# Why dont instructors like giving lunge lessons?



## On the Hoof (9 February 2015)

So Im not the most balanced person in the world, and I am a novice rider and silly old me thinks that having lots of lunge lessons is a really good idea. I did have quite a few last year when the riding school where my horse is stabled was  open (cannot have lunge lessons on my own horse due to her arthritis) but after the RS part closed I was left without anywhere to go. Went to another yard and was put on a 5 year old new to RS and it was unbalanced and panicked, tanked in canter and I did the wall of death. The response was that my seat was good anyway and if I could sit the tanking on the lunge I could sit anything (ha ha I wish -  my hands were white holding onto the pommel!). 

So after a few months I searched elsewhere, a few places don't do them, and some that do seem to want to get me off the lunge after one lesson. Lets be clear I am NOT  well balanced and I am rubbish at canter so why cannot instructors see this and give me what I want. I'm a bit of a perfectionist and ideally I would like to be able to walk, trot and canter on the lunge with my eyes closed, no reins and no stirrups! If I could get to this level of balance I would be happy and much more confident in my riding.  Am I being unreasonable?

And while I'm ranting, what's with using a horse that does not canter on command for a lunge lesson and just rushes faster in trot most of the time, so by time it canters Ive lost my 'stillness' and concentration and end up bumping on the poor things back. Surely horses need to be trained to take riders on the lunge?  Perhaps that is why many places don't do lunge lessons or don't want people to have more than one or two because they know their horses are not suitable?  Yesterday I went to a well established and highly thought of place, with an excellent trainer at a high cost for a private lesson and was put on another horse that did not want to work and wouldn't canter. Even this trainer said that I should only have a few lunge lessons and then have a 'proper' lesson.  I rebooked for a few weeks time - now why did I bother Im asking myself this morning?  Do you think its ok to ring them and suggest that perhaps they could find me a different horse next time ?

I should say that ive had a bad fall in canter and am currently not very good at it - its like ive gone back in time and freeze  - so I thought lunge lessons would be really helpful - i could concentrate on the rhythm and get my seat right without getting too scared to even ask for canter which is where I am mostly at the moment. 

Sorry for long rant - just feeling a bit depressed about this situation at the moment and really want to know if Im being unreasonable in wanting a well trained horse and for someone to accept that lunge lessons are what I want/need.


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## FfionWinnie (9 February 2015)

They are possibly concerned for your safety and or do not have a suitable horse to provide it safely. 

I've never had a lunge lesson in my life. I don't think you need them to achieve what you want either. Just lots of lessons on a decent horse with a good instructor.


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## swampdonkey (9 February 2015)

I'm not sure on the legal side of things but maybe they would be responsible if you had a fall while on the lunge because they have control of the horse.  Rather than you have control if you are riding alone. ?


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## Sleighfarer (9 February 2015)

Whereabouts are you OP? My instructor never goes anywhere without her lunge line ...


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## be positive (9 February 2015)

I love giving lunge lessons, I have not lunged an adult for some years but I have spent many hours lunging novice children so they have the balance required before riding alone, I don't understand the reluctance of many RS to lunge rather than have novices riding either on the lead or loose struggling to master the basics. 
Many RS do not have a well trained lunge horse, it should not be hard to get one or two well trained to carry a rider in all 3 paces safely but does take some time which may be the main reason, other than the fact that group lessons are more financially rewarding than private, which is why so many children start on the lead as they can be led round in a big group.

I think there are places you could go but they are likely to be dressage training yards rather than RS, a quick google of lunge lessons does bring up a few, they may be expensive but could be a worthwhile investment, the other thing to consider is  few sessions on a mechanical horse they can be very beneficial.


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## Shay (9 February 2015)

Lunging can put considerable strain on the horse and it is worse with an unbalanced rider.  If you were looking for lessons on your own horse I don't think you'd have any trouble; the issue  is that you want a lesson an an RS horse.  Often they are under enough strain with the variety of riders and the level of work that schools are understandably reluctant to make matters worse.

You could try working with a mechanical horse?  I know it sounds odd but they are really good for correcting position and will keep going as long as you do.  You also can't hurt them by being unbalanced! 

It might be that the reason you find RS horses reluctant to canter is that you are hunching slightly or off balance making it difficult for them to get the strike off. That will be the same on the lunge as well as off.  If you are out of position most horses will just run faster in trot rather than strain to strike off.  Plus of course RS horses probably more than most know every trick not to work - and who can blame them!  But if you have tried a range of places and a range of horse who all won't canter for you the issue is likely to be you rather than them I'm afraid.  The professional place you have found sounds good and like they are willing to work with you.  My view would be to trust their judgement.

EDIT:  Crossed with BP's post.  They are quite right about dressage training yards.  Well worth a try.


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## chestnut cob (9 February 2015)

I think you just have to find the right place. I have lunge lessons occasionally on my own horse and also recently had a schoolmaster lunge lesson at Ingestre which was fantastic.
If the RS is putting you on horses that tank off on the lunge then I guess they just don't have suitable horses. Where are you based? A good BHS school should have at least a couple of decent lunge horses I'd imagine.


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## On the Hoof (9 February 2015)

thanks for all the replies, I can see that perhaps the time investment in a good lunge horse might not be sensible for most RS's.  I am a bit unbalanced, but not that bad, I just want to improve, but Im sure you are right Shay in that some of the problem is with me. I have had successful lunge lessons at my old RS though, they had a good horse that they used for lunge lessons when needed and I had no problem asking for and balancing in canter on that horse. Of course things have gone downhill for me since then and I recognise Im part of the problem - hence wanting the lessons.   Im in the SW and not many places nearby that I can see, but will go back to the place I went on Sunday and see how that progresses.  I dont want to throw the towel in because I felt that I didnt get what I needed from that one lesson and I appreciate that I did learn other things so it wasn't exactly a write off. Its a shame I cannot use my own horse but the strain would be too much for her hocks.  I do appreciate that lunging is challenging for the horse with a rider on top, in fact I was really surprised on Sunday that the horse was NOT  lunged without me on first in order to warm up - I have always expected that at least some of the lesson time is for the horse to warm up on the circle first.  If the current place does not work out - and I have to say I loved the instructor - then I will look at dressage yards as suggested, but I will also look into the mechanical horse idea as suggested - that might be the most sensible next step.   Thankyou for all your suggestions and comments.


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## ironhorse (9 February 2015)

I would avoid the place you went to like the plague - not warming the horse up one the lunge before putting the rider on is not only unfair to the horse but also potentially dangerous. Even the best trained horse can have a 'whizz' when you first ask it to canter on the lunge and a less balanced rider would probably have fallen off. I think you probably want to look for somewhere fairly 'old school' as when I was training for my BHSAI (some twenty years ago!) lungeing riders of all standards was a very important part of the programme. How far are you from Talland (Cirencester)? I'm sure they still do lunge lessons.
A slightly more 'out there' suggestion would be to get in touch with a vaulting group - obviously their horses all lunge very well, and it could do wonders for your balance if you were feeling brave enough!


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## Deseado (9 February 2015)

Why? Because in the UK (and Ireland, where I'm from) it is not a common method of teaching riders. On the continent it is the most usual way of learning to ride, and IMO the very best. You only have to look around you to see and compare the results of both methods


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## Cortez (9 February 2015)

Perhaps they don't know how to? A good lunge horse is vital to teaching beginners and would be the first thing I would acquire/train if I ever ran a riding school again (which, being relatively sane, I won't!).


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## Pinkvboots (9 February 2015)

I think most riding schools do not have a suitable horse for proper lunge lessons most I worked in didnt, one place I did work many years ago used to have vault horses and they are perfect for the job we used to give each other lunge lessons and I think they do really help your riding position, I would keep ringing round other riding schools in the area and ask about lunge lessons failing that you could see if you have a vaulting team near you they might be willing to help you.


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## The Fuzzy Furry (9 February 2015)

Our local BHS approved RS wont lunge novices.

They put them on the mech horse & any rider is not allowed on a real horse till they have at least mastered the basics (usually for an adult its around 6 x 1 to 1 lessons of half hour or so.

To me, this is MUCH better than the days of yore, when all starters or novices were lunged. Cortez, I did this too for a long time back in the late 70's & early 80's.

I pop down to the RS every so often (3 or 4 times a year) to have a mech horse session, much easier for working on position for them & me, let alone the hammering a horse has to take on its legs.

OP, try one, you might be pleasantly surprised


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## ihatework (9 February 2015)

To give a good lunge lesson you need:

A horse that is very good on the lunge, preferably a few horses (as continuous lunging is not so good for a horse so you don't want them doing it day in day out)

An instructor that really understands biomechanics and can make a difference.

Otherwise all you end up with is a bored pupil and a peed off horse. Very few instructors have the skills to deliver a beneficial lunge lesson so they actively avoid doing so!


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## dianchi (9 February 2015)

I have had lunge lessons on my own horse and I have given them, She is lunged 3 times a week in a pessoa anyway.

Whilst she does indeed go off voice commands, I would expect the person on board to be able to ask for the transitions.

If you dont/cant do this then you should be on a mechanical horse where no damage can be done and you can learn your balance.

I also dont see why you would expect the horse to be lunged prior to you getting on- you wouldnt do this in a general flat lesson! Plus you need to work on your work positioning as much as other paces.

I have had mechanical horse lessons, and with eyes of a biomechanics instructor found this very beneficial.


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## humblepie (9 February 2015)

I have had various sessions of lunge lessons over the years and agree it has been quite difficult to find but really feel them beneficial when do have them.  Last ones were with a BHSI on her own dressage horse who was beautifully schooled and lovely for lunge lessons.  The ones before were at a BHS approved riding school and again the horse was really suitable for the lessons, so there are people out there just have to keep searching.


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## Steorra (9 February 2015)

Sadly I have found that it is difficult to find high-quality lunge lessons. Many riding schools don't give lunge lessons at all or only offer them to beginners as an intermediate step between lead-rein and independent riding. 

Giving lunge lessons to make fine adjustments to the riders position seems to be a specialist skill. None of the "normal" riding schools local to me offer it, but I did eventually find a small place with a classical dressage ethos that did more-or-less what I wanted. Might be worth looking for something similar, even if you aren't necessarily into classical dressage as such.


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## Midlifecrisis (9 February 2015)

Can you find a vaulting club near you..they lunge and ride their horses all the time and might be able to accommodate you?


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## On the Hoof (9 February 2015)

Hi, no vaulting groups near me, but think Ive found a riding simulator quite close, so will ring them tomorrow for a chat and see if i can book something.  thanks all


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## Kadastorm (10 February 2015)

I used to give lunge lessons at a riding school I worked at, but we had 2 very good horses for it. Both lovely to ride and well schooled and both listen to voice commands. However, I didn't give many as it is hard work for them and the lesson would be 20 minutes max with the rider going off the lunge to work the horse down at the end. 
To be honest, I think for both the riders and the horses health and safety, people don't do it anymore, or not many people do and people have to really know the horse they are lunging and trust them to behave. 
Congrats for sitting the wall of death!


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## Apercrumbie (10 February 2015)

I would imagine the issue would be wanting lunge lessons every time - most instructors would want you off the lunge reasonably quickly, not only to save their horses' legs but to put what you are learning into practice.  Lunge lessons are very useful, but as the odd one for tweaking, not as the only way you ride.


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## On the Hoof (10 February 2015)

Kadastorm said:



			Congrats for sitting the wall of death!
		
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ha ha thankyou!  it wasnt pleasant riding!


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## Cortez (10 February 2015)

Gosh, I spent 6 months on the lunge when I was in Portugal! At least 3 times a week, and was only allowed to ride after I was deemed capable of holding the reins properly (i.e not hanging off them and able to control my balance). Oh, and I'd been "riding" (or not, as my instructor said) for at least ten years when I went there.


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## Goldenstar (10 February 2015)

I wonder if the skills for teaching on the lunge are not being taught as much as they where .
Trainers need to trained to do it or all you are doing is running round in small circles and I also wonder if schools have the horses now riding school lunge horses need to be trained for the job.
The first one to one lesson that some one was paying for I ever gave was a lunge one that was a long time ago.


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## Orangehorse (10 February 2015)

OP, I see you are in the South West.  Heather Moffat in Devon has a mechanical horse and gives lessons.


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## CBAnglo (10 February 2015)

Cortez said:



			Gosh, I spent 6 months on the lunge when I was in Portugal! At least 3 times a week, and was only allowed to ride after I was deemed capable of holding the reins properly (i.e not hanging off them and able to control my balance). Oh, and I'd been "riding" (or not, as my instructor said) for at least ten years when I went there.
		
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I would agree with this; when I was taught to ride again (after having ridden for about 10 years) it was on the lunge and I wasn't allowed reins.  But the horse in question was very balanced and engaged in all three paces.  These aren't the normal horses you get in riding schools.

It makes a massive difference - I have to go back to Portugal every for "top ups" i.e. my instructor shouting "hands" at me for the first 2 days ...


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## Orangehorse (10 February 2015)

Cortez said:



			Gosh, I spent 6 months on the lunge when I was in Portugal! At least 3 times a week, and was only allowed to ride after I was deemed capable of holding the reins properly (i.e not hanging off them and able to control my balance). Oh, and I'd been "riding" (or not, as my instructor said) for at least ten years when I went there.
		
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I guess you were being taught to ride, rather than being taught to stick on.  That is why the Portugese riders look so poised.


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## ester (10 February 2015)

I was going to ask where in the SW are you OP?

I did also wonder whether you are gripping etc which is why the horse in the most recent RS struggled to canter. I wouldn't necessarily take it as a bad thing that the trainer has suggested keeping you on the lunge for only a few sessions as he might have seen things that makes him think that is a better way to progress with you. My pondering if you had the right sort of horse would be whether you might be better to make the canter transition in a forward seat and then sit back down into it rather than concentrating on being too still.


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## Cortez (10 February 2015)

ester said:



			I did also wonder whether you are gripping etc which is why the horse in the most recent RS struggled to canter. I wouldn't necessarily take it as a bad thing that the trainer has suggested keeping you on the lunge for only a few sessions as he might have seen things that makes him think that is a better way to progress with you. My pondering if you had the right sort of horse would be whether you might be better to make the canter transition in a forward seat and then sit back down into it rather than concentrating on being too still.
		
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What?


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## ester (10 February 2015)

Assuming that is for the last sentence?

Well if the OP is getting very tense anticipating the transition meaning that the horse runs/OP can't sit it all ends up in a mess. 

If someone else is dictating the transition and OP is nervous about cantering it might be better to get the canter with the OP in more of a 2 point seat if she were happy to and then sit back in the canter. When I was a kid I wish someone had got me to do that, canter transitions just became a ridiculously complicated thing and a huge source of tension and over thinking and resulted in a tense me, a tense horse and at least one wall of death issue. I wish someone had just got me and the horse cantering in a safe situation/on lunge and then work on the seat after that point. Does that make sense?


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## Kokopelli (10 February 2015)

I know a fantastic RI near Gloucester that gives the best lunge lessons on very good horses. Pm me if this isn't too far and I can send you details


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## Burnttoast (10 February 2015)

When I was having lunge lessons (from someone who trained in Portugal - wish he hadn't moved away!) I wasn't allowed to contemplate a canter trans until I was sitting in such a way that meant I could ask correctly and get it at the first time of asking. No need to run before you can walk. All I ever want is lunge lessons and finding good ones, with good horses (and instructors who aren't always trying to rush you off the lunge) in this country is almost impossible. Some places have told me I'm too advanced for them, which makes me laugh (and despair) - just because I can sit there and look presentable doesn't mean there isn't an enormous amount of work needed to make me effective! Agree with the poster who said that many instructors aren't actually capable of delivering a worthwhile lesson on the lunge. Sorry, rant over


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## MotherOfChickens (10 February 2015)

I think most people don't have the horses for it these days or don't want them used for it, and with a lack of horses comes the lack on instructors capable of giving useful lunge lessons. Where I holiday in Portugal they have an after school vaulting club for the local kids. Lots of real littlies up to 16yo all vaulting onto horses and doing all sorts up there. Great way to an independent seat. When I was a WP in the late 80s, we had weekly lunge lessons and worked every day without stirrups-even in jumping lessons.

I would love lunge lessons-if I could I'd have them several times a week! Be the only way to really get my seat back as good as it was when I was in my 20s..


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## Fuzzypuff (10 February 2015)

I think Heather Moffett would be a good one to try. If not, then a classical instructor as I think you need someone who will work on helping you in a classical position - unfortunately many(most?) riding schools don't focus enough on position. Mechanical horse lessons are good too, to give you a feel of where you should be. I went to Julian Marczak for an excellent lunge lesson a few years ago but I don't know if he is still doing them and he was in Sussex so a bit far for you.


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## On the Hoof (10 February 2015)

Orangehorse said:



			OP, I see you are in the South West.  Heather Moffat in Devon has a mechanical horse and gives lessons.
		
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Thanks Orangehorse, that's too far for me but I may have found one in Bristol that I can follow up.


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## On the Hoof (10 February 2015)

Lots of interesting comments here, thankyou to all who have suggested places to try- I really appreciate this. 




ester said:



			I was going to ask where in the SW are you OP?

I did also wonder whether you are gripping etc which is why the horse in the most recent RS struggled to canter. I wouldn't necessarily take it as a bad thing that the trainer has suggested keeping you on the lunge for only a few sessions as he might have seen things that makes him think that is a better way to progress with you. My pondering if you had the right sort of horse would be whether you might be better to make the canter transition in a forward seat and then sit back down into it rather than concentrating on being too still.
		
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I have worked hard to ensure I don't grip, but it's entirely possible I was doing so given that I was a little anxious with new RI, new place and unknown horse...  .. It's funny you should mention light seat as I had been wondering if I should 'try this at home ' on the rein that I have difficulty getting the transition....however I can report that had some really nice canter transitions today on left rein..which is both mine and cob's favoured rein.. something to build on!


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