - would you stay???


I know what you mean about the poo-picking though. Our fields are supposed to be done by all the liveries, but the reality is through the summer I was taking a full barrow off every day before I went to work and the others did precisely nothing.  Does my horse produce 7 barrows full a week. Um, no.  My mother nags me about not getting any physio for my very dodgy back, but can't see that I'd undo all the good work the very next day. I might as well tear up £10 notes.


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## La Fiaba (14 November 2011)

You poor thing, sounds like you are in a really bad situation. Firstly, what do you mean by your horse is in your boyfriends name? Do you just mean on the passport? Or is it his horse and he loans it to you? Who bought the horse?

Secondly, just going by what you've written and having no other knowledge of you or your bf, I wouldn't want to be in either a relationship with a man who lost his temper with me over something like this OR financially dependant on him or his mother. I would get out of the situation asap.

However I don't know if this is a one off and you're just feeling like this because you're ill etc and things always seem worse. Hope things pick up for you.


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## PooJay (14 November 2011)

could you suggest a local youngster coming to do the stables once a week with the promise of a free ride? 

I don't know how "good" your horses are but i know as a teenager i would've done anything to ride a horse for more than my 1 hour riding lesson. 

Then you and your OH could maybe have a saturday off together  and "mother" can spy on the potential teenager!


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## MissMincePie&Brandy (14 November 2011)

I think you sound lonely. 

I know this feeling because I grew up on my parents farm, and we kept the horses at home. Myself, my brother and my dad were the riders of the family, but all the horsey chores were my responsibility (after the age of about 14). We had between 3 and 5 horses, and at times I felt very depressed and resentful with it all. I was almost thinking of giving up, but by the time I moved out of my parents place to move towards London for work and with my BF, I took two of my horses with me and put them on livery - and it was like a new beginning, the company was all that I was lacking. When there are others around you and you are having conversations whilst mucking out and making feeds etc, it really isn't as bad as being alone on a yard with 5 horses and no one else around, day in, day out.  I guess I was lucky that the livery yard I went to was a nice one.  I've been there 10 years now, and still love it.

Perhaps, if there is space you could get a livery in?  You will have some company, and they might even help you a little?


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## Wagtail (14 November 2011)

I cannot believe they will not allow you to ride their horses?! Do they only trust you to be a skivvy?

You can look at it two ways. You are getting free livery in return for work and as you have no other way of earning, this is your only option and so grin and bear it until you get your degree and hopefully a job and then tell 'em where to go. If you see it as serving your purpose and not theirs then you will start to feel better about it.

Or

You can take the view that they are simply using you and have a free groom who does everything and also 'services' the boyfriend to boot! Sell your horse and leave.

I personally favour the first option. If it's any consolation, I do eight horses entirely on my own. They are on full livery and I also have two of my own. My OH does the muck picking though at weekends. But all eight horses are stabled 20 hours a day in winter and I poo pick the all weather turnout all by myself. OH only poo picks when they are in the fields all summer and part of the spring and autumn. I also do all the cleaning, washing and cooking for a family of four, but I don't have to study or work elsewhere. Just think how fit and healthy you will be? Nice and attractive for someone else should you decide to kick your OH into touch.


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## Archangel (14 November 2011)

Personally I hate things where I get something for free as the things you do in return often get a completely out of proportion to the original deal.  

OK so you get free livery for 1 horse (say a value of £120 pcm equalling 15 hours of your time @£8ph) in return for looking after the mum's horse 5 days a week.  Say 1 hour a day = 20+ hours a month.  Now you are equal.  

Your BF subsides you at the moment because you are training and you balance it out by doing his horses.  All very good but again some boundaries.  You cannot be beholden to someone over 'I pay the electric gas etc' for an unlimited amount of 'work in lieu'.  Work out how much time you spend doing his horses and sit down with him to 'balance the books' with him.  Again, he may pay the electric/gas/council tax etc but it is only your half that he is paying extra and this does not equal a free slave.

Value yourself properly, your time is worth money and you are contributing in kind.  Set time aside for your own horse otherwise what is the point?  

I sympathise with your feeling that you cannot do a whole winter of this.  18 wheelbarrows is too much, no wonder you flipped.  

It is so hard, I once had free livery for my pony and the person expected me to be at their beck and call 24 hours a day in return!

Also with Mum looking over your shoulder and reporting back to her son is a bit toxic.  Either he trusts you to do the horses or he does them himself.  OK he works two hours away but that is not your problem really and doesn't entitle him to a free slave!

Sorry gone on a bit!


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## Cedars (14 November 2011)

I do talk to him - and all I get back is a load of 'well you don't pay for anything' 'i'm sending your horse back if you wont do mine' 'we wont be together if you wont do the horses' 'you're so ungrateful, my mother houses your horse for free'.

It upsets me as well because its like babysitting when his mother is on the yard. She has excuses for EVERYTHING, why she can't help. She's scared of my youngster (who literally is brain dead), she won't go in to their boxes (so wont muck out if their are horses in), she won't pick out her horses feet, she won't change rugs, she can't even bring her own fricking horse in to the field! Because she's 'scared'. 

Cant stop crying tonight.


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## Once was lost (14 November 2011)

Take the horses out of the equation and you have an abusing relationship, he is controlling you and emotionally blackmailing you.
From what you say I can't see anything changing for the better but I do see it getting a whole lot worse.
Not the same but when I was younger I was controlled by somebody, she was the owner of the horses I cared for, rode, broke in, brought on, I did all the work every day for all 5 horses while she paid for them, most of the time but it was getting so I was having to pay more and more. She was using me I was young and emotionally fragile (My Dad had been ill and then died) and my bond with the horses is what kept me going, I knew that the situation was bad and I knew she was taking advantage but I felt that I just couldn't turn my back on the horses, I was very depressed and even started self harming, I couldn't see a way out as I was not willing to leave 'my' pony. An accident saved me in the end, didn't feel like that at the time mind, I suffered a very bed injury in a fall from 'my' pony, she didn't visit me once through my week in hospital having surgery, the only time I saw her again was when she came and dropping some of my things from the tack room (that she only gave me back due to the YO putting pressure on her) once I couldn't give her what she wanted she dropped me like a hot brick. It hurt like hell but my depression lifted once I was out of the situation, I was able to move on. I still miss those horses every single day and I am so sad I never got to say goodbye but I know now, 15 years down the line it was the saving and making of me.
You need to think about what you get out of this relationship, think about if you are staying because of your horse or because you love your partner and you want a future with him.
If you are staying for your horse then you have to either find away to keep him and leave (grass livery, loan), if you paid for him and you can prove that you paid for him then that shouldn't be a problem (ownership wise not costs of keep) but if you didn't pay for him, have no proof of purchase in your name then you have a problem and maybe, just maybe you are going to have to sacrifice the horse for your own future well being and happiness. I know it is the unthinkable, I know that you just can't imagine doing that and I know you feel that your heart would just break and there would be no future or happiness without your horse but I have to say, having been there that there is, I am not in a situation so far removed from where I was then and so much happier for it. You can do it, short term hell but tell me, can you look into the future and tell me how you will survive another 20-30 years like this?


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## Sugarplum Furry (14 November 2011)

Golly they really have got you dangling by a few strings haven't they? Financially, emotionally, and not to mention somewhere to live, and your horse. I can't believe the mother openly spies on you, that's not just rude....it's creepy. And the threats from your OH about losing your home and your/his horse if you walk, listen, with respect, are you sure  this is the man for you? You sound like a lovely caring intelligent hard working woman and OH and his mother ought to be falling at your feet with gratitude for everything you do for them and the horses. Right now I think you should throw a sickie (well you HAVE got flu) crawl into bed for a couple of days and let them get on with it themselves.. In the long term it's time to set down a few ground rules,.....I know it will be hard, but you've got to initiate the change or your going to be their live in slave for a very long time, especially if you stay with your OH. Wishing you luck and hope you feel better soon.


Edited to say...((((((((((((BIG HUGS)))))))))))))


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## Trot_On_Dressage (14 November 2011)

Cedars said:



			I do talk to him - and all I get back is a load of 'well you don't pay for anything' 'i'm sending your horse back if you wont do mine' 'we wont be together if you wont do the horses' 'you're so ungrateful, my mother houses your horse for free'.

It upsets me as well because its like babysitting when his mother is on the yard. She has excuses for EVERYTHING, why she can't help. She's scared of my youngster (who literally is brain dead), she won't go in to their boxes (so wont muck out if their are horses in), she won't pick out her horses feet, she won't change rugs, she can't even bring her own fricking horse in to the field! Because she's 'scared'. 

Cant stop crying tonight.
		
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If he really uses those threats to you Cedars he is not worth your tears. I would not let anyone hold me to anything like that. if it means selling your horse as your OH owns him so be it. You said your horse was a baby, can you really be beholden to this man for what, the next 30 years or so just because you are frightened he will sell the horse. Get out of there and find someone nice who wont use threats to keep you there.


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## SS.89 (14 November 2011)

Once was lost said:



			Take the horses out of the equation and you have an abusing relationship, he is controlling you and emotionally blackmailing you.
From what you say I can't see anything changing for the better but I do see it getting a whole lot worse.
		
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I'd ditto that .... I had a horse whilst I was full time at university but luckily I still had time for a part time job so was able to afford livery so I can't help in that situation :/
However .... I think somewhere in the equation someone is taking the P**S out of you  I really hope you make the right decision and things improve for you !!

SS x


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## Devonshire dumpling (14 November 2011)

Cedars said:



			With what horse, and with what money? My horse is in my boyfriends name, and I'm a full time student! And should I just walk out on my 5year relationship?
		
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I would!  Do you realise what you are worth?? They just don't deserve you end of! x


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## Devonshire dumpling (14 November 2011)

Cedars said:



			I do talk to him - and all I get back is a load of 'well you don't pay for anything' 'i'm sending your horse back if you wont do mine' 'we wont be together if you wont do the horses' 'you're so ungrateful, my mother houses your horse for free'.

It upsets me as well because its like babysitting when his mother is on the yard. She has excuses for EVERYTHING, why she can't help. She's scared of my youngster (who literally is brain dead), she won't go in to their boxes (so wont muck out if their are horses in), she won't pick out her horses feet, she won't change rugs, she can't even bring her own fricking horse in to the field! Because she's 'scared'. 

Cant stop crying tonight.[/QUOTe
Blimey I hadn't read this when I commented before, definately leave, there is someone somewhere who will treat you like a princess, life is too short! xx
		
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## Cedars (14 November 2011)

I am unbelievably lonely, because I never have any time for friends! Any time I would spend with friends gets a 'well you could have spent that time poo picking'. 

The horse is in his name because shes 'on loan' from WHW - to him, because at the time I didn't have enough experience. She has always been all mine, he only needed a companion and when we took on a youngster it was assumed she would be mine and thats how is it (I pay for everything for her, shes mine) except in name. So, he COULD send her back if he wanted.

xxx


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## JingleTingle (14 November 2011)

To be quite frank, this sounds like a sort of upstairs downstairs set up, and you sound VERY much the downstairs part of things.

You haven't been in a relationship with this cretin for 5 years - you have been in 'service' (in more ways than one) to his family.

Doesn't sound like you own your horse at all - just a little crumb or two that the cretin has thrown to you from his overflowing platter to keep you in loyal and unending servitude.

Walk away, quickly and purposefully. Don't look back, weep a little for what you thought you had (but in truth had nothing) and then move on with your life. In no time at all you can really own your own horse, keep it where ever you choose, but hopefully in the company of like minded young people of your own age.

Let Miss Haversham and her sprog rot away in their own pile of horse poo as you ride off happily into the sunset.


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## Cadfael&Coffee (14 November 2011)

I'm a full time student, I work and I pay for myself and my horse. It is doable!!!!


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## skydancer (14 November 2011)

Cedars said:



			I do talk to him - and all I get back is a load of 'well you don't pay for anything' 'i'm sending your horse back if you wont do mine' 'we wont be together if you wont do the horses' 'you're so ungrateful, my mother houses your horse for free'.

It upsets me as well because its like babysitting when his mother is on the yard. She has excuses for EVERYTHING, why she can't help. She's scared of my youngster (who literally is brain dead), she won't go in to their boxes (so wont muck out if their are horses in), she won't pick out her horses feet, she won't change rugs, she can't even bring her own fricking horse in to the field! Because she's 'scared'. 

Cant stop crying tonight.
		
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These people are nothing but bullies - for your OH to show you the door when something is not to his liking is both manipulative and abusive. If you have somewhere else to go - then go, you will be able to get your "own" horse when you have finished uni. The mother in law sounds like my mother in law a control freak and whatever you do or no matter how much you work she will never be happy!Now, stop crying and dry your eyes they are really not worth it and know that whatever you decide you are the better person xxxxxxx


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## Cadfael&Coffee (14 November 2011)

Forgo to add- personally, from what you've said here I would walk away.

Tough to walk away from the horse I'll admit, but if it's in his name I'm afraid there isn't anything you can do about it.

This is why ALL my animals will always be in MY name alone I'm afraid- noone can take them away!


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## ridefast (14 November 2011)

If he's serious, take him up on it and leave. Is there a ring on your finger? I would have though after 5 years things would be in a good state, you shouldn't be his slave. You may have to take the risk of leaving your horse, but do you really want to stay in this situation?


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## darkhorse123 (14 November 2011)

Cedars said:



			With what horse, and with what money? My horse is in my boyfriends name, and I'm a full time student! And should I just walk out on my 5year relationship?
		
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After reading the rest of your replies - yes.

I do not mean to be harsh but after 5 years things are unlikeley to improve and they are treatign you like a slave - they know you are "beholden" to them.

Have you spoke to your parents about this?

Do you really want ot be in this position in 5 years time?

Cut your losses and walk out. If you are studyng now you will be able to afford your own horse in no time and not be beholden to anyone.

In the meantime look for a share  - if you were near me you coudl share my lad.

They sound like horrible bullies  - well mum does and her son sounds like a right little chicken sh** mummys boy


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## ghost&secret (14 November 2011)

Once was lost said:



			Take the horses out of the equation and you have an abusing relationship, he is controlling you and emotionally blackmailing you.
From what you say I can't see anything changing for the better but I do see it getting a whole lot worse.
Not the same but when I was younger I was controlled by somebody, she was the owner of the horses I cared for, rode, broke in, brought on, I did all the work every day for all 5 horses while she paid for them, most of the time but it was getting so I was having to pay more and more. She was using me I was young and emotionally fragile (My Dad had been ill and then died) and my bond with the horses is what kept me going, I knew that the situation was bad and I knew she was taking advantage but I felt that I just couldn't turn my back on the horses, I was very depressed and even started self harming, I couldn't see a way out as I was not willing to leave 'my' pony. An accident saved me in the end, didn't feel like that at the time mind, I suffered a very bed injury in a fall from 'my' pony, she didn't visit me once through my week in hospital having surgery, the only time I saw her again was when she came and dropping some of my things from the tack room (that she only gave me back due to the YO putting pressure on her) once I couldn't give her what she wanted she dropped me like a hot brick. It hurt like hell but my depression lifted once I was out of the situation, I was able to move on. I still miss those horses every single day and I am so sad I never got to say goodbye but I know now, 15 years down the line it was the saving and making of me.
You need to think about what you get out of this relationship, think about if you are staying because of your horse or because you love your partner and you want a future with him.
If you are staying for your horse then you have to either find away to keep him and leave (grass livery, loan), if you paid for him and you can prove that you paid for him then that shouldn't be a problem (ownership wise not costs of keep) but if you didn't pay for him, have no proof of purchase in your name then you have a problem and maybe, just maybe you are going to have to sacrifice the horse for your own future well being and happiness. I know it is the unthinkable, I know that you just can't imagine doing that and I know you feel that your heart would just break and there would be no future or happiness without your horse but I have to say, having been there that there is, I am not in a situation so far removed from where I was then and so much happier for it. You can do it, short term hell but tell me, can you look into the future and tell me how you will survive another 20-30 years like this?
		
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Read this .... then read it again.... very wise words. I wish some body had said this to me seven years ago. I was in a similar situation to you. Abuse is not only violence, it's emotional blackmail and humiliation that makes you keep putting up with a situation without changing it or feeling like you can't change it, it's all your fault , you feel duty bound to provide and carry on regardless, you are hopeless, useless, a liar, and find yourself 'set up' for a fall, until you get a the first point where you are now. Next you will make yourself ill, and all for what? 

Change it or walk away... heartbreaking yes but only YOU can change it all. 
As some one said to me Talk or Walk. 

It will feel worse as you are feeling crap with the flu as well but really think what YOU are getting out this relationship and the boundaries that are set. Can or would your partner change things for you, back you up against his mother and support you. 

Harsh words maybe, but something you need to think about. Your studies are so important don't wish things were different - be strong and positive and do something about it. 

Good luck and we are all here for you  xxx

have edited to add this .... read this it helped me understand things http://helpguide.org/mental/domestic_violence_abuse_types_signs_causes_effects.htm


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## ChesnutsRoasting (14 November 2011)

grumpyoldmare said:



			To be quite frank, this sounds like a sort of upstairs downstairs set up, and you sound VERY much the downstairs part of things.

You haven't been in a relationship with this cretin for 5 years - you have been in 'service' (in more ways than one) to his family.

Doesn't sound like you own your horse at all - just a little crumb or two that the cretin has thrown to you from his overflowing platter to keep you in loyal and unending servitude.

Walk away, quickly and purposefully. Don't look back, weep a little for what you thought you had (but in truth had nothing) and then move on with your life. In no time at all you can really own your own horse, keep it where ever you choose, but hopefully in the company of like minded young people of your own age.

Let Miss Haversham and her sprog rot away in their own pile of horse poo as 
you ride off happily into the sunset.
		
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This x a 1000. Walk away, whilst you're still young and have the energy. Once you qualify, a whole new world will open up for you and you will wonder what the hell you were doing staying in such a one-sided relationship for so long.


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## Cedars (14 November 2011)

Thank you all so much for being so supportive, I was expecting people to say 'pull yourself together look at everything they give you'! 

Told the boyf we need to have 'the talk' tonight about what is happening, because its clear to me today that I can't continue as I am, so...

Thanks everyone xx


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## Cedars (14 November 2011)

ridefast said:



			If he's serious, take him up on it and leave. Is there a ring on your finger? I would have though after 5 years things would be in a good state, you shouldn't be his slave. You may have to take the risk of leaving your horse, but do you really want to stay in this situation?
		
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Nope - he won't propose - 'we're too young'. xx


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## Cedars (14 November 2011)

darkhorse123 said:



			After reading the rest of your replies - yes.

I do not mean to be harsh but after 5 years things are unlikeley to improve and they are treatign you like a slave - they know you are "beholden" to them.

Have you spoke to your parents about this?

Do you really want ot be in this position in 5 years time?

Cut your losses and walk out. If you are studyng now you will be able to afford your own horse in no time and not be beholden to anyone.

In the meantime look for a share  - if you were near me you coudl share my lad.

They sound like horrible bullies  - well mum does and her son sounds like a right little chicken sh** mummys boy 

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-My parents don't care, have no relationship with them really. Moved in with OH and his mother when stuff deteriorated beyond any reasonable point (yes, another thing I 'owe' them for). Before anyone says I'm sure your parents would take you back, firstly they're in London (and my degree is in Bristol) and secondly they were extremely abusive so its not just teenage falling out. 

-I've not even sat on a horse (apart from my youngster) in over a year - I'm nowhere near good enough atm to share anyones horse. 

-If Puzzle was in my name, then I could afford her. We would make something work. But she's not, so I have no hope of moving with her.


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## tallyho! (14 November 2011)

Goodness me cedars, how are you even managing not to kill this mother from hell!!!

Totally agree with the others, you are being thoroughly abused. I think leaving this 5 years is well worth it because it will kill you.

If you can't do what a member said and work out time = cost thing and make it fair, I think this is one situation you need to get out from. It's horrible! I'm not even you and it's making me cry! I know you love your horse, but you could have a chance to rebuild things, be totally independent, get another horse which is 100% yours kept how you like and spend as much time as you want.

You feel trapped, and it is difficult to get out but you must!

(((hugs)))) kleenex, cup of tea & chocolates xxxx


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## Cedars (14 November 2011)

Think I'm deciding that, in my head, there are two issues. 

The MIL issue - I am happy to have her horse during the week when she is not here, because thats my 'payment' for livery. It would be nice to be allowed to ride the mare. However, on the weekends, or the days that she is here, I am NOT responsible for that horse. I don't bring it in, I don't feed it, I don't muck it out, I don't poo pick it. She is there, if she does not want to do it, she needs to pay someone other than me to do it. 

The OH issue - we need to work out who owes what financially, and agree my time 'in hours' against what I should be paying. Because this isn't working for me. I love him, god I love him SO much, and when we're happy we're amazing, but this isn't working for me with all of the rest of my life so in turmoil too. So something has to change.

I also want to speak to WHW and have Puzzle in my name. Then that means there is none of this 'we'll get rid of your horse' business, she'll be mine fair and square. 

Does this sound reasonable? I don't want to be unreasonable, and I AM grateful for what they give me, but I cannot carry on like this. 

xxx


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## imaginegenerous (14 November 2011)

If Puzzle is loaned, is there any possibility you could approach the owners about taking over the loan if your OH were to send her back? Might mean she'd have to go back for a bit but might be worth considering if you can find a place for yourself and her. I know easier said than done but OH sounds awful, get out if you can. Good luck.


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## ridefast (14 November 2011)

Ah so your horse is from WHW? Well atleast you know where she's going, I have a plan! Find somewhere to live and for your horse to live, move out, OH will send  horse back and you can apply to have her on loan for yourself  Ta- dah! If you didn't mind the commute I'd offer you to keep your horse on my field, I'm about an hour 1/2 - 2 from Bristol depending on traffic


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## Merry Crisis (14 November 2011)

Sounds to me that they need you more than you need them! Anyway he would have to pay the bills whether you are with him or not. As for the mother, well she sounds perfectly gahstly. I would talk to him tonight and tell him that if they dont treat you better you are going to walk. I bet he will not let you go. Be strong because he doesnt sound like he is, he is holding you to ransom because of the horse. God I have gone off men!


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## DragonSlayer (14 November 2011)

Cedars said:



			With what horse, and with what money? My horse is in my boyfriends name, and I'm a full time student! And should I just walk out on my 5year relationship?
		
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I gave my horses up (loan homes ) whilst I was at uni.

Just a thought....


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## onlytheponely (14 November 2011)

What a positively horrid situation you're in. 

I echo what everyone else has already said about getting out but also remind yourself that if you allow them to make you ill/exhausted/depressed there is a very real chance that you may not even manage to complete your university course. Please talk to someone at your university to see if they can sort you out some emergency accomodation if you need somewhere to go at short notice. 

I'm so sorry that you don't have supportive parents, especially at a time like this but from what you've said already, you need to learn how to not 'let' people take advantage/abuse your kind nature. I'm putting this as politely as I can but I think you and others will know exactly what I mean.

Take care and start sorting out the next 6 months of your life, only you can do this.


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## bumblelion (14 November 2011)

So sorry about your situation. No wonder you feel so down! If you left your partner, would he send puzzle back to whw? If so couldn't you find grass livery somewhere and rehome him? If he wouldn't send him back, could you not explain to whw the situation, you paying for his care and that you're the one who looks after him? They may be able to change ownership over? Even though you're not married you may still have rights as you live with him? Im sure the legal geniuses on here will know exactly your rights but if I was in your situation I'd be seriously looking into all of my options to get out and to get the horse in my name! Even if it means being devious and doing it all behind my partners back (if I thought I needed to!) so I can just say "bye" one day and going with horse!! 
Hope this makes sense! On my phone and can't read back what iv written!!!


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## YasandCrystal (14 November 2011)

Cedars said:



			Think I'm deciding that, in my head, there are two issues. 

The MIL issue - I am happy to have her horse during the week when she is not here, because thats my 'payment' for livery. It would be nice to be allowed to ride the mare. However, on the weekends, or the days that she is here, I am NOT responsible for that horse. I don't bring it in, I don't feed it, I don't muck it out, I don't poo pick it. She is there, if she does not want to do it, she needs to pay someone other than me to do it. 

The OH issue - we need to work out who owes what financially, and agree my time 'in hours' against what I should be paying. Because this isn't working for me. I love him, god I love him SO much, and when we're happy we're amazing, but this isn't working for me with all of the rest of my life so in turmoil too. So something has to change.

I also want to speak to WHW and have Puzzle in my name. Then that means there is none of this 'we'll get rid of your horse' business, she'll be mine fair and square. 

Does this sound reasonable? I don't want to be unreasonable, and I AM grateful for what they give me, but I cannot carry on like this. 

xxx
		
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That sounds very reasonable Cedars. Definately a way forward. Don't let him hold you emotionally like he is - it's so bad for your psyche. You are young and should be having a ball at uni, meeting new friends and having evenings out.  The longer you tolerate and allow his and the MIL behaviour the worse it will get and you will lose sight of what is normal. This isn't normal it's really really mean against you. Good luck


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## Ibblebibble (14 November 2011)

grumpyoldmare said:



			To be quite frank, this sounds like a sort of upstairs downstairs set up, and you sound VERY much the downstairs part of things.

You haven't been in a relationship with this cretin for 5 years - you have been in 'service' (in more ways than one) to his family.

Doesn't sound like you own your horse at all - just a little crumb or two that the cretin has thrown to you from his overflowing platter to keep you in loyal and unending servitude.

Walk away, quickly and purposefully. Don't look back, weep a little for what you thought you had (but in truth had nothing) and then move on with your life. In no time at all you can really own your own horse, keep it where ever you choose, but hopefully in the company of like minded young people of your own age.

Let Miss Haversham and her sprog rot away in their own pile of horse poo as you ride off happily into the sunset.
		
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this 100% Cedars! 
 I know from your later reply that you love him but ask yourself does he love you or does he just like having the control over you?
I was in a controlling relationship in my late teens, early 20's, these men are very good at turning on the charm when needed to make you think that it can be wonderful if you just 'behave' or be 'more reasonable' Nothing is ever their fault ,always yours and it's always you causing the problems, you're the unreasonable one never them and just to top it off they'll start with the 'how much they do for you' spiel just to really make you feel worthless  
Yes it will be painful to leave and things may be touch financially for a while but your sanity is at stake here and don't underestimate that fact, get out while you still have the strength to do so, I'm only 45 mins away from Bristol, I'll come and help you pack!!!!xx


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## Miszeemare (14 November 2011)

Is there a counsellor you can talk to at Uni.  It strikes me that you have gone from an abusive relationship with your parents to an abusive and relationship with this man and his mother.  I think you need to examine your reasons for this (eg not having a proper relationship role model and repeating patterns of childhood).  This could be a turning point for you, helping you with your self esteem and ensuring you do not repeat these patterns.

Good luck (and if you want my honest opinion, I would leave - you teach people how to treat you and you need to show them how to treat you)


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## Cedars (14 November 2011)

Hi, I do have a counsellor at uni, I'm currently in weekly counselling for the abuse I suffered as a child. She i aware of the situation with my OH but (and I know this is so 'battered wife') but apart from this, we ARE pretty perfect. But as you all know, horses are just such a time waster and part of your whole life. xx


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## Cluck (14 November 2011)

Cedars said:



			Hi, I do have a counsellor at uni, I'm currently in weekly counselling for the abuse I suffered as a child. She i aware of the situation with my OH but (and I know this is so 'battered wife') but apart from this, we ARE pretty perfect. But as you all know, horses are just such a time waster and part of your whole life. xx
		
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I am sorry for your situation, it sounds terrible. It also sounds like a repeating pattern and that you are in another abusive situation. It would be safer for you to get out of it altogether.

What does your counsellor say about your present situation?

Look after yourself first and then the horses


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## Cedars (14 November 2011)

Tbh think she's more worried about the rest of my life falling apart, as atm its like juggling whilst dodging bullets - trying to keep uni and the horses and potential police investigation etc in the air, let alone my own mental health, is a fun game! Not really explained to her how much I feel taken advantage of, although she does know that I really struggle with the relationship with my MIL. 

Feel remarkably calm now I have a plan actually, something has just snapped tonight, I've had enough. xxx


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## stencilface (14 November 2011)

I can only see one way round this, and that is to get out.  I would be on the phone to WHW first, as I feel thats the thing that is upsetting you the most. See if you can arrange something with them, maybe puzzle could go back for a while until you are able to take her (him?! - fear I have not been paying attention) back?

Regardless of what you 'get' out of the relationship, your OH should not treat you like this, try a few years down the line, and exchange the horses for kids, he will not change.  Many women do not work whilst at home looking after their kids - and I doubt if many OHs have the same reaction as yours. And better getting out after 5 years than 10 

Any friends you can stay at whilst you sort yourself out?


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## angelish (14 November 2011)

poor you what a horrible situation to be in 

tbh this is what "I" would do in that situation 

try to speak to OH about it ,i mean really sit down and pore out how your feeling ,maybe chuck a huge sicky (in bed groaning/sweating etc  ) so they get the feel of just how much work you are doing 

and i would give it about 2 weeks and if nothing looks like changing i'd stick two fingers up and walk ,i'm sorry but i would not let anyone bully/blackmail me into doing what you are doing 

i'm sorry to be blunt as you already have such a lot to deal with but relationships are meant to be a team and you shouldn't be made to feel like a skivy because you are on a lower/non existence wage ,they are taking the pi** out of you big style and it's not on !

belive me iv'e been there and i know the thought of leaving is scary as hell but you need to do something about this and if your OH doesn't care enough to try and sort it out with you i think you should think about leaving 


of course this is going on what you have wrote here and i might have gotten the wrong end of stick and if i have i am sorry 

good luck


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## tallyho! (14 November 2011)

Cedars said:



			Tbh think she's more worried about the rest of my life falling apart, as atm its like juggling whilst dodging bullets - trying to keep uni and the horses and potential police investigation etc in the air, let alone my own mental health, is a fun game! Not really explained to her how much I feel taken advantage of, although she does know that I really struggle with the relationship with my MIL. 

Feel remarkably calm now I have a plan actually, something has just snapped tonight, I've had enough. xxx
		
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Good, that is called self preservation and glad to see your is intact  be strong girl. You deserve ( and WILL get!) sooooo much more than what life seems to have dealt you xx


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## Sugarplum Furry (14 November 2011)

Good girl Cedars (without being patronising...grin!) sounds as though you're getting there. If you walk have you got somewhere to go? It's always good to have to have a place lined up, however temporary. I've no idea where you are but we've got a couple of spare rooms in our house, in Bath, if thats any good. Very chummy household and you'd be most welcome. And...no poo picking involved!


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## Slinkyunicorn (14 November 2011)

I don't normally comment on threads like this but I really think you need to take a step back and look at your 'relationship' with your OH and look at it as if a friend was telling you this - i suspect your advise would be to leave I don't think you are in love with him i think you are grateful to him and dependant on him which is not the same thing. You are stronger then you think and will survive on your own - yes it maybe tough but it is for a lot of people but better on your own than in a relationship which is in so many ways abusive and chipping away at your self esteem and making you dependant. 

People only treat you the way you ALLOW then to treat you - is the behaviour of your OH and his mother in anyway appropriate or necessary? of course not and if your OH loved you and had any respect for you he wouldn't treat you like an unpaid groom with threats of losing your house etc and let his mother treat like that either. They are both taking advantage of you.

If necessary print this out and take it to your counsellor and a copy for yourself to keep reading it to remind yourself of the excuses you make for your OH and his mother treating you like unpaid staff

If you were one of my friends I would be helping you pack your bags and move - you will only get beaten down the longer you stay - as other have said history is repeating itself for you - you are trapped in an  abusive relationship of a different sort and it is doing you no good at all.

Sorry if it snot what you want to hear but better to face it now than in 10 or 20 years time when it is so much harder and you have no self esteem/confisence left.


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## StickyToffee (14 November 2011)

I think you need to get away from these people, they sound horrible, as someone else said earlier, they need you more than you need them.  I am sure you feel you are in love and that your boyfriend is lovely when he's not abusing you (controlling you through threats) but that is not love, it's cruel and degrading, I've been there myself and the only way to heal the past is to take control of your future and not allow people to control your life, it's yours after all. I so feel for you and hope that you will be okay xxx


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## Spring Feather (14 November 2011)

Unfortunately for you Cedars, your BF knows fine well that you won't leave him so he continually gets to treat you however he pleases.  His parents probably also know you won't leave and it sounds like they've jumped on the bandwagon too.  As far as I can see your 5 year relationship appears to have no future but you think there is so you remain there.  Personally if I were you I'd be moving out and standing on my own two feet, making the very best of life and what it has to offer and most importantly not be beholden to anyone.


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## Cinnamontoast (14 November 2011)

The guy sounds like a fool and his mother clearly thinks you're the 'help'. 

I see you are in a horrible position re the horse, worse, I take it you live with idiot boy? He needs to understand that you are a full time student (do you work to finance yourself?) and you need to study (well, duh!) 

You need space and time to sort yourself out. Is there anywhere you could go temporarily? I'm appalled that he has threatened you with lose everything if you don't basically slave for him and his mother. Are they royalty? If so, fine, they can treat you like a peasant (although we arein the 21st century ). 

I'm afraid my advice is to gather up your dignity and stroll off into the sunset if you can bear to leave the horse (and puppy?). Ultimately, this relationship sounds deeply unequal and like it has zero future. He's not going t propose if he treats you this way, quite honestly and he clearly does not hold you in any esteem.


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## *hic* (14 November 2011)

Maybe it's because I've been through a similar relationship when I was your age and have now been happily married for long enough for you to be my daughter but I don't quite see it as clear cut in some ways as the others.

Your OH and his monther were your safety net when you left your parents. they took you and sorted you out and got you in a position where you were able to "have" puzzle. Now, whilst you are a student you are in deep financial doo doo. At the moment you don't have a job, you have Uni and you have to do nearly all the work on the yard. In return for that you really only have to pay for your food IIRC - certainly you have a vastly reduced share of the bills. 

So, you could decide that you won't do the yard work, you will get a job and you will pay your full share of the bills including appropriate livery bills. OH and his mother will need to pay a groom, it would of course be their choice as to whether the livery would then have no element of DIY and recover a quarter of the grooms costs as part of your livery bill.

Or you can decide that you just want out of an abusive controlling relationship and leave and attempt to keep control of Puzzle although I'd suspect that if you didn't have the experience before it's unlikely they'd consider you did have now, coupled with not having anywhere to keep her it might all get a bit difficult.

Or you could decide that you are over-reacting a little, these people have put you up (and put up with you) whilst you were in dire straits at a very young age and that although you feel hard done by it's a hiccup. You could further decide that if you want a long term relationship, in order for it to last there needs to be a bit of give and take. OH is trying, presumably, to better himself or climb the career ladder and as such is away from home for 12 hours a day. You stand to benefit significantly from such an improvement and thus it is up to you to help support him through this - which means that if you have the time available you are the one to do the yard duties. It's all very well to try to divide things up equally but life isn't like that. It's akin to a mother with a young child saying "Right I've had him all day, now you're back from work you can have him for the rest of the day while I go out partying" Sounds fair in theory but is hardly practical. If you divide things equally what happens if one of you is away or hospitalised? Is the other one going to say "I'm only doing my bit?" Whatever happened to give and take? Bad things do happen. As a couple you have to get over them. I assume this long commute won't continue for ever for him.

As for his mother, over the five years you've obviously both slid into this relationship and that makes it hard to change but again I'd say as a couple you have three horses free of charge on a yard with (from your photos) reasonable facilities. You (between you, currently falling mainly on your shoulders) have to do three horses, surely doing another makes little difference? I'd suggest you just get on and do it - basically you have four horses to look after all the time, at least when she rides she tacks the damned thing up for herself. It seems a small price to pay, to me, for having a nice yard which 6 days out of 7 is yours with no-one to interfere, no blasted livery yard politics, etc. If you are going to have a long term relationship then you need to accept his mother is there, and learn how to negate anything she says without alienating either your OH or her.

There's no doubt you are feeling very overworked and hard done by and we all know how hard this time of year is. I think you are taking a jaundiced view and I honestly think that a good night's sleep will put a better complexion on things - but of course you do have the option to leave, get digs, get a job and do precisely what you want, when you want - within, of course, the bounds of Uni work, job work and finance.

Take a step back, count your blessings and don't do anything hasty. I hope it all seems clearer in the morning.


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## Cedars (14 November 2011)

Thanks again everyone - particularly Jemima-Too who is also right with regards to the things that tie me down.

The yard is absolutely fantastic, really amazing, no complaints. But I literally am not allowed/don't get a chance to use them (I'm not allowed to loose school MY horse in the school, but they loose school theirs...I'm not allowed to ride their horses at all in the school, but of course they do). 

You are right that, when things were really pants, I relied wholly on her goodwill to have somewhere to live etc. But our relationship has soured since then (which is probably my fault). I think its been my fault because I have just let stuff get piled on to me without ever saying NO. Things like, I organise her plumbing, cleaners, electricians, etc because she asks me to - but I should say NO. 

We just need to rebalance the situation, and if we can't, then I've got to go I think. But I certainly won't be walking out overnight, we've been together too long for that. xxx


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## Paddy Irish (14 November 2011)

It's definitely time for action cedars - you've done the talking with the OH and it's got you nowhere so now you need to take stock of the situation and , although it's so so sad , it's time to realise that these people are bullies and I really think that they are treating you badly because they know the'll get away with it , they already know that your parents have done so , so they are probably confident that you wont challenge their manipulating spiteful behaviour - this isn't the begining of the end , it's the end of the begining and you're so young , you need to shed these parasites whilst you still have the energy - be the master of your own destiny , carve out the future that YOU deserve..and never ever think that you haven't got friends cos we are all here right behind you..I'm all the way down here in Cornwall but you'd be more than welcome to come down and have a break , if only to give them a rocket up the backside and show them that you're not going to put up with this treatment anymore!!!


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## Spot_the_Risk (14 November 2011)

Some great advice on here, I hope it's helped you to see things clearly.

Couple of points - could you get emergency accomodation through or at Uni?  Can you get a part time job to work around your course, there should be some good Christmas jobs coming up soon. Having a good should get you meeting people too, so making friends.  If you do leave, I would email the WHW with some purely factual information - that you were the full time groom and carer to their horse, and if she came back into their care, you would like to be considered to loan her.


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## angel7 (14 November 2011)

Cedars my heart breaks for you reading this....
Its so easy for us to sit here and say you should leave this BF and MIL, but I can see how hard this will be if the rest of your relationship is fine (in your eyes). 
You are alone and vulnerable and under a great deal of emotional anguish, the idea of leaving at this point may simply be too hard to take on along with everything else!!

Contact the WHW and explain the situation, peoples circumstances change all the time and they are used to things like this occurring with their horses. You are only asking for the horse to be in your name as you are paying and looking after him (including insurance?)
IF BF makes a song and dance about you doing this (taking control of your life) then its a clear indicator things are not as perfect as you believe.
You sound like you are perfectly capable of looking after the horses (you have been doing it for goodness sake) so don't let them make you believe you are not "good enough" to do this on your own.
Many WHW horses are given to "relatively" inexperienced homes but the owners are caring and capable, knowing when to seek advice, vet, farrier, ect. thats the beauty of WHW.

And as for poo picking?! Unless horses are on a tiny acreage they won't keel over if you cut back on this. PS I don't know ANYONE who actually does poo pick, on livery yards or at home on 2 acres, and I know over 70 good horse owners!!! Most folk simply worm properly and rest their fields, rotate with other animals and / or harrow regularly. Not politically correct I know but the truth here in Scotland at least...
Life is too hard to be giving yourself so much of a hard time.


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## Sarah Sum1 (14 November 2011)

I feel that you are still suffering from what you have experienced in life (I know this as you keep referring to it in posts, some that have no connection to it) Speaking from experience, you will not be the same person you are now once you have finally rid yourself of the demons that you carry on your shoulders. You will be stronger, wiser and will know in your mind what you will and will not accept from people. My guess is that you depend on your OH, for the stability he has given you through some tough times, but maybe now he is holding you back from fully moving on from everything.

I have no doubt that you love your OH, whether they are for the right reasons anymore I cannot say. I know I had to make some very tough choices that I knew would cause me huge upset in the short term, to change my life in the long term. I had to move away from everything I knew, start again. But I knew this would be the making of me, and it was.

I guess what I am saying is, you still have a long way to go, but there is no point walking down the same path everyday if it leads you nowhere, you need to make your own path, you need to look at the bigger picture and decide what you want from life, what you deserve. If you sit and look inside and listen to yourself, you will find the answers, it will never be easy, never be straight forward, but nothing that is worth having ever is.


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## Spring Feather (14 November 2011)

Cedars said:



			The yard is absolutely fantastic, really amazing, no complaints. But I literally am not allowed/don't get a chance to use them (I'm not allowed to loose school MY horse in the school, but they loose school theirs...I'm not allowed to ride their horses at all in the school, but of course they do).
		
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Why not?


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## horsesatemymoney (14 November 2011)

I really feel for you- are you doing the 4 years degree or the PGCE, I did the latter and it was so so so stressful without the added pressures that you are facing! I think your OH is so dependent on you that he is blackmailing you to think you are the 'vulnerable' one- i.e if he works 2 hours away, MIL does nothing, if you left who would do his horses?! I try and stick with it, at least until you qualify because it sounds like at the moment leaving and trying to find accommodation/a pt job/losing your house/uni is too much- see how it goes, if it gets worse then look at going but remind yourself that they need you more than you need them. They might have you at their beck and call now (out of order) but once you qualify and your OH cuts his apron strings with his mummy, he'll realise  does your OH actually realise how he is making you feel and what his mother is doing? Hope you are ok


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## Cedars (14 November 2011)

Because I'm not...thats the rules...

Cos Puzzle has big feet, is the usual reasoning given. xx


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## Cedars (14 November 2011)

horsesatemymoney said:



			I really feel for you- are you doing the 4 years degree or the PGCE, I did the latter and it was so so so stressful without the added pressures that you are facing! I think your OH is so dependent on you that he is blackmailing you to think you are the 'vulnerable' one- i.e if he works 2 hours away, MIL does nothing, if you left who would do his horses?! I try and stick with it, at least until you qualify because it sounds like at the moment leaving and trying to find accommodation/a pt job/losing your house/uni is too much- see how it goes, if it gets worse then look at going but remind yourself that they need you more than you need them. They might have you at their beck and call now (out of order) but once you qualify and your OH cuts his apron strings with his mummy, he'll realise  does your OH actually realise how he is making you feel and what his mother is doing? Hope you are ok

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Im doing the 3yr undergrad degree at UWE. In year 2 now, so I will qualify in nearly 2 years time.

Need to speak to OH about it. xx


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## Spring Feather (14 November 2011)

Cedars said:



			Because I'm not...thats the rules...

Cos Puzzle has big feet, is the usual reasoning given. xx
		
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Puzzle has big feet and that's why you aren't allowed to use the school?   Are you allowed to ride Puzzle and their horses out of the school?


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## monikirk (14 November 2011)

If you are doing teacher training you must be absolutely snowed under with school stuff. This training is your ticket to independence - make good use of it. Don't become a victim. 
Either fill your time with your studies and take on a 'what ever' attitude to their demands, just doing the minimum or move out and share with other uni students. 
Get in touch with WHW explain the situation - they would probably prefer as many horses to be out on loan and may be accommodating once you have found a livery for her. Many of my friends doing pgce have bar work or a shift in tesco. 
Stay strong and make a plan.


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## snoopyinfrance (14 November 2011)

jemima_too have you been reading the same posts as the rest of us????  I really don't think you have unless you're playing devils advocate or trying a bit of reverse phsycology.  (In which case I take my hat off to you!)

Cedars: Read all of this over again and tell yourself the truth.  Be honest.  Then get the hell out of Dodge! 

None of us know you but we are all of the same opinion and that has to count for something.  People have been very candid and given a lot of very good advice if you care to take it.  

PLEASE tell your councellor everything that's going on.  She cannot help you unless she knows every detail.  

Sorry that this is so bitty but it's all going around in my head and I'm getting rather angry with the BF and MIL.  I'd like them both to read this post and then insert it where the sun don't shine (did I think that out loud? Sorry, I'm not normally that rude). 

Keep us up to date please with what you decide.  If you fancy a holiday then I can suggest Vienne, France.  There's a slightly odd but very friendly family there who'd let you ride their horses and there'd only be a small amount of poo picking to do (joke).


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## Spot_the_Risk (14 November 2011)

Just re-read your first post, if your OH is away all day and MIL only around three days a week, if you're not in FT study, you can use the school when they aren't there and they'll never know - yep, behind their back!


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## Cedars (14 November 2011)

I am snowed under with my degree- just back off of two weeks of placement which is partially why stuff is so bad because ive not been there, so ive not been doing stuff during the week. 

Puzzle not allowed in school loose schooling because shes 'heavy on her big feet so leaves holes'. But she really doesnt...and its fine if you grade it, but I'm not allowed to grade the school cos I'm not allowed to use the quadbike...

I did ride her in the school this weekend, first time I sat on her ever (see my other post), but it was a battle even to let that happen (and in the end, I just did it, didn't ask, which is why I've made MIL cross this week...). xx


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## Cedars (14 November 2011)

Cant use the school behind their backs because I'm not allowed to grade the school and use the quad - and as careful as I am, you CAN tell when a horse has been in the school. xxx


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## Merry Crisis (14 November 2011)

Cedars said:



			Because I'm not...thats the rules...

Cos Puzzle has big feet, is the usual reasoning given. xx
		
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I simply can not believe that you can be this bullied, its disgraceful.


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## horsesatemymoney (14 November 2011)

But what would they do if you defied them?! Sack you?  Dump you?  Pretty unlikely because they wouldn't get anybody from outside their family to do what you do just for free livery and unlikely to dump you for reason above- need you more than you need them! (especially in the long term)  Ride away in the school, go for it!


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## canteron (14 November 2011)

Definitely talk to the WHW about the horse.  They are snowed under with horses at the moment and would prefer not to take any back.  Whilst they may not be able to help you financially keep your horse, they may know somewhere you could keep it at a rate you could cope with.

Anyway, chat to them and ask their advice - if it was me I would be getting as much information/plans together before talking to OH.  If OH know you have options, it may make him really consider what he wants and whether it includes you!!


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## Spring Feather (14 November 2011)

Why don't you should show your BF this thread?  I think that could be useful/helpful to both you and your BF.


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## HBrae2 (14 November 2011)

I think it's easier to say just leave than when you're in that position yourself. I think you had the best plan in speaking to your OH about how you feel. You say you love him so he must have some redeeming features (although TBH I'm not sure what they are reading your posts...) Maybe write him a letter and go out while he reads it, that saves it from turning into an argument and you being unable to get your point across. He may not realise just how much you're hurting and how lonely you feel. If he doesn't respond with compassion though then he isn't worth it! It would break my heart if my OH told me he felt as unhappy as you do!!!
If you do leave then you will be fine, when I was at Uni (did Law so pretty full on too) I worked a couple of evenings a week at the local riding school in return for my horse's DIY livery. I actually really enjoyed it (and I never had to poo pick, just turning out ponies, tacking up, helping clients get on etc!) - maybe you could look at this sort of thing? Good luck and big hugs to you. You're not on your own, everyone reading your post cares for you and wants you to be happy xxx


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## dressagelove (14 November 2011)

I have just read this entire thread, and feel awful for you Ceders. That they wont let you use the school is ridiculous, absolute tosh, and I feel it is this, out of everything, which has given away the kind of people they are. They are bullies, and idiots. And you deserve so much more, love and support. 

I DO understand how difficult it could be to walk away, but I think it is for the best. Do you have nowhere else to go? Go and stay with some friends for a while. Get out of their, and see if they miss you.

I SO feel for you, come and stay with me if you are close!  DONT let them get to you, anf fight your corner. They sound like bloody idiots. Big, nasty bullies!!!


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## jeeve (14 November 2011)

I am sorry Cedars - but I can tell you it will not get better the longer you stay with him. I have seen many men like that, and my OH is very demanding with what he expects from me. I have developed a tough hide, and do draw a line in the sand, from time to time. I would stay while it suits you, or if it does not then go.


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## ClassicG&T (14 November 2011)

Cedars said:



			I am snowed under with my degree- just back off of two weeks of placement which is partially why stuff is so bad because ive not been there, so ive not been doing stuff during the week. 

Puzzle not allowed in school loose schooling because shes 'heavy on her big feet so leaves holes'. But she really doesnt...and its fine if you grade it, but I'm not allowed to grade the school cos I'm not allowed to use the quadbike...

I did ride her in the school this weekend, first time I sat on her ever (see my other post), but it was a battle even to let that happen (and in the end, I just did it, didn't ask, which is why I've made MIL cross this week...). xx
		
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With all these "rules" it sounds like they are treating you like a child. This is NOT okay what so ever. You and OH should treat eachother as equals, not one telling the other rules and regulations. 

I do feel for you, but you need to get out of that relationship asap. In 10 years would you rather be the pilot of your own life or having someone else control it for you? 

Keep us updated on how you do with the talk with OH


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## JFTDWS (14 November 2011)

Cedars, I'm sorry, I haven't read all of the thread - I've skimmed but it really is quite distressing.  Heaven knows I shouldn't be advising people about relationships, but...

I am astounded by the attitude of your oh - he sounds like he thinks he's doing you a favour by being in a relationship with you.  He isn't.  I don't think it's so unreasonable for someone to work to support the person they claim to love (I presume after 5 years) while they get a degree to help them in future work.  He shouldn't be blackmailing you in that way with you horse - that's disgusting.  He shouldn't be listening to his mother about things and not trusting you enough to ask what happened.  He just doesn't sounds like he views you as an equal partner.  

Surely it must be possible to change the name of the horse through WHW - or talk to them about it and ask to get her yourself when he sends her back.  Then let him send her back, you take her on, move away, get a job to pay for the pony and have her to yourself, without the aggro from him and his bloody mother.

This just sounds like a decent person being abused by manipulators


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## MiCsarah (14 November 2011)

My bf moved in with me 2.5yrs ago. He moved in as I was struggling to pay for everything and was going to have to move in with my parents. Which would of mean leaving england for rainy ol' Ireland. I couldnt afford food so was making myself very ill. A couple of months after moving in I had to quit my job due to being bullied by my boss(who at the time was my brothers girlfriends mother!). With my current job and trying to kick start my own business I am incredibly poor and I cant afford to pay anything towards the house. My boyfriend never complains and understands that if he wants us to go on a night out he has to pay or I just dont go. This is how a relationship should be, not having to basically work for your OH. 
Im only 22 so only young aswell. He sounds to me like your first love and never really having love back I dont think you kind of understand how a loving relationship should be.(sorry if I'm being completely out of order but I think everyones views will help you make things clear). I feel you need to leave this controlling relationship and learn how to be yourself without being controlled by anyone else. Then when you learn this you can find a man to love you for who you are and actually want to look after you.


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## Spotsrock (14 November 2011)

If u can't talk it through and fix it then bite ur tongue, Qualify, take ur horse and leave. It sounds as though u are being treated like a child staff member. If it's ages till u qualify, Rent in a shared house is not too expensive and u can get cheap livery diy especially if u cover a weekend day for yard owner so they can have a day off! I'm sure he has some redeeming features but doesn't sound like there's enough. I qualified in law with 5 horses, a mortgage and no partner, though my dad did help as much as he could. Explore ur options.  Good luck. Xx


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## Dancing Queen (14 November 2011)

Hi, i havent read the complete thread.

I do feel sorry for you and the way OH has behaved towards you. TBH it sounds like you are getting stressed with your current workload and perhaps reading more into it.

You are lucky not to pay for livery and yes you may have to look after these horses but you are doing this because you cant pay your way ... yet.

OH owns your horse? If so can you buy the horse from him and move yards (can you afford to do this?) If the answer is yes then do it, if you cant and you dont want to lose your horse then just stick it out.

Other than that next time he kicks off dont stand there and take it - give it him back stand up to him.


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## annaellie (14 November 2011)

I've only skimmed the thread it's great that you are getting free livery I'd give my left arm for that BUT that does not make you a dogs body and to be treated like a piece of s@@t  
Am in Bristol and I have seen loads of shares around, or could you get anyone to help you. You sound like you need a break and a bloody good night out along with some respect from the people who are supposed to love you not use and abuse you


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## Flame_ (14 November 2011)

I answered this once and then my internet crashed. It seems that reply didn't make it so I'll try again.

Chin up Cedars. You can do it, you're just tired and flu-ey and having a November fed up day. You did it last year and you can do it this year. Keep telling yourself that you like being with the horses and you are doing the work for them, forget about the other people in the equation. 

At the same time, if you want to get yourself into a different situation, start making some long term plans that end up with you arriving at wherever you want to be, doing what it is that you want to be doing.


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## VixieTrix (14 November 2011)

I'm sorry i dont have advice just wanted to send hugs xx sounds like a rubbbish situation xxxx


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## caberston (14 November 2011)

GET THE ****** OUT!


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## OldNag (14 November 2011)

I don't think I can put it better than others already have.  It sounds as if you're in an abusive relationship.  For your own sake, I do think you should tell your Counsellor the whole story.  
I appreciate you've a whole lot of things to weigh up, and you've got to make a decision that's right for you.  But please do tell someone the whole picture of what's going on.  It's not a good way to be living and you obviously realise that.

I hope you manage to sort a way forward that works for you. Sending a big hug x


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## wyrdsister (14 November 2011)

*hugs* 

Only you can decide what to do here, but I'd seriously suggest talking to a therapist and making sure you stand up for yourself, whether that be a serious heart-to-heart with your partner or showing him the door. Having horses as a full-time student *sucks* - and I speak from ongoing experience! I couldn't possibly have afforded my guys without serious family support, but that said I have been able to pay for one all the way through off my own back. No, there's no money for anything else, ever, but it's worth it. It can be done if you plan very carefully and make some (okay, a lot of!) compromises.

My advice? Wait until you feel well again so that you're not making a decision on flu-brain and take a long hard look at what you want to do and what it will take to achieve it. 

Best of luck!


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## sugarpuff (14 November 2011)

Sounds like a really hard situation to be, and at the end of the day only you can make decisions about what you want to do.  There is some good advice on here, read it, but only you know the extent of the real situation.

You don't sound happy and it sounds like you've not been happy for a while.  How would your relationships change if there were no horses involved?  If you got a job 2 hours away?  If MIL got ill?  You got married?  Had kids? etc.

You should have confidence that OH would support you in all aspects of your life?  Does he?  

You say its a 5 year relationship that you don't want to give up on?  Better to give up on a 5 year relationship than a 50 year one.  If you end the relationship, don't see it as a waste of 5 years.  Look at what you have learnt from that relationship, look at the mistakes and move on.  Life is short and we are only here once.  If youre not happy, do something to change it.  

I've left a 4 year relationship whilst at uni, (someone who's family I had actually lived with for a year whilst my parents worked abroad for a year too) really hard decision, heart breaking at the time, but the best thing I ever did.  I don't see those 4 years as a waste of my life, just part of it.  Now been with OH for 11 years, 2 kids, horse, 2 dogs, skint and couldn't be happier.

Good luck whatever you do.


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## noodle_ (14 November 2011)

just read the entire thread and im gobsmacked.


I wouldnt stand for any of that... tbh right now, id be telling the OH exactly how i felt...lay your cards on the table, if he threatens to send the horse back...let him.

then he has no hold over you horse wise.

Once the horses are out of the equasion.... concentrate on your degree, and if he still supports you, its meant to be

but tbh you sound like hes using you as a skivvy.  free livery or not, id be gone.


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## Daytona (14 November 2011)

Leave this man, it sounds like he does not love you ( if he did he would bot threaten you that if you don't do the horses you can leave) both him and his mother are using you.  Go and find yourself a real man who will treat you like you deserve to be treated.  I know it will be hard to leave your horse but can you really risk your health and happiness for a animal , you know the horse will be cares for as the WHW owns it so you don't need to worry what will be become of him.  This is a relationship of convienance not love,  if he cared for you he would not allow you to work like a dog and ban you from riding his horses etc, that's cruel and unkind..! Please speak to your Uni they will help you find a place to stay and you can get a PT job etc.  You can then get your own horse at a later date and I'm sure if you put a advert out you would find someone to let you ride thier horse in return for a little help


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## tasel (14 November 2011)

You are doing a lot, but then again, you somehow chose to be with this guy and you chose to have a horse. Having a horse is a luxury I would never have been able to afford as a student... so in a way, you are having that luxury, and you're now paying for it, too.

I'd seriously ask you to consider whether you really love your OH. Whether you love him enough to withstand his pain in the a** mother. Or whether you are just staying with him due to your love for horses. Do you have anything else in common with him other than riding/horse stuff? Do you do other things together? When was the last time you two went out together?

In my mind, this all just sounds too much like a "marriage of convenience" - like the kind of stuff you read in historical novels. He and his mother get your service, and you're that little orphaned girl who had no choice really.

To be honest, if you decide your relationship is not a good one, the best thing to do is walk away asap. Any minute you spend with a man you actually don't want to be with is a wasted one.


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## blood_magik (14 November 2011)

oh hun.. *hugs*
only you can decide what to do.
feel free to pm if you want to talk x


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## Sherbie (14 November 2011)

You seem like your having such a hard time all round!   I agree with all those who have said get out! I understand that it is difficult and you love him.  It sounds as if his mother is using you as much as she can and your OH will always side with  her mo matter what. Take it from one who knows.  You are better than them (esp MIL!!!)   

It also sounds to me as if while they want you as a free, (yes free!) stable hand they dont want you actually doing anything you would consider fun atall. The reason they give about your youngsters schooling and feet ect is utter S%%t!  They are bringing you down, knowing you are having a hard time and if you dont sort this and get a rest you could end up very ill indeed.  Dont let your studdies for YOUR career suffer because of other people, no matter who they think they are.  OH does realise that you cannot make more money for household as you are running round doing all horses on you own all the time?!! 

If you dont decide to leave look in to a sharer ect, there are lots of young people and mothers who would love the experience and it may also give you some comapny too.
Good Luck xx


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## SeasonalSituation (14 November 2011)

I've sent you pm but if you do need to talk anymore send me another  ... I understand what you might be feeling.


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## palomino698 (14 November 2011)

Do you honestly think he really, really loves you too?  What a sick and twisted way of showing it.  They certainly have you dangling on a string.

Love isn't about threats, bullying, emotional manipulation.  Love isn't about making your partner feel crushed, pathetic, resentful and scared of what you will do.  Love isn't about constant put-downs, mockery, criticism and anger.  Love is about tolerance and fairness, kindness and good grace, caring and sharing, supporting and nurturing.  That's not what you have here, is it?

Do you honestly think he respects, admires, and values you?  Do you think his friends and family are certain how much he adores you?  Do you honestly feel you are in a relationship in which you have an equal emotional investment, a relationship in which you both continue to grow?  Do you honestly believe you really, really LIKE each other?

Because if this is how he (and his silly, arrogant mother) could treat someone he cherished, there's not much hope for anyone they didn't like, is there?  

Putting up with such appalling treatment is not a fair price to pay for material security.  

He has threatened you with losing 'your' horse.  One threat, and it's one threat too many.  Any man who threatens to take away something you love if you fail to comply with his demands, does not merit any place in your life.  How dare he, how DARE he be so nasty?

Don't EVER let anyone threaten you into submission.  Please, tell your counsellor what is going on, remind yourself you are worth a million times more than he is ever likely to make you feel... and get the hell out of his life.  

Talk to WHW and see what you might be able to arrange re Puzzle, but don't stay involved with this arrogant bully for the sake of a horse.   WHW will assure her of a decent home if it can't be with you, she won't be his responsibility.

You have a lifetime ahead of you, remember you're stronger and worth much, much more than he wants you to believe.

Enough is enough.


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## bumper (15 November 2011)

Absolutely that ^^^^


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## PooJay (15 November 2011)

Has anyone heard from Cedars yet?

Really troubled me reading this 


I hope Cedars get's through uni and takes the bad experiences of her life and turns them into strength as she gets older! 

Hope you had the talk with the boyf and i hope you have managed to sort this? 

xxx


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## peaceandquiet1 (15 November 2011)

Cedars said:



			I do talk to him - and all I get back is a load of 'well you don't pay for anything' 'i'm sending your horse back if you wont do mine' 'we wont be together if you wont do the horses' 'you're so ungrateful, my mother houses your horse for free'.

It upsets me as well because its like babysitting when his mother is on the yard. She has excuses for EVERYTHING, why she can't help. She's scared of my youngster (who literally is brain dead), she won't go in to their boxes (so wont muck out if their are horses in), she won't pick out her horses feet, she won't change rugs, she can't even bring her own fricking horse in to the field! Because she's 'scared'. 

Cant stop crying tonight.
		
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Get out now!!!! You do not want to spend the rest of your life with a selfish control freak!! Just wait til there are kids involved!!


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## Serephin (15 November 2011)

Your OH does not love you.  Hard but true, based on what you have written.  His mother does not like you.  

I have been in loveless relationships before - it is not until you experience true love that you can see the reality of this world, and that is that a lot of people have no clue what love is.  Do you feel loved?  The biggest thing you can do in your life is be honest with yourself and pull the veil of fear from your eyes.  You are only young, life is yours for the taking, it would be sad if you allowed yourself to remain in this situation with people who do not love you.  Love yourself, respect yourself and do what you have to do for YOURSELF, no one else will, it is all down to you, always has been, always will be.

I feel for you, I really do.  You sound like a good person, you don't deserve to be treated so badly.


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## juliag (15 November 2011)

I have not read every post on this thread but my heart has just gone out for you. If you were here I would be giving you such a hug! You are still only young and you have your whole life ahead of you. But dont make any rash decisions whilst you are feeling ill. It wont help, honestly. Give yourself a few days to feel better and get over the flu, turn your horse out and leave it for a couple of days, you are ill for crissake and your MIL lives on site. The horse will be fine.  Going to read the rest of the posts now, doing this in the wrong order.... sorry. But if you were my daughter I would want you back home for a few days until you feel better and can make better decisions, is this a possibility? xxx


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## juliag (15 November 2011)

Cedars said:



			Nope - he won't propose - 'we're too young'. xx
		
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Thank God for that, no excuses get out and run! 

Would love to know who these people are so I could give them a piece of my mind, they have made me so cross for you! 
will continue to read the other posts now, still not finished yet...... xx


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## Kat (15 November 2011)

Cedars, I haven't read to the end of the thread yet but I think you need to come up with a plan of action for what you would do if you decided to leave. Then when you know it isn't the end of the world if you leave/get thrown out you can evaluate things more dispassionately. 

The fact that your horse is loaned from WHW actually makes this easier. If your horse was owned by your OH then he could threaten to sell it behind your back or send it to the meatman or keep it and not allow you to see it. He can't do this because it is owned by WHW and so he must either keep it and look after it properly or return it. It has a safeguarded future even if you aren't around. Talk to the WHW anyway though, see if you can get him changed into your name or if they can note puzzles file that if he is ever returned you would like first refusal to loan him. 

Therefore the most important things are to think about getting an income and getting accomodation. I would try and get a job anyway, if you have your own money you will be far less beholden to your OH and it makes it easier for you to leave if you want to. You can use your money to start a secret emergency fund and also to contribute to the bills. 

Find out from the uni and from the council what options there would be for housing if you left your OH or were thrown out. You would almost certainly be housed somewhere and you would probably be entitled to some financial help too. 

Even if you decide to stay it will make it easier if you know that you have a choice. 

Don't let your OH walk all over you. Just because he is paying the bills it doesn't give him the right to walk all over you. Plenty of people are supported by their OH due to children, health, study, changing career etc but their OHs don't treat them this way. Remind your OH that your studying will benefit him in the long run as you will bring a decent income into the house making a better life for you both.


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## Amymay (15 November 2011)

It must be nice for your OH and his mother to have a lacky........

Stop doing everything - and just do what you can.

You work full time too - it's called University.

As for your OH kicking off because he'll have to muck out 4 horses - tell him to get a grip.  That's an hours work at the absolute most.  It's everything else that takes time.


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## Mithras (15 November 2011)

Apologies if I've got this wrong.  You get free accommodation, bills and livery for your horse in return for doing their three horses (not riding) and some housekeeping duties occasionally?  And you don't get on with the people who provide it because they are beginning to treat you like a skivvy?

tbh its not actually a bad deal in return for doing three horses.  But if you don't like any of it, why not move out, pay your own way and be in control of your own destiny?  So many students now have to run part-time jobs and give up their horses.  You should also not be missing whole days at uni because of horses having swollen legs.  I think you need to get your priorities in order, pay your own way and be in charge of your own destiny.  Theres not a lot of point in saying you can't afford it, because having a horse while a student is a luxury, and what you are doing just now is a way of providing for that luxury.

Moving out into your own place might actually help your relationship, maybe it would make your OH respect you more or miss you or something, who knows.  But right now, you are far too dependent on these people.


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## riding_high (15 November 2011)

sorry not read all the replies so hope i don't repeat anything that's already been said.

it's easy for us to all sit behind our computer screens and say leave, you are the one living this, not us. BUT if you stay you will lose everything you have, he will start telling you what to wear or question how many times you shower. as it is he's using the horse to keep you there, if he loved you then he would ease up on you and help you out or god forbid he would tell his mother to grow up.

you do have to leave, you say you can't socialise, you can't ride your horse but you have to do everything for him and his mother. he is controlling you, simple as that.

if a friend came up to you and said all that you've said what would you advise? it would be hard to walk away, i'm not going to lie and say it won't but once you've done that you will feel so much better and who knows maybe he will actually realise how good for him you were and come crawling back on his hands and knees begging for forgiveness, if he doesn't well think yourself very lucky. you have to start taking care of yourself and stop being a doormat, you are going to uni to better yourself so you can get a good job afterwards, maybe he's also scared of you doing better than him so it's better for you to be under control now before you get ahead of him.


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## SeasonalSituation (15 November 2011)

Right just an idea, if I'm being dumb do tell me! 

How about get a part time job? Just find one where you can do maybe 8 hours over two nights, this will give you three benefits: 1. You can contribute towards bills, even a little bit well look good towards your OH. 2. You'll have two nights off where they will have to sort there own horses out. But he can't complain as you will be contributing towards the household. 3. You'll be gaining a new social circle and will no longer feel so Linley and isolated.


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## Natch (15 November 2011)

Cedars said:



			I do talk to him - and all I get back is a load of 'well you don't pay for anything' 'i'm sending your horse back if you wont do mine' 'we wont be together if you wont do the horses' 'you're so ungrateful, my mother houses your horse for free'.
		
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Cedars said:



			Any time I would spend with friends gets a 'well you could have spent that time poo picking'.
		
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Cedars said:



			Think I'm deciding that, in my head, there are two issues. 

The MIL issue - I am happy to have her horse during the week when she is not here, because thats my 'payment' for livery. It would be nice to be allowed to ride the mare. However, on the weekends, or the days that she is here, I am NOT responsible for that horse. I don't bring it in, I don't feed it, I don't muck it out, I don't poo pick it. She is there, if she does not want to do it, she needs to pay someone other than me to do it. 

The OH issue - we need to work out who owes what financially, and agree my time 'in hours' against what I should be paying. Because this isn't working for me. I love him, god I love him SO much, and when we're happy we're amazing, but this isn't working for me with all of the rest of my life so in turmoil too. So something has to change.

I also want to speak to WHW and have Puzzle in my name. Then that means there is none of this 'we'll get rid of your horse' business, she'll be mine fair and square. 

I cannot carry on like this.
		
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Okay I've selectively quoted a few things so that I hope you'll read them back and hear yourself. You're not in a happy relationship by the sounds of it. Hard though it is (and I've been there and can sympathise totally with you on this one) you are being held to ransom for a horse. This just isn't acceptable. The ONLY solution is to be prepared to walk away from the horse. I'm sorry its come to this, because I know its heartbreaking, but if you hang on in there "because you owe them" and "because you will lose the horse..." they will take more and more liberties, because sadly that's what some humans are like.

If I were in your shoes, I would... a) consider how long you have left in uni, and work out student loans, crisis loans and grants from uni, that side of things. Compare how much you do spend on all your bills - including the horse at present. My guess is you could live in a house share, all bills inc, for equal to or less than what you are currently paying.
b) Ask WHW to speak to you in confidence about your situation with the horse, and ask what they would need to transfer the horse to you, should your BF follow through on his threats (yes, they are threats. It is intimidating and bullying behaviour). It may be that they would like horsey references for you, and you'll have to be prepared that it may be that they feel you won't be in a position to care for a horse with your uni commitments. But you don't know unless you try.
c) Take your own power back from your BF and his mother when the time is right for you. Issue HIM with the ultimatum.. that you will walk away from him, the horses, his mother, unless something is sorted out that will work for all 3 of you. And if he won't compromise, you'll find no happiness with him, move out, leave them behind, move on. It'll be hard, but my god you will be so much better off in the long run.


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## Cedars (15 November 2011)

Good afternoon everyone! Thanks again for all your replies, offers of places to stay etc. You will never truly know how much I appreciate them! 

We didnt talk much last night but I did explain that I had absolutely had enough, something has got to change. We briefly decided that, with the MiL situation...

During the week I do her mare. This is payment for my livery. 

On the weekend, I expect not to be responsible for her horse for 3 half days. As she should be doing at the very least Sat night, Sun morning and Sun night. 

So, either that means that she gets up at 7 with me and does her mare, PROPERLY. Or, she pays someone. If she pays someone, then they can do the three half days during the week so I get time for Uni work, socialising, etc. Because on the weekend I'm on the yard anyway so seems daft to have someone else there too on that day. 

She also needs to learn how to do her own horse. No more excuses-I expect her to be capable of bringing her own horse in from the field, changing it's rugs and picking its feet out as a very minimum. Im not expecting her to be able to tack the mare up because she IS difficult, but I am certainly not babysitting her any more. 

I think if I get some days off in the week I will then feel much better about doing my boyfriends horses-because he DOES provide for me and I don't think it's unreasonable that I help him out. However on his day off he needs to step up and do some jobs. 

I've also decided that I will be using the school, il learn to grade it properly so that i dont damage it, and that's final-I have a youngster, she needs time in the school, end of. 

I am also waiting for WHW to ring me back about putting puzzle in my name. 

I do have a part time job, I nanny, and I COULD afford puzzle if I absolutely needed to-so feel calmer about that. 

Thank you all for your help in making me see how unreasonable some of this is! Going to make a big effort to improve things otherwise enough is enough. I'm 21 and need to be happy with what I'm doing. 

Thanks again xxx


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## PooJay (15 November 2011)

Cedars said:



			Good afternoon everyone! Thanks again for all your replies, offers of places to stay etc. You will never truly know how much I appreciate them! 

We didnt talk much last night but I did explain that I had absolutely had enough, something has got to change. We briefly decided that, with the MiL situation...

During the week I do her mare. This is payment for my livery. 

On the weekend, I expect not to be responsible for her horse for 3 half days. As she should be doing at the very least Sat night, Sun morning and Sun night. 

So, either that means that she gets up at 7 with me and does her mare, PROPERLY. Or, she pays someone. If she pays someone, then they can do the three half days during the week so I get time for Uni work, socialising, etc. Because on the weekend I'm on the yard anyway so seems daft to have someone else there too on that day. 

She also needs to learn how to do her own horse. No more excuses-I expect her to be capable of bringing her own horse in from the field, changing it's rugs and picking its feet out as a very minimum. Im not expecting her to be able to tack the mare up because she IS difficult, but I am certainly not babysitting her any more. 

I think if I get some days off in the week I will then feel much better about doing my boyfriends horses-because he DOES provide for me and I don't think it's unreasonable that I help him out. However on his day off he needs to step up and do some jobs. 

I've also decided that I will be using the school, il learn to grade it properly so that i dont damage it, and that's final-I have a youngster, she needs time in the school, end of. 

I am also waiting for WHW to ring me back about putting puzzle in my name. 

I do have a part time job, I nanny, and I COULD afford puzzle if I absolutely needed to-so feel calmer about that. 

Thank you all for your help in making me see how unreasonable some of this is! Going to make a big effort to improve things otherwise enough is enough. I'm 21 and need to be happy with what I'm doing. 

Thanks again xxx
		
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Great news  I'm sure you may've painted all this in less than rose tinted way because of feeling so blue yesterday, but i really felt for you. I'm proud that you got what you wanted. Please don't let your uni work slip as that will be your only route to independance. 

Congratulations and good luck! xxx


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## jesterfaerie (15 November 2011)

I have read the thread and I am so sorry you are struggling as much as you are. It is very easy for us all to offer advice it is you that has to make the difficult decisions but please do not put that you off, harder doesn't mean it is the wrong decision. I do think you need help looking at your relationship, no matter how much you love your OH this situation cannot continue. I do think you need to speak to your councillor about these issues. What would you say if a friend came to you and told you what you have told us on here?

I do agree with the majority of folk on here saying that you do need to leave your OH however if you are prepared to stay then something needs to change.

I can understand you aren't wanting your OH to send your horse back I imagine that she means the world to you and makes you so happy that you don't want to loose that out of your life. Unfortunately it is giving your a OH a way to have an emotional hold over you. If you want to keep your horse and stay in your relationship then changes need to be made.

If Puzzle gets sent back, then although it will be difficult it will allow you to get away from the yard and find a job so that you are contributing to the household, tough luck on him and his mother they will have to do their own horses or find someone else but it may help get the MIL from hell off your back and get your OH to see who you are, a hard working person who deserves respect.
OR
Have you spoken to your OH about you finding a PT job, pay your way for Puzzle and contribute as much as you can financially into the household as well?

By working and contributing financially, even just a little bit will help you feel that you are part of the relationship and household and not just dependant on your OH (I have been in the same situation whilst at uni but my OH was supportive of this and didn't use it against me).
It is do-able to have a job, horse and uni (speaking from experience). You will be contributing towards the horse, so OH and MIL shouldn't be able to complain and it will show you are not expecting to have things handed to you for nothing. You are putting money into the house, again showing you are trying to contribute. Like stich said you will also be gaining a new social circle. 

I really do hope that you turn this situation into something good that works for you, because you do deserve A LOT more than what you are getting. Please do not stay in the relationship for Puzzle, it is the same as staying in the relationship for a child it does not work. 

Sorry I haven't managed to read through my reply I am sure there are loads more I wanted to add or re-phase.

I really want to wish you the best of luck and I hope whatever you decide it works out for you


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## *hic* (15 November 2011)

snoopyinfrance said:



			jemima_too have you been reading the same posts as the rest of us????  I really don't think you have unless you're playing devils advocate or trying a bit of reverse phsycology.  (In which case I take my hat off to you!)
		
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Yes I read cedars' posts as she is the one in the situation and, as you'll have seen if you read my post carefully, I have been in a similar situation but many years ago. I also read with increasing horror the frantic reaction that other younger (than me) people were having. 

I may be being unfair to cedars but I suspect that when she is a little calmer she may feel that she has looked very much on all the worst points and not really thought of any of the current positives. I merely tried to show her some of the options. When you ARE caught in this situation it is so hard to know what is for the best, however being a young person with no financial or emotional support, with the issues that cedars freely posts about, trying to dramatically change your living and support circumstances in the middle of counselling AND whilst trying to do a degree is an almost certain guarantee of failure. Add in losing a beloved animal . . .

I managed to stay, I put up with some unbelieveable (to others) situations which cedars would probably recognise. It meant that I had a safe place to live and a far higher standard of living than I could otherwise have afforded. I didn't have to take up any of the offers that were made to me "to help me out" like being an older man's mistress or peddling drugs.  I could not have survived on my own. It gave me time to sort myself out and meet someone who is a pleasure to be with - and has been for more than 20 years. When I do occasionally spill to other people about what went on they are appalled, any counsellors I have seen have been stunned by the **** that was handed out but it was a phase of my life that gave me a chance to go to somewhere better. Like cedars I was taken in by my OH and his mother when relations with family broke down. It is difficult for the parent/MIL in this situation to get it right. Partly they want to treat you like a daughter - and few people would argue with a daughter being expected to provide the support that cedars is supposed to provide in order that the family can maintain it's standard of horse care, partly you are a threat to the family unit as a "daughter in law". When you so badly want to be helpful and loved and part of the family as I wanted to be helpful and loved and part of the family and I suspect cedars does one allows and even encourages people to ask more and more of you. Then it becomes natural and as you grow up and, if you were a daughter of the house, would move away actually you are not in a position to do that as you are in a relationship already. 

The other part of my post about making a long term relationship work - and believe me both parties need to work to maintain a long term relationship - isn't just based on my failed relationship but on my current relationship and the current relationship of the woman who is now in my place with my previous OH and his mother. She was obviously older that I was when her relationship with my ex started and she was better about being able to distance him and her from his mother. She has been able to just accept things more than I did because her situation before she met him was worse than mine was I expect. There is so much emphasis nowadays on having "a partner" and so little understanding of partnerships needing constant give and take and mutual support. If each person in the partnership does exactly what they want then it's doomed to fail. Someone always has to be the back end of the donkey - pushmepullyous don't survive as there is no-one to deal with the s h i t. The trick is to be able to decide who is front and who is back and to be able to negotiate the change successfully. My ex's GF is very skilful at negotiating and managing him tactfully so that she gets what she wants and needs out of the relationship. She has succeeded in what I failed at and has a relationshipe that gives her what she needs and she is very happy in it - as is my ex. Cedars is an intelligent young lady and if she can understand her MIL and alter that relationship she stands every chance of working with her OH as my ex's GF has done. Alternatively if too much damage has been done it will not be long before she is in a situation to get the heck out of there and get on with her life. 

Jumping ship at the moment is a very very scary option.

Cedars, I have been blunt. I hope you understand that I sympathise, have a far better understanding of where you are than you can imagine and that I wish you well.


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## *hic* (15 November 2011)

^^^^ I spent some time typing that essay obviously whilst you were already posting!

Good luck with the new arrangements


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## jokadoka (15 November 2011)

LEAVE!!!!!!! They are a bunch of control freaks.


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## scarymare (15 November 2011)

Oh dear.  So he's talked you round again by the looks of it.

You are far too young to be putting up with this BS.

You have gone from one abusive situation to another (just like the statistics said you would).

You need to 'choose life' (sorry for the cliche).

Leave the shower of ***** (and I only ever use that when I'm really cross).

Teaching will wait, nobody ever fails a PGCE (I'm a student teacher regent and there are some horror stories who pass trust me).  In a similar (not nearly as bad) situation I brought a one way to Perth Aus, only told parents day of flight.  You will never look back.


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## Amymay (15 November 2011)

scarymare said:



			Teaching will wait, nobody ever fails a PGCE (I'm
		
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Actually, and thankfully, they do.


OP - where are your parents??


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## ester (15 November 2011)

Amymay, I think she mentioned it somewhere earlier in the thread, as London way. and OP is near bristol (I spotted it as I didn't realise that's where she was PGCEing!)


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## rhino (15 November 2011)

ester said:



			Amymay, I think she mentioned it somewhere earlier in the thread, as London way. and OP is near bristol (I spotted it as I didn't realise that's where she was PGCEing!)
		
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She's not doing the PGCE/DE anyway, she's doing the BEd. And SM, in the region of 10% of my year failed their PGDE although I'm sure some of those would have managed to resit.


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## elsielouise (15 November 2011)

Bit off topic but re pgce - you can miss only a small amount of course in order to fail but you can fail on both teaching quality (or lack of) or on admin and attendance. I am former head teacher and have failed pgce students when their institutions might have passed them. If you are doing pgce you will find your first year of teaching more intense than pgce year so perhaps bear that in mind also.

Sent from phone.


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## jendie (15 November 2011)

Haven't read every post but it seems to be as if your OH is treating you like a skivvy rather than as an OH.

If you cannot talk to him about the situation then it is time to leave. You are not throwing five years down the drain, you are saving yourself from future heartache.

If he is siding with his mum now it will only get worse as time goes on. Having an interfering M-I-L would be a nightmare. It is MUCH harder to get out of a marriage than to leave a relationship that obviously isn't working because you OH has no respect for your needs. 

If you have to lose the horse then, sadly, so be it. You have to save yourself.


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## Amymay (15 November 2011)

ester said:



			Amymay, I think she mentioned it somewhere earlier in the thread, as London way. and OP is near bristol (I spotted it as I didn't realise that's where she was PGCEing!)
		
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Thanks Ester.  Have come in on the end of this, so haven't read the whole post.


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## HBrae2 (15 November 2011)

I'm glad you're feeling more positive and have made some decisions, I was worried about you last night, I'm sure everyone was.

A practical idea, could you suggest to your MIL that she take in a livery without charge in return for them looking after her horse Mon-Fri. That seems reasonable to me, there must be plenty of people who would look after another horse in return for free stabling and grazing. You could suggest it would be like having her own private groom and it wouldn't cost her anything! That way you could do your girlie and your OH's horses with his assistance when he's off work. It would also give you some company during the week, I think that would help make the work less of a chore if you had someone to chat to and have fun with. I hated being on my own all the time!


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## ChristmasPixie (15 November 2011)

Dump him, dump his mum, dump their yard. Get out and find your feet. I have been in an abusive relationship, it took the police to eventually get rid of him and even that wasn't straight forward. Even now, years on I have moments where I think I still love him... but then I remember how he made me lose my horse and quickly recover from my insanity!! Yes, whilst I was with him I couldn't imagine life without him, but I haven't looked back since leaving. I am now fully independant of any man and have a gorgeous horse no one can take away from me! 

If he sends your horse back, good. It means you can get out, sort yourself out and get it on loan on your own terms elsewhere 

Good luck xx


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## galaxy (15 November 2011)

Cedars, I just wanted to add a little something

I am not going to outright say whether or not you should leave, that can only be your decision and you should not be influenced by others.

You say that he is the main earner and you feel indebted to him to pay your way.  Now I'm not saying you should be a free loader....  but my husband is by far the main earner in our house.  I basically pay for my horse, my car and any left over money goes towards luxuries we want.  My husband pays the mortgage, ALL the bills, holidays etc etc.  I am self employed and sometimes I won't even earn enough to pay for what I am meant to.  However, I in no way feel indebted to him.  I do sometimes feel I am blatently spending "his" money just to enjoy myself without him, like going to HOYS/Olympia, but I don't feel guilty.  He is happy for me to go.  At the moment, we have no children, but this is what we decided together to do when we got married.  I assume he supported you in your decision to go to Uni?  I do do nearly all of the housework, but sometimes it doesn't all  get done and he may help me out and he works 12 hours + a day.  What I trying to say is that I know my husband loves me and would never try and make me feel I have to earn my keep.  That is not how a loving relationship works.

Anyway, I hope you understand what I am trying to say.


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## Spring Feather (15 November 2011)

Shygirl said:



			A practical idea, could you suggest to your MIL that she take in a livery without charge in return for them looking after her horse Mon-Fri. That seems reasonable to me, there must be plenty of people who would look after another horse in return for free stabling and grazing. You could suggest it would be like having her own private groom and it wouldn't cost her anything!
		
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But isn't that the situation at the moment?  Cedars is getting free livery for her horse in return for looking after MILs horse.


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## Sidesaddle (15 November 2011)

Cedars said:



			I do talk to him - and all I get back is a load of 'well you don't pay for anything' 'i'm sending your horse back if you wont do mine' 'we wont be together if you wont do the horses' 'you're so ungrateful, my mother houses your horse for free'.
...
		
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Cedars said:



			I am unbelievably lonely, because I never have any time for friends! Any time I would spend with friends gets a 'well you could have spent that time poo picking'.
		
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Cedars said:



			Nope - he won't propose - 'we're too young'.
		
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Cedars said:



			... and when we're happy we're amazing, but this isn't working for me with all of the rest of my life so in turmoil too. So something has to change.
		
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Cedars said:



			... apart from this, we ARE pretty perfect. ..
		
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Hmmm.

You are painting a very different picture of him from the one you usually paint of how caring and supportive he is.  Odd that he should have changed so much.  

It is pretty clear that

a) he and his mother are bullying you 
b) you are unhappy
c) the two of you are not perfect at all
d) he will never ask you to marry him

I am amazed you were able to write so much and so coherently when you have the flu.  Most people just collapse in bed.


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## ester (15 November 2011)

*waves at SS in new lounge*  

tbf I remember a similar thread last winter(ish).


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## Sidesaddle (15 November 2011)

*waves back*

So it's been going on for over a year?  Clearly Cedars has no intention of doing anything about it then!

Much easier to come on and seek a bit of attention on here than be proactive and sort herself out!


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## OWLIE185 (15 November 2011)

I feel very sorry for the position you find yourself in and can well appreciate your strong relationship with your horse.
However, your boyfriend and his mother sound as if they are taking total advantage of you and this will not change.
Neither is the situation you find yourself going to put you in the frame of mind of studying and completing your course.
If you want to free yourself from all this then you are going to have to walk away from the entire situation you find yourself in.
Find yourself some alternative accomodation and move out and have no more contact with them.
You can then get on with your life - complete your studies - and get a worthwhile job.


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## Spring Feather (15 November 2011)

Sidesaddle said:



			Hmmm.

You are painting a very different picture of him from the one you usually paint of how caring and supportive he is.  Odd that he should have changed so much.  

It is pretty clear that

a) he and his mother are bullying you 
b) you are unhappy
c) the two of you are not perfect at all
d) he will never ask you to marry him
		
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SS; sharp as always (in more ways than one!).  I think you're spot on


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## mulledwhine (15 November 2011)

No real advice except that, I would have marched him over to the muck heap and shown him what 18 barrows of not doing any pop picking looked liked.

Sadly that is mothers and sons


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## HBrae2 (15 November 2011)

Spring Feather said:



			But isn't that the situation at the moment?  Cedars is getting free livery for her horse in return for looking after MILs horse.
		
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Yes but she is looking after 4 horses and that is too much, especially with the poo picking. If her MIL's horse could be looked after by someone else and that person help with the picking, other general yard chores etc then I feel it would make it less onerous on Cedars and give her some company. It doesn't sound much like her MIL would be likely to employ someone to help so this might be a solution? Looking after 4 stabled horses and poo picking fields with no assistance every day on top of trying to do a full time course really is a lot.
You make it sound like she is just looking after her MIL's horse in return for livery which would be fair, but she's also looking after the other 2 which are her OH's so it's caring for 3 that aren't her own.
Cedars, you are her daughter in law in effect, you should be treated as part of the family. My parents would never charge my OH livery (that is if he liked horses....) as he's part of our family.


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## Amymay (15 November 2011)

Spring Feather said:



			But isn't that the situation at the moment?  Cedars is getting free livery for her horse in return for looking after MILs horse.
		
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No Ceders is getting free livery for managing a yard of four horses.  There is a big difference.


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## Spring Feather (15 November 2011)

Shygirl said:



			Yes but she is looking after 4 horses and that is too much, especially with the poo picking. If her MIL's horse could be looked after by someone else and that person help with the picking, other general yard chores etc then I feel it would make it less onerous on Cedars and give her some company. It doesn't sound much like her MIL would be likely to employ someone to help so this might be a solution? Looking after 4 stabled horses and poo picking fields with no assistance every day on top of trying to do a full time course really is a lot.
You make it sound like she is just looking after her MIL's horse in return for livery which would be fair, but she's also looking after the other 2 which are her OH's so it's caring for 3 that aren't her own.
Cedars, you are her daughter in law in effect, you should be treated as part of the family. My parents would never charge my OH livery (that is if he liked horses....) as he's part of our family.
		
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The BFs horses have nothing to do with Cedars looking after the MILs horse in exchange for free livery.  That's a seperate deal that Cedars has made with her BF whereby he pays for most of the bills in exchange for Cedars looking after his 2 horses.  I'm confused how can you say that someone else would be happy to have free livery for their horse in exchange for looking after 3 horses .... but when that person is Cedars it's not acceptable?


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## Spring Feather (15 November 2011)

amymay said:



			No Ceders is getting free livery for managing a yard of four horses.  There is a big difference.
		
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If that's how you see it fair enough.  The way I see it is Cedars gets free livery for looking after MILs horse and she gets free board and lodgings for herself for looking after BFs horses.  All mighty strange but if that's the understanding Cedars has come to with these people then it's up to her to change things if she no longer finds it acceptable.


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## Amymay (15 November 2011)

Spring Feather said:



			........ if that's the understanding Cedars has come to with these people then it's up to her to change things if she no longer finds it acceptable.
		
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I agree.

Slave labour was abolished many moons ago.


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## HBrae2 (15 November 2011)

Spring Feather said:



			I'm confused how can you say that someone else would be happy to have free livery for their horse in exchange for looking after 3 horses .... but when that person is Cedars it's not acceptable? 

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I didn't say anything of the sort, I said if someone looked after her MIL's horse in return for livery and left Cedars to do her own and her boyfriend's 2. I think free livery in return for looking after 1 horse is fair but not, as amymay said, managing a yard of 4 horses and being worked into the ground.

You are right that it's a very strange arrangement though, I can't imagine anyone in my family acting like that - ever! I just don't get why she's being required to work for her livery in the first place, this woman is her MIL who took her in!!!


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## galaxy (15 November 2011)

Spring Feather said:



			she gets free board and lodgings for herself
		
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to me, if they are in a serious commited relationship neither she nor her OH should be looking at it this way.  Just my opinion, but I don't think that's how successful, loving relationships work.


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## Spring Feather (15 November 2011)

Shygirl said:



			I didn't say anything of the sort, I said if someone looked after her MIL's horse in return for livery and left Cedars to do her own and her boyfriend's 2.
		
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My apologies, I did misquote you.  I find it all a little too strange.  Bartering is great so long as it works for everyone involved.  



galaxy23 said:



			to me, if they are in a serious commited relationship neither she nor her OH should be looking at it this way.  Just my opinion, but I don't think that's how successful, loving relationships work.
		
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I agree it's quite a strange setup.


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## Archangel (15 November 2011)

OK, great that you have had a thrash out with the OH but
these two people are actually quite hideous so dont underestimate them.  You come across as quite firm after your chat with your OH, but actually these people have walked all over you.  You going boo to them is unlikely to scare them off for long or change them in the long term. 



Cedars said:



			On the weekend, I expect not to be responsible for her horse for 3 half days. As she should be doing at the very least Sat night, Sun morning and Sun night.
		
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What happened to Saturday morning?  I can already see a gap for the hideous pair to slither through.  You dont buy a horse and keep it at home then expect someone else to pick up the slack 



Cedars said:



			She also needs to learn how to do her own horse. No more excuses-I expect her to be capable of bringing her own horse in from the field, changing it's rugs and picking its feet out as a very minimum. Im not expecting her to be able to tack the mare up because she IS difficult, but I am certainly not babysitting her any more.
		
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If you telling her to do it will make her do it then I will eat my hairnet. 



Cedars said:



			However on his day off he needs to step up and do some jobs.
		
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This is where I will eat my second hairnet.



Cedars said:



			I've also decided that I will be using the school, il learn to grade it properly so that i dont damage it, and that's final-I have a youngster, she needs time in the school, end of.
		
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Right on.  It is a school, it can take threequarters of a ton of horse jumping up and down on it, subzero temperatures and torrential rain.  It is going to stand a wee slip of a girl whizzing round on a quad.  It is a school not a piece of fine china. 

I hope I dont sound too negative, these two will take some steamrolling over so dont leave even a chink of a compromise up for grabs.  Remember to value yourself.


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## tasel (15 November 2011)

Guys... I think we all have to understand that families are different from one another. If my father had stables, he wouldn't just give away free livery even to my OH...

After reading all of this, I started thinking about the whole arrangement differently. You have to think of how much grooms actually get paid (the ones that work for riding schools, etc.). In my understanding, not much. Then, you have to look at how much it actually costs to keep Cedars horse and her lodging, etc. If it's about the same, I guess the arrangement should work.


The question really is... Would Cedars be prepared to move out, pay for her own flat and the livery? She'd have to get a job for that... One where working hours may just be the same as her current yard duties...


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## Dirtymare (15 November 2011)

galaxy23 said:



			Cedars, I just wanted to add a little something

I am not going to outright say whether or not you should leave, that can only be your decision and you should not be influenced by others.

You say that he is the main earner and you feel indebted to him to pay your way.  Now I'm not saying you should be a free loader....  but my husband is by far the main earner in our house.  I basically pay for my horse, my car and any left over money goes towards luxuries we want.  My husband pays the mortgage, ALL the bills, holidays etc etc.  I am self employed and sometimes I won't even earn enough to pay for what I am meant to.  However, I in no way feel indebted to him.  I do sometimes feel I am blatently spending "his" money just to enjoy myself without him, like going to HOYS/Olympia, but I don't feel guilty.  He is happy for me to go.  At the moment, we have no children, but this is what we decided together to do when we got married.  I assume he supported you in your decision to go to Uni?  I do do nearly all of the housework, but sometimes it doesn't all  get done and he may help me out and he works 12 hours + a day.  What I trying to say is that I know my husband loves me and would never try and make me feel I have to earn my keep.  That is not how a loving relationship works.

Anyway, I hope you understand what I am trying to say. 

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This is very very well put and I do think Cedars that you should read this and take it on board.
True love does not make you feel like you are freeloading or you have to repay their "kindnes" with slave labour.
If it were me....I would go home to Mum and Dad for a day or two and see what they say.
Good luck.


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## silvershoes (15 November 2011)

Wow this is a very long and in depth post! I wish I could read every single post but I THINK I have got the jist of things.

I think everything has been covered that could be, but basically, like most have said your BF has no right to use your horse, his horse, whatever....A horse as blackmail to make you work, or what I see it as, slave labour. It sounds like they've taken you under their wing and made an illusion that they have done a lot for you when really...you're doing a lot for them. If it wasn't for you who would look after the horses? I think you're really doing it for the horses sake, not theirs because I know who I would rather do it for. 

Just think if this was a job you were at. Seeing to the horses every day for no pay just to live there, you're right in thinking it isn't right because you just wouldn't do that! You could go somewhere and be employed by someone to be a groom but you would get paid, receive rides and probably be much better treat. 

As for the relationship side of things, it is entirely your decision but....there's plenty more fish in the sea.

Good luck with things and I hope the "talk" goes well. Keep us informed


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## DragonSlayer (15 November 2011)

Sidesaddle said:



			*waves back*

So it's been going on for over a year?  Clearly Cedars has no intention of doing anything about it then!

Much easier to come on and seek a bit of attention on here than be proactive and sort herself out!  

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I've also just remembered something....didn't Cedars leave because the OH found out about the thread in Soapbox when she was being somewhat negative towards him....?

I guess that lesson went out the window then!


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## Cedars (15 November 2011)

Can't go home to mum and dad but I appreciate the sentiment. 

Still feel totally rubbish today, but feeling clearer and the situation is still the same as I see it. I can't carry on doing the level that I do with the horses. And I love my OH to the bottom of my heart and back again, so I'm not going to give up on him. So something has to change. I can't see ME suggesting to my mil that things change will work, but my OH certainly can talk to her about it. 

I love him, I love our life and I do want to spend the rest of my life with him and being his-but I'm just at a breaking point with this now! 

WHW ringing me back tomorrow so thats good. 

Fingers crossed we can persuade his mother!! I'm sure we can. At the end of the day if it's meant to be, it's meant to be. Right?! These things always work themselves out. Xxx


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## marmalade76 (15 November 2011)

I have only read the first page, but it looks to me that the BF and his mother are taking advantage of the situation and treating the OP as a skivvy. Yes, I do think it is fair for the OP to look after the horses as it allows the others to work and therefore pay for accommodation for both horses and humans. It is NOT fair for them to use this as a tool to blackmail the OP. 

You are obviously a very unhappy person, OP. Please find someone or something that makes YOU happy - life is too short!


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## TicTac (15 November 2011)

Sometimes all you need to do is talk, but at the end of the day's it's your life and you are responsible for it.

It's often harder to walk away than it is to stay.


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## spotty_pony (15 November 2011)

Sorry I haven't read all of the replies but I feel really sorry for you.  Your OH and his mother sound horrible tbh!! Sounds to like they are taking advantage of you and you need to show them you are not prepared to let them walk all over you. Glad to see you have contacted the WHW about your horse, hopefully they will be able to sort out changing it over to your name so she is properly, seeming as you look after her all of the time and pay for her anyway! As for looking for somewhere to live, if your at Uni, couldn't you rent a flat near to your Uni or something? If i were you, I would get you and your horse out and away from your OH and his mother asap. Good luck and keep us updated.


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## Slinkyunicorn (15 November 2011)

Cedars said:



			I love him, I love our life and I do want to spend the rest of my life with him and being his-but I'm just at a breaking point with this now! 

WHW ringing me back tomorrow so thats good. 

Fingers crossed we can persuade his mother!! I'm sure we can. At the end of the day if it's meant to be, it's meant to be. Right?! These things always work themselves out. Xxx
		
Click to expand...

This is going to sound harsh but I think you are deluded and attention seeking. All of this is your life and your descicion to make but having read some of your previous posts about various things it feels like you cry wolf - a lot - so don't be surprised when you really need help there is no one there to help you


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## SeasonalSituation (15 November 2011)

Give her a break guys. When your down everything feels worse then it is. 

Glad it's working out for you


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## SeasonalSituation (15 November 2011)

Oh and keep us updated please


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## Sidesaddle (15 November 2011)

sitch said:



			Give her a break guys. When your down everything feels worse then it is.
		
Click to expand...

Hahahahahahahahahaha!

Oh - you are a newbie.

You clearly don't know Cedars, her previous IDs and fantasies.

Slinkyunicorn has her to a T.  Thank the lord that finally others are beginning to see what I have seen for years.


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## palomino698 (15 November 2011)

Cedars said:



			I love him, I love our life and I do want to spend the rest of my life with him and being his-but I'm just at a breaking point with this now!
		
Click to expand...

Being 'HIS'?????  

Nobody possesses another person.  What is it that makes you feel so pathetically grateful to be in a relationship with him?  

And really... you haven't said anything else that implies you love your life together.

Is it some kind of status thing?  You like having a boyfriend who rides, and whose mother has a smart yard?  And you're grateful that out of all the girls who'd love such a catch, he 'keeps' you?

Love is blind?  Ten years down the line, let's hope you have really learned what love means.


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## SeasonalSituation (16 November 2011)

Sidesaddle. Ok fair enough. I don't know before and all. Never mind


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## jokadoka (16 November 2011)

I love him, I love our life and I do want to spend the rest of my life with him and being his-but I'm just at a breaking point with this now! 

If you loved your life (as it is at the moment) so much, why the original post?
As I said before, LEAVE, they are a bunch of users. If the guy loved you he wouldn't treat you like this. As for the mother in law....


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## HBrae2 (16 November 2011)

Sidesaddle said:



			Hahahahahahahahahaha!

Oh - you are a newbie.

You clearly don't know Cedars, her previous IDs and fantasies.

Slinkyunicorn has her to a T.  Thank the lord that finally others are beginning to see what I have seen for years.  

Click to expand...

Hi Sidesaddle, I'm pretty new too and I'm confused. Do you mean that this is made up?  That would be a pretty wicked thing to do, why would someone make up unkind things about their partner and post them online?


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## Cedars (16 November 2011)

Shygirl, it's not made up, SideSaddle has an issue that my life isn't rosy and i come here fr support-may well be her favourite sport to stalk me round the board (particularly as she has no interest in horses so why is she in NL?) 

I was previously Flamehead, and as allowed by TFC I changed to Cedars, but both accounts are merged so you can see every post of mine from day one. Xx


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## HBrae2 (16 November 2011)

But surely one of the whole points of this forum is to get help and advice when things aren't going well or when you're unsure of the best thing to do??? I think I'm even more confused now....... : )
Never mind! And I don't want to read previous posts, I was just unsure as to what Sidesaddle meant by her comment as it seemed very strong.


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## Cedars (16 November 2011)

Don't worry shygirl, we're all confused by her too! 

When I was a bit younger, struggling and without the support for my illness I have now, I relied on the forum a lot and came across v needy. Which sidesaddle couldnt cope with. Bit sad for a middle aged woman who supposedly taught teenagers though. 

Xx


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## marmalade76 (16 November 2011)

Cedars said:



			Don't worry shygirl, we're all confused by her too! 

When I was a bit younger, struggling and without the support for my illness I have now, I relied on the forum a lot and came across v needy. Which sidesaddle couldnt cope with. Bit sad for a middle aged woman who supposedly taught teenagers though. 

Xx
		
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Come on, C, you haven't always been entirly straight! For example, I was under the impression that it was 'your' yard (as in yours and your BF's) 'your' school (were you not interviewed by H&H about how 'you'd' spent a lot of money on having the school put in?), etc, and I always wondered how such a young couple, one a student, could afford  to own a house and a yard in quite an expensive part of the country. Turns out it's his mother's and you're not even allowed to use it!


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## Cedars (16 November 2011)

It is our yard-I've always said it was funded by my MIL! interestingly actually HHO knew that when they reported it but didnt put it in the report because I think it's a bit too long winded!


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## marmalade76 (16 November 2011)

Cedars said:



			It is our yard-I've always said it was funded by my MIL! interestingly actually HHO knew that when they reported it but didnt put it in the report because I think it's a bit too long winded!
		
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I don't remember reading anything about your BF's mother funding anything, but I do remember reading something about your BF not getting on with his family, having to 'fight' to keep his horse and having saved for years to pay for an eventer (which he now has, right?)

If my son's GF went round telling the world that my property was hers,  I might feel that she needed putting back in her place!


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## Sidesaddle (16 November 2011)

Cedars said:



			Shygirl, it's not made up, SideSaddle has an issue that my life isn't rosy and i come here fr support-may well be her favourite sport to stalk me round the board (particularly as she has no interest in horses so why is she in NL?) 

I was previously Flamehead, and as allowed by TFC I changed to Cedars, but both accounts are merged so you can see every post of mine from day one. Xx
		
Click to expand...

1.  I have no issues, dear.  You are the ones with a barrowload according to your many self pitying, attention seeking, whining posts over the time you have been here.

2.  The reason I came in NL was cos of the PMs I got telling me of your latest "fantasy"/"moan"/"tall tale" (take your pick as to which poster you choose).

3. Stalk?  Still, makes a change from being called a bully!   



Cedars said:



			Don't worry shygirl, we're all confused by her too! 

When I was a bit younger, struggling and without the support for my illness I have now, I relied on the forum a lot and came across v needy. Which sidesaddle couldnt cope with. Bit sad for a middle aged woman who supposedly taught teenagers though.
		
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1.  Violins at the ready.

2.  Came across?  You still do!  ME ME ME ME ME.  Why don't you just post a thread saying that every day?  It would bring you the attention you so badly crave.

3.  My dear girl - no supposedly about it.  I did indeed teach 11-18 year olds for many years which is why I can smell a rat from 100 paces.


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## Fellewell (16 November 2011)

Phew, that's a relief, I thought we were back with Theo and Ofilia for a while there. No sign of Lucas Fielding though, or do I mean Buttons?

The difference between a fantasist and a victim is the amount of noise they make IME


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## Queenbee (16 November 2011)

palomino698 said:



			Being 'HIS'?????  

Nobody possesses another person.  What is it that makes you feel so pathetically grateful to be in a relationship with him?  

And really... you haven't said anything else that implies you love your life together.

Is it some kind of status thing?  You like having a boyfriend who rides, and whose mother has a smart yard?  And you're grateful that out of all the girls who'd love such a catch, he 'keeps' you?

Love is blind?  Ten years down the line, let's hope you have really learned what love means.
		
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marmalade76 said:



			Come on, C, you haven't always been entirly straight! For example, I was under the impression that it was 'your' yard (as in yours and your BF's) 'your' school (were you not interviewed by H&H about how 'you'd' spent a lot of money on having the school put in?), etc, and I always wondered how such a young couple, one a student, could afford  to own a house and a yard in quite an expensive part of the country. Turns out it's his mother's and you're not even allowed to use it!
		
Click to expand...




Cedars said:



			It is our yard-I've always said it was funded by my MIL! interestingly actually HHO knew that when they reported it but didnt put it in the report because I think it's a bit too long winded!
		
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Cedars: whatever the real situation in you home life it clearly is not suiting you.

I see a number of similarities on some levels with me, My OH owns a lot of land, he has built stables where we live, it is my home but not my house, my contribution was food, cooking and cleaning.  I did try to contribute more, but was not allowed (it was covered by the business)  we both work full time,  At many points I have had this flung in my face during arguments, we have had episodes where he cheated, then he became violent  I suspect that your concept of breaking point is, not the same as mine.  We are still together five years down the line and engaged, but would I still be here if someone told me what I would have to trapse through to get here?  No!  I did the bit where I was hurt, and grumbled about the injustice of it all,  I was grateful for a partner who had a house, stables and land, I did not think it gave him the right for his behaviour or attitude.  So I got some self respect and took control of my life, in all honesty, walking out on him for good would have not been a problem for me (I won't possibly go into the depths of detail I could on a public forum), It is why I considered moving counties, I moved my horses, I stopped doing anything for him, if I wanted to talk to him, I would, if not I diverted the calls so I could have peace.  I took my life back and it was his choice if he followed me.  It takes a certain type of person to change who they are from Victim to Cold Hearted/Strong Independent.  I am a lot harsher, less forgiving, colder than I used to be, I still love him and am with him, will I always be with him for ever and ever and ever?  probably not, love him as I do, and knowing his attitude about the house is just something to hurt me in an argument, he is still a ******, and I have changed because of it, I love him and am with him, I don't dislike it anymore but my fluffy wuffy focus has gone and I feel I am too hardened and selfish, If I didn't have him, I certainly wouldn't want someone else and not because I would be pining.  I find I have an ability to zone out and switch my emotions off very quickly.

I don't really care what your true situation is, whether you cry wolf, use HHO to whinge and get pity or lie and mislead magazines.  What is certain is that you will have to change who you are dramatically, you need to stop whining, get self respect and a backbone and take charge of your life if you don't like it.  If he is worth it, he will follow (he will probably follow if he isn't worth it too).  If it was me, I would leave things now since you have had the chat with your OH, I would get the horse put in my name, and if things didn't change I would walk, I wouldn't be reminding anyone a second time and I wouldn't be putting up with cr ap, and I would certainly be doing a hell of a lot more than going online winging about it.


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## Triskar (16 November 2011)

Cedars, you do seem to spend an awfully long time mooning about on line writing about how you feel and what you think you might do - just get up off your butt and DO something.  What about your Uni work if you've gor time on your hands!  Or go and po pick.  Anything, rather than sit about feeling sorry for yourself.


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## Cedars (16 November 2011)

Queenbee-your post was really thought provoking. Thank you xx


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## JingleTingle (16 November 2011)

Just a little puzzled here - at one point when somebody suggested on here that your parents might help you out - you described your relationship with them as they had been abusive, they arent interested in you and the relationship had totally broken down. 

But on searching some previous threads you talk about them paying for a holiday for you and BF to go to Greece with them? Surely if they are prepared to do this they have more than a passing involvement in your life???? You also talk elsewhere about your MIL being OK as MIL's go?

Just that things aren't quite adding up now I have done a little research?  I do so hate it when I feel great concern for someone and then I start to wonder if I may have been duped by an attention seeker?


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## Spring Feather (16 November 2011)

Cedars if you love your life and your OH so much and if you're now sure that your BFs mother will take a bit more responsibility for her horse then surely you knew this all along?  In which case why bother starting this thread?  There are always two sides to every story and I wonder if the same story would be told if by your BF or his mother.   

Many of your threads Cedars/Flamehead have been deleted. I often feel sorry for new posters who take you at face value. You've been banned from this forum a few times when your aggressive nature got the better of you again, so it's not quite as simple as saying to new posters that they can read every single post you've ever made because many of your posts are no longer viewable.  I do think it was a great shame that you alienated and upset some very kind posters recently.  I for one felt very humbled by the depth of concern shown and the genuine offers made to you at that time.


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## DragonSlayer (16 November 2011)

grumpyoldmare said:



			Just a little puzzled here - at one point when somebody suggested on here that your parents might help you out - you described your relationship with them as they had been abusive, they arent interested in you and the relationship had totally broken down. 

But on searching some previous threads you talk about them paying for a holiday for you and BF to go to Greece with them? Surely if they are prepared to do this they have more than a passing involvement in your life???? You also talk elsewhere about your MIL being OK as MIL's go?

Just that things aren't quite adding up now I have done a little research?  I do so hate it when I feel great concern for someone and then I start to wonder if I may have been duped by an attention seeker?

Click to expand...

I was too, when I first arrived, and felt irritated at myself for doing so. Don't worry, it's not your fault at all, many here see this poster now in a whole new light...



Spring Feather said:



			Cedars if you love your life and your OH so much and if you're now sure that your BFs mother will take a bit more responsibility for her horse then surely you knew this all along?  In which case why bother starting this thread?  There are always two sides to every story and I wonder if the same story would be told if by your BF or his mother.   

Many of your threads Cedars/Flamehead have been deleted. I often feel sorry for new posters who take you at face value. You've been banned from this forum a few times when your aggressive nature got the better of you again, so it's not quite as simple as saying to new posters that they can read every single post you've ever made because many of your posts are no longer viewable.  I do think it was a great shame that you alienated and upset some very kind posters recently.  I for one felt very humbled by the depth of concern shown and the genuine offers made to you at that time.
		
Click to expand...

I also feel sorry for new posters too, but hold back now with what I really want to say, because I don't want to be labelled a bully, as I have been previously, just for picking up inconsistences of a tall tale. I don't like being called something I'm not, just for giving my opinion as to how I feel after being taken for a mug...


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## Snowy Celandine (16 November 2011)

Totally agree with you DragonSlayer.  Cedars/Flamehead has called me a bully too, when I have finally felt compelled to point out the many inconsistencies in her various 'all about Cedars' epic tales   I generally just have a little smirk now when I read her tall tales because she posts so many contradictory things.  I do sometimes wonder which bits, if any, are true


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## Ladyinred (16 November 2011)

I too used to feel very sorry for the OP, but those of us with a little intelligence soon recognise the inconsistencies in her posts. It doesn't take long to search back through the other posts, although, as DragonSlayer says, if a thread doesn't go her way then she has it deleted.

Crying wolf is a very foolish act, one day she will have a genuine and serious problem and no one will listen to her. I predict that if she doesn't have this thread deleted this evening then we will get the 'abused person with psychological problems who needs much counselling' played yet again, in an effort to extricate herself and gain sympathy.

Oh what a tangled web we weave when first we practice to decieve....


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## ajn1610 (16 November 2011)

Ladyinred said:



			I too used to feel very sorry for the OP, but those of us with a little intelligence soon recognise the inconsistencies in her posts. It doesn't take long to search back through the other posts, although, as DragonSlayer says, if a thread doesn't go her way then she has it deleted.

Crying wolf is a very foolish act, one day she will have a genuine and serious problem and no one will listen to her. I predict that if she doesn't have this thread deleted this evening then we will get the 'abused person with psychological problems who needs much counselling' played yet again, in an effort to extricate herself and gain sympathy.

Oh what a tangled web we weave when first we practice to decieve....
		
Click to expand...

I can't comment on whether this story is true or not I've had no experience of the OP. Just wanted to add a couple of things. 

It is not unusual for someone who has suffered abuse in their past to crave attention, even if this is a fantasy it doesn't necessarily mean that the stuff about her past isn't true. Even if she is making it all up then IMO she still warrants sympathy as she must be very sad, lonely and have a very empty life to go to such lengths.

Cedars whether everything you've said in the post is 100% true or not I hope you find a resolution and some peace and happiness in your life. Either way I feel sad for you as you seem unhappy. 

Also I am a teacher, and sorry hun but Uni is the easy part! It only gets more emotionally demanding and time consuming as you start to teach full time. If you are finding it that difficult to manage now I think you need to seriously give some though to whether this is the career for you. I regularly work a 60 hour week and although the holidays make you more flexible I'll work through most of them too. e.g. I was in school 2 full days of last half term (1 week) to do revision school a third day to catch up on my marking and did roughly 5 hours of stuff at home. So of the five days off I worked 3 and half! It's a brilliant job but it's not easy.


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## JingleTingle (16 November 2011)

Well I feel a total t*t now for posting such a sympathetic thread earlier on in the thread - especially now I realise I was sucked in by the same poster on the thread about a poor young dog that was PTS for dubious reasons. 

I could throttle people like this who play on other peoples natural concern and good nature - so call me a bully - I can live with that! I dont know how she lives with herself though?


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## DragonSlayer (16 November 2011)

grumpyoldmare said:



			Well I feel a total t*t now for posting such a sympathetic thread earlier on in the thread - especially now I realise I was sucked in by the same poster on the thread about a poor young dog that was PTS for dubious reasons. 

I could throttle people like this who play on other peoples natural concern and good nature - so call me a bully - I can live with that! I dont know how she lives with herself though?

Click to expand...

Don't worry, many of us have been there.


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## dressagelove (16 November 2011)

If this is true, then I am also annoyed I too got sucked in  I am pretty gullible unfortunately. 

I am struggling to see how someone with such issues is hoping to go on and teach young, impressionable and vulnerable children who in fact need a strong, mentally stable and adult role model to teach them life lessons, not someone who appears to be as confused with life as this young lady appears to be?

This is all rather confusing!!


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## *hic* (16 November 2011)

I think the disenchanted are a step or so behind me. I've been where you are now with this poster. She has utterly hated me. I've moved on. I do understand where she is coming from. I know she needs help. She isn't trying to deliberately wind anyone up in the way a troll does, what she posts is absolutely how she feels at the time.

She needs the love and attention shown by those outraged for her. She needs love and attention full stop. I hope she grows out of it, but at the moment she has a place of safety, having been in a similar mess myself I feel she needs to grow away from it rather than be encouraged to leave without a realistic backup plan. "Realistic" is not something she's able to arrange for herself, or maintain, right now.


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## missshell (16 November 2011)

Cedars your comment about you loving your OH to the bottom of your heart and back made me think. Does he feel the same for you? It seems to me like he knows how struggling and miserable you are but is quite happy to allow it to still happen 
If you all can't cope with 4 horses then don't have them. Especially when from what you have said his mother doesnt seem capable of looking after her horse. 
I hope you get it sorted fairly but it seems whilst relying on his mother for so much theres not alot you can do.


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## MrVelvet (16 November 2011)

gosh this is a lot to take in on a Wednesday evening with no alcohol to support me...


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## MrVelvet (16 November 2011)

dressagelove said:



			( I am pretty gullible unfortunately. 
!!
		
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lol me too!


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## Spring Feather (16 November 2011)

dressagelove said:



			I am struggling to see how someone with such issues is hoping to go on and teach young, impressionable and vulnerable children who in fact need a strong, mentally stable and adult role model to teach them life lessons, not someone who appears to be as confused with life as this young lady appears to be?
		
Click to expand...

Truth be told, that has always been my fear.


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## SeasonalSituation (16 November 2011)

i feel quite let down now that i was concerened.


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## JingleTingle (16 November 2011)

I wish I was nasty enough to post a copy of the pm I have just received....but in view on the content of said pm it has only confirmed what some posters are saying. 

OP has serious mental health issues, Walter Mitty doesnt have a patch on this lass believe me......it is very curious and a strange twist of fate that she has chosen to tell a pack of lies in a pm, to probably one of the few people in a position to have experience enough in the field she mentions, to know beyond a shadow of a doubt that 99 per cent of her persona is fantasy.

I will try very hard to ignore anything she posts from now on - but I just hope to God that she NEVER gets a job teaching children - or for that matter, anything that might let her have any influence on any young people within her circle. Did she say she is a nanny???? Christ!!!! And her poor parents - I feel for them.


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## Ibblebibble (16 November 2011)

queenbee said:



			I don't really care what your true situation is, whether you cry wolf, use HHO to whinge and get pity or lie and mislead magazines.  What is certain is that you will have to change who you are dramatically, you need to stop whining, get self respect and a backbone and take charge of your life if you don't like it.  If he is worth it, he will follow (he will probably follow if he isn't worth it too).  If it was me, I would leave things now since you have had the chat with your OH, I would get the horse put in my name, and if things didn't change I would walk, I wouldn't be reminding anyone a second time and I wouldn't be putting up with cr ap, and I would certainly be doing a hell of a lot more than going online winging about it.
		
Click to expand...

ohhh excuse me while i go all Oprah on you but 'you go girl'


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## DragonSlayer (16 November 2011)

grumpyoldmare said:



			I wish I was nasty enough to post a copy of the pm I have just received....but in view on the content of said pm it has only confirmed what some posters are saying. 

OP has serious mental health issues, Walter Mitty doesnt have a patch on this lass believe me......it is very curious and a strange twist of fate that she has chosen to tell a pack of lies in a pm, to probably one of the few people in a position to have experience enough in the field she mentions, to know beyond a shadow of a doubt that 99 per cent of her persona is fantasy.

I will try very hard to ignore anything she posts from now on - but I just hope to God that she NEVER gets a job teaching children - or for that matter, anything that might let her have any influence on any young people within her circle. Did she say she is a nanny???? Christ!!!! And her poor parents - I feel for them.
		
Click to expand...

Have you reported the PM?


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## Puppy (16 November 2011)

queenbee said:



			I see a number of similarities on some levels with me, My OH owns a lot of land, he has built stables where we live, it is my home but not my house, my contribution was food, cooking and cleaning.  I did try to contribute more, but was not allowed (it was covered by the business)  we both work full time,*At many points I have had this flung in my face during arguments, we have had episodes where he cheated, then he became violent  I suspect that your concept of breaking point is, not the same as mine.  We are still together five years down the line and engaged, * but would I still be here if someone told me what I would have to trapse through to get here?  No!  I did the bit where I was hurt, and grumbled about the injustice of it all,  I was grateful for a partner who had a house, stables and land, I did not think it gave him the right for his behaviour or attitude.  So I got some self respect and took control of my life, in all honesty, walking out on him for good would have not been a problem for me (I won't possibly go into the depths of detail I could on a public forum), It is why I considered moving counties, I moved my horses, I stopped doing anything for him, if I wanted to talk to him, I would, if not I diverted the calls so I could have peace.  I took my life back and it was his choice if he followed me.  It takes a certain type of person to change who they are from Victim to Cold Hearted/Strong Independent.  *I am a lot harsher, less forgiving, colder than I used to be, I still love him and am with him, will I always be with him for ever and ever and ever?  probably not, love him as I do, and knowing his attitude about the house is just something to hurt me in an argument, he is still a ******, and I have changed because of it,*  I love him and am with him, I don't dislike it anymore but my fluffy wuffy focus has gone and I feel I am too hardened and selfish, If I didn't have him, I certainly wouldn't want someone else and not because I would be pining.  I find I have an ability to zone out and switch my emotions off very quickly.
		
Click to expand...



Why on earth would you get engaged to someone who you can say all that about....?


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## Fellewell (16 November 2011)

Spring Feather said:



			Cedars if you love your life and your OH so much and if you're now sure that your BFs mother will take a bit more responsibility for her horse then surely you knew this all along?  In which case why bother starting this thread?  There are always two sides to every story and I wonder if the same story would be told if by your BF or his mother.   

Many of your threads Cedars/Flamehead have been deleted. I often feel sorry for new posters who take you at face value. You've been banned from this forum a few times when your aggressive nature got the better of you again, so it's not quite as simple as saying to new posters that they can read every single post you've ever made because many of your posts are no longer viewable.  I do think it was a great shame that you alienated and upset some very kind posters recently.  I for one felt very humbled by the depth of concern shown and the genuine offers made to you at that time.
		
Click to expand...

The post about her riding one of the horses (she's not allowed to ride) in the school (she's not allowed to ride in) did it for me. 'Horse stung by wasp' posted by Cedars(8.9.11 @16.50). Having a lively imagination and a bad memory will come back and bite you on the bum


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## Sidesaddle (16 November 2011)

dressagelove said:



			...
I am struggling to see how someone with such issues is hoping to go on and teach young, impressionable and vulnerable children who in fact need a strong, mentally stable and adult role model to teach them life lessons, not someone who appears to be as confused with life as this young lady appears to be?
...!
		
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This has been my over-riding concern from the outset.  Someone who posts a thread asking where she can get diazepam asap on a public forum is not the sort of person who should be in charge of children.  I have always said that I am extremely concerned that Cedars is left in charge of young children.  She appears not to be able to cope with her own life, let alone shaping the future of others.



jemima_too said:



			I think the disenchanted are a step or so behind me. I've been where you are now with this poster. She has utterly hated me. ...
		
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As many on here know, I have been called a bully and stalker by Cedars many times.  Even in this thread.  However, all I have done is pick up on her inconsistencies and downright lies and asked her to explain them.  Like jemima_too, I rumbled her from the outset, but have been insulted by people. I hate to say it, but .................... 



grumpyoldmare said:



			... but I just hope to God that she NEVER gets a job teaching children - or for that matter, anything that might let her have any influence on any young people within her circle. ...
		
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You, me and an awful lot of genuinely worried HHOers.


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## HazyXmas (16 November 2011)

WOW. I'm quite new on here.

I thought it was going to be about horses, blimey, didn't know what i was getting into 

I shall take everything with a pinch of salt & do my research on fellow posters.

Still, an interesting way to spend an hour with a glass of wine before dinner.

Good luck to everyone who's posted, i hope things work out.............


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## tallyho! (16 November 2011)

Dear oh dear.... I'm such a sucker....


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## Arizahn (16 November 2011)

I was totally fooled!

I was even about to ask why she didn't change the locks while he was out, lol! Oh well. Screw her then. Just hope the horses - if they exist - are ok. Oh yeah, and the children too I suppose. Feckin kids


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## horsegirl (16 November 2011)

18 wheelbarrows????? How long since you pooh picked the fields? That must be a month at least!

Still move out and support yourself and put your horse on livery and pay for it then you won't  have anything to complain about


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## bumblelion (16 November 2011)

My god, just caught up on this thread!! Even though iv been on this forum a few years and I recognise people's names, I can't say I remember their previous posts, what horses they have etc! That probably comes across as really bad but i think it's just because im such a forgetful person!! I really do think the op needs some help!!!


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## Sherbie (16 November 2011)

jelphick said:



			WOW. I'm quite new on here.

I thought it was going to be about horses, blimey, didn't know what i was getting into 

I shall take everything with a pinch of salt & do my research on fellow posters. QUOTE]

I was beggining to think the same. Was totally fooled, really was sorry for her 

Click to expand...


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## Spring Feather (16 November 2011)

grumpyoldmare said:



			I wish I was nasty enough to post a copy of the pm I have just received....but in view on the content of said pm it has only confirmed what some posters are saying.
		
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Cedars often PMs people when they finally see the light and start to query her stories publicly.  It's not the done thing to post PMs on here so I suspect it's her way of trying to diffuse negativity towards her.  However there will always be new people who become lured in by her tales and they usually react the same as you have done when it starts to dawn on them that things may not be as they first appear.


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## JingleTingle (16 November 2011)

Just for the record, I haven't reported pm - pointless really. A total blank and refusal to reply does it for me. 

They say don't feed a troll, but I feel this is far more serious than a troll, far too hurtful and damaging to the real people in OPs life who she happily slates and accuses to boost her own frail and warped sense of self.

Off to find a really juicy thread with lots of lively debate and harmless banter and foot stamping about the colour of stable rugs or how to teach your horse to fart with clicker training.......much more harmless and entertaining.


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## dressagelove (16 November 2011)

grumpyoldmare said:



			Off to find a really juicy thread with lots of lively debate and harmless banter and foot stamping about the colour of stable rugs or how to teach your horse to fart with clicker training.......much more harmless and entertaining.

Click to expand...

hahaha lol


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## Merry Crisis (16 November 2011)

grumpyoldmare said:



			Just for the record, I haven't reported pm - pointless really. A total blank and refusal to reply does it for me. 

They say don't feed a troll, but I feel this is far more serious than a troll, far too hurtful and damaging to the real people in OPs life who she happily slates and accuses to boost her own frail and warped sense of self.

Off to find a really juicy thread with lots of lively debate and harmless banter and foot stamping about the colour of stable rugs or how to teach your horse to fart with clicker training.......much more harmless and entertaining.

Click to expand...

Yes! far more wholesome


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## Fii (16 November 2011)

Whie you all worry about the kids and the horses, im a bit worried about Ceders.
 If she's at such a low point to post lies (if they are lies) kicking her while she's down is not going to help, is it?
  And no i am not shouting bully, before anyone says it, but just maybe draw a line under this and walk away forwarned.


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## rhino (16 November 2011)

Fii said:



			Whie you all worry about the kids and the horses, im a bit worried about Ceders.
 If she's at such a low point to post lies (if they are lies) kicking her while she's down is not going to help, is it?
  And no i am not shouting bully, before anyone says it, but just maybe draw a line under this and walk away forwarned.
		
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Absolutely agree but think you are wasting your breath. Some posters on here seem to take great delight in antagonising the OP and I don't feel that is likely to change


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## HazyXmas (16 November 2011)

sorry, Newbie here!

1) What's a troll?

2) How do you teach a horse NOT to fart???????


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## Sheep (16 November 2011)

Fii said:



			Whie you all worry about the kids and the horses, im a bit worried about Ceders.
 If she's at such a low point to post lies (if they are lies) kicking her while she's down is not going to help, is it?
  And no i am not shouting bully, before anyone says it, but just maybe draw a line under this and walk away forwarned.
		
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This.


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## galaxy (16 November 2011)

Fii said:



			Whie you all worry about the kids and the horses, im a bit worried about Ceders.
 If she's at such a low point to post lies (if they are lies) kicking her while she's down is not going to help, is it?
  And no i am not shouting bully, before anyone says it, but just maybe draw a line under this and walk away forwarned.
		
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I do agree in the most part.  I think there there is a small inkling of truth in the posts, that gets blown up outof proportion.


On a tangent, do people who teach children not have to go through some psychometric (sp?  sorry!  I'm not a teacher  ) testing or something to ensure they are mentally suitable?


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## ChesnutsRoasting (16 November 2011)

ajn1610 said:



			I can't comment on whether this story is true or not I've had no experience of the OP. Just wanted to add a couple of things. 

It is not unusual for someone who has suffered abuse in their past to crave attention, even if this is a fantasy it doesn't necessarily mean that the stuff about her past isn't true. Even if she is making it all up then IMO she still warrants sympathy as she must be very sad, lonely and have a very empty life to go to such lengths.

Cedars whether everything you've said in the post is 100% true or not I hope you find a resolution and some peace and happiness in your life. Either way I feel sad for you as you seem unhappy. 

Also I am a teacher, and sorry hun but Uni is the easy part! It only gets more emotionally demanding and time consuming as you start to teach full time. If 
you are finding it that difficult to manage now I think you need to seriously give some though to whether this is the career for you. I regularly work a 60 hour week and although the holidays make you more flexible I'll work through most of them too. e.g. I was in school 2 full days of last half term (1 week) to do revision school a third day to catch up on my marking and did roughly 5 hours of stuff at home. So of the five days off I worked 3 and half! It's a brilliant job but it's not easy.
		
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An exceedingly compassionate and sympathetic post. I wish schools had more teachers like you.

To the posters who are now circling Cedars, if you believe she suffers from mental health issues, please don't succumb to scrutinisation. You believe she is ill, so don't start knocking someone when they're down and in mental dissaray. Nobody's a fool for replying in a genuine, concerned way and the intention was good.


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## rhino (16 November 2011)

galaxy23 said:



			On a tangent, do people who teach children not have to go through some psychometric (sp?  sorry!  I'm not a teacher  ) testing or something to ensure they are mentally suitable?
		
Click to expand...

No, they don't.


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## Wagtail (16 November 2011)

This is worrying. I agree with Fii (and I am a qualified psychologist). If you are angered or annoyed by her posts, don't post. If you feel the need to warn others about her then PM them rather than posting your views on a public forum. People have committed suicide because of online activity.


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## Arizahn (16 November 2011)

But I like poking people with pointy sticks...especially when they're down! They can't run after me then!

Meh. I'm just cranky cos I wasn't able to spend any time with my horse today...had to get the YO to step in due to random meeting Plus, well I hate humans in general anyhow.

So when can I expect a nasty PM? I feel left out now...

And, yes, I am horrible. I have been told that this is actually healthy, since I spent years being nice to everyone!


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## Puppy (16 November 2011)

horsegirl said:



			18 wheelbarrows????? How long since you pooh picked the fields? That must be a month at least!
		
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Actually, the three horses at mine (15.2-16hhers) probably produce almost exactly that in a week. And I have a BIG barrow  

I am getting through so much haylage...


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## skydancer (16 November 2011)

Puzzle not allowed in school loose schooling because shes 'heavy on her big feet so leaves holes'. But she really doesnt...and its fine if you grade it, but I'm not allowed to grade the school cos I'm not allowed to use the quadbike...

Your not allowed to do this and your not allowed to do that - they treat you like a child at best their skivvy. I really feel for you - dont stand for it - get out NOW!!!


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## dressagelove (16 November 2011)

Wagtail said:



			This is worrying.  People have committed suicide because of online activity.
		
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An excellent, very valid point Wagtail


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## Sheep (16 November 2011)

This thread makes me slightly uncomfortable. All I can say, and I think many others would agree, is that I sincerely hope Cedars gets the help and support she needs- regardless of what the actual issues may, or may not, be.


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## bumblelion (16 November 2011)

Totally agree sheep


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## Fii (16 November 2011)

sheep said:



			This thread makes me slightly uncomfortable. All I can say, and I think many others would agree, is that I sincerely hope Cedars gets the help and support she needs- regardless of what the actual issues may, or may not, be.
		
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Agree^^^^^^^^^^


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## ridefast (16 November 2011)

Well, just caught up. Don't know what to believe but all I can say is whether it's fact or fiction clearly something is wrong and I do hope Cedars is ok


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## Queenbee (16 November 2011)

grumpyoldmare said:



			I wish I was nasty enough to post a copy of the pm I have just received....but in view on the content of said pm it has only confirmed what some posters are saying. 

OP has serious mental health issues, Walter Mitty doesnt have a patch on this lass believe me......it is very curious and a strange twist of fate that she has chosen to tell a pack of lies in a pm, to probably one of the few people in a position to have experience enough in the field she mentions, to know beyond a shadow of a doubt that 99 per cent of her persona is fantasy.

I will try very hard to ignore anything she posts from now on - but I just hope to God that she NEVER gets a job teaching children - or for that matter, anything that might let her have any influence on any young people within her circle. Did she say she is a nanny???? Christ!!!! And her poor parents - I feel for them.
		
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good god, and you didn't say anything really bad 


Ibblebibble said:



			ohhh excuse me while i go all Oprah on you but 'you go girl' 

Click to expand...

Thank you... I'm here all week


Puppy said:





Why on earth would you get engaged to someone who you can say all that about....?
		
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Because the violence erupted as a result of a major inability to communicate on his part, he cheated and was violent, but it did not make him a bad person, just a small minded man who came from a small town, who had been positively brainwashed into thinking that he could have anything he wanted, that consequences did not matter and that he was better than everyone else.  Plus the farming culture down here is errr... wierd   furthermore he had no comprehension of how to treat someone or of what a real relationship entailed.  It took a lot of work to find ways to communicate, to find more productive ways of saying 'you hurt me and that wasn't nice' we went to couselling, plus puppy it is my belief that his thought processing is not what you would expect in a 'normal' person, and I also suspect that he has aspergers.  Things are very black and white and he has tried very hard to understand the shades of grey for the sake of his relationship.    Things are much improved, and we are still working on things,  but in all honesty if I had the money I would move away, simply because a fresh start would be easier for me than the hard work of fixing a relationship that became very badly damaged. There are a lot of other factors involved that led to our downfall, but as I said, I will not be going on here airing my dirty laundry to that extent, its none of anyone elses business.  I am colder and harder, I stand for far less s hit, but it does not mean I am not warm and loving, I am just more selfish, I went into a relationship as I always do giving my love and trust freely, I have never stopped loving him, but for me to be the gushing housewife, that has to be earnt now.  We do get on, we are alright and we have fixed ourselves but I had to change in order to be able to deal with being with someone like him, what i mean is the 'mindset' it is no different than the other people from his background down here, they are all tos sers   and I want to throttle him, but he means no harm or offence and would do anything in his power to make me happy.  I love him and could spend my life with him and it could be good, but the past has made me defensive and I suspect a bit restless.  To help you understand the ins and outs I would have to absolutely spill my guts to you and I am not doing THAT. 

You will also see, that I said If I knew how much effort it would take in advance, I would have bailed, I didn't so I rode it out to the other side.  I was probably flipant when I said I wouldn't be with him, I probably will be, I wouldn't have agreed to marry him if I couldn't see it and believe in it and want it, but I am more cautious because of the past.


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## Flame_ (16 November 2011)

This thread has turned horrible. Inconsistencies happen in life with changing seasons, moods and situations, it does not make the OP a liar. Plus WTF does this thread have to do with any past threads? Why not (Sidesaddle) just let people give advice and the OP receive it?


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## ester (16 November 2011)

I think plenty probably have their own thoughts about cedars but keep their own counsell, unfortunately being a forum plenty of others won't. 
Cedars I just hope you get it sorted so you're ok with it


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## horsegirl (16 November 2011)

Quote de horsegirl
18 wheelbarrows????? How long since you pooh picked the fields? That must be a month at least!
Actually, the three horses at mine (15.2-16hhers) probably produce almost exactly that in a week. And I have a BIG barrow 

I am getting through so much haylage... 

A week??? I have 2 horses both 16.1 who eat non stop unlimited hay and I pick 2 barrows a week out of their field and it is completely clear.


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## Sidesaddle (16 November 2011)

Flame_ said:



			This thread has turned horrible. Inconsistencies happen in life with changing seasons, moods and situations, it does not make the OP a liar. Plus WTF does this thread have to do with any past threads? Why not (Sidesaddle) just let people give advice and the OP receive it?
		
Click to expand...

Who died and made you Queen?

I am interested in how you have picked on me when there are many others who have also stated how Cedars has lied.  Why haven't you mentioned them too?

Cedars' threads have a habit of turning horrible as the truth comes out.

I wondered why she had posted this relationship type problem in NL rather than SB, but I guess she has worn that audience out.


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## SouthWestWhippet (16 November 2011)

I have two ponies, one 14hh, one 12.2hh, who are fed no haylage/hay at all yet and I take AT LEAST five wheelbarrows a week out of the field. How do you do it horsegirl?


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## Wagtail (16 November 2011)

horsegirl said:



			Quote de horsegirl
18 wheelbarrows????? How long since you pooh picked the fields? That must be a month at least!
Actually, the three horses at mine (15.2-16hhers) probably produce almost exactly that in a week. And I have a BIG barrow 

I am getting through so much haylage... 

A week??? I have 2 horses both 16.1 who eat non stop unlimited hay and I pick 2 barrows a week out of their field and it is completely clear.
		
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Then I think you have a poo thief! 

When mine are out 24/7 a paddock of three does two barrows a day (14 a week). If course now they are in most of the time, but I still get almost one barrow load a day.


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## horsegirl (16 November 2011)

Well I don't know, it's a small field which is why I have to clear 100% every week. I have a reasonable size barrow but not one of those massive ones. Maybe it's the yard dogs getting in and eating it all.


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## Flame_ (16 November 2011)

Sidesaddle said:



			Who died and made you Queen?

I am interested in how you have picked on me when there are many others who have also stated how Cedars has lied.  Why haven't you mentioned them too?

Cedars' threads have a habit of turning horrible as the truth comes out.
		
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LOL, Queen? OK, if you say so.

I have not "picked on you", I replied to you in particular because Cedar's threads have a habit of turning horrible when you join them.


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## bumblelion (16 November 2011)

I must just say, I take a large wheelbarrow out of my two boys a day, (probably equal to 2 normal sized barrows!).


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## Dancing Queen (16 November 2011)

Just to make you all aware that it is 

Anti Bullying week this week!


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## Fii (16 November 2011)

Sidesaddle said:



			Who died and made you Queen?

I am interested in how you have picked on me when there are many others who have also stated how Cedars has lied.  Why haven't you mentioned them too?

Cedars' threads have a habit of turning horrible as the truth comes out.

I wondered why she had posted this relationship type problem in NL rather than SB, but I guess she has worn that audience out.
		
Click to expand...

Probably to avoid you, but it didnt work did it!
 Lots of people post in both SB and NL, , although most who post in here have at least some interest in horses!
 It is quite sad i think for you to have come in to NL just to post on her thread, i usually have a lot of time for you SS, but you and a few others have gone  down in my estimation quite a bit tonight.


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## ester (16 November 2011)

and the OP was mostly about poo-picking  that's pretty horsey to me


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## DragonSlayer (16 November 2011)

Fii said:



			Probably to avoid you, but it didnt work did it!
 Lots of people post in both SB and NL, , although most who post in here have at least some interest in horses!
 It is quite sad i think for you to have come in to NL just to post on her thread, i usually have a lot of time for you SS, but you and a few others have gone  down in my estimation quite a bit tonight.
		
Click to expand...

Yes, it is sad that this has happened like this.

It is sad that people who have realised what is going on, are having to defend themselves against being called 'bullies', I don't know if the OP is telling the truth or not, because when I mentioned the fact a story didn't compute, all hell broke loose and I was accused of several unpleasant things, by many posters. I quickly realised what was going on, and although I certainly now don't believe what the OP says, I'll continue to post on the thread if the OP is asking a question and I have an answer, such as I answered here - 'when I was at uni, I didn't have the horses'....

I don't think you can blame at all, those who wish to be truly vocal about the situation, because just because someone is saying 'woe is me'...is it the law to have to believe it? If the OP really has these issues, then a forum is NOT the place to airing those problems, and I hate to see other posters, genuinely thinking they are giving advice, could well be being suckered.

I could say MANY MANY things, but will restrain myself, because as you say, it's a public forum.


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## indiat (16 November 2011)

Fii said:



			Probably to avoid you, but it didnt work did it!
 Lots of people post in both SB and NL, , although most who post in here have at least some interest in horses!
 It is quite sad i think for you to have come in to NL just to post on her thread, i usually have a lot of time for you SS, but you and a few others have gone  down in my estimation quite a bit tonight.
		
Click to expand...

I think that considering some posters offered practical help, including a place to stay, they do have a right to know if their chains are being pulled by a fantasist. One day, such a person might turn up on their doorsteps and they would be justified in feeling angry if people who knew better had kept silent as the saga was gathering momentum on a forum. While I do feel sorry for people who need the meagre attention of posters on a forum, its not healthy for ANYONE, the fantasist or the respondent, to feed that need. It solves no problems and can be dangerous for all concerned. This is not a comment directed at Cedars, on this subject, I have no opinion.


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## rhino (16 November 2011)

DragonSlayer said:



			If the OP really has these issues, then a forum is NOT the place to airing those problems, and I hate to see other posters, genuinely thinking they are giving advice, could well be being suckered.
		
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I would far rather take the risk of a poster not telling the truth/the full truth and still giving advice or reassurance than making a potentially vulnerable young adult feel even worse by accusing them of lying. How that is me 'being suckered' I have no idea  I don't have finite resources of empathy 

It's no skin off my nose if anyone is lying on here, it does not affect me personally... I agree a forum is not always the best place for personal discussions but if you truly believe you don't have anyone else, what do you do?


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## Fii (16 November 2011)

I havent called any one a bully!
 I just think some people should take a step back, and consider the affect their words may have on a vunerable young girl.


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## DragonSlayer (16 November 2011)

rhino said:



			I would far rather take the risk of a poster not telling the truth/the full truth and still giving advice or reassurance than making a potentially vulnerable young adult feel even worse by accusing them of lying. How that is me 'being suckered' I have no idea  I don't have finite resources of empathy 

It's no skin off my nose if anyone is lying on here, it does not affect me personally... I agree a forum is not always the best place for personal discussions but if you truly believe you don't have anyone else, what do you do?
		
Click to expand...

Then that is your choice, if you wish to believe it. But if it has been shown by previous posts that the OP is not getting the stories straight, then what CAN we believe? Are we to be guilt-tripped into thinking that 'we might be responsible' for anything that might happen...? Not in my book. 

...and there are MANY MANY avenues someone can turn to for help....it is up the OP to find those, because the OP at some point, is going to have to take charge of her own destiny, no-one here is going to be able to do that.

...and let's say, for arguments sake....the OP is taking us all for a ride, what if someone here actually bent over backwards to try to do their best to help, and it turns out it was all codswallop? I'd feel bad about that, if I knew what I did, and said nothing....

..but maybe people are right, and I'm wrong. Let the OP carry on, let people try to help, and let the circle continue....as it will, until the OP realises a forum is NOT going to solve all her problems.


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## DragonSlayer (16 November 2011)

Fii said:



			I havent called any one a bully!
 I just think some people should take a step back, and consider the affect their words may have on a vunerable young girl.
		
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She is a 21 year old woman I believe, classed as an adult.


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## JFTDWS (16 November 2011)

rhino said:



			It's no skin off my nose if anyone is lying on here, it does not affect me personally... I agree a forum is not always the best place for personal discussions but if you truly believe you don't have anyone else, what do you do?
		
Click to expand...

I will confess I have used this forum to get impartial advice on a relationship situation - and damn it all if the posters weren't right and I wasn't a bit blind, so I'm glad I did and took the advice  

I don't care if someone "suckers" me (wth?) by lying about something like this, but I do wonder what the point of a forum is if you just lie and fabricate on it.  The OP clearly has problems, so I wouldn't hold it against her (though I might be wary of future threads if I remember...).  It is a bit of a worry that people with such serious issues might end up teaching impressionable kids though...


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## Fellewell (16 November 2011)

I'm with DragonSlayer on this one.

The OP posted a detailed character assassination of this man and his mother. My sympathy for her stopped before I'd finished reading it and for that I make no apologies.


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## fizzer (16 November 2011)

It is a bit of a worry that people with such serious issues might end up teaching impressionable kids though...


This is what would concern me also. I would not want my child having a teacher with such issues.


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## Fii (16 November 2011)

DragonSlayer said:



			She is a 21 year old woman I believe, classed as an adult.
		
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Yes classed as an adult, but still a young girl in my book.
 My daughter is 23, that is still young to me.
 Maybe it's the mother in me, i have a protective instinct, and it comes to the surface sometimes.


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## Puppy (16 November 2011)

horsegirl said:



			A week??? I have 2 horses both 16.1 who eat non stop unlimited hay and I pick 2 barrows a week out of their field and it is completely clear.
		
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I know, I know, it's bonkers, but honestly true. 

My retired mare is renowned for what a ridiculous amount she can produce, but the other two are pretty impressive too! A lot of it is the haylage though, they weren't so bad before that became the bulk of their diet. 

15.2hh in foal, TB, per day  (*waves* at Jemima_too ):
12.5kg Haylage 
500gm topspec stud balancer
400gm Lucie nuts
Scoop of dengie hi fi


16hh, retired, WB, per day:
12.5kg Haylage 
500gm topspec lite
handful of good doer chaff

15.2hh, v light work but still growing Connie x TB, per day:
17 kg Haylage
500gm Topspec comprehensive
400gm Lucie nuts
500gm linseed
scoop of dengie hi fi

= a bit over 2 LARGE barrows of poo per 24 hours! 

It is blooming ridiculous! Never had such 'production levels' with my old girl who was 16.2 and ate way more 


Ho hum, there's my attempt to get the thread back to onto a horsey topic!


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## DragonSlayer (16 November 2011)

Fii said:



			Yes classed as an adult, but still a young girl in my book.
 My daughter is 23, that is still young to me.
 Maybe it's the mother in me, i have a protective instinct, and it comes to the surface sometimes.
		
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Thats fair enough....I was paying towards a mortgage when I was 18...so maybe I've missed that stage completely!


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## DragonSlayer (16 November 2011)

Puppy said:



			I know, I know, it's bonkers, but honestly true. 

My retired mare is renowned for what a ridiculous amount she can produce, but the other two are pretty impressive too! A lot of it is the haylage though, they weren't so bad before that became the bulk of their diet. 

15.2hh in foal, TB, per day  (*waves* at Jemima_too ):
12.5kg Haylage 
500gm topspec stud balancer
400gm Lucie nuts
Scoop of dengie hi fi


16hh, retired, WB, per day:
12.5kg Haylage 
500gm topspec lite
handful of good doer chaff

15.2hh, v light work but still growing Connie x TB, per day:
17 kg Haylage
500gm Topspec comprehensive
400gm Lucie nuts
500gm linseed
scoop of dengie hi fi

= a bit over 2 LARGE barrows of poo per 24 hours! 

It is blooming ridiculous! Never had such 'production levels' with my old girl who was 16.2 and ate way more 


Ho hum, there's my attempt to get the thread back to onto a horsey topic! 

Click to expand...

We get one barrow a day out of each of the paddocks....if you leave it, you are doomed!


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## horsegirl (16 November 2011)

Mine don't live out so I get a barrow each from their stables each day but they are out 12 hours a day. 
I don't know where the food goes for my tb certainly not into fat


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## Puppy (16 November 2011)

Wagtail said:



			Then I think you have a poo thief! 

Click to expand...

I think the poo thief is fly tipping in my field!


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## Sidesaddle (16 November 2011)

For those of you who think I am being unfair, simply take half an hour to read through all the threads she has started over the past year.  It may take you longer, depending on how fast you read.

There is thread after thread after thread proclaiming woe is me.  When people offer advice and help (as I did at the outset), she finds a multitude of reasons to reject their advice.  She is an attention seeker, pure and simple.  

She isn't a vulnerable young girl.  If she is, do you think it is right that she is allegedly left in charge of other people's children and is allegedly training to teach primary children?  I would be worried sick if she were in charge of any of my great nephews and nieces.

As for keeping quiet - why?  Why allow other posters to be duped and made fools of? As indiat and DragonSlayer have said - I would feel bad if anything were to happen and I had kept quiet.

Let's face it, this has been going on for over a year.  I have lost count of the number of times Cedars has been told it is not a good idea to bring her problems (perceived, real, made up) to the forum.  But still she does.  Why?  Because she adores the attention.


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## The Fuzzy Furry (16 November 2011)

DragonSlayer said:



			Thats fair enough....I was paying towards a mortgage when I was 18...so maybe I've missed that stage completely!



Click to expand...

Me too! OK, I was 20 with my 1st mortgage - but I meant the missing things out 



DragonSlayer said:



			We get one barrow a day out of each of the paddocks....if you leave it, you are doomed! 

Click to expand...

I take 1 builders (Wickes type) barrow twice a day for 2 fuzzies - and the barrow isn't full (but almost!)


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## indiat (16 November 2011)

I love the way the tension on this thread is being diffused with horse ****!


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## DragonSlayer (16 November 2011)

The Fuzzy Furry said:



			Me too! OK, I was 20 with my 1st mortgage - but I meant the missing things out 



I take 1 builders (Wickes type) barrow twice a day for 2 fuzzies - and the barrow isn't full (but almost!) 

Click to expand...

...do you find you get obsessed with it...?? If you are an hour late from the previous day, there seems to be loads more....! It's stuck in the brain now, if I do nowt else, that has GOT to be done....


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## Sidesaddle (16 November 2011)

indiat said:



			I love the way the tension on this thread is being diffused with horse ****! 

Click to expand...

Makes a change from bull s hit!


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## indiat (16 November 2011)

Sidesaddle said:



			Makes a change from bull s hit!  

Click to expand...


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## horsegirl (16 November 2011)

So we've established I am very lucky with poo picking


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## EllenJay (16 November 2011)

Does it actually matter if the OP was telling the truth?  She raises topics that others discuss - and for all you know someone else may be is a similar position, but too shy to post about their issues, can read the well thought out replies and it may help them out.

I can understand how some of you longer term members feel let down, but in the great scheme of things does it really matter?


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## Fii (16 November 2011)

For the strong characters on this thread.
 Be glad you are strong, your life and the way you have lived it, and the people you have encountered along the way have made you like this. You have experience on your side, there isnt much you havent seen or done, and you can sit back and see a situation for what it is. 
  Not every one has your life experiences, some just cant cope with it on their own, wether they lie to gain sympathy, or just need help wiith every day situations.
 Some are just not strong, others apeare strong but in reality arent!


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## The Fuzzy Furry (16 November 2011)

DragonSlayer said:



			...do you find you get obsessed with it...?? If you are an hour late from the previous day, there seems to be loads more....! It's stuck in the brain now, if I do nowt else, that has GOT to be done....
		
Click to expand...

too damned right on that! 

Work days its like 12 hours in & 12 hours out - lovely, nice amount for barrow (tho pitch dark each time).
Non-work days its horrible - am clock watching as am worrying about those 2 or 3 extra piles going in


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## Eaglestone (16 November 2011)

But does anyone else count their horse's poos  .... I do, every day and write it down, so that must make me different, as at least I do not count the wheelbarrow loads


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## JFTDWS (16 November 2011)

I have 3 small horses/ large ponies and I get 1- 1.5 barrows a day...  Mind you, it's been so dark lately there could be twice that in there and I'm just missing it


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## Puppy (16 November 2011)

horsegirl said:



			So we've established I am very lucky with poo picking 

Click to expand...

Actually, I think we've established that your horses are clearly lobbing their poos into in MY horses' paddocks!


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## Puppy (16 November 2011)

DragonSlayer said:



			...do you find you get obsessed with it...?? If you are an hour late from the previous day, there seems to be loads more....! It's stuck in the brain now, if I do nowt else, that has GOT to be done....
		
Click to expand...


My problem is that at this time of year, haylage + less day light = that it is a never ending battle. 

So, yes, I agree with the OP, poo picking on Monday morning before lectures, when my neck was killing me, I really was thinking, 'ARGH! I can't do this all winter! I can't cope with it all!'


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## The Fuzzy Furry (16 November 2011)

Actually, I think we need a new thread - for wheelbarrow SIZE - as this has not yet been taken into account


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## Puppy (16 November 2011)

Eaglestone said:



			But does anyone else count their horse's poos  .... I do, every day and write it down, so that must make me different, as at least I do not count the wheelbarrow loads 

Click to expand...

Count as I go, yes! 

Write it down?! 

Good lord no! 

You freak


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## Flame_ (16 November 2011)

EllenJay said:



			Does it actually matter if the OP was telling the truth?  She raises topics that others discuss - and for all you know someone else may be is a similar position, but too shy to post about their issues, can read the well thought out replies and it may help them out.

I can understand how some of you longer term members feel let down, but in the great scheme of things does it really matter?
		
Click to expand...

I'm with you. I also don't understand what it is exactly that is going to happen to the allegedly lied to forumers if the "enlightened" don't speak out with the truth as they see it.


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## DragonSlayer (16 November 2011)

Puppy said:



			Count as I go, yes! 

Write it down?! 

Good lord no! 

You freak  

Click to expand...

...we could have a competition....and a chart to display all the results....


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## Puppy (16 November 2011)

The Fuzzy Furry said:



			Actually, I think we need a new thread - for wheelbarrow SIZE - as this has not yet been taken into account 

Click to expand...

Exciting stuff! 

I like to think that I would be in serious contention for both size of my swanky new wheelbarrow AND no. of poos my horse can produce in 24 hours


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## Jesstickle (16 November 2011)

Puppy said:



			Exciting stuff! 

I like to think that I would be in serious contention for both size of my swanky new wheelbarrow AND no. of poos my horse can produce in 24 hours 

Click to expand...

At least your horses are beautiful. One of mine is hideous and one is so hairy it might as well be! And even worse the hairy one hardly poos in the field. It waits til it gets in, does it all in the stable and then smushes it up into tiny, tiny pieces!


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## JFTDWS (16 November 2011)

jesstickle said:



			At least your horses are beautiful. One of mine is hideous
		
Click to expand...

Ahhh but are any of Puppy's horses endorsed by her Majesty as HMS BH is?


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## Puppy (16 November 2011)

DragonSlayer said:



			...we could have a competition....and a chart to display all the results....

Click to expand...

Oooh, interesting! 

Will this be a photo competition?? 

If so I must stop my mother giving the stuff away to her tennis pals in exchange for wine and veggies!


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## Wagtail (16 November 2011)

Puppy said:



			I think the poo thief is fly tipping in my field! 

Click to expand...


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## Wagtail (16 November 2011)

EllenJay said:



			Does it actually matter if the OP was telling the truth?  She raises topics that others discuss - and for all you know someone else may be is a similar position, but too shy to post about their issues, can read the well thought out replies and it may help them out.

I can understand how some of you longer term members feel let down, but in the great scheme of things does it really matter?
		
Click to expand...

This was exactly what I was thinking.


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## DragonSlayer (16 November 2011)

Puppy said:



			Oooh, interesting! 

Will this be a photo competition?? 

If so I must stop my mother giving the stuff away to her tennis pals in exchange for wine and veggies!
		
Click to expand...

Yes, it could be a photo-comp...

We could have various classes..

Biggest Pile of Poo in the field...
Biggest Pile of Poo in a wheelbarrow...
Biggest Pile of Poo EVER! (could be the muckheap...)

Anymore??


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## Jesstickle (16 November 2011)

DragonSlayer said:



			Yes, it could be a photo-comp...

We could have various classes..

Biggest Pile of Poo in the field...
Biggest Pile of Poo in a wheelbarrow...
Biggest Pile of Poo EVER! (could be the muckheap...)

Anymore??
		
Click to expand...

Biggest poo obviously.


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## ajn1610 (16 November 2011)

My horse once did a poo that looked just like a Buddha!


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## DragonSlayer (16 November 2011)

ajn1610 said:



			My horse once did a poo that looked just like a Buddha!
		
Click to expand...

...we can have a class for horse poo that resembles a celebrity....or something!


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## Puppy (16 November 2011)

DragonSlayer said:



			Yes, it could be a photo-comp...

We could have various classes..

Biggest Pile of Poo in the field...
Biggest Pile of Poo in a wheelbarrow...
Biggest Pile of Poo EVER! (could be the muckheap...)

Anymore??
		
Click to expand...

Charlie wonders if there could be a class for biggest-load-of-poo-half-in-the-barrow-&-half-in-the-field?













You can probably guess why I have since had to buy a new barrow... 


ps - He will help clear up afterwards:


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## Eaglestone (16 November 2011)

Puppy said:



			Count as I go, yes! 

Write it down?! 

Good lord no! 

You freak  

Click to expand...

I know 

Well I think that the most piles of poo per horse can be added to the list ^^^^


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## Spring Feather (16 November 2011)

You're all weirdos!! 

No barrows for me, I harrow


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## The Fuzzy Furry (16 November 2011)

Puppy said:



			Exciting stuff! 

I like to think that I would be in serious contention for both size of my swanky new wheelbarrow AND no. of poos my horse can produce in 24 hours 

Click to expand...

and here you are - just for you: http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=497174


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## Ravenwood (16 November 2011)

You are all completely bonkers 

I've never poo picked a field in my life!


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## Tonty Tont (16 November 2011)

What about the worst way to pick up the muck? 

I just use rubber gloves and grab it with my hands


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## intouch (16 November 2011)

Cedars said:



			With what horse, and with what money? My horse is in my boyfriends name, and I'm a full time student! And should I just walk out on my 5year relationship?
		
Click to expand...

Go for it!


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## fidleyspromise (17 November 2011)

Horsegirl said:
			
		


			A week??? I have 2 horses both 16.1 who eat non stop unlimited hay and I pick 2 barrows a week out of their field and it is completely clear.
		
Click to expand...

HOW???? 
I've two 14.2hh ponies, a standard barrow and I take one full barrow out PER day.  Actually the other day, I just couldn't fit any on the first and had to go to a second wheelbarrow   I think mine must be throwing parties and they're all leaving their shi t behind!!


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## Queenbee (17 November 2011)

Puppy said:



			Actually, I think we've established that your horses are clearly lobbing their poos into in MY horses' paddocks! 

Click to expand...

That just made me chuckle   this thread reminds me of a post a few weeks ago:

The truth is...

I'd rather be with horses than with most people.
I'd rather scrub buckets than scrub dishes.
I'd rather go to a tack shop than go to a supermarket.
I'd rather clean a stable than clean the house...

and I much prefer horse **** to BULL **** 

horses are what keep me sane


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## Hippona (17 November 2011)

The Fuzzy Furry said:



			Actually, I think we need a new thread - for wheelbarrow SIZE - as this has not yet been taken into account 

Click to expand...

Indeed.

In fact- sadly- last night I was thinking about this thread as I did my poo-picking.

3 horses out for at least 12 hours per day = roughly one orange B+Q wheelbarrow.

So it would take my horses 3 weeks to fill roughly the same amount of barrows as Cedars was complaining about.

So if I had 4 horses - give or take -2 weeks to acheive the 18 barrow figure....

I poo pick every day cos I hate doing it.....only takes 10-15 mins per day and then you don't have to do a marathon sesh.

Either that or I pay my teenage son


(FWIW....I guess theres loads of us that manage multiple horses on top of a full time job, kids etc- so I'm a total meaner but no sympathy from me)


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## *hic* (17 November 2011)

Do I get a prize for having a poo picking poem?

Every s h i t that I shift is one less to lift

After developing that and chanting it thousands of times my mother said "What on earth are you poo picking for? We never used to with the farm horses, no-one does for cows, why don't you just harrow?"

So whilst I was waiting for the harrow to arrive I could be found singing this:
[youtube]7yiwlkPHPHQ[/youtube]
 whilst dancing around madly and kicking s h i t out of the piles on the field.


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## Vixen Van Debz (17 November 2011)

Oh Cedars, I had no idea things were this bad 80( From the picture you've painted I think it's easy to say 'He doesn't really love you, MIL doesn't like you so leave', but only you know the detailed lay of the landscape, and I trust you'll make the right decisions to make yourself happy.

I've discovered that, when I need to explain to my OH about how things are getting on top me, I first of all acknowledge everything I'm lucky enough to have. So I'd open a big chat about how much you appreciate the yard, Puz etc, so he can scrap that ungreatful claim. I also find that men in general need to be told not just that x is happening, but "this is how x makes me feel". Certainly my OH is sensitive, but he does respond emotionally very differently than I do, and explaining the exact emotions that certain situations cause me always opens his eyes and makes him more sympathetic.

With all that in mind and giving that you plan to say, I think it's only fair that your 'weekend' or 'day off' at least is disucessed and sorted. Your OH clearly has a day or two off work, and your MIL has her non-horsey day at the weekend (the weekdays being your livery-payment duties). It's only fair that you be granted the same, or at least that you're only responsible for Puz on that day/those days, rather than general yard duties like poo picking.

As you are paying for your livery in toil, I'd highlight what livery allows: i.e. bedding, stable, field, hay and ACCESS TO FACILITIES! Having a school but not being able to use does not qualify as livery: it is a necessary part of the fee you pay in livery. The fact that your fee is not in cash should not enter the picture. (If OH is away all week, I'd be busy in that school and on that quad as no one would know, but it would be much better for things to be open and honest rather than needing to resort to that).

What would really hurt me though, is if my MIL-to-be said something to my OH about me and he automatically believed her without even asking me. I know his Mum has been so all his life and he has no reason to think she'd be lying, but he loves and trusts me, so would have no reason to believe I'd been up to no good/been lazy either. I'd expect him to ask me about it and have a rational conversation. That's not too much to ask for, and I hope in future your OH grants you this.

FWIW, a ring on the finger wouldn't help in my opinion - if he truly believes that you're too young but would give you a ring to keep hold of you, you could end up having a five year engagement to counteract it. The financial pressure of a wedding wouldn't likely help at this junction either.

Whatever your plans are though, and whether your OH is yours or not for life, I'd be pursuing the loan issue with the welfare charity and changing it to your name as soon as possible. As I say, it needn't be anything to do with an exit strategy, but it is both smart and fair. Perhaps when the time comes that you meet their criteria, you suggest it as the best b'day/xmas gift ever? Men do love it when they don't have to think of a gift, espeically one that will undoubtedly make you so happy.

Wishing you well in every single way my dear. If I was nearby, I'd happily pop over to help with yard chores x

ETA: just because you haven't ridden regularly in so long doesn't mean you're not fit to share. As long as you're honest about your past experience and your rustiness with the owner, it shouldn't be an issue. You certainly must be a skilled carer, running your yard on your own! 

Also, I'd ask why you're not allowed to ride their horses. I think your OH horses are event horses if I remember rightly, so some people aren't keen on them being ridden for leisure for others. What about asking for lessons on them though from your OH? There are things to be learned about riding a horse from watching it too: you could both find it really useful in your training.


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## SeasonalSituation (17 November 2011)

Good advice there.


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## Fairytale (18 November 2011)

"What about the worst way to pick up the muck?"

Defo rubber gloves on a cold frosty morning - when its nice and fresh 'cos it warms the hands a treat!!!     When times are hard and no gloves available - bare hands!  Makes your nails grow


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## The Virgin Dubble (18 November 2011)

EllenJay said:



			Does it actually matter if the OP was telling the truth?  She raises topics that others discuss - and for all you know someone else may be is a similar position, but too shy to post about their issues, can read the well thought out replies and it may help them out.

I can understand how some of you longer term members feel let down, but in the great scheme of things does it really matter?
		
Click to expand...

I've come into this rather late, and wasn't going to comment, but feel I have to reply to this post.

Yes it does matter if people are telling the truth. Of course it does.

Quite often, people will draw on their own painful experiences, to give advice and support to others who seem genuinely distressed.They do it out of the goodness of their hearts even though it can be extremely difficult for them to do so.

It's not nice when you have done that, and then find the poster is lying through their teeth.

I am not saying this is the case here with this OP, but there have been odd users who have been extreme attention seekers, told a pack of lies, got tons of support, then have just turned around and thrown it back in the faces of those who have taken the time and effort to help.

I am not naive enough to think that everybody tells the truth all the time, and there are some top rate b*ll shi**ers on this forum, but it is one thing to over exaggerate, and quite another to cause people to be genuinely concerned through lying.


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## 5horses2dogsandacat (18 November 2011)

fatpiggy said:



			My mother nags me about not getting any physio for my very dodgy back, but can't see that I'd undo all the good work the very next day. I might as well tear up £10 notes.
		
Click to expand...

Thought Id address this before I see if I can offer any advice to cedar... 

You really really need to go see a physio if your back is bad fatpiggy. Im a training physio, but you seem to think that what the physio will do will be undone soon as you get back to the yard. It is true that we can loosen muscles, but what the physio will also do is teach you ways to strengthen your back, the point of physio is not just to have sessions where we palpate your back but we also can educate you how to protect your back and strengthen it in the future. You could be doing some really terrible damage to your back not having it treated.


Cedar.. Im really sorry for you, I can relate in someways, Im at uni doing a full time physio course (its supposed to be a 4 yr course but they have now squished it into 3 yrs so v.v. full on) I have 3 horses of my own to look after, an extremely grumpy farmer bf who suffers with depression so having to deal with his constant outbursts and I also work so I can support the horses. 

I do think it is terrible how your OH has spoken to you. Maybe you should just take a break, see how he feels when he really does have to do all the work, he might actually miss you! Although after what he said , if you left the horses you can leave the house and the relationship it really does cast a black cloud over why he really wants to be with you... Perhaps it was just said in the heat of the moment?? 

I always found writing down my points I wanted to get across to one of my ex's when we had arguments,  then going to a public place, like a park or shopping centre, a place where people were too busy with their own lives to ear wag, then talking them through there always worked wonders.

I guess it really doesnt help your feeling terrible, uni-flu is the worst, espcially when essays are due or your going on placement to somewhere new... Hope you feel better soon and you work things out with your OH. You have enough stress with uni and horses with out emotional turmoil as well


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